This Podcast Is... Uncalled For - NASL vs USSF and MLS (Snowed In 2025)

Episode Date: February 4, 2025

This episode is part of our Snowed In 2025 miniseries. The long-awaited lawsuit filed by the North American Soccer League (NASL) against the US Soccer Federation and Major League Soccer is about to go to trial (at least at the time this was recorded).  Soccer Wars has reached the courtroom. (Update: This will be an early release episode for Season 9 because the lawsuit has reached a verdict.  We will follow up as part of our upcoming Fortnight Challenge episode.)

Hey everybody, it's Mike. Just wanted to throw this L-LPS on it. Because of something that happened recently, we have to push this episode into the time-sensitive category of things for the ninth season. part of our fortnight challenge i will react to the case as it has wrapped up needless to say i am not very happy about it i don't want to waste another um um elements of the podcast um talking about it so that'll be in our fortnight challenge um so in the meantime enjoy our early release episode on the North American Soccer League versus United States Soccer Federation. Enjoy. Check the mic will go live. Stories told their eyes and dive.

Topics fresh with every spin. You won't guess what's coming in. Every week a new surprise. Minds away, never lies, conversations bold and free. Tune in now, just wait and see this podcast is uncarned for. Can't you see there's so much more? Laughs and tales you can't ignore a journey that will leave you floor.

the day just press play hi everybody so welcome to the

podcast the first of a few snowed-in editions of the podcast the line

is open for anyone who wants to jump in and it is no joke we literally

are snowed in today so so so so let's get let's get this

kicked off with a story but following a little bit over the past few years and I feel it's important to

talk about because well we got the world Cup coming in a couple of years. I still to this day, don't think it's a good idea for the U.S. to be hosted in the World Cup,

especially when we do not follow the FIFA guidelines on sporting merits, also known as promotion and relegation. And nothing demonstrates this

better than the whole concept of soccer wars. On one side you have Major League Soccer and they're sick of fans over to USL. And on the other hand, you have people who are actually reform-minded that wanted to bring a promotion and relegation

but were stopped on the way by MLS and their sock puppets. if you will at the United States Soccer Federation if there are a lot parallels between this and

if it seems there are a lot of parallels between this situation and what's going on government-wise in the United States and what's going on with the NFL yeah i think i think there's a lot of overlap between all those and nothing illustrates

this better than the fact that the main league in the among the reform minded owners is suing the USSF and MLS because they were driven out of business literally had business so and that case is about to go to trial

which is why I want talk about it today so we'll start with an article ESPN US soccer must face trial over MLS and SL

competition so if the NASL were still around there would be a division two league and another much maligned league NISA

the National Independent Soccer Association will be a feeder league for the NSL for terms of promotion and relegation So let's read. So the antitrust lawsuit filed by the North American Soccer League against the U.S. Soccer Federation and MLS can go to trial after a federal judge denied one of the motions for summary judgments filed by the USSF and MLS.

where have we seen that before? Oh, yeah, the St. Louis NFL lawsuits. They were denied summary judgment and settled shortly after that. And this is a good time to insert that some of the owners in the NFL are also invested in MLS. I will leave it up to you all to. look at the names, but that it is one of the

NSL, the second iteration of a league to use that name operated from 2011-2017 and eventually seized operations after losing its designation as a Division II League from the USSF in September

2017. NASL filed its antitrust lawsuits shortly after this decision. So this has been going on for quite a while. We're now in 2025. Happy New Year, by the way. And it's just now getting to trial. And this was written in June of 24. It's been seven long years of in the NASL is delighted to finally get its day in courts against MLS and USSF said Jeffrey Kessler, the lead attorney for

the NASL, in an email to ESPN. Neither USSF nor MLS responded to a request for comments. The trial is scheduled to begin on September 9 that I heard

it was starting it got pushed back to like next week or something. I digress. NASL's original complaint alleges that the USSF had violated federal anti-trust laws through its anti-competitive

division structure that divides men's professional soccer from U.S. base leagues based on what's an NASL news release described as arbitrary criteria at the USS

and manipulated to favor major league soccer which is the commercial business partner of the USSF so most soccer league almost all soccer leagues that said the

US operates in such a structure so I'll use the Premier League as an example in England so the Premier League top 20 teams in English soccer playing the Primarily

If you finish the bottom of three you'll go down to the second division which is called the Football League Championship from which the top two automatically

go up to the Premier League and the next four play for that final spots in a playoff so there's promotion around getting out work and it doesn't stop there below the championship is league one uh three up three

down between after league one is league two it's four up four down and then the uh from a league two to the national league they call it uh two up two down and below that it starts to tear off so uh So you have the National League, then below that it's National League North and South and then some regional leagues and then even more regional leagues and everything. And the idea is if you do well, you get rewarded by going up a level. And if you suck, you get punished by going down levels. I use England as the example, but this is really how it works in other stock. league around the world. So we continue with the article.

The division structure via the application of the USSF's professional league standards are PLS, which I've often said are POS, is intended to provide a set of minimum requirements for a league. including number of teams, geographic distribution of teams. There's that word again, metropolitan area size of a team's city, state and capacity, as well as the minimum financial requirements for team owners. And there's a photo right there of the NassL. this was Fort Lauderdale What happened to Fort Lauderdale?

That's a story of itself. It's pretty damp shady playing New York Cosmos Right there. The complaint alleges that the USSF selectively applied and waives the PLS

criteria to suppress competition from the NSL and benefits MLS. and USL. The SSF granted the NASL professional D2 status

for the 2017 season, but in September of that year, the USSF announced it had denied NSL's application to be sanctioned as a D2 league due to the fact that it could not guarantee

that it would field at least eight teams in 2018. Well, most of those teams were being poached by MLS and

USL. In fact, well, I have you guys here. Let's go to the Wikipedia on

the assuming it wants to cooperate, of course. With Wikipedia org That is not

white types Now, what became of the teams in the NASL is yeah, a couple of them did wind up

in MLS and uh All that. So, N-A-S-L. And we're looking at the 2011-2017 version of this league. Most champions, New York,

champions, San Francisco deltas. The club's in this thing. Well, we have Atlanta silverbacks folded. Cal United FC joins Nisa. Never actually played. FC Edmonton joins the Canadian Premier League. Unfortunately, they folded as well. Fort Lauderdale Strikers.

Yeah, about that. Yeah, that was a pretty messed up situation there. There. Indy United, they joined USL. And by the way, that's a good time also to say, I don't think the Borg is a good metaphor for using to, describe what's going on here. I would use it in Firefly terms, actually.

So, um, L.S and USL would be, uh, the alliance of the big baddies and Firefly whereas NSL and NISA, only independent leagues, uh, would be more akin to, uh, yeah, independence, uh, Malcolm Reynolds.

Tate deals. So, in the 11 they joined the Alliance there we have a Jacksonville Armada joined in PSL and

I'm not sure this does a bad Jacksonville Armada but Miami FC they went it says here they joined the NPSL but then they joined Nisa for a little bit and then

joined the Alliance Missou United MLS, Montreal Impacts, although I've heard they changed their name lately. MLS, Cosmos are in some sort of suspended animation

right now. North Carolina FC, formerly the Carolina Railhawks, joined the Alliance, Oklahoma City FC never played a game by the way Otto Fury

joins the alliance and through a big hissy fit about being about their big hissy fit was about the Canadian Premier League so I know something for them

Puerto Rico FC Folded, Prairieco Islanders Folded, Ryo, Oklahoma City folded, San Antonio Scorpions Folded, that was a mess to one that involves the NBA team.

San Diego 1904 Joints Nisa, merged with another San Diego team, and it's currently on highest Delta's folded. after the one and only season Tampa Bay Routes joins the Alliance

and for J. Cavalry, you have seen never played the game. Which is unfortunate. Which is all a fortunate and all that. But back to the article.

All right. So we were at eight teams in 2018. So Amalais is the only Division 1 league to be sanctioned by U.S. soccer. N.S.O. was founded in 2009 as a Division I hopeful,

but its request was denied in 2016. Both sides have filed motions for summary judgment, but the U.S. District Courts for the Eastern District of New York Judge

Brian and Kogan dismissed. the motions from NASL because there were enough questions of facts that a trial was necessary.

St. Louis NFL, all Oregon. As for motions filed by USSF and MLS, Kogan granted one of their motions, which challenged the NSAIL's assertion that the mere presence of PLS

violated anti-trust law. That part of the case can no longer be litigated, but the second motion put forward by USSF, which challenged NASL's assertion at both USSF and

MLS used the PLS to put NSAL out of business was denied due to competing evidence. Because the parties competing evidence had created issues of material fact at every phase of the

rule of reason analysis, the issue of whether the PLS enforcement unlawfully restraints trade will proceed to trial. And this is way more this next article is way more

recent from Forbes or may as that's more recent. well let's let's figure these guys have to say why is can we please go away with this

pop up so I think this goes a little more detail too in the short of that time we have left the North American Soccer League NASL folded in 2018 because of what

in our use were the empty competitive acts of the U.S.S. Ferderation and MLS after course of recent ruling the NNAS cell will now proceed to September trials.

So I was under the impression this trial was starting in just a couple weeks. Maybe it is I don't know, seeking hundreds of millions of dollars in damages. U.S. soccer is the authority to regulate professional soccer in the U.S. by virtue of its membership in FIFA, the Globes, the sports global governing body,

and by having been recognized as the national governing body, the sport of soccer in the U.S. by the U.S. Olympic and Paralympic Committee. U.S. soccer was responsible for America's first ever hosting of the World Cup in

94. Leading up to and after that World Cup, there was renewed interests in an American men's pro-socer league. Not such league had existed since the original version of the NASL folded in 19,

To provide structure to session efforts in 95, U.S. soccer established professional league standards through which prospective professional leads are classes, Division 1, Division 2, Division 3, and initially with the intention of promotion and relegation. but still they were demarcated by seeing capacity number teams time zone coverage and other benchmarks a league's compliance with the standards is reviewed annually in 94 the u.s. soccer board voted preliminarily to make mLS the sole d1 link there's all not surprising given that an ls application was developed in

submitted by Alan Rothenberg, the U.S. soccer presidents from 1990 to 98. Well, when the MLS began playing in the 96, it meant all the standard, however, as the league expanded in every year from between 97 and 14. It required a waiver as one or more of its clubs were not personally in compliance with the one requirements. And the U.S. soccer always granted the waiver. At the time of L.S.'s launched, there were some pro and semi-pro leagues operating in the U.S. in the 90s, these leagues morphed into. the United

Soccer League, the USL, who can also burn it to help. And they did such a craptacular job that in 2009, a new

NSL was formed by former USL clubs that wanted to challenge MLS as a Division 1 league. And after a combined season with the

USL in 2010, the NASL played as a stand-alone D-2 lead between 2011 and 2017. In 2015, the NASL applied for D-1 status, but were denied by U.S. Soccer, who refused to grant NASL any waivers. Then, in the 2017, U.S. soccer, denied NASL's D2 application, which required two waivers, and by

comparison U.S. soccer granted U.S.S.L's Division II stands, even though it required, 21 waivers. Fucking sick

joke of O'League, I swear I got. Of potential relevance, three years earlier, MLS and USL reached an agreement to coordinate on player development.

Then in, oh, I'm written the same sentence again, without U.S. soccer sanctioning N.S. folded. It also did not help that the league's principal backers pled guilty to fraud charges, that that's a different issue altogether. and Nassau responded by hiring renowned sports litigator Jeffrey Kessler and his team of Winston Strawn LLP. Kessler is responsible for the recent settlements of various antitrust cases between student athletes and NC2A, and also represents promoter relevant sports, and another antitrust case against FIFA and USSF. With Kesson on board, N. ASL sued U.S. Soccer and MLS in the New York federal court, alleging that they had violated an antitrust law. 2017, the court denied NASL's motion for preliminary injunction, tolling the least death knell.

At that stage, the court found that U.S. soccer and MLS had plausibly allege that the arguments between them are pre-pro-competitive because they promote quality in the matches being played in the stadiums in which they are played enhancing fan experience and interest in soccer. The case then proceeded through the discovery process and culminated. with USSF and MIS filing a motion for summary judgment seeking to dismiss the case on its merits in April 21

and in late 23 with that motion is still undecided court ordered a trial to begin September 9 2024 and finally

on June 11, and 224 decision. The league largely denied the plaintiff's motion for summer judgment, penalty for this trial. And courts ruling, so I think we may

have to end with this, but the courts ruling, US soccer and MLS sought to have the case dismissed by arguing that there was no evidence of an agreement by them to apply standards in such a way as to harm the NASL. The court disagreed and found sufficient circumstantial evidence

of parallel conduct by defendants which must be assessed by a jury. First, the courts known that MLS had long been sanctioned as D1, even though it did not uniformly meet its standards. indeed MLS Commissioner Don Garber NFL crony

and U.S. soccer president Sunil Galati also with NFL ties routinely and successfully encourage the U.S.S.S.F. boards to grants MLS every waiver it requested. Secondly,

The court recognized that U.S. Soccer's application of the standards changed at interesting times. Specifically, U.S. Soccer first instituted a formal waiver review process in 2009. The same year, N.A.L. was formed with the intention of challenging MLS. Second, U.S. Soccer made the D-1 standards more difficult in 2014, the same year NASL, made known to U.S. Soccer that plans to apply for D-1 status. The revised standards increased the number of required teams from 10 to 12 and required a team in the Pacific time zone, among the other changes. Third, the court acknowledged the significance of soccer and marketing. And as I alleged, that the effect of the SUM arguments was to tie a significant source of U.S. soccer revenue to the economic value of MLS rights as the sole G1 League. And for there was evidence that's MLS and meaningful.

control over the U.S. Soccer Board and it's decision-making. Yep. There. I just made those permits to the court thusly concluded that NSL had presented evidence that's defendants. Applications of standards have resulted in a reduction and the output of D1D2 leaves because MLS is the only member of the former and USL the latter. Thus, in effect, reduces customer, i.e. soccer team

choices, of which leads to join. Further, NSL had presented evidence that analyzed in USL had been enabled to charge higher expansion team fees because their league memberships are the only products available to purchase of D1, D2.

League memberships. Finally, the courts will entertain NASL's argument as a result of defendants applications of the standards that failed to obtain higher entry fees, suffered a diminished reputation

and goodwill. Ultimately, he had to stop league play. Okay. AMLAS's arguments that NASL was mismanaged is bullshit. And over the objections, the court also generally permitted NASL's planned experts analysis. While the courts request that some justice made,

these analyses estimate combined damages in the area of $400 million. which will be tripled under anti-taxed antitrust law. So 1.2 billion if these charges hold. And as I was pleased with the court's decision, I's looking forward to finally getting to trial. I'm looking forward to it. I had heard it was delayed. I'm looking forward to saying how this trial goes.

and uh we will we are right against the clock so uh with all that out of the way uh we will go and stop share and uh we will be doing this again uh in just a short while so thank you everyone and uh we will talk This podcast. is uncalled for is hosted, produced, and edited by myself, Mike Chernevsky. The opening music is the, this podcast is uncalled for theme created at suno.com. SUNO.com. The outro music for this and every episode in our Snowden 2025 series is Snow Ticket by PC3. License and create of comments by attribution license, you can find this at freemusicarchive.org.

Please support the podcast and purchase our exclusive uncalled-for merchandise, t-shirts, sweatshirts, mugs, stickers, and so much more. Go to www.caffeepress.com slash uncalled for pod. Thank you so much for listening. We will see you next time. Thank you.