This Week in Startups - The virtuous cycle of tech startups, Mr. Beast turns down $1B offer + OK Boomer: Taylor Bell | E1574

Episode Date: October 1, 2022

First up, J+M discuss the virtuous cycle of tech startups (2:15) before breaking down Mr. Beast turning down a $1B acquisition offer for his media business (24:58). Then, Producer Rachel is joined by content creator Taylor Bell to discuss her lessons from growing a brand to 180K+ subscribers while having a full-time job. (39:02) (0:00) J+M tee up today's segments! (2:15) Demystifying "Friends and Family" rounds, history of angel investing (10:32) Athletic Greens - Get 1 year free of Vitamin D and 5 free travel packs with first purchase at athleticgreens.com/twist (11:57) The virtuous cycle of tech startups, angel investing (23:53) Paperclip - Go to getpaperclip.com/twist to get the app free for life (24:58) Mr. Beast turned down a $1B acquisition offer for his media company (33:24) Producer Rachel joins to tee up today's OK Boomer guest! (37:45) MasterClass - Get 15% off an annual membership at https://masterclass.com/startups  (39:02) Taylor Bell joins Producer Rachel to discuss starting and growing a YouTube channel to 180K+ subscribers while having a full-time job FOLLOW Jason: https://linktr.ee/calacanis FOLLOW Molly: https://twitter.com/mollywood FOLLOW Rachel: https://twitter.com/_rachelbraun FOLLOW Taylor: https://youtube.com/taylorbell Subscribe to our YouTube to watch all full episodes: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCkkhmBWfS7pILYIk0izkc3A?sub_confirmation=1

All right, everybody, it is Friday, Friday, we made it, Molly to Friday. Friday. Yay! I have, after listening to you and Lon, so much TV to catch up on, so I'm thrilled that it's Friday because I got. Nothing but work in TV. I got my booster, so I'm having a couch, couch weekend. We've got some fun topics and some news though today.

At least my seventh, maybe ninth booster. I don't even know. We'll talk about the virtuous cycle of early startup employees turning into angel investors after a major acquisition or going public, not like news. but just part of what is so magic, why this tech industry keeps on being so powerful. Yeah, and where it's going. We'll talk a little bit about what that's going to lead to

and the democratization of venture capital writ large. So it's a very interesting moment for society here in the U.S. and capitalism. Totally. And then everything about entertainment is changing, by the way. We're going to talk about Mr. Beasts. It's amazing business and how he evidently turned down a billion dollar offer for his content empire. And that is not crazy at all. Yeah, I mean, I think he's going to build a multi-billion dollar business from here.

And he is a savant who understands a certain generation. And on that note, we'll have Rachel doing another great OK boomer segment. You're going to love this Friday show. Stick with us. Bye-bye. Sorry. You're going to love this Friday show. It's a great episode.

Stick with us. This week in startups is brought to you by Athletic Greens. Reclaim your health and arm your immune system with convenient daily nutrition. Go to Athletic Greens.com slash Twist to get a free one-year supply of immune-supporting vitamin D and five free travel packs with your first purchase. Paperclip. In a downturn, every dollar counts. See where your firm's cash is going and stay on top of your runway with Paperclip.

Go to getpaperclip.com slash twist to get the app for free for life. and Masterclass. Learn from the world's best minds. Anytime, anywhere, and at your own pace. Get 15% off, an annual membership to Masterclass at masterclass.com slash startups. All right, everybody. Happy Friday. Anything in the news?

Nah. Pretty slow. Hold, it's kind of a little sip of this Grande-Laugé. There you go. Bruno Mars. Two words, people. Bruno Mars. Here we go.

What is in the news? There must be something in the... Let's not talk about nuclear war. Let's instead, or any of the other things. Or any of the other things, that will get me in trouble. Although, that's funny, because this one, I feel like, is skating close to the edge. But there was this really interesting piece in Bloomberg about Silicon Valley's sort of virtuous cycle of angel of, like, friends who get rich from tech investing in their friends. And this is kind of like everybody who, exactly, and everybody who does well.

at some tech company, then turning around and writing angel checks to their buddies and how this is getting more and more and more common. And most likely the Figma Boost, the Figma Sale, like, created a whole bunch of new angels. And it's just a, it's an interesting piece about this kind of circle of investment that I thought might be a fun discussion topic for us, because it's sort of cool and great. that friends, very insular, right? Like, it keeps the club tight. Well, here's the thing. You know, if you're raising money for your venture, whatever the venture is, your friends might say, sure, we'd love to put money in.

And because they want to support you, and they trust you, and they know you. So this is not some big deal. This does not require a story. This is something that's always existed because we literally have named around friends and family. So before you can get series A, you either bootchrap your company, which means you pull yourself by your own bootstraps. You don't raise money. You use your own skill as a builder to build a product.

Or you do a friends and family round. So you can do either of those two things. Now, if your friends and your family are in the industry, all the better because they can write bigger checks and they understand what you're doing more. So when you do a friends of family typically, you might be like, hey, I'm starting an internet company. And if your friends and family are not in the internet business, they're like, okay, what am I supposed to do? It's like, put 5K in. Could work for you. So just to demystify this, what happens in Silicon Valley is, well,

if you made a million dollars on your Airbnb stock and a friend from Airbnb starts a company, and like, you know, when you work together for five years and they're like, hey, you should put 10 or 25K into this. Of course you do. Because you made your million dollars in your RSUs and restricted stock options, whatever. They're, they're not. actually units, but yeah, think about restricted stock options. So yeah, no big deal. This is what's always happened.

Why this is interesting now, I'm not sure. I'm not sure what the newspeg is here, but I did write a book about Angel investing and start a course when this happened the last time, which was during the Uber mania. I think, I suspect that it's becoming more of a story as, and we've talked about this,

like venture the industry, is getting more mainstream, right? Like, there's more awareness of it because of the weed work show and the dropout show and the democratization, exactly. And actually, according to Pitchburg, Pitchburg, Pitchblerc.

Erma Gerd, Perchburg. Oh, my God, it's Friday. We're delusion it. Just, according to Pitchbook, 449. You're such a consummate professional. The fact that I have one blooper in six months of you mispronouncing something with my dyslexia and inability

to pronounce even the smallest names is absolutely fair. So it took six months, folks, but if you bet, actually, if you took the over on six months for Molly to make a mistake, you win the show. I can't stop laughing at Ermager, Perchberg now. I'm just going to, I'm going to call it that forever. Don't you know. Hermagher, Perchberg. Don't you know.

What was that movie Fargo? I used to do a great Fargo. Oh, yeah. Anyway, what does Pittsburgh say? I lived in North Dakota for eight years. Like, if you need a Fargo, I can give you a tight five. No problem. Perchberg says 400, bless you.

to you. Sorry. Thank you. 449 micro investment funds or $50 million and less in assets. That's not micro is under $5 million, but okay. I think so. But 449 of those were raised in 2021, which was 100 more than in any previous year. So basically, a lot more people are getting in the venture game.

And I think a lot more are getting there via angel investing. Yes. Because it's literally what I wrote in my book. I literally wrote a playbook for this. I said, invest in 20 year friends if you're here or 20 syndicates. And really, if you want to know the archaeology of this, it goes back to a man named Ron Conway. Now, Ron Conway became what's called a Super Angel. He raised a microfund, and that microfund invested in Google.

And then famously, he was affiliated with Paul Graham. This is, you know, in the 2005 era. And then in 2008, 2009, myself and an individual named Naval Ravacant started getting into this. Naval was doing venture hacks. I was doing Open Angel Forum. They were both the same thing. Navajo would send an email. Here's a list of deals that are open.

And here's an article on how to write a term sheet. And then I did Open Angel Forum where Uber and other people came and pitched in person. And I had a hard time finding 10 angel investors back then. Then I wrote a book explaining how to be an angel investor called Angel. And then did Angel University and taught that 30 times for charity. We've now raised almost 200,000 for charity. So anyway, it's become a bit of a known practice. It's been professionalized as a class.

So there is now a professional class of angels. And hey, Bloomberg's on it. Great. Last year, Angel is introduced a tool, making it easier for investors to bet small amounts. Like, I think you just have this. Yeah, that tool was from 10 years ago. Good. Rising.

Maybe it was the Figma thing that made him write about it now. I don't know. It was interesting. It's always a good story. I'll tell you what's always a good story as a journalist. It's always a good story to talk about insiders. people are fascinated with how this thing works from the inside out and they're always fascinated by networks and getting in early on things

so it's it's you know and there was a big acquisition so there's more like every time there's money sloshing around there were a bunch of stories like this actually when we work was going to go public and it was like what's going to happen when all that money it's basically like ermigurd urnjel's well i mean i knew that and when i did my book i said here's a title for you how i turned 100,000 into 100 million. That'll catch people's attention. And of course, that's the dream is I made this microscopic bet and it, you know, was over a thousand X. That does happen. It will happen for

the Figma investors as well, depending on, you know, I don't know if that round was five or 25 million, but they'll have a 500 or a thousand or 2000 X. So congratulations. This happens all the time. Networks are there. You could take credit for like planting the seeds of something that has now blossomed into a bona fide super trend. I would say Ron Conway, Paul Graham, you know, kind of got the ball rolling on this because Paul Graham did those demo days and Ron Conway, you know, was like very impressively, it was just very quick to put 25, 100K into anything and would do it, you know, I remember at some point, some M&A person made fun of Ron Conway to me. And they said like, yeah, Ron Conway is like

Huckster, you know, he opened up his spreadsheet in an M&A meeting and pulled up his list of 50 companies and was explaining, you know, which ones we could acquire, what. And I thought to myself, well, that's dope. This guy has information and has placed 50 bets. My mind was kind of blown. It was like a real inception moment for me. And so what Ron Conway did was he showed the negative way of looking at it was spray and prey. The intelligent way of looking at it was diversification in order to hit outliers.

So I think people were kind of dumb making fun of Ron Conway because that actually is a pretty great strategy. If you know there's a power law, placing five bets is not what you should do. You should place 50 like Ron Conway did. And then you hit Google or whatever and it makes up for the other ones. Listen, you know I've been on a health kick and what's a critical part of my health kick? It's Athletic Greens with one scoop of athletic green AG1 formula. You're absorbing 75 high quality, vitamins, minerals, probiotics and more to help you start your day off right. It's so easy. One scoop, mix it with a little water, shake it up, and then have that incredible, sustainable power for the rest of your day.

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And to make it even easier, Athletic Greens is going to give you a free one-year supply of immune-supporting vitamin D and five free travel packs with your first purchase. All you have to do is visit athletic greens.com slash twist. Again, athletic. Greens.com slash twist, take ownership of your health and pick up the ultimate daily nutritional insurance. It is interesting, though. Nick was pointing out, it's interesting because it's in some ways a unique advantage of the tech ecosystem, right? Which is that every time there's a distribution of equity, it cycles right back into this. It's sort of like why Silicon Valley will always still have power. It's why the tech industry will always have disadvantage because it'll cycle

right back into this same industry and create this virtuous cycle that just sort of keeps it going. People who make a lot of money in this industry placing a bet, a fortuitous bet, a lucky bet, whatever it happens to be,

a brilliant bet, will then make more bets. And they create more millionaires, billionaires, sent to millionaires, decadionaires, who then place more bets. The problem is in some societies, like I had somebody in Italy

explained to me that when people got rich in Italy, like these families, they would never bet again. They would just keep all the money inside the family. They would never spread the wealth. They would never take more risk. They would just keep it inside their family.

So there are other networks where people make a bunch of money and they don't put ladders down behind them. What we do in our industry is we get kind of frisky. Okay, I won a big bet. I won a lottery ticket. There must be more lottery tickets out there. Yeah. So if you believe it's totally random and you got lucky

and the chances of you getting lucky again are like zero. and this was just a totally one-off case, then you would, the right thing to do would be to say, I'll never invest in another startup. I'll just consolidate all this wealth and put it into real estate or something safe. Yeah. But if you're here in the Valley and you see this happening,

you're like, oh, this wasn't random. I'm good at this. Right. And there'll be more of these. And lightning strikes a lot of times in the valley. We live in a lightning storm. We live in a lightning storm. Ooh, that's fun.

That's a good mug. Like literally, our job is to have a bunch of bottles and to stand out there in the lightning storm and just catch lightning. We're just trying to catch lightning here. And we do it as a factory, right? And that's a great thing for society, because we will create more value in society by doing this. It's awesome that there's an angel class.

And I want to do it now for LPs and funds. So my next decade, first act, you know, was doing this with angels. Now that we have so many of them, I want to do it with fundraising. And so what's happened that's really interesting is with these 11,000 members of the syndicate and the two podcasts. I started tweeting, hey, we're raising launch fund three.

Oh, I'm sorry, launch fund four. And we did the 506B. You and I have talked about this on the show. We just hit 30 million in commitments

after three webinars, so 10 million a webinar. And so the reason I'm talking about here it's not a flex. It's more about, we're always going to be able to raise a fund.

I've got a pretty good track record. Some people might say great, but anyway, I'll just say pretty good track record. We work hard. We got a good process. We got a good thesis for the future. We're going to raise another fund.

But the fact that we were able to raise essentially what took me a year for the first fund we raised three X stat in three webinars yeah three hours in the second fund yeah and so actually

we raised more in three hours in what took 18 months for the first two funds that was 20 million combined so we did 30 50% more in three hours and we'll blow past what we did in the last fund in the same thing because we have

existing LPs who are going to re-up and haven't even started talking to them yet so long story short I'd like to democratize this. And then the thing I was thinking was, hmm, if this works so well and we fill up, well, then at some point, we could do a fund to funds. So I also have unique access to funds.

And I'm in 20 funds. So what if I did? What's called the fund to funds? I said to this group of people, hey, we're going to raise 50 million to put in 10 funds, five million each on average. But it might be like, you know, some younger funds we might put in one to two million,

some other ones we might put in 10. So we could actually do a fund to funds. We could actually then democratize access to venture funds. with our unique ability or knowledge. So it's sort of in my head. I love that. I love that. Also, like, I could totally see if you're a medium net worth individual where, like, I'd be all

about the LP thing as opposed to the angel thing because it helps me spray. It helps me with that diversification that you're talking about. Spray and pray, right? Like, if I'm an angel, it helps me spray and pray. It helps me get more, like, kites in the air with metal attached to them. Yes. You got more connectivity. I really want

conductivity. Conductivity. Conductivity. I want team t-shirts that say professional lightning catcher. Exactly. That's a good.

Literally we just have like a picture of Molly like grabbing a lightning bolt out of the sky. I think it's, you know, being an LP in a fund is slightly different

because you don't meet the companies. You're not making individual decisions, but it does build your network. And so that's a great part of it because when you know, when you know a GP of a fund, you know their entire network.

So, and this is what creates this weird, you know, we have all these people, you know, sparring with each other on Twitter and, you know, VCs and other people, journalists dunking on VCs,

VCs, dunking on journalists, founders in the middle, mommy and daddy, police stop fighting, all this stuff going on. And then what's really happening underneath it is we're all LPs in each other's funds. We're all trying to place bets together.

We're all trying to build companies, grow things, and support each other. and, you know, listen, we're basically, you know, ride or die with each other to a certain extent. Just to use the term. As some might say. As some might say. In case you're wondering if this is an insular society, everyone, it is.

It 100% is. And like, you can join at any time. And if you were, if you are the entrepreneur in Minnesota who wants to raise that $10,000 friends and family round, then you need to watch the blueprint that Jason did. Yeah. About expanding your network. This week in startups.com slash the blueprint. It's a closed network that anybody.

can join. Yes. So, you know, this is where people overthink it. So many VCs have some origin story about a company that involves it was a cold email. Of course. Right. Like this is, I actually really wholeheartedly, and I say this as the newbie, agree and believe that it is a closed network that anyone can join because all you need is hustle. Like all you need is outreach. And the right amount of outreach legitimately works. You get somebody's attention with a great idea no matter where you are. If I have my red flag is on the other side of the room, I was going to run over and get it and just say narrative violation. You know, there could be two things that are true at once. Thank you. I'll flag myself. Well, here's a thing. Now that you're on the inside, you see it a little bit clearer

because you have, you have now, dare I say, you're getting towards a 360 worldview. You haven't, I don't think, been a founder of a company. That's venture backed. But you now have the journalist view, and the investor view. Now, I have the journalist view, the investor view, and a founder view. And so when you start putting these views together,

you can see the whole chess field, the whole chess board, right? And this is what the great awakening for you has been, now being on the other side of the table, it's just wonderful to watch. The world could seem like a bunch of closed networks,

of course, right? And Hollywood is one. You know, finance is one, ventures one, startups, whatever, pick fashion, I'm sure, media. But what you have to ask yourself is how hard is it to infiltrate each one of these? Now, to infiltrate Hollywood is insurmountable.

Like, that's incredibly hard. Fashion? Yeah, that's pretty hard too. But I guess you could make some fashion designs and sell them yourself on Etsy and you could start to break in maybe. Exactly. I don't know the exact career path there. In so many of those other industries, it's all side routes. Like, the way you circumvent Hollywood is you become a YouTube creator, right?

Like, you become Mr. Bese, who we're going to talk about in a minute. Issa Ray. Exactly. Like, you just... Awkward black girl. You have to be a channel. What was her original channel called? Awkward.

Was that her? And then she got a show. Yeah, Issa Ray. Let me just see here. Ysa Ray. But our industry, I think, is actually, and by our industry, I mean, both tech and B.C. Right. VC is not easy to break into.

It is becoming more and more democratized legitimately. So, for people who... Pretty close. but tech in general. Yeah. Come on. Anybody can do this. Anybody can get into this industry.

Yeah. So here's the thing. Awkward black girl. Thank you. Awkward black girl, yeah. So, gosh, you know, you hate to even say this stuff because it triggers so many people. The world can be at the same time, unfair, biased, cruel, and unbelievably beautiful and never being more fair at the same time.

So we could hold in our heads these two different ideas. The world is unfair, but it's never been more fair. And that's what I tried to explain to people. Yes, is there systematic bias, racism, classism, ageism, whatever you want to pick, racism outright? And then could it also be more open than it's ever been? Yes. So what are we here to do?

Complain about this? Sure, you want to, is it a news? to anybody that it's unfair? I don't think so. And that there's bias in the world. So you can talk about it, but everybody knows it already. Of course, it's rigged.

It's unfair. So why not focus on the ladder part, which is, the ladder is, hmm, you can just show up with a ladder and climb right in and do it.

So that's what I like to sort of encourage people to think about. More than one thing in your mind at the same time, I beg you. It can cause dissonance. exactly well and people really want to we have a negative negativity bias is a real thing

yes that humans suffer from and we want to over you know we want everything we want the perfect to be the enemy of the good all the time and in fact there is a lot of good happening and we can even improve upon the good right we can continue to amplify the good and do the best we can and whatever because the rest is just people i was literally having this conversation with a friend today who was like, I looked at too much Twitter today and I need help. And I was like, you know what? This is just humans. There's not a like, there's no story arc in the universe that ends with like, and then everything was fine. It's all the story. The story is just always happening in good things happen and bad things happen and that's that. I mean, now is now people. Eckhart Tolly. Now is now.

Be it. Yeah. Just focus on now. You want to be. This is my Eckartolin. If one seeks peace, one should not read the comments. I'm like, I'm trying to listen to it, but he just lowers his voice and trails off. I tried to listen to it. And then the space between words increases and I'm like, what is the next? happening. Bono.

I tried to listen to it. And I just, I created the ultimate Eckertoli impersonation like years ago and we just troll her on it. She was like, what should we have dinner? I'm like, I wonder if

Italian is too often the default answer. And then you go. She was, I mean, she really got to. I was really got upset.

In between every chapter, there was like a ding that made me lose my mind. It made my eyeball explode. And I had to stop listening to it. And then I put it on speaker. And then the dogs thought that the ding was a doorbell ringing. And so they would go ape doodle barking at it. And I was like, this is not relaxing. Founders, when you know your numbers at your startup like the back of your hand,

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That's right. It's typically 30 bucks a month. But if you use my link, you get a free for life. There's no downside. Go to getpaperclip.com slash twist today. Let's talk about hacking media for a minute for our last big story of the day. news broke today via business insider and via Mr. Beast himself, by the way, real name Jimmy Donaldson saying on a podcast that he has turned down at some point here in his career a billion dollar offer. Yeah.

A billion dollar acquisition deal for his content empire. And he said, if you want to come for the Mr. Beast business, you need to start the bidding at $10 billion. the end. I know Jimmy. I know his business dealings intimately. He, yeah, he's making like nine figures in advertising revenue. Yeah. And media companies are typically not worth that much, but his is growing and is worth that and has the brand extensions. And Mr. Beast Burger, the delivery service was kind of shaky, but then he opened up an actual store with a really good burger. And that had like tens of thousands of people or 10,000 people showed up or something

insane like that. So it is a very growing business. And I think, influences equal distribution and he has the most followers therefore he is a massive distribution channel in the same way Kim Kardashian is so the same way Kim Kardashian's skims Molly became a billion dollar business and so did her fragrance became hundreds of millions

or Kanye West as an influencer himself his Yeezy brand became worth over a billion this is the new influences our distribution period full stop and if you look at what is the thing to do in direct to consumer or any consumer business, it's to get distribution. So you can just basically take that out, which is why I believed, you know, if you had a social

network that was underperforming, if you could in some way draw these people to that social network, you could maybe revitalize social networks that didn't have people like Mr. Beast participating in them, you know, in a primary fashion. So, you know, this is why like I always felt if you didn't have YouTube-like features in your social network, Facebook and other social network should really target trying to get that YouTube business, uh, because that is a really great business to get people to publish original content to your platform.

I mean, it is pretty startling how only YouTube, early, initially, right? Yeah. Understood. And maybe even lucked into the creator economy. They shared revenue.

It wasn't luck. And then they started to share revenue. Well, yeah, but I mean, like, at some point they realized, and it was, to be fair, it was because creators were saying like, hey, you seem to be making a lot of money off of us and we're just doing all this user generated content for free. And like, maybe we could work out a little something. Something YouTube was like receptive to it, right? Yes, let's do that. They built a creator studio. They created a redshirt. They embraced it. They embraced it. Exactly. And if you look at how long it took Instagram to even acknowledge its creators, let alone. They still haven't really helped to pay them, and they still don't help them and they still don't help them make money. No, most Instagram creators, one, have gone to YouTube or TikTok.

Yes. And make money off of like brand deals. There's not a real Retshare component at all. They make it off platform. Yeah. This is where, you know, a new entrant or one of these existing social networks could really, really do some damage

if they went to this category of influencer and said, hey, we'll give you 100% of the revenue. for the first couple years. Hey, not only we give you 100% of revenue, we'll promote you, we'll get you more reviews than those other places because that is a secret weapon that some people have is the ability to promote them.

So if you look at Spotify, they kind of did this playbook with Rogan and Call Her Daddy. They said, we'll take all the risk out, we'll give you all of the, what you're going to make in the next five years in advertising. We'll guarantee it, right?

They guaranteed the Caller Daddy and the Joe Rogan shows that they would be sold out. Yep. So they took that risk. not a lot of risk for them to take, is it? Because they know they're going to make back 60, 70, 80, 90, 100, maybe even

150% of it if they do it right. And then they have the promotion spiket that they can point at whoever they want. And you know who had the opportunity to do this and just completely, just very recently crapped the bed is Twitch. I don't know if you talked about this, but Twitch is cutting the creator revenues.

They should big time, like for everybody. They should do the opposite. They should do the opposite. Exactly. They had an opportunity to really swoop in and scoop up all of these like disinprint, you know, because everybody's mad at YouTube all the time. Like there's an opportunity here for like you're saying, the right network to like get it together. Absolutely. If the right network that was underperforming or under monetized compared to

their contemporaries, if, for example, could in some way, you know, listen, I know, I know Jimmy, but I don't know if other networks know Jimmy personally, but if they did and they put a deal in front of him, who knows? Maybe they could get somebody like that to actually embrace it or maybe even somebody like a musician who is not active on there, but is active on TikTok. Like if you look at Justin Bieber, super active on TikTok, super active on other platforms, not active on certain other platforms. Why is that? They maybe not give them any incentive to do it.

We're creeping. We're creeping. I'm just, I'm just saying. But if you look at, by the way, one of the reasons that Mr. Beast believes that his network and his business empire overall could be worth $10 or $20 billion, it's because of all of the things we just said. and skims I looked up

is as of this year now worth $3.2 billion evidently. And then what he's also evidently working on a game has hired a developer to build out a mobile strategy game for iPhone and Android.

So there will be this reach. There will be the burger business. There's the feastables thing. There's a gaming empire. All of these things have the potential to work. And we've got to put out quality product. And each of them has a different, here's the rub.

Each of these things, these are not software in some cases. So, you know, how you value a media company is typically two to five times revenue. Now, Jimmy might get a premium because he's number one, right? Or he's number one or number two on YouTube now. I'm not sure. I know he had that like back and forth with the other video game guy.

So anyway, if you're number one or two, you will get a premium, right? The premium brands like HBO will get a higher evaluation because they're premium. So, okay, maybe you make the media business is worth seven times revenue, top line, and maybe 20 times bottom line. So could very conceivably be a billion dollar media company right now. So if it had 50 million of profits on 100 million, 20 times that is a billion. If you gave them seven times and it had 125 or something,

just picking a number out of the air, worth a billion. Yeah. Okay, what is a burger chain worth? Well, you just have to look up Shaitchak, right? And you can, Shayshack has a certain number of, you know, you know, locations to hit that number,

certain amount of revenue. So you just pull these things together. Shake Shack currently worth 1.8 billion. So if he becomes Shakeshack, there's a long way to go, but it's possible. Right. Okay, now you add $2 billion for that, a billion for the media business.

You're at $3 billion. Okay, if the video game, there are analogies for video games. You just look at Roblox. You could look at Zinga. Okay, that's worth another billion. So, you know, you put a collection of assets together. He's not inventing this.

You know, it's not, he's a very shrew, he has a plan. He has a very shrewd capitalist with a very ruthless plan. And we'll be sitting here in like, you know, a year or two going, is this the Yahoo,

when Yahoo turned down Microsoft? Or is this like, he's a genius and, and it's good that he didn't say. He's a gene. I think he's a media genius. I think he really is a savant when it comes to making content people want.

He studies it. He's hard working. He does burn money like a drunk and seller. I will say that. He does that. What is that. Like, which he brags about,

right? Which he brags about. This video costs a million dollars to make. But it's like, this would be a nice, like, you know, this would be what vice.

was supposed to be. Remember the brand vice was going to have all these brand extensions, TV shows or whatever, it was going to be a network eventually, never got there. This is like, I think for that generation will be their vice or HBO, or Marvel or Disney. It could be like their Disney. Like, you could go to Mr. Beast World would be packed. Like, if he literally did a theme park, Mr. Beast World, it would be packed. It could be, it's like Lego, right? It could be like Legoland. So congratulations to him and a great job. And that's another great week in the book. Yeah. Let's bring on Ray for OK Boomer.

All right. Rachel is here. Rachel reporting. How are you doing, Rachel? I'm doing good. How about you? Bri, yay. How's your life in New York?

It is good. Molly made a good point. We were on a call earlier. It's definitely getting louder. A lot more people are in cars, so it's getting colder in New York. Oh, okay. The sound in Rachel's apartment is an excellent indicator of both economic activity and

weather. Yeah. Like lots of people out on the street. It's true. And now it's cold, so they're in their. cars. Do you have like headphones you wear or a sound machine? I used to wear headphones sometimes to bed. Sometimes I have an I mask and I have my Amazon like plays rain music. That's what I'm using now. Excellent. Oh like you have your Amazon Echo play rain music. Yeah. Correct. Even though it's

I know. I was afraid to say any. New York gets freezing cold, man. There are some that I remember those Februarys. I would be wearing two pairs of socks, Molly with the boots. And I would be on the subway platform. and you're standing on concrete and those socks would last about, I don't know, 10 minutes and then all of a sudden your feet are frozen solid. You get into the subway car

and it's 107 degrees. It's Bickram Yoga. And so everybody gets in the subway car starts taking it off their jackets. You're sweating, big it out, it's freezing again. Rachel, is this going to be your first winter in New York? No, last winter was my first one, but because of the All In Summit, I actually

I moved to New York in January and I was between here in New York, between here in Miami, a lot. So this is going to be my first. You spent half the winter in Miami. Yeah. You were like a snowbird.

Okay. I love it. Quite charming in New York. Quite charming in New York when it's winter. You get a nice coat and you get a French onion soup. Can we go like, I think I'd like to propose while I have you on camera and you might have to be on the record here.

Can we go like the week before Thanksgiving and do a meetup in New York? Because fall in New York is the best. Oh, so wonderful. Let's do it. We'll go to a Knicks game. Let's do it. Done. Sounds good to me. I knew this is going to work. Who do you got this week? Who do you got? So this week, I have Taylor Bell on. She's a business-focused content creator, and I've been having a lot of creators on recently,

but I realized that all of them were doing it full-time. That probably wasn't super applicable to people listening to my segment of the show if they were young people looking to kind of break into the space, or people that were young founders looking to, like, advertise a little bit more and use marketing tactics for their startups. They're probably not, like, creating content full-time. They're probably focusing on their business. So Taylor was a great person to have on.

She talks about being a management consultant while being a very successful YouTube creator. I love this is no shade on makeup or funny, making fun of people who buy candles, like this TikTok series that went viral. But like the idea of a business focus for this content, I think is great. That's great. I love her content. I wish there was more. She's somebody who I feel is a great role model for young girls that are really interested in like lifestyles content. I don't think she's like promoting like overconsumption anyway. If she doesn't talk about management consulting, she's talking about traveling. Overall, great creator puts a lot of time and effort in her videos and I think you're right. It's a little bit has a little bit more substance and like takeaways at least that I prefer in my content. Just amazing how being a content creator opens so many doors.

for people now. Like, when I see somebody, they've done, you know, 10 of these shorts, TikToks, whatever, reels, and you're like,

wow, the person has charisma. They can communicate. It is the new communication platform. I was literally on a board call with developers, and they're like, when we send people to a text document, they say,

where's the videos? And so we're going to hire a TikToker to explain how to use our dev kit. And I'm like, really? Developers want to learn through 90-second videos. Okay, fine.

I want to watch cooking videos that are 90 seconds that teach me how to make a salad perfectly. So I think this new format is here to stay and 90-second to, you know, three-minute content, you know, T-LDR of YouTube videos is here. And Rachel's got her finger on the pulse, as always. All right, enjoy everybody. Enjoy.

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just go to masterclass.com slash startups. Once again, masterclass.com. You know how to spell that. That's easy. Slash startups for 15% off the masterclass annual membership. Okay, Boomer. I understood the assignment. Thank you so much, Taylor, for coming on this segment of OK Boomer.

I got to meet Taylor when I was moderating my first event, which was super duper cool. I think I talked about it a few weeks ago. her along with former guest Danny Miranda and actually another former guest, Nate O'Brien, were there. So Taylor's a friend of a friend and I'm super happy to have you on. Thanks for having me. I didn't realize that was your first time moderating. You killed it. Yeah. Thank you. I really want to keep doing them in IRL like these IRL moderating events. It's funny, Jason, who is my boss and the host of the show, him along with Molly Wood.

they both have like moderated IRA like events in the past and before COVID that was something they did like a little bit more frequently. So now I want to get like on the moderating train I think. I think it's really fun. I love that. Yeah. Follow on their footsteps. I like it. Right. I'm like you know, I'm already learning from them so much in podcasting.

I might as well learn how to interview people in real life because I feel like it's a little bit more stressful and I don't know. Hopefully it'll make me a better like eat podcaster at the end of the day if I learn how to do like moderating with like a live audience. I'm sure. Yeah, you can't edit that. So right. And then in speaking of editing, I wanted to have you on today because you are a amazing YouTuber and management consultant. And you recently, I see it right behind you, got that YouTube

plaque. So tell the audience, what does the plaque mean? The plaques for 100,000 subscribers. Yeah, that came in the mail. I came in the mail like three weeks after, or even more, like weeks and weeks after I hit it. And now I'm approaching 170. So the growth has just, yeah, it's insane. That is a J-cur. yeah dudes congratulations so you are very very awesome the i definitely have like a timeline of things i want to go and talk to you about but the big gist of this is we've spoken to quite a few different content creators on the podcast like i said we've spoken to nate o'brien who um does investing alongside being a creator danie miranda who does full-time podcasting jules turpac is an amazing

commentator and does a bunch of other side projects um Way back when we talked to the Morning Brew's Dan Tumie, who's the guy that makes the TikToks for Morning Brew. He's hilarious. And we also spoke to Ben Awad, who is a content creator for like computer sciencey kind of things over on YouTube and TikTok. And I believe he also is a startup. But the only person, basically, I have not been able to cover is somebody that is a content creator and has a full-time job. And I think it's very interesting where we see these influx of young children, especially around our age. people maybe that are even coming into adulthood, really wanting to be full-time creators.

And I don't meet a lot of people that are balancing like the 9 to 5 along with it. So you're a great example. And I want to hear your thoughts, how you do it, and any advice you have. But first things first, how did you get into management consulting and how did you get in the YouTube? Yeah. So I guess starting with management consulting, well, first of all, to cover kind of the umbrella question there, it is hard to balance the two. but I'll get into the details. As for management consulting,

just the school that I went to, it was Wharton Business School. And so pretty much, I don't want to put a percentage on it, but a very high percentage of everyone that comes out of Wharton goes, rather the finance route, the tech route,

or the consulting route. So, I mean, admittedly, definitely hopped on the bandwagon, even tried my hand at finance, as you and I have talked about for like a couple internships, a couple, you know,

summers, my sophomore and junior summer, realized that wasn't quite for me, or at least, you know, I was interested in the finance space, but I'm not sure that's what I wanted to go full, full time in. And I figured, consulting from what I knew about, it did seem to kind of play to my strengths a little bit more, you know, a little more client facing, a little more creative. I don't know, maybe in hindsight, I wouldn't, I wouldn't say creativity is like one of the number one things per se, but it did interest me. And I figured, you know, I'd go for it. I interviewed and I got a job there. And so, yeah, I was at my first consulting job for a little over a year. I actually left a few months ago.

So I've been doing YouTube full time for a couple months, but I do have another corporate job and consulting lined up. So I start in about a month. And it's a tough balance. So anyway, that's how I got into consulting. And then YouTube was actually a little more of a less streamlined story. It was during quarantine. So for my first consulting job, I chose the latest possible start date so that way I could

travel after graduating from college. You know, I had when else would I have that time? And then COVID hit. So I can no longer travel. I was at home, just at my parents' house in L.A., and just wanted something productive to do, you know, ideally a way to make a little money and just, you know, keep myself busy basically for that full year that I basically had off. And so I started flipping clothes.

And I know it's funny. I think you're the one who mentioned to me that people who flip clothes, there's like a high correlation with them starting a business. That is my theory. That is my theory. And I'm putting a stamp on it. I also do reselling. I love it.

I'm a posh cart, like Poshmark eBay, girlie till I die. I swear. Amazing. That is, there has to be a correlation. I bet there is because it is a very entrepreneurial thing. Like you get addicted to it. Oh, I am. I fully am.

It's so bad. Dude, totally. Same here. And Poshmark is such a great app. It's so user-friendly. I know they take a higher percentage, blah, blah. But anyway, that's the side hustle that I started when I had my time off. And, you know, after some time, I realized that the way I was becoming a better reseller is

through YouTube videos. people, you know, making and talking about brands that sell and all that good stuff. So that's how I entered YouTube is through reselling videos. And then eventually just, you know, it was a long journey, but basically once I got a bigger audience, I just started to expand my type of content, talking about management consulting, kind of the Ivy League experience did pretty well for me, you know, talking about that in the beginning. And then now talking about New York City lifestyle and some personal finance things and a good little mix of everything. So yeah. That's awesome. And Why do you think it's important to have content creators out there as examples that do also have a nine to five job and aren't just full-time creators?

It's a good question. It's a tough balance for sure, especially with consulting, which is more like a, you know, 12-hour minimum work day. I guess it depends. It can be less. But my philosophy with so many things I'm now noticing these days is that it doesn't have to be all or nothing. I guess in some cases it definitely helps. Like if I just did one or the other, I'd be able to put myself fully into it versus splitting my time a little bit between the two. But, you know, as someone who's risk averse and I talk about this in my videos, but I just enjoy the idea of being able to reap the benefits from both.

So I get my kind of creativity from YouTube and learning ins and outs of like running my own business in so many ways. But then with consulting, you do have that built in stability, kind of that built in social context and definitely some, you know, credibility within the business world as well. And it's like a good, I don't want to call it a fallback. because it's a great job. But kind of getting best of both worlds is just something that I personally value. And I'm sure, you know, setting that example to show that you can do both would speak to a lot of people who kind of probably think the same way that I do. Yeah. I feel like I hear a lot of people who try to do this talk about on like the risks of burnout.

Are you doing anything to kind of mitigate that and make sure that, like, you don't fall into that bucket? It happened for sure. And it still does, even though I'm in the period of doing YouTube full time. but, you know, for me, it really just came down to posting less frequently because, you know, it's interesting because with consulting, let's say you have four hours at the end of the day free. It's not, in theory, yeah, there's enough time of the day to do both. I could then start filming a video or start writing a video, but ultimately if I have literally just four hours to myself, I'm not going to switch over like that to kind of the content

creation mindset. So I did get burnt out sometimes. But really what that just manifested in was me deciding to take that four hours for myself and not forcing myself to make a video. So really just yeah, I came down to me posting once every three weeks or are not super frequently. Plus, I also, one thing I've also noticed I do is I won't compromise on quality. I know some content creators really, really say, you know, quantity, quantity, especially in the beginning, just throw everything out there. I can make an argument for both. I've always focused on quality, I would say, especially in the last like six months. So if that means I post less frequently, but it's a banger every time or like I hope it is, you know? Yeah. And it feels like I'm really dropping an

episode, like something, something really good. That's kind of what I value a little bit more. So I'm glad that goes hand in hand with doing the consulting at the same time. Yeah. No, that definitely doesn't. It's funny because that contradicts what I fellow podcaster and one of our friends, Danny Miranda has previously set on the show. And she very, very well-knownly posts a bunch of TikToks, like something crazy, like 10 a day. Like, don't quote me on it, but something insane. So for him and I'm not saying those aren't, those aren't quality because he's in a different bucket where that is his full-time role and that's his full-time thing that he's doing. But that is such a different mindset where he is more like looking at content in terms of the algorithm and getting

his name out there and you're more looking at it as putting quality content out there. Have you ever tried to venture into other mediums like TikTok that maybe favor that quantity more than quality? You know, I actually, I haven't really. I've posted a few shorts, like short form content. And it's funny you ask because I don't know if you notice. I had one on Instagram pop off. It was just like a silly little video. A silly video of me sitting right here and then the window I'm on, you know, very high up and high rise. Not even a window washer. I'm not sure. A mechanic of some sort, but a guy literally right outside my window. And then I just filmed, you know, me kind of giggling to him and he did a piece sign. And it had, it has 15.5 million

views on my Instagram reel. Which is insane. And then on TikTok, it's out like three you're, I haven't checked in a while, but three, three million, something like that. It's crazy. It just popped up. But to answer your question, no, I've never done it like consistently. It's just, so the three, I think, YouTube shorts I've made, I put on my Instagram reels and I do have it, like I made a TikTok just to put them there. But no, I haven't really ventured into it.

I know it's a good strategy for growth. We've also talked about this. But I don't know. I can't. I can. I just haven't, I guess, really gone into that world too much yet. Yeah. I mean, it makes sense for the.

of content that you, I actually am a giant, I don't know if you are, but I was a giant YouTube junkie. I didn't, to be honest, watch that much lifestyle, but I did love commentary. So I knew, for example, Jules Turpec, who I've mentioned multiple times down in this conversation, I knew of her content before even meeting Jules and becoming her friend because I love that style of content where it's just commentary on recent events and things like that. I don't think that necessarily translates along with videos on reselling and like tips and tricks and things like that, I don't feel like I get that full experience going over to short form content. If you could give somebody advice on trying to create a YouTube channel, not trying to venture out in a different avenues like TikTok,

what advice would you have for them? Yeah. So, I mean, the first thing that I always say, it's simple, it seems obvious, but I feel like a lot of people don't even actually do this. it's to create content about something you actually are very passionate about because, I mean, I know it seems obvious, but like, I mean, day one, you're just going to quit if it's not something that you actually enjoy talking about. Yeah. So starting there. Second would be, I actually, I have thought about this recently. That's where I would start. Second, it depends on the niche you're in. If you have really searchable content, maybe this doesn't apply as much. But I posted my first video on my Facebook page, which, you know, all across my personal Instagram and all that because I knew, or at least I thought, that it really wouldn't get any views unless my peripheral people who actually knew me and who would actually watch me would watch it. So I just got like, I put it on my Facebook and, you know, people from elementary school and middle school who I haven't seen in so long probably were just like, oh, interesting. And I clicked.

And I got like, you know, 900 views in the first day on that video, which is, you know, huge numbers for just starting a channel. I mean, I was happy with it anyway. So really just not being afraid to put yourself out there because I know that most people's number one fear with starting a channel is like, well, it's embarrassing. What if this so-and-so finds it? It's like your goal is to, you know, presumably to grow. And, you know, it could be other, other things also if you're just doing it for fun. But if your goal is to grow, like ultimately, you want as many eyeballs as you can get. So anyway, just, yeah, starting with something you're

passionate about. And then I would say posting across your social media platforms worked really well for me. So it's like similarly to starting a startup, I guess, and creating a YouTube channel or putting any content out there. It is like really daunting. to think about, like, just from a personal stance, like, oh, like, what are people going to think? Because you really are putting yourself out there. And not that many. I always think about when I'm, like, scrolling through TikTok or if I'm on YouTube, and I sit and I, like, I'm judging somebody's content where I'm like, I have they

could have done this better. And I'm like, you know what? Like, how many creators are there versus how many consumers are there? Like, it takes so much to be a creator. It takes so much to be a founder. It takes so much to, like, start your own venture in any sense. So I like that frame of reference But what advice would you give to people

That are really nervous About having their friends and family See their content And why weren't you nervous? Good question. And you're putting it on Facebook. That's a jump. It takes, that is a jump, you're right? And you're right, like to your point, it takes balls.

It really does. And people don't realize it until they do it. It's easy to, you know, make fun of someone else That you kind of sort of know, like, what are they doing? But then, yeah, the reason I guess I wasn't nervous was because I was confident in what I was talking about. So it wasn't, I didn't start with like a day in my life, you know, which is fine. But like it's going to be a little harder to get traction if no one knows who you are.

If you're just starting with like lifestyle day and the life content. I was talking about something very specific, how I got started reselling on Poshmark and how much I made in quarantine. You know, I had these like hard numbers to fall back on. It wasn't a huge amount. But it was cool. It was like, you know, here's how I made whatever it was, 2,700 bucks, you know, just flipping clothes for fun in my bedroom, you know. Yeah. I think it's because of that. Because of the topic and I actually filmed it like three times because the first two times I edited it. I was like, this isn't perfect. So I just, I think it came down to feeling very confident, I would say, about the final product. And, you know, looking back now, it seems silly because I'm so much, you know, I've come so long so far in my editing and I would say and, you know, it was I'm moving at the time, whatever. But I just at the moment felt confident in what it was and that it wasn't just, you know, I don't want to say fluffy lifestyle because I, I don't want to say fluffy lifestyle because I, I don't want to say fluffy lifestyle because I. I do plenty of the fluffy lifestyle now,

but I wouldn't have started with that. Do you know what I mean? I think it's because of the topic. I felt confident in it that I just, you know, I didn't really care if other people saw it. I enjoy also. Yeah.

So, yeah. You mean the lifestyle. Like you mentioned before, like getting more eyeballs. I like your lifestyle content because I think you were, I think there's sometimes, at least when I first saw lifestyle content, maybe this was just because I wasn't that into it.

I was like, why would I want to see like somebody else just going? about their day. But the lifestyle content you make, and this is probably true for other people, and I just, I'm not watching them. I like that you have like tangible, it's almost like tangible outcomes. So like, this is how much I spend on coffee in New York City. Like, yes, New York City is expensive. This is how, like, I can afford to live here. I really like that because it gives somebody like a tangible takeaway. So even though it's lifestyle content, it's providing value. And that is a really interesting line, like, to follow. Thank you. I do try to do that. That's very, very, yeah, that's on

purpose. I try to like even in my even fluffier ones where sorry I'm using that word, but you know what I mean, like where I'm just walking around New York City and exploring, I still do try to teach something or or add in those little, you know, valuable tidbits in some way, shape, or form in each video. Not just because I think it'll perform better, but that's honestly just feels more like purposeful to me. I just enjoy it. It feels more like an assignment like, ooh, I'm cracking the coat on something. Yeah. You know, so I just, I enjoy it more that way as well. I totally get it. So, yeah. The one lifestyle YouTuber that I was like obsessed with and I still love is Emma Chamberlain. I know

it's like very, everybody knows Emma Chamberlain at this point. She's crossed that barrier from like I feel like influencer to a celebrity. She's now much more than what she was back in her heyday, I guess. And one thing though that drastically changed

was like a viewer was her editing style. So you really saw her after she took breaks from YouTube, how different her editing style got. And there was even a point when she was way earlier on in her career where you almost tell she got an editor. I don't think she's an editor now, possibly a little later on, because it does feel a little bit more authentic. But there was a point in her content, a brief

stint where I was like, wait a minute, this doesn't feel as real, like as I'm really watching Emma. It feels like I'm watching somebody else's version of Emma. And it's so interesting as if you were to kind of like see that progression. You, and this is very, very evident, have been super consistent with editing. You were obviously the one that edits your own content. The one reason viewers can know that is because you just have a lot of jokes in there. A lot of it's about timing. Your videos are really quick-paced and, like, where you're speaking changes. Like, there's a lot of shots being done.

You're obviously the person editing. Why have you chosen to keep on editing, which is, like, the hardest part, like the most in time-intensively is part of creating content? Why haven't you passed that along to an editor at this point? Thank you for the kind words, by the way. It does take a long time. And, yeah, I do. But for the very reason that you just said with Emma, I noticed the same.

exact thing. It didn't feel as much like her when it was someone else editing it compared to now when she edits her own videos again. For that same reason, you know, it's for a couple reasons, but this is the main one. It's that I feel, I don't feel confident that someone else could, could, I mean, of course they have, there are people out there who can edit the same way that I do, but to teach them to have my same vision, to have my same humor, to add in those little jokes, all those little things because the creativity really, really comes in the editing. Yes, of course, I can script little things or I can plan to go to a certain location that I think will be interesting. But ultimately, it's in the editing where the storytelling really comes in I have found.

And part of it is that I just, I love doing it. I love taking the ownership over that piece. But also because of how incredibly difficult it would be to train someone else, it takes time. It's probably something I'm going to have to do when I'm in the thick of the consulting job again, you know, to balance it. But we'll see. I mean, if I'm not happy with that product, then I don't, you know, I'm not afraid to cut ties there. So just to maintain my own authenticity and honestly,

because of the like barrier to entry with teaching someone else is just so high, I feel like. It sounds like you've gone through the same thing yourself, right? You said it was really difficult. Yeah, I had when I was doing my own podcast outside of the speaking startups, it was definitely something that I was looking to try to find an editor for at one point. Right now, I've taken a break on my own podcast. I think I'd be podcasted out if I was doing both at the same time,

maybe sometimes in the near future, I'd like to start that back up. But right now, that would be, I think that'd be podcast overkill. And during a short stint, when I was trying to do both, I was trying to find somebody to edit.

And it's like, they don't wonder, it's hard to have somebody think like you think. Because there's certain things that I listed to it. I'm like, well, that doesn't necessarily pertain to the conversation or, um,

that isn't something that my audience would necessarily like, you know, benefit for like, my episodes were always like a certain length too and I'm like you know what this isn't beneficial to the audience like this should be cut out and I think teaching like what is funny content to keep in because it's engaging versus what is something that's just like me blabbering on that doesn't like give anybody value is something that I don't even know if that can like be taught because it's really teaching somebody to think like you um so I have a lot of a lot of respect for any creative um again we're talking about another friend Nate O'Brien has he has, I believe, found different people to, like, edit his content at points in time. Phenomenal. Phenomenal. Everything's really, really high quality.

Then again, he's not necessarily doing, like, funny, like, lifestyle content. But he is able to really find that, like, consistent person with the same really high expectations. And I know that must have been really, really difficult. And I don't know if all ever be able to do that. Yeah. I know. I know exactly what you're saying. his videos that are a little more like cinematic where there are drone shots and all that.

They come out so, yeah, so beautifully. And even I know other like New York City vloggers who do kind of put in those little funny quips that have found editors and even the creators say that it's now at the point where it gets edited to the exactly how they would have done it themselves. So I guess it's possible. I don't know. It seems impossible to me as well. But some people seem to do it.

I don't know. Maybe I'll figure it out one day perhaps, but it's not totally on the radar right now. I'm looking forward to seeing if one day if consulting catches up to you in your face with having to hire an editor how that process goes. If people wanted to watch her YouTube channel, where can they find you? Taylor Bell, just type in my name, should come up.

Amazing. And then on Instagram, you can type in Taylor Bell as well. But it's Tay K Bell. I wish it was just Taylor Bell, but I'm sure, you know, that was taken. So T-A-Y, the letter K, B-E-L-L-I. I'm freaking Rachel underscore. Like, no, I'm at underscore. Rachel Braun on everything.

And sometimes I can get Rachel Braun, but at this point, I'm already underscore Rachel Brown on so many other platforms that I've got to keep it. Big bummer. So if anybody is willing to give up at Rachel Brown or at Rachel, that would be crazy. Just let me down. That'd be crazy. That'd be insane. I'd be on Twitter.

Awesome. Thank you so much, Taylor, for joining. Thanks for having me. This was fun. All right, everybody. Thanks for listening. We have a great show for you on Sunday. We got more BC Sunday school. a fascinating climate interview. It's all good stuff. We're talking climate-friendly debit cards.

Just get straight up, get paid for making climate-friendly choices. That's what I'm talking about right now. All right. You got five great shows this week from This Week and Startups Monday through Friday. You got your all-in Saturdays. And of course, on Sunday you got your grade this week in startups VC Sunday School and this weekend climate. It's been a great week.

Thanks for sticking with us. If you love the show, you love the effort we put into it. Yeah, rate, subscribe, whatever. You know what to do and follow Molly Wood. on the Twitter and follow me. I'm Jason on the Twitter. We'll see you next time. Bye-bye.