Throwbacks with Matt Leinart & Jerry Ferrara - Michael Jordan, NCAA Final Four and Showtime Lakers with James Worthy

Episode Date: April 2, 2026

Hall of Famer and Finals MVP James Worthy joins the show and kicks things off looking back at Braylon Mullins legendary shot to push the Connecticut Huskies into the Final Four, plus he defends Cayden Boozer’s crushing turnover. Big Game James looks back at his own NCAA tournament memories, including the emergence of a young Michael Jordan during the North Carolina Tar Heels 1982 Championship run. James talks about his time on campus at UNC, including what NFL legend Lawrence Taylor was like back at Chapel Hill. Worthy discusses his Showtime Lakers days as well, looking back at his Finals MVP performance and his crushing loss to the Celtics in 1984 before giving his thoughts on LeBron James, Luka Doncic and the current Lakers’ chances at a championship this season.   Finally, Matt and Jerry give us their list of the best players to wear the iconic number 42 in any sport.   New episodes of Throwbacks drop every Thursday. Make sure you’re subscribed on YouTube and following on all podcast platforms. Also, make sure you’re locked in on social @ThrowbacksShow on all platforms for highlight moments, bonus content, and to engage with the guys & the Throwbacks community. (http://throwbacksshow.com/)      00:00 Show open  02:24 James Worthy joins  03:30 “I hate Duke BUT”  07:26 James on 1982 Michael Jordan  9:45 Lawrence Taylor at UNC  15:15 What made the Showtime Lakers so special?  17:13 James Worthy’s Welcome to the League moment  22:00 Throwback 3: Best Trash Talkers  23:40 What is the mindset entering a Game 7  What loss hurt the most?   34:00 Do the Lebron and Luka Lakers have a shot to win a championship?   39:25 Greatest players to ever wear 42  Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Michael Jordan, man, not only did he hit the big shot, but there were times in that game where he really kept us within three points, and then his defense was really good, too. So I know I was the most outstanding player. I was 13, I believe, 13 for 17. I was on fire. Damn, okay.

Michael Jordan arrived that year. All right, welcome to another episode of Throwbacks. Please don't forget, give us a like and subscribe on the YouTube. It's free. Press that subscribe button. All social platforms at Throwback Show. Leave some comments, leave reviews, whatever.

When we talk about throwbacks and what is a throwback and the things that really get us going, right? It's obviously a player or actor or musician. Someone from the past has done something great, but it also gives you a great interview. I think we found maybe one of the greatest throwback guests we've ever had before coming on the show today. I got to be honest.

with you, man. I was like, I'm like a kid in a candy store. I ain't going to lie. Big game. That's all you got to say. Big game. Big game. James Worthy. Hall of Famer, national champion. Legend. Goat. Incredible golfer, storyteller. Can you imagine, Jerry, what it was like to play for the Showtime Lakers in the 1980s? We're going to find out. We're going to find out. Yeah, because I've heard him say in the past before, too. He's like, uh, it's almost like a little bit of a death wish, he kind of called it because it's wild times. But yes, I couldn't think of a better guess.

Also, too, he did a great breakdown of like the crazy Yukon shot. Yeah, I mean, part of March Madness back in that he won a championship with MJ hit the shot, played with Sam, I mean, some of those teams he played with the North Carolina, Sam Perkins, MJ obviously, what could have been? You know, there's a big what if with James Worthy that we're going to talk about. You got to stick around. But man, what a great dude, man. Man.

Great, great dude. And then obviously, too, we had to talk a little bit about the current Lakers. We give you a little current stuff at the end. So let's get to it. Big game, James. Today's guest is a true basketball icon, a Hall of Famer, three-time NBA champion with the Los Angeles Lakers, a national champion.

And he's wearing it right there, the jacket with the North Carolina Tar Hills, one of the greatest nicknames in all the sports. Big Game James for his clutch performances. matter most, the true definition of a throwback, the one and only James Worthy. And God damn, I am fired up to have you on, buddy. I'm like a little kid right now. Yeah, you're going to, you're going back. You're going back to the way back machine, the throwback machine.

Yes, sir. The show is called throwbacks, and you are literally the true definition of a throwback, man. James, thanks for coming on. I saw, you know, everybody's obviously talking about the Yukon shot. You did an amazing breakdown on television. of that shot. I really felt like, obviously you broke down the shot, but you had some

some sensitive feelings for Boozer. Not a lot of people covered it, but you covered it in such a nuanced way. I appreciated that. That was a good coverage of the shot. You know, I hate Duke. I've always hated Duke. Everybody knows the rivalry between North Carolina and Duke.

But it was an amazing game. I hate that it had to come down to that. It shouldn't have. Duke had a 19-pointed. lead. And I hate a game that ends on what looks like a mistake from a kid

who's now got to walk around campus and have that on his shoulders. I've been in that situation before in 1984 when I threw an air it pass in the Boston Garden that tied that series up. We had five more games

to make up for, but it's such a critical play. And then in 1982 in NCAA championship game against Georgetown. I was involved in a play where Fred Brown picked up his dribble, and he panicked and threw me the basketball, and we went on to win a national championship. So I felt bad for Boozer to end like that.

It was such a tough ending, you know, sitting to come down to that, but I thought he would hold on to the ball. I actually thought the older loser can would hold the ball and just receive a foul. But it's just one of those situations where it ended up. And Duke's been on the other end of that. I remember when Grant Hill threw a long pass to Christian Layton for a big shot against Kentucky. So that's the beauty of March Madness.

You mentioned Duke, Carolina, and I totally forgot because I've seen some of the most heated rivalries in football, obviously in college football, but then in basketball, you played for two of the most heated. Lakers, Celtics, Duke, Carolina. Do you have a, is there a story from your time playing against Duke back in the day that maybe sticks out that just defines how heated it was and how much hatred you guys had for each other?

You know, when I came to North Carolina, coach Foster was still the coach at Duke. I can't remember his first name. I only had Coach K for one year, and it really wasn't a big rivalry at the time, but they did have Gene Banks, you know, Mike Jerminsky, you know, Jim Spanarkle, and just going over seven-mile bus ride over to Durham from Chapel Hill.

And, you know, as soon as you get into Durham area, you're on the bus. Everybody starts giving you the finger. You know, their fans are obnoxious, and they really were back then. They camped out back then, too. And if there was anything going on on your campus, they read about it.

Like, they had this one kid. He was about five feet tall. And Sam Perkins had really long arms. You know what I mean? And so this guy, he taped on these long arms, on his arms that were touching the floor. And he just kind of walked around, as we were warming up.

They did things like that, man. They were really obnoxious. But, you know, Gene Banks and, and, Jimisky, you know, we didn't have a really tough time with them, but they did go on to the final four, I think, in seven and 80 in 80. So I can't remember exactly, but not a big rivalry until Coach K arrived,

and I was pretty much gone by then. We all know the shot, The MJ hit the shots, won the championship. You mentioned you had the steal, I think, before that. Was there like a kind of a hidden play or maybe a sequence in that game that maybe people, because we all know the ending, right?

We all know the shot. But throughout that game, there's a lot of plays that are made. Was there any, is there like a part of that game that sticks out that no one really knows about? Well, I was 13, I believe, 13 for 17. I was on fire. Damn, okay. Michael George arrived that year.

I mean, he was, he, he really propelled us starting in the ACC tournament. I guess Virginia hit some big shots. In the Georgetown game, you know, Georgetown were really tough. And the game could have gotten away from us. You know, Michael hit a left-hand finger roll over Patrick Ewing. That was a big shot. I mean, and then there was another. shot he hit on the baseline.

It was like a up and under kind of hit a little eight-footer. That kept us tight. Then he hit another shot. You know, it was a putback. I think Jimmy Black missed the layup. So Michael Jordan, man, not only did he hit the big shot, but there were times in that game where he really kept us within three points. And then his defense was really good, too.

So I know I was the most outstanding player. And, you know, I was the guy that was the decoy on that last shot because everyone thought that I was going to get the shot. So when I flashed in the middle, they collapsed. Ginny Black made a cross four pass on Michael Jordan. And it's funny during that timeout, you know, Coach Smith never really put any pressure. He just said run the offense and take the best shot. but we came out of that timeout and everyone else was

walking onto the court and I kind of looked back and I saw him Pat Michael on the butt and say hey, if you get a good look, knock it down and that's exactly what happened. Gave him the green light. You know, I've watched that play obviously like we all have thousands of times. I will say

that's a good read on the past because if I have that ball and I see James Worthy, even though there's two guys collapsed and I still might have force fed you the ball there. You guys 13% 17, but that was a, like, the past was a great read because you're right. Everyone collapsed right on you. I wanted to ask you, because I'm a huge Giants fan, full disclosure. Were you at campus with the Lawrence Taylor?

Because I was doing the math. I was trying to figure out, did your guys paths cross when you were at UNC? Yes, yes. Lawrence was a junior, my freshman year. And he and Al Wood, who was a team. of my really good friends. And I knew Lawrence. I think I had a class with Lawrence.

And I think my first memory as a freshman, you know, I had an 8 o'clock class, you know, everybody does on Monday, Wednesday, Fridays, whatever your setup was. So about 815, the campus is clear. You know, the yard is clear. Nobody's walking around. Everybody's on campus in class.

And I just happened to be, you know, like daydreaming, looking out the window. And Lawrence Taylor was walking across campus with a pool stick. He had one can of beer in his hand. And he had the other, you know, five hanging down below. And he was going to, you know, shoot pool, like in the rec room. And that's what I remember, man. Lawrence Taylor was a, I mean, he was an amazing football player, man. but he was a terror on campus, man.

He was just... He had to be a knucklehead for sure. If they lost the game, man, you couldn't speak to him, man. He was so upset. And I just... I love Lawrence, man. He was just a great guy. It's fun to be around.

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Try Kachava risk-free with their love-it guarantee. Stick with your wellness goals. Go to kachava.com and use code throwbacks for 15% off. That's Kachava, K-H-A-V-A.com code throwbacks. I talked to our boy Geter, right? And we were talking about this because I was like, what's something about James? And I want to go back to the draft because we talked about on the show before some of like the the what ifs in sports. Like what if this would have happened? What if that would have happened? Is it true? Because Ralph Samson ended up coming back to school,

which made you declare early for the draft. Is that accurate? If he would have, if he would have stayed or if he would have if he would have left for the draft early you would have stayed an extra year do you ever think about that if that would have happened because then you would have been drafted by the rockets the following year well most likely you know had ralph come out he would he would have gone first without question and then i think dominique would have gone second uh terry cummins probably would have gone third uh i'm not even sure who was who was up uh you know fifth or team that wanted a Dean Smith player who really wasn't scoring a lot and really, you know, just didn't come from that type of program. So I definitely would have stayed my senior year.

I had, you know, helped recruit Kenny Smith, who was a freshman, who would have been a freshman in my junior year. And I also had helped recruit Brad Dardy. So that would have been a great a team to come back with Sam Perkins and Michael Jordan and the additions of those players. But Ralph Samson stayed, and I knew that the Lakers weren't looking for, like, a dominant score. I mean, obviously, Ralph Samson is a unique player, and there was a lot of rumors surrounding, you know, even that draft. Like, had I come out along with Ralph, there were rumors that, you know, that they were going to trade Kareem to New York for their number, for their second pick and they were going to keep me anyway, keep Ralph and I together. So there's always these rumors, but I was definitely going to stay in school and win another national championship with Michael Jordan, Sam Perkins, Kenny Smith, Brad Doherty, you know, Jimmy Bradda.

That would have been the goal that I would have set for us had I gone back. But I came out here. What a squad. I like, yeah. Could you imagine if your Knicks got the... Oh, I'm a Knicks fan, James. Yeah, that would have been interesting. I'm a big Knicks fan.

So the thought of Kareem wearing a Nick's jersey for even a half a second would have been different. Yeah, Kareem was still, he was still performing. You know, he was MVP in 1985. But, you know, I think he might have been his 12th or 13 years. This is just things that you hear after you retire. You know, you're talking to some GMs who remember things. But there's always, you know, they thought maybe 13, 14th year he might have been looking to retire anyway. So, but he went on and played 19.

years. We won three more championships. And, and, you know, but to get, you know, the number one pick Ralph Samson and the number two pick James Worthy would have been something that would have been talked about, you know, back in the 80s when players kind of stay on one team for a longer period of time and to go along with magic and whatever the future was going to hold with Byron Scott. But never happened, and I'm glad it did. Well, yeah, because now we got the Showtime Lakers out of it. And, yeah, I mean, they made television shows and documentaries. But what really to you was the thing that made those Showtime teams so special?

Because there's many options, right? As a fan, and so having been a part of it, what do you think made that Showtime team so special? You know, I think, you know, when I look back, you know, like Kareem Abdul-Jabbar had four years. with John Wood. Jamal Wilkes had four years with John Wooden. I had three years with Dean Smith. You know, Magic Johnson played, came from a great program in Michigan State.

Pat Rowling played for Adolf Welp, if you do some history on Kentucky. And I think, you know, a college coach would rip your eagle out of your chest. That's what we all went through in college, if we stayed two or three years. And I think that had a lot to do with it. we came from great programs.

So we already knew how to win. And then when you put Pat Riley into it, he's a winner, man. Pat was a player that came off the bench, didn't really play that much during his career. His job was to get Jerry West ready to play. So, you know, he was always a hard worker. We were always prepared.

He was a great communicator. And we accepted that. And we knew how to monitor one another. We knew how to solve problems. We didn't let anything get inside the locker room that, you know, got in the way of us winning. And whenever it happened, we always knew how to solve it. So it was a good group of guys that were together for a long period of time.

And we knew how to, we knew how to, you know, create a winning atmosphere. And that's what happened. James, you were talking about, you know, obviously the great players. and you kind of just came into the league as a part of a title contender right away. Do you remember, you know, a welcome to the NBA moment or a specific moment where you're like,

oh, shit, like I got to perform with these guys. Yeah, I'll tell you, I'll tell you my Kirk Rambus story. You know, I came into the league. You know, the number one draft pick. I wasn't arrogant, but I thought I was pretty good. You know, I was the most outstanding player. I had talent.

I knew the Lakers really didn't need a dominant score, okay? Otherwise, they would have drafted the human highlight fam, Dominion Wilkins. The Lakers had already won two out of three championships. So they had Kareem, you know, Magic, Jamal Wilkes, you know, Bob McAduh, Michael Cooper. That's five Hall of Fame was right there already.

So they wanted me to come in and like, you know, kind of be a role player. But I came into the training camp first day and there was magic. There was Kareem. There was Jamal, Norm Nixon, Bob McAdoo. And then Kurt Ramish came into the gym. And I looked at Kurt and he had this long hair. It looked like he hadn't showered in like two or three days.

He had these glasses that had duct tape, you know, in between hauling up. And he had all this apparatus on. It fucking smelled like Ben Gay and shit. You know, I'm like, I'm like, I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm faster than he is. I can jump higher. I can score. I'm like, you know, I can start.

I say, I'm going to get that position. In my mind, I'm saying that. Well, within about the first 15 minutes of practice, Kirk showed me what an NBA power for was all about. And I didn't have, I didn't want to have anything to do with it, man. He beat the living shit out of me, man. Every time I came in that pain, I was bruised up. And I came back to the next thing.

next day and I said, I'm going to get him today. But no, there was a big difference between a college power for it and an NBA power for it. So I started looking at Jamal Wilkes's position. I said, eventually I'll get that one. I had to sit on the baseball a couple of years. But

Shirk was not having it, man. He was not having. So that was my first experience to the NBA. My second one was on a Tuesday night having to guard Larry Bird. Okay. that's enough for a week. But then having a back-to-back game on Wednesday in New York,

and you got Bernard King on a Wednesday night. Larry Bird, Bernard King on Wednesday night. Get Thursday off, you know, get over to Philly, only they have to guard Dr. Jay on a Thursday night. So every night, every night. Then you got fly back to Denny. You got Alex English. Over to Portland, Kiki Van,

the way, these are all every night. You know, in college, you had maybe one or two star players every now and then. But, and then you got 82 of these as opposed to 32 or 35. It just, it's, it's mind-boggling how, how one can last. But through the grace of God and some good, you know, some good mentors, you know, I was able to adapt. But those first couple years, man,

you're playing against grown men. You know, some of them smoke cigarettes. You know what I'm saying? It was a different time, but it was a tough adjustment, brother. I can tell you. Could you imagine just lighten up, like Vladai Diva,

just lighten up some cigarettes at half time? I mean, you probably had to see some crazy shit like that during games. I mean, I think maybe Vladdy rode his on cigarettes when he came, but I think he learned quickly. He learned quickly that that wasn't going to happen. But every now and then, man, you know, you might catch a veteran player. I can't remember who it was, man. But I can remember at the forum seeing a veteran player tucking on a cigarette under the bleachers,

looking at a stat sheet before he went back out. You know, you had to figure out how many points he needed to get, you know. It was crazy. But, yeah, there was a few smokers, not many, but yeah, it was a different league. Commissioner Stern came in and cleaned the league up. You know, coming out of the 70s, it was a bad image. Didn't really have a drug policy. So, but Commissioner Stern came in, cleaned that up, got the TV contract.

It was a cleaner league, more professional. So you didn't see too many smokers. But, man, you know, you had coaches smoking, players smoking. Everybody was smoking. So every episode we do our throwback three, where we ask you to, we'll ask you a question to list your three. We were going to ask you your toughest covers, but I feel like you kind of just covered it, right,

with those names, so I'm going to pivot a little bit. Who would be your throwback three from your era, best trash talkers? The guys that you knew when you were going in are going to talk to most shit in the game. Larry was one of them. Larry was one. He didn't, you know, with the Lakers,

he didn't really get too involved. We got into some scuffles every now and there, but he didn't really do a lot of talking. Cedric Maxwell, you know, always giving you the choke sign at the free throw line, you know. That kind of stuff was tough. But, you know, we didn't have too many people that talked trash to us. We just didn't because there were consequences if you did. And they didn't know what the consequences.

We run your ass out of there, you know, in the second quarter. And so you didn't want to get us riled up. but Larry, you know, the bad boy, you know, of course, with that name, you had to talk trash. So we get into it with Lamb Beer and Isaiah and those guys, but it was mostly Boston, Boston, and Detroit. I didn't really have that much on the West Coast, and nobody really got into it with us. They knew there were consequences for that. So I think you have one of the best nicknames. For sure, we've talked about nicknames on this show and well deserved.

I mean, your game seven performance to me, I think that's the best game seven performance I've ever seen, just in terms of the stakes and everything. And we just broke down the Yukon, Duke game. What is like the mindset, you know, because I know you were feeling for Boozer, and sometimes it's the moment, right? Like, why did Fred Brown kind of stop his dribble?

probably 99% of time, different moment that never happens. So for you going into a game seven, big game James, do you approach it any differently than you would any other game one or game two of the finals? Yes. Yes. This is my last stop at the gas tank. So I'm full and I'm using all the gas. I don't have to drive anymore after that game seven.

You know, a regular season, like I mentioned, man, you got to play a lot of multiple players. You got to travel. And, man, we were traveling on Eastern Airlines and TWA and Delta, you know, it was going through airports. It wasn't like it was today. So it was tough during the regular season. But during the playoffs, I always thought that you had to enhance your game.

You only have one team, less travel, get a lot of video, a lot of chance to prepare. So I always thought that you must be better in the play. And if you can get to a game seven, what a joy, you know, what a great accomplishment just to, you know, fight to get there. Now you're leaving nothing on the table. And I guess I learned that, you know, back in college and, you know, when we lost to Indiana in 1981, the year before we won in 82. James, I wanted to follow up on the game seven thing, right? And it's kind of like a golf reference for me. I know, like, if I'm hitting it bad on the range, that usually means I go play well.

If I'm hitting a good on the range, usually is a bad round. So when you're getting out there warm-ups, game seven, that particular one in 88, did you know, like, I'm about to have a night? Because your performance all over the court. How did you feel, could you go back to that time, warm-ups, game seven, 1988, did you know you were about to go off? Yeah, during the warm-ups in game seven in 1988 in 1988, you know, remember, we were down to when we came back,

from Detroit. We were three, two down. So it was a lot of pressure mounting. One game six, and in a game seven, you just have this, you just block out everything. And all you were doing is thinking about what you have to do, you know, thinking about the defense you're getting ready to go up against, which were the bad boys, Dennis Rodman, Rick Mahorn,

John Salad, those are my three primary. So you're just, you're, you're portraying your game. You're living the game before you even play it. You have to. You have to imagine what you're doing. So I'm sweating. I'm imagining that I'm running the break. I'm diving on the floor.

I'm pumped faking. I'm doing all this stuff in my routine because it's on the line. You know, Pat Rowley had guaranteed that we were going to win a back-to-back. So how embarrassing it would be if we didn't do it. So you have all that stress all year long, and it really propelled up into the playoffs. We had to do it. It was just no second. There was no nothing else.

We were going to do it. So I had all that on my mind, all on my shoulders, and I was strong. I was ready. And, you know, you have this thought in your mind that you're not going to be denied at home. Just not in your back yard. You're not going to, nobody's ever going to beat you in your back. So you plant all that stuff in there, and it worked. It grows, and we just weren't going to be denied.

And Corrine was a little older, and I knew I had to step up. And I was ready. I was ready for the moment. When West Jet first took flight in 1996, the vibes were a bit different. People thought denim on denim was peak fashion. Inline skates were everywhere, and two out of three women rocked, the Rachel. While those things stayed in the 90s, one thing that hasn't is that fuzzy feeling you get when WestJet welcomes you on board.

Here's to WestJetting since 96. Travel back in time with us and actually travel with us at westjet.com slash 30 years. I can imagine, and I didn't know this, but I can imagine that you developed a lot of that mindset from your mom, Gladys. Your mom was a big time Hooper back in the day.

How instrumental and just influential was she throughout your basketball career? Dude, you're going to get a bottle of wine for bringing this one up, brother. Yeah, Gladys was like, I believe, 1947 state championship. That's when they played with six women. Let's go. Three on the offensive end and three on the defensive end.

But yeah, she was very instrumental, man. She was a good player, told me to put Arc on my free throw. I was kind of tall and I had a straight line. It was my mom. I didn't know what Arc. was in the seventh grade. And she said, pull a little arc on him.

She went to all my games. And she also kept me off the team in the eighth grade. It was a blessing in disguise. I was getting big-headed. I was playing for the YMCA. I was playing for the Boys Club.

I was playing for the Church League. I was playing for the school league. I was coming in, throwing my books down, and I was gone. Coming home late night. I came home with a report card. I had four Cs. and 1D.

Passed everything. That's all I was trying to do is pass. And wasn't good enough for her. She saw the direction I was going, and she called my coach and kicked me off the team, man. And I hated her for a while. Because I was 6-7, 6-8 in the 8th grade, and I was starting to get a little bit of tension,

starting to get, like, newspaper articles, And in a small town, that's a big thing. You know, got to go to basketball camp at Carolina. So I was starting to get a little bit outside of my bridges, as she would say. So she signed my report card. I took it back to school, thought everything was okay, at basketball practice, and Coach Bird comes out and says, sorry, you're done for the rest of the year. Wow.

blessing in disguise, then I realized best thing ever happened to me. Made me a better student, made me think about if I didn't play basketball. So, yeah, she was tough. Glad it didn't play, man. I love that. By the way, I always lived by the moniker of D equals degree, James.

So I was with you, man. D equals to D equal degree. Got me through. I'm not going to lie. Yeah, hey, me too. So, well, one, listen, I'll gladly take a nice bottle of wine, but you might take that back, because I do, I do have to ask you this question. What loss haunts you more? 1984 or your high school state championship to Sleepy Floyd.

And that's coming from, that's coming. I need that wine. I need that wine to drink right now, man. That's coming from our boy, Geeter. He's like, you got to ask him about Sleepy Floyd. I've told Gita my whole life, he could write a book on you, man. Having achieved college pro, you know, Hall of Fame, top 75, got a boys club championship, got a YMC championship, got a church championship.

Yep. Never had a high school championship, man. So it hurts me to my heart. both 84 and the high school hurt, but I would have to say that high school championship, I don't have a ring for that. I was able to redeem myself against Sleepy, however. Yes.

Because we did beat Georgetown, but I never got a high school championship. So I can always tell him, and you've never got a college championship. But I would have liked the guy That and we got beat on a We beat them three times that season And we got beat on the last second shot From a guy that we would let shoot a hundred more times

Scott Hopper Those are the worst We would let him shoot it a hundred more times And it hit the rim And it bounced around And it went in and that was it It was a long ride home that night But yeah

I think I think Sleepy for that the high school one hurts. So I just want to throw out something too. I'm sure you've heard this, but there's a great interview with your mom that our research team found from like 1993 at North Carolina, right? Yeah. Yeah.

And they interviewed her a lot about playing. And literally one of the first quotes that I listen to the whole thing. I encourage everyone to listen. I'm sure you could Google it. But she talks about basketball. She's like, yeah, I really like basketball. I like more physical sports like hockey. She said hockey.

She's like basketball is great. But there's like more physical. I like more physical. I'm like, wow, basketball is not physical enough for it. It's a great interview, man. It really is an unbelievable in you for the time. 1948 women's basketball. Crazy.

Yeah. We had a hockey, we had a minor hockey league team in Charlotte. And they were called the Charlotte Sheckerts. And my mom loved roller derby, too. She loved roller derby, dude. She loved it. And so, and she would tell me. me, son, you know, stop being so passive.

You got to meet force with force. That's where I got that term from in the ninth grade. Don't let them push you around. That was her thing. Don't let them push you around. And she was right. Amazing. Before we let you go, because we've taken up too much of your time, no, you know.

And maybe Matt, I don't know since Matt, you're the big, you're the big Laker guy here. But these Lakers are up to something, man. Yeah, they're up to something. We know you cover, you cover the Lakers with our mutual dear friend, Chris, Chris McGee, Geter. Obviously, do a great job on there. I watch you all the time. It is, you know, Luca, I know how much praise you have for Luca, A.R. Obviously, LeBron's sort of taking this backseat roll a little bit.

Just, James, I mean, do we have a shot to win a championship? You know, what is your thought on the Lakers? Because they're rolling right now. Yeah, I really think the Lakers have arrived at a place where they, they now are a threat in the West. I know the Spurs in Oklahoma are the teams ahead of them, and I know Denver is right there behind them, but I do think regardless of all the teams that I mentioned,

the Lakers that have put themselves in a position to win. Now, I'm not saying that they're going to guarantee to win a championship, but they put themselves in a position, and here's why. one, they're healthier than they've ever been. And they have all their tools in the toolbox that are available. And I think after the all-star break and when they got everybody back, they decided that they wanted to play defense. The defense has been pretty good in the clutch minutes,

but now for four quarters, they're committed. They like each other. They like being around each other. I think Aiden is key. He's key. I think, you know, he's, when we lost Anthony Davis, we really needed a rim protector and a big who could score. I guess Denver, he started to show some consistency.

After he said himself, I had to look in the mirror. Austin Reeves, anybody that's like a plus one handicap is good at everything. You know, the way they think, the way they analyze. their work ethic, all of that. This guy was undrafted, undrafted. And LeBron, being the genius that he is, he said, hmm, there's something about this guy that I laughed. And so he's just an amazing player.

He gets through the line. So, and then you have probably the best entertainer in sports in Luca, who's just a phenomenal player. I mean, I play with Magic, a great score, great passer. Luca is breaking records. He's reaching goals that no one has reached as fast. The way he can just pull up and score and shoot and really enhance everybody around him,

it's just been amazing. And then you have Jackson Hayes, a great backup center. You know, and guys like Jake LaRavia. My favorite is, You know, Marcus Smart, who I think put his print on this team immediately with defense and diving on the floor. When is the last time you've seen a 41-year-old LeBron James diving on the floor? He did it one time. And I think that might be the last time.

But Marcus Smart came here, and he has injected that attitude. And he's been out the last three or four games. And I think it's good that he's out because he needs to rest as they get ready to enter into the playoffs. But I just think the coaching staff has done a great job. I give Brooks and McMillan, you know, an 8-plus for, you know, being there for JJ in his second year. So they're starting to understand what it takes to win. They have a lot of injuries, Reeves out. The Bron didn't start training camp.

You know, everyone has that. But you do need all your ingredients available when you're trying to cook up something. And I think they're at a place they've secured, you know, the tiebreakers against Denver and the Rockets and the Sons. They're in third now. So they've got to hang on as the season goes out. They got Oklahoma coming up Cleveland tonight. So they're still tested, but they're playing well enough to secure that spot, I believe. Oh, man, well, I hope so.

I hope they can win another championship. Big game, you have no idea. This was so cool for us. We could talk to you for hours, man. I'm telling you. We both obviously love basketball. I appreciate you coming on, man. And I'm on to get on the golf course.

I used to play a mountain gate all the time, so I would love to go out there and hit some balls. Come on, man. Hey, look, I've been inviting Geter for the last five years, man. We'll go together. I don't think he likes to come north, north of, like, you know, he doesn't, you know, he doesn't leave the bubble. Yeah. All right, man. We appreciate your big game.

You got it. Matt, I got to say, not only is it big game, James, I think that's big podcast, James. Great storyteller and guest for a podcast, man. I mean, could we not talk to him for 18 straight hours? We did. When we waited for his audio to upload, we talked for another hour off the air.

I mean, just legendary, man. He's one of the greatest basketball players of all time. He's, I mean, big. I mean, and also one of the greatest. nicknames of all time, big game James. He always delivered in the clutch, man. What a great dude. It gets you thinking.

I don't know, me and my buddies do this. I'm sure you have had these conversations when you start saying like, okay, James worthy, pretty iconic player, pretty iconic number 42. Oh, yeah. Like, if you could think that 42, that for, you know, guys are aged, it's one of the first people, if not, maybe the first that come up. But let's let's talk all-time great 42s, number 402. number 42 in any sport, okay?

Because this is an interesting, interesting number. So I'm sure we're going to agree. We could like ping pong it. I think there's, I got five that I would put up there. I got four. Okay. Why don't you begin? Because I think I know who you're going to leave out.

And I'm ready to yell at you. Well, why don't you begin? Well, I'm going to put big game is, big game is. He's in there. He counts. He's in there regardless. But he's not going to be in my top three just because. So I'll start with, I'm going to go your guy who I think you probably have number one

because you just, you just glaze the Yankees all the time. I'm going to go Mariano Rivera as my, as number three. I mean, look, he's the greatest closer of all time. He's one of the best baseball players of all time, five time world series champ. How about this? The last major league baseball player to wear number 42 full time. I don't know if you knew that. It's pretty cool.

So I would start with Mariano Rivera as my number. as my number three. Yeah, I mean, he's definitely up there for me. I couldn't put him one. Okay, good, good. But he's now, quick little sidebar to the Twitter beef that I'm embroiled in.

And this goes directly to you, Matt. I'm sure you probably loved your guy, Edwin Diaz, come out to that cinematic. You're just a hater, bro. No, Matt, I watched it for years with the Mets. We did this thing already with the cinematic thing. And now we did the lights off. West Coast. We're bringing it to the West Coast.

But we see it. Back World Series champions, bro. And like the dude blows saves. What are we doing? We're talking about him. Like, he's one of the greatest closers to ever pitch in baseball. He's a very good closer. I'd want him on my team. He's a good closer. But enough with the like, it's such a cinema. Guess what? All that cinematic about it is the cameras are better. Can we talk about number 42? Can we talk about number 42? Where are you going with Edwin Diaz?

I just think it's ridiculous. You're falling for the chumpets. You guys in L.A. are falling for the trumpets. Oh, it's awesome. This is... Spoken from someone who has a losing mentality. That's you. Okay, let's go. What's 42?

Obviously, the number one is Jackie Robinson. He's iconic as iconic can be. I mean, when you think four... I mean, the movie's called 42, right? I mean, they have a day in the bigs for Jackie Robinson. 42 is Jackie, for sure. I'm going to clear the decks for your next one, and then we can wrap it up because I think I know where you're going with this one.

Well, yeah, I got, yeah, Mariano III. Obviously, Jackie Robinson is the greatest number 42 for everything that he meant for a lot of different reasons. Obviously, just an icon. My number two, I'm going Ronnie Lott, the great Ronnie Lott. I think we just heard big game talk about L.T., who's arguably, who's probably on the Mount Rushmore, greatest defensive players of all time. Ronnie Lott, by far, is on the Mount Rushmore of greatest defensive players

of all-time four-time Super Bowl champ. I mean, the old myth story of just tearing the pinky off on the sideline, which we don't know if it's true or not. Ronnie Lott was in our locker room all the time at USC when I was there. Yeah, did you get to know him a little bit? Yes, and I will say this, as people watch Big Game James is that you talk to me, you're like, man, Big Game James is one of the great, just a great human being, a great dude and obviously great at what he did.

Ronnie Lott is very similar. What's Ronnie Lott like? He's one of the great. greatest people I've ever met, man. Humble, loves being a Trojan. Every time I talk to him, he's just like, he's just the, he's just the best, man. You walk away, you're like, man, Ronnie Lott is one of the greatest human beings. Not only is he one of the fiercest most hate, like just one of the fiercest players of all times. So I got Mariano, Ronnie and Jackie Robinson as my top three. So, and James and my four. So I don't know who a number, another 42 is that

that deserves to be on this list. And don't say Kevin Love, please. I'm not going to say Kevin Love. You know what? There is none. No, you're not. I couldn't make the case for like a Mo Vaughn or Jerry Stackhouse. It just doesn't add up.

I thought for a minute, I got excited because I'm like, wait a minute. I was going to make a case for my 5 foot 7, bro, Darren Sproles, but he's number 43. So I couldn't even make the case. That's it. That's it. It's Jackie. It's Mo. It's Ronnie Lott.

It's big game. Those are the four best 42s. You got Moe in there. Yeah. Moriano. No, we call Mariano Rivera-Mov. Oh, I was like, you got Movon? I mean, Movon.

I got, see, this is what I'm dealing with. He's getting caught up with the trumpets, guys. Man, I better not see you post a video on Instagram from the game. The trumpets are going to win us a third straight World Series championship. You would win it without them. You'd win it without them. You don't even need them. Hey, the rich get richer, buddy.

The rich get richer, buddy. do me a favor. Well, you're gonna, if you want to just piss me off, you could do this. If I catch you at a game and you post on Instagram when the lights go out

and the trumpets kick up and you're like, Edwin Diaz, cinematic, I will fucking throw up all over the place. Oh, I'm gonna do that.

I'll go win a championship. The problem is, I usually don't stay through the ninth inning. I was still homeroomeroom. You don't want to beat that Dodger traffic. Oh, so you'll never hear the trumpet.

All right, well, can't thank James worthy enough. I really want to go play golf with him, Matt. So I'm going to ask you to hook that up next time in LA. And Lakers, man, he's felt very optimistic for these Lakers. So we shall see.

I love what he said. They're just giving themselves an opportunity. That's it. That's all you can do. Top three seed in the West. It's tough to do. We'll see. Go like, subscribe.

Watch us on YouTube. Throwbacks. Man, that is fun. Back next week.