Throwbacks with Matt Leinart & Jerry Ferrara - Russell Wilson to the Giants, Building our Perfect QB and Raymond Felton Talking Hoops

Episode Date: March 27, 2025

Raymond Felton turned down HOW much money when he was being recruited??  The Tar Heel legend joins Matt Leinart and Jerry Ferrara talking about this brave new world of NIL and transfer movement along with his memories of UNC’s ‘05 title run, the trade he still wishes never happened and why he stopped dunking.  Then, Jerry – our resident Giants fan – weighs in on Big Blue bringing in Russell Wilson and Jameis Winston at quarterback... What’s the verdict?  Like it?  Don’t like it?  REALLY don’t like it??    And finally, in this week’s mailbag, the guys build their perfect QB from today’s current crop of quarterbacks and Jerry tells us which Entourage cameos caused him to feel just a little bit starstruck.  New episodes of Throwbacks drop every Thursday. Make sure you’re subscribed on YouTube and following on all podcast platforms. Also, make sure you’re locked in on social @ThrowbacksShow on all platforms for highlight moments, bonus content, and to engage with the guys & the Throwbacks community. (http://throwbacksshow.com/)      A big thank you to our sponsors:    Wendy’s    Head to the Wendy’s App To Get a $1 JBC or $1 Double Stack with Offer and Additional Purchase. https://m-wendys.app.link/marchmadness25  ZipRecruiter  Try ZipRecruiter FOR FREE: https://www.ziprecruiter.com/Throwbacks   Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Raymond Felton is just not dunking four times a game in the NBA. You think like, oh, he probably doesn't really have a dunk package. You should have dunked more in the NBA. You throw in a down. I could really get up. But once I got into the league, man, listen, when you get knocked out of the air by Shaquille O'Neal and some of these big dudes, you learn to shoot a floater. All right, everybody. Welcome into another episode of throwbacks. Please, however you're listening to us, don't forget to leave a comment on the YouTube or leave a review on Apple or Spotify.

It helps us out. Email us some questions, thoughts. We're doing some mailbags feedback at Throwback Show. Did you see my post about golfing? I said golf is speaking to me this year. It's just speaking to me and it's because of you. You went to a Bryson DeChambeau launch event, right? I saw Bryson DeChambeau launch balls with his new driver, LA Golf. LA Golf. At Bel Air Country Club a couple nights ago, pitch black with lights, and he was trying to tag these drones in the sky.

It was actually pretty funny, but he was just hitting absolute laser beams. My goal is to get you to a place. And you have a lot of hobbies, and you work out a lot, and you got three, four kids. I place and you have a lot of hobbies and you work out a lot and you got three I don't really have a lot of hobbies I don't what I mean is like you'll go you have beach volleyball, right? You coach your kids and stuff. You have things It's not like you're you have tons of free time However, my goal for you and I'm glad you went to never you had a nice blue blaze

I like a sport coat a blazer. What was that? You're a nice piece on. You know, gotta step up every once in a while. My goal is like- I got more than hoodies and sweats in the closet, you know? I would love to get you to a place where you golf like once a month, once every six weeks, mate. Like, you know, just get you in the mix. Once a month is great. I'm actually, I hit up my boy

because we have a couple par three courses right by the house. So we have Top Golf, which is a par three. And then there's a par three behind a hotel over here that's actually pretty good. I used to play at Decent amount. So I'm gonna try and get one in this week. And then, yeah, I just need to get out there, dude.

It's calling me. It is. I think since we've been doing this together, I've talked more about golf, been invited to really cool shit that we'll get to later on the pod, you know, in a couple months where I'm going this summer, which is fricking ridiculous.

But yeah, man, it's gonna be part of my life. It just takes up so much fucking time. It does, but can I say, and then we're gonna tell you about who our guest is today, I'm not going to spoil who the guest is in the coming week or two. All I'll say is you got a little chubby from a major champion from the PGA tour coming on. We'll talk a little man. Not today. Not this episode coming. I think

maybe next week. We're looking good. Good teaser, buddy. But you have a you have a chub I mean zero doubt easy. It was the easy I'm already prepped for that interview next week, but we have a great guest today, too I'm not trying to outshine our guy today because also he has some Nick's blood in him Raymond Felton former Tar Heel Oh, man national champ obviously You know that my college tournament's coming back tonight. Games will be going back on.

I did think of you though, Maddie, because we had Coach Gottlieb on a few weeks ago and I know it's been talked about, but the Juju interview and women's college basketball. Yeah, heartbreaking for so many reasons. Also it happens in the tournament. We were on a collision course for UConnon which I think that could have really broken a lot of viewing records. I still think that's going to be a good game. Now here's what I'll say and hopefully we wish Juju the best and hopefully a speedy recovery and just a full recovery. I'm not counting out this USC women's team just yet. I know going into Yukon that's going to be a massive upheaval without Juju but I'm not so fast to say that's a

wash. I feel like that locker room gets fired up now to get into the spotlight. Just to echo really quick, I mean, you know, we're thinking about Juju. She'll make a full recovery. She's going to come back stronger. We all know that. It is just hard. It's just, it's part of sports. It happens and it's unfortunate, you know, and it unfortunate. And just what she's done for USC, the fact that those seats are full because of her and her team, but she's a star, man. She's a superstar. And Coach Gottlieb talked about her a couple of weeks ago.

So look, at the end of the day, it happens. She's going to be fine. She's going to come back bigger and better and stronger. But to your point, they've recruited really well through the portal, through high school. And this team is built to continue to make a run. I think it's going to be challenging if they do line up with UConn and Page Becker's in the lead eight. I think that's a difficult game the way you kind of, I mean, you kind of might be the

favorite to win it now. But yeah, they've Kiki was is a stud like they've they have eight or nine deep that they go so they're gonna be tough. You know, Lindsay does a great job there. So but shout out. You know, we're thinking about juju. Obviously, she'll be better and shout out to USC women's basketball. Let's see. Let's see what they can do. But they Ray Felton. What a stud to I mean, just growing up because

we're the same age. So pretty much the same age, right? He's 40, 41. I think he's 40 on the dot, about to be 41, I think. Yeah, so those are the, those, I mean, UNC years, I mean, they had a squad back then. They had an absolute squad the year they won the national championship. I'm a little mad at UNC though,

because I had them on the fourth leg of a nice little opening parlor, and they just didn't come through they came back from like 25 down And they suckered me right back into okay. I might still win this bet Did you pull it off? You took UNC to win? No, no just for that game Yeah, just for that game.

Ole Miss is playing good. You know what here's a take and then we'll get to Ray so I used to You know avoid flying during things like March Madness or an NFL playoff game or a basketball game I really wanted to watch because if you didn't get that JetBlue Direct TV seat, you couldn't really watch.

The wifi now, they figured it out for the most part. Every now and then you get on the flights where the wifi doesn't work or the airline, whatever. But for the most part, for the most part. Every now and then you get on the flights where the Wi-Fi doesn't work or the airline, whatever. But for the most part, for the most part, it's really, really good. So I flew home. I did that movie in Florida. I stayed a few days and played some golf with the boys.

No surprise. And then I flew home for that Colorado State, Maryland game on the plane. So I was able to order a drink, pop open the laptop. It was like a sports bar in the air. To the point where when we landed, I was like, taxi a little slower. I got to see I saw the ending while taxiing to my gate.

And it was an awesome flight. And now I'm going to start making flights for games I want to watch as long as that Wi-Fi holds up. So this Thursday's a, this Thursday's a, you know, it's a sneaky good day because the tournament kicks back up. And then we got major league Baseball opening day and busting this out for you Matt although I think my boys are gonna have a lot of questions, but listen here's the big question

How much baseball you get to tune in too early? We'll talk about baseball in in September Yeah Maybe the all-star break maybe that let's talk about baseball. There's too many games, dude We might go we might win 120 games this year. I mean we got is true 30 Honestly, I just go back in talk about I just really want I want to say like thinking about Mookie Betts man really sick That's the only thing really I care about he's been saying what's happening with it. Have they have them down to the bottom of it Yeah, lost like 30 pounds. I just been reading the report. So

nasty virus flu, whatever but Not eating he's not able to like hold down so it'll be fine But yeah thinking about it. Yeah, but you you catch me on the bay. You catch me baseball in the summer, dude We talk about this. I was so back in Last end of last season into the playoffs but to the point where I said I'm gonna really pay more and it's not that I'll pay attention I don't love baseball I think when you have kids and as you get older you have to let go of some things you have to make some tough

choices and for me I'm not letting go of football college and pro I'm not letting go basketball and baseball is one of the things that I let go a little bit and UFC some fights that are on like after midnight because I just can't stay awake. However, at the end of last season, I was saying I'm back in on baseball. I'm going to the true test if you're back in on baseball, especially if you're T if you don't live in the city that your favorite team is in is are you getting the baseball package? I am not yet currently subscribed. Let me, let me, let me just, let me just say something really quick about my team and for all the Dodger fans listening, this might be the greatest pitching rotation of all time. And now they got to stay healthy, but let me just read some names off.

Go ahead. First of all, Snell, just a minor pick up this off season. He's a Cy Young. So annoying. Tyler Glasnow, a monster who by the way, just hurt most of last year. He's back. Yamamoto, okay.

Yamamoto. Sasaki, the other guy we picked up. Oh, and then let me just throw in Shohei Otani, by the way, who's probably a top four pitcher in the forgot he pitches because he took some time off Guys I'm leaving. I mean Kershaw came back, you know, obviously shout out to Kershaw. I mean it is Unbelievable and then you just just throw the lineup in there with Mookie and Freddie and I mean look dude That's what I'm saying. We're gonna coast. Okay OK, I'm going to follow my Lakers here the next couple of months. We're going to make a deep playoff run.

It's a long, long MLB season, dude, a long one. I'm not worried about what happens in April and May and June. You get me September. No, you're a buck oh five. Like 105 wins is like a down year. Dude, I'll check the standings like every four days and we'll be up 14 games by the time June comes around. And it's like, all right, let's go. I'll see you guys in the class. You'll check the standings like every four days and we'll be up 14 games by the time June comes around. And it's like, all right, let's go. I'll watch some at bats,

right? You'll see, oh, he's up with two on and they're down two in the ninth. Let me just see what happened. I'll take the, I'll take the boys to a game. We'll go to a couple. We go to a couple of games every year. I'll take the boys this year. Probably the first time we'll see case. And it's ready. Cannon might not, but you know, those things we go for six, seven innings and we leave and it's a pretty fun day for them. So well, it was one of the first things we truly bonded on with this podcast was the Yankees Dodgers World Series. I will say for my Yanks, uh, interesting off season and I just can already tell you we might not pay attention to it now, but when it gets into September,

you're just going to hear a lot about that fifth inning or sixth or whatever it was you're just gonna that is gonna be the real if it's a Fox game or whoever has the game nationally their ESPN they're gonna bring that clip up we're gonna see that a lot this year being brought back up. Hey. It's gonna happen. I want to ask you about the the the kids I think Bri posted something on Instagram or maybe you about I mean, are we raising a little are we raising a little a little point guard in the Ferrari house or what? man, I you know that not get you pumped. I'm trying to Keep my emotions in check because you know with kids right like? Like it's this for two weeks and then next week, who knows?

It could be, I don't do that anymore. But since going to that Knicks game and I showed him, when we were in Florida, I showed him a clip of that Bridges game winner against the Blazers, right? Because he's never seen a game winner. I'm like, hey, I was in the morning too. So the next day I'm like, watch this clip of me. I showed it and we watched it again in like slow motion and he heard Mike Breen make the call and that was

it. He kept it moving. So they come back here. I'm I'm still in Florida and Bree sends me a video of Jacob in his Carl Anthony Towns Jersey driving and shoots a basket. And when he hits it, he goes bridges for the wind. Bang's good Nick's well he did the Mike Green call that's great and asked me every morning dad did the Knicks win even if they didn't play last night and he's he's in two different basketball camps right now so I'm gonna ride this thing out as long as it lasts I don't know if it's forever but man man, do you keep a spot right now? It's a good start because typically if they don't care they'll just show no interest or like well They'll hate not they'll hate if you drag them to something

They'll hate if you want them to watch something with you But if he shows interest on his own then dude You just keep you keep milking that keep kind of keep watching the game with showing him some highlights, because he's gonna get the bug, dude. And it doesn't, I mean, that's just in him, which is awesome. And you really don't know what your kids hear you say. Someone asked, when he was wearing the Townsters, someone asked Jacob,

why do you like Carl Anthony Towns? He's like, I like that his nickname's Cat, but he has too many dumb fouls, which is exactly what he got that from. He heard me bitching about Kat for having a dump, like too many dumb fouls, and now that's like in his brain. Well, the word that's going around our house is ass cheeks. I gotta be honest, it's not for mom and dad.

I have no clue. Kids cursing is super funny, but you really have to manage your reactions because then it's just going to be for ass cheeks. It's ass cheeks. And then this morning when I dropped, I dropped the boys off at school, can't, can't, can't, is going to get kicked out of school at like age seven. He goes, but cheeks into the room. He said butt cheeks this time and I go he cleaned it up. He's in

He's in preschool, right? So like I walk in the teachers in there like it's it's pretty low-key It's it's awesome walk in put his bag around case and follows me And I drop case and not case and start school after and he just goes in and he's just like butt cheeks And I'm like I looked at him. I said dude, you cannot say that in school. Yes. Stop your bat You don't do that. No, I, the police are going to come and get you. And he goes, daddy, really? I go, yeah, man, you can't say that. That work. You're going to get locked up.

But dude, ass cheeks, man. Well, speaking of ass cheeks, this is a perfect transition for me. Speaking of ass cheeks, let's talk. Can you join me on the New York Giants roller coaster for one second? Speaking of ass cheeks, I don't know. Is that how you feel? Do you think it's just ass cheeks? Well, I mean, Jamis Winston's a throwbacks, you know, he's a friend of the show. Friend of the show. I love that signing, by the way. I love the Jamis signing. I was fully ready and me and all my group chats and all that. We were fully ready to just embrace

look. We ain't really going anywhere. Malik neighbors probably going to break their wide receiver rec receiving hearts record with Jamis. It's going to be a wild ride to six or seven wins, but it'll be fun. We'll have some weird comebacks. It'll be, it just is gonna be an entertaining bad year. And then, and then look, Wastell may be drafting a quarterback and who knows. The Russell Wilson signing. Now, not my favorite player in the world either.

Not my favorite. Yeah, why is that? I just, he's a little bit of a history there. There's a little bit of a history there. There's a little bit of a history there. But also- What, well, no, no, no, no, no. You can't just throw that out there and not talk about it. Well, if you really want the gist of it-

He came on Entourage, right? Yeah, and Doug Allen and Connelly talk a lot about it on the Victory podcast. Like, when we were promoting the, first of all, he's in the Entourage movie, along with Gronk and Edelman and a bunch of cameos, right? And he's the one who threw the pass that Connelly broke his leg on when I was guarding him.

It was a Russell Wilson pass that got Connelly's leg broken, not his fault. And he was all about, had us up to Seattle after the movie was done, we screened the Entourage movie for the entire, by the way, we were trying to get into the facility and we were locked out and no one was coming to get us. And Pete Carroll walked up, chewing gum, like, what are you guys doing? And he had no idea who we were right away.

They were like, we're meeting up with Russ, and Pete Carroll led us in. We ran the 40, we did that tennis ball machine, we were catching the tennis balls, we did a bunch of drills, kicked some field some field goals screen the movie for the entire team all this stuff And he's like him and Doug are like friends like they come in and just movie gets close to coming out You know, it's doing good not great tracking strength and then people start saying oh, I'll throw I was just toxic and then I think Russell just ghosted everybody from Entourage ghosted Doug ghost. Everyone like just unfollows, like just high knees on the plane. Something happened there. I don't think something specific happened other than maybe he saw it wasn't a giant hit and didn't. I don't know. I don't know. I don't know. Nice

guy. Nice guy. A few times I have hung out with a very nice guy. So you're holding on to a beef for like 14 years. So there's a half a beef, but then when you dive into the action. So the former Steelers quarterback room is now in New York. You got Fields with the Jets, Russell Wilson with the Jets. Where are you going? Where are you going? And Matt, do they not draft a quarterback now?

Do you say I know Wilson's like ten years guaranteed one year? That's you saw yeah, I mean the Jamis signing Okay. All right. We got a bridge guy. Let's go see if we can get let's go get should door I think cam ward's a lock to go number one. I like that. That's all I think that's a lock, right? So what does Cleveland do it to? I think that's a lock, right? So what does Cleveland do at two and then Giants at three? And we talked about it this week on the phone, just like I think Giants, I think Giants would take Shador in a heartbeat.

And now this signing of Wilson makes me believe that there is no chance Shador is going three, that he's gonna go number two. But what if Shador does go three? But the Browns don't have a quarterback. They have Kenny Pickett. That's it. Maybe they're in the same boat. Maybe they're just like, you know what?

We'll take our chances this year. Is it going to be Flacco? There's no one left. It's Flacco and Rodgers. They're the only two left. No, we'll take our chances this year and then we'll go get Arch Manning next year. Take our chances with Kenny Pickett? No offense to Kenny Pickett.

Like you said, go win a couple games and then go get, and then set yourself up to get Arch Manning next year, who I think will be the number one pick. All that's being said is, I understood the Jameis thing. Yes, me too. And why do you need both? Why do you need both?

Exactly, and that's, I mean, and listen, like Russell Wilson's a starter. I don't think there's gonna be a competition there. Maybe they told him there is gonna be competition. I can't imagine Wilson's not the starter. He actually played pretty well for Pittsburgh last year. But I just don't see, that's not a move that's going to get the fans excited.

And it's not a move that's gonna say, all right, well now New York is, now they can compete in that division and get to a playoff. It doesn't say any of that, which is why give them all that money? And go draft, go try and get Jackson Dart, trade back, trade, by the way, maybe. I'll start talking Millrow over this situation.

You could talk me into a lot of other, I got talked, I talked myself into Joe Milton before this. There's some drafts that have Dart going in the top 10. I know, it's so crazy. And you could trade, I mean, that's the thing. Like he's, yeah, I don't know, man. I've always been able to spin it, Matt. I'm excellent at spin.

What I mean is like, I was able to spin the Daniel Jones draft pit when they drafted him, even though it was way too high, I tried to spin it and it made sense. And then I was able to spin the contract, right? It's like, there's so like, what quarterbacks could you even pay at this point? There is no spinning this. And for me, anything short of a playoff, a playoff appearance and win, it's a failure. If they if they win eight games, what does that get you? They go eight and nine. That's that's bad. They're not they're not way that's worse than

What was the record last year they won what four games? Something like and by the way, they're over under Wins total was three and a half. They signed both these quarter three three and a half still yeah, it moved. It didn't move at all That's it's gonna be another long fall for you, buddy And then now I know we'll talk about it cuz we're gonna be doing some a lot of fun draft stuff. But now that I got to start getting my mind ready for Travis Hunter, it's just, I don't know if this is, is this keeping your job? If you're like, Dable and Shane, is this the move? This is a thing that's gonna allow you and buy you more time?

It's awful, man. Yeah, I don't know. I don't know. I don't have an answer for you. Nine starters since 2020. I don't know the reasoning of both. And I know, I think, obviously, Rogers is, I think that's going to happen quickly. It's got to be Steelers now. There's no right Steelers or Browns or retirement.

Cleveland, Ch door and Kenny pick it. You know, prime wants them to go to New York so bad, probably number three, they should get the Jets and the Giants at this point. So they still could draft should door at three. I mean, maybe what we could do like for the NFL draft that could be fun before the actual draft is we'll sit down And let's let's do a draft if we combine the Jets and the Giants to make one team What players are we taking because that's where we're at already talking Giants in March. No, I'm not talking Giants

But come on, what did you do? Your mind must have been a little broken when you saw that No, my mind me I immediately went to you. I said, oh, fuck Jerry's gonna be so pissed. Poor guy. Poor son of a bitch. I was like, fuck why? But it's just why. I don't get it. I don't get it. We've mentioned a few times how much we appreciate the rating, the ratings and reviews on this show.

It does help on Apple and Spotify particularly. And before we give you the Wendy's fresh moves, we want to just, we're going to take a second. We're going to read another one. Hold on. Let me see. Got a few. Okay. I like this guy. I promise this one's fresh moves. We wanna just, we're gonna take a second, we're gonna read another one. Hold on, let me see. Got a few, okay, I like this guy. I promise this one's not me. The name is NYC Football. So someone right now who wrote this review,

not too happy, either Jets or Giants fan. But NYC Football says, chemistry between these guys, that's us, is great. Shows getting better every episode. Feel like I'm in their real life entourage. Did your boy write that? That does seem like someone I would know that wrote that or maybe even me. It wasn't me. This is a real review. You could see it, but it does help us. So if you get a second, what would our real life entourage look like? Am I, I mean, am I Vinny

chase in your turtle or am I turtle to your Vinny Chase? I don't think I can- We just fucking rockin', we're just rockin' and rollin', just fuckin' Matt and Jerry. I don't have Vinny Chase vibes. I just never have, you're Vinny Chase, bro, that's it. You're Vinny Chase. I think I could be a good E right now. I think you're a good E.

I think you're more than Turtle. So we have two spots open. We have Johnny drama open and we have turtle open. So we're taking- I still can't look like, it's so funny dude. Cause obviously now that I know you, I can't look at you in, in pictures of turtle and just look at you the same.

Early years? You were fucking 250 pounds. I wasn't 250. That's a little extreme. I was 205. No, shout out. I mean, you look, you look like you look fantastic, dude I'm just saying I get some crazy. You gotta remember something too, Matt

I came in like a little heavy, but also once something starts working, but once something starts working you just add then It's just you know, and look the fat jokes worked and it became a thing You played it up and you've been on sets before. You're in SAG, you know. You get around those craft service tables at six in the morning when you haven't eaten anything yet and there's fresh hot Krispy Kreme donuts just sitting there on the table with good cod.

They'll take your coffee order. It's just a great place. Craft services is great. Great place to put on some weight. When I was super fat, when I was little, my brother would go to my mom and he would be like, mom, like, what are we gonna do about Matty? He's so fat.

This is when he was like 15 and I'm 10. He's fat shaming you when you're 10 years old. You know, and God bless my mom. My mom was like, don't't worry he'll grow out of it he'll grow out of it and sure enough I grew out of it but dude there's some rough years bro how tall is your bro six feet dude I'm a so easy considered is that more normal like is your height and aberration in your family you're what about six we used to say is a mail, but it couldn't have been the mailman.

Not one person in my family is over six one, and that's extended everything. So I'm just, I'm an anomaly. Well, you got some like great, great, great grandfather who like somewhere had to have. I think a great uncle who might've been six two, maybe. I didn't too, my grandparents were short. My mom was tall.

My mom was 5'8", 5'7", 5'8", and growing up in the 60s, 70s, that was pretty tall. My dad's 5'11". So like, yeah, man, I don't know what happened. But yeah, dude, shout out to all the fat kids out there. You can change. You had 250. If I was 250, I'd have to be hospitalized at 5.6.

Well, dude, you're 5'9". 5'9", I love it. Yes, keep it coming. Did I just give you 5'9"? You gave me 5. If I was 5'9", I'd be Vince. Bro, 5'6", two bills. Yes, 205.

Two bills. Yep. Look at you now, bro. Hosted throwbacks. Well, again, give us some more of those ratings and reviews. We do appreciate it. Yes, please. And now it's time for Fresh Moves of the Week, brought to you by Wendy's.

Head to the Wendy's app to get a $1 JBC or a $1 double stack with offer and additional purchase. All right. Each week, we're going to pick our Fresh Moves of the Week. And it's hard for me to ignore, you know, again, I'm new to NIL and trying to keep up with transfer portals and all that. 750 men's hoops players, student athletes, entered the transfer portal.

Gone. Already? There was already 250 there from other coaching changes and stuff like that. They're expecting well well over a thousand, maybe two thousand, who knows, Matt. Is this now just free agency? It's free agency, right?

And I have a question for you. We talked about during college football, remember the backup quarterback for Penn State? Yes. Before the play, he bounced. And because that's when the portal window opens, so it leaves these student, these players a limited amount of time to either stay

or go find another home somewhere, which then obviously you're leaving your team. And I think Pippen, like Scottie's Pippen's son did that. He was on Michigan. Michigan's still playing obviously in the Sweet 16. And he wasn't, you know, he's not playing a lot, but he left his team in the portal. And along with over 700 players that you said,

it's, it's the same thing that we talked about in football, the windows need to be changed. Yes. It's, it's just, it's, it's just, it's crazy. Like there's not really an answer that we have. Like the windows are open this time, players are going to leave and go find another opportunity somewhere else if they can. And that's the way it is. But how crazy is it even I think, one player, so St. John's, right, gets bounced in the second round, they couldn't hit the broad side of a barn, they couldn't hit water if they fell off a boat in that game. And I hate what happened to Lewis and how that team, how the fans started like going at him. That's horrible. But anyway, they clearly, the shooting was always a thing.

They needed a shooter. They already got a shooter. Kid from Arizona State transferring, six five wing, could shoot. They like already addressed one part of their thing that was a loss. So it felt like a free agency. Isn't it crazy, like a lot of these schools now

are hiring general managers. You know, like you've seen that. They have to. They have to. So you have coaches, and we'll just take March Madness, college basketball coaches and GMs that are playing in the tournament, but have eyes and ears and people already looking

to upholster the roster for the following year because they know they're gonna have guys that leave and they know there's gonna be guys available. So that first day of the portal, when you get 500 kids, boom, you already have guys. And by the way, you have a coach practicing for a March Madness game, while you probably have a GM on the computer

doing all their recruiting rankings, reaching out to these kids. It's just, it's crazy, um, that that's happening, but that's, that's the way this system is right now. And it's, it's, it's just, uh, the, the hard part is like, it feels like there's not a lot of loyalty anymore on some, you know what I mean? Like it's, it's, and, and again, the argument from the athlete's perspective is coaches can leave and take more money and they can leave a team.

And I get that, right? And so now the players have a lot more say, a lot more power. They can kind of control some of their decisions, which is, which is great, but you just don't see like back in the day, when you sign a letter of intent, you sign a letter of intent to go play for that school.

And you were, you were, they were being loyal to you by offering you a scholarship and you were being loyal to them by committing to that school and competing and doing your best and trying to, in hopes it works out. And then in the opposite, maybe you would transfer a couple years in and all of that kind of stuff. And that just doesn't happen anymore.

And to that point, there was a crazy graphic going around this week. And I want to ask you this, a little trivia question. So. Oh, boy. OK. Not ready for this. Well, we talk about the portal and just the constant change.

So there's 16 teams, right? Sweet 16. There was a graphic out there that basically had the starting lineup for each team and where those players started in college. So they could have started at the school they're at and they're still there. From the Sweet 16.

From the Sweet 16. There is one team in the Sweet 16 where all five starters started at their school and have stayed at their school. One team. Can you guess that team? Oh man. All right.

There's a couple teams that have four, four of the five starters. And their fifth, it is not so much that they went to the end, they switched schools. They're at other schools. Yep. Got it. Uh, one team in the sweet 16. I'm going to, I'm not confident, but I'm going to say Maryland. Nope. No, same, same conference. So big 10. I don't even know. I got to pull up who's remaining to, uh, I'll, I'll tell you, tell me please. Purdue, Purdue. I was going to say, so all five starters on Purdue started at Purdue. They haven't left. Whether freshmen and they have some older guys too. Michigan State, four or five, started Michigan State.

Duke actually, four or five. That I knew, I knew Duke wasn't the. And then you go into some of these teams like BYU three. BYU's got a player coming in next year though. Yeah, I mean Houston three or five, Maryland I think two or five based on this graphic. Oh, my guess was terrible. Maryland is a whole. Yeah, Tennessee only two, but like there's a couple that all five, Maryland, I think two of five based on this graphic. Oh, my guess was terrible. Maryland is a whole-

Yeah, Tennessee only two, but like there's a couple that all five or one like Auburn, I think just one from Auburn, the rest of the starters all came from somewhere else. If I'm not mistaken. It's just crazy. And it goes to the point. It's like, like, especially in hoops where you can be one and done and all that kind of stuff. Yeah.

So two things for you on this. Look, I totally get if you're not getting playing time, but you were a big recruit and you've shown some promise and for whatever reason you're not getting playing time, you go in the portal. Got it. I also get the coaching change. Hey, it was this guy brought me here. It's totally different. I'm just new start for me. Great. How much if at all though is this really saying I just could get more money here You know like is that do you think that's? Becoming a main reason why some of these things because the playing time part is like tried and true and in football I really really get it. You know you just want to get reps and get seen basketball. You know You could still go off on your potential even if you don't get to playing time. I mean, isn't it as simple as some of these guys just could get more money

elsewhere? Dude, same as football. Absolutely. You have and and that's why we've seen sort of the Cinderella kind of fade this year in the first, you know, like it would be careful with that Cinderella will be dead soon. It's the first time since 2007 that there are no teams seated number 11 or higher in the Sweet 16. The top 16 teams in the tournament all won their first round games. That's the first since 2017. Yeah it's just, to your point I think a lot of these mid-majors lower level schools you have a really good player

that it's this it's the same it's the same thing in college football. And I tell a lot of kids this, if you're a quarterback, especially, or whoever, and it's like to go play for a smaller school, group of five school, compete, start, ball, then in two years, George's are coming, Collins, Morgan are coming, Collins, because you have the experience

and you're going to go get a bag. It's the same thing in basketball. I mean, you go out there and play for a mid-level team, a mid-major team, and you average 15 to 20 a game. Or you have a nice little tournament where you have one or two good games. You're getting a payday somewhere else. That's what we've seen.

That's what we're seeing in the portal now. It's just wild. Yeah, so I think a lot of it, I would say most of it is chasing the money and a better opportunity potentially. Shout out Wendy's, because we gave you 750 fresh moves right there, because 750 players went to the portal. Before we bring in Raymond Felton,

I was, you know me, I always try to think how I could equate sort of my job and my business into sports. So what, what's like the transfer portal in Hollywood and can there be one? The answer is no, of course, it's a silly thing to think of. But I racked my brain trying to think what would be a good equivalent and I think I came up with it. A transfer portal for characters killed off of shows.

Now here's why they need the transfer portal. I'm going to bring you quickly through the process of getting killed off a show. It's happened to me multiple times. Josie got killed off a show. Well the biggest thing is, you know, with power and power had multiple deaths a week. They bring you in like hard knocks. Courtney Kent would call me and say, bring your scripts. Like when they're cutting the player on hard knocks, bring your script. You're like, knocks, Courtney Kemp would call me in, say, bring your scripts. Like when they're cutting the player on hard knocks, bring your script. You're like, oh, it's happening.

But the biggest thing is it's not that you can't take another job right away. You just got to be really secretive because if we shot my death scene and I take a job the next day and then it gets announced in the trades, Oh, Jerry Ferraro is on the office. You could kind of say, oh, we know he's getting killed off power then. It tips the ending off. So a lot of times they want you to wait to take a job and really do a good job about not announcing it.

I think a transfer portal for characters killed off would be a good, easy way with rules written in to transition on another show. So what show would you go to? Like when I was getting killed off power and yeah? In the five scale. Let's see I mean it might have been nice to pop up on I don't know like a handmaid's tale or something something dark I don't know

It's a good show Maybe pop up on Ted lasso even though there's only two you just read from whole show. You just went from Handmaid's Tale to Ted Lasso. I'm just trying to think of the last two shows I watched while Power was on. I don't know. Watch White Lotus right now. That's good. F. We'll do a White Lotus recap at some point.

We should start doing recaps on here. White Lotus got weird too. I binged the last Kingdom. White Lotus is at all time HBO. Are you caught up on White Lotus? No, I'm not, So don't say anything. We'll talk. We'll talk later. I guarantee you'll watch it and you will text me. I've been, I've been trying to get like, everyone's talking about it online. So I'm trying not to look

into like what happens. I don't know anything that happens. We've only watched two episodes. So we're fine. Well, you at some point, well, I guarantee I'll get a WTF from you at some point as you get along in the season. All right. Um, again, thanks Wendy's. And now let's bring on Raymond Felton. All right. Thanks for joining us. We were just talking a little bit before you jumped on to I celebrated the 20 year anniversary last year with entourage it was 20 years since entourage started and then we were kind of looking back you're coming up on 20 years since your national championship with us it is so about that number that 20 year number i don't know why it just really starts to make you feel bad has it hit you yet there's been 20 years since the national championship yeah man we just um

Has it hit you yet? There's been 20 years since the national championship. Yeah, man. We just, early in the year, we had our reunion. We did it during football season just because a lot of guys coaching and a lot of guys can't move around like that during basketball season. So it was just fun, man, to get back with my old teammates.

We still keep in contact. We all like brothers. We have our, we still have our group chat. We keep in contact with each other throughout the year. But just to get with everybody and see everybody, man, it was, it was so real. Just to relive that moment and just to, you know, see videos and, you know, we had like a little slideshow that we did and every thing. So it was fun to see.

It was fun for my family to see it, you know, who wasn't there to be a part of it. When I was, when I was a young buck. So it was, it was one was when I was a young, but so it was on It was one of those moments where you can you can never take that from me That's probably one of my biggest parts of my career is winning a national championship because it's not easy to do It's not easy to do. I remember, you know, we were we were in college the same time. I was at USC and I When you when you look at USC football it's a football school the Cardinal and gold there it's just something about wearing

that jersey and then you look at all the the former players you know Marcus Allen Ronnie Lotz and all those guys I can own and I'm a I love basketball I grew up playing basketball my oldest son played basketball forever. Like what is it like wearing like a North Carolina basketball uniform? Like I just as a fan, I gotta imagine like walking around that school, being the starting point guard for a national championship team, it's gotta be like pretty electric.

That's colorway in the, in the, in all it is too man. That's colorway ever, best colorway ever. One thing I can say man, Carolina fans is amazing. They travel. They're everywhere you go. I don't care where I played at when I was in the NBA. There was always Carolina fans there. There was always fans at the games. And it's, I don't know, man, it's just, it's like a fraternity. Guys like Vince and even MJ, James Worthy, Shea Wallace, Jerry Stackhouse, the list goes on.

Even Julius Peppers was like a real good friend of mine, who played football, and he also played basketball in Carolina. He could hoop, right? He could hoop too. He could really jump out the gym. You should have seen him coming off the edge though. That shit was scary.

I don't believe it. But you know, the history goes on, man. And it's just, and it's like a brotherhood. Like I could call any of those guys to this day, you know, and I didn't even play with them. And it's like, and it's like family, you know? So I think it means a whole lot more than just the name and you know the colors and just the history is just it's like a it's like a big fraternity.

You know we we all look out to each other. We all you know like family. I don't care how far it goes back. You know I some of these guys I never even played with some of these guys I watched playing growing up some of them. I never even seen play. I just see clips of them and it still doesn't matter. It's like family, man. So putting on that jersey and being a part of that is special, you know,

something that is gonna be with me for the rest of my life. So I had the pleasure of going to a UNC Duke game. But at Duke, so I didn't go to Chapel Hill, I was at Duke, but it was, I've been to a lot of sport events. I was like, this one was a bucket list one. And do you have any funny, any unique stories about that rivalry? And I know you played against Reddick, right?

Yeah. And Reddick is literally outside of Christian Leitner, like the most, I always thought like Duke always has, you had like Leighton, you had Redick, you had Grayson Allen, you had like three of the top five probably most hated college basketball players of all time. Do you have any stories playing against JJ or just that rivalry in general?

Well, no, I really don't have no stories. You know, JJ, you know, me and JJ have been battling with each other ever since high school. You know, we was in the same McDonald's game, just AAU and just going to college, him going to Duke, me going to Carolina. And it's just always been a rivalry and a battle. JJ is one of those guys that, you know,

he didn't really get up on my skin, but I know Jackie Manuel got up on his skin. Cause Jackie Manuel was on him like white on rice, man. It was but it was fun. You know, I think I think the rivalry and the junk talking and all that stuff really comes from the fans and the students more than more. Then, you know, saying because actually, you know, Sean Docker is like one of my one of my good friends even to this day

And he went to Duke and it was never no no bad blood But we stepped on the court against each other. It was like we wasn't friends It was time to compete and was trying to trying to win a game But um when it comes to JJ though, you know, JJ was always one of those guys that you know, he could shoot the piss out of the ball and God, guess people just didn't like him. He always had that little arrogant look about him. And the guys just didn't like it.

But it did bother me. JJ Cool with me, we got a chance to play with each other. With the Clippers in the league as well. So everything comes in full circle, man. But that rivalry is like, man, playing in Cameron. Yeah. It's crazy. You got the students and the fans on top of you.

They can barely, sometimes we take the ball out, they can touch you on your back. That's how close they are. So, but it's fun though, it's electric. Yeah, we talk a lot on this show about rivalries, even at professional sports. And it feels like, look, there's certainly rivalries in professional sports still.

You got Celtics, Lakers, which they might be on a collision course this year. Who knows? But it really does feel like the college level and a lot of that might change now with NIL and transfer portals everywhere. And maybe those rivalries will start to fizzle out. But it really does feel like Duke UNC is one of the last few remaining that even if you're not a fan of either of the two teams, you're still putting that game on. I want to ask you though, just going back to how aware were you guys as players, does this even come up when like,

you know, you know, coach Roy Williams, you know, he hadn't gotten that monkey off his back of winning the title. Like, is that something that any, you know, you guys are all young players at the time. Like, is that ever even discussed, like getting coaches first, or you're just so locked in on the mission at hand? Cause I feel like I would know, like this guy's been at it for so long, he's never, we wanted to be the team to get him that first one.

No question. I mean, that was definitely part of it. You know, we wanted to do it for the school. We wanted to do it for ourselves. We wanted to do it for our families. And of course, definitely wanted to do it for coach, you know, cause he's been there and he could never get over that hump. So to be able to be a part of that first team

to get him his first national championship. I mean, that's, all of them is gonna be special to him. All the players are gonna be special to him. But I think the one that he got with us is gonna be always stuck in his mind and his head because it was his first one. You know, of course, was one, you know, it was his first one and it was a, it was a beautiful run, man. It was, it was tough, you know, battle against Michigan state in that final four and then go on playing as Illinois in that

championship game with a lot of talent. Great game, man. You, I mean, right now such a good game. I, I watched some of it back and I will have to admit, Raymond, I did look back at the Villanova game. All right. Have you looked though, only because it's so funny all these years later, Alan Ray in the travel. I don't know how often you've been asked that in your, but I watched it 10 times. I'm trying to figure out, man, by, by like NBA standards now, this isn't even like, this

isn't even close. Like, have you even, have you seen, when was the last time you even seen that play? Cause it was, I think you guys win anyway. I really do. I don't think that was like the deciding factor of the game, but at the time, I remember being a kid watching it and like, yeah, it kind of took an extra half step there, which now that's not even debated. That's no travel, right?

Right. Right. I mean, it was a, it was a big play. It was definitely a gutsy call. But, hey, listen, I'm glad he made it. You know, because I got in foul trouble that game and I I found out, but you know, my guy, Melvin Scott, he stepped up and he hit four free throws to steal the game to win the game at the end right there. So, you know, one thing I tell people, man, no matter, you know, who, who's supposed to be the best player in the team, who's supposed to be the man,

who post be what it always be somebody that, that, that comes off the bench or don't play as many minutes that steps up in order for you to win a championship. All of that stuff happens, man. Injuries, everybody being healthy, all kinds of stuff mixing to that. And I think, you know, it was just, it was just God's plan for us to win it that year. Everything just came in our favor.

Everything was working for us. We was playing great basketball. We was locked in. You know, it was just, you know, a blessing, a blessing for us, man, for real. What I saw, now look, I'm again, admittedly, huge Knicks fan, so I know a lot about your career. You're one of my favorite Knicks.

So I start looking at that McDonald's game. I see you in the dunk contest, man. This is what I'm saying, we don't, normal civilian fans don't realize because Raymond Felton is just not dunking four times a game in the NBA. You think like, Oh, he probably doesn't really have a dunk package. I saw some of the dunk, man. You should have dunked more in the NBA. You throwing it down.

Well you know, uh, I, I, I did used to have a pretty, I actually had a 42 inch vertical. So 42. Yeah. So I could, I could 42? Yeah, so I could really get up. But- Yeah. Once I got into the league, man listen, when you get knocked out the air by Shaquille O'Neal and you know, Dwight Howard, Andrew Bynum, some of these big dudes that was in the league at the time

when I first got in the league, when you get knocked out the air trying to go dunk, you learn to shoot a floater. You learn to shoot a floater. You learn to shoot a floater. So there ain't no more dunking. There ain't no more trying to jump. Like these guys like John Moran and Anthony Edwards, these young guys now.

Scary. Man, the way they get up now and jumping like that, I would like to have seen how they did that with Shaq and those guys up under that rim. So like we talked about this a couple weeks ago when there was a lot of talk about the NBA All Star Game and yeah, just how you fix it, how you don't what's wrong with it. I'm more curious of the dunk contest because you were a dunker back

in the day. Why don't the Anthony Edwards of the world job Moran's of the world some of these high flyers why don't they like why don't they enter the dunk contest? Like it used to be, cause back in the day, I mean, LeBron's ever done, I don't think, right? Kobe did it, Vince Carpenter was the greatest. Like we just don't see the faces of the NBA that can get up do that.

Why is that? I have no clue. That's something that I've always asked and always just been like, just why? And I never really got a legit answer, but I would love to see that. I would love to see John Moran, Anthony Edwards, Zion Williamson,

Oh gosh. Zach Levine, like I would like to see a dunk contest, Aaron Gordon, you know, these guys who can really fly. I would like to see a dunk contest with those, with all of them in just one contest, just to see what happens. Yeah, I've always wondered what it was like to, because I could dunk back in the day, but I always had I had like the lazy hop. Yeah, you have like, yeah, you aren't like throwing it on someone. I've always wondered what it's like to like dunk on

somebody and all like what it's like to run a four-4. Just what it's like to be fast. That's it. As an athlete. I was a pretty good athlete, but I never had any fast twitch though. That's for sure. You know what I wanted to ask you too before we dive into some other NBA stuff. So we're talking about JJ and I kind of came to this thought the other day, but I was just wondering from your perspective, someone who played the game at the highest level, right?

So JJ is in year one. Is it any kind of an advantage? And I know we saw it with Steve Nash, who was relatively recently retired, you know, like JJ has played against 80% of the current NBA, right? He's only been out of the game two years. You know, I guess from a player perspective and from a coaching perspective, do you think that's any sort of advantage that he, he's played against these guys within the last three years?

I always wondered that like he's drawn up plays with guys. Obviously he knows LeBron, but he's coached, he's played against Jason Tatum. He played in Dallas with Luca. Like he's played in the NBA recently. I mean, I think that helps with relationship wise. I think they help with a level of respect that you have with each other because, you know,

you are literally a player's coach. But I'll just, you know, it also helps that you got LeBron James on your team too. Right. Very. Yeah. Yeah. That helps a lot because you know, just the things he could do and the things he's doing at the age of 40, like, listen, it hurt to get up this morning. So to see him do that at the same day, Diane read me. Is this nothing but amazing, but, um But I think JJ is doing a great job. I think he's a really good X and O guy that draws up some good plays

and he makes good adjustments in games, before games. And I just, be interested to see what he does over the next few years. But I think he's doing a great job so far by far having a good year as a first coach, you know? And I think, you know, with his knowledge of the game, I think he'd be fine though. You mentioned a little bit of Shaq

and just some of the old school big guys and there's a lot of chatter about the eras, right? And I think Tim Hardaway was on, I think Gilbert's podcast just roasting the dudes, like literally, like Swaggy, who's my boy from SC to his face. These guys just like, you couldn't play, you guys suck, blah, blah, blah. You, I mean, you played in this current era,

but you had a cross, right? Cause you played against Shaq, you played against some of those, got Kobe in the mid 2000s. Where do you stand on this whole era debate on whether or not the old school guys could play in today's game, which is a lot more open and fast and shooting threes and all that,

or whether or not the current guys are, you know, quote unquote, tough enough to play back in the 80s and 90s. Where do you stand on that side? I'm just fascinated by it because I love, like I grew up Laker, I'm a diehard Laker fan. I grew up, you know, the Shaq and Kobe era, even Showtime I was a little kid, but like, I just, it was different back then.

Like everything was through the center and it was more physical felt like today. It's just a different game today. Well, put like this, professionals are professionals, athletes are athletes. Of course. And I think, you know, back in the day was very physical. The game was totally different than what it is now.

It was a lot of just pound the ball in the paint, get the ball in the post, come off pins, pin downs, you know, ball screens and just, there was more physical guards back then. You know, when I came into the league, point guards like Johnson Billups and, you know, Andre Miller, and you know, these guys were physical dudes who would post you up and just, you know, the game was a whole lot different.

You know, point guards now are scoring 30 points a game and, you know, shooting threes from half court. Like, the game is just evolving, the game is different. Now to say that these young guys couldn't play back then, now I can't say that because these guys are very talented, very athletic and very skilled. But to say that these older guys couldn't play now, it's absurd because these dudes was physical, they was mean,

and they was talented and they was skilled. You know what I'm saying? So I think a lot of the old school guys think that the game is soft now, which the game is, you know, they do, you know, they can't touch no more. Just the fouls, man. It's the fouls all the time. Just let them play.

You might get a flake and get thrown out the game. Dudes would get knocked out of the air left and right back in the day, like in the 80s. Bill Lambeer just come and just close the line. Oh man, Bill Lambeer would probably be banned from the league at this point. He wouldn't be in the league, and there wouldn't be no Bill Lambeer right now.

He'd be banned from the league at this point. Who was the toughest? I mean, cause like Ben Wallace, I'm trying to think of back like Ben Wallace was a dog inside, like Rashid was a dog inside. Like Rashid was nasty. Like who was the grizzly teams part? We probably weren't a fun grand off.

Yeah. The most physical team was probably back when I played the most physical team was on. Yeah. By far Detroit, Detroit defense. But even with them being physical, they wasn't like, it wasn't like a nasty physical, like, like the old Detroit bad boys. Right. They were saying, yeah, they wasn't like it wasn't like a nasty physical like like the old Detroit bad boys, right? They were. They were saying, yeah, it wasn't like that.

Then you got, you know, Indiana, too. Indiana was like that as well. We're Ron Artis and all those guys, you know, those guys were really physical, you know, play a lot of great hard defense. You know, play a lot of great hard defense. But yeah, to answer your question, man, I don't believe that neither one could not play in the era. Like I feel like the young guys can play, then I feel like the older guys can play now.

So that's how- You just would have had so much more space to operate, you know? Like even if you look at, you know, I know your game well from watching you in the NBA and You just would have had so much more room So I stick a look at all your score you just would have scored way more because it's sort of a more space I feel like you know space and then nobody could really touch me and I was right. I like to play physical

So yeah, just just with And I know a lot of people don't like this debate when it comes to MJ and LeBron, you know To me they both they both are goats, you know MJ is mine because that's who I grew up watching Of course, you know saying but they both are goats, but If MJ played in this time Where they could be physical with him, I mean who who tell how many points this man would have had? I mean the 38 a game It's crazy. So I mean, who, who tell how many points his man would have had? Or how many to 38 a game. I mean, it's crazy.

So, I mean, the game is different. And that's all I can say. The game is different now. You know, they score way more points. It was, it was unheard of to be, to see two teams score over 140 points in the game. We got Tom Thibodeau in the New York Knicks scoring 140, man. That like, that's a box score. I never thought I would see a Tom Thibodeau coachicks scoring 140, man. That's a box score I never thought I would see.

A Tom Thibodeau coach team scoring 140 points. I just never thought I'd see that in my lifetime. Exactly, exactly. Where do you, Raymond, where do you put Kobe in that conversation? Because I feel like, I'm like MJ, Kobe, and LeBron is great, clearly, what he's been able to do. But I just, I don't know if Kobe doesn't get enough credit

or he does get, because I've seen a lot of guys come on and say, Kobe was a top, is closest to MJ than anybody. And I had some people who don't even have him in his top 10. That's crazy. He played him. I mean, that was the same era. Like where does he stack up against, basically those two guys, right?

That's the debate. To me, he's number two. Like that's my opinion. To me, he's right behind MJ for what he's done to the game. And like you said, just a second ago, he's the closest thing to MJ. He's the closest thing to it. Just his work ethic, what he puts into the game, the way he studied the game, student of the game, always learning. Like MJ said, he always used to call him and ask some questions, trying to get better. And just what he's done for the game and what he's done during his time of playing.

I mean, what can you really say, Van? For somebody to say that he's not in their top 10, that's crazy. I don't know who, Jerry barely had him in the top five. I think that's not true. Yes, it is. You relax. You said that.

I'm just older than you, so I remember Magic and Bird a little more than you, because I'm older. But like, come on. I feel like if you look at Jordan, Kobe, like Tiger, and even Brake Tom. Oh, you're going all sports now. No, I'm just thinking, LeBron, and this isn't even a slap.

Like we always talk about the killer instinct and like the greatest, greatest, greatest, greatest athletes. Like those four in my opinion are like the greatest athletes. And like I put Serena up there and Gretzky, like you have all these guys, but like that killer instinct is just like either, like Tom Brady played to 45 and like people could say he was, I trained people and say, oh, he wasn't great athlete. He was an absolute just psychopath when it came to like, I want to be the best of all time. That's to me what Kobe was, you know, it's like he was a psychopath. And you hear stories time I like the guys that played with him and his work ethic and all that is like, he to me he's yeah MJ is one a and he's one b it's not even close

I totally agree with you I told that LA has some LA roots too we're gonna we gotta talk about some New York things for a sec you probably put it you probably put Jalen Brunson in your top five right of course of course well speaking of Brunson all right so you know diehard Nick fan I very very happy with Brunson and all that. But I've always said this is something like on all my Knicks group chats and I'm in 10 million of them, right? Even before Brunson, it was like, who was the last point guard that Knicks had? It's like, it's easy.

It's obvious as Raymond Felton, that's the last point guard before Brunson that we Nick fans had that felt like real leadership, all the things you want out of a top point card. So you get to the Knicks and you were balling man, balling, right? And I'm still like, don't know how to feel about the Mellow trade because I love Mellow and you know, came one of the great Knicks, but like was kind of short changed because he didn't have a ton of weapons around him because most of the weapons went in the damn trade. So all I can say is as a Nick fan, I was super happy to get Mellow, but I remember being a little younger saying like, but he's got to play with Felton, man.

That's like the whole point. So I don't want to go too far back in the past and make you relive that stuff but like before that trade happened were you really feeling like New York was home for you because you know how it is in New York too when we when we latch on to a player man that love lasts forever. Oh no man listen I still get love to this day from the fans and when I go when I go out there and go to games and stuff. That trade, man, I think that's the one trade I think hurt, that hurt because it was my first, actually it was my first time getting traded. And I was just, I was having such a great year, man.

Yeah, you were like 18 and 10, I think. Yeah, I mean, I got snubbed from the R-Star game that year. You know, I thought I was gonna make it and got snubbed. And just, you know, just having a great year in a big city. And if you went to New York, you know how it goes. You went to New York, man. New York loves you, man.

It was beautiful. So when they was talking about getting mellow, I was like, okay, we gonna have a chance to win this thing. Cause we was already like top five, top six in the East at that time, but you add a guy like Mello to that team and he still be able to keep some pieces. I said, we gonna have a shot.

So I wasn't even in that trade at the beginning. The last minute I got thrown in the trade the last minute and I was just like, oh my damn, it hurt. and I ended up coming back. Oh, yeah, I will talk. Yeah. You know, after that, but it hurt, man. It was just, it was just one of those moments where it was just like, you know, I still you know, I did I did what I had to do when I got to deliver. Yes, it was just like, it was just it was just just unhappiness because, you know, I just didn't want to

leave New York, you know, it was just a good times and it was fun. It was fun. So yeah, like, so you represent for a lot of Nick fans, like this kind of last moment up until the recent two, three years of this team where it's like the last time we had an all star level point guard was you. And then you come back to the Knicks, right? And I don't know if that was like, I don't know how that feels coming back for you.

Were you like, okay, I'm finally back now. We could do this thing because that 2013 team wins 54 games that up until again, the last two, three years, that team, that was the last Nick team to get out of the first round in a year and like everything kind of collapsed once that team fell apart. But you get back to the Knicks. Was that like bittersweet or is that like, okay, no, I'm back where I belong. Let's, let's run this. Cause now I can play with Mello and starting all these guys. Right. No, it was, it was one of those situations where I, I wanted to come back and I got the

phone call Mello, Mo actually called me, Coach Woodson called me and you know they signed Jay Kidd so you know before I even got there and so I was a little iffy about going there first because I'm like listen this is Jason Kidd like this is Hall of Famer point guard somebody that I idoled somebody that I looked up to and it's like if he's going there then you know what am I coming for? You know what I'm saying? And it was just a phone call that I had with him and I decided to come. And then when I got there, the crazy thing about it,

when I got there and Jason Kee was just like, this is your team. Yeah. I'm like, what? He was like, this is your team. We gonna go as you go. You know, you're gonna be the guy who, who will He was like, this is your team. We gonna go as you go. You gonna be the guy who will be the leader of this team, who gonna run this offense and we gonna go as far as you take this.

And I was like, wow. So to get that type of confidence coming back from a guy like Jason Kidd and him to just learn from him. I mean, he used to tell me things on the court with plays before I even saw it. He would he would tell me what was going to happen. And it happened. Like, so, man, shout out to him, man. He's just a great coach, you know, great, you know, teammate, just an all around great person, man. You know, he did a lot for me. And then second state when I came back to New York, man, freaking Roy Hibbert turned into Bill

Russell in the second round out of nowhere, man. I don't understand what York, man. Freaking Roy Hibbert turned into Bill Russell in the second round out of nowhere, man. I don't understand what happened, Matt. I don't, you probably don't remember because you don't watch much like Beat the Self easily, J.R. Smithball and all of a sudden just control this year and then Roy Hibbert turns into Bill Russell blocking Mello at the red. Never seen anything like it. I'm still pissed about. And then Roy Hibbert was gone, isn't it? He did that. And then that type of center was like out of the NBA. So mad, Ray. I'm so mad about it. Still. Yeah, me too. But I thought we had a chance, man. I feel like we was the one team that can

compete with Miami because we beat three times out of one that year. So, you know, we was one of the teams that I don't think Miami wanted to see that year. Stat was on that team? Yes, that was on that team too. Yeah, I used to- Tyson Chandler, defensive player see that year. Statt was on that team? Yeah, Statt was on that team too. Yeah, I used to- Tyson Chandler, defensive player of the year. Tyson Chandler, yeah.

I was in Arizona when Statt was in Phoenix, man. Those Phoenix, there's probably around, when did Statt go to Phoenix after New York? No, no, he- He was there before. Yeah, he came up with Nash and then he signed. Well, no, it was like Nash, Boris Diao, they had a Barbosa, they were like run and gun, with Dan Tony, you played for. Well, no, it was like Nash, Boris DL. They had a Barbosa.

They were like run and gun. But you played for Dan Tony? No. Yeah. That was the first time I came to New York. Yeah. Is all that true with Dan Tony of like, I forget there's like this urban legend story, which you never

know is true where they're like, I don't know what, I don't even know if it was a Knicks or a Suns team, where he's like drawing up plays. And like one of the players is like, coach, what about defense? Like, don't worry about it was a Knicks or a Suns team where he's like drawing up plays and like one of the players like coach What about defense like don't worry about it. Just out score from was he really that offensive? My I mean, I'm sure he talked defense with you guys, but he goes down as like an offensive Guru, you know, he's an offensive like

Wizard is crazy. Yeah, you know the things he could draw the way his offense goes You know if you if you have guard if you are way his offense goes. If you have guarded his offense, or point guarded his offense, you're gonna have some of your best numbers, your best, playing up on him. But as far as defense, like everybody has a defensive coach. So coach Mike Wilson was actually the defensive coach

on that team, which was crazy. Then he ended up being the head coach. Right. Next time I came, I came back around. But, um, and it's so funny is that I've known coach, I know coach Mike D'Antoni even when I was in high school, because his brother, Dan D'Antoni was my AU coach. Oh, really?

And he's an offensive dude too, right? Yes, he is. Wow. Just running gun, man. Just run and gun. Run and gun. Do you? I'm telling you.

I'm curious because we talked before you jumped on a little bit about club hoops. And I've witnessed it kind of firsthand at like the made hoops tournament. And then my son flirted with a little bit of EYBL. But do you teach because you, but do you teach, cause you coach and do you teach, cause the game has changed so much. We talked about earlier where it was center driven, you throw it in the post and you work around a big.

And obviously that now the bigs are shooting threes and they can run the point and all that. How do you teach the game to your kids? Curiously, because when I teach quarterback, it's hard now because the game is run out of the shotgun and the game is run at the RPO that you hear. And it's not as much under center with the old school play action,

which I still believe we all know this, like you still make your money and win games from playing within the tackles, throwing the football. What is your perspective and approach on coaching like the next generation of kids? These generation of kids are definitely different, but I think as teachers and as coaches, we still have to still teach these kids the basics.

And I think when you look at a lot of these kids now, they are very talented. They're probably way more talented, way more athletic than we were. But the things that we knew about the game is we knew the basics. You know what I'm saying? So if you could put us in any type of offense

and we could survive, we knew how to play. That's why you see a lot of these kids now, they struggle now because a lot of them don't really understand how to play. They just right off raw talent, raw athleticism, you know what I'm saying? And I think with me as a coach, what I do, I still teach the basics. I teach the little small things. You know, these kids now want to just come out and do a straight step back on the three.

I'm like, no, that's that's that's not realistic. That's my oldest son's only move to step back on the three. I'm like, no, that's, that's, that's not realistic. That's my oldest son's only move to step back. Steph Curry screwed everything up. To go on the post. I begged him to go on the post. I was like, dude, you're, you're a six, four guard. You're big and strong. The dudes guarding you might be like, jump, but like you're big, use your body and like, look at, I would always say like Kobe's gang, Kobe would go in the

post as like it's just it's so it bothers me man because I love that you're too old bro that's like me and Jerry man when we play the 40-year-old pickup like I'm I'm by the way I ain't going in the post no more I just shoot outside because I don't want to get fouled but I'm saying like the post is like the old school man these kids don't know they don't know they don't know but you know I just you know I can relate to the kids because I was able to play in both in both eras but at the same time like I still have to be you guys still got to be firm with these kids because you know a lot of these kids now unfortunately you know they're spoiled you know they didn't they didn't come up and

was raised the way we was so you these kids now spoiled, they're a little softer than we are in certain ways. And I don't mean softer, sensitive, let me say that word. They're a little more sensitive than we are. By far. We didn't have transfer portals and these, I love the NIL deal part of it. And the transfer port I really don't like because,

you know, a kid now, if you hard on the kid and you holding the kid accountable, if you don't like it, now I'm leaving this school. And you're not gonna learn that way. You're not gonna get better that way. You know, I don't like that part of it, but it is what it is. But we just gotta continue to just keep teaching these kids

the basics, man, and really staying on to just keep teaching these kids the basics man And really staying on them and really teaching them how to play basketball rather than just throwing a ball out there and just say look Who's the most talented that's who's gonna win this game? You know that ain't gonna work when it get in college that ain't gonna work when you get into the NBA or even overseas You know saying so you got to really just teach them the basics NBA or even overseas, you know what I'm saying? So you got to really just teach them the basics. A lot of people ask me about NIL and I'm all for it and we shout out the O'Bannon brothers, man, because they really they spearheaded the whole thing. Everyone used to say I took a pay cut from going to USC to the NFL.

You probably did. You probably did. That's bullshit, I didn't. But I mean, I can't speak for other guys, but what was there, you know, any story you could tell about? I mean, I can only imagine 20 years later, cause we can speak freely about this now, cause we can't get in trouble. Being a North Carolina basketball player

had to come with its perks. Oh, 100%. I was okay in college put like that. You're good. I was good. I was I was okay in college. I didn't have I didn't have to be the wormy's when I was in college. I put it like that. Oh, those are the now though in these NIL deals now. It's crazy. But you guys, you guys would have cleaned up the two of you. I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I much, man. I was just I was just grateful and happy to go to Carolina and I was the number one player in the country coming out of high school. I was the Nate Swift national player of the year in high school that year in 2002 and I just wasn't on that type of

time. I was just grateful just a little kid out of Atlanta, South Carolina that was just grateful to be in a situation I was in to go to school and play college ball at a dream school and had an opportunity to, you know, better myself there and possibly get to the NBA. And that's all my focus was. I really wasn't thinking about how much money I can get or, you know, anything. And the great thing, my parents wasn't,

my parents wasn't like that too. You know, I'm not gonna call the school out, but we was offered millions of dollars from another school, plus a house, plus cars, all kinds of stuff. And my mama just looked at me and said, where do you wanna go? And I said, I wanna go to Carolina.

And she said, okay. And they turned the deal down. That's great. Yeah, they turned the deal down and ended up working out for all of us at, you know at the end so, you know is As one of those things down there where the game is just not the same no more, you know You have you know parents out here selling their keys for money. Yeah, even in the a you game, man I'm dealing with that now you the teams are offering people

Money kids money pay families money to get their kid to just come play for their team. And to me, what I'm telling parents is, what is that teaching your kid? Do not caring about what are these kids are learning, how are these kids developing? You know what I'm saying? I'm just not with that. I don't like that.

I remember one kid, I remember, I think it was seventh grade or eighth grade, where it made hoops. And I think before like, I remember, I think it was seventh grade or eighth grade where it made hoops. And I think before like the third, the third stop, like you could, you could switch a team or whatever. And then after the third, whatever you could, I remember seeing a kid literally play for three different teams in one day.

And he was, I don't remember that, but he was a top kid and he would just take his jersey off. He'd go throw that and I was like, what the fuck? What's going on? It was the same shit. It was just like parents, like these coaches are poaching the kids. There's probably some handshakes going on

to get the kid to come play for them. And I was like, man, like to your point, where I'm like, the parents are almost just as bad. Not all the parents and you're lucky, obviously, you're a great one, but like they're not all like that. And it's unfortunate. Yes, it is. Yes, it is. Before. Yeah, totally. That's all very unrelatable to me. I know one ever offered me money to play anywhere or anything. I don't think they're gonna offer my kids any money.

And I'm going to be a good sports parent because my kids are going to be playing, you know, we're going to just be talking about playing time. Last thing, Raymond, and we're gonna let you go. So for you, your all time UNC team, you could put yourself on there, you could leave yourself off. We're talking about the UNC greats. And again, it could be guys you played with that some of us might not put on there. But who's your North Carolina five? That's tough. You go any direction. No, no, no, it's tough. You go any direction? No, no, no, it's tough.

For me, point guard. I'm gonna go with Phil Ford. Okay. I told you, Jerry. I told you. Go feel forward to go with obviously MJ at the two guard. MJ. Now the three spot is where it gets tricky.

That's tough. You know, three spots where it gets tricky because you can go, man, you can go Vince, you can go Jerry Staghous, you can go. It's tough. That's probably the toughest spot. You're right. Man, you can go so many places, but I'm going to go with Vince at my three. The four is tough too, because you got my big bro, Rashid.

Rashid. Got my big bro Rashid. Shied. Got my big bro Antoine Jameson. You know, you got James Worthy. James Worthy, yeah that's tough. You got James Worthy. But for me, if I just had to choose one just off the history, just off you know, what I

know about James Worthy, I'm gonna go with him at the fourth spot. And then for me at the five spot, I know when I, when I said this before, a lot of people was like, Oh, you ain't gonna go with Tyler Hemsborough. I like Tyler, you know, I think he's a, he's a great player. He did a lot of great stuff in college basketball, but for me, I'm going with my big fella at the five spot. I'm going big Sean May. Big Sean May. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Go. That's a girl. Oh my god. That's a great squad. I had a Hansborough in there. Hansborough was a dog. I went felting man. In college he was a dog.

Anytime you got bloodied you're just bloodied and you're just bodying people out there. Obviously like you can't go wrong picking James Worthy is one of the best players. But like, I love the way like the legend of Rashid Wallace continues to grow. Like even former NBA players just talk about like just guys who would have thrived today. We had that conversation of what guy backed it like I mean he had the whole pad he had everything he's before big men shot threes and can shoot threes oh yeah left hand left hand this is good this is right just as good as I'm so serious listen I was playing for the Bobcats and that's when Detroit was Detroit right and they was beaten so bad that he showed

it. He started shooting threes left-handed and he hit and he hit like three in a row. It's we can. I got to see if we can find this footage. That's crazy. You shouldn't threes left-handed man. It was bad. It was bad. Can't thank you. We appreciate you, man. One of my favorite players to watch over the years and appreciate it, man. I appreciate y'all, man. Thanks for having me Appreciate it. Thank you, right? All right, should we do some mailbag now? That was awesome that Raymond Felton stop off still I just still will never be over the mellow Tree, I know we talked about in the interview. It's still

That's like the big what if for Nick fans, but anyway, well, you just been haunted being a New York fan your whole life Yeah, it's it's I'm bringing to the West You're you're you're a pseudo LA guy too, though There I never I never caught on to any LA team I enjoyed watching Kobe and the Lakers all those years like as a fan. I went to a lot of games Can't get into the Kings Rams weren't even there when I was living in LA and definitely not rooting for LA football It's not a football town anymore. It's not.

All right, let's do some mailbag stuff because that's been working. I think I pulled two good ones. You want me to take, I could take the first, you take the second? Yeah, what do you got? All right, we're going to go to Leonard in Detroit, who is probably happy that the Pistons are doing well, but he says, Jerry, there are a lot of big time cameos and entourage over the years. Any of them cause you to feel starstruck.

I think he talked about that once right? A little bit. Was it Phil? Well Phil was definitely it was starstruck early but then we he's so good at like disarming you and like being normal dude we played some golf too at while he was shooting so that went the Brady thing was definitely a little starstruck at the disarming you and like being normal dude we played some golf too at while he was shooting so that went the Brady thing was definitely a little starstruck at the time because also the way he came in but again that went quick um Kanye didn't have me starstruck and again this is Kanye 15 years ago um it there was a moment there where he was like so late we wondered if he was just gonna if he was coming at all for his cameo uh I will say the one that got me a little bit was uh matt damon matt damon got me a little bit also it was like matt damon lebron james and bono all shot on the same day so that and even

some of the scenes i wasn't in i said i have to show up for some of these scenes this is like one but when you look at a call sheet, you know, I'll give you the scenes for the day and the time. And it was like, yeah, first up, it's Matt Damon and LeBron James. And then second up, we had this quick thing with Bono. And then we're finishing with this like Matt Damon meltdown scene that he's gonna improv.

I'm like, I gotta, I gotta show up, you know. It's for the kids, Vince. It's for the kids. That's one of those famous lines, for the kids, Vince. I love it. All right. David Orlando saw your guys build your perfect quarterback video on Instagram the other day where you were allowed to use quarterbacks from any era.

Now do it. Just the quarterbacks playing today. I got a lot of heat from mine. But my Peyton Manning accuracy for all time, I got a lot of heat. No, you did. Well, you put Eli Mananny in there for clutch. Yes. I got more heat for Peyton for accuracy.

I got a lot of heat for that. Okay. Arm strength. Uh, I'm going to go Josh Allen. I'll just build mine really quick. Arm strength, Josh Allen, accuracy. I'll go Tua, athleticism. I'll go Lamar, clutch factor. I'll go, because I want to make this different, Clutch Factor, I'll go Joey B. And then overall, I'll go Patti Mahomes. I'm going to go super specific. You're going to hate this. You are going to absolutely hate this.

You're going to go Daniel Jones, Eli Manning, Tommy DeVito, Russell Wilson, and now Jameis Winston. Wait, we might still sign Aaron Rodgers too. And Aaron Rodgers and Shador Sanders. Aaron Rodgers draft Shador, six quarterbacks. Like what people do in a fantasy draft. They draft all quarterbacks and they build their team through trades. Arm strength.

We've heard all about it. Why not put Joe, why not Joe Milton for arm? Just arm strength. We're only talking about the strength of one's arm Joe Milton Hey, just keep going accuracy. It's I know he's only a rookie going into his second year It's hard to overlook Jaden Daniels when you're talking accuracy do you putting it? pinpoint accuracy athleticism

Love Lamar you have to take Lamar. I I still don't want him taking too many hits, but you were right on that. Clutch factor, look, you ready for this? This is gonna be a controversial take. Who was more clutch in the biggest game of the year than Jalen Hurts this year? Love it. So how do you ignore that?

I'm giving Jalen Hurts. Give the man his flowers. And overall, that's where I put in the Josh Allen, because Josh Allen has just enough of all of these things that I think Josh Allen's a good overall good question though David appreciate it all right all right let's get some more don't forget it's feedback at throwback show thank you to Raymond Felton next week next week we can't even say it, but you are so fucking excited. In the words of DJ Khaled, let's golf.