Throwbacks with Matt Leinart & Jerry Ferrara - The Best of Recruiting on Throwbacks

Episode Date: August 13, 2026

Everybody dreams of the red carpet treatment that is being recruited as a Division I athlete, and our own Matt Leinart and so many of our Throwbacks guests did just that. Of course, those legendary stories are some of their favorites to tell, and on Throwbacks they pull no punches. From Nick Saban’s ability to predict the future to Mark Ingram, to the running back the GOAT Barry Sanders idolized on his recruiting visit to Oklahoma and so much more. Those moments plus LeSean McCoy being brought to tears thinking about a coach that took a chance on him, plus where weather factored into Matt’s decision making as a California kid and so much more on a special Throwbacks episode.   A big thank you to our sponsors:  BetMGM: Make It Legendary. Please gamble responsibly. Download the BetMGM App to get started.  Uncrustables: Uncrustables sandwiches are ready from your fridge!    New episodes of Throwbacks drop every Thursday. Make sure you’re subscribed on YouTube and following on all podcast platforms. Also, make sure you’re locked in on social @ThrowbacksShow on all platforms for highlight moments, bonus content, and to engage with the guys & the Throwbacks community. (http://throwbacksshow.com/)      00:00 Show open  02:00 Who Matt recruiting to USC  03:13 Matt’s Oklahoma recruiting trip  08:25 Did weather impact Matt’s college choice?   10:27 Nick Saban recruiting Mark Ingram  12:14 Barry Sanders’ Oklahoma State recruiting trip  13:40 The Bush Push was Evan Turner’s Notre Dame recruiting trip  15:42 Why LeSean McCoy chose Pitt   19:22 Why Shawne Merriman stayed home with Maryland  23:43 Michael Redd picked Ohio State over Michigan   24:55 Mark Ingram’s recruiting parties were legendary   30:02 Derrick Rose, OJ Mayo, Kevin Love and Mike Beasley took all the money during Evan Turner’s recruiting  32:27 LeSean McCoy’s favorite recruiting visits   34:09 Why Greg Olsen left Notre Dame for Miami  37:20 Arian Foster wants to know how much money Matt made at USC  Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

I think you're maybe your top three person to ask this question to. Did weather ever enter your mind? Yes. Yes. My mom was like, you are never going to survive. You've never been there in the winter. You don't even have a winter jacket. Yeah, like you're from the California.

Oh, of course, dude. You're never going to survive. It's so cold. All right, welcome to another episode of Throwbacks, Best of Edition, as we slowly get ready for season three, which jumps off while basically football season starts. Let's go. Do us a solid go over with all the socials at Throwback Show.

Give us a subscribe on YouTube this week, Matt, which I think has been some of my favorite parts of this show with all the guests we've had. We have a compilation, a best of, everyone's recruiting stories, which also dives into NIL or lack of their own. By the way, recruiting nowadays a lot different than recruiting about 15, 20 years ago

because a lot of that you had to do you know, you couldn't get caught doing a lot of stuff that people did back in the day. Now you're getting paid to go everywhere. Well, I think that's been my favorite part of throwbacks to this point, and I'm pretty sure it's going to be in this episode. It's not necessarily a recruiting story, but it's Arian Foster. You're talking, because he's very open about what he took. And, you know, you stick to what you said, that you've never taken a dollar.

He just, Aaron Foster just. He looked at me and basically was like, shut the, With disgust. That was the funniest ever. One of the greatest moments. But it hit me as we put in as we're putting together this episode. And I know you've told great stories about hosting players and the OJ Mayo stories in here. But we never really heard much about your recruiting story.

And was it USC from day one? I think you've heard. We've heard like Coach Ogeron, when my day are Pete Carroll. And they get asked who was the one that got away. I think Adrian Peterson was the big one that got away from coach. Coach O. He was trying, he tells a story like he was, I think his dad was in jail at the time. He was going to try and get his dad at it. Like he was doing all sorts of stuff to get him. But the one and, and he came on. He's a buddy of mine is Shady, Lashaw McCoy.

Remember hosting him and we were trying to get him because he was a stud. And he ended up going to Pitt to play for Coach Wants. That was one of my favorite episodes we did with him because Shady's the best, but he also got emotional on that. And he told some great stories in that. So his recruiting story was pretty fun. We pulled out all the stops for him. It didn't work. It's so funny. I took two recruiting trips. That's it. And I always tell people, I guess now it's a little different, but I was like, oh, man, take all of them. Take four or five if you can. Because at the time you were allowed four or five. I don't know. It's probably changed now. But I took two. I took one at Oklahoma. I took one at USC. Everything you could imagine at the time. You know, we were eating at steakhouses in Beverly Hills. My hosts were Carson Palmer and Matt Castle.

But it was just, it was USC. It was close to him. It was everything you could probably imagine, right? like the frat house parties all that kind of stuff i went on the oklahoma trip i think prior to that the cool thing about the oklahoma trip was this is the year they were playing for national championship against chris wanky and florida state they end up winning that game but i went out on my trip in december um so i was there for their national championship prep practice which is pretty cool um bob stoop's um gosh they had they had uh josh hypoil they were i mean they were they were they were legit their defense was legit. So I'm out there that weekend, and I'm in Norman, Oklahoma, dude.

And I don't know. Oklahoma fans hate me now because the whole Lincoln Riley thing and this and that and all this stuff. I got nothing but respect for Oklahoma, but there ain't to do in Norman, Oklahoma. Nothing, dude. And I'm from Orange County. Like, I'm just from, I'm like a beach kid, you know. Our big dinner that weekend was Applebee's. And by the way, shout out to Applebee's, Chilies, all that shit.

I mean, I love Appleby's. Bees, but I'll never forget. I was like, damn, this is hilarious. I'm just, I'm just not close to home anymore. And we had, I mean, we had a fun night. Dan Cody, who I ended up playing in the national championship game against a couple years later, Teddy Lehman, the great linebacker for Oklahoma. Those guys, those guys were my host and stuff.

So, long story short, couldn't go to Norman, Oklahoma. I went to USC. So I got two follow-ups for you. I don't think you've probably experienced. I don't know. You said like with Shady and like the ones that got away, right? But when you're a quarterback, you know, I think for other players, it maybe is a little better like, oh, like we may get Matt Liner to come play quarterback here.

And then when you don't come and you run into them in a game a year, like is not bad blood, but does that stick? That's a great question. I don't think so. I know like a running backs one thing like Shady didn't come. It's a bummer. But like to think like, hey, we got this quarterback maybe for the next three or four years. Yeah, I mean, I don't like, you know, for me at least, I was, you know, I was getting recruited by, you know, UCLA.

I turned them down very early. So I wasn't really going to like a school. Like I committed to USC. I wasn't going to the schools that I was going to like, I took recruiting visits on. So, you know, I went out to Michigan. I was close to going there. We ended up playing them in the Rose Bowl. But like, you know, that was three years later. So you never really know if you're going to cross that path again. But yeah, I'm sure. I think it's more of when you have guys on a recruiting trip and you really, and you really, really want them and you miss out. And then you kind of see how their career plays out.

It's like, damn, we could have had, you know, so and so. Well, I see you with a Natty and a Heisman like, like, if you're Oklahoma, it's like, and it's also just like my career doesn't happen if I go anywhere else, right? It only happens because I was at USC. True. It's just that was the path, you know? Like, it's always one of those things like I would have never been who I was able to become at USC at Michigan or Oklahoma.

just wouldn't happen that way. So, but it, but it was fun to see those guys later on, the Oklahoma guys, even though we, we kicked their ass. But, you know, Deshawn Jackson was a big one that, that we didn't get. Oh, man, but would he have been even more famous at you? I see. My gosh. He's a local kid.

He's Long Beach, you know, Long Beach Polly kid. And then I think, God, there was Lorenzo Booker was a big one. He ended up going to Florida State. The one that made me the most nervous, I don't know if I ever said this story. the year that I was competing for the job, right? And every year you're bringing in someone. It was Carson. Carson leaves.

It's me and Matt Castle and all that stuff. Chris Leak. Chris Leak was the number one quarterback in the country. He's a year behind me, maybe two behind me. And he took a recruiting trip to USC. And I had never played. I'm like, I might have to transfer, right? Like they were on him hard.

And you don't maybe he could have jumped you if he did go there, possibly? I had never played. I wasn't like, so it was a battle, but like you're taking the number one kid in the country. I wasn't like a big time recruit, you know, like I was a four-star kid. Like I was a good recruit. But like, and at this point, I'm two years in. It's not like I haven't played a whole lot, right? So I just remember like Chris Leak and Chris Leak was like never went out. He just played video games all weekend. Like he was like, you know, quiet, quiet kid. I don't even think I met him that weekend. I wasn't even there around campus. But I was like, it was the only one that I was like, damn, like I might have to leave. he ends up going to Florida, plays for Urban Meyer, helps win a national championship with Tebow and all that stuff. And then the next year, it's John David Booty who comes in. Right. He skips a grade. He reclasses.

He was the first kid to ever reclass. So he was a junior, reclasses up to a senior and graduates early. He was one of the first to ever do it. Maybe the first, I don't know. The first big one. And he was the number one quarterback in the country, set every record, all these things. And he was the other one.

I was like, shoots I had to fend off him. he ends up playing after me starts for two years wins a rosebow and all that he ended up being my backup my son and jd he was awesome but yeah those were the those were the guys that i was like oh man like and he had to you know i had to compete against castle and all the other guys too so so ready for my final follow up before we get to the compilation and you are i think you're maybe your top three person to ask this question to because you are a california kid okay but you know you you you look at Michigan and you, I don't, like, did whether ever, you know, obsessed I'm with this with athletes, did weather ever enter your mind? Like, you know, Michigan obviously, like, fuck that,

though. I'm not like, talking. You're a California kid. You know, like, you just, so when you're making your decision, you're like, Michigan, too, and cold. Like, does that enter the conversation? Oh, for sure, dude. My mom was like, you are never going to survive. You've never been there in the winter. You don't even have a winter, Jack? Yeah, like you're from the California. Oh, of course, dude. That's funny because that's such a mom thing to say to, like, you're never going to survive. It's so cool.

Yeah, when you're there for summer camp and you're like, you're having a blast and you're going out with the guys and it's 80 degrees. It's beautiful. In the Midwest and the Midwest and even in the fall, it's beautiful. The changing of the colors, all this stuff like the leaves. Man, when you, I mean, you know better than me. That hits, that you start to get to November, December, and then all the way through March. Yeah, dude.

you're there for football and spring and all that. I'm like, oh, man, no. Dude, that's so funny. Because those are the things, if I, if I were an elite athlete, those would be the things I would focus on, maybe more than like, all right, who's the coach? What's my competition like? What, you know, in the SEC, where are we? And then like, what? So it's going to be minus 20 below and snowing. I don't know. No. The big, big part. That's awesome, man. And also when you're in the NFL where you get drafted, which you can't control. You can't control that. But you're like, But you're like, oh God, oh, God, oh, I'm going to Arizona, sweet.

No, but that's why you're perfect to ask because at that time, you could control, but you were able to control your collegiate decisions. So that's why I had in the NFL, you're going where you're going. I mean, some guys try to hold out. No, you're going where you're going. All right, well, without further ado. Fun recruiting stories and some N.I.L. Yes. A lot of NIL and a lot of before NIL as Ari and Foster will help provide us.

Here we go. I want, okay, so I'm sure you've gotten asked this. I don't know if I've ever, like playing for Nick Saban, right? Because I always get asked like, I always get asked in our time at USC. What was Pete Carroll like? Man, what were the sidelines like? All the celebrities. Like, that was much different than Tuscaloosa, obviously.

But you all were Bama and you guys were, I mean, you guys were the dynasty before the dining and all that. And you are a part of that. And Sabin and Carol are both great. Sabin's the greatest fall of time. but very different personalities. I would love to hear your, a famous Nick Saban story

that you were a part of that you can share. Maybe he motherfucked you at some point or just something about Nick Sabin that we don't know. Because I would love to know what it was like playing for him. I'll tell one from recruiting since we're talking about recruiting

and I'll tell you one after I won the Heism. So recruiting. He's sitting there in my living room. I'm like, all right, if I come there, how do you think, how do you think the team would be? He was like, if you come here and, you know, we finished signing out some of our recruits,

he was like, I think we'll have a pretty good team your freshman year. I'm like, all right, and he's like, I think the second year will win the national championship. Wow. The first year, we went 12 and 0, lost in the SEC championship to Irvin Meyer. They went and went and won the national championship.

And then we lost in the Sugar Bowl, and we had a bunch of other stuff. So 12 and 2, pretty good year, he said, right? second year, 14 and 0 national championship. Like, he called it verbatim sitting in my house. He was like, it was just recruiting. I'm like, bro, you literally called it verbatim, sitting in my house as a recruit.

Yeah, we'll have a pretty good year, your first year. Your second year, we'll probably win the national championship. 12 and 2, 14 and 0. Was there a fun or interesting story in your recruiting process for them? Oh, yeah. Well, the guy who showed me around on my visit was Thurman Thomas's sweetmate.

And so I remember as a high school senior, and Thurman had a monster year that year, right? I think that would have been his sophomore year. And so I remember the guy's name was Kevin. Kevin took me to meet Thurman in his, and Thurman's apartment. And we, you know, we had a good like 10 or 15 minute conversation and I was excited to meet Thurman.

But it's funny because Thurman, he never remembers that conversation ever happened. But I was a high school kid. Obviously, he was in the middle of, you know, a Heisman trophy type season. But I was really geek to meet him. I didn't, I don't think I knew at that point that I was going to Oklahoma State. I didn't have a lot of offers.

Oklahoma State was my best offer. And for me, just the fact that Thurman was there, then I was excited to be able to go and play in, you know, and play running back, and sit in a runback room with someone like him, you know, and so that's one of the biggest things I remember from my recruiting ship to Oklahoma State. We, uh, I'm a funny recruited story.

Yes, I would love to. Love recruiting stories. I was getting recruited by Notre Dame, right? So, uh, so they called me on like a tomb, say, Rob Bilanis. And you're saying, Evan, what are you doing this weekend? I'm like, just shit, just chilling. Like, so when to come down here, it's going to be pretty rocking.

Like, it's going to be pretty crazy. We got USC coming in. I'm like, oh, no, I'm cool. I think I'm just going to hang out. Like, you know what I mean? Like, because I had nowhere to get there. I was like, now I'm cool. Like, from Chicago, I'm straight out just watching on TV.

So I call my AAU coach. I'm like, yo, Notre Dame is trying to get me and come on a recruit a visit. And he's like, yo, you're going and I'm taking your ass. It's like, it's either Matt Liner or Reggie Bush is winning the Hizman, but those are like two of the most elite athletes I've ever seen at their age. So I remember driving from South Bend, I mean from Chicago all the way to South Bend,

we watched the game, I believe it was like the Bush Bush, right? Yeah. So I remember being in like the student section on the other end. I can't see. So we don't know what's going on. I just remember you guys cheering. I remember like a bunch of people just crying all around me.

And like literally, and I remember like my coach was like, yo, that's the greatest game you'll ever see. like those two kids put the game on their back like, liner's pushing Bush for the highs men. He's like, that's how you got to be it. I just remember like, I always been like a pretty big thing. I was like, damn, like,

liner's a man. He's on MTV made and he's like hitting all the local teams. Like, oh boy, man, that's, that's, that's who you got to be. And Nick Young was telling me everything. Dude, I got, I got punked, remember? Are we talking about Ashton Citcher punked me on him? Yeah. Yeah.

Yeah. That's, it's, it's interesting, too, because that game, It's like always, I love, I mean, like you do, I love hearing stories because it's like, it's that game in the USC Texas game, the game we lost. It's like, where were you when you watched that game? And there's so many great stories. That's awesome that you were, that you were in that. Yeah, that was a hell of a game, man.

God. And I just, Notre Dame, Notre Dame, we called them. Notre shame. Can't stand. I was the top, you know, top recruit. And I had all, what, like 70-8 scholarships. It's crazy because I was so hard to recruit it that only the head coach was really recruiting me. You know what I mean? Like I had team at was the running back coach, but I really

dealt with Pete Carroll, you know what I'm saying? And so I had everything, I thought I knew everything. And then I broke my ankle and then like all them schools and calls, they stopped, right? And I was like, damn. And I remember when like Penn State is the in state school, right? So they're always got to be lawyer because there's other players in state they want to get from my high school or around the area. And Wonstead from Pitt, he had a big name, right? And he had a big name. And he, he was was still trying to recruit me, I'm like, dang, I only got like two schools left. That's crazy. I try to commit to Miami just to, because I love Miami, right?

That's why. That's why. They honored my commitment, but they didn't really honor it, to be honest. So I remember I had to go to press school because I didn't want to go to school no more. I was banged up. I had had no scholarships. And when I get to the prep school, you know, Warnstead, man, he was still talking to me the same way. He said, I'm the only coach.

If he told me, I'm the only coach that has a power to put you in front of the NFL scouts, put you in front of NFL head coaches. I remember him calling him, Norbert Turner. He called Damien Thomason. So he was still selling me, right? And the whole time, I was like, you know what, I'm going to go to Penn State just because it's the in-state school. And at the time, this is a crazy story.

So when I break my ankle, Penn State, they find out they don't let no doctors do my surgery. They fly their doctor, their team doctor, from their game in Happy Valley, right, on the helicopter. He comes in the Harris brand and does my surgery. So they're thinking like, all right, this kid's got to come here because we're doing all this for him. Right. Right. So, but I didn't feel like I fit in because paternal, rest of peace, he was like, he had one agenda and all the other coaches had something else. So, like, small example.

I just told you I'm a 50th fan. So I got the du rag on with the coat, with the hat, with the jersey. right he comes in there the coach is like hey take take your stuff well paternal's coming right right yeah so then when I so I remember Juan said say hey look just come do a visit and to see how you like it so I remember telling my dad like I mean it's pit like come on I'm saying it's but I took about I go right so I go I go take the visit and I loved it right and once they say yo I'm not guarantee you you're gonna start but I'm gonna give you a chance to regain your name

regained your status. So when he told me that, you know what I mean? Then I get the pit, you know, it was real. You know what I mean? And like everybody that kind of like, turn it back home in and treat me a certain way, you know, wants to give me a chance to regain that respect. You know what I mean?

I wasn't there and I went to work. You really did. Yeah. I remember my freshman year I started, whatever, you know, like all American stuff and all that. Then my second year, I remember one of the coaches, He coached the NFL, won't say his name, but he said, Wonstead came in the first,

the first day of Kent. He said, all right, guys, we gotta make some moves because 25, he won't be here long. And I always, you know, thank Wonstead for that, because, you know, my life has changed, you know what I mean? And like, without him, you know, who knows? You know what I'm saying? So, so Coach Wonster really, um, wow.

His wife, Jen, great, great woman, you know, they're good family, man. And like, they really, you know, What I want is there, I probably, who knows? I asked Aryan Foster this, my former teammate Houston, like, goes to Tennessee. I just want to know, like, what did Kevin Plank pay you at Under Armour to get you to go to Maryland? Look, KP didn't have money yet.

I can't even keep it straight face asking you that. KP didn't have any money yet. I'm sure I'll have a couple bucks. That's true. Actually, that's a good call. So what was the recruiting process like? I mean, you stayed home, but were you close going anywhere else? Yeah, so in the metropolitan area, I was number one player coming out in high school.

And any of the top players that was before me always went to Ohio State, Penn State, Florida, State, Florida, South Texas. And I grew up like less than 30 minutes from the school in the bad area. So, you know, I kind of built this name in the Prince Georgia County area. So like Kevin Durant came from where we'd say, it was Michael Beasley. Because I played basketball first also through the same AAU team. And I wanted to be the first one to stay home. You know, I just wanted to be the first guy to stay home because it just meant like, why would I, you know, I made a home base here. You know, my coaches and people knew my background, where I grew up, how I grew up.

And I was like, man, you know what? I'm going to stay home. So I had offers from Miami. Now, when you say somebody else who I possibly could have went to, it would have been Miami. Did you? If I didn't go anywhere else, it would have been Miami. And I was scared to take a visit down there because I wouldn't have came back. That was their peak.

That was their peak. Oh, yeah. You would have never left, dude. Antrail, Frank Gord. I mean, DJ Williams, I think, I mean, it was just loaded with everybody. And I was like, you know what? Let me just stay home, not take any visit. And then I just got inducted to the University of Maryland Hall of Fame a couple weeks ago.

I know. Congrats, man. Yeah, appreciate it, man. And so it made it all worth it for me. And then right after me, who stayed home? Vernon Davis. Yeah. Right.

Bernie Davis State home. Right after that, I think it was like Tori Smith and Stefan Diggs. And so before me, the University of Maryland wasn't getting number one guys or top guys coming out of area. And so it actually had an effect by me being able to do that. Hey, it's BetMGM Ambassador Jerry Ferrar. And BenMGM is your home to bet on MLB action and much more. Enjoy special promos like boost packs, parlay boosts, no sweat home runs, and the free-to-play swing for the fences game.

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rewards vary and bonus bets expire in seven days in partnership with Kansas Crossing Casino and Hotel. Was it always OSU for you? What was your recruiting journey like? The first school to recruit me was Michigan. And I was a Michigan fan growing up, ironically. To your point, Matt. And Jerry, I love Glenn Rice and Ramil Robinson growing up.

And then obviously it went on to the Fad 5. And Jenner Rose being a left-handed player, tall, point guard, guard. So was I growing up as a kid and looked up with those guys tremendously. So, but something changed my senior year. And I didn't want to do my laundry. And so I just want to stand at the Ohio State University and state coast. I grew 10 minutes from there.

It came out of that. And also at the time, Ohio State was a distress program, a really struggling program. And a lot of kids from my area were leaving Ohio to go and build up other programs. And I wanted to stay home and help revitalize our program. And it wind up working out. God, there's nothing better than driving down the road on mom and dad and just dropping the laundry off. Correct. I almost went to Michigan, too.

My mom almost had a heart attack. She's like, you're never going to survive out there. And I ended up staying home. Your recruitment to Bama, but just in general, we've talked about this. And I told Jerry a little bit, but I think it's always fun to hear the recruiting stories and what other teams recruited you. And you got the funny one when you went out west. And you were like, man, I'm kind of a fish out of water here.

But kind of go back to some of the recruiting stories and what you remember about some of those teams that were recruiting you. Man, so I started off and I was not a real big recruit early on. My father played in Michigan State. My grandfather played in Michigan State. So I probably had Michigan State early probably before I even deserved it.

You know what I mean? they probably like my sophomore junior year they probably early junior they probably offered me before i even deserved it a lot of max schools but then after my junior year um i transferred had a huge senior year um and when i after that i started getting a lot of traction so i remember i i remember iowa was high on my list i went there i had a great time um it was lit and i and like i was so i want i wanted to commit there like my i was city's fired jay i was i wanted to commit there when I was on my visit. But my dad was like, no, bring your ass home.

We're going to talk about this. You know what I mean? Smart. Smart. Yeah, yeah. So, and then Wisconsin. Went to Wisconsin. Watch them beat Michigan when Michigan was like a top three team.

That was, that was lit. Wisconsin was a great campus. They always have great running backs, good old line. So that was appealing to me as well. I had Michigan State was a great visit. I remember Draymond Green was there. Oh, no way. Yeah, we were all on the same visit.

Like, we had a great time. East Lansing be jumping, too, like, when they're good. And, but Alabama was, is a funny one. So, like, they came and offered me tour after my senior football season. Like, so what, that's like November-ish. And what, shining day is like, what, February-ish, January, February? I don't remember that time. Yeah, I think it's former.

Yeah, yeah, they come up there, you know, I'm like, Alabama. I'm like, I ain't going to know Alabama. Like, that's far. Like, you know what I mean? And it was like, man, just come check it out. You know, my dad had some history with Coach Saban, my mom as well. Coach Saban was a defensive backs coach when my father played in Michigan State. And funny thing is, Coach Saban used to have to make sure my father and Andre

Ryzen, who were both from Flint, they were troublemakers. He used to have to make sure they went to class. And so when my dad wasn't that class, he would call my mom, and my mom would tell on him. And so he was sitting in the living room. That's great. Yeah, yeah. He was sitting in the living room. And she was like, you used to call me asking for where Big Mark was that.

He was like, I remember that, but I didn't want to say anything because I didn't know if you were to steal a girlfriend. Like, you know, so he was like, you know, he kind of gangster for that. Like, he ain't want to like, you know, drop the beans. But so, yeah, we took a visit there, fell in love with it. I remember I landed. GA was there. Two, you know, attractive young females picked me up. I'm like, okay.

You're like, okay. I like this. Like, no, but I went there, man. If you love football, you love history, you love tradition, you go there, you see all the trophy. fees, the stadium, like, you have no choice but to fall in love with it. And then I took, so I came back home and that was great. Then Arizona State, which Matt was talking about. I went to Arizona State.

I took my final visit to Arizona State. Yeah, it was like January. And I'm coming from Flint, Michigan. I go on a big South Pole bubble coat, Timberland boots. I'll land. I don't see no grass. It's hot. I'm like, bro, what is going on out here?

But I had a great visit there as well. The recruitment process is crazy, man. you know, these people just preparing for you trying to get you there. I can't imagine what it's like right now with the NIL and all that. But it was a great time, man. Great, great, great, great memories

from the recruiting days, man. I can't share all the stories on here. The only thing I ever know from recruiting was one of my favorite sports movies of all times, the movie The Program. I don't know if you remember the program. Yep, the program. That's about Cosworth.

And they recruit Darnell Jefferson, tailback, played by Omar Epps. And there was all this fanfare, girls, Tyra Banks, picks him up. Yep. And then, no, or is it Hallie Barry. Holly Barry, actually. Hallie Barry.

High-Berry. But then when he actually comes back to school that semester, everyone's gone. There's no big fanfare. He's like, he just walks in. He's like, where is everybody? Like, yeah, that was for recruiting. Now you're in school. Now it's real deal.

Yeah, they get you on the campus. Your first day, you're running 16-110s and doing max squats and stuff like that. You're like, all right, the pampering days is over. It's real now. I bet recruiting weekends were better. then they are now given like Now I mean obviously money But like social media

Like you just can't get away with anything now back like back like back then Yeah you have you know you just had your setup You had your routine like this where we're gonna go on the Friday night This is who we're gonna take care of us on the Saturday night This is who we're gonna call to be a part of the like it's just You can't really do that Yeah you can't you can't function how we was functioning Because it's cameras everywhere everyone's a journalist everyone's the paparazzi

Everyone's TMZ and we we was functioning You know what I mean? We was, you know what I mean? What was your recruiting like for a way? Like, we've had a few players on. We talked to Aryan Foster

about his recruitment and stuff like that. You basically asking, how much money did you get paid? No, no, no, no. I didn't say that. I didn't say that. See,

I wasn't that good. I wasn't that good. I wasn't that good. So, that's, not straight. I was probably top 50, but I was in a class of O.J. Mayo,

Derek Rose, Kevin Love, like, Eric Gordon, like some killers. So there's some, like, Mike Beazee, it's guys before me that took all the money. You know what I mean? By the time it got to me, they're like, we got a bus hair for you and like a meal card.

And then you can get it out of the month. Same hotel you're in right now. And basically, but there's a roommate with me. There's a tall white guy named Kyle Mattson that was staying on the other side of the room. But now it's like, I was mostly like a Midwest guy, though. So I was a big 10 dude. So I thought at one point I was going to go to Wisconsin. And then, you know, obviously I had Illinois on me because I'm from Chicago.

So Illinois at the time had Eric Gordon committed. He's like top five in the country. And we were waiting for Derek Rose. So I was kind of waiting to see if Derek Rose is going to go to Illinois. And we would have did like a three-headed monster, like tight situation, pause. But I never played out. I went to NBA camp one week and hung out with John DeBler, Coase of Coulphus and Dallas, Lauderdale. And it had the whole, yeah, and he had.

had the whole team with uh, Greg Oden and Mike Conley the year before coming in. So that might have kind of loaded up. And, um, I was like, shit, I want to get with the Buckeyes and it was history from there. I love,

I, uh, I went to a, I, got what I got. I think I won like the Archie Griffin Award in college. I went to a, in 2005, I went,

or four, I went to an Ohio state game. Um, I was just telling, we had Myron Piggy. I don't know if that name rings a bell. He's like the Godfather A, basketball. Does that name are you? Yeah, yeah. Yeah. So we had him on the pod last week. And you

mentioned OJ. Mayo. I actually helped recruit OJ. Mayo to USC. I'll never forget. I was, yeah, because I was. Did you get from the bike? I mean, I was on a golf cart with I was, I was on a golf cart with them going around campus. They say, bro, this is your, this is your city. You're only going to be here one year anyway. You might as well go to USC and ball out, which he did. And then obviously, you know, play in the NBA. So, But any other school visits, though, that stand. Obviously, SC, but any other schools, even just a visit, maybe you weren't going to go, but you were like, that was a great, that's a great spot.

I'm just not going to go there. Anything stand out to you? I'm obsessed because I didn't really, I barely went to college. So I think this is like crazy. How you're doing good for yourself then? That's pretty good, brother. I'm all right. I'm all right.

College ain't for everybody. He's college eight for everybody. You know what? This is a crazy story. So I go to Penn State. This is when Mike Robinson was having a phenomenal year as a corner. Yeah. Right?

Mike was nice. And I was this dude named Vidal Hayeson, one of the top. Did you? Was you left before? He was at SC. I know, but you didn't. But he transferred. But you didn't play well because he was, you.

No, but I remember the name in recruiting like they were recruiting them. So we there and he's the top wire receiver or whatever. And Penn State was a phenomenal like time. And they were, we were having a conversation. And I've always been like this real honest. You know what I'm saying? And it's nothing like a, and they'll come from like a malicious place. I'm just being real.

And we were talking about like the quarterbacks. And these dudes are trying to say that Mike Rob was better than Vince Young. So I'm like, whoa, fellas. Are y'all joking? And y'all are serious? And then we're going back and forth. And then he shows up. Mike, he shows up.

So me and the guys are arguing and Mike's in there. And he was a super cool dude. He was like, it's all good. He's a young buck. You know, he don't understand. And to this day, we always talk about, because it was a rumor that we had a fight, which we never fought. And me and Mike always left about it, like, everybody made a big deal about it. And I was a seventh-year-old kid.

It just was speaking his honest opinion. Because Mike had a phenomenal year, but this young and hard. Dude, you know. I mean, you know. What's the story behind you leaving Notre Dame? I know you're there briefly, but why did you leave? Yeah, so my story was always with Miami. So my dad, so at the time I was going into my sophomore year, the first ever camp I went to.

So we grew up going to football camps with my dad. we'd go to Rutgers and Penn State and whenever my dad would work in the summer as a high school guy, he would go make extra money and work these summer camps and bring me and my older brother with me. And we'd sleep on the floor and just be like the young kids at camp. My first time ever going to like a real camp as like a true player myself, the summer going into my sophomore year, my brother was going into his junior year. My dad knew Greg Shiano, who at the time was the defensive coordinator at Miami under Butch Davis. So Greg went to Ramaph, again, all full circle.

So Greg played at Ramapo against my dad, had me and my brother come down the camp. And that was the first time we had ever, like, gotten out of our little bubble of New Jersey and went down and experienced. But again, no pads, sleeping in the dorms. But, you know, it was a very casual

compared to, like, real football. And so I loved Miami. They were the team of the country. Like, they were on TV every night. Tight end was a big thing. You know, they had Shockey in Winslow and Bubba, of Franks and they were kind of at the cutting edge of like using their tight end um in the passing game and stuff so long story short my final couple schools were um were miami notre dame because my

older brother chris was a quarterback he went to notre dame got the class ahead of me so he went there with all of his buddies that i got to know as a high school kid after my games we'd jump into car and drive to south bend to watch my brother and be around the team and be around the school and you know, it was one of those things where I was like, if it's a tie, I'll probably just go play with my brother. They had a great year. That year, Tyrone Willingham took the job and they really caught it. So I was like, you know what, I'll go play with my brother. That'll be fun for my parents. Two of us back playing together. Went through training camp. Shortly thereafter, they signed Brady Quinn in my class. So I was with Brady and became pretty clear that Tyrone, like he was going to be the quarterback of the future for Notre Dame.

that was his first ever recruit. And my brother's like, hey, I'm going to go to Virginia and start fresh and go somewhere new. And I was like, well, I'm not, I wouldn't even be in South Bend if it wasn't for you. So I'm going to go down to Miami because that's really where I want to be anyway.

And I left the day after freshman orientation. I never enrolled in class. Got in the car, drove back to New Jersey with my mom, waited for the NCAA clearinghouse. Back then, you couldn't just like bounce around. My dad called Larry Coker. and was like, hey, do you have a spot for Greg? He's like, yep, I went down Friday of that week.

I was late, like a week or so into the semester I'd started and hit the ground running and talk about walking into a different planet. I went from South Bend to Miami. We were like two in the country. And I was like, oh, my God, I'm never going to see the field here. But this place is awesome. And the rest is history. Gosh, what a time to be a hurricane back then.

This is an apology message from Uncrustibles. They made the perfect pillowy soft game day snack and then also made you wait up to an hour to eat it. Maybe you've seen the Thaw Hack videos going around. People so desperate to thaw out their uncrustables. They wedged them in their armpit to warm up under their pillows. The other day, my son tucked one of his uncrustibles into one of my old hand warmers for my playing days.

I don't even know where he found that thing. My boys have their own methods. I don't even know what they're doing. I hear them in the kitchen, and then I see them later, and they're crushing one of their favorite uncrustables. They even have their baby brother in the mix. I think they put one under like the playpen the thawed out the other day. You shouldn't have to do all that, Jerry. And now you don't have to because now you can keep uncrustable sandwiches in the fridge. So they're ready to enjoy right when that craving hits. There's no more wait time. Personally, I can say I accept their

apology because when it's game time for me and my family and we're running out the door, I grab an uncrustable straight from our fridge. because I get ass all the time and I'll tell you right now swear like everyone's like how much money did you make at USC listen I can't speak for other people that I played with

but I didn't take I didn't I was like a broke kid from Santa Ana just driving a white forward ranger so how much money would you have made in today's world? I just want to know stop it

I'm just fucking gay stop it that's fucking gay all right so I'm by the way that's the reaction I get from everybody yeah

because it's bullshit shit. That's what I'm saying. Bro, bro, bro, stop. Stop. What are you talking about? Stop, stop, stop. By the way, wait, hold on. Put him in this place, Aaron. Tell them. I told, I told Portnoy, who I'm going to ask you about in a second, the same shit. And he looked at me the same way you're looking at me and be like, what the fuck are you talking? What do you want me to say? Go ahead. All right. So, they're in the league. When I was in the height of my career, we came out with a documentary called School the

Price of College Sports. And in there I detail how when I was in college, I took improper benefits, right? And it was like a shit storm, and they started the NCAA investigation. They called me, they called me. They called me, bro.

They called me, and I was like, the NCAA called me. They was like, hey, this is the NCAA. So-and-so with the NCAA, we're going to open up an investigation on the improper benefits. It was like, are you going to cooperate? I said, nope, good luck. Fuck you. Like, and my problem with the NCA is,

serious and my problem with the people in general and with ex-players was when I came out and said that I never I never said I never implicated any coaches I never implicated any anybody any other players I just said what I did and my my problem is this because I went to go speak I was it was at Harvard business school law school something like that I went to go speak they asked me to come speaking and Richard Sherman and Larry Fitzger Leridgell were there and we were talking there was like damn folks like why would you why would you say that man like you kind of fucking enough for the younger, for the younger cats.

I'm like, I'm like, y'all fucking it up for the younger cats. I'm trying to help get them paid, bro. We deserve to get paid.

I said, but if everybody tight-lipped about the shit that happened, I was like, think about it. I told Fitzhiss this. I was thinking about it.

I said, you came out, said you took money. And then, and then Rich, you came out and said they took money. Reggie come out, say to him.

Matt come out, say to him. Everybody said it come out, what are they're going to erase the whole history of college football? No,

They're going to change the rules And that's exactly what they ended up doing But I just did it in a time where it wasn't popular But now everybody's saying fuck the MTA And now everybody's getting paid Where it doesn't matter But like at the time It was not it was not normal

Because everybody wanted to keep it on a hush But the problem what is If you don't stand up to systems Of any kind of injustice That will happen though They'll take advantage of kids And that's what they were doing They were making money

I used to piss me off I used to play in these 100,000 seat arena's packed to the brim. I go back to my dorm, and I got nothing in my fridge. I'm like, dog,

this isn't right. You got concession stands, people making their money. You got parking attendant guys making their money. But you can tell me I don't get nothing from that. No, I know business. I know how this works.

And it was just, it always blew my mind how cash was so afraid to say anything. Because, like, if we all stood up and said something, they would change the rules. But, I mean, it's water under the bridge now,

but I used to get very passionate about it. back in the day. Now, Matt, if you're going to tell me that you never took a free fucking... What was the craziest thing? You don't have to name names. I know you're not. I don't want to do it. They still got you shook. That's crazy. They still got you shook. What are you talking about? No. I go, okay. The only time, I'll tell you, I'll tell you the story. I've said that the only... Don't get in no NCAA violation because of me. I don't want no more banners. By the way, I'm 42 years old. What are they going to do to me? That's what I said. I had Reggie on my...

I'm saying. I had Reggie on my podcast along. Reggie's a different story. Before everybody had a podcast, I had a podcast in 2017, and I had Reggie and we were talking about it. And I'm like, I'm like, come on, bro. I know Reggie, but I don't know him, you know what I'm saying? Like, you know, we're from the same city.

Like, you know, I know him in passing. We never really kicked it like that. But I'm like, though, why did you give them your high, man? He was like, you know. It's a good point. It's a good question. He's like, you know, you know, just the right thing. I don't even remember what he said, honestly.

But I was like, dog, it was your husband. You won it. I was like, they had to come and take that shit from my house. Good luck with that. Like, I just, but everybody was so scared of the NCAA, though. Fuck them guys. And fuck them now. They should still fucking.

Yeah, but look what, look what happened to USC when that all came out. They got, they almost got the death penalty like your boy Eric Dickerson. Like, they got, like, which is dumb. I love the game so much, man. I was just, I was just grateful and happy to go to Carolina. And I was the number one player. in the country coming out of high school. I was a native national player in high school that year in 2002.

And I just wasn't on that type of time. I was just grateful, just a little kid out of a lot of South Carolina. That was just grateful to be in a situation I was in to go to school and play college ball at a dream school and had an opportunity to, you know, better myself there and possibly get to the NBA. And that's all my focus was. I really wasn't thinking about how much money I can get

or, you know, anything. And the great thing, my parents wasn't, my parents wasn't like that, too. You know, I'm not going to call the school out. But we was offered millions of dollars, you know, from another school, you know, plus a house, plus cars, all kind of stuff. And my mama just looked at me and said, where do you want to go? And I said, I want to go to Carolina. And she said, okay.

And they turned the deal down. That's great. Yeah, they turned the deal down. And they end up working out for all of us, you know, at the end. So, you know, it's one of those things down, man, where the game is just not the same no more. You know, you have, you know, parents out here selling their kids for money. Yeah. Even in the AAU game, man, I'm dealing with that now in AAU.

Their teams are offering people money, kids, money, families money, to get their kid to just come play for that team. And to me, what I'm telling parents is, what is that teaching your kid, you're not caring about what are these kids are learning, how these kids are, You know what I'm saying? And I'm just not with that. Dude, you completely, we all thought that you grew up like a rich kid from like what was going on in college. Like it wasn't until your doc that when it came out, I'm like, oh my God, he didn't grow up with like some Texas oil money stuff. Like you completely had us back in Brooklyn completely.

Yeah, I think it was something that, you know, around that time just made the most sense to kind of go with something like that to. It worked. It worked. It definitely did, you know. I think the dog did a good job of kind of showing how it really was. But, no, it came from a pretty normal family for the most part. Yeah. Was, was, I love it.

When you were doing that and you were like, we're just going to go along with this, was there ever a time where you were like, did you ever worry about the consequences? Or you were just like, I'm going to keep going? I mean, I always thought, like, you know, I thought about it a little bit. But at that point in time, I mean, is your broke. in college just trying to make some money like there was probably no stopping it and then you know getting around the compliance stuff and being able to talk to compliance guys and just pay for everything in cash type of thing and just you know it was it was it wasn't all that wasn't all that

difficult I guess well you're paying the compliance guys no you just they were to ask you oh they were doing all this you know how are you going in this game like do you have a receipt you have nothing you know we paid paid in cash it's baller at is baller man and it worked you have have a son, Justin, I believe, 2029, Stud QB. Did he, I know he's getting recruited everywhere. Did he commit to Maryland? Did that happen?

Okay. So he got, he has 10 offer, but he haven't committed. What has put your dad hat on because I kind of just lived this and I thought it was the coolest thing. What has this process been like for you as a dad? Dude, so I'll tell you a crazy story. I don't think I've told us to anybody. So University of Maryland was.

was the first school to offer them. He went to a camp down there and kind of just tore it up. They took him to another field. They kind of had him working out. You know, he was just on the money. He's just on the, even I've said back like, dude, he's on fire right now. And I've seen him for a thousand times. But he's just laying the ball right in the money everywhere and just really locked in.

And as we're walking off the field, so it was Coach Locksley. So Coach Locksley, by the way, was a runnerbacks coach when I was at the University of Maryland. now he's the head coach. We're walking off the field, walking up to the office with me, my son, Justin, and his mom walking into the office.

We're sitting on the couch. And Loxley's in the corner, me and his mom and Justin sit on the couch. And he went through the process, told him how much he thought, how great he was. And then he said, he went to offer him to a scholarship

to the University of Maryland. Dude, I was fighting one. Bro, I was fighting. Dude, I got goosebumps now, dude. That was, you know, because at 16 years old is when they offered me by the same coach, right? So it was kind of this deja vu thing where I'm kind of, I'm kind of turning my head a little bit to the side because I, you know, one of them, it's about the drop.

I know it's coming. The bottom lips off quiver and a little ground. If you don't, if you even think about it. But it was, it was such a cool moment, man, because, you know, that's what we live for, right? Like, that's why we do what we're doing. And he's going to go out and do the work and all that stuff. but to be hearing those same words come out of the same person's mouth who offer me as a 16 year old kid dude it was it was one of the greatest days ever of my life and then soon as we

the next week he got offered by nine more schools but i think laxie and maryland wanted to be the first but yeah it's it's great it's great man just going through the process and then you know nowadays with social media and these nils and everybody caring about you know what their posts on social media who's got what he's just such a good kid where he's locked in he doesn't care about that you know i try to get him again doing more stuff you like that just want to go play football and i'm like okay you do that love it and let me you know handle this stuff over here man but uh he's he's he's at st francis now in baltimore and uh these guys i mean i don't know who's gonna help who's gonna play them this year look they look ridiculous um but it's it's been a fun process all the way through

so great dude oh man i got i literally almost got tear i think about i just i went through the whole thing It was such a unique as a former player, just seeing your son go through the same stuff we went through. And then when you hear that, you get that first offer. Like, you're just so proud, man. I can't wait to follow him in the next couple of years. Was he always wanting to be a QB? Or did he ever, do you ever go to that?

Come on, man, let's do some pass rushing stuff. Most kids want to be a QB. I couldn't get him to tackle a soul. Like, yeah, no matter how much shit I gave over the years. And I just found out, he was working with Tony Raz in Jersey. for a long time. Tony's a hell of a coach. He's training a lot of college and pro guys. He's going down to see Paxhamo's coach. You're going to fly down to Texas probably in a few weeks to work with him for a weekend. But yeah, it's just he was born a quarterback doing.

I don't know what I did for God to try to make me have a quarterback at all positions. But he loves it, man. He's just, you know, he's just born for it. It's just what he wants to do. Listen, man, this- This NIL world, man. It's, he's going to be doing just fine in college, man. You just protect him, protect him from all those other people like, you know. Like, that's what I'm trying to do. But he's going to be just fine, man.

That's awesome, dude. Yeah, I'm looking to retire here soon, man. So I told people keep on up. Just like my mom did me. Keep on up, buddy. We're out of here soon.