Timcast IRL - Timcast IRL #151 - James O'Keefe In Studio With BREAKING Expose On Google Election Interference

Episode Date: October 20, 2020

Tim, Ian, Lydia and special guest James O'Keefe (@JamesOKeefeIII on Twitter, projectveritas.com) sit down to discuss the state of the union and what the side effects are of breaking news the old-fashioned, nitty-gritty way - undercover. James discusses the ways Google plays god, how the public has a right to know, the ways in which democrats and the media are a complex, how conservatives cannot make movies, all the litigation Project Veritas has won, and whether they've ever done any kind of deceptive editing.  Support the show (http://Timcast.com/donate) Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Ladies and gentlemen, we have some very serious breaking news which is going to affect the very fabric of our society. And we are joined by a very, very important guest who has nothing to do with this story. I'm talking about Jeffrey Toobin, the CNN analyst who was caught whacking off on a Zoom call. This is crazy. You guys heard about this, right? Yes.

Yeah. Okay, that's actually the crazy news, but we actually do have real news. We do. And James O'Keefe is here. We do. Hello. I'd like to see that Toobin picture, by the way. No, you don't.

No, you don't. Why would you want to see that? I'm just curious. Okay, so Jeffrey Toobin is from The New Yorker and a CNN analyst, and apparently on a Zoom meeting, he was whacking off. He's like an anti-Trump guy. Trump is racist, all that stuff why would anyone for any reason be on like a work meeting call and decide to just start cranking it out and like because he said it was a mistake i i didn't think they could see me it was a mistake

wait well hold on a minute like at least when louis ck did this he asked for permission first you know he still got canceled for that this guy just was like well i'm at I'm at a work meeting, better just, you know, go at it. And then, oh, oops, oh, no, they saw me. I didn't realize what a Zoomie was. So he meant to turn off his camera and then jerk it while no one could see him. Yes. Oh, is this, I think I'm looking at the picture right now. They covered up his thing

with a birthday hat. His tube end? No. Is it the Vice article? Yeah, that's what it looks like right there. Is that what you're looking at? Oh, no, I'm scared. Oh, no! Oh, my gosh! What? You can see his stomach and his body and his gut, and everyone's putting their hands over their mouth. I'm not sure if I'm looking at the real thing.

You are. I think that's right. Is that the Vice article? I'm not sure. I'm not sure. I'm not sure. I'm not sure. I'm not sure.

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I'm not sure. someone i made the tube and pick sfw ish safe for work ish safe for oh my god it's like it's like it's like two is that it is that what it looks like why are you making me look at this sorry why did you look it up i mean i didn't look it up it showed up on my twitter it just turned up it shows up it's the algorithm yeah it's the first groundbreaking journalist james o'keefe sources image i don't know if this is yeah we don't we can't confirm no maybe someone took a fake it might it might be a weird recreation thing yeah i don't know photoshop couldn't confirm it i don't i don't want to find out i'm not gonna look for it i'm not interested just seeing his face you know it may surprise many of you listening that we actually do have like real

important news that we have important things to talk about and then that's why james is here but why i talked about that for a few minutes. That was not planned. Good use of time. Anyway, welcome to the show. Yeah, that's James O'Keefe. I think most of you know who he is, and he's got a big story he just dropped, so we're going to talk about that. Of course, you know him, you know me.

We got Ian. He's hanging out. Yo! Ian's in the corner. And Lydia's here as well. I'm here as well. Hello, everyone. So I think that's as good as an intro as it's ever going to get.

So subscribe, hit the like button, hit the notification and uh oh man how do you how do you top that i guess we'll just we'll just start talking about stuff so uh so james you just dropped a big a big story yes sir not as big as a jeffrey tubin thing but you know correct yes depends upon how big that is before we go in oh my gosh james for anyone that doesn't know you run project veritas i run project veritas where the nation's premier, perhaps the nation's only undercover or even investigative reporting organization. We use video and contravertible video evidence. And we just launched a story an hour ago on Google, a Google engineer discussing how the algorithms are skewed to favor Joe Biden in the presidential election. So we will definitely lead with this.

And I've got your website pulled up. We'll look at it. But I'll just add, you may be the only undercover news out in the country. And man, do they hate you. But we'll get into all the things to say about that. Yeah. So we'll leave with this big story. So we can pull this up real quick just to give people a quick glimpse.

But instead of reading through what your website says, you're here. You can tell us. But I'll read the headline. Senior Google manager on search engines power. You are just plain and simple trying to play God. The powers in the search. Trump says something, misinformation, you're going to delete. If a democratic leader says that, then you're going to leave it. So how about you just tell us what's going on? What's this breaking story? Well, this is a, this is a guy, Ritesh Lakhar, technical program manager at Google, and he works for the cloud. And he's talking about, he's kind of an unwitting whistleblower. He talks about how the corporation plays God, and I'm reading here, like if it was fraud, it doesn't matter. But for Trump or for Melania, it matters. On the other side, Trump says something, misinformation, you're going to delete that because it's illegal or whatever pretext. He talks about the double standard, something we all suspect to be true. But if he says, if a democratic leader says that,

then you're just gonna leave it. And he talks about how the corporate Google is outsourcing jobs in order to spy on Americans. And he feels guilty about this. And he describes the algorithm, how people cry in the corridors of Google when Trump won. So a lot of what Veritas does is confirm suspicions, right? None of this is surprising to

you, but it may be one of the first times we ever heard them say it as a current employee. That's why we use hidden cameras, people are more honest. Sometimes the newsworthiness is such that people talk about the ethics of recording maybe a good man saying this, but the public's right to know is paramount. It's important that we show this information to the masses this guy says something about training chinese people to spy on america and something like that what yeah he says in this tape that he feels guilty he feels quote suffocated at google and particularly guilty for outsourcing jobs overseas in order to spy on the american people one point in the conversation we ask why, why is it that Google prefers Democrats? And his answer, well, this is America.

Very, very enlightening video. And this is part one of a series of videos. We'll release a video every day this week on Google, different employee. I tweeted out your video and the first responses from people was- Can't see it. I can't see it, it i can't see it's unavailable

so on so there's a there's a tweet that i've been getting the same thing sitting here right now and it says quote this tweet might include sensitive content to view it you need to change your privacy settings you know what i love i love the irony of you literally exposing manipulation interference and censorship and then they censor you it's it's the perfect you know i always say this the the best way to describe irony to to define irony is a fire truck on fire like that's irony like the fire truck is supposed to put the fire out not in flames you're exposing these big tech companies and they're actively shutting you down in real time they're actively doing it they've always done it but you know we have a saying at project

paradise content is king right so you know you just got to do the good work you got to expose it you got to put it out there get proxies to put it out there we embargo we embargo clips with people ahead of time you know sometimes i do that with you tim i'll share a little link that's true and um and that's why the new york times called it a misinformation campaign because we were embargoing clips with people ahead of time which is what reporters always do but that's why i brought this book with me 1984 if you haven't read it since you were 15 reread the book listen to it on an audible whatever you do that looks like it's a 1984 printing it looks yeah i think this is my high school book that i i i uh took so the yeah the embargo thing is important too because that is extremely common.

People don't realize it. And the New York Times tried smearing you simply because you did it? Simply because we did it. This is something we should talk about at some point. I can mention it now. The New York Times talked to researchers at Stanford University, interviewed them, and they said, well, it's probably part of a disinformation campaign because James O'Keefe shared it with the MyPillow guy two days before. I met with Mike Lindell because he's a big time deal in Minnesota. He's a Minnesota guy and we're doing a Minnesota story.

He's got a big following. Hey, Mike, here's a tease of what we're doing. And Stanford University told the New York Times, well, that's the reason it's probably disinformation. USA Today quotes the disinformation part. And suddenly Facebook is censoring the video because USA Today says it's disinformation. Straight out of Orwell. So I don't know what else there is to say about, you know, you've got another guy. It's not the first time you've caught somebody. We've all, but here's what's crazy to me. We've seen other videos like this. The Verge, actually, I think it was The Verge who published this video where you see them giving a meeting

about Donald Trump won and we're all scared and sad yeah and people are crying that was a left-wing publication you also had gizmodo this was back in i think 2018 yeah where they wrote one of the first stories saying facebook actively censored conservative news websites yes and you confirm all this and it's misinformation they publish it and oh it's fine well i think it's the courage to continue doing it you know there's so much cynicism and hopelessness we were talking last night about how cynical people are i think you just have to keep going i really do because you get caught in a trap of being defensive like responding to their bias and whining about them and what i found is if you just keep reporting they keep attacking me i just keep reporting and and i think the audience that you're serving right

here this stream right now and the audience i serve these are new audiences these are people who don't necessarily watch cnn or maybe even watch fox news they're just people that are being enlightened little by little and the truth is tim i think we're winning i mean i think i've got more sources coming to me than ever before people people the sources tell me i've got no place else to go they say i can't go to new york times i can't go to usa today York Times. I can't go to USA Today. I don't even know what USA Today is except right pieces about us. So let's do this. I think I'm going to really enjoy ragging on the media.

But we should give it. We should give it. We should talk about it. So let me do this. You've exposed this. You had another video of a director at Google talking about censorship. That woman, I forgot what her position was. What was the name of the woman at Google?

The Irish woman? You've had a couple so jen jenai the big the big one was jen jenai saying we need to have algorithmic fairness yeah because god forbid you google search something and you get reality or facts so what if the facts are unfair so we have to do is censor the reality such that it makes the world more fair who defines fair we don't know and then jen jenai says we got to prevent the next trump situation this is what jenai says who's a senior uh individual google head of innovation google's innovation department so when she said we have to prevent the next trump situation yeah was it was it a smoking gun not quite because what did she mean by that now she'll she'll say on the medium, she wrote an article. No, no, I meant stop Russian interference in the election. Oh, yeah. So they'll say whatever they need to say to explain away their comments on the tape.

Have you seen The Social Dilemma? Just a few minutes downstairs. Yeah, we were playing just a bit of it downstairs. And what's really interesting is they basically confirm everything you've got on camera. You've got former tech executives. They don't go as deep as to say, yeah, when we were there, we were like, we're going to make sure the Democrats win. But they were straight up saying, we manipulate people into doing what we want them to do. We figured out how to persuade them into doing what we want them to do.

And then I see stories like that, like, you know, so in, in the documentary, they have this mock version of political extremism called the extreme center, and don't vote like these two groups that are fighting each other. But it's very clear that they're straight up saying social media companies are encouraging, you know, are favoring political factions or institutions. And considering we're seeing something like this, it reminds me of what we heard from the CEO of Reddit. I don't know if you're familiar with this, but he actually said, I'm confident Reddit could swing could sway an election. We wouldn't do it. Then what do they do? Now they're actively censoring, you know, conservatives, Trump supporters. So we're

seeing this kind of thing just basically across the board. I guess I would just ask you, we have the story, all right? So, you know, I don't know what else- To say about it? To say about, well, this one individual. So I'm gonna ask you to, with all of the exposés you've done on Google so far, give us the big picture of what's happening with Google,

with Facebook, with Twitter, from this story to the other stories you've done. Right, well, you know, and I think video, I said this many times, video transfixes in a way that words don't. So kind of hearing these people talk about what how they do this and what they do with the first with the Google clip we were talking about a moment ago, a, it's, it's becoming more obvious. It's becoming more clear that there is no shame on these platforms. And I think the recent New York Post story was a good example of that, where it's just, it's just, it's no longer, you need a hidden camera. They're just doing it out in the open. And, and, and I still believe

that if the content, the story is good enough, it can circumvent the powers that be because people are hungry for real, raw, enlightened information. So that's my premise. If that premise is off or if that's wrong, then maybe this escalates into the next DEFCON stage, which is civil unrest in this country. But I still believe fundamentally that people are intelligent enough to be receptive to real and raw information like you're seeing with Project Veritas. And what's more, Tim, is – and I can't emphasize this enough for your show – Veritas' vision is insiders and whistleblowers coming public, brave people. That's why our motto is Be Brave, Do Something. So when I do something like this, what happens is six Google insiders will contact me and say, hey, bro, I've seen this. I don't want to lose my job, but here's encrypted.

And then it's like this army of people because they can stop one man, but they can't stop a thousand people. You know what I mean? That's like this idea of an army, a thousand insiders sending information at the same time. Well, this guy Ritesh, I feel bad for him. I mean, he's going to get a lot of unwanted attention. He's being honest. Yeah. You know, he says in this clip, if the, what does he say? If Trump wins, there'll be riots. If the left wins, there'll be ecstatic. Yes. I mean, he's being, he's being honest about what's happening in this country. He tells you, you know, candidly what's happening. I feel bad because, you know, I don't

want, I don't want this guy to go through any hardship or anything because of this. The problem is what happens when no one is willing to step forward and tell you what's actually happening and they're actively participating in it? You know, the ethics of – I had this conversation with a guy named Eric Weinstein on his podcast for like two hours about this ethics of blurring faith. Very fascinating, very, you know, intellectual conversation. But I was telling my staff that, you know that Ernest Hemingway once said, what is moral is what you feel good after and what is immoral is what you feel bad after. Morally defensible journalism is really what you feel good about afterward. It is only that which makes you feel better than you would otherwise. So it's like eating coal in the forest to help

your stomach. It never feels good, but you feel better after you do it. Undercover work is tough. People don't like it. It's like you're filming someone without them knowing. Sometimes they're good people. Sometimes they're bad people. In this case, this guy is probably some combination of somewhere in between. Right. But the public's right to know is paramount.

And we're better off for knowing this information. I don't like harming people. That's not the intent of this. We're not trying to shame people we're trying to the public what's more important than a monopoly on a search engine telling you we're trying to elect this guy nothing's more important than that so and it's a public place or in a restaurant so it's a very interesting ethical conversation i suppose but i think we need more of this sort of thing not less of it i agree though yeah yeah so i i feel bad you know because i i empathize with somebody who is scared to come forward, won't be honest about it. But I

also feel like, at a certain point, if you know what you're doing is destroying something, someone, society, and you're like, well, I'm not going to stick my neck out. I mean, that's kind of messed up. Yeah. And there's no other option. It's a choiceless choice to do this work because people are not going to speak on the record. Nobody will ever do that. I mean, some people do. Well, once in a while, I mean, you had the Eric Cochran, our colleague at Pinterest, was making a ton of money. And he gave it all up. And he said, I just, I don't, what am I going to do?

But he ashes to ashes one day and go to the grave. And I'm young and want to do this. I hope to find more of these people. We have a tip line Veritas. That's V E R I T A S tips at protonmail.com. For those of you watching, if you want to be brave and do something. And yeah,

so there's a lot of options. You know, man, I, I worked, so you know this, I worked for a Disney company. It was Disney.

It was ABC Univision. And it's interesting. You said something that reminded me of what they told me. Side with the audience. The goal of this news outlet, Fusion, as I was told multiple times by the president, was to just say things that the audience would agree with. And so I asked him, if there is a story that's factually true but would upset our audience, we wouldn't report it? And he said, I think that's fair. How does that translate?

Let's say you have raw footage of a Proud Boy walking down the street. And then Antifa runs up to him and punches him in the face. The Proud Boy gets up and punches back. The full context would offend our audience. We don't report it. The shorter context would not offend our audience. The Proud Boy hitting Antifa. That's the story that complements their worldview. The Proud Boys are bad.

So ultimately, I never blew the whistle or anything while I was there, but I refused to play ball with them. I ended up leaving and then basically explaining everything about what these companies do, how they do it, how the media manipulates. And I think too many people have said to me things like, oh, well, this is really funny to me. They say, yeah, but you could support yourself, but you weren't worried about what you were – like you were going to lose your job. You didn't care. I cared about all that stuff. I was worried that coming out – I did a video that Sargon of Akkad put on his channel where it was me breaking down four different ways i think it was four that the media was manipulating everybody and i knew i'm like i'm

gonna put out a video on this you know this youtuber you know anti-feminist guy's channel they're not gonna hire me this is it i'm gonna say this right now let everybody know and this is how we're gonna get it out because these companies won't let me say it and then i better start something on my own because i'm never going back to these companies i had actually gone to a bunch of these i'm not going to name them but you know who they are these big new york digital firms and and some of them were like you name your job you name your salary and i said i am not going to get i saw some people working there i'm not going to get myself in a situation like that anymore and so i decided just build it up from the ground you're an entrepreneur and that's very important what you're doing it's it's like

you have to be a journalist and a businessman at the same time i mean it's very important you are an entrepreneur i'm at your place right now and it's amazing what you are building and what you've built and and and and and what i've learned in my career is that when i started i was in a garage with nothing but a mic and a laptop and i realized okay in order to make videos i have to do something else and do all i have to be the chairman of a company and i don't settle litigation i have to raise millions of dollars so in order to make videos, I have to do something else and do all I have to be the chairman of a company and I don't settle litigation. I have to raise millions of dollars. So in order to do what I think is right,

in order to not compromise or ever sell out, I haven't sold out to anyone. I'm not answering to anybody. I have no advertisers. No one can boycott me. I had to build a company and learn how to be a CEO in order to do my passion, which is investigative reporting. Otherwise, I can't do investigative reporting because I have to be owned by somebody.

And that's what you're doing and more power to you. Well, so the reason I tell the story is just because my own personal experience with not I'm not going to pretend it's as brave as some of the whistleblowers you've seen because my contract expired. I was I was I was I was in golden handcuffs. I couldn't do anything. They wouldn't. I was straight up told by the president i wasn't allowed to participate in a presidential event because of my race because i looked too white wow i was told that and i was actually contemplating like do i sue them for this and i was like i don't want to

i don't want to get involved in any of that i just want to i want to carry on but what i'm trying to get to is when you say be brave, that's exactly it. A lot of people seem to think that they're like, they look to me, they look to successful people and they say, you're the exception. I know that if I strike out on my own, that I'm going to fail. No, no, you have to just try. You've got to throw it out there. So if you're, I'll tell you this, man, you have two choices. If you work for one of these companies and you know, they're doing something wrong and you say, well, I'm not getting my hands dirty or taking my neck out. Then, then how are you not a part of the problem? You are. If you see something and you decide I am going to stand up and let people know what they're doing, you

are solving that problem. Yes. But there are too many people who are more than happy to just let the problem carry on. Well, you know, that's true. And I think you got to be a leader in this life. You got to take risks. Courage is the virtue that sustains all others. I don't think you need to have 100,000 people or a million. You just need a few. You need like a couple dozen.

Again, going back to this example of Eric Cochran, you meet this guy. He works with us. He runs our- This is the Pinterest whistleblower. Pinterest whistleblower. And it was just – it brings tears to your eyes to hear him talk about – he left a salary, a very high salary. And he describes why he did it. And he says a lot of people go through life and they just want the material things in life and that's not what life is about.

And you get a lot more fulfillment in standing up for something that is right. And I don't think I could ever do anything but Project Veritas. I've tried to live a normal life. I've tried to go to law school and do all these things. And I just feel so passionately that if you stand up for what's right and moral and decent, like you have done in your career, good things will happen. And I don't know what the alternative is. Do you know the story of how the Nobel Peace peace prize or the nobel prize came about no it's uh the dude nobel inventor of dynamite someone at the news outlet i guess accidentally published his obituary early and i'm probably flubbing some of the details because i'm not pulling it off website or

anything but apparently they accidentally published his obituary early it happens and they called him the merchant of death and so he apparently got panicked it was like is that my legacy so he decided to create something to be you know to be better the nobel prize and all the chemistry engineering mathematics peace prize etc i think people it's it's maybe maybe it's something that not all people have this feeling about what you're going to leave behind but i I'm curious if, you know, these people at Google who refuse to speak up, the people who are there, like, look, clearly not everybody at Google is a zealot who wants to manipulate people and control the world, thinking their ideology is legit. This guy clearly doesn't. He thinks they're playing God and something wrong with what they're

doing. It's unethical. But why wouldn't he just actually come out and give that statement, put out that video and say, hey, guys, this is what do people not care about the legacy that they leave behind i think people i think people are afraid i think that you know the only thing you have to fear is fear can fear itself but the biggest question that i get asked uh is what can i do do you get asked that question all the time it's like what can i do what can i do and you know dennis prager says there's three types of people in the world. There's people who fight, people who support those who fight, maybe financially, and those who do nothing. So, you know, you could certainly financially support those who do things, or you can do things,

or you can do nothing. It's those, it's those are the three options. The biggest question I get asked is how can I help? How can I contribute? And I'm not saying it's for everybody, but there's this tiny fraction of people who, I mean, this guy, Zach Voorhees, another one I didn't mention at Google, algorithmic unfairness. Zach leaked the document out of Google and he was terminated by Google. And he said, quote,

this was an act of atonement, an attempt to make my conscience clear. Very powerful. And he meant it. And he was tearing up. And, you know, it's just some people can't. It's a choiceless choice. They can't do anything.

And whistleblowing, which is sort of what some of us do at Project Veritas, because a lot of people are not my employees. They're actually people who just send me stuff. It's like you're an astronaut, which is let go from the spacecraft. You're not part of any organization. You're not part of Veritas. You're not part of Google. You're just out there floating out in the wind with no safety net for a higher purpose. And in the 20th century, you had Jeffrey Wigan and these sorts of whistleblowers who were, their lives were over. All they had was 60 minutes. But in this day and age, there's GoFundMe. There's a life after whistleblowing, although that's a-

Right, the GoFundMe thing. But there's a new market for this sort of thing. There's a new, it used to be in the 20th century, you'd get divorced, you'd be bankrupt, your life would be over. Most whistleblowers have reportedly said that they regretted doing it. Wow. They wish they could not do, they were naive. I think there's a new era.

I think there's a new age. I think we're living in an era of, these are the times that try men's souls to quote thomas pain i think it there's like this new movement of people that are about to do this tim yeah because you were talking last night or we're going to go to war okay well before we go to war there's going to be whistleblowers recording everything i think to quote breitbart yeah yes to quote breitbart exactly so you know yeah so last night we were we were talking about where where do we go from here like what's and you Yes, to quote Breitbart. you know, a lot of people don't like the conversation around potential civil war, anything like that. But I'm, I think people get confused about what it really means. I'm not talking about factions marching in the streets anytime soon or anything like that. But I do think that we're seeing this and I'm going to, I'm going to pause right here. And I've been, I've been,

I wanted to say this as soon as we pull up this article, I got, I got bad news for you, man. This doesn't shock anybody anymore. You know, it's like, I think it's really, really important. You're putting this stuff out. You're showing it. You're confirming it. You're proving it. Right. And it's at a point now where like, I see this and I'm like, I know.

I know. Yeah. So what do we do? It's like we're hitting a wall. You know what I mean? Well, I don't know if I agree completely. I think that you need to do more of it. This is like, I do these things.

I used to do these things once a month. Now I'm doing them like three times a week. And it was, you know, Andrew Breitbart wrote a book called Righteous Indignation, which I believe was coined by Ida Tarbell, the investigative reporter. Investigative reporting. There's another book called Custodians of Conscience. So we test investigative reporting, test and affirms what is moral and what is not moral. And that there's that Overton window where you're kind of testing where the boundaries are about. And you're saying the threshold of anger it's hard because there's so much noise and crap how do you break through that investigative reporting is the uh fiercest fiercest of

indignation fused with the hardest of fact so you're trying to find these facts that are outrageous to people um and it is hard but i think it's working eric eric uh sprack well i think we're i think we're getting there i think we just have to do more of it i think we need you know you need 100 videos and the audience is not going to watch cnn because they can't stand it i mean cnn has no viewers by the way nobody watches cnn actually actually their viewers have been going up oh yeah yeah it's a weird phenomenon right now tucker carlson of course if you probably as you probably heard has the highest rated cable news show in history over five million in in you know the past like a week or two ago massive but uh around the same time rachel maddow and anderson cooper have been

skyrocketing as well so it's it's what numbers are we talking about i'm talking about anderson cooper hitting three million three million three million. And Rachel Maddow hitting 4. Like in one night? We can average over the week. We can beat that. Well, I'll tell you this. Across my channels, I'm getting over 100. There you go.

And on YouTube, CNN's getting 190. So for one person, you know. Not bad. And this show actually has a couple people. But compared to CNN's, you know. Yeah, I think they're on the way out. I think they're doing really well now because of the Orange Man narrative, the Trump bump. And Tucker sort of cuts through a lot of the BS.

So naturally his show does well. But none of these companies, none of these media organizations are willing to be the tip of the spear. They're not willing to go – they don't go there. Like Vice's unique value proposition was we go there. Imagine how broken the media is right imagine how broken the news business is when your unique value proposition to your customers as we go to the place we're reporting on people none of these people will ever have me on tv obviously but they'll talk about the stuff and i think it's that idea of of the tip of the spear being in an exposed position where you're not where you're not just responding to events, but

you're actually creating events. The Google thing tonight is new information into the matrix. It's like not just us talking about pre-existing information. And most media corporations, because they're commercial, that economic imperative compromises what they do. I don't have an economic imperative we have never generated a penny of profit which is a pain in the ass because i have to go work 100 hours a week raising money to pay the bill but we you know what i'm saying i think it's economics not ideology isn't there a partisan element to it there is there exists it but jeff sucker i mean

everything i've learned about the guy i mean he kind of built trump up and then he's trying to tear him down and i don't know what these companies are going to do after trump when so so you you do fundraising at relentlessly just constantly it would you consider your donors to be conservative some many of them some of them there seems to be a overlap between conservatism – I don't even know what that means anymore. To be honest, I agree. And reality. There seems to be a – That's the inverse Colbert proposition.

Because CNN, they just keep yammering about crap. I mean I've been through the ringer with this New York Times and USA. They literally say the opposite. We should talk about this. The opposite of what is real. So if you just, you know, extrapolate that over everything they say, if I just aim my camera in any direction, any direction, it's going to show things that are contrary to what they show you. Is that conservative? I don't really consider myself an ideologue. I really don't. I tend to focus on the sacred cows,

the organizations that these places won't go, won't talk about because I believe in justice. I always have since I was a college student. My professors were telling me how great Stalin was. And I said, no, no, that's not true. So I guess I'm more of a contrarian. If the media was saying doing the inverse, I'd probably – my cameras would show something different, right? I think – how about anti-establishment in a sense? Perhaps. So I consider myself to be fairly anti-establishment, and that's why I'm often ragging on – I find myself ragging on Democrats because I don't like the Republicans either.

But right now with Trump, you have something very different. And so when it comes to the things that we see on CNN and MSNBC, on mainstream news outlets, these are supposed to be the news outlets that are informing everybody and being fair, and they're not. They're clearly pandering to one side and catering to one political faction in this country. So I view that as, do I care what Breitbart is doing? Why? Why would I care?

Breitbart's not that big. Do I care about what the New York Times is doing? Absolutely. They're the gray lady, the paper of record. When they're acting, you know, a fool, I'm worried about that. Look, i get it there's always going to be some little blog some right-wing channels or right-wing news outlet or something and then i hear all of these you know you see like brian stelter on cnn saying fox news

does this and i'm like yes so what it's one channel they do this sometimes they do that sometimes what about you guys what about abc nbc cbs all of these washington post they're all endorsing biden they're all you know not not every single one of them but a lot of papers are endorsing a political candidate they're putting out information they're clearly lying about it like like the twitter fact check did you see this when the new york post story got censored the washington post fact check put up on twitter said joe biden played no role in ousting the ukrainian prosecutor even though he's on video saying he did this is what they're

going to start doing now it's just saying the quite literal opposite of reality this happened it's happened to us i i'm aware of it yeah well so anyway my point is i i i view things as like the establishment is breaking the rules and that's a problem to me if there are people who oppose the establishment who are much smaller who are breaking the rules i'll bring it up when it matters but i don't think it's that significant like i understand it can be in concert with all these other channels but anyway that's that's just me kind of breaking down my point of view uh as it relates to you you guys have been accused of being you know partisan conservative and going after left-wing organizations and trying to smear them or whatever so well well i mean the i mean mean, there's a lot of examples to the contrary.

I mean, we went after the Republican attorney general of New Hampshire recently because he, his deputy said that there was no such thing as voter ID in the state. And I confronted Gordon McDonald, who is a Republican, who works for Chris Sununu, who is a Republican. There are examples in Amy Robach, the Jeffrey Epstein video. That wasn't conservative or liberal. That was actually plotted by liberals. And suddenly the New Republic was like, is James O'Keefe legitimate now?

They actually have a headline that said that. It's like the moment I go after like the NRA, we live in a world not of angels but angles. Where people don't talk about – they don't ever think that our motives are pure. There must be a – and not everything is political. What's going to happen, Tim, eventually is that whistleblowers are just going to trust me because I don't settle lawsuits and don't back down. And there's going to be 10, 20, 30, 40 percent of our sources that just bring us straight up corruption.

If someone comes to me, Republicans ripping up ballots, I will air that video. I guarantee, I swear to God, if someone gives me a video of Republican congressmen, I'm publishing the video. But I don't get videos of republicans i get a guy in minnesota who says absentee ballot it's we don't care that it's illegal right right it's the guy is saying i don't care that it's illegal and the new york times says there's no evidence this is unsubstantiated well what would it takes what is substantive what is evidence the guy's on tape he's covered and it's like a southpaw it's like Parker and Stone come up with the most outrageous video.

They're writing 2020. Let's get some Somalis. Let's put them in a car. Let's say I'm still hustling at 2 in the morning, ripping up absentee ballots, blank ballots. I break the law. It looks like a South Park episode. And the New York Times goes, this is unsubstantiated video. So it's –

It's his own video. It's a self-fulfilling prophecy because if you have the incontrovertible evidence and the New York Times says it's unsubstantiated and the information monopolists at Facebook only cite, quote unquote, verified. You guys all know this. And Jeff Bezos, we speak of the Washington Post. I have a quote here. This is Jeff Bezos, maybe the most biggest, most powerful company, Amazon in the world. Quote, even though the Washington Post is a complexifier for me, I do not at all regret my

investment. The Post is a critical institution with a critical mission. This is, quote, something I will be most proud of. I think it's very telling the CEO of Amazon thinks that his investment in some woke clickbait rag in Washington is the most important thing he will have done in his life. Wow. The media is more powerful than all three branches of the government of the United States. Yep. And that's the truth. So anyway, what I was getting to in terms of the biosecretizations against you, what I really love about this was when you're publishing Google.

Yes. Is Google a left-wing institution now when they say that you're you're targeting liberal organizations or leftists they're almost admitting yeah that's true that these big tech companies are they are newspapers are the democrat media complex i think ritesh lakar tonight we're gonna have more videos tomorrow and he does say that they're that they are they lean that way and it appears to be tim that the case that they are partisan institutions. And some of the evidence in these tapes, you'll see one tomorrow, which it might even trigger

an FEC complaint. There is a hearing next week in D.C. The Senate Committee, what is it, Eric? The Senate Commerce Committee is having a hearing, and I'm sure they'll play some of this. If they're helping left-wing parties, Democrat parties in advertising on Google, that triggered an FEC violation. democrat parties in advertising on google that that triggered fbc violation i think uh speaking of the washington post and how social media amplifies you know a lot of what these journalists

do verifying them giving them credibility i love it when i see a verified journalist with 300 followers well they're verified they work for the news outlet that's why it's important i guess and uh let me tell you a story and i think it i think it may have been 2016. It's been a while now. The Washington Post published a story that insinuated, out of thin air, that Kim.com, the notorious mega upload hacker, fabricated a trove of emails or something. It's been a long time since I've covered this story but they basically wrote this story claiming that he may have hacked seth rich's email account or tried to break into seth rich's email account to plant a trove of fake emails to prove quote-unquote prove the seth rich conspiracy theory that d uh was it the dnc staffer seth rich leaked emails uh that that's the conspiracy i guess to wikileaks they made this whole story up completely fabricated so the the general story was that uh someone in the rich family got a mega upload email saying they signed up and from that tidbit this guy dave weigel at

the washington post fabricated this whole thing so i went on twitter i found his his number and i called him and i was like you know i sent i sent him i said i think i sent him a signal message like where's it what's you know can you I was very polite, very professional saying, hi, my name is Tim Poole. I'm a journalist. I'm curious as to your sources to verify, blah, blah, blah. And he just was like, oh, what is this? What is this? Basically, the sum of the story.

A fake story was written to smear Kim.com and people who were concerned about WikiLeaks release with no evidence. And then I think it was maybe six or eight months later, they went back and changed the And people who were concerned about WikiLeaks release with no evidence. And then I think it was maybe six or eight months later, they went back and changed the entire story. And you can track all of this on newsdiffs.org. Newsdiffs. Which I'm not sure if they exist anymore. But at the time, they showed you the difference from the original article and the article as it was changed in November.

I think it was published in May, I think. It was a smear a hit job and then after the dust settles in november they go in and they change all the language without telling anybody i've seen this so many times and they so when you have the washington post for instance that doesn't like that and i've seen it they endorse joe biden and then they put up this this false twitter fact check i love it Twitter had this fake fact check up for days. Were you able to pull it up or did you? I've been trying to right now. But I just want to say while you're talking to me about this, the people on your show, the people watching this, there are insiders that are reaching out to our encrypted Proton mail address right now. Already.

Like right now. My chief operations just sent me a message. There's people literally right now. Insiders are coming to the email address. Wow. They're watching your show. We're going to get banned. I'm going to do another ad. Oh, man.

VeritasTips at ProtonMail.com. You know that show Cars for Kids? Do you ever hear that one? Yes. Yeah, Cars for Kids. 1-877-CARS-FOR-KIDS. Yep. VeritasTips at ProtonMail.

I like that. Beautiful. We need a MyPillow jingle. Right now, Eric, there are insiders coming to us watching Tim Pool's show. Cool. Inside these tech companies. I feel like we're doing one of those. What are those things they used to do where they would raise money on public access TV?

The phones are ringing off the hook. It's true. Yeah, telethons. The ProtonMail is being inundated with whistleblowers as we speak. Like the Live Aid concert. There are people working for tech companies watching Tim Pool's live cast right now. Oh, no. Who are emailing Project Veritas right now on the inside.

Yeah, give me one of those cameras. We're going to get banned. You are changing the world and you don't even know it. I mean, I think so. You know, it's the goal every day to just do something. Yes. I was talking to, you know Jack Murphy? Yes.

And, you know, he was like, you work so much, Tim, because it's like 16-hour days. And I was like, I'm just trying not to be bored, you know? It's like, if I wasn't working, I'd be sitting there just like staring at the wall. Could you do anything but what you're doing? Could you really go back to doing this, right? Oh, I do a ton of stuff. I showed you my music video. Well, that's true.

Yeah, I'm crazy. I just work all the time. Do you think you'll ever stop doing the sort of journalistic stuff in your life? No. And I think it's a blessing in a lot of ways because it's something you can always contribute to. I can be bedridden and I can be writing something down or I can be researching. I could break my leg skating. My hands could be ripped off by some kind of strange shark for some reason.

And I'd still be able to talk and read and use my feet for my computer or whatever. Voice to text. Yeah. Yeah. So I, you know, I think, but, but you know what? This has always been my, it's always been a passion of mine to read things, to understand things. I've been on the internet since I was little researching, reading and understanding.

And you know what it really is? I, I, I don't really trust people. Yeah. It's probably a problem, but i would hear people say things and i'd be like i don't know if that's true and i'd check and then i would check again and then so it turned into me just being like here's what i think about things and here's you know here's my experience and uh from going on the ground and traveling around it was like i like traveling i would travel and then tell people what i thought now it's a little too dangerous

because people know who i am and antifa started you know threatening me and stuff so now it's more of just a more field work used to be in there used to be all the field yeah all the field all i did was you did a bunch of field work i still do i'm you know i'm like you know sometimes i'd be like patting and go in there like on the tank you know you know but you don't any field work anymore uh i would say there's a couple things we might end up doing soon. Like I have the van ready to go. Maybe after the election. But the challenge is, I'll tell you this. I don't think people realize, you know, I'm not super political personally. Like I clearly have my opinions on, you know, Trump and the Democrats and Republicans and stuff like that.

But my interest is always more just like what's the biggest story? And that's why if you go back like a year or two and look at my YouTube channel, there's stuff about, you know, Jordan Peterson. There's stuff about cultural issues. I have a video from a couple years ago that's got over a million views about men not wanting to help women and children because they might get accused or something like that. And so it was always just like what was the news cycle? What was important? What did I think mattered? And now that we're in this big election cycle, especially coming after 2018, they've ramp up like crazy, all the anti-Trump stuff and the street violence.

So it's just dominated everything. I look if all of this stuff goes away after the election night, you know, Joe Biden wins in a landslide. Trump shakes his hand. They wave and then everything's back to the Obama years, which is never going to happen. Then, you know, I'll be off, you know, in, you know, I don't Middle East or something covering some conflict or crisis like I was doing eight years ago. But it's the way I explain it to people. I had a friend hit me up and say, there's this huge

unrest in Thailand right now. Will you cover it? And I said, I've been following it, but I'm not going to cover it. You know why? There's an election happening right now. And the most important story to me that I care about is the u.s election media censorship manipulation and what's going to happen to us after january 20th if uh you know six years ago i was in thailand you know i was in turkey i was in these countries because that was the most important thing i could see things in the u.s were kind of just you know moseying along but everything started to change i don't know where we're where we're ending up but i tell you this is a lot of people who seem to think that voting for joe biden will bring them back to those good old days the obama year no you know it's it's never going back to normal the the world has changed

fundamentally social media has changed the game we are not returning to some some bygone era of even five years ago this is it yeah it's it's it's from here wherever we go i don't know what's your prediction after the with the social media companies after the election what do you think's gonna happen to the social media company next six months what's gonna happen trump and the republicans landslide across the board then maybe some kind of section 230 reform i'm not confident i mean the republicans controlled everything from 2016 2018 they did nothing they could they couldn't even get the fun you know funding for the wall and stuff like that why do you think that is that's an interesting topic why why do the republicans so weak when they get the power i have a theory well my theory for 2016 is that it was corporate crony

establishment politicians i i've never seen a difference between the republican and the democrat i don't care i used to i i made a meme back in the day on facebook of the republicans and democrats like holding hands behind your back because i view them as fundamentally the same thing they don't care about principles I think it's the Dinesh D'Souza line about uh uh the the Republicans fear the terrifying and humiliating power of the press like they don't do the right they don't do the thing that they were elected to do because the media will crap on them and ultimately what they want is to be praised by the New York Times because it hurts I mean I can tell you they've probably given them dean back case satisfaction saying this i don't it's a difference between seeking their recognition and knowing that it's hurtful you know no one wants to be boycotted

targeted you know tarred and feathered yep so i think that's my theory why the republicans republicans aren't cool no and people want to be cool and so the republicans have seemed to be especially now desperately trying to be like, hey, I'm hip. New York Times, look at me. I'm cool. I'm like those celebrities. But it's changing. It's definitely changing.

And I had a conversation. Believe it or not, there's a lot of Hollywood celebrities, rock stars, musicians, artists, et cetera, who are secretly pro-Trump. And many of them hit me up, pro-skateboarders even. Really? Definitely. Oh, man, you'd be surprised. It's like the soviet union they can't tell their friends or their family skateboarders this is crazy to me are uh not leftists they used to be like when i was growing up it was like when it was cool uh you know you know what it was because skateboarders oppose the moral

authoritarians skateboarders want to be left alone so now you have this moral authoritarian left insulting attacking skateboarders like making edgy art they like pushing security guards running away and skating and just what do they do they just message you hey don't tell anybody like how do they reach out to you i had someone message me crying on the phone just text me like sending me a message being like i'm in tears right now i'm crying i'm i'm so scared i you know i can't believe what's happening in this country and these are celebrities and things like that so you know i bring this up just to say uh i forgot exactly where i was going to go with this but my you know my point from there is there's a lot of people who believe it or not are are cool and don't want to be on the left so that was kind of the point i was saying is that republicans aren't cool right but i've gotten hit up by now probably like three or four different cool types and i know the air quotes

like stereotypically celebrity hip saying things like the reason why they think what i do is so important is because it's kind of anti-establishment but i'm not some suit wearing republican yeah you know i'm like beanie and even getting to know which I've, this is like the second time I've met you. You're singing. You're singing music. That's beautiful music. Well, good animation. You got a good voice.

You're an artistic, creative individual. And a lot of these people in DC are stodgy. They write white papers. They can't dance. There's a skateboard park on this property that you built. And you sing. And, you know, I find myself the same way. I was a thespian before I was a journalist.

But there's something to that. There's a creative aspect. Charisma. It's charismatic. It's creativity. Republicans lack charisma. Terrible. They're terrible storytellers.

Oh, awful. Have you ever seen a movie funded by conservative money? I'm not going to name any names. It's actually just so funny it's terrible yeah it's bad i mean so it's so bad it's getting and when the left when the left makes them they just make a movie when the right makes let's make a conservative movie i gotta i gotta point this out though i think things are changing and this is is really, really important for not so – I don't think it's about the right. It's about freedom, liberty. It's about respect, individualism, and civil rights.

And right now the left doesn't have that. They're moral authoritarians. It used to be the right back when I was growing up and the religious right, moral authoritarians putting labels on things and banning things. It's not anymore. So I'm going to point something out. Can you change to to james's camera again yeah i can up in the corner of the screen right behind you there's a picture of joe biden eating a small child i like that one i love this this is uh this is some of the best art i've ever seen i ordered a bunch of these prints from george alexopolis he's g prime 85 on twitter and instagram and he makes these really amazing like comic critiques and

and it's art and it's a gruesome and grotesque image of joe biden eating a child and it's incredible art i mean it's i saw this on twitter and i was trying to find this guy it's it's like a satirical exaggeration of of what you'd imagine a joe biden nightmare to be yes it is it's like that it's just that what's that artist ralph stedman it's sort of like i got a ralph stedman ralph said but uh fear and loathing aspect to it i bring this up because this is incredible art that normally wouldn't be so you don't see these things associated with the right never but now it's it's this change is happening and that's i think there's a couple different ways to view what's happening whatever it is on the right you've got laughter comedy

you know they try to cancel all the comedians claiming that they're bigots or far right or whatever so if you can't have a good time what do you got but now you've got artists you've got video games you've you've got people that are now associating themselves with either Trump or just the right in terms of the culture war. And they are creative and charismatic and interesting and exciting. And the right needs more of that. And I don't know if it's the right or whatever you want to call it, but the world. Well, the world's had it. But whatever's happening right now, you have a lot of people just pretending to be on the left, I guess, or they are. And the left is becoming so boring and corporate and stodgy and just like plastics.

It's like anti-punk rock. The right has become punk. What's that? The Sex Pistols guy? Johnny Rotten. Make America Great Again. Yeah. He's in for Trump.

And he voted for Hillary in 2016. Yeah. So I don't know if Trump's going to win again. I kind of think he, you know, I kind of feel like he is. And the Republicans, I think, are going to win. But I have no basis for this other than. I don't think anybody knows what's going to happen. Right.

Nobody does. And I think hard predictions are dumb. But I'll say this. I think there's a fracture happening in reality. I mean, you even hear it from the left that there's two different realities right now. But I'll tell you what, man. Whatever we're doing, this is the real world what like the work you're doing the work we're doing here on the show is reality and whatever whatever whatever cnn is doing is this weird fantasy realm of russian spies and trump peeing on beds and stuff but it really is insane

it's insane but people believe people believe it the difference between the soviet probt and the american probt is in the in the united states people actually believe what they read in soviet union everyone thought it was a joke privately when they're in their you know cottages and they're whispering to their you know some of their kids some of whom they didn't even trust they'd sell each other out they'd say we all know this is you know bs but in them but in but in the united states what I've discovered and learned and doing this for 12 years is a lot of people actually believe what they see on the TV. They believe it. They see it and they go, that is the truth.

Hitler's minister of propaganda, Joseph Goebbels, I think was his name, would say if a lie is told enough, people believe it is truth. It's like a phenomenon that's real. Well, so look look you put out a video of a guy saying google is doing this yeah and they say it's a smear yeah you put out a video of a guy going look at all the ballots in my hand i'm gonna get paid for this and they're like no evidence no evidence no evidence so so let's let's do this let's look we'll use this to segue into the this this the hit piece oh piece and how the fake news operates. Amazing story.

Amazing story. Tell me the story, James. Oh, my goodness. Well, I've done – I don't think you've ever seen me as angry and passionate that week. I did those response videos. I was angry. I was pissed. I don't get angry.

I was angry. I was upset. I've never seen anything like this in my career. We put out this Minnesota video, and it's got this guy in the car with all the ballots. And this was recorded on his Snapchatchat i did not secretly record him now you might ask how did i this is a private snapchat that one of my sources obtained so he he he posted it to an individual or two and that person sent it to me it is has a time stamp on the snapchat since july 2nd so we didn't even record this tim Tim. It was recorded by himself, of himself, in his car with many, many, many absentee ballots. It's illegal in Minnesota to have more than three.

We put this out. All these clips of people saying we're breaking the law. We don't care. All these Somalis doing cash transactions for ballots. It's all on the tape. And the New York Times puts out an article, Tim, two hours before the presidential debate, because i'm pretty sure trump was going to mention this he all you know he's talking about fraud ballot fraud and it says you know videos are part of a coordinated disinformation uh campaign experts say who are these experts who are the stanford university researchers who they pay

so it's interesting about this and this is something that, you know, again, going back to the Soviet Union, they tend to project onto me that which they are. They are the thing that they hate, and they accuse me of doing the thing that they do, and they do it first, and they do it well. And it's an incredibly effective Machiavellian tactic. So they come out and say it's a coordinated disinformation campaign. Well, that's precisely what the New York Times is doing. I'm going to speculate for a minute. I think the executive editor of the New York Times knew that was defamatory, and it is. And I would win on summary judgment if I sue them, and I'm about to.

But they told me they're going to retract the article. So we'll see if they retract it in the coming days. And if they don't, I'll sue them for defamation. Well, so that pulls the teeth out of any suit. The fact that they said, oh, yeah, we're going to retract. Yeah, the general counsel said that they're going to make a correction. But the USA Today has already used the article so the usa today's gonna have to print a retraction so walk us through that though so like let's get to that point but let me just finish the point about so so i threatened to sue for defamation the new york times um and they

they basically uh say that it's a disinformation campaign the new york times i think they made a utilitarian calculus and said we know this is defatory, but we need to muddy the waters of O'Keefe's work three weeks before the election. And we'll just deal with it two years from now in a trial. And they knew they knew that they were part. They are part of their own disinformation campaign. And it's genius to call me a disinformation expert. They're the ones engaging in disinformation by contacting Stanford, quoting some idiot in a room who says it's probably disinformation. It is literally, I've never been more pissed. So anyways, here's what happens. We put a video out, USA Today

quotes the New York Times, Facebook views USA Today as credible and sends a notification out to every single person who has ever shared that Minnesota video. I got texts from everyone in the country. James, Facebook just told me your fake news. And I think we've got – my attorney says – and I don't want to be in the litigation business, Tim, because there's only so many people I can sue. My general counsel told me today, he's like, what about suing Facebook?

I mean, it's just – the only thing these people respond to is raw power. That's what they want. They only care. The only thing they respond to is a threat to their power. And I have not, and this is a pretty extraordinary accomplishment. I don't mean to brag. Project Veritas Corporation has never lost a lawsuit. Not once. We've been sued over a dozen times. We've won eight straight lawsuits. Why? Because they'll take it all the way to the Supreme Court. At the end of the day, I'm on the right. The facts and law are on our side.

So a similar thing happened to me. Someone took a tweet of mine that was factually correct about Bill Clinton, Epstein Island, and then reposted the screenshot. Facebook said it was fake news. Facebook's liaison for politics told me they can't do anything about it because it's the organizations that post the fact check. The fact checking organization told me to basically shove it, even though they knew what I posted was true. They have the power to deem it fake news, even though the link they put on it confirmed everything I said, which made me think,

no, Facebook's the one who published that. When Facebook sends a notification to your followers or to people who have shared the story that you are fake news, that's Facebook making a statement. I think you should sue Facebook. Yes, it's just the way. I think you should challenge their Section 230 protections under the rules that they are not fairly moderating. And they personally made – Facebook made a defamatory statement in that presumably algorithmic response this is a very important point you're making and i want your audience to know that it's very important we fight back you know it is it is a it is a pain in the butt but you have to i have to sue these people and i will sue the new york time if they don't retract the article i'm suing them

i swear it's going to happen and i have to go through discovery they'll go through discovery it's a it's very labor intensive it's a headache i went to a trial once a jury trial it's you're putting your company on the line but you have to fight back against these people in the courts and there's a lot of federal judges out there who do believe in the rule of law you can't defame someone you can't you can't intentionally maliciously you know if you're a public figure like me or tim it's it's a actual malice you have to prove that they knew that they lied yep that's hard and it's hard to prove and and but i think we went on summary judgment after discovery against the new york times and nick sandman sued the new york times

and cnn he settled out of court would you get them to downscale the value of usa today as a fact-checking organization uh i don't know how i could do that uh uh what do you mean by downscale well if usa today came out and said that what you did was fake news and they were wrong that's that they're they're never going to force facebook through litigation to discredit usa today henceforth it's a it's a war of attrition i mean you're fighting all these litigation battles but usa today is going to have to print a correction because the new york times going to have to print a correction because the New York Times is gonna have to print a correction. And when that happens, we can go to Facebook.

But the problem is while all this is happening, we're two weeks away from a presidential election. I continue breaking videos and media establishments. No, no, no, it's a disinformation campaign according to the New York Times. So you have to, as an entrepreneur, I've had to build a whole division within Project Veritas

to just fire legal letters off to publications every day. We have like two people doing that every single day now. For people that want to start an organization like Veritas – Very hard. How would they do it? So walk me through. How did you start the organization and how did you build it out? I mean, as they say in economics, the barriers to entry are two. The only other person that I know of that has tried

to do this and was very effective is David Daleiden, Center for Medical Progress. He did the Planned Parenthood baby harvesting videos. And he was instantly sued by everyone. Kamala Harris, is it Kamala or Kamala? I don't know. Kamala. What is it? Kamala. Kamala. I don't want to get that wrong. Kamala Harris, then Attorney General of California, raided his home, took his drives, and they just tried to umpteen felonies. I got to jump in on this. You've got a successful organization. You're bringing in money from donors.

You're getting millions and millions of views. You're breaking these huge stories that I think, what, you got like 8 million views or what was it the last? Yeah, the Minnesota thing was like 20 million 20 million on twitter one video is 20 million or something well so what's a regular person gonna do i mean look when i got defamed by the today you know the today show put a picture of my face up on tv and claimed i was a conspiracy theorist and it was totally that what they accused me of was made up entirely and i couldn't do anything about it yeah just they just they can lie and they can get away with it.

I don't have the ability to go up against NBC Universal. What was that, like Comcast? Like multi-billion dollar international corporation. Well, Dan Borsten, this is the quote we use at Project Veritas to answer your question. What can I do? You're going back to the what can I do question, which I think is the most important question in the world. In this world of illusion and quasi-illusion, our heroes tend to be anonymous. So it's school teachers, janitors, cops, just honest, decent, salt of the earth people. And most of them are just drinking their

coffee, going to work, don't mess my life. But there's like 0.1 or 0.01% of the people that say, you know what, screw it. There's something more important in life than bread. There are just things that are more eternal. So I don't know if many people can – you can contribute $1 to Project Veritas, I suppose. That could be something you could do. But, you know, I think there's – Tim, there is a tiny fraction of people that are willing to make the ultimate sacrifice for a cause greater than themselves. And the greatest sacrifice right now in this world appears to be giving up your reputation. And that is a sacrifice that few people are willing to give up. And there are people wanting to do that, and that's what they can do.

Well, I guess what I mean is if John Doe, plumber in Minnesota, gets defamed by the new york times what's he going to do about it i mean granted public figures have different standards this regular guy can you know have an easier go of it for defamation but there are smaller public figures you know when nick sandman was smeared across the board they actually argued he was an involuntary public figure meaning they can put a camera in your face and then claim you're a public figure and that's their defense granted there needs to be more organizational entrepreneurs like you, like others like you. Someone needs to start an organization

raising money, suing the New York Times for defaming ordinary citizens. I can't do that. I'm only one man. I work 110 hours a week. If I work anymore, I'll get sick and die. Someone, there needs to be more people with, I'm just gonna say it, people with balls.

And there just has to be more people that do this sort of thing. I can't do all of it. I encourage other people to start organizations and have balls and just do what's right. There is a great idea. Start an organization and sue the New York Times for defaming ordinary citizens. And by the way, you'll raise $50 million. Oh, yeah. For sure.

Easy. Done. I probably yeah, for sure. Easy, done. I'd probably do it another life. But now they're going to be like, that's trying to destroy real journalism. No, no, no, no, no, no. It is, I mean, there are philosophical and constitutional arguments against defamation in this country. You can't just maliciously lie about someone.

They do it every day. Yeah, but they were a nation of laws and in the federal court system, you can win. And the federal court system in this country, I mean, Trump appointed like, I don't know how many, 200 federal judges. They'll be there. They're article three constitutionally appointed federal judges who believe in the rule of law. I took it all the way to a jury verdict in this case in North Carolina with this democracy partners individual who sued me for quoting her. Wow.

I quoted a guy talking about this woman. The woman sues me. I'm like, why the hell are you suing me? He's the one who said it. And I quoted him. And it got all the way to a jury verdict. A jury verdict. There's an incredible documentary on YouTube about this.

We produced it. And it gets all the way. The jury's coming out of the box. They sit down. I'm like, I can't believe them. There's a jury about to issue a verdict multi-million dollar defamation case and the federal judge guy named what was his name uh last name federal judge in north carolina he says stop stop it and he pulls out a rare rule 50 in federal court directed verdict case dismissed wow and he says this is outrageous if

mike wallace are being, people would laugh. Those are his words. And he said, O'Keefe was just quoting. They're just quoting the guy. Why did it get that far? It got that far because of my brand. I edit videos. When you actually deconstruct all the BS and you actually take it all the way to a jury and to an appeals court there's still some semblance of the

rule of law in this country and people need to sue media corporations and and they have to go all the way it's expensive though man well like i said have some guy like you start a company with the soul our mission don't make me do it not you but someone someone if it were a different life maybe i can clone myself and you know it's and it's a project you, maybe I can clone myself. And it's Project Sue the New York Times. You will raise $50 million and you'll have so much business. Project Sue the New York Times. I love it. It's very on the nose.

So like a nonprofit that raises money to help clients sue. How about 5-1-C-3? 5-1-C, tax-deductible donations with a stated mission to expose fraud and hypocrisy. How about the Citizens Defamation Defense Fund? That's very clever. I like that. What is that, CDDF? Yes.

You know what? That sounds too much Washington, D.C., you know. Get them. It sounds like an organization doesn't do anything. How about the Citizens Retribution Center? Yes. I like it. That's better.

Defamatory Retribution Legion. You could raise millions. CRC. I mean, if the Southern Poverty Law Center can raise 500 mil, I'm sure that— And store it all, what, in the Bahamas or something? Yeah. But you've got to have balls. You've got to stand up.

There were many times—I'll give you one quick story, anecdote, from that North Carolina case where they put me in a room with these plaintiffs. The people sue me. And they have an arbitration hearing. They try to negotiate. And the judge comes in there and he goes now okay if you could lose you could lose your company you could risk it all why don't you just give this person you know you know twenty five thousand dollars and called it you're going to spend a million dollars okay just give her 25 and i said something to the effect of so help me god i will not settle this lawsuit so they try to threaten you and scare you and all this crap.

And I just say, you know what? If I have to go bankrupt, if I have to give it all away, if I have to liquidate the clothes and my watch and go bankrupt, I have to be willing to risk everything in order to stand on principle. You have to be willing to do that if you want to play in this game. If you are going to give them an inch or sacrifice your principles or sell out or fear anyone, don't even start it. Forget it. I don't think people realize when I say, you know, I've had people message me saying, Tim, Tim,

you know, you've talked about you get banned and you get in your van and just go off, live down by the river. No, you got to tell people to be strong. You're going to keep fighting. And I'm like, well, listen, you know what I'm saying when i say i'm absolutely happy living out down by the river with nothing there's nothing you can take from me i will throw everything and the kitchen sink at you if you try and screw with me or what i believe in i will sacrifice literally everything to win i'm i i completely agree with you and i applaud you for it don't settle other people shouldn't it's this is something that's always bothered me my entire life is people saying things like, why won't someone else do it for me? Terrible.

No, if you want it, you stand up for it. If they don't give it to you, you walk away. But when you just cave and give in, then what do you actually have? A lot of the people that are doing the change the world thing, they get co-opted or they get destroyed. Their mission is not to do – it's to raise money. So I want a 501c3 corporation under the IRS. We're a tax-deductible charitable organization. So if you're in the business of running – you end up – your business model, I need to raise money.

So your focus becomes my deal every day is to make more money. That is not my objective. My stated objective is to do journalism and win every lawsuit that I file and is filed against me. So in order to accomplish that objective, money is a means to an end. It's not my end.

I'm not a for-profit organization. And I hate to put it in that way. It makes me sound like I'm not a capitalist. But I do believe, Tim, that the economic imperative, just like that ABC News guy said, Eric Spracklin in February, remember the ABC News guy? He said, the economic imperative is corrupting, ABC News guy said, Eric Spracklin, in February. Remember the ABC News guy?

He said the economic imperative is corrupting – Disney Corporation is corrupting ABC News. And they sell Marvel comic books instead of telling the news. It's just investigative reporting. There's no business model for it. And anyone who comes up with some ingenious paradoxical way to make a profit doing real investigative reporting, it costs a million dollars sometimes to do a story a million dollars you want you want to know what i was i was i was at a big investors meeting for a major there's a major major company that invests in all these different media companies and i'm not going to say these names or anything but you know they told me they said if you are an investigative journalist and you come to me an investor and make me a

proposition you give me three hundred thousand dollars and I'm going to investigate this story for the next year. My first question is, what do you project to accomplish by the end of that year? And you know what every investigative journalist says? I have no idea. We're going to investigate. We'll see what we find. So you mean to tell me I'm going to give you 300 grand to investigate something and I have no idea what I'm getting back in return? Not interested. I tell you what, though. You come to me and say, we're going to write rage bait articles about Donald Trump. How much is that going to cost?

Eh, five grand. How much do I get back? Oh, we're going to make half a million by the end of the year. Done. Here's a check right now on the spot. That is corrupting media. That is corrupting journalism. Yeah, yeah.

The rage, the click bait, the woke click bait stuff is, you know, what's the guy who resigned? The girl resigned from New York Times and said, I'm just sick and tired of seeing a thousand anti-Trump – what was her name? Barry Weiss. Barry Weiss said that quote. It was very eloquently stated. I don't remember. It was something to the effect of, I'm just tired of seeing all the anti-Trump stuff.

How many more articles on the op-ed page do you need to see? So there's a hunger for information. But I think this, the real meat and potatoes of what fundamental the issues are is people need to have more courage. And there needs to be more people like you and people who are organizational entrepreneurs. So you're a creative person who also runs your own company. And you have to, and Tom Fitton and I were talking about this Judicial Watch guy. And he said, James, you're an entrepreneur journalist. And I realized in my life that, okay, so I can't settle the lawsuit. But in order not to settle the lawsuit, I have to raise millions of dollars. How am I going to raise? I had to figure this stuff out. And I never thought in my craziest imagination that I'd have 50 plus employees and traveling around the United

States, jettisoning around, you know, getting checks from foundations. But it wasn't my stated goal to do that. I wanted to do whatever was right. And I had to learn how to do all this other stuff to do the thing that was my passion. Why don't you guys start a straightforward news website, actually writing articles, fact-checking? Because the reason why I don't do that is because there's only so much time and I have to be very – I have to focus on the critical thing that we do. I believe that video is – this should be self-evident. But the medium is the message to quote Marshall McLuhan.

It has to be hot. It has to be smoking gun videotaped evidence. It has to be incontrovertible. Even when it is incontrovertible, they say it isn't evidence. So I just have to focus, Tim. I can't do mission creep on these other things. I have to focus on the task at hand. I think you have a 501c3 and a 501c4, correct?

So what's the difference between the two? So the IRS – I think this is absurd. But the IRS says if I investigate a politician within 90 days of an election, I am doing political advocacy. I've never advocated for anything in my life. I expose, but I've never advocated for anybody. So one of our attorneys said just to be careful, you should start a 501c4. The money is not tax deductible, but should start a 5-1 c4 the money's not tax deductible but it is a donation to to the c4 and that's this project veritas just with the

word action so we're investigating correct if we're investigating hillary clinton or or a senator from arizona a lot of these people in the uh, these employees for Senate candidates will privately admit that their bosses are lying about their progressive views. They're minimizing them in order to get elected. And once they get elected, they'll do all the things that they told you they couldn't do. I'm going to ask you this question. I'm pretty sure everyone can guess what your answer is going to be. Have you ever deceptively edited a video for any reason uh no uh there we've done hundreds of investigations and i'll give you and i will list right here right now this is the specific things that they talk about like mistakes i've

made if you want to call them that um in the acorn investigation which is the one most of my critics will bring up they'll say he didn't wear the pimp costume in the video. Well, in some of the offices, in fact, Hannah was dressed like a prostitute in every office. In one of the offices, we had the pimp fur. But no, I wasn't dressed like that flamboyant pimp in the video, but pimp protocol doesn't require the wearing of a coat to be a pimp. I said I wanted to whore out girls,

classify them as dependents on the tax form. So that's kind of a ridiculous criticism. The second example they use, we were talking about this last night, was in the NPR video in 2011. That was nine years ago. There was one scene where Ron Schiller, the vice president of National Public Radio, tells someone he thinks is a Muslim fundamentalist. He's kind of quoting somebody else, but mid-sentence, it becomes his own thought.

So an editorial decision was made in the timeline to create an in, to cut, when he went mid-sentence it becomes his own thought so an editorial decision was made in the timeline to to to create an in to cut when he went mid-sentence that's it the video was was 20 12 minutes long it was one part and and the way the media works is they they yammer about this one specific editorial decision i don't think it was a material edit tim that is the only two examples in hundreds of investigations and look at my wikipedia page it all it talks about are those two examples and this is an outrate this is a god standard they're trying to hold me to no journalist in is god everyone makes mistakes so i bring this up because i remember when i can't remember exactly what

expose you did but they said you deceptively edit videos and you secretly record people. So, you know, it's unethical. And at the same time, Channel 4 in the UK did this big undercover expose on like Brexit supporters or something. I don't know if you remember this. And I was sitting I'm sitting on Twitter and I'm like, wait a minute, they're praising this and condemning this at the exact same time.

It's the exact same thing. No, it's the deceptive editing is just i mean all journalism is edited in a selective fashion words are arranged onto newsprint bob woodward in his book uh fear uh and the new book which i don't even know the name of the new book he wrote but bob woodward uses deep rap background sourcing and something that tom wolf invented like this new journalism this uh this thing where tim they that he meets with the source and the source tells him a story on hearsay. And then he puts the quotes from the one source in other quotes and he tells it like it's a direct quote. What is that if not selective editing? Our stuff, every word you can see the person's lips moving.

So what you begin to realize when you open your eyes is it's worse than we can – it's worse than 1984. As Gavin McGinnis says, it's become almost a Kafkaesque nightmare. It's no longer Orwellian. It's just this pathologically insane double standard. And the only solution is to just keep moving forward. You just have to keep putting out the work. You got to keep moving. There's a metaphor I was thinking about that is if you're in the military and you're under fire in the military, if you hunker down and sit there, they're going to kill you. No, you can't. They're going to zero in on you and surround you and kill you.

Same in journalism. If you stop to defend yourself – Can't stop. They're going to circle you. Well, you have to do both. You just keep pushing even though it doesn't make sense. No, you have to do both. You have to – so we'll put the Google video out today, put another one out tomorrow, put another one out tomorrow.

But you simultaneously have to have a division within Project Veritas with lawyers that just files defamation lawsuits. Oh, man. You have to actually do both things concurrently, which is to answer your question, who can do this? You'd have to be a masochist to do this. You have to love and inflicting self-pain. I'm sure there are humans who can do it. But I was put in federal prison. I was charged with a crime I didn't commit. I thought my life was over in Louisiana 10 years ago. And I was on federal pretrial release living with my parents. It was all nonsense. I didn't do it. But you're right. You have to keep moving forward. You can't stop no matter what, unless they are, as Elon Musk says, you're dead or incapacitated. You just have to keep putting

out product, more stories. And I don't think they would stop. People say you're going or incapacitated. You just have to keep putting out product, more stories. And I don't think they would stop. People say you're going to go to jail once the Biden gets away. The Truth and Reconciliation. Truth and Reconciliation. Who said that? Robert Reich.

Truth and Reconciliation Commission to name Trump, the politicians, the moguls, the collaborators of Donald Trump. Truth and Reconciliation Committee. That's right out of Emanuel Goldstein, Emanuel in 1984. Truth and Reconciliation. So will we go, of Emanuel Goldstein, Emanuel. Yeah, man. Truth and Reconciliation.

So will we go – what does that look like when we go to jail? And I think – No, I think it will be the removal from society. What does that mean? So if you look at Laura Loomer, purged from every platform. She's been banned from some banks, I think. Has she? Or was that – I think so.

Yeah, yeah. So they start removing your ability to function in society. They start stripping your access to financial institutions, communications, et cetera. I think that's what it means. And so it reminds me of – I can't remember which dystopian novel this is where they excise you from society. You're free to move around, but everyone just ignores you and they won't talk to you and you're like an other and you can't shop or anything. Yes. That's Swift Global Payment System. you and they won't talk to you and you're like an other and you can't shop or anything yes that's swift global payment system if anyone out there has info about the swift global payment system

and wants to contact project veritas to uncover that corrupt centralized thing because if they ban you off the swift payment system you can't use visa can't use mastercard i mean think about this if you're banned from visa mastercard take pick one if one of those companies bans you you got no credit card the way i look at it i hear what you're saying. I understand the argument. Everyone gets banned and information gets censored. But I also think that like, let's take a very clear example, like a videotape. Let's think of a nonpartisan example, like a federal judge on tape accepting a briefcase full of cash. And let's say that I'm banned or you're banned or anyone's banned. But let's just say we have this clear, incontrovertible videotape of a federal judge taking a bribe it just seems to me that like the people who are not banned

well you you can use them as proxies and like text them the video and they can send it out i just think that i just think that content is king like i i hear you i'm saying but what happens when you can't pay your rent anymore well because, because you have no bank. Crypto. And your money is in a shoebox under your mattress or whatever. So that's what I fear. I do want to bring something else up, though, because I want to talk about how the media plays this. There's a really funny phenomenon in news about how journalism fact checks itself. There's an inherent bias that the New York Times is credible. The Washington Post is credible.

So from that standpoint, they'll start using the New York Times and the Washington Post as a gauge of whether or not another organization is credible, creating this bias feedback loop. Yes, feedback loop is right. So the example I use is NewsGuard. It's the easiest way to explain what's broken in media because they've quantified it. Before, you'd be like, why are they saying James O'Keefe and Project Veritas are fake news or deceptive? Well, I think they have an agenda. They don't like that you're exposing these longstanding institutions and you're hurting them politically.

So what they'll do is they'll say that you're deceptive, you're biased, or part of a coordinated smear campaign. People then just trust the New York Times. But I'll tell you this. NewsGuard is an organization that rates the credibility of various news organizations. They give you guys a proceed with caution. This website fails to adhere to several basic journalistic standards. But they do say you do not repeatedly publish false content. But for a variety of reasons, they say you're not not credible of which it's the examples you've actually given those two things among you know some other points about you

know not knowing where your fundraising comes from right they give media matters of america green checks that's crazy that's actually insane for those that don't know media matters doesn't do journalism at all it is just a group of activists that complain about their opinions on other organizations and make things up quite literally fabricate things that aren't true you know what's funny can i just jump in here for a second like i'm not verified on twitter and i don't how many followers do i have i think you have more than i do yeah i think i have like eight eight hundred thousand or close to this it's time to verify james okay but let me just say something about this because this is pretty this is 778 000 followers on twitter and I'm not a verified human being.

And I think at some point it's like – it's actually a badge of honor to not to be verified. Like so this whole – I think the inverse is true. Like we're not verified. We're not credible. But when people like that do that to me and the powers that be like USA Today has to do that thing, and Facebook has to send that ridiculous notification, it actually has an inverse effect. People go, wow, it's like the World War II bombers are over the target. Like, I've never seen anything like, everyone's, James, I just got a notification on Facebook, they said your video is fake. The fact that Facebook did

that is almost a verification in and of itself. And it draws more attention. It's kind of a, you know, I'm pioneering here with my logic, but it seems to me, and I've thought about this not being verified thing. I don't know many, there's only a handful of people that are in this league where they've got a million followers and they do all this work that everyone's always taught and they're not verified. In many ways, that is a kind of verification, isn't it? Yeah, you're kind of like, I i don't what's the right word for it a rebel rebel uh rogue eye patch if everyone's saying don't believe this man he's fake he's terrible if people are loudly saying that all the time then you must be doing something right

and going back to the cliche from churchill if you have haters, good, it means you stand for something. So I think they're walking a very slippery slope, constantly saying how fake everything is. If anything, they're kind of just quiet, like unable to engage in defamation. Journalists are typically rendered mute. They don't say anything at all. And this Dave Weigel character is a great example.

They don't even open their mouths if they can't say anything negative so anyway what's his what's his story well he was the guy who fabricated that the thing so we have this thing called retracto the correction alpaca i love it that song's good and everyone and we're making we get that record we're making plushies and everyone loves the song it was uh written uh 10 years ago it was an andrew breitbart creation it was the quick story andrew breit i arrested, and everyone said I committed a felony, felony, felony, and we kept getting corrections and retractions. And Andrew Breitbart says at like 11 o'clock one night, he calls me and he goes, James, what if there was a mascot for the corrections?

And he's like, let's think of it. And we're on the phone, completely exhausted, and Breitbart says, Andrew Breitbart says to me, it's a retraction alpaca. And literally, I shit you not, I laughed until I cried. We were just laughing for an hour about this ridiculous creation. And then Andrew Breitbart died two years ago, and then it went away. And then like a year ago, I resurrected the retraction alpaca. And every time a journalist prints a retraction, an angel gets its wings and retract the correction alpaca. So Dave Weigel prints two. We get two retractions on Dave Weigel, The Washington Post.

Here's a guy. I'm going to say something on Mr. Weigel. He was a friend of my comms director, Steve Gordon. Steve Gordon passed away. Weigel wouldn't even email me. Just so, just these people are so filled with hate. And so what we do is we, you know, you know what we do. We frame the retractions, put them on the wall.

Dave Weigel has two retractions in his honor. And he'll hate me for the rest of his life for it, I'm sure. You're going to run out of space. We need a whole new building just to put all the retractions. Seriously. Yeah, hundreds of retractions. This huge wall of all the retractions. Yeah.

Well, so here's what I'm thinking, right? You keep exposing this stuff and it becomes more and more apparent and evident that there's some kind of – I mean look, people are – you've got corrupted individuals at high-ranking institutions. Yes. Media companies are lying to us, social media companies. We see it in the documentary, The Social Dilemma. We've got a bunch of former executives saying straight up they're manipulating you on purpose and it's making people go crazy and it's creating this massive partisan divide. Watch The Social Dilemma. I don't know know we watched tidbits but i say for everybody listening where do you watch it on netflix netflix check this out unfortunately they show have you seen that

pew research where it shows the left and the right moving far apart but the right barely moves the right barely moves to the right and the democrats go very far to the left this is what i see happening Social media companies are banning conservatives and anti-establishment. Like, I don't want, I don't, it's not necessarily just conservatives. I don't necessarily know

what that means anymore anyway. But it's people who are not associated with the establishment left who challenge the system are more likely to get banned. And many of them happen to be conservative. By getting rid of fringe elements

and bombastic elements of the right, the only thing that's left are regular looking conservative individuals. Like you look like a normal guy, James O'Keefe. You've got people like Will Chamberlain who just suit wearing lawyer, Trump supporter, very calm, rational guy, very, very, you know, easygoing. On the left, however, they they they're pushing things in favor of this more extreme, insane, cultish rhetoric. Antifa is given a free pass across the board. And so politicians see the insane rhetoric, believe that's where the Democrats and the left are today and embrace it. And it leaves the regular people behind. So you've got social media.

Here's what I'm trying to say. When you look at the Pew research showing the Democrats have moved very, very far left in terms of – it's consistently liberal, meaning they don't hold any conservative views or negotiate with conservatives. And conservatives have barely moved at all to the right. Conservatives are staying where they are. They're regular people. The media is manipulating people and driving them into this insane leftward direction, which eventually at some point – Well, we'll see. We'll see what happens on november 3rd no what i'm saying i'm not saying that every single person is i'm saying they've captured

people in a storm that's going crazy that's true it's leaving the regular people behind so this is what we saw uh i did this my main segment today gallup shows that today there is a party affiliation poll at the last the latest update they have from September 14th to 28th shows there is a Republican plus one advantage in party affiliation in this country. Four years ago in the same time duration, it was Democrat plus five independent voters are also up to. So that means what we're seeing now is several percentage points of Democrats no longer identify as Democrat. A couple now identify as independent and some identify as Republican. So they're being driven away from the Democratic Party. What I think is happening is the things you expose, the thing where we're seeing, I think I absolutely think you're having an impact.

And I think that people are starting to see through the facade, realizing these people are going insane. What they're promoting is insane. And now they believe they're Republican or independent. They're leaving the Democratic Party because of it. I think what people need is hope. I think the thing I fight in speeches and wherever I go is just the sheer amount of cynicism. Nothing.

You see this in the comment. Nothing matters. Nothing will be done. Nothing will be done about it. You see this. I see this top comment. Every nothing will happen to Ilhan Omar. No one will get arrested it's just this cynical nasty nihilistic sentiment and i say stop whining

and complaining about just do i say be brave do something yeah so so obvious of a motto it's just like a kindergartner can understand it you know so here's what's what gets scary to me is the average person can't do anything to ilhan omar what do what do regular people do i said i said it earlier and it's very simplistic answer but i think it's true you can you can fight in other words you can jump on a grenade i mean i don't nothing that i do or we do or anybody journal it has not even close to the comparison of something like a marcus luttrell who saw his you know combat veterans go overseas and die for their country. Think about that.

And I don't know if people ask them, do they fear for their lives? But these are people that go overseas and make the ultimate sacrifice for a cause. How many people in Washington, D.C. do that? Can you think of one? Can you think of one member of Congress? No, no, I'm serious. Well, I'm sorry. Well, a member of congress who i'm serious well i'm sorry uh well a member of congress can you think of a

person who will make a sacrifice in a civic way in the in the same in the same in the same vein you know what i mean you want you want to you say that there are people in the military who would jump on a grenade to save their they'll save their political there are people who would travel overseas and risk their lives for the good of America in DC those are the people that would pick up a child and hold it in front of them to shield themselves that's what I'm talking about so

you have to do that there's no easy answer it's like what can I do well most people aren't going to do it but you don't need most people you just need.001% of the people to do it you can do is need most people you just need point zero zero one percent of the people you can do is call her office and you can coordinate calling campaigns because if you get another thousand people to call her office at 2 p.m on thursday and then do it again on friday and again on monday you will change people's minds let me tell you what let me tell you what

someone did do an insider in the somali community and somali is a very you know it's hard to infiltrate or undercover work because they're very tight-knit there was an insider in the Somali community. And Somali is a very, you know, it's hard to infiltrate or undercover work because they're very tight knit. There was an insider who was upset by what they saw. And they contacted us. That's what they did. And it made an impact. That investigation. So, Tim, what can people do?

It's the Dennis Prager line. You can fight. You can donate a dollar or $10 or $1,000 to those who fight. Or you can do nothing. Those are your options. Very simple. Pick one. Pick one.

You can afford to send. You can afford to. I'm not going to raise money on your show. But you can afford to send money, $10 to a cause you care about. I think the first and most important thing everyone can do is speak up. That's it. In fact, share shows like this and share the videos from James, the video you just put out. Did you know that my, this, I have four YouTube channels.

I control three of them because Scanner is editorially independent. They do their thing. My, of the channels I control, two of them are blacklisted on Google. You cannot Google search Timcast or Timcast News. If you do, only this show comes up because this show is new. At some point, they removed my main YouTube channels from Google so they cannot be searched for, taking away all of that information. And the only reason any of it works is because people on YouTube might be linked to it or people are sharing it.

So I tell you this, man, if you think if you're watching, well, I'll say there's two things you can do. If you think what James is doing is important and the information you're exposing, then share those videos. And then just to throw back to what you said, what was your email address? It's VeritasTips. That's V-E-R-I-T-A-S

tips at protonmail.com, fully encrypted. Also, projectveritas.com backslash brave if you want to sign up to work for us or do anything else like that. You can – Blow the whistle. Veritas tips at protonmail.com. There are a lot of people working for tech companies right now watching this, and actually they're emailing me as I speak. So that's – so I just want to stress this.

I don't want – I think people need to realize you're much more powerful than you realize, and there are things you can do literally by – you go to work and you can be like, hey, did you guys see that thing from Project Veritas? Yes. What Google is doing? And then when they're like, what is this? You just talk about it. Share the ideas. Everyone on this podcast right now watching this, go to Twitter and just tweet the video out 50 is i don't know how many people 100 000 people watching this right now just do that 50 000 i wish 50 000 people

tweeting that google video out will change things you can also start using the brave browser and duck duck go search engine google i love you but your browser is proprietary and it's biased as all get out from what i can tell no offense but that's what the algorithm is doing so something like the brave browser and duck duck go will circumvent that uh i guess you would call it people people are scared to say words they're scared to say who they're going to vote for there was a research from a group of phds they found 10 of people who are going to vote for trump are likely to lie about who they actually support to polls you just got to say it uh be brave is a great i guess what is it your motto slogan it's

the it's like got milk you know we were just sitting there reading the harvard business review trying to come up with some motto that can we just come it came to us um yes you got it listen courage is the virtue that sustains every other virtue. So you have to, I go back to my analogy about sacrifice. You have to make a sacrifice, Tim, if you want to actually truly make a difference. You have to sacrifice something. And I think the thing that people fear most is not their life. And right now in this society, and I'm talking domestically, I think they fear their reputation. And I can tell you as someone who's taken a lot of arrows over the years, and it's very personal. And I do this, and I'm a sensitive guy. I have a heart. If I didn't have a heart, I would not be good at my job. And it's very, I mean, the hardest thing for me to accept, it was to be hated i i didn't i don't want to be hated i i certainly don't i'm not like i don't love to be loved but i don't want to be despised by everyone that i grew up respecting and i remember right after this is about my first year you know 10 11 years ago i remember looking

at my wikipedia page it was just it was awful and i remember thinking i i is breaking my heart to read this the first thing you see and you you all know how Wikipedia works and how ridiculous it is. And then you quote this guy and that was retracted, but the citation's still up. And I can't change it. There's nothing I can do. And to me, that was the hardest part was accepting, was literally saying, I'm not going to read the comments and I'm not going to give a shit about Wikipedia.

I'm just going to move forward. That was, for me, it was very hard to accept being hated and not not you know what just i had a guy an advisor who said to me many years ago i was disgusted by all the attacks vicious attacks people trying to infiltrate me women all types of weird situations i was and he said james it's a badge of honor that they do this to you and his name was steve and he told me this i went oh my god it's a badge of honor that they attack you in this sick twisted underhanded way you're effective this guy was a vietnam veteran and i said he's right and i've had to ignore the wikipedia and i've to ignore the haters, and I've had to just press on, right?

The slogan of human history, just press on. So is there an example of anybody you looked up to growing up that doesn't like you or has said bad things about you? That's a good question. I get what you're saying. No, no, no, specific, well, the New York Times I didn't respect in high school.

I'd read it. I think the New York Times has gotten a lot worse. Definitely. There are a lot of institutions – CNN. I wanted to be liked initially. There's a large part of me that wanted to be respected by these establishments because I respect their power. And the moment you stop caring about what the executive editor of the New York Times thinks, the moment you don't care is the moment you are truly free. This is the moment you are free to do the good things that you need to do.

But there's always 4% of you because you're human. There's 4%. Maybe for me it's down to almost one where you're like, you know what? Part of me still cares. I bring this up because I think you will get your due. You're going to have – like I tell this right now. I'm pretty sure there are young people who look up to you, and you are the person they're looking up to as a young person. They're going to grow up, and you're going to give them that respect that you know you wanted for from these institutions as long as you don't sell out

back down compromise settle a lawsuit uh the arc of the moral universe i always quote martin luther king the arc of the moral universe is long and it bends towards justice but i remember reading the new york times in my dining hall at ruckers i was a freshman sophomore i just sat there and read the new york times back to back and I was so disgusted by it. And I decided that someone should do something. I started filming my professors and ambushing them. And this is two years before YouTube. This is 2005. So it was a Kodak digital camera with QuickTime on a website. There was no YouTube. Wow. 2005. So James,

do you think that Andrew Breitbart would be proud of what you've done? I hope so. I mean, he was someone who, Andrew Breitbart was someone who is very much a, very, very, him and I were very different people in many respects, very different. But I talked to him every day. And what he would do is understand the, the, the, you know, he would tweet a thousand times a day. He was very, he was very aggressively in the weeds on everything and fighting every battle, probably why he died so young, 42, 43. And we were very much aligned in that way. And when he died, you know, nature abhors a vacuum nobody has quite filled his shoes it's you many others have filled it but um you know i i think so um i wonder what life would be like and what the world

would be like if he never died well me too john stewart gave you praise back in the day that was that was that was a many moons ago i don't know what's the new guy uh the daily show they're all they're all they're all awful but so unfunny. But here's the thing. Jon Stewart, back in the day, he was looking at what you did. I think it was the acorn thing, right? And he was like – it was acorn, yeah? It was acorn. He praised it.

He was like, journalists, where are you? Look at this guy. How's – you know? And that was amazing. Two kids from the cast of High School Musical 3? Journalists, where the hell were you? Meet me at Camera 3. Where were you?

Yeah, man. He was like – what did he say? You know who broke this story these two yeah it's like two kids with a 25 year old and a 20 year old with a sony minicam that was a he was foretelling the future yeah i'll tell you this john stewart has praised trump on the 9-11 uh the victims fund yeah john stewart's been a pretty uh level-headed guy but he left the you know the. And now we've got a bunch of plastic people in his wake. There were people that gave you respect, although many of the institutions were still against you early on.

Here's what I'm trying to get to. I felt similarly. I was like, I'm going to keep saying my thing. I'm going to say what I believe. I don't care if people get mad at me. And there have been instances where I'm like, there are some high-profile people that I've looked up to when i was younger and i'm like i wonder what they would think about me and everything i do i'll tell you this man i get messages from the people

i used to look up to when i was 14 these pro skateboarders who messaged me saying i love your show you're the best there you go they and so what i think is it's you just got to stay true to yourself yes and if you have principles if you you're honest, if you have integrity, you do good work. That's it. You never back down. I think then any honest person worth having respect of will give you the respect. But you must understand. And we have a curriculum.

We have an ethics curriculum at Project Veritas. Like we have a whole week seminar where we bring in journalists. And I spend the first day talking about ethics. Like I'm obsessed with the history of undercover work because if you don't have integrity, nothing matters. Now, what's interesting and ironic about this is that they will, the first thing they will do is say you have no integrity.

So the more integrity you have, the more you will be attacked for having no integrity. And that creates a feedback loop or that creates a self-fulfilling prophecy, a reverse incentive, a perverse incentive where you will actually not have integrity so that you are branded as having an integrity. And I'm telling you the hardest part, if you want to do this, anything like this, is to accept being hated by all the people you want to be liked by.

You have to be hated. I mean, like the true lie. Who's the guy in Tom Arnold in True Lies? Here's a guy who I grew up watching these movies with Tom Arnold, and suddenly he's doing tweet storms about me. It's very ironic. I mean, Tom Arnold's an affable guy. You know, he's a good actor.

I enjoyed his movies. And he's just, you know, I don't know what he's on a drug-induced binge tweet storming. Seriously. I tweeted the song White Lines by Grandmaster Flash at him when he was tweeting at me last time. So anyways. It's crazy, huh? Hey, regarding the future, I want to ask a question about deep fakes. Because your business model is to get video.

And in the future, there's going to be, if you don't – deepfakes is when they take video and they change it. A computer modulates it so it looks real. But it's completely whatever you want to call it, fabricated. How are you going to deal with that? Well, this goes back to the defamation law. You can't just lie about someone. Newspaper reporters don't even use video. They use words.

There's no evidence. They can make them up. They can write any lie about someone. Newspaper reporters don't even use video. They use words. There's no evidence. They can make them up. They can write any words they want. That's a good point. So if you think of it in that prism, there's a new paradigm, and the paradigm will be there will be fake things out there. But there's always been fake things. There's been fake language. There's been fake arguments.

There's been fallacious arguments. There's been newspaper articles that have no evidence. There's been forgeries. There's been anonymously sourced crap in the New York Times with no documentation. So that's common now. This is not a new issue. McLuhan would say it's a hot medium. Television is a hot medium. So I suppose it's a little more concentrated of a problem. But you still can't intentionally lie about someone in a a court of law you would lose that defamation case so i cannot create a fake video about someone they would sue me and

win so i think there's going to be litigation around these deep i think people will bring fake videos to you so maybe you have to you have to vet them you have to do the hard shoe leather reporting the sourcing and corroboration and i and by the way a lot of people give me a lot of stuff i'm sitting on some stuff we should have a dead man switch and release all of it by the way i'm sitting on some crazy you mean you don't i'm sitting on some crazy shit right now like beyond anything you can imagine i can't publish it you know why because i haven't corroborated it yeah well how about we take some uh super chats let's do it some questions make sure before we do you smash that like button correct we have uh we have a lot of people who are hanging out we have some really important points i'm not going to be able to read out obviously

every single super chat but i'm gonna try and read as many as i can there's a very important one scott hale says tim i'm a trump supporter for very similar reasons you are i appreciate everything you do but sadly mainstream media is winning my family winning my family is majority democrats and told me to my face any proof i physically show them is a lie so i guess i would uh ask you james how would what would you tell someone if no matter what they seem to show their friends and their family don't believe it even if you have video that's a good question i've been asked this before i'm trying i'm tired so i'm trying to remember how i respond um you're never going to convince you're never going to be able to convince everyone uh i would probably ask them what is a lie about it you know facts just say you know this guy o'keve

hasn't lost one lawsuit did you know that i did not know that just ask ask them questions what just take another look it's kind of like uh you know you know uh a cross to a vampire just just look at this and tell me what about this is is is not real are you saying that that's not the person you know just sort of have a come to jesus moment with the person just like look at the tape together and re-watch it uh i don't know i mean some people don't want to believe it people believe what they want to believe I've found in life. And, and, and it's a very hard thing to change people's minds.

But, um, I think you gotta be persistent. You gotta watch the video with them and you gotta ask questions. What's the next one? Donut donut says I'm working for FB lighted up James. It's about time. Tired of internal comms from Zuck about how to listen.

Soul searching BLM on every, and internal tools for coding. Oh, snap. So what that person needs to do is email VeritasTips, VeritasTips at ProtonMail, VeritasTips at ProtonMail. Email VeritasTips at ProtonMail.com, please. And you can use an encrypted deal. You can have a secret account, a phone number, burner phone, whatever you need to do. I got to be honest.

A lot of these super chats are just praising you. I'm not going to read all of them, but Pensive says, James, you whatever you need to do. I gotta be honest, a lot of these super chats are just you know, just praising you. I'm not gonna read all of them, but Pensive says, James you are a true American hero. And I mean in every sense of the word thank you more than words can say. Well, that means a lot. Thank you. We've got this one from Joseph. He says, every question asked by

mainstream news media should be prefaced with, quote, I'd like to preface my answer with Trump denounces white supremacy and racism. Pass on to Kaylee mcinerney we got another thank you for uh for james uh david walker says not that i think biden will drop out at this point would that mean kamala would be the democratic candidate even though she has she is a vp pick and not runner-up primary uh i don't know but i do think pelosi is setting up the 25th Amendment panel to remove Joe Biden, which we've talked about. Wouldn't the DNC just get to pick somebody if Biden dropped out? It'd probably just be Kamala.

Yeah. Mark G says, does Veritas need any programmers? I work for one of the companies involved in the Senate hearing. I just got told that I can't use the terms whitelist and blacklist since it's racist. This company wasn't political five years ago, but now it's evil. Yes, we do need. We do need tech people. we always need people you know we're just running a email email you can email uh jobs at projectbarrett'shouse.com excellent we're looking for an it support yes i know people but they're going to infiltrate you we have a very extensive vetting process we have a big filter so yeah i know people say that about me and you

know i have to behave in a way that's fairly ethical such that not if but when i get infiltrated there's no big story because the people that worship you are eventually going to come and try and infiltrate you oh they've already tried they've already done it i mean i've been through that i've been through that that hell uh and uh you know it is what it is you have to run the risk of of that uh people infiltrating me but to what end the only thing i really have to protect are the identity of our sources and those those are quarantined so you know all right v city it says your epstein video is the biggest reason i will never trust the mainstream media if they can't be trusted with to report trusted with to report that why trust them with anything thank you for your work i appreciate that yeah daniel

brudwick we got a bundwick bundrick sorry and we have a ton of super chats by the way so i'm just trying to go through as fast as we can i'm trying to read through them and find good questions but i can't you know he says we think we fight evil people but we forget the line between good and evil cuts through the heart of everyone. That is amazing. That's my favorite. Who said that? So this is Daniel Bundrick. He said, let me read the full thing for you.

We think we fight evil people, but we forget the line between good and evil cuts through the heart of everyone. Blowing the whistle means calling attention to the evil that crawls out of you as well. That's a Solzhenitsyn line from Gulag Archipelago. The line that separates good and evil runs through every human heart. Perhaps the most profound thing said in the 20th century. In a YouTube comment. And we all have this line, every one of us. It's like what Peterson talked about when if we were born in Nazi Germany and how many of us would do the right thing and have the balls to take on the

regime. And most of us don't want to admit that the truth is not what, you know, people, oh, I would, oh, I would be the heroic one that would take on Hitler. So the line that separates good and evil runs through every human heart. And that's going full circle here with the Google guy today, working for Google, saying this stuff, you know, how culpable is he? I don't know. So I love this one. Curtis McLaughlin Jr. says, Tim, you should take the photo of Biden devouring a child

out of frame of your guests. Is that in the frame? Keep up the fantastic work, Tim. It is. That is brilliant. Sorry, Dave. Well, so we were actually playing on rotating the photos. Yeah, we're gonna move around.

And that's just the one that we put up. Brilliant. So I think it is art. I don't think it is meant... George. It's just meant to be silly and absurd. And it's really great art. You and I have similar tastes because I saw that on Twitter and I was like, this is genius.

Isn't it some of the best art ever? It's G prime 85. Who's the guy in the lower right over that that's trump that's trump yes is that baby trump yep he's making fun of trump he's got tiny hands yes so that's actually a that's actually satirizing the the the insults of trump like the point he was making was that that's what everyone says he's like his tiny hands or whatever that's genius yeah yeah yeah let's see what we got here? Dave Kruple says, I'm a tradesman, proud aviation maintainer, blue collar, and I have neither the brains nor the will to own my own business. I can't have my name and face out there with a pro-Trump opinion.

Dang. That's brutal, huh? A lot of people in Hollywood, you know, do this where they're, again, it's like the Sami's Dot, which was the revolutionary publication in the soviet union and they have to whisper you know i i agree with you i guess we had secret voting we've had it since the beginning right where you don't have to disclose who you're voting for you do it in secret because of that because you don't want to get harassed by your neighbors or have people come to your house and be like you voted for this guy so we're all coming yeah we have uh jennifer scott says love your work, but it seems like nothing ever changes. We never see criminal charges like in the case of Omar or people losing their jobs like in the case of what happened in Denver.

So I have to ask myself and you, what's the point? This is that cynicism, that hopelessness that is so pervasive and is toxic. The journey of a thousand miles begins with a single step and the price of liberty is eternal vigilance. It's like the metaphor I use, like the black goo in Ridley Scott's Prometheus. It manifests. You have to start somewhere. And the vision of this, which people don't sometimes see is that one video becomes 10 videos become 100 like one whistleblower becomes a thousand they can stop one man that does two people get arrested i don't i don't have the authority of the attorney general

the united states the doj uh may may in fact be prosecuting someone but they can't talk about that because they don't comment on ongoing investigations or should they nor should they it's against the policy so let's see what happens. Apparently, in the case of the New York Post story, the FBI does comment that they're investigating. This is the one time. Then we need to blow the whistle on the FBI. Oh, yeah.

Absolutely. Everyone needs to think bigger for a second. Yes. Like, stop. I'm tired. I'm just going to speak to the person right. Is that the camera? Yeah, the camera.

Stop. Stop. Stop. Can I say? Stop whining. Stop bitching yes stop complaining you know think big for a second think think big imagine if someone had the stones at the fbi now there are two types of courage to fight a war to quote von clausowitz von clausowitz military philosopher there's the courage to march up a hill with a bayonet and to take the hill.

Okay, that's physical courage. And then there's a more rare or an equally amazing form of courage, which is moral courage. And just imagine if someone at that Bureau of Investigation in D.C. wore one of those little hidden cameras and recorded Comey and recorded Christopher Wray. Can you imagine the difference that would make? So stop whining about things and instead think about how you can contribute to that objective in any way, matter, shape, or form. But the negative energy and the cynicism is starting to piss me off because I happen to represent an organization that has a lot of people right this minute working for tech companies, emailing us, asking for hidden cameras.

So you can choose to live your life cynical and pissed off and whining, or you can contribute to the vision and the mission of actually trying to do something about it. I got a super chat for you. I'm sorry, but that one gets me a little passionate. Hold on. Hold on. This one's going to cheer you up. Tempest 83 says, I must not fear.

Fear is the mind killer. Fear is the little death that brings total obliteration. I will face my fear. Be brave. Very well said. Be brave. That's from Dune. That's from Dune, yeah.

Very well said. Fear, you know. Yo, what about authority? This word keeps coming up. People just like adhered authority they kind of believe authority whether that's whatever the new york times kind of derived from the word author but the word authority to to to tim's point earlier is changing yeah like tim is saying that young people don't do young people really look up to these bozos on on network well

they look up to the author of whoever's speaking to their reality and if you're the author or if your your message is being proliferated there are many now authors, then maybe that's the new authority. Correct. I agree with that. I think the authority is changing depending upon whose stories are most credible and prevalent. And if you build it, they will come. News has a way of attracting an audience. If people can't get actual news from CNN, they'll go to where they can get news. They'll go to Tim. They'll go to people who have new authority. Yeah. What's the

next one? Charles Bay, ball, Yosian, big fan. Want to talk about Armenian war. Biden came out siding with Turkey saying Armenia can't occupy territory there since 500 BC. While Trump says we're, we're working on it. Just want to shine light on the issue. Arts sock is Armenia. Not entirely, you know. I don't know what that is. No, it's Armenia stuff. There's just a lot of so I'm reading through a lot of these chats, but a lot of them are James, you're awesome. James, you're awesome. Yeah, just get some hard questions.

I know, and it's difficult. That's a hard one. James, why? James, everybody loves you. I can't, you know. Just let's find a good question. Well, I'll read this one. NA says, if you have haters, that literally means you stand for something. You're Churchill. you i can't you know just let's find a good question well i'll read this one na says if if you have haters that literally means you stand for something you're churchill you do i'm in it you do i'm an independent time to make a stand for something another churchill quote that i love i read a biography of him last year and it was uh it's better to be an actor than a critic it's

better to be better to be making the news than taking it it's better to be an actor than a critic so it's another way of saying i guess be the man in the arena you know to go out there and go go to go there again this is the idea of going to the location go there don't sit in an you know air-conditioned booth in manhattan and you know read teleprompters so be it better to be an actor than a critic indeed benjamin Benjamin the Rogue says, while I was in the Democratic Party, they accidentally gave me access to a secret server. What was in it has haunted me ever since, and I did tours in Afghanistan. I have lived with the guilt of not being able to get the info out. Thank you for your work.

I think this is a really important super chat. I have no idea what this person saw. But imagine you are somebody who is witnessing now something you know is wrong, you know is very wrong. Do you just sit there and do nothing or do you be brave? That is a very good question, Tim, to be or not to be, to blow the whistle or not. And again, a lot of the whistleblowers that I've read about and spoke about view it as this choiceless choice.

Eric Cochran said, I had no other option. There was no option for me. There's no optionality in these people's hearts. They must do this. It is a necessary consequence of their destiny. If you just know, and if you're sitting there next to your boss, your supervisor's doing some illegal activity, you're like, well, I'm going to lose my home, my mortgage, my reputation. But what if there was an organization that had my back? So CNN, Kerry Porch, the guy that blew the whistle on Jeff Zucker's phone calls, I think he raised $120,000 on GoFundMe after that. Is GoFundMe going to keep allowing that?

There will be some other platform. There's a solution, market solution. That was twice his yearly salary. And he got hired by someone who was a freedom person and i again i think the 21st century is different than the 20th as it pertains to whistleblowers so if you're sitting there in a work environment and you're thinking right now someone thinking maybe i should report on my colleague uh you know racketeering you know you know, or stealing money from the federal government. All I need to do is take a picture of that deal. But if I do that, then I'll lose my job.

99.9% of you won't do it. But if 0.1% of you do it, you'll change the world. There's a lot of people out there. If, you know, if you have a million people and 1% stand up, that's a lot of people. And there's so much more satisfaction in doing in taking that other road less traveled uh and there will be a safety net for you at project we will have your back we will tell your story in a way that nobody else will and in some cases and i'll give you a specific example abc news amy robach that was given to me by a current ABC News employee. She, he gave me a tape

and that person identity was protected and that person does in fact still work for ABC News. And they fired the wrong person. And they fired Ashley Bianco, who never was my source. Wow. And she has a wrongful termination lawsuit in the world. Wow.

Excellent. So I got a stumbling Saint says, James, based on everything you know, is there hope coming? I think we've went over the hope thing i i think yes i think i think that we think we've answered that i think we are seeing the tide change you know you know it really bothers me about that the whole gretchen whitmer thing with these guys you want to kidnap or whatever is that she had already lost the like it the system worked surprisingly i used to think i was thinking in 2016 there's no way trump would win because the system is under control.

It's rigged, right? Yeah. Then Trump won. And I was kind of like, wow, if Trump can win, anybody can win. Must be real. Like you can. That gave me confidence in the system. You look at what happened in Michigan and they filed the state legislature rules against Whitmer.

She defies them. The Supreme Court rules against her. She defies them. The AG says you have no powers anymore. She lost. She this is the the the checks and balances worked her ag has defied her this courts and the legislation ruled against her that to me is extremely hopeful and these lunatics who are like you know planning some dumb

garbage mission or whatever just risked everything because it worked the stuff you're doing exposing them is going to work there's there's people watching right now who are seeing this there's people emailing right now well it has to has to. There's no other, other than what you talked about last night, other than physical conflict. Abraham Lincoln once said, public opinion is everything. Going back to Walter Lippman and a lot of these authors that talk about how important sentiment is, politics is downstream from culture culture culture is downstream from data and information and what what is a hotter medium of information than people speaking in their own words in the most honest pure fashion so for that and i say if that doesn't change things then nothing will change things so i mean rock beats another way

of saying this is um a builder can build faster than a destroyer can destroy. Like it's kind of a rule of political movements or rock beats scissors. In other words, a videotape of someone talking defeats propaganda against that thing. And if that isn't the case, then I guess we're headed towards civil war, chaos, anarchy. Seven Seed says you should set up that dead man switches right away yeah if that happens they're all types of weird stuff is going to happen uncorroborated video is going to be released into the ether boy price man says james tim is there a solution to this problem companies manipulating their algorithms government regulation breaking

up tech monopolies if there's one thing the communists fear more than anything else it's being exposed to expose them Whitaker Chambers writes about this in witness to expose is the power the solution is exposure the solution is to simply do what we've been talking about this entire show this is interesting Leslie Elizabeth says hey guys my father is the judge that presided over James's criminal case in Louisiana in 2010 I'm'm now a lawyer in New Orleans and I'm a fan of your work. Wow. What you both do is important. Keep it up. David Knowles.

What's his name? Well, this is the subject comes from Leslie Elizabeth. Leslie Elizabeth. So there was a federal judge and a magistrate judge in that case. The magistrate judge was the one who I have a misdemeanor conviction in Louisiana. And it was a magistrate judge, David Knowles. Anyway, great Elizabeth.

Nice to hear from you. Awesome. Mr. Boogie says your views and thoughts on Snowden and Assange. Interesting topic. My views and thoughts. I think that a lot of people view this in a black and white way, you know,

like he's good or bad. And I would say that, that I don't view it in that dichotomy. I think it's a false dichotomy. I saw, I think someone can both be a hero and a bad. And I would say that, that I don't view it in that dichotomy. I think it's a false dichotomy. I saw, I think someone can both be a hero and a traitor. And I, and I,

and I, and I don't want to cast moral judgments on what he did. I tend, I viewed citizen for, I viewed the documentary where, you know, he's being interviewed by lawyer Poitras comes across as very sincere to me, maybe slightly naive in the way that I was when I started this organization,

not knowing the, the, the shit storm that would ensue but i think that he could be quite literally in some literal sense a traitor but also a hero and and the greater good is served um but that's a very complicated you know yeah question and i don't like viewing it in in because a lot of people that are betraying these organizations tim that i that I work with, they are kind of traitors. If someone betrayed Project Veritas, you put anyone's life under a magnifying glass. You're going to find human foibles. You're going to find issues and problems. So to betray one's country for your country. Can't both things be true simultaneously?

I think with Assange, he's not an American citizen and he's a publisher. He receives leaks. He publishes them. So what they've actively been doing to Assange is criminalizing the act of journalism, whatever is political. Are we talking about Snowden or Assange? Both. Okay. So in Assange's case, I view him as a publisher who publishes leaks. Yes. And if you don't like the information and he and he's encouraged well it's you know that's that's too bad his organization can do that it depends it depends upon the facts of there was

a recent uh a criminal complaint against him from virginia this year last year i think well it's the ongoing extradition thing extradition thing but there was an actual complaint filed uh uh criminal criminal thing filed against assange in the last year, right? It depends upon the facts in that complaint. I'm trying to remember the specifics. But if he coordinated with the leaker, if he constructed – he said curious – I know. Curious eyes don't run dry, right? So that statement to the source about hacking, if he told him to to hack so it really comes down to discovery in

the criminal case about what he told the person right right because i'm protected under you know united states supreme court bernicke where if someone goes in there and you know hack some some stuff and then just mails it to me of course i can publish it yeah but if i coordinated with that hacker well that's a violation of federal law the thing about snowden however is that uh i don't view snowden as a whistleblower. What do you view him as? He's a leaker. This was evidenced by an interview he did with I think it was John Oliver where he wasn't familiar with some of the information he leaked.

So a whistleblower says, here's a thing that's bad or here are multiple things that are bad. I better let people know about this. A leaker just gives you documents. I'm not saying that as a to condone or condemn anything. I'm just saying that's the fact. Yeah. So if you don't like that he did it, if you do like that, that's on you. I'm just pointing out a lot of people say he's a whistleblower. Well, he did blow the whistle on some things, but he released a ton of documents that he didn't know. But I think there's more of

a philosophical question inherent in the question, which is that, well, what do you think about him? Is he good or bad? And I think on some level, know it's like it's like undercover journalism it's it's it's like can you be an ethical undercover person it's like trying to create dry water or fireproof coal you can't it's like is he good or bad well he he he did betray his country he did break the law many federal laws probably so it's a very strange philosophical dichotomy he i think overall exposing people spying and violating our fourth amendment rights is the public's right to know is paramount but you have to break laws that are serious laws and by the way one of one of you know one of our ethical rules of project veritas is don't break the law i can't do that. But other people can and give me information. So it's a very interesting,

and I've read the literature on this. It's fascinating. And it's not an easy question to answer. So I would urge your audience not to view it in black and white terms. All right, you ready for the heavy one? Go ahead. Ford 2016 says,

how do you deal with the pressure of knowing that people want you 86th? Powerful people. Is there a limitation walled to the depth of your investigations that you will not move past? 86th, I should know this. Killed. Yes. Like 187 on the cop.

What is 86? What is the etymology? We don't have any more of that. I can tell you actually. What is the etymology of this? No one really knows. It have any more of that. I can tell you actually. What is the etymology of this? So no one really knows. It's a bit of folklore. Some say it has to do with old pre-World War II electronics about lockout switches.

Some say it has to do with the prohibition era of a business that was on 86th Street where the cops would tip off the bar saying, 86, the customers. Push them out the door to 86th Street. The cops come in on the other street. So others say it means 80 miles out and six feet under. UrbanDictionary.com has the answer. Exactly. Well, that's what they say, 80 miles out, six feet under. What do I think about getting killed? I mean this is also a very tough question to answer because there's no – you got to

answer it the right way. Otherwise, you – I take – I'm not a fatalist. I take precautions that I can't talk about. I don't think about it really, Tim. I don't worry about that too much. But we do take precautions. I think the way that they've tried to hurt us so far is to use the justice system against us, like jail and prosecution and reputational threats. But I think we're getting to the point now where you do have to be worried about not someone trying to assassinate you,

but a crazy lunatic who's an anomaly. And you have to do some smart things. People always say to me, be careful. I'm not going to be careful. I'm not going to be careful at all. Um, but I try not to think about it too much. And, uh, I, there are limits to, I suppose what I'd be willing to do. There are some topics that would scare the crap out of me, like investigating the Mexican

drug cartel. I don't know if, if that's my beat. You know, they will kill you. There are some stories where you just get killed. And I've yet to find a one, I've yet to find a story, and this is honest to God truth, that I've gotten that I didn't publish because I was afraid. So far. So far.

There are organizations that will kill you. Have you heard that Voltaire quote, that if you tell people the truth, they'll kill you unless you make them laugh? Interesting. I had not heard that quote. A lot of our stuff is pretty serious, you know. It's very serious. All right.

Not this thing. We'll do one more that you've already answered, but just to wrap up on. Chris Stroud says, James, if someone brought you info on a right-wing organization, Fox News, for example, and offered to expose them via hidden camera, would you do that or do you only focus on exposing left-wing organizations? I would do it. Of course. It depends upon the information. Someone says if – the problem with the question is if someone brought you information on Fox News, would you publish it?

The answer is that depends on what the information is. If someone brought me information on CNN, that depends. Like if someone brought you a video of, say, Jeffrey Toobin cranking it on a Zoom meeting, would you publish that information? Oh, no. That's interesting. That's a really interesting philosophical question if someone's jerking off on a camera. Oh, no. It depends.

It depends. The whole Kogan thing. It depends. The whole Kogan thing. Remember that? It depends upon what the Zoom call was. I mean, you know, the 9 a.m. conference calls at CNN, for example. Probably full of it.

You know, it's all – the thing about ethics, the beauty and bane of ethics is it's completely circumstantial. There are no universal rules about journalism ethics. I go back to the Hemingway quote that you're better off, the real ethical issue, this is a little deep, but you're better off for having done it. Because it's not necessarily, journalism does harm people. Journalism harms good people. Information harms people. Truth harms people. If your objective is to reduce harm in the Kantian sense, in the categorical imperative

sense, never use someone as a means, you can't actually do journalism. So in every case, it's a situational test that you evaluate the specific factors. But the answer, the bottom line is, I would publish the story about Republicans, conservatives, and I think that we will do more of that. And I think the media is going to have a huge problem on their hands because they're not going to be able to say, well, he's just an ideologue. Well, what are they going to say when it's someone that they don't like, the NRA? They cheered you for it with the Epstein thing.

In one story, it was like suddenly they're like, oh, can we like this guy now? Can we be allowed? And I think that says a lot about them. I really do. Asking their rich overlords. I mean, you had Seymour Hersh and all these people or you know go throughout the 20th century you know upton sinclair was an avowed socialist and i say more power to him and he's exposing he didn't do the jungle to to expose rotting meat conditions he did it to because he supported unionization of workers more if he's

an advocate i don't care as long as the information is real uh seymour hirsch very anti-war guy anti-vietnam war more power to him as long as he's reporting the facts there are plenty of award history is replete with unbelievable reporters who are 100 focused on a specific ideology and didn't do anything else and they all all won Pulitzer Prizes. And history views them fondly. So if your argument against me is that I only expose big tech and, you know, government bureaus, if that's

your argument that I'm discredited because my beat is, that doesn't make, that's not consistent with any historical view of investigative reporting. The question is, is are you is what you're posting true exactly yeah well we're a little bit over but uh this is this is tremendous man that seriously thanks for coming on this has been uh veritas tips at proton mail veritas tips

at okay what are your other be brave what are your other social links what do you mean we're like your website project veritas.com uh twitter it's uh it's james o'keefe the third that's james okay efe capital iii at twitter you can follow us there right on well thanks for hanging out everybody make sure you smash that like button on the way out we've got uh we've got awesome guests throughout the week of course thursday is gonna be the debate so i don't think we'll be live then but we're gonna have a really great show tomorrow talking big tech censorship, kind of following up on some of your reporting and probably bringing up more of your reporting.

So make sure to smash the like button. You can subscribe. We'll have clips up from the show all throughout tomorrow. You can follow me on Twitter, Instagram, and Parler at TimCast. Check out my other channels, YouTube.com slash TimCast News and YouTube.com slash TimCast. And of course, you can follow Mr. Ian Crosslandan follow me anywhere and

everywhere at ian crossland oh very nice i like that and that's me sour patch lids l-y-d-s sour patch l-y-d-s because you spelled it with a y and then yes yeah but uh but seriously again james thanks for thanks for coming on and thank you you know come back anytime everybody else will be will be live tomorrow at 8 p.m and again smash the like button and we'll see you all tomorrow