Timcast IRL - Timcast IRL #525 - Pro Abortion Activists Ransack Pregnancy Centers w/Daryl Davis & Bill Ottman

Episode Date: May 7, 2022

Tim, Ian, and Lydia host Bill Ottman of Minds and prominent speaker, anti-white supremacy activist, and de-radicalization expert Daryl Davis to break down the White House refusing to condemn the far leftist who posted the addresses of Supreme Court justices, Daryl's use of his musical training to draw out white supremacists and members of the KKK and convince them away from extremism, and whether the US is a fundamentally racist country, and what that means for black Americans today. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

It's been a crazy week. We have this story out of Maryland and Portland where pregnancy centers, they're centers for helping women who are pregnant and are, you know, having doubts or having issues or need support. Because they're pro-life, they've been ransacked by pro-abortion activists. And man, the violence and the just the anger, it just keeps getting worse. I feel like people are becoming more absolute in their positions and unwilling to compromise. I think most people probably can see that as well. So we'll definitely talk about that. Another element of the story is that these activists, a different group of activists or a similar activist group, published the addresses of several Supreme Court justices because they're upset about the leaked

draft on Roe v. Wade. Jen Psaki essentially said Joe Biden doesn't care that they don't care that it's happening. And also Joe Biden has no position on abortion restrictions. So you've got now, I think Tim Ryan in Ohio said abortion, no restrictions, none of our business. And that's where it is. Everything's becoming more and more extreme. Now, my view of it is the right seems to be exactly where they've been. They've always wanted to ban abortion. The left now wants to remove restrictions, which is more to the left of or more extreme than they've ever been. So we'll talk about that, too. And then in that in line with that and the other big news from the past week or so, Elon Musk, Tesla has announced they will cover the costs of women to travel out of state to get abortions, which somehow involves Elon Musk again. So we're going to talk about censorship.

Elon Musk, there's a story where apparently they're claiming Trump told Elon Musk to buy Twitter. He's denying it. So we're going to talk about this censorship. Marjorie Taylor Greene, of course, won her court case. She is eligible to run for reelection. But I think the big conversation tonight is going to be hyperpolarization, ways to deal with it, ways to connect with people. And joining us to discuss this, and probably one of the foremost experts, is Daryl Davis. Good afternoon. How are you?

I am fantastic. Do you want to introduce yourself? I think you just did. My name is Daryl Davis. I'm a 64-year-old musician, author, and lecturer, and race reconciliator. Right on. I guess the big story around you, aside from the fact that you're a famous jazz musician, is that you actually de-radicalized Klan members. Well, I inspired them to de-radicalize themselves. I have been the impetus. A lot of the media says black blues musician or black rock and roll musician converts X number of Klansmen. No, I never converted anybody. I have been the impetus for over 200 to convert themselves.

Yeah, absolutely. Cool. Well, this is going to be fascinating because we talk about polarization a lot. And we actually did an event with you, which was really interesting. And it's going to be fun to talk about and kind of understand what happened there. But also we have Bill Ottman of Minds, who can also talk about, you guys are working together on censorship and how censorship is making things worse. Absolutely. Thanks for having me. Yeah. I'm Bill. I'm a founder of Minds, Minds.com. Check it out. Daryl and I just recently published a paper together with multiple

PhDs and a bunch of researchers called The Censorship Effect, talking about the blowback of censorship, how to facilitate dialogue. And that's what we need more of. Right on. Yeah, man, I'm down to talk about censorship because I do believe a little bit of censorship is necessary. Otherwise, you have a wild zoo of people eating each other. So you've got to create a little bit of a just sensorial atmosphere, in my opinion. We can talk about that later. Well, just to add to that point real quick, some content is illegal. Of course. Child abuse.

It's got to be censored. And that means someone goes in and has to remove it, right? Dude, Daryl, I just want to point out that you rocked with Chuck Berry. I didn't know. For 37, you said 37? 32 years. 32 years with Keys with Chuck? I played Keys.

He's great with inventing rock and roll. He did invent rock and roll. So you kind of invented rock and roll with him. No, no. I came long after. Johnny Johnson was his original piano player. I was born in 1958, so right at the peak of rock and roll. That is hot.

Thanks for coming, brother. All right. You guys want to get started? Well, we got to do it. Yeah, I am technically here as well. I just wanted to say, too, we were late getting up to the studio today because all of us who are supposed to do the sound check were so enthralled by what Daryl was telling us. So I'm really looking forward to this evening's conversation.

I know the chat likes to laugh at me for being excited about my guests, but I'm excited about this conversation for sure. It's going to be great. Before we get started, head over to TimCast.com, become a member. If you would like to help support our work, not only are you helping us with keeping our journalists employed, and we just brought on another really amazing, talented personality to contribute to our columns, I suppose, now that she has articles up. It's Josie, the redheaded libertarian on Twitter, is going to be writing articles and commentary for us. She's absolutely fantastic, so I'm thrilled that she was able to, to come and work with us. And it's thanks to you guys

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subscribe to this channel, share the show with your friends. Let's get started with this first story. I'm going to start here, actually, and not necessarily jump in with the violent photos, but this is part of the same story. White House refuses to condemn activist group who posted home addresses of Supreme Court justices. And there are these pregnancy centers where activists went and smashed up the windows and damaged them, ransacked them. These are places where they try and talk to women who are pregnant. They're called crisis pregnancy centers. Well, activists who are associated with the pro-abortion side of things, I guess, just hate them. And so they went and vandalized and tagged them up. I think seeing stuff like this reach the highest levels, like the White House, where we

learned that Supreme Court justices had their addresses posted. We've already seen people lose their lives. It shows that we're reaching this very extreme level of hyperpolarization. So, Daryl, I don't know if you've been following any of the current news about the Roe v. Wade stuff. I mean, things have been kind of crazy over the past couple of years, or, you know, Bill, if you've been following this stuff. But I think we should get started with this, the modern hyperpolarization. And I'm curious what your thoughts are with, you know, far left, as they would call it, or far right people fighting in the streets. Or how about just this right here, you know, pro-abortion groups smashing up windows and vandalizing buildings? Well, you know, that's been going on for quite some time. About probably 30 years ago, there was an anti-abortion person who was going up and down the East Coast bombing abortion clinics.

And he got arrested, I think, down in Florida. Another one murdered an abortion doctor in Florida, Dr. Gunn. The guy who bombed the clinics lived right in Maryland. And I remember I was in bed one night at my girlfriend's house, and there was thunder and lightning, and she lived right up against the woods. And we thought a tree had been hit by lightning, because the whole ground rock, things fell off the walls, everything, 4 o'clock in the morning. And we jumped up out of bed. And then, you know, still thunder and lightning and raining outside.

So at 7.30 that morning, things had died down. We came outside. All the neighbors were out. We're all looking in the woods for this fallen tree. And this was on a Sunday morning, about 4 a.m. It wasn't discovered until Mondayay in annapolis maryland that uh that guy had bombed the abortion clinic on the other side of the woods wow how far away from your house was it uh from her house it was um gosh less than a quarter mile that's wild yeah it feels like there are political issues that are kind of impossible in a sense

like when we talk with people who are pro-life because we have you know Seamus on the show periodically and we have a lot of conservatives and they're staunchly pro-life their view of this is for one most reasonable people most most people and particularly like all reasonable people think bombing an abortion clinic is wrong and killing people is wrong. But you have moral questions that arise if the pro-life side genuinely believes that babies are being murdered, then they're trying to stop murder. Now, how do you solve for a problem like that if you can't convince someone that it's wrong to bomb a clinic? You know what I mean? Like if they if they believe in their heart of hearts that they're saving babies, I don't I don't know if you can convince them not to commit these these acts. Well, I think, you know, that if they they're convinced that you're murdering babies and perhaps they're, you know, they're not they're separating babies from adults.

So in their minds, I'm not I'm not agreeing with them, I'm saying. But in their minds, they're murdering the people who are murdering babies. adults. So in their minds, I'm not agreeing with them, I'm saying, but in their minds, they're murdering the people who are murdering babies. So therefore, they're preventing the murder of babies. That's their justification. Right. It's like, this is where things are getting interesting because we talked about this yesterday. Louisiana has advanced a bill that will make abortion homicide, that will legally list it as homicide. So this is, I mean, this is a political line that is as hard as a line can be. Because once that line is crossed, that means you have serious questions about whether or not someone is justified in using force to stop an abortion doctor from committing an abortion. If the act of abortion is homicide, then there's a

legal justification to prevent that from happening. That's if it's codified. Regardless of the law, though, there are people who already believe that to be the case. I thought the conversation you guys had down in Nashville sort of theorizing about future technology that could potentially enable a fetus to live at a much earlier age. Like that is a fascinating philosophical conversation that I think people just need to be willing to have because that is what, it puts it into context. It makes it less emotional. Well, the fascinating thing is

we had this conversation where I basically asked if there was a way that from the moment of conception, a baby could be taken from the womb and put into an artificial womb, a machine that would allow it to live, should we then ban abortion to the extent that the baby is killed and only allow procedures to terminate a pregnancy if the baby is allowed to survive? The issue with that, I suppose, is everyone on the right basically says like, oh, okay,

that's an interesting question. Maybe separating from the mother might be bad. But I've asked a handful of people on the left, and they say, meh, who cares? No, I don't know. Why not? Whatever. So not to get into a technological discussion. My question, I guess, is what I'm trying to get into is are there issues we can't mend?

Are there just ideas that we're never going to be able to rectify amongst each other? I believe so. I mean, we can come close, but there are always going to be issues that will crop up. And then, you know, you have what you just proposed there as a possible viable solution. But when you have things that are that extreme on the right, that extreme on the left, you know, you're not going to change those people necessarily. But what you can do is uplift the middle when you have that extreme polarization then what you want to do is strengthen the middle pull the middle up and in doing so you will pull some of those uh people on the left and some of those people on the right into the middle as you

do that sort of like a vortex yeah yeah i think the have you heard the the idea that socialism is able to exist within libertarianism but libertarianism is not able to exist within socialism? Yeah. So I think that that's a pretty powerful idea. I mean I don't necessarily know one way or the other if it's true but it seems like a true fact. What do you guys think about that idea? In a fully libertarian system, you have the right to create a socialized system with no problems. In a fully socialized system, you've got a lot of checks and balances you'd have to get through to create a system where you're like, I don't want to be a part of that.

Unfortunately, you have to because you're already part of it. That's the idea of social. Absolutely. So one of the issues now in the whole Roe v. Wade debate, I tweeted about this earlier. We had Tim Ryan and we had Obama. I'm sorry, not Obama. We had Jen Psaki talking about Biden. I had Tim Ryan and we had Obama. I'm sorry, not Obama. We had Jen Psaki talking about Biden. I don't know why I said Obama. We had Jen Psaki talking about Biden

refusing to condemn late-term abortions. She was asked, I think it was by Ducey over at Fox News, whether Biden was in favor of restrictions on abortions. And she just, you know, hee-hawed around the answer and was like, it's between a woman, a woman and a doctor, a woman and a doctor. Tim Ryan said the same thing. So for me, I've always been kind of in the center left position. It used to be the left liberal position in this country of like in the first trimester, maybe into the second, second and third trimester abortion are kind of just not okay.

And it's supposed to be safe, legal and rare. But now you have one side saying unrestricted up to nine months, the woman is about to go into labor, the baby can be aborted. And then you have the right saying ban outright in every circumstance. So how do you find that middle? I mean, how do you how do you most people are now finding themselves like there's no middle, There's very few people left. I think part of it depends upon the circumstances as to why a particular woman wants an abortion. I'm not saying, I don't believe that all abortions should be illegal.

I don't believe that all abortions should happen either. But I think it depends upon the circumstances. If a woman has been raped by a stranger, if a woman has been raped by her father, or it's a young girl, something like that, these are mitigating circumstances. It's already bad enough, a rape is bad enough, that that woman is going to remember that the rest of her life.

It's going to traumatize her. It's going to traumatize her even more if it's somebody within her own family, her father. Okay? And if that child is produced, she's going to be confronted with that child every day as a reminder. Is that something that we want? You know, that might be a decision for her to make and not for us to make. I suppose the issue is, you know, we've talked to a great deal this past week about the abortion.

But I think one way to kind of elevate the conversation is what do you do when you have two competing political factions that have just moved away from each other? Well, that's what Roe v. Wade is sort of bringing up in the cultural conversation is like should local areas make that decision? I'm not – It's almost like that's the solution then to repeal Roe v. Wade or to overturn it. Yeah. It's just crazy how controversial it is and how emotional it is. But we have to have the conversation. Here's what I think.

I think that – we mentioned to have the conversation. Here's what I think. I think that we mentioned this briefly the other day. If you look at the history of the United States and personhood, that we have a tendency to move towards granting more personhood rights than rescinding them, that in almost every circumstance, we are continually expanding who gets access to what we deem to be civil rights. It wasn't always the case in the United States with racism that people weren't granted full civil rights with women not being able to vote. I actually think that based on the trends of this country, we're going to move towards completely banning abortion outright.

That we'll come to a point where people agree that they're going to say we deem an unborn baby to be a human life guaranteed constitutional protections. What was it like before Roe v. Wade, Daryl? Do you remember much about it? Yes, but vaguely. Was it like a big problem? Was abortion a hot topic?

There wasn't so much media. It was always a hot topic, and women were giving abortions in secret, doing it themselves with a coat hanger or having somebody else do it with a coat hanger. I remember friends of mine even did that, you know. And then there were those who were very vocal about it. You know, they would come out and say, yeah, I had an abortion. What about it? You know, things like that. But it was always very controversial. And, you know, there were a ton of abortion clinics where you could go and get it done legally. And, you know, they were a ton of abortion clinics where you could go and get it done

legally, and there were always, you know, not almost always, but a number of times there would be protests out in front of the clinics. It was particularly more violent back then, wasn't it? In some cases, yeah. I mentioned the guy, I forgot what his name was, it was Michael something, who went up and down the East Coast

bombing the abortion clinics. Yeah, you know, that part was violent and killing doctors who performed abortions, as in Dr. Gunn. But not everything was violent. You know, there were a lot of loud, vocal protests in front of some of these clinics. Let me ask you about your view of how things have been going today. I mean, there's been a lot in the past several years with the riots of the country over George Floyd. I'm curious as to your perspective. You're older than us, and so you certainly have seen way more. Does it feel worse today in terms of the political divide than it has in the past? I wouldn't say that it really feels worse.

You know, there's always been a divide, but people today are more outspoken and less hidden about their views. It seems to be a more emboldening, if you will, today. Like, you know, you see people who used to wear hoods and masks come out there with their burning crosses, and now they come out in their regular clothes and express the same views. So they don't feel like they have to hide so much anymore because their jobs are being threatened or whatever.

When did you – so we can just get started with your story for people who aren't familiar. So just in terms of the context, I want to talk about modern politics and all this stuff and where we are now, but I think your history might lend some understanding to a lot of people. You're famous for being the, how did you describe it, you inspired people to de-radicalize the Klan's members. Okay, so to give you a little bit of background on myself, as I said, I'm 64 years old. But I grew up as the child of parents in the U.S. Foreign Service. So I grew up as an American embassy brat.

I was born in 58. I began traveling around the world at the age of three in 1961. And how it works is you get assigned to a country for two years. You come back here to the States. You're here for a few months, maybe a year, and then you're assigned to another country abroad. So my first exposure to school was overseas. I did kindergarten, first grade, third grade, fifth grade, seventh grade, and all the schools I went to overseas, this is back in the 1960s. My classmates were from Nigeria, Japan, Russia, Czechoslovakia, Germany, France, Italy, Sweden. Anybody who had an embassy in those particular

countries, all of their kids went to the same school. So that became my baseline as to what school was supposed to be about. I had all these colors. You guys here are too young to remember black and white TV, but you know about it. I remember black and white TV. And I remember when color TV came in, it was like, wow, it's like a whole new dimension, right? You know, you never want to see black and white TV again. You saw something in living color. Okay. Well, every time I would come back home from overseas, back to my own country, the United States, it was like going from color TV to black and white. Because we did not have that amount of diversity in this country, in our schools. When I would come back, I would either be in all black schools or black and white schools, meaning the still segregated or the newly integrated.

Just because Brown versus the Board of Education desegregated schools in 1954, it didn't mean that integration took place overnight. It took years and years. But even in many cases still, it's not. Exactly. In fact, the Prince Edward County, Virginia, shut down. They refused to integrate schools, the public schools. They shut down all public schools in Prince Edward County, Virginia, not for five days, not for five weeks, not for five months, for five years. Years, okay? Imagine how much education is lost in five years.

When you go down there today, people my age, a lot of them are basically functional illiterates because they missed five years of their education if you know if they were in third grade you know they didn't go back to school until they were in eighth grade you know you know that kind of thing um so you know you're dealing with that kind of thing so look look at kids today who have to go to school over zoom over the last two years because of the pandemic some some kids did better than others but a lot of them did not do so well over Zoom because they weren't getting

that personal one-on-one education. Well, as an aside too, I don't want to derail too much. I think we're going to start seeing something similar because schools have started adopting ideological praxis in their teachings. So instead of telling a kid, you know, two plus two equals four,

they're saying two plus two equals five. Well, in what context are we talking? So you actually had a viral trend where people, teachers, were saying 2 plus 2 equals 5. In what context? It was the 2.4 plus 2.4 equals 4.8, which is rounded up to 5. So if you round down 2.4, I don't know what kind of simplicity mess they were intending. It's an issue of tribalism. And this is it's part of the polarization.

The idea is that the people on the right started saying two plus two is four. And sooner or later, the woke people are going to say it's not. And then a point was being made by, you know, left tribal people where they're like two plus two could be five. Here's how. And then they say two point four rounds down to two, but two point four plus two point four is four point eight, which rounds to five. Therefore, two plus two is five. And then most people who are reasonable are just like two point four plus two point four is four point eight. End of story. If you want to

make some weird equation that omits information for the sake of making your strange argument, I guess. But they're teaching kids this. You also have a lot of the critical race theory ideology stuff in schools where the kids are getting more of this kind of social emotional learning as opposed to actually learning stuff. Okay, so let's define two terms that you use just so that everybody's on the same page, not just us here but everybody out here listening to us. So let's define the same page, not just us here, but everybody out here listening to us. So let's define the term woke, your definition of term woke and your definition of the term critical race theory. Woke is typically a reference to like a left tribal identifier. So it has a reference to critical race theory, critical theory, critical gender theory. It encompasses these different schools of thought.

We got to define all these things. Critical race theory is basically the – oh, man. It gets tough to actually – does that stink bug? Critical race theory is critical theory in a racial context. Critical theory is the political theory of the oppressed versus the oppressors. With Karl Marx back in the day, his critical theory was that the wealthy oppress the poor. The proletariat is oppressed, the bourgeoisie oppresses. Kimberly Crenshaw wrote a book called Critical Race Theory, which says this doesn't take into context the race, the racial component of the United States. Therefore,

critical race theory is white people are dominant and they oppress all people of color. So critical race theory has several different subsequent schools of thought like intersectionality, that a black woman experiences different discrimination than a black man because there's also sexism plus racism. But the sexism plus racism is a different category than the sexism that a white woman would experience. So this is another school of thought within the realm of critical race theory. Critical race praxis is the implementation of these ideas into standardized learning. An example would be, if I were to give you a math problem, I would say, a train leaves Pittsburgh traveling at 100 miles an hour.

A train leaves Cincinnati traveling at 75 miles an hour. They're 300 miles apart. How long? Blah, blah, blah. Critical race praxis gives math problems to kids like in Florida. Jerome was stopped by the police 17 times in the past month.

Harold was stopped three times. What percentage are black people stopped by police more than white people? So what they're doing is it is a math question, but they're injecting an ideology, a praxis of critical race theory.

Assuming that Jerome is black. Well, they do these things that are overtly racist. Absolutely. But it'll show a little black character and it'll show a little white character. And then they'll do this problem. And so we've started seeing the emergence of a lot of that. What I see from this is one viral video that went around is a kid who didn't understand pronouns. Because this is – wokeness includes what is called critical gender theory, which is boys and girls don't exist. Doctors guess gender.

And so there's a video of a little boy asking, he's doing a pronoun worksheet. And it says something like, Juan gets on the swing. Which pronoun would you use? Janet uses jump ropes. Which pronouns would you use? And he put they for all of them. And his mom goes, why did you put they for all of them? And he says, how am I supposed to know if they're boys or girls?

And she said, didn't you notice their names? And he was like, but you said there's no boys or girls names. And so now the kids don't understand basic English grammar because of the praxis being injected in the current generation, the current

learning systems. So not to derail too much from what you were saying, because now we're getting particularly verbose. When you talk about these schools, the first thing I think of is, at this point, schools have become so corrupt in many ways. I think regardless of whether we have them or not, people are going to become functionally illiterate. Basically, when you mentioned functional illiterates, I thought of the kid who didn't know how to use pronouns and everything that comprises that problem we're experiencing. Assuming that he doesn't know that Janet is a female name or now is androgynous, right? Where Janet could be a male name or a female name. Like, for example, my name is Daryl.

For the longest time, I thought Daryl was always a male name until an actress came along named Daryl Hannah. That's right. Well, so that defines wokeness. Was there another term? No, that was wokeness and a critical race theory. Yeah. Okay. Well, there we go. I think the impossible thing about it is that everything is blended together.

And so every issue becomes – with intersectionality, the reality is that if you're talking about race, you're talking – race and gender are different conversations. But, yeah, they're the same conversation. And so it makes it really hard to talk about anything because – so woke blends all of that together. And it's just – it's hard to define because it also means different things to different people. I think I could define wokeness as like – it's like a faux awakening. People feel like they're having an awakening right now. But it's an awakening to like what they're being told is real. So they just believe what they're told rather than a real like central awakening of like having like a reality shift.

So, you know what I mean? It's not like an internal struggling. I mean, maybe it is for them. They're probably having a similar feeling to someone that's actually had a spiritual awakening on a hill meditating for 40 days. But it's like a false awakening and people are making fun of it, calling it. Oh, they're woke. They're so awake now. Have you ever heard the term red pill?

Red billed red pill. No, it's the inverse of woke. calling it oh they're woke they're so awake now have you ever heard the term red pilled red build red pilled no it's the inverse of woke but they basically mean the same thing okay if you are red pill it's a reference to the matrix you get the blue pill the red pill the red pill wakes you up from the illusion of reality woke means you've awoken to what's really going on and so they mean effectively the same thing a great realization of the lies you've been told. Based on my understanding, and I think fair research, red-pilled is a bit troll-y

and more tongue-in-cheek. Woke is zealous and ideological. But I also think the woke stuff is manipulative and wrong for the most part. So, you know, we often have people on here and I talk about it. Well, okay, so for example, when I was in high school, we were taught in the textbooks, I still got my textbooks,

that Robert Perry, Admiral Perry, discovered the North Pole. Not true. You know, Matthew Henson discovered the North Pole. Not true. You know, Matthew Henson discovered the North Pole. Admiral Perry was a white guy. Matthew Henson was a black guy. Matthew Henson was Admiral Perry's best friend. And they went on the exploration together. Perry got sick and told Henson to go on.

Henson went on and discovered the North Pole. All right? Interesting. When they got back, Perry told everybody it was Henson. They said, no, we can't give him the credit. And they gave the credit to Admiral Perry. All right? Admiral Perry was buried in Arlington Cemetery.

Matthew Henson was buried in a pauper's grave. In the 1980s, when Ronald uh was in office as president uh there was a a bill put forth coretta scott king and some other people came to him and he uh passed this bill now in the textbooks it says matthew henson discovered the north pole now i knew that all along because my parents told me even though it wasn't in the textbook all right um they exhumed matthew henson from the pauper's grave grave and now he's buried next to his best friend uh admiral perry in arlington cemetery when i was in school uh we did not learn that this country had internment camps for japanese americans I didn't learn

that until I was in college. And I was incredulous. I was like, what? Are you kidding me? No way. And I asked my parents. They were like, yeah. You know? Why wasn't it in our textbooks? Because it was a dark blemish on our history. It was a shameful thing that we did in this country.

So, did I become woke when I was in college? But that's not wokeness. All right. So what is that? So an example of wokeness is saying things like all white people are racist. All white people are not racist. But that's – wokeness is not a reference to understanding how history works.

So I'll give you an example. When I was a little kid, I was told in school Christopher Columbus discovered America, which is just not true. They were already people here. But did you know that? Yes, because I had a mom who told me there were already people here. And I tell this story all the time. She said, actually, Leif Erikson came to the North American continent 1,000 years before Christopher Columbus. But, honey, there were already people there, weren't there?

And I was like, yeah. And she goes, did they teach you there were already people there? And I was like, yes. And she goes, didn't, weren't there? And I was like, yeah. And she goes, did they teach you there were already people there? And I was like, yes. And she goes, didn't they discover this continent? And I was like, yeah. And I was like, then why did they tell me that? And she said, they think you're stupid, but they'll tell you the truth in college. And that was like a real anti-authoritarian moment for me as a kid.

So was that an awakening or a woke? So wokeness doesn't refer to learning the truth wokeness is typically i mean depending on who you're talking to if you're talking to people who are trying to avoid the overt ideologies of either you know extremists what any extremist faction wokeness is typically a pejorative term to reference someone who says you're white so you're racist that's considered to be woke now some people might use woke in a more lax manner like perhaps towards the angle you're describing it but uh based on like this show and how we approach things most people who watch would probably say they're anti-woke but they completely agree with what you've said or would completely agree

with the idea that native americans already were here. The proper way to describe it is Christopher Columbus discovered the Bahamas for Europeans. As part of the European culture, he was the first to kind of bring that information to them. But again, Leif Erikson, also of European descent, discovered it. It didn't really make the rounds in the European continent. And other people were already here who had discovered the land. Typically, people do not use woke as like a badge. You know, people who support critical – Even the woke people don't say that.

No, they don't. And so people who are like pro-critical race theory wouldn't necessarily call themselves that. And I think, look, most people are pro-uncensored history. I think that is a common thing that we need to get on the table. No, I would have to disagree with well maybe i don't i'm i don't have a statistic in front of me but i think we all here want well so uncensored history and i so it gets complicated because critical race theory some

people are trying to say the critical race theory is the truth of history that's some people's perspective other people would agree with teaching what you just said was omitted, but that's not the same as critical race theory. So take a look at this image. This is part of a book called Not My Idea, in which grade school children are shown the whiteness contract with a white hand reaching out and a devil tail and goat's feet. I think this is wrong to teach children that white people are inherently evil, inherently oppressors, or inherently racist, that all white people are racist. And this is what woke typically means when we criticize it. I think we should tell people that some people are good, some people are bad, and race is not relevant to whether or not someone will be a good or bad

person. You've got to find out who they are within. Would you agree? I would agree 100% with that. Well, the problem is, this is what they're teaching kids in school. Dude, we can see your pointy tail. Contract binding you to whiteness. You get stolen land, stolen riches, special favors. Whiteness gets to mess endlessly with the lives of your friends, neighbors, loved ones, and fellow humans of color.

Sign below for the purpose of profit. Land, riches, and favors may be revoked at any time for any reason. Showing a white hand reaching out with a whiteness conjured in a devil's tail, I think is particularly dangerous to be teaching children. Okay, but now, so that's called critical race theory by your definition, correct? Yes. Okay, but there are also people who are calling critical race theory teaching the transparent history. Okay, people banning books.

No, no. Not talking about. These are the books being banned. Those are not the only books being banned, right? They're talking about banning books on Rosa Parks' biography out of schools. Not talking about slavery. Not talking about, not talking about oppression and things like that.

They're calling that critical race theory as well. But hold on. The challenge with this is I'm not familiar with a book on Rosa Parks being banned. And in the experience that we've all had here and probably most of our listeners, when recently Florida banned math books, the left came out, woke people and said, see, now they're banning math. The issue was they were banning the math I explained to you where the math problem isn't a math question. It says how many people are racist, blah, blah, blah. So Florida said we don't want ideological praxis in our math books.

We want math problems. So when we hear that they're banning books, it's a question of which books, why? Well, what we did was we had several experts on who brought the books to us and showed us. This is the easiest and most notable example, saying whiteness is the devil. Do you remember about four years ago, the state of Texas changed all the public school books? They removed the word slave and slavery and changed it to immigrant worker. That would be bad.

At the same time, the New York Times removed the word slave from their game Wordle because it was offensive. So I would consider all of that to be in the same line of authoritarian censorship we don't want. Okay.

So there was a big protest and I think it was Macmillan and Press or whatever that did all the Texas school books, had to recall all those books and rewrite them. And now it's enslaved people as opposed to slaves. So there is an effort. I think they did this. Didn't they remove master and slave from some coding language? Yeah, on Git.

Right. So I oppose exactly what you described and no matter where it's coming from, typically what we're seeing today, I don't think woke people, well actually I take that back. They literally banned the word slave from Git. GitHub.

And the New York Times, they have this game called wordle where it's every day you try to guess a five-letter word you literally can't guess the word slave because it's offensive i think that's bad i don't think books should be i don't i don't think i don't think this book should be banned from schools i think this book should be banned from curriculum in which the teacher says child learn the truth wh truth. Whiteness is the devil. I think a teacher could say to a more age-appropriate group, take a look at this book and what these people believe about this idea and approach it critically.

But there are people who also consider critical race theory showing pictures of the four black people trying to integrate the Woolworths food counter and having stuff poured on their heads. The girl walking, Ruby Bridges, walking into the school with the white people yelling behind her and all that kind of stuff. They consider that critical race theory and they don't want their kids seeing that. So the issue is these things can exist within the ideology of critical race theory in the context of critical race theory is rooted in Marxist, the Marxist philosophy of oppressed and oppressor. I do not agree with that. I think that's wrong. And I think when you put a racial tone on that, it's extremely dangerous because what they've

started doing at Dearborn University in Dearborn, Michigan, they created a POC and non-POC digital cafe, meaning white people only, people of color only. In Seattle, they created diversity, equity, inclusion events for POC only, non-POC only. And that's under critical race theory. And they justified exactly how you explained it. They show racism from the past we all think is wrong and then say, see, shouldn't black people have their own private spaces separate from white people?

And I say, if people in a private context, you know, within a certain reason, I guess it's fine if you have a private club. In public accommodations like universities and libraries, I don't think they should be allowed to force gender segregation. I'm sorry, racial segregation. They're the ones who actually want to get rid of gender segregation as well. Well, just a few years ago, what, maybe four years ago, five years ago, maybe even less, a high school in Mississippi, the principal had two separate proms, a black prom and a white prom. And you were not allowed to have any integrated couples at these proms. And was this a critical race theorist who had implemented it? I don't know.

Isn't it, they kind of overlap because it wouldn't be surprising if there are cases in the country where there's actual old school segregation but you sort of have new school segregation and old school segregation coming together. So Daryl, what is your response to kind of the new... Take a look at this, right?

I'm willing to bet the story you heard was actually about someone who was woke creating black-only spaces like this story we have from Atlanta. No, it wasn't a black person creating the segregated. No, no. They're white liberals who do these things. There are white progressive women who are overwhelmingly the woke who are creating racially segregated spaces. It's against the law. Atlanta parent filed complaint over alleged segregation of classrooms. This wasn't a white right-wing racist who created this. It was a progressive

white woman who created white only. I'm sorry. I'm sorry. I think this was actually a black principal in the school. They segregated all the black students under the guise of critical race theory saying that there's an idea that came from Derekrick Bell. Are you familiar with Derrick Bell? He believed that Plessy versus Ferguson was correct. That separate but equal was the right way to approach racial issues. I believe it was Derrick Bell. I don't have the book pulled up in front of me.

One of the arguments that I've heard, at least him be attached to, and I heard quite frequently with the Black Lives Matter protests, was that before desegregation, the black community had their own wealth, their own neighborhoods, and they had their own economy. Segregation took a weaker economy in the black community and forced it into the white economy, putting it underneath it, allowing white people to then oppress black industry and black business. That is the justification they use for bringing back segregation. The actual argument among the woke that Plessy v. Ferguson was right.

And I, me, I come from a second generation mixed race family who told me the stories of life before loving v. Virginia and the Civil Rights Act and the things they went through getting spit on. I'm sure you know better than even I do because I grew up after the fact and so when I started hearing the things that were coming out of the modern iteration of the left and critical race theory I said those are bad racist things we should oppose okay so now let's understand something

when you say that they say all white people are oppressors all white people are racist all black people are victims and they'll always be victims. No, I don't agree with that. That's not the way it is.

But that's the core definition of critical race theory. No, it's not the core definition of critical race theory. I've got to stop you. It's a critical theory. Critical theory was Marx's approach to class-based oppression. And he said, the rich oppress the poor. Kimberly Crenshaw in her opening chapter literally says, white people oppress black people. It is critical race theory. No, I disagree with that. I'd have to see that because I've seen Kimberly Crenshaw

interviewed. Okay. And she has been challenged with that by the other guy. What's his name? Kendi or somebody. Ibram X. Kendi. Yes. Okay. Well, they're both the same school. No. Two different schools. No. No, no, no, no. Okay. What you're saying leans more towards what Kendi has stated.

For my watching Crenshaw be interviewed, no, that is not the case. Okay. I don't have the computer here to bring it up but uh but i would say research that uh that that is not you know there are several different definitions of critical race theory and so you know there's no one universal definition of it i think what happened is that the romans uh had a slavocracy that spread into europe and then into like feudalism so they had still slaves as like their feudal people the the peasants and then they because their skin happened to be white or light then they had enslaved people from around

north african coast in the east so that their slaves happened to have different color skins and now because of that it's created a system where the the generations that follow those slaves had less education and less wealth and the slave owners, but it wasn't because of the skin color. It just happened to be the Roman Empire happened to be the dominating empire. I don't think... Well, you know, the Roman Empire evolved out of Africa.

Okay, Italians come from Africa. The Moors. The Moors, exactly, precisely. And southern Italy, those Italians are dark. Yeah, the Sicilians particularly. Exactly, precisely. And I think that the racial component's been

misappropriated to this class issue that we have of the descendants of slaves, like 6th, 7th generation slave children of like, you know, the great-great-great-grandfather was a slave, didn't have any education, so there's no familial wealth or there's less familial wealth. My great-great-grandfather was a slave.

I'm a descendant of slaves. Now, we were promised at the end of slavery what? 40 acres and a mule. Find me one person who got that. Japanese Americans

who were in internment camps or their descendants have received reparations. Native Americans, if you have one-sixteenth Native American blood, you can get government money. I got Cherokee in me, but I've never gone to get any money from it. So we've made the apologies to Native Americans. We've made the apologies to Japanese Americans. This country has never, never apologized for slavery. The person who came the closest to apologizing but never apologized was President Bill Clinton. What he said was slavery was wrong.

Those are his words. Now saying something is wrong and saying we're sorry for doing it are two different things. How many people died liberating the Japanese from the internment camps? I don't know the numbers. I think it's zero. They just opened the camps after the war, didn't they? I don't know the history of that. So I think this country overtly did wrong by putting people in these camps and then realized they did wrong.

But I think – They also did wrong by putting people in shackles and selling them on the courthouse steps as property. Absolutely. I suppose that the main difference though – I actually agree with you. I think – I actually think there should be some form of reparations. But I don't know if it's ever been – I don't know if the politicians will ever actually do anything meaningful in terms of this. And what's that called? Lying? No, it's ever been. I don't know if the politicians will ever actually do anything meaningful in terms of this. And what's

that called? Lying? No, it's called racism. That they won't do anything meaningful? Yeah. But I mean, you have black political leaders who also won't do anything meaningful. You got black people who are worthless just like you got white people who are worthless. Nobody has a monopoly on racism or being worthless.

I don't think it's a prejudice against race is the reason why they're not doing it. I think it's because they want to hold that over as an issue to gain power in politics. Have you listened to Coleman's arguments on reparations? Coleman Hughes. I don't think the fact that it hasn't happened yet

necessarily means racism. It's more so extremely complicated because where do you draw the line? What percentage of black do you have to be like it's very complicated i just have to say no it's not complicated at all listen what you know does racism exist yes or no yeah i think that people are afraid of what they're not familiar with sometimes but but does racism exist well there's yes we're the same race we're the human species like i understand there's no... We're the same race. We're the human species. I understand. There's only one race, but you know what I'm asking. Small R, yeah. Does racism exist in this country? Are there people

of different colors who are discriminated against? This country owned people as property. People like me were considered three-fifths of a human being. We were bought and sold on the courthouse steps. Families ripped apart, just like when you got your first pet. Somebody's cat or dog had a litter, and your parents took you over and said, pick out one, and you took that kitten or that puppy from its mother. That's what happened to human beings in this country.

We were taken from our families. We were raped in front of our children, in front of mothers' husbands, and things like that. You know, about nine out of every ten black people in this country have some white blood in them. Some of it

consensual, some of it non-consensual. Let me tell you this. Thomas Jefferson, you all know he had a slave mistress, right? Yeah. Named Sally Hemings. But I bet you didn't know this, and if you doubt me, check it out. What was Thomas' wife's name? Was it Martha or Mary?

I forgot now. I think it was Martha, wasn't it? Martha Jones? No, no, no. Martha Jefferson? Jefferson. I remember Washington's wife. She's Martha for sure. Okay, so it's Mary. It was called Mary. They're both Martha. They're, no, no. Martha Jefferson? Jefferson. I remember Washington's wife. She's Martha for sure.

Okay, so they're both Martha. They're both Martha? Okay. Like Bruce Wayne in Superman. Their moms. Bruce Wayne in Superman? Both their moms are Martha. Okay.

Martha Kent and Martha Wayne. Okay, so Sally Hemings, who was President Thomas Jefferson's slave mistress. Did you know that she was a half-sister to Thomas Jefferson's wife, Martha Jefferson? Uh-huh. You need to check that out. That's not in your history book, but you can find it because Thomas Jefferson's father-in-law, Martha's father, he had slaves too, right?

And he had an affair with Sally Hemings' mother, which produced Sally Hemings. Martha's father. He had slaves too, right? And he had an affair with Sally Hemings' mother, which produced Sally Hemings. If you look at a picture of Martha Jefferson and a picture of Sally Hemings, they look very similar. One darker, one lighter.

How much is one human life worth? You can't put a value on it. 828,000 casualties from the Union soldiers fighting to end slavery. 828,000 people died. Endless amounts of wealth destroyed. Homes ransacked, burned, completely destroyed. The country almost collapsed trying to end this. So while I still believe that there's an issue of reparations in terms of we cannot have –

I've mentioned systemic racism on this show and people don't agree. But I think it's because people misunderstand what the idea actually is behind it. So we'll get to that in a second. I think there needs to be – I lean liberal on all these positions. There needs to be some way to strengthen the weakest link in this country, those who are historically impoverished or generationally impoverished. I think after we did away with a lot of the laws that were bad, I think after we had constitutional amendments and then ultimately new laws that codified you cannot do these things, we now need class-based solutions

which should disproportionately help those who are disproportionately affected. Okay. So in the 1940s and 1950s, a lot of black people in this country moved to France. Now, people over in France are a lot whiter than white people in this country. All right? The French people treated these black people as equals. That's why we moved there. Eartha Kitt was one of them who played Catwoman on Batman. She's the one who had the cat growl. Right.

James Earl, not James Earl Jones, Paul Robeson, Memphis Slim, Josephine Baker. A lot of these people moved to France because they were being treated as equals. So when people say all white people are oppressors, no, that's not true. That's because people have been exposed to only a small group of white people, and those are the people here in this country. People in France did not oppress black people they didn't own slaves this country owned slaves

look you guys are too young to remember there is only one holiday in this country one holiday in this country that is named after an American man. One holiday in this country that's named after an American man.

And guess what? That man is black. And people had a fit over that. It took decades to get Martin Luther King Day. People did not want to put it up there because he's a black man. There used to be two white guys who had a holiday each to himself. One, we used to have George Washington Day, and we had Abraham Lincoln Day. And then it was decided that we had too many holidays.

So they combined Washington Day and Lincoln Day into one day called President's Day. All right. But I remember when I went to school, we got off for Washington Day and we got off for Lincoln Day. All right. Now, but we had to fight, fight, fight to get Martin Luther King Day. Yet we celebrate. We celebrate. There is another guy who has a holiday all to himself.

All right. He's not an American. He didn't discover a damn thing he was a murderer a pillager and a rapist and his name christopher columbus okay martin luther king never raped anybody never pillaged any place and never and and he he gave his life bringing people together but yet we had no problem celebrating Christopher Columbus, who didn't discover America. As Tim said, how do you discover something people are already here when you arrive? Yeah, his brothers were the real psychos, too.

Columbus let his brothers ransack. I think it was, were they in Haiti? Is that where they set up shop? It was in the Bahamas somewhere. And he just let his two brothers drag women down the street by their hair as they would beat them and rape them and stuff. Hey, I want to confirm a couple things you mentioned earlier. From Newsweek, there's

an article from, this is like September 21, Martin Luther King Jr. and Rosa Parks books among those banned in Pennsylvania school district. I didn't read into this article and I don't know why they were banned, but that's an article from Newsweek. I'll tell you, here's the challenge. Very quick, the other thing is Sally Hemings is apparently the half-sister of Jefferson's wife,

Martha Wales Jefferson. That's from Monticello.org. One of the challenges with any cursory story about banning books is that we recently had a book banned in a bunch of schools called Gender Queer. The Washington Post and the New York Times wrote that it's just a story about growing up queer and a story that kids need. But the book actually also displays graphic images of sex between what is probably minors, and Amazon rates it as being 18 up. When you hear the story, just in passing or on the surface, if you actually read the New York Times and the Washington Post, they won't tell you why the book was actually banned. They'll simply say anti-trans or anti-queer bigots banned the book because they're banning books. You then actually open the book and say,

whoa, they wanted middle schoolers to see blowjobs? Yeah, I don't know about that, but that's actually in the book. I can't show you the book on YouTube because we'd get banned if we showed it. So Tim, can you confirm that there's kind of a split within critical race theory between these two different camps that Daryl's talking about? Well, I call it a Martin Bailey, right? So when you actually in that, what is it? The I was confused the two, one of them. Are you familiar with the Martin Bailey argument?

No, they'll say something like, we're just trying to teach the true history of racism in America. And then you go, oh, OK, well, then what is this? Or I'm sorry, the way it works is they'll say something like all white people are racist. All white people are oppressors because whiteness is property. Kimberly Crenshaw actually said that. It's in her original book. Whiteness as property grants people specific access to things other people can't.

Therefore, white people oppress all other people of color. You then say, hey, whoa, wait a minute. You can't call all people racist. You can't show a picture of a devil who's white with a whiteness contract. And then they go, we're just trying to explain the true history of this country. It's a Martin Bailey argument. You start with this very aggressive approach. And then when someone actually investigates and call you out, you retreat, saying, no, no, no, no, no no no no it's just about the true history of this country so for someone like me the true history of this country

is this country was built on racism okay it was it was be I mean the world itself is still just racist but the United States no no no no no no no no no the world itself is not racist this country is racist.

There is discrimination in the world. For example, in Northern Ireland, like here in our country, if you're Catholic and I'm Protestant, there's no big deal. Who cares? In Northern Ireland, it's conflict. That's not racism. That's tribalism. No, it's religion. It's tribalism. Okay. That's tribalism. Okay. And no, it's religion. Okay. And it's tribalism.

So, uh, if you, so having, I'm not going to try to be an expert on the Irish Republicans and the Protestants and Catholics and the orange order or anything, but at least having been there and, and, and covered this, both sides of this, it's not about Protestant or Catholic. That may be, that may be what it's described as, but you notice really weird things. One side's pro Palestine. One side's pro Israel. One side believes weird things. One side's pro-Palestine. One side's pro-Israel. One side believes in socialism.

One side believes in capitalism. One side is pro-militaristic imperialism. One side is anti-intervention. What happens is two different factions hate each other and they adopt whatever the other side opposes. And so tribalism emerges where I asked on the piece. Isn't that what we're experiencing right here, right now with Republicans and Democrats?

Right. That's why it's- Is that tribalism? Yes, absolutely. That's why- By your definition, okay. So when they say Candace Owens is a white supremacist, something is wrong, right?

They said I was a white supremacist. Something's wrong. I don't always agree with Candace Owens though. Right. So the issue is for me, I don't think race is the principal component of the defied right now. I'm not saying racism doesn't exist. I'm saying in a separate issue, we have a problem of tribalism in this country.

And I think just not to derail you, because I was mentioning when you mentioned Northern Ireland as being religious, it's tribal. It started as a religious conflict that became more tribalized over time. That's the same with politics in the United States. Let's go from Northern Ireland to Lebanon. There is Christians and Muslims. In Israel, it's Jews and Palestinians. So these are religious discriminations. You wouldn't call it racism.

In this country, it's racism. People were bought and sold. People were owned. This country was built on a two-tier society. White supremacy at the top and slavery at the bottom. That's what built this country. And as we progressed over the decades, we progressed like this. Maybe like this, but never like this.

Is it fair to say the Native Americans were on the bottom? Yeah, absolutely. I mean, they were basically exterminated. Yeah, absolutely. They were on the bottom. Absolutely. Not, I'm not, I don't know ifated. Yeah, absolutely, they were on the bottom. Absolutely. I'm not sure. I don't know if we should make it a...

From trailer tears and et cetera. I don't know if we should make it a hierarchy of... You know, and to this day, we still discriminate against Native Americans. You know, there are a lot of phrases that you don't even realize that are pejorative or derogatory. Like, you know, you say,

you know, man, that guy went off the reservation. Yeah. Where do you think that comes from? Right. Or it's none of your cotton-picking business. Where do you think that comes from? Well, that one we all know. Okay.

That was like foghorn leghorn, man. Or he comes from the wrong side of the tracks. So, Daryl, you're president. My president. How do you deal with this? Who's my president? No, I'm saying theoretically, if you were president. Oh, if I was president.

If you were president, how are you handling this? I'm having more talk, more discussion. The same way I'm handling it right now. I bring opposing forces together. What about specifically in terms of reparations? What would you like to see? What I would like to see, A, is an apology. Okay. you like to see? What I would like to see, A, is an apology, okay? And B, reparations in terms perhaps of education, tuitions. Not necessarily be handing out people money necessarily,

but provide people the means to get a great education, all right? Because that way you can uplift, can help uplift yourself. Let's go back to the abortion thing. What do you think about the history of Planned Parenthood? Are you familiar with it? The history of it? No, I'm not familiar with the history of it. Margaret Sanger was... I know the name, but I'm not familiar with all the... She was a eugenicist.

And one of her... We can't say the name of the project she created because it uses an iteration of the N-word which would get us in trouble on YouTube. But her idea was to go around to the black community and start propagating birth control practices to stop black people from having kids. Let me tell you something. My mother was a victim of that. Okay?

There was a big scandal back in the 50s where doctors were systematically giving women hysterectomies in order to cut down the black population. That's right. And my mother was a victim of that. And you don't find that out until 20, 40 years later, just like the Tuskegee experiment, just like Agent Orange. The government doing all these kinds of things, and you don't find out about it until much later. Yeah, or like Pfizer data dumps and stuff like that. They wanted to wait 75 years to give that information out. But I digress. I'm into repairing the system to reparation, whatever you want called repairing it. And I

agree. I don't think throwing money at people is the way to repair the communication. I mean, obviously communication is real. Do you think school choice is legit or you follow that at all? School choice? Yeah. It's instead of like people sending their kids to a public school every year that costs a certain amount of money. Instead, you get a voucher for that amount of money that you can spend at any school of your choice or homeschooling if you set up a homeschooling curriculum. Does that appeal to you at all? I'd have to look at that some more. Also, it was very vague, and I don't know if I described it exactly right, but it's the idea that instead of having to adhere to a public school system or private, that you would get to choose where you send your kid, and you'll have credits along with that. Because I think education and communication is the key to moving forward.

Absolutely. I do 100%. I'm 100% pro-education. It would have to be schools that are you know, that are top notch. You know, you would have the right to go to those schools. I mean, there was a time where I couldn't go to Harvard or I couldn't go to Princeton because of the color of my skin. That's why we have what we call HBCUs, right? Historically black colleges and universities.

That's why the United Negro College Fund was founded and things like that. And by the way, I went to an HBCU. I went to Howard University, which was founded by General George Howard, who was a white guy. Is that going to do it? So I'm trying to pull up the specific story. Google's not too... Let me see if I can do this. I did have another thing pulled up I want to ask you about.

Sure. I hope that YouTube can start to understand context of language. Well, I mean, we'll see. If the algorithm detects the word that Daryl just said and demonetizes the video, that is just so unacceptable. No, it's okay. It's okay. Use the N-word. N-word. Which – No, I didn't. N-word. Oh.

Let me ask you. We have a story from Independent. Harvard University will hold first ever black-only graduation ceremony. This is from May 2017. Do you agree with institutions creating racially segregated – No. So I agree with that. And this is not coming from the right.

This is coming from – Like I said, nobody has a monopoly on stupidity. I wanted to ask you about the abortion thing because it's big in the news, and this is a really fascinating one because one of the things we hear from a lot of people on the pro-life side is that the foundation of Planned Parenthood was eugenicists who wanted to depopulate the black population community in this country. I just pulled up the 1990 to 2006, it's a census government abortion demographic. And the interesting thing is that in 2006, for every 1,000 women, there were 14 abortions. But for every 1,000 black women, there were 50 abortions. So I look at this and I think- So is that tribalism or is that racism? I think it's racism.

Both probably. Absolutely. Racist tribals. I think when you look at the locations of Planned Parenthood facilities, they tend to be in black and Latino areas, not lower income areas. Just like when you look at all the advertisements and billboards for cigarette smoking and alcohol, usually in impoverished black areas. Yep. So I'm curious as to what your thoughts on this would be. Why is it that in 2006, for every 1,000 black women, there's 50 abortions,

but for every 1,000 white women, there's 14 abortions? How do you think something like that happens? Racism. Racism. Sure. But like, is it, are there racists who are advocating for, you know, are these pro-choice racists who are trying to trick black people? Or how is it racist? They're trying to cut, okay, let me tell you what's happening here. When you were a kid, even though you're a lot younger than I am, and when I was a kid, even when your parents were kids and your grandparents were kids, the black population in this country was 12%.

Native Americans, 1%. Hispanic people, around 2%. Asian people, around 3%. Asian people, around 3%. Whites, 86-87%. Alright? The U.S. Census is taken every decade, every 10 years. You can Google uscensus.gov and see the trends. Alright?

Today, black people remain just over 12%, like 12.9, 13%. All right. Native Americans remain at 1%. Asians have pretty much doubled. They're like at 5.9, almost 6%. Latino, Hispanic people have more than quadrupled, 17-something percent. If you take just black people, 12%, Hispanic people, 17%, that right there is 29% non-white. That's almost a third, right?

This is happening, all right? Today, the last census was last year. I'm sorry, two years ago, 2020, all right? White people in this country right now are 59 percent. All right. In the year 2042, which is two decades from now, this will happen for the first time in our country. This country will be 50 percent white, 50 percent non-white. All right. For the first time between 2045 and 2050, it's going to flip and whites will become the minority in this country. Whites are already the minority globally, but in this country, they are the majority. You guys may know the term white flight. Yep. Okay.

White flight barely exists in our country anymore because the color of America's landscape has changed so much that anywhere you go, there's already somebody there who doesn't look like you. And so people are, people, there's a large swath of the American, of the white American population that doesn't care about this happening. Hey, it's evolution. I don't care. No big deal. I don't have a problem with that. But there's also a large swath that does care about that. They feel they're getting squished out. You know, you know, we built this country. We wrote the Constitution, you know, and now, you know, our our identity is being squashed out with race mixing and people moving us out and so forth and so on. So they are fearing this happening. And this is a problem for them.

And this is why, you know, we're seeing a lot of these things that you're talking about, voting rights changing, and people – I'm sorry, go ahead. Just what voting rights in particular? Where they're trying to rewrite the voting rights bill, and what's going to be next, the civil rights bill, right? Well, I just ask because they're doing it everywhere, and it's the left and the right. So I'm not sure the context. Right.

So in in a bunch of the blue areas, they've they've changed the voting laws dramatically. Pennsylvania, there was a lawsuit where they ruled the Republicans and Democrats made an agreement on voting changes that was ruled unconstitutional recently. So we're seeing when you when you have sat on the throne of power for 400 years as white supremacy has sat there, it's hard to get off that throne. Okay? Say, as, you know, some of us are musicians here, right? So if you have a number one hit, number one on the charts, you don't want to see yourself fall down to number two and number three and number four and then fall off the top 100. You want to stay at the top. So when you sat on the throne of power for 400 years,

and I came here 400 years ago in 1619, all right? And, you know, you've got our last president sat on the throne of power for only four years, and he thinks he's still there. It's hard to give up power. But you're operating under the pretext that a lot of what we're seeing in modern politics from Republicans is due to them not wanting to lose white power? Yes. But where does that idea come from?

Now, I'm not saying just Republicans. There are racist Republicans, and there are plenty of racist Democrats. Do you agree with Harvard's affirmative action plans? What are they? I believe in affirmative education. I don't believe in lowering standards and having quotas to get people up there and lower the standard. No, I don't believe in that at all. But I do believe in affirmative education, giving everybody an equal opportunity to get educated. So Harvard, if you're Asian, you have to score, I think, 1,300.

And if you're black or Hispanic, you have to score lower, like 800 or 900 on your SATs or something like that. So they make it more difficult for Asians, and they make it easier for black and Latinos. I think that's wrong. I think they should do that. I just said that, yeah. Don't lower the bar.

Always keep the bar up. This is the issue I'm fighting when I say things like critical race theory should not be allowed in curriculum. But now let's talk about what you just said, okay? So I've sat there with neo-Nazis and KKK people, et cetera, and I say, how can you hate me?

You don't even know me. And sitting two feet in front of me. Well, Mr. Davis, you have to understand one thing. You know, black people are prone to crime. And this is evidenced by the fact that there are more black people in prison than white people. What he's saying is 100% true. The data shows that. The statistics show there are more black people in prison than white people so what he is saying is 100 right but so that justifies

his thinking you know we need to keep black people down because they will the crime will grow but because it enforces what he already believes as a KKK person or a neo-Nazi or whatever, a white supremacist, if you just want to use a general umbrella, he is satisfied with that statistic or that data. He doesn't bother to look behind the data and find out why. And why is it? Why is it? Because black people tend to get imprisoned for longer sentences than white people committing the same crime. When you find a state like, let's just say the state of Maryland, a few years ago, well, more than 10 years ago, Governor Paris Glenn Denning of the state of Maryland put a moratorium on the death penalty, as have a lot of states. Why? Because black people were being legally

executed for their crimes where white people went to prison for life or life with parole. Okay. So what he wanted to do was, you know, we want to put a 10-year moratorium on the death penalty to study why this is happening. What the hell do you need to study? You know why it's happening. It's called racism. White people have been studying black people for 400 years. If you haven't learned anything in 400 years, you're not going to learn anything in 10 years. I think class plays a big role in why we see the crime rates the way they are. I think people who are in poverty, you tend to see higher crime in lower income areas. It's not absolute. It's not the only reason. But the issue with black people in prison, typically what you'll hear from the right is, I shouldn't say the right,

typically you'll hear from white identitarians is that they commit a disproportionate amount of crimes relative to other races. We hear that all the time, but why? They don't have the opportunities. They're not being given the opportunities. Why? Because of racism. But that would be by class. No, no, no. It's by the fact. It's by color. It's by color.

I know. It's both. It may be class, but as a black man, I have experienced things that you guys will never experience. Okay? I get pulled over that you guys will never experience. Okay? You know, I get pulled over ten times more than you do. Do you? I do. Yes, I do.

How do you know how many times I've been pulled over? I don't know. But by looking at you, I can tell you I have. I have. Okay? I reject that outright. Let's go and compare those times.

Plus, I've lived longer than you have. And you were around, to be fair, considering you were around in pre-civil rights era. I've been pulled over just for having a white woman in my car for no other reason. I've been pulled over and had cops plant drugs in my car. I've been pulled over completely illegally, like for no reason at all, and then had my license suspended. How many times? So I've been pulled over illegally in my life probably four or five times. That's a drop of pepper in a salt shaker.

How many times have you been pulled over? You can't even count the number. Like more than 50? Yeah, absolutely, absolutely. And still today. You are almost twice as old as I am. You've lived through eras of pre-civil rights and all that stuff. So I can't speak to that.

But I've been pulled over. And I'm not trying to say that I do. What I'm trying to say is I don't respect you telling me you know outright Without actually listening to me or knowing anything about my family Or my life or what we went through That you know outright I didn't experience These things No no I didn't say you didn't experience these things No I said I've been pulled over more times

Than you have is what I said And I stand behind that You are older than me though Doesn't matter I'm also a lot darker than you are Yeah absolutely Listen than me though doesn't matter i mean it doesn't matter i'm also a lot darker than you are yeah oh yeah absolutely okay and i and i had okay listen i i uh i i lived in in a place called potomac maryland okay which tradition is an all white or predominantly white uh area it's mixed now all right my family was the second black family to move into our neighborhood.

My father was a senior foreign service officer. My father was Richard Nixon's interpreter when he was vice president of the United States. When he went to Russia, he was vice president to Dwight Eisenhower. He went to Russia to have what's called the kitchen debate with Nikita Khrushchev, the famous kitchen debate. My father was Nixon's interpreter. My father was one of the first black Americans to speak Russian, all right, fluently. My father spoke nine languages fluently, all right? My father was one of the first black Secret Service agents in this country, all right? And the Secret Service would only let him go but so high. He did such a good job interpreting Russian for Nixon.

Nixon came back and told Eisenhower about him. And Nixon and Eisenhower called my dad into the White House. And Eisenhower told my dad, you have gone as far as you can go in the Secret Service. You should take the Foreign Service exam. You can go higher there. So my dad took the Foreign service exam and became a foreign service officer but there was still a ceiling for black people in the foreign service but but let me let me just finish okay so in potomac maryland my dad had a mercedes second black family in the area

my dad was getting pulled over in our own neighborhood i was was a teenager. When was it? We were there in 1971 through I still own the house there, but I have another house where I live. 1971, he died in 2018. So between that

more black people started moving in probably in the mid to late 80s. Alright. The cops thought my father walked into the neighborhood and drove out. So when I turned 16, I got what all black parents give their young boys. It's called the talk. Have you heard of the talk? I had the talk, too.

Okay, you had the talk, too. Yeah, tell me about it. Okay, the talk is what black parents give their young boys especially when they start driving. When you get pulled over by the police, even if the cop is wrong, do not argue with them. Just take the ticket, sign it, we'll go to court, we'll settle it in court because you can get shot. But see, this is the issue I have with, I think what you're saying is racist. The idea that black people exclusively do that or it's predominant among black people when that's actually a normal thing most people do. No.

So perhaps it's a class issue because all of my friends and myself had the exact same talk in the exact same way. I was told no matter what happens, when you're pulled over, you turn the light on, you turn the car off, keys and wallet on the dashboard, hands on the steering wheel, you roll down the window, and you don't move. You answer the officer's questions. You do not argue with him. Do you understand? Yes. Say it back to me. I'm sorry, Tim, but you are 100% wrong.

So it's just – No. I think it's fair to say that you're older than I am. We agree on the racism of the past, and I absolutely agree. Well, we can agree on the racism of the past, but we can also talk about the racism of today. And I agree a lot on it. What I don't agree with is that this, you know, it's strange to me to hear the idea of the talk. Perhaps white suburban upper class wasps don't do that.

But growing up in the south side of chicago in mixed race areas in gang territory i'm from chicago anyway and you're from midway i'm from chicago 500 east 33rd right on the south side right yeah midway so i'm on uh 47th 49th in laramie so i'm two blocks away from the leclerc courts i had to talk to my friends all had the talk everyone had the talk the talk existed among all had the talk. Everyone had the talk. The talk existed among white kids, Polish kids, Mexican kids, Asian kids, and black kids. I think the nuance is you have the talk for the inner city kid. Every inner city kid is going to get that talk.

But you're saying in the suburbs, black kids get the talk. He's from the south side of Chicago, same as me. Yeah, but I'm here. Different part of the south side. Yeah. But also here in Potomac, Maryland. Lily White, Potomac, Maryland. Okay?

Now, sure enough, when I started driving, when I turned 16, I was getting pulled over in my own neighborhood. All right? I dated a woman in Luray, Virginia. Luray, Virginia is like, are you all familiar with Mayberry? No. No. Okay.

There was a TV show called the Andy Griffin Show. Andy Griffin, yeah. Okay. And Mayberry was just a little white town. Everybody knew everybody. Real small town. No black people on the show. And just super nice town.

That is Luray, Virginia. You hear the Luray Caverns, etc. So I began dating a white woman down there. And within two weeks, the Luray City Police, who did not know me from Adam, everybody knows everybody down there, went to her house and told her that I was a drug dealer. And she said, why? Why would you say that? No, he's not.

Because he drives a black Lincoln Town car with dark windows. That was their excuse. Okay? But let me get back to my conversation with the Klan leader. So he told me I'm a criminal. He didn't bother to look into the background

as to why these black people are in prison, more so than white people. Then he goes on to tell me into the background as to why these black people are in prison more so than white people then he goes on to tell me that um that that black people are inherently lazy we don't want to work we want to scam the government welfare system we always have our hands out for a freebie all right so now i'm sitting here i've been called a criminal i'm now i being told that I'm lazy. And then he tells me, and I've heard this many times thereafter from other Klan people, that black people are born with a smaller brain than white people. And the larger the brain, the more capacity for intelligence.

The smaller the brain, the lower the IQ. And he says that this is evidenced by the fact that year after year after year, black high school students score lower than white high school students on the SATs. Again, he is 100% correct. Black kids do score a lot lower than white kids on the SATs. All right. Now, the data shows that. So it enforces what he already believes about black inferiority so he doesn't bother to look any further but why is that well where do most black kids go to school in this country in the inner city where do most white kids go to school in this country in the suburbs it is a fact inner city schools are not

as good as suburban schools all right there's not the opportunities there's not the textbooks the quality of teachers etc i can guarantee you black kids who go to school in the suburbs can score just as high if not higher than some white kids and white kids who go to school in the inner city can score just as low as some black kids, if not lower than others. It has nothing to do with the color of the student's skin or the size of his brain, but has everything to do with the educational system in which that child is enrolled. I would also say I'm pretty sure the brain thing is just not true. Of course it's not true. But one of the things I find interesting is that the inner cities are all Democrat run and typically have been for generations.

Chicago, for instance, I think for 80 years now or 100 years has been run strictly by Democrats who keep promising to solve these problems and never do. So for me, I was just like, these people are just lying about everything. And typically what they do just makes things worse. And then you look at the suburbs and they have a tendency to lean Republican, or at least they were for a while until Trump came along, to be honest. And so I wonder why it is that the political party that keeps claiming, well, to be honest, not a hundred years ago, but in the past 50 years, these are the 60 years, this is the parties claiming to fight for the black community, but continually just things just get worse. New York's a great example. Yeah. New York is Democrat, Democrat, Democrat. Sometimes there's a mayor who's Republican or independent, but it is overwhelmingly the biggest Democrat stronghold in the country.

And it's where you see – It's also the biggest city. Biggest city. Big city, for sure. But it's where you get stop and frisk. It's where you get the complete disproportionate cops will give a ticket to a black guy drinking a 40, but they'll not to a white person drinking wine. I mean these are liberal areas, not conservative. Cops will give a ticket to a black guy drinking a 40, but they'll not to a white person drinking wine. I mean, these are liberal areas.

Well, you know why there's a higher penalty for crack cocaine than regular cocaine, right? Was it more addictive? No, because more black people use crack cocaine because it's cheaper. I wanted to ask you. More poor people use crack cocaine. In the past 18 years, have you ever been illegally pulled over with drugs planted in your car by the police? No. Illegally pulled over, yes. Drugs planted, no. So why is it that I've had that happen to me and you didn't? Luck.

Just, I mean, in the past 18 years. I thought I was going to have some plan at one time. My band and I were coming home from a gig and we got pulled over and the cops figured, you know, they had to be drugs and drugs in the van because I have dark windows, you know, so people can't see it and see the drum sets and the amplifiers and whatever else is in there. Right. So he starts making us pull out all the amplifiers. And he's like looking in the back of the amps, looking in the drum kit, in the drum cases. He was, he was not satisfied that there were no drugs there.

He made us wait 30 minutes while he called the canine a patrol. Canine had to come and we all had to get out of the van, sit on the damn side of the road while the dog runs through the van sniffing for drugs. So, so, and he still didn't find any. All right. The dog didn't find any. And so I figured, okay, this guy's not going to give up. He's probably going to plant something in there. He didn't fortunately. And then, and then he says, okay, you're free to go. And I said, well, why did you, why'd you go through all this? And he says, oh, we're training the dog. That's bullshit. When I was in, in 2012, I was in Chicago with

a group of friends, and we had been covering one of the protests there. At the end of the night, I think we had gotten some, like, Maxwell Street, because, you know, if you're from Chicago... It's gone now. It's gone? Maxwell Street is gone, yes. Oh, wow. Well, anyway, we got surrounded by about

12 vehicles, some unmarked. They pulled us out of the car at gunpoint and did basically what you described. They pulled us all out. They wrote down our credit card numbers, our IDs, our passports. They started banging on everything, trying to pop things in the car open. And then after about 10 minutes, another cop shows up, and he points to me. And we're all in cuffs. And he makes a motion.

The guy uncuffs me, and he says, oh, you – sorry, you matched the description description you're no problem i got that all the time so they also had raided the apartment we were staying at and then they also uh tried to get someone through what we believe was a criminal informant to plant drugs in our car but i wouldn't let them they kept trying to get adderall from the basement and bring it in the car and i told them if you go anywhere near the department the cops went in the apartment this guy was like i'm gonna go inside I told him, if you go anywhere near the department, the cops went in the apartment. This guy was like, I'm going to go inside real quick. I said, if you go in there, we're leaving. You're not coming with us. And he's like, but I need a ride. I'm like, if you go in there and you bring anything, you are not coming with us. We found out later through a series of text messages, a person that was dating one of the cops after

getting criminally charged with something surprise, surprise was telling him to put Adderall in our car. We were then told that on the scanner, they were describing our vehicle and looking for us. Uh, so in the, in the past 18 years, uh, I, you know, I don't, I don't really drive all that much anymore. Usually other people are driving. I tend to tend not to drive. Other people drive. Uh, so I would say from like 18 to 25, when I was mostly driving, I had been pulled over illegally, maybe five times. What I mean by illegally is I've been pulled over way more than that had been pulled over illegally maybe five times what i mean by illegally is i've been pulled over way more than that but pulled over illegally is when there's no justification for it and the cops would make something up uh that was uh you were swerving that was that was when they planted drugs on me so i the only reason i didn't go to jail when they

planted drugs in my car was because first what they did was they pulled me over illegally and said, the guy says I was swerving, but then goes, oh, whoa, oh, you're smoking pot, which I wasn't because I don't smoke. I don't have tattoos and I barely drink. I mostly don't drink. And so they out of the car, I say, okay, because, you know, I had the talk, hands on the steering wheel. I get out of the car.

I keep my hands up. He immediately cuffs me, calls his partner. His partner shows up. First thing he does is go to my car and plants a nug of weed, takes it out within a few seconds and walks up to me holding it in his hand and says, what is that? And I said, I don't know. And he says, it's marijuana. And I said, is it yours?

And he says, it was in your car. I said, no, it wasn't. And he said, confess that this was yours and this will all go easier on you. And I said, that's not mine. And he said, confess that it was yours or it's going to be worse. And I said, that's not mine. And then he makes a look. He walks back to my car.

The other cops are asking me a bunch of questions. I very much am just not saying anything. I was about 19 at the time. The cop walks back out. Surprise, surprise. He popped up in the glove box. What did he find? A firefighter emblem.

My dad was a firefighter. He said, who's a firefighter kid i said my dad the cop takes the cuffs off go home and they get in their car and they left the only reason they didn't decide to charge me with possession illegally by planting drugs in my car was because they found out that my dad was a firefighter and there's like oh can't do that i wonder why it is i experienced that i wonder why it is they experienced the cops pull me over at gunpoint i wonder why it is that I was driving 10 miles under the limit on Lakeshore Drive in Chicago when I was exiting at Belmont Avenue, which is a 45 mile an hour speed limit. And I get pulled over abruptly as I'm exiting. And the cop says, you were going 20 over. And I said, officer, I'm exiting. And he goes, tell it to a judge. And they suspended my license for that.

I wonder why it is that I was driving to O'Hare airport and I had a cop nearly rear-end me. And so when I turned, when I put on my signal to move over the right lane, he immediately flips the lights on and said, you started speeding the moment I came up on you. And I said, you nearly rear-ended me. And he says, tell it to a judge. And so I ended up losing my license for years. Why did that happen to me? Was it because my family was poor and we couldn't afford lawyers? Was it because my car was a piece of crap 1989 Mazda 323 with rust all over it? Was it because they saw me as a poor person? Was it because they were racist and they saw me and just happened to know what my race may have been? I honestly have no idea. I don't know why those things happen. I don't doubt anything that you said. I've heard those stories before. Some of them have happened to me. I've not been yanked out of my car at gunpoint. I've seen guns before,

okay, pointed at me, but not like that. Okay, I've not had anything planted in my car. But I've seen all those things happen. And I still to this day get pulled over a lot. Look up. Okay, speaking of Chicago, you probably never heard of this guy. But look him up. John J.O.N. Oh, yeah. You know him? Oh, yeah. We know him. John Birch.

I'm not saying racism isn't a real thing or that racism wasn't affecting you. I'm just saying what ignites me in this regard is when I'm told by someone that I've had it worse than you because of my race. And it's like it may be that you've had it worse than me, but I don't know. I'm not saying those things don't happen to you. Well, sure, but I don't know. But listen, this country is not only racist, but it's also based on a caste system.

Okay? Where lighter skinned black people get better jobs. All right? The darker skin you are, the worse off you are. All right? The darker skinned you are, the worse off you are. All right? I'm darker than you are. That's a fact.

We can't even argue that. Okay? You look at, for example, you watch the soap operas from the 80s and 70s or 90s, whatever. All right? Basically, they all were white. It was always a big deal when one of the soap opera people on General Hospital or whatever was going to have a date with a black girl or some

white woman was going to have a date with a black man or whatever. That black actor was always light-skinned. To this day, the only black actress who has received an Oscar for a leading role, leading role, okay, is Halle Berry. Halle Berry is a very pretty girl. She's a very light-skinned black

woman, all right? She is not the actress as, say, a Cicely Tyson was or any number of other actresses. All right. There is a caste system going on. I agree with the caste system in a different way. I can't speak to the skin color, like the lighter skin. I wouldn't know. Well, you know, I mean, even during times of slavery, it was the lighter-skinned blacks who got the jobs in the house. I can say in Brazil, it's overt.

Yes, it is. I've been to Brazil. Rio, De Janeiro, Sao Paulo, Recife, Bahia, and Brasilia. They straight up tell you that's how it works. Yes, absolutely. And India, too. There's a story, a friend of mine who is a – he's like half native, half European descendant Portuguese. And he was saying that he once saw two black men fighting each other over who was blacker as like an insult to each other because that's the culture they have.

What I will say about the caste system, for me, I think a lot of this has to do, I think class is the bigger issue. Maybe, maybe it's because there's a generational divide and your experiences came from, you know, very much more racist eras. And mine is coming from an era when a lot of these laws are being sort of being taken away and stuff or for whatever reason. But, uh, I know people who are rich because they're rich. I know people who sell garbage to other rich people for hundreds of thousands of dollars. A piece of jewelry sold between rich people is a net profit of 50 grand for one person. It's tax evasion, my friend. Well, it's something. I wonder why it is. I'm like, how do I know people who do so little of anything and they party in Switzerland and they party in the Mediterranean on these yachts and these boats. And they'll be like, well, you know, work is hard.

I sell jewelry. I make about $500,000 a year. And I'm like, why are there jewelers in New York making $50,000 a year? Just by virtue of being in the higher class, they have access to people with cash and they make bigger deals, which nets them bigger percentages. So I certainly think there is a class system in the United States, but I think the U.S. allows you to navigate it. I think like many other countries don't, the U.S. affords the opportunity to figure out how to work within the system to manipulate and build your way up to get out of these situations. Okay. You know, back in the day, back in the day, when black people were first, you know, going to vote and all that kind of stuff, most black people were Republicans. Did

you know that? I mean, the first black congressman was Republican, I think, right? You know why? Why is that? Why did blacks join? Well, first first of all the Dixiecrats which became the Democrats and stuff come up on the mic yeah they okay the Ku Klux Klan

was created by that party alright so A that was a racist party blacks gravitated towards Republicans because

Abraham Lincoln freed the slaves and Lincoln was the party of Republicans. So they admired Lincoln. We went Republican. All right. And that stayed for a long time. And then in the 1960s, a vehement racist named Barry Goldwater opposed the Civil Rights Act and all this other kind of nonsense and became pretty powerful. And blacks left the Republican Party and went to the Democratic Party, which became more liberal and more accepting. And more and more racists began joining the Republican Party.

This is in the 1960s. And then it would flip back and forth from time to time. But that's how it how it modulated. When they say that the parties flip, it's because of Goldwater. In the 60s. Yes. Yeah. I don't I don't know if if I would look at what's going on right now with Planned Parenthood and with the Democratic Party that they flipped in any meaningful way if they did. I know it's argued the right says they didn't. The left says they did. I know it's argued the right says they did and the left says they did.

But I look at, as I mentioned, Chicago, which has been under Democrat rule or whatever you want to call it for nearly 100 years, I think. I don't know what point. So you were making an issue about Planned Parenthood and you were telling me about Margaret Sanger. Yeah, yeah, yeah. You didn't finish. Well, so she was a eugenicist.

She believed only the good should procreate. She had a project that was called – see, I hate how YouTube does this, but I have no choice but to call it the N-word project. But it's not the slur. It was a slur. And the goal was to disseminate birth control and contraception and trying to convince them not to have kids for those reasons. Now, there's a debate on the quotes from this woman, because some of them are extremely egregious. And then the left claims they're not real quotes.

So whatever, I'll leave that out of it, I suppose. But if the goal of Planned Parenthood started by this woman was to prevent black people from having kids, and to this day, you mentioned the white population is decreasing, but the black population is stagnant. It seems like her ideas to stop black people from having kids. And to this day, you mentioned the white population is decreasing, but the black population is stagnant. It seems like her ideas to stop black people from having babies worked. And now you can look at 2006 data I pulled up that black women are five times more likely to have abortions than white women. And this is preventing black families and children from growing up. It sounds like these racists and the Planned Parenthood was overtly

defended by the Democratic Party, which was the party of racists. They are still enacting policies to hurt black people. When it comes to these statistics, this is like black crime, black abortion, whatever. Say that there's a five to one ratio in the past. What is black crime? Yeah, exactly. So in the past, let's say for every one white person that committed a murder, there were five black people when they add the numbers up. Then what they do is they project that past

to the future. They'll say, so therefore, black people are five times more likely to commit murder. No. Then the cops are like, I got to look at every black guy

like he's five times more likely. And it's like, we're creating a racist projection. Let's go profile him. Yeah, just because it happened in the past doesn't mean it's going to happen again. I'll tell you a funny story out of New York.

Okay. And then I want to go back to the point I was making. But there was a black cop who went to Central Park and started giving tickets to white couples drinking wine. And he said, public drinking is a citation in New York City. And they got all bent out of shape and angry and started complaining. And they were like, we are having wine at our Central Park picnic. How dare you?

And he said, white cops come to the black neighborhoods and give young black men tickets for drinking 40s on their own stoops. And you're mad at me because you were publicly drinking in a park. And the city admonished him. He got in trouble for it. I'm like, that's remarkable bullshit. Getting me swearing on the live show. But I want to go back to that point because I'm curious as to your reaction of what we see out of Chicago, for instance.

It's not improved. So I used to live – where I lived was 49th and Laramie. Are you familiar with the LeClaire courts? No. It's fascinating and horrifying at the same time. Are you familiar with Marquette Park? Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. And the history of Marquette Park?

It depends on the history, I suppose. I don't know. Marquette Park was originally very racist. Nothing but neo-Nazis and KKK people lived there. You didn't know that? No, no, no. Yeah. I mean...

The American Nazi Party was headquartered there. Wow. That wasn't that far away. I mean... It wasn't that long ago either. Right, right, right. There's... So I live on 49th and Laramie.

If you walk north two blocks, you get to 47th Street, which as soon as you crossed it, it was a hard racial segregation. Everybody who lived north of 47th was black. Everybody south was, for the most part, it was mostly white, like kind of redneck. We had Stickney, the suburb, and so everyone there was kind of just like low-income white people. And then you had Mexican and you had – Greek? No, Polish.

Polish. So Movimi Popolsku everywhere over on Archer. And we weren't allowed to walk north of 47th because the police would detain us. They would say the only reason you're here is for drugs. Get in the car and they would take us back. And so it was fascinating to me that there was this kind of soft enforcement of segregation, that there was two things happening. There was a choice.

People chose to racially segregate. People who moved to the area wanted to live near people who looked like them. And that's what actually started making prominent racial segregation. And then from there, which it's actually not necessarily from that one point. There's obviously blockbusting and redlining before that. But then you'd end up with police profiling. They'd see you and say, what are you doing here? Get out.

There were a lot of stories I'd hear from white friends of mine, like young girls. Older black men would stop them if they tried to cross 47th. And they would say, young woman, you best not come here. You need to turn around right now. Because they would be in trouble, older black men would stop them if they tried to cross 47th and they would say, young woman, you best not come here. You need to turn around right now. Because they would be in trouble, the black people. Well, no, no, no. Because they were worried about what would happen to the white girls for coming into the black neighborhood. They were like, the segregation here, it was violent. Back in the 60s, Martin Luther King himself said,

Chicago was the most segregated city in this country. I think that's still true. So you know what they did? They destroyed the project housing. They just flattened it. The grainy green? No, this was – I don't know if this is specifically the LeClaire Courts because the LeClaire Courts, I think, are a different – there's a bunch of project housing off of Cic going all the way down to central avenue in chicago and i don't know if the entirety of that

was the call to leclaire courts but there was an area of it but uh they just flattened it all and it was crazy when i one day i decided to look at a google map of my neighborhood and i saw that all of the housing were uh like a lot of the houses are still all you know black owned black community but all of the project housing was flattened and there are empty fields with fences saying no trespassing. The city just came in and just destroyed it and kicked everybody out. See, you know, when people look at that and they see this self-segregation and they see that it works, they think it's the only way. You know, there's no way people can integrate.

And this is not true. It's because of the racism that has been perpetrated and promulgated by this country. It works in other countries. I saw it. I was living 10 years ahead of my time when I was overseas, living in integrated communities, going to integrated schools in the 1960s, not in my country, but overseas. I was living 10 years ahead of my time because 10 years later, there was diversity in my classrooms here. I know it can work, but when you don't travel, you're not exposed to different things. You think the world, everything around the world is the same way it is in your neighborhood.

My favorite quote of all time is by Mark Twain. It's called the travel quote. And Mark Twain said, travel is fatal to prejudice, bigotry and narrow mindedness. And many of our people need it sorely on these accounts. Broad, wholesome, charitable views of men and things cannot be acquired by vegetating in one little corner of the earth all one's lifetime. It's so true, man. I went to South America for I was there for like five, five months or something. cannot be acquired by vegetating in one little corner of the earth all one's lifetime. It's so true, man. I went to South America.

I was there for like five months or something. And I got a taste of what it felt like to be the other for the first time in my life. And I don't know if it was my race or just the fact that I looked different. But I was walking. People kept looking at me and watching me. And it was like unsettling. And I was like, wow, this is is what people in the United States maybe feel like when they feel like in the minority of the amount of people with a similar skin tone or something.

And it was just so eye-opening. And I think everyone's got to know. They've got to know that feeling. I want to go to Super Chats. We'll go a few minutes over because we went a few minutes over. It's Friday. But I'm going to try and just find the good core questions, and I apologize if we can't get to you. But I want to tackle some of the best questions we can.

So smash the Like button. If you do like the show, I know a lot of people are reeing and arguing and yelling at basically everybody. But if you like the show and you appreciate the conversations we have, we appreciate it. You can support us at TimCast.com. But I'll start with this one from Patriot, who said, I'll say it again. The state of Texas isn't who removed slave from textbooks. It was the board of education dominated by leftists. I don't think you can answer to that, this statement. But I do think it highlights one of the issues is that if you read a cursory story, it will say in Texas they removed this word from the books, and then someone will say that's not true. It was the other side.

How do we navigate when – Okay. So I'm going to assume that whoever said that is probably correct. I don't live in Texas. But the fact of the matter is in the state of Texas, the word slave was removed from textbooks. Whether the state did it or whether the Board of Education did it, it was done in the state of Texas. But it does matter who did it and why they did it. Right, right.

No, no, I'm talking about as far as my point goes. The state of Texas removed the word slave from textbooks in Texas public schools. Now, who did it? The Board of Education, the state government, whoever. He's probably right. Okay, maybe it was the Board of Education. But it happened in the state of Texas. It didn't happen in California or Nevada or Maryland or New York or wherever.

No, but I think the point is that we agree. The issue is when you mentioned they put back enslaved people, I think that shows— No, they replaced it with immigrant worker. Oh, right. And then there was an uproar in the black community. How dare you water down what happened to our ancestors? They were not immigrant workers. They were slaves. But is it possible that Daryl is misinterpreting the reason that it was removed and that it was actually removed by pro-critical race theory people?

That's the situation. So I think that – Like removing master and slave from a coding library, GitHub or whatever, they're getting rid of the word slave because it's offensive to black people and it's under the guise of progressivism and critical race theory. They're doing it. You know, see, you know, you want to blame things on Democrats, on Republicans, on critical race proponents. Listen, at the end of the day, you've got to understand something. This country was built on racism. Racism still exists. When I was in elementary school, we had slave auctions. You would never do that today. They do it today.

Progressive teachers. How? A progressive teacher just got fired for a white progressive teacher held a slave auction amongst his students. You meant like mocking schools, right? Yeah. That literally just happened. Oh, yeah. We did a crazy race. No, no, no, no, no. Not mocking, okay? Yeah. That literally just happened. Oh, yeah. We did a crazy –

No, no, no, no, no. Not mocking, okay? Yeah, I think I read about that. I didn't read all into it. Not mocking it. A mock as in they practiced it. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And they jackaled the black children.

In seventh grade Ohio. Right, exactly. They were demonstrating something, okay? But I'm talking about they did it in my school. I participated in it, As a kid, it was a regular thing to raise money for whatever school trip or whatever. We would have slave auctions

where kids would bid on other kids. It wasn't like white kids bidding on black kids. I could bid on some white kid or whatever. And you paid 50 cents or whatever and you bought that person, and that person had to carry your books around all day.

Well, that's not the same thing. Yes, it is. It was called a slave auction. No, no, no, I'm saying what I was referring to. I know what you're referring to. You're referring to a reenactment of a slave auction. Right. It was a practitioner of critical race praxis

who segregated the kids by race and then made the black kids wear shackles. When I was in seventh grade in 1992, seventh grade Ohio, Cuyahoga Falls, Ohio, we did this exercise in social studies class where we were all plantation owners, they were called. And we had to either get slaves or indentured servants. And then there was a third type of worker that you would get. And you put these little stickers on your board, and everyone had their stickers. And you go around, you trade stickers with other people.

So I just did the math, and I was like, well, this is cheaper than that. So I got all the right stickers and then won the game. But it was just like indoctrination. Okay. And we weren't slave owners. We were called plantation owners. Right. Now, do you remember a lady named Jane Elliott?

No. Okay. You all need to look up Jane Elliott. Brown eye, blue eye. You all never heard of that experiment? Mm-mm. I think I may have heard of this, actually. Okay, Jane Elliott, she's a friend of mine, and she's still living.

She's a lot older now. Back in the 1960s, she's a white lady. She took her class of white kids, and she separated all the brown eyes from all the blue eyes. And she told them that the brown-eyed people were superior and blue-eyed people were inferior.

And guess what? The brown-eyed people started acting, these little kids started acting superior. All right? And you would see this, this, this, you know, this change. And then and the blue eyed people were feeling inferior and, you know, being oppressed. The next day she flipped it around. Oh, it's the blue eyed people were supposed to be superior and the brown eyes who are inferior and they learn more about racism from that and if you watch interviews with those kids today as adults they say i wish my kids could experience that in school okay let's jane elliott we'll read some more the first thing i want to mention is uh trock says where's james lindsey actually if you'd be interested i'd love to have a james lindsey knows more about this

stuff than certainly i do i think it'd be fascinating conversation if you'd be interested, I'd love to have a – James Lindsay knows more about this stuff than certainly I do. I think it would be a fascinating conversation if you were interested. Sure. Invite me. I'll be happy to come back. That would be great. We should absolutely – I think James is probably – I'm always ready to learn. James is going to be listening to this going, Tim, no.

What? You're wrong. You've missed this point and this quote and this quote. And he's going to be saying things like that. All right. So Dragon Stallion says – is that what it says? Dragon Stallion says, is that what it says? Dragon's Talon. Oh.

Does your guest feel like black families who own slaves also need to pay reparations? John Kasser. Was the first lifelong slave in the U.S. owned by a black plantation owner, Anthony Johnson?

Do black families need to pay reparations? Those who own slaves. I didn't say any families need to pay reparations. I say the government needs to make those reparations. Those who own slaves. I didn't say any families need to pay reparations. I say the government needs to make those reparations. OK, the people who own slaves are no longer here. I cannot fault you or you for what your great great grandparents did. All right. You need to know about it. You need to know it was wrong. But I'm not going to hold

you accountable. All right. You're not around. You were not around then. All right? I think the government needs to make those reparations. And also, it's possible that their parents aren't even from the United States. Well, I mean, whatever. I mean, I know parents who are from the United States who did have slaves. Not parents, but their ancestors. Okay? No, I'm not going to hold their descendants responsible for sins of the father or whatever you want to call it. No.

But the government needs to make good on it. But they never have. That was a straw man. That was a straw man of what Daryl said about reparations that, you know, it's possible to have a nuanced view about reparations that doesn't involve throwing money around, but does involve something like a major education overhaul. Absolutely. Right. Right. But but hold on. I mean, eight hundred ninety eight000 people gave their lives In this country to end slavery And what's your point

I mean you mentioned the Japanese The reason they get paid is because Nobody gave their lives to stop that It was wrong and they stopped it This country is the one Is the country that won against slavery That sacrificed nearly a million Of its children saying

We won against slavery Let sacrificed nearly a million of its children saying we're going to get slavery you know let me tell you something even today when you go to schools in the north when you study the civil war you are taught the civil war was fought over slavery in the south no no no no it wasn't fought over slavery it was fought over states rights yes it was fought over states rights the state's right to own a slave they don't put it that way but that's what it was it's the same thing this country is still fighting the civil war my friend i agree okay why are they still flying confederate battle flags even most young white people don't even realize you know they don't call it that down there. I know. They call it the

rebel flag. I know. Because they rebel against wanting to give up their slaves. It's also, the Civil War is also called the War of Northern Aggression. Right, exactly. And I've heard that Lincoln, it really was an economic war for Lincoln too. He wanted, he couldn't let the states take all that money away from the but he said the best way to rally

people is to say it's about slavery. And then he also deep down wanted to end slavery. So he kind of tweaked the message. I've heard that. I don't know. But, you know, they're still fighting that. You know, flying Confederate battle flags. Okay.

The crossbar and stars that you all call the Confederate flag is not the flag of the Confederacy. That is the confederate battle flag that is the flag that flew in the civil war to battle to maintain slavery the flag of the confederacy are the red and white stripes with the blue square with the circle of silver stars that is the flag of the confederacy that crossbars and stars is the confederate battle flag but a lot of people want to call it the confederate flag it's awesome yeah it's true i just looked it up exactly okay so we have huh i was gonna say we have a i was gonna i didn't know if you were done with your point i was gonna read another comment okay so we have a few that are they're bringing

up uh french people owned and sold slaves in Haiti. And Mark says, this man has never heard of French colonies or French Africa. Ask what happened when French African soldiers were brought to Europe in World War I. The accusations made towards them, racism is the unknown. Okay, let me correct that man right there, and I hope you're listening. Listen, son, I lived in French West Africa for six years. I lived in French West Africa for six years. I lived in Guinea. I lived in Senegal, both which were colonized by the French.

So, yes, I do know about French colonies. Y'all are off to French Indochina Burma. I'll try to find another one. I'm just looking at how the Europeans split up Africa, man. In the late 1800s, early 1900s, and before that, too. It was just all, it was just a race to colonize and enslave the entire continent.

So Colin Burke says one of the bigger problems with reparations, that more than 80% of even white people moved to the U.S. much later, after slavery, and half near the end of Jim Crow. So do you comb ancestors or... Do you call them?

Listen, like I said, I'll go back to my point. Whether you moved here yesterday or whether you moved here 500 years ago, nobody is still living today who owned any slaves. All right. So I'm not faulting the descendants of slave owners. I am not faulting people who came here yesterday. I am faulting the U.S. government for not doing what they were supposed to do. They gave Japanese Americans reparations. They gave Native Americans reparations.

They promised black people 40 acres and a mule and have done nothing. They haven't even apologized. That's what I'm holding accountable. The majority, do you know what the, without looking it up, do you know who makes up the majority of white Americans

in this country? Of what descent? Irish. No. That was my guess. No. German. German Americans are the largest white majority

followed by british americans oh yeah i'm german well i'm american but yeah some some drunk boxer was german in my history i think daryl's like envisioning of reparations is actually much more moderate than people might think. In terms of pure acknowledgement, it seems like that's what you're getting at, Daryl. You're not necessarily... People have different definitions of what reparations are, and you're more so saying you just want clear acknowledgement, which you think...

Well, no, I want an apology. And I think people who have been disenfranchised, held back, and things like that, should get something. I'm not saying throw money to them. I'm saying there should be government vouchers for

education, for college tuitions, things like that, that we were denied in the past. Even after slavery, we couldn't go to Princeton. We couldn't go wherever. So you're saying based on race? Based on race.

So what happens in, say, the mixed-race areas of South Side of Chicago when all of a sudden half the people get vouchers and the other half don't? They're all in the same neighborhood same economic status if you are the descendants of slaves you should be entitled to that okay like if you are the descendants of native americans you got one eighth or one sixteenth a native american blood in you you can get something if you if you are a survivor of the internment camps or your or your descendants are of the japanese internment camps, you can get something, okay? Descendants of slaves should be entitled to what they were promised and they never received,

just like the courts awarded the survivors of the Tulsa race massacre and their descendants something, and to this day they haven't got it. So my question was, what do you think would happen to the mixed-race neighborhoods when only half the people get vouchers, get some kind of benefit or resource? Nothing would happen. Why would anything happen? If they're not entitled to it, they're not entitled to it. Should some guy...

I suppose it's like... Well, wait a minute. I mean, listen. If somebody came over here yesterday from Nigeria, okay, yeah, he looks the same as I do, but he's not entitled to what I should get. He didn't go through that. His ancestors didn't go through that.

Okay, so it's just like, you know, somebody comes over from Japan tomorrow. Do they get something that's owed to the survivors and descendants of the people from the Japanese internment camps? No. Let's say somebody is the descendant of – a man and woman come from Afghanistan with a child after their country was completely just destroyed. And that kid is living in poverty in a neighborhood. And then all of a sudden the government comes in

and hands out checks based on race that they're not entitled to. And they say, well, your oppression doesn't count because we're only talking about other oppression. The issue I have with race-based distribution of resources, one, the resource has to be paid for by somebody. The government doesn't count because we're only talking about other oppression. The issue I have with race-based distribution of resources, one, the resource has to be paid for by somebody. The government doesn't have money. The government taxes the people. And then it uses the people's resources to distribute

where it wants to. I think the problem is if we use race-based programs to give people money, it's just still racial segregation. Why is it, Tim, that you haven't said anything about that as far as Japanese people go? They're still getting – they're still entitled to money. But I did.

Hold on. They can still get money. Native Americans to this day can still get money. How come I can't get money? Not that I'm going to go look for it or whatever. We have been denied it. So you're okay with this group getting it. You're okay with that group getting it.

But now when it comes to black people, now you come up with all these excuses about so-and-so died in the war. Isn't that enough? Or no, they should not get money because this person isn't getting money. No. I didn't say it was okay that we're giving people money based on race. I think it's wrong. I literally said it was wrong to distribute resources based on race. No, no, no.

Listen. I'm not saying give people money based on race. I'm saying give money people based on the crime you committed against them. What if – so if they have one ancestor who was enslaved? If they had one ancestor who was enslaved? Are they entitled to it? I would say so, yeah. You'll end up seeing a lot of white people get those vouchers. Huh. You'll end up seeing a lot of white people get those vouchers.

Huh? You'll end up with a lot of white people getting those vouchers. There weren't that many white people who were enslaved. No, but there are white people who are the descendants of slaves. Like, if there was a black slave who found themselves in an interracial relationship, and now this person is one-sixty-fourth black or one-eighth or one... I mean, there are people who... A famous actor, I'm not going to use their name, who is, you know, I think one eighth black and no one realizes it because he just looks like a white guy. But he'd get one of these checks and he's a rich white dude.

That makes sense. It would you in order to be consistent, it would have to be like that. Yeah, the rich white guy gets his check to truly repair the system. He's rich. The idea is reparation, which means to repair. Then I don't think haphazardly handing money at people that we need to build holistic systems that lift everyone up together, like decentralized technology. And I'm not going to derail guys into that. Don't worry about it.

But I feel like when you can do things that everyone benefits from clean water supplies and like free internet access with satellites and stuff like that, then everyone has an opportunity to be better themselves. You can't throw $80,000 in someone's face and expect them to be better. I don't think Will Smith's family should get free money, should get money from the government. I just don't understand it. If Will Smith's family were descendants of slaves, I do.

And I think so should my family. We should receive something for the crime that was perpetrated upon us, that split my family apart. My ancestors were, you know, we don't have nuclear families. OK, well, your name is Tim Pool. Where does that name come from? It's fake. OK, well, then I won't have to know what your real name is. The lore of my family is that they were bandits who created a fake name after getting into a train robbery that murdered somebody. Okay. That's awesome.

All right. So we won't go there. All right. So Mr. Ottman here, okay? River Man. River Man. Okay. River Man Ottman.

Where does the name Ottman come from? I actually – well, I can tell you one interesting lineage fact. I'm actually, so my mother's name is Ball, middle name. British name. My maiden name, Ball. George Washington's mother, Mary Ball. So I'm actually, George Washington is my direct cousin, seven generations removed. So that is what it is.

It's a British, Ball is a British name. Yeah, but I'm a mutt. I'm a mutt. Huh? I'm a mutt of all of you. Well, whatever. Okay, so this man right here can go to Britain and find some Balls and find some people, some Balls who are related.

Oh, you know he will. We're kids, we're children. Lots of them. There's a lot of them out there. I'm sure there are. I got a couple of them. Now, he can go there and find some balls that he is distantly related to.

My name is Davis. Do you know where the name Davis comes from? Jefferson Davis. I have no idea. Davis is a Welsh name. Do I look Welsh to you? comes from? Jefferson Davis. I have no idea. Okay. Davis is a Welsh name. Alright. Do I look Welsh to you? No. Okay. Slaves took the names of their plantation

owners. Their owners. Okay. If they, because the plantation owners could not pronounce their real names. Number one. Alright. So, you know, the name Davis came from the Davis Plantation in North Carolina. All right? Now, if they did not like their plantation owner, and most of them didn't, they took

names, when slaves were freed, they took names of people that they did like or people who had higher positions, like presidents. Or free men, right? And free men, right? And free men. Okay, now, most people that you find, that you see today, who are named Jefferson, or who are named Washington, or who are named Lincoln, are mostly black people. Yes, there are some white Jeffersons. You know, a few white people are named Washington.

But I'll guarantee you, nine out of ten people you meet with the last name of Washington or Jefferson is going to be a black person. And they took that name because their names were stripped from them. Their mothers and fathers were, we didn't have nuclear families. I lived in West Africa. I lived in Senegal where Goree Island is. Goree Island was where the slaves came from. They were locked up and chained in Goree Island, put on the boat. I've been to Goree Island is. Goree Island was where the slaves came from. They were locked up and chained in Goree Island,

put on the boat. I've been to Goree Island. I've seen those slave quarters. I cannot go to Senegal or West Africa and find somebody named Davis. I can go to Wales. I played in Wales with my band. And just for fun, I said,

anybody out there named Davis? Half the people started screaming. The name Davis in Wales is as popular as the name Smith is over here. So I'm like, hey, cuz, how y'all doing out there? So we were stripped of our identity. We can't get that back. But we are owed something for the crimes perpetrated upon us. I'm going to read some critical ones.

I think some of the others were already critical. But this one's just overtly critical. Deliopolis says, This conversation has been really effing disappointing. Daryl's antics today have done more to radicalize me than de-radicalize me. Well, apparently he's already radicalized. I think it's undeniable that this is exactly the type of conversation that needs to happen and the fact that you know tim you're getting like i saw the splc thing

coming out like for for for them to accuse your show of not having cross-spectrum conversations is completely ridiculous this This is that. Well, that's why the smear was like, he gets bad super chat sometimes. And it's just like the Southern Poverty Law Center tried. They don't like me either. Yeah. Did you ever see my documentary, Accidental Courtesy? No, no.

Oh, you should check it out. I know that there are a lot of people on the left who don't like you. And I think it might be because you've actually helped to de-radicalize people. I think these nonprofits that make money off racism don't want racism to go away. Here's what I think. I think there's a generational difference between us. We've talked to a couple other boomers in the past, and it seems like the way we consume as millennials and younger information... You should ask that guy why is he radicalized in the first place.

I'd be interested in his response. Well, it's because when you look at the older generation, it seems like they've abandoned the millennials. That's how it feels, I think, to a lot of millennials. We recently had a guest who said feminists are not pro-war. And it's like here we are as millennials online talking to millennials and the feminist millennials are all overtly the ukrainian flags defending intervention defending nato's intervention and we're like we don't want this the boomers in their world is completely different little stink bug yeah so i think for a lot of

people it feels like when we hear from the older generation, they're detached from the world we live in and they don't understand what we're experiencing. And so it... Frustration. Yeah, frustration. It's funny because you say that, but I can say the same thing.

Being the older generation from you guys, you have no clue what we went through. Yeah, I feel like what's happening is you're exposing a sort of truth, a perspective truth. And I'm reading this Galileo quote, the truth. All truth passes through three stages. First, it's ridiculed. Maybe you'll see that in the super chats. Second, it's violently opposed.

Usually you see that in the super chats. Then it's accepted as being self-evident. Okay, so let me tell you about Galileo. And I'll tell you about, but before Galileo, his mentor, his person that he looked up to was another astronomer who you've heard of called Copernicus. All right. Copernicus said that the earth revolves around the sun. Okay. That is a heliocentric theory. The world said no, because we were egocentric. We thought the earth was the center of the universe and the sun revolved around the earth.

And they called Copernicus a heretic. And they locked him up in prison for saying that guess what he was right a hundred years later galileo galileo comes or comes along and he had studied copernicus and galileo came to the same conclusion that we are not geocentric we are heliocentric. All right? And the Earth revolves around the Sun. All right? They called him a heretic. But guess what? Galileo

was right. I want to read the super chat. Kid Funky Fry says, I think my great-great-grandpa who was blown apart to free the slaves was payment enough, especially considering I or no one in my family has ever owned slaves. So there's a couple of questions I get out of this. This is interesting.

So if this man is telling the truth and his ancestor died to end slavery and his family never owned slaves, if we do reparations, should we also create an exception that anybody who is not descendant of slave owners is exempt from the tax that would fund the reparations. Anybody who is not a descendant of slaves would have a tax credit exemption from any taxes that would go towards reparations. I'd have to think about that. But it doesn't matter. I'm not saying it doesn't matter

that his ancestors died fighting in the Civil War. You go and you fight for your country, you go and you fight for your country, you go and you fight for your land. Like, listen, an American just died the other day over in Ukraine. Okay? That was his choice to go there and fight. All right?

So, you know, does his family get some kind of reparations? You know, I don't think so. Okay? We fought against Japan. Do these people still get reparations? Why is it cut off when black people don't get any reparations, black people who are descendants of slaves? That is the racism, and I'm calling that guy who just wrote you a racist.

Why is he a racist? Why is he racist? Why is he racist? Because he does not see the racism that was perpetrated by his country against people like me and my ancestors. Thank you for your great-grandfather's service for fighting in the Civil War against slavery. But if you can't see that black people in this country have not received the same apology for one and the same reparations

for another that Japanese Americans have received and that Native Americans have received, something is wrong. You're blind. I don't think he's saying that. I think he's just saying that for you to say that he should pay – I didn't say he should pay. What did I say? I said the government should pay.

But the government takes money from him. Listen, we all pay taxes. Right, right, right. So if we all pool our money together for, say, the common defense and services, and then you step up and say, I want to take from that pool because of reparations, he says, okay, well, hold on. My family member died for you is is that enough you say no you're a racist i think that's kind of i mean you can't you also just because you're anti-reparations does not mean that you're racist there are many black people who are not he didn't say anything no i'm not i'm not talking about him i'm just i'm saying is for you to call him a racist when he's simply saying don't take from me. I'm not taking from him.

I don't think you can call someone a racist like that. I'm calling him a racist. But you don't know him, Daryl. I'm calling him a racist and I'm standing behind what I say. And listen, we all have to pay taxes. When you drive down the road, you are not allowed to use the HOV lane if you don't have two people in your car or HOV 3, three people in your car. If you're riding by yourself and you drive down that lane, you will get a ticket if a cop sees you. All right. I've done that and I've gotten a ticket.

All right. Not because I'm black, but because I was driving down the HOV lane with one person, me, in the car. All right. Guess what? I pay taxes and my taxes built that road. What if he said... Why can't I use that lane? Can he get reparations

for his great-great-great-grandfather dying? Should the government pay him for the loss of his grandfather? Right now, I'm talking about black descendants of slaves. Okay? Now, if he wants to get reparations

from the government because his great-great-grandfather died, you know, that's his fight. Convince me, and I will stand behind him. Would you think that if he went to the government and said, I should, and the government said yes, and they took tax money and gave it to him, tax money that you pay,

would you be okay with that? Not if I'm not getting any reparations, no. Well, then why should he, after his great-grandfather died, think that he should give his tax? You're missing the point. Because when it comes to giving black people something, you all are saying, no, cut it off here. No, no. Stop seeing it.

We're not. That's not. Bullshit. Because you've already acknowledged Japanese Americans are getting it. Native Americans are getting it. So what is the problem? I said it was wrong. I said it was wrong.

Well, whether you say it's wrong or not. I said racial disbursement of money is wrong. Hold on. Whether you say it's wrong or not, it's happening. What are you doing to stop it? I do a show where I say it's wrong. Oh, that's not stopping it, is it? I mean, I vote. It inspires other people to vote. It has

an influential impact on people sharing ideas. We allow people to talk to us and share their ideas. Once everybody... Should the people who first, first of all, should the descendants of the Tulsa race race riot, the black Wall Street descendants, should they get reparations from the people who committed the atrocities? Maybe people in that people committed the atrocities are dead. So then what do you do? Do you punish the living the sins of the father? See, the issue I have with this is that...

Did I say punish? What did I say? The money has to come from somewhere. I said specifically the sins of the father... Who is paying for it? Who takes it? The U.S. government pays for it, whether it comes out of your taxes or whether it comes out of their Fort Knox or wherever it comes from.

The U.S. government pays for it. It would be the Federal Reserve. They'd print a bunch of money and then it would cause inflation. That's, I think, why they from, the U.S. government pays for it. It would be the Federal Reserve. They'd print a bunch of money and then it would cause inflation. That's, I think, why they haven't done it. Yeah, well, you know what? Why didn't people think about that before when they were murdering Indians and murdering...

But those things are all bad. Yeah, yeah, but the point is, but the point is, you keep driving home. This is where I draw the line. You know, what you're saying, Tim, is racist, whether you are or whether you're not. I think it's racist. Well, that's fine. You can do whatever you want to think.

I don't care. My point is, when it comes to uplifting black people, the line is drawn. Nobody said that. Did I say anybody said it? You said we all did several times. I said what you're saying is wrong. I said when it comes to uplifting black people, the line is drawn. When it comes to uplifting this person, that person, that person, it's already been done.

I wasn't alive. It's being done. I wasn't alive. It doesn't matter whether you were alive or not. It happened. So I wasn't alive when they interned Japanese people. My family actually suffered because I come from an Asian background and they were spit on and treated horribly no doubt and uh the only thing i can say is that i was born into a world with problems and we advocate for solving those problems but i don't think that racial policies

solve those problems i think that's what we're fighting against yeah we're fighting against the government creating racial segregation because we want people to come together and live together and work together and so what we end up seeing is okay so how do people come together when this person has ten dollars and that one only has 50 cents and this one keeps ten dollars and that one well this is why i said i think it's a problem that they disperse money based on race i wasn't alive when they said disperse money based on race i said disperse money based upon those people who suffered from crime due to racism. Okay. But that means white people, a lot of white people.

A lot of white people committed those crimes. No, they'll get the money. A lot of white people who are overtly white with blonde hair and blue eyes still have slave ancestors. I'm not saying millions. Then fine. Then fine. I just don't agree with giving white people reparation. No, you want to give people opportunity, not money.

Money could be part of it. Did I say money? You said it doesn't have to be money. Resources. The idea that we're going to try and like – you're going to see some rich white family who's like, actually, one of our ancestors was a slave. We're 164th, and that person was a part of our family. And then all of a sudden this WASP family is like getting a voucher for college. Yeah, that's what I want to avoid.

I think that the only way we can do it is uplift everyone together. I think if you can create software or some sort of technology that allows people with or without money to create a business, to start their own entrepreneurship and get subscriptions from people, then you're uplifting everyone. Because a lot of times it's the poor that are suffering right now. It sounds like you said you wouldn't take money if there was a system like this where they're handing out checks or you just said earlier you wouldn't. I don't know. Right. Because you don't need it.

But these people that need it, they need opportunity. Well, what about tax credits? What about like a tax break or something like that? There are many different things that can be given in lieu of money. Maybe a tax credit, maybe a tuition. I'd have to think that through or have other people who have more intelligence than I do think it through.

But something needs to be done and nothing has been done for the descendants of slaves. That is my point. Something has been done for the descendants of Native Americans. Something has been done for the descendants of Japanese Americans. Something has been done for the descendants of Japanese Americans. But when it comes to people who look like me, the line is drawn. We have never even received an apology for slavery. Telling me slavery is wrong, well, shit, so what?

Okay, yeah, it's wrong. But telling me we're sorry it happened is a whole different thing. Is affirmative action something to assist in this way? It's overtly race-based. Affirmative action has many different definitions, just like critical race theory. I don't, like I said before, with affirmative action, I do not believe in lowering the bar of standards.

I believe in keeping the bar up and people aspire to hit that bar, not lower the bar so people can reach it. Keep it up. I believe in affirmative education where everybody has the opportunity to better themselves and go out and get better jobs. As you mentioned, give people opportunities. They don't have the opportunities if they're not educated. And even those people who are educated, like myself, okay, I still experience discrimination when it comes to jobs. Yeah, people need to learn how to run their own business as a young kid, regardless of where they go to school or their age or any of that stuff.

People need to learn that stuff. You know, when I think about apologizing for slavery, I have a hard time doing it for real because it's horrible. Like, to enslave humans is horrific. The Uyghurs in China, that's horrific that this computer was made by slaves in part. But like, if it hadn't happened the way it happened, we wouldn't be here. And that I like that we're here. So I wouldn't change it. I mean, maybe if I could go back and say, no, it wasn't a slavery. Maybe it would have been conquered by, you know, the Mexicans or the Portuguese or, like, who knows where we'd be.

So that's why I have a hard time just outright giving, like, a genuine, like, I'm sorry it happened. Because it didn't happen to you. So I want to apologize to, if I saw somebody, I don't know, man. All right, let me give you an example of something, okay? True story. I was giving a lecture at Michigan State

University some years ago in Lansing, Michigan, all right? And this white girl, you know, we're talking about apologies and stuff. And she says, you know, why should we apologize? Now, she was not a racist, okay? What she was saying was racist, but she was not a racist. I could see that. She's like, why should we apologize? I mean, I wasn't around when slavery was happening. Nobody in my family owned slaves. Why should I apologize for what my great, great, great ancestors did? You know, I wasn't responsible for that. And I said, the apology is symbolic. Nobody is around. All right. You know, you give medals posthumously. It's symbolic. All right. People cannot move forward until they have received an apology for wrongdoing to them. And I said to her, I said, listen, it was in November

when I was lecturing out there. I said, OK, let's say I'm a student here at Michigan State. I said, and I live in the dorm, and I live, you know, on the East Coast. You live here in Michigan, and you and I are friends, and you say to me, hey, are you going home for Thanksgiving? And I say, no, I can't afford to go home for Thanksgiving. I'm going to save my money and go home for Christmas vacation. Okay, and then you tell me, oh, well, you know, my grandparents told me,

you know, if I wanted to, I could ask some of my students who weren't going home if they want to come over for Thanksgiving dinner, you know, would you like to come? And I say, sure. Okay, so now I'm invited to her grandparents for Thanksgiving. So she comes by my dormitory, picks me up, takes me over to her grandparents' house, along with some other students.

Now, let's say her grandfather didn't realize that she was going to bring a black student home. This guy's a little older. He makes some racist remarks or whatever that offends me. I said to her, I said, what are you going to say to me on the way back to the dorm? And she said, I'm going to say, I'm sorry about what my grandfather said. I said, but you know what? You didn't make that remark. Your grandfather did. You are apologizing for your ancestor.

I said, I can't change how your grandfather feels, okay? But I appreciate the fact that you acknowledge that it's wrong and you say you're sorry for it. But a real apology would be to confront the grandfather as it happens and be like, dude, we're in the 21st century. Grow up. Look at the eyeballs. I want to read some more Super Chats. So there's a bunch that are saying very similar things. So I'm not going to read.

I'm just going to give the general ideas. There's two interesting ideas. Many people have said that they think you're a racist fine and uh a couple right here we have one from kyle we have one from kevin d uh who both said i'm white uh kyle says white dude i've had the talk i'm pretty sure everyone has the talk kevin says i'm i'm white grew up in the middle class family in a suburb in los angeles and i had talk. And others have said that they think your view

of the talk being explicitly a black thing shows that you've been radicalized. I didn't say explicitly. Well, you said it's something that black families do. I said black families do it. I didn't say explicitly. That's your word. Well, so the general idea that I guess people absorbed by that is that you think it's exclusive. Listen.

I never said it was exclusive. I didn't use the word exclusive. I didn't think it's exclusive. Listen, I never said it was exclusive. I didn't use the word exclusive. I didn't use the word exclusive. I said black families give their boys when they turn 16 something called a talk. I said black families do that. Did I say black families do it

exclusively? Did I say black families do it explicitly? No, I did not. So that guy is putting words in my mouth. Well, no, no. I guess the idea they're conveying is that when you say black families do it, they interpret you as saying as if it's not happening elsewhere. Guess what? Black families listen to James Brown.

Does that mean no white people listen to James Brown? So do black families exclusively listen to James Brown? So you're clarifying. I'm clarifying. I'm clarifying his BS. I'm calling BS on him. Now, hold on, hold on.

Let me tell you about the talk, okay? The talk that black kids get is the one that I described, the same one that you described about keep your hands on the wheel, don't argue, sign the ticket, we'll fight it in court. Otherwise, you could come home in a box. Now, a lot of white people get the talk, but most of the white people that get the talk is a different talk.

How do you know? Because I have a lot of white friends who tell me. I have a lot of black friends who tell me. Well, that's fine. That makes no sense. But hold on. That makes no sense. You haven't even heard what I said.

You're generalizing based on race. Huh? You're generalizing based on race. You said you had a lot of black friends. I was making a sarcastic point to counter your racist point. You haven't. I know you haven't even let me finish my point. So hold on.

I'm going to finish my point. OK, a lot of white kids get the talk, but it's not the same talk as the black kids get the talk because they don't have the same experiences. The talk that a lot of the white kids get is when they start driving, don't get pregnant. Don't come home pregnant. Use condoms. You know, I don't want to be a grandfather or grandmother before my time. That's the talk that a lot of white kids get.

Now, I challenge you. Hold on. I challenge you to, you say you have a lot of black friends. No, no, no. Hold on. I know you're being – well, maybe you don't have any. But find some, okay? Okay.

Hold on. Hold on. Hold on. I'm going to clarify that. When you made a racist generalization, I made a sarcastic point. What was my racist generalization? That you have a lot of white friends. Therefore, you know what white people in general do.

Did I say I know what white people in general do did i say i know what white people in general yes you did i said i said most white kids get this talk no they say all white yes they do you don't know yes i do no you don't yes i do did you grow up in a white family in a suburb i grew up in white neighborhoods i went to white schools when we have people saying us to us right now it's not their experience you say well they're racist and wrong i didn't say they're racist and wrong. You called the guy racist. You overtly said this man was racist. I said what he said was racist. I didn't say he was a racist.

No, Daryl, I haven't spoken in a while. I need to say something. Seriously. We need to stop overtly calling people racists. I will call a person a racist if I see that they are a racist. I'm just saying at this table, I know and love you all. And I know for a fact that nobody at this table is a racist.

A hundred percent. Maybe certain racial comments can be made, but I know that for a hundred percent, like a hundred percent. So the fact that like these names are getting thrown around, I just I don't think it's really productive. I'm not saying you can't call someone racist. I'm saying racists don't exist i'm but i think we need to be very careful all this dude said is as a white dude i've had the talk i'm pretty sure everyone has the talk well see he's pretty sure everyone has the talk talk so now you're going to defend him he's pretty sure everyone has the talk but yeah when i but you accuse me of saying all white people and now i'm a racist and i don't

know shit but he says everyone and you're not defending him well let me explain when he says everyone he means you too everyone has to talk i know a lot of people haven't had to talk well sure a lot of white people haven't had to talk well sure but but now you're just getting semantics no no i i i'm i'm reacting to what he said so this started everyone and didn't get on him, but you got on me for saying a lot of white people. Because I don't like the racist generalizations. I don't like it when someone says one race does one thing. This country is based on race. I believe there is only one race. It is a human race.

One race. You and I are the same race. Ian and I, Bill and I are the same race. We all are the same race, the human race. But this country has divided us by color. And if you don't believe that, you need to go back and learn your history, which you apparently have not learned if you don't see that. And if they don't see

that, this country is predicated on race. This country was built on white supremacy and slavery at the bottom. So I think a lot of people, especially me, we agreed with you with like so much of the historical problems and racism and civil rights and all that stuff. But you think it's all over. No, I literally said that wasn't.

So what's your point? So when you say something that is dividing people based on race and people take issue with it, you recoil, you call them racist. Do you not see this country dividing people based on race? You think we live in a post-racist society because we had a black president or something? A lot of white people think that too. I've heard white people say, racism is over. We've had Obama.

Well, we're not saying that. I'm saying, you know, one of the things that I'll just say triggered me was this idea that there are certain things you've suffered that are either described only as a black experience. Or in this instance, when people felt when you said black families give their kids the talk, the response was them saying, I'm white and I've had the talk. And some people saying they feel like that was you showing you're radicalized to a racial, as a racial component. Well, that's pretty, that's pretty stupid. And that's pretty racist. So I just called somebody stupid.

I just called them racist. So now, hold on. I can speak as a black man. So why is it when I say I, as a black man, got the talk, I am racializing something. I am black You then said white people do X and you're not a white person I didn't say white people do X

I said I'm black And you said white people have a different talk They do this You can't speak as a white person can you I can repeat what white people have told me Are you denying that white people have told me that Are you calling them liars That's not I'm asking you that question Answer yes or no have told me. Are you denying that white people have told me that? Are you calling them liars?

That's not... No, I'm asking you that question. That has nothing to do with what we're talking about. No, no. Answer yes or no. Are you calling my white friends liars? I'm calling them anecdotal. Anecdotal. So you're saying that they did not have the talk that I told you that they had. No, no, no. Anecdotal means you heard a few stories. I know what anecdotal means. So the issue is, if you have your stories and they have their stories,'s a moot point meaning no it's not some some white people experience the talk

in great degrees have you experienced everything i've experienced no no it's no what you're saying vice versa yeah dude it's evidence what you're saying is evidence and then what these guys saying is evidence none of it proves anything but we're all given our anecdotal evidence it doesn't prove anything well like our statements today us we whatever you say and whatever i mean it doesn't prove anything? Well, like our statements today, us, we, whatever you say and whatever I say, it doesn't prove it. It's just a piece of evidence towards the postulation. I don't understand what you mean it doesn't prove anything. If I tell, okay, so he tells me that he got pulled over at gunpoint and he got handcuffed and some guy tried to plant Adderall in his car. I just said, it's a moot point.

It didn't happen. Oh, no. Well, that would be evidence that there is more crime towards people like him in that area or something like that. No, it's just that crime happens.

It wouldn't prove that it's always more crime towards people like him in that area. It doesn't prove it, but it's evidence suggesting that it's real. And I think you saying...

Suggesting that it's real. It is real. He experienced it. I don't doubt that he experienced that. It's actually on video. When you speak for the greater whole... When it's real. It is real. He experienced it. I don't doubt that he experienced that. It's actually on video. When you speak for the greater whole. When it's on video or not, I believe it happened to you.

Because that crap was happening long before you were born. So I don't need the video to know that it happened. You know why I know it happened? Because it happened to me. Not at gunpoint. Similar things. I've been hearing about that shit long before long before video before anybody had video cameras other than tv stations when you say you experience something like the

talk or a white person told me the talk and then a white person from their own personal experiences say that this is what happens to me why would they be wrong or racist did i say they were wrong listen there are white people yes who get talk. Keep your hands on the wheel. Don't argue with the cops, whatever. Alright? But there are also plenty of white kids who get to talk. Don't come home pregnant. Use condoms. Alright? We get to talk

when we get stopped by the police. When we start driving, obey the speed limit. Don't do anything to raise suspicion to cause somebody to pull you over. Because, here he Hold on, hold on. Are you saying anything to raise suspicion to cause somebody to pull you over. Because... Hold on, hold on. Let me say something. It does not happen with the frequency. Like I told you earlier.

Hold on, hold on, hold on. I'm telling you, the frequency which you debated with me and was the first time you called me a racist. I told you that I have been pulled over more times than you have and I have. Whether you want to than you have, and I have. Whether you want to accept it or not, I have.

That's objectively true. You're older than me, too. It doesn't matter. I still have, even if you and I were the same age. In the last five years? Yes. Yes. Okay?

Yes. Now, I want you to do something, both of you, and you, too, if you want. Here's an experiment. Okay? You said you had some black friends. I assume you do. You also have some white friends. I want all of you all, ask 10 of your white friends, male friends, what is the first thing,

and you people out there listening, you do the same thing. Ask 10 of your white male friends, what is the first thing that goes through your mind when you're driving home late at night let's say two o'clock in the morning whatever from a date or from getting off work whatever and and you see those those lights come on in your in your rearview mirror those flashing lights you're being pulled over maybe you were speeding maybe you weren't maybe you cross swerved whatever maybe you didn't whatever you're being pulled over What's the first thing that goes through your mind? I will bet you 10 out of 10 or 9 out of 10 of those white males, your friends, are going to say, I hope I don't get a ticket. I hope I don't get points on my

license. I hope my insurance doesn't go up. You ask the same question to 10 of your black male friends, they're not going to say anything about the damn ticket or points on the license or insurance. They're going to say, I hope I don't get shot. I hope I don't get beat up. Because there is a more frequency of violence against black male drivers than white male drivers. Okay?

Just like there is more of a frequency of blacks being sentenced to death and whites for the same crime get to go to prison for life or life with parole. Okay. That is called racism. And that's why black people get that talk. I'm not saying white people don't get the talk, but black people's lives are more in danger. And that's why Black Lives Matter was created. I'm not saying I'm a proponent of that movement or whatever. I'm just telling you why it was created. Because of the things that were happening to black people where they were not happening to white people in the same situation.

Black Lives Matter was started over Trayvon Martin. That's right. And Zimmerman's a Hispanic guy. And the... Zimmerman, he is of Hispanic descent, but Zimmerman enjoyed what is called white privilege. That's critical race theory. The idea that white people...

That's your definition of critical race theory. Kimberly Crenshaw, I can pull it up right here for you. Listen, that's your definition of critical race theory. Whiteness as property in which she described how passing led to benefits a kid to owning property. Yeah, this is Cheryl L. Harris in the Harvard Law Review.

And citation for it is Crenshaw et al. 1995. So this idea that because Zimmerman, I mean, I disagree. I don't think he looked white. I think he looked like a Mexican guy. And further, the news lied about what Zimmerman did.

NBC edited his phone call to make it seem like he was racially profiling when he wasn't. So the narrative that emerged from that was actually fabricated. Okay. Do you remember – well, you're probably too young for that, but you know about it. The O.J. Simpson trial? Yeah. Do you remember O.J.'s picture on the cover of Time Magazine and Newsweek? No.

Okay, well, then you guys need to research that, okay? Time Magazine and Newsweek Magazine came out the same day. Time Magazine intentionally darkened O.J. Simpson's picture. Darker than his skin tone. Because the blacker you are, the more evil you are. There you go. Voila. That is racism.

I don't give a damn what you all say. You can call it critical race theory. You can call it whatever the hell you want to call it. That is racism. That is what this country is predicated upon. To turn white people against people of darker skin. And that's why I get pulled over more than you and more than you and more than your 10 white friends. But Newsweek didn't darken his skin?

Well, I can't tell. Listen, you can argue all you want. There's your picture right there. One is showing a darker version of the event. One is showing O.J. Simpson in his real skin tone, and the other one is showing him darkened. And Time Magazine did that intentionally. But Newsweek didn't.

I don't know if they did or not, but look at that. That's how I know O.J. Simpson. I don't know him personally. I think the media is garbage. I think the media is overtly racist and trash. I think they employ some of the most vile racists. Oh, whoa, whoa, whoa. You're saying all media?

Oh, my goodness. Oh, yeah. Oh, no, no, no. It's like this Council on Foreign Relations media. You're the media. You're the media. Yeah, for sure. I'm not calling you a racist. I don't think everybody here is racist.

No, you know, I'm just so disdainful of corporate press. So usually the colloquial definition of the media is – So is everybody at Time Magazine responsible for that? Yes. Really? Oh, I'm not going to swear. Even the peons? Yes.

No, not the cheap workers. It's some brainchild. If you guys listen to this show, you know my position on all of this. If you stand beneath the infrastructure holding it up as they do things that are wrong and you know they're doing it wrong, I will hold you responsible. You know the Chinese have this term called bite swa which means white liberal like that's a white left white left which is inherently i feel like a lot of this racism is being seeded like it didn't up until i'm not saying it didn't exist but in like the early 2000s it felt like there was a we were coming together it felt like it i felt like it did you feel like it in that

you know i i see progress all the time. I think right now, right now, there are people who would disagree with me, but I would say right now is one of the best times in our country, even though we're so divided, all right, because the wool is being pulled back. The carpet is being pulled back and we're seeing all the dirt. People are saying how they feel, what they're thinking, etc. It's hard to address something when people are hiding in the closet or hiding behind a smile and stab you in the back. Right now, people are expressing their views. It's very divisive, but this is the best time because now we know what people are thinking. We know how to address them rather than be a, what do you call it, a wolf in sheep's

clothing. Okay. YouTube literally just deleted all of the super chats. Oh. Yep. No kidding. No kidding. The only ones that are up are the ones that are in the active chat, so I'll see what I

can... Whoa. How did I delete them? No, no. YouTube just went... They were probably too racy. Has that ever happened to you before? No.

Wow. Yeah. What happened? So the paid comments where people were asking questions just crashed. They're gone. Why? I don't know. Oh.

I've never seen that. I'll just say it was a browser error, I suppose. I'm still seeing them come in. I can see them come in, and I can see the ones that are over the chat, but I can't see any of the other ones. And I don't know how much more time we have. I don't have a whole lot. I've got to go out of town tonight. Alright, alright. Sorry guys, YouTube just

nuked your Super Chats. I suppose we'll just read a couple more, but I think people are unhappy with your views. Well, you know what? People have been unhappy with my views for 400 years. So I'll read this. BlackRockBeacon

says, Daryl is done. He has abandoned nuance and critical thinking and has become emotionally defensive and lost empathy. He is literally starting to rant when pressed with logical arguments. He's entitled to his opinion and that's fine. I think that people need to recognize that the conversation is happening and everyone's in a different spot on it.

And Daryl is extremely pro free speech, vastly more than many people sort of in the critical race theory realm. And that I absolutely appreciate that. And a lot of people won't come on this show to talk. So that matters. Someone just mentioned that the chat was gone too. Oh, it's bad. I'm watching it live right now. Did you see the chat disappear at all?

No. Someone said YouTube wiped the whole chat, not just Super Chats. Oh, okay. Yeah, this kind of conversation is hot. I mean, that's the reason why not everyone does it. And this is why it's good. Because now people like this guy criticizing me, it's free to express his view.

I'm free to express my view. He can think whatever he wants to think about me. I'm fine with that. I've been, you know, called every name in the book. I've been called every name but my own. And that's fine. Okay? He's entitled to his views.

I'm entitled to my views. Okay? And, you know, like you guys never saw those pictures before. Why is that? We're too young. No, not because you're too young. Because you haven't done the research. They're there.

They're there. Go back and connect the dots, Tim. You're talking from a bubble, man. You're not talking from the past moving forward. A gap, exactly. So we've got to bridge that gap, and that's why I'm here, to connect some dots for you as to why I've arrived at this point. Right, right. So I think the issue we experience is that the world and the information we consume as millennials is so vastly different from yours that we see it's literally two different universes.

But you know what? Figuratively. You are here. Figur two different universes. But you know what? Figuratively. You are here. Figuratively different universes. Whatever universe you're in is because of the universe from which it came. But you don't look back to see where you came from. I mean, I do. That's a good point about censorship.

Just because I didn't know of the one story doesn't mean I don't know his story. Talking about his story. You're talking about history. His story. Like, who's controlling his story? Who's writing it? I like your idea, Bill, about freedom. I're talking about history, his story. Like who's controlling his story? Who's writing it? I like your idea, Bill, about freedom. I've got a Life magazine from 1944 that I picked up at an antique shop.

And I've also got one from the 1950s. And I think it's got – who's on the cover? Is it Nixon? Winston Churchill. Nixon doing a peace sign for a big crowd. And it's talking about the civil rights movement. It's fascinating to read the 1944 – it was March just before D-Day, a couple months. And the explanation for why US forces were in Britain is like laughable. It's like, well,

now we know. But when you read stuff in the past, it's amazing what people thought about this stuff, how information was being withheld. But I think what's happening is for most of the people who watch, the bulk of our viewership, like 60%, 70%, are between 18% and 35%. So the news that they're reading is rapid, and they've probably heard everything you've mentioned. No. I doubt that. Well, when you live in the digital world and it's – They have access to everything.

100,000 tweets every single day that you're being slammed by. It's very different. So I think – we see it with Bill Maher. We've seen it with our other guests who are in the Boober generation that the rate of information consumption for the older generation is substantially slower based on just the traditional information gathering practices of the previous generation relative today. So these younger people right now, as you're saying it, are Googling it in real time. And they're commenting saying you're wrong about this. And so that's one of the challenges we have, why we have to be walking on ice and making sure we're doing the best, is that the 50,000 people concurrently watching at any moment

are all sending the real-time fact check because they can research exactly what we say. So most of these people... Now, as far as them telling me that I'm wrong, I don't believe that they are factual. They're telling me that I'm wrong based upon their opinion and what they think about what I'm saying. That's fair. But a good example is the Kimberly Crenshaw thing,

who explicitly wrote that race, Marxism, and all that stuff... I don't have a laptop in front of me, okay? But I can send you a link to Kimberly Crenshaw talking about what she means by quick race theory and the same argument that you gave that she refutes.

And I will send you that link. Like, I just read her book. I read the first introduction to her book. So what? You know, I mean, I was showing... If she recanted her book, I mean, that'd be fantastic. We could talk about it. I don was showing... If she recanted her book, I mean, that'd be fantastic. We could talk about it. Listen, I don't know. If she recanted her book, I know what she said on live interview.

Okay? You can see her talking. Okay? Yeah. People say, you know, listen, people have done interviews with me and have gotten it wrong. Okay? For example, I won't name the school. A very famous university hired me to come do a lecture. All right. And this guy called me before the lecture and wanted to know if he

could interview me before I, before I came, well, when I came down before I gave the lecture from the student paper, I said, sure. I said, but are you going to stay for the lecture? Because I want you to see the lecture as well. And then you can interview me after as well. He said, okay. So he interviewed me when I came down to the university. Good guy, good lecture, good interview. And he stuck around, watched the lecture, asked me a few questions afterwards. The next day, headline in this famous university paper, first black member of the Ku Klux Klan speaks on campus. Now, he did not write that caption, that headline. That was done by the editor of the paper or whatever.

The campus had an uproar and they had to make a retraction. There are no black editor of the paper or whatever you know the campus had an uproar and they had to make them you know make a retraction there are no black members of the clan if there were black members of the clan there wouldn't be a damn plan okay but you know people get things wrong in writing i can show you a link of her talking now whether she wrote it in the book and then changed her mind or whether the book got it wrong or whatever i i will send you a link to her talking answering the exact question that you said, which is opposite of what the other guy says. I do think I've watched her give a statement.

She's given several interviews. I'm pretty sure I've seen a bunch of them. I suppose the issue is just what she wrote in her books versus what she says today may be different. Listen, George Wallace, do you know who he is oh yeah okay and you know what he did he uh school segregation and all that stuff segregation today tomorrow and forever stood in the in the door wouldn't let the uh the black kids come in national guard had to come and pull him out of the door okay he got shot i watched him get shot

wow i watched him get shot on live TV. The news was covering his speech. He was in a town called Laurel, Maryland, over in Prince George's County. And he was in the parking lot giving a speech. There were some black guys in the back of the crowd and a bunch of white people up front and he was giving his you know racist speech and um all of a sudden boom boom boom right on live tv he got shot everybody turned and looked at the black people it was a white guy up front named arthur bremer who shot uh george wallace okay arthur bremer just got out of prison a couple years ago anyway he went to Hagerstown prison later George Wallace

spent the rest of his life in a wheelchair as a result of that shooting from the wheelchair he said he was wrong he changed his racist attitude now most people don't remember that they remember him segregation today tomorrow forever you know they remember the negative stuff but they don't remember that wallace changed his tune so i will just say i i uh i think it's it's funny you mentioned everyone looked at the black people

was a white guy because you know why don't you they assumed people who are mad at them were probably black exactly but the funny thing is today when it comes to issues of critical race theory it is white is white people who are advocating this mostly and that may be a a the fact that white people are the majority of this country so you'll see more white people advocating for critical race theory but typically a lot of these progressive ideologies like gender ideology or race ideology come from white liberals it It's also, you say, more white people advocating for critical race theory. It's also more of white people advocating to ban critical race theory. Yeah, I think one of the issues is that people are confused and they're not arguing the same thing. Exactly. That's my

whole point. There are so many different definitions of it. You have yours. Crenshaw has hers. Kendi has his. What's that lady's name? Robin somebody. She has hers. I think critical race praxis should be banned the same as Christian praxis should be banned. We shouldn't be putting ideology in our curriculum, but we can teach about what the ideology is. So the issue is like if a Florida school said, Jesus died and on the third day he rose again. If a day has 24 hours, how many hours was it until Jesus rose again? I'd be like, yo, that should not be in a math book, right?

Would you think that's appropriate for a public school math problem? Well, you got to understand something. When I grew up and was going to school, first thing we did in class was stand up and pray and say the Pledge of Allegiance. You would pray as well? Yeah.

Yeah, we all said a prayer. But based on today's standards in which we don't allow prayer in public schools, I mean, do you think prayer should be in public schools? I think so. Oh, okay. However, I think people, it depends upon the classroom, okay?

If there's a Muslim person in the classroom, and there's a Jewish person, and there's a Christian person or Hindu person, I think they each should say a prayer. If someone is an atheist, then they can opt to leave the room or remain seated or do whatever they want to do. They should be respected as well. Have no thought. Chris H. just said, Congress officially apologized for slavery in 2008. No. They didn't? No.

You want to look it up, somebody? Yeah, what was the statement? Congress officially apologized for slavery in 2008. Yeah, but were they legit? Let's find out first. Official apology. I think we've gone way long. I know you've got to go, and we've got to wrap, so I'm going to read.

We'll just read one more. We'll read two more, actually. The got to go and we got to wrap. So I'm going to read just, we'll just read one more. We'll read two more. Actually, the first one will come from Maltese as a black man. I disagree with quite a bit of what Daryl said, but I will forever respect this man's action better than any Antifa thug has done. And then there is, there's another really good one that we need to read because it's the most important one. Where did it go?

Oh, there we go. Andrew Lantz says, thank you, Daryl. This has been a really good conversation that reminds me of many I have had with various black friends I've known. I think people, I just got to say for everybody who watches or listens to this show,

we are trying to have more discussions over ideas that we disagree with. We're trying to make more of that. That we routinely invite people on the left or progressive or whatever. They just don't want to come on the show. Some are, and we have a few booked, and I appreciate their expressing their viewpoints. Okay. And I think we should have more of these discussions. So I hope we can do that. Now, to your point about these people who are on the left or whatever, who don't want to come, I was invited a couple of years ago to this, this lady called me up. She's a sociologist professor. And she wanted to know

would I consider coming to a dinner gathering with some people on the left and some people on the right. And she named a few white supremacists, one being Richard Spencer.

And I said, sure. So, you know, they didn't reveal where the dinner was to be held until the day of, because they wanted to keep it secret or whatever. So on the day of, I got the email as to what address to come to, et cetera, et cetera, what time. And I showed up, and there were all these people over there on the right Richard Spencer some other neo-nazi type people and this that and the other and we had dinner

together no one from the left but me showed up and you know they backed out at the last minute that's exactly what happens well you know I'm not one of those who back out I will stand up to anybody and everybody and you're welcome to agree with me you're welcome to agree with me.

You're welcome to disagree with me. But let's have the conversation. I agree, man. And I appreciate you having me on the show. Oh, I appreciate you coming, man. I thought this was fantastic. You know, if people don't get along or if people disagree or even if they agree, I think we most, I think we agree on a lot more than we disagree on.

I think we just highlighted disagreements because we disagree. We want to express those the most you know i think often the conversations we have an agreement it's like well yeah of course we agree on those things but let's move on to the things we don't know right exactly let's get hot so considering we've gone way too late tonight oh i want to point out you were right uh congress apologized for slavery there's a lot of npr stuff from 2008 apparently the u.s house of representatives issued an unprecedented apology to black amer Americans for the institution of slavery and the subsequent Jim Crow

laws for years of discrimination. Steve Cohen, Democrat from Tennessee, drafted the resolution. Now, to be honest, my personal opinion, platitudes. A real apology is fixing the system. But thank you for at least putting forth

an official apology, Congress, at some point. Here's what we've got to do. So everyone is actually saying, you know, who do we have to bribe to have you have a conversation with Thomas Sowell? Oh, that would be amazing. I don't know if we can. We can have him. Of course we can. All right.

Thomas Sowell, John McWhorter, a lot of other people, you know, they have their opinions. Some I agree with, some I don't agree with. It doesn't make them right. It doesn't make me wrong. It doesn't make me right and them wrong or whatever. I think people would just love to see the intellectual clash, as it were, like the ideas presented. Maybe we'll do that this summer. In June. People get a kick out of seeing black people fight each other

for whatever reason. White people get a kick out of that. Okay? I'm telling you all, get the movie. Go on, it used to be on Netflix, it's not on there anymore, Amazon Prime or iTunes. Okay? It's called Accidental Courtesy.

And they followed me around the country when i was interviewing kkk and neo-nazis etc and they they set me up to interview some people a faction of black lives matter and there was a major clash between me and black lives matter it happened at our event and um yeah and but but're going to see this on film. And you're going to see about eight minutes. This went on for about an hour, and it almost erupted into violence. Wow. Okay?

Take a look at that. You know, they did not respect, you know, what I stood for, what I did, etc., etc. Now, a year later, they reached out to me and said, you know, we've been seeing you, we've been reading some interviews, you know, we sort of get what you're doing. You know, we want to try to work together. You know, we don't agree with everything, but we think, you know, we can find some common ground.

So we met and we had dinner. And we started working together. And then one of them fell off the wagon and reverted back to himself, you know, in the whole movie the whole movie everybody talks about that particular scene because for whatever reason now you're going to call me a racist again and that's fine if you want to call me that a lot of white people try to put black people

in one box we are not monolithic. We are as individual as white people. Okay? Just like, you know, people say, well, you know, your black leaders, you know, should do this and do that. Who are my black leaders?

You know? Is it Sharpton? Is it Jesse Jackson? Is it Obama? Is it Thomas Sowell? Is it John McWhorter? I mean, who are my black leaders? I hope it's not Farrakhan.

Who are your white leaders? Is it Donald Trump? Is it the imperial wizard of the Ku Klux Klan? Obama. I'm my own leader. It's Obama. Well, exactly. You know, you have all your own people. You know, your leader might be different than his leader than his leader. Well, we don't have white

leaders. We had an orange leader for a little while, right? Yeah, technically. Now let's get specific about skin tone than his leader. We don't have white leaders. We had an orange leader for a little while, right? He thinks he's still the leader. Now let's get specific about skin tone color. You know what? The best thing that I saw I'm still doing this. I still go to Klan rallies and all that kind of stuff. But one of the best things I saw, I went to a Klan rally

and it was held on the lawn of the governor's mansion in the state capitol. And there are all these protesters and all the state police keeping the protesters at a distance from the people in the robes and hoods. Well, these people showed up who had painted themselves green

and they were yelling, green power, green power. That was the best thing I'd ever seen. Yeah, because I'm kind of pink. Your skin tone is a little auburn. Now I like the specifics. Now we're nuanced. We went way late for a Friday, but it was really good. Daryl, this was fantastic.

Thank you for having me. Thank you so much for coming. Hopefully you'll get me back. Not everybody liked the show, but 88% liked the show. And I think people should expect two things. We are going to have conversations that we'll disagree on. People will not agree. And I am not a master debater.

I am not a debater. But we'll have conversations. And so if the issue is you feel like I don't do a good enough job, well, maybe we should actually do like what we did with Charlie Kirk and Vosh. And we'll have people who actually want to have a debate have a debate here, but don't expect me. I'm not that kind of guy, right? So if you do like the show and you appreciate that we're doing our best, I thank you so much for watching. And if you don't like it, thanks for watching anyway. You're up to your opinions, and we respect all of your comments and everything. Head over to TimCast.com if you want to support the show and support our journalists. You can follow the show at

TimCastIRL. You can follow me at TimCast. Daryl, do you want to shout anything out? Hey, really appreciate everybody. You can find me at Daryldavis.com. D-A-R-Y-L 1R at Davis.com. Right on. And thank you for attending. Hope we can come back sometime. Absolutely. Yeah, we'll do it. Yeah, thanks for having me, everyone. I'm Bill. Find me at Minds.com

slash Outman. Alright. I'm Ian Crossland and I love you guys. Thank you for coming. Everybody, Tim, you're great, man. This is really cool. One more time, your documentary, the name of it? Accidental Courtesy. Accidental Courtesy. Look for it on iTunes or Amazon Prime.

Beautiful. Thank you guys very much for tuning in. It's been a very engaging conversation, a lot of fun. I always love sparring conversations like this and I'm really glad that we went long this evening. It's always more interesting. It's way more interesting to have someone you don't agree with fully on any one thing. Anyway, you guys can follow

me on Twitter and Minds.com at Sarah Patchlitz. One last shout-out. Colin Stevens said, Tim, get Thomas Sowell and Clarence Thomas on. Oh, yeah. That would be one of the greatest shows ever for any podcast at any point ever. I would love that to happen. I'll throw some coins into a wishing well

and see if they can make it happen. Thanks for hanging out, everybody, and we'll see you all next time. Wait, wait, wait. Is it too late? No, okay. Go to Chicken City. Watch Chicken Sleeping.

YouTube, chickencitylive.com. All right, we'll see you later. Bye.