Timcast IRL - Timcast IRL #879 Hamas BEHEADED BABIES According To Reports, US Offers Special Forces w/Max Blumenthal

Episode Date: October 11, 2023

Tim, Ian, Phil, & Serge join Max Blumenthal to discuss reports claiming Hamas killed babies & beheaded them, the argument that Hamas terror attack was really a military operation, how the Israel Palestine conflict has been going on for generations, and Max Blumenthal arguing that the Abraham Accords caused the Hamas terror attack. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

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Download the BetMGM Ontario app today. You don't want to miss out. Visit BetMGM.com for terms and conditions. 19 plus to wager, Ontario only. Please gamble responsibly. If you have questions or concerns about your gambling or someone close to you, This is a serious story that's been circulating. And already the internet is up in arms over whether or not they believe it. With many people who are pro-Israel saying how could you not the reporting coming out that babies had been beheaded by hamas and it sounds so extreme it is i mean this quite in a literal sense it is unbelievable but uh fox news is reporting it i-24 initially reported it and

there are many people who are skeptical of this because of past testimony, the New Year testimony in particular, back during, I think it was in the early 90s, when a young woman claimed that Saddam's forces were taking babies out of incubators. So we're going to talk about the news that's coming out. And obviously, this is a very, very complex issue that is extremely heated. But of course, it is now on the forefront as U.S. special forces are offering assistance over the hostages who have been taken by Hamas, which Biden says many may be American citizens. Of course, there was a carrier group dispatched and fears that this could escalate into a more serious conflict. And if we're seeing conflict now escalating to the point of U.S. or other countries mobilizing, you know, maybe we're at the point where we might say World War Three.

They've been saying that about Ukraine for some time now. But when we get, you know, conflict at this level in various regions, if China then moves on Taiwan, things get really, really bad. So we'll talk about that. Plus several of the stories. But for the most part, this is the news that's dominating right now. Before we get started, my friends, head over to castbrew.com. You like coffee? I know you do. We got coffee. You want to buy it from us.

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out with like-minded individuals can submit questions and actually call into the show and talk to us and our guests so smash that like button subscribe to this channel share the show right now take that url post it on every platform if you really do want to help out joining us tonight to talk about this and a whole lot more is max blumenthal how's it going it's going good who are you first of all thank you for the malort yes uh i cannot believe that max came in and i said we have water we have we have uh you know some whiskey and you can have whatever you want most people don't drink these days and he went oh i'll have the malort and i was like what so for those that don't know malort is a it's a joke in chicago it is like uh considered to be not good we're about to we're just about to like reveal the greatest secret is a, it's a joke in Chicago. It is like considered to be not good.

We're about to, we're just about to like reveal the greatest secret right now. Cause it's, it's dope. I mean, you like it. I got hooked on it. My, most of my family's from Chicago and I just got hooked on it out there. It's made out of wormwood. It's like, it's like bathtub prohibition style liquor and it's a very acquired taste. And so, yeah, I was was really it was really a privilege

to try that um i am the editor founder of thegrayzone.com we're an independent website because you really can't say anywhere outside of independent media these days most of the people i work with all of them can't work in media and we focus mostly on issues of empire, foreign policy. We try to touch the third rail, say what other people say, say what isn't being said. And I think our work really speaks for itself. And we try to focus on reporting investigative journalism and not striding commentary. We do lots of video work. We do a stream every week. I've written four books. I've done two books on Israel-Palestine. Wow. Goliath and the 51 Day War, where I covered the war in Gaza in 2014, which lasted for

51 days. And I've done a documentary about that called Killing Gaza, which is free on YouTube. You can find it at the Grey Zone YouTube channel. I directed it. Dan Cohen did YouTube channel. I directed it. Dan Cohen did a lot of filming for it. And we, I mean, Dan interviewed fighters from these Gaza factions about why they fight. We interviewed people who have been, who've just, we showed the whole spectrum of life in the Gaza Strip under siege. And so, you know, from that experience that I've had, I am not surprised at all by what's happening right now. I'm not

shocked, as upsetting as it is to watch. I'm not shocked at all. So what you're saying is you're totally partisan. No one can trust you. No, I'm just kidding. Well, I'm transparent. And I think that's what people like is they know where you're coming from. Well, I think it'll be, it'll be interesting to, to talk to you about it. I'm biased, but I,

I mean, we need, if we, we wouldn't have got anywhere at the gray zone if we weren't factual. But I obviously have a bias and that will come out in the next three hours. I think it'll be, I think it'll be great. So thanks for coming.

Thanks for this. Yeah. Right on. We got Phil Labonte hanging out. Hello everybody. My name is Phil Labonte, very failed musician, vocalist for all that remains, anti-communist and counter-revolutionary.

You guys, Ian Cross, and I've had a powerful 24 hours. I prayed to Jesus for the first time in my life last night. Actually, no, last night was the second time I prayed to Jesus. Last night I said, Jesus, what should I do? And he said, go surfing. And I was like, but I knew what he meant. It was like, get healthy, go out on the water,

get away from all the radiation, like find peace with yourself. Ian got love bombed. Yeah, and then the comments are like thousands of people, like finally you understand what it sounds like, what his voice sounds like. And it's like, I get it. I appreciate it.

Yes, but I also prayed to Muhammad. And I said, please help me. And he said, it was this visualization of a knife like his anger was palpable so i started listening to the quran to understand how he thinks so that maybe i can have a more clear prayer union with him well you know quite powerful take your journey and also it's interesting that uh in gaza palestine they had the 51 day war because i want to make palestine the 51st american state i think this is the solution we're just here to offend everybody with yeah I want to make Palestine the 51st American state. Whoa! I think this is the solution.

We're just here to offend everybody with the next show. Disavow! I want to make life good for those people. I want to make it a high-tech place where people can thrive and communicate with their neighbors and live in peace. We can have trade unions all working. And it can be Islamic in nature. It'll be wonderful. I think Ian's probably just being a little hyperbolic to shock people.

I am desperate. Absolutely looking for a way. I think it's fair to say, no matterbolic to shock people. I am desperate. Absolutely looking for a way. I think it's fair to say, no matter who you are, we want peace in the Middle East. We want peace in the world. But we'll get into it. We got Serge here. Yeah, man. You don't pray to Muhammad, but I mean anyways, yeah. Serge.gov

today. Fill in for Serge.com. At least the way I'm dressed. You can tell by the nice do. Anyways, yeah. Let's get into it, Tim. All right. Here's the big story. This is from Fox News. They say at least the way I'm dressed. You can tell by the nice do. Anyways, yeah, let's get into it, Tim. All right, here's the big story. This is from Fox News. They say at least 40 babies, some beheaded,

found by Israel soldiers in Hamas-attacked village. IDF Major General Itai Verov described the scene in Kfar Aza as a massacre. Israel's military has discovered unspeakable horrors in an Israeli community

that was attacked by Hamas on Saturday, including dozens of dead babies, some with their heads chopped off, Israeli media reported. According to local Israeli outlet I-24 News, IDF soldiers moved into Kfar Aza, one of the community's Hamas terrorists, invaded early Saturday morning and

discovered about 40 dead babies, some decapitated. They say it several times before the article gets started. The IDF were removing the bodies of victims found in the area when they found the children's remains. Israeli soldiers are attempting to use bones to identify the victims, according to the report. It's not a war. It's not a battlefield. You see the babies, the mother, the father, in their bedrooms, in their protection rooms, and how the terrorists killed them. IDF Major General Itai Varuv said, describing the scene. I-24 reported it's a massacre.

Now, immediately, a lot of people brought up the Nayyirah testimony, which is a young woman, Nayyirah al-Sabah, in the early 90s, in 1990, early 90s, who had stated that Saddam's forces were pulling babies out of incubators and leaving them to die. So, the news is obviously shocking. And the first thing I'm going to say as we get into this subject matter is, look, man, this is such a heated issue. There are there's people tweeting out photos and videos. They're saying the attacks, it's pure evil. Don't support this. You've got tweets from people like Ben Shapiro saying there's a big difference between Israel trying to prevent civilian deaths and Hamas targeting civilians. So obviously, this is extremely heated. That being said, I remain skeptical on stories like this. There are a lot of videos I'm seeing

shared. I can't prove these videos are what people say they are. There are some videos that are easily discernible. Like, yes, there's paratroopers coming in. Some of these are clearly not from, they're not, what people will do is they'll take videos from other conflicts and then they'll caption them and put them as if it was now to shock you or whatever.

Some of the videos we've seen are clear and plain as day. And I think the reporting speaks for itself. But then there are more shocking stories like this. There are videos that start right in the middle of something egregious happening that we don't know where they come from. So i just hope everybody keeps a level head to the best of their abilities we can try and figure out what's true and what isn't but i'm curious what all of

you guys think about this latest reporting because this is look the the idea that babies are beheaded is is international cass's belly i mean it is the u.s sending a strike group a carrier group this is we rally our allies and say, these terrorist groups must be stopped. That's why I have fears about what these stories mean. The first thing I heard, or the first thing that I thought when I heard it was obviously the stories that led to the first Iraq war. That's the, no, your testimony.

Yeah, so, I mean, that was the first thing I thought of. Discover the magic of Bad MGM Casino, where the excitement is always on deck. Pull up a seat and check out a wide variety of table games with a live dealer. From roulette to blackjack, watch as a dealer hosts your table game and live chat with them throughout your experience to feel like you're actually at the casino. The excitement doesn't stop there. With over 3,000 games to choose from,

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19 plus to wager. Ontario only. Please gamble responsibly. If you have questions or concerns about your gambling or someone close to you, please contact Connex Ontario at 1-866-531-2600 to speak to an advisor free of charge. BetMGM operates pursuant to an operating agreement with iGaming Ontario. I mean, there's plenty of actual evidence of horrible things happening when the Palestinians actually, you know, launched the attack. I think it was like 1,500 actual fighters they said actually went into Palestine.

Into Israel, you mean? Yeah, I'm sorry, into Israel. There's plenty of evidence that they killed innocent people. There's plenty of evidence that they, you know, carried out what amounts to a terror attack. It's not a military operation. There's plenty of evidence that they you know carried out what amounts to a terror attack it's not a military operation there's plenty of evidence so there are videos you don't want to watch absolutely and and i don't so i don't need to i don't need to believe that they were cutting off babies heads to condemn the attack on israel so you know i if if it turns out that it happened i'm not shocked i mean i was alive when isis when when the the the uh the islamic state was in existence and the i saw videos of them

cutting off people's heads and doing terrible things i remember 9 11 you know that you don't need to have this particular thing to be real to to be like, okay, terrorists do really horrible, horrible things with the intent of terrorizing people. I'm curious what you think, Max. Yeah, I would be shocked, first of all, because Hamas is mortally opposed to ISIS and Salafi elements. They've actually battled them in the streets in Rafah before. They consider them a threat to their stability. And Israeli intelligence actually has worked with Salafi elements in Gaza to destabilize Hamas, just as Israeli intelligence supported Hamas to destabilize the PLO when it controlled Gaza in the 1980s. far on this story is one Israeli soldier who's a very interesting character. We've traced his identity at the gray zone. And it comes through a state-sponsored Israeli media organization, as you pointed out, I-24, the reporter Nicole Sedeck, who just went to Kfar Aza and said,

I'm hearing that babies were beheaded. Then the Israeli foreign ministry goes and blasts it out, 40 babies beheaded. Why? Because the U.S. bombed the crap out of ISIS in Raqqa. We destroyed half of the city of Raqqa. And that's what Israel wants us to do to Iran. They want us to see Hamas as ISIS and then to get involved in their regional conflict. So they're pushing this story. The source is a Israeli soldier named David Ben-Zion, who is a settler leader. He's from one of the fanatical wings of Israeli politics. And he, you know, he's a reservist. He's serving in the military. But he got in trouble earlier this year because he called for an entire Palestinian village

to be wiped off the map next to his illegal settlement in the West Bank. And he's the guy that she's interviewing as her credible witness. I don't trust it. And as you said, Israel has enough to go on right now to try to portray itself, even though it's the occupier and besieger of the Gaza Strip, according to international law, to portray itself as a victim. Why do they need to do this? It's because they're trying to draw the U.S. in. I agree with that for sure that because because that's why everybody immediately brings up the near testimony what will shock americans to the most extreme degree to justify u.s involvement you should break that down though like the near testimony yeah i mean i can i can break it down we have the wikipedia we pulled up uh false testimony given to the

united states congressional human rights caucus october 10th 1990 by a 15 year old girl who was public identified by the time by her first name, Nayira. The testimony was widely publicized and was cited numerous times by U.S. senators and George H.W. Bush in their rationale to support Kuwait in the Gulf War. In 1992, it was revealed Nayira's last name was Al-Sabah and that she was the daughter of Saud Al-Sabah, the Kuwaiti ambassador to the U.S. Furthermore, it was revealed that a testimony was organized as part of the Citizens for a Free Kuwait

Public Relations campaign, which was run by the American public relations firm Hill and Knowlton for the Kuwaiti government. Following this, al-Sabah's testimony has become regarded as a classic example of modern atrocity propaganda. So it is false testimony. Her story

initially was even corroborated by Amnesty International. So this is crazy. I mean, I'm a little kid. I'm four years old when this stuff's going down. Actually, what month was it? It was October. So I was four. The story was that they were stabbing babies in incubators with bayonets and throwing them on the ground so that way they could take the incubators back to iraq from kuwait that was the

that was the story like and i mean i was 15 when i heard it or whatever so you know what the hell did i know but i was like oh that's so terrible but now looking back obviously it's like it especially today with the the way that we have the ability to communicate and produce fake videos and have videos that don't have any context with them you have to be really careful you know look man uh do i think it's possible that some babies were killed yes absolutely uh if if they're if they're coming into a kibbutz and they're shooting yeah there's crossfire i see kids killed in chicago right it's and you're in an active conflict zone likely gonna happen i think it's possible that uh like the most

reasonable and rational thing that could that i would say highest probability in terms of this being truthful is that you know a couple babies died one had its man this is such a horrible thing to say but severely injured to the point of decapitation and then someone passes it along and it purple monkey dishwashers itself the telephones itself into 40 babies killed beheaded and a more extreme version of the story but now it serves a political purpose so it escalates to a point where fox news is reporting it headline as though it's you know proven the challenging thing is what do you need how do you prove it what do you like what do you do if this is if this is true if they're? Well, there's another purpose to it, which is to deflect from the obviously true real videos of babies being killed by Israeli airstrikes all across the Gaza Strip.

When I was in Gaza in 2014, I went to Khan Yunis, which is in the southeast, had been completely destroyed at its eastern edge by the Israeli military. And the casualties were so intense that the hospital started filling up in Khan Yunis. And I went to a small hospital and talked to the head of the hospital, and he showed me photos. And these photos are on my Twitter page from the time, all real. He had to bring in from local shops ice cream coolers to store dead babies in because the mortuaries had run out of space. And now we see Israel attacking. The hospital in Beit Hanun in the north is completely out of commission.

All of these hospitals are coming under attack. So babies are dying in the Gaza Strip. There's video right now. Jackson Hinkle just tweeted a video of a father carrying his baby out of the rubble. There's another video on Times of Gaza, a local publication of a father putting his infant daughter to sleep for the last time. And they've completely erased these casualties. They've always been erased.

And that's part of what fuels the violence and the ruthlessness that we see from these fighters is that they want to avenge what they call their martyrs. And that fuels what is referred to as the cycle of violence. That's the invisibilization of them. So you think that some Hamas fighters, they target civilians because civilians in Gaza are targeted? Well, first of all, let's point out another thing that's being left out of the conversation. CNN never showed this. CNN never showed this. Fox never showed this.

They targeted military bases, primarily military bases like Nahal Az that are maintaining the siege of Gaza. And they overwhelmed those bases and humiliated the fourth most powerful military on the planet with a blue water navy with nuclear weapons. Some of these fighters were filmed entering the bases with no shoes on. They're using homemade weapons, AK-47s, paragliders, fishing boats to get in. This is not a powerful army and they humiliated them.

And Israelis vaunted intelligence services. So they don't want to talk about that. And yes, they went in. A lot of these kibbutzim are right next to the bases. I've been to them. They did. I've been to them. They did. I mean, this is a terrorist attack.

They went to a music festival and started killing people. So I get what you're saying. They are definitely the underdogs and stuff. But to classify it, to try and point out that it's, or to make it, to legitimize it as an actual military operation, I think totally glosses over the fact that they attacked civilians intentionally. They did. It was a military operation, I think totally glosses over the fact that they attacked civilians intentionally. They did. It was a military operation and Israel is now attacking civilians intentionally.

They're not targeting. Targeting. Israel has a doctrine of targeting civilians intentionally. It's called the Dahiya doctrine. And I can lay out what it is, but they believe that if they attack civilians and humiliate them, they will overthrow overthrow they will eventually rise up against their government they tested it against hezbollah in lebanon and it failed it's called and it's and it's being used against the civilians in the gaza strip they want to

lower their morale so much that they actually turn that you're still talking about you're talking about a retaliation right like because like i said again this initially started and and granted you you i don't know the the details about about where they if they attack the uh the military bases or whatever and i'm not trying to push back on that but the idea that this is just a military operation they specifically went and started killing people at the festival like i i mean it has all of the the it reminds me of the botaclan in paris like it's a terror attack the point is to like so maybe if you want to say that the israelis are terrorists as well fine like i'm not here to defend israel but the idea that the initial attack

was a military operation or exclusively military uh-uh they attacked people and they went after civilians and killed people at a show when max Max started bringing this up, I mean, I'm not interjecting because I want to hear what you have to say about what were they targeting in terms of military targets. I don't think it makes sense for Hamas to come in and just literally only target a music festival. Obviously, I think it's reasonable that they targeted a wide breadth of things. But I do agree with Phil. I mean, the problem is one of the arguments we're hearing is that they're breaking out breadth of things. But I do agree with Phil. I mean, the problem is, one of the arguments we're hearing

is that they're breaking out of an open-air prison. Well, okay, absolutely. I mean, I know people who are the families of those in Palestine, those who have come from Gaza, and absolutely have heard these arguments. But to then see them going to a music festival and laughing about it, you know,

and grabbing people and throwing them on the ground. I mean, I suppose the argument is the videos are all fake or something but there's videos of the guys walk up to cars and just shooting regular people like just in their cars who have no idea what's going on what's that israeli doctrine of targeting civilians called dahiya doctrine and they also if you could if you look up israel and mowing the lawn that's a common term that the israeli military uses that ain't just the israeli military blood makes the grass grow homie no no but we but i i brought this up before when um i think i brought this up when i was on pbd on saturday when this all went down back when protective edge happened in 2014 i i did not cover uh this stuff mine was civil unrest not civil war not not war but uh speaking with many of the journalists who had covered the region both in

israel and in Palestine. And these guys, I got to tell you, if you met them, you'd be like they're middle of the road, milk toast fence that are types. They refer to it as mowing the lawn. They say Israel every couple of years will decimate parts of Gaza to reduce, you know, as they described it, their military capabilities. But I'm curious what you know, if you want to elaborate on that. Yeah, I mean, there's there's so many issues on the table i mean to the music festival which is like the most you know grisly thing one of the most grisly things we've seen prior to israel leveling entire neighborhoods in gaza city including neighborhoods i stayed in where many people actually are not

friendly to hamas um they're holding an edm, Mali-fueled music festival on the border. The drugs that they're on do not matter. It doesn't matter that they're doing... Okay, it doesn't matter what drugs they're on. You're right. What matters is they're holding a music festival on the border of a caged-in ghetto where people have very little water.

They bathe in saltwater in Gaza. I've done it. They bathe in saltwater. They have two to three hours of electricity and they're doing this right there, right next to a military base. And what appears to have happened is a military base was targeted. This music festival became a target of opportunity, which is unfortunate and maybe gut-wrenching. There's no way to justify it. And here's what the objective of these fighters, one of the main objectives, which is not really discussed properly in our media. And it doesn't matter if you support Israel or Palestine here, you have to acknowledge this objective. It's to get as many Israeli citizens into the hands of the authorities in Gaza to negotiate

because Israel is holding thousands and thousands of Palestinian captives in its prison. There is one guy named Hadar Anand who died this May after a three-month hunger strike. So you just said that the goal is to kidnap and return- The goal is to spur negotiations and change the strategic. By kidnapping and bringing them back to Gaza. That's kidnapping. That's terrorist activity. That is not.

I've watched Israel kidnap children. I am not saying that Israel's right. No, it's not. It's not about, this is not about right or wrong. It's about not being, not seeing this in a stupid emotional way. I'm not saying you're being stupid or emotional, but we are being cultivated in this country to be stupid and emotional by not trying to understand why this attack took place. Gilad Shalit was an Israeli soldier who was captured out of his tank in 2011 by fighters from Gaza, actually not affiliated

with Hamas. And Israel was forced to exchange over 1,000 Palestinian prisoners, captives in the mind of Palestinians, for this one soldier. So now they have, let's say, 100 captives. They do not want them to die in Gaza because this is the only bargaining chip they've had after Palestinians have had every single diplomatic channel blocked to them. And they've even had food channels blocked to them and they are even they've even had food channels blocked to them people people want us to take the most emotional approach to this they're killing civilians and stuff i think i think you know that's typically my view it's bad that they're doing that i agree with phil but i do think it's absolutely a fair uh to step back and say why are they doing it how do they

view it and and to do that involves some very ruthless shit well exactly kidnapping civilians which they've explicitly said they will now execute unless israel takes specific specific actions like no more bombings the return of other warn they said warn before bombing because israel's been bringing roofs down on the heads of entire families a family of 19 was killed in jabalia refugee camp that's what they said they didn't the but the palestinians didn't warn the israelis that they were coming to the festival right they didn't warn no and israelis that they were coming in so the festival was the target no it's fine you you they weren't warning they weren't warning people they weren't warning the israelis that they were coming so you're pointing out that the israelis do warn the palestinians like hey this location

we are going to blow it up yeah like i do i i uh correct me if i'm wrong i think uh uh the al-qassan brigades warned ashkelon that they were going to be firing a bunch of rockets ashkelon i think yes they did they should have these areas are now mostly evacuated. But, you know, I've done interviews in Gaza, just like we're doing now, although maybe without the Malort. And I went up in Palestine Tower to do an interview in the middle of Gaza City. I walked up nine flights of stairs because the electricity was off. Everything's running on generators there and did some interviews. A few years later, Israel drops a warning flare on the roof of that media tower where all the journalists work and operate.

I've also edited videos from there with some really nice Palestinian journalists, just cool people you would all like to hang out with who would love to leave their little strip of land and can't anyway. And then Israel brings the whole tower down. There's video of it. So it's okay, they warn it,

but why are they bringing down residential and office towers while everyone is silent allegedly because there's hamas they always say that that building i mean well you asked the reason so that's the reason they say at least so this is this is the challenge for those that are not involved right i i'm i'm anti-war i think u.s involvement in in 99 of things is their lies i mean i grew up on this stuff right all all the lies to get us to what's put military bases surrounding iran uh john bolton saying by this time next year we'll be celebrating in tehran it's it's bloodlust so when i look at something like israel the challenge for me is i'm not nearly as involved as you and i'm not nearly as zealous

as many of the neoconservatives and the more conservative base. So when rockets come flying from Gaza and start blowing up over Tel Aviv, this was huge, right? This was like 2014 when the rockets first started reaching Tel Aviv. Was that...

Because I remember I had a friend in Tel Aviv. I was there at that time, yeah. Messaged me freaking out on Facebook that a rocket exploded over her house and this has never happened before. I just know what to do. And I'm like, man, this is horror. It's horror. It's war. It's terrifying.

How do we stop this? And so what ends up happening is every time I've engaged with it, again, not an expert on this stuff. I mean, I might know a little bit more than the average person. But it's like, I appreciate your perspective. I'm glad you're here to tell us about this stuff too uh because i think only talking to people who are on the more perennial side is going to leave us you know blind to the arguments from the other side but i hear israel they're they're they're using hospitals and schools and civilian areas to launch rockets from knowing that it will make it extremely difficult for israel to stop the rocket fire into

civilian areas then i hear the same thing but a media tower was taken down for what purpose? Why is Israel targeting this? And every time I hear this, my media is communications. I fall right back to this is war. And in, in war, the rule,

there's no rules. Rules are for in my, it's like this idea of war crimes. I always find so silly. Like, obviously we think some things are so egregious that even in war, they're a crime, but yo,

the people who win those wars don't care what you think because you're gone. And so when I look at what's going on in Israel and Palestine, I know that you've got two factions that are going to use whatever arguments, whatever, whatever psychological warfare, whatever physical warfare they can to try and win this. And I know that there probably is a right a right side and someone's telling the truth. And I know for a fact there's an objective truth and lies to what's going on. I don't know how to navigate that. Well, just two points on that. I mean, there's this issue of human shields. Like Biden said, Palestinians are human shields. That's a way of basically saying there are no civilians there at all. And the Gaza Strip is one of the most densely populated places. Two million people. It's two million people. Why are they there? By the way, most of them are refugees and they have to be there because they're not Jewish.

They can't go back to the land of their families pre-1948. They keep having kids. They're being warehoused there. There's surplus humanity. So it's like the logic of a prison. And so everybody there is a human shield. But there was a place I like to eat because it was real cheap in Tel Aviv

that was right next to the defense ministry called Hakiria. And all the generals would be in there, the intelligence chiefs, good Mediterranean food. Are they human shields? Is building this giant tower in the middle of a residential area in Tel Aviv, are they making those people human shields? If that gets hit by Hezbollah and people die nearby, were they being used by Israel as human shields? No one will say that because the logic is so discriminatory towards Palestinians. No one will consider their position. And then the other point I wanted to make is just about the use of violence

in this conflict by Palestinians who have tried everything. I mean, I don't know if you know about what the Great March of Return was. It was sanctioned by Hamas, but it was a grassroots initiative in Gaza to just march without weapons like guns to the wall that surrounds them. And they were shot one by one in the legs. Many of them were killed. Journalists were killed covering it. It was a complete bloodbath. And that's when the society said, you know what? We can't win with this tactic of, you know, walking to the fence and just asking them to let us in.

They don't want us. That's, that's, and so, and everyone, and, and, you know, no one, everyone ignored that. And now they're paying attention to the violence. In Gaza used to have 9 000 settlers in it 9 000 settlers who took like 30 to 40 percent of the water in a place of 1.5 million people why did those settlers leave it was because of the second intifada it was because of the violence that was applied the and much more gruesome violence in many ways than we're seeing now because this was the time of suicide bombings um people willing to die because they were so desperate

blowing themselves up in order to kill because they had no weapons at that point. Now the factions in Gaza actually have reverse engineered Israel's military and they have weapons so they don't need to do suicide bombing. So Gaza did that. They got enforced too.

Hamas did that. Then what is the West Bank right now? It's controlled by the Palestinian Authority, which is funded partly through the EU and State Department. They don't resist Israel. In fact, they arrest Palestinians on behalf of Israel. And what do Palestinians have there? In many ways, they have the same prison style situation as they have in Gaza, but with settlers all around them. So what does that tell Palestinians? It tells them the only way to get this off our back is through violence. Are there Palestinians who live in Israel?

Yes. In like Tel Aviv and all that? Well, they live mostly in an area south called Jaffa or Jaffa. But I mean like somebody who is of Palestinian ancestry. There are 1.5 million Palestinian citizens of Israel. And they're said to have equal rights, but there are discriminatory laws on the books. Yeah. That's what I was going to ask about.

There's like 400 mosques, right? There's like 400 mosques within Israel, right? Yeah. I mean, the mosques operate. I mean, there's pressure on them to shut off the Muzin at night. And there's all kinds of personal, individual conflicts or cultural conflicts taking place. But yes, there are Palestinian citizens. What's the solution?

I mean, it's like the generational question that nobody has the answer to. Offer Palestine to become the 51st state of the United States. Oh, come on, come on. Let's, let's, let's. I'm being 100% serious. Okay, but that's, that's not, that's not serious. Where is, see, Palestine is not a state.

It can be. And no, Hawaiiestine is not a state it can be and no hawaii hawaii can be a state israel will never let them be a country no we work with israel to make it a peaceful place that they either that or they're going to get annihilated what's your other choice i i i i i i'm interested in asking mass uh max this question because of your extensive coverage of it your views on on the conflict yeah and uh right now i think it's fair to say every single person wants peace there's clearly a divide though and it's that israel's view of peace is very different from palestinian view of peace and then say our view of peace right middle of the road anti-war americans who are like why are

we involved in this and how do we make it stop or do we do nothing at all and stay completely out of it because like what is what is this what what what how do we if you know if hamas is like we're gonna go take civilians because they're bargaining chips for us you've now got a story where i'm like bro i'm 37 this conflict's been going on a lot longer than i've been alive and all i know is i watch a video of people storming a music festival killing and kidnapping people all i see that's bad we want to stop i see three ways for this to end either it's the total obliteration and annihilation of two million palestinians or it's they refugee and they flee the land and they come here to the united states or somewhere else or they are absorbed into another nation i i so those are three solutions that israeli leadership is

kind of putting forward because they cannot exist with palestinians in their midst and eat like egypt doesn't want to take them and and jordan was doesn't want to take them and lebanon doesn't want no one wants to take palestinians yet why won't egypt open up Rafah and let them come? Because it's politically useful to have the Palestinian problem. The fight between the Arabs and the Jews, that's politically useful. The Jordan is politically useful to Lebanon. It's politically useful to Egypt.

It's for the same reason that many Americans don't want Hondurans or Mexicans coming across the border. Egyptians look down on Palestinians and they consider them a burden on a society with 90 million people with a very weak state where there's a lot of poverty. And the Rafah crossing between Gaza and Israel was bombed today with many people who are dual nationals trying to get out, as Netanyahu and the Israeli leadership are saying, leave Gaza and we won't bomb you, but they have nowhere to go. But, you know, on this issue of the

solution, I mean, we're entering a very dangerous phase and we're looking at the Holy Land right now. So this does affect us all. If this conflict moves from a political conflict, which it always has been, it's not about the Bible. It's about the colonization of the land of Palestine and people trying to get their land and rights back. And then another group of people trying to have a state run along ethno-religious lines as a Jewish state. If it moves into a religious conflict, we're all screwed and it's going there. This operation waged by Hamas and Palestinian Islamic Jihad

was called Al-Aqsa Flood. It's about the Al-Aqsa Mosque. waged by Hamas and Palestinian Islamic Jihad. It was called Al-Aqsa Flood. It's about the Al-Aqsa Mosque. And what's been going on there is that the security minister of Israel, who's the biggest fanatic in Israeli society, his name is Idmar Ben-Gavir. He's led literal riots against Palestinian shops. He's so extreme, the Israeli military

would not allow him in. He's been convicted in Israeli courts of terrorism. He is now the security minister because Benjamin Netanyahu needs him and his small party in order to maintain his coalition. He has been leading groups up to the Al-Aqsa compound of Jewish extremists who try to break in there into the third holiest site in Islam in a direct provocation. And what they want to do is blow up the Al-Aqsa compound and bring back the third Jewish temple. And they belong to a movement called the Temple Movement, which sees the Jewish prayer that

takes place at the Western Wall as phony, as fake. What they think the original prayer that took place there was the mass slaughtering of sheep continuously. And they want to do that there. So these are the kind of elements that are provoking one another and leading us into a religious conflict that would be disastrous.

Real quick, doesn't al in Arabic mean the? Yeah. I just wanted to point that out because it's funny because we say the, al, whatever, like we say the, the. I just thought it was interesting. We were talking, I disagree about the Al, whatever. Like we say, I just, you know, I just thought it was interesting. We were talking, I, I, I disagree about the context,

the modern context being the actual driver. And we were talking earlier today before the show about the, the actual driver. I, it is biblical. It goes all the way back to, to Genesis, the book between the feud between Ishmael and Isaac,

or the, the, the, the fact that the story says that isaac was god's was was chosen by god and ishmael is the father of the arabs isaac's the father of the jews this is this this is like the hatfield and mccoy feud on steroids it goes back thousands and thousands and thousand three thousand years or whatever i don't know how far back but people that put it into a modern context i understand that like because there are things that inflame the tensions but the tensions go far beyond just you know it's it's deeper than islam and that's the thing that most americans don't realize americans think that it's about a religion and it's not it's an ethnic feud that goes far deeper than than a religion i think a lot of the tension comes from that but the violence is coming from the colonization uh sure it's it's

you can always do a video chat and get past your hatred of each other but if you're if you're gonna die you have a choice and some people can i know i know this issue is particularly contentious so yes ladies and gentlemen we we i i do want to bring on i'd love to bring on someone who a journalist who has covered the israeli perspective not that i think that you necessarily don't but you do have your biases i wrote a book about the israeli perspective it's called goliath and i lived in jerusalem in one of the most jewish areas for almost a year, just trying to absorb that. That's fair, but- And I'm Jewish myself. And I came to this understanding by first going on the Birthright Israel trip, which

is a free trip for Jews. It was then 18 to 25. And it's basically like the best sex vacation ever. They want you to mate. They want Jews to have relationships because we don't proselytize. So they're encouraging you to have sex with Israeli soldiers. It's a big party,

but I got really, really into the situation there. And it was right at the dawn of the second intifada. And it affected me in a way that they didn't want it to. I mean, they did propagandize us. So there are obviously a lot of people who, we got some chats where they're saying, it's great, you're a real journalist covering this because the, you know, but then there are other people saying that you're, you're a joke and you're wrong about this stuff. But I do want to point out the, the, the seemingly contradictory statement you made earlier. I would say seemingly in that the people's view of tribal politics,

you, you had praise for Donald Trump uh peace efforts before the show i don't know if you want to depending on which peace effort right for sure for sure but we're talking about north korea and south korea and you were saying like you know i won't speak for you but i don't the bloods yeah yeah i mean a one point to you real quick before i get into that um if christians should be paying special attention to this conflict because the Christians who live in Bethlehem, they have nothing to do with Hamas. They're not represented by any of these factions, but they are affected by occupation and they are being forced out of their lands where they are carrying the tradition of the disciples. The Anastos family, who I know, had the wall,

the separation wall built entirely around their home and shop. And that was the end of their existence there. They are directly descended from the disciples. So this isn't just about Jews and Muslims. And by the way, Jews and Muslims resisted the crusaders in Jerusalem. We haven't always been enemies, but to your point about Trump, no, you wanted to say something. Well, just the, the, I wanted to point out that the that the way you've characterized this, you've called Jews terrorists multiple times. And every time that anyone taught, and then I talk about the fact that the operation was a terror operation, you push back on it. So I understand that you have a perspective and it's totally cool. I'm not trying to say you're wrong for having an opinion or having having a perspective but i do want to point out you you are characterizing the israelis as jews

and you talk about how far right and and how bloodthirsty they are and the terror attack you you've been pushing back on and saying well it's not a terror attack and etc so i mean i just wanted to call attention to it it it is not just that jews are terrorists or that the uh palestinians are terrorists this particular issue this particular flare-up or whatever is because of a terrorist attack but it's not that one side or the other are the bad guys and the good guys i at least i don't see it that way it's well it's a for me it's about justice and injustice one side is much more powerful than the other and has been abusing them historically. But Israel, to me, does not represent Judaism. To me, that's an anti-Semitic point of view. And

actually, anti-Semites try to implicate all Jews by invoking Israel's crimes. I see Israel as embracing the philosophy of Zionism. And if you go to Brooklyn and you see all those ultra-Orthodox Jews from the Satmar clan, they're not Zionists. In many ways, they're anti-Zionist. So all Jews are not Zionist. Back to Trump. Yes. I mean, as we were saying before the show, I mean, I stood and cheered when he crossed the DMZ into North Korea. I never thought I would see an American president do that. And in some, and so in so many ways, um, Trump going off script was the greatest thing about the Trump era. I never thought American president would do that. Admitting the weapons deals of Saudi Arabia and all that stuff, the oil fields in Syria, it's, it was like not good things, but it's like,

he's saying it. Yeah. Even with the bad things, he lifted the mask on American empire. Cause he wasn't trying to be elegant about it. He just told the truth about what we are. With Israel though, I don't know if you remember, but it was like in 2015, he went to the Republican Jewish Coalition and he said like, I'm a landlord. A lot of you guys are landlords.

We need to make a deal with Israel-Palestine. And they called him an anti-Semite for saying that. It's like, he's calling Jews landlords who are dealmakers. And then he changed and Jared Kushner came in the equation, his son-in-law. Just imagine if Trump's son-in-law was Palestinian. What do you think about the Abraham Accords? Well, the Abraham Accords are a real reason why this happened, why these attacks took place. Because the whole point of the Abraham Accords was to go over the heads of the Palestinians, put that whole issue in the icebox forever, let them stay in their cages or wherever, maybe give them a few crumbs, and then Israel will make peace with the monarchies who have

all the money and all of the sovereign wealth funds. And Jared Kushner is directly overseeing that. There's going to be more Trump towers in Dubai. And meanwhile, Trump goes and assassinates Qasem Soleimani, second most powerful figure, prestigious figure in Iran, who heads the IRGC, which has a relationship with the factions in Gaza, as well as Lebanon. I mean, he was setting the stage for all this. So the Abraham Accords and the normalization with Saudi Arabia, between Israel and Saudi Arabia, the Al-Aqsa flood operation declared by Hamas was explicitly designed to undermine that. Like they openly said it. Then what, I guess the issue is everything leads to chaos. Everything leads to chaos. Everything leads to conflict. Well, everything leads back to Jerusalem in the Middle East and the Palestinians will not allow

themselves the rest of the region, especially these monarchs who don't answer to anybody except their own internal clan. They will not allow themselves to be ignored. What would happen if the security fencing, the barriers around the Gaza Strip were all removed and all the people of Palestine were granted free movement. What would happen? Well, it would certainly reduce the drive to violence and revenge over time, but there would no longer – what would they be within what we call Israel? And this goes to the whole logic of Zionism. In order to have a Jewish state, you have to have a demographic majority of Jews within a certain territory, although Israel has no internationally recognized borders.

The U.S. has a border, like you all support defending the border. Israel doesn't actually have a border. It just has areas that it declares Israel, and then it says we have a majority of Jews. We are the Jewish state. So the areas outside those— Aren't the borders created by all the countries around it though? Well, Palestinians don't have a country. Gaza is not a country.

It's a human warehouse because they're not Jews. But Jordan and Egypt and Lebanon, they all have borders. Yep, yes. So that's what constitutes the borders. But Israel declares itself a democracy while violently demographically engineering a majority of a specific ethno-religious group.

So that would be like the US saying, we are a white Christian nation. We're not deporting the migrants because they're not legal citizens. We're deporting them because they're not white Christians. That is the problem. That's why Gaza is there and has to perpetually be there. But I mean, they're having kids, right?

The population's growing. Yeah. So it doesn't, i mean israel could cut food off and stop population growth they could do they just cut off electricity gas and water i mean after hamas came in and killed a bunch of civilians and you know shot up a bunch of you know houses and stuff i mean so you know i look at it and i'm like if hamas perhaps you can argue that it is a roughed edge scalpel in their attacks, which results in it backfires on them tremendously. You know, I want to see peace. I don't like the stories that, you know, I hear from you about what's going on in Gaza. But all I see with everything they've just done is they've exacerbated the problem tenfold. Why would they do this?

They have no, from their point of view, there's no other diplomatic path to getting out of the siege and the siege was becoming too comfortable for Israel. They had, Israel's always going to be in a comfortable situation as long as the Palestinians don't do anything. Firing rockets doesn't accomplish anything for them. What do they gain by firing rockets? Well, I mean, in each conflict, the more rockets... I mean, this is not my justification. I've been under those rockets too.

It's not pleasant. It's not as bad as being under the Israeli missiles that I've been under, which is absolutely horrifying with a drone over your head all night and you wake up and houses are blown up around you. But it's still scary. The point is they get concessions and it's the only way and the only time that Israel has ever given them any concessions, whether it's more work permits.

All I hear is terrorism works. All I hear you saying is terrorism works. Or let's look at it from this perspective. Power works. Let's make the other hypothetical. State terror works as well. Or the masters of it. From the perspective, from your perspective perspective you could make the argument that

israel lets them fire the rockets to justify the the the expansion of control over the gaza strip and that you're saying it works maybe they want it to work they want hamas to constantly attack civilians so they can go to the international stage they can go to the united states they can go to foreign countries and say see this is why we need money and this is why we are justified in controlling the things that we control having the iron dome i i kind of view it like like like right now for the average american who has no idea about what this conflict is rooted in all they know is that civilians were massacred can you tell me it is uh go ahead tell me about the balfour declaration unless you want to keep going this is about the inception of the idea of the british mandate for palestine we talked about last night

basically end of world war one the arabs were fighting with the ottomans the the germans and the austrians and they were they were winning the war so the british and the french manipulated the arabs and they're like if you betray the ottoman empire we'll give you this land we call palestine after the war so the arabs were like sweet they betrayed the ottomans the french and the british won the war and then they went back on their deal with this secret declaration the balfour declaration can you take me from there and talk me through uh after we we cover where where you were at uh tim uh which the gist of it being to the average person around the world who doesn't follow this stuff yeah hamas just committed a major act of terror killing civilians right well the the yeah but that's because they're being propagandized by

corporate media which is telling them this is unprovoked i mean just look up how many but provocation is immaterial i mean like for for me when i cover this context isn't material but the reason but i the reason that they did it was because otherwise they're consolidating permanent siege in the Gaza Strip. And yes, it's a fact, as you pointed out, that Israel initially supported Hamas. Actually the Mossad funneled money, as Robert Fisk reported, into Hamas' coffers in the 1980s because they wanted to destroy the PLO, which was secular, more socialist oriented, and they saw them as the greater threat.

Israel allowed Hamas free movement around the Gaza Strip when Israel internally controlled the Gaza Strip. But we're entering a new era in international relations, a multipolar era where the United States doesn't matter as much. And so while this is kind of a bonanza for Israel to be able to show these images of a music festival being attacked and so on, but the United States doesn't matter as much in the region

and Iran is emerging as a regional power. So I think the calculus on the ground is changing a little bit and it's moving more in favor of the Palestinians as long as, and i think that is another factor in why this took place um on the balfour declaration i mean you're talking about the earliest stages of the colonial powers handing over the land of palestine to those they saw as a more powerful force and a lot of it was motivated actually by anti-Semitism.

I mean, Balfour didn't have kind things to say about Jews in the UK. And so he thought that if we actually displace what he saw as a Jewish problem onto the backs of an indigenous population, just get our Jews out of England and put them there, it's going to be a good deal for us. And they'll be our allies eventually and we maybe we can use them to control the suez canal perpetually if we lose control of it um they're uh the the the english anti-semites were not the only anti-semites in history to see zionist colonization as a positive thing uh The largest export market for the Zionist colonies

in 1930s and pre-state 1940s Palestine was Germany. And the Zionist movement, the labor wing, the quasi-socialist wing, actually inked a formal deal with Nazi Germany called the Havara Agreement, the transfer agreement. Anyone can look this up. It's on the books. And basically what they were doing was they were exchanging the property of Jews in Germany for their bodies. And more Jews means we'll start to move towards a Jewish majority here and they'll fight the indigenous people. And then the Nazi Germany was saying, well, we'll get their property and we need their wealth. So it was a very convenient arrangement. David Ben-Gurion's number two, his name was Haimar Loseroff. You don't have to worry about the names, but he was actually assassinated when he bragged about this deal in Tel Aviv. So

there's been tons of collaboration with anti-Semites in order to consolidate the colonization of Palestine. Now look at this, there's this carrier battle group that's sailing into the region. There's so much we can say about it. But one thing it says is that, first of all, Palestinians have no sovereignty. They cannot call on anyone to support them militarily.

I mean, Iran's kind of supporting the military, aren't they? They can't come in with a, you know, their Iranian fast boats or whatever. They can't really come in there. They can't get in there. Let me pull supporting the military. They can't come in with a, you know, their Iranian fast boats or whatever. They can't really come in there. They can't get in there. Let me pull up the story.

We have this from the AP. The U.S. will send a carrier strike group to the eastern Mediterranean in support of Israel. So this news came just the other day. It's on top of what we're hearing now from CNN that the U.S. is offering special forces as several of the hostages or some of the hostages

taken are believed to be Americans. I was saying this the other day, my concern is if Americans are captured and some of these, one of the individuals that's taken hostage is an IDF soldier who is a dual citizen, American and Israeli, which creates all sorts of questions about should the U.S. be involved? No question the U.S. is going to use that. They're going to say that's an American citizen, despite the fact it was also an Israeli citizen fighting on behalf of Israel, you know, in a conflict. But now with the deployment of a carrier strike group, I'm curious the chance by which the U.S. gets involved in a direct conflict, which is a dramatic escalation and what could possibly happen.

Do you think the U.S., I mean, look, the U.S. is involved. This is it. Deploying a carrier strike group is involvement, but where do we see this going? Hezbollah took out an Israeli cruiser class ship in 2006 with, I think, a French Exocet missile that was smuggled in. It was one of their surprises. So they, in Southern Lebanon, have the capacity to take out ships. french exocet missile that was smuggled in it was one of their surprises so they in the southern lebanon have the capacity to take out ships i don't think they'd be stupid enough to do this

but you now have u.s assets in there that are just a trigger point for world war three it would probably be better if there were fewer u.s assets in the area honestly just because of just because like max is this it's it's then you have potential is this in in 2014 I remember uh protective edge kicked off and I'm hanging out a bunch of journalists and they were concerned about a very slim possibility of world war three that actions taken against Gaza could incite Iran and then Russia and then China and then you get you know much like the assassination of Franz Ferdinand was not at that time when that happened. Nobody said that's it.

It's World War One. Like the World War started. No, the assassination happened. It got reported. And then over a long period of time, treaties kick in. Eventually, it's called the Great War. We now call World War World War One. There was fear that protective edge could lead to something like that.

But ultimately, it didn't. It was 51 days now with this with the u.s being more directly involved with the active war in eastern europe which is very much related to energy syria the syrian conflict and iraq and a bunch of other countries and then the fear that china moves on taiwan we could be really knocking on a legitimate world war three knocking the door of yeah i mean i think syria in a lot of ways was kind of a laboratory or a sort of a test case for World War III because you had Russia coming in with Iran and Hezbollah to stop US and Western proxy forces who happened to be aligned with Al-Qaeda and ISIS.

And Israel was actually supporting Al-Qaeda and ISIS in the Golan. It was giving them weapons. It was allowing them to pass in and out of the Golan. Actually Moshe Ya'alon, who was the Israeli defense minister at the time, this is a headline. I would prefer Islamic state to Iran in Syria in the times of Israel. You can look that up. So now- Is that because of the difference between the shia and the sunni muslims that and that they are just weaker and they don't want to fight israel because in many ways they're just a creation of the west um i mean if there is a regional war all those al-qaeda forces in idlib in syria that resist that fought the syrian government they're not going to be fighting against Israel.

And they're kind of like on Israel's side, Al-Qaeda and ISIS. I mean, just think about that. But what could happen here that I think could set the region on fire is, and it's already happening anyway, is if Israel tries to march on Gaza City, it would be a disaster for them. They'd lose so many people. There would be thousands and thousands of casualties inside Gaza. It's not favorable terrain for Israel. Didn't IDF go on the ground in 2014?

Yeah, and it didn't go very well for them. They went into an area called Shujaiya east of Gaza City and lost something like 40 soldiers, including officers. They totally underestimated the Al-Qassam Brigades, the armed wing of Hamas. And they retreated and then blanketed the whole area with howitzers and missiles, which is why that if you look at the rubble from 2014,

it's that area. I've been there. We've filmed it. It's in our film, Killing Gaza. But if they go all the way to Gaza City and they're already softening it up, they've destroyed an entire neighborhood in the center of Gaza City where all the administrative buildings are, all the cafes, the middle class lives. If they go all the way there and they try to bring

down Hamas and occupy that area, Hezbollah will have to enter. They will not allow Hamas to fall. They basically have an informal treaty. And then what can Hezbollah do? They are so much stronger than Hamas's armed wing. They can actually do targeted strikes throughout Israel. They gave Israel a bloody nose in 2006. Israel failed to defeat them. And I don't know where that will lead. It could then lead to more forces intervening. Because that'd be Sunni-Shia then agreeing with each other. If Hezbollah and Hamas agree that Sunni and Shia Muslims are agreeing to be against Israel, right? So isn't that opening a whole other category?

If Hezbollah is with Iran backing Hamas, which is Shia and Sunni, etc., that's a whole thing in itself already. Well, that's a great question to raise because Saudi Arabia, which we had thought of as sort of the, the, the, the, the real Sunni power that was supporting the overthrow. They were supporting the overthrow of Syria. They're different now. Mohammed bin Salman has kind of turned his back on the West and his statement on what happened on October 7th, uh, the attacks inside Israel was kind of, he didn't condemn it. He said, we just call for peace and Washington's

furious at him. Um, you know, our gas prices are going up right now. He's, he's, he's not, he's not opening up the tap. He's pissed off. What's the story of Hezbollah? Who are they? Where did they come from? Hezbollah is a Shia faction in Lebanon that was really formed in the 1980s when Israel invaded Lebanon. Israel thought that the Shia, because they were a minority that had been mistreated, would be their allies and that they would greet them with candy. But then the Israeli forces started abusing them. Hezbollah formed after the Iranian revolution with some support from Iran. And they became one of the most powerful forces in resisting Israel as it consistently attempted to occupy and reoccupy Lebanon. And they are responsible for forcing Israel out completely in 2000. They acquired anti-tank weapons. They were training in combined arms tactics. And in 2006, Israel again attempted to destroy Hezbollah. Remember, Condoleezza Rice called it

the birth pangs of a new Middle East, basically a test case for the war with Iran. And they repelled Israel when Israel came in again with tanks. And Hezbollah has only gotten stronger. They are led by a political wing. Hassan Nasrallah is their spiritual leader. And he is an ally of Iran, but not a proxy. In many very, in some, in many ways, he can influence the strategic calculus that Iran makes. And they do also have Christian supporters because they are in, they're like a state within the Lebanese state. And they prioritize resisting Israel, which is really popular there. Whereas the Lebanese army is totally trained by the U.S., just like the Palestinian Authority. They're there just to keep the peace. They don't do anything when Israel

attacks. And Israel has done so much damage to Lebanon that Hezbollah is just popular. And Hezbollah intervened in Syria in order to defeat Al-Qaeda. I actually went to one of the villages where they intervened called Malula, which is the oldest Christian settlement in all of the Middle East. Actually, the Passion of the Christ, if you saw that, all of the extras from the Passion of the Christ came from Malula. They speak Aramaic.

It's one of the last places in the world Aramaic is spoken. And Al-Qaeda took over. Wow. Turkish NATO-backed forces of Al-Qaeda and Qatari backed, and they took the nuns hostage so uh and hezbollah came in and liberated that town so can we pull this christian town pull up this uh we have this map here and uh take a look at iran look where iraq and afghanistan are most people

don't know their geography no and so uh when you wonder about the U.S. involvement in Afghanistan and Iraq, and the U.S. has consistently been trying to, you know, whatever you want to say, like these elements within the U.S. government want war with Iran. one small story in all of this i would i i i would say on the surface it seems that all of this everything we're talking about is about supplying europe with cheaper energy to compete with u.s adversaries yeah controlling the trade agree or what do you think um when the u.s began sanctioning Venezuela and Iran, it had to then take its oil from Russia. Right. And now we're sanctioning the crap out of Russia. So the oil prices are going up. And Europe, I mean, they're screwed. Germany doesn't have a plan B.

You know, the Green Party is in their governing coalition. They wanted to take even nuclear offline. Now they're bringing, what, 26 coal-fired plants back online. But why are they doing that? Why not just go nuclear? Because they're the Green Party. I mean, it's completely ideological.

This is insane. So the point is- More people need to hear that. This is blowing back this entire drive for war with Iran, regime change in Venezuela, turning Ukraine into an unsinkable aircraft carrier. It's destroying Europe, which the US kind of likes for now because we sell them our liquid natural gas that they weren't trying to buy.

But it will eventually come back here and it's hurting the American consumer already. Everybody's feeling it. So we can pull up the map real quick for those that uh don't understand there's a story i think it was in 2012 the guardian reported that as of 2009 u.s intelligence wanted to destabilize syria because we wanted to build an a natural gas pipeline from i believe it was the persian gulf through iraq was it the persian gulf it was it was through Persian Gulf, through Iraq. Was it the Persian Gulf? It was through Iraq, through Syria, through Turkey, into Europe. Partly, or I should say a majority of the largest reason why, was to offset the Russian Gazprom natural gas monopoly.

Syria said no. Syria is allied with Russia and outright refused to allow this. Of course, they also have Russia as a military base in Tartus, which is, where's where there it is right right here yeah and so uh conveniently for the united states whatever you believe syria falls into civil war with the united states on the side opposing assad whatever side that may be and uh it seems like now with ukraine with barisma all of these things are deeply connected to we are trying to get cheap energy into Europe.

It's a very simple way of putting it. Nord Stream gets blown up. Where's the US military in Syria? It's in the Northeast where all of the Canoco oil fields are. Well, Trump told us that. Well, Trump tried to pull them out. Yeah, they lied about it. If I understand understand correctly they're

actually uh they were in iraq based in iraq and and going to syria from iraq but if i and trump wanted to get our troops out of syria which is really funny because when was the formal declaration of deployment right it's like just all of a sudden it's like we have troops in syria it's like wait when well the thing is but the reason the reason that they're the reason there was no declaration is because it was special forces so it was like delta and stuff like so those dudes they don't they lied to the american people that's because the american people voted for a president who was saying no more to these garbage wars you know what grinds my gears that that was that was me in 2008 brock obama and i was I was and you know I very much

was listening to what Ron Paul was talking my friends were all very into Ron Paul and then when it came down to the actual election my friends were just like dude he's clearly not like the establishment this is our one chance and I was like okay whatever I mean I'm in Chicago I'll vote for him I don't know if it means anything and then he went what was one of the first things

he did was he bombed a village of women and children I think he killed 23 or something like that. In Yemen, in Hodeidah, right? Perhaps. All I know is I'm at these anti-war protests. They're saying George W. Bush is Hitler. And then Obama's like, oh, Obama. I thought we were talking about the Trump era.

Sorry. Oh, no, no. Obama did. Yeah. Yeah. So George W. Bush, they're calling him Hitler. They're waving these signs. They made the Hitler mustache.

So I'm like, okay, well, I'll vote for Obama. And then I think it was like within a few weeks actually i think it was like three days later after his inauguration women and children killed 23 or so and then i was just like oh okay no that was well there's a lesson learned that was my ticket out of the democratic party forever was oh that was me right i was just like oh so everybody's lied to me and i'm an idiot i was pissed and then I didn't vote again for 12 years. Well,

I mean, it was so much crazier than like just believing in it. It was like he got a Nobel Prize before he came in, a Nobel Peace Prize. I almost, I was really,

really, really upset when that happened because I was like, he literally did nothing. This means, this is cheapening the value

of every single nobel that has been given up before he got an award for being not george bush and there was no reason to believe other than you know he had a nice smile and was charismatic there was no reason to believe that he was going to have any different policy there was no and there was no change in fact he shot just as many missiles and violated the constitution just as badly and worse he killed he killed i think he killed more american citizens than any other president i mean i think he's the only well he's the only guy that ever targeted american citizens is the only one without yeah and and targeted him without without judicial

you know without due process what it just i'm just so disgusted by all this, man. It's sickening. The idea that we've talked, I can't remember who I was arguing with, but they were saying that the president has a wide, what's the, Birth? Not birth, but like a mandate

in terms of defending this country. And if that means American citizens overseas, I'm like, no, it doesn't. That is so, that is such fabrication to apologize for the guy they like doing illegal shit. That's all it is.

Dude, I'm sick of this too. And I've been thinking, okay, Federal Reserve formed in 1913. World War I begins in 1914. Maybe a coincidence. Maybe. World War II ends in 1945. Israel is formed in 1947.

Maybe, probably. Okay, I'm done with the coincidences now the british and the french wanted that area of the world it's we've been in perpetual war for 115 years this is one war it started in 1914 we're still there we're still in it no no it's not it's been cold for a while it's been proxy it's the same fucking thing man you can reduce it all the way back thousands of years it began no it didn't take over it didn't i've you know you know what really frustrates me as i occupy wall street and they were having a general assembly meeting to determine what should be the goal and one guy stands up waving his arms like you just said fracking is everything why can't you see it i'm not saying that conflict began in 1914 i'm saying this war the great war began in 1914 and it has not ended. The reason World War II—

Why did the alliances form? Because they wanted to control the world with the economy, man. No, no, no. Why did the alliances form that led to World War I? Cousins, birthrights, money. The conflict was well before this. You can get as reductive as you want. It goes back forever.

But the banking cartels, the Bank for International Settlements, the Federal Reserve was formed in 1913, and it set the world napoleonic wars and and and uh what was it the rothschild yeah those were not the legend of coming back and say yes napoleonic wars were european wars and what do you think world war one was a global war with what what countries united states mostly based in i mean it was mostly based in europe and world war ii and america united powers it's when you took and north america got involved is when we started calling them world wars and with world war ii you had the japanese empire which was relatively separate from what the the what was happening in europe but yes even the napoleonic wars you could argue was like world war these countries had colonies everywhere australia new zealand there's there's french uninhabited islands

near antarctica like so it was world war it's been colonization since like the 1600s and when when the french empire in 1914 the french empire was at war with all the other countries of europe that included all of their colonies around the world as well they fought war there too there was they fought against the russians the dutch ian what i think what you're you're describing is the fact that the when the federal reserve came into being it allowed the government to print money which allowed the government to finance war and also profit off of it i don't know that that's the case because i think that they could profit off of war long before the federal reserve but you get to blow things up and then loan them give them as much

of your money as you want your i mean anyway sorry interrupt maybe but the but the point is that the the existence of the federal reserve unleashes and and basically not just the federal reserve but but money that's not actually tagged uh pegged to uh to gold they can manipulate it much easier if they're printing money that's not pegged to gold but the existence of the federal reserve is what really gave governments the the specifically the united states government the ability to fund wars and when you have the ability to fund wars then they'll go ahead and they'll look for reasons to go to war but it's not like all the wars that you're describing are not the same thing i think it's all one war they say world war one and world war two it's semantic in my opinion then you need to go back further than that you need to go back to where these alliances come from the i'm talking about this war is began

in 1914 but this war dude this is a world war it's been going on for 110 years and it's banker control you okay you are ignoring the history of europe there's other wars that have happened i'm not saying that this is the first war i'm saying it's the first that we're still in this war it hasn't stopped yet and it's been cold it was cold and now it's a cold war with china and it's like been proxy and ian when you say china's involved in the same war you need to go back they were involved in world war one you are choosing to hyper focus because that's what you care about this this banking war started in 1914 no it didn't no when do you think that the federal reserve war began before the federal reserve existed like what are you talking about you are you are the federal reserve is a symptom a creation because of these things

i mean you're ignoring the history started that freaking thing to control people and you're ignoring where they're where they came from and where their wealth comes from and what conflicts they were involved in you are choosing diapers on the federal reserve because that's your thing but bro it's just all of this is reductive no no it's not man it's a war and it's semantic to call the cold war not world war world war one is the cold war it's the same shit so ian the but the the the the world wars of the 20th century were wars of ideology it was really people figuring out because in the in the 18th or in the 19th century um you had the basically the the industrial revolution made it possible for people to not live just agrarian in an agrarian society you

had people going to cities and stuff you had this massive explosion in people that could be become philosophers and blah blah blah and so in the 18th in the 19th century there was a lot of philosophers they were they came up with the ideas of socialism fascism was was was the idea was was created liberalism was a was a creation that was also in the 18th century and and the wars of the 20th or 19th century i'm sorry the wars of the 20th century were kind of or at least the first half were kind of trying to hash out what what system works best you had socialism you had fascism you had liberalism. And the way that it worked out at the end of the 20th century is it looked like liberalism probably was the best system for humanity because it allows people to make mistakes without having it being a top-down control.

So what you're describing is really more of humans trying to figure out the best way to to organize their societies and and fighting over the way to organize because you went from total war feudalism in the in the 19th century and then you went into capitalist societies and then that that's where you had enough production where people could start to you know just talk about socialism or fascism and whether the state should be in control or whether the individual should be in control but these things are all symptoms or the the wars that you're talking about are all symptoms of trying of humans trying to figure out the best way to organize their society we're currently in fascism right now and it's not working

very well we're not in fascism right now we are we have private corporate let me let me finish this because i want to go on but there's a war between england france called the hundred years war wars can go on that long so just consider that maybe we've been in like it's not normal to be at war like we're not how long was that it's not true war is the war is the norm for all of human history i don't think so it absolutely is you weren't there how do you know i i don't i don't think we have to be okay okay so so we've been in a war my whole life okay but we've just been winning it the whole time. We've been in a siege where America has 150 military bases controlling people's behavior. War and violence are the norm for human society.

Peace is extremely rare. And we are living in an anomalous time where generally our society is at peace now. It's the world's not. I know. I know that it's not the world. That's why I'm saying our society Western society is generally at peace and it is anomalous. It is not normal in human history to not be at war. There has been if you look at human history, it is drenched in blood and made of piles of bodies the fact that

we can get up in the morning and not worry about dying like i'm not in that place anymore huge huge it's it's totally unique to our time and place i don't feel that i'm worried about dying that's fine i understand like we're not it's just a ticking time bomb i i don't feel that i am worried about dying that's fine i understand like we're not it's just a ticking time bomb i i understand what you're saying but i'm trying to what i'm trying to do is give you a little perspective and or to pull you back from the brink because we are actually in one of the most peaceful times in human history we got it and human history is full of war we're going to jump to this story from politico. RFK Jr. Super PAC raises $11 million within hours and courts Elon Musk's support. Just hours after RFK Jr. announced he would run for president as an independent, more than $11 million gushed into the coffers of a super PAC supporting him.

American Values 2024 said it raised $11.28 million in just six hours following Kennedy's announcement in Philadelphia on Indigenous Peoples Day. Are they seriously going with that, Politico? It's Columbus Day, isn't it? According to a press release, millions of independent-minded Americans are seeing through the most powerful censorship and propaganda campaign against any candidate in American political history, said Tony Lyons, co-founder of the PAC, in a press release. They are angry at the DNC for attempting to disenfranchise them, eager to support an honest Democrat and more open than ever before in American history

to an independent and honest candidate. So I guess I'll just throw it to you, Max. I'm curious what your thoughts are on RFK. RFK Jr. is announcing he's running. Do you like the guy? Do you think he's going to pull votes from Biden or Trump? I mean, I personally like him. I really hit it off with him. I felt like he was a like-minded person when I met with

him and I've been interviewed by him. He's completely woke in the good way of woke on Ukraine, on issues of Iraq, Afghanistan. And his opening speech for his campaign was in many ways inspiring. I mean, I thought it was a great anti-war speech and he brought up his uncle's wish to scatter the CIA into a thousand pieces. I mean, that was the message we needed to hear. Since then, his campaign has been completely deflated within the anti-war movement since he took on this Likudnik kind of extreme pro-Israel dimension to it, which, and started to seem like he was agitating for war with Iran. Wow. Didn't see in his speech. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, if you watch, he did this weird event with Shmuley Botiak, who's this kind of like rabbi runs around calling

everyone an anti-Semite who won't do what he wants. He's paid by Sheldon Adelson, who was one of the biggest individual donors to Trump who came in through Jared Kushner. And it was a weird event. I was like, did you get paid to do that? Is there some kind of incentive for you to take on this non-anti-war line? Because if you're that pro-Israel, you're not going to hang out with me. You know who I am. And it just seems strange to me. So I, there's just been this feeling of deflation within the kind of anti-war movement, anti-war independent media, uh, within the sectors of the left that initially supported him,

the grassroots left. And yeah, the Democrats were always going to screw him over. Yeah. And now the question is, what is he going to do as an independent? Because we know he was one of the boldest people in America speaking out against the propaganda and psyoping of the country during the COVID event. That would seem to drain from Donald Trump if he was an independent or whoever the Republican, a DeSantis. And I've, I mean, hasn't he,

I've heard that as one of his recent rallies, he's been attacking Trump in a more strident way. So, well, it's unclear what he's trying to do here. But you're not voting for him. I mean, I can't see myself doing that, but I don't really, it doesn't matter who I vote for because I live in DC. Well, sure, sure. But I mean, in terms of see myself doing that, but I don't really, it doesn't matter who I vote for because I live in DC.

Well, sure, sure. But I mean, in terms of your moral compass and your heart, if Trump beats Biden, how does that make you feel? Or if Biden beats Trump, like, does it matter to you? I mean, it matters, but I mean, I'm not,

I can't see myself voting for either of them. But just looking at it from a more objective point of view, not me, I think this election is so much about whether you trust the system or not. And so many people who just simply don't trust the system are going to vote for Trump just to give the finger to the system. Not because they like him. The indictments, a lot of people who've been screwed over by the criminal justice system

who are not traditional Republicans are starting to sympathize with him. The things he says about the system, about the deep state, the national security state, the media, everybody hates the media. It's the worst. I mean, having been in the media for 20 years, it's like you get all the worst people in the country in one place and then just let them

go crazy and dominate your mind. So Trump is the, I mean, I loved when he would call the media, the corporate media, the enemy of the people. So this is about that. And the people who have the most to lose from the loss of establishment control financially tend to be the democratic party donor class. I think so. I think, I think he's, you can't pull from Trump for the reasons you described. I mean, my, my, my attitude toward Trump is I just think he's the best bet in terms of firing people. You know, I think Ron DeSantis is a negotiator. I like a lot of his policies. I think he's running a bad campaign. And I think he goes to D.C. and then he just says, you know, let's let's negotiate and play ball unemployment. Yeah. Donald Trump, I think, is just at this point. He wants revenge. That's the joke we make. We made the poster of him that says revenge on it. And if he fires a bunch of people,

I'll take what I can get. I don't like when it was trump versus hillary i just thought it i thought it was w2 it was garbage like hillary clinton is a psychopath she's a sociopath she wants to murder people she was the she was secretary of state under obama and all of that bloodshed i'm like i'm in new york you're not getting me to vote for this lady even obama knew she was crazy yeah dude yeah he wouldn't let her buddy sydney blumenthal work with uh uh in the government and sydney's like a gun runner he wanted to set up osprey global solutions in libya and he was like a long-time advisor of the clintons and obama's like i don't want him anywhere near here hillary but she was having secret emails with him and like doing what he wanted to get his company set up in libya when we took over just a dirty dirty dirty woman but i mean i wonder if uh i mean i i have to feel like you're not a trump guy

but you'd have to think trump is better than biden um i don't think trump is better than biden based on him bringing okay i know i know bolton what do you mean better than biden well i mean look joe biden is the perpetuation of the establishment warmonger, war hawk garbage, neoliberal, neocon machine. And Donald Trump is an extremely imperfect, loud mouth who at least told us a bit of the truth, tried to get our troops out of Afghanistan and Syria and no new wars. So if it's like, if you don't like his policies, if you don't like his character, if you don't like his attitude, I can, I understand this libertarian argument where it's like, if you don't like his policies, if you don't like his character, if you don't like his attitude,

I understand this libertarian argument where they're like, Trump is bad. Here are all the really bad things he did. And I'm like, and doesn't it suck that he was better than all the rest? And they're like, well, that's not saying much. I'm like, but it is saying something. I mean, there were things Trump did

that I found absolutely horrible, like trillion dollar tax cut is from where I'm coming from. It's just fueling the economic crisis people are in and where i live in ward 8 in dc i mean you just see total desperation there is no program no there's no social safety net for anyone and it's fueling homicide people just don't care anymore donald trump did some off you know he brought John Bolton in, he brought Nikki Haley in, he brought H.R. McMaster in, he brought Jared Kushner in, he let Ivanka show him pictures

of Syrian children, supposedly, and then acted on a false flag to fire missiles. So can you really trust him? Obviously, what the establishment is afraid of with Trump is not what he does. It's what he says. Yeah. And then with Biden, well, we see what we get with Biden. And seriously, but, and to your, and to, and to your point before, I mean, you know, you should play the man, not the ball. I mean, I, you should judge, you can judge me, uh, based on my work and the things I do. I think that's only fair.

I think all those criticisms of Trump are absolutely fair and then it's still like he crossed the dmz into north korea and it's like no new wars perpetuation of wars for sure uh an effort to wind down and get us out of afghanistan when he brought the taliban to camp david he got attacked for it and i'm like negotiate negotiate we're done with this and uh he tried getting our troops out of syria except for the oil, and they lied to the American people about it. And my attitude is just, I'm not saying you have to support him or like him, but it's like, and you don't have to comment at all.

That's up to you. I'm just saying for me, I look at it like, yeah, Trump may be in general bad. I don't know if a president could be good, but he's better than that. Then he's the best president I've had in my life. No, I understand why people feel that way.

As a journalist, I'm just not going to be drawn into being like a court voice for a candidate. It's because they're always going to disappoint you. What Trump shows is just, he lifts the mask on the fact that there is what you could call a deep state. I just loved when he was in, it was like he was in front of the helicopter or whatever.

And he was like, we're doing this weapons deal with syria it's going to be great for the academy and then all the anti-war left they were just like he just said it he just came out and said it what did he do with the drone weapon program uh luke was saying on the show that he gave control of drone assaults to the generals like so he no longer made the decision of who's going to die he just so he's like, he kind of washed his hands of it and gave, what was that exactly? I mean, I know that he gave the CIA unprecedented powers

to carry out black operations, including assassinations. The CIA, which is funny because the CIA also was working against Trump. And I mean, John Brennan was running Russiagate. And once you're in the CIA, you're always in the CIA., John Brennan was running Russiagate. And once you're in the CIA, you're always in the CIA. Like John Brennan being former CIA

and then going on MSNBC and calling Trump a traitor. He's speaking for a wing of the CIA. But meanwhile, the black ops guys in the CIA were getting to do whatever they wanted. So that's not cool. Yeah, I mean, they say no new wars, but he empowered the deep state by giving CIA authority to do secret assassinations.

And he also, the Abraham Accords on their face sound neat but like you were saying earlier it put the palestinian people you know in an icebox and gave the like the kings of israel and saudi arabia the actual head of israel not literal kings but the leaders i should say like emirates and the wahhabi forces like the most backwards forces in the middle east who are the least democratic, we're going to get a complete win-win situation under the Abraham Accords, but so much for that.

But so I just don't, I don't think you can trust what Trump will do. It was his personnel that really- I think he'll fire people. His personnel choices were abysmal. So that's the question. What happens if he fires people? What happens if he really starts draining the swamp what happens if he um goes into the state department

and just like you're all out of here no more usa id none of this crap oh fbi uh you're all you're actually going you guys are going on trial on alaska are tapping me there's send them all to alaska i'm i feel bad for the people of alalaska when I say that. I was so depressed. I followed a BLM marched up Pennsylvania Ave and they walked right by the

J. Edgar Hoover FBI building as if it didn't even exist. And I was like, that's how I knew this whole thing. This is the guy

that like wiretapped Martin Luther King. We're going to go somewhere. But anyway, if Trump did that, I know from a source who was like down with Trump, that one of Trump's greatest fears was assassination.

I wouldn't be surprised. The new report is that he only uses individual bottles of ketchup that are sealed. He is not as dumb as I thought. And I knew people that were on the campaign trail with him in 2015 said he only eats McDonald's. And the joke was he just loves fast food. No. The that when you walk into a mcdonald's the burger's already made and you could say that one right there and you know it's not been tampered with whereas if you go to most restaurants who knows what they're doing so you're saying the assumption is that if he tried to fire everybody they'd kill him well take reagan

being shot by john hinkley to impress jody foster out of the equation when was the last political assassination significant political assassination, significant political assassination in this country? Do you mean like admitted and acknowledged? Yeah, acknowledged. Because acknowledged, then we'll skip over JFK and we'll... Well, I mean, there were more recent ones than that. George Wallace.

Oh, sure. Yeah, right. Okay, George Wallace was running as I think an independent candidate in 72, and he was going to harm nixon because he had a lot of republican you know southern support so he gets taken out so you think kennedy's at risk the kennedy family the kennedy family history is not is not you know confidence building i don't think the democrats are threatened by him right now that's my sense especially as an independent i don't and i don't think the Democrats are threatened by him right now. That's my sense, especially as an independent.

I don't think they're threatened by Cornel West. I think Cornel West effectively dropped out of the race. And he just wants to have a platform to go around giving talks. He doesn't have on the show. He's pretty cool. He's a cool, very wonderful human being, but he doesn't have a platform. He just makes proclamations and uses a lot of isms, which is disappointing to me because he's someone I have so much common ground with.

But I don't think there's a threat right now to the establishment other than Trump. And obviously Trump's kind of like the front runner. So what will they do if he actually fulfills those promises? If he goes like dark Brandon Trump? Is that a rhetorical question? I mean, yeah, I'm just putting it out on the table so i don't have to do alex jones said that his plane would go down in a plane crash that's how that they would kill him i don't know and like a lot of people would celebrate yeah that would be it it is

terrifying like trying to destroy it doesn't make any sense to destroy the system right now it just doesn't make any sense the system's the least now. It just doesn't make any sense. The system's the least worst system on Earth. It's horrible in a lot of ways, but it... Yeah, the system works. It's just the people in the system that are the issue. People in the system become wicked. People become wicked. The systems become wicked, you know?

What is it, greed? I'm saying the people that are in the system are who become wicked. The system itself, I agree, it works, but that's why when we're saying fire people, we're not saying get rid of the positions. Well, some people are saying get rid of the positions. Oh, yeah, I was going to say that. Yeah, I know.

But generally speaking, yeah, I agree. The system generally works because it's checks and balances, etc. But there are people in there that have made it so that their checks and balances kind of even out in favor of them. I think there are predators, and they view the world very animalistically. And so the attitude of so many

people in power is all that matters is power. Yeah. You know, and then there are the classically liberal individuals. And I don't mean the literal political liberal. I mean people who hold some of these traditional American views of honesty, integrity, negotiation, cooperation, which exist in a lot of different, you know, peripheral uh uh political philosophies and these people think they're playing a good fair game with the predators who are laughing behind their backs yes this is speaking of the history of our nation and predatorial behavior how they're like land grab and they're like well there's people there no they're not real people they're called savages

just take the land that does that's the story of history again that's like it's not like and especially successful governments so like there's a deer outside my house. You know what I mean? That deer is eating my grass. Okay. The issue is in, if I was a farmer and an animal came onto this land and said, my family has been here for a thousand generations eating the plants that grow here. Whose land is it? But does it belong to the deer and the rabbits that were eating the plants or the human who put fences around it and said no my family gets this now

there's the de facto rule of ownership which is whoever's there and can take it and control it and then there's the du jour type of ownership which is i have the paperwork that says this is mine well that's when there's a monopoly on violence elsewhere that you can appeal to authority to come and agree with you but uh at a certain point conquest is is is a real thing i think we we're trying to advance to a point where we resolve matters through rules and legal channels like i was mentioning with the classically liberal approach but i i don't think you get rid of predator predators well i mean if they if they can't use force they'll use coercion they'll use soft power

jordan peterson talks about the the way that we interact as a game and right so we all kind of decide that we're going to play this game and we agree to the rules and if you're a liberal and you live in the united states and and you want to have a normal kind of life, you will abide by the rules of the game. The people that don't want to abide by the rules of the game actually are the people that have more power than the people that want to abide by the rules. If you decide you don't want to play and you want to use violence to acquire things,

the rest of the people are going to say, well, we have a situation or we have a process to take care of that. And it's police and that's the judicial system, et cetera. But at the end of the day, that only works because you have people that are willing to use violence and force to make the person that decided to step outside of the rules of the game play by the rules and the only rule when you get once you step outside of the rules of the game then the rules are just violence so max was talking earlier today about about the the behaviors of of the palestinians and they they don't have any recourse etc and so they're choosing violence but once you choose violence then it's just a matter of who's got more power in my opinion for

the palestinians to choose violence it's a terrible decision because they're going to get the shit stomped out of them because of the fact that israel just has more military power whether or not that and i'm not talking about right or wrong i'm just saying the actual conditions mao said actual political power comes out of the barrel of a gun and in you know starship troopers the violence is the ultimate authority that that all other authority gets its power from and that is actually true and so you have to decide do you want to play by society do you want to have a society that has rules and has people that play by the rules or do you want to play by society do you want to have a society that has rules and has people that play by the rules or do you not i mean in a fair society you have a choice they didn't have i mean they chose initially they attempted to choose negotiations look what happened with oslo

they got record amounts of settlements built immediately in their territory like literally in their olive olive groves and backyards so they weren't living in a society that they had any control over. Yeah, I understand that. I didn't mean to pick on what you were saying. I was just talking about- Just the concept of what is a society or what is a citizen. I mean, being a citizen is you have the right to have rights. And theoretically, we have that here.

We have a constitution, but more than- That's the game we play. More than ever, our rights are determined by a donor class and an unelected group that's deeply embedded in the government that we can't even see. That's what I think has caused a political realignment, by the way, where a lot of people on the left and right who see that are moving away from these traditional labels of left and right and forming a coalition against what people crudely would call the deep state. That's what we did at the Rage Against the War Machine rally in February is put aside the left, left and right and forming a coalition against what people crudely would call the deep state. Yeah.

That's what we did at the Rage Against the War Machine rally in February is put aside the left, right boutique culture war differences and just come together because the fight against the Ukraine proxy war really was a fight against those elements. They've created this war, not us. The people didn't vote for it. And what is the created the war what's the war really about i mean it is about the banks it is about one of our only productive industries getting flooded with investments the arms industry we don't make stuff like we used to in the u.s but we make weapons and uh russia brought it hot russia brought it brought it hot but war is war man yeah when you siege someone and you hold them in their house and and then they break out and make it hot it's like well that that's nato on the doorstep man that's it and i'm that's israel putting these people in a little open-air prison you know you you put them right up

against the wall and you don't let them move like eventually if they lash out who's it i'm talking about russia invading ukraine was turning a conflict hot that had already because we because we'd push nato east and and it's the same thing with the israelis pushing the palestinians into gaza like you push them into it and you don't give them any other opportunity like they lash out we're gonna go to the same thing we're gonna go to super chats if you haven't already would you kindly smash that like button subscribe to this channel share the show if you like it and head over to timcast.com click join us the members only uncensored show will be up at about 25 minutes and that should be very fun we're gonna have a more spicy conversations but uh check that one out let's read culture abduction says first can't believe ian is slowly turning into seamus

i'm not a christian i just love god and i love communicating with spirits and uh prophets and things like that and i'll keep doing it. Mr. Batalon says, fun fact, as per the Geneva Convention, protected locations lose their protected status, i.e. schools and hospitals, if they are used for military purposes, military operations. That's correct, yeah.

Fix Bayonet says, Hamas named their attack after the Al-Aqsa Mosque. I won't be surprised if civilians tear it down. The Israelis would then be able to build the third temple. Watch for the temple institute sacrifices, the red heifer. I don't understand that. Red heifer, it has to do,

it's like, I'm trying to remember this exactly, but it's a significant religious symbol. I can't remember what it is exactly. I can help with that. Thank you. I'm going to probably get it wrong, but basically you need the blood of a red

heifer right or something like that used to be able to enter the compound uh and it's hard to get a red heifer there so well all right noah sanders says tim what happened to the michael seifert uncensored episode i went to find my clip of saying he should do a shark tank not even an hour after he announced on IRL and it wasn't working. What's up? I don't know. You want to take that note down, the Michael Seifert members only and see if there's something up with it later on. We'll try it. We'll get that sourced. Our crew is probably already on it

because we have a crack team that is working to bring you only the best content at TimCast.com Alright. Meshutes says finally got someone smart on the show. content at timcast.com alright me shoots says finally got someone smart on the show now max can pick on you guys like how y'all pick on Ian because you know insecurity issues

I do love how polarizing you are with like there's a bunch of people being like you're so smart and you're so knowledgeable and others being like you're a fraud and a sham you really you did it I guess are they mutually exclusive I think the overall majority of people are just watching like the people who comment are like the top tier

politically active individuals and they're gonna have very strong opinions 85 of the people who are watching are just like huh max i'll look i'll see what this guy's writing about and they'll you know matt gates pointed out that our audience is super rational and super like logical and when he bumps into he's like you you bump into like a fox news viewer and they're like i saw you on tv once you bump into a timcast viewer and they're like i thought about everything you said and i've written down this plan so much more uh you know involved let's grab some more what is this idg says brett weinstein tucker vivek bannon alex jones dave smith etc are all coming to the conclusion that israel had foreknowledge of the attack but stood

down and allowed it to happen change your mind uh i think i think that uh i would lean slightly away from uh from that i guess you could say this i think it is completely reasonable to believe that to any degree be it small or great israel did have foreknowledge of something to then say that israel stood down and allowed like these attacks and killings of civilians i i would lean against i have no evidence but it is completely within the realm of reasonability for a country to allow a thousand of their citizens to be raped and murdered and captured in order to go to war to destroy an enemy they want annihilated i completely agree it's called false flags countries that history uh have have utilized as governments i should say have utilized

this tactic but uh i i do i don't i actually think it's not the simple answer right i think if we go by occam's razor it's hamasas. Like you said, like the targeting of civilians is leverage for them to negotiate the release of their people. So a military operation makes more sense. And I suppose you could say Israel doesn't need this degree of conflict in order to justify what they're doing, especially as you mentioned, they shot people who are unarmed and there was no outcry over it. Israel has something called the Hannibal Directive in its military, which allows the military to kill its own soldiers if they become captive, if they are held captive, because the political price of being held captive is so high.

You know, they'd have to exchange thousands of prisoners or who knows what. And there's evidence that they have enacted the Hannibal directive and attacked Hamas vehicles that were carrying soldiers back, live soldiers back into the Gaza Strip. So I'm not, I think that cuts against the theory that they allowed this to happen because their fear of one soldier being captive is so extreme within the military intelligence establishment in Israel. And now they have dozens and dozens. We don't even know how many. Yeah, I think typically the false flag narratives, while possible, are usually on the more complicated solution as opposed to the simple solution. And the simple solution, what is it? In the absence of evidence, the solution. And the simple solution, what is it?

In the absence of evidence, the solution that makes the least amount of assumptions tends to be correct. Israel and Hamas conflict. Hamas wants captives. They take civilians. They take soldiers.

They use them as political bargaining chips. Much, much simpler and least amount of assumptions as opposed to Egypt warns Israel. Israel says, aha, now's our chance. We'll utilize this to... There's also this image of Israel much simpler and least amount of assumptions as opposed to egypt warrants israel israel says aha now's our chance we'll utilize this to there's also this this image of israel that they market to the world that they have the best intelligence services that they they're the surveillance masters i mean they make they they do their economy thrives off of selling their spy tech

abroad i mean they have an entire unit called unit 8,200 that goes into the tech sector afterwards. I mean, they did that. They were the founders of black cube, the company that Harvey Weinstein used to tail his accusers. They're making so much money as consultants. So everyone thinks they're so brilliant and we overestimate them. In fact, they're kind of a paper tiger and they just got humiliated by a bunch of guys on motorcycles. Yeah. But the conspiracy theorists, the people that hate Israel, they're really good at telling people that the massad know everything too and they kill jfk yeah there's there's a lot i mean so maybe we overestimate it but it's not that it's overestimated just because of the people that are like in

supporting israel or israel it's like the people that hate is loved, they'll tell you Israel did everything. You know, my timeline on Twitter has been full of like, but don't you know the Jews control the sun and blah, blah, blah. You know, all kinds of like, man, Mossad. Yeah, so it is definitely something that the conspiracy theories have globbed onto and really push as well as. And, you know, they're not going to stop. They're not the,

the Mossad and Israel's intelligence service. They're not going to be like, no, no, no, no. They like it. They like it.

Yeah, absolutely. The drum night says war never changes. I love this one, but it's a line from fallout where I think it was Ron Perlman, right? Did the VO and he's like, war never changes.

And it's just like war changes all the time. Come on. Like I just, I always hated that line in Fallout. War never changes. What are you talking about? There's all sorts of developments. Like, guerrilla warfare was a major advance.

Scorched earth. Like, war changes a lot. Digital warfare. Yeah, now you've got information warfare. And aerial vehicles. Oh, yeah, right. Israel invented them. But I suppose the argument is that it's always just about killing and destruction. But, yeah, I still got to say, eventually, it's going to be robots fighting robots.

It's going to be fun. Yeah fun yeah like our drones versus their drones yeah i mean you see it over israel with the rockets versus rockets almost it's machine on machine yeah crazy all right where are we at let's grab this one uh glenn mannival says breaking points had a good video on debunked videos and photos a circulating video was a video game screenshot be wary of the fake stuff. That's what I'm talking about. If a reporter comes out and says, I'm hearing babies were beheaded, I'm like, okay, well, a reporter hearing something and an official statement from military

or a spokesman or something with evidence is very, very different. I'm expecting to see a blurry image of a baby with a head in the next week or two. I just bought a bunch of these, by the way. They're really good. Spins are highly recommended. We don't have any up here?

No, we should, though. So be wary of seeing something because there could be false or deep-faked images of babies with heads cut off. Just be very... You might start seeing images in the next three to five days, two weeks, to verify the claim. Maybe they don't show it all at once. Maybe it's legitimate.

I don't even know yet. Alexander Ali says, has Tim gone full neocon yet? No, but between Cassandra Fairbanks and a lot of eliahu man i'm being ripped in two directions yeah it's funny when uh yeah cassandra uh is just so 100 purely anti-intervention at any and and elad is he called himself the resident neocon yeah so he's that mustache he yeah he's's a Bolton bro. That's right. He's very much like the United States should be the unipolar power in the world. He doesn't want other countries getting a foothold and things like that.

After having spent so much time in Israel, max, like, do you, what's your interventional stance? Like, how do you feel about foreign wars and things like that? I mean,

I'm an anti interventionist. Uh, that's why, why I'm able to find common ground with people who are libertarians or conservative. Why I spoke at the Ron Paul Institute is, you know, we should not be over there. But I also think that's kind of an issue of like honesty and integrity. There are a lot of people that, you know, we describe these prominent left wing personalities as just agreeing with whatever whatever tribal position and refusing to have conversations like their position will change with whatever the narrative is like you know what uh i i i i i'm somewhat reluctant to bring it up but progressives it just means you follow the psyop at this point

it doesn't even have anything principles attached to it yeah they're like we we must support the war in ukraine because we progressed on to the thing narrative that's the young turks in a nutshell but i but i think did something happen with jenk uger arguing with jake jake went on hasan's show and they went at it jake was like no hasan no hasan was defending uh i think the police the police thing well i hasan was was he was i was saying police are bad and jank was saying releasing these criminals is making things worse. But the progressive narrative is, no, release the criminals. And it's like, so, but Ukraine, I think, is a really great example of people claiming to be on the left. If you are, if you, have they called you right wing yet?

Oh, yeah. Far right. Oh, we got that article together. I mean, come on. That was like 10 years ago. After today, it's like finished. What was it? What was that? Like, no, that was that was that was like 10 years after today it's like finished what was it what was that like uh no that was like uh that was nine no what was it nine years ago what was the article oh yeah the southern poverty loss but it wasn't even like an splc job it was like this weird character came in there who is like this

anarchist freak from portland who had no journalistic chops and he concocted this vast conspiracy that involved me you like katrina vandenberg her steven walt and we were all controlled by vladimir putin uh to enact this red brown conspiracy to like take over alt media they had to apologize for it it was it was absurd the spLC argued that, they called me alt-right, I think. And they argued that I was right-wing. Their source was- No, they said you went to Iran, so Iran was controlled. Right, right, right.

But I think they said like alt-right Tim Pool went to Iran or something for a Holocaust denial conference or something like this, which is just like the most insane thing imaginable. I was like, I've never been there. This is crazy. You should print that article and put it on the wall somewhere. Oh,able. I was like, I've never been there. This is crazy. You should print that article and put it on the wall somewhere. Oh, yeah. I think it's archived somewhere.

They had to apologize for it. But it's funny. I mean, it was a long time ago, but I think the interesting thing is the only, I think the only thing that really connected all of us was we're to varying degrees, but greatly anti-war and anti-intervention.

Yeah. And so we're seen as a threat to the American order. Yeah. I could go deep into that rabbit hole, but it's going to bore everyone watching this. But anyway, I called the Southern Poverty Law Center and said, this is bullshit. And they retracted all three, like on the spot.

That's crazy. But it's just- Because they were afraid of a lawsuit. Good, good. And I should have just done the lawsuit. Yeah, true. Well, I think, I mean, it's it's just because they were afraid of a lawsuit good good and uh and i should have just done the lawsuit yeah true well i i i think i mean it's tough because i don't i don't think they i don't think that i don't think you'd win that one right right wing is an opinion it's a nebulous statement and that's that's why they get away with it but i think it's hilarious how if you are anti-war they're just calling you right wing these days well majid nawaz won a 30 million dollar

lawsuit against them because they called him an islamophobe oh so that was a characterization as well but interesting and i think no it was a summary it was a settlement because he actually didn't want to go to court i think it's i think yeah honestly i think you should have sued and i think all of us it should have been like a class action well i i got called by some lawyer or something i thought there was like some lawyer involved i don't know it's been 10 years man they got a lawyer's letter but any anyway you're right everyone had like a similar opposition to the u.s just dominating the world militarily and you look at china whatever you think about china what countries have they attacked like recently to bet, that's not really a country

and it wasn't any cost to them. But what I'm saying is they're not going thousands of miles away and taking over, sending their troops into conflicts like Iraq. They're not weakening themselves. They're preparing. They're buying stuff. Yeah, they're buying stuff. They're creating infrastructure.

They're cutting deals. And that's how they're going to do it with a handshake. Yep. And the US's only move apparently is bombs, which it's just, that's why I're going to do it with a handshake yep and the u.s is only move apparently as bombs which it's just that's why i'm like this stuff doesn't work secure our borders build up our manufacturing base cut these these garbage international treaties and then lead by uh wealth and and like right prosperity yeah make people want to be like us and build cultural influence i guess the tibet, it wasn't an invasion, Chinese invasion.

It was an annexation. Tibet used to be a country. And then at what point, like 50 years ago, China was just like, now you're part of China or they've just keep saying it. And Tibet's like, we have no voice. Is that what's going on over there? Well, the Dalai Lama was a CIA asset as were his forces.

And they were being used as the Uyghur nationalist movement was by the CIA to balkanize China. And China went in, the population was living under a boy king in abject poverty, and China went in and much of the population actually welcomed them because they started to get homes and to be able to not worship a boy king and have infrastructure and plumbing and electricity. But there's also a Tibetan exile nationalist movement that's just viciously opposed to China. And where are they based here? Where are the Uyghurs based? Here in Northern Virginia, right near Langley. And the National Endowment for Democracy is funding all of their NGOs. So this isn't a judgment on whether they're right or wrong. It's about... We're going to read

some more. We got this from Alejandro Reyes. He says, boy, I'm glad failed all that remains lead singer is here for sanity's sake, but thank God someone is having this argument. I never was able to have one with people I know. We should put a gold record on the wall behind you. Yeah, bring one. You can hang it up behind you when you're here.

Right failed on it. All right, we'll grab some more super chats. What have we here? David Guyton says, Tim, I make metal sculptures on my YouTube channel. I made you a memento mori mask based on stoic philosophy. It's yours if you want it. Oh, cool.

That's sick. I don't know how to go about sourcing that stuff, though. Tweet at Ian. I'm open to that. I have no other response. I don't know how to... don't know tweet at me and send me a direct message do both edgar ortiz says good on tim for having a credible journalist such as max on not sure who the other guy is though but could learn a little something from max you see you get one person being like phil he's so right about this another person says max is so right about this i Another person says, Max is so right about this. I respect the attempt at conversation.

Well, that's what happens when you have so many diverse guests on. Yeah, I'm the failed musician guy. That's who I am. Oh, but I mean, typically the left doesn't come on the show. It's pulling teeth. It's impossible.

And so then, I don't know. It is what it is. It is what it is. It's frustrating to me because the left could get so much more done if it would just focus on issues instead of virtue signaling. Yeah. That's, which is a large component of what our issue is.

Yeah. You know? And so like we, we, we, we've had some leftists on and we have like these, these books, like this book is gay where it's got explicit material and it kids should not be exposed to some leftists we bring on. We'll say, no, I agree. You're right. That book book should not be for kids i don't know why they're even defending it i'm like well then you need to speak up because you're you're saying nothing and like lowering your head while these other people we've had come on the show just explicitly defend it and

say kids should have it and i'm like you're just saying that because that's the progressive line of like the narrative that you're the psyop all right what is this well that's the that's the dividing line issue it's like okay you're not with me on the trans issue so we can't work together against ukraine yeah to me that's so much more important than the trans issue and so i'm willing to i'm willing to work on it with it on a tactical basis with the freedom caucus with, with Marjorie Taylor Greene. I might not agree with her on other things. Yeah, but I mean, avoiding World War III might be pretty important.

Yeah, I'd like to disagree later, let's stay alive. And at the Gray Zone, we'll promote their initiatives to end. We have promoted Paul Gosar's initiative to end the emergency declarations on Libya, Syria, Yemen. And this was the Freedom Caucus. These declarations are used to make war on thoseemen uh and this is free the freedom caucus these declarations are used to make war on those countries and the left is just giving them the cold shoulder when they totally agree so i i think i i i think aoc is an evil person i think

she is fake i think she's just going through the motions i don't know it's it's i think she'll be the she'll be the establishment she'll be the next nancy pelosi she's the new obama well there you go or that right yeah yeah we need allies now so let's let's work together all right ptb says anyone who likes malort hates themselves okay great i'm not trying you know i want to be careful because i don't want to rag on malort i'm from chicago but but the Chicago joke is he just says he drinks more. For those that don't know, Malort is like a prominent, it's a well-known liqueur in Chicago. It's Wormwood liqueur, right?

Yeah. And people in Chicago think it's horrible, but they want everyone to drink it. And so they buy tons of it to get people to drink it. And the joke is it's distilled from the grass that grows on the side of Interstate 55. So everybody from Chicago knows. It tastes like it. I just have a... You like it?

That's the grass I like. All right, where are we at? And I'm a self-hating Jew, so... Do you believe in God? You've gotten some of those comments for sure. In a way. A side of salt... let's read this one. Aside of salt says Hamas is in charge of Palestine.

Their charter calls for the eradication of Jews and Christians. WTF do you mean? It's not religious, Max. The Hamas charter was formally changed to remove those anti-Semitic passages in 2016 or 17. It's no longer there. But I don't know how much time we have. I would love to address the issue of Arab anti-Semitism. We can go nuts on the after show in a few minutes.

We'll go deep into all this stuff and I'm sure it will be equally polarizing. It needs to be understood. They did that just so that they could attempt to negotiate with the outside world. Cause they recognize it's ugly. And anyway, here we are.

Right. Let's grab, try and grab a couple of good ones. There was one that I really wanted to get. And, uh, where did it go? Hmm.

All right. Well, I'll just read this one. Uh, DTY LMW says, Tim, I'm begging you, please bring in a real historian that can push back to all this nonsense this clown is talking about as a starting point please read and learn about the whole history from the book the palestinian delusion they can't all be praising you for being a good journalist some of them have to

be criticisms but i'm well it's either real or fraud yeah all right ab says oh did it just jump on me it did just jump yeah i hate when youtube does that yeah it's frustrating man right there oh there you go he says uh ab says ian you do know that sydney blumenthal is max blumenthal's father right is he well that's why you brought it up no i don't know are you guys related yeah he's my father oh well so what's up what you just talking crap about hillary like they're tight well i don't i don't agree and i speak for myself you don't agree with your dad or you don't agree that i don't agree i was formally denounced by the by hillary clinton in 2016 you can look that up i was denounced by hillary i was also denounced by the Trump campaign.

I think I'm the only person to be denounced by both. You got a little foreplay to do there? So Max's company, Osprey, what's, they were basically like, when we take Libya, let's make sure our company gets up. Man, I can't speak to any of that, but all I know is there is no company and no money that I know of.

But I honestly, I can't speak for somebody else i'm speaking for myself here i don't and like i think hillary clinton is a dangerous figure i made that decision i spoke out in 2016 jake sullivan who's the nsc director for joe biden right now he authored the statement denouncing me on her behalf wow uh and it was because she wanted pro-Israel money from her largest donor who is named Haim Saban. And, you know, my father's a complex figure. He helped start alternative media in the early 70s. His columns on the Iraq war

are like vicious denunciations of the neocons. And in some senses, yeah, that work has inspired me but i don't agree with him on other things and i think a lot of people watching this don't agree with their parents right on politics so i just uh my i just i'm just here to do my own work and to be judged on that i would love to have max in here because i've talked crap about him before i mean sydney uh he's oh yeah man uh i love that your dad in here because I've talked crap about him before. You mean Sidney? Oh, yeah, man. I'd love to have your dad in here if he ever wants to and talk about it. And we don't have to talk about Osprey.

He's got his fifth book on Abraham Lincoln coming out, so I'll invite him. Oh, cool. Oh, yeah, dude. Because, I mean, war is the way of the world. I understand this now. Before it was like warmongers are evil, stop. But now I understand the power and the value of force.

Oh, Ian's full on an interventionist. Just the other day, he was talking about he's for intervention now. He's literally trying to make a state in the Middle East. There are times and places when horrific things can be deterred with force. But I would love to have a debate with someone that's been there and worked behind the scenes i think that you know we we should find uh maybe prominent academic countervailing views and have a larger conversation you know god that's but again i don't do this question for max just because you're related i wouldn't you know well if we want if we want to have your dad i'll ask your dad i don't ask you about it you know i mean i'll put forward a request

happy to do that yeah that'd be great whatever you know like he's not really in the game anymore but uh but yeah i uh my work speaks for itself that's all i gotta say i mean the fact that you that you are that close to hillary clinton and are critical i mean that's kudos to that i mean we disagree on a lot of stuff but kudos i don't give a shit i met her once in my life uh sorry to hear that yeah let's uh we'll pull up the uh one more we'll do one more raymond g stanley jr asks tim any word on the 2a documentary man that thing was supposed to be out for the 4th of july yeah and then uh we really wanted to include in certain footage which we have to get clearances on for copyright issues and so i suppose it's just been delayed due to that yep but it's fine i don't i don't think it's a big deal actually as we're

getting into a um into the election season and all that stuff it might be more um i don't know prescient or uh more opportune to to wait a little bit on it. And, you know, we'll see. We'll see what happens. So other than that, smash the like button, subscribe to this channel. And how about this? We're going to talk deeper on all of this stuff in the members-only Uncensored show, which will be up in a couple minutes. So go to timcast.com, click join us, become a member.

We're going to have that Uncensored show on the front page of the website. And if you join the Discord server, you can submit questions and potentially call in to talk to us and ask us questions you can follow the show at timcast irl you can follow me personally at timcast max do you want to shout anything out thegrayzone.com and uh check us out on youtube just look up the gray zone we stream every week usually fridays we'll do another stream on Friday. And I work with some incredible people there. You should follow them all. Right on. We just do straight up investigative journalism

and we break the media blockade on all of these issues of war and peace, propaganda, intelligence, everything else. Sounds good. I am philtheremains on Twix. I am philtheremainsofficial on Instagram. The am phil that remains on twix i am phil that remains official on instagram the band is all that remains you can follow us on apple music spotify pandora youtube amazon music you know the internet and i'm ian crossland i'm very serious about considering offering the palestinian country to become a state in the United States.

I cannot- This is the most hilarious one. It's not my idea. My friend said it last night and I'd like balked at him and I shut off the computer and I was sitting there and then it started to all kind of form. And I was thinking of like Hawaii is so beautiful. You know that they don't want it, right?

Well, I do know that. I do know that. It's like a less worse of either that or do they want the carpet bombs? Like what do they want? Let's talk about the members. Okay, bye guys. Yeah, this has been interesting.

Iamsurge.com. Yeah, I'm excited to talk to the members on this show, especially to have this be broken down by you, Max, and more so. I think a lot of people don't understand it, don't know many of the underlying issues behind this. Anyways, we'll see whether that's stay hitting in. I guess that's an interesting take.

We'll see you all over at timcast.com in a couple minutes thanks for hanging out