Timesuck with Dan Cummins - 24 - Wild West Legend Billy the Kid

Episode Date: February 27, 2017

William Bonney aka Billy the Kid killed several men while still a teenager and shot his way out of a New Mexico jail when he was 21. He shot a man for insulting him,  gunned down another in a saloon, and was shot dead himself before reaching his 22nd birthday. He stole cattle and killed a sheriff and several deputies. But was he really a bad guy? Or just a product of circumstance and the time he lived in? Find out in this wild west edition of Timesuck! www.theveteransmc.com

Outlaw, cold blooded killer, victim of circumstance. The man the myth the legend, Billy the Kid, the very personification of the Wild West. Did he die at 21 years old and bushed by Sheriff Pat Garrett? Or did Garrett let the friend he called Lil Casino vanish into the dark New Mexico night? I don't know about you, but I've always been fascinated by the American Wild West. A time when gold nuggets were found on the ground and family fortunes were made overnight. Stage coaches, banks, trains were robbed by armed desparados, quite literally riding off into the sunset on horseback. Mustachioed men drinking warm whiskey neat and a dusty bar.

Law men sitting next to gamblers, gamblers sitting next to cattle rustlers, cattle rustlers sitting next to the very cattle barons, they stole their cattle from. It was a time when insults were settled with pistols and brothels and poker tables, whereas common is tumbleweeds and rattlesnakes. So let's giddy up, you cow poaks, slap on some spurs, slip on your best 10 gallon hat, pour yourself a tall glass of something that smells like gasoline and tastes much worse. And let's mosey on into this high noon, circling the wagon, showdown edition of Time Suck.

Welcome to the Wild Wild West Time Suck, everybody. And no, we will not be examining Will Smith's 1999 hit single. If you don't know what that song is, take my advice and don't look it up. You don't want that nonsense stuck in your head, I promise you. Very excited for today's show, Gotta Love Westerns. Tombstone is my favorite movie of all time. I was warming up for the podcast, watching some of my favorite clips in that movie. Like the showdown between Doc Holliday and Johnny Ringo.

I play for blood. God, it's so good. You'll know days that Johnny, you'll know days. Tombstone, oh man, love that movie. I'll probably quote it here and there throughout this episode. Even though it has nothing to do with Billy the Kid. Quick thank you for all the new subscriptions and iTunes reviews. Man lots and lots of listeners

leaving reviews. It's so nice man. Makes me feel great. Makes me feel like this is something you guys really appreciate. Makes me feel all warm and fuzzy in my Western heart this week. The rise of Hitler in the third Reich bonus episode is going to be coming up pretty quick. Only need a few more reviews really to hit 300. So depending on you guys, it could be this next Friday, the Friday after that, it's probably gonna be the Friday after this next Friday. Just so I have time to mention it on the next Monday podcast.

If it's cut and close, I don't wanna just spring it on you again like the Alien One, I want you to know it's coming. Also working on the beginning of some time suck merch, time suck t-shirt, it looks dope, very excited. I'm a big t-shirt guy. I've always liked graphic t-shirts for a long time. I wore these Ames brothers t-shirts.

God, man, maybe someday I can get an Ames brothers time suck t-shirt. That'd be like a dream come true. They do these badass t-shirt designs. And I like that, kind of like the soft t-shirt that I like that kind of heathered look so it's not just a flat color and yeah I wanted to get a time t-shirt that I would really like to wear. So more on that you know down the road but I just saw the first prototype and I'm very happy. At a time suck boner of joy.

I don't know whether kind of boner you'd have. Boner of sadness would be. Naviast, Naviast, scary boner. If you're like, ah, I got another sadness boner. Ooh, you got some shit going on in your head. Okay, so yeah, hopefully I get that coming up soon. Also, I had an interesting week, turned down some sponsorship, which is not

easy to do. I would like to have this thing make some money eventually and reinvest an equipment and expand it and all that fun stuff. But the company I was working with, considering working with, uses Walmart. And look, if you work from Walmart, I'm not going to rag on them a bunch and know that I am not against you. Actually, I am for you. I am for you being paid more by a company that makes exorbitant wealth off your back. Billions and billions and billions that they, anyway, I'm not gonna go down that wormhole again. But you know where I stand if you've listened to a lot of the podcasts.

But anyway, I can't announce one company's business practices and then have that exact same company sponsor the show. Unless I wanted to change the name of this podcast to the King of Assholes. And as much as I do kind of like that name, I don't want to be the King of the Assholes, at least not for that reason. I love this show, I really love it.

It's been the most rewarding creative project so far of the whole time I've been doing stand up. I love you guys and respect you trusting me to kind of like, I don't know, you know, do my best with this kind of thing and make it the best it can be. And right now that's not going to include being a hypocritical adoosh. Fucking principles, man. Why do I have to have them? I have to be so much easier if I didn't. And I have weird principles. Some people would have a lot of problems with my morality.

You know, like for example, I worked for the Playboy channel. A couple of hundred shows, hosting with nude Playboy models on the show, zero guilt over that. Zero guilt over that. Do have guilt on working on talk dynasty. Cause to me, like nude pictures, women who love the female form,

they love to showcase their body. It's very natural to me. And I don't care if I can do it, can do it body. It's very natural to me, you know, and I don't care what fucking dudes can do it too. It's like all nudity, it's just not a big deal with me. It really isn't. I just look at it like, you know, in my opinion, we're all just chimpanzees who can think a little better than a chimp.

And, you know, we like having sex. It's a natural urge, we like seeing sexy things. That's never gonna go away. People get real prudish and trying to like suppress that. I think it's just so, it's fucking ridiculous, that's never gonna go away. People get real prudish and trying to suppress that. I think it's just so, it's fucking ridiculous. It's never gonna go away. And on the female nudities specifically, sometimes the feminism gets skewed over there

like how dare men just look at these naked pictures for the purpose of pleasure in themselves. That's actually very natural. And you can be a woman who doesn't mind showcasing everybody and also very intelligent. And you know, and and very into a quality. They're not mutually exclusive. But that's what I think. A lot of people would not agree, but I've, I don't know, man, I've not really fit in with mainstream thinking my whole life. So that's me. But, but,. But however, helping some far right kind of nuts,

convincing American people, they're just some fucking good old boys working out of a warehouse in West Monroe, Louisiana, making some duck calls, even though they're millionaires. That's me, some manipulative nonsense. And I didn't like that. So I don't think that's gonna happen again. I, you know what, I'm not just gonna think, it won't happen again.

I'm done with that phase of my life. Rather just get a straight job and do that again. So, don't get me wrong though. You know, I do wanna make some money. I do like that. I am a capitalist, you know, deep down. I just wanna do it the right way. That's what I'm really trying on this show.

So thanks you guys for listening and making that even a possibility for me. Thank you very, very much. And now, I have a new little segment I'm excited about before we get into the Billy the Kid. I think you're, very much. And now, having a new little segment I'm excited about before we get into the Billy the Kid, I think you're gonna like this. I have some flat earth theory updates that people have written in and a little correction

on a previous episode about the Nigerian emails last week. So time for some your time sucker updates. Okay. All right So this this update comes in from from time sucker Russell Clem Russell, he's he's updating my original estimate that it would cost the government $10 billion a year to have the NASA Ice Wall guards protect the world citizens from falling off the Antarctica edge of our flat earth and out into space So it can if you if you haven't heard the flat earth, the fuckery episode, basically some people who believe in a flat earth also believe, some people believe that it's infinite, which is the most ridiculous to me, like it just never ends, earth never ends, which is so unbelievably ignorant.

I just, I am not even, I am not even gonna talk about that, that's so stupid. But then the other one that I believe most flat earth-their-us-believe is that, yeah, it's like at this disc, the earth is this disc, on the edge of this disc is Antarctica. Like, think of like the center of the donut, or the middle of the frisbee as the North Pole, and then the outer edge, the pie crust, if you will, is this Antarctic ice wall. Some people believe that NASA is guarding this ice wall. They want to keep people from falling out into space, and they want to keep people from realizing that they are this flat, from knowing the truth through guys. They're suppressing the truth so they

can keep getting their sweet NASA money and fueling that into the illiterati or whatever, in fact, Illuminati, excuse me, Illiterati. Sounds kind of fun, just like a group of powerful, illiterate people. The Illiterati, they can't read, but they control your destiny. Illuminati. So anyway, it's some ridiculous stuff, and I speculated previously about how much it would cost to have all these ice-wolt guards protect the earth. And I thought it'd be about 10 billion.

And I thought the circumference, you know, was around like 45,000 miles around. Well, it turns out thanks to another time-sucker, you guys suck in the best way. Brandon Grahamlein pointed out that a guy who actually knows how to do equations, a guy with some skill with mathematics, that's about 78,000 miles will be the circumference. Okay.

So based on this, I'm going to read Russell's email here. He says, based on the added correction in your recent Houdini episode where the disc shape Earth is 48,000 miles at the edge, the Department of Defense recently released a statement that each deployed soldier costs 2.1 million. Wow! To train, equip, feed, house, and man per year. With a bare bones crew guarding each base, it would take 72 guard soldiers.

And this is a guy with some military knowledge. So I was way off of my estimates. That's four eight hour shifts with two soldiers on each corner, two sets of roving guards, two guards at the front and rear gates, and one NCO officer to monitor. With the current tooth to tail ratio, combat soldiers to support at 10%,

this equates to 720 soldiers per base. With bases spread out every five miles, it gives you 9,600 bases, 720 soldiers per base times 9,600 bases gives you a force of 6,912,000 soldiers. There's a lot of that's a lot of ice wall guards. So the number of soldiers plus the cost of soldiers deployed equals 14,515,200,000 dollars per base. So the number of soldiers plus the cost of soldiers deployed equals Wow 14 trillion

515 billion 200 million dollars per year not even Trump could hide that on his tax returns But the biggest question this gave me is how are we hiding this big of a budget? That many soldiers and no one has leaked a thing well, okay, so Russell I'm gonna add really quick since you base the numbers on my So Russell, I'm going to add really quick. Since you base the numbers on my incorrect calculation of 48,000 miles and not brandens, 78,000 miles, we have to kick your number up by another 62 and a half percent, raising the new number of the budget necessity from 14 trillion to 23 trillion, $587 billion, $200 million annually.

And since the annual operating budget of the US federal government is less than $4 trillion, covering a, you know, 23 and a half trillion dollar ice well seems a little bit shall we say, fucking ridiculous. So if you believe a flat earth surrounded by an ice wall, you are preposterously ignorant. And yes, I'm talking to you, Kyrie Irving, point guard for the Cleveland Cavaliers. I actually don't know if Kyrie believes in an ice wall, you are preposterously ignorant. And yes, I'm talking to you, Kyrie Irving, point guard for the Cleveland Cavaliers.

I actually don't know if Kyrie believes in a nice wall. But I do know he's gotten some heat lately as well he should for believing in a flat earth. Which doesn't mean he's an idiot. I think everybody's throwing out like, wow, what a moron this guy. He's not an idiot. He's just terribly misguided scientifically.

He's obviously very intelligent in these sports at the athletic intelligence, you know, kind of Arena or he wouldn't be as good as he is at being a point guard Where you're gonna think really quick and make a lot of quick decisions and make him well at his level to be you know Near MVP candidate caliber of play, but Jesus man It comes to some basic science He is a dummy So Russell also had the end of his message. I'm gonna say this too It comes to some basic science. He is a dummy.

So Russell also had the end of his message. I'm gonna say this too. I also wanted to push a shameless plug for veterans that are serving or have served honorably and write a motorcycle to check out their local veterans motorcycle club. We are a nonprofit organization who supports veterans and their causes. For more information, please visit www.thevetrinsmc.com.

Sorry, V, F, F, V, and God bless our men and women who still put themselves in the harm's way, so I can listen to Dan, bring me a little ear joy every morning. Well, thanks Russell, and yeah, thevetrensmc.com, the motorcycle club that sounds very, very cool. Yeah, thanks for the update and then the shout out. One more quick little update. On the Nigeria email scam, I have said last week, I acted like Garnard was not a correct word. I thought they meant gathered.

And I made fun of somebody for saying Garnard and said it gathered. Well, Time Sucker Bob Bobson, not sure if that's a real name, highly doubt it, but that's what shows up in the email. Awesome, awesome fake name. Even better real name, highly doubt it, but that's what shows up in the email. Awesome, awesome fake name. Even better real name if it is real. That'd be fantastic if your last name is Bobson

and your parents chose to name you Bob on top of that. Well, again, I actually like the scammer should have said, gathered, but garnered is appropriate. It means as Bob pointed out to gather or collect. And I do know that because of Bob's email, here's what Bob said. The subject line in Bob's email said, you're an idiot. And then the body says, garnered is a word beef float. With your subpar vocabulary, it's a surprise. You haven't been the victim

of an Nigerian scam. Love the podcast, slow stroke forever. I love that. For those of you don't know, slow stroke is a reference to a bit of mine about this weirdo I saw at this Folsom Street fair years ago on the here this album. I love you guys man keep it me informed and keep me humble. Thank you Mr. Bob Bopson that was a fantastic man that that that subject line you're an idiot definitely got my attention and that is it for this week's time sucker update. Thanks time suckers I needed that. We all did.

Okay, Billy the Kid. We're finally in it now. In a perfect world, Sam Elliott's circa 1998 would be narrating this episode, walking us through this tall tale, just like the stranger walked us through the world of the dude in the Big Lebowski. And to tell this tale right, you you have to go back to the beginning.

So as often is the case, we're gonna get historical. I finally accepted this as a historical podcast. You usually have to look back, you know, to properly understand even recent events. So, so let us get back to the beginning with a time-sub timeline. Shrap on those boots, soldier. We're marching down a time, some time line. 1859 Henry McCarty, aka William Henry Bonney, aka Billy the kid, aka Emilio Estivez. In 1988's Young Guns, aka Val Kilmer, in 1989's Gordvidols' Billy the Kid, aka Chris Christofferson, in 1973's Pat

Garrett, and Billy the Kid, aka Paul Newman, in 1958's the left-handed gun, kind of aka Michael J. Fox, and back to the Future III, wasn't necessarily Billy the Kid, but he did go back to Wild West Town in the late 1880s, a decade, in which Billy's killed, and he looked like someone about Billy's age, and he technically participates in a sneaky shootout. Any who, the real Billy the Kid is born in New York City on November 23rd, 1859, maybe.

You can hear a lot of babies in this episode because that's all there is with a lot of the details of Billy's life. A lot will forever remain unknown. And by the way, if you love Westerns, check out that Gore of Adales Billy the Kid. I missed that one. Didn't get a lot of exposures,

like a TNT, I think, made for TV movie. But good traditional Western movie. A lot of the Billy the Kid fans say it's one of the most accurate depictions of the young outlaw. And it's Val Kilmer in his prime, man. When he was thin and not really weird and not making straight to video movies with 50 cent.

Tombstone, my favorite movie of all time, would come out just five years later with Kilmer killing it as Doc Holiday. I'm your Huckleberry. We're back to the real Billy. We know he was real, but no hospital records of his birth were ever found. It was a lot easier to be off the grid back in 1859. Social security numbers weren't a thing until November of 1936. Fingerprints weren't used in any capacity in America. Let alone for criminal identification until 1882. 1903 is when the first criminal database using fingerprints was beginning to be established

in the States. You know, back in 1859, a lot of moms just had babies. And if they weren't baptized or born in the hospital, no record of their birth was ever created. Burst certificates didn't show up in America, and any standardized regulated way until an act of Congress in 1902, a uniform version agreed on by all states

didn't show up in the 1930. Babies way less sacred back then. Lot of unmarked graves in the late 19th century. People died a lot, and no one got a Facebook tribute when they did. No one got a memorial tattoo. People just got tossed in a shadow on Mark Grave and forgotten about. It's sad but true. However, historians agree the Billy was born

somewhere between 1859 and 1861. Most think he was born in New York City. Some historians say there was a baptism of a young Henry McCarty at the church of St. Peter in New York again in 1859. But who gives a shit? He was a baby. He was a young well of a city slicker. Not doing nothing know how. Don't matter nothing. Billy was born in New York City or not because as a baby he didn't get any gunfights. All right, no baby gunfights for young Billy. Oh man, he was a young gunfighter, but not that young. Kind of cool though, if you would have been, right? You know, if it was like young Billy got into his first gun battle at the tender age of 18 months. A

perkotious child, he'd learned to crawl out four months, walk at eight months, smoke some tobacco at 12 months, play tarot at 14 months at the casino. Russell cattle at 16 months and drew down on another toddler in a milk saloon at the age of 18 months. The other baby James, two teeth Mahoney drew first, but Billy Quick draw the baby. Got the first and only shot off. Now that would be an article written by Lunatic. So yeah, I'll ask you, it was just a baby,

and most likely just cried and shit himself a lot. Probably puked up on his mama's teeth, and got yelled out to be quiet. Well, let's go to the 1860s. 1860s, from the time he was born, until about 1870, there's virtually no definitive information about the kid's life. Some say his mother, Catherine McCarty,

and Irish immigrant moved to Indianapolis after Billy's father died. There's also the possibility that Billy was a bastard. That's right, a bastard. Billy the bastard. His mom probably wasn't married when he was conceived scandalous Either way she moves to Indiana at the age of 18 blue the boys away. It was more than they'd seen

Wait, those are Tom Petty lyrics, but she did go to Indiana She lived at 199 North E Street in Indianapolis and it was there that she met Billy's step-pappy William Antrim a 23-year-old labor laborer team, and overall deadbeaten dickhead, more on him later, lived in the neighborhood, and they started doing it, you guys. Yep, that's what I read, numerous historical documents. Catherine and William began to quote, do it, quote, often in hard, quote, sweaty in a bit rough at times.

Of course, that didn't happen. As far as me reading it, and then, okay, 1870, 1870, young Billy, Catherine, old Billy, and the fam, they moved to Wichita, far from this opera forevermore. It's where they work the straw, making sweat drip out of every pore. Okay, that's a white striped song. But they did move to Wichita, according to the Wichita Eagle, a newspaper, and not an information giving bird of prey. How the fuck, that'd be so cool if there was like to Wichita, according to the Wichita Eagle, a newspaper and not an information giving bird of prey. How the fuck am I so cool if there was like some Wichita like an actual bird?

Just Eagle. What? What happened? What happened last week? I was gonna go Kaka. What bird does a Kaka? I'm an idiot. That's not an Eagle. Hey, you know what? It's the Wichita Eagle. It's a speaking eagle if it wants to go cacacaw an eagle Then you know, that's what it does That was the worst eagle impression that I don't I don't know how anyone could do a great eagle impression verbally, but if I were to hear it mine would pale in comparison to that mine was just a weird, mine was more of like a weird dude like a

An insane dude wearing an eagle hat on the side of the Who is whispering for some reason? All right, anyway According to the Wichita Eagle A newspaper and not an information giving murder prey Kasson McCarty was an enterprising business leader who was one of 124 people to sign a petition on July 21st 1870 to incorporate the town of Wichita She ran a downtown laundry was the4 people to sign a petition on July 21st, 1870, to incorporate the town of Wichita. She ran a downtown laundry, was the only woman to sign the document.

So Billy, you know, he wasn't the only outlaw in the family, wasn't the only pioneer, I guess. But then consumption came along, just like doc holiday, and just like that longer doc holiday in Tombstone, Catherine got the consumption. And young Billy's life was changed forever. Consumption also known as the white plague by the beginning of the 19th century, it killed one in seven people. Some historians estimate the so-called white plague

caused about 25% of all deaths in Massachusetts and New York during the 19th century. Victim suffering from, or suffer from hacking, bloody coughs, the ability to pain in their lungs, fatigue, there was no cure, but doctors came to recognize that fresh air and outdoor living could change the course of the disease. You know, just let you live a little bit longer. And occasionally people did get it and lived a long time. Doctors advised patients to head away from the humidity of the Midwest, move to the more

airy climate of Colorado or the Southwest, and that's what Catherine did. You know, doctors didn't know a lot back then, but they did know that humidity sucks. And boy does it ever. Sometimes I daydream about retiring to Florida. I do love going to Florida. Sip into my ties on the beach, but then I don't know if I can handle it.

I don't know if I can handle the humidity. Man, I guess you have to have it if you have it pool, whatever, but it's like a wet blanket hit in your face. So she's getting out of that Midwest humidity. And in 1873, Catherine and longtime boyfriend and do it friend, William Atrium, head west first, Colorado, then the Santa Fe, New Mexico, we're on March 1st, 1873. They were wed, no longer living in sweaty carnal sin.

After getting hitched, the fam head south to Silver City, New Mexico, and beautiful Grant County. Actually, no idea Grant County, New Mexico is beautiful, but it sounds beautiful. You know, some old billboard on the side of old wagon trails is head west to Grant County, New Mexico, where dreams are realized and fortunes are made. Silver City was founded just a few years prior. After, wait for it, check this out. Silver was discovered.

What a gastis! Silver! What have been funnier if something random like turquoise was discovered there? So you've come to Silver City to open a mine claim, eh? What were you hoping to mine? Why silver, of course. Silver, that's it. There's no silver around here. These hills are laden with turquoise. Just turquoise, as far as the eye can see. Great big oars of turquoise. Lot of tacky jewelry money to be made here. Well, Catherine sets up her laundry business in Silver City.

She may have tuberculosis, but she also has a strong Irish immigrant work ethic, bacon, selling cakes, pies, bread to minors on top of washing their clothes, taking on borders as well. Herner Husbin, Mr. Andrew, the owner of Small Cabin on the corner of Main Street in Broadway, Ash Upsen, co-author of Pat Garrett's biography, The Authentic Life of Billy the Kid. Excuse me, the co-author with Pat Garrett of Billy the Kid's biography, the authentic life of Billy the Kid, wrote of her, to those who knew Billy the Kid's mother,

its courteous kindly and benevolent spirit was no mystery. She was evidently of Irish ascent at her husband called her Kathleen. She was about medium height, straight and graceful in form with regular features, light blue eyes, and luxuriant golden hair. She was not a beauty, but with the world calls a fine looking woman. graceful and formed with regular features, light blue eyes, and luxuriant golden hair.

She was not a beauty, but with the world calls a fine-looking woman. She kept borders in silver shitty, and her charity and goodness of heart was proverbial. Many a hungry tender foot has had cause to bless the fortune which led him to her door. In all her deportment, she exhibited the unmistakable characteristics of a lady, a lady by instinct in education. Not a beauty. What a what the world calls a fine looking woman.

Man, that may be the kindest way I've ever heard someone call kind of ugly. So ugly mom or not, in 1873, things are going well for Billy, who's somewhere between 11 and 13 years old, depending on which source she'd choose to trust. His mom and his stepdad are making good living. Thanks entirely to his mom. They have a house to call home, while most silver city residents are living in tents. Mom's TB seems to be doing okay.

Even if it wasn't. I mean, she shouldn't be working on these jobs. But anyway, Billy and his brother, Joseph, or half brother, depending on the source, possibly year to older, possibly year to younger, Billy and his brother, Joseph, or half brother, depending on the source, possibly year or two older, possibly year or two younger. Most sources believe two, three years younger. They're going to school, they're learning arithmetic, and whatnot. Eat mom's cakes and pies jerking off in the family cabin when mom's not looking, dreaming of sneaking into one of Silver City's more delos and losing their virginity to some

corset and garter wearing woman of the night, living the American dream. Life is good. And then, as it often happens, life is not good. 1874. By early 1874, mom's consumption is taking a turn for the worse, exacerbated by the fact that she's working about 14 goddamn jobs, making enough money to compensate for her deadbeat husband, William, making next to nothing as a half-ass silver miner,

who gambles and drinks whatever little he does make, what a piece of shit. And the deadbeat husband father thing, that's a character I've never understood. Like I have my own faults, man vices and sins for sure, but I would rather eat a bullet than just sit around getting drunk and pissing my money away, just gambling while my wife is working her ass off to keep her roof over her head. I couldn't look her in the eye. William, you know good sum bitch.

Well, Catherine, she knew that William was a no good sum bitch. And while she was dying and being the good woman and mom she was, she got her friend and neighbor Claire Trusdale to agree to look after her two sons after she passed away. What strength is that? I cannot imagine having that conversation as a parent. Like, you know, if I'm wrong about being an atheist and heaven is real, oh, you can bet your sweet ass that Catherine is up there.

Woman was a saint. Reminds me of my own mother-in-law, seriously. You're gonna be hard pressed to find a better woman than Joan Radsiminski. Saint Joan is what my wife and I call her. Wonderful Catholic woman, the best. Well, on September 16, 1874, good woman or not, fine looking or not, Catherine does die.

And William isn't even home when she passes, the older William, Billy Stepdad, doesn't even make the funeral. He's out in the hills, prospecting. Gonna find that silver, Gonna make his fortune. Gonna be a selfish, unsuccessful asshole. That's a tough combo, man. Selfish and unsuccessful.

Like, it's one thing to be sitting in your silver empire mansion, drinking some fine and ported scotch, tearing up with a thawed a missing your wife's funeral. I think it's another thing to be sitting around a campfire, poor moonshine, into your toothless gullet, thinking, well, Rick and I could have showed up for old Katie after all. Oh, well, it passed into the past. Now, have me in beans for you, cleaning that whole can out there, tugboat.

Had Catherine lived, maybe Billy would have turned out to be a hard working entrepreneur, just like his mom was. Instead, after she dies, and his dirtbag stepdad takes off there, Zona, and the Hindu's brother Joseph are separated. Clara can't take care of everybody. He doesn't have the means. Billy stays with Clara, Trusedale, and Joseph. He goes and works and lives this gambling hall called the New Orleans Club in Silver City, growing up drinking, gambling, smoking a little Chinese opium from time to time. You know, just kid stuff. Turns into a career gambler, bounces back and forth between Silver City, Las Vegas.

Las Vegas, New Mexico, that is. And Trinidad Colorado before events, he's settling down in Denver, Dine, Freneless, and Broke at the age of 66, exactly how you don't want to die. Outliving his brother, though, by threefold. Now, Billy initially did well as a kid. He's working at the Silver City Hotel,

he's washing dishes, he's waiting tables at the restaurant. For some reason, he wasn't able to live with the Trusdale family very long. Not sure if that was his choice or theirs, but he did all right. He lived at a boarding house, he's paying his way with money from the hotel. He's well liked by his schoolteachers and his boss,

but without proper adult supervision, he gets into some trouble as kids do. 1875. Now this is Billy's first arrest. But without proper, you know, adult supervision, he gets into some trouble as kids do. 1875. Now this is Billy's first arrest. Billy gets arrested for stealing several pounds of butter from a local rancher and selling it to a local shop owner. Gonna make that butter money,

making that sweet butter cheddar as a butter baron. If that isn't a dumb kid's crime, I don't know what it is, man. You know, it's perfect. I'll steal butter from the rancher. I'll get you a couple pounds of the town so they don't even notice. I'll sell to Georgia to mercantile and I don't make a hundred percent profit. Now I'll do it every week until I have enough money to buy my very own buttered ranch. You know, and then you do it one time and the store owner's like, wait, hey kid, why don't you get this

butter anyway? I got it from my butter horse. You know that butter comes from cows, right? Yeah, my butter cows name horse. I gotta go. Just disappears in a puff of smoke. That rancher comes in, complains about some missing butter and you're arrested for being a teenage dipshit. Well, all Billy got for that first arrest was a tongue lashing from the local sheriff. But the next time he wasn't so lucky, he's now befriended a local hooligan who went by the nickname Sombrero Jack. And Sombrero Jack was up to no good. Of course he was.

He's called Sombrero Jack. Let that be less than any kids listening to this podcast. If you meet an adult who wants to be your friend and has a nickname like Sombrero Jack or belt buckle Bernhard or, you knowhard or Moose Nuckeltoni. Run away. No one ever writes in their memoirs. Life was looking bleak until the day I ran into Moose Nuckeltoni.

That's one thing took a turn for the good. No, huh. So, December 23, 1875, Billy is arrested for stealing a bundle of stolen clothes from a Chinese laundromat. Sambrero Jack had actually stolen them, but he let the kid wear some of the clothes. If Billy was going to be cool for taking the fall, if he got caught and he did get caught and he gets thrown in jail, the local sheriff Sheriff White Hill, same guy who lectured him earlier, what a great name for a wild white sheriff by the way, Sheriff White Hill.

He still has a soft spot for Billy and even though he puts him in the jail to await his trial, he kind of lets him have run of the little jail. It doesn't leave him in his cell. He lets him kind of hang around in the actual jail building unsupervised. Billy takes advantage of that favor, and after only two days of being there, he sneaks out by climbing his skinny ass into the fireplace, and sneaking up the chimney, jumping off the roof, and fleeing. So now Billy heads to the Truesdale family

and they give him enough money. The only friends he has in the area, really like long time friends, they give him enough money to flee to Arizona, go find a stepdad William. And so they're looking out for him, even if he's not living with him, good old Truesdale's. Well, Billy finds his stepdad in Clifton, Arizona,

who reportedly told him, well, if that's the kind of boy you are, get Clifton, Arizona, who reportedly told him, well, that's the kind of boy you are, get out. Wow. No surprise there. We already knew William was piece of shit. So now it's 1875. Billy's alone in the Wild West, not a good place for a kid to be.

Man, this is a largely lawless land full of stabbings and shootouts, hard people living hard lives. The U.S. Army is currently at war in the area with Joronimo and the Apaches. I mean, these are the days when you could still die from getting an Indian arrow. You know, you could get scalped. That shit actually still happens. You know, there's rattlesnakes, there's tumbleweeds, unforgiving desert sun, young Billy. You know, he's a slender of a slender build and a girlish look. He's alone, mom and dad are dead, his stepdad's a piece of crap. And while he's not a top police priority, you know, he's technically a fugitive.

Well, 1876. 1876, not physically capable of a man's work due to his youth and build, Billy eventually falls in with a man named John Mackie, and the two of them start stealing saddles and horses, especially from the army around camp grant, grant, Arizona, and 1876. I guess it was from Mackie that Billy would get his nickname of the kid. And I mean, he literally is a kid at this point,

especially. And in 1876, Billy would also kill his first man. A man with another nickname, everybody seemed to have nicknames back then. Sambarro Jack, Billy the kid, and now a blacksmith named Frank, Wendy Cahill. Oh, Wendy!

What a terrible nickname. Just sounds like you're a dude who farts a lot. Open the windows, boys. Oh, Wendy Cahill's ahead in this way. Leave the door open. Wendy Cahill, he's coming on in. Apparently, Wendy's nickname should have been dickhead. Cause I guess he acted like one.

Gus Guldaya, who's working as a ranch hand around Fort Grant this time, he recalled the kid having a lot of trouble with Cahill. Shortly after the kid came to Fort Grant, this is a quote from him. Quote, shortly after the kid came to Fort Grant, Wendy started abusing him. He would throw Billy to the floor, ruffle his hair, slap his face, and humiliate him before the man in the saloon. And quote, so and Wendy was a big man and Billy wasn't. You know, Billy, a full grown, you know, later in life was about five seven, about a buck 35 soaking wet.

So at this time, you know, he, maybe he's, you know, not even that, five four, five five, you know, a hundred pounds. And he's got this, he's got this dickhead, big old, windy windy windy, windy, meaty cat hill, wrestling him, wrestling him to the ground and humiliating him. Well, he doesn't, he doesn't put up with, uh, uh, windy shit. We're going to find this as we get farther in the belly.

He doesn't really put up with anybody's shit. Um, August 18, 1877, the kid has had enough a windies abuse. He's had a running with his tormentor at Atkins, Cantina. Cahill called the kid a pimp. The kid returned the insult by calling him a son of a bitch. And it's home in this corner. We have Billy, the kid in this corner, windy, blown out

pair of underwear. Cahill. Well, Cahill plows the kid, wrestles into the ground, Gilday every call quote, windy through the youth to the floor, wrestles into the ground, Gildet, Gildet, Gildet, he recalled, quote, when he threw the youth to the floor, sat on him, pinned his arms down with his knees and started slapping his face. Billy worked his right arm free, managed to grasp his 45,

then there was a deafening roar. When he slumped to his side, as the kid squirmed free. End quote. After the kid shot, Cahill, mortally in the stomach, man, gut shot, no less. He bolted out the door, mounted the nearest horse, skinned on out of town, despite the previous abuse and Cahill being much larger and getting the upper hand in the fight,

the shooting was still considered unjustifiable, and Billy was captured by some local soldiers from the local camp there, the local fort. Well, these guards, you know, they take pity on the kid, and he's basically allowed to escape. This is the second time his young life believes escape trial. It won't be the last. And it also shows that he must have been, you know, he wasn't like some outlawed villain. He was very well liked all throughout his young life. People like this guy. So he must have been, you know, very charismatic. And this won't be the last, yeah, like I said, last time he escapes trial,

he has a big bloody highlight escape scene from like a future Hollywood blockbuster coming up. It's gonna be very excited to tell that part of the story. So now the kid is wanted for murder. He makes his way back to New Mexico. He's gonna be dead in four years. But man, what a legendary four years he's gonna live. He's gonna live more in those four years

and most do in 90. And so even though, you know, we're still gonna kind of go in chronological order for the rest of today, timeline just doesn't feel right anymore. This next four years, we're going to take some twists and turns, we're going to expand too much, too many side roads. All right, partner. Let's hop along out of this here, miss.

Good job, soldier. You made it back. Barely. So now, Billy is on the run for murder. Billy next turns up in the house of high school Jones. It's kind of a weird name, H-E-I-S-K-E-L-L. High school Jones and Pacos Valley, New Mexico. A patchies. I remember I brought them up earlier, they'd stolen the kid's horse, left him no choice,

but to walk many miles to the nearest settlement, which was Mrs. Jones' house. How crazy is that, man? He's on the run in the days when you can get killed by a Pachies. This is all happening in the heart of the Wild West. And Mrs. Jones nurses the young Billy who is near death back to health. And then because her name is Mrs. Jones,

I also imagine her having a toward love affair with the young William, learning him in the uninhibited ways of the lonely love starved frontier's woman. For the record, there's no mention of that anywhere. And she's probably a happily married maternal godfair and homesteader who never gave him a single seductive glance, but I'm going to ludicrously assume

Billy got busy in the Pekcost value nonetheless. Because that's what happened in the movie and this all feels very cinematic to me. The Jones family did develop a strong attachment to Billy. Okay, even one of their horses. Again, shows the kids must have been a fairly likable dude. It's always someone willing to help him out. Well, Billy, after leaving the Joneses, you know, he can't get taken care of by Mrs. Robinson forever, he's got to make some money. And so, around this time, he begins to firt to himself as William H. Bonney instead of Henry William McCarty, probably to try and conceal his wanted identity.

I mean, you know, he's not just wanted for a little thievery now, he's killed a guy. He would also, you know, sometimes you firt to himself as Billy Antrim, take a stepdad's last name, but McCarty, Bonney or Antrim, he's, again, he's wanted for murder, honest work is gonna be a little hard to come by and he ends up falling in with the boy's

cattle rustling gang led by another outlaw, Jesse Evans. Now, quick note about cattle rustling. Super common in the 1870s, Southwest, right? It was huge in the Pecos Valley in Lincoln County, New Mexico. At the time, the largest county in the entire country had like one sheriff. It's huge county. 1866, Charles Goodnight, all of her loving

had driven vast herds of cattle along the Pecos and set up cow camps and seven rivers, what is now Carl's bad. Texas cattle bear and John Chisholm soon joined them, brought an estimated 100,000 head of cattle of his own to the Pecos Valley, earned him the nickname King of the Pecos Valley. That's a lot of beef, hard to keep an eye on it all. And with again, with very few lamin around, it was easy pickings for cattle rustlers. Chisholm, by the way, for cinema buffs, was portrayed

by John Wayne the Duke in a 1970 movie called Chisholm. All right, very direct. And in the early 1870s, two dudes, Lawrence Murphy and James Dolan, they opened up the only store in all the Lincoln County, this gigantic county near Fort Stanton, Murphy and Dolan, Mercatile and Banking, soon bringing another powerful businessman, John Riley, of the air into the fold. And he's Irish, guys.

And this little, the only business in town. And again, the county was huge. At the time, it covered a fifth of the entire New Mexico territory. And in addition to the story, these guys also owned huge cattle herds, big cattle ranches. And so these guys were able to obtain lucrative government contracts with the military at Fort Stanton, so now they have a monopoly. Hopefully, some of you remember my attitudes towards monopolies from the Walmart episode, not a big fan.

These assholes own the cattle and the only store that sells the cattle for many, many miles around. They control pricing on the meat. They both raise and sell on the rest of the goods as well. They virtually control the entire local economy of this county. And the local law enforcement is in their pocket as well. And together with their allies, they formed a business association really gang called the House.

And the House runs Lincoln County like Brad Wesley runs the town of Jasper in the 1989 classic movie, Swazie, a Swazie movie, Road House. All right, this is Road House. If I can, the House is Brad Wesley in his little associates. It's their town. And soon, Billy the Kid will be Swazie's Dalton,

undersized and underestimated. Again, Billy the Kid was only about 5'7, $35, produced quick as he was quick with the gun, just like Swayze was quick with a throat rip. And he'll help a new store owner, just like Swayze helped to do trying to clean up the bar and roadhouse. Okay, so the house is not well liked by locals, for obvious reasons. They charge too much for their goods, pay too little for locals' cattle. But no one is able to stand up to them until lawyer Alexander McSween and cyborg, John Tundstill set up a rival business. Tundstill, check this out, half robot

killing machines set back from the future to free the people of Lincoln County. Okay, that's obviously not true. A little bit of terminator got into my brain for some reason. How cool would that be if it was? Right, little sci-fi mixed into this western, get a little westworld with it? No. Tundstill is a young, wealthy English banker who's decided to try and make his fortune in the New Mexico cattle business.

You know, he had moved to Victoria, British Columbia to work at a store. His father had there, had some money to invest, wanted to strike out on his own, heard about people pouring into Lincoln County, New Mexico, and there was a lot of money to be potentially made. So he arrives in Santa Fe, meets this lawyer, McSween, McSween informs him that the house runs the only game in town, but that there is, excuse me, another regional cattle baron who would like to expand his business from the Pecos Valley in Delincan. And that's the king of the Pecos Valley, John Chisholm.

Right? John Wayne. Tundstall meets Chisholm. Again, only over more than 100,000 had a cattle. And Chisholm decides to back J.H. Hunstall and co-shopping bank, located near and in direct competition with Murphy and Dolan mercat island banking.

So now the seeds of the Lincoln County War. This is a big, wild west to do. A battle where Billy the Kid would achieve most of his notoriety. Now they've been sewn. Tundstle, Chism and McSween, and soon to be Billy versus the House. And just like with gambling,

initially the odds favor the House to win. Man, they had local sheriff William Brady on their side. They had territorial governor in their pocket. Other politicians in their pocket. And when Tunstall refuses to cave into local law and political pressure to just go away and let them run their county, you know, let Brad Wesley have his town, violence is threatened. And the young John Tunstall hires some local tough guys to both protect himself, his investment and help work his ranch. And Billy, the kids, one of these men, he wanted the boys gang who had previously stolen cattle from both Tunstall and from the house. Now Billy had just been put into jail in the town of Lincoln. I say town, it was like unincorporated,

we can call it a town, wasn't officially a town, but he's in a little Lincoln county jail for stealing a team of buggy horses from none other than John Tunstle. But Johnny has him released on the condition that he'll work for him. He'll put Billy on the payroll as a cowboy gunslinger attached to a team of other young, you know, men, basically the plot of young guns, the movie with Emilio Estevez, and it is said that Billy was delighted by this opportunity to go straight. He respected Tunstle because Tunstle treated him with respect. Again, how charismatic must have Billy win? Billy Bend, excuse me. He just talked the man he just stolen from into hiring him. And how crazy was the old west where men like those in the house

could just run shit the way they saw fit, could just run a county. Well, after seeing Tunisl hire Billy and a few other kind of, you know, local tough guys. The house decides to further arm themselves. They hire other boys gang members. Billy used to ride with, including Jesse Hefferfucker Evans, the gang leader. Jesse had recently acquired this new, more aggressive nickname in a drunken Romanic encounter witnessed by none other than Willie Steardick Whisperer, McJankins in 1976. And Hefferfucker is ready for war. Okay, the nickname stuff was bullshit, but you know that.

But Jesse and a few other cattle rustlers really are now working with the house. And Billy and a few other rustlers are really working with Tundstle. Billy loved Tundstle, you know? Claiming him as the only man that ever treated me like I was free, born, and white. All right, so that love's gonna come into play later.

And again, I say love, like, love's in like a father figure, even though he was aboutborn and white. All right, so that love is going to come into play later. And again, I say love, like love to him like a father figure, even though he was about the same age, that this doesn't get any homo erotic territory. Okay, so now let's get into Lincoln County War. Billy has stumbled into a very volatile situation. He's working as a cattle hand, slash hired gunslinger for Tunstall. A man very much wanted dead by the house.

His official title is cattle guard, but as Tunstall, he's really hired to protect. And then in February 1878, a man very much wanted dead by the house. His official title is Cattle Guard, but it's tonnestole he's really hired to protect. And then in February 1878, shit hits the proverbial fan. Dolan and his house associates are losing lots of money to tonnestole's new store in bank. The house is super pissed at tonnestole's lawyer

and business partner, McSween. McSween is the executor of a will, of a recently departed, the will, of a recently departed house associate, Emil Fritz, a man who dolan and Murphy, members of the house, had a hundred thousand life insurance claim on. And now McSween won't sign off on paying the house to a hundred thousand dollars, money they need to stay afloat in this new competitive financial atmosphere. House members go to court and the court ends up siding with the house. Of course they do. They're probably in their pocket.

And the House holds McSween, or excuse me, the court holds McSween accountable for owing, Dole and Murphy the money. Well, McSween still won't pay. So now the court authorizes them to see some of McSween's assets. And those assets include goods from the store he shares with Tundstool and also ranch assets he shares with Tundstool. All a bunch of trumped up bullshit. But what it leads to is share of Brady forming a posse deputizing a bunch of local tough guys. And this whole posse heads to Tundstle's ranch to seize some of his assets.

When Tundstle protests the legality of Brady bringing this posse onto his land, one of these new deputies, William Morton, feels like there's a fucking million Williams in this story. Well, this William, will he Morton? He gives tonsil a bullet in the head and shit is on. The war has begun. Woo doggy!

Oh, you don't start shit now, William Morton. You peeled open a big ol' can of worms. Oh, you don't even know how many worms hide in their can. So now Billy, he, remember, he adored this tonsil guy. And now this guy's dead. He's not happy about it. After tonsils funeral, Billy swore, quote, I'll get every son of a bitch who helped kill John if it's the last thing I do. A showdown to come and watch on a ring go. You look like

someone just walked on a real grave. Well, Billy has to wait a bit on revenge. The kid, along with Fred Wait are briefly jailed by Sheriff William Brady on some bullshit, nothing charges to keep a bit on Revenge. The kid, along with Fred Wait, are briefly jailed by Sheriff William Brady on some bullshit, nothing charges, to keep a war from breaking out. But he doesn't stop it, all Brady does is delay it. After he's released, Billy soon joins a posse led by Dick Brewer.

That's a real name. Dick Brewer, he's to Dick Brewer. He's brewing up some dick. And he's Tonsville's ranch foreman, a group of cattle guards and other people who finally had enough of the house. And they all called themselves the regulators, Mound-Up.

My brain automatically says that every time I hear the word regulator, Mound-Up. And initially, the group's primary aim was to hunt for Tonsville's killer William Morton. So now, the regulators Mound-Up are coming for Morton. I'm going to stop saying that after that word. And on March 6, 1878, the regulators have tracked Morton. I'm gonna stop saying that after that word. And on March 6, 1878, the regulators have tracked Morton. I still said that in my head, the mount-up part.

They've tracked Morton in the countryside near Rio, Pinyasco. After a five-mile running gunfight, Morton surrenders on the condition that he and his fellow deputy sheriff, Frank Baker, would be returned alive to Lincoln. However, on the third day of the journey back to Lincoln, March 9, Billy, and another regulator killed these guys

along with another fellow regulator that tried to stop him from killing him. Man, remember, he swore he'd get you, and that's what he did. He's gonna get you. And talk about how cool is that five-mile running gun battle. That's like straight out of a western man. Horses galloping across a prairie, shooting across the saddle, Cowboys hunkered down, making themselves as small as possible to avoid the gunfire behind them. I'm here and just like,

yeah, yeah, come on, silver, come on, secretariat, come on, Mama's teacup. Man, you are shit out of luck if you're riding on the back of Mama's teacup in a firefight. I mean, you're already embarrassed to have that as a horse, but she was cheap. You didn't have a lot of scratch, you spent on horses. She's always been slow in her size, but now Mama's teacup is going to get you killed. Well, the regulators, they're not near through, not by damn sat. Three weeks later, Billion, several other regulators hold up in tonsil store while Sheriff William Brady searching for the killers of his deputies. They ambushed the Sheriff and his men on April 1st,

April Fool's Day, 1878 killing Sheriff Brady, mortally wounding one of his deputies, shooting from behind a 10 foot Adobe wall outside the worldly hotel and Lincoln, New Mexico, the concealed gunman, Mowdown Brady and Deputy Hinman. The sheriff could sit by a dozen bullets, sitting in the middle of the road,

still not daddy groans, oh Lord, tries to rise, another volley of shots riddles his corpse. He follows over, he's dead. Deputy henman mones and cries out for water. Ix Stockton emerges from a saloon rushes down the street, temps to pull the wounded deputy did safety and he does, henman is hit again himself and dies in the street. And now the kid is in a whole heap of trouble. He's killed a sheriff.

May no law round here, law dog. May no law round here. Probably killed a sheriff, probably, I don't say killed a sheriff, because some historians think it could have been another regulator whose bullet actually killed Brady, but whatever, Billy's who gets blamed for it. So now Billy's hiding out in Lincoln County,

still working for Townestall's party, McSween, his partner McSween, who was able to hide him from what few authorities came looking for him. It was easier to evade the law back then. The work continues. But then McSween himself is shot dead. On July 19th, 1878, McSween and his supporters, including Billy the Kid, are besieged by the new sheriff, George Peppin.

Sheriff Peppin, and a group of Peppin's men in McSween's home, McSween's house is set on fire, and several people are shot dead as they flee out of the burning house men in McSween's home, McSween's house is set on fire, and several people are shot dead as they flee out of the burning house, including McSween himself. Damn it. He had a place to hide, and now that place is burnt. Dag, nabbit. Well, shit has gotten so out of hand in Lincoln County that President himself now intervenes. On September 1878, President Rutherford B. Hayes removes New Mexico's corrupt territorial

governor, governor Axteail, and appoints Lou Wallace in his place. And then on November 13, 1878, Governor Wallace proclaims Amnesty for all those involved in the Lincoln County War if they were not already under an indictment. Well, this proclamation does not include Billy the kid because he is under indictment for killing Sheriff Brady. So instead of getting Amnesty, he gets a $500 reward put on his head, which is a little over $11 grand in today's dollars.

Not a crazy amount, but enough to get people looking for him. Man, the fucking house, man, the house always wins. They're back in charge now. Tonsville and McSween's cattle empire, their brief competition is gone. Well, Billy, tired of living on the lamb, he gets a message to this new governor, Wallace,

that he'll abide by the new peace agreement of Amnesty will be given to him as well. Says he has no interest in fighting anymore and then the governor makes him a deal. Gets word to Billy that he'll give him Amnesty a full pardon as long as Billy will testify against others for the various crimes of the Lincoln war and Billy agrees. And he agrees because he really is sick of the violence because his old boys gang friend outlaw Jesse Evans, who some historians believe was far deadlier than Billy himself, had recently killed the attorney McSweeney's widow had hired to go after the house for McSweeney's murder, a guy named Houston Chapman. On February 18, 1879, Billy with some others wrote into Lincoln

hoping to parlay with Dolan in his group. One of the Dolan group wanted to shoot Billy, instead the two sides gathered on the road to shake hands and sign an agreement not to testify against anyone. It was decided that anyone who broke the agreement should be killed on sight. This agreement was celebrated by everybody getting drunk except for Billy. The drunk's demanded that one of those on Billy's side Houston Chapman do a little jig, just dance a little jig for me. Alright, you dance a little jig. Well, Houston refuses and then Dolan and another, they fire their guns and they kill him and then set him on fire and force Billy to watch. Not a subtle message that, you know, you better not, you better not actually testify, you know, with the governor against this.

We don't give a shit about your amnesty. Well, Billy does testify. In March of 1879, he testifies in front of a Lincoln Grand jury, his testimony leads to the arrest of more than 50 men for the murders and crimes related to the Lincoln County War, Dolan himself, leader of the House, is indicted on his involvement in the murder of Houston Chapman. He hired Jesse Evans to do it. Jesse himself takes off fleas, eventually

captured by Texas Rangers and imprisoned. However, Billy himself is not given the promised pardon. And then shortly after testifying and being double crossed by governor Dick Bag Wallace, he slips his handcuffs and escapes, spending the next year or so of his short life hiding around Fort Sumner and the Pecos River Valley. So now Billy really is an outlaw. He's not just wanted for murder.

He is wanted for the murder of a law man. He's testified against a number of other bad men who also want him dead. Not a good spot. And he's a little pissed off that everyone was given to Amnesty but him. He's getting by rustling some cattle with a new gang that includes some former regulators who grouped it, simply called themselves the rustlers. Governor Wallace has put out wanted ads

and the papers all over the Southwest, including Santa Fe and Vegas, making sure everybody knows about this $500 price on his head. While on January 10th, 1880, Joe Grant, looks like he tries to collect in that $500 and it doesn't work out well for him. Billies having a drink in Bob, Hargroth, 1880, Joe Grant looks like he tries to collect $500 and it doesn't work out well for him. Billy's having a drink in Bob Hargrove's saloon in Fort Sumner with James Chisholm, brother of Tunisal Ranch backer John Chisholm and some other cowboys.

Wanted as he is, he's still enough of a badass to pop into the saloon and grab some drinks. There's a different era, man. Dude had some balls, too. Well, newcomer to that area, Joe Grant, aka Texas Red, recognizes the kid, walks up to him and says, I'll kill a man quicker than you will for a whiskey. Apparently, he's looking to make a reputation as a local badass and become some kind of wild west legend himself. Well, the kid says back to him, that's a beauty Joe, referring to Joe's revolver.

The kid then takes the pistol from Grant's hand, spins the cylinder, checking at the same time to see how much ammunition contains, three cartridges instead of the full six. Purposely moves the cylinder, so that the next load will be a failure, returns the revolver to Grant. He knew this guy, obviously, is looking for some trouble. Short time later, Texas Red threatens to kill Barron,

cattlebarron, John Chisholm, not realizing it's not John, it's his brother James. Billy tells him to go look for trouble, trouble, that, trouble, somewhere else. Joe Ames is pistol on the real target. He had that evening, Billy himself. Billy turned his back to Joe to continue drinking. Joe pulls the trigger.

Billy hears the click of the empty chamber because he's a goddamn Wild West Batman. And he spins around and lickety split puts a bullet right through Texas Red's brains. Billy then walks over to the fresh corpse, looks down at it and says, Joe, I've been there too often for you. Cool as a cucumber that Billy was.

Kills a man, throws out some slick phrase and's over his recently died corpse. Wow man, how crazy is that man? Just how smooth is that? He's like, this guy might be some trouble. I'm gonna take a couple bullets out of his gun. In case he tries to shoot me, I'll have a little jump on him. So, okay, so even though Texas, Killin' Texas Red doesn't bring him any additional heat from local

lawmen, things are heating up. After Billy's escape in 1879, a former friend of his Pat Garrett is elected sheriff in 1880, and he vows to bring Billy to justice, even getting permission from the U.S. Marshals to chase Billy across state and territory lines if necessary. All right, well Sheriff Grant Garrett gets in numerous gun battles with Billy and his rustlers over the next year. One of his deputies, James Carlyleau, getting killed in one of these exchanges, Billy's blamed for that murder as well. You know, now at least according to Sheriff Garrett, he's killed, you know, two lawmen. Well, finally Garrett's posse tracks the rustlers so they're hideout and stinky springs. Well, finally, Garrett's policy tracks the rustlers to their hideout in Stinky Springs. Surround them. Inside, we're Billy and for the rustlers. The siege continues until the next day.

When one of the rustlers finally waves a white flag and the bandit surrender after one of them is shot and killed. And then Billy and the kid is his gang are captured on December 23, 1880 and taken to Santa Fe, New Mexico. I love that Stinky Springs. That's a perfect Wild West hideout. So now he sentenced to die April 9, 1881 after a one-day trial, Billy the kid is sentenced to hang for the murder of Sheriff Brady in order to be transferred to the Lincoln County Courthouse. Now legend says that upon the sentencing, check this shit out. The judge told Billy he was going to hang until he was quote, dead, dead, dead. And then Billy responds with, well, you can go to hell, hell, hell. Woo!

That is some Wild West shit right there, you guys. So it's bad news for Billy, but good news for us. Because then he goes on to have one of the most badass, if not the most badass jailbreak in Wild West history. Thursday, April 28, 1881. Billy waits to be hung while the new Lincoln County Sheriff Pat Garrett, one time friend to Billy, more in that relationship later, he travels nearby White Oaks.

New Mexico to buy supplies, build the gallows to hang Billy with. While the sheriff is away, Billy asked Deputy James Bells who used the outhouse. He's gotten along with Bell all right, past few weeks, have even played cars together and the jail for past time. I mean, death throw is very different back then.

These guys all knew each other, both Bell and the only other at Deputy on duty, Pecos Bob, Ollinger. You know, they were around for the Lincoln County War. Pecos Bob even fought in that war, fighting for the house, actually killed one of Billy's friends, John Jones. Pecos Bob apparently has been taunting Billy,

daring him to try to escape so he can use a new shotgun they have in the armory on Billy. Well, Peco's Bob, he takes the other five prisoners, St. Lincoln County Jail, and courthouse to a local hotel for dinner. Billy is deemed too dangerous to be let out, and he's left behind. Again, the penal system of the New Mexican Wild West

is clearly in its infancy. They don't have an actual prison with proper cells and dedicated staff. They just have a two-story courthouse with a few cells in the middle of a very rural area in an unincorporated town of Lincoln. And they have a couple, you know, former fucking cattle russers or cowboys or whatever working as deafies. Well, Deputy DeBell, he puts billions of shackles, takes him to the privy behind the courthouse, not even an indoor toilet in the courthouse, man.

This is rural. Billion does his best to deny impression in the bathroom, slips out of the, slips a wrist out of one of his handcuffs, and then as he and Bell step back inside the courthouse, slugs that dude in the face, and either shoots Bell with his own gun, he's just taken from him, or a pistol a friend may have hidden the outhouse.

The exact detail is lost to history, so much for his poker buddy. Guess maybe they weren't that close after all. And now check out what he does. I love this because he already has a pistol. He doesn't need to do this, but he clearly has a flair for the dramatic. This is the kind of thing that really made Billy the kid a Wild West legend. Billy goes upstairs, grabs the shotgun, deputy Allinger had been taught in him with from the second story, Armory, and he waits for Allinger to return where he's you know taking to the prisoners cross street for dinner or for lunch. Excuse me. So the man who's been taught in him, the man who killed his friend, old regular buddy John Jones, he returns to the courthouse. No one he's heard the shot, you know, he's

heard the shot that fired the killed Bell. Well now Billy is perched under a window facing the court side yard. He can see Peco's Bob running back to the courthouse. Here's Peco's Bob, you know, did Belle just kill the kid? God-free, gosh, a former cook on the Tunisle Ranch who had been grabbing vegetables from a guard behind the courthouse, had just seen Belle stumbled from the courthouse moments

before dropping dead from a bullet wound. And he answered to him, he says, the kid has killed Belle. And then just like out of a damn movie, smiling Billy pops up in the second story window, shotgun aimed at all in just face and says, hello, Bob. And Bob says, yes.

And he's killed me too, right before taking a whole mess of buckshot to his obliterated face. Whoah, whoo, that's how you make an escape. Hot damn. Well, Crowd is now gathered over the gunfire and Billy addresses them from the courthouse. He tells him he doesn't want to kill anybody else but he will if he has to. He gathers a Winchester rifle, two pistols. A whole bunch of ammo from the armory. He tells his old friend, you know, Tunnistol Ranch guy, Godfrey, to gather him some tools,

to get the shackles off, get him some food and get him a horse. Godfrey obliges about an hour later, after getting the shackles off enough to ride, he gallops out of town, a legend of the Wild West. Man, unreal, sounds so cinematic, it's hard to believe. Kills both the Epidies, the only lamin-on duty in town, broad daylight, frees himself from shackles

in front of the damn near the whole town, and then rides off in a stolen horse, taking the sheriff's rifle and two pistols with him. That alone makes this entire time suck worth it for me. All right, so now Billy's on the run. He's back on the run, sheriff's gear, back on the chase. Billy's now killed or at least gear up. He's killed at least four lawmen.

He has lost interest in capturing him alive after Billy's numerous escapes. Governor Wallace has renewed the $500 reward. You'd think he'd raise it, whatever. A few months after his escape on the night of July 14th, the sheriff and his two deputies approached the dusty old fort now converted to living quarters and Fort Sumner. And the residents were sympathetic to the kid there,

and the lawmen knew that, they knew they could extract, not a lot of information, but Garrett thought he maybe could get some info out of an old friend that he and Billy shared and a guy named Peter Maxwell. And so he goes to Peter Maxwell's house, or a little apartment to talk to him.

And before we get into that a little further, the last moments to Billy's life, let's delve into his relationship with Sheriff Garrett. Cause Pat Garrett and Billy have a lot of history before Garrett became Sheriff. Pat Garrett born in 1850, nine years before the kid, down in Chambers County, Alabama. Dad moved his family to Louisiana to work on a plantation. Didn't go well by past teenage years, the family's in debt, and like Billy, soon after that

both his parents were dead. Young Pat moved out west to make his fortune, first arriving in Dallas County, making his ways a buffalo hunter, back when that was still a thing. Also like Billy, as a young man, he killed a dude, shoot and fell a Buffalo Hunter, Joe Brisco, dead after a heated argument. Never charged for the crime because back then, you could shoot somebody for an argument,

it was totally understandable. Think about that, man. I heard you killed a man, Mr. Garrett. Shot him down, is that so? Yes, your honor, I did indeed killed that man myself. And can you give me a reason? Why you shouldn't be charged, is that so? Yes, Your Honor. I did indeed kill that man myself. And can you give me a reason why you shouldn't be charged with murder and hum? Yes, Your Honor. Joe Brisco was a nasty some bitch, agitating Coral some fond of liquor and arguing ways.

And well, the entire saloon had heard enough of his shit. Down to good to me, Mr. Garret, case dismissed. Best of luck with the buffalo. Well, by 1878, Garret's working at a ranch in New Mexico by 1879, he's tendon bar and a saloon and fort Sumner. And right in the middle of the Lincoln County War, and Pat liked Billy, loved to gamble. And he and Billy would often find themselves

in the same car table and fort Sumner. And while gambling, they earned themselves some new nicknames, Billy, who'd call Pat, who stood at six foot four inches tall, Big Casino, and Pat would call the five, seven-inch Billy, little casino, and they drank and gambled together numerous times over the next year, so in the small community of Lincoln County.

But then, you know, Garrett got tired of all the bloodshed and lawlessness of the area, and when he ran for share for a short time later in 1880, he prioritized bringing Billy the kid to what he considered justice. His opinion of Billy, taken from a book on the kid, he writes shortly after the kid's death, called the authentic life of Billy the kid, says, quote, the kid had a lurking devil in him. It was a good humor, jovial imp, or a cruel and bloodthirsty fiend, his

circumstances prompted. All right, so Garrett, his old buddy, Big Casino, and his two deputies, stumble on over to the converted fort summer that July night, speak to known kid associate Peter Maxwell. And after speaking with Maxwell for several hours Pat Garrett realized he wouldn't have to go far to find Billy. He wouldn't have to go anywhere at all because Billy was about to find him. He's sitting in Maxwell's dark bedroom, questioned Maxwell over candlelight and notices a man approaching Maxwell's room from the outside.

He retreats into the shadows of the room. Garrett claimed he could see the outline of Billy the Kid. He could see a knife in Billy's left hand and revolve on his right. Many historians think he was unarmed. Billy slowly approached the doorway, asking who was there several times in Spanish. Kienes, kienes.

Spanish will be the last language he would speak. Garrett fires twice from the darkness. First bullet hit and Billy the Kid, AKA William Bonnie, AKA Henry McCartney in the heart, and a Wild West legend is dead at no more than 21 years old. No legal charges are brought against Garrett since a killing was ruled at justifiable homicide. And Billy the Quidd is quickly buried, early the next day, and a plot in between his dead friends Tom OFoliard, and Charles Bodra at Fort Sunder's Cemetery. But, did he really die that July night?

Some said Garrett had shot a different man, or even conspired with Billy the Kid to stage his killing in order to claim the $500 reward money. That conspiracy theory gained momentum in 1950 when an old man in Hico, Texas, named Oli Brushy-Bill Roberts, proclaimed himself the authentic Billy the Kid, guess he switched his nickname, and petitioned new governor, new Mexico governor, Thomas J. Maverie for a pardon. Although the testimony of Roberts proved flimsy, doubts about the official demise of Billy the Kid remained strong, strong enough so that in Heiko today, a Billy the Kid Museum continues to vouch for Brushy Bill's story. Well, we'll never know exactly the truth,

because a flood washed away Billy's original wooden tombstone not long after he died. 1904, so no one knows exactly where the body is anymore, making DNA testing, trying to link him to Brushy Bill, or anybody else claiming to be the original Billy the Kid, a huge undertaking if not completely impossible. And all likelihood, Billy died that night. And even if he didn't, he's still long since dead by now.

He did, however, almost finally get that governor's pardon in 2010. Then governor of New Mexico Bill Richardson, a history buff, strongly considered it finally making up his mind right before leaving office. Says, I've decided not to pardon Billy the kid because of a lack of conclusiveness and the historical ambiguity as to why Governor Wallace reneged on his pardon. So Billy the Kid may never get that pardon. And we'll never know all the details of his life, but we will definitely write, damn now, get us some top five takeaways. Time suck, top five takeaways. Number one, the windy cahill murder. We'll never know exactly how many men Billy the kid killed.

He was involved in numerous shootouts with the regulators in Lincoln County War, the rustlers after the war before his death, and in a few random run-ins along the way. But whatever one seems to agree on is that the man he first killed was named Frank Windy Cahill. He of the worst nickname in the West. What was he thinking? Going by the nickname of Windy. If only he knew that in future western movies, guys with nicknames like Wendy always die early. Wendy, Scooter, Mudflap, Fruit Loop. Those guys

don't make it to the third act. Well, what happened to Mudflap, Scooter and Fruit Loop? They out, they out got shot. Who lived? Killer, Blade, dead eye, Reaper, the kid. They're all fine. Number two, life in Lincoln County. Lincoln County in the mid 1870s sounds like a terrible place to live. It's high desert, cold at night, hot during the day. You have to look out for Geronimo, let it patchies.

And if you're not a member of the house, you pay too much for everything and you get too little for anything you have to sell. And a place that only has one store. You probably work in the cattle industry for some bearing who doesn't give two shits about you, and you probably die young and poor. And there's a very good chance you can shop. The whiskey's warm, and I'm guessing, the wild west women are fairly homely. And there was no running water, air conditioning, or

decent medicine. Remind me, never to be a ranch hand in the 1870s. Number three, jail breaks. Billy broke out of custody. At least three times was allowed to slip out of fourth time back at Fort Grant after that first killing. Dude was an escape artist on par with Houdini and clearly pretty likable and charismatic. Except, you know, he had a gun for his biggest tricks. He snuck up a chimney when he was a kid, slipped out of the handcuffs years later as a young adult, finally shot his way out of the Lincoln County Courthouse a few months before his death. Him may have died by 21, but he died with cooler stories than any of us will ever have no matter how long we live.

Number four, the killing of Joe Grant. Billy admired the gun and rotated the chamber to an empty position on a man his intuition told him was going to try and kill him that night. A man named Joe Texas Red Grant. Then that guy turned and then, you know, and he turned and shot that guy in the head when the man later drew down on him. Texas Red, man, pretty cool nickname,

but not quite cool enough to keep him alive against the kid. That story alone is enough to make the kid a legend. He was a slick character that Billy, and pretty damn wise, in a lot of ways for someone so young. And number five, death of a legend. Billy the Kid was shot dead by Sheriff, Pat Garrett. On July 14, 1881, a man he literally never saw coming.

A man hiding in the dark, hiding in the shadows. Big casino killed, little casino, that cold New Mexico night, or did he? Like a 19th century two-pock. The man was so shrouded in legend, his death just couldn't be accepted. How could someone so young and inematic in the dark no less, possibly while on arm be it shot? It may be right, but it's just some feel right. Don't feel right.

Well, like all good legends, we'll never know the whole story. And sometimes, isn't that kind of the best way to be? Time suck, tough, five, take away. Well, thank you for listening, everybody. I hope you enjoyed today's episode. I really appreciate you taking the time to listen to it. And it's looking like, based on the rate of iTunes, or ratings coming in, as I said, that the next bonus episode will probably come out Friday, March 10,

that Friday at noon. I'll let you know for sure during the next week's episode. If you want to know what the next episode of TimeSuck is going to be before it comes out on Mondays, please follow me on either Twitter, at D underscore Cummins, on Facebook, at Dan Cummins Comedy, on Instagram, at Dan Cummins Comedy. I also post tour dates there. I'll be the Tacoma Comedy Club in Tacoma, Washington, March 2nd through the 4th. That's right, gonna be in Tacoma this week, Charlie Goodnights and Raleigh North Carolina, March 9th through 11th and Hyena's in Dallas, March 16th through 18th.

Full calendar, full tour available at Dancomans.tv. I'll be posting more dates very soon. Also if you wanna hear a little more about some outlaws, specifically me talking about them, I'm gonna be the guest host of a really fun little podcast called Why why I say little, I don't know, it's a big podcast. I'll be the guest host of a gigantic podcast called the Twisted 10 coming out this Thursday. Every episode of the Twisted 10 is a top 10 list on one subject with Twist. This week it's me rattling off my top 10 Wild West out, and the twist is I made one of them up. So see if you can spot the fake one.

And that's all, that's all y'all. Have a great week, you cow-pokes, outlaws, and city-slickers. Keep on sucking! You keep on sucking! Mmm. Cheers.