Timesuck with Dan Cummins - 280 - The Murder of Laci Peterson - Who Really Killed Her?

Episode Date: January 24, 2022

Did Scott Peterson REALLY kill Laci Peterson? Did you know that zero direct evidence tied him to these crimes? And a lot of the circumstantial evidence in this case was... very loose. And there were huge holes in the prosecution's case against him that they jury just didn't seem to care about. Did you know that numerous neighbors spotted Laci walking her dog in the neighborhood after Scott definitely left their home to head to the San Francisco Bay where and when he supposedly dumped her dead body? Did you know that the house across the street was burglarized at the same time she went missing? That one of the burglars reportedly confronted Laci? Did you know that other pregnant women were also vanishing from the Modesto area for a few years leading up this case, and that one had her headless, limbless body wash up on shore just as Laci's would later?  And there are so many other problems that were never properly addressed or explained in the mainstream media's coverage of all this. The Bad Magic Charity of the month is Love Thy Neighbor! We'll  be giving $15,500 to this Denver-area based 501(3c) nonprofit dedicated to working with local businesses to hand out free food to the homeless. They also give clothing, shoes, blankets, etc. Go to https://ltnsocks.com/Watch the Suck on YouTube: https://youtu.be/7lZeyPa9dEwMerch - https://badmagicmerch.com/  Discord! https://discord.gg/tqzH89vWant to join the Cult of the Curious private Facebook Group? Go directly to Facebook and search for "Cult of the Curious" in order to locate whatever happens to be our most current page :)For all merch related questions/problems: [e-mail] (copy and paste)Please rate and subscribe on iTunes and elsewhere and follow the suck on social media!! @timesuckpodcast on IG and http://www.facebook.com/timesuckpodcastWanna become a Space Lizard?  Click here: https://www.patreon.com/timesuckpodcastSign up through Patreon and for $5 a month you get to listen to the Secret Suck, which will drop Thursdays at Noon, PST. You'll also get 20% off of all regular Timesuck merch PLUS access to exclusive Space Lizard merch. You get to vote on two Monday topics each month via the app. And you get the download link for my new comedy album, Feel the Heat. Check the Patreon posts to find out how to download the new album and take advantage of other benefits.

If someone in your family suddenly went missing or if a crime happened around you right now, and then you were questioned by the police, would you be able to give them an exact rundown of everything you've done today? Maybe everything you'd done last night as well. Would you be able to account for your exact whereabouts, the exact times you arrived and left various places, making sure to never contradict yourself? Would anything about your day or life in general, anything at all, including what you've been doing recently or 10 years ago, suddenly seem suspicious? Would you have a strong documented alibi for everywhere you'd been today, everywhere you'd been the past few days? When put on the spot about all of your activities, is there any chance you'd get any of the details confused? What about

if you were asked six months from now, a year, would you be able to remember a day like today that when it started maybe seemed completely ordinary? Christmas Eve 2002 would become that day for Scott Peterson. And the days and weeks leading up to Christmas Eve and the days and weeks following it would be put under a microscope. That Christmas Eve started for Scott and his wife Lacey like any other day. Maybe. Or maybe it started with the murder. Maybe Lacey didn't make it to Christmas Eve and the night of the 23rd ended for her with her murder. Or maybe Scott, like he told police,

woke up with his wife, Lacey, who was over eight months pregnant with their firstborn, a son to be named Connor. And they ate some breakfast, watched some Martha Stewart. And then he decided it was too cold to go golfing like he'd planned. And he went fishing in his new boat instead. And then when he returned home late that afternoon, he noticed that his dog was in the backyard and his wife, despite her car still being in the driveway, was nowhere to be found. Undeterred, he allegedly assumed Lacey had gotten, you know, picked up to do something by one of her family members who didn't live that far away. And he put his clothes in the wash, tidied up and had a snack. Then confused as to why his Lacey stepdad, Ron, called his house and left a voicemail asking he

and Lacey to grab something on their way to her house or his house. He assumed Lacey was probably at his, uh, her mom's and stepdad's. He phoned Ron back and said that Lacey wasn't home. And then Lacey's stepdad would soon call the police and report her missing. And that would set off a huge and highly publicized chain of events, starting with a search for Lacey, tearful press conferences, area visuals filled with hundreds of search volunteers, a national media firestorm where Scott would immediately be demonized, his every move and emotion scrutinized. covered by America's now entrenched and sensationalized 24-hour news cycle, where talking head after talking head, tabloid after tabloid, conclusively convicted Scott of murder in the court of public opinion. And then it ended with cheers of joy outside the courtroom and in front of TVs across America, celebrating Scott's eventual real conviction for Lacey's murder in 2004. For a long time, it seemed that almost everyone believed that sometime between the night of the 23rd and the morning of the 24th, Scott, for sure, without a doubt, killed Lacey,

threw her body in his truck, drove her to his new fishing boat, took her to the Berkeley Marina, motored out into the San Francisco Bay, dumped her body into the water, concrete blocks Scott supposedly made in his work warehouse weighing her down, and he went back home, pretended to the rest of the world to be a concerned husband. The national media, and especially Nancy Grace, following the old guideline of, it's probably the husband, framed quite the airtight narrative regarding Scott Peterson and how he had to have done it. It was laughable to think otherwise. You were a fool to think otherwise. The police seemed to have, from the very beginning, focused their investigation only on Scott. It was proven by the defense team and court that other credible leads were never

followed up on. Early on, again, it seems the police found out that Scott was having an affair, and at that point, they knew he did it. And when the public found out, exactly a month after Lacey went missing, that Scott had been sleeping with Amber Fry for weeks before Lacey disappeared, the public seemed to have collectively made up their mind that he had to have done it. A lynch mob mentality took over. Scott, with his pregnant young beautiful wife at home, was hooking up with a hot single masseuse. Nude pics of Amber were quickly leaked to the tabloids, and this made him look like a real pig, a real hateable dude, a guy who couldn't wait to get rid of his young wife and unborn child so he could pursue the life of a handsome, hedonistic bachelor.

And then there was Scott's face. He appeared in the days, weeks, and months following Lacey's disappearance to be pretty consistently punchable. His emotional displays on camera or consistent lack of emotion made him appear to many as a sociopath, a heartless narcissist who just wanted to do whatever he wanted to do. And if a petite, adorable pregnant wife were to ever get in the way, well, he'd just have to kill her, not care about killing her and move on with his selfish life. And then Scott changed his

appearance shortly before his arrest and seemed to be in the process of fleeing the country when he was arrested for Lacey's murder. That didn't look good. That seemed to fit the narrative of what a douche. So he did it right. I sure thought so at the time. I remember judging Scott real, uh, real quick. So many of the time I thought it was an open and shut case. And then he was convicted and he is now still in prison. I still thought he for sure did it when I decided to dive into this topic. And then when I did dive in, I started to think, oh, whoa, uh, wait, wait, what? Oh, I don't remember that. Oh, I didn't know that. Oh, shit. Did Scott Peterson murder Lacey or was he wrongfully convicted? If you're

only casually familiar with this case, I bet you're going to be as surprised as I was. And if he was wrongfully convicted, what role did the media circus play in convincing people across the world, undoubtedly influencing a non-sequestered jury, that Scott Peterson was without a doubt 100% absolutely guilty and that he definitely deserved the death penalty. And why is he still in prison if the case against him was as bad as it might seem? The disappearance and murder of Lacey Peterson, an examination of Scott Peterson's guilt, right here, right now, on another Trial of the Century, true crime edition of Time Suck. This is Michael McDonald and you Crime Edition of Time Suck. This is Michael McDonald and

you're listening to Time Suck. You're listening to Time Suck. Happy Monday, meat sacks. Happy belated Martin Luther King Day as well. Thanks for stopping by for this weekly gathering of the cult of the curious. I'm Dan Cummins, the Suck Master, Bagpipe Tuner, Lusafina, the Sunscreen Applicator, Problematic Juror,

and you are listening to Time Suck. Hail Nimrod, hail Lusafina, praise Bojangles, and glory be to Triple M. Hoping I had fun in San Diego and Hollywood this past week. Symphony of Insanity stand-up dates Continue for the spring of 2022 Next month Orlando, Oklahoma City, Atlanta Charlotte, Tempe, Missoula Raleigh, Salt Lake City, Davenport

And Chicago all coming up Might add a date or two actually Dates and ticket links up at dancummins.tv The Appalachian Mountains Has some unique cryptids as you you know, and now we have a unique cryptid tea. The Flatwoods Monster, Devil Dogs, the Tittle Whisper Dragon of Johnson City, that's the tea we're doing. That was the one that caught the Art Warlock's imagination. New Fakelation Cryptid Tea, tie-dye tea in the Bad Magic store now at badmagicmerch.com.

And that's it for announcements. We have a lot of show to get to. So let's fucking go. Topic time. I've gotten a lot of shit in past sucks for, you know, kind of harping on defense attorneys for not considering some defense attorneys to be the most honorable people for taking a, how could you in good conscience represent that piece of shit angle? I'm going to throw the defensive bone on this one. This made me re-examine my stance on defense attorneys and seemingly open and shut murder cases. Not above eating some crow this week. Defense attorneys, they had their hands full, represented Scott Peterson, and his trial reminded me of just how important representing a client who looks guilty as shit can be, when they might not actually be guilty. Let's head back into the world of true crime

for one of the most surprisingly ambiguous murder cases, at least to me and some fellow true crime deep divers that we've covered yet. I'm going to start by talking about the role of circumstantial evidence versus direct evidence in this case. Then we're going to get into confirmation bias, its role in this case, how Scott seemed guilty, looked guilty. So therefore he must be guilty and any evidence to the contrary should just be ignored. I'll talk about the big media circus around this case. I might have doomed Scott from the start. Then there'll be a big timeline starting with Scott Peterson's birth leading up to the present. And then after the timeline, I will dig into why I have some serious, serious doubts about his guilt in this case,

or at least about the prosecution proving his guilt. Let us begin. This one got me this week. This one truly sucked me in more than topics normally do. Did you know that the police never found one single bit of hard forensic evidence linking Scott to the murder of his pregnant wife or the disposal of her body? Seriously, not a drop of blood, not a single eyewitness, not a murder weapon. Also, he made no admission of guilt to any friends, any family, even to the woman he started sleeping with a few weeks before Lacey disappeared. And she asked numerous times when she started working with detectives, a lot of other neighbors and family members asked when they started secretly working with detectives, trying to get something out of him, but nothing.

The state's case against Scott Peterson was built entirely on circumstantial evidence. In fact, the Peterson case is often cited by legal experts and professors as a very rare example of a murder conviction secured with only circumstantial evidence. So what is circumstantial evidence? According to Britannica, circumstantial evidence is the kind of evidence not drawn from direct observation. Basically, instead of a witness saying something like they saw a person fire a gun at someone else and saw the victim die, circumstantial evidence in this example will be the witness saying they heard a shot,

arrived a couple of moments later to see the accused standing over the corpse with a murder weapon in their hand. That evidence is circumstantial because in the second scene, the accused might have been shooting at the escaped or escaping killer, or they might've merely been a bystander who picked up the weapon after the killer dropped it and ran away. Circumstantial evidence is much more ambiguous than direct evidence. And the circumstantial evidence that pointed to Scott Peterson's guilt wasn't nearly as powerful, in my opinion, as the evidence in the example I just laid out.

Direct evidence is evidence that directly links a person to a crime, right? Without any need of inference. Here's several additional examples of direct evidence. Security camera footage showing a person breaking into a store and stealing items. An audio recording of a person admitting to committing the crime. Ballistics tests showing a bullet was fired from a specific firearm belonging to a person. Eyewitness testimony

that a person saw the defendant commit a crime. The defendant's fingerprints on a murder weapon or the weapon used to commit the murder, a computer record showing a person illegally using someone else's credit card, the defendant, you know, being witnessed dropping fresh fecal matter onto a victim's chest, showbiz, a peanut butter, someone watching a person kill their mom and do very unnatural things to her head, to her head, excuse me, in a fit of rage. Mother, why do you make me so angry uh a witness seen a creepy looking ukrainian fellow masturbate his limp penis over the body of someone they just saw him murder what this big deal uh don't worry about those last three if

you're new here uh but those other ones you know obviously are real examples of direct evidence uh here are some examples for contrast of circumstantial evidence eyewitness testament testimony uh that a person was seen fleeing from the scene of a crime. Not committing it, but fleeing. A person's fingerprints found at the scene of the crime alongside other people's fingerprints. An audio recording of the defendant stating his or her intent to commit a crime before the alleged crime actually occurs. Harassing emails or text messages aants sent to a person who was later assaulted, a person's browser history showing how he or she searched for information about the tools

used to commit the crime of which he or she is accused, a person being a dad, which studies I've made up and then referenced have proven time and time again that most dads are murderers and should be arrested, whether there's any direct evidence or not that they did any particular crime. You can ignore that last one if you're new. None of the circumstantial evidence examples I just laid out there were, excuse me, Scott Peterson, the circumstantial evidence against him was not as strong as any of the real examples I just laid out. It's pretty wild. In Scott Peterson's case, direct evidence could have been someone saying they saw Scott attack Lacey or investigators finding blood stains matching Lacey's blood type on any of his clothes or body, or someone seeing him either take her body to his boat or dump her body in the San Francisco Bay. Those are the kind of things

that could have definitively pointed to Scott being guilty of murdering Lacey. But for Scott, no direct evidence. Instead, prosecutors leaned only on a lot of circumstantial evidence, like the fact that Scott was fishing alone. The morning Lacey disappeared and thus couldn't prove exactly what he did out on the water that morning. And that's where, you know, her body would be found. Even though, you know, there were witnesses

who did see him that day on the water and their testimony did go against the prosecution's case and did support Scott's story. The prosecution's equivalent of a smoking gun was that Scott was having an affair behind his wife's back at the time she disappeared. And that he had lied to this woman about numerous things and that he didn't seem sad enough about his wife and unborn child, A, being missing and then B, being dead. about his wife and unborn child, A, being missing, and then B, being dead. And then this was all combined with the fact that, you know, again, where he went fishing is where her body would be found, the body of his unborn son, Connor, would be found. But there's a lot of problems, big problems with this as we'll see today. And that's pretty much it.

That was basically the entire case against Scott. He was cheating on his pregnant wife. He didn't seem sad enough about her death. He went fishing in the San Francisco Bay the morning she disappeared, which is where her remains would later be found, although not in the same part of the bay. Pretty big body of water. Typically in a murder case, unless you have eyewitnesses or even better security camera footage of someone killing the victim, for example, the victim's DNA on the murder suspect

and or, you know, the murder suspect's DNA on the victim. The big three investigators look for to nail a suspect to a crime are murder weapon, body, and motive. The investigators in the public following the case struggled to pin Scott to the crime based on these three criminal aspects. No murder weapon ever found that could be definitively proven as having been used to kill Lacey. By the time Lacey and Connor's bodies were found,

two degraded for medical examiners to determine any exact cause of death. And as far as a motive goes, prosecutors would say that Scott didn't want to be with Lacey anymore and was facing money troubles, which a divorce and child support payment certainly wouldn't help. But they didn't seem to be facing any unusual money troubles for a couple in their 20s, he in their twenties, you just turned 30, uh, expecting their first child. And even if they had, why turn to murder in that scenario? To me, that's not a real,

real strong motive. What's got that kind of person? A lot of couples have money problems. A lot of people have affairs. Very few spouses ever turned to murder to solve these problems. In 2021, Fidelity Investments did their seventh couples and money study, analyzing retirement and financial expectations, communication, and preparedness amongst 1,713 couples ages 25 years and older in a married or long-term committed relationship. And 44% of respondents said that they argue about money with their spouse. One in five said that money was their biggest relationship challenge. Just one study I know,

but many others echo its findings. Looking at numerous studies online, I can confidently say that sex and money, top two sources for romantic relationship problems. And speaking of sex, you know, what about infidelity? On a recent study of 1,700 adults in long-term relationships conducted by Relish, a relationship coaching company, 16% experienced physical infidelity. Other studies I found seem to consistently fall in the 15% to 30% range. Cheating is very common. No surprises there. Murder, though, not very common. The odds of being murdered in America in any given year, according to CDC stats, one in 18,929, uh, you know, higher than I thought, but still really low compared to say heart disease, which is one in 517. And the odds, if you don't live in a particularly violent

neighborhood are obviously going to be, you know, lower than one in 18,929, uh, murders account for less than 1% of all us deaths by, but most solved murders are committed by someone the victim knew, as opposed to a stranger. And if you're a woman, it's more likely that a lover or former lover killed you than anyone else. The CDC analyzed the murders of women in 18 states from 2003 to 2014, finding a total of just over 10,000 deaths. Of those, 55% were intimate partner violence related,

meaning they occurred at the hands of a former or current partner or the partner's family or friends. Women are most likely to be killed by a romantic partner, former romantic partner, somebody who knows one of these romantic partners, and they are to be killed by a complete stranger. So that's pretty scary, right? Women in general should statistically be more worried about the people in their houses that they know than about some stranger in a dark alley. Although maybe don't sleep on that motherfucker in the alley either. These stats shed some light on why Modesto, California investigators

made Scott the primary suspect in Lacey's murder. Statistically, he was in the group most likely to have done it. And since there was no evidence that Lacey was having an affair or had ever had trouble with an ex-boyfriend, since it had been years since she'd ever dated anyone else. You know, he was statistically most likely the person who killed Lacey. Combine these stats with a guy who had just begun to have an affair a few weeks earlier with a guy who went on a fishing trip on Christmas Eve in the same body of water where his wife and unborn child's remains will be found later. And yeah, I get it. Doesn't look good.

Strong suspect as he should have been. Then combine all that with Scott not having the emotional reaction most people seem to expect from someone whose pregnant wife is missing, and he looks really fucking guilty. When I talked to Lindsay about all this, she joked about how I better make sure that nothing ever happens to her because of how I look. And I know how I look. You know, a while back on a father-daughter date, Monroe and I sometimes go on, she made some joke about how if I wasn't her dad how I look, you know, while back on a father-daughter date, Monroe and I sometimes go on. She made some joke about how if I wasn't her dad, she didn't know me. She'd think I was a scary dude. So I look like a scary dude. You know, not the first time I've heard that.

I've had friends, you know, women and men joke about how they would not like to see me in a dark alley. And I'm a good sport. Yeah, I know it's true. Also, I know in the court of public opinion, if I got accused of something like Scott, oh my God, I'd be fucked. If something happened to Lindsay, the Nancy Grace types of world, you know, could and probably would have a fucking field day with me. My natural resting, you know, kind of face is to look irritated, dead in the eyes. It doesn't mean I feel that way. It is how I look. If I focus extra hard to listen to someone, you know, I just look kind of angry. All the shit I've said on the podcast over the years, so much can be taken out of context.

So many stand-up bits about death and murder. Holy shit. I don't like my chances in a jury trial if I don't have an airtight alibi. I listened to some recorded phone conversation between Scott and Jail and his mom, and they talk about his kind of emotional state, his stoic reactions during the trial. And his mom was not surprised at all. You know, it's who he was, who he'd always been, as we'll learn in the timeline. She talked about how he comes from a long line of people who are stoic. His public emotional reactions in the wake of his wife's disappearance did not seem abnormal to those who raised him.

He just, you know, didn't wear his emotions on his sleeve, still doesn't, and he was crucified for it. Jurors said Scott stayed emotionless the whole trial. And this was huge for them. For sure made them feel like he was guilty. One juror did say that was the biggest thing for them. That was the biggest deciding factor. He just didn't seem sad enough. He just wasn't showing emotion. Well, maybe he just wasn't someone who cries in public. I get it. I come from a long line of Stoics on my mom's side. Literally never saw my grandpa cry. Not one time ever. Spent a lot of time around him for, you know, 40 years. Saw my grandma cry one time. Her eyes barely, and it wasn't at his funeral. Her eyes barely watered up at his funeral and she was laughing the day after he died.

And I'm pretty sure she didn't kill him. She loved the hell out of him. If Papa Ward had ever been put on trial for murder, even the murder of his wife and child, I don't think he would have shed a tear. I truly don't. He would have just pushed it all inside. Would have been furious. They dared to suspect him. Dude just did not allow emotion to leak out of him in front of others. Was Scott a guy like that? I don't know. So what made me really question his guilt? What started for me was watching a great six-episode docuseries released on this case in 2017 on A&E titled The Murder of Lacey Peterson. I watched a lot of documentaries. This one was exceptional. Huge kudos to the production team. I'd name them, but so many.

There were seven executive producers, an army of other producers. You can tell a lot of work, a lot of time went into that production. So many interviews with lead detectives, private investigators, original prosecutors, Scott's defense attorneys, the Peterson's neighbors, legal analysts, local journalists who covered the case extensively right as it was happening. You know, various jury members, prosecution and defense key witnesses, Scott's mistress, Amber Fry, various family members, on and on and on. I spent a whole day obsessively watching this entire series and taking a ton of notes. We use a lot of other sources on this, as we always do, some books,

ton of articles, but thank God for online archives. But God dang, this is one of the best done criminal docs I have ever seen, and I had no idea it existed until this week's research. So refreshing to see a critical thinking- logical approach and are increasingly sensationalized culture. I truly think most mainstream news sources now, CNN, Fox, MSNBC, New York Times, et cetera, have just gotten so lost in their own biases that a lot of the news, quote unquote, they put out is just conjectural fucking trash. So much spin. So depressing. I was just talking to my doctor about this the other day about, you know, some, you know, COVID related stats. And I've talked to another friend who's a hospitalist and they're frustrated. They think things are just being spun so much because that's

what we do now. But man, there are some great docs out there. A lot of awesome investigative work being put in. Hail Nimrod to the documentarians. I don't even know if that's a word. I just pulled out documentarian, but it might be. A lot of the problem with accuracy in reporting, I think, is due to the monetary nature of the 24-hour news cycle, right? So much demand to get things out very fast as opposed to accurately. You know, back when you had just three networks

reporting the news, you know, a few hours a day, much of it being repeated throughout the day, less competition. You know, you could get a good team, a likable, trustworthy, seemingly trustworthy anchors, put together some solid, willing to march into the thick of things, field reporters, have a good team of investigative journalists and producers getting the stories right, and you're golden, solid news. Now, and back when the story broke, such a different world, so much more competition, you know, takes too long to get things right. And by the time you

throw out your thoughts, the public, the audience, you know, they've moved on to the next story if you take too much time. You know, you have to milk a story in a different way to fill more airtime. You need more than just the facts, so much speculation, a lot of time for opinion, opinions, you know, from the positions that used to just represent the stories. For years, Tom Brokaw, Dan Rather, Peter Jennings, these types, you know, prime time anchor types, they didn't share many opinions. Definitely didn't share opinions ad nauseum with you. They just slip in a few thoughts, maybe a raised eyebrow here and there. But for the most part, they share the facts that were shared with them.

But then the market changed. And what was good for investigative journalism was not necessarily good for ratings and ad income. So much pressure now to have a strong opinion on the information being provided, you know, to an increasingly celebrity and true crime obsessed culture. Don't have a strong opinion. And even if you're right, you might really suffer in the ratings and then you're out. Probably replaced by someone like Nancy Grace.

Nancy was never popular in my opinion because she was accurate. She was popular because she was angry. She took a fast position on a topic like Scott Peterson and she just fucking railed on it and never backed down from it. She and other news personalities popular at the time like Geraldo Rivera, Larry King, roasted Scott from the very beginning. Perception of Scott heavily tainted by media coverage.

And I should mention that as unbiased as we try to be here on Time Suck, is any news really delivered in a completely unbiased way? No. It seems to be human nature to want to frame a narrative. It's how our brains work. I fight my urge to do it all the time here. Good old confirmation bias. And this confirmation bias, I feel like really fucked Scott and messed up this trial. We've talked about this proven psychological phenomenon here before several times.

Generally when examining cults and why people stay in them or in regards to conspiracies, why people tend to continue to believe in them, even when presented with powerful, overwhelming evidence to the contrary, disproving what they believe in. Confirmation bias is a tendency to interpret new evidence as confirmation of one's existing beliefs or theories. The tendency to search for, interpret, that's big, interpret, favor and recall information in a way that confirms or supports one's prior beliefs or values.

As Warren Buffett, the Oracle of Omaha, one of the best financial minds, investors of our time once famously put it, what the human being is best at doing is interpreting all new information so that their prior conclusions remain intact. Why do we do that? Because we like to feel smart. We like to think we were right all along, right? That I told you so. I knew it. Confirmation bias is so powerful that in some studies, even when there was concrete evidence

showing that the study subjects' beliefs were wrong and when holding onto these beliefs would cost them money, the subjects tended to stick to the incorrect, costly conclusions. No one wants to feel stupid. No one likes to think, ah, shit. Okay. I was wrong. I had it wrong. I think the Peterson jury's confirmation bias was fueled by mass media confirmation bias, right? They're seeing the same tabloid headlines when they check out at the grocery stores, everybody else. They hear people talking at the restaurant. They see what's being said on the news. Scott is a murderer, you know, only an idiot. Wouldn't believe that. And the trial becomes a witch hunt. Scott immediately came across as a very unlikable husband, you know, and then as an unlikable suspect. And finally, as an extremely unlikable defendant. And I'll start with him going fishing

on Christmas Eve. Just that alone made him look like an asshole in a lot of minds, right? What? He took off to go fishing by himself on Christmas Eve. What about his helpless pregnant wife? Over eight months pregnant and he leaves her alone to walk the dog, probably do a bunch of holiday cooking, wrap his presents all while he goes fishing. What a dick, right? That's how it started. Then in the first few days after Lacey disappeared, Scott just never looked really distraught. The only image of him I could find crying was during a New Year's Eve vigil

to search for her a week after she disappeared. One tear on his cheek and he didn't speak at that vigil. Vigil. And this didn't sit well. So many people interviewed about this, right? His reaction fell off. He looked guilty to many. Then there was a time he dared to smile at the vigil.

You know, this New Year's Eve, he helped a very young niece of his place a candle at a memorial of sorts for Lacey. They shared some private moment. Little kid said something to him. Maybe she said something tonally off for the occasion, unintentionally funny for the situation, as little kids often do. Scott briefly smiles and they get a picture of that exact moment. Photographer took a photo, that moment, photo of Scott smiling at the vigil to look for his missing pregnant wife. That put together with his punchable face. He looks very smug, right? This picture gets plastered across tabloid covers shown with no context, shown next to headlines like, did Scott Peterson kill his wife? And he gets talked about in all the Nancy Grace type shows again at nauseam.

And now in addition to why was he fishing alone on Christmas? There was a bunch of, why is he more upset? What's going on with this guy? Then a month after Lacey disappeared. Oh shit. His affair with Amber Frye came to light. Important to note that before this came out,

he was already public enemy. Number one in a lot of people's minds. Now they fucking hate him so much more, right? I knew it. I told you so. Then it came to light that Scott lied to Amber in numerous conversations. The Modesto detectives, you know, had encouraged Amber to record. He told her that he was single, that he'd lost his wife after he said he was single, you know, that he was, this is his first holiday without her, so many more lies, flirting,

flirting in the days after Lacey disappears. That doesn't look good. Some of this information is leaked to the press. Some of Amber and Scott's private conversations will be leaked to the public. Very damning. Now everyone knows he's capable of holding on to some really big secrets. He's capable of living a pretty big lie

to get what he wants. He's coming across like a huge piece of shit, and I'm not saying he wasn't. But being a piece of shit, and I'm not saying he wasn't, you know? But being a piece of shit, being a bad husband, that doesn't just automatically make you a murderer. A few months later, just days after Lacey and Connor's remains are found, when Scott is arrested, he's arrested only a few miles from the Mexican border

with thousands of dollars in cash, camping gear, multiple cell phones, new bleached hairdo, another like, ha ha, I knew it. The one of those moments, he looks guilty as shit. It was like a guilty man about to flee to another country. That was definitely how the narrative was framed in the media circus. Scott will claim he was just trying to escape the constant scrutiny of the press, was down there playing golf with his dad and some other family.

Critics point out that, you know, he could have accomplished staying out of the, you know, press's eye by staying at home, closing the curtains, waiting for investigators to do their jobs. Was that really an option for him? Reporters started camping out in front of his house day after day, sometimes every day for weeks following Lacey's disappearance. That began the day after Christmas. The coverage kept increasing, you know, constantly week after week, uh, leading right into Scott's

trial. I heard a local reporter say that by early 2004, uh, uh, Scott was far in a way, the most hated man in Modesto. There was so much coverage that by the time of his trial in 2004, he probably couldn't have found an unbiased jury, literally anywhere in the country, especially on California for two years, big network morning shows like the today show with Matt Lauer, Katie Kirk, uh, the all news cable channels, especially Nancy Grace. Admittedly, I was never a big fan of hers and less of a fan now. I'm not a big fan of Nancy Grace. So many newspapers, especially those in California and the New York tabloids, they all went crazy over the Peterson case. Greta Van Susteren, I always have trouble with her last name on Fox. Larry King on CNN. Dan Abrams on MSNBC.

I feel like they didn't talk about anything else for months and months. The case made the cover of People magazine numerous times. It became the staple of talk radio. Constantly talked about on the front page of the grocery store tabloids. Actor Dean Cain. Fucking Superman. He played Scott in a made-for-TV movie. Perfect Husband.

The Lacey Peterson story. The movie that framed Scott as a definite murderer. And that movie debuted on the USA Network February 13, 2004, several months before Scott's murder trial began. Everyone thought this motherfucker was guilty before, you know, his trial ever started. You know, even Superman. On Fox, Geraldo Rivera, before Scott's trial began, called Peterson a rat now caught in the trap. Nancy Grace was saying

all kinds of shit to make Scott look worse than he already looked. She told CNN's Larry King during the trial that Peterson tied his wife's feet to a concrete block, tossed her in the San Francisco Bay. She spoke in definitive, clear sentences about the sequence of events as if she were there, as if the police told her all this happened. She talked about, you know, concrete blocks that there was zero proof of ever being created. She talked about tossing a body off a boat. There was zero proof that had ever been, you know, tossed off of the boat or even in the boat. Nancy just pulling shit out of her ass, speculating, but presenting speculation as indisputable. You're a fucking idiot if you don't believe this fact. Just two weeks after Lacey had gone missing, Nancy Grace, other national media personalities,

openly speculated that Scott probably killed Kristen Smart, a woman who'd gone missing from, you know, the college he went to while they were both students there. Kristen Smart disappeared from the campus of California Polytechnic State University in San Luis Obispo, May 25th, 1996, in SLO, California there. She was at a friend's birthday party. At approximately 2 a.m.,

she was found passed out on a neighbor's lawn. Two students helped her walk to her dorm room. Third student, Paul Flores, joined the group because his dorm was close to Smart Storm. Paul told the other two students he'd get Kristen home safely. Then she was never seen again. What was Scott's connection to all this? He also went to Cal Poly. That's literally it. The only connection. He was already dating Lacey at that point. No record he ever knew Kristen. No record he ever saw her. That they literally ever spoke one time.

Even knew who the fuck she was. But she went missing. Now his wife was missing. He didn't seem sad enough. He was a student at the same school. School with around 15,000 students at that time. So, you know, he killed them both. Investigators in SLO actually thought Paul Flores did it.

Still seem to think that. Just have never been able to get enough evidence to charge him. He was actually arrested last April. His house searched, no charges filed, but detectives claimed to find items of interest. After SLO investigators quickly ruled Scott out as a suspect back in early 2003. Well, now it's like a page nine retraction. Nobody pays attention to like, ah, he had nothing to do with that. All they remember is the headline of he did it. He killed them both. Tabloids throw Scott's face on their covers, you know, uh, before this retraction came

with a Lacey's photo, Kristen's photo. There were some, uh, uh, uh, covers with the photo of other random missing area women that he was, you know, never around, probably had alibis for. And just, you know, headlines like, did Lacey Peterson's husband kill before? Is he a serial killer? Long before he was ever charged, the American sensationalist news machinery was preparing for Scott Peterson's upcoming trial to be another very profitable trial of the century. The likes of which we know, we'd see later with Casey Anthony, Jodi Arias. That shit was big business back then. Before reality TV flooded the market,

before there were so many podcasts like this one pumping out true crime tales, the gears of crimes and trials as reality TV machinery were well greased by the time this crime and trial occurred. It followed several notable trials that have revolutionized the news commentary industry. Almost 15 years before, August 20th, 1989, brothers and very savvy financial investors, Lyle and Eric Menendez, shot their wealthy parents to death. That was an

interesting case to look into here for sure. Over several years, three trials, countless hours of media footage, the brothers were found guilty. Court TV, a new network in the early 90s, proved the network dedicating itself to turning court cases into virtual sporting events could not only survive, but thrive. Each broadcast the trial followed by extensive coverage before, you know, and after every newscaster drawing their own conclusions as to what actually happened. Then it was Pamela Smart.

Pamela Smart, married 22-year-old teacher, carried on an affair with a local teenager named Billy Flynn. May 1st, 1990, Smart comes home to find her husband Gregory shot to death. She's arrested in August with the prosecution arguing that she had coerced Flynn and three of his friends to break into the home and kill her husband. Jury found all five conspirators guilty in Greg's death. Sorry, there was a, sorry. So it must've been, there was another friend there.

Smart was sentenced to life in prison. The four boys received lesser sentences. Yeah, sorry. I misspoke. It was four, four, not three. They there. Smart was sentenced to life in prison. The four boys received lesser sentences. Yeah, sorry, I misspoke. It was four, not three. They're out now. Smart's still in prison. Interestingly, she has said she wished she would have been given the death penalty

rather than to grow old and die in prison. Media was all over her sexualized case, broadcasting the trials live, often over previously scheduled programming. Then it was the Bobbitt case. Oh my God, still makes me wince a bit. Still makes me feel a little queasy to think about that one too hard.

June 23rd, 1993, manicurist Lorena Bobbitt cuts off her husband's dick with a kitchen knife. God dang. Drives away from their Manassas, Virginia home with his dick still in her hand. And then she just fucking tossed his dick out in a field before a friend called 911 to report the incident. My God, we might have to look into that case one of these days. I still can't believe she just tossed his dick out in a field before a friend called 911 to report the incident. Micah, we might have to look

into that case one of these days. I still can't believe she just tossed his dick out into a field after cutting off with a kitchen knife. She did have motive. She told investigators

that her husband, John Wayne Bobbitt, had raped her that night. Police had incredibly located the missing dick, brought it to an area hospital where John Wayne Bobbitt underwent a more incredible

and successful procedure to reattach it. And then John would go on to star in some highly publicized pornos with his franken-dick. And yes, I've looked at pictures of his new dick. And not as big as I expected. Those professional porn guys, hard for a novelty act like Bobbitt to compete with. I was impressed that, you know, she was able to kind of stretch it out and cut it off. Both Bobbitts arrested during the spectacular trial that followed,

broadcast in its entirety by Court TV. A history of physical and emotional abuse emerges. John Wayne Bobbitt is acquitted of sexual assault. Lorena Bobbitt, she is found not guilty of malicious wounding. Hell yeah, there's a malicious wounding by reason of insanity stemming from abuse. Then there was, of course, the O.J. Simpson trial. You know, former suck subject. By the time O.J. was put on trial for the murders of Nicole Brown Simpson and Ronald Goldman, January 24th, 1995, cable news firmly entrenched in American

culture. They become big, big business. CNN been around for 15 years. Court TV been around for several years. Fox News, MSNBC just about to launch. The 24-hour news cycle made such a spectacle of the OJ trial, broadcasting every detail for an obsessed country that couldn't get enough. Very real specifics of the case treated like plot points from a TV show. The white bronco, the leather glove, Cato Kaelin, the DNA evidence. As Mark Crispin Miller, professor of media culture and communications at NYU, told the Washington Post, the Simpson trial served as a harbinger of an entirely different media landscape, an event that preoccupies everyone full-time for months on end. From the white bronco chase

to Simpson's shocking acquittal on October 3rd, 1995, countries watching the future of media play out before their eyes. Not only were these trials broadcast in new and much more immediate ways, but the vast majority of them had, you know, to do with interpersonal romantic relationships. In many of these cases, OJ, Pamela Smart, the perpetrator, someone who is married or romantically linked with their victim, and a common language among viewers began to develop to talk about the perpetrator's behavior. Did they seem remorseful enough? What signs about their courtroom behavior indicated their guilt? It was so fun to be given so many voyeuristic details into these people's lives, so much to gossip about. So gossip everyone

did. All the things we say now about whether or not someone looks guilty or if they're grieving in the right way, how much of our fixation on all that has been directly influenced by all the coverage those trials received. I grew up with all that shit. I grew up watching a lot of it. Would I have ever wanted to host a podcast largely focused on true crime details if I hadn't? Would you want to listen to these details if you hadn't been influenced by this in some direct or indirect way? I don't know. I do know that back in the 90s and early 2000s, a lot of true crime focus was on the romantic relationships of the victims and the perpetrators. And news broadcasters and commentators dissected those relationships at length in order to figure out what really happened.

All while racking up millions and millions of viewer ratings and all that money. This was the environment in which the Scott Peterson trial would take place. Now that the stage has been set, let's dig into today's timeline, look at this crazy case, then afterwards,

I'll present some alternate possibilities regarding what may have happened to Lacey that had nothing to do with Scott. But first, a word from today's sponsors. Today's time suck is brought to you by DadWatch, a 5013C nonprofit dedicated to solving dad-related crimes. DadWatch stands for dads are disappearing where all the corpses hide. I'm Dan Cummins, a different Dan Cummins. but dedicated to solving dad-related crimes. DadWatch stands for Dads Are Disappearing Where All the Corpses Hide. Hi, I'm Dan Cummins, a different Dan Cummins, the DadWatch founder, not the stupid, overly opinionated podcast host. I wanted to remind you that Lacey Peterson

was far from the only person in America to go missing in 2002. Did you know that roughly 50,000 people go missing in the U.S. each and every year and are never found. And there's so many dads conveniently cannot remember exactly what they were doing when these people went missing. Coincidence? We here at DadWatch don't think so. The shitty podcast version of me is going to try and convince you that Scott doesn't look that guilty based on the evidence. What he won't do

is remind you that Scott was about to become a dad. And if there's one thing we know for certain here at Dad Watch, it's the dad's kill. Is there any direct evidence? Scott killed Lacey or his unborn son, Connor? No, who cares? Was Connor about to make Scott a dad? Yes, that's what matters. Would that put Scott on more people's radar for other people?

He probably or definitely killed. Yes, case closed. If he didn't want to be convicted of murder, he should have never had sex without birth control. What if Scott really didn't do it? So fucking what? He would have just killed someone else when he became a dad. Justice was still served. We here at DadWatch just want to keep trying to do what's right.

And what's right is keeping Scott behind bars and putting your dad behind bars where he belongs as well. TimeSuck is also, okay, that was an interesting sponsor for today. TimeSuck also brought to you by Whipple! Scott would have never been sent to prison if he would have just drank some Whipple! This joke has finally truly crossed the line edition. Need some help disposing of your, uh... God, oh shit, that is, that's bad. That doesn't...

Need to really focus and figure out a solid alibi when you've just fucking... Ha! Uh, for fuck's sake. Uh, fuck you! Fuck your family! No! Shit! That sounds bad. Really bad in the context of today's story. Just, uh, just drink!

Wh-wh-wh-wh-wh-wh-wh-wh-wh-wh-wh-wh-wh-wh-wh-wh-wh-wh-wh-wh-wh-wh-wh-wh-wh-wh-wh-wh-wh-wh-wh-wh-wh-wh-wh-wh-wh-wh-wh-wh-wh-wh-wh-wh-wh-wh-wh-wh-wh-wh-wh-wh-wh-wh-wh-wh-wh-wh-wh-wh-wh-wh-wh-wh-wh-wh-wh-wh-wh-wh-wh-wh-wh-wh-wh-wh-wh-wh-wh-wh-wh-wh-wh-wh-wh-wh-wh-wh-wh-wh-wh-wh-wh-wh-wh-wh-wh-wh-wh-wh-wh-wh-wh-wh-wh-wh-wh-wh-wh-wh-wh-wh-wh-wh-wh-wh-wh-wh-wh-wh-wh-wh-wh-wh-wh-wh-wh-wh-wh-wh-wh-wh-wh-wh-wh-wh-wh-wh-wh-wh-wh-wh-wh-wh-wh-wh-wh-wh-wh-wh-wh-wh-wh-wh-wh-wh-wh-wh-wh-wh-wh-wh bad in the context of today's story. Just drink. Whipple. I don't know. JK, TimeSite was not brought to you by Whipple today. That's really the wrong spot for a fuck your family at. Like the worst spot. Before we launch forward for real, first, our actual mid-show, not nearly as polarizing and you know, just uncomfortable sponsors commercial break. Thanks again for supporting this show, allowing us to have these sponsors. And now

we're back in today's shit show to quote one of the greatest minds of our time, Super Mario. Here we go! Strap on those boots, soldier. We're marching down a time-suck timeline. August 24th, 1972. Scott Peterson is born at Sharp Coronado Hospital in San Diego, California, to Lee Arthur Peterson, who worked for a trucking company when he was born, and Jacqueline Jackie Helen Latham, who owned a boutique in La Jolla called The Put-On. Sadly, the murder of her daughter-in-law, Lacey, not the only family

homicide Jackie dealt with in her life. Her dad also was murdered. December 21st, 1945, Jackie Peterson's father, 36-year-old John Latham, was killed outside his tire shop in Salvage Yard on San Diego's Point Loma Boulevard. At the time of his death, she was just two and a half years old, the third of four children. According to articles published at the time, in the San Diego Union, Latham was attacked as he left his shop after 9 p.m. His skull smashed in by someone wielding a rusty pipe. Former employee whom Latham had recently fired, 26-year-old Robert Sewell, later convicted of the crime, sentenced to life in prison. Then more tragedy followed. Jackie Peterson's widowed

mom had trouble caring for her kids. When Jackie was five, she was sent to a Catholic home for children she described as an orphanage. Her mom came to visit her there when she could, but then died when she was 18. She never got to go, uh, you know, have a, uh, a childhood with her, with her family the same way again. Jackie's teen years sounded as if they were pretty rough. She never went into great detail about them before dying of cancer in 2013 at the age of 70. Cause she was afraid her story would be twisted by the press after what she'd watched them do to her son's story. Uh, Lee and Jackie had six kids from other relationships, but Jackie had had her first two kids, uh, when she was when she was young and struggling and she'd given them up for adoption. So Scott would be their only child together, a love child. Lee Peterson had three kids from his first marriage, Susan, 12, Mark,

10, Joe, nine, who lived with her mom in San Diego during the week, spent most weekends with the dad. Jackie's son from previous relationship, Scott Peterson's half bro, John was six when Scott was born and they would share a bedroom in the family's two bedroom apartment in La Jolla for a time. The Petersons would lovingly describe their brood as like the Brady bunch. Almost all these details regarding Scott's childhood and his parents' background backgrounds, by the way, come from one interview, uh, the Jackie and Lee gave to Kelly St. John, a San Francisco Chronicle reporter in early 2004 before Scott's trial. Thank you, Kelly.

After the trial got going, the press were so vicious in general towards Scott and sometimes also towards his family. So much hatred towards Scott that the Petersons really bottled up and kept quiet. No need to bring more heat on Scott. No need to help anyone find out where they lived, risk being assaulted or having their property destroyed. I mean, people really got angry even towards the family. Shortly after Scott was born, Jackie would bring him to her dress shop in La Jolla. I'd lay in a crib while she sewed halter tops, helped customers, that sort of thing. The family and her customers loved having the baby around.

Soon became a family joke that Scott's feet barely ever touched the ground. He didn't walk before he was one, she would say, because someone was always carrying him. Jackie worked hard to give Scott the childhood she had never had. She became his Cub Scout leader, supported his golf ambitions as he got older. Scott said, you know, to have enjoyed a close, he was said to have had enjoyed a close relationship with both his parents as he grew up. His mom, who always thought he was innocent, would visit him in prison until she died. And his dad, who, you know, still thinks he's innocent visits him regularly still. In 1976, when Scott Peterson was about four, his family bought a home in Scripps Ranch, friendly suburb ringed by eucalyptus trees

in Northeast San Diego. It was around that time that his father started a shipping and packing business and he would bring Scott along as he made rounds, picking up packages for delivery. Lee, believing that if his children learned to do the things he liked, they would end up spending a lot more time together, taught his kids to golf, to fish, and to hunt pheasant. And Scott would continue with fishing and golfing. Family photo shows Scott as a blonde toddler holding up a fish he caught in San Diego's Miramar Reservoir, grinning in a room of blue shag carpet, holding a golf club and a ball. By the time he was five, Scott was tagging along when the family went to the driving range. Lee sawed off the top of a handle of a wooden driver so it'd be short enough for little Scott to swing. Started to carry it around with him

at home too. In 1979, when Scott was seven, his parents started bringing him along on family golf outings at the Stardust Country Club in San Diego. The family always brought Scott's fishing pole along too. When he got bored, he'd wander out to fish the San Diego River, which runs through the course. Joan Pernicano, I don't know how to pronounce her last name, whose youngest son, Andrew, was in the Cub Scout troop, led by Scott's mom, will later remember Scott as a homebody

who was close to both parents equally, and will also say he was a little bit reticent. Stoic, maybe. My son bounced off the walls, but Scott wasn't that way. He was quiet and polite. Was that word again, stoic? You know, if he wasn't really full of emotional expression back in Cub Scouts, probably wasn't going to be more full of emotional expressions later. In my observation, that's generally not how it works. People's emotions, they tend to harden as they move from childhood into early adulthood, at least.

When Scott Peterson was a fifth grader, the family moved into a new home in Poway that had a swimming pool and a yard that bordered a creek. He attended Painted Rock Middle School. There, Jackie Peterson later recalled, Scott was picked by teachers to work before and after school as a crossing guard, wearing a bright orange vest, carrying a stop sign and a whistle to usher younger students across the street. Jackie would say he didn't fuck around with his crosswalk duties. She didn't say like that, of course. She said he was very serious about his responsibility, describing how one driver got frustrated when Scott kept children from crossing when a car was still a block away. I remember this mother said, oh, come on. He never let anyone go. It was so much fun to watch and sit and watch him, said his dad, Lee, who sometimes would detour on his shipping routes or his rounds, you know, to watch and sit and watch him, said his dad, Lee, who sometimes would detour

on his shipping routes or his rounds, you know, to stop and observe Scott from a distance. There's my little kid directing traffic. By the time he was a teen, Scott was working part-time at a country club in Rancho Santa Fe, picking up golf balls, filling carts with gas in exchange for lessons and time on the course. He started attending University of San Diego High School, a Catholic college preparatory school with a good golf team. Lee Peterson told Scott he would buy him a Ferrari if he shot par. By the time he was 14, Scott was consistently hitting the ball better than his dad. He set his mind to it. He really believed his dad was going to get him a Ferrari, Jackie Peterson said, but dad lied. And maybe that's what drove him to murder.

Dad lying. He got fucked out of a Ferrari. And the world had to pay. He would get a used Peugeot sedan at 16 when he shot par. Dude crushed it in high school with golf. For a time, he had dreams of becoming a professional golfer like Phil Mickelson, who was his high school teammate. That's a random connection, right? Mickelson was two years older than Peterson, one of the best professional golfers in history,

the main rival of Tiger Woods when Tiger was in his prime, and on the same team for two years older than Peterson, one of the best professional golfers in history, the main rival of Tiger Woods when Tiger was in his prime and on the same team for two years with Scott Peterson. And Scott was good. In 1987, when Scott was a freshman, the golf team made it all the way to the California Interschool— Oh, my God. To the California Interscholastic Federation San Diego Section Team Championship. That was it. Really rolls off the tongue, that title. Mickelson, a junior, opted to skip the championship to participate in the U.S. Open local qualifier.

Peterson took Mickelson's place at the match. He didn't win, but he played very well. During his senior season, he tied for seventh in the CIF Individual Championship, six strokes behind the winner. By the end of high school, he was one of the top junior golfers in San diego here in the team's most valuable player award twice was named to the san diego union's union tribunes all academic team three out of his four years in

high school university high school's coach david thones at the time uh uh you know told a writer later for the san diego union tribune he was a tremendous kid and a tremendous golfer before adding uh he never even murdered anyone one time. I can honestly say that no one, to my knowledge, murdered less than Scott Peterson when I knew him. And of course he didn't say that. It'd be fucking super weird if he said that, but he did add, he was very respectful. I don't think I ever heard Scott use foul language. Some kids will hit a bad shot, go into all kinds of antics. Scott would hit a bad shot and just go to the next one. I don't think I ever saw him get out of control. Again, not a super emotional dude,

not outwardly expressive. Finally, David said he was both popular and a leader. And that assessment, you know, would be disputed by some. That was very rare to find a person everybody likes. Disputed by former teammate Ed Ventura, who told the Union Tribune that he was the biggest snob. He was always talking about how good his golf game was, how much better he was than the others. But then Brian Tasto, San Diego dentist, who also played high school golf with Peterson, said Scott was a good

person. He came from a good family. He was more of a leader, strong-minded person, confident in what he was doing. So, you know, maybe Scott was an asshole. Maybe Ed just fucking sucked at golf. He was jealous. Or again, you know, maybe like most people, some people like Scott and some people didn't. Maybe his stoic nature read his arrogance. Maybe he's a fucking douche. Tasto said a few of Scott's peers did consider him arrogant,

but also said he was a nice guy who wore white polo shirts and a red and gold varsity letterman's jacket and didn't have a steady girlfriend. Scott gave him rides home from practice, helped lead his team

to an undefeated season during his senior year. Mickelson, after Scott's arrest, will say he had no recollection of Peterson. That's fucking bullshit. You don't remember a dude who was on your team for two years, one of the best other players? Come on. I think Mickelson just didn't want to give the press any association between himself and America's most hated husband, or Mickelson fucking did it. Come on. He has a very punchable face. If he didn't kill Lacey Peterson, he killed somebody, right. Come on. He has a very punchable face. If he didn't kill Lazy Peterson, he killed somebody, right?

Come on. If he was suspected of murder, I don't think he'd fare a lot better than I would. Anyway, sounds like Scott Peterson overall was a good kid growing up. He was a good student. Also tutored the homeless throughout high school. 1990, Scott graduates high school, 17. Tries to walk onto the golf team at Arizona State University where Mickelson had gone. Didn't work out for him. He was good, but he wasn't that good. Scott Peterson left ASU after just one semester, moved in with his parents, who were by that time living in what they thought was going to be their retirement home, a cottage in Morro Bay on the

Central Coast. From the spring of 92 to the spring of 93, Scott attended Cuesta College in San Luis Obispo, played on the golf team for two years, said 93, Scott attended Cuesta College in San Luis Obispo. Played on the golf team for two years, said Pete Shuler, Cuesta's sports information director. The 1992-1993 yearbook mentions Scott having an outstanding season his sophomore year. He just missed qualifying for the state meet. That year, Jackie Peterson said her 20-year-old son abruptly announced he was going to move out of the house and support himself. Telling him, I've had the greatest parents. You don't owe me anything. I said, give it a go. I used to tell him old war stories about how I left home at 17 and joined the Navy, Lee Peterson said. That's the way we were brought up. You take responsibility for yourself. Scott's sister,

Susan, will later say. That was Scott's mentality. He could have taken the free ride, but he didn't. Scott moved into an apartment. His dad would later compare to Animal House, bachelor pad he shared with some friends from the golf team. The garage had a flat roof that the roommates would cover with green artificial grass, and then they'd stand up there and drive golf balls into a nearby cow pasture. Sounds pretty fucking fun, actually. Scott also juggled three jobs at that time. One as a waiter, two at local golf courses.

In the spring of 94, Scott transferred to Cal Poly in San Luis Obispo. Originally, he planned to major in international business, then change his major to agricultural business. He would tell his dad, instead of driving a Beamer and drinking martinis, I'll be driving a pickup and drinking beers. Professors who taught Scott would describe him as a model student. He seemed more mature than most. He was pleasant to deal with. Recall Jim Ahern, Cal Poly agribusiness professor. I wouldn't mind having a class full of scott peterson's that uh that can be that can be taken out of context and sound very weird for this

guy now like we said that right after he got convicted yeah fucking i love it for all my students you know it's the same uh peterson was working as a waiter in the pacific cafe in slo when a young woman who came in for a meal caught his attention one day lacy rocha fellow cal poly student majoring in ornamental horticulture. Family member said Scott was promptly smitten with the petite outspoken brunette. Within months, his sister Susan said Scott had introduced Lacey to his siblings, saying something to the effect of, I hope this is the future, Mrs. Peterson. Virginia Walter, a Cal Poly horticulture professor and Lacey's advisor said Lacey and Scott spent basically her senior year together and said Scott

was gaga or gaga over Lacey. It was all looking so perfect. College sweethearts, two young, attractive people in love. Their future looked so promising. This will all definitely later fuel public interest, especially the attractive part. I think seriously, I don't know. I can't remember if I've talked about this before, but I was thinking about this with this case. What if they had both been really, really physically unattractive? Would this trial have gotten the same coverage if Scott wore an eye patch after a tragic accident playing darts at the bar one night? What if he had a bleached mullet, a wispy mustache, uneven, not even symmetrical. Balding, big gut. Wore nothing but tight-ass jeans covering pipe cleaner, skinny chicken legs.

Cowboy boots with the jeans tucked into the boots. Tank tops with unironic pictures of nothing but wolves and eagles. What if Lacey was three times as heavy as she was? Massive muffin top. The graphic tees with Looney Tunes characters on them, which she always wore, never quite covered. You could still see her belly button, and you can see that it was hairy. What if she only wore pink sweatpants that didn't ever quite cover the crack of her ass, that said juicy across the back?

Uggs, tiny drawstring backpack. Unibrow, hair like Marge Simpson's sister Selma. Fuck, I'm serious. Why do we care as a society more about attractive people? Right? OJ and Nicole Simpson, attractive. The Menendez brothers, attractive. Pamela Smart was hot. So was Lorena Bobbitt. John Bobbitt was handsome. None of those trials would have been watched like they were if the key players were very unattractive. If some

lady cut off some dude's dick and that dude looked like a fucking swamp troll and she looked like, you know, she was a pond fucker, not going to get the same play. You know, you have to have at least either a hot victim or a hot assailant. An ugly person killing a hot person? Okay, grab the pitchforks. It's witch hunt time. We'll watch that a little bit. Ugly person being killed by a hot person. Interesting.

I'm not going to watch it every day. Ted Bundy. So much fascination around that guy. Would have been even more had his trial taken place 10 years later. 1989 instead of 1979. And his trial got a tremendous amount of coverage back in 79, covered by 250 reporters from five continents, the first to be televised nationally in the US. Why? Because he was young and handsome and his victims, young and hot. John Wayne Gacy's trial took place the very next year,

1980. He killed more people than Bundy did. At least 33 victims compared to at least 20, but probably 30 for Bundy. But come on, he was fucking ugly. And he was gay when most of America was still, you know, openly super homophobic. So not televised. Let's put that one in the basement. Let's hush on that one.

Wild shit and race plays into it too. If OJ had killed a black woman and not a white woman, not going to get the same coverage. I don think not to the same degree nearly everyone else I mentioned you know was white Kristen Smart the girl who went missing from Cal Poly Scott was associated with in the tabloids also very attractive also white Scott's mistress Amber Frye attractive and white Casey Anthony Jodi Arias hot and white Amanda Knox hot and white apparently if you want America to really care what happens to you, first, it helps to be white, at least historically.

And second, you better be hot. You better get your ass to the gym. Use the right skincare products. Eat well. Put yourself together. Maybe. Or I guess if you're one doing the killing, probably best to be ugly. Still helps to be white statistically sentencing-wise, though.

So Scott would have been better off if he was an ugly guy married to an ugly girl, which is weird for me to think about. Okay, now that I've done my attractiveness rant, now that we've met Lacey, let's back up and get to know her a little better. But real quick before we do, though, on Scott, important to note, zero history of violence in Scott's childhood. The police, media, they looked so hard to find something, could not, nothing. No rumors of cruelty towards animals, no bullying, no women coming forward to talk about what a

creep he was, no fires he's setting, not even accusations of bedwetting, which we know now do not actually point to someone being a serial killer. No frontal lobe injury that could have messed up his morality and decision-making wiring or some shit. Fucking nothing. Nancy Grace would have told the world if anything had been found. Okay, now let's look into Lacey's childhood. Lacey Denise Rocha, born May 4th, 1979, to Sharon and Dennis Robert Rocha, who'd met in high school. Not a ton of info about her childhood seems to have been written, but enough to paint, you know, her picture for today's tale. Well enough, I think.

Her parents owned a dairy farm west of Escalon, California. Sharon named Lacey after a pretty girl she'd met in high school. The couple already had a boy, Lacey's older brother, Brent, who'd been born four years prior, 1971. Lacey worked on the farm from a young age, also enjoyed gardening with her mom. Sharon and Dennis divorced before Lacey turned two, and Sharon and the children then moved to Modesto, where Scott and Lacey would live, though the children visited the dairy farm and saw their dad on weekends. Escalon, just north of Modesto, only a few miles separate these two towns. About 7,500 people live in Escalon, and it's been a town of some form since around 1900, although not incorporated until 1957. Modesto, quite a bit bigger, around 1900, although not incorporated until 1957.

Modesto, quite a bit bigger, around 220,000, about a half million in the metro area. Founded as a railroad stop in 1870. Lacey's mom, Sharon, eventually remarried Ron Gransky in Modesto. Hmm, dad and, well, at least stepdad, and Polish. So that's concerning. He was the man who would help raise Lacey and Brent. I can't believe he was never looked into because he was Polish. So that's concerning. He was the man who'd helped raise Lacey and Brent. I can't believe he was never looked into because he's Polish. I keep thinking about him, this poor guy,

actually, breaking down at a press conference to encourage people to keep looking for her, Lacey's poor family. Even if Scott didn't kill her, fuck, they suffered a lot. Their grief put on display for the world to see. According to Ron's obituary, he died in 2018 at the age of 71. He'd served in the Navy, received died in 2018 at the age of 71. He'd served in the Navy, received a Purple Heart for a tour of duty on the USS Liberty. An avid fisherman, loved going to the horse races.

Lacey growing up, an outgoing, popular kid, a cheerleader in both junior high and high school. Split time between, you know, mom and dad's houses, seemed to be close to both parents, although probably closer

to mom and stepdad. It seemed after graduating from Thomas Downey High School, Lacey will attend Cal Poly, where she'll major in ornamental horticulture, as I said. While at Cal Poly, Lacey would sometimes visit a friend who worked at a restaurant in Morro Bay called the Pacific Cafe. And who else worked there? You know, Scott Peterson, of course, her friend's coworker. And they will start today to mid-1994.

Lacey made the first move. Scott never comes across as a truly socially outgoing person at any point in his life. She gave Scott her phone number and soon he called to ask her out. And their first few outings didn't go super smoothly. She was not interested in his two passions, which were fishing and golf. And she got seasick on their very first date, which was deep sea fishing, but she really liked him. Lacey called her mom to say, mom, I met the man I'm going to marry. You've just got to get down here and meet him. She soon did. Sharon thought he was great guy, smart, polite, laid back, very handsome. Looked a lot like Ben Affleck, like a crazy amount like Ben Affleck.

Lacey's relationship still does. Lacey's relationship with Scott grew more serious as it did. He put aside his dreams of professional golf. I wonder if he would resent her for this in order to focus on a business path, something he hoped would provide for Lacey and their eventual family. And soon the two move in together and they look like an ideal couple. Both very attractive. Both come from good families who love him tremendously. Both go into a good school, live in a nice town. Things might not have been so perfect though. According to the prosecution years later at Scott's murder trial, Scott cheated on Lacey early in their relationship. Not many details about it, just an allegation that he'd had an affair with an unnamed woman who never testified. So maybe that happened. Also around

this time, Scott learned that he had two siblings who had been given up for adoption before he was born. Brother born in 1963, sister born in 1965. Those siblings found each other first, then had an emotional reunion with their birth mother, Jackie. Jackie then introduced them to her other children. Unfazed, Scott quickly became close friends with his new sister, Ann, and Lacey and Scott attended her wedding wearing matching black and orange outfits. And then it will be Scott and Lacey's turn to get married. August 9th, 1997, Lacey and Scott get married after dating for two years. Lacey it will be Scott and Lacey's turn to get married. August 9th, 1997, Lacey and Scott get married after dating for two years. Lacey's 22. Scott's about to turn 25. Wedding takes place at the Sycamore Mineral Springs Resort in San Luis Obispo County's

Avila Valley. The following June in 1998, Scott Peterson graduates with a Bachelor of Science degree in Agricultural Business. After getting married, the Petersons invest in a hamburger joint called The Shack. They actually create this place right off campus. They both run it in San Luis Obispo. They did a great job. It quickly becomes a popular restaurant. They'll run it together for about two years. Scott used what he learned about the restaurant business during his time as a waiter to buy used kitchen equipment, get discounted food.

For months, Scott and Lacey worked behind windows covered with newspapers to convert an old bakery and a strip mall into this burger business. Lacey handled the decorating, incorporating signs painted on driftwood, wine barrel, trash can, old fishing tackle box, you know, fixed over the front door. Sounds very cool. By all accounts, they were a newly married couple in love, running a successful restaurant together, seemed to have a very healthy relationship, but they wanted to focus on expanding their family and having children. So they sold the business to a new owner in 2000. After having turned it into a profitable venture, which is impressive in a short amount of time, they relocated to Lacey's hometown of Modesto, just over 200 miles north of San Luis Obispo. In October of 2000, the couple purchased a three-bedroom, two-bath bungalow

for $177,000 on 523 Covino Avenue in an upscale neighborhood near East La Loma Park. Lacey got a part-time job as a substitute teacher. Scott got a job with Trade Corp USA, newly founded subsidiary of a Spanish fertilizer company, in which Scott would earn a salary of $5,000 a month before taxes. Plus on top of that, he could make a sales commission. He sold irrigation systems, fertilizer, chemical nutrients, related products to big farms and flower growers, primarily in California, but also Arizona and New Mexico. Lacey's family, including her mom and younger sister, remember that Lacey worked enthusiastically after moving to Modesto as being the perfect housewife. She enjoyed cooking. She enjoyed entertaining guests. Scott worked hard at his new job. He

worked out of a warehouse just a few miles away where he would also store a fishing boat bot shortly before Lacey disappeared. Scott got a golf membership at the local country club, became the youngest member of Modesto's Rotary Club. Seems like a model citizen at this point. The couple who still shared a love of cooking after their burger business, hosted dinner parties, borrowed money to build a swimming pool in their backyard. Peterson's also started trying for a family, though they initially had some trouble conceiving.

It wasn't until May 2002 that Lacey became pregnant with their first child. And the expectant parents over the moon, or at least seemed to be over the moon to others, attending doctor's appointments and Lamaze classes. Secretly, Scott didn't seem to be as excited to start a new family as Lacey was. In November, the month

before Lacey goes missing, November of 20, or my god, 2002, Scott began having an affair with a Fresno-based massage therapist named Amber Fry. With his wife seven months pregnant, Scott is introduced by a friend, sounds like a shitty friend, to Amber.

Amber and Scott arranged to meet at the Elephant Bar in Fresno. Fresno is about 90 minutes from Modesto on November 20th, 2002, right? About a month before Lacey goes missing. From the bar, Amber and Scott then go to a Japanese restaurant where he'd arranged for a private room, then do a karaoke bar next door, then go to a hotel where they, you know, spent the night together fucking each other's brains out. Guessing if Scott really is innocent that meeting Amber Frye is one of his life's biggest regrets, if not the biggest regret. Also going fishing on the 24th would be another big one. His affair with her, according to what some jury members will later say, will be what convicts him of Lacey and Connor's murders more than any other single piece of circumstantial evidence. It's what for them gave him motive. You know, some people didn't like his emotional reactions.

That's what really, you know, sold them on him being a murderer. For a lot of them, it seems to be this affair here. Scott hid this affair very well from everyone, which of course will just make him look guiltier. He knew how to keep secrets. December 14th, Scott went to a holiday party with Amber where they were photographed together. That same day, his wife Lacey goes to a Christmas party alone.

The jury will understandably really not like, goes to a Christmas party alone. The jury will, understandably, really not like this. Not a likable move. Next day on December 15th, the day after the party, Fry sends Peterson a Christmas card with a picture of her and her daughter. To my love,

I will keep you close to my heart, she wrote. So shit is moving fucking fast for these two. Right? They'd met up for the first time, you know, less than a month earlier. What is going on here? Upcoming kid did seem to freak scott the fuck out Possibly facing mounting tension with his relationship with amber on december 16th

Scott tells her tearfully that he'd lied about never having been married But he said it was because he had lost his wife And it was too painful to talk about and this will really not look good later on down the line Uh, you know, it seems to give him motive. December 23rd, 2002, the day before Lacey goes missing. This is a big day for the later trial. Scott and Lacey go to Salon Salon where Lacey's sister, Amy Rocha, works.

Amy gave Scott a haircut, showed Lacey how to fun flip her hair with a straightener. Scott invited Amy over for pizza that night, but Amy already had plans. Afterwards, Scott and Lacey leave the salon. They pick up Mountain Mike's Pizza on the way home. At home, they have dinner and watch Monday Night Football. The 9-5-1 Pitchford Steelers

versus the 11-4 Tampa Bay Buccaneers. Steelers won 17-7, clinched the AFC North. Tommy Maddox versus Rob Johnson, and you'll never hear about this game because it was pretty fucking forgettable. But that's what they watched. Around 8.30 p.m., Lacey spoke with her mother, Sharon Rocha, on the phone to confirm their Christmas Eve dinner plans at Sharon's the next day.

After the phone call with Sharon, Lacey and Scott continued watching football, then watched the movie The Rookie. Nice, family-friendly 2002 film starring Dennis Quaid, playing a character based on Jim Morris, who made his Major League Baseball debut at the age of 35. It's a great story. Jim dreamed of playing in the Major Leagues growing up, but he tore his shoulder when he was young.

He gave up on his dreams. He gets married. He has three kids. But then he makes a deal with the high school team he's now coaching, ends up trying out for the Tampa Bay Devil Rays, and he makes the team after going through a whole bunch of, you know, Hollywood adversity. It's a good movie.

I remember it. And I wonder what this movie meant to Scott. Did he still have dreams of maybe playing pro golf? Did he feel like his upcoming child in marriage to Lacey were going to forever keep him from that dream? Was he cheating because he wasn't happy with his sex life with Lacey? Did he just not want to settle down? Did he settle for her in some way? He made the safe choice, but now he's regretting it, leaving him unfulfilled. He's working for a shit company, a fertilizer company in Modesto. He's

literally selling shit in Modesto. Is this the life he wanted? The prosecution would definitely paint the picture that Scott did not want this life, that he was not excited to be tied down to it. A few nights earlier, Lacey Scott and Lacey's mom, Sharon Lacey, had been watching TV in the Peterson home. And this incident would speak to the jury and, you know, about his lack of interest in the family. Last time Sharon saw her daughter alive, Lacey told her mom the baby was kicking. Rocha said in an interview with People Magazine, she and I were sitting side by side. Scott was sitting on the floor. We were watching TV and she said the baby was kicking. So I put my hand on her stomach because I never felt him kick. I still didn't feel him kick even when she said that, she said, but she leaned over to

me and said, mom, Scott doesn't like to do this. I've asked him about, you know, feel my stomach when the baby kicks and he never wants to touch my stomach. So did he not want to have Connor? Maybe the man who just turned 30 a few months earlier didn't want to be a dad. Didn't feel he was ready. Didn't ever want to be a dad. Getting somewhat normal, cold feet or something deeper. Is he panicking? According to Scott, the couple goes to bed around 1030 on the 23rd, according to the prosecution at his later trial. Maybe he murdered her that night with something murdery in a way that left zero forensic evidence, maybe. December 24th, 2002, the big infamous day in this trial, the day Lacey Peterson would disappear. Scott will tell police that Lacey woke up around 7. According to Scott, she got dressed, placed Scott's blue pajama bottoms, which she'd worn to bed in the hamper.

By the time Scott got up around 8.30, Lacey had already eaten breakfast, some cereal. Since eating right after she would wake up would make her less likely to have nausea. 8.40 a.m., Lacey logged onto the computer in the spare bedroom while Scott took a shower. She browsed the MSN homepage, a weather site from Yahoo, and two Yahoo shopping sites. One shopping site was for a red Gap scarf, the other a sunflower umbrella stand. Later investigators will say that it was not Lacey who logged into the computer, and that it could have been Scott. If, in fact, he'd murdered Lacey at some point before, which they waffled on. If it was Scott logging onto websites that his wife liked,

some attempt to impersonate his wife, why the fuck would he do that? What criminal advantage would it have given him to have her still appear to be alive that morning if she wasn't? If that was his game plan and then he goes and he dumps her body into the bay, why didn't he pretend to be her again on the computer that afternoon? Then no one would think that he took her body to the bay. That would put the timeline into a much more favorable place for him. But he did not do that. It makes no sense to me.

For this and other reasons, I'll reveal later that Lacey is already dead at this point. Also, before he leaves home, you know, he'll later tell investigators that he and Lacey watched Martha Stewart, or rather that she watched it and he watched it a bit with her. Scott told detectives that Martha had a cooking segment on that day and that her guest showed everybody how to make a meringue. The prosecution will later hone in on this. And in their opening statement, they will tell the jury that Scott lied to investigators. Scott told police Martha talked about how to make a lemon meringue, how that

wasn't true, and they fucked up there. I've watched the interrogation video you can find online. One of the many fuck-ups of the prosecution. They clearly didn't research what Martha's show was about that day because Martha's guest did absolutely talk about meringue, just like Scott said she did. The defense will point this out to the jury, and the jurors will think it was sloppy work on the prosecution's part, but oh well. Everyone knew he was guilty. Who cares? To me, this Martha Stewart detail is actually important. If Scott had killed his wife already, and her body is then either in his truck in the driveway or in the house with him, this is Christmas Eve when they have plans with Lacey's parents. Why the fuck is he just chilling out watching Martha Stewart? Why even have it on in the background?

Again, i'll share more evidence that makes me think, uh, you know, uh this later But but no part of me thinks uh that uh, lacey was killed prior to the 24th And I shouldn't even admit this there's no reason for me to admit this but in my notes I must have been talking to her. Uh, I wrote lindsey instead of lacey. What does that say? Oh god, somebody call her Protect her from me Um, scott will say he left the house around 9.30 a.m. to go fishing on the 24th. This will check out with later cell phone records, work computer records. He'll claim that he last saw Lacey mopping the floor, planning to walk their dog when he left for a fishing trip to Berkeley Marina,

that she was nowhere to be found when he returned. But what kind of fish was he fishing for? Peterson couldn't say what type of fish he was trying to catch when questioned that evening by investigators. And this will bother the jury a lot. Not me. I have for sure gone out to fish, not really having decided what I'm going to fish for. Partially because I fucking suck at fishing. I just like to go out on the water, right?

I just like to be on the banks. I'll go out, maybe I'll catch some trout, maybe perch, maybe bass. I don't know. Maybe who gives a shit? Just enjoy fresh air and, you know, maybe a beer. Also, a neighbor named Amy Krigbaum will testify that Peterson said that he was golfing all day when he knocked on her door looking for his wife later. That does look bad. Why say golf when he went fishing?

He was going to go golfing. Slip of the tongue? Or was he guilty? You know, did he, you, uh, get her body to the lake. He didn't want investigators to know that. Uh, but when Lacey's stepfather, Ron Gransky asked him whether or not he was able to play golf that day, Peterson doesn't hesitate and tells him he decided to go fishing instead because it was too cold. So why, uh, not lie to Ron, who is more important to the investigation. If he wanted to hide the fact that he went to the Marina, he just told his victim's father or stepfatherfather rather, that he was, you know, he went to where he supposedly dumped her body. That makes no sense.

He's not coming across as a criminal genius here, right? If he did, it is he. Not coming across as the same guy who left no trace of a violent crime after supposedly brutally murdering his wife in his home. Scott will make this slip again, telling some he went golfing, others he went fishing. The main story is that he was going to go golfing, decided to go fishing instead at the last minute. After leaving the house, Scott said he made the nine minute drive to his warehouse, checking his voicemail on a cell phone at 10 0 8 AM. This is confirmed from a cell phone records. He was definitely not in his neighborhood. When he made that call, he was definitely near his

warehouse. Scott parked at his office warehouse between 1015 and 1030, entering through the personnel door, not the big bay door. The warehouse he worked at was located at 1027 North Emerald Suite, number B1 in Modesto. Scott and Lacey lived, you know, 523 again, Covina Avenue, and the distance between both places, 3.1 miles, fastest route, takes you about 8 to 10 minutes with no traffic. Movements here, all checkout. Scott would send an email to his boss from his work computer, also do some web searches related to how to assemble and use a new tool, a mortizer he had recently

ordered. Supposedly he did this, according to the prosecution, with his wife's dead body on the truck. Just left it there while he looked up assembly instructions, usage instructions on this fucking woodworking tool, sent a work email, checked a bunch of other emails, then took his new 14-foot fishing boat out of the warehouse,

drove to the Berkeley Marina, the boat he was supposedly used to dump Lacey's body with. The marina's 85 miles away. An hour, 20 minutes with no traffic. So just chilling, just researching a mortizer while his wife's corpse is laying in the truck when he has plans to go to his mother-in-law's house that night.

Huh. And his truck and boat will soon be thoroughly investigated and zero real forensic evidence will be found. Is he a criminal mastermind or one of the dumbest criminals ever or not a criminal? At 10 18 a.m. neighbor Karen Service. Oh, fucking Karen. We're going to hear about her a lot. She finds a Peterson's dog, golden retriever named Mackenzie, wandering around outside their house with his leash on. Karen puts the dog back in the Peterson's yard, backyard. Fucking Karen. It's going to cause real problems for the defense in this trial.

Seems like another somewhat inconsequential detail, but later I'll get into just how important this 10-18 timestamp really is. So important. Without this one neighbor saying that this happened at this particular time. I don't think there's any way Scott is in prison right now. Scott tells the police that he checked his email, sent the email to his boss. I mentioned to it, uh, left him a voicemail earlier between 10 30, 10 58 AM computer forensics will show Scott continuously logged onto his work computer at the warehouse for 26 minutes between 1030, 1056 timeline checks out here as well. Checked his email, sent that email, looked up instructions, right on that fucking mortizer. Uh, he just received from UPS. Then he heads to the Berkeley

Marina. He'll be able to prove he was there with a receipt, parking receipt, uh, from the, uh, Marina parking lot around two 15 that afternoon. Scott leaves a message for Lacey on her cell phone. He says, Hey, beautiful, just left you a message at home. It's 2.15. I'm leaving Berkeley. I won't be able to go to Vela Farms to get that basket for Papa. I was hoping you would get this message and go on out there. I'll see you in a bit, sweetie.

Love you. Bye. Scott says he returns home between 4.30 and 4.45, but the Peterson's next door neighbor, fucking Karen, later testifies Peterson's truck was not in his driveway when she left home at 5.05 p.m. Karen will become next to his mistress, Amber Fry, the prosecution's most important witness, in my opinion. Cell phone records show Peterson was in Livermore,

which sits between Berkeley and Modesto at 3.52 p.m. To arrive home at 4.45 p.m., he had 53 minutes to drive 51 miles, most of them towing a boat, then stop at his warehouse, unhook the boat, check his email. So maybe he didn't get home by 4.45 p.m. He had 53 minutes to drive 51 miles, most of them towing a boat, then stop at his warehouse, unhook the boat, check his email. So maybe he didn't get home by 4.45. Maybe he got home at 5.10, 5.15. Does that make him look more or less guilty? Did he just not remember exactly when he got home? I'll say that I could have easily gotten a time like that wrong. I don't

always remember what time I leave work or get to work. I could easily get things off by 30 minutes or so when I'm doing something like going fishing. Lindsay's continually amazed by my ability to accurately pull up demographical information, for example, on some fucking random city that she's never heard of, some obscure historical fact, but not be able to remember what I had for lunch two days ago, or what time I, you know, got out of bed that morning. I don't always pay attention to stuff like that. I'm usually lost in my thoughts. According to Scott, when he got home, he entered through the side gate where he found their dog Mackenzie and Mackenzie had his leash on. Scott remembered the leash or removed it, excuse me, put it on the patio table, Lacey's

car in the driveway. Lacey's not home. Scott told investigators he assumed her mom, Sharon, had probably picked her up. She's over at her mom and stepdad's, you know, preparing for a Christmas Eve dinner. After going inside, Scott empties the mop bucket Lacey had used earlier, undressed, put the clothes he was wearing in the washing machine, probably jerked off, though he never said that, ate some pizza, showered, then listened to phone messages. The last message was left by Ron Gransky, Lacey's stepdad. On the voicemail, Ron asked Scott if he and Lacey could bring some whipped cream over when they came that night. And according to Scott, now he's confused, right? If Lacey was already there, why was he asking him to bring some whipped cream?

Why was he asking him and Lacey? So he decides to call Sharon and Ron. 517 is when he does this. Talks to Sharon Rocha, Scott's mom. Hasn't given himself much time here to clean up a murder scene. Excuse me, if he'd just gotten home. Or did he clean it all up

before he left to go grab his boat? Or maybe there was nothing to clean up. The guy with no history of violence apparently choked Lacey to death in a way where she never scratched him, then just snuck her body out to his truck the night before when no neighbors were likely to see him, then just stayed home, you know, slept there, got up, watched Martha Stewart, Martha Stewart, so we know how to talk about the fucking meringue, then went on his home computer while her body is, you know, probably in the truck or maybe just left in the house shopping for the sunflower umbrella stand, red scarf and

shit, just in case investigators did end up suspecting him and did end up, you know, checking his computer or he killed her that morning in a way that left no wounds on, you know, his body or left her body in there, got no blood of hers anywhere, then carried her body out to the truck and brought fucking daylight in a neighborhood where it seemed like people were always out and about where, uh, Karen and all the other neighbors are always, you know, fucking watching everybody's every fucking move. And he put her body in his, uh, small fishing boat where anyone at the Marina could see it. Then he motored the boat past several witnesses, the Marina who did see him that morning in broad daylight, who reported nothing unusual. I'll save another, even bigger hole with, uh, this body dump boat hypothesis for later.

I'll save another even bigger hole with this body dump boat hypothesis for later. Scott immediately tells Sharon at 517 that Lacey is missing. Sharon thought later that this was suspicious, right? Scott didn't say Lacey wasn't home or that he couldn't find her, but he used the word missing. But she was fucking missing. She's not answering her phone. Her car is in the driveway, but she's not there. Dog with the leash in the yard. What was he supposed to think and say?

Search for Lacey now begins. Over the next half hour, Scott exchanges two more calls with Sharon and Ron. Scott then begins knocking on neighbors' doors, calling neighbors and friends. Heads to the park, where Mackenzie and Lacey would often go on their little walk. Sharon tells Scott that they'll begin calling hospitals while Scott checks the park. Ron calls 911 at 547 to report Lacey as missing. Why did Ron say she was missing? Weird.

He's Polish and he said missing. Murder. Later that evening, when police arrive at the Peterson home, Lacey's keys, wallet, and sunglasses are found in her purse in a closet at the house. The dining room table meticulously set for a family dinner the following night. And those details, apparently that was not unusual for her when she would go for a walk, like just take the dog for a quick walk. This next part doesn't look good though. One detective finds a phone book on a kitchen counter open to a full page ad for defense lawyer.

That doesn't look good, right? Not sure what was going on there, but also if he's guilty, how fucking dumb is he to leave the phone book open to that particular page when the police come over? Like if he's thinking he might need one, a defense attorney, because he killed his wife. Shouldn't you leave the phone book open to literally anything but a page for defense attorneys? Except for maybe, you know, maybe don't leave it open to a page for like gravediggers or, you know, ads for some kind of no questions asked, garbage disposal service. Scott was also reported to be weirdly calm. This was big for the police. They found his emotional state suspicious. He's too calm. Stoic. Another word that comes to mind.

Modesto police detective John Buehler, Alan Brocchini, lead investigators on the case questioned Scott Peterson that evening. Although Scott initially says he spent the day golfing, he corrects himself. Tells police he'd gone to fish at Berkeley Marina. And again, this doesn't look good. Why is he golfing? He just keeps getting flustered about golfing and fishing. But, you know, he did change his story on his own to the marina. The next morning, Christmas Day, December 25th, one day after Lacey's disappearance,

Modesto police and firefighters carry out an extensive search of the area. You know, helicopters with searchlights, police mounted on horseback, bicycles, canine units, water rescue units on rafts, a Total of 30 officers involved in the search, as well as Lacey's loved ones, volunteers. People are posting flyers to raise awareness of her disappearance. At a press conference, Detective Broccini says that the police did not believe that Lacey decided to leave without contacting her family, commenting, This is completely out of character for her. They're treating her disappearance as a possible crime already. First two days, up to 900 people are involved looking for Lacey. Before community officials or police directly participate in the search again.

Yeah, there's like they do that first one. But then after that, before the police will search again, we get 900 more people. $25,000 reward is offered. Later increase to $250,000. Finally to half a million for info leading to Lacey's safe return. Posters, blue and yellow flyers are circulated. The original basic version of LaceyPeterson.com website is launched by the husband of one of her friends. Search quickly becomes a national news obsession. Friends, family, volunteers set up a command center at a nearby

red line hotel to record developments and circulate information. Over 1,500 volunteers sign up to distribute info and to help search for her, and they find nothing. Scott works with other family members to coordinate, you know, search efforts. December 28th, authorities search the water near Berkeley Marina for the first time, find nothing. December 31st, New Year's Eve, Lacey's friends and family hold a candlelight vigil for Lacey in a nearby park. I mentioned that earlier during the vigil, and this will really not look good for Scott. At his trial, Scott calls Amber Fry to wish her a happy new year. And he says some weird shit to her. He says, I'm near the Eiffel tower and the new year celebration is unreal. The crowd is huge. What the fuck's he doing here? Why is he pretending to be in France? To avoid having to see her while his wife is missing because of how bad this all

looks. I'm guessing he's trying to buy himself some time here, right? He has to know it's going to look real bad for him to be seen with her while his pregnant wife is missing. But he does have feelings for her, or at least wants to sleep with her again. So he's stalling.

Really wants to see her, but gosh dang, can't, overseas. You have to wait until I get stateside again, babe. Probably likes her, you know, thinking he's some international man of mystery as well. I don't know, some fun fantasy-like shit to escape to. It's pretty awesome, Scott tells Amber. Fireworks there at the Eiffel Tower, mass of people

all playing American pop songs. The next day, the two have a long talk during which Fry hints at a possible future together. Says she misses him. I'm just waiting, anticipating the day that I get to, you know, see you again, Fry says. It bothers me because, you know, I'm not going to see you for so long. And Scott replied, oh, how sweet. Thank you. Gosh dang. I feel the same, obviously. You know that. Okay, again, kind of weird emotion there.

Oh, thank you. Oh, babe, I just, I love you so much. Oh, thank you. How sweet. Later in the conversation, Fry said, on Saturday, you were saying that there's so many things you thought about about us, but you haven't shared them with me Why can't you share them to me on the phone Scott tells Amber on the phone that he'll be returning January 25th To America But soon afterwards gosh dang it He's off to Guadalajara Mexico

He's gotta be stalling here Buying more time so he can maybe see her later when shit calms down for him I don't know Amber recorded this call why because she'd already seen the press about Lacey's disappearance New Scott was her husband, and she went to the police, and they encouraged her to record the calls, which she did. The police now really think Scott did something to Lacey. On January 3rd, 2003, Modesto police asked the public for help verifying the whereabouts of Scott Peterson in the days before Christmas. Not good. Scott knows he's

a prime suspect. Obviously, the media frenzy, or circus has a frenzy with this. Nancy Grace, others, right? They're just waiting for Scott to be arrested now. In Berkeley, police spent hours combing waters near the marina. On January 6th, Scott finally comes clean to Amber. Over the phone, he admits to her that he had not gone to Paris, but was in Modesto, aiding the search for his wife, explaining she was alive but missing. Also told her he wanted a future with her, but didn't want to have any children. That's odd, right? The jury wouldn't like that. They'll keep talking nearly every day until February 19th, telling each other lie after lie. Amber lying to keep him talking.

Scott lying to either try and get away with murder or to hopefully sleep with her again. On January 14th, the authorities and friends of the Petersons expand their search for Lacey to Southern California. The next day, the 15th, aware that the whole world will know soon, police tell Lacey's immediate family Scott has been having an affair.

They show Ron and Sharon photos of Scott with Amber. Oh, yeek. World around Scott really starting to crumble now. His in-laws, fucking done with him.

They're furious, can't blame him. If I'm them, yeah, I think Scott has probably killed Lacey at this point. Three days later, January 17th,

Lacey's Peterson's family, friends hold a news conference to demand Scott tell authorities everything he knows about the case. National media circus feasts on this. Next day, the 18th, as suspicion of Scott grows, authorities investigate his whereabouts in connection with the disappearance of that San Luis Obispo student in 96, Kristen Smart, right? Vanishing when Scott happened to go to school there. Authorities later determined he had nothing to do with the second missing woman. As I said, this admission doesn't stop the court of public opinion from now thinking, you know, he's probably a serial killer.

Following day, January 19th, Scott brings the search for his missing wife to LA, where he and his family distribute flyers to volunteers at a hotel. January 23rd, Lacey Peterson's family says Scott told authorities he'd been involved with another woman. They, of course, already knew about this from police. Next day, whole world will know. This really fucking kicks things up a notch. January 24, 2003, Amber Fry comes forward, confirms she had a romantic relationship with Scott Peterson. This is breaking news, interrupting previously scheduled programming.

Hours before Fry would speak out on January 24, Sharon, Ron, and Lacey's brother, Brent, told reporters they're not supporting Scott anymore, who had not been officially named yet as a suspect, although he is a suspect for police. Scott has not been forthcoming with information regarding my sister's disappearance. I am only left to question what else he may be hiding, Brent says. And then Sharon adds, there are no words that can possibly describe the ache in my heart or the emptiness in my life. I know someone knows where Lacey is. I'm pleading with you to please, please let her come home. Amber said at the January 24th press conference, I'm very sorry for Lacey's family and the pain this has caused them. And I pray for her safe return as well. Nancy Grace, other pundits, have a fucking field day with all this. As do the tabloids, right? Of course they do. Sales ratings soar. Things really not looking good for Scott now. January 17th, Scott's mom, Jackie Peterson, left him a voicemail advising him to deny, deny, deny whatever the cops claimed he did. His family, they're worried about him, rightfully so.

Is his mom trying to get Scott to cover up something here or is she just trying to get him to not incriminate himself further for something he didn't do in her mind? Then on a police wiretap, Jackie's heard telling her son on the 26th, I can't imagine anyone being stupid enough to say they went fishing in the Berkeley Bay after having committed a crime there. I mean, not even you, Scott. Scott wants to respond to all the press on him now. He's become public enemy number one in Modesto. He's being harassed, glares, insults from strangers around town, reporters always outside his house. January 28th, Scott does an ABC interview with Diane Sawyer, where he admits to cheating on Lacey, but he insisted he told Lacey about the affair she had forgiven him.

Huh? I don't know. They were looking forward to having their baby. He said, maybe that happened. Every couple handles things differently behind closed doors. Did you murder your wife? Sawyer asked. No, no, I did not. Scott said with a small shake of his head and I had absolutely nothing to do with her disappearance. Diane then asked him about the possibility that Lacey had been murdered. It's not one we're ready to accept, but it creeps in my mind late at night and early in the morning. Then he gave a small smile, which would lead many to think he was guilty. During the day, all we can think about is the right resolutions to find her. And then that's it. find her. And then that's it. Was this smiling just a nervous tick? Are his emotions chronically misunderstood? Later in the interview, Scott called violence against women unapproachable, the most disgusting act to me. This interview doesn't help him. He just does not seem upset enough. People are very bothered by his emotional responses. February 5th, Lacey Peterson's family steps up their criticism of Scott saying he's now sold his pregnant wife's car, has considered

selling the couple's house. February 10th, what would have been Lacey's due family steps up their criticism of Scott, saying he's now sold his pregnant wife's car, has considered selling the couple's house. February 10th, what would have been Lacey's due date comes and goes with no more information leading to her or baby Connor's whereabouts. A week later on the 17th, Scott Peterson's mom, Jackie, tells the Associated Press her family believes kidnappers abducted Lacey Peterson with the intention of holding her captive until she delivered the baby. And that might sound, you know, crazy, but later we'll examine how Lacey was not the only pregnant woman to disappear from the area, to have weird shit

happen to in the area. February 18th, authorities issue a search warrant for the Peterson's home in Modesto, where they remove possible evidence that turns out not to be evidence and take measurements that lead to nothing. March 6th, 2003, Lacey missing over two months now. The Modesto police officially declare her case a homicide. March 12th, authorities begin to search the San Francisco Bay again. Important note that the media has known they have been looking in the bay for Lacey and Connor's body and that Scott was fishing in this bay for, you know, well over a month now. So the public knows all too well that the police think that Scott killed Lacey

and that he dumped her remains in the bay, right? This is important because, you know, if you're somebody who say Scott didn't do it, and you're somebody who did, you think, oh my gosh, I should dump her remains. I should take her remains and dump them in the bay. And then it'll be open and shut with Scott. Uh, the police don't find anything, but the next month officers do. April 14th, 2003, couple walk in their dog, find the decomposing, but well-preserved body of a-term male fetus in a marshy area of the San Francisco Bay in Richmond's Point Isabel Regional Shoreline Park, north of Berkeley. The umbilical cord still attached. Later, an anonymous Associated Press source revealed that one and a half loops of nylon tape found around the fetus's neck,

significant cut present on the fetus's body. Day later, a passerby finds the body of a recently pregnant woman wearing beige pants and a maternity bra washed up on the eastern rocky shoreline of the bay, one mile away from where the baby's body was found. The corpse was decomposed to the point of being almost unrecognizable as being a human body. Lacey had been decapitated, her limbs missing, most of her internal organs missing as well. The fact that Lacey and her baby had likely been underwater for almost four months meant that both corpses, of course, in a poor condition, no DNA evidence gathered off of either body as far as, you know, who may have done this to them. Four days later, April 18th, police in San Diego arrest Scott Peterson. What he had with him when he was arrested, where he was arrested, used against him at his later trial.

Scott claimed to be meeting his father and brother for a game of golf. They do live down by San Diego when authorities pulled him over. His naturally dark brown hair had been dyed blonde. Oh, and they would back him up, his dad and brother on this. His naturally dark brown hair had been dyed blonde. The Mercedes he was now driving, full of stuff, including nearly $15,000 in cash, 12 Viagra tablets, doesn't look good, survival gear, camping equipment, several changes of clothes, four cell phones, two driver's licenses, his and his brother's. What the fuck

is going on, right? Scott's father, Lee, explained that Scott had used his brother's license the day before to get a San Diego resident discount at the golf course, and that Scott had been living out of his car because of all the media attention. Police and prosecutors, however, saw all these items combined with Scott's location as an indication he's about to flee to Mexico. Same day, April 18th, Attorney General Bill Lockyer says that the bodies found in Richmond are those of Lacey Peterson and her unborn son, Connor. And I got to say, Peterson's blonde hair situation, that part, it doesn't bother me. Scott would later say he did this to disguise himself because he's being constantly harassed wherever he goes in public.

Everyone thinks he's the biggest fucking biggest asshole on the planet. Right? Everyone knows what he looks like. Imagine that's you. Would you want to disguise yourself if you're him? I would. Also, there are photos of him meeting with the police looking like this. So if you're trying to hide from the police, why would you show up in your disguise?

The media, Nancy Grace, et cetera, they use his hair color as further proof he's guilty. He's preparing to flee the country, head off to Mexico, start a new life. And maybe he was. Right? Maybe he just assumes they're going to, you know, put him on trial. So I don't know. It doesn't look good. I know. The cash, the extra phones, you know, at least shows that he's thinking about running. But his dad talked later about, you know, how worried he was about Scott already having been convicted of Lacey's murder in the court of public opinion, how he would never be able to get a fair trial if it went to trial, how he's on all the tabloids all the time, he's a criminal talk of the nation. Right, if I'm him, I'm thinking about fleeing.

How the fuck are you getting a fair trial in that atmosphere? April 21st, 2003, Scott Peterson pleads not guilty to charges of murdering his wife, excuse me, and unborn child. Same day, Lacey's family holds a press conference thanking the public for support since her daughter's disappearance.

April 25th, Stanislaus County District Attorney James Barzleton announces he will seek the death penalty against Scott. May 2nd, Scott Peterson hires high-profile attorney Mark Garagos to take over his case. This guy's a pretty famous attorney. Managing partner of LA law firm Garagos and Garagos. Mark has an interesting tie to another time suck episode, the Armenian genocide and Armenian American. Mark was one of the lead lawyers in two groundbreaking federal class action lawsuits against New York life insurance and AXA for insurance policies issued in the early 20th century. During the time of the Armenian genocide of more than 1.5 million Americans, the two cases settled for over 37

and a half million in 2004 and 2005. He has represented everyone from Michael Jackson to Scottie Pippen to Roger Clinton, Colin Kaepernick, Chris Brown, Winona Ryder, on and on. He now co-hosts a podcast with Adam Carolla called Reasonable Doubt. And I wonder if he had too much going on at the time to properly represent Scott Peterson. He was working on defending Michael Jackson from child molestation allegations at the same time. He had that going on in LA, and Jackson would fire him for not having enough time to devote to that case. Maybe Peterson should have fired him too. May 4th, 2003, thousands of people flood into Modesto's First Baptist Church for Lacey's

memorial service. May 15th, Lacey's autopsy is completed. May 16th, Peterson's lawyers go public with a theory that a satanic cult kidnapped and murdered Lacey. autopsy is completed. May 16th, Peterson's lawyers go public with a theory that a satanic cult kidnapped and murdered Lacey. Probably not a great call. Sounds pretty fucking desperate. It sounds crazy, I know. But more credible than it seems at first glance, I laughed when I first read this. When I got into some of the alternate possibilities regarding who may have killed Lacey after the timeline, and when I do that, it won't seem as outrageous. May 29th, Lacey and Scott's unborn son's Connor's autopsy report leaked to the media.

The leaked information reveals Lacey's fetus was found with tape around his neck. Major Gash on his tour. That tape thing is weird. That's never explained by anyone in this trial. June 2nd, the defense team indicates that they're searching for a man in a mysterious brown van spotted in the area

of the Peterson's house on December 24th, maybe linked to Lacey's murder. June 6th, in a rare show of emotion, Scott appears to cry as the judge decides to keep autopsy reports of his slain wife sealed. Same day, a celebrity photograph broker offers nude pictures of Amber Frye to the highest bidder. And then, of course, censored versions of those get plastered around the tablets. June 12th, Judge Al Ghirlami issues a gag order And then, of course, censored versions of those get plastered around the tabloids. June 12th, Judge Al Ghirlami issues a gag order preventing lawyers,

police officers, and potential witnesses from discussing the Peterson case in public. I doubt anyone really fucking followed that. August 29th, Lacey Peterson

and her unborn son are buried in a private ceremony. August, September 2nd, Ghirlami reschedules the preliminary hearing from September 9th to October 20th.

Allow the defense more time to gather evidence. September 21st, the Fresno Bee reports that a jailed inmate told investigators Scott had met with him in Fresno in November of 2002 to discuss kidnapping Lacey. But the Peterson family tells Fox News that Scott and Lacey Peterson were in San Diego at that time. And this is quickly dismissed by everybody. This was definitely bullshit. This case has so much buzz around it. People are coming out of the woodwork saying crazy shit.

Trying to get their five minutes of fame. October 29, 2003. The preliminary hearing is finally held. An FBI expert testifies that mitochondrial DNA tests had loosely linked a strand of hair. Found embedded in a pair of needle nose pliers on Scott Peterson's boat to Lacey. But someone who worked out of the warehouse near Scott's had witnessed Lacey visiting that warehouse and Scott's boat inside the warehouse the week before she disappeared. So the hair could have come from her during that visit. And that really didn't get any press. Also on November 3rd, a defense

expert testifies that mitochondrial DNA tests cannot link evidence to a specific individual and are scientifically flawed. Therefore, the hair on the pliers doesn't even necessarily belong to Lacey Peterson. Next day, November, and this kind of stuff never gets much play.

You know, if there's something like, her hair was found. Oh, they go crazy with that. And then it's like, I might not have been her hair. People get real quiet. The next day, November 4th, the defense suggests police

planted evidence in Scott Peterson's home truck and boat. Also this day, some of Scott's friends and relatives tell Fox News he had several affairs, which Lacey was allegedly aware of November 6th, police detective drops two bombshells in testimony tells that Scott told Fry he was a recent widower, right, on December 9th, 2002 two weeks before his wife disappeared, we heard about that, and that Peterson had a handgun in his truck when police responded to his missing person report. However, not an illegal handgun. And if he had used this gun on Lacey, blood should have been found. Why wasn't any blood found

anywhere? When would he have had time to thoroughly clean up, right? Why was no gunshot hurt? November 12th, Detective Brocchini in testimony admits he urged Scott Peterson's friends and neighbors, including Fry, to ask Peterson leading questions in hopes he would somehow implicate himself in Lacey's death. Scott never did. November 12th, Detective Philip Owen testifies that Lacey's body was found in tan pants. As her sister testified, she had been wearing December 23rd. Scott said she was wearing black pants

the next morning, the 24th. Numerous witnesses will also say they saw Lacey the morning of the 24th around the neighborhood wearing black pants. What does this discrepancy mean? Not sure. Again, where did Scott hide her if he killed her on the 23rd before he took off? Why go on the computer?

Why watch Martha Stewart? Why dick around on the computer figuring out how to use his new woodworking tool at the warehouse, you know, et cetera. Detective Brocchini also testifies that Scott drove to the Berkeley Marina three times in early January, looked out over the water. Twice on days, police were searching the bay. What does that mean? Also not sure. He might be nervous that they're going to find the body of the woman he killed, or he might just be curious what's going on here. I don't know. November 14th, Detective Owen

testifies that he ignored a tip in the Peterson case, that a woman resembling Lacey had been seen walking a dog near the Peterson home mid-morning, December 24th. The defense will claim this was one of many, many, many similar credible tips the police completely ignored. And I believe this after watching several documentary interviews with people in the neighborhood who lived around the Scott Peterson, you know, the Petersons, who said that they saw a variety of things I'll talk about later, called the police, no one called him back. Three days later, November 17th, prosecution pathologist, Dr. Brian Peterson, no relation, testifies he could not determine Lacey's cause of death. That day, Judge Ghirlami

rules mitochondrial DNA analysis can be admitted as evidence. The hair found in the boat will be used as proof that Scott used his boat to dump Lacey's body. A big loss for the defense. November 18th, Garalami rules that Peterson will stand trial on double murder charges, being charged with second degree murder for the death of Connor. In addition to first degree murder with special circumstances for killing Lacey. Proceedings scheduled to begin on January 26th.

January 20th, 2004, Judge Garalami rules the trial will be held in the suburban San Mateo County, south of San Francisco, the County Hall of Justice in Redwood City, the likely venue. Scott can't get a fair trial in Modesto. January 27th, Alfred A. DeLucci, retired Alameda County judge,

is appointed by the state's chief justice to preside over the Peterson trial. February 4th, Vivian Mitchell, one of the people who told police they'd seen Lacey alive in Modesto the morning of December 24th, which fucks up the prosecution's timeline, dies of natural causes. That doesn't help the defense. Next day, February 5th, the Peterson defense team announces that they were ready for trial. February 23rd, DeLucci schedules jury selection to begin on March 1st. Two days later, he'll rule that the trial jury will not be sequestered. This is big. He rules the jury are free to go about their lives, you know, during the trial, free to go to the grocery store, see all the tabloids with Scott's face saying he killed

Lacey, not supposed to watch the news when Scott's being discussed, but you know, they do, you know, friends and family are talking about the case with at least some of them when they're not in court, they were around, uh, they're out in the world that is positive surrounded by a world is positive. Scott did it March 2nd, judge DeLucci rules that prosecutors can use evidence from wiretaps on Peterson's phone and can introduce testimony that dogs tracked Lacey Peterson sent to Berkeley Marina. Dogs did do that, but the dog that was the main dog here flunked the majority of its certification tests. Got their tracking wrong more often than they got the tracking right. A lot of legal analysts have spoken about this. They consider this kind of tracking junk science.

May 27th, 2004, 12 jurors selected for Scott's trial, six men, six women who appear to range in age from 20s to 60s, all said they would be willing to sentence Scott to death if he's convicted of killing his wife and unborn son. Scott Peterson's trial begins June 1st, 2004. Lead prosecutor Rick DiStasso, while Garagos, there we go, led Peterson's defense. In opening statements, Garagos claimed Peterson was a cad for cheating on Lacey, but that didn't mean Scott was a murderer.

Who the fuck calls somebody a cad? The internet says Mark was born in 1957. He was talking there like someone born in 1907 or something. He's a cat, see? A dirty, rotten cat. And an ink and poop. And a lollygagging, ne'er-do-well tomcat. But a big bopper?

Mmm, not this dew-dropper. Cats and dames. The prosecution's argument was that Scott had murdered Lacey sometime between the night of December 23rd and the morning of December 24th. They claimed that Scott Peterson made cement anchors to weigh his wife's body down in San Francisco Bay, pointing to the fact that Scott had bought some concrete mix supposedly to redo the driveway, but the driveway was tested. The concrete mix didn't match. He did use that concrete mix to make one anchor he told about. There was an anchor on his boat. Then again, no concrete anchors ever found when sonar searched the bay, even though the sonars were equipped to locate small objects on the seafloor. No proof Scott ever made these extra anchors to tie her body down.

Much was made of Scott Peterson's supposedly aloof behavior, including a satellite TV employee testifying that 15 days after Lacey went missing, Scott began ordering explicit adult material, starting with the Playboy channel. He cheated and he watched porn when his wife went missing. Does that make him look like a super cool dude? No. But what does it have to do with murder? One of the jurors will, after the trial,

mention how much the porn specifically bothered him during the trial. Scott also tried to conceal these subscriptions from investigators, reportedly abruptly canceled the X-rated satellite channel right in front of the eyes of one of the cops in the house. Not a criminal genius. Then there was the evidence, or lack thereof, a single hair was the only piece of forensic. Not a criminal genius. Uh, then there was the evidence or lack thereof. A single hair was the only piece of forensic evidence that was ever identified. The hair matched to DNA comparison to hair from Lacey's hairbrush stuck to pliers found on Peterson's boat. The prosecution said that the hair had to have gotten there when Scott was dumping Lacey's

body since Lacey had never been on the boat while alive, but that's not necessarily true. There was a witness that just, uh, you know, did see Lacey at the warehouse just a few days earlier. And Lacey had shoulder length hair, lots of it. Did it ever get on Scott's clothes, get transferred anywhere? I mean, my wife's hair gets on my clothes all the time. Pretty weak if that's the only forensic evidence. Stronger, much stronger if it was found on a stranger's boat, not Lacey's husband's. And I'll talk about the real problem with the boat theory after this timeline.

Too big of a deviation to get into now. Presented as prosecution evidence during the trial was also the fact that Scott changed his appearance for a purchase of a vehicle using his mom's name, as well as all the things that were found in the car at the time of his arrest. The prosecution presented Peterson's affair with Fry, financial problems, impending fatherhood, his motives for murder, surmising that he killed Lacey due to increasing debt and a desire to be single again. Peterson's defense lawyers based their case on a lack of direct evidence, played down the significance of circumstantial evidence, and they said there was no clear motive for Scott Peterson to murder his wife. If he wanted to be single, why didn't he just divorce her? The defense also questioned whether the investigation had been thorough since Modesto Police Detective Mike

Hermos admitted he did not check the alibi of a prostitute who was accused of stealing checks from the Peterson's mailbox. Other leads, again, not followed up on. The defense questions those. Police community service officer testified that an interview with Peterson had no sound due to no batteries being put in a tape recorder. That's problematic since now what Scott said is reduced to the memory of the detectives. The defense suggested the fetal remains were of a full-term infant and theorized that someone kidnapped Lacey, held her until she gave birth,

and dumped both bodies in the bay. To prove this, they hired Charles March, a fertility specialist, thinking that he could single-handedly exonerate Peterson by showing that Lacey's fetus died a week after

the prosecution claimed. But under cross-examination, March admitted, basing his findings on an anecdote from one of Lacey's friends that she had taken a home pregnancy test on June 9, 2002. When prosecutors pointed out that no medical records relied on the June 9 date, March became flustered, confused on the stand, asked a prosecutor to, quote, cut him some slack, and that undermined his credibility. By the end of the testimony Thursday, legal analysts and jurors closed their notebooks, rolled their eyes, snickered when they thought no one was looking.

However, other medical experts have said since the trial ended that they too, based on Connor's autopsy report and medical pregnancy records, do think Connor was alive for several days to several weeks after December 23rd. Then there was issues with the jury itself. Juror Francis Gorman was removed, replaced early in the trial due to misconduct Talked to Lacey's brother on the way into court one day Another juror, juror number seven Got kicked off the case during deliberations For fact-checking something on the internet It was thought by another juror That this juror did not think Scott was guilty

The alternate juror who replaced her Rochelle Nice, known as Strawberry Shortcake During the trial because of her red dyed hair. She came in pushing heavily for Scott to be guilty right out the gate. Later revealed she committed juror misconduct by hiding the fact that she had been a crime victim. She didn't disclose in jury selection that her

boyfriend beat her in 2001 while she was pregnant, making her a very biased juror. She seems, based on trial footage and documentary interviews later, to also, you know, not be a real critical She seems based on trial footage and documentary interviews later To also You know Not be a real critical thinker Very emotional person Frankly she just doesn't seem real fucking right

Jury foreman attorney Gregory Jackson Later requested his own removal During jury deliberations at the very end of the trial This is very concerning to me Gregory Jackson the original jury foreman According to several other jurors, he took the most notes on the trial, by far was the most intellectual. He had a doctorate in medicine and had a law degree. He did not think Scott was guilty. And this led to contention with

the other jurors. In his opinion, the other jurors were making emotional decisions. That opinion led to heated arguments, may have led to physical threats against him. After the verdict, during deliberations, Jackson will later say he felt unsafe and under intense pressure to render a popular verdict, as opposed to the correct one. When another juror allegedly physically threatened Jackson, he went to the judge, said he was frightened by the other jurors. He was then dismissed from the fucking case. And the guy who supposedly threatened him remained on the case.

He'll be replaced by juror Stephen Cardozi, who will only spend nine hours with the other jurors before they render a guilty verdict. After the trial, Larry King will ask this dude, this Stephen guy, straight up, how did Scott kill Lacey? No fucking idea. He didn't know where he did it,

didn't know how he did it, but you know, he did it. There's no IQ test required for jury service. Watching some of the interviews of Steve, he seems like a fucking idiot. Jumping back a bit from deliberations now on November 1st, 2004, closing arguments begin during prosecutor Rick DeStasso's closing argument. He states the following.

It's simple. It's a simple case for a man murdered his wife. I can't tell you he did it at night. I can't tell you he did it in the morning. I don't have to prove that to you. I only have to prove that he did it. The only person that we know without any doubt who was there in the exact location where Lacey and Connor Peterson's body washed ashore at the exact time when they went missing is sitting right there. And he points at Scott. And that's actually

not true. It wasn't the same fuck. It was like a mild difference. That alone is proof beyond a reasonable doubt. You can take that fact to the bank. You can convict this man of murder. I'm not telling you that he killed his wife to go marry Amber Fry. Amber Fry represented his freedom. Freedom is what he wanted. This is the life that Scott Peterson wanted. Not necessarily to be with Amber Fry, although he was completely obsessed with her. The reason he killed Lacey Peterson was that Connor Peterson was on the way.

Things were going to change. No more of this running around, living this double life thing. He wants to live this rich, successful, freewheeling bachelor life. He can't do that when he's paying child support, alimony, and everything else. You can't if you make enough money. He didn't want to be tied to this kid the rest of his life. He didn't want to be tied to Lacey for the rest of his life, so he killed her. No big secret there. I don't care how upset you are. Nobody forgets he just got home from fishing at the Berkeley Marina. Peterson had planned to dump Lacey's body, get back to Modesto, go to the golf club, but the disposal took longer than he planned. And that was it. He just screwed

it up, screwed up his alibi. He's a very manipulative guy. Scott Peterson knows exactly what he's doing at all times. The two lives are catching up on Scott Peterson. He got those porn channels because he knew she was not coming home. He's moving on with his life. He created a fantasy life in his head and he made it his reality. And then he would finish by stating, we take the piece. You see where it fits with the other pieces. You know what pretty soon, you know what pretty soon you put those pieces together. Maybe that's a transcript error. Let's see that.

That pretty soon, and you know, you got a bridge. Even if some of the pieces you don't think, you personally don't think fit, you're still going to see what the puzzle is made of. That's exactly what we have here. Each piece that I've talked to you about today fits in only one direction, and that's that this man is guilty of murder. Circumstantial evidence, you know, look at these things, or look at these things like this. Is it a coincidence that the bodies in the exact same area where the defendant went fishing? And again, that's not true. Very loose usage of the word exact. Is it a coincidence that the defendant was lying about being in Paris in Europe?

Is it a coincidence that he wanted to sell Lacey's house or furniture or car? Is it a coincidence he lied about the affair? How many of these coincidences does the defense want you to swallow and have to still call yourselves reasonable people? If the explanation for all these facts taken together is not reasonable as defense,

is not reasonable as defense is trying to present, you must reject it. If the evidence as we present, as I have argued it today, is reasonable, you must accept it and find this man guilty of the murder of his wife and son. I thank you very much for your time. I thank you for your time throughout this whole case. I don't know. The speech, the speech wouldn't do it for me, right? He was supposed to be found guilty beyond a reasonable doubt, but there's a lot of doubts, as I'm going to point out here pretty soon here uh him being a porn loving cheater doesn't make him a killer him not caring that his wife and unborn

child are very likely gone for good uh makes him real shitty husband and father but not a killer the porn shit kills me if he was able to smooth over a recent affair with his wife if she knew he was a cheater and stayed is she really gonna fucking freak out and leave if she comes back and finds that he'd ordered porn channels ah come on come on. Disposing of the body in the bay, so many problems with that. I can't wait to dissect. Mark Garagos, Peterson's lawyer, gives his closing statements,

November 2nd and 3rd, 2004. He starts, the place where I want to start, I guess, is after listening all day to Mr. Destasso, I kind of just want to go over to my client over here and just ask you all, do y'all hate him? Do you all hate him? Because apparently, that's what the sum total

of what we heard yesterday was. We heard four hours, this guy's the biggest jerk that ever walked the face of the earth. This guy's the biggest liar who ever walked the face of the earth. You should hate him, you should hate him, you should hate him. And if you hate him,

then maybe what they're asking you to do is just convict him. And don't bother with the five months worth of evidence. Don't bother with the fact that an ever-changing theory in this case, don't bother with the fact that the evidence shows clearly that he didn't do this and absolutely no motive to do this, but just hate him. Because if you hate him, then you'll convict him. Don't try to understand what was going on with him.

Just assume that he's got this public and he's got this private profile. Just assume that he's some kind of maniac who lived for 30 years in this planet, who had the FBI investing, investigating him. You saw every single one of his family and friends come through here and tell you that before the moment that Lacey Peterson went missing, this guy was one of the greatest, kindest, nicest men that you'd ever want to meet. Everybody was a staunch supporter of him

until guess what date? January 15th. And then it's all turned. And when it all turned on January 15th, it was because of Amber and because of the disclosure. Whether it was Modesto PD telling the family, whether it was the National Enquirer coming out with the article,

that's when it all turns. At the close of his long speech, he says, but the fact of the matter is that whether you like him or you don't like, or whether you like or don't like a lawyer, whether or not you like or don't like the judge or the experience, the fact of the matter is that you have to focus on what the evidence is. And the evidence in this case shows beyond any reasonable doubt that Scott Peterson didn't have anything to do with this. I would thank you and thank you on behalf of Mr. Peterson, you know, blah, blah, blah. Asking you to return a verdict of not guilty in this case. November 12th, 2004, the jury convicts.

Peterson on two counts of murder. First-degree murder with special circumstances for killing Lacey. Second-degree murder for killing her fetus. Penalty phase begins November 30th and concludes December 13th. And they sentence Scott Peterson to death. March 16th, 2005, Judge Alfred A. DeLucci followed the jury verdict sentencing Scott Peterson to death by lethal injection, ordered him to pay $10,000 towards the cost of her funeral. He called the murder of Lacey cruel, uncaring, heartless, and callous.

In press appearances shortly following the conclusion of the sentencing trial, several members of the jury say they believed Peterson's demeanor, specifically his lack of emotion. The phone calls to Amber Frye the days following Lacey's disappearance proved his guilt more than any evidence. They kill people. What's he do? But not necessarily this dirtbag. Peterson arrived at San Quentin State Prison early morning hours of Wednesday, March 17th, 2005. Scott joined the more than 700 other inmates in California's only death row facility

while his case was on automatic appeal to the Supreme Court of California. It takes seven fucking years to get that appeal filed. July 6th, 2012, Peterson's new attorney, Cliff Gardner, files a 423-page appeal of Peterson's sentence, stating that the publicity surrounding the trial, incorrect evidentiary rulings, other mistakes deprived Peterson of a fair trial. Another brief in 2015 claimed that a certified dog that detected Lacey's scent at Berkeley Marina had failed to write the tests with similar conditions. In its certification

course, the state and the defense would volley briefs back and forth for the next eight years, trying to get Scott's appeal to go to court. In March 2019, California Governor Gavin Newsom issued a moratorium for all 737 prisoners on death row in California, including Peterson. August 24th, 2020, in a 7-0 decision, the Supreme Court of California upheld Peterson's conviction but overturned his death sentence. Year later, September 22nd, 2021, news outlets report that Scott will not be getting a new trial. Judge and Christine Mizzullo had ruled that there was not enough new evidence to justify a new trial. Peterson will be resentenced in November, which will get him off San Quentin's death row,

where he had resided for 17 years. Then December 8th, Mizzullo resentenced Peterson now 49 to life in prison without the possibility of parole. Now let's hop out of this timeline. I would like to share why I think the U.S. judicial system may have massively fucked Scott Peterson here. Good job, soldier. You've made it back. Barely. I want to kick off this talking about a fucking boat and some bodies. Have you ever been on a boat? A small boat. Not sure anyone from Peterson's jury was ever on one. I've been on plenty.

In particular, I've been on a little fishing boat, just like the one he was on the day Lacey disappeared many times. Papa Ward used to take me on this little fishing boat in the Salmon River, Lost Valley Reservoir. We called it Lost Lake. About an hour from Riggins, Idaho, not far from New Meadows. It stocked that lake with big fat rainbows.

I would fucking kill it. Best fish of my life. It was an aluminum boat and I never got the specs on it, but looking online, if it wasn't a 14 footer like Scott's, it was damn close. No shorter than 12 feet.

And that's a small ass boat. When I would stand up in that thing as a kid, I'd worry about falling out. It'd not feel steady, right? Not real heavy. One of the things the prosecution's case would rest on was Scott dumping Laysen's body over the side of a boat like this. Laysen weighed 153 pounds at the time of her disappearance. The prosecution theorized that Scott wrapped her remains up in a tarp. I mean, otherwise he just, you know, floating on past people to Marina with his wife's dead body out in the fucking open for the world to see. There's nowhere to hide a body in a boat like this. To get a feel for how these things are built, imagine sitting on a park bench.

Then cut the back off, take the back off the bench. Cut the bench in half lengthwise, right? This is what you're sitting on. And there are three of these little benches all parallel to one another. You can't put anything under them. It just sealed. Your knees are never more than about two feet off the bottom of the boat when you're sitting down. The boat's no more than five feet wide at its widest point. There's zero hidden compartments. You can find tons of pics online of Scott's boat specifically. Everything highly visible, easy to peek into, sits very low in the water. Anyone at the marina, and there were several people that day who saw Scott, could and did peek in. You would remember seeing him with a huge

tarponette covering something human-sized. You would wonder, what the fuck is going on there? It would look ridiculous. It would look very suspicious. No more than three people are meant to ever be on a boat like that at one time. Scott's 14-foot low boat, fishing boat, very small. One of their smallest models, not a luxury boat, a little outboard motor, room to set a few coolers down, some poles, some tackle boxes, a few benches to sit on, and that's it. So if he did it, Scott had his wife's body wrapped up on a tarp in this boat, and the prosecution alleged, you know, he had four different eight-pound concrete anchors.

Those anchors are tied with ropes to her arms and legs. And he throws his wife's body with Connor still inside with these fucking weights all attached legs. And he throws his wife's body with Connor still inside with these fucking weights all attached overboard. Doubt it. That's over 185 pounds of unruly, floppy, heavily unbalanced weight

that you're trying to toss off a rickety ass boat. Scott weighed 200 pounds. If you were to lift her up to toss her over, that's 385 pounds standing on one side or corner of this small boat

having to shift around, get the fuck out of here. Had I been on the jury, and this is one of their most important key pieces of evidence, I would have found this motherfucker innocent. No way. This doesn't prove shit. And recreations that were not allowed to be shown in court for reasons I do not understand.

The judge said the experiment was not similar enough to what Scott may have done. The boat either immediately starts taking in a massive amount of water, like it's going to sink, begins to sink, or it capsizes and kicks the person out into the water. Defense attorney Mark Garagos bought the same exact model of boat like Scott's. Had a guy about Scott's size who worked for him. Try to throw a weighted dummy, 100-pound weighted dummy, out of the boat. Boat started to fill up with water. He'd fall out every fucking time.

He did this four times. In the video of this, I did watch it. It doesn't come across like some, you know, shitty infomercial either. We're just, you know, no one can do anything right. Are you tired of never being able to stand up in a boat without it sinking or flipping over? Can't lift up your beer cooler without falling over the side and drowning? It's time you said goodbye to boat trouble with Tippy Gone. Tippy Gone is a simple anti-gravity device made out of three neutron reactors

and black magic. So you can river dance, break dance, do cartwheels, or whatever else you want in a boat without ever losing any of your balance. No, it's fucking, they did it,

they seem like to try to genuinely recreate this. Court TV also did an independent recreation. Could not get someone of your balance. No, it's fucking, they did it. They seem like to try to genuinely recreate this. Court TV also did an independent recreation. Could not get someone to toss anything near that much weight off the boat without falling out of the goddamn boat, without taking a massive amount of water, flipping the boat over. So how the fuck did Scott do that? He only recently bought this boat. This was the first time he'd taken out on the water, not used to it. But let's say for argument's sake, he could balance well enough to throw something heavy off the side and not fall in. But is he strong enough to lift it? How did he pick up her body with those weights in a way high enough to toss her overboard? You know how hard it would be to pick up something in a boat that weighs 185 pounds,

just toss that shit, you know, into the water, doesn't have handles or anything. I'm just under 6'2", at my strongest, I was about 235 and I could bench press 315 pounds. Most I ever tried to curl, which would most closely simulate the controlled way you'd have to lift something from the bottom of that boat and up and over the side by yourself without blatantly capsizing, 145 pounds. Nowhere near 185 pounds. And that was a barbell. Easy to grab on. Both feet, flat ground. Scott never looked like a big weight room guy. He weighed about 200 pounds, six feet tall. No fucking way looking at him. He was anywhere near strong enough to do that. Looking at the jury members, I'm confident none of them really knew

their way around a weight room, like at all. Maybe that's why this did not bother them. Maybe didn't bother the judge either, right? Judge probably didn't know his way around a fucking weight room. Apparently none of them real good with physics. A fishing expert would later testify for the prosecution that 150 pound fish could be tossed out of a small fishing boat and not capsize it. But what about the extra 32 pounds of concrete weights? That's a big jump up. And just because someone could get 150 pound fish out of that boat, theoretically, which they never demonstrated, that doesn't mean Scott could. But let's say he could do all this shit somehow. There's still a big problem of how her and Connor's body turned up.

Connor's body was found about a mile away from Lacey's body. How did that nylon tape end up around his neck? Prosecution had no answer for that. How did Connor suddenly come out of his mom's body after being inside her for months after his death

when she's waded to the bottom of the bay wrapped in a tarp? Why did her body turn up around the same time as his? But her body has no head, legs or arms. Prosecution said that during the decomposition process, uh, sea life apparently feast on her a bit,

uh, and her body separated from her arms and legs. Her torso did. Uh, why didn't that same sea life eat her fetus? Like it doesn't make any fucking sense. It's never explained in a reasonable way. They had a title expert speak to this.

Most of Lacey's internal organs were also missing when her torso was found in this tidal expert said that tidal action responsible for her organs coming out. Some of the best forensic pathologists in the country went public after the trial. Scott's defense team was apparently, you know, too fucking busy trying to keep Michael Jackson out of prison for being a pedo. Then to bring them into the trial in time. They said that shit doesn't work that way. These forensic pathologists stated that they'd examined bodies left in the ocean for years and fish and other marine life don't chew through cartilage

and ligaments that they would have needed to, to separate Lacey's arms and legs from her torso. And organs don't just, you know, float away because of tidal effects, like the tidal experts said. All of that seems to me to be like smoke and mirrors to confuse the jury and judge and it seems to have worked i feel like all the jury heard was like uh you know lacy's body was found near where scott went fishing and he lied to some people about going fishing when where the bodies turned up case closed fuck evidence uh again you don't have to pass an iq test to be a juror you don't know fuck all about boats or marine biology i wonder if that original jury foreman understood this shit. I'm guessing he did.

But since the others just may have been too stupid, him explaining it to all of them just led to so much anger, right? But guys, guys, that's not how decomposition works. We're going to focus on the... But porn, Greg! He watched porn when she disappeared! I know, Todd. But right now,

we're trying to focus and figure out how the sea life would have eaten through the cartilage in her arms and legs to allow her to float up to the surface, maybe not eat her fetus. He cheated on his wife, Greg, with masseuse, take a nudie pic. I know, I know, Rochelle, I know.

But we're not talking about that right now. Don't you talk to strawberry shortcake that way, Greg. You think you're smarter than me? I'll kick your fucking ass. Professor, shut the fuck up. Okay, I'm done. Okay, may God have mercy on your souls. Now forget about the boat.

Fuck the boat. All right, there's other problems. Let's, uh, some big problems here. Let's talk about who may have seen Lacey on the 24th when she was supposed to be already dead. Remember Karen, right? Fucking Karen. Peterson neighbor Karen Service testified that she saw the Peterson's dog, golden retriever named Mackenzie, wandered around outside the house with his leash on 10, 8, 8, 10, 18 a.m. Then put the dog back in Peterson's yard. Also remember Scott left home to go to his warehouse

at approximately 9, 48 a.m. Cell records back up this claim. The defense would claim that Lacey left home shortly after Scott left right before 10 a.m. to walk the dog. That would explain the dog having on its leash. Multiple neighbors will claim to see her walk the dog that morning. Neighbor Homer Maldonado, his wife Sue, claimed to see Lacey walking with Mackenzie, struggling with a golden retriever sometime between 9.50 and 10 a.m., headed out to deliver Christmas presents to some friends. Scott was gone by the time they saw her cell phone records indicate that. Tony Freitas, UPS route driver, saw a young pregnant woman who fit Lacey's exact description walk in a golden retriever near the Peterson home around 10 a.m., maybe a little after 10 a.m. when Scott was gone. 10.08 a.m., Scott makes a call from his

cell phone that, based on cell tower records triangulated by the police, placed him not in his neighborhood but by the warehouse. Neighbor Frank Aguilar and his wife saw Lacey walk in the dog further down Loma Avenue between 10 a.m. and 10.30 a.m. with no coat and cold weather, stuck out to them, thought she must be crazy. Three additional people in the neighborhood, including Vivian Mitchell, Mike Chiavetta, remembered seeing a petite, very pregnant woman walking a golden retriever in an area within a mile of the Peterson home between 10 a.m. and 10.30. Altogether, witnesses would see Lacey along a looping route around her house that she would walk. It would take about 45 minutes to complete, which times out to the length of time she usually took to complete that walk.

Nurse Diana Campos, the additional third witness, took a smoke break at a nearby hospital she worked at, saw someone matching Lacey's exact description. At 10.30 in the park, Lacey often walked through, noticed two men following this woman. Golden Retriever was barking at the men. One of the men yelled at Lacey or this woman to shut the dog up. If any of these people are correct, Scott didn't kill Lacey before he went fishing. And if he didn't kill her before he went fishing, he didn't dump her body in the bay and there's no case against him. But the jury chose to believe one person, Karen, over all the other people, right? Those who testified.

Several didn't testify because the defense didn't find them in time. Several of these witnesses said that the police never followed up with them after they placed calls to the police in the early days of the investigation. Why not? Maybe because the police had made up their minds that Scott did it. So that's fucking wasted time. Doesn't match the narrative. Confirmation bias. Now let's talk about that satanic cult shit.

The Order of Lion. In 1990, several members of a self-proclaimed satanic cult, the Order of Lion or Order of the Lion. I saw it as both ways. Did for sure kill four people in the Modesto suburb of Salida. Five members of the group were convicted and sent to prison. Three, including the master, Gerald Cruz, put on death row, two given life sentences. And in the years between this crime and the Peterson case, numerous so-called Satanists were arrested in the area. And you know, I don't like that satanic panic shit, but there are police reports

to prove that, you know, people with 666 tattoos are arrested, people that claim to be Satanists, people that thought a newborn baby was the ultimate sacrifice. People that claim to be Satanists, people that thought a newborn baby was the ultimate sacrifice. So that claim didn't come from nowhere. And check this shit out in line with this. Between 1999 and 2002, during the four years leading up to Lacey's disappearance, seven pregnant women disappeared from the area.

Three from Modesto, four others from less than 90 miles from Lacey's house. Just seven months before the very pregnant Lacey Peterson goes missing from her home in Modesto, December of 2002, the also very pregnant Evelyn Hernandez disappeared from San Francisco, less than 90 miles away. And her headless body, like Lacey's, would also wash up along the shore of the San Francisco Bay.

Evelyn came to the U.S. from El Salvador when she was 14. She attended San Francisco's McAteer High School, became pregnant with Alexis at 17, held jobs at the city's Clift Royal Sonesta Hotel in Costco. When she's 24, her son Alexis is five. Hernandez disappears. Lacey's 27 when she disappeared, both petite and short, both approximately in the final month of their pregnancy. And I'm sorry, yeah, Hernandez was 24. Okay, make sure I said that. When Evelyn's body washed up on the shores of the bay,

in addition to having also been decapitated, hands and feet also missing. Body washed up in the same deteriorated condition as Lacey's body. Baby never found. She disappeared on May 1st, 2002. Her body found July 31st, 2002. Murder has never been solved. And still not done with this little line of thought. The pregnant connection continues

five blocks away from Lacey's house on either the last day she was seen or the day before the last day she was seen. If you believe any of the people who say they saw her walking her dog on the 24th, on December 23rd, Petit, also eight months pregnant, Lourdes Avila, was working at her clothing store when she saw two suspicious guys across the street. The guy scared her. She didn't like the way they were looking at her. She said they had the faces of killers. And then they got out of their car, made their way towards her small shop. She calls the police. She's on the phone with an officer. When they start to come in the shop, she said, it was very, very clear they were going to do something to me. She thinks to this day that

these guys are Lacey's real killers. She called the police before she knew Lacey went missing, right? Before the world knew. And again, this happened five blocks before she probably was missing. And again, this happened five blocks from the Peterson home. Remember that woman at the hospital who saw Lacey being followed by two men who, uh, yelled at her to shut her dog up in the park the morning of the 24th. Uh, Lourdes thinks, uh, the guys she saw are those guys, the real killers. Nancy Grace and the rest didn't have fuck all to say about any of this. Didn't fit their narrative. Uh, now forget about the boat. Forget about the Satan shit. Forget about the pregnant women disappearing or being frightened by dudes the day Lacey goes missing. Let's talk about a burglary. This might be the most concerning.

Rudy and Susan Medina, who lived directly across the street from Scott and Lacey Peterson at 516 Covina, leave their home on December 24th, 2002, 10.30 a.m. for a short holiday trip to Los Angeles. When they return on December 26th, about 4.30 p.m., they discovered their home had been burglarized. And again, right? December 23rd,

probably 24th, is when Lacey disappeared. January 2nd, 2003, Stephen Wayne Todd, Donald Glenn Pierce are arrested in Modesto for this crime. Through an informant named Mark, the Modesto Police Department learned that some of the items taken from 516 Covina Avenue were now in the possession of Stephen Wayne Todd. When the Modesto Police arrived at Stephen Todd's address, they recovered some of the jewelry in a large safe that had been taken from the Medina home. Todd, interviewed by Officer Michael Hicks on January 2nd,

said, unprompted, I had nothing to do with the woman and the baby. Fucking weird. Maybe a little suspicious. Then told the officer the burglary at Medina's

had taken place on December 27th. Why lie about the date? Maybe to distance himself from Lacey's disappearance. When this date was proven to be for sure not true, the Medinas were home by the 27th. Now he says the burglary took place on December 26th, between 3 a.m. and 7 a.m.

Also appears to have been another lie. Lying again about the date, but not about the crime. Why should that matter? It only matters if he's worried about being charged with something in regards to Lacey. The MPD takes his word for the new timeline, doesn't investigate further, but there's credible information to suggest this burglary occurred on December 24th, 2002, right after Medina's left home at 1030.

And this crime may have been directly connected to Lacey's disappearance. This new time would put the burglary, all right, occurring right after, right, Scott leaves for the warehouse. Police presence in the Covina neighborhood was, I'm sorry, media and police presence in the Covina neighborhood was extreme after word of Lacey's disappearance became known on the evening of December 24th, making a December 26th burglary, even if it's, you know, in the wee hours of the morning, highly impractical. Probably would have been reporters out on the street. Get the fuck out of here. Remember all the sightings of Lacey Peterson walking her dog in the Covina neighborhood on the morning of December 24th, not thoroughly investigated by the MPD. Her estimate, you know, Karen's of the time, she found the dog was used to exclude a connection between Lacey's disappearance and this burglary.

Fucking Karen. Everyone's relying on Karen and Karen alone for this stuff. Another neighbor, Diane Jackson, who lived a short distance away, reported seeing three men with a van and a fucking safe in front of the meeting in his house 1140 AM, right after they finished the burglary, uh,

December 24th, 2002. They're done burglarizing when Scott's Don Scott's gone. Uh, her information considered credible enough to be used in a flyer asking for info about the burglary offering a thousand dollar reward. However, the Modesto police arranged for her to be hypnotized by an unqualified

hypnotist. Don't like what she says under hypnosis. And for that reason, her testimony, not allowed at trial. What the fuck is going on here? A hypnotist? Why not just get a fucking clown to come decide if people get to testify or not?

Hypnotism is bullshit when it comes to these situations. Proven to be totally unreliable for memory reconstruction. December 31st, 2002, gold croton watch, or croton watch, identical to Lacey's watch, which disappeared the day she did pawned by Deanna Renfro. The Modesto police did not investigate this woman or her connection to the Medina burglars. Background check would have

shown close links between the families of Deanna Renfro and Steven Todd. Just two weeks before the end of Scott's trial, the prosecution turned over very important info about a prisoner in Stanislaus County Jail who confirmed the information given in a tip which had been received from Lieutenant Xavier Aponte working at the Norco Correctional Institute. Lieutenant Aponte set a phone call between an inmate and his brother, Sean and Adam Tenbrink. They discussed Stephen Todd's confrontation. They knew Stephen Todd and they discussed his confrontation in detail with Lacey Peterson during the burglary at Medina's What the Fuck. So as she gets back from her walk of the dog, she maybe confronts these guys. Something happens.

The only information provided to the defense about this tip was a simple notation on a CD, which included 10,000 other tips about the case. This is with two weeks left in the fucking trial. They fucked them on this. Modesto police do not provide reports or info about any investigation of this tip. Lieutenant Aponte gave a signed statement to the defense investigators, which said the prisoner had been interviewed by the MPD.

MPD received a copy of the taped phone conversation, but the MPD didn't follow up, didn't give them that taped phone conversation in any way that they could actually use for the trial. Judge DeLucci will later refuse to consider this info, which connected the Medina burglary to Lacey's disappearance and will deny Peterson's defense of motion for a new trial in 2005. Finally, where the fuck was my dad on December 23rd or December 24th, 2002? I have no idea. I sure as shit wasn't with him. I know he was very likely on the West coast and probably no more than a half day's travel by flight from the Modesto area. I know he's been to California

and, uh, and that should have been enough to have his, uh, his name, you know, brought up at the trial, but it wasn't. So, you know, what the fuck's going on there? Uh, but seriously, this case, uh, reeks of shitty police work and shitty reasoning by the jury more than any other true crime topic we've covered. This case shows my, uh, you know, This case shows me how important the role of the defense attorney is. Sometimes, even when it seems like there should be zero chance of you getting convicted, a fucking dumb jury can fuck you. So you might need a real good defense team to help baby step the jury through basic logic.

Looking like an uncaring asshole, actually being an uncaring asshole, being a really shitty husband, being a guy who hopes his wife and kid to disappear, does not equal being guilty of murder. I don't think Scott probably wanted to be married to Lacey. Probably didn't want to be a dad. You know, maybe when she went missing, maybe a part of him was relieved, thought some dark prayer had been answered. You know, he might be a real selfish piece of shit, but I don't think based on the evidence provided by the prosecution that he killed Lacey Peterson. And that's how you're supposed to determine these decisions.

Too bad original foreman Gregory Jackson didn't have some more fucking nuts, more of a spine. In footage, I've watched this guy. He seems like a, he doesn't seem like a real strong person. It seems like his spine's made out of butter. He seemed like the kind of guy who would easily be frightened by their jurors. This case was so surprising to me, right? I truly feel bad for Scott and his family after, you know, thinking about this so much. What a strange and complicated case.

Reminds me that people don't miraculously become smarter and more rational when you put them on a jury. Not sure why that did surprise me, right? I don't consider us meat sacks in general to be a very rational species. Why wouldn't that translate into jury behavior? You know, someone who was always a D student, are they suddenly going to have an A student mind when they get put on the fucking jury? Someone who never paid attention to what was going on in class, didn't pay attention to

teachers, maybe thought they were smarter than teachers. Are they suddenly going to pay attention to what the lawyers say day after day, month after month, right? Someone who was always given into peer pressure, are they suddenly going to think for themselves on a jury or are they going to, you know, descend into group think? I've only served on one jury. I'm forgetting out of jury duty in California. I have a whole standup bit about it. You can see online. I did my jury duty here in Coeur d'Alene, was on a one day DUI case. And it was an eye opener, pretty straightforward case. Young dude driving the wrong way on the freeway, three in the morning, swerves off the road, rolls down the embankment. When the police show up, both empty and full cans of beer strewn all over the place. Cab in the truck of the

truck reeks of beer. Young dude reeked of beer. His blood alcohol levels tested three times the legal limit. And this motherfucker said that he ended up on the wrong side of the freeway. He said this with a straight face because he was tired. He only had two beers that night, but the accident shook him up. So he pounded. After getting this crazy accident, waiting for the police, he pounded several beers on the side of the freeway, waiting for the police to show up. What? I shit you not. And some of the other jurors, they were like, oh, okay. This seems to make sense. That was his story. And had I not been there, he would have been found not guilty. Why? Because one of the other jury members, a couple of them were skeptical, but one of the other

jury members just hated the police. I'm not kidding about any of this. Just didn't like the way some officers had talked to him in the past. A few times he'd been pulled over. He started shaking when he talked about he was a fucking lunatic and he didn't want this kid to get a DUI. Right? This guy was fucking crazy.

I told him how stupid he was acting. I absolutely, admittedly intimidated this weird, nut, nervous wreck of a man, the shell of a man, into going along with the verdict I wanted him to give. I made him feel stupid in front of the other jurors. Right? Treated him like a fucking dumb heckler at a comedy club. And then he made the right decision. But that scared me.

Right? Total lack of reason he showed, how quickly he caved to me. This trial scared me. If you get accused of some serious shit you didn't do, meat sack, don't think that facts and reason alone are going to save your ass. Get a really good lawyer and smile when you're supposed to smile.

Maybe talk to a smile expert. Cry when you're supposed to cry, right? Try not to look punchable. Really, really think about any questions the police ask you. Get your story straight, stick to it. Really hope you get a better trial, better jury than the one I think Scott got.

Let's now take a few looks back at all this crazy shit in today's top five takeaways. Time shock, top five takeaways. Number one, between the evening of December 23rd, morning of December 24th, Lacey Peterson, who was eight months pregnant, roughly disappeared around her home in Modesto, California. Almost four months later, her body, body of her son, Connor, found washed up on a shore near the marina where Scott Peterson kept his boat. To this day, no one definitely knows who killed Lacey or how her body made it to the bay because there is no direct evidence. Number two, on November 12th, 2004 Scott Peterson, convicted of murdering his wife Lacey

and their unborn son, jury of six men and six women, delivered a verdict based on nothing but circumstantial evidence 23 months after Lacey's disappearance. Casey Anthony was found not guilty of the murder of her child, even though way more evidence pointed to her guilt. But she's free, and he's in prison. She's hot. She knew how to play the victim. He's handsome, but he's super punchable looking. What a world. I need to try and get a more likable face if I ever get arrested for some serious shit.

Number three, unless new evidence turns up, we'll probably never know whether Scott truly murdered Lacey or not that fateful night. So many people still convinced Scott murdered Lacey. So many people convinced of the opposite. You know that just because Scott cheated on her doesn't mean he murdered her. But now after his latest appeal for a new trial was denied, you know, unless a lot of new evidence services, he'll probably never get out of prison. Number four, the Lacey Peterson case captivated the media for years as footage of searches for Lacey and Scott's subsequent trial became a media

sensation with people like Nancy Grace in particular, directly naming Scott as the person responsible for Lacey's murder from the early days of her disappearance. There's no telling how much the trial and Scott's sentence were influenced by widespread media coverage. I'm guessing a whole bunch. I'm guessing a lot of minds were made up before the trial ever got started. And number five, new info. Did you know that the book and movie Gone Girl share a lot of similarities with the Lacey Peterson case? Author Gillian Flynn has denied lifting any specific details from the case, but when you compare the two plots side by side,

share a lot of similarities. Gone Girl details a meeting and marriage of Amy and Nick Dunn, beautiful couple from New York City, who eventually moved to Nick's hometown in Missouri. Amy then abruptly goes missing, leaving behind a trail of evidence that seems to point to Nick as the person who killed her. Add in the fact that director David Fincher said that Ben Affleck looks more like Scott Peterson than Ben Affleck. It's very funny to me. And the movie really seems to look like it was inspired by Scott and Lacey Peterson.

And Scott does look so much like Ben Affleck. It's crazy. In both the Peterson case and in Gone Girl, a woman goes missing. Her husband is suspected of being responsible for her disappearance, especially after it's crazy. In both the Peterson case and in Gone Girl, a woman goes missing. Her husband is suspected of being responsible for her disappearance, especially after it's revealed. He's been having an affair because of his seemingly undisturbed reaction to his wife's vanishing. Both the real case and the fictional one also receive heavy media coverage, something that takes a toll on the families of those involved. media coverage, something that takes a toll on the families of those involved. The biggest major difference between the two cases is that Lacey Peterson was killed and Scott Peterson was found guilty of the crime while in Gone Girl.

I'm not going to spoil it, actually. I recommend watching it if you haven't seen it already, if you find any of today's information interesting. Both the book and the movie aim to show how the media influences high profile cases and how a seemingly perfect marriage on the outside can actually be highly toxic, tense, and maybe even lethal on the inside. Time shock, top five takeaways. The murder of Lacey Peterson, who really killed her, has been sucked. Curious how many of you will write in about this one, what you'll say, maybe strongly disagree with me. Do it. Do it.

Let's, I want to see what you think about this one. Thanks you'll say, maybe strongly disagree with me, do it, do it. Let's, I want to see what you think about this one. Thanks to the Bad Magic production team for helping make Time Suck every week. Thanks to Queen of Bad Magic, Lindsay Cummins, again, for giving me the time to do all this. Thanks to the Reverend Dr. Joe Paisley for production. Thanks to Bid Elixir for keeping the Time Suck app running smooth. Logan, the art warlock, Keith, creating all the merch at badmagicmerch.com and running the socials with Liz, the Enchantress Hernandez. Thank you, Liz. And thanks to the Cult of the Curious

private Facebook page, to their moderators, and thanks to Beefsteak and his mod squad keeping all the meat sacks happy over there. Next week, let's explore another dirtbag who definitely did it. Time to return to Serial Killerville with Arthur Shawcross, aka the Genesee River Killer. This dirtbag murdered definitely did it. Time to return to serial killer-ville with Arthur Shawcross,

aka the Genesee River Killer. This dirtbag murdered two kids, 1972, then got a plea bargain, got out of it for 14 years. How the fuck does he get a plea bargain? And Scott Peterson doesn't. Then got right back to murdering, killing 11 women between 1988 and 1989. How did a known murderer kill so many women after he got out? It's another real dark one. Dude had a Steph Cox-Gervais kind of childhood. We're going to explore all of it next week.

Right now, we're going to head on over to this week's Time Sucker Updates. Updates? Get your Time Sucker Updates. I'm going to start off with a sweet sucker and a funny creeper, Rosie J. Creep creeper, I think. I had an interesting mashup experience with Time Suck and one of her other bad magic shows, Scared to Death. Rosie writes,

Hi, two of my favorite people. This was written to Lindsay, but she passed along to me. I don't know in real life. Thank you. The dumbest thing just happened to me, and I just wanted to share it with you because I know it'll make you laugh. I was doing my Sunday afternoon grocery shopping at my local Sprouts. Oh, yeah, Sprouts. Well, listen, it's scary to death.

I usually have one pod on, you know, just so I'm more aware of my surroundings. But of course, I was too into the story to even remember removing one of the pods. You know, both the AirPods in. It was the Danvers Asylum story. And just as Dan was narrating the part of the little hands clawing out of the patient's arms, an old lady tapped my arm to ask me to move out of

the way kid you not i let out a scream so loud and jumped so fast both my pods came off she was looking at me horrified while i scrambled to pick up the pods from the ground two sprouts employees come running ask what just happened everyone around us is staring at me i immediately apologized to the poor old lady explained to her and the employees a bit loud so everyone around could hear that I was listening to a scary podcast. I got startled when she tapped my arm. Everyone around us, even the employees, kind of chuckled, but the old lady not having it. She looked mad as fuck.

Then she pointed at my shirt. Coincidentally, I was wearing my Time Suck black and white Salvette Lusafina shirt. Right? Hail Lusifina. And she said, I'm a Christian lady. You stay away from me. Oh boy. I couldn't help but laugh out loud right on her right there.

Uh, which made her even matter. She turned around, walked away, mumbling some shit. Even funnier is that the employee that was still hanging around, looked at my shirt and smiling said, Hey, Lucifina. We both started laughing. His name is Derek and he's a pretty cool sucker. Moral of the story, don't be a dummy like me.

Stay spoopy, Rosie. You know what? Thank you, Rosie. I needed that message. It has been a very long couple of weeks. Riding on creative fumes right now. I think this recording got me through the crazy part of it.

And that kind of shit recharges my batteries. Love hearing about cultly curious run-ins out in the wild, especially when combined with scared to death, uh, or is we dumb? Uh, glad Derek was cool. Uh, he'll never, Derek, I bet that lady will never forget you. Uh, you stay spoopy. Now for a quick hit of inspiration from David Bates, who writes inspiring sucker, uh, just listening to the PT Barnum suck and want to say, thank you. You talked about how hard it can be to get and keep your life together when you suffer from any medical or mental roadblocks in life.

Excuse me. I've had kidney problems my whole life. And when the pandemic hit and so many people chose to stay home and be safe, I saw an opportunity and got my ass to work. I'm living a full life now, making my own way with no more government financial help. Your comment about finding people who want to work made me laugh. After many years of only having the minimum because that's all I could afford on disability, my wants and needs are more than fulfilled now because I work my ass off. I'm a driver transporting medical supplies from Reno, Nevada to Sacramento, California, giving me a few hours a night to get lost in

some suck. Hope this wasn't too long. I owe many nights on the mountain to you keeping me awake and alert, listening to the twisted ways of the world. You know what? Good for you, David, you fucking kick-ass motherfucker. Some people get real pissed off about my occasional preachiness about work ethic specifically. Try not to go on about it too much. I truly just want to help, right? I love hearing about people going the extra mile to chase their dreams, just because that is often just what it takes. And I've just met so many people who just bitch, what it takes. And I've just met so many people who just bitch and I watched them not do the things that I know if they did would probably really get them on the path they want to be on. Uh, it doesn't, you know, ensure that you're going to improve your life dramatically, but

goddamn, if it doesn't increase the odds consistently, keep on trucking, David, go fucking get it. And now for a sex worker update and a good reminder from julie. Um Whose last name I will keep out of this to uh, you know be nice to Be nice to people be nice to all the people. I just wanted to tell you thanks She writes I don't talk about this ever, but my daughter is an addict and she's also a sex worker to support her habits I've done everything in my power to stop it. Trust me Thank you for handling this topic with humor and making sure they are seen as real people The majority of people don't care or don't understand. The police don't seem to care about them.

She's a daughter and a mom. I have her kids now. Sorry this is so long. Keep up the good work. Three out of five stars. No, not long at all, Julie. And hail Nimrod to you for taking in her kids and raising them. That's some saint shit right there.

That's some top shelf meat sack shit. You're changing their lives in a big way. I so hope that your heart is so full about doing that when you go to bed at night, you are a light in an often dark world. And hell yes, they're real people. And the less we demonize sex, the easier it will be for more people to see them as real people and not look down their noses at them. And I hope the opioids suck also, you know, taught a few more people to look at addicts as real people, just struggling with some intense shit. May Lucifina watch over your daughter,

help with her addiction so that she can make her own choices instead of having some powerful drug chemistry make them for her. And now let's end on one brave meat sack's defense of the bagpipe. Okay, Rich G, good dude, man of questionable musical taste Writes, greeting Suckmaster Supreme Lord Mushmouth, Lucifina Simp Ha ha Lindsay's housemaid, okay

All around mixed bag of nuts, fair I'm writing in to respond to your hatred of the bagpipes On the latest Celtic legend suck Admittedly, what you played on the show sounded like a sheep being fucked to death with a submersible mixer. There's no doubt about that. However, one common issue with the bagpipe recordings is that they're often done inside a room or in a small crowded space.

Bagpipes are designed to be played in large open hills where the sound can properly travel. And when played right, they sound downright amazing. A good example to check out that might sound unconventional would be the song Hunugutun by Batsorig Vanchig. It's a mix of traditional Irish Celt instruments and Mongolian throat singing. Sounds weird, I know. Trust me, give it a shot. I'll guarantee you'll find a new appreciation for the bagpipes. Anyway, sorry for the long email. If you happen to read this on air, if you could, give a shout out to my friend Jeff. Went to see live at the Tacoma Comedy Club in December. Uh, it was one of the best shows either of us had ever seen. Well, that's very nice. I turned him on a time suck after

finding out he listened to your comedy at work. He's been a member of the cult ever since. Anyways, three out of five stars wouldn't change a thing. I love that, that it's still going three to five stars. Wouldn't change a thing. Uh, keep on sucking yours, rich G. Well, thank you, rich. Uh, I took you up on your offer. I listened. I was okay. Okay. This is not what I expected. Very blown away. I'm going to play everybody a bit of that crazy-ass mashup you told me about. Check this shit out.

Yeah, this is Hunu Gurin. This is wild. Cool visuals, too, by the way. Ready? Here come the back pipes again. Got a dozen of them. It's a Celtic drum. We're going to start Mongolian throat singing here in a second. This is interesting.

It is good. It's just so different. What is this? What is this? Alright, Rich. Okay. Okay. You made a great point. What I just heard did not sound like

the devil playing an accordion. Didn't sound like the sheep situation you were talking about. Alright. Okay. Bagpipe sounded good. That shit was wild.

And I'm so glad you had fun in Tacoma. Yeah, keep on sucking and you know what? Fuck it. Keep spreading that Alright, okay. Bagpipe sounded good. That shit was wild. And I'm so glad you had fun in Tacoma. Yeah, keep on sucking. And you know what? Fuck it. Keep spreading that bagpipe love. You softened my stance a little bit. Let's get on out of here.

Next time, suckers. I needed that. We all did. Thanks again for listening to another Bad Magic Productions podcast, Meat Sacks. If your significant other disappears this week, don't call your mistress. Don't order porn. Try to look sad. And keep on sucking. Bad Magic Productions. I think I should try and pull some of that

Mongolian throat singing bagpipe mashup out at karaoke night blow some people's fucking heads off and come on where's my cue? Cue! Imagine if I did that at fucking karaoke. And then just people start laughing?

How fucking dare you? Just commit I've never heard anything like that When he says it I know that there's actual words There's meaning I like making that noise That's fun as shit I just play that for Lindsay

And sing it to her a lot in the car I'm sure that's going to go over really great See you later