Timesuck with Dan Cummins - 429 - Serial Killer Aileen Wuornos: Damsel of Death

Episode Date: November 18, 2024

The true story behind the incredible 2003 film, Monster, about sex worker and serial killer, Aileen Wuornos, who killed seven men over the course of one year beginning in November of 1989. Aileen's story is incredibly unique, the exceptionally rare female serial killer who murdered the men who paid her for sex, instead of the other way around. If you are able to give extra support this holiday season, please consider supporting the annual Bad Magic Giving Tree by purchasing a digital amazon gift card and sending it to [e-mail] are accepting gift cards starting now through November 21st!Merch and more: www.badmagicproductions.com Timesuck Discord! https://discord.gg/tqzH89vWant to join the Cult of the Curious PrivateFacebook Group? Go directly to Facebook and search for "Cult of the Curious" to locate whatever happens to be our most current page :)For all merch-related questions/problems: [e-mail] (copy and paste)Please rate and subscribe on Apple Podcasts and elsewhere and follow the suck on social media!! @timesuckpodcast on IG and http://www.facebook.com/timesuckpodcastWanna become a Space Lizard? Click here: https://www.patreon.com/timesuckpodcast.Sign up through Patreon, and for $5 a month, you get access to the entire Secret Suck catalog (295 episodes) PLUS the entire catalog of Timesuck, AD FREE. You'll also get 20% off of all regular Timesuck merch PLUS access to exclusive Space Lizard merch. 

The child who is not embraced by the village will burn it down to feel its warmth I read that quote left under a YouTube video about Eileen Warnos The author is unknown when you look it up online. It's attributed simply to an African proverb After finishing this week's research. I feel it perfectly describes Eileen Society abandoned her and she turned on society She suffered a lot as a kid, was used, abused, and abandoned over and over again. Due primarily to her early childhood treatment, she became angry, manipulative, and extremely promiscuous. And the more

she acted out in negative ways, the more she continued to be used, abused, and abandoned. And the more she was used, abused, and abandoned, the more she acted out. And this toxic cycle not only kept repeating and occurring, it worsened over time. Until eventually, Eileen's greatest abuser became herself. And the anger she harbored about the world around her, anger mostly directed at the men who saw her as having little value outside of someone they could toss a bit of cash at for some cheap sex, men she paradoxically both hated and continually sought out,

men she hated for using her sexually, but men she also continually propositioned to pay her for sex, it built and built until eventually her anger exploded into murder after murder after murder. Before she was identified by a task force of investigators, Eileen Wuornos was known as the damsel of death the exceptionally rare female serial killer who both killed violently instead of via poisoning and who killed strangers instead of those she knew Eileen met her victims along the highways and interstates in North and Central Florida By posing as either a sex worker or a hitchhiker in need of a ride for roughly a year from late

1989 to the fall of 1990, six men were killed and another went missing, probably killed, and the bodies of those who were found were riddled with gunshot wounds and abandoned to the elements. Their vehicles would be found miles away from their remains, many of their personal belongings were stolen. There have been movies, documentaries, books, songs, even an opera made about Eileen Wuornos, who is often incorrectly labeled as being America's first female serial killer. She was not. She was, however, the first woman to be labeled by the FBI as a serial killer.

So how did Eileen become the damsel of death? She never knew her father, who was an abusive psychopath who died in prison after being sent there for sex crimes. She was abandoned by her mother, grew up in a strict, abusive household where for years she was led to believe her grandparents were her parents and aunts and uncles were her siblings. She was impregnated as a 14-year-old, the father of her baby being her rapist. Before that, she'd had sex with her own brother. And she was protected, it it seems by no one. Eileen lacked the love, acceptance, protection and stability during her childhood that many of us have probably taken for granted. She was abandoned by the people who were supposed to take care of her and nurture her.

She was mistreated and seen as worthless by most of the boys and men in her life and she grew to hate them and her hatred of them would eventually lead to murders. And she grew to hate them. And her hatred of them would eventually lead to murders. This week we dive into the rarest kind of serial killer. One where the sex worker is not the victim, but instead the perpetrator. In today's episode I'll share the life and crimes of Eileen Wuernos, details of her infamous murder trial, how the police hunted her down, how rare this kind of serial killer is, and more in this raise your kids with love put them first to protect them and

they'll probably turn out all right abandon abuse and neglect them and you might just create another monster destined to be the subject of a true crime podcast edition of time suck this is michael mcdonald and you're listening to time suck you're listening to Time Suck. Well, happy Monday and welcome to the cults of the curious, you beautiful bastards. Pull up a chair. Dan Cummins, suck nasty, professional weirdo, sling blade impersonator, and you're listening to Time Suck. Some folks call it a Kaiser blade, I call it a Time Suck. Hail Nimrod, Hail Lucifina, praise be to good boy Bojangles and glory be to Triple M. Just one quick thing before our topic. This month our Space Lizards,

thank you Space Lizards, allowed us to donate $13,000 to the Best Defense Foundation which was founded by former NFL linebacker Donny Edwards. The foundation honors and celebrates veterans from past conflicts and those who have recently retired. The foundation works to take World War II vets back to the battlefields where they served as well. If you'd like to learn more, get involved with this incredible organization, please visit bestdefensefoundation.org.

We also put $1,400 into the scholarship fund for 2025 as well. And as a quick note of gratitude to all of those who have been able to support us on Patreon, I'd like to share with you that as of now, our community has made it possible to donate just over $880,000 since we began making these donations. Thank you so much for years worth of support. Nimrod is so pleased. Now let's get into today's episode. Let's tackle the story of a serial killer I felt a lot more empathy for than most. But in the end one whose killings were in my opinion you know maybe more understandable. I think definitely more

understandable but no more justified than the killings at least not all of them of any of the other serial killers we have covered. Starting things off today by discussing the question of why the public is so fascinated by female killers, while also taking a look at how different women tend to be compared to men when it comes to murder, followed by a full timeline of the life and crimes of Eileen Wuornos. Since her arrest in the early 90s, Eileen Wuornos has frequently been described as America's first female serial killer, which is definitely not true. When considering serial killer history in the U.S., some think the title of first should instead be given to Lavinya Fisher, an early 19th century criminal who may or may not have been the first serial killer in the US along with her husband John Fisher. Lavine's crimes and some associated paranormal lore were covered on Scared to Death in the episode

You Will Suffer and I should say alleged crimes. Seems Lavine's crimes of helping to kill guests stopping by and renting a room in her husband's six-mile Wayfarer house near Charleston, South Carolina between 1810 and 1820 six-mile Wayfarer house near Charleston, South Carolina between 1810 and 1820 may have been greatly exaggerated or even probably more likely completely fabricated. More urban legend than true crime. But there have been many other thoroughly documented serial killers who did their killing before Eileen Ornos and shared her chromosomes. Sister Archer Gilligan was a nursing home owner in Windsor, Connecticut who murdered at least five people,

her second husband and four of her nursing home residents by poisoning them with arsenic between 1907 and 1917. In 1976, Velma Barfield became the first woman in the U.S. to be executed after the resumption of capital punishment. Only convicted of one murder, she eventually confessed to six, all in North Carolina, and all killed between 1969 and 1978. Again, she poisoned her victims. She poisoned several elderly people she worked for as a caretaker. Also poisoned a boyfriend, and like sister Archer Gilligan, she used arsenic. Judy Bueno-Año used arsenic as well. She used it to poison her first husband and son in Florida. And her last name by the way, she made it up for herself. If you're like, I've never heard Bueno-Año. Yeah, no, she made that up.

But she used it to poison her first husband and son in Florida, boyfriend in Colorado, possibly another boyfriend in Alabama. Also tried to poison yet another boyfriend in Florida all between 1971 and 1983. She was electrocuted by the state in 1998, she became the first woman to be executed in Florida since 1848. Nanny Doss, aka the Giggling Granny, amongst many other monikers, killed 11 people between 1927 and 1954. She killed four husbands. Fucking four of them.

Two children. One of her sisters, her mother, two grandsons, and a mother-in-law in Kansas, North Carolina, Alabama, and Oklahoma. She took a plea deal in Oklahoma, got life in prison, and again, she was arsonist. She fucking took out her entire family tree. My god, Christine Falling was a 17 year old babysitter from Perry, Florida, very mentally ill. When she began her killing spree, she murdered at least five neighborhood children between 1980 and 1982 by suffocation and or blunt trauma to the head because she said she heard voices telling her to kill these kids. She remains in prison today in Florida. Helene Auguste Geisenvog ran a so-called baby farm

in New York City in the early 20th century. She was found guilty of killing 53 babies. 53 babies in her care between 1918 and 1925. Her probation officer's report characterized her as a, quote, woman without conscience, who strangled and froze to death infants left in her care. Judge described her as cruel, bestial, and a revolting anomaly in humankind.

And I could go on and on, list a lot more, but you get the idea. There have been many female serial killers in America, many more before Eileen Werneros, and of course elsewhere around the world. But they generally, if not part of a murderer's duo, if not along for the ride with a sexually motivated man like some of the killer couples we've covered, they generally don't target strangers or at least not like adults outside of people in their care.

They don't kill them face to face with the weapon. Mainly female serial killers target vulnerable or unsuspecting victims that they either are supposed to be taken care of, such as elderly residents of a nursing home or young members of an orphanage or baby farm, or they kill romantic partners, boyfriends, husbands, lovers, and they do it primarily for money, typically insurance fraud. Their method tends to be poison or say smothering someone who is asleep, already vulnerable, like the elderly or the very young. Even Belle Gunnis, the serial killer from episode 150, hangy bangy, hoofda hoofda, she likely used poison. On at least some if not most, maybe even all, of her 14 plus alleged victims.

All killed between 1884 and 1908 in Illinois and Indiana, burying most of them on her so-called murder farm in Indiana. Also, female serial killers are much, much more rare overall than male serial killers. Only around 15% of serial killers are women. And I couldn't find a single one who went around shooting dudes like Eileen did. And that says a lot about the sexes, doesn't it? Men and women overall, obviously there's individual exceptions, but overall, not even remotely wired in the same way. Men and women overall, obviously there's individual exceptions, but overall, not even remotely wired in the same way.

Looking at serial killers specifically makes that so painfully obvious. There is not a nation on earth that has more female serial killers or female murderers in general than male serial killers slash murders. And women overall, not nearly as violent as their male counterpart, especially not as sexually violent. I mean I could talk about a new sexually sadistic male serial killer every week for the next 50 plus years. Seriously, how crazy is that? There have been over 3,000 of them so far just in the United States. Just the ones who have been caught and documented.

I haven't been able to find a single woman, not who works alone and is the one driving these sexually motivated murders at least. And that is why there is such fascination with Eileen Wuernos. While she wasn't a serial killer like Ted Bundy, Richard Ramirez, Gary Ridgway, while she didn't rape her victims, didn't sexually or otherwise torture them. She is the closest example I can think of of a female serial killer who behaved more like a traditional male serial killer. But also kind of like the inverted version, you know, the inverted archetype of the typical American serial killer. Where there is sex involved, right? I think of a man who kills sex

workers, hitchhikers, So many serial killers have done that. The murderous John. Instead, she was the opposite. She was the sex worker. She was the hitchhiker. And she killed the Johns. Or the man who picked her up to give her a ride. She didn't poison the elderly or smother babies.

She shot men to death. Men who were, you know, bigger than her. She shot them up close many times. And that's why Eileen Wuornos' case made national headlines. Not only because of the incorrect label as her being America's first female serial killer, but also because she didn't seem to fit the standard, you know, role of a typical female serial killer. And her victims, the men she killed, because they are assumed to have picked up Eileen for sex, they didn't get the same amount of sympathy that serial killer victims tend to get. And they

still don't. If you read the comments under a lot of videos on the web about Eileen, the overwhelming majority seem to fall into the category of, finally a sex worker gives it back to the guys who prey on them. Or, she shouldn't have killed them, but I feel so bad for her and I hope she's now at peace. Although Eileen would claim self-defense, was that true? Were the men Eileen killed trying to harm her or did they pay the price for the sins of other men who had harmed Eileen previously? Or maybe a combination of both? Were they dirtbags, not good dudes, but not necessarily people deserving of murder in that instance.

Let's find out as we jump into a timeline of the life and crimes of Eileen Wuornos. Shrap on those boots soldier. We're marching down a time suck timeline. Eileen Carol Pittman, last name we'll later change to her in us when she's adopted, born February 29th, 1956, the rare leap year baby, in Rochester, Michigan, a northern suburb at the edge of the Detroit metropolitan area now. Back then it was more on its own, a little town when there was a bit of separation from Rochester and the burbs of Detroit. And it was a very quaint town. Strong Andy Griffith Mayberry vibes. Starting five years before Eileen's birth, the city began to hold its annual Rochester Hometown Christmas Parade. The largest Christmas parade in all of Michigan. Still holds it every year.

December 8th, if you really need to catch it this year. In 2006 the city held its first big bright light show for the Christmas season. Most of the downtown businesses were covered in roughly 500,000 individual lights and later years an expansion the program extended the coverage to a reported 1 million lights. Kicks off November 25th this year lasts until January 19th. Oh enjoy it. I find it so ironic that Eileen had the childhood she did in a place that looked like such an amazing place to raise a family. So quaint and idyllic. Eileen's parents were Diane Wernos and Leo Dale Pittman, who divorced before she was even born. Diane was just 16, Leo only 19 when their second child, Eileen, was born. Eileen's older brother, Keith Edward Pittman, born the year before, March 14, 1955, when Diane was just 15, Leo just 18. And Diane had gotten pregnant with Leo when she was just 14 and Leo was just

barely 18. That is so young. A baby having a baby. Eileen never met her father, but the two had tragic similarities in their early lives. Leo had been abandoned by his parents when he was just five months old. And like truly abandoned. In a pretty dramatic way. His parents straight up left him and his two sisters alone in an apartment overnight. Just fucking bounced and then called the grandparents like, Oh hey by the way, kids with the apartment are probably hungry. They probably shit themselves, we're gone.

Mirroring Eileen's childhood further, Leo was then raised by his grandparents who adopted him and his younger sister. Leo's second sister adopted by another family. Always hate to see the kids separated like that. Leo's grandfather died when he was a teenager. He remained close with his grandmother who overlooked his truancy and poor school performance and behavior and doted on him.

He did not dot back on her at all. Leo repaid his grandma's love and devotion with abuse and scorn. In the book Deadlier Than the Male, Stories of Female Serial Killers, author Terry Mannertz wrote about Leo, when his grandfather died of throat cancer, his grandmother spoiled him even more, baking him cakes and giving him money. In his teens, he returned her love and kindness by beating and abusing her. One of his favorite games was to tie two cats together by their tails and throw them over a clothesline to watch them fight. So fucked up. I've heard about so many kids doing that too. I knew a kid growing up who

did that. He was just as weird as you would think. So yeah, so he was super cool. Super cool, well adjusted, not at all deranged or psychotic dude. Someone who, you know, definitely should have been having kids. And as many as possible and as young as possible. Leo met his future wife, Diane, in school. I would hope so. She was no older than 14 when they met. Would have been fucking weird for him to have met her at a law office she was working at. Or the bar or something. Her strict parents had forbidden her from dating, but she did not listen to them. Leo wouldn't take no for an answer when it came to dating her.

He hated her dad. Hated him so much he once put sugar in his gas tank. Which can clog the fuel injectors or the fuel filter pretty bad. Be fairly expensive to fix and just a pain in the ass. Diane's father was furious when she and Leo eloped on June 3rd, 1954, as he should have been. Leo's grandmother, however, she gave the underage couple her blessing to get married, even though Diane was only 14 and Leo was just 17. Not sure what her reasoning was there, probably just didn't want to get beat up by fucking Leo again. Or maybe she was an idiot. I don't know. I mean, you know, sad. She could have been an abuse victim and an idiot. I feel like that's a

possibility. You should almost never rule out when just talking about anybody. When it comes to why did this person do this? Why would they ever do that? Well, maybe they're an idiot. Maybe they do dumb shit because, you know, their the brain isn't working right or because they lazily choose not to use their brain when they should. Who knows? She probably just wanted to get rid of him. Probably just like, oh thank God, he'll fucking get out of my house now. Both Leo and Diane lied about their ages to get married, claimed to be 18, and Ann had

a vouch for them. Then their first child, Keith Edward Pittman, who I mentioned a bit ago, was born March 14, 1955. Leo showed his true colors immediately after the wedding. Diane's dad was right to hate him. He became extremely jealous, made Diane a prisoner in her own home. When she was home with the baby he forced her to keep all the shades drawn and the doors locked. Didn't even want her to look out the window. Didn't want anyone looking at her through the window. He was that

possessive and jealous. He's just psychotic. It reminds me of a running joke actually of sorts between Lindsay and I. I like to have the windows open. Not because I'm some exhibitionist, but I love natural light. I hate this time of year up here when there's there's not enough snow to like go ski or anything yet. It's not pretty, but it's just so fucking dark and gray and shitty. Makes me just like so sad. Uh, yeah. But I love the natural lights. I like to have that. And I also do like to be naked in the house.

Not to show off anything. I'm just more comfortable. I'm pretty sure I'd be happy on some tropical island just being naked. If I had a good place, get some shade, food, nice place to sleep, maybe not so many bugs. Not a bunch of creepy bugs I have to worry about crawling in my butthole. But anyway, I leave the windows open. Lindsay, who likes to also walk around naked when it's just us, she gets so mad when I do that.

She's always like, what are you trying to put on a show for the neighbors? Do you want them to see me? And I'm always like, yeah, just give them a show, sexy girl. Make them happy. Come on, stop being so selfish. Everyone loves boobs and cute butt. Light up the neighborhood. And then she generally calls me a pervert and insists I close all the windows. And I do. But I couldn't care less. If some dude saw her naked. I don't even understand that level of jealousy.

Uh, being obsessed about no one ever glimpsing your wife in your home. With her clothes on. That is a level of insecurity I actually can't comprehend. It's so pathetic. Uh, Leo wouldn't even allow his wife to wear makeup. Ever. He's that fucking asshole. Even forbid her from hanging clothes to dry outside because he didn't want her going out there to the clothesline because some dude could like, I don't know, look over the fence and see her. God, how fucking tiny was this guy's dick?

When am I gonna get to suck a serial killer who only kills misogynistic dipshits like Leo? God, wouldn't that be nice? Someone who tracks down men who abuse, demoralize, and or imprison, truly submit women not in a joking way. Cowardly, insecure, pathetic, just power-hungry little baby men. Let's see some serial killer just start mowing them down. Ah, that'd be so great. I'd even be okay with that serial killer being very sexually sadistic towards him. Who gives a shit? Anyway, Diane wasn't even allowed to receive phone calls. Not from anyone. When Leo wasn't around. Not even her fucking mom. Wasn't allowed to answer the door for the mailman. Diane would later say that Leo also beat her almost every

other day. Demanded sex from Diane five or six times a day. Just treated her like a living fuck doll. And cheated on her often. How horny was this guy? How afraid of beating off was he? How is he? How is he still horny after coming five or six times a day? He was a sex maniac. Even Lusovina is like, dude, too much. There's more to life. Luckily for young Diane, Leah was arrested in the summer of 1955 for stealing hubcaps and furnishing liquor to miners, of course. Miners, I'm guessing he was trying to either impress or fuck or both. He chose to go into the army rather than serve time, remained in the service until

October of 1957. Stationed apart from Diane, I will not thank him for his service. There's some fucking dirtbags in the military. Come on. Diane filed for divorce from Leo, such a great example of why divorce should never be made illegal, and a divorce decree was issued on November 14, 1955 when Diane was roughly six months pregnant with Eileen. And then Leo's behavior would devolve even further once he was single. By 1958, Leo Pittman had been sentenced to three years probation for breaking and entering. 1959, he was sentenced to federal prison for car theft, transporting stolen cars across

state lines. Then in the early 60s, Diane was questioned by detectives who wanted to know Leo's whereabouts back on March 24th, 1955 in connection to the unsolved rape and murder of a minor Keith had been born just ten days before that and she told the police that Leo had come into the apartment Acting like he was hiding from someone and he beat her a little extra that day. She thought he did it. I did too. By September of 1962 Leo Pittman had violated federal parole, was on the run with a pregnant second wife and their young daughter, dude just could not keep his dick in his pants or pull out. They hid out in Wichita, Kansas and then on November 23rd of that year Leo parked beside a school playground and started

talking to a seven-year-old girl parked beside a school playground and started talking to a seven-year-old girl asking if she wanted to see his pony like a fucking cartoonish creep in some commercial about child predators. Little girl said she had to take her little sister home first. Creepy, creepy old Leo waited while she walked across the street with her sister then returned to the playground. He then picked her up drove her a few miles away from the school and after he stopped he told the girl the seven-year-old Girl that he would kill her if she resisted his advances and then he raped her. Yeah dude was a monster Again really would like to see a serial killer start to eliminate the Leo Pittman's of the world. Come on real-life Dexter

Let's fucking go Let me do an episode about how just prolific and especially brutal you are. About how the authorities just, they just can't catch ya. Oh, hail Nimrod. Leo dropped this poor little girl off back at school. The girl told her grandma as soon as she could. She was taken to the emergency room for an exam, able to give a detailed description of her rapist.

Very brave, strong kid. Then when the police were canvassing the area, they found a gas station attendant who knew Leo, gave his address to the police were canvassing the area they found a gas station attendant who knew Leo, gave his address to the police. Leo was caught, tried, and found guilty. He was given a life sentence without the possibility of parole and on January 30th 1969 at the age of 32 Leo Pittman hanged himself in his cell. Yippee! Yeah! Bummer he didn't do that sooner. Now let me back up the timeline a bit and refocus on Leo's daughter, Eileen,

who never met her dirtbag dad. Diane Huernos, Eileen's mother, abandoned both of her children in early 1960 when Eileen was barely four. She'd left them with the babysitter, then called the babysitter, told her she just wasn't coming back. This family's so fucked up.

Eileen's family tree. A lot of rotten branches. Diane later told the police, per the Tampa Bay Times, I just couldn't cope. The whole family came to me and in turn, one at a time, begged me to give Eileen and Keith to my parents, which was probably the biggest mistake I've ever made in my life. I should have adopted them to strangers. We in our family suffered a form of child abuse. My father was verbally abusive, my mother was verbally abusive, and we

were always told we were no good. Diane headed off to Texas, not sure what to draw was there, and she signed adoption papers giving full custody of Keith and Eileen to her parents Lori and Britta Wernos who lived in Troy, Michigan. Troy just five miles down the road south of Rochester. So, I mean, they're essentially kind of lived in the same place like Rochester It was way less populated back then and now today Troy has around 90,000 people back in 1960 less than 20,000 both Britta and Lori were the children of first-generation Finnish immigrants and let's call Lori Larry now That's what most people called him. And since he a daughter named Lori it's confusing to have both of them

be Lori. Diane soon returned from Texas. Shit must not have worked out down there. Tried to reintegrate herself into the family unit but this only seemed to make her mom jealous. Things were like weirder now. Diane later claimed that she once overheard an argument between her parents where her mom lied and accused her of beating her children. Or maybe she didn't lie and Diane was a terrible mom. Doesn't seem to be the best mom, clearly. Either way Eileen and Keith raised to believe that Larry and Britta were their biological parents and that their mother Diane was actually their sister. And what a great call! Oh what could go

wrong with that situation? Oh secrets like that never ever get out and fuck a kid's head up later. Oh, secrets like that never ever get out and fucking kids head up later. Mm-mm, not a chance. Eileen and Keith were raised alongside their uncle and aunt, whom they also believe were their siblings. Barry Wernos, Eileen's uncle brother. That's always a good sign of a childhood when you have an uncle brother. You have a good childhood? Oh yeah, just frolicking in the woods with my uncle brother, my sister and aunt, hell yeah.

Oh, fucking grandpa mommy, grandpa daddy, grandma mommy. Childhood? Childhood? Oh yeah, just frolicking in the woods with my uncle brother, my sister aunt. Hell yeah. Oh, fucking grandpa mommy. Grandpa daddy, grandma mommy. Yeah, Barry Wernos, Eileen's uncle brother, was 12 years older than Eileen and the golden child. Left the house when he joined the Air Force in 1967. Laurie Wernos, Eileen's sister aunt. Just two and a half years older than Eileen. Eileen will be closer with Laurie than with any other member of the family. She's two and a half years older than Eileen. Eileen will be closer with Lori than with any other member of the family. And all these kids grew up in a strict controlling, at times abusive home environment, at times, perhaps very abusive in her book, lethal intent.

Eileen Wuornos, America's deadliest female serial killer, author Sue Russell writes, uh, and I w I gotta say, just being nip-hicky, she wasn't the deadliest too. I went over a few far deadlier. Come on now. But anyway, uh, she writes, The Wernows home, an unprepossessing one-story ranch, its wood siding a sad faded yellow, sad amidst a cluster of trees away from the roadside in suburban Troy, Michigan, just 16 miles north of Detroit.

Benign looking and otherwise unnoteworthy, it was nevertheless a house of secrets. Sounds gross. I don't think anything good comes from a house of secrets. I need to remember to tell Lindsay that another reason, right, to keep our blinds open always. So we don't have a house of secrets. Neighbors recall that the curtains were always closed and that the Wernos family didn't interact with their community much. They were those neighbors. Do you have any weird secretive neighbors? I do. We actually have several

families of weirdos living on our block. Coeur d'Alene is, oh it is full. It is filled to the brim in my opinion with weird families. Bad combo of doomsday preppers and religious extremists. We have a house behind us to the left where the parents and the kids, most of the kids are gone now it seems, but the ones that you do see, God, they always look so miserable. Always just real serious, never like, never light and smiling. I only met one of the kids one time before he moved out. He was like 16 or 17.

He was helping a neighbor of mine cut down some small trees. I was also helping this neighbor and he was very weirded out by my tattoos and started quoting scripture about how essentially everyone was doomed if they didn't come around to his family's version of their faith.

Only time we spoke. I don't think he cared for how nonchalantly I just didn't fucking give a shit about what he was saying. Then there's this other house on our side of the block, three houses down. This might sound like nothing, but hear me out. They have a swing set in their backyard. There's more to it than that. And I can't remember the last time I went out to sit in the hot tub in our backyard before going to bed and couldn't hear and see

Some kids swinging on that swing set and we've had the hot tub for like four or five years now There's fucking always a kid out there even in the winter and they don't just swing for a few minutes They're swinging when I first go out there and they're still swinging when I head inside 20 30 minutes later, even if it's cold and usually it's some kid that you know, but I don't know based on their size I mean they're little ways away, but they look like they're at least in junior high. They're not like a tiny kid Lindsay the kids my kids thought I was exaggerating about how you know often someone was swinging out there first And then they started paying attention and they got weirded out because fucking weird right swings not that much fun I feel like only kids who aren't allowed to watch TV or play video games Or hang out with their friends or at least fucking

Read cool graphic novels do something anything. That's actually fun They're not swinging that much. I Would call the police but I don't feel like they would understand you have to get those kids out of there No, there's something fucked up in that house Come on, what normal kid swings that goddamn much every night. They're being abused Something weird going on. They don't Their only refuge is a shitty ass swing set. I'm done with my swing set tirade now. I don't think I'm gonna get a lot of supporters on that one. But I'm gonna remain convinced. Something weird's going on in that house.

Now let's get back into the story. Right after today's first of two mid-show sponsor breaks. Thanks for listening to those ads. If you don't want to hear anymore get the entire catalog ad free and more by signing up to be a Spacestrong on Patreon for five bucks a month. Now let's check back in with Eileen's grandpa dad, ol' pappy daddy, Larry Wernos. Larry Wernos worked as an engineer, anyway, for Ford when Eileen was young, where he was not well liked, I guess. He was supposedly arrogant, thought he was superior to others very opinionated also supposedly according to Eileen told Eileen she was evil, worthless,

never should have been born, shit like that. If that stuff's true I want my imaginary Dexter-like serial killer to come for him too. He was reportedly an alcoholic seems like everybody kind of said that. Stuck to wine I guess but drank like two or three bottles a day a Lot of people the neighborhood seemed to find him an intimidating man very strict with his children Brother uncle Barry and sister aunt Laurie agreed with Eileen that the dad was strict was firm But they denied that he was abusive Barry actually thought his dad was someone to look up to he wasn't he wasn't bear come on fucking wake up All the kids in the word knows home agreed that they had a very regimented daily routine. Bear, he has fucking Stockholm syndrome.

They dinner at 5 p.m. sharp. Were expected to do chores and homework afterwards. Bedtime was eight on the weekdays, nine on the weekends, very authoritarian. Eileen would not do well in this environment. She started getting into trouble at a very young age. Sounds like Larry didn't go light with the punishment. 1962, when Eileen was just four, she suffered burns on her forehead when she and her brother

Keith were setting fires with lighter fluid and they got some ass whoopens. It seems like the burn to the forehead will be punishment enough. Good example of natural consequences. I guess not. Not for Larry. Later when they were caught skipping school they were grounded for an entire month and according to Eileen Larry sometimes would force her and her brother and her sister aunt to skip in school. They were grounded for an entire month and according to Eileen, Larry sometimes would force her and her brother and her sister aunt to stay in the sauna, like lock them in the sauna as punishment. I know that nobody loves a sauna more than a Finn, but that seems pretty dangerous. I keep telling you, you finish your chores on time or you get cooked.

But maybe some of this never happened. I don't know, sister aunt Lori would later not recall getting locked in the sauna and she'd also say we got spankings and groundings, but we never got beat It's actually kind of a weird thing to say. I mean, yeah, I fucking spanked us, but we never got beat I mean technically there's a little bit of beating. Well, she said we did get yelled at Lori explained that they were spanked until they cried So she learned to cry sooner to shorten her punishment. That is pretty smart. I think that's a dangerous game that you gotta be careful Now you start crying before the first swat blow blow your cover, now you might get beat even harder. Eileen will claim that her grandpa dad did a lot more than spank her, ground her, and lock

her in a sauna. She will claim that she was sexually abused by him. She claimed that when Larry whipped her with the belt, he first forced her to pull her shorts down and bend over the kitchen table, or forced her to lay down completely naked on the bed. She didn't elaborate what else she would do to her once her clothes were off but just being made to completely undress for a spanking that's fucking creepy and it just gets creepier as the kid gets older. Eileen claims she was sometimes hit with a belt for consecutive days even when her skin was still raw from a previous beating. Larry also allegedly once forced Eileen to watch him drown a kitten. That's fucking psychotic if that happened.

So maybe her dad and her maternal grandpa were psychos. Some neighbors will later back up at least some of Eileen's accusations against her grandpa dad. Neighbor Cheryl Stacey said you could hear Larry shouting at his family from half a block away. She added, quote, That was just how he talked. He didn't treat them like human beings. He treated them worse than anybody would treat an animal. So he sounds yeah again pretty cool. Eileen's sister mom Diane, while she

claimed to never witness or know of her dad sexually abusing Eileen, she did later recall a disturbing incident involving her dad from her own childhood. She said the one time the morning after a sleepover, she didn't say what age she was or what age her friend was, but you know sleepover sometime during childhood, friend of hers told her that her dad came into the one time the morning after a sleepover she didn't say what age she was or what age her friend was But you know sleepover sometime during childhood friend of hers told her that her dad came into the room in the middle of the night and Asked her friend or said told her friend that he wanted to ah With her just like written. It's just written as a age dot dot dot like oh With her and she told him to get out

Diane believed her friend and with her. And she told him to get out. Diane believed her friend and wondered that, you know, after that, how often her dad had snuck into her bedroom in the middle of the night before. That is fucking creepy. I'm now choosing to believe Eileen about her grandpa. He seems pervy as fuck. Like, who comes to their daughter's room in the middle of the night? Tells one of their friends he wants to uh with her. A pitot. That's the answer. Maybe Larry had three bottles of wine that night. Diane said that her dad had also told her that her mom didn't care for him physically and Britta told her daughter Diane that sex was an unpleasant chore for women. So quite a bit of dysfunction in this family. Sister Aunt Laurie would later say that she didn't think Eileen was sexually abused by her dad.

And then Eileen was probably lying, but she didn't say certainly. She conceded it was possible it happened and she just wasn't aware of it. So maybe that's kind of a nod like, yeah, dad was creepy. She added that Eileen only ever told her one story of sexually inappropriate behavior involving her dad, Larry, during her early teens.

And she said this like, I don't wanna say it like apologetically, but like, yeah, like uh I don't want to say it like apologetically but like yeah like I guess maybe apologize like there's just this one big deal I kind of like trying to like gloss over it but this is so creepy she said that in front of his wife so her mom Larry grabbed Eileen kissed her on the mouth and forced his tongue down her throat and then Eileen laughed about this story what the fuck is going on in this house moving away from speculation about what grandpa dad Larry did or didn't do, Eileen definitely struggled in school.

She showed artistic promise according to author Sue Russell, but quote, her home environment was not conducive to maximizing that potential or to putting her into any situations where she could shine. Yeah, exactly. Outside of art, she really struggled with reading, writing, and arithmetic. A lot of her struggles were probably due to hearing and vision problems. She was prescribed glasses but refused to wear them. Her hearing problems were recorded as early as kindergarten at age 8.

It was determined Eileen had significant hearing loss in her right ear and she was recommended to sit in the front of the class. Eileen had poor grades all throughout school, poor relationships with her classmates and teachers as well. A 1970 school report written two months after Eileen's 14th birthday, when she was attending Troy High School, detailed her negative relationships with classmates and teachers. The report stated, quote, it is vital for this girl's welfare that she receive counseling immediately.

But of course, Larry and Britta, they didn't give a shit about school reports. They didn't put that kid in therapy. To be fair, almost no one did back then. But still. Testing from around this time showed that Eileen had a low verbal IQ score of 80, which is slightly below average, and an average performance IQ of 106. That's actually on the high end of average. She was prescribed a tranquilizer to address some behavior problems, but that did not seem

to help. The problem was a lot deeper than that, and there was probably a lot of fucking crazy shit going on at the house. Actually there definitely was. Finding out her grandparents were her parents and some of her siblings were really her aunt and uncle did not help Eileen kick ass in school or have better behavior. Neither did learning about the true identity of her mom or dad I'm sure. Eileen and Keith found out the truth about their parents when Eileen was between the ages of 10 and 12. So before that council report, according to sister mom Diane, Eileen learned the truth through some

gossip in school or at school. According to author Sue Russell, grandpa dead Larry was the one who told the kids that Diane had abandoned them when they were babies. That feels correct to me. After he dropped his bombshell on them, Eileen and her brother Keith rebelled more. Eileen would now taunt Larry by saying, you're not my real father. In one instance, Eileen and Keith supposedly told Larry they were gonna run away and he just told him to never come back. Then they did run away or both picked up by the police. But when the police called Larry, he refused to come pick him up. Dude wasn't fucking around. I don't think he wanted them. Eileen was sent to

Juvi and from there she ran away. She'd soon return home though, that time. Backing up a bit again to when Eileen was 11, around the time that she learned the true identity of her parents, Eileen lost her virginity to a neighborhood kid a year older than her, if grandpa dad hadn't already taken it. And she then began to offer sexual favors to boys in school or from around the neighborhood in exchange for stuff like cash and cigarettes. This is at 11 years old.

This earned her the derogatory nickname of cigarette pig. That's not good. Further isolated her from most of her classmates. This makes me think that grandpa probably did molest her. Or if not, somebody else did. When someone is hypersexualized at the age of 11, they've very likely been sexually abused. Could just be if you know

Abused essentially by this other kid not always but but often According to author Sue Russell Eileen would meet boys in a makeshift fort in the woods across the street from a gas station in her neighborhood Eileen would claim that she had penetra also Eileen would claim that she had Penetrative vaginal sex when she was 11 with her brother Keith at his request. Fuckin' my god. Keith's friends said he was embarrassed by Eileen's reputation amongst her peers for being promiscuous. He would make fun of her, but he also asked his sister to teach him about sex so girls wouldn't laugh at him. Kind of twisted logic is that, come on, sis, I don't want to get a weird reputation about sex, so why don't we fuck?

Come on, sis. I don't want to get a weird reputation about sex. So why don't we fuck? At the age of just 14 in 1970, Eileen said she was raped by a family friend and became pregnant. She waited six months to tell her family hiding the pregnancy as long as she could. Then when Eileen finally did tell her family she was raped, they did not believe her, did not file a police report. That is fucked up. If no one taught you anything about how to be just a decent parent, here's one quick lesson. If your kid ever tells you that they have been raped, believe them. That's it. It's pretty simple. Even if you're very skeptical, for whatever reason, believe them. Go to the police,

support them, and if it really didn't happen, let the police determine that. Not you. But don't just assume that they're lying about something that serious because that's a real good way to permanently fuck up both your relationship with them and their self-esteem. Instead of going to the police, grandpa dad or I guess just grandpa now, Larry Warnow sent her to the Florence Crittenden unwed mother's home in Detroit to finish out a pregnancy and deliver the baby there. So she was just kind of like banished like I just like to fucking get out of here go have your baby and then maybe we'll take you back. Eileen's son born March 24th 1971 is adopted. Eileen claims she never got to hold him. It's so fucking dark. After she

gave birth to him he was taken out of the room she only caught a glimpse of him through a window. She could see that his hair was full and dark brown. He was born weighing seven pounds and 11 ounces. Eileen was full and dark brown. He was born weighing seven pounds and 11 ounces. Eileen was just 4'11 when he was born, just still a child herself. She was able to name him. She named him Keith in honor of her brother. Supposedly on the birth certificate, Eileen listed the father as quote rapist. Eileen returned home to live with her grandparents and then she would re-enroll in Troy High School. She'll drop out before the next school year though. Eileen's grandmother Britta Wernos, who had always struggled with alcoholism, died of cirrhosis of the liver four months after Eileen

gave birth to her son. So shortly after she returned home, July 7th, 1971, she was only 54 years old. Also her real name was Eileen, first name. I forgot to mention that. Eileen was the was named after Britta, who went by her middle name. Diane Wernos believed her father Larry killed her mom with his abusive ways over the years. But one of Britta's daughters believed that stress Eileen Keith, well, so, but Lori, believed that stress Eileen and Keith, excuse me,

put her through, caused her to drink heavily. Yeah, I'm gonna say Britta chose to drink and that it was Britta's gonna say Britta chose to drink and that it was Britta's fault that Britta drank too much. After Britta died, Larry refused to care for Eileen any longer and just kicked her out of the house. She was 15 years old and he's a piece of shit and that leads to Eileen dropping out of school. She then goes to live at the Adrian Training School in Adrian, Michigan, about an hour and a half drive southwest of Detroit.

Now closed, this quote facility to rehabilitate juvenile delinquents was open for over 100 years before it closed. Her sister aunt, Lori, would visit her there. Doesn't seem any of the rest of her relation did. After a few months, she briefly tried returning home to live with her grandpa, but it did not take and she ran away for good now. Now she starts hanging out with men of all ages, some of whom seem to maybe try and help her. Most of them seem to definitely exploit her. She was frequently homeless, sleeping in the woods or abandoned cars. She began to drink heavily, frequently, went on various drug binges. She would frequently hitchhike. She would sneak into dive and biker bars where she got pretty good at playing pool, learned to hustle. Also by the end of the year she drifted into steady sex work,

became her primary and sole, yeah basically almost her sole source of income. The lone bright spot of 1971 for Eileen, she met her close friend Don Botkins. They both dropped out of school in 1971, both teenagers would become sex workers and frequent drug users. Aileen and Don would share their earnings from sex work to buy alcohol and drugs for them and their friends. Don will tell the Tampa Bay Times in 1991 regarding Aileen, She had the worst life of anyone I ever met.

When I first heard of Aileen's murder charges, it didn't shock me. If you had only been there and seen how terribly she was treated all her life. It only makes sense Dawn added I was really her only friend. I knew she had a hard life and slept in the woods So I never questioned what she did Think about what Don is saying here Don also 18 dropout runaway sex worker living on the streets being preyed on by men of all ages I'm sure taking in care of by no one, someone definitely hanging out with a rough crowd. She's saying that Eileen had the worst life of anyone she had ever met.

That had to have been saying a lot. Years later in 2018, Dawn did an interview for the Oxygen Channel show Snapped, where she provided more insight into their friendship. And poor Dawn in that interview conducted so many years later when she's in her early 60s she still looks like someone or she looks like someone had just punched her in the face. Seriously her nose is scuffed up, makeup is not quite concealing, clearly a black eye. Yeah her life was still rough just a few years ago. Dawn said of Eileen on that show the kids would only hang out with her to give her cigarettes when she needed cigarettes or money.

That's when she started doing favors, I guess. That's what they called it. And I never asked her if she was a prostitute. I already knew, so I asked. I got to know her and she was perfectly normal. She also spoke about Eileen getting pregnant from being raped, putting her at the age of 13 while other sources say 14.

Dawn said, it was a guy that lived in the neighborhood, an older man that would let a bunch of kids come in and drink and all that. Well, Eileen must have got real drunk one night and he sent the rest of kids home. Eileen was too drunk to leave at 13 and apparently he raped her and she got pregnant. Nobody believed her that she was raped, none of her friends. They all turned against her. It was awful. And she was 14 by the way, just because you can find genealogical records of her son being bored and just kind of do the math count backwards. But anyway, when Eileen returned from the home for unwed mothers, no one would have

anything to do with her. And the kids called her quote, a whore and a prostitute. Dawn was one of the few people who defended Eileen and she maintained contact with her after she was arrested for murder even. The two exchanged hundreds of letters over the over the years. Dawn recalled the exact moment she found out Eileen was a killer. She said quote, my mom just called me and says oh my god you're not gonna believe what I just seen on CNN. And I said what? And she said Eileen Wernos just got busted. I said no kidding. Are you kidding me? I said for what? And she said she

killed seven men Don. I said she did Hmm. She finally fighting back I guess And she said I was freaked out. Of course. I often thought she must have been dead or something I really never thought she would kill anybody and think about what Don said there as well. She finally fighting back I guess Everyone who knew and cared about Eileen seemed all agree about one thing about. That she had a really hard life being victimized by a lot of men. Sometime in early 1972, when Eileen would have been 16 or about to turn 16, she began hitchhiking out of Michigan and around the country, continuing doing sex work to make money. She traveled to Colorado, New Mexico, eventually Florida, clearly a bunch of other states in between Michigan and all those states. She used several aliases, obtained documents and licenses from friends and family

She frequently ran with biker gangs and hung out in biker bars as early as 1973 She was frequently using her sister aunt Laurie's diploma to throw off Michigan police trying to track her down and find her since she was still underage In May of 1974 now 18 year old Eileen is arrested in Colorado for driving under the influence disorderly conduct and firing a gun from a mute moving vehicle She was later charged with failure to appear because she had left town before her trial 1976 a significant year and Eileen's life jumping ahead two years now

March 12th that year her grandpa dad Larry Wernos died of suicide by turning on his car inside a closed garage. Sweet! Oh, let's hit that fucking button again. Ding. Yippee! At this time, he was living in his son's basement, was in poor health due to diabetes and alcoholism and just being a piece of shit. He was 65. Doesn't seem Eileen attended his funeral. Not surprising. Interestingly, Larry's own father had also died by suicide, hanged himself in an aircraft hanger, and Larry had unsuccessfully tried to kill himself weeks before he died by standing in a flooded basement and turning on an

electric switch. Bad genetics, worse environment for Eileen. She was getting hammered off by both nature and nurture. Two months later, Eileen traveled to Daytona Beach, Florida where she met her first and only husband. 69-year-old Louis Gratz fell. A wealthy retiree and yacht club president. Louis saw her hitchhiking, offered her a ride. Eileen was 20 years old. When they married two months later in July. Just like a tiny 49-year age gap.

I mean, they were obviously soulmates. Clearly they're soulmates. They're very much in love. No, clearly he was after sex with a young woman. He wanted a much much newer model of a bike to ride than his ex-wife's rusty old 10-speed with a fucking chain that won't stay on. His ex-wife was 67 when she passed away the year before. He fucking threw her bike over a cliff. Eileen was after his money. He was loaded. Neither would get what they wanted for long, as their marriage would last just nine weeks and it doesn't seem like

Eileen will get anything in the divorce. They married in Kingsley, Georgia. I'm sure there was a prenup. But after just a month of marriage, Lewis left for Florida, filed a restraining order against Eileen, claiming she beat him with his walking cane. It cracks me up. Eileen would claim that Louis was the one who beat her, however, she did admit to her sister-in-law Laurie that she did make Louis fall down once by swiping his cane off one room. She told her mom the same story. You know what kid? Diane asked Eileen why she would do that when Louis had millions of dollars and could take care of her and Eileen explained that Louis became angry with her because of her excessive shopping sprees and now he'd

only give her 30 bucks at a time and that and that when he reprimanded her for spending too much she beat him with his cane. Lewis was roughly the same age as Eileen's grandpa Larry. He died. Is that a coincidence? Did she marry a guy you know this old, treat him how she did because of unresolved trauma experience with her grandpa dead? I do wonder about that. Eileen and Lewis's divorce decree was issued July 19th and a week before that on July 13th Eileen was arrested for getting pretty rowdy in a bar. One of Lewis's complaints in his divorce filing was that Eileen didn't seem to think being married was a good reason not to go

bar-hopping and just fucking get rowdy and cut loose She returned to Michigan for this arrest was in Mancelona way up in the UP the Upper Peninsula. She was in this dive bar called Bernie's Club. It's a place that no longer exists She was hustling some local 27 year old construction worker named Bud Castle at pool Getting louder and drunkers the night were on she was swearing more starting to patrons, just making a scene. All this apparently very typical Eileen behavior now. Finding the bartender Danny Moore had enough. He walked over to their table, gathered up all the billiards balls, told Eileen she was done for the night, and she didn't take that well. She grabbed another ball from a different table, threw it at Danny the bartender's head, so hard it stuck in the wall behind him. It only missed him by inches and apparently you know people just thought like,

God if that would have hit him he would have been killed. She's arrested for assault and battery. And then just four days after her arrest, two days before her divorce is finalized, on July 17th Eileen's brother Keith, her only true sibling, died of cancer. So what a fucking week. Keith was just 21 years old. He had been fighting cancer for two years. Eileen's sister Aunt Laurie would say that Eileen had

barely visited him towards the end of his short life. Sounds like he was kind of a dick to her obviously growing up. I mean, I mean, they fucked. They made fun of her. She was also too busy that time getting fucked up, bounced around the country to visit him. Back in 1974 Keith had joined the army. Shortly after passing his physical he'd felt a lump on his neck that was diagnosed as cancerous. Had it surgically removed, doctors were like, oh yeah, you're good now. All cancer free. But they were wrong. Few months later, he drunkenly slipped on a short flight of stairs one night and just broke his leg after what didn't seem to be that bad of a fall. Turned out his leg broke

because his bones were just fucking brittle. His bones were just made out of balsa wood now from the cancer. Soon he'd be spending 18 months in a VA hospital undergoing chemo that would ultimately be unsuccessful. A few months later, Eileen would inherit 10 grand in life insurance from the army. She would not invest it in a 401k or IRA or any kind of savings. She would quickly use some of it for a down payment on a Pontiac. Some kind of fucking firebird. She almost immediately wrecked. Soon had it repossessed for failure to make payments. She also bought a premier stereo system, which wasn't a good idea because she didn't have a permanent place to live.

She was crashing at her sister-in-law Laurie's house with her and her husband, Laurie's husband Irv. Spent the rest on drugs and drink mostly and it was all gone in three months. Gone in three months, even though 10k back then is equivalent to 55 grand now. No, she is a train wreck. And around the time she had finished blowing her money, she was kicked out of her sister Lori and her husband's place for essentially being the worst roommate ever. She was frequently drunk, combative, ate their food, never bought any food, never cooked, took three long hot showers a day most days, wouldn't

leave hot water for Lori or Irv, never cleaned up after herself, would do shit like change channels on the TV even when Lori and Irv were in the middle of watching a show, would bring strange men over that they assume were clients, like sex work clients, and never helped pay a single bill. Then after getting kicked out, she crashed with a few other people in the area for brief stays. People Lori and Irv assumed she was scamming. Irv in particular, not a fan of Eileen, saw her as a drunk user who robbed everyone around her blind. Not long after getting the boot from Lori and Irv, Eileen showed up at her mom, her sister mom, Diane's doorstep in Texas. Where Diane was living in Texas is not specified in sources. Diane would later say that Eileen scared her now.

She was scared of her rage and potential for violence. But Eileen at first seemed to be trying to get her life back on track, or at least she said she was. Said she just needed some help, told she got a job, get her own place. However, instead of looking for a job, Eileen just got drunk and high all the time and was the same kind of roommate

she had been while she stayed with her sister on. After a few weeks, Diane had had enough, told Eileen she had to leave. She later said she gave her money for bus fare, dropped her off at the bus station, then watched Eileen leave the station and start hitchhiking. Eileen would later say she left because she was sick of her mom's rules and had her mom drop her off alongside the highway. Either way, Eileen is a fucking hot mess. God, um...

What if someone would have just done a better job looking out for her back when she was 11, right? When her life was starting to go off the rails. What if she had been born into a different family? But she wasn't. Eileen spent most of 1977 in Colorado hanging out mainly with dudes and biker gangs again, it seems. She was arrested twice for DUIs in 1977, twice for weapons offenses. In her first DUI arrest of that year in August of 1977, she was spotted erratically driving a brown Grand Prix and waving around and firing her handgun out of the window. She likes to wave a gun around outside the window. I picture her blasting some like, you know, classic 70s Aerosmith as she's doing this. Just, woohoo!

Ayayayayay! Just fucking weaving all over the road. Kinda makes something out of a cool music video. Uh, man, Aerosmith. They were so good back then. Following year, 1978, Eileen attempted to end her life by shooting herself in the stomach. My god, that's a painful way to try and do it. A lot of self-hate there. Said she did it because she was heartbroken over a breakup. A breakup with one of the many unnamed men

she would have brief and tense relationships with. By 1981 after committing a variety of crimes across the Midwest like stealing a diamond ring from a woman who was nice enough to let her stay with her in Pueblo, Colorado, Eileen had made it to Florida, living in the Daytona Beach area. Now 25 years old, she meets, starts dating a 52 year old used Carl salesman named Jay Watts, a man she had met at the talk of the town lounge. That sounds like a dive bar if there was ever a dive bar. The talk of the town lounge. You're not getting high shelf scotch for the talk of the town lounge.

This was a place where Eileen liked to play pool. A place where they undoubtedly had a lot of old crow. Jay seems like he was a he was actually a good dude. He bought her a 1971 Ford station wagon so she could go get a job. Apparently she was the one who initiated a sex relationship that seemed to go well at first day he was like cool being like I'll help you out you can stay here they would play golf together Eileen was a natural they like to cuddle up on the couch and watch some TV but then their relationship pretty much came to an end on May 20th when Eileen was arrested in Edgewater Florida for robbing a convenience

store called the Magic Market on Ridgewood Avenue where nothing but a bikini. She was probably drunk. She put a.22 pistol in a young cashier's face and only got $35 and two packs of smokes. She would be charged with robbery with a deadly weapon and she'd end up spending a year in prison from 1982 to 1983. Jay would visit Eileen while in prison and the two would write together. He was just kind of saying, like, I was just trying to be nice. Felt like she had no one. Then a few months though before she got out she put an ad out in the personal section or personal section of a biker magazine

looking for a boyfriend. Said she got dozens of replies, narrowed the list to ten finalists from those ten guys who all sent her money. She picked some guy from Maryland, a divorced 47-year-old engineer with grown children to go live with when she got out. She was released in August of 1983. Jay was gone now. He later said he was relieved that she found somebody else. And now Eileen hitchhikes all the way with this guy, Ed, this engineer and just rock Ed's world. Oh, Ed. But not in a fun way. She told Ed when she showed up that he was to never touch her. She was gay now. Even though she had been romantic and sexual in her letters with him.

Doesn't seem like she liked what she saw when she got there. But even though she wasn't going to fuck him now, she did want to stay at his place. For free, of course. And for some reason, this idiot lets her move in. Just a glutton for punishment, I guess. Then while she stays with him, she is drunk almost all the time. Oh, what a delight! I bet he was so glad he responded to that biker magazine ad. She also kept leaving. She'd head down to Florida, but then come back to him unannounced.

And why did Ed put up with this shit? Why did he, you know, allow himself to live with the drunk stranger of a roommate who never slept with him, ate his food, drank his beer, didn't help pay the bills? Someone who's either drunk or preaching fire and brimstone Christianity out of him, apparently. Well, because he said he felt sorry for her. And she scared him a bit.

Luckily for him, she would eventually leave for Florida, actually move back in with her old boyfriend Jay, but then she would get caught stealing from Jay, and then she'd come back to Maryland for one last hang with Ed. And during that stay, at one point I guess she told Ed, quote, Hey, I'm bored. Let's go have sex. What a pickup line. And he said, I thought you were gay. You told me not to touch you. And then she replied, I was just kidding about that. And then they went into bed and we fucked. Oh, and they say romance is dead. Nobody says that. Some people say people say that, but I don't think anybody says that. Anyway, Eileen told him

it was the best sex she'd ever had. And then a few hours later, she was drunk and she grabbed a knife and said she was gonna kill him. You know, never a dull moment when you're dating Eileen Werneros. She knew how to keep things spicy. She knew how to keep you on your toes Ed finally got out of her place for good when he found her passed out from either alcohol or drugs or both After trash in his new couch I guess and he had the cops pick her up and take her away and she would end up staying in a psychiatric Facility for a few weeks and while she was there Ed would visit her. He does seem to have been a really nice guy

Who cared about her now? She told him she was going to move to North Carolina. She was going to work for Jim and Tammy Faye Baker and work for their ministry Heritage USA and she was going to travel around the world saving souls. She's very stable. She's incredibly stable. About six months after he saw Eileen for the last time, her sister Aunt Lori called him saying the cops were looking for her. She had never started to work with former Suck subjects Jim and Tammy Fay. I am shocked! Then months after that Ed got a letter from Eileen herself. She said she was living with the female lover now named Tony helping run a carpet cleaning business but wasn't happy and wanted to come back and stay with him and he did

not reply. Oh he finally wised up. She needed a lot more help than he could give her. In 1985 and 86, Eileen bounced around all over the place again, robbing men. She would charge for sex, stealing checks, shoplifting, hustling people at the pool tables and biker bars, getting arrested here and there, bounced out of town before a lot of her trials, just, you know, complete and total mayhem, just chaos. During this period she also told her sister aunt Lori, the main family member she's keeping in contact with, that she is gay now. That men did nothing but use or hurt her and she was done with him. Lori was actually disgusted by this. She was super homophobic. She did not want Eileen to ever bring her lover around because

she'd be so humiliated if somebody saw her with two lesbians. What a family! 1986, another important year in Eileen's life. It was the year she met who she will go on to consider her true love, Tyra Moore. I know I said 1905, 1906 earlier. That was like 1985, first half of 1986, second half of 1986 now, or really the end of the first half, I guess June.

Eileen meets Tyra at the Zodiac Bar in Daytona Beach, a gay bar, and it was love at first sight for Eileen. Tyra Joleen Moore was 24 when she met Eileen, who was 30. Tyra was born August 3rd, 1962, somewhere in Ohio. Her mom had died when she was just two years old. She was raised by her dad and his second wife, very close with her stepmom who was great I guess. Tyra moved to Florida in 1983 after getting a large settlement in a car accident. Not long after making it to Florida she lived with her girlfriend and the woman's two kids on a houseboat. But then they broke up. And she moved to Holly Hill just north of Daytona. It was there that she met her close friend Cammie Green. In early 1984 Cammie, her husband and two sons were new to the neighborhood. Cammie Green in early 1984. Cammie, her husband and two sons were new to the neighborhood.

Cammie felt a connection to Tyra because they were both born in August of 1962. So they had to be friends. They have to. Cammie liked that Tyra was fun and easygoing as well. When Tyra got evicted from her home, the Greens allowed her to move in and she became an extended family member. Tyra was working as a housekeeper at a local motel, babysat occasionally, and attended a local Baptist church regularly. According to author Sue Russell, she found no conflict between her belief in the Good Book and her lesbianism. The only thing she vehemently opposed were all the references in the scripture implying that women should obey men. She was not about to submit. When Tyra brought Eileen home, they spent three days and three nights in her room only leaving to get food.

Oh, so much puss. Oh my gosh. Just fuck fest. Eileen's, uh, right when you first fucking meet somebody you're really into, God, isn't that so much fun though? So exciting. When you're just exploring everything. Eileen soon became another roommate in Cammie Green's home, And Cammie, I guess, you know, very generous. At first, Eileen said, telling Cammie, that she was in the pressure cleaning business. But Eileen would leave home to hitchhike for days at a time. She would often leave on a Monday, be back Friday, spend the weekend at the house, and normally she would return with

hundreds of dollars in cash. And Cammie thought there was something off about Eileen. Who was going by the nickname of Lee at that time. Yeah, you think Cammie thought there was something off about Eileen. Who was going by the nickname of Lee at that time. Yeah, you think Cammie? Lady who hitchhikes out of town on Monday hitchhikes back into town on Friday with a big wad of cash. Yeah, I would say that's a bit off. It's a weird way to make money in the cleaning business. Cammie also noticed that Eileen was controlling. She made Tyra shave her legs, which she had never done before. Tyra stopped going to church not long after meeting Eileen. For her part, Tyra initially thought Eileen was long after meeting Eileen. For her part

Tyra initially thought Eileen was a drug dealer. Later she'll learn she's a sex worker. By August of 1986 Eileen and Tyra had moved out of Cammie's house so they could live on their own now. She rarely saw them again after that but she'd hear about them later because it's something Eileen took from her. We'll find out what that is later. Tyra now quit her housekeeping job. And by the way, if you see Tyra's name in print, it's T-Y-R-I-A, but even she pronounces her name Tyra. Just one of those weird redundant letters where you're like, why the fuck did my parents put that letter in there? But yeah, now Tyra quit her housekeeping job, Eileen became her

primary financial support. This might have been because Eileen was possessive and disliked it when Tyra went to work or interacted with others. The two women moved often now bouncing around between different motels, apartments, mobile home communities in Daytona Beach and other locations in Florida. Despite all this chaos Marion County Sheriff's Captain Steve Binniger will later say that Tyra was probably the most stable relationship she had ever had in her life. Based on what I've read about Eileen, yeah, I would agree. The bar for stable relationships with Eileen very, very low. The two women maintained a strong emotional connection for the length of their relationship, but the sexual nature of their relationship would change a lot over time,

I guess. Tyra would say in a later police interview that they started out as lovers, and later we were just like sisters more These two sister lovers bounced around in Florida for a little over three years Living mainly off of Eileen sex work and petty theft often robbing her John's before Eileen began her murder spree that began at the end of 1989 and Before we jump into the killings time for today's second of two mid show sponsor breaks Before we jump into the killings, time for today's second of two mid-show sponsor breaks. Thank you for listening to those sponsors.

Now let us return to the start of Eileen's murder spree. On December 13th of 1989, two young men were looking for scrap metal on a dirt road near I-95 in Volusia County, Florida, when they found a body wrapped up in a carpet runner. The victim would be identified by his fingerprints. He was 51-year-old Rick Mallory, lasting alive November 30, 1989. Mallory owned an electronics repair shop in Clearwater, Florida, and lived a pretty chaotic life.

He was known to close abruptly, disappear for days at a time on drinking binges, and to frequently hire sex workers. Rick also wasn't the most reliable employer. According to author Sue Russell, he only kept employees long enough to complete the work that piled up during his time off and then he would unceremoniously just let him go once he was caught up. So when Ricky didn't open his shop in the early days of December of 1989, no one really thought much of it. That was just a typical Rick. But then on December 1st, a local deputy found Rick's abandoned

Cadillac several miles from where his body would be found two weeks later. Rick's radar detector and camera had been stolen. An autopsy would find that Rick had died from three gunshot wounds from a 22 caliber weapon. One of the early suspects was a local, quote, exotic dancer and maybe sometimes escort

who went by the ironic name of Chastity. Pretty funny name. Chastity actually confessed to the murder but investigators soon realized her confession was prompted by anger towards her boyfriend. Okay doesn't make a lot of sense to me. I'll show you Johnny. Fuck with me again and I'll confess to a murder that I didn't commit and get falsely imprisoned for decades. That'll teach you to cheat on me. Also, Rick had been previously convicted of attempted rape and served time in prison in Maryland. So Eileen's later claims regarding why she killed Rick might actually be justified. Does not seem like he was a good dude. Over six months later, June 1st, 1990, an unidentified nude male body is now found in the woods of Citrus County, about 40 miles north of Tampa.

The victim had been shot six times with a.22 caliber weapon. A used condom was found near his body. Six days later on June 7th, he was identified as 43-year-old David Spears, a heavy equipment operator last seen on May 19th. David told his boss he was going to Orlando, but he never made it. Like Rick Mallory, David's truck was found before his body. The truck was found on the side of I-75 with the doors unlocked and the license plate missing. Just five days later on June 6, 1990 another naked male body found in Pasco County, Florida a few miles off of I-75. The victim had been shot nine times in the chest and stomach with a 22 caliber weapon. Man, nine times. That's some rage. Body was so badly decomposed that the medical examiner couldn't get fingerprints or even

estimate a time of death. Although Pasco County Detective Tom Muck didn't know the identity of the John Doe, he'd heard about the body just found in Citrus County. Detective Muck notified Citrus County Sheriff's Investigator Marvin Paget about the similarities in their cases, asked him to stay in touch. But then Paget told him to get fucked, hung up on him. Okay, Detective Muck called back thinking he must have misheard him, and Paget said, nope, quote, I told you to get fucked, Muck, so get fucked, and he hung up again. Well now Muck, understandably, is pretty pretty upset calls back to find out what the deal is

Padgett told him what's the deal? You think you can make me kneel? Banana peel? You ever eaten veal? Maybe eel? Think you got balls of steel? I'll squeeze them make you squeal for real. He hung up again Now detective Muck does something interesting. He calls Steven Swidd head of SBK records a subsidi a subsidiary of Capitol Records. And he told him he just found what Stephen's been looking for. A Florida white boy with some attitude who could rap. Swyd then called Padgett, convinced him to change his name to Robert Van Winkle, then convinced him to change it again to Vanilla Ice. And two months later, August 22nd, 1990, they released a single for Ice Ice Baby and A Star Was Born. If there was a problem, yo I'll solve it. Check out the hook while my DJ revolves it. Ice Ice Baby.

Mm-hmm. Ice Ice Baby. Uh-huh, yep. Ice Ice Baby. God, what a cool little side road that was, huh? Bet you didn't know that piece of trivia. I mean, how could you? You know, because I just made it up. Spiced up this episode. That was crazy talk. I liked it.

Detective Muck really did notify Citrus County Sheriff's Investigator Marvin Padgett though about the similarities in the two murder cases. Asked him to stay in touch. Second victim was eventually identified as 40 year old Charles Kerscadden, a rodeo worker. Went missing on May 31st 1990. Just says rodeo worker, doesn't say if he's like a bull rider or a rodeo clown. Wish I had more details. Change the story a little bit for me if he's a rodeo clown for some reason. Rodeo worker, pretty vague. Following months, investigators get their first big lead in the case on these two murdered men. July 4th 1990, when a car crashed off a

state road 315 near Orange Springs Marion County, Florida, 1990 when a car crashed off a state road 315 your Orange Springs Marion County, Florida Witness Rhonda Bailey sitting on her porch saw the accident two women got out of the car were cursing each other One woman was shorter heavy set with brown hair other woman was a bit taller. Maybe around 5'4 blonde hair Blonde woman was bleeding from an injury to her arm They approached Rhonda and the blonde woman was doing the talking pleaded with with Rhonda, please don't call the police. Said her dad lived up the road. Women then got back in the car, moved it out of the brush. They weren't able to drive it any further, so they got out and started walking down the road.

Then Hubert Hewitt from the Orange Springs Volunteer Fire Department responded to a call about the accident. Asked the two women if they were the ones involved. Blonde woman cursed at him and said no. That's what's said in the stories. Cursed at him and said no. That's what's said in the stories. Cursed at him and said no. Sounds like Eileen. She refused medical help, so Hewitt left him alone.

Short time later, Marion County deputies came to the scene of the accident and inspected the vehicle, a gray 1988 Pontiac Sunbird. Glass was smashed from the accident. There were blood stains inside the vehicle and the license plate was missing. A search of the VIN number revealed the car was registered to one 65-year-old Peter Simms, a retired merchant seaman who had disappeared the previous month on June 7th after leaving

his home in Jupiter, Florida to travel to Arkansas to visit some family. Jupiter police set out a nationwide teletype containing descriptions of the two women seen in Peter's vehicle as well as a synopsis of the case and sketches. Authorities also collected a bloody palm print from the door handle of the vehicle that will help them in the future investigation. And yes, Eileen had also shot Peter to death per her confession later. Exactly a month later, August 4th 1990, the body of 50-year-old Troy Burris found in a wooded area along State Road 19 in Marion County, Florida. Troy was reported missing July 31st.

He worked as a delivery driver for Gilchrist Sausage. Sausage is made with no artificial nitrates, if you don't know, and 15% less fat, natural casing, in case you need more details about this sweet ass sausage. Still there. But he wanted to quit because he hated life on the road. You can give a fuck about Gilchrist sausage. Anyway Troy started his daily route July 30th but didn't return in that that afternoon. His manager made some calls discovered he hadn't shown up his last few stops for the day. Some

angry people want some sausage still. Manager and her husband went out looking for him that night Troy's wife reported him missing at 2 a.m. At 4 a.m. Marion County deputies find Troy's Troy's truck on the shoulder of State Road 19 20 miles east of Ocala where Gilchrist sausage was and is still located If you want to buy some sausage, they've got some Cajun flavored sausage if you like that I spent too much time just fucking around the website. I don't know why his truck was unlocked. The keys were missing They don't even have a good website. It's very like industrial. Troy was nowhere to be found. Five days later, a family was

having a picnic in the Ocala National Forest and they found Troy's body in a clearing just off the road, eight miles from where his truck was found. And then they went back to enjoying their picnic. And then a different family found his body five days later and then they reported it. And I'm kidding. Can you imagine somebody doing that? Can you imagine being out with your family enjoying a picnic? See what looks like a fucking dead body? Right? You see at first you're like, oh maybe it's a person. Then you go out there and look your kids are with you. You know it's definitely a dead body when you get close and then you're just like, huh well, you know kids there's nothing we can do to help him now. Let's

hurry back. Let's finish that chicken. get those biscuits while they're still warm you know kfc sucks when it's cold uh no they called in the body the florida heat and the humidity had sped up decomposition which made identification at that time impossible man's poor wife later was able to identify him by his wedding ring uh troy had been killed by two gunshot wounds from a 22 caliber weapon one to the chest one to the back The initial suspect was a drifter named Curtis Michael blankenship. It was hitchhiking the high on highway 19 the day Troy disappeared Was picked up near his truck, but it soon became clear that blankenship was not involved and there were no additional suspects not right away a

Month later everyone's everything's happening a month a month apart now Around 6 30 p.m. September 12th, 1990 two teenagers We're out biking and some under under. Oh my god undeveloped rushland Whoo off County Road 484 just west of I-75 and a gated housing community They saw what looked like a pile of clothes at the edge of the grass next to a concrete culvert soon realized It was a body the victim identified his 56-year-old Charles Richard Dick Humphries.

And that's not me adding the Dick. He called himself Dick. Dick and his wife Shirley had celebrated their 35th wedding anniversary two days prior, September 10th, September 11th. Dick's last day of work at the Sumterville office of Florida's Department of Health and Rehabilitative Services where he worked as a child abuse investigator. He was about to transfer to the Ocala office before he, I guess he wasn't like retired,

it was just his last day of work there. Shirley Humphrey knew something was wrong when Dick didn't come home the evening of September 11th. He always called if he's going to be late. He thought he might have gone out with his coworkers to celebrate his last day there, but then he became more worried obviously obviously, as the evening passed. And within hours, Dick was reported missing slash endangered. Well, he had gone out to celebrate that night, just not with his co-workers.

He'd gone out looking to pick up a sex worker, it seems. Which I have to say bothers me, if that's what he's doing as a child abuse investigator, because he had to have known that most sex workers were victims of child abuse themselves. I mean, maybe he thought he was just picking up a hitchhiker but Dick's body found in Marion County he had been shot seven times in the head and torso. Jesus. Six 22 caliber slugs found in his body the seventh went through his wrist and was never found. Dick's missing vehicle found later in September in neighboring in a neighboring county. Excuse me. Marion County investigators immediately noticed similarities between the Troy Burris and Dick

Humphrey's murders. They were killed by the same caliber of weapon both bodies found miles away from their vehicles. Marion County investigators checked bulletins of unsolved homicides throughout Florida and found two similar cases in Citrus and Pasco counties. David Spears and the John Doe, who would later be identified as Charles Kershkadan. Those victims were also middle-aged white men traveling alone on central Florida highways who were murdered by a 22 caliber weapon. Then they found another victim

who fit the same profile in Volusia County, Rick Mallory. Like Mallory, some of the other victims also had their property stolen. Investigators noticed that in all the cases, the vehicles were found with the driver's seat pushed all the way forward. Victims all ranged in height from 5'10 to 6'5 so it was clear the last driver of their vehicle is somebody much shorter than 5'10, possibly a woman. This brought investigators back to the July 4th accident where two women were seen

getting out of the missing Peter Simms, that guy's car. Seat had been pushed forward all the way in that vehicle as well. Also a receipt was found under the front driver's seat from a truck stop off of I-75 in Wildwood, Florida. The clerk did not recognize Charles Humphreys, but when they showed her composite drawings of the two women from the July 4th car accident, she said, oh yeah, both of them were in that store

acting giddy that day. And that's what caught her attention and made them memorable, the way they were acting. By now ballistics confirmed that all the victims were shot with the same gun. Investigators felt that a 22 handgun being a smaller weapon with a little less kickback something a woman might prefer. Now all the county investigators are thinking the same thing. That they might be dealing with the very rare case of a female serial killer. Not poisoning people she knows, but shooting men she doesn't.

Two months later, switching things up, November 19th, the nude body of 61-year-old Walter Gino Antonio found on a logging road in Dixie County, Florida. Walter had been shot four times in the back of the head with a.22 caliber weapon. I just was saying, changed up in terms of of two months not one month. Not anything different about the murder. Walter was a trucker, part-time security guard, reserve police officer and he had been dead less than 24 hours when his body was found. Similar to the other cases his car was found five days later in Brevard County abandoned near a major roadway. The license plate had been removed and the

driver's seat once again pushed forward all the way up. It was cleared to investigators that Walter Antonio, another victim of the unknown serial killer who they're now calling the damsel of death. The multi-county task force now decides they need to release a composite sketch of the two female suspects for public safety reasons. A week later, Reuters publishes a story about the murders asking for the public's help in identifying these women. Florida papers also run the story. Captain Steve Binniger, commander of Marion County's criminal investigation division, reasoned that the killer had to be non-threatening in some way. You know, her victim's not afraid to have her get in the car with him.

Calls started pouring in immediately after the press release. Authorities got 400 leads roughly and four of those tips named the same two people, Tyra Moore and her girlfriend Lee. A man in Homasasa Springs said the women rented a trailer from him a year earlier. He listed their names as Tyra Moore and Lee. A woman in Tampa reported that they worked at her motel south of Ocala. She listed the names Tyra Moore and Susan Blahavec. An anonymous caller identified the women as Ty Moore and Lee Blachewich, various A-lises. They purchased an RV from him in home Assasa Springs. Also said that Lee Blachewich was a truck stop sex worker.

With these tips, the police in Port Orange, Volusia County were able to create a detailed account of Tyra and Lee's movements from late September to mid-December. They'd been staying at the Fairview Motel in the Harbor Oaks neighborhood of Port Orange. Port Orange is south of Daytona Beach. A Lee Blachowek had checked in using the additional alias of Cammie Marsh Green. That's fucked up. Remember Cammie Green? She was the woman who Tyra used to rent a room from. I don't even know if she paid rent. At least got to stay in a room in her house. When Tyra met Eileen, she was the woman who let Eileen crash at her place on the weekends and Eileen repaid her by stealing her identity. Eileen and Tyra had spent a short time living in an apartment behind a restaurant near the Fairview Motel, then returned

to the motel, checked out again early December. Then Lee Blahavec slash Cammie Green, but of course really Eileen Wuornos, returned alone, stayed in the motel until December 10th. The police now perform background checks on Tyra Moore and the aliases Susan and Lee Blachovec and Cammie Green. Tyra Moore had a run-in with law enforcement back in 1983 for breaking and entering but had the charges dropped. Lee Blachovec had once been arrested for trespassing, but the Cammie Green alias, no criminal record. The photo on Lee Blahavec's driver's license did not match the photo for Cammie Green. The Cammie Green alias turned out to be the most useful piece of evidence the police had.

Volusia County investigators checked pawn shops discovered that a Cammie Green had pawned a camera and radar detector in Daytona Beach. The missing items from Rick Mallory's vehicle. In Ormond Beach Cammie Green pawned a set of tools matching the description of missing items from Rick Mallory's vehicle. In Ormond Beach, Cammie Green pawned a set of tools matching the description of missing tools from victim David Spears' truck. At this time in Florida, pawn dealers were supposed to get thumb prints from people selling them items. There was no thumb print on the first pawn ticket but was one on the second. There were no hits when investigators ran the print through their identification system, so they had

to do a physical search of fingerprint records in Volusia County and within an hour doing physical a physical search they had a match. Impressive. The print matched a print from a woman named Lori Grody, yet another alias of Eileen's and Lori's print was the same print as Cammie Green and Lori had a weapons charge and an outstanding warrant for her. The bloody palm print found in Peter Simms' abandoned vehicle matched Lori Grody's print as well. And all this info was sent to the National Crime Information Center. And over the next few days, investigators got responses from Michigan, Colorado, elsewhere in Florida, learning that Lori Grody, Susan Blachowich, Cammie Green, all the same woman,

Eileen Carol Wernos. Michigan sent over a file on Eileen's background. Investigators learned about her horrible early life. Now that they had the woman's real name, they set about finding the real Cammie Green, a woman who still lived in Holly Hill, Florida. They spoke to Cammie, ruled her out as a suspect. Cammie told the police that it had been years since she was ever in a pawn shop, but she identified photos of Eileen Wernos and Tyra Moore, said her license had gone missing years earlier, right around as in exactly around the time Eileen moved out.

The search for Eileen Wuornos ramps up now in early January 1991. Officers hit the street in pairs trying to track her and or Tyra down. They decided to bring in Mike Joyner early in the search, a skilled undercover detective. Detective Joyner made a plan to hit all the bars in Daytona Beach since that was Eileen's preferred area. He figured he would run into her eventually and he was right. It took over a week of countless bar crawls but Mike did eventually find her January 8, 1991 at the Port Orange pub. Eileen looked just like her booking photo. A distinctive scar on her face confirmed it was really her. The investigation was

almost derailed when the Port Orange police entered the bar unexpectedly, took Eileen outside. In a panic, Mike Joyner called the command post at a nearby motel where authorities from six jurisdictions were present. It was determined that the arrest was not made because of a leak and these officers were just doing their jobs. Representatives of the Volusia County Sheriff's Office called the Port Orange Police Station told them not to arrest Eileen under any circumstances. So she was now allowed to go back into the bar. Hey sorry about that big misunderstanding. And in this bar, Joyner

and his undercover partner Dick Martin, a lot of Dicks, a lot of Dicks in this episode, began chatting her up. We got ricks, we got dicks. Detective Joyner offered to buy Eileen a beer. She accepted and then she accepted another beer, and another beer, and another beer. She was friendly at first, but as she drank more and more, things got weird. She eventually asked Mike if she could kick the bass in and get the Vegas pumping and he was confused. He tried to act like he knew what the fuck she was talking about he said what what and she was like to get

the party jumping and then he's like yeah yeah yeah okay but like what party and she said you know that she just goes crazy when she hears a cymbal he was like yeah but what else makes you crazy hoping that she would name some of the men she killed but instead she said hi-hat with souped up tempo not wanting to blow his cover he was was like, yeah, no Yeah, me too. And then she was like, you ever go to a 1a beachfront Avenue and he was like maybe yeah What's going on over there? And she told him girls are hot there. They're wearing like less than bikinis, right? Rockman lovers They're driving Lamborghinis. He's like cool cool cool

So he drove her there but the Avenue was fucking packed and the police were on the scene Luckily they passed he and Eileen Looked for some dope feets. So they're blowing his cover and he told Eileen that was close We almost got arrested and she wasn't even fazed. She just said if there's a problem, you know Yo, I'll solve it. Check out the hook when my DJ revolves it How long did it take you to realize I was quoting me to ice Well, what was the I don't know, the dead giveaway? Every day!

But he didn't have a clue! He was in his house Sorry, let's back up We're at the Port Orange Pub with undercover agent Mike I'm not sorry, I loved that Let's back up We're at the Port Orange Pub with undercover agent Mike Joyner and his partner Dick Martin Oh, fucking dick

Detective Joyner offered to buy Eileen a beer, she accepted Then she accepted another, another, another Friendly at first, right? Then she drank much Now we're back where I started earlier, get weird at one point joiner bent over Take a shot during the game of pool and I just hit him across the back hard. I guess with her pool stick Join her popped up yelled at her called her a fucking idiot As to why the hell she would hit him and she just replied honey. I don't know just comes over me So that kind of behavior will not look good when she

will later claim that she killed her victims in self-defense. Did she? Or did she just impulsively kill them out of some kind of PTSD rage reaction? Did she kill them because something quote just came over her? Eileen left the Port Orange Bar around 10 p.m. declined the undercover detective's offer for a ride home. The secret operation was almost ruined again when two Florida Department of Law Enforcement officers now pulled up behind Eileen as she walked down the street. They were following her with their lights off but then officers at the command post motel called the FDLE got them off of the street. Eileen arrived at her next destination a biker bar

called the last resort. Detective Joyner and Martin met up, drank with her there for a while more then left her just after midnight. She did not leave the bar. She ended up falling asleep on an old car seat in the bar. Man, what a crazy life. She's getting fucking hammered, playing pool and dive bars all the time, sleeping at the bar, 34 years old. And she's been living like that since she was around 14, 15 years old. Eileen Warnos was finally arrested at the last resort bar in Port Orange, Florida, January 9, 1991. Authorities planned on arresting her that night, but the bar was going to have a big

barbecue so they arrested her that afternoon. The surveillance team stayed out front while Detective Joyner went inside. He told Eileen he was going to go gas up his truck and the officers put a wire on him. Eileen told Joyner she had nowhere to live and no money. She kept buying her drinks to keep her talking all the while. He felt like Eileen was sizing him up, baiting him to be her next victim. At one point Eileen said, I'm so fucked up and so hurt. Joyner asked her why. Eileen said she was heartbroken that her girlfriend had left just two weeks earlier.

About this time Eileen suggested that she and Joyner should go out on the town together. She asked him to bring all his money with him, and she'd show him some fun places. Joyner now knew it was time to make the arrest. He was not willing to go out for a drive with her and hope she would incriminate herself because he knew that at any moment during the drive, she could impulsively shoot him. He excused himself to go to the bathroom and then told the team, piss on the fire and call on the dogs to hunt's over. He left, that's pretty cool actually.

He left the bar, called Eileen outside, and at that point she was arrested but not for murder. They didn't want to tip her off to the murder investigation quite yet. She was told she was being arrested on outstanding weapons warrant against her alias Lori Grody. Detective joined her pretending to be outraged, got combative with the officers in hopes of keeping Eileen's trust. They were putting the back of a car together so they could keep talking, but Eileen was on to him now. She said, honey, you're probably one

of these little undercover suckers. In the end, the undercover operation was unsuccessful in obtaining a confession from Eileen, the former poor student long ways from being dumb. She was definitely street smart. Mike Joyner told the task force that they needed to find Tyra Moore quickly and get her to talk about Eileen. While they looked for her, Eileen was told, you know, not told, excuse me, that she was suspected of murder and her arrest not announced to the media. Tyra Moore is found the very

next day, January 10th. She was living with her sister in Pittston, Pennsylvania. Two investigators from Citrus and Marion counties quickly flew out to nearby Scranton. It's just less than 10 miles away for an interview. Tyra was read her rights to rattle her and it did work. She couldn't, you know, it didn't take much to scare her and to throw Eileen under the bus she knew about the murders and she was afraid of going to prison. Quickly during that first interview she explained that she had known about the murder since December 1st 1989 Eileen had told her that she had killed a man the day before which would have been her first victim Rick Mallory

Tyra said quote I told her I didn't want to hear about it And then anytime she would come home after that and say certain things telling me about where she got something I'd say I don't want to hear about it Tyra said she had suspicions about other murders But the more she knew the more she would feel compelled to report Eileen and she didn't want to hear about it." Tyra said she had suspicions about other murders, but the more she knew the more she would feel compelled to report Eileen and she didn't want to do that. Tyra said, I was just scared. She always said she'd never hurt me, but then you can't believe her. So I don't know what she would have done.

Since Tyra was now so terrified to go into prison and she hadn't actually killed anyone herself, the prosecution decided, or prosecutor, decided to use a witness and work with the investigators instead of prosecuting her alongside Eileen. So she's gonna be the star witness now. Next day Tyra agreeing to be a state witness in exchange for immunity travels with detectives to Florida. The police wanted to use her to get a confession from Eileen to make their homicide cases against her just airtight. They put Tyra in a motel, had her contact Eileen in jail. She would tell Eileen that she was back in Florida to pick up her things

and the police were questioning her and her family. She said she was terrified that Eileen's murders were going to be pinned on her. The police hoped that Eileen would confess out of loyalty to her girlfriend. Eileen's defense would later argue that, quote, law officers improperly tricked her into confessing and in doing so violated her right to counsel. But the Florida Supreme Court would rule that Eileen freely waived her rights and confessed contrary to advice of counsel both before and during the first confession and later. The first call happened January 14th, 1991. At

this point Eileen still believes she was in jail on the outstanding warrant for weapons violation. When Tyra voiced her suspicions about the murders, Eileen said, I'm only here for that concealed weapons charge in 86 and a traffic ticket. And I tell you what man, I read the newspaper and I wasn't one of those little suspects. Eileen was aware the calls were being monitored so she tried to be indirect saying, I think somebody at work where you worked at said something that looked like us and it wasn't us see see. It's a case of mistaken identity. More calls continued over the next couple of days. Finally, Eileen told Tyra, I will not let you be involved in the picture. You're not the one. I am the one

who did everything. I did it all myself. Investigators still wanted her to confess more explicitly though. So the calls continued. Tyra insisted the police were after her. Eileen was starting to get suspicious. Said she thought their conversations were being listened to, but then she did become less careful over time despite that, and she eventually told Tyra, Something grabs a hold of me tightly, flows like a harpoon, daily and nightly, will it ever stop, yo? I don't know, turn off the lights and I'll glow. To the extreme I rock a mic like a vandal, light up a stage, wax a chomp like a candle, dance,

go rush to the speaker that booms, I'm killing your brain like a poisonous mushroom. Sorry, that was more vanilla ice. No, I will stop now. Right after this, actually. Ice, ice, ice. We'll kill it. Ice, ice, ice. We'll kill it.

Ice, ice, ice. You know you kind of like it. There's a reason that was a huge hit. Here's what Eileen really told Tyra now. Just go ahead and let them know what you need to know. What they want to know or anything and I will cover for you because you're innocent. I am NOT going to let you go to jail. Listen, if I have to confess I will. Within an hour of telling Tyra she would confess to keep her girlfriend from getting into trouble.

Eileen reached out and was ready to talk to investigators. And she would tell them everything. January 15th, 1991, Eileen is charged with the murder of Richard Mallory. Her first victim, officials said she would soon be charged with more. Further supporting the belief that she was a serial killer, the police found clothing, boots, watches, toolboxes, and suitcases belonging to multiple victims in a storage shed rented by Eileen. Eileen made her full three-hour confession the morning of January 16th, 1991. She spoke to investigators Larry Horsepa and Bruce Munster. She started off by making it clear Tyra was not involved at all and then she admitted to shooting seven men. Eileen didn't want her girlfriend to be quote messed up for something I did. I know I'm gonna miss her for the rest of my life. Eileen now claims she killed all of the victims in

self-defense saying I just wish I never would have done what I did. I still have to say to myself I still say that it was in self-defense because most of them either were gonna start to beat me or we're gonna screw me in the ass. They'd get rough with me so I'd fight him and I'd get away from them. As I'd get away from them I'd grab my gun and just start shooting. Eileen even gave directions for a dive team to recover the murder weapon, her 22 caliber pistol. She told the police she had sex with over 250,000 men. She'd had sex with that many. Had been raped nine times to the best of her memory and beaten more times than she could remember.

Over 250,000, over a quarter of a million. I think it's pretty obvious that number is highly exaggerated. Still, that's crazy that she even thought it was that high. Now, there's no way it was that high. She's only 34. If she would have started sleeping with different guys at the age of 14, she would have had to sleep with over 34 guys a day, every day, every single day to hit 250,000. Even if she worked 12 hours a day, every day, every single day to hit 250,000. Even if she worked 12 hours a day, every day, and she wasn't engaged in sex, you know, work every day, that would be almost three guys an hour, 12 hours a day, every day for 20 years. It's like she would have had to work at some like weird dick factory, like in Laverne and Shirley, like in the opening sequence, title sequence of Laverne and Shirley when they're on the assembly line.

With the bottles coming down the line. It's like that but just dicks. Just dudes in their dicks. Just a conveyor belt. Big factory warehouse. She's pushing a button, stop the belt when a guy and his dick get next to her and she has to blow them or fuck them until they come. Then she pushes the button, just sends them on down the line. And she would do that like four or five times an hour then take like a smoke break, you know, every two hours. You know, hour lunch clock out after just eight hours maybe put on some overtime when they have a fucking dick surplus and the lines are getting backed up I link can you please work late tonight so I'm

sorry to ask you again we just have so many dicks that's a crazy amount of dicks not even passed any moral judgments but how many dicks that is it's just mathematically incomprehensible that's but how many dicks that is, it's just mathematically incomprehensible. That's way too many dicks. She told investigators after being abused and used by men for most of her life, she decided that she was going to fight back. She was done being victimized and disrespected. She told them that each man she killed had assaulted, threatened, or raped her, and that she killed him out of fear for her safety. But then weakening her claims in the same interview, she also said, I don't understand why I did it. I just don't.

See, most of the times I was drunk as hell. And I was a professional hooker. She continued by saying they were bad because they were going to hurt me. This person was either going to physically beat me up, rape me, or kill me. And I don't know which one. And I just turned around and did my fair play before I would get hurt. She said she'd meet them at truck stops or while out hitchhiking. And that she would lure them off the road for sex. The Tampa Bay Times reported

that the police did not find proof Eileen had been sexually assaulted by her victims. Not sure how they would have found that proof though, but that's what was said. Also some of her friends apparently said Eileen thought she was quote raped if a client didn't pay her. And while not paying her definitely you know it's a dick move. It's not rape. Eileen was asked if she intended to kill each victim when she first encountered them. She said that was not the case. She said, quote, because I didn't know if they had a gun or anything. I once I got my gun, I was like, hey, hey, man, I got to shoot you because I think you're going to kill me. See, Eileen told the interviewers, I had a lot of guys, maybe 10 or 12 a day. I could kill

all of them, but I didn't want to. I'm really just a nice person. I'm describing a normal day to you here, but a killing day would be just about the same. On a normal day, we would just do it by the side of the road if they wanted oral sex or behind a building or maybe just off the road in the woods if they wanted it all. On a killing day, these guys always wanted to go away way back in the woods. Now I know why they did it. They were going to hurt me. When speaking about the murder of Charles Karskaden, the victim describes that rodeo worker. Eileen claimed that if she hadn't have killed him, he would have definitely killed someone else. She also admitted she shot Charles Humphrey seven times, quote, to put him out of his misery. At one point, she said, I figured if these guys lived and I got fried for attempted murder,

I thought, fuck it. I might as well get fried for murder instead. Obviously, statements like that do not bode well for her self-defense claims. A public defender advised Eileen to stop talking several times, eventually becoming so exasperated with her incriminating herself, he actually said, quote, do you realize these guys are cops? And Eileen replied, I know and they want to hang me and that's cool because maybe man I deserve it I just want to get this over with I actually love that that has to be the most honest statement any serial killer we have ever covered has said in their first big confession with investigators within two weeks of her arrest Eileen and her attorney sold movie rights to her story several

investigators involved in the case actually the same it's kind of weird to me Eileen believed she was going to be able rights to her story. Several investigators involved in the case actually did the same. It was kind of weird to me. Eileen believed she was going to be able to sell her story and make millions, but she didn't think about a Florida law that prevented killers from profiting off their stories at all. Still, Eileen felt famous because her face was all over the news and she continued confessing to investigators, even jail employees. Jay Watts, that 52-year year old used car salesman.

She had met at the top of the town lounge in Daytona, who she lived with for a while. The most stable romantic relationship with a man she had seemingly ever had. He would recall that Eileen once talked about Ma Barker, former suck subject actually. How she admired the mother of the leaders of the Barker Carpus gang who were gunned down by the FBI in 1935. She admired how Ma didn't seem to take shit from any man and how she was infamous for being a badass. So just like so many male serial killers,

it seems she wanted to be notorious. This is weird. A film producer named Jacqueline Garot, based in Studio City, California in the Hollywood area, would claim to be the first producer who would sign a film contract with Eileen. In December of 19, so messed up, she said in December of 1990, before Eileen was even arrested, Garou's mom supposedly ran into Eileen in a grocery store checkout line in Ocala. She recognized Eileen from a widely circulated composite drawing and instead of alerting anyone, oh my god there's a fucking serial killer right here, she just snuck over to Eileen, gave her her daughter's business card, and asked her to call her daughter.

Then later she reported the sighting to the police. That is so messed up if true. Oh my god! Hey, are you that murderer? The damsel of death? Oh, I'm a huge fan. Oh, my daughter would love to make your movie. Take her card.

I love your work. Good luck. She later said Eileen called her shortly after she was arrested. In exchange for a payment of just $60 a month for life, a guru obtained Eileen's permission to tell her story in a film titled Angel of Death. It doesn't seem that that film was ever made. If it was, it's hard to find it. In late January of 1991, now Eileen received a letter from 44-year-old Arlene Prowell.

Oh, Arlene's a character. Arlene saw Eileen's picture in the newspaper, said she felt God was calling her to write to the suspected killer. Oh, hell yeah. That sounds exactly like something God would do. God, is that you? Yes, Arlene, it is I, God. I would like you to help me help humanity. Yes, of course, Lord. Do you want me to raise money for starving children?

Or perhaps go to a third world country and volunteer my time to help drill for clean drinking water so your children there can stop literally shitting themselves to death from dysentery? Or perhaps go vaccinate third world babies against lethal infectious diseases we haven't had to worry about for years in the west like measles What? No. No, Eileen. I have something even better more helpful in mind I want you to befriend a serial killer with a name that sounds a lot like yours, Eileen. Oh, of course Lord Should I work with Eileen on a book that will then help others from following the same dark path and save an untold number of your children here on Earth Souls?

What? No. Stop overthinking this. Stop putting words in my mouth. I just want you to be like cool with her. That's all. I want you to adopt her. I want you to talk to her on the phone for a while. Okay? It's got out. Yeah. Arlene herself had been adopted and raised by wealthy parents in Long Island. And if I didn't say it, yeah, she's thinking about adopting Arlene. She and her husband Robert, a field engineer for Sony, were wealthy. They bred very expensive horses on a lavish 35 acre farm. Arlene had attempted suicide twice before becoming a born-again Christian in 1981 and when she saw Eileen's picture she stared into the woman's eyes and quote, God prompted her to do something. She said, me though. Part of the letter of her letter said, I don't care if you're guilty or innocent I

want to be your friend and she left her phone number and then Eileen called her on January 30th. From then on Arlene would visit Eileen once a week and talk to her almost every night. And that's very nice. Not sold to God was behind that, but that's nice of Arlene. Maybe. They didn't discuss her case, but Arlene told the LA Times in December of 1991, In my heart I know that Lee is not a serial killer. She has a heart of gold and she cares about other people more than herself. God has brought us together. Okay. Arlene showed the LA Times some of Eileen's drawings and poems. One poem was

titled Friendship. It goes like this, A friend is one who fights to the end to make things right. Our pact as a friend. Cheering you up never bringing you down and making sure your life is safe and sound. Uh, okay. So maybe, you know, maybe Eileen was a little better at murder than poetry, but maybe she had more practice at murder. Robert Prowl admitted that he was very troubled by his wife's obsession with Eileen. He worried about losing his job because of the publicity. Also troubled by the $4,000 worth of phone bills that she racked up speaking to Eileen. Arlene sounds a little extra. She sounds like a lot. On November 22nd, 1991, Arlene and her husband will legally adopt Eileen because God told Arlene to do that. God was very invested in Eileen

now. He wasn't invested enough to make sure that she hadn't been continually abused and abandoned and sexually exploited growing up. Not enough to say, you know, have her not be executed by the state of Florida for multiple murders, but enough to introduce her to an obviously mentally unstable pen pal who wants to adopt her, but not like get her a good defense attorney or anything. Arlene later said regarding her relationship with Eileen that her and her husband had been called many names and accused of trying to get a book and a movie deal, but really quote, we just want Lee to have a family who cares about her

and is not gonna hurt her. She has a heart of gold. You need it after all she's been through. She's given me so much. Lee's talked about going to Colorado when she gets out but this is it. I see her here with me. Okay. Arlene later described her relationship with Eileen Devanity Fair as quote a soul-binding. We're like Jonathan and David in the Bible, she said. It's as though part of me is trapped in jail with her. We always know what the other is feeling and thinking. No, you didn't.

Nuh-uh. Nope. I love my wife, but I would 100% divorce Lindsay if she told me that she has a soul bond. She's soul bound with the death of her inmate serial killer and she can hear that person's thoughts. Get the fuck out of here. Come on Arlene, just go enjoy your pretty horses. Arlene reads like the kind of person who gets continually scammed. What? No Robert! He's not taking advantage of me! Everyone needs help from time to time, even Nigerian princes! Throughout 1991,

Arlene appeared on talk shows and spoke to tabloids about Eileen's good heart. Also arranged numerous interviews between Eileen and reporters. For example, in an interview with the Orlando Sentinel, Eileen said, I'm not a man hater. I'm so used to being treated like dirt that I guess it's become a way of life. I'm a decent person. And you know what? I actually think that a lot of the time, Eileen probably was a decent person. A very damaged person, but a decent person. Someone who had been mistreated by so many men for so long. She becomes so mentally unwell She could maybe no longer tell the difference between I don't know a guy who wanted to pay her for sex and nothing more

And a guy who meant her harm or made her feel bad She would stay in one interview with the police before she died that she killed some of her victims because they'd ended up turning down Her offers for sex and she felt rejected. Eileen had been very unwell for a very long time before she was caught. If only she had met, if only she had met guardian angel Arlene earlier. Speaking of Arlene, she accused investigators who had book and movie deals of corruption told Eileen that her public defenders were trying to profit off her story. You've seen a little bit though that Arlene might not be the best person. Arlene's attorney did not want to go to trial, neither did she. They worked out a deal

with the prosecution where she would plead guilty to six murders even though she confessed to seven. No charges would be brought against her for the murder of Peter Abraham seems because his body would never be found. In this deal she would receive six consecutive life terms but one state attorney believed she should receive the death penalty, so the deal shut down and she ended up going to trial. In the court hearing now, Tyra Moore described how the police put her in a motel room, recorded ten phone conversations between her and Eileen. On the stand, she admitted that she had lied, cried, and begged Eileen to recount her crimes. Eileen's attorney, Tricia Jenkins, argued that prosecutors may have covered up evidence linking Tyra Moore

with the murders to ensure she would be a star witness for them. Brian Jarvis, former Marion County Sheriff's Deputy, argued that Tyra's involvement was ignored because investigators worked with her on a movie deal. However, a state attorney investigated found no wrongdoing on the part of three investigators who had a deal with public pictures. The Tampa Bay Times reported the movie agents approached lead detectives before Eileen was even arrested. Claims that Tyra was involved in the movie deal were never substantiated. Man, so much talk about movie deals. Never seen that before as one of these serial killers. I'm sure it had to do with the narrative of a sympathetic serial killer, right? The female sex worker fighting back after a lifetime of abuse,

much of it by the hands of Johns. That's a story a lot of people can get behind. You know, a lot more than a story about some sexual sadistic dude approaching women who want nothing from him. Women just out living their fucking lives who he abducts, rapes, tortures, and kills. Opening statements in Eileen's murder trial

began January 15th, 1992. For this trial, she was only being prosecuted for the murder of Rick Mallory, the guy who had previously been convicted of attempted rape in Maryland. And I do wonder if that guy tried to do something terrible to Eileen. I wonder if he at least verbally abused her, was real rough with her. I mean, he spent time in prison for attempted rape. He constantly fucked over employees. He was always hiring sex workers. That all makes him suspect to me.

I think there's a decent chance that someone who, you know, does that, you know, does mistreat women. I mean, clearly he mistreat at least one. You know, I bet he was mistreating these sex workers, but a lot of guys, you know, who use sex workers do not all, but some, my guess is the part of the reason that some guys frequently pay women to have sex with them is because, you know, uh, the women that they're not paying just don't want to do or won't do what they'd like, which is probably something they find degrading. Defense attorney Trisha Jenkins argued that Eileen had been abused by men her whole life and finally had had enough saying quote,

she defended herself. Eileen said that on the day she killed Rick, she was trying to get from Fort Myers to Daytona Beach, but had taken six rides and six sexual acts for her to get to Tampa. Jesus Christ. In the late afternoon, she was standing beneath an underpass in a rainstorm when Rick Mallory pulled up and offered her a ride. He was drinking, smoking some weed. She said that he and Eileen made it to a secluded place off I-95 at 5 a.m.

They started to have sex, but then Mallory stopped, got out of his car, and went to the trunk. Defense attorney Tricia Jenkins said, what happened next was bondage, rape, sodomy, and degradation. He told her, I've done this before. He wanted to see her in pain. She said that Eileen grabbed a revolver, warned him before she shot him. State attorney John Tanner, working for the prosecution, told the jury a different story. She said Eileen Wuernos was a predatory prostitute. She was a woman whose appetite and lust for control had taken a lethal turn. According to the prosecution Eileen became angry when she thought Richard wasn't going to pay her.

A struggle ensued. Eileen shot him with a.22 caliber pistol while he was still in the driver's seat based on evidence found in his vehicle. He crawled out of the vehicle and then she shot him at least four more times. The medical examiner who performed Richard's autopsy testified it took between 10 and 20 minutes for him to die. Tyra Moore, the prosecution star witness, testified on January 16th, 1992. Tyra said that Eileen came home drunk, December 1st, 1989. Confessed she shot and killed him in and hid his body in the woods under a rug. She added that she'd abandoned his car near Ormond Beach. She also said that Eileen had a box with his personal belongings in it and showed her a picture

of the victim. And that, and this was really damaging for Eileen's self-defense claims, she said Eileen expressed no remorse and did not say she was raped at that time. January 17th, a judge ruled the jury could view Eileen's video confession. The judge allowed evidence from six other murder cases as well involving Eileen because of the Williams Rule, a Florida law that allows evidence related to collateral crimes to be admitted if it helps to show motive, intent, knowledge, modus operandi, or lack of mistake. I like that law. I like that actually. Established that Eileen had very likely killed six other men in a similar fashion and all in a year's time

That definitely did not help Eileen self-defense claim on January 22nd a truck driver named Bobby Lee Copas Testified for the prosecution about a frightening encounter with Eileen He'd stopped at a truck stop in Haynes City, Florida between Orlando and Tampa November 5th 1990 There another trucker asked him to give Eileen a ride while on on the road to Orlando, Bobby Lee said Eileen propositioned him three times. He said he refused each time and then he saw what he thought was a small pistol in her purse, which frightened him. He then tricked her into getting out of his vehicle by pulling into another truck stop and giving her five bucks to call her sister in Daytona Beach. He said that when Eileen realized what he did she she screamed she would kill him just like, quote, the other old fat sons of bitches. That testimony again, not making her claims of self-defense look

good at all. The jury then listened to Eileen's previously recorded confession on January 23rd. The court heard her say stuff like, I took a life. I'm willing to give up my life because I killed people. I deserve to die. Eileen said about shooting Rick Mallory. I didn't give him a chance to say nothing. I mean, he was coming after me and I just shot him. She said about murdering Charles Humphreys. I felt sorry for him because he was gurgling. I shot him in the head to get him out of his misery. Eileen got on the stand against her attorney's advice the following day, January 24, 1992. She was the only defense witness. Eileen testified that Rick Mallory had

raped her, tortured her, kept her in the car for long periods of time. When asked why she didn't mention this in her January 1991 confession, she said she was interrupted too many times by investigators, also claimed she could not remember details at that time of her initial confession, which she only gave to clear Tyra's name. And again, that doesn't look good. Jury's going to have a hard time accepting her claim that she either forgot that Rick had violently raped her and held her hostage before she killed him or that she just didn't mention it because, you know, she kept getting interrupted. I, uh, yeah, that's, that's, that's hard to accept.

Eileen now testify that Rick Mallory tied her to the steering wheel and raped her. She said she escaped, but then she shot him in self-defense. She continues to not help her case. Eileen told the jury, I'm the innocent victim, not him. Rick allegedly told Eileen, if you don't do what I say, I'm gonna kill you right now.

It doesn't matter to me because your body will still be warm. She claims he poured alcohol and eye wash over her lower back and hips before raping her and that she thought he was going to kill her when he tied a rope around her neck. She said that he that she, excuse me, spit in his face and he said, do you want to die slut? You're dead bitch, you're dead now. Eileen testified, I decided right then, no, I wasn't going to die. So when he started toward me, I finally jerked my hand loose, grabbed my gun from the bag, whipped it

out in front of me and I shot him Then I shot him again She said that after she got her hand loose and after she grabbed her gun and shot him Rick got out of the car But did not flee she said she warned him not to come near her, but he kept moving towards her So that's when she shot him again. So he would stop moving towards her Eileen also now claimed that Tyra Moore quote knows a lot more than's saying. She's lying to keep herself from being charged as an accessory after the fact and murder. Eileen additionally blamed Tyra Moore for pressuring her to do the sex work.

She testified that Tyra, quote, was my pimp, and I was her white slave. She wanted money and clothes and a place to live. According to Eileen, Tyra, quote, would tell me to go on out there and work. And if I didn't, she'd break up with me and find another girl that would definitely take care of her. I did it because I loved her to the max. I

loved her very deeply. On cross-examination Eileen became enraged when prosecutor John Tanner brought up a shit-ton of inconsistencies between her testimony and prior statements. Made it look like she was constantly lying. She invoked her Fifth Amendment right 25 times during the cross-examination. Then on January 27th, 1992, Eileen Wuernos was not surprisingly convicted of first-degree murder for the death of Rick Mallory. The jury deliberated for only two hours. Eileen was furious at the verdict. She shouted at the jury as she was led out of the courtroom,

I'm innocent! I was raped! I hope you get raped! Scumbags of America! Back with the movie talk for a second. Showbiz! That's how you do it in Florida! In the middle of the trial, several investigators hired a lawyer to represent them for film rights to their story. Marion County Sheriff's Captain Steve Binniger said, as quoted by the Tampa Bay Times, "...we were proud of what we did and if there was going to be a movie or a book, we wanted the story told properly. We never intended to make any money off of it.

Any profits would have gone to a victim's fund." Okay, now the penalty phase, which would determine whether Eileen received a death penalty or life in prison, began January 28, 1992. The defense described Eileen's abuse of childhood, told the jury how she was raped, became pregnant as a teenager. Three defense psychologists concluded that Eileen was suffering from borderline personality disorder at the time of the murders, or this murder, which resulted in extreme mental or emotional disturbances, her ability to conform her conduct to the law was impaired, and she also exhibited evidence of brain damage. One expert testified that Eileen's inconsistent statements should not be considered

lying because of her mental illness. That's ridiculous. I mean, I can understand arguing that she has trouble remembering past incidents correctly or consistently because of mental illness, but, you know, lying is lying. It's just saying something's not true. It's making an intentionally false statement. Doesn't matter why you intentionally made the false statement. I mean, I guess he's saying that, you know, that she wasn't intentionally making false statements, her brain just isn't working right. I don't know. That's such a stretch to me. Another expert said Mrs. or Ms. excuse me, Wernos, is probably one of the most primitive people I've

seen outside of an institution. January 29th, 1992, Eileen's brother Uncle Barry Wernos testifies that his dad Larry, in his recollection, was not abusive nor an alcoholic. Get the fuck out here. Everybody else said he was an alcoholic. What are you talking about? Barry said we were a pretty straight normal family. Very little trouble in the family. Shut up Stockholm syndrome. He explained that Eileen began to act out around the age of 10 or 11 and then he left the house to join the military. Echoing earlier testimony of the psychologist in closing arguments, defense attorney Tricia Jenkins called Eileen a damaged primitive child, asked

the jury to spare her life. Jenkins explained that Eileen was suffering from an extreme mental and emotional disturbance when she killed Rick Mallory. Quoted her mind and her perception she thought she was in danger. So it sounds like her own defense attorney did not believe Eileen's story about Rick. But also like most people you know felt a lot of sympathy for her. Jury not swayed by the defense's testimony and on January 31st, 1992, the jury recommends the death penalty. Eileen bowed her head and cried once she heard the verdict. Eileen then told the judge before her official sentencing, quote, law enforcement has labeled me a serial killer

purposefully for books and movies. I'm no serial killer. She claimed that she was, quote, coerced into making a confession. I had no intention of killing anyone. I would not do that. I told you I was raped. And that's what happened. These people had a violent attack on me. And I did what I had to do to protect myself. As deputies put Eileen in a transport vehicle, she shouted at the crowd of onlookers, bust these crooked cops and their conspiracy, please. I'm innocent. of onlookers. Bust these crooked cops and their conspiracy please. I'm innocent." March 31, 1992. Now, Eileen pleaded no contest to the murders of Dick Humphries, Troy Burris, and David Spears. She told the court, I wanted to confess to you that Richard Mallory did violently rape me as I've told you, but these

others did not. They only began to start to. She ended her speech by turning to the Assistant State Attorney, Rick Ridgeway, and telling him just about the most inflammatory thing she could. She said, I hope your wife and children get raped in the ass. And then in a wild coincidence, Rick Ridgway's wife and kids were all ass raped very next day. All of them in separate incidents. Arlene set it up. She was God's right hand of vengeance now. All of them in separate incidents. Arlene set it up. She was God's right hand of vengeance now. Obviously joking.

No, May 15th, 1992, Arlene receives three more death sentences. She also flips off the judge, calls him a motherfucker. I do like how spicy she is in moments. June 22nd, 1992, Arlene pleads no contest to the murder of Charles Kershkaden saying, I'm guilty. I killed him. No outbursts in the court for that one. I was gonna help him for more calls for ass rape, but she just wasn't feeling that spicy that day.

November 3rd, 1992, Eileen pled guilty to the murder of Walter Gino Antonio, telling the judge it was pointless to fight the charge because she would never get a fair trial. But then she asked her attorney to change her plea in the Charles Kershkaden case. She wanted to go to trial one more time. But then on January 25th, 1993, Eileen waived her right to a jury sentencing,

saying she was tired of people making money off her and she was ready to die now. She said, you're trying to kill me before you kill me. I just want to go back now. I'm ready to die. And she told the judge, if I get out, I'll kill again. February 4th 1993 now Eileen's sentenced to death plus 17 years for the murder and robbery of Walter Gino Antonio her fifth death sentence. She said I accept responsibility I'm sorry that it happened even though it was self-defense. She read Bible passages and had a

message for the victim saying I do hope they will find the Lord and repent they are facing their own death penalty in hell. Jesus there's something darkly funny to me about Eileen saying that she hopes that her murder victims can find the Lord and repent and saying that they're in hell. Eileen must be teaching Eileen some pretty unorthodox Bible lessons. I didn't realize you could ask for forgiveness from hell. I mean, why bother? Was ever trying to follow any biblical rules, you know, when you can just go to hell and then be like, hey man, I want out. Sorry about that. And then just get like beamed up.

February 5th, 1993, Eileen received her sixth death sentence now for the murder of Charles Kershkattin. When the judge entered the courtroom, Eileen said, I'm pissed off about the transfer here. I want a lawsuit on Pasco County. I've been mistreated physically, mentally and emotionally. I want a grievance put in Tallahassee on these people." Eileen then hurled insults and profanity in court until the judge threatened to have her gagged and bound to her chair. When she was allowed to speak again she said,

I can't believe that I'm the only female about to face her six death sentence. Ted Bundy killed 30 to 100 people and he only got a death sentence every other time. I've been mistreated. You order them to mistreat me because I've waived my trial. I waived the jury. I didn't give you a limelight. And you know what? I'm gonna have to agree with her on this one. I have been thinking while working on this episode, she's not giving anyone a limelight. That's gonna come back and bite her in the ass. You know that's court 101. You gots to give people a limelight or at least a fleshlight or at least not

wish ass rapes on the children of court officials. Okay, Eileen's murder trials are now all over but her time in court not quite done in Florida the state constitution requires an automatic direct appeal to be taken to the state Supreme Court on behalf of the defendant in execution cases. The direct appeal cannot be waived and the defendant must be provided legal representation. Back in November of 1992, Dateline reporter Michelle Gillen discovered that Richard Mallory had been convicted of a violent attempted rape in Maryland. Detectives previously denied that there was any evidence to corroborate Eileen's self-defense claims. However, a judge refused

to allow this in post-trial proceedings. Eileen also now found out that her pious adoptive mother Arlene was being paid for her interviews. Sometimes up to $10,000 in appearance. So like when she was lining up interviews for Eileen to go on these shows, this lady was getting paid 10 grand for some of those interviews. So what an asshole. And that makes me genuinely feel bad for Eileen again. Another person taking advantage of her. Also Eileen's trial attorney person taking advantage of her. Also, Eileen's trial attorney Trisha Jenkins accused attorney Steve Glazer of mishandling Eileen's subsequent cases and appeals. Jenkins testified that Glazer never picked up the discovery files from her. Instead, he filed a notice that he was taking over the case and a motion to change Eileen's plea to no contest the same day. According to Jenkins, quote, he told me he was taking the

case because he needed the media exposure. Eventually Eileen began to suspect that Arlene was only talking to her for publicity and money. Eileen claimed in one interview that Arlene and her attorney Stephen Glazer were telling her ways to kill herself in prison and advised her to make a no-contest plea because Glazer too inexperienced to handle a multiple murder trial. I hope all that's not true. That is a pretty dark. October 7th, 1994, the Florida Supreme Court upheld four of Eileen's convictions and death sentences.

She had two other appeals pending. The court rejected Eileen's contention that her no-contest pleas were involuntary. Eileen pleaded no-contest so she could avoid a trial. Her attorney argued that she should have been told she could be tried without being present. Supreme Court justices ruled that there is no provision in state law, requiring the court to notify the defendant of that. It's the duty of their trial lawyer. The court also dismissed Eileen's arguments that her statements were so incoherent that the judge should have ordered a mental competency exam.

Okay, in April of 2002, after spending a decade on death row, the Florida Supreme Court allows Eileen to fire her attorneys now. The decision was based in part on a letter she wrote to the court that said, I am one who seriously hates human life and would kill again. Eileen said after she fired her attorneys, there's no chance in keeping me alive or anything because I'd kill again. I have hate crawling through my system. Eileen's court-appointed attorney tried to stop her, arguing that the comment she made

suggested Eileen was profoundly disconnected from reality, but it didn't matter. Florida Governor Jeb Bush signs Eileen's death warrant September 5, 2002, but does grant a stay of execution on September 30, pending the findings of a psychiatric evaluation. A panel of three psychiatrists then reported to the governor that she understood she was facing the death penalty and what its application meant. And the death penalty is reinstated October 2nd. Eileen gives her final media interview the day before she's executed October 8th, 1993 with British producer Nick Broomfield, who produced a documentary about her titled

Eileen Werneros, selling of a serial killer. The doc essentially highlights the exploitation of Wuornos by those around her including Arlene fucking fancy horse lady douchebag. Interview lasted just 35 minutes. Eileen insisted she was being framed. The prison guards were bugging her cell using sonic waves to control all sorts of crazy shit. Broomfield said quote, my conclusion from the interview is today we are executing someone who is mad. Here is someone who has totally lost her mind. Let's listen to a bit of this last interview to when Nick is trying for the last time to get her to say why she really killed the men that she killed.

Nonetheless, you killed seven men. Yes, you did. And I'm asking you what got you to kill the seven men. And I'm telling you because the cops let me keep killing them, Nick. Don't you get it? Not everybody is killing seven people. So there must have been something in you

that was getting you to do that. Oh, you are lost, Nick. So explain. I was a hitchhiking hooker. Right. Running into trouble. I shoot the guy if I ran into trouble. Physical trouble, the cops knew it.

When the physical trouble came along, let her clean the streets, and then we'll pull her in. That's why. But how come there was so much physical trouble? Because it was all in one year. Seven people in one year. Oh, well. Oh, well.

But why not say no? Because I'm out of retaliation for taking my life like this and getting rich off it all these years in total pathological lying. Thanks a lot. I lost my fucking life because of it. Couldn't even get a fair trial. Couldn't even get a fair investigation or nothing. Couldn't even have my appeals right.

You sabotaged my ass society and the cops and the system, a raped woman got executed. It was used for books and movies and shit, bladder climbs, reelection, everything else. I got a big finger on all your faces. Thanks a lot. You're inhuman, you're an inhumane bunch of fucking living bastards and bitches and you're going to get your asses nuked in the end and pretty soon it's coming. 2019 Iraq supposed to hit you anyhow. You're all going to get nuked. You don't take fucking human life like this and just sabotage and rip it apart like Jesus on the cross and say thanks a lot for all the fucking money I made off of you. And I care about a

human being and the truth being told. Now I know what Jesus was going through. They've been trying to tell the truth and I keep getting stepped on. Concerned about if I was raped, if I, I'm not giving you book and movie info. I'm giving you info for investigations and stuff and that's it.

We're gonna have to cut this interview, Nick. I'm not going to go into any more detail. That's it. She just gets up and yeah, walks off after that. And then the next day she is executed. Whether she, whether what she believes is true or not. And I do feel bad for her, right? She did bring so much trouble on herself, but also, God, she was just raised to think

that she was fucking nothing. No one cares about people when they're children, you know, this is how they can look as adults, right? October 8, 2002, the Florida Supreme Court unanimously rejects the request from an Ohio group to challenge the execution on the grounds that Eileen is mentally incompetent and borderline psychotic. Eileen Wuernos is executed by lethal injection October 9th, the day after this interview, 2002.

She was 46 years old. Eileen declined a final meal, asked for a cup of coffee instead. Her final words were, I'd just like to say I'm sailing with the rock and I'll be back. Just like Independence Day with Jesus, June 6th, like the movie, big mothership and all, I'll be back. And with that, we are out of this timeline. Good job, soldier. You've made it back. Barely. Eileen Wuernos, The Damsel of Death.

Yeah, again, I truly feel bad for her. She learned early that the best way to get attention from men was letting them have their way with her. I didn't share this in the timeline, but when she was around 12 or 13, I don't know, 11, 13, I think she thought in there, there were these two boys that she really liked from the neighborhood. You know, boys she liked at different times as opposed to liking them both at once. Boys that she wanted, you know, to be her boyfriends. Boys who would dote on her. Take her out on dates. You know go to the movies.

Hold her hand not be embarrassed by her. Boys who would pass her notes at school. Dance with her in front of all those other students at the school dances. You know like really like love her. Respect her. Both these boys acted like they did like her, told her what she wanted to hear when it was just them in private. They slept with her and then both made fun of her for being a quote whore along with other kids from the neighborhood. One saying he was just joking around when he did this years later literally pissed on her when a bunch of them were hanging out in the woods. Right? She was that kid. The girl the boys would pretend to like in private,

boys who wanted to lose their virginity or put another notch on their belt, and she would think that they cared about her, and then they would just mock and degrade her, just like the rest. Just like her own brother, who both had sex with her and also mocked her for being promiscuous.

Think about how that made her feel, right? About herself, about others, and the other male family member in her house growing up, her fucking grandpa, a mean drunk who very likely molested her. Another male figure, some dirtbag described as an older man in the neighborhood who let kids come to his house and party. That guy fucking raped her. She's 14, got her pregnant. Her family didn't do shit about it. Put all the blame on her when she was so young, such a cowardly thing to do. She blame on her when she was so young. Such a cowardly thing to do. She had the baby when she was barely 15. Her dad was an abusive rapist. A man she never met. Her mom, not much of a mom. For most of her childhood

she thought her mom was her sister. Her only blood sibling died when she was 20. Her grandpa, her main father figure, killed himself when she was 20. Her grandma, her main maternal figure, a neglectful alcoholic who drank herself to death by the time Eileen was 15. Her only consistent relation, you know, was Laurie as far as someone she had a consistent relationship with, her sister but really her aunt. A woman who said she would be humiliated if Eileen ever brought her girlfriend, her one true love Tyra around. She was living on her own by the age of 15, at 15 pulling

tricks at truck stops behind biker bars. You think most of those guys, most of those John's treated her with kindness, with respect, with dignity. How rough were they? How degrading. Did she have family trying to get her into counseling, looking out for her, people telling her to get her you know shit together, or just people telling her to stop being such a whore. Did she do a lot of fucked up stuff as an adult? Did she steal, manipulate, take advantage of people too, also kill people? Yes, she sure did.

But holy shit. Did so many people early in her life set her up to head down that path? Have I been much harder on male serial killers? Yep, I have. Does that make me sexist? Yeah, it might. Maybe I'm not holding her to the same standard. But also, male serial killers, almost all of them that we have covered, they hunted down their victims.

But Eileen's victims, didn't they in a way hunt her down? I mean, maybe some of them were just picking her up to give her a ride. That could have happened. I doubt it, but it could have. Maybe they picked her up, you know, probably maybe they picked her up because they wanted to fuck her. And maybe they insulted her. Maybe she, you know, said that she wanted 50 bucks from them, and then they laughed and said she'd be lucky to get 10. Maybe they did try and rape her. Maybe they paid for one thing, but then tried to sneak another or force another on her thinking like, ah, why not? Who cares? She's just a whore. I mean, there are plenty of those men out there. The stats on date rape and rape in general are sickening and misogyny is rampant.

I do find it odd that even though she only killed men in the final year of her free life, she also was doing sex work that a whole year and not killing the vast majority of her victims. So why did she kill the men that she did kill? What was different about them? Did at least some of them have it coming in some way? I mean it's hard right? It's not like these guys were home with their families and she snuck in through their windows and slit their throats while they were sleeping. No, several of them were married guys picking up a sex worker. I mean what kind of guys were they? Based on the evidence at trial, her wildly inconsistent testimony and evidence found at the vehicles, it does seem that at the

very least most these guys probably were not trying to kill her. You know, not all of them, maybe not, maybe none of them. You know, based on evidence I don't think most of them were trying to rape her. I do think it was the right call to execute her, to find her guilty. I do think was the right call to execute her mostly because I think that she would find spending the rest of her life in prison to have been worse than being executed. I think she would have gotten just crazier and angrier than she was at the end. If she wouldn't have been executed she definitely shouldn't have been allowed to walk free again. I mean she even said herself multiple times

that she would kill again. She was just so broken by the end and like not damaged like broke broke. I mean we're resilient creatures but we all have our limits and life pushed Eileen past hers It does make me think that African proverb again, right? The child who is not embraced by the village will burn it down to feel its warmth That last year her life my her free life. She sure certainly did that She started to burn shit down and can you really blame her? time for today's takeaways. Time shock top 5 takeaways. Number one, Eileen Wuernos is often called America's first female

serial killer. That is not true, but she was the first female serial killer to kill much like a male serial killer traditionally does that I know of. She confessed to murdering seven men who picked her up off highways in central Florida. She shot him each multiple times and robbed them of their valuables. Number two, all the victims were middle-aged white men traveling alone along Florida highways. They picked up Eileen who was off and out hitchhiking because they were either offering help or looking for sex. We'll never truly know what each man was looking for except for the rapist Rick Mallory. He was definitely looking for cheap sex. Glad that that rapist is dead. Mm-hmm. Ding. Yippee! Number three, during her confession and at trial, Eileen argued

self-defense claiming the victims had threatened her or raped her and that she shot them out of fear for her life. But the evidence in her own testimony did not often support that claim. Number four, after 10 years on death row, Eileen Wuornos was executed October 9th, 2002 making her one of the few women executed in the US in the 21st century and securing her place as one of the country's most infamous modern serial killers. Certainly the most infamous female one. And number five new info Monster. That was the name of the 2003 biographical crime drama film based on the murders of Eileen Wuornos. I saw it in the theater when it came out it was

yeah it was incredible it's great movie. Charlize Theron I always want to say Theron. Theron transformed herself into Eileen. Christina Richie played Tyra Moore. Against only a $1.5 million budget, it grossed over $64 million at the box office alone. And legendary film critic, Roger Ebert, called Theron's portrayal, quote, one of the greatest performances

in the history of the cinema. She won the Academy Award for Best Actress, the Golden Globe for Best Actress in a Drama, the SAG Award for Outstanding Lead Actress, the Critics Choice Movie Award for Best Actress, and several other awards. Highly recommended. If you want to dive more into her story, it's a dramatized version of course based on real events that you know takes creative liberties but an outstanding movie. Time Suck Top 5 Takeaways

Serial killer Eileen Werneros damsel of death has been sucked. Thank you again to the Bad Magic Productions team for helping making time suck. Starting with queen of bad magic Lindsay Cummins who gives me the time to make it doing so many other things so I can focus on this. Thanks also to Logan Keith helping to publish this episode designing merch for the store at BadMagicProductions.com. Got our holiday stuff in there now. Thank you to Olivia Lee again this week for her initial research. And thank you to the all CNI's continuing to moderate the Cult of the Curious private Facebook page. Let's calm down a bit now.

Mod Squad, making sure Discord keeps running smooth and everyone over on the Time Suck server and Bad Medic server. And seriously though, our all-seeing eyes and the folks at the Mod Squad at Discord. Just fantastic. Thank you guys so much. And now time for this week's updates. Updates.

Get your Time Sucker updates. Let us start off with an update to an update. Oh silly sack Harvey B. Sent a message with the subject line of Doctor's Orders Update with a none. He had written it before because his doctor who listens told him to. And now he writes, So I just thought I would provide an update on doctor's orders. First of all, thank you for reading my first update. Silly me, I forgot to add my name as my wife pointed out. LOL, my name is Harvey B.

And boy do I have an update for you and the team. I was listening to episode 425, Ireland's True House is a Horror, in which you read my Time Sucker update. I was ecstatic along with my buddy Eddie and Johnny that you read my update and we were on cloud 9 so I stopped to get gas the local gas station I'm giddy as a schoolgirl going back to rewind the episode listen to the update as I was in disbelief that you read it on air well I did not realize how loud I had the car stereo and it gets to the point where

you say oh yeah and for those of you who didn't listen to that episode there's a lot of context to this but the quote is is, I wish I could beat a nun to death with a baseball bat. I look around and to my horror, there is a Catholic nun also getting gas. I mouth no fucking way. She looked at me in disgust, actually did the sign of the cross, got in her car and drove away. I hope it wasn't Mother of Flanagan, but nonetheless, I grew up Catholic, so I know my Catholic school teacher mother had a disturbance or felt a disturbance in the force.

Needless to say, I got Cummins Laud once again. If you read this on air, please give a shout out to my wife, Stephanie, who again pointed out in my moment of glory, I forgot to add my name to the last update, HeavySci. Love all that the team is doing and thank you again. Well thank you Harvey B. Yeah, that must have been intense. That nun's probably still looking out for you. Probably a bit twitchy. Glad you remembered your name this time around.

And yeah, thank you again for sending that in. And now stoner sack, Corey Lilly, has an update based on an episode from long ago that really cracked me up. He wrote it with the subject line of, update Harry Truman didn't die at Mount St. Helens. Good morning, Bad Magic Crew. I'm sorry to do the clickbaity thing that YouTubers and influencers do to grab your attention,

but I recently re-listened to the Mount St. Helens Suck and I had to write in. First and foremost, you need to know something about me. I'm a bit of an idiot. This email will reflect that here shortly. Second thing you need to know something about my dad. He's very smart. A sniper's dream big head smart. That's a fucking awesome description. Patient, and above all else, knows that I'm a bit of an idiot. Now get the gang together because it's a doozy. So I listened to this episode right when it came out and was laser focused on the information

being relayed. The politics, the science, the controversy, the tragic aftermath of the eruption. One thing I totally missed that was central to this entire story was that Harry Truman that perished in this pyroclastic flow was not the Harry S. Truman, the 33rd president who died eight years prior to the eruption from pneumonia, but Harry R. Truman of no relation. Fast forward to last April, I'm hanging out at my dad's, watching some TV.

I can't remember what we were watching, but Harry S. Truman, the president was referenced. Without hesitation, no prompting, with no less than 100% conviction, and without even turning my head towards my dad, I confidently surrendered. Ain't it crazy that Harry Truman died in the Mount St. Helens eruption? After those words were said. So obviously there's a lot to unpack here so I haven't listened to that episode since. And you don't have to check, you don't even have to make... Obviously there's a lot to unpack here, so I haven't listened to that episode since. And you don't have to check, you don't even have to make... You didn't even...

Oh, so I have... I have, excuse me, listened to that episode since. And you don't have to check. You didn't even make that misdirect. Or even the connection would have been epic, but whatever. I just fucking listened to the name Harry Truman and immediately was like, yep, there is a president in the Pacific Northwest, even though I specifically know he's from Independence, Missouri.

There was a long pause and then an exasperated sigh. I look over, literally see my dad go through all the stages of grief before my very eyes. Then he asked me to leave before I gave him a stroke or gave him what I got, quote, a case of stupids. By the way, I'm 33, a dude, and looking for some oceanfront property in Arizona. The worst part of it all is that it was my own undoing. I can't even blame this on you, you sick son of a bitch, but thought you would enjoy it all the same.

Love you guys very much, a bad magic, hail Nimrod, praise Triple M, good boy Bojangles, and perverted dreams, Lusifena. Cory, you can use my name in the podcast if you want to share. P.S. I hope all this made sense. It's my day off and I'm a few bong rips in. Well, Cory, you did it. The bong rips didn't even fucking touch you. I like that you carried that around for a while.

That a former president and kind of like a you know, a well-known former president got blown up in a volcano. And for some reason that's not trivia that most people know. Also, I love your dad. Sounds hilarious. And now one more. One more. Oh, I love this one from Cassette Parker. Subject line of thank you. And Cassette. Yeah. Yeah. I don't know why I pause there. You threw me. Your name threw me Cassette. Cause then I thought like, wait, tape cassette? Yeah. Cassette wrote, Dan, you son of a bitch, you did it again. Maybe it's your comedic timing. Maybe it's Kismet. But you picked me up when I was feeling pretty down after the election.

Firstly, biographical episodes have always been my favorites. Then you mentioned at the end of the episode how your support of the LGBTQIA plus community lost you roughly 20% of your subscribers and it brought me to tears. Not just because you're supporting that community, my community ended up costing you, but because there are still that many people who dislike us so much that they're willing to give up great content to try and make a point. I mean, I don't like butt stuff, but I don't know why that would lead me to hating gay men. Finally, you ended on a brand new 1-800 business tune that brought me back up. The original is still my ringtone.

You toy with my heartstrings in the best of ways, thank you. There are a number of reasons why I am alarmed at the election results, but I guess it comes down what it comes down to is Or no, but I guess if it comes down to it, I've got guns and MREs same as most Americans I love you as much as a lesbian can love a straight man suck my dick, please cassette P.s for the homos. Can we drop all the damn letters and just call ourselves queer? We can even take the QAnon logo. Easy peasy. Ah, well Cassette, the Suck My Dick line fucking killed me. Yeah, happy to support.

Don't do it for money. Do it for my conscience. Just feels like the right thing, obviously, to do. And I feel very lucky to have held it 80%. Truly. I also am sorry that so many people don't just see that you're no different from them other than that, you know, you're a lady who likes well what I like boobs I mean, honestly, how are all women not lesbians boobs are so fucking great as our vaginas and everything else. It's magical I hope you're having a good week

You funny fucker and for the love of God meet sex don't get your fucking panties twisted about me showing love for cassette and think That equates to shitting on your beliefs if you're different. Aren't we all just getting tired of that? The binary bullshit, the divisive, polarizing bullshit. If you like A, you must hate B. That's not how fucking life works, right? Only simple simons think that. I hope so many members of our nation can stop acting like brats on a playground one of these days. I have a lot of friends who lean right. I love them. I have a lot of friends who lean left. I love them. And I'm gonna suck Cassette's lady dick next time I see her. She's gonna lady cum all over my fucking face and it's gonna be great. And if that bothers you, go fuck yourself. Sounds like your uptight ass needs to get laid.

Hail, Lusifena. Hail, Lucifina. Thanks, Time Suckers. I needed that. We all did. Well, thank you for listening to another Bad Magic Productions podcast. Scare to Death and Time Suck each week short sucks Nightmare Fuel on the Time Suck and Scare to Death podcast feeds some weeks. And actually, speaking of Nightmare Fuel, sorry to those of you if I haven't gotten back on Patreon comments recently. I uh, some of the Nightmare Fuel's have just uh, they've taken some time. Be nice to the ladies this week. Be nice to them every week. Especially sex workers. Don't degrade them. Don't treat them as less than.

I mean, actually, I mean especially like they're doing something very nice. Very nice. Why would you punish someone when they're just trying to keep on sucking? I don't know about you, but I am I am very happy that Bob and his bonsai I don't know about you, but I am very happy that Bob and his bonsai bullshit did not show up in today's episode. Glad to not hear from this week. It's probably starting to get super annoying for you, you know? And I don't like to end the show on something annoying. Fucking ever. I'll solve it, check out the hook while D.J. revolves it Ice, ice, baby

Ville girl, ice, ice, baby Ville girl, ice, ice, baby Ville girl, ice, ice, baby Ville girl, ice