Timesuck with Dan Cummins - 478 - The Hog Trail Killer

Episode Date: October 27, 2025

In the mid-1990s, the quiet backwoods of southwest Florida became the hunting grounds of a sadistic killer the media would dub “The Hog Trail Killer.” What began as a routine hog hunt quickly spiraled into one of the most gruesome investigations in Florida history - a string of bodies found in the woods, all bound, mutilated, and left to rot. This week, we look at Daniel Owen Conahan Jr., the man accused of turning Charlotte County’s wilderness into his personal killing field, and explore the chilling possibility that he’s connected to even more victims — the mysterious Fort Myers Eight.Merch and more: www.badmagicproductions.com Timesuck Discord! https://discord.gg/tqzH89vWant to join the Cult of the Curious PrivateFacebook Group? Go directly to Facebook and search for "Cult of the Curious" to locate whatever happens to be our most current page :)For all merch-related questions/problems: [e-mail] (copy and paste)Please rate and subscribe on Apple Podcasts and elsewhere and follow the suck on social media!! @timesuckpodcast on IG and http://www.facebook.com/timesuckpodcastWanna become a Space Lizard? Click here: https://www.patreon.com/timesuckpodcast.Sign up through Patreon, and for $5 a month, you get access to the entire Secret Suck catalog (295 episodes) PLUS the entire catalog of Timesuck, AD FREE. You'll also get 20% off of all regular Timesuck merch PLUS access to exclusive Space Lizard merch Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

On February 1st, 1994, a pair of hunters were out searching for a secluded area to hunt some hogs in when they spotted buzzards circling near Wyandotte Avenue and Tulip Street in northern Charlotte County, Florida. Curious and thinking they were going to find a dead hog, they pulled over, parked, walked out into the woods. And instead of the hog carcass, they were hoping to find, they found mutilated human remains. The men reported what they found to the Charlotte County Sheriff's Office, unintentionally initiating what will later become a massive hunt for a suspect who will become known as the hog trail killer. Two years will pass with no new developments, but then three more bodies will be found under similar circumstances. The victims, all men, had been sexually mutilated, and ligature marks had been found on trees at the crime scenes,

suggesting they had been bound to those trees in their final moments. And then another victim will be found next to the skeletal remains at the same dump site, someone who had died less than 24 hours earlier. He'll be quickly identified as 21-year-old Richard Montgomery, who had recently acquainted himself with a man named Dan. This clue and several others will lead investigators to Daniel Owen Conahan, Jr. Unlike many former time suck true crime subjects, Conahan is a suspected, not confirmed, serial killer.

Although he was convicted of only one murder, he has been linked to many, many more. most of his suspected victims, transient men seeking employment, and gay men in Charlotte County, Florida. Conahan also suspected of eight more murders called the Fort Myers-8, founded a mass grave in 2007. This week we'll cover the life and known and strongly suspected crimes of Dan Conahan, the Hog Trail Killer, as well as the undercover police operation that finally led to his arrest in this last October true crime Halloween week edition of Time Suck. This is Michael McDonald, and you're listening to TimeSuck. You're listening to Time Suck. Well, happy Monday.

Happy Halloween. Welcome or welcome back to the Cult of the Curious. I'm Dan Cummins, the master's sucker, baby farming dissenter, Victorian-era morality critic. And you are listening to Time Suck. Hail Nimrod, Hail Lusufina. Praise be to Good Boy, Bojangles, and Glory to B to Triple M. One quick, very cool, charity announcement, and then we are off. This month, happy to say, we have donated $12,000 to Skate, Ohio.

We connect with the fan named BJ, not that kind of BJ, who is the president of Skate, Ohio. He reached out to us to share his story of how he's been working hard to bring smaller skate park. So cool to the city of Mansfield, Ohio. You know, a city where it's a little spread out. It doesn't have the best public transportation, which can make it hard to get everybody together at one giant park. He and his team have been creating smaller parks across Mansfield so that more kids have more access to a space where they can cut loose, be fucking cool, and build some community. Their mission is to provide alternative athletic opportunities through the thrill of skateboarding to all ages, all skill levels at skate Ohio. They're more than a sport.

They're a movement that's carving a path to a healthier, more connected lifestyle, one trick at a time. and you can learn more about them at Skateohio.com. An additional $1,300 will be set aside for our annual scholarship fund. Big thanks to all the space lizards who continue to make donations to cool shit like this possible for coming up on eight years and just so cool to have fans who take the initiative to do this kind of stuff on their own, like the good folks at skateohio.com. And now let's dig in to today's last bit of October true horror here. No real introduction needed for this one.

The backdrop, mostly just West Florida in the 90s. The Backstreet Boys, right, they formed in Orlando. InSink has also formed in Orlando. O-Town, unfortunately, forming in Orlando. And southwest of all that, a murderer is terrorizing men in the area in and around Punta Gorda. Diving straight into the timeline of the last. Life and Known Crimes of Daniel Conahan, Jr., covering the cases authorities strongly suspect, are linked to him as well. Shrap on those boots, soldier.

We're marching down a time-sunk timeline. Daniel Owen Conahan, Jr., born on May 11, 1954 in Charlotte, North Carolina. And the medical staff president of his birth got a little preview. of the bondage-obsessed sexual sadist he would grow to be when he quickly wrapped his umbilical cord around the doctor who had delivered him's neck pulled it tight

and then whispered, hold still, I'll let you go when I come or maybe that didn't happen I don't know sources don't say a lot about the first few minutes of his life for some reason surely after he was born

his parents moved nearly 700 miles to Punta Gora to Florida I know that happened for sure that's a fact that is a fact Punta Gorda is Spanish for Fat Tip Which is a pretty weird name for a town If you really think about it

Especially when you picture the tip of a dick Which of course I do Because I watch too much beavis and butthead as a kid It can also be translated to Fat Point But that is not as funny Punta Gorda the small county seat of rural Charlotte County Florida Only about 20,000 people there Also part of the pretty much

Neverending populated sprawl though That comprises the majority of Florida's coastline Punta Gordas on the Gulf Coast of Florida, just south of Sarasota and just north of Cape Coral. It sits on the shoreline of Charlotte Harbor, a pretty young town by Florida standards. White settlers did not start living in the area until the late 19th century. Town was not incorporated until 1887, less than a decade after it was first settled. Stayed pretty rural and small, less than 2,000 people living there until around the time that Danny's parents moved there in the mid-1950s. That's when a trio of entrepreneurs, Al Johns, Bud Cole, Sam Birchers, made a fuck ton of real estate money, creating 55 miles of canals in Punta Gorda, each roughly 100 feet wide, 17 feet deep, using dredged sand to raise the level of the canal front land around them.

That's insane and genius. They converted thousands and thousands of previously dry lots into what was now waterfront property with access to Charlotte Harbor and from there the Gulf. not 100% positive that the Conahan family moved into a house built on one of these new canal lots but I'm pretty sure they did they definitely got into boating and that whole lifestyle

Al Johns who came from nothing founded his real estate venture with two other buddies who would work with him overseas and the CIA went on to develop several other communities in Punta Gorda among which were burnt store aisles

another waterfront community with a golf course Seminole Lakes also a golf course community these communities provided waterfront and or golf course homes for retirees with access to downtown with lots of shopping restaurants and parks and the whole area went from being a sleepy middle-class bird to become a boogey place full of seven-figure homes for the country club crowd.

When Al died in 2008 at the age 80, he was probably entombed in fucking gold in a diamond mausoleum or something. Punta Gorda is still a pretty boogey place to live just to establish a setting for the area where this week's murders took place. I looked at on a real estate site, found dozens and dozens of homes selling for between one and three million dollars. According to his obituary, Danny's dad, Dan Conahan Sr. was born in Bethlehem, Pennsylvania. He was a Navy veteran, fought in World War II, then went on to work as an electrical engineer for Pan American Airlines.

And then when he retired in 1982, taught engineering at the Grumman School or, excuse me, Grumman School in New York for five years before returning to Florida and becoming a member of the Punta Gorda Boat Club. It sounds like he did pretty well for himself from the family. His wife and Dan Jr.'s mother was Alice Friedman Conahan, and Alice worked as a high-end dominatrix who specialized in juggling butt plugs while standing on her client's taints and whistling show tunes. It's a very specific niche, odd, but she's clearly wildly talented and did pretty well for herself. I don't know what she did. Sources don't say what she did. So I'm going to assume she worked as a home worker, homemaker, homeworker, who, who, maybe juggled buck plugs.

Dan Jr., let's just call him Danny. I had two other siblings, a brother named David, sister named Sandy. Neither of them, to my knowledge, have ever publicly spoken with the media about their brother. Danny's aunt, Betty Wilson will later describe Danny grown up as friendly, jovial, and honest.

She said he was a good son with devoted parents who never ever abused him. However, investigative journalist David Lour, who's written extensively about and interviewed many of the world's most notorious criminals does not seem to think that he had some kind of squeaky, clean, carefree childhood.

Laura has reported that Danny had a very troubled childhood intensified by the use of alcohol and drugs. He said that friends described Danny as a loner who didn't seem to enjoy participating in any of these school activities and that also Danny realized he was gay early on in high school, came out to his parents and was intensely rejected by them. His very Catholic parents absolutely disgusted.

by this revelation and tried to have him somehow, you know, counseled out of being gay. Sadded their reaction. Definitely the norm for the times. Well, I would say the norm in the sense of the rejection, probably not the norm in terms of sending him to counseling. This is, you know, late 60s, early 70s when this is happening. His parents sent him to several psychiatrists to try to cure him. But all that did was pissed Danny off.

He was irritated that he was being treated by his parents as being abnormal. He told him many times, apparently, that he said, his sexuality was not a disease, nothing that needed to be cured, but they just weren't having that. They didn't want to hear him at all talk at all about who he was in that regard. Danny later told the police, quote, it wasn't the kind of thing you were open about in the 1970s. But I found a gay bar, and if I got there early, they wouldn't card me. Being gay is part of God's plan too. And yeah, he's right. And yet so many parents still today in their little medieval pea brains. Still act like being gay is something you can catch or be indoctrated into or part of, I don't know, Satan's

plan or some shit. Dr. Brianna Fox, a psychological criminologist, explained how all of this may have affected Dan in her interview for an episode about Conahan in a series called Unknown Serial Killers of America. Dr. Fox said Daniel Conahan was a gay man and he had very disapproving parents, which was extremely difficult because he was a member of the Catholic church. All this made him feel like he was wrong, bad, even evil for being gay, and maybe even triggered him to lash out the way he did. Danny graduated from Miami's Norland High School in 1973. Source is not exactly clear on why he went to high school in Miami, at least for a few years. Not sure if his parents moved there for a little while, or if they sent Danny there, you know,

had him live with some relatives. Maybe they wanted to make sure that, you know, he didn't gay up the other two kids. That's how crazy that people believe that, too. Like, you could be a totally straight dude. Fucking love pussy. But then, I don't know, your fucking gay cousin wrestles you down to the ground one time. And then when you head to football practice later, you're like, why is my fucking dick so hard?

Why do I want to play center and have Johnny Jall Line play quarterback place his hands next to my butthole? Why do I suddenly want to join the wrestling team and suck my drama teacher's dick? Hmm. I'm surprised his parents didn't enroll. him in some kind of conversion therapy. Maybe they didn't know about that then. A recent Stanford medicine-led study

found that conversion therapy, by the way, leads directly to depression, PTSD, and higher suicide rates because, of course, it does. Anyway, four years after graduating high school in 1977, 23-year-old Danny joins the Navy. Fuck, what? A gay man

joining the Navy? That's crazy. That has to be the first and last time that's ever happened. Not sure what Danny did between 1973 and 77, but he was young and in Florida, so I imagine he partied his ass off and snorted a boatload of grade A. Colombian Coke. I know Coke's heyday is in the 80s in the U.S., but Florida had quite a bit of nose candy floating around in the 70s, too. And Floridians have long known how to party. When I was touring for years, oh my God, the hardest I partied was almost always after shows in Florida. After completing boot camp, Danny was stationed at the naval base in Great Lakes, Illinois, but he would not stay.

long. His military career was troubled. 1978, just a year after enlisting, Danny attempted to lure some sailors off base for some sex in a motel room. That's how sources describe it, that he lured them. Lured such a funny word here. Like he had some fucking evil gay fuck layer set up in a motel.

And he was trying to get straight as an arrow sailors to go there so he could spring his gay trap on them. I picture him sitting on the bed when these dude show up. TV's playing gay porn, and he's just got this huge bucket of popcorn on his lap with a hole cut, you know, out of the bottom for him to stick his bone or through. Come on, guys, have a seat. Enjoy some popcorn. Go ahead. I'll share. Get some of that warm buttery popcorn. Stick it in your mouth. That's not buttery enough for you. Just grab that butter pump.

I put in the center of the bucket. Just pump and pump and pump. Oh, till the butter comes out. Anyway, somebody turned him in, and Danny was threatened with the court marks. but no one was willing to testify against him. Months later, Danny attempted to perform oral sex on a sailor who was apparently not into it or maybe change his mind and freaked out during it. Something resulted in a physical fight and Danny ended up hitting this dude in a head with a fucking rock for refusing his sexual advances. Sounds pretty messed up. Fucked up to gay bash and be homophobic also fucked up to try to get a straight guy to suck your dick if that's what was going on. Danny was ultimately discharged under less than honorable conditions under threat of court martial.

He left the military, and then he spent the next 13 years living in Chicago, working various odd jobs. His resume included a job as a computer operator, position at the hospital in a unspecified capacity. Spent a lot of his free time at gay bars, he said. During this period of his life, Danny was in his first seemingly only long-term stable romantic relationship with a man named Harold Lindy, went by Hal. Howell and him met in a bar in Chicago, lived together from 1988 to 1992. Howell's father was Robert Lindy, a retired hospital counselor and college professor who, unlike Danny's parents, did not care that his kid was gay, loved and accepted him just the same as if he was straight. Imagine that. Robert later testified that he liked Danny, that Danny helped his son with his alcohol and drug abuse struggles. So that Howe relapsed shortly after they broke up. During the relationship, Robert considered Danny a second son and regularly participated Danny did in family gatherings. So hail Bob Lindy, sad that him just not being a fucking judgey jackass and being cool was not the norm for the time

while we don't know much about the details of their seemingly normal relationship Hal would later testify that Danny told him on numerous occasions about a fantasy he had regarding cruising around to pick up hitchhikers for sex in this fantasy, very specific fantasy Danny wanted to take the hitchhiker out into the woods tie him to a tree and quote screw them

okay here and shit like that always makes me feel a little little vanilla a little boring my wildest fantasies are like ooh I want Lindsay to wear fish nets and heels and let me play with her whole body maybe also tire up to the bed

you know some light bondage but then that's about as far as it goes like even if I just have like a you know whatever time to just jerk off think about whatever I want it never goes to some extreme it's like I'm going to pick up a hitchhiker I'm a driving way out to the woods and my time to tree they're going to say this then i'm going to say that then i'm going to do this then they're going to do

that uh whenever i think about a role play situation i just think about how hard i would have to work to not laugh like if lindsay pretended to be my secretary or something i mean it sounds hot in a way but i feel like at some point i would just be like what are we doing i i know you're my wife this is crazy you're not secretary uh and specific locations like the woods they just i don't know don't even cross my mind i mean i mean i i've fucked in the woods but only because i was camping maybe that's why hearing about these fantasies like they fascinate me you know I just can't really relate

I'm jealous in a way interestingly Danny supposedly never asked his boyfriend how to go into the woods to have sex never admitted to doing that with anybody else just something he wanted to do with a stranger this makes me wonder if Danny maybe didn't share the entire fantasy with Hal

because the fantasy ended in murder and you know he cared about how January of 1993 per Danny's own testimony he moves back to Florida to live with his now elderly parents I mean elderly but like not like that elderly they're 60s he moved into a that's what sources say though elderly he moved into a condo they'd purchased in 1987 he's 38 almost 39 when he does this

and maybe he did that mostly to help but in my gut I think this was more about him needing help than his parents needing help I doubt Chicago worked out like he hoped he never built a career for himself and now maybe he's in like dire financial straits or whatever has to move back home He's unemployed when he first arrives in Florida, and for a while he cooks and cleans for his parents, parents who still do not accept that their son is gay.

That sounds fucking tense. April of 1993, Danny enrolls in a three-month CNA or certified nursing assistant program at Charlotte Votech, aka Charlotte Technical College, in nearby Port Charlotte. In July of 93, Danny got a nursing assistant job. No longer had to work as mommy and daddy's little bitch, which must have felt good. February of 1994, Danny went back to school, enrolled in a course to become a licensed practical nurse, and kills it. That's great. Literally graduated at the top of his class in 1995, gets a new job at the Charlotte Regional Hospital in Punta Gorda. A hospital later renamed Shore Point Health, Punta Gorda, and sadly a hospital that closed last year because of hurricane damage, just never came back.

Job-wise, at the time of his arrest, Danny was out on leave, waiting for workers' compensation. due to a back injury, he had suffered supposedly on the job. Eh, you'll see his back apparently was too fucked up for hospital work, but not too fucked up for murder. While earning his education and working, Danny cared for his alien mother. While she was in the hospital, often visited her at her nursing home. Sources don't say exactly what she was suffering from. When he wasn't doing that, he was allegedly but almost certainly cruising the streets of Charlotte County and the surrounding area picking up men he found along the way.

taking them into the woods for what they thought would be either nude bondage photos or photos and a sexual encounter. Sometimes it would be that but sometimes in their final moments these men would meet the true monster that Denny hid behind the mask of his normal life. February 1st, 1994, two hunters route searching for a secluded area to hunt hogs in

just like I mentioned in the cold open when they spotted those buzzards circling near WynDott Avenue in Tulip Street in northern Charlotte County hoping to find a dead hog they pulled over walked out into the woods instead of the hog carcass hog carcass right they find mutilated human remains one of the men calls the charlotte county sheriff's office who arrives at the scene begins an investigation that will essentially spiral into a massive serial killer case but that'll take a little while the medical examiner's report stated that the victim was a white male with brown hair 25 to 35 years old roughly five feet nine inches tall weighing between 150 and 160 pounds the body been in the woods for approximately a month. Rope marks found on his skin mutilations found in both the neck and pelvic region. Most disturbingly, the man's genitals had been surgically removed. Fuck.

Hearing about that makes me think about somebody surgically removing my genitals. That'd be, ah, my God, that'd be such a terrible life moment. To be held captive by some sexual sadist, right, hear them be like, you know what I should do, I should chop off your cock and balls. Don't worry. If you start to bleed too much, I'll just cauterize the wound. where your cock and balls were. Ooh, this is exciting.

It's fucking wild to think that people have absolutely experienced a life moment like that. Probably with somebody who didn't talk that weird. And then had the psycho follow through and actually do it. Investigators also found rope marks on a nearby tree, suggesting the man had been tied to it. You've been tied to it with a rope around his neck, to be clear. Nothing else of interest was found at the crime scene. There was no ID found, no distinguishing characteristics that could identify the victim.

Only real clue. A surgical rod in the victim's ankle from a prior surgery. The manufacturer of the surgical pin was provided with a serial number, but it was only traced to hospitals. She used instruments within the same lot number. Detectives issued subpoenas for any patient who had received similar pins that matched the description of the John Doe, but every patient they could find was alive and well.

Charlotte County investigators requested dental charts, fingerprints from all men reported missing over the past few months in Florida, but that won't turn anything up. Police also requested a clay skull reconstruction in hopes it would help them ID their John Doe. That is so cool that they can do that. I have these reconstructions and just other, you know, advanced forensic tools now at their disposal. And this was all, you know, 30 years ago. They have even more now.

Despite investigators' efforts by the end of 1995, they're no closer to identifying this, you know, this body or to solving his murder. The media published photos of facial reconstruction. And while there were a few leads generated, none of the other. them panned out. Investigators handed out a bunch of flyers at area businesses, hospitals, schools, churches, asking if anybody had info about someone talking about, uh, you know, I don't know how they wanted to remove people's fucking cock and balls or if they knew anyone who had removed their own cock and balls, but that didn't help either. I doubt they fucking talk to people about exactly that. But they did, but they did talk, you know, to people in the community.

Try to find some info. Imagine if they did talk about, imagine a cop going to some school. like a grade school, right? They're just, they're looking for any possible lead. They're not going to, you know, rule any place out. Maybe the kids' parents know something. They show up at a school. The teacher, you know, introduces them to the class. Now there's detectives holding flyers.

The text was like, hey, kids, some detective comments. And I want to know if you've heard anybody talking about somebody cutting off someone's cock and balls recently. Has anyone talked to you about cutting off your cock and balls? Listen, we got a guy in the area who likes to cut off cockat balls. I don't want to scare you, but, you know, you can be next or your dad your dad or your dad can be the guy who did it hell my dad can be the guy who did it a lot of dads do a lot of dirty shit help me out ask your dad when you go home from

school if he's been running around cutting off cock and balls or asking around for someone to cut off his cock and balls with your help we're going to catch this fucking monster hoping before he kills you or your dad or your uncle or older brother hope before he cuts off all your fucking cock and balls want your kids to have a great day right keep your eyes peeled It's probably way too fucked up to do in real life. But fun scene to watch in a movie. Anyway, almost two years after those first remains were found, more bodies will turn up in neighboring Sarasota County

that will intensify this investigation. January 1st, 1996, a dog named Hollywood brought a human skull to her owner's house near Palmedin Road in Northport, Florida. Northport, only a 25-minute drive, at least with no traffic from Punta Gorda, right across Charlotte Harbor. the homeowners Susan and Wayne Brown

had woken up at sunrise they lived in a secluded part of Northport next to a bunch of open wilderness and they had two hunting dogs not as Hollywood and between 530 and 6 in the morning Wayne would start his day by letting out the dogs out of the pen and then they'd run

around the property and then they would stop at the base of this palm tree and get real curious about something this day and then Hollywood which is such a fucking great name for a dog brought Wayne a skull started yelling for Susan Susan ran down to see what the hell the fuss is about. They walk over to the base of the palm tree.

The dog, where the dog had found the skull, they see other bones and call the police. When officers show up, the Browns told them that the dogs have been actually bringing bones home for about a month. They had no idea they were bringing them human bones. Susan gathered a collection of about 12 to 15 bones

that Hollywood and the other dog, named Speed Bump, by the way, had brought her by the time that skull showed up when she left, or which she left in the front yard. In Hollywood and Speedbump, that's an incredible duo. Way better names than my dog's Penny and Ginger, I'm going to have to admit. That dog duo legitimately sounds like a fun kid's cartoon, where the dogs are a pair of detectives.

Right? Hollywood, newer to the force, doesn't follow the rules. He's fast and reckless. I picture him being like a young hyper beagle. You know, come on, speed bump, forget what the commission said. Let's just take these cats down now. Meanwhile, Speedbump, he likes to play things by the book. Slow down, Hollywood. would let's do things the right way we don't have a warrant he's an old fat basset hound

he's trying to hang on until his pension's fully vested and the commish by the way has to be bojangles okay jump it back into the real dogs now uh bringing real bones back to their owners wayne brown said about finding the skull i about died i fell down the stairs trying to get to the phone to dial nine one one i'd sure like to hear the tape of what i said to that dispatcher i like wayne Can you imagine how disturbing that would be To be laughing about some bones Your dogs have been bringing home for weeks Only to find out they belong to a body

Somebody had dumped in the woods behind your house Susie Brown told the son Harold of the time They've been bringing pieces home for months Hollywood and her mom speed bump He thought they were bringing pieces of deer Rabbits or alligators The Northport police confirmed That the school was human

And as Sarasota County Sheriff Posse Called the Police Exhibes explorers were called into search for remaining bones. According to Susie, they were the long bones of arms and legs and fingers and stuff, but I didn't know that then. They started raking leaves and looking around the yard, they found a bunch of bones, and most of them were human. The chest and hip bones were found in separate locations within a half mile of the school. The police report mentioned rope marks found on a tree near the discovery site. Other than the chest, hip bones and the bones found in the yard, investigators could not find the rest of the skeleton.

and the medical examiner later determined the victim was a white male, 25 to 35, 5-9, 150 to 160 pounds again. An examiner felt that the head detached from the skeleton due to decomposition and animal activity, cause of death listed as undetermined, but the medical examiner surmised that the man was mutilated and his genitals may have been cut off. How did he determine that off these bones?

Well, just a hunch. Or maybe an obsession. that examiner Riazal Imami believed that genital removal had occurred in over 76% of cases he covered where the victim had been reduced to nothing but bones and then Amami himself will die

a few years later after he cut off his own cock and balls in a misguided experiment make it that what you will make of that I'm being absurd no the examiner made the determination when he found a number of disturbing knife marks on the pelvic bones

also declared that the victim based on that had been murdered but no exact cause of death specific injury-wise could be determined, you know, just because of decomposition. Also, decomposition of the body was greater in the areas of the head, neck, and lower pelvis suggesting there were severe injuries to those areas. Once again, investigators, though, will get no ID, they'll find no ID, you know, near the body, and no leads. But they will get more clues soon. And before finding out what those clues are, time for today's first of two mid-show sponsor breaks. If you don't want to hear these ads ever again, please sign up to be a space lizard on Patreon,

help us make monthly charitable contributions, get the catalog ad-free, episodes three days early and more. Thanks to listen to our sponsors. I hope you heard a deal that makes sense for you. And now we head to March 7, 1996, the day another hog trail killer victim is found. Two months later, March 7, 1996, a man was traveling down Route 75 in Northport and pulled off onto Laramie Circle. He got out of his vehicle to relieve himself in the woods. As he walked past the tree line, he found a nude male corpse lying on the ground and called

the Northport Police. The body had been posed face up, arms laid out straight, in the shape of a cross. The medical examiner determined the man was killed roughly 10 days earlier. He'd been stabbed four times, and his genitals had been surgically removed. Fucking so brutal. And sadly, something we have come across numerous times before with other male serial killers who target other men they have a sexual interest in just cutting off the fucking genitals. There were also rope-like marks on the

victim's chest suggesting he'd been tied up. He had cuts and scrapes on his feet, slash marks on his upper torso, indicating he may have escaped and tried to run away from the killer. A palm tree less than 20 feet from his body had ligature marks, making this the third case where investigators found rope marks on

trees near a homicide crime scene. According to local news outlet, Cairo 7. After seeing these marks, investigators had returned to the John Doe No. 2 scene and found similar marks on a tree there. Then they returned to the first crime scene from 1994, saw old marks indicating John Doe number one had also been tied to a tree. This led detectives to suspect, of course, that all three murders had been committed by the same person. Investigators created a composite of the third John Doe and described him as a white male, Auburn Hare, 35 to 45 years. sold five, six, with a muscular build and bad teeth. No weight listed for some reason. Still, they have no leads, no suspects. But then the following month, investigators will make the most important discovery thus far, one that will finally lead to a breakthrough in the case. On April 17th, 1996, two county road workers found a human school near Trembly Avenue in Willow Drive in northern Charlotte County. The workers were on their lunch break when they decided to walk down a

nearby hog trail. They stopped at the top of an embankment, looked into the gulch below. They thought they saw something, so they went down to check it out, not expecting to make a horrifying discovery. They found that skull. The two workers drove to the closest gas station where they found two officers on their break. The officers agreed to come back with them and confirmed the skull was human.

Investigators from five agencies then showed up at the crime scene. The Florida Department of Law Enforcement, aka the FDLE, the state attorney's office, the Charlotte County Sheriff's Office, the Fort Myers PD, and the North Port PD. Investigators photographed labeled the skull. They brought in a cadaver dog to check for more bones, quickly found a shoulder and a rib cage. The body appeared to have been sawn in half, and there was only a small amount of tissue left on the torso. Investigators continued searching the area for more evidence, and a detective spotted a piece of rolled-up carpet padding with a human hand sticking out. They unrolled the padding and discovered the nude remains of a young white male labeled John Doe No. 5.

unlike dondo number four five have been killed very recently as in within the past 24 hours like that their victims the young man's genitals had been surgically removed why were the genitals removed in all these victims detectives theorized it was quote to remove evidence the assumption was that the killer had engaged in sexual acts with the victim then wanted to remove evidence of that as opposed to taking the genitals as some kind of trophy or as opposed of doing it to torture them you know by removing them But that's just a theory. He had ligature marks on his throat, chest, and legs. Near these remains, investigators found fresh footprints and ligature marks on the trees, and some rope was found on top of a nearby trash pile. The preliminary pathologist report stated that the victim had been raped and strangled with either a rope or some clothesline. This time, pathologists were able to identify the victim through dental records and fingerprints.

It was 21-year-old Richard Allen Montgomery. The never-ending parade of Richards continues. It is absurd. Just how many Richards are apparently out there in the world. Also, a paint chip was found in Richard's pubic care, and this little piece of evidence will come in very handy. It'll be a very, very important clue of ways down the road. And when examining the remains of John Doe No, number four,

the medical examiner found some fibers to compare to the other victims. Victim also had a tattoo on the back of their shoulder, which was published by the media, and will later lead to identifying this victim. investigators focus on learning as much as they could about Richard Montgomery's final days Rich lived with his mom at the Palms and Pine's mobile home court just east of Punta Gorda

some sources will say he was living with his sister at the time of his death seemingly more credible sources list the mother he had a lengthy criminal record that included assault with a deadly weapon auto theft burglary excuse me possession of burglary tools disorderly intoxication and violation of probation

he was actually on probation for aggravated assault with a deadly weapon at the time of his death neighbors at the mobile home park said Richard was a problem child one long time resident Cheryl Gibson said that they were afraid

of Richard because quote he was constantly abusing his mother and you didn't see him out and around much during the day he never had a job spent the nights partying cars came and went all the time at their place and we wondered if they were doing drugs She all sounds like a nosy nelly

To give a more well-rounded view of Richard His best friend John Jakud Said that not long before his death He'd been living with his sister and brother-in-law And their young child He said they all got along great Helped each other out That Rich was a fantastic uncle

Opinions about him Like they do for I guess all of us I guess You know we're pretty mixed John said that for work Rich bounced around took odd jobs Sometimes work on a construction site wasn't really thinking about a career

you know at this point in his life he's very young he's having fun he's partying hoping to buy this or that cool car talking to his buddies about girls he's tall thin good looking quite the ladies man apparently he's outgoing drank a lot crash with whoever would offer him a place to sleep when he was out drinking he was living life you know fast and reckless which is a sadly

a good way to live a pretty short life oftentimes between 4 and 7 p.m. April 16th 1996 the 90 disappeared he was out with bobby Whitaker, Gary Mason and some other friends partying when he said he was going out to make a few hundred bucks. He'd be back soon. When asked whether or not what he was doing was legal, I guess he just smiled mischievously, and he said that they could throw a party with the cash he'd make when he came back. Dude, loved a party. Rich also mentioned to his mom that somebody had offered to pay him $200 to post for nude photos a day or so earlier, but he didn't say who had made the

offer. However, in the same conversation, Rich had brought up to his new friend, Dan Connahan, uh, in that same conversation, Rich did bring up, excuse me, his new friend Dan Conahan, Jr., who lived in Punta Gorda Isles and was a nurse at a medical center. And then Rich was last seen standing on the corner of Royal Road and Highway 41,

shortly after he left that party with his friends, looking like he was waiting for somebody to pick him up. After these five victims had been found, many residents of Charlotte County were now panicking. Nobody knew who the killer was and if and when they would strike again. In interviews with local media, medical examiner,

Rizal and Mami said that he believed again, of course, how could you not believe this, that one man was responsible for these murders. Charlotte County undersheriff, Colonel John Davenport, held a press conference to try and reassure residents saying, do you have some mass murderer running around praying on the citizens out here? I don't think there's cause for alarm in that way. But we do not have that subject in custody that we know of, so there is cause for concern.

On the day the two bodies were found, the most recent bodies, the Charlotte County Sheriff's Office began sharing notes with the North Port Police Department, Northport in Sarasota County, just north and neighboring Charlotte County. A task force was assembled consisting of the Charlotte County Sheriff's Office,

Northport PD, the FD, the FDLE, and the state attorney's offices of both Charlotte and Sarasota counties. And this group will meet almost daily now going forward. Authorities also called on Wayne Porter. a profile for the FDLE, who told them they appeared to be dealing with a sexual sadist. According to former Agent Porter, one of the characteristics of a sexual sadist is that ability to con others through the mask that they wear, showing that they're a nice guy.

But the mask does come off, and it's really a demon. It wasn't a nice guy he portrayed himself to be. Also, he had the plan, he had the organization, he had a vehicle to transport, so we felt like we were dealing with a highly intelligent killer. Lieutenant Mike Gandy, the head of major crimes for Charlotte County at the time, told the News Coast Herald Tribune that they were not attributing the mass murders to a serial killer just yet, but we're not ruling it out. It sounds like he was just doing that mostly to try and calm down local residents. You know, since the term serial killer, serial killer, excuse me, elicit so much fear.

But it was too late for that. The next day news stations warned residents that a serial killer was on the loose, and the media speculated that the killer was either gay or bisexual. and most likely, quote, a schizophrenic psychopath. That's a strange assumption. Well, part of the crimes read as schizophrenic. I feel like that was just a buzzword, popular at the time. You know, I tossed that.

Or maybe like a buzz term. He's a schizophrenic psychopath. The case has now become known as the Hog Trail murders since the victims have been found in remote areas inhabited by wild boars, often along hog trails. On May 8, 1996, investigators get a real lucky break that leads to a prime suspect to be identified in this case.

A 34-year-old David Allen Payton, an inmate at Glade's Correctional Institute in Moorhaven, Florida, called investigators, claimed he knew who was committing these murders. State attorney investigator, Brian Kelly, and Lieutenant John Brock headed to prison to interview him. Peyton proceeds to tell Kelly and Brock that he had talked to the Fort Myers Police two years, excuse me, two months earlier, back in March, but they didn't believe him. And now he proceeds to tell them that on March 5, 1995, he was heading home from DJ's bar on U.S. Route 41 in Fort Myers, feeling the effects of the alcohol he drank.

While walking to a local bus stop, he decided to sit down in the shade so he could sober up a bit. A few minutes later, a blue mercury capri pulls up beside him, and the driver asks him if he wants to party some more. Come on, buddy, let's go drink some beer, smoke a little fucking weed,

pop some valiums. Let's fucking go. Peyton agrees, gets into the car, for what I imagine, will be the most memorable ride of his life. The driver identified him, excuse me, identified himself as Daniel Conahan, and as they headed down Zimel Road in Charlotte County, Dan asked Peyton if he would pose for some nude photos for a hundred bucks, just some light

bondage stuff, where Peyton would be loosely tied to a tree, and Peyton said no. Then he started feeling pretty unsettled and anxious when Dan turned on to an isolated dirt road to go find some place for them to keep partying, you know, keep drinking, smoking that weed. Luckily, very luckily, Danny's car got stuck in a mud hole. Peyton went out of the car anyway or wanted out of the car anyway so he offered to hop out, you know, push the car and when he made that offer, Danny's tone

changed. He got very authoritative and told him no, shouted you stay here. Then he told David to get behind the wheel. While he got out and pushed, and while Peyton pushed down the gas pedal and Danny pushed the actual vehicle from behind, Peyton looked back at the backseat,

saw camera, some blue tarp, a coil of rope, and a big ass hunting knife. Uh-oh. Now he's very concerned, and he thinks that him being picked up was never about him maybe taking some nude photos in the woods. It was about violence and possibly murder. Then some random guy driving a four-wheel drive truck appears, offers to help Danny get his car out of the mud. After he does, Peyton's still terrified, decides to speed off in Danny's car while Danny is speaking to that driver. That's fucking so smart.

Love it. Dude just saved his own life. However, once his initial adrenaline rush wore off, the drugs and alcohol he'd take and make him very sleepy. and the next thing he remembers is waking up into Fort Myers and being arrested for driving a stolen car and driving drunk. Well, the detectives currently interviewing him. They read his arrest report from this night, and they see that the car he had stolen was registered to one Daniel Conahan senior.

He was the one who reported the vehicle stolen, and he had listed his son, Daniel Conahan, Jr., as being the driver. Fucking Danny Dirtback! Authorities then learned that Junior was living with his dad in Punta Gorda. Dad was elderly. health, so not likely a suspect. Peyton is given a photo lineup, confidently identifies Danny Jr. as the driver who had picked him up that night. So this is huge, obviously, for the task force. The task force now asked Peyton to take a lie detector to verify a statement,

which he does May 9, 1996, and even though we now know that lie detector tests are not that reliable, Peyton does pass, which makes his claim look, you know, that much more credible. Soon after this interview with Peyton that points to Danny, Charles Bateman and Robert Beckworth come forward. Both men claimed to be acquainted with the victim Richard Montgomery. They described a man who had been propositioning panhandlers and transient people around the time of their friend Rich's murder for some nude photos. One of these two men even admitted that they had posed for some nude photos with Danny

but said that he was not tied to a tree for these photos. However, when Bateman and Beckwith are shown a three-year-old driver's license photo of Danny Conahan, they cannot positively ID him, but then when investigators take Bateman to a parking lot near Danny's home, Bateman does spot Danny's Blue Capri and identifies it as the car that Danny had been driving when he met him. Richard Friends also confirmed that Rich knew Danny Conahan and had spent some time with him before.

So now, Danny's definitely the guy. Investigators think is probably behind these murders. However, there's not enough evidence to charge Conahan with five murders, so the task force begins doing 24-7 surveillance, involving between 20 and 30 officers. They weren't ready to make an arrest, but they also didn't want Danny to be left alone to harm anybody else.

Most of the things he did while they followed him now turned out to be pretty routine, going to the ATM, various stores, visiting his mom at her assisted living facility. But also he does frequent a store called the Happy Unic,

which sells nothing but castration supplies, which they find, you know, interesting. That story was real. I don't know if it would be called Happy, the Happy Unic. Maybe the wistful eunuch, the regretful, the wretched eunuch. What they really noticed was that he always had a backpack with him, and authorities suspect it contains his murder tools. According to task force leader, Lieutenant Mike Gandy, quote, he would drive to areas of Fort Myers, Salvation Army, the park downtown. He seemed to be just hunting, and he would be making U-turns and approaching people, standing on the road.

he primarily approached transient people who were asking for money according to the fort mire's news press danny would talk about weed money problems chronic back pain the unsolved murders before propositioning people in one instance the task force saw danny talking to some random person then saw them leave in separate vehicles and drive out to a wooded area the police quickly called in for aerial surveillance because they were rightfully worried that danny was going to fucking kill this guy eventually they get so worried they send in a marked patrol car to spook Danny and it works and both these guys drive back out of the woods so the surveillance operation

it is successful and that they do stop Danny from killing further but the team not get any evidence to file charges against him and they're constantly worried you know that he's going to evade them you know sneak away from surveillance and kill somebody so they change their tactic now the task force decides to set up undercover decoys on king's highway this little road leading to Danny's mother's nursing home to try and get more evidence, and this will work. At least to work a little bit. Danny finally takes debate, May 17th, asked undercover detective Ray Weir if he's interested in doing some nude modeling and making some quick cash.

Danny said he liked to take photos of, quote, progressive bondage. Oh, yeah, very progressive stuff. Definitely not that normal, like, old school bondage. You know, where you get fucking tied to a tree and your dick cut off. Nope, not that. Weir agreed and Danny told him that he liked to take these photos out in the woods. We were asked when they would take these photos. Danny said he might see him the next day.

Weir later recounted at his first interaction with Danny and his interview for that show Unknown Serial Killers of America. Weir thought Dan gave off a quote, weird vibe, just something different that wasn't normal for a regular person. Well, Danny returned on May 18th, talked to Weir more about modeling, told him he paid well that he had a model lined up for the weekend in Fort Myers adding quote i'm paying him 150 some of these pictures are on the kinky side so i don't know if you'd be into it we're said he he might be into it if he could get some more money and danny replied well 150's a limit it would be stripping different poses nude and there's a bondage scene you know that i want to get and now they agree to try and meet again later and now the task force instructs weir to tell danny he had a place in mind where they could take these pictures and on may

21st, we or sees Conahan on King's Highway, tells him about a camp out in the woods where they could have some privacy. Danny was all about this, as you can imagine. He asked Danny to follow him out there on his bike. Danny agreed. We're hoped Danny would do something incriminating. Police had a sniper in the woods, additional detectives hiding out in case anything happened. Once there, we're and Danny, they get to talking, and we're agrees to let Danny tie him up naked to a tree. He later said he was a bit nervous about this, a bit embarrassed, right? None of the other office. are watching, but he wants to fucking nail this guy. He's committed to his job and he wants to make sure the charges stick. And yeah, this guy's definitely more committed to his job than I am. Once tied naked to the tree, Danny offers to blow Officer

we're right to suck his dick, not being game himself. We're not exactly pumped about this, but again, he feels like he's very close to making an important arrest. He wants to nail this guy, so he takes one for the team and he lets the suspect, you know, suck his dick for a while. Way more committed to a job than I am.

And then Danny showed him the monster behind the mask, and he starts telling Weird that he's going to cut his dick off. Now, Weir could have yelled for help at this point, should have yelled, but he didn't. He wants to make absolutely certain that Danny's not bluffing. Way, way more committed to his job than me. So Danny gets a knife out, and before the sniper fires a warning shot, he slowly cuts off one of Weir's testicles. And now I have to wonder, is anyone still believing that this actually happened? No, there's rules to undercover police work. And I'm pretty sure that you're not allowed to get tied naked to a tree

and get your dick sucked by a murder suspect while other officers watch. Really hope someone had had enough and turned off this episode right before I admitted that was nonsense. For real now, once out in the woods, Weir and Danny gets a talking and Weir asks, you know, when they're going to take these pictures. And now Danny says he's, uh, he's not really into the pictures. He says that he's bisexual and what he really wants to do is kind of fool around. weir replies that he is straight not into that Danny then offers Weir 20 bucks to suck his dick

And again weir's uh no sorry not interested And now they joke around talk her about 15 minutes And then Danny is ready to leave So after all that the task force doesn't actually get what they wanted Other than Danny admitting that he does like to take nude bondage photos But they still can't make an arrest But then just two days later the task force sends another under under oh my god sends another undercover detective Danny's way.

And now they do authorize him to be tied to a tree naked to get his dick sucked and to let the suspect cut off his junk if the opportunity arises. They promise to have a surgeon waiting nearby who can reattach everything like it never happened. Now that's still insane. Also, that is something I would 100% ask a rookie officer if he was willing to do, just to fuck with him if I was like a police chief or something, which is, you know, one of the many reasons I'm not a police chief or something. Two days after the last meeting, May 23rd, Detective Scott Clemens does meet with Danny

in Kiwanis Park in Port Charlotte, pretending he had just come down from Georgia, needed some money, work, a place to stay. Then he actually asked him during their conversation, you're not a cop, are you? And Clemens said no. And yes, despite what you may have seen on old TV shows and in movies, an undercover cop can absolutely deny being a cop. They're not legally required to reveal their true identity of fast. And I feel like a fucking idiot admitting this.

But I actually believed that if you just asked an undercover cop, if they were a cop, they would legally have to tell you, yeah, I'm a cop, which is crazy. I mean, if it was that easy, there would be no undercover police work. It would just be completely pointless. Like, imagine working for years undercover, you know, infiltrating some gang or something. You've been away from your family, your friends, you've sacrificed so much, you've made this group think that you're one of them, you've risked your life countless times, you're finally on the edge of gathering enough evidence to bring the entire,

organization down. And then the big boss is like, hey, don't take this a wrong way. I can't believe I never asked you this before. Should I ask you this a couple years ago, but I just got to be careful, you're not a cop, are you? And you're just like, God damn it. Fuck, yes. Fuck! Oh, I am, fuck, I am a cop. Man, I really thought you guys were going to ask at this point. No, that's ridiculous. That myth is based on the concept of entrapment. And to prove entrapment, a person must show that they were not already inclined to commit a crime and that an officer's actions forced or persuaded them to do so,

which is very different. That an undercover cop portraying somebody who just goes along for a crime. You know, like witnesses are crime, right? Working with people already in the act of committing crimes. Okay, that being explained, Danny has also asked Clemens if he had ever hustled.

He said he had. Danny now offered him cash for oral sex, but says he doesn't have 20 bucks on him. So he gives Clemens. his home phone number and says it was nice meeting you. I just call this number if you ever want to, you know, suck a dick for 20 bucks. The next day, May 24th, Danny met up with Clemens in the same place, asked him if he had ever modeled.

He said, sure, he had. And Danny now offers him $150 for nude photos. But tells Clemens, he needed to see him naked first before he agreed to take the photos. You know, I got to see what I'm working with. If it even turns me on, Clemens said he was not comfortable getting naked in the park. And again, they go their separate ways. Next day, May 25th, two guys meet for a third time. Clemens asked Danny about the murders, saying that they unnerved him.

And now Danny suddenly gets coy about the nude photo shoot. Says that maybe before they think about that, you know, they should just hang out for a while. He says, quote, maybe we can get together, party a little bit or something. You know, play by ear. Clemens, you know, is worried that Danny is on to him. And now the task force feels like the undercover work is just not working much better than the constant surveillance. They need to come up with a new plan. They need something incriminating fast

So they can arrest Danny before he hurts anybody else And so now, and I think this is so smart I really like the way the guys worked this case The task force sets up in a room and a motel They know that Danny will drive past And they plan to initiate what will appear to be a random traffic stop Out in front of this motel May 31st, 1996

Danny is stopped, brought into the motel room for questioning Lieutenant Mike Gandy tells him that they're just investigating investigating for local homicides. They'd like to talk to him, right? They're talking to lots of people. It's no big deal. You know, this is one interview of many. Danny happily agrees, goes into the room for the interview,

has no idea that cameras have been hidden in the room, that everything he is saying is being recorded. Gandy later says that Danny seemed to like the attention. When he walked in, carried himself like he was the smartest guy in the room, which is an arrogance, so typical of these killers. Gandhi explained once he got to talking that his name had come up, their investigation a few times. No big deal, though.

And they just, you know, had a few questions for him. I just wanted to clear his name. It didn't, of course, let on that he was the prime suspect, you know? Just a guy who might be able to help them catch the real killer. Danny replied, quote,

oh my gosh, this is so scary. I haven't encountered anything like this. If I'm a detective, anybody who says, oh my gosh, this is so scary, they immediately jump, you know, up a couple notches in my suspect list. And they jump to the top of my who, is the biggest fucking dork i've talked to to today list

uh danny was cooperative he appeared calm but gandy noticed that his leg was bounced up and down quickly as if he was extremely nervous or maybe he's just a dude who has restless legs my leg bounces all the time whether i'm anxious or not uh gandy asked if he was in a relationship danny said no he acknowledged he was gay but denied he was into bondage uh listen to this little clip of him saying these kind of things the audio is not great apologies for that uh but it's worth hearing him

He says, no, I don't do the bondage. I'm not into that. Danny spoke about his connection to Richard Montgomery's friend, Bobby Whitaker, said he'd been to Whitaker's home a few times, but hadn't been there for at least a year, possibly hadn't been there for two years, which detectives think is a lie based on what they have heard. Bobby Whitaker claimed he had met Rich about six months before he was killed. Rich lived with him for a month and a half. Bobby had met Danny through a friend named Jeff Dingman. They'd known each other for a couple years. Danny had visited Whitaker's trailer to see Dingman about three times. And according to Whitaker, Danny had come to the trailer to see Rich one time while Rich was living with him. This is about two and a half to three months before he was killed. Also, Rich told several of his friends that Danny had offered to pay him to take Bonnie's photos. And during the same motel room interview, he does not deny that happened.

You offered him? He talked about it. He said you offered him to be tied up. I made a, I mean, I offered, but I didn't want to do it. I didn't do it. It was just a passing New Year's a golden bondage. He said, you actually told him bondage is what he said. He knows you fucked up. And I've been very well, I've said, you know, maybe he'd like to do some bondage or something, but I, we didn't.

Ah, he fuck's up bad there, right? They just catch him in a lie. He clearly was into bondage, and he admitted that he was taking the dude, or talking to the dude, excuse me, about taking bondage photos right before that guy was killed in the woods in a scenario that involved bondage.

That's one hell of a coincidence if he's not the killer. Then while this interview is happening, the police informed Danny that they had just executed a search warrant on his home and vehicles and that they'd obtained some paint samples from the mercury capri that he drove,

right? his dad's Mercury Capri. And now Danny's mood changes. He doesn't seem so happy to be there anymore. He shuts down and Gandhi ends the interview and lets him go. And now before we head further down this timeline, time for today's second and two mid-show sponsor breaks. Thanks for listening to these sponsors. I hope you heard some deals you liked.

Now let's find out what investigators are uncovering back at Danny's house while he leaves their motel room interview. Meanwhile, investigators are finding rope, semen-stained underwear, a camera, hairs, and fibers from Danny's car. And the paint samples they had taken from the Mercury Capri will be compared to a paint chip found on Richard Montgomery's corpse's hip and the lab will determine that they're an exact match. Additionally, a fiber from the Mercury Capri was found on John Doe number four, right?

The walls are closing in, but he's still got a few weeks of freedom left while they gather more evidence. June 3, 1996, John Doe number four, the poor bastard who's limbless, headless, genital-less, mostly skinless torso was found in the woods, identified as 25-year-old Kenneth Lee Smith. His sister, Teresa, who lived in Naples,

had seen news coverage of the case and recognized her brother's tattoo. Man, what a shitty life moment. Kenny had moved to Charlotte County, but had no fixed address. He'd been arrested at 1991 for grand theft, looting officers, driving with his suspended license, petty theft, resisting arrest, and reckless driving. He'd been arrested again in 1992 for probation violation. He had a daughter named Brandy, who was just three when her dad went away for a construction job and then never came home.

Kenny was described by friends and families being outgoing and fun, enjoyed fishing and hunting, loved his family, also struggled very heavily with substance abuse, which led to being out on the street regularly, right, making terrible, dangerous, irresponsible decisions. One friend said he was a hard partier known to crash at flop houses and, quote, do anything for a beer. Sounds like he was similar to Richard Montgomery. after Kenny went missing his mom called friends and neighbors but no one had heard from him his sister and mom ended up reporting him missing a strong consistent victim profile is emerging for the task force the killer clearly likes young white men who like to party people down and out who don't have much money are desperate eager to make a buck right willing to take a risk

four days later june 7th fort mire's detective pete soto finds a police report from august 15th 1994 about a man named Stanley Burden. This will be big. Stanley's been picked up or was picked up a few years back near Lyons Park and Fort Myers. The report said that a man had performed oral sex on Stanley after tying him out or

tying him to a tree way out in the woods not far from Punta Gorda. They were a half a mile from the nearest main road when this happened. Stanley was currently in prison in Ohio for rape. Detectives decided to pay him a quick visit, right? This is fucking huge. Also this day, detectives learned that Conahan

had made an ATM withdrawal on April 16th the day Richard Montgomery was killed at a bank near where Richard lived. To end of June, 26-year-old Stanley Burden is interviewed. This would be big. Stanley was a high school dropout who had difficulty keeping a steady job, had similar physical features to Richard Montgomery, and he claimed that on August 15, 1994, he'd been picked up by a man he knew as Dan, who had drove a 1981 Plymouth station wagon, which was a car Danny still owned. He said that Dan offered him between $100 and $150 and post for some nude photos

and that he drove Stanley to a wooded area off Rockville Road in Fort Myers. Once they arrived, this Dan pulled out a duffel bag, not a chicken skin duffel bag, but just a regular duffel bag. They contained a tarp and a polaroid camera. Dan laid out the tarp, asked Stanley to take off his shirt and quote, show a little hip.

What the fuck? What was it, the 1950s? Show a little hip doll. You got a real. classy chasses, Daddy-oh, take off that top, send this cool cat to Cloud 9. Ouga! You got me crank, dolly. Come on, kitten. Drop those drawers all the way. After taking a few photos, Danny, or Dan took out a new package of clothesline for some light bonded pictures, asked Stanley to step close to a tree, then clip the clothesline in several places,

draping them over Stanley lightly to make it look like bondage. And then saying needed to rearrange a clothesline to make it look more realistic. he moves behind Stanley and he makes his move he snaps the rope tightly around him pulls his hands behind the tree places ropes around his legs and chest

wraps a rope twice around his neck how fucking terrified are you in this moment now Stanley can't move the ropes are cutting into him hard enough to make him bleed he's far enough out in the woods that no one can hear him scream

Danny then forcefully performs oral sex on Stanley and then attempts to rape him Stanley is fought to position himself in the middle of the tree as Danny attempts to pull him to the side so he can penetrate him after many unsuccessful attempts

Danny grabs the rope around Stanley's neck, places his foot against the tree, pulls as hard as he can, trying to strangle him. When Danny tries to slide around the tree to keep his windpipe open, Danny hits him in the head, then unsuccessfully attempts to strangle him again, right, putting his foot up against the tree

and pulling. They keep doing this over and over for about 30 minutes by Stanley's estimation. During the attack, he says that Danny said to him at one point, why don't you just die, you son of a bitch. Give up and make my job easier. Strange to me that Danny could have just grabbed a fucking rock and used it to bash Stanley's head in, but didn't. Could have stabbed him with a knife, didn't do that. It was very set on killing him in a very specific way, apparently. Eventually,

Stanley, and this is so smart, pretends to die, pretends to lose consciousness. Danny exhausted, buys it, and then he just gathers up his things and leaves him there. After he's gone, Stanley is able to bend down, grab a pair of pliers that Danny had dropped and left, not sure what scary shit he had playing with those fucking pliers at one point, and he cuts himself free. Then he receives treatment at a local hospital and speaks to police. I saw the photos they took of him. It's fucking brutal, like his neck really cut up from that rope. The police who took the photos, visited the crime scene, saw ligature indentations in one

of the trees that verifies Stanley's report of what happened. Stanley still had scars on his wrist and neck from being tied up and strangled when the task force detectives speak with him a couple years after this happened. his statement also backed up by hospital records Stanley has shown a six photo lineup identifies Daniel Conahan Jr. immediately, confidently. That's the guy who did it. Around the same time, investigators looking at Dan's background

learned he was discharged from the Navy in 1978, right, under threat of court martial for sodomy and physical assault. Naval records state the offenses were part of a, quote, continuing plan or scheme by Conahan to lure servicemen just beyond the limits of the naval training center in Great Lakes, Illinois. Investigator subpoenaed Danny's credit records Find receipts for knives, alcohol, leather gloves, rope, plastic tarps,

several dozen rolls of Polaroid film. These purchases will correspond to dates that people get murdered. So fucking jackpot there. Even more evidence now, fibers from a rope seized during the search of Danny's home match fibers on the rope used in the attempted murder of Stanley Burden. Fibers found on at least one tree were also matched to a pair of Danny's gloves.

Finally, investigators, speak to Danny's ex-boyfriend, Howell Lindy, who tells them that one of Danny's fantasies is not only sexual bondage, it's sexual bondage with a stranger in the woods where the dude's been tied to a tree. Now it finally feels like it is time to arrest this creepy motherfucker. July 3rd, 1996, Daniel Conahan is arrested in charge with attempted first-degree murder and also kidnapping and sexual battery in connection with the Stanley Burden incident. Police won't say publicly that Danny is a suspect in five murders, but the 25-page arrest affidavit showed that he had a pension for picking up drifters

and propositioning them for nude photos. On August 2, 1996, Danny is arraigned on his charges. Pleads not guilty. Over 500 pages of task force documents were released later that month, which identified Danny as a suspect or as a suspect in the other murders for the first time. The sheriff's office still will not say anything publicly, though. Charlotte County Lieutenant Michael Gandy says at a press conference we're still investigating the homicides. I can tell you, I believe the homicide cases will conclude satisfactorily, but won't say serial killer.

The following month, September 21st, 1996, two more bodies are found in dense woods in Inglewood, Sarasota County, by more hog hunters. The skeletal remains had been there at least six months to a year, or less than 20 miles from where the other remains been found. however authorities did not think they were related to the hog trail murders but now you know some people do think they're related scarier if they're not related right just some other fucking creep just dumping bodies in the woods October 9th 1996 prosecutors finally publicly labeled Danny a suspect in the five murders

we've gone over at his bond hearing and his bond is set at five million dollars detective Rick Hobbs said in court the ammo used in the attempted murder of Stanley Burden matched the ammo of the serial killer's expected in the five murders exactly. Danny's defense attorney argued there was not enough evidence for the murder charges, though. January 4th, 1997, Danny's mother, Alice, passes away in the midst of these legal proceedings, her age not listed in sources, and what a shitty time to die as a parent when your kid's

about to go to trial for murder? I guess better than dying right after they're found guilty of murder. February 25, 1997, Daniel Conahan, Jr., indicted for first-degree murder, sexual battery and kidnapping in the death of Richard Montgomery, the murder where they had the most evidence due to his body being so fresh when they found it. The charges in the Stanley Burden case are dropped the following month, meaning Danny will only go to trial for one victim. Prosecutors felt like this was the crime they had enough evidence for, and if found guilty, he would be eligible for the death penalty. A few months later, Danny's father, Dan Senior, dies May 15,

1997, at Fawcett Hospital in Port Charlotte. He's 70 years old. Man, both parents die between his arrest and trial. I wonder how much the stress and shame of it all, you know, helped kind of accelerate their deaths. Week later, May 21st, 1997, more skeletal remains are found in a grassy clearing

in a remote area of woods in northern Charlotte County. The bones were found by Dale Wahlburn who was clearing some pepper trees. Walburn uprooted tree when a skull and some bones fell out of the backhoe he's operating. And then Dale,

and this is so ridiculous, he sets the bones in his truck and then gets back to work just finishes his work day he wasn't going to let no skeleton fuck I was plans the landowner eventually called the police 29 hours later

say what you want about Dale Walburn just don't say he doesn't take his work very seriously this was the six set of remains found in Port Charlotte and Northport deputies were not able to determine conclusively if Daniel Conahan was connected to the remains

but he was now the prime suspect The latest victim was labeled John Doe No. 4, even though we already have a John Doe number 4 in this case. Because of the excavation, any evidence left of the scene was sadly destroyed. In the coming months, Danny's trial will be delayed repeatedly. He dismissed his attorneys, accusing them of lying, perjury, and witness tampering, accusing his own attorneys of that. Also put in a request for antidepressants. Danny admitted to picking up men on the streets, taking them into the woods for paid sex, photographing them, discussing bonding, but claims he never actually tied anybody up.

That's fucking ridiculous. Do I talk to a lot of people about bondage? Oh, yeah, so many people, constantly asking people. If they will go into the woods with me and take, you know, photos of them being tied to a tree, do I do that? No, of course not. No, it's just fun to ask. Nonsense.

Danny's attorney, Mark Albrand, said to the AP about his client, he's either an innocent man who's going to the chair or the most depraved sick individual you'll meet. I feel like Mark didn't care for his client. March 16th, 1998, at 2nd John Doe number four, identified his 24-year-old William Billy Charles Patton. He was identified by comparing skeletal DNA to his parents' DNA. The coroner estimated Billy had been dead for several years.

He was working as a landscaper back in 1993 when he disappeared. He was reported missing by his family almost three weeks after. He was last seen carrying a cooler of beer towards the Baron Collier Bridge, which connects Punta Gorda to Port Shard. A few months later, June 28th, 1999, Daniel Conahan agreed to give a jailhouse interview to reporters. Just two months before his trial was scheduled to start. They won't get much info from him.

All he did was maintain his innocence, say he was going to be railroaded at trial. Two days later, June 30th, investigators publicly identified John Doe No. 3, who have been found back on March 7, 1996. This is the body that was found by a dude traveling down route 75 in Northport, who pulled over off a Laramie circle to take a piss. Then as he walked past a tree line, he found a nude male corpse propped a face-up, arms laid out straight in the shape of a cross. The guy had been killed 10 days earlier, stabbed four times, his genitals surgically removed. He was 36-year-old John William Melagrano, originally from Cleveland, or, I'm sorry, Melarogno. Originally from Cleveland, Ohio, John moved to Northport in November of 1995, with two women believed to be sex workers.

Daniel Conahan's trial for the murder of Richard Montgomery began August 9th, 1999 now. He'd waived his right to a jury trial instead opted for a bench trial. And a bench trial is a trial decided solely by a judge, who acts as both judge and jury. When can you request one of these? Well, as a defendant in a criminal trial, you can waive your right to a jury with a written waiver, and then you still need the prosecutor's consent and the court's approval. The prosecution in this case obviously agreed, and they also, sought the death penalty due to the barbaric nature of Richard's murder.

Unfortunately, though, investigators will not be allowed to bring up other murder cases at the trial. Assistant State Attorney Bob Lee said during his opening statement for the prosecution, the evidence will show that the defendant has a very dark fantasy, a dark fantasy that he would act out with very deadly consequences. He spoke of Daniels, stalking the streets, looking for men like a hunter, looking for prey, offering desperate victims, money before assaulting and killing them. He talked about how a combination of deviant fantasies and a paranoid personality led him to murder Richard Montgomery, a high school dropout who abused drugs and alcohol, making him easy prey because he often needed money.

The prosecution also described how Richard was found near the remains of Kenneth Lee Smith, who'd been bludgeoned and sexually assaulted. They couldn't say that Danny had also killed Kenny, but they could lay out some puzzle pieces and let the judge connect the dots. They spoke of how Danny had cut off Richard General's quote With near medical perfection Using surgical techniques he had learned in nursing school Lee told the court quote He did this because he felt that if he left him on the victim

Investigators would take saliva samples And his DNA would have linked him to the murder His terrible lust and passion spent And his dark fantasy fulfilled He walked away with his gruesome trophy in his hand I wonder if Danny took the genitals for other reasons right, too. Enacts some dark sexual fantasy with him later.

And then it was the defense's turn to make their case. Defense attorney Mark Albrand acknowledged that Dan was attracted to men, but maintained he was not aggressive, saying, quote, this man is on trial not because he is guilty of the offense, but because he has adopted a lifestyle, which is similar to their scenario as to who killed Richard Montgomery. He matched their little profile. Ah, pretty fucking specific little profile, dude. as far as I know it is not a common sexual fantasy

for gay men to take other gay men out into the woods and tie them to trees I mean bondage is a fantasy oh yeah very common tying a dude that you just fucking

picked up off the street to a tree way out in the woods that can't be super common makes me picture somebody giving up on hiking like if it was super common they're just so tired

of just trying to go for a nice little hike taking some peaceful nature and it's just fucking one dude and a gimp mask after another Just fucking tree after tree Just guys in leather harnesses

And chaps You know Fucking getting lightly whipped And fucked and fucked Just come on guys God damn Get a room For the love of God

This is not the vista I came up here to see The defense argued That Dan's back problems Made him incapable of committing the murder Saying They're describing this as a very brutal Physically demanding thing

And he was on his butt For about two, three weeks And was bedridden for a couple months no he wasn't I do not think he was bedridden for months I mean the police surveilled him for weeks he was very active didn't seem all gimped up

to the underdecover detectives you know he was spending time with the prosecution called on Richard's friend slash former roommate Bobby Whitaker who had lived with him for about four months he described Richard as somebody who lived a carefree lifestyle like hanging out with friends playing duns and dragons

hell yeah like drinking said he had difficulty keeping a job as mentioned earlier he last saw Richard the night of April 16th, 96, when Richard told him he's going out to make 200 bucks, walked towards the Cox Lumberyard where he was presumably picked up and then never seen again. Whitaker, in a rare win for the defense, did concede that Richard did not specify it was Dan he was going to meet with, although he had been talking about Dan quite a bit recently. Dr. Riazal, Imami, the medical examiner of Sarasota County, testified that at some point after he died,

Richard was sexually mutilated with a knife for his scalpel. And glad to hear that, yeah. that he was not castrated while still alive. I know I mentioned that before. Hopefully he wasn't. Not that he still didn't die in terror, but at least didn't die in that kind of terror. Dan's former boyfriend,

how Lindy testified that Danny told him about his fantasy of tying dudes to trees, having sex with him in the woods, but didn't believe Danny ever acted on this fantasy or killed anybody. Lindy said, quote, they're making some big deal out of this. I don't think the man is guilty,

and I don't think he did anything. Danny apparently wept during Harold's testimony. a rare moment of showing emotion for him Even though Hal did not think Danny did it testifying about the whole fucking tying dudes To Trees, fantasy obviously does not help Danny's case Court also heard from John Cecil Newman Who was serving time for manslaughter

In a Florida prison In a Florida prison Newman and Danny met while Danny was in Lee County jail After being charged in the Stanley Burden case Danny originally told Newman He didn't know Richard Montgomery Never met him Who is this rich guy?

Oh man, such a shame what happened to him I never met him. Then later he admitted, oh, yeah, okay. I guess I did meet him. We did go on a few beer runs together, now that I recall. Oh, you know what? Actually, I did go to his house on several occasions. I did hang out with him and his sister and got to know them both.

Oh, you know what? We did go to a bank together once. Come to think of it, I definitely did know him and we were acquaintances. Newman said, quote, the comment he made to me at one time was that Montgomery was a mistake. Hmm. During cross-examination, the defense suggested that Newman received a reduced sentence

from first-degree murder to manslaughter in exchange for his bullshit testimony. Then Stanley Burden takes a stand, the one that got away, one of the prosecution's star witnesses. Stanley told the court, quote, I live the attack every night. You don't forget nothing. It just beats at you and beats

at you and tears you apart. Stanley testified that he first met Danny at Lion's Park. He was down on his luck when Danny offered him $150 to pose for some nude photos. He needed the money and he agreed. The next day, said he met Danny in the parking lot of a restaurant, got under the car, they went out to an isolated hog trail

where Danny asked if he had ever had photos taken in bondage. Stanley said no, and Danny said, I'll show you how. And then Danny began to lightly tie Stanley's hands around a tree, take a few photos, you know, his hands are tied up in a way that if he wanted to break loose, he could, you know, no reason to be nervous. Stanley said he felt awkward and alarmed when Danny then tied a rope around his neck. Stanley testified, he said, here, I'm just going to drape this around your shoulders

and take some pictures. Then he yanked straight back into the tree. Then the tone of their little photo shoot changed dramatically. Stanley said that Danny was sweating, cursing while attempting to strangle Stanley as I went over earlier saying, why don't you die, you son of a bitch? Stanley continued, he tried with everything he could to kill me. You got your foot on the back of the tree, you're pulling with everything you've got and it don't work.

What would you do? It was like he gave up. If he didn't have somewhere to go that day, I believe he would have tried to stand there and keep going. The defense contended that Danny admitted to being with Stanley in August of 1994, but that Stanley refused to be photographed naked, and they had consensual sex instead. They noted that Danny was also held on those charges for a year while investigators tried to build a case against him,

and the state later dropped those charges. They brought up Burden's 10 to 25 years sentence for sexually assaulting a 12-year-old boy in Ohio. That obviously didn't look good. Yeah, Stanley Burden, not a good dude. Not all victims are, right? sometimes one piece of shit attacks another piece of shit. Sometimes the victim of a very terrible crime is a monster, not all that different from the one that's attacking them.

I forget that sometimes. A burden admitted to having used cocaine, alcohol, other drugs around the time of the attack. He claimed that Danny's attack on him, led him to assault that boy. Okay. Also said, quote, How do you know that I would ever have did that? The kid asked me for sex. He said he was starting his puberty or whatever.

That's what he wanted. So that's what he got. Stanley doesn't seem very smart And also Fucking dirtbag That's fucked up Stanley The kid wanting to be fucked If that's even true

Not justification Actually fucked the kid That's not how that works That can't be a thing You used to defend yourself I know how fuck this kid But hey The kid wanted to be fucked

Who might have to deny A kid what he wants During I hope somebody didn't Play that out of context Around other people in public That's not something you want to have other people hear you listen to,

hey, sometimes kids ask to be fucked, and you know what, you do your good citizen duty, and you fuck some kids. During cross-examination, Stanley was asked if he was a habitual liar. He said there was a time he was. That's also a weird thing. I used to be a fucking pathological liar,

but now I'm not. Yes, I am. No, I'm not. Yes, I am. He said there was a time when he was acknowledged not being truthful to Fort Myers' detectives investigating the assault and attempted murder. He said he initially lied to escape prostitivism,

charges because he agreed to have sex with Dan for money, but that this later haunted him. Stanley said, quote, it's something that has been hitting me in the head. When I sleep at night, things blur out at me. I can't sleep because of it. You shouldn't be able to sleep because you fuck that kid. Maybe that's something that you shouldn't be able to sleep for. So the prosecution star witness is far from perfect. Thankfully, they still have a solid case, you know, without this guy. Another important witness is Paula Sauer, a microanalyst with the F-D-L-E, she analyzed 15 types of fiber from Danny Boy's home, his father's Mercury Capri, which he sometimes drove, and his Plymouth Station wagon. A 16th-type fiber found on the property

matched fibers on a rope that was used in the attempted strangulation of Stanley Burton. In, quote, an uncommon pink fiber called polypropylene was found on Richard Montgomery's body and was later matched to a length of rope in Danny's father's car. Senior crime lab analyst Janice Taylor also testified, and this is huge, testified that the paint chip found in Richard's pubic hair was a perfect match for a paint chip taken from Danny's father's Mercury Capri. When Mary Ellen Montgomery West,

Richard's mother testified, there was some drama in the courtroom. She testified that her son told her that he was proposition to do nude modeling, and when she said that, Dan, muttered quietly, she's lying, and then shouted, You're a liar! Cannot imagine that won him any points with the judge.

yelling at the mother of a murder victim. The defense argued that Mary Ellen made no such mention during sworn statements previously. The state also had evidence that on the day of Richard's disappearance, April 16th, 1996, at 6.07 p.m. Danny's credit card had been used to buy clothesline, Polaroid film, pliers, and utility knife from a Walmart in Punta Gorda.

And at 6.12 p.m., Danny withdrew funds from an ATM, not far from this Walmart. So that doesn't look good at all. Now, finally, it is Danny's turn to get on the witness stand. He denies ever meeting Richard Montgomery, which I do not think was a good call, since there was so many fucking people who said they for sure knew each other and testified as such. He admitted to having a bondage fetish, also acknowledged having a sexual encounter with Stanley Burden in the summer of 94,

said he did not remember the exact date but claimed it was not August 15th because he had a nursing clinical from 5.45 a.m. to 1.30 p.m. that day. testified that on the day of the encounter with Stanley he arrived at Fort Myers in Fort Myers saw Stanley walking on Highway 41 near Lions Park said he tapped his horn Stanley put his thumb out, grabbed his crotch apparently that was a signal for Will Fuck for money or something

Danny said he turned around and Stanley got into the car Danny offered him 20 bucks for mutual oral sex Stanley accepted he said he then directed Danny to a wooded area two miles away there they went down on each other and Danny paid him is 20 bucks for a 69 seem cheap to you seems cheap to me uh he said that he uh then took stanley back to the park so he could keep working danny then asked if he would pose for some new bondage photos stanley wouldn't do it but he said he had a friend who'd be interested uh danny denied stanley uh or excuse me danny denied tying stanley up or trying to kill him and said he did not see him again after that encounter also claimed he did not remember sharing a fantasy about tying a man up in the woods with howlindy but did acknowledge that he was having him having such that that fantasy.

August 16th, 1999, the defense gets a win. The sexual battery charge against Danny is dismissed after a medical examiner testifies there's no signs of semen on Richard Montgomery, no trauma to the anus. But then the very next day, August 17th, the prosecution gets a huge win. Daniel Conahan Jr. found guilty of the murder of Richard Montgomery. The judge reached the verdict within 15 minutes after closing statements were given. For the sentencing phase, after getting his ass whipped by the judge, Danny opted to have a jury decide his fate. He's also granted a change of venue due to extensive media coverage,

and then the penalty hearing is postponed and moved to Naples and Collier County about 60 miles south. Then in mid-October, Danny argues that his two trial attorneys failed to give him an adequate defense. He claimed they did not argue that an investigator altered witness statements, nor point out that one of the state's witnesses committed perjury. But then the judge was like, dude, shut the fuck up. He found that the attorneys had provided an adequate defense and informed Danny he would be on his own if he chose to fire them now.

So he doesn't fire them. Penalty phase begins as scheduled. November 1st, 1999. The jury hears about Howard during an interview, that one I played a few snippets from earlier. Danny had talked about his bondage fantasy. Jurors few photos of Richard Montgomery's mutilated body. Lee County Medical Examiner, Dr. Carol Husser,

testified that being killed by strangulation requires applying pressure for a length of time, notwithstanding the fact that the victim loses consciousness after just a few seconds. Dr. Cuser said that Richard was likely conscious long enough to realize what was happening to him that to be killed in that manner would be terrifying for the victim.

Danny's aunt, Betty Wilson, testified that her nephew was a jovial person who participated in family activities and cared for his alien mother before she had died. She said, quote, he was gentle, he was comforting. He couldn't have been nicer. Robert Lindy and his daughter, Nancy Thompson, the father and sister of Howell Lindy,

testified that Danny was like a son and a brother to them that Danny had helped both Hal and Nancy overcome alcoholism. Jurors were not told about the four other murders or that Kenneth Smith's body

was found next to Richard Montgomery's. They weren't allowed to hear that since Danny had not been charged with those murders. During closing statements, the prosecutor told the jury that Danny had murdered Richard for sexual gratification

that there were two faces to Danny, a kind and caring man who was accepted into his boyfriend's family, he's a second son and a killer with dark sexual fantasies, right? Good old compartmentalization, the serial killer's calling card. At the end of the proceedings, Danny became openly furious with his attorney, Paul Sullivan. During his closing argument, Sullivan told the jury that Danny had committed the murder for the Fort Myers news press.

Danny stood up then and said, I do not know Mr. Montgomery, nor did I ever. I did not kill this man. I am not going to sit here while you tell them that. the jury was now ordered out of the courtroom The judge told Danny he could be quiet Or he could be bound and gagged Danny said he wanted to leave But he stayed in court on the advice of his attorneys

Not sure what Danny's attorney's strategy was there Ladies and gentlemen of the jury Did my client, Daniel Conahan, kill Richard Montgomery Oh yeah, big time He's found guilty The judge took like two seconds to find him guilty He was very guilty. Did he tie Richard to a tree,

strangle him and cut his junk off? Yeah. Oh, yeah. Sure did. But should he be put to death for those crimes? Oh my God, yes. Now, he's guilty of way more than that one terrible murder. Like, he has told me so much shit, you guys.

It's fucking unreal. It's like horrible, murdery. I can never get it out of my head, evil shit. He's the fucking worst. The absolute worst. That'd be awesome. Awesome, if a defense attorney just did that one. Anyway, November 3rd, 1999,

the jury took just 22 minutes to vote for the death penalty. And a little over a month later, December 10th, 1999, Danny formally is sentenced to death. Judge William Blackwell said during sentencing, it is obvious that during this or imprisoned against his will, such confinement against his will was for the most obvious purpose of inflicting bodily harm upon the victim or terrorizing him.

The crime was especially heinous, atrocious and cruel. Two medical examiners testified that many of Montgomery's wounds were inflicted before he died. May God have mercy on his soul. The trial and sentencing were now over, but a huge question still remained, was Daniel Conahan not just the murderer of one but the serial killer, known as the Hog Trail killer? Well, the evidence certainly adds up. All of the Hog Trail victims were found within a 10-mile radius of each other and also within 10 miles of Danny's home. The evidence at the crime scenes, such as the missing genitals on several victims

suggested one perpetrator with the same uber-specific M.O., same M.O. used on Richard Montgomery. Police suspected that Danny got rid of the body parts he severed in biohazard containers that he got through work at the hospital. But since he was already on death row and because of the extreme state of decomposition

most of the remains were found in and the transient hard partying hanging out with lots of strange people in strange places, nature of many of his victim's lives, Danny was never charged with any of the other murders. one officer closed the investigation did tell a reporter that the murders were committed in such a unique and distinctive way

it was extremely unlikely that anyone else did it and I would agree and then after Daniel Conahan was convicted and sentenced more potential victims were found in the years after the trial more bodies most people familiar with this case a tribute to Daniel Owen Conahan Jr. On October 19th, 2002 individuals

found some skeletal remains in a wooded clearing south of Peachtland Boulevard and Murdoch, Murdoch, less than 10 miles from Punta Gorda, across Charlotte Harbor. The remains of Billy Patton believed to be a victim of the hog trail killer found in a wooded area visible from a previous crime scene from May 21, 1997,

when Dale Walburn had found that skeleton and just kept on trucking, the close proximity supporting suspicion that the victims were killed, you know, the close proximity supported suspicion that the victims had been killed by the same person. January of 2001, some landscapers found more human bones on group or hole drive in Boca Grand in Lee County. Boca Grand, just 30 miles from Punta Gorda.

On November 28, 2001, during construction near U.S. 41 in Charlotte Harbor, crews find another set of human remains, later determined to be male. So many bodies. Just over a month later, on January 6, 2002, county employees find human remains near a landfill off Zimel Road in Punta Gorda. The body remains aren't identified to this day, but the case is being treated as a homicide. Danny Dickhead appealed his lone homicide conviction before the Florida Supreme Court, September of 2001. His new public defender argued that the state did not provide or, excuse me, did not prove premeditation and that Richard Montgomery had died during a sexual game gone wrong. The state, meanwhile, argued that Danny's purchasing of ropes, a knife, and withdrawing money from an ATM right before he fucking took him out of the wood, showed premeditation. nearly two years later, January 16th, 2003, the Florida Supreme Court affirmed Danny's conviction and death sentence.

And then six years later, a whole bunch of more bodies are found. And many think that Danny is responsible for all these victims as well. On March 23rd, 2007, the skeletal remains of eight different people are found in a wooded area in Fort Myers, marking the largest mass grave discovery in Florida history. The victims will become known as the Fort Myers-8. Fort Myers just 24 miles from Punta Gorda An ecologist who was surveying a 10-acre wooded lot off of Arcadia Street when they found a sinker

They were they were surveying this 10-acre wooded lot off Arcadia Street When they found a single human skull Police brought in cadaver dogs And soon they discovered the remains of seven additional people Damn There were no personal effects No clothing left with any of the victims All the skeletons were labeled and brought to the medical examiner's office in Fort Myers

DNA samples extracted from each. The medical examiner determined the victims were all white males between the ages of 21 and 40. There was no blunt force trauma. None of the victims had been shot or stabbed, leading the medical examiner to believe the cause of death was strangulation. The victims were likely dumped there 10, 12 years prior based on vegetation growth, where the bones were found putting their time of death in the mid-1990s. The full range estimates that the victims were killed between 1980 and 2000. Most of the bones were covered

haphazardly by nature. Some intentionally uncovered according to Detective Jennifer Soto, quote, human touch came into play and actually messed with the bones or replaced the bone. Investigators were actually able to tell

where the sun hit the bones before and after they were tampered with. Some of the victims had received dental care such as braces, wisdom teeth extraction, fillings, crowns not typically characteristic of homeless individuals.

One man had suffered for a broken wrist at some point prior in his life. The estimated times of death led the police to suspect the Fort Myers-8, very possibly related to the Hog Trail murders. Additionally, Stanley Burden had been attacked within just a single mile of this grave site. On November 21st, 2007, two of the Fort Myers-8 are identified through DNA samples provided by relatives. The victims identified as 21-year-old Eric D. Kohler and 26-year-old John C. Blevins. Both men had gone missing in 1995.

John of a living in the Fort Myers area and sadly never officially reported missing Eric was living with his grandparents Janice and David Kohler at 1174 Winston Street in Port Charlotte both John and Eric had criminal records Eric had spent six months in jail

in April of 95 for pass and forged checks he had misdemeanor convictions for trespassing disorderly intoxication open container disorderly conduct failure to obey a traffic control device charges range from August of 1993 to deliver to July of 1995, Eric's aunt, who lived out of state,

called the Charlotte County Sheriff's Office in 1999 to report him missing. She said he had been living with his grandparents, left her home with 95, and hadn't been heard from since. John Burt, Jr., who went by the alias of John C. Blevins, arrested several times in Fort Myers in 87 and 88 by the same officer for misdemeanor offenses, including loitering, prowling, possession of drug paraphernalia, solicitation for prostitution.

Blevins was his adoptive name, which is why I was used to identify him in the news release. Burt, who listed the same date of birth as Blevins, November 19th, 1969, pleaded guilty in April of 1988 to misdemeanor possession of drug paraphernalia, ordered, or was sentenced to time served and fine hundred bucks. Then a third victim identified, September 21st, 2008, Jonathan James Tehaye. Jonathan, either 25 or 26, when he died, lived for a time with his family in North Fort Myers. died in 1995 or 96. Last scene, October of 95 in Fort Myers, when he had called to ask his mom for some money. The sister came forward after the case, received national attention.

All of these men live in similar lives to the lives of Danny's other victims, right? Lives of little to know, financial stability, criminal records, partying, committing, you know, like these petty crimes, desperate, making poor decisions. Over a decade then passed, with no updates in the case. but in recent years, there have been some significant developments. June 9th, 2021, John Doe No. 1 found February 1st, 1994, is now identified as Gerald Lombard. Authority still believe Lombard, a victim of Danny Conahan. June of 2013, Heather Walsh Haney, a forensic anthropologist at Florida Gulf Coast University,

had submitted John Doe No. 1's tooth to the University of North Texas Center for Human Identification for Development of DNA. and entry into the national missing and unidentified persons, Namus, and the combined DNA index system, CODIS. Namus determined there was remaining DNA available for further testing. Nearly seven years later, January of 2020, it's crazy the fucking path to stuff takes. The Charlotte County Sheriff's Office contacted Steve Kramer, Associate Division Counsel, FBI, Los Angeles,

and the FBI Forensic Genetic Genealogy team leader after receiving his info from their regional coordinator of the NamUs program. The FBI recommended they contact Dr. Ed Green now at the Biomolecular Engineering Department Laboratory at the University of California, Santa Cruz, who said the lab could process the remaining DNA and determine if it was suitable for genetic genealogy.

February 5th, 2020, the Charlotte County Sheriff's Office released a new rendering of what John Doe No. 1 might have looked like, hoping a member of the public would recognize him. A clay model had been previously used, but the new rendering was made with the help of the Palm Beach County forensic imaging unit and some new technology. Meanwhile, the DNA sent to California in June of 2020, and in December of 2020, the police advised there was sufficient DNA to send to Fulgent Labs now for additional sequencing and genealogy

searches. Processing there complete February of 2021. The file then forwarded to the FBI office in Los Angeles and the information uploaded into available databases. The cold case team receives the likely family name and potential relatives of John Doe number one now. Fucking amazing. Forensic technology, it just keeps advancing. Man, thank you, scientists. In April of 2021, the team gets some DNA from Jerry's sister, brother, and son. The DNA sent to the FDLE lab May of 2021.

June that year, FDLE confirms it's a positive match. A woman believed to have been Jerry's niece had also submitted her DNA to Ancestry.com, which is likely how this match was made. holy shit what a fucking journey jerry lombard born in massachusetts august 30th 1962 grew up in lull one of 17 siblings his family had not heard from him since 91 or 92 he'd become a drifter it was normal for him to disappear for very long periods of time not contact anybody uh his sister carroll told fox four news that she did not think the family would ever learn what would happen to him or what had happened to him and she confirmed that the last time she had talked to him

was way back in 91. Anyone who knew Jerry or may have seen him with Daniel Conahan can still call the Charlotte County Sheriff's Office at 941-639-2101. Oh man, what a journey again. September 6, 2022, Bobby Sodan, identified as one of the Fort Myers-8. Sodan, the fourth set of remains to be identified,

the Fort Myers Cold Case Unit, work with the FDLE, and a private company called Parabon Nanolabs. to conduct a genealogy research program working with some DNA collected from the skeletal remains based on the data a family tree developed

was developed that gave the person's probable identity. Fort Myers Police then located direct relatives completed direct DNA comparison with the FDLE which confirmed soden's identity. Crazy that at any point the police could just call you like hey can you just give some DNA

not because you're a suspect but just because they think that you might be a distant relative of you know like a body they found Bobby was around 30 the last time he was seen alive. Investigators did link Bobby to the Fort Myers area around the time of his last contact. His family was in New Jersey, North Carolina, and Washington State.

Anyone who may remember Bobby can contact the Fort Myers Police Department, cold case unit with info at 239-32188040. And you can remain anonymous. To date, four of the Fort Myers-8 remain unidentified, victims, A, B, F, and G. But you can view their facial reconstructions online. In July 2024, the unidentified remains found in Punta Gorda back on January 6, 2002 were identified. 44-year-old Alejandro Narciso Lago. Alejandro last seen November 17th, 2001 in Miami, reported missing by his mother, December 27th that year.

Charlotte County Sheriff's Office still seeking info that would help identify his killer and determine why he was in Charlotte County. You could call 941-639-21 for that. In January of this year, 2025 news outlets reported that Danny Conahan was asking for some new DNA testing himself. He asked for five items to be re-examined. A hair found on a sheet used to wrap one of the victims, two cigarette butts, and fingernail clippings from a left and a right hand. No decision has been made yet on the retesting. He still awaits execution on Florida's death row. He's incarcerated at Union Correctional Institution, formerly referred to as Florida State Prison.

also known as Rayford Prison, located near the little 200-ish-person town of Rayford, Florida, which is between Jacksonville and Gainesville. Same prison that Ted Bundy spent his final days in, where he died. Danny's execution not been set as of this recording. He's 71 years old. He'll probably die natural causes before he's executed. There are currently 265 inmates,

awaiting execution on Florida's death row as I record this. So he's got a long line. He's a part of. Good job, soldier. You've made it back. Barely. Before I share some final thoughts on all this, we have a very cool sponsor.

I know we haven't had some extra sponsors in a few weeks. Very excited to have landed this one. Today's time suck is brought to you by America's favorite animated buddy cop Duo, Hollywood, and Speed Bump. Come on, Speed Bump, forget what Bojang was said. Let's take this dirty drug dealing push down now. Slow down, Hollywood.

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Saturday morning at 8, right after a replay of Roy Disney and Pat Sayjack's classic cartoon movie, Gerbil Team 6 escape from Richard Gear, only on Channel 7 kids. Hollywood and Speedbump, keep when the streets clean, one paw at a time. Well, that legit sounds like a cartoon I would like to watch. Ooh, probably well-stoned. Definitely well-stoned. Okay. The Hog Trail Killer.

Yet another creep covered. Daniel Owen Conahan, Jr., the Hawk Trail Killer, only convicted of one murder, but strongly suspected the prime suspect in over a dozen other murders, including those Fort Myers-8. All white males. One of the biggest questions I'm left with in this case is, what happened to all the Polaroid photos that Dirkbeck? took. I mean, I doubt he got rid of him. He didn't get rid of a lot of other, you know, incriminating

evidence like ropes used in attacks. I imagine he hid those photos somewhere and that they're still hidden. And if they're ever found, you know, a lot more murders will be definitively solved. And imagine walking around near Punta Gorda somewhere. I don't know with a fucking metal detector or something. You find a metal box, you open it up, and you just see photo after photo of murder victims. People being tortured, tied to trees. That would be something you could never and see. Danny has never admitted to doing what sent him to death row. He's maintained his innocence and all the other murders he has suspected in. So we'll never get to hear from him why he did it, but I think it's pretty obvious. You know, he just fixated on a fucking dark fantasy too hard. He fixated on this bondage fantasy. He'd been running through his mind ever since he was living in Chicago, maybe even before that. Very specific fantasy where he wanted to tie up a man, a man he did not know a stranger, right, to a tree out in the woods where, no one could hear him scream where he get to do whatever he wanted to the guy

you know you get to hurt him watch him writhe and tear you know maybe it started out as him just fantasizing about just taking some photos but then that wasn't enough right he wanted this guy to be scared and instead of pumping the brakes instead of thinking like fuck what no this is a creepy fantasy this is dangerous

this revolves around some other person being harmed you know eventually being murdered instead of thinking like I need to get back and see a therapist he let that dark fantasy take over his life, right? We've seen this time and time and time again. Guys, and it always, nearly always is guys when it comes to these sort of crimes. They slowly progress to a place where they are willing to kill others specifically so they

can just come in a very specific way. It's just so pathetic, right? But at least they caught him. And after losing appeal after appeal, I don't think he's ever getting back out. Time for today's takeaways. five takeaways number one Daniel Conahan Jr. grew up in Florida, in an overall normal family, it seems.

Realized he was gay in high school, but it being in the late 60s, early 70s, he knew his parents would not approve, and they sure didn't. Danny joined the Navy after high school, was given a less than honorable discharge under threat of court marshal. During his time in the military, he attempted to lure sailors off base for sex

and physically assaulted a sailor for refusing his sexual advances. Number two, Conahan was in a serious relationship while living in Chicago in the 80s and early 90s. His partner never claimed Danny was violent, but Danny did tell him about a fantasy where he said he wanted to take a hitchhiker to the woods for bondage and sex. Investigators believe Conahan enacted this family over and over again, escalating it eventually to the point of rape and murder. Number three, for years, authorities called the cases of unidentified skeletal remains found in the woods

the hog trail murders. The hog trail killer was not caught until a victim was found, and identified the day after he was killed. Authorities finally set their sights on Daniel Conahan and relentlessly pursued him until they secured enough evidence for an arrest. Number four, in March of 2008, eight bodies were found in the woods of Fort Myers, Florida.

They became known as the Fort Myers-8, the largest mass grave discovery in Florida history. Due to the estimated timing and condition the bodies were found in and their location, authorities strongly suspect that they could be victims of Conahan. Four remain unidentified to this day. And number five, new info identifying the remaining victims. The most challenging of the Fort Myers-Aid to identify has been victim John Doe G.

On 2025, Gulf Coast News reported that a new facial reconstruction could give an idea of what he may have looked like and that the police are working with Virginia-based forensic artist, Joe Mullins. Mullins told Gulf Coast News, doesn't have to be perfect, doesn't have to be a portrait. It just has to spark that recognition. Mollins takes a scan of the victim's skull, works on a 3D printed copy, then works with forensic anthropologists to identify gender, ethnicity, age, and facial features. Mullins explained, quote, it's kind of like doing a portrait but from the inside out. We start with the bare skull, then sculpt the muscles, then go through, put tissue depth markers

based on your age and ancestry. John Doe G is possibly of Lithuanian and South American Hispanic lineage. He was estimated to be between 18 and 35 when he was last seen, had a fracture to his his right hand or wrist prior to his disappearance, likely not from Fort Myers, but may have been familiar to people in the area in the mid-90s, believed to have been homeless and a day worker who may have lived on the street and may have worked odd jobs. Joe Mullins, this guy's had an interesting career. Mullins has been a forensic artist since 1999 when he began to work with the National Center for Missing and Exploited Children. He's helped identify and trace

long-term missing children approximate unknown skeletal remains and reconstruct faces and soft tissue, paving the way for law enforcement to solve their investigations. Mullins does workshops and demonstrations of his work across the globe. He trained as a graphic designer and fine artist before becoming a forensic imaging specialist, first studying at Savannah College of Art and Design in Georgia, then at James Madison University, then attending the FBI Academy for his forensic skills training. And for over a decade, he's been teaching a facial reconstruction. class to graduate students and George Mason University's forensic science program.

In the spring of 2022, he started teaching a forensic figure sculpting class at George Mason School of Art. And now let's hear a little interview he gave about what he does back on May 31st of this year. The difference of being, you know, fine art versus forensic arts, forensic art, you have the parameters. You really don't have an artistic license. You have to follow. It's like paint by numbers and the skull is the of the numbers. You have to make sure it matches, you can't just go off the rails and make it pretty. It has to match the skull underneath and that information we're given to by the medical examiner or the forensic anthropologist. If it's a hard pill to swallow one day one with a walk into a classroom full of artists,

and I hold my hand out figuratively, he's like, okay, give me your artistic license. They give it up very, very reluctantly. But it's a process, you know, trust the process. And as we get through this, it works, it works time and time again. So it's from bare skull to finished facial approximation. And the real hope is that we put the right face on, but the right person still has to see it. So we want to get these out to as many eyes as possible. And somebody can look at these faces, these 15 faces that we've sculpted this week.

And once it goes out in the media, the interviews, It'll go on the NamUs, N-A-M-U-S site. That's where all the unidentified cases go. We want in many eyes as possible and somebody to see these facial approximations and say, hey, I think I know who that is. That looks like my cousin, haven't seen him in 10 years.

And that's how it works. That's so cool. Big thanks to Joe Mullins for what he does. Time suck. Top five takeaways. The Hog Trail Killer has been sucked. Hopefully that wasn't too disjointed. Some of these episodes when they're a little bit not as well known, I should say,

there's not really like the quality of sources is not as good. And so you're just kind of trying to patch a story through a lot of like little snippets and newspaper articles and, you know, interviews here, interview there. And this one was kind of all over the place. Thank you to the bad magic productions team for helping and making time. suck. Thanks to Queen of Bad Magic, Lindsay Cummins. Also to Logan Keith, helping to publish the episode signing merch for the store at

Bad Magic Productions.com. Thanks to Olivia Lee, tracking down a lot of the sources. Also, thanks to the all-seen eyes, moderating the cult of the curious, private Facebook page, Mod Squad, making sure Discord keeps running smooth and everybody over on the TimeSucks subreddit and Bad Magic subreddit.

And now let's head on over to this week's Time Sucker updates. Updates? Get your time. Sucker updates. First up from freshly disturbed long time sucker, Mike Rausch, who wrote in a, sent an email to bow jangles at timesuckpodcast.com with the subject line of just one word. La boo-boo.

Dan, I'm listening to Time Sucks since 2019. Your stand-up even longer than that. And through all these years, I've never felt the need to reach out until now. From all the episodes, nothing has disturbed my brain quite as much as that. fucking La Boo Boo song. I'm an hour and 45 minutes into the episode and I'm losing it. The second I finally get it out of my head, you put it right back in. I consider this assault, and I'm adjusting your star rating to reflect that.

Two out of five stars, please change some things. With love, Mike. Mike, that is totally fair. It is a disturbing song. No one should ever have to hear it. Not ever. No, stop. La pooh, la pooh, come on.

Yeah, thank you for, thank you for bringing that to my attention. And also, for real, thanks for listening for so long. Next up, incredibly, incredibly, incredibly, incredibly, adventurous, sucker, even kale, sent in a message with a subject line of a time, a saga, really, with a subject line of a time sucker became huge in China. This is wild. Greetings, Suckmaster. Long-time listener here from Minnesota,

I've been tuning in since 2017 when I saw Dragon versus Eagle as the episode title, I had a feeling I'd be writing in. The subject line of this email might sound far-fetched, but I had to share this with you and your listeners

since it ties in with my mission of peace and diplomacy. Back when I first started listening, I was chasing the Hollywood dream, writing screenplays, working on low-budget film projects, trying to break through. I got close, but as you know,

show business can be brutal, and it didn't quite pan out. Around the same time, I discovered time suck. I was ready for a change. I was waiting tables with a degree in Japanese studies from the University of Minnesota and not much to show for a decade of chasing dreams. My big wild plan back then,

adapting Japanese anime into big-budget live-action scripts. Like I said, crazy. I pivoted from screenplays to books, self-published a few, but still nothing took off. Then in 2019, just before turning 30, I got a tip that an elderly man who owned a gold, silver, and collectibles shop was looking for an apprentice. I begged him for a job. I took a leap of faith.

He was old school, so I digitized his business and started using social media to bring in customers under the name of Pawn Man. It exploded, but he didn't get it. And he gave me an ultimatum, shut down the social media, or be fired. I quit instead. And I opened up my own store, St. Louis Park, Gold, and Silver. And that's in a Minneapolis, just for you guys listening, not in St. Louis, Missouri. I sold everything.

I owned and took out short-term high-interest loans from a few supporters. It worked. I kept using social media to bring in inventory, creating videos about the history and intrigue behind the items. People mailed me. I bought and sold what came in with one rule, no war criminal material that belonged to museums. In August of 2022,

I had around 100,000 followers on TikTok. When someone sent me a war, a World War II photo album from the Pacific Theater. The quality was stunning, but a few pages in, I found horrific images of mass killings in China. Having studied Japanese history, I knew what I was seen. The word Nanking appeared several times, and I thought these might be photographs of the Nanking or Nanjing massacre, one of China's darkest historical chapters. I made a TikTok video asking for help, getting the album to a museum.

Overnight, it became one of the most viewed videos of 2022, and my life turned upside. down. Turned out the photos were not from Nanjing, but from the Battle of Shanghai, which preceded it. The internet branded me a villain, claiming I staged a hoax or used war crimes for fame. I received death threats, from people accusing me of exploitation, from militant deniers insisting Japan had done nothing wrong. It was terrifying. Even stranger, I was called a hero in China for bringing attention to the tragedy. Chinese people started showing up at my store, crying, hugging me, giving me flowers. It was truly surreal. to be so hated and so loved at the same time. My brain melted. I was featured in Newsweek,

Rolling Stone, the New Yorker, mostly in a negative light. I lost 20 pounds in a few weeks, started suffering panic attacks, a lot more than that, but I won't go into the details. In the end, I paid the man who sent me the photo album $1,000 out of pocket, contacted the Chinese embassy, and donated it to them. In November of 2022, they flew two ambassadors to Minneapolis to meet me in person. It just felt like the right thing to do. do. The book had become a symbol of the Nanjing massacre, an essential piece of Chinese history, and who was I, a white American, to decide where it should belong? It didn't matter that I had made a mistake. The video had already educated millions, and donating the album to the Chinese government

was the most honest way to show that my intentions were genuine, and that I truly wanted to do the right thing. The story went viral worldwide, shining a light on a chapter of history most Westerners had never even heard of. In gratitude, the Chinese government awarded me a Guo Li-C, a diplomatic porcelain gift traditionally reserved for presidents and heads of state. I'm the only living private citizen ever to receive one. Two years later, I decided to visit China to pay my respects. When I arrived in November of last year, I walked out a baggage claim to an army of journalists and more than 10 million people tuned in to the live stream of my arrival.

I ended up staying for 74 days on what was supposed to be a 30-day visit. The trip changed my life all over again. I've since made it my mission to use my platform to build a bridge of peace and understanding between the U.S. and China. Tensions between our countries are higher than ever, and it's been far too long since an American has both been well-respected and genuinely popular in China. Just last week, I was invited to Washington, D.C., for a private meeting with a Chinese ambassador to the U.S. I still own my store and return every few months to film Pondman content, but most of my time now is devoted to this work in cultural diplomacy. Many Chinese people tell me that when they think of Americans, they think of me. And that means more than I can ever express.

Dan, I'm sharing all this because time suck has been a huge influence on me. You've always encouraged curiosity and critical thinking, and that message stuck with me. Before traveling to China, I studied the language, read deeply, and challenge everything I'd been told. Western media paints China as an oppressive dystopia, and I believe that too. But what I found on the ground was the opposite. Kindness, community, a sense of unity. I honestly miss back home. don't judge a book by its cover

read it for yourself and if you don't like it at least you gave it a try. There are some countries you shouldn't travel to but China is definitely not one of them. I know I might sound biased but I would encourage you, anyone listening to go see it firsthand. It's extremely easy and affordable to go there. The world would be a better place if more people stepped

outside of their comfort zones and saw things for themselves. So true. Travel builds understanding in ways headlines never can. Also so true. Thank you for the years of education, and perspective time suck has been a constant my life and your work has inspired me more than you know all the best evan kale pawn man p s please cover the nonjing massacre sometime it's not an easy subject to cover but it's very important people should know about it it isn't taught in western schools the same way the german holocaust is but it should be well heaven holy shit uh what a message dude i will be honest at first i thought it sounded too

crazy to be true but i googled around and i was able to yeah quickly verify all this you've gotten so much press this this situation has gotten so many views it's fucking crazy what a fascinating life you have made for yourself right hail nimrod a hundred times over man so cool talk about taking the road less traveled very quick i i've never covered the nonjing master or fully indirectly, as in it's having its own episode. But I have briefly covered it in, you know, several China-related episodes.

And yeah, it probably does deserve a deep dive. And yeah, just like with Russia, while I do have problems with China's government in many ways, but I also have problems with our fucking government, but I have more problems with China's governments, being authoritarian in certain ways that don't exist here, at least not yet. I hope it never comes across that I judge Chinese people

for the actions of their government. Just like many of us in America, most of us, I would argue, do not feel at any given time that our government is a fair representation of who we are, what we believe in. China's government, like Russia's government, like any nation's government, does not fully represent the people. I would love to visit. My sister Donna, who's a teacher, took a bunch of students to China several years back, had such an amazing time. There's so much history. Man, the one place my pop award wanted to go travel and see that he never did that he talked about for years was the Great Wall of China. he that was like if he could visit like one place on earth that was what he wanted to visit i would

love to visit it my sister did so much culture there uh so much good to be learned about and appreciated and just good on you for immersing yourself showing their culture so much respect uh that's such a beautiful thing that to not judge a book by its cover to get out there and see for yourself right it's so much easier to be dismissive and just to other a big group of people uh so much more rewarding though to not do that and like just dig in yeah thanks for keeping that old order of the suck sticker up on the wall at your desk as well uh saw it in a in a video of a local news station doing an interview with you and felt very proud uh yeah just thank you and last up from incredible psychonaut Danny p who wrote it with a subject line of 10 grams of blue penis envy

shrooms in one sitting oops yeah that was an intriguing subject line greetings and salutations sir suck nasty and crew and fellow suckers of Dan's glorious teat long time listener longer fan uh we're talking world's dumbest days holy shit but i digress in regards to the email you received about psychedelic shrooms in episode 474 i figured now would be as good a time as any to write in with my own amazing shroom story a quick suck of myself giggity if you'd allow nice giggedy reference there on 37 i've suffered severely from anxiety and depression my entire life and was diagnosed as an adult with bipolar, too. One of my first memories was an insane panic attack

while being strapped in a car seat in the back of my mom's sedan while she was outside talking with a friend. I was under the age of two, and I remember it so vividly to this day, literally thought my dumb little baby brain that I was going to die or something. Fast forward a few decades of different therapists and specialists and psychologists and psychiatrists

giving me many different medications, some of which made one symptom better while making the other much worse, but finally falling on a combo that doesn't get rid of anxiety or the depression fully, rather just tick it over the line into the manageable zone. Fast forward again, to me finally getting high for the first time at the ripe old age of 33 on the devil's lettuce.

Dramatic music, please. But I will save that story for a different time. The TLDR is that the devil's lettuce, dramatic music or thunder or some type of sound effects, please and thanks, help me more with my anxiety than any SSRI or benz-or or other medication I've taken my entire life. reminder. That's just me. It might be different for everybody. And I hold the same sentiment throughout this email. Fast forward once more to a little over a year ago when after slowly dabbling, experimenting and educating myself of the ways of the magic mushroom, I decided to turn my brain into a bowl of lukewarm rice pudding.

Now, up until this point, the most I'd had was around four or five grams and only had lights look more vibrant and everything felt just super chill and nice, no crazy visuals, no kaleidoscope effect, no time distortion. same as all the other times. So on this day of me picking a big old bouquet of whoopsie daisies, I decided it would be a great idea to eat about 10 grams of blue penis envy caps and stems, idiot, in my apartment alone, idiot, and that's him saying it, not me, and proceeded to go on the wildest ride of my fucking life. For self-therapy purposes, I put on Bob Dylan to make sure I would invoke a certain period of time in my life that was very traumatic.

And not just because I was being forced to listen to Bob Dylan, though that may have had something to do with it. Now, mind you, I'm not a Bob Dylan fan. I'm an old-school punk and metalhead. But on this late sunny afternoon, I was all whiny, nasly Dylan. I knew the mushrooms had kicked in hard when I proceeded to get stuck in the chorus of my boy Bob song,

a hard rain's going to fall for the next eight fucking hours. Now, mind you, in those eight hours, I reverted back to a newborn, laying to my crib in my childhood bedroom. Dan, it was so realistic as if I was actually there living that exact moment again, but also for the first time. Don't forget the background is our dude Dylan telling me a hard rain is going to come

or are going to fall on loop over and over back in the real world only about four minutes have actually passed. I eventually got off my back, wiped the tears away like a big strong man, called my best friend to ask if I was going to die from eating too many mushrooms. Sober me knows this answer. Wrecked puddle of drool me thinks I'm a fucking goner. Cutting to the climax of the trip, I experienced ego death. In my mushy, mushy mushroom mind, I was in limbo.

My soul was trying to get back to the real world and back to my body. I swear I heard paramedics and police come. I felt my body being lifelighted. I heard the hospital machines beeping and I swear I could smell that hospital smell that all hospitals have. Back in my tripping brain, I was given a choice. Give in and take this opportunity of accidentally ODing on psilocybin, impossible idiot, to end it all and just float on for eternity and be at peace with the universe. Or own up to my mistakes and know that when I come out of this,

I will wake up in the hospital on a ventilator. I'll have to relearn everything from speaking to walking and worse of all dealing with the disappointment of my father. In my trip, I chose the path back to my body and the real world and to deal with the consequences of my actions. And Dan, I swear, ever since I had that trip, my depression has been damn near eradicated. My anxiety is even more manageable while still being a dirty, dirty doper. I definitely won't be taking a double hero dose again in my life, but I'm glad I did it once.

I go through life much more positively now I take more time to notice nature and wildlife and try to make as many people smile as I can live and let live but also seriously fuck the human race come on three eye Atlas bullseye baby sincerely yours Danny Danny that was a fucking great message couple sagas this week

I relate to you so much I also try to spread like love and positivity and be kind and care so deeply about so many people while simultaneously wishing that a fucking comet or something would just come down and destroy the entire human race because so many of us suck so fucking hard. Not in the good way. Oh, the bipolar ride of being a real sensitive Sally, I guess.

10 grams is insane. I have not had that much. But I have had various psychedelics turn me into a sniveling slug of a human, convinced I was gone forever, facing various demons that threatened to consume me. such an emotionally exhausting journey but on the other side I also feel so much healing

and such a damn shame that more people can't think critically and look past decades of propaganda and understand how life altering this shit can be how worthy of further study it is one conspiracy I believe in more and more as I get older is that the power as it be do not want us to expand our minds

they want to keep us dumbed down easily manipulated easily controlled so their greedy soulless asses can exploit us further so they can have bigger fucking mega yachts be virtually worshiped by more of the downtrodden so they can have bigger bank accounts, more power than the other evil power players they surround themselves with and just fuck all those people. Man, the real Illuminati doesn't even need to hide. They just

fucking eat it, you know, White House gala's and full view of all. But I digress. I'm glad your depression and anxiety got knocked down several pegs by that magical fungi. I can't wait to take the next trip myself when I'm working a bit less down the road, living and exploring and more. I hope some epic spirit quests await. Got to find some peyote. Thanks for the messages, you beautiful motherfuckers. You all do so much for my mental health on a weekly basis. Truly, I don't think you'll ever fully understand how good it feels to express all these crazy thoughts and not feel alone in them.

Next time, suckers, I needed that. We all did. Well, thank you for listening to another Bad Magic Productions podcast. Happy Halloween. Be sure and rate and review time suck if you haven't already. Please don't try and talk anyone into heading with you into the woods this week. So you can time it to a tree, take some nude photos, unless you own the land and aren't going to kill them. Then by all means, you know, enjoy yourself. Get that wood porn. Hi, ha!

And keep on sucking. This Saturday, lock your doors and hide your trash cans, Miami. Troubles on the prowl. It's bead bump. Those bandits ran it again. They're right in the suburbs. Raccoons, Hollywood, they're raccoons. And they're a lot smarter than you think.

When the Rumble raccoons hit the neighborhood, nothing safe, not even the snacks. You snooze, you lose, coppers. This box of macabre. on his mind. Now it's up to Hollywood in Speedbump to roll up their fur and get to work. Let's get these trash panda speed bump. Slow down.

You're chasing the wrong car again, Hollywood. We need Bojangles. Get us some backup. Don't miss the fur flying action in Hollywood and speed bump. Raccoon Rampage. Saturday morning at 8.30 right after Turbo Karani Turtles

on Channel 7 Kids. It's.