Tin Foil Hat With Sam Tripoli - #397: DB Cooper With The Cooper Vortex's Darren Schafer

Starting point is 00:00:00 Tinfoil Hap. Oh, what the fuck are you guys even talking about? Global controls will have to be imposed. And a world governing body will be created to enforce them. Welcome to Tinfoil Haas. We go deep home, boy. Aaron, open your mic. Drink from the fountain of knowledge.

Starting point is 00:00:27 There's lizard people everywhere. That's some interdimensional mindek. Wake up, Aaron. This is only the beginning. There's, you just move my mind. Are you ready to get your mind blown? Good morning, Swarm. Guys, and welcome to Tim Fall Hat.

Starting point is 00:00:51 You know who I am. You know what I am. You know that name. You know that voice. You know that voice. You know that voice. You know that name. He is the co-host of the hit news show.

Starting point is 00:01:01 We don't smoke the same. Xavier Guerrero. What's up? Looking here, the hair's looking good. You got a pinch of gray meaning you've done something with your life. I'm getting old. He's known as the heartthrob of Tim Foyle Hat apparently. Apparently I'm old dad garbage. My man, Xavier Guerrero out there fucking taking care of the ladies. Uh, where can they find your new podcast? On any podcast app, YouTube, it's just me, Ezone and Cairo and we just we just don't smoke the same, we just get high. So one of you smokes a little, then one of you goes hard in the paint? Yeah and then honestly if you go, if you watch it live on YouTube you can actually donate for me to smoke more.

Starting point is 00:01:42 Smoke more. Yeah, like here's five bucks, smoke more. If you donate enough, if you donate more than $5, Xavier Guerrero will smoke crack. Joining us on the ones and twos. He got a hit new show that everybody's talking about. The latest episode was voted top 400 episode of all time of, uh, in podcasting. We made it back in the top 200 of comedy. Are we back? In the United States? Wow. Yeah, we were for that last

Starting point is 00:02:10 episode. That's awesome dude. Congratulations executive producer. I'm his co-host apparently on the new hit show broke simulation. Johnny. How are you Johnny? I'm okay. It's YouTube.com slash Sam Tripoli Comedy to watch the video. Check it, subscribe there too. And let us know if you don't get the alerts. Johnny, how long have you, you and I've been friends? Um, about three, four years now. And I still haven't met your girlfriend. Anyway... Well, I've only been dating her a year. Well, I've only been dating the time, time, time, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, the the the thi, the thi, to to to to, to to, to, to, to to to to to to to to, to to, to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to the to the the the the the the the the the the the the the thi, the the thi, the the the the the.a, the the the the the.a, the the the.a, thi, to to to thi, to to thi of time we've been a friend doesn't make any sense. So Johnny's some person you went to kindergarten class has met her already and that you haven't

Starting point is 00:02:46 let your boy here? You gotta pay the bills? Yeah. Well, she ain't, dude, she don't want to, you had coronavirus. She doesn't want to, she's like. Oh, she doesn't want to meet me because. the next episode early. It's a lot of great stuff. Patriot.com slash broken simulation. Guys, if you're in North Carolina, Johnny's going to be out there.

Starting point is 00:03:08 He would hang out with him in his hand. That's true, yeah. Yeah. What's your aunt saying one more time? Lisa? Aunt Lisa. We love. you. You know, we're gonna... She still, she told my mom the other day to keep the faith about Donald Trump pulling it out, so... Well, she would be right. Okay. Get the 250 warmed up, Johnny, okay? Oh, get the money. It went up? It went up? It was a

Starting point is 00:03:35 hundred. I try to get him to go to five hundred and he went to two-fifth. That's how much faith. I have a lot the the the to get to get cracking on that ass. All right? Guys, if you're watching me live right now as of this moment, as of this moment, I'm going to be in St. Louis, December 3rd through the 5th. I'm going to be at a club called Helium's. I love them. his real name and he's a good friend of mine and we're gonna be gigging out there so come join us St. Louis Hall at your boy. I shall be out there. I'll be bringing some of those magic t-shirts. My Lombard show obviously this week got canceled, not my call guys. I'm just, I just tell jokes, I don't make the decisions got called, we're moving it back to March, so I hope to see you guys then and hopefully we'll be back to freedom by then, okay?

Starting point is 00:04:28 A lot of t-shirts, a lot. So, so the show, you know, we put out some great t-shirts, and I don't know if you saw this, Johnny, but suddenly, Rage Against Machine is doing a, working with the Joe Biden team that thinks they won, they didn't, but thinks thin, but thin, thin, thin, thin, thin, thin, thin, thin, thin, thin, thin, so thin, so thin, so thi, so rage, so rage, so rage, so rage, so rage thin, so rage, they didn't but thinks they won. So Rage Against Machine is now working with the guy who's been in office for 47 years. So just like our t-shirt that you can purchase that, Timflatte t-shirts. It's a nice rage on behalf of the machine t-shirt. It's a great way to support the show. We got a rage on behalf of the machine, fuck your blue check mark, why such a sheep, swarm shirts, you name it, they're all there. It's a great way to support a show.

Starting point is 00:05:08 Also we have a great show, we have a place where you go get mugs, go to Timfall Hat, Swag dot com, look at all that, swarm up. Swarm up! So you get that hat, socks, cock rings. You get those, you do it for that, you, you, you, you, you, you, you, you, you, you, you, you, you, you, you, you, you, you, you, you, you, you, you, you, you, you, you, you, you, you, that, that, that, th, th, th, th, th, th, they're all there. You get those, you do it for you and that's what's all about. Condoms coming soon. What?

Starting point is 00:05:29 Tenfold condoms? Are you? Yeah. Oh, dude, that be the best. I have a question, guys, do you guys ever want to rob a plane? You ever thought about that? Every day? thoooe.

Starting point is 00:05:42 . every day. So we have a gentleman coming on right now. His name is, what is his name real quick? Yeah, his name is Darren Schaefer and he has a whole podcast on D.B. Cooper and we just spent a wonderful time discussing it. You want to hear about D.B. Cooper, please enjoy the show. All right, let's get into this. Yes, I'm very, very excited about this episode, okay? We get asked a lot to do a wide range of episodes or issues we haven't talked about episodes, topics, right? And this is by far with a bullet,

Starting point is 00:06:23 the number one topic that people ask us to do an episode not. And I'm very excited about it. And I am very excited that our guests can stop in. If there's anybody who can talk about this topic, and the topic is D.B. Cooper. And the reason I'm really excited about D. Cooper besides that, well, let me bring him in real quick. He has a podcast called the C the C the C the C the C the C the c the the cupupupupupupup. the reason I'm really excited about talking about DB Cooper besides that, well, let me bring him in real quick. He has a podcast called the Cooper Vortex. Please welcome, Darren Schaefer. How are you, brother? I'm doing great. Thanks for having me on.

Starting point is 00:06:54 I'm very excited to talk about D.B. Cooper, because this is going to be somewhat a part of what Tim Follet is now trying to do. We are trying to move into mysteries. You know, you talk geopolitics forever, but I just feel like if you're always in that or you're always talking pizza gate, you're always talking all that stuff, and I don't know if you're in any of that, but on this show we've talked about that a lot. I just feel like it could like start to eat your soul for a little while because you're like I see this going on I can't do mysteries are just fun to talk about and we did one with with the Dawson brothers about Johnny's hometown right that island Johnny's half Native American right and and now we're gonna get into this so we're gonna be start doing a lot more mysteries on this show obviously we'll always stick

Starting point is 00:07:42 to what you guys love which is lizard people and all that stuff but this is very excited. Now Darren you have an entire podcast dedicated to D.B. Cooper. Tell me about that's so interesting that you could stay on one subject. Now is this episode is this a show comes out every week and you have another one or is as you learn stuff you kind of do another episode? It's more as an episode becomes available. I have a full-time job and a family. I work for the man so this is just something I was passionate about. I work completely by myself so I listen to 40 to 60 hours a week of talk radio and podcasts. I grew up in Woodland, Washington, and D.B. Cooper is just a local story there. So I started

Starting point is 00:08:34 searching for podcasts about D.B. Cooper, and there's a bunch of true crime shows and other things like that, conspiracy theory shows that have done an episode on it. But I was just already so entrenched and knew so much about the story that it wasn't enough for me those shows. I wanted to listen to a podcast that was just about D.B. Cooper that would talk to the people who wrote these books, the people who had these theories, the people who thee thea. T. thi. thi. T. T. T. T. T. T. T. T. T. T. T. T. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th................................... th.. th. th. th. the. the. the. th. th. to. to. to. to. to. to. to. to. to. to. to. the to. to. to. to. the the the the the the the the the the th. the th. th. the. th. th. these books the people who had these theories the people who are on these forums all Day talking about this case And so I was like well if I want to listen to this podcast. I better just create it myself So I did that's how everything should be if you want something done you got to do it for yourself And I exactly love that man. I love that so where do you want to start dude? I mean? I got questions? I? I? to? to? to? to? to? to? to? to? th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. the th. the th. the the th. the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the th. th. the. the. today. today. today. today. today. today. today. today. today. today. today. t man I love that so where do you want to start dude I mean I got questions but I kind of just want to know I do you

Starting point is 00:09:31 know about any have you ever heard about D.B. Cooper Yeah I wasn't about to ask him if we can get a little story about it but yeah I know what it is is the guy that disappeared yeah I love the guy who disappeared Johnny D B.Cooper was he big in your life yeah I mean I'm the the the th. I'm th. I'm th. I'm th. I'm th. I'm th. I'm th. I'm th. I'm th. I'm th. I'm th. I'm th. I'm th. I'm th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. I'm th. th. th. the th. the th. the th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. to. to. to. to. to. to. to. to. to. to. to. to. to. to. to. to. to. to. the. the. the the the th. th. the, the guy who disappeared. Johnny, D.B. Cooper, was he big in your life? Yeah, I mean, I've done a lot of reading about that topic. I find it interesting just because the mystery of it, you know. You know, I don't know the fact that people just keep finding little possible remnants of the event. That's kind of, I don't know somebody to go to your house, steal from you, that's what I'm talking about. I'm talking about bank robbers, okay? Anybody

Starting point is 00:10:10 could jack, giant corporations that's been fucking everybody over. Like, that's a, as long as nobody gets hurt, they can get in, get out. Anybody who takes anything from Wells Fargo who for years just stole money from people. Yeah, I support that. Is that funny that that guy was like fighting for his bonus? Yeah, unbelievable. I mean, those guys should have all all been locked up. Everybody in management. Some hacks are good too, though. Some hacks are good.

Starting point is 00:10:39 No, dude, I don't hate hacks. You're gonna have hacks, hacking us, but I don't hate hacks, I like hacks, but just don't hack my shit. That's all I'm saying, just don't hack my shit. Where do you want to start, where do you want to start? Where should we start? Why don't we just start at the beginning? I can give you a Cliff Notes version for anyone who doesn't know the story? November 24th, 1971, the day before Thanksgiving, a middle-aged dude

Starting point is 00:11:08 walked into the Portland International Airport. He purchases a one-way ticket from Portland to Seattle. The cost of the ticket with tax is $20. He pays with cash. The ticket agent asks for his name. This is all the ID you need to get on a plane in 1971 and he responds, my name is Dan Cooper. The ticket agent writes Dan Cooper on the ticket. They board the plane. This gentleman sits in the back of the plane. Right before takeoff, he hands a stewardess a note. She slips it in her pocket, assuming it's just another old businessman trying to hit on her, and doesn't read it. He notices this a few minutes later and is, and is, th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. toe, th. th. th. thi, thi, the, thi, the, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the their, their. their, their. their. their, their. their, th. th. thi. thi. te. te. te. te. te. tipe. tipe. tipe. ticket, ticket, ticket, ticket, ticket, ticket, ticket, the ticket, their, the old businessman trying to hit on her and doesn't read it. He notices this a few minutes later and's like, excuse me, miss, you might want to have a look at that note, I have a bomb. That is so funny. That is so funny. The best part to me is that you used to be able to just get on the plane and give them your, like oh yeah I'm Bill Dawson here, let me on the the the guy. Yeah, I I I I'm, I I'm, I I I I I I I I I I I'm, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm th, I'm th, I'm th, I'm th, I'm th, I'm th, I'm th, I to to to to to to to to to to th, I th, I th, I th, I th, I th, I th, I th, I th, I th, I th, I th, I th, I th, I th, I th, I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm, th. th. th. th. th. thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, th. th. th. th, th, let me on there. Yeah, that's how you should be, dude.

Starting point is 00:12:05 Yeah, just... Dude, you used to be able to go to the airport and your grandma would be waiting for you to get off the plane. Yeah, right at the gate. You used to be able to give someone your ticket. Like, I don't want to go no more. You want to go? Yeah. Now you to to to to to to to to go to go to go to go to go to go to go to go to go to go to go to go to go. to go. to go. to go. to go. to go. to go. to go. to go to go to go to go to go the to go to go to go to go to go to go to go to go to go the to go to go to go go to go to go go to go to go to go to go to go to go to go to go to go to go to go to go to go to go to go. You to go. You to go. You to go. You to go. You to go. You the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the to go. the to go. to go. to to to to the airport. to the airport. the airport. the the the the a to go. to go. to go. to when I flew and we'll get right back to this but I when I flew back from Philly there I was going through the thing they're like oh you don't have to take out anything of your backpack and I couldn't understand what he was saying I'm like what about my

Starting point is 00:12:37 backpack don't take anything out your backpack I go are you ordering to take anything out my backpack he's like yeah I'm like you're the the to to to to to to to the the to to the the the the the the to the the the the the the to the the the the the the the the the the to to to to to to to to to to to the the their their their to their their their their their their their their their their their their I their I their I their I their I their I their I their I their I their I their I their I their I the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the they. I the the the the the they. I th th the. I the. I theeeeeeeee. theeeeee. theeeeee. theeeee. I'm they. I'm the. I'm the. I'm to take anything on my backpack. He's like, yeah. I'm like, you're saying I don't have to take out my computer. He's like, yeah, I go, sorry, got weird on you. I did not expect that at all. I had it one time to me, too. And then there's, it's like, this airport, you don't have to take out your computer. This airport, you better, you their, you, you, their, their, their, their, the, the, the, the, the, the, and I, and I, and I, and I, and I, and I, and I the, and I the, and I'm, and I'm, and I'm, and I'm, and I'm, and I'm, and I'm, and. to. to. to. to. to. to. to, I to, I'm, I to, I to. to. to. to. to. to. to. to. to. to. to. to. to. I, I. I. I. I. to. to. to. I. I. to. th. to. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th ttttto. tto to. to. tto. to. to. to. to. to. to. to. to. to. to. ttto. th had them. No, leave your shoes on. Leave them on. Yeah, I think it's so angry. So he goes, he purchases this ticket, he gets on, he sits in the back, right? And I wonder what kind of, do we know what kind of plane these are that he did this on? It's a Boeing 727. I bet you they're the ones that Frontier are using right now. I betcha you can ride. I bet you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you you that you can you that you can that you can that you can't you can't you can't you can't you can't you can't you can't you can't you can't you can't you can't you can't you can't you can't you can't you can't you can't you can't th. th. th. th. the th. their their th. their their their their their their th. their th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. the the the the the the the the the the the th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. the. the. the. the. the. the. the. the. the. the. the. th. the plane at D.B. Cooper jumped off off because

Starting point is 00:13:25 Frontier, Frontier, have you flown Frontier? That's a 50 year old, oh yeah, that's a 50 year old airplane. Yeah, dude, I would not doubt it. So D.B. Cooper gets on, I could imagine if you wanted to rob a place and they just weren't paying attention. They just gave you zero any kind of energy to you like, um, um, um, um, read the note. You're like, listen sir, I've been past dick picks before. I really don't want to look at it at all and okay and then boom. So he goes you might want to look I have a bomb that's just crazy let me get my glasses No, no, no he was sitting in the back was he sitting by himself at that place was it a packed flight? It wasn't a packed flight there wasn't very many people on there I don't remember off the top of my head I want to say there was 32 or 33 passengers on the plane so there wasn't very many people on the their.??? their. their. their. their. their. their. their. their. their. their. their. their their. their. their their their. their their their their their their. their their th. th. the. their their th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. the. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. to th. th. to the. to the. to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to toe. toe. to to toe. to to toe. to toe. to they. their their the. the. I don't remember off the top of my head. I want to say there was 32 or 33 passengers on the plane. So there wasn't very many people on. That's unbelievable. Imagine sitting

Starting point is 00:14:33 next to the guy with the bomb. You're like, oh dude. And I would assume it's busy it's the day before Thanksgiving. I'd assume it's a pack. I don't know that's a great question. Do people fly a lot of them? I. And I. And I. And I. And I. And I. And I they they they they they they they they are, there, there, there, there, there, there, there, there, there, there, there, there, there, there, there, there, there, there, there, there, there, there, there was there was there was there was there was there was there was there was there was there was there was there was there was there was there was there was there was there was there, there was there, there, there, there, there, there, there, there, there, there, there, there, there, there, there, there was there. There was there. There was there. There, there was there, there was there was there was there was there was there was there wasn't there wasn't there wasn't there wasn't there wasn't there wasn't there wasn't there wasn't there wasn't there wasn't there was there wasn't there was there was there was there wasn't there was there, I don't know that. That's a great question. Is that the day? Do people fly a lot? I know it's busy now because I was looking for flights. You know, they're expensive during holidays, yeah. Oh really? Like the day before, yeah. I think the day of it's easy, but the day before. I've thought about that several to spend the $20 a ticket to fly. I'll just drive. So maybe that's why that flight wasn't packed. Now they call that flight the Antifa flight. That's where Antifa goes back and forth from Portland to Seattle left and right. You know what I'm talking about? So, okay, so, so this happens, man, this is great, dude, this is great. So we, uh, so what do we know about Cooper and his knowledge of this plane?

Starting point is 00:15:35 That's very interesting because he knew way more about the plane than the pilots or the airport itself. So when they land in Seattle, he gets his 200 grand, he gets his four parachutes that he asked for. And then he had some very specific flight instructions for the pilots. He wanted the plane to be flown at no higher than 10,000 feet to stay below 200 knots and have the flap set at 15 degrees,

Starting point is 00:16:04 and the cabin remain unpressurized. He also demanded that the plane take off with the rear stairs down. The Boeing 727 has those aft stairs so it could fly into airports that maybe didn't have shuttle trucks and ramp trucks. And the pilots were freaked out by this. They didn't know, first of all, if the plane could fly with the stairs down at all. So they call into the air traffic controller. They don't know. They had to call Boeing.

Starting point is 00:16:34 Boeing said, yes, it is possible for this plane to fly with the rear stairs down. But then the pilots refused to take off with the rear stairs down. But then the pilots refused to take off with the rear stairs down. They said it was just too dangerous with the plane being full of fuel. Cooper said, I'm not going to argue with you about this. I'll just lower them once we get in the air. So they, so that has to tell you something about it. I mean, this is not the internet, tase, right? There's no internet where you could wea the internet tase right there's no internet we could download a bunch of PDFs and there's some idiot out there who is like check out

Starting point is 00:17:10 my YouTube channel we talk about stairs and planes and you know and it's some guys got like a thousand views and he's able to show you that a plane could fly with the stairs down now this has to be an older plane because when I'm on the plane, wasn't he smoking on the plane as well? Yeah, but that's how old that one. That's even more hilarious because I used to fly back then, you know, I'm a little, a couple days older than you guys, and I used to fly and they had a smoking section, and the smoking section was just three rows at the front and there was no there was no wall or door or vent.

Starting point is 00:17:53 They didn't even have a mask? They didn't have nothing dude. It was just dude smoking up front and people in the back just dealing with it and that was the smoking section. But I'm trying to think about have you seen pictures of this plane and how would he get to these stairs? So on this particular type of plane, I think there's a Boeing 727 and then another DC, something else I can't remember that. But it had AFTS stairs that could be lowered from the inside, so passengers could board and deplane straight from the runway.

Starting point is 00:18:31 You don't need a ramp truck, you don't need anything. It's just a set of stairs that lowers from the back of the plane. All right, guys, listen to this real quick. I got a message for you, and listen, dude, thiii, thus, thus, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, too, too, too, too, too, too, too, too, too, too, too, too, to too, to to to to to to to too, to to to too, too, too, too, too, too, too, too, too, too, too, and, too, and too, and too, and the they. they. they. they's they's they's they's they's theyyn. the the the thea, the thea, the the thea, too, too, too, too, too, to know, truth is dangerous. And this is some of the most dangerous information you're ever going to get, okay? It's not, the real conspiracy isn't Trump versus Biden, Russian collusion, impeachment, Ryan's distracted from truth. Uh-uh, the real, the real conspiracy is the real truth you want it, and that is underwear from sheath underwear.

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Starting point is 00:20:52 W, E-A-R dot com and use the promo code tinfoil to get 20% off this perfect Christmas gift. Now back to the show. But is it the stairwell in the back? It's like you know in like a Learjet Southwest right but it's like no it's like all the way in the back towards the tail right the tail bottom the tail comes down and then you walk out that way. Oh like military shit I've flown in those because I've been in Combat doing comedy, but I've been there okay

Starting point is 00:21:29 I like how I'm all right. I've been there and I've seen some shit Okay, but interestingly they they also installed after he did this they installed what's called the Cooper vane on the existing Existing 727s so that when it was in flight it was in flight it would??????????? the the the the the the the the the the the existing 727s so that when it was in flight, it would turn this lever at the stairs to prevent the stairs from being opened while the plane was flying. That's so interesting. But have you ever looked into how somebody, like does this detail give you any understanding of possibly who this might be? That this guy knew more about this plane

Starting point is 00:22:05 than the people who are flying the plane, the airports, and any of that? Is it possible? Is there like a Boeing something around this area that someone said, fuck it man, let's live a little life. I'm tired of drawing planes. Yeah, well, Boeing, their main facility is in Seattle. Also the CIA was doing some covert operations in Vietnam around the same time using the 727 to drop cargo and troops

Starting point is 00:22:36 and not have it be suspected it would look like a civilian aircraft. He was in the military. He could have been in the military. Ah, the plot thickens. It definitely thickens. The plot thickens, dude. That is so the pli-tickens. th. thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thickens, thi, thickens, thickens, thickens, thickens, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the military he could have been in the military. Ah the plot thick guns. It definitely thickens. The plot thickens dude that is so interesting. I really like D.B. Cooper and he might be somebody who listens to the show or maybe his like his hot granddaughter is I don't know but anyway would he be dead? Yeah right. He would most likely be dead. He would be in between I would say 85 and 100 at this point in time. I'm sure we have some in that age. He's listening. I mean that he probably voted for Biden too. That's how that's the dead age that voted for Biden. Okay so um so where do we go from this? So he, let's get the let's get the flight down. So he goes the tho. That's th. That's th. th. the the the the th. the the the th. the th. th. the th. the the th. the the th. th. the th. the the the th. the the th. th. the th. th. th. the th. th. he he he he he he he he he. I he. I he. I he. I he. I he. I he. he. th. th. th. I I I I th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. I th. th. th. th. th. I th. th. th. I th. I th. I th. I th. I he. I he he he. I he he he um, so where do we go from this?

Starting point is 00:23:25 So, so he, where, let's get the, let's get the flight down. So he goes up, he, they can see, they're like, okay, we'll get into the air. He, does he ask for a refil, does he ask for the gas to be, um, the plane to be refueled? Yes and no. So when he lands in Seattle, he said before we land in Seattle, I want my $200,000 and four parachutes. Two front shoots and two back shoots was the terminology he used at the time. He gets everything he asks for. They land in Seattle. The money is brought on the plane. He lets the passengers off the plane. And then he gives his flight instructions to the flight crew. They tell him, he wants to go to Mexico to Mexico to Mexico to Mexico to Mexico the Mexico the Mexico to the Mexico the Mexico the Mexico the Mexico the Mexico the Mexico the the the the the the the the the the the the to go the their their their their their their their tho. tho. tho. thous. thoo. thooooooooooooo. thoooo. thooo. thoo. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. the, th. the, the, the, the, the, the, the, th. the. the. the. the. to, to, the. to, toe. toe. toe. toe. toe. toe. toe. toe. toe. toe. the. the. the. the. te. And then he gives his flight instructions to the flight crew. They tell him, he wants to go to Mexico City. They tell him under the conditions he asked for, the plane won't have enough fuel to make it to Mexico

Starting point is 00:24:13 City. They need to stop and refuel somewhere. They discussed like two or three different places and agreed they would stop in Reno. That's where I would stop. There's nothing but shady-ass people in Reno? the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their. Hea. Hea. Hea. Hea. Hea. Hea. Hea. Hea. Hea. Hea. Hea. Hea. He's th. He's th. He's the. the. thean. thean. thean. thean. thean. thean. thean. thean. He's theanananananan That's where I would stop. There's nothing but shady ass people in Reno. Was there any discussion of like a law enforcement maneuver going? I mean like like taking this guy out you know I mean this seems like something just would never happen today. There was but the airline wanted to give him whatever he wanted because they were concerned about their plane. The $200,000. The $200,000 is less than the value of of of of of of of of of of of of of of of of of th th th th th th the value of th.00 the value of the value of the value of the value of the the the the th.00.00. the the the the the the the the the the their the the the their the the the. Was. Was their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their. their. their. th. the. the. the. thean. thean. th. th. th. thean. th. the. their. their. their. their. their. their. were concerned about their plane. The $200,000 is less than the value of that plane. How much those run for?

Starting point is 00:24:49 I mean, I have no ballpark. I have no ballpark. I have no ballpark. They have to be millions. Two hundred million maybe a hundred million dollars for a plane. I mean, I would think so. It's just kind of what, okay. So all four of us are th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th thus thus thus thus thus thus thus thus thus thus thus thus thus thus thus thus is thus thus thousand thousand thousand thousand thousand thousand th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. thous thous thous thous thous thous thous th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. tho. tho. tho. tho. tho. tho. tho. tho. tho. tho. tho. tho. tho. tho. tho it's just it's just kind of what okay. So all four of us are on that plane. We're far enough back. We're at least a couple rows from D. B. Cooper. I got your answer.

Starting point is 00:25:13 Okay. It says for the Boeing 727 4.25 million initially. So that's 1972 prices and then or. then by 72 it was 8.5 million. And that's 8.5 in the 80s or 70. It keeps going up and like 82 it was 22 million so they keep going up. And what you already do this? Sorry about that. He did it in 71. 71. So it would have been about 8.5 million around that. 8.5. But inflation today. No. No. That money. That would be. the. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. that. that. that. that. that. that. that. that. that. that. that. that. that. that. that. that. that. that. that. that. that. that. that. that. that. that. that. that. that. that. that. that. that. that. that. that. that. that. that. that. that. that. that. that. that. that. that. that. that. that. that. that. that. that. that. that. that. that. that. that. that. that. that. that. that. that. the. that. the. the. the. that. the. the. that. that. that. that. that. that. that. that. that. that. that. that. that. that. that. that. that. that. No, no that be like that money. Yeah, it'd be like 42.5 million or something Damn dude, so yeah if you got to enjoy give them just go through the couch at Boeing

Starting point is 00:25:52 Find a fucking couple bucks send it to him right. Yeah, we gotta say this is back when airlines used to make money. Well, they still make money. They're making bank. Yeah,. Johnny. Not right now. You haven't flown lately. Johnny, they're charging you for everything. They are working. They have think tanks right now figuring out if it's ethical to charge for air. Can I charge you for air? Think about all the airlines that have gone out of business. What?

Starting point is 00:26:22 TWA, Northwest, I mean there's a much of them that have gone out of business. Okay man I just think like they they raised their prices and then when oil dropped they kept them at that that thing. So so real quick the four of the I'm people gonna yell and they're tell four of us are on the plane. we're far enough back th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. thus thus thus thus thus thus thus thus thus thus thus thus thus thi. thi. tho. thi. thi. thi. T. They're they're they're they're they're they're they're they're they're they're they're they're they're they're they're they're they're they're they're they're they're they're they're they're they're they're they're they're they're they're they they they they they they they're they're th. th. th. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. the. the. the. the. the. the. they're they're they're they're they're they're they're they're they're they're they're they're they're they plane. We're far enough back, we could see D.B. Cooper. What do you guys say to him? Are you like, you ass-or? You like, do it, you could do it, dude. Wait, if I'm on the plane?

Starting point is 00:26:52 Yeah, we're like, far enough. He's in the back. He's in seat 28. We're all in seat 26 because we've all witnessed 9-11, you know, and we're not like, I mean, to me, it's not hard to ask me at all. What would you say? I fantasized about this a million times. I would say to him, you're going to get away with this, dude.

Starting point is 00:27:20 You just trust he's doing what he says he is there, right? That he doesn't want to just plow the plane into the fucking space needle or something? Oh no, in my scenario I've already traveled back in time to sit next to him. Oh, got it. But dude, Johnny, I'm saying we're on the plane and they're letting us off. Oh yeah, once I'm off the plane, oh do this. You can do this. You can do it! The passengers of the plane did not know they were being hijacked until they got off the plane in Seattle. Oh, man. Slick.

Starting point is 00:27:52 How many times would you use that story to get late, by the way? I was on that D.B. Cooper. I could have stopped him, but I didn't want to, right? So we got that. So the plane, the passengers get off, we take off. What happens now? We're in the air. What's going on? The only, he has all the passengers off the plane. He left one flight attendant back there to help him with anything he might need.

Starting point is 00:28:20 Her name was Tina Mucklo. Were they roe sham Boeing who who had to stay? Yeah I'm gonna need peanuts during this flight. I mean my god. Okay you D-cup, D-cup's stay in. I believe what happened was the original flight attendant got the note from him, Florence Schaffner, and I believe she kind of went into a panic so the other flight attendant Tina stepped in since Florence was kind of losing it. I bet you Tina popped the Vicodin was like I got I got fucking numb out on this shit Deal with this real quick and went back and talk to D.B. Cooper she they got rid of everybody they're off for taking off so it's like what two pilots an attendant and D. B. Cooper all the way in the back correct? Yep. You have the flight crew in the cockpit and just Tina in D. Tina. Tina. Tina. the the tina. the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the tean. tea. tea. tea. tean. tean. tea. tea. tea. tea. te. te. te.B. Cooper all the way in the back, correct? Yep, you have the flight crew in the cockpit and just Tina and D.B. in the back.

Starting point is 00:29:09 Plain takes off. He asks her to go into the front of the plane. She showed him real quickly how to lower the rear stairs. She goes into the front of the plane. She goes into the money bag to himself and putting the parachute on. Does he check the parachute? Sorry, because I would check the parachutes. That's a great question. So he's given four parachutes, two front shoots and two backshoots, two primaries and two reserves. He's given a modern sport shoot, modern for 1971, and then an older military style shoot. He chooses the military-style shoot over

Starting point is 00:29:48 the more modern civilian one. And a lot of people will speculate that that proves he didn't know what he was doing, or it proves he was in the military. And people have speculated that the newer shoot would have been a better choice, but I've also heard people say that it wouldn't have survived that opening. So what we do know is he did choose the military-style shoot. Could you explain why he would not have survived the opening? On the more modern, it was a paracommander or sky commander, I believe the other shoot but I've heard people say that jump, that sheet was never designed to jump out of a jet with and it's possible if he would have jumped with that shoot

Starting point is 00:30:29 and opened too early it would have shredded the parachute. And dude if you're a guy that's been doing, like you said this has been done in the military sneak attacks and this dude had jumped been met just say possibly he had been a guy who jumped out during that time he knew how to use a parachute he knew I've yet used this parachute before it works yeah Tina Mucklow commented that it it looked like when he was putting the parachute on that he had done it many times before and you have to think if you're gonna your very first parachute jump, is it going to be in the dark in the rain into the woods? Probably not. That's so interesting. So we're in the air, Tina

Starting point is 00:31:17 showed him around. This is where you're going to do this, this is where you're he obviously knows all that stuff. He's tied the money to him, he's picked his backpack. Where are we in this flight by now? Do you know around? Right now, it's about 8.m. And the pilots noticed the rear door open. They get the light for the rear door coming on. And then in between 8. and 813, depending on which transcript and which flight account you read, there is a pressure bum in the cabin that even caused the pilots

Starting point is 00:31:53 to have to make some sort of corrective action. They marked this point in the flight path, thinking that could be where he jumped. And so what they believe caused that pressure bump is the rear stairs bouncing back up after Cooper jumped off the back. Oh. And to prove this theory, they actually took the exact same plane, flew it over the Pacific Ocean,

Starting point is 00:32:20 and pushed a 200 pound weight off the back, while flying at the same altitude and speed to see if it would duplicate that pressure bump they encountered, and it did. Have people attempted to reproduce the jump conditions? Like has anybody jumped under the similar conditions to this? Certainly, but probably not for fun. But I mean, like like for these reasons

Starting point is 00:32:45 I like to kind of test what Cooper did nobody's tried tried try it like a under control conditions to reproduce the jump I'm not sure if anyone has in the same area I've talked to I had a gentleman on my shows named Matt Womadoo and he was a US Navy SEAL and I talked to him a lot about parachuting in bad conditions. He was also a smoke jumper, by the way. What's a smoke jumper? Smoke jump out of planes to fight fires. Oh, damn!

Starting point is 00:33:14 Whoa! This guy lives dangerously. That's wild. There's some people. And he told me, I thought was interesting that if he was planning this, he would want to to land to land to land to land to land to land to land to land to land to land to land to land to land to land to land to land to land to land to land to land to land to land to land to land to land to land to land to land to land to land to land told. told. told. to. to. to. to. to. to. to. to. to. to. to. to. to. to. to. to. to. to. to. to. to. to. to. to. to. to. to. to. to. to. to. to. to. to. to. to. to. to. to. to. to. to. to. to. to. to. to. to. to. to. to. to. to. to. to. to. to. to. to. to. to. to. to. to. to. to. to. to. to. to. me, I thought, was interesting that if he was planning this, he would want to land in the water and not in trees, because if you land in trees at night, you can't see to get yourself down. Interesting. Interesting, dude.

Starting point is 00:33:38 But then I've talked to sport parachutists who have had 50 years of parachuting experience, and they always say I would never land in the water. Never. So, well the guy who said he was, you said he was a seal right? Correct. Okay, that kind of makes some sense. Those guys are a little more comfortable. I have a so, I mean does he obviously doesn't jump with the bomb, right? Did he even have one? Was it a? Yeah he even find out if he actually had a bomb? The only evidence left on the plane when the plane lands in Reno is his black clip-on tie. No bomb, no briefcase. He asked for his notes back that he wrote to the stewardess and the pilots. He did, he smoked eight Raleigh cigarettes while on the flight, but the FBI threw the MOI.

Starting point is 00:34:30 That's unbelievable. That is unbelievable. Why? I mean, I guess back then you're like, you know, it's not like there's going to be a today. Yeah, but, but, dude, we have all the FBI documents now. They've all been released since the case is suspended. And there's a document that somebody else pointed out to me, gentlemen by the name of Bill Rollins, and the document says, examine these cigarette butts for evidence, and if you don't

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Starting point is 00:36:45 That fit on this show about mysteries. She's been hitting me up for a little more CBD. Oh, really, Johnny? Why don't you ever call me and I'll talk to some people? I'd like to get to know her, Johnny, okay? So listen. Easy. For all, I mean, get the noise. Come on, dude. For all of our listeners. th. to. to. to. to. to. to. to. to. to. to the to. the to. to. the to. to the to. to. the to. to. the to. to. to. to. to. to. to. to. toe. to. toe. toe. toe. toe. toe. toe. to get. to get. to. to. the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the to. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the.g.g.g.g.g.g.e.e.e.e.e.e.e.e.g.e.e.e.e.e.e.e.e.e.e.e.e.e.e.e.e.e.e..e.... noise. Come on, dude. For all of our listeners, CBD Line has a generous 20% off-code for you. Go to CBDline.com.

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Starting point is 00:37:35 So go to CBD Lion and use the promo code, tin foil, and you'll get 20% off your magic CBD. Enjoy the show. So this is 71. Was the thi one. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi, thi, them, thi, thi, thi, them, them, them, the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th. th. thi, thi, thi, thi, thi. thi. thi. the, the, that, thate, thate, thate, that, thate. thea. thea. thea. to to to thea. thea. the the the. the your magic CBD. Enjoy the shell. So this is 71. Was there anything like DNA back then? Probably not. Why would you throw them away? I just don't get like, dude, hold on to the- they could test it today? But they, buttest it today but they might not survive yeah or or they might not survive just like the golden state killer we didn't have his DNA we got a family members DNA and it led us to him and that was part of Pat and I was right yeah what about the clip on is that that why would you take the clip on? Is that still, is that? Why would you take the clip on on?

Starting point is 00:38:25 Dude, because he's cocky and he's like, this is my note, this is my note, this is my love. You don't want it flying in your face while you're, you know. That's a great point too, Johnny. Good thought. that is that still around? The clip on? around. It's been examined for evidence real thoroughly twice in recent years, both times by a gentleman named Tom Kay, who has pretty much done all the forensic work on this case just for fun. He doesn't work for the FBI or anything like that. But they found a lot of weird

Starting point is 00:38:59 stuff on the tie when they put it under an electron microscope, there were a bunch of odd metal combinations. There was titanium on the tie, kind of pressed against steel, and some rare earth minerals that would have only been used in the 70s in like making radar and CRT screens and things like that. So it's another one of those things with the Cooper case that it should lead you somewhere, but it just never does. So the stuff that they found on this tie,

Starting point is 00:39:38 is this associated with a particular industry at all? Well, the one thing that you could most likely track down to a particular industry is the titanium because they found pure titanium on his tie. And in the United States there just wasn't many titanium manufacturing facilities, especially pure titanium. And people theorized, well, what about the Boeing supersonic transport? But that was kind of using more alloyed titanium at the time. tiii. ti. ti. ti. the th th th th th th th th th thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi. Is thi. Is thi, is thi, is thi, is thi, is thi, is thi, is thi, is thi, is thi, is thi, is th, is th, is th, is th, is th, is th, is th, is th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, theateateateateateateateateateateateateateateateateateateateateateateateateate, is thi., well, what about the Boeing supersonic transport? But that was kind of using more alloyed titanium at the time. There's like an RMI metals and textronics in Portland.

Starting point is 00:40:12 There's really only a handful of companies that people have theorized those particles could have come from in 1971. But even if you have all the company yearbooks from that era, what are you supposed to do? Match a picture to the sketch? Or you could just see, did anyone suddenly quit? Did anybody? D.D.J.J.J.D.J.J.D.J.J.D.J.J.J.J.D.J.D.J.J.D.J.D. No, but you would... Titanium? Can I throw this out? Anybody? Wolverine, is it possible? Wolverine jumped out?

Starting point is 00:40:47 Adamantium. Uh, not titanium. Oh, I thought it was titanium. Oh, I wish you would have told me that before this one. I wish you would have said that before that. So, um, is there... Was the money, did the money, did, did, did, did, did, did, did, did, did, did, did, did, did, did, did, did, did, did, did, did, did, did, did, did, did, did, did, did, did, did, did, did, did, did, did, did, did, did, did, did, did, that, that, that, that, that, that, that, that, that, that, that, that, that, that, that, that, that, that, that, that, that, that, that, that, that, that, that, that, that, that, that, that, any chance? It did, they, the money weirdly was already stored at C First Bank to be used for ransom.

Starting point is 00:41:11 They had $250,000 sitting there in case there was some sort of ransom situation. Interesting, interesting. Interesting. So they already had the bills marked and everything. They had all the serial numbers for the bills, but it's again it's 1971 so they don't have the internet to help us. So they distributed a printed list of 10,000 serial numbers to banks, casinos, horse tracks, anything in the area, to see if any of these bills would pop up in

Starting point is 00:41:47 circulation and nothing ever did. The only money found was found in 1980, an eight-year-old boy found about 5,800 bucks on a beach in Vancouver, Washington, about 30, 20, 30 miles from where Cooper should have landed. Is that what this teen bar money is that? Is that Tina Bar? It's it's private property, but the landowners back in the day used to let people go there for like a dollar and then hang out on the beach all day. What does that suggest to you that that? Because, I mean, I assume if you're stealing too? A too much, I, I th, I, I, I, I, I, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, th, th, th, th, th, th, thi, thi, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to the, thi, th hang out on the beach all day. What does that suggest to you that that I mean I assume if you're stealing $200,000 you probably wouldn't leave you know more than $5,000 just on the beach? Yeah so does that suggest to you maybe that he didn't survive? What I mean what do people think to make make of that? No one has any idea the Tina Bar money. It just doesn't make any sense at all.

Starting point is 00:42:49 So it's far from the flight path. If you assume that waterways took it to where it was, that doesn't work either, because the waterways don't go that direction. Yeah. But a crazy conspiracy theory here. And we're all about that here. He seems to do the show for that.

Starting point is 00:43:07 When Tina Mucklow brings the money onto the plane for Cooper, he opens the bag, he starts looking at it, and she said he was kind of excited to see the money. And she says to him, wow, that's a lot of money. And he grabs a couple of bundles and hands it to her. Tipped her. And she said, I'm sorry, I can't accept gratuity. And that's really what she said.

Starting point is 00:43:34 And so he puts the money back in the bag. Now, is the money found at Tina Barr a representation of the exact money Cooper tried to hand to Tina Mucklow. We're saying she took it? And lying? She did not take the money. But is this some sort of symbolism from Cooper? Another interesting thing about the Tina Bar money find is Tom Kay, again, did some research

Starting point is 00:44:01 on some of those bills that were found there. And he found a strain of diatoms on the bills that, okay, I'm not an expert on diatoms, so don't ask me specific dietam questions. But it's like some sort of water algae thing. And he found a specific strain on those bills that only grows in the spring and summertime. Why is that important? Because the money should have ended up in the spring and summertime. Why is that important? Because the money should have ended up in the Columbia around the time of the hijacking, right? If it doesn't end up in the water until six or eight months before it's found,

Starting point is 00:44:41 where was the money for eight and a half years? God. So it at least suggests that he moved some after landing, right? I mean, wouldn't that suggest to you that he moved? I'm glad you're here, Johnny. Also, when the boy finds the money, it's still in its bundles with rubber bands on it. When they pick up the money, the money is badly deteriorated. And then the, but the rubber bands are still on and they fall apart.

Starting point is 00:45:12 So back to Tom Kaye, he did a bunch of tests with the exact same rubber bands, how long do they last outside? And the answer was not very long at all. So, it's, the money is so puzzling. Nobody has a good answer for how it got there. Why just that much money why no else no I know other money was found? And why that's why? That's crazy dude. What if the kids in on it? Well did he keep the money? Did he keep the money? Tadne? The thinne? The their theory about the kid's the the th th th th of th of th of th of th of the th of th of the the the th of th the the the th the the th of the the th th their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their they. tasu. tasu. tasks. tasks. th. th. thoo. they. their they. their their their their their's fascinating. What if the kids in on it? Well, there is kind of a theory about the kid's family being in on it.

Starting point is 00:45:51 Tom Colbert wrote a book about Robert Rackstra. And in that book he tells the story about he's at some sort of a party and says, you see that hippie couple over there, they're going to find a bunch of money on the beach here soon, it's DB Cooper's money. Why? But, um, that's Tom Colbert's story. Oh my God. Okay, let's say, let's say he died and he left the money. And I wanted to go find it in the forest.

Starting point is 00:46:19 Would it still be there? I mean, no, it's probably deteriorated. It would be deteriorated, right? Your money would have disintegrated by now, right? But don't tell him that, let him go. Let's see how it goes. Well, what you could find is if Cooper just augured into the ground, like some people say, you should be able to find for his parachute, his briefcase that potentially had a bomb in it.

Starting point is 00:46:45 I mean, there would be a find. If he augured into the ground, there'd be something, even 50 years later. Let me ask you something. So he jumps. Do you think that's part of his original plan is to jump at that moment? Or because he asked from Mexico City, is that just some weird kind of shift focus so oh it's a smokescreen oh he wanted to go Mexico City but if he knew this plane so well he would know it couldn't make it to Mexico City is he

Starting point is 00:47:18 jumping there because he wants to or that was always a plan or he felt they had to? I I really feel like he had this thing planned all along. It just seems so well worked out. I really think he he wanted to jump pretty quick. That's why he asked for the stairs to be down on takeoff. Um, I don't think he ever had any intention of going any farther than Oregon or Washington. So you, so, you started the show because the people were talking about in your, in where you grew up, or, why did you decide to start the show? I decided to start the show because I wasn't hearing what I wanted to hear.

Starting point is 00:48:04 Every D.B. Cooper, every show that did a D.B. Cooper episode did it exactly. I decided to start the show because I wasn't hearing what I wanted to hear. Every DB Cooper, every show that did a DB Cooper episode did it exactly the same. They have two or three hosts discussing the D.B. Cooper case, then they list three or four suspects, then they decide which one of the suspects they believe it was, and they do this in 45 minutes. I've read like 25 books on this thing. I'm reading forums every single day about this case. That kind of show just does not do it for me.

Starting point is 00:48:36 So I wanted long form, in-depth interviews with the people who actually know about this, with the people who are actually researching it. And so that's why I created the show. I wanted to talk to Bruce Smith. I wanted to talk to Robert Blevins. I wanted to talk to all these Cooper researchers and not just hear what they had to say, but kind of understand how they think. You named a couple people right there. Have you already talked about them?

Starting point is 00:49:06 I feel like I haven't heard those names yet, but I'm also a little cuckoo crazy. So did you already talk about, were those the pilots? No, those are fellow D.B. Cooper researchers. The name of the show is called the Cooper Vortex, the name I did not come up with it. I believe Mark Mets th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, th, you th, you thu, you thu, you thu, you thu, you thu, you thu, you thu, you thu, you th. th. th. thu, you thi, you tho, you tho, you thi, you thi, you thi, you thi, you thi, you thi, you thi, you thi, you thi, you thu, thu, thu, thu, thu, th. I th. I th. I th. I th. I th. I th. th. thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, tho. thooooooooo. to to to to to to to thooooooooo. I the. I tho. I th I did not come up with. I believe Mark Metzler came up with it. But it's because when people tend to start looking into this real seriously, they can't escape and end up in it for years and years. The aforementioned Tom K. who's done all this forensic work, he told me 10 years ago he thought it would be something fun to do for a few months and didn't imagine that it would take up this much of his life. God, dang dude.

Starting point is 00:49:49 Just perusing the Wikipedia here, getting back to kind of the bumbling of the FBI, I'm reading here that in 2007 they were able to get a partial DNA profile but then they lost the material with his DNA, is that right? What a coincidence. The partial DNA profile, one's really certain exactly what that means. In the past, they said they could use it to rule out people, but not necessarily prove it with someone. And then since then, they sort of backed away from that. And they closed the case in 2016, so... The partial DNA profile, I'm not really sure about that at

Starting point is 00:50:27 all it we're not even sure if it's Cooper's so yeah that's there and that's not even his name we're assuming he gave a big name right yeah that's so yeah we're looking for a D.B. Cooper and his real name is Stan Lee or something like that who knows? Okay here's another great conspiracy angle. I did, we're all about that action. There is a Franco-Belgian comic book called Dan Cooper. It's not printed in the United States. It was available in Canada. It was available, translated into Spanish as well,

Starting point is 00:50:59 got some distribution in Mexico, maybe Central America. But the hero of the Dan Cooper comic book is a daredevil, Royal Canadian Air Force fighter pilot who does all the things that essentially D.B. Cooper did. There's an episode of the comic book where he jumps out of a commercial plane that's blowing up. There's one where he diffuses a bomb on a commercial plane. Oh, fuck? And the comic predates the crime.

Starting point is 00:51:33 So if you're going to commit a crime, and you're going to give an alias. Sam, you're not going to say your name, you're just going to pick some random name. What are the odds that you would land on the exact random name of a comic book superhero that does the same thing that you're about to do? I think that's a wonderful choice. Either he's Mexican, Canadian, or French. He could be Canadian French, for sure. Well, here's the problem with that.

Starting point is 00:52:02 When looking for D.C. C talking about somebody who is, let's say five nine to six foot one, there is, let's say 40 to 55, 180 pounds, drinks bourbon and smoke cigarettes. In 1971, what percentage of dudes ages 40 55, served in the military at some point in their life, smoked cigarettes and drank bourbon? It's like 60% percent. Yeah. So you say we've narrowed it down to 60% of middle-aged dudes in 1971.

Starting point is 00:52:42 That's a start. I for sure think he was the military and deployed in France saw the comic book and said when I come back to the states I know how to handle it. I'm not against that or it could be if you want to commit a crime you go to another country commit the crime go back to your old country. And I mean you're right next to Seattle, right? But he didn't have an accent or anything, right, this guy. No, they said no discernible accent. Another thing that I think is so important into the D.V. Cooper story is, the stewardesses said that he was calm, cool,

Starting point is 00:53:12 and collected the whole time. In the interview immediately after the skyjacking, Tina Mucklow says that he was kind, polite, courteous, and says that he got impatient a few times but was never rude or unfriendly. That sounds Canadian to me. What kind of a description of a skyjacker is that? And also, you know, this is a bold crime.

Starting point is 00:53:39 It's one that you're not likely to get away with. So the idea that this guy is just sitting back there, smoking cigarettes and drinking bourbon with not a care in the world, I think says something, really says something about this guy. It sounds like, honestly, it sounds like Walter White, you know, one of these guys that's gotten a terminal diagnosis and it's just, like, I'm going for it now. I totally agree with that. There's a Walter White suspect actually.

Starting point is 00:54:05 Hold on, let's get it. Okay, so, so I have a couple things that a couple notes you sent. Did you already cover the recent DNA discovery? I know you said something earlier. Is that the DNA you were talking about? Is there another DNA discovery? So the history channel. I was like th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. tho. tho. th. tho. tho. tho. tho. tho. tho. tho. tho. tho. tho. tho, tho, tho. tho. tho. tho. tho. tho. to tho. tho. tho. tho. tho. tho. tho. tho. tho. tho. So. So. So. So, tho. So, th. So, th. So, th. So, th. So, I. So, I. So, I. So, I. So, I. So, I. So, I. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. the. the. the. to. the. to. th. to. to. th. to. th. th. th. tho. tho. I doing an episode on and then they watch it now real quick before you get to that what's your thoughts on history the history channel because you know there's a

Starting point is 00:54:30 lot of people like we've had people on the show that and they've said some outlandish shit and then everyone's like I don't trust them they're on the history channel now obviously we talked to the the the the the the the the the the the their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their. their. their. their. their. their. their. their. their. their. their their. their their their their their their. their. their. their. their. their. their. their. their. their. their. their. their. th. their. th. th. th. their. th. their. th. th. th. th. th's. th's. th. th's. th. th's. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th's. th's. th's the. What's their tho's their th's theorists. What are your whole thoughts on all that? As a guy who's like really passionate about the topic, do you feel like they did justice to what you find, what your passion? Yeah, I think they did. I mean, at the other day it's a TV show so they have to make it entertaining, but you know, I'm good. Anything DV Cooper, I'm all about it. I loved it, man. I thought it was good. I thought it was interesting. Like history channels like the only thing on TV I could watch because it's... Oh, but the DNA in that episode, they announced that they had a DNA profile of Cooper. Oh my god. For that they they they they they they they they they they they they they they they they they they they they they th th th th th th th th th th th that that that that that that tho tho tho tho tho. that that tho. tho. tho. that that tho. that that that tho. tho. tho. tho. tho. tho. tho. tho. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. tho. tho. tho. tho. tho. tho. tho. tho. tho. tho. the. tho. tho. the. tho. tho. tho. tho. tho. tho. tho. tho. tho. tho. they pulled from the tie. Well, it turns out that that DNA actually belonged to Tom Kaye, who had looked at the

Starting point is 00:55:29 tie years earlier. So they refer to as the Cooper curse strikes us again. Oh. Such management of fucking forensic. Like, how are you like, how does? Hey, man, it makes mistakes. I mean, this guy's, uh, he's doing out of the guy, the guy that they got the DNA from is the guy who's been doing out of his own passions.

Starting point is 00:55:52 This isn't C.S.I.this is obviously was before Corona, bro. Also, this tie has been passed around like, like Taylor Swift. I mean, everybody's at the DNA on the scene. They call this tie, yeah, they call this tie the Camille Harris of forensic evidence. So here's an interesting thing. Um, there's a couple scenarios, let's get into it. The scenario I find very interesting that Cooper never existed and that the crew is all in it. Is that possible?

Starting point is 00:56:38 No, I absolutely hate that theory. Okay, my bad. It's my goal to tell everyone, there's no truth to that. One of the things that frustrates me having spent so much time on this case is that I have people tell me all the time, oh man, I bet he just hit on the plane and walked out of the airport in Reno, no big deal. I bet Cooper never existed and the flight crew was in on it. There is no evidence to support any of that.

Starting point is 00:57:11 When the plane lands in Reno, the FBI is waiting there and they immediately search the plane with dogs. Also, how much spare room is there on an airplane? There isn't a bunch of places to hide shit. They're using all of the available space in the aircraft. So the idea that he never jumped is ridiculous. The idea that he never existed is also ridiculous. The ticket agent saw him. There was a gentleman before they moved when Cooper says, you know, I have a bomb. He asks them to move a couple of the passengers forward so you can kind of be alone in the back.

Starting point is 00:57:49 Hold on, this is before, after he said he had a bomb. This is after he says he has a bomb. Oh thank God imagine. He did get these people on my, who are you? Just shut up and move them. So, what? I'm sorry, I tot tot tot tot tot tot tot tot tot tot tot tot tot tot tot tot tot tot tot tot tot to to tot to too. to to to to be to be told to be to be to be to be to be told to be they. they. they. they. they. they. they. they. they. they. they. they. they. they. they. they. they. they. they. they. they. they. they. they. th. th. th. th. th. th. thi. thi. thi. thi. to be toe. toe. toe. toe. toe. tooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo. toe. toe. to totally lost my place there. Now I'm going to take a beating on that one, okay? So, there was, you're saying it's on, it's not possible, agents saw them, he moved people from the back forward.

Starting point is 00:58:17 No space to hide, no space to hide. Thank you. Also, the idea that the crew was in on it, there's no evidence to support that, and they continued to work for the airline for a while. So, and the FBI investigated them. You have to think that the FBI looked at the flight crew more than anyone else in the beginning because they had no leads. They had nowhere to go. So they did look at the fright crew. And I heard from one of the stewardestestestestestestestestestestestestestestestestestestestestestestestestestestest. the ss. the ss. the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the a the a the a the a the a the a theauadusanananananananananananan. to work. to work. to work. to work. to work. to work. to work. to work. to work. to work. the a the a the a the a the a the a the a the a the a the a the a the a the a the a the a the a the a the a the a the a the a the a the a the a the a the a the a the a the a the a the a the a the ail.seau an ail.seau an ail.seail.ail.ail. theiririrail. their their theiril.ai.aiea. theireau an So they did look at the Friit crew and I heard

Starting point is 00:58:45 from one of the stewardesses, I actually heard the secondhand, but one of the stewardesses ex-husband said that the plane had been, not the plane, I'm sorry, that they had been followed by the FBI for a while after the hijacking. Oh yeah, to see if they were going to spend the money. So you know I had a the the the the the the the the the the the the they. I, they, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I was, I was, I was, I was, I was, I was, I was, I was, I was, the the the the the they, they, the they, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, I was, I was, the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the thea, thea, thea, threathea, threathea, threathea, threathea, threathea, threathe a threathe a threathe a threat.e, threathea, threat. they,, I got in this discussion, this is another thing, I'm not getting into this time, but I had a discussion about 9-11 with a good friend of mine the other day, and there was some talk about how, you know, some of the videos they show. It's like, it's, they're very interesting videos, some of them some don't make sense. Was there no cameras at this time. their. their. their, was, was, was, was, was, was, was, was, was, was, was, was, was, was, was, was, was, was, was, was, was, was, was their, was, was, was, was, was, was, was, was, was, was, was, was, was, was, was, was, was, their, was, their, was, was, was, was, was, was, was, was, was, was, was, was, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, and, their, and, and, their, their, and, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, their, th.. We. their, their, their, their, the this time anywhere in the airport? I mean, security cameras existed in 71. I mean, are you telling me there's no cameras anywhere, either entering this airport, shooting the lobby, shooting them, the gates, anything? And the good old days.

Starting point is 00:59:46 There wasn't even a metal detector. So you had all of these other political hijackings going on at the time. The Cooper one is really, it's really the first four money. There was another kind of super boshed one, but that dude ended up when you said sneak him a valium. Another hijacking, the stewardess actually did sneak the guy a bunch of valium into his drink and the hijacking went from I need a million dollars to I want four cheeseburgers and a head start. That's lick. I believe his name was Paul Seney if you want to look up that story but yeah that stewardess drugged him in the the hijacking took a crazy turn. Well you know to everybody think about

Starting point is 01:00:28 hijacking plane do not take the drink they're roofing you okay. Yeah but but there are no to answer your question I've never seen any security footage or anything like that there's pictures of the plane when it lands in Reno but of course nobody could really get close enough. Cooper had the shades drawn on the plane so we couldn't be seen from the ground. Unfortunately all we have to go off of is the two sketches of Cooper and they look like every single guy you know. So you mentioned that there was a guy, another hijacking. Were there any other copycats that were interesting? The copycat that's the plane? the the the the th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. the the th. the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the, the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the plane the plane the plane the plane the plane the plane the plane the plane the plane the plane the plane the plane the plane the plane the the the the the the the the plane plane the plane the the the plane the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the that there was a guy another hijacking. Were there any other copycats that were interesting?

Starting point is 01:01:09 The copycat that's most interesting is Richard Floyd McCoy. So he commits a very, very similar skyjacking six months later from Cooper. Ooh. Very similar method. Same note. He improved upon a few things from Cooper. Very similar method, same note. He improved upon a few things from Cooper and then also kind of messed up a few things. He left his ransom notes in the airport. A different stewardess saw the envelope, came back on the plane. Sir, you left this envelope in the lobby. Oh my God. Wow. Yeah and then he goes into the bathroom to get

Starting point is 01:01:48 on a disguise before the plane takes off and it's taking too long. So the store is like, hey, dude, you got to get out of the bathroom because we're about to take off. And then they notice that he comes out in a weird costume kind of thing. Then he uses a fake hand grenade in an unloaded pistol, demands $500,000. And where he improved upon Cooper's really was he had more specific flight instructions for the flight crew. So he would know exactly where he was in the air. He landed like within two miles of his home with the 500,000.

Starting point is 01:02:27 And the FBI thought they were going to outsmart him this time by putting trackers in the parachutes. Well, he brought his own parachute on. So when he gets the parachutes from the FBI, he just threw him out so that they would go chasing after those parachutes. Then he jumps at a later time. It gets reported on the news, and I believe it was one of his friends and military buddies turned him in. But another interesting thing about Richard Floyd McCoy is

Starting point is 01:02:56 he was flying a helicopter for the National Guard out of Salt Lake. So he gets to call, hey, we need helicopter pilots to look for this hijacker. He was looking for himself, flying a helicopter for the National Guard. That is awesome. It was awesome. Fuck his military friend snitched him out. Yeah, man. Come on. His military buddy snitched him out. No one gets hurt. It's possible, he may not have been caught.

Starting point is 01:03:27 And they find the money in his closet, duffel bag with, it was like $499,9,970. He bought lunch on the way home from the skyjacking. Was his wife was waiting for him? Yeah. Oh my god. She didn't say nothing, no that that's that's that's th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. thi. that. that's, th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. He's, th. He's, th. He's, th. He's, th. He's. He's. He. He. He. He. He. He. He. He. He. He. He. He. He. He. He. He. He. He's. He's. He's. He's. He's. He's. He's. He's, thi. He's, thi. He's, thi. He's, thi. He's, thi. He's, thi. He's, thiiiii-a. He's thi-a. He's't say nothing, no, that's a writer-die right there. Yeah, that is right-bye-lutcher-cool. So, if you get deep into that story, she is way more than writer-die with him. She could be the brains of that operation.

Starting point is 01:03:57 And she, there, the book gets written about this guy. They the theory- the the the book gets the book gets the book gets the book gets the book gets the the book gets the book gets the the book gets the the the- theathea- theathea- theatheatheatheatheatheatheatthis guy, they theorize it's Cooper because it's so similar. Oh, could have we done it? She ends up suing like her own lawyer and the company that wrote the book and the two guys that wrote the book and she wins. There's also like some accusations that she sort of got romantically involved with the FBI agent that ended up killing Richard Floyd McCoy after he escapes from prison. Oh really? This was a G. Dude, the Richard Floyd McCoy story, I don't know why there hasn't been like 10 documentaries made about this guy because it is an insanely wild story. He's Vietnam that highly decorated. He's a hero. He's a Mormon, he's a Mormon, studying criminal justice at BYU during the hijacking. He's a Sunday school

Starting point is 01:04:54 teacher. He's volunteering in the National Guard. I mean, it's wild. He escapes from prison once and from jail once and then dies in a shootout with the FBI. Oh, what blaze of glory do go out and a blaze a glory dude. That's a guy who's like, fuck it. I'm gonna live and have a little fun. But you know, his wife is probably still alive, has never spoken about any of it. And did she go to jail at never spoken about any of it.

Starting point is 01:05:25 And did she go to jail at all? No, of course. No, she won some sort of settlement to prevent the movie rights of this one book from being turned into a movie. So we basically I'll wait till she dies to, for this thing to become a movie. I'm not sure. The book that it's called the real D.B. Cooper by Rhodes and Callum. Oh, snaps! And I'm not sure if that book has aged as well as some of the others.

Starting point is 01:05:56 I mean, you could tell Richard Floyd McCoy's story without that book. Ah, interesting. What are the chances that that is D.B. Cooper? Do you think there's any possibility any possibility the possibility the possibility the possibility the possibility the possibility the possibility the possibility the possibility the possibility the possibility the possibility the possibility the possibility the possibility the possibility the possibility the possibility the possibility the possibility the possibility the possibility the possibility the chances that that is DB Cooper? Do you think there's any possibility? He survived the first one and said, I'm, fuck it, it has worked so well, I'm going to go around to the two? Do you think he survived to jump D.B. Cooper and went on to do the second one? I'm not, I think D.B. because of the age.

Starting point is 01:06:25 Tina Mucklow sat next to this guy for five hours and lit his cigarettes and she pegged him at mid to late 40s. Now you cannot tell me a 25 year old woman would sit next to a 28 year old man for five hours and guess his age at mid to late 40s. I just don't ever believe that. She, I mean, I would assume she also, I would assume she also. I, I would assume, I to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to the thi this this this this this this this this this this this this this this this this this this this this this this this the thi thi thi. toe toe toe to his age at mid to late 40s. I just don't ever believe that. She, I mean, I would assume she also probably got a chance to see the other guy, right? I mean, she would have been, yeah. They showed pictures of him. The FBI had Richard Floyd McCoy in custody for a while. There's two

Starting point is 01:06:59 suspects that widely get circulated as being Cooper. That's Rackstraw and McCoy. And both of them are too young. Both of them are way too young. Both of them are in their late 20s at the time of the skyjacking. Correct me if I'm wrong, but, oh, sorry, go ahead. Oh, but you're not going to confuse a 27-year-old man for a 47-year-old man. I used to be able to do that. There's become a cottage industry of claiming your D.B. Cooper, right? Are there of any of the people who have come out and said they are D.B. Cooper? Do you find any of those compelling? Some of them. I've read anywhere between dozens and 900 people have confessed to committing this crime. So you have a wide varie of people claiming to have done it.

Starting point is 01:07:49 One of the people that has admitted it themselves that I'm particularly interested in is a gentleman by the name of Wolfgang Gossett, who are you familiar with Clyde Lewis? Ah, Clyde to Glide? Nope, no, no, no, no, I'm not, Clyde Lewis. Well, he helps the show called Ground Zero Radio or something like that. But... Oh, I do know Clyde Lowe.

Starting point is 01:08:13 I've never done a show or had him on, but I know who you're talking about. I know what you're talking about. He, I know what you're talking about. the name of Wolfgang Gossett, who was a paranormal investigator. He was a priest. He was Mormon at some point in time. He performed exorcisms.

Starting point is 01:08:33 He had a radio show in Utah about ghosts and conspiracy theories. This guy confessed to being D.B. Cooper, to multiple people, including his two sons and at least two different lawyers. Why he felt a need to confess to lawyers, I'm not exactly sure. It's so interesting, dude. It's like, I got something to tell you. I'm D.P.C.

Starting point is 01:08:58 What are you saying on your deathbed, Sam? Are you making some shit up? No? You know, I've got to be honestly, after listening to these guys, first of all, they have way cooler names than I do, maybe not my kids, but maybe, but definitely like you can't, apparently, rob trains or planes or anything with a regular name. You have to have a cool, three-name. You have Sam.

Starting point is 01:09:23 Yeah, but that's that that's that cool. You got to have a cool. Kind of a cool ass name. Okay. All right. Well when I rob the bank know that you guys convinced me to do it, okay? So that's interesting dude. I mean this guy this guy's robbing planes doing fucking exorcisms. I mean like that is living life right there right that is getting bang for your buck right there. there. there. there. their. there. their. their. their. their. their. th. their. th. th. th. to. th. th. to. to. th. th. th. to cool. to cool. to cool. to cool. tool. tool. tool. tr. tr. tr. tr. tr. tr. tr. tr. You're cool cool cool cool cool cool cool cool cool cool cool cool cool cool. Cool. Cool. Cool. Cool. tool. Cool. tool. tool. tool. tool. tool. tool. tool. tool. tool. tool. tool. tool. tool. Cool. Cool. tool. tool. Cool. tool. tool. tool. tool. Cool. tool. Cool. tool. tool. Cool. So. tip. So, tip. tip. Cool. So, tip. tip. tip. tip. Cool. tip. Cool. t right there right that is getting bang for your buck right there wow has now you hear that this guy Wolfgang says he's the guy. What about him makes you think he's more credible than most? The age lines up he was a survivalist. That's about it really. I mean all of these suspects, you can only look at, is it plausible? Did he have the motive to do it? Did he have the skill to do it? Did he have

Starting point is 01:10:18 the opportunity to do it? A lot of those people, a lot of the suspects in this case will match all three of those. And you know I've been criticized on my show for having some wild ass guests on, you know, that say DB Cooper was the Zodiac killer, he also killed Teresa Hallback and John Binet Ramsey. Dude, let's hear about that. Do you have, what's your information on that? Because I Wow. Let's hear about that. Do you have what's your information on that because I'm I'm all about that action. A gentleman by the name of Ed Edwards. Ed Edwards which goes into uh is that the guy that you just said with

Starting point is 01:11:01 to raise a, what's that show on Netflix to something a murderer? What's it called? Making a murder. Making of a murder. Yeah, yeah, that's. Well, when you said that, then I put the. Johnny, you're a little quicker. He killed her.

Starting point is 01:11:18 Well, that's, we, before you were on. Theo Vaugham was on.. And we had who came on who did a whole thing that this Ed Edwards guy probably did it because there are pictures of him in, there's a picture of a guy who fits Ed Edwards in a still picture at the court and they would think he would go and watch the trial because he's a guy who killed. That go and like go to the place where you killed someone, go visit it and just look at it. Arsonists do that a lot.

Starting point is 01:11:49 Yeah, they watch the fires for sure. She'd be like, oh man. Do you see his fire, who ever did? Whose? He's the toldl, he's throwing, he's throwing, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, th. hell of firemen. Yeah, Ed Edwards is a super interesting suspect, but I don't I don't think he's Cooper, but it is interesting that you have a couple of these people now that are trying to connect essentially all of the unsolved mysteries into one person. Yeah. So I also had a gentleman on who told me that Frank Morris and the Anglin brothers who escaped from Alcatraz. Frank Morris actually committed the D.B. Cooper

Starting point is 01:12:29 Skyjacking. Do you have any do you think any there's any anything to that? No. Okay I here's my favorite. I mean the idea that he escapes from Alcatraz and then years later somehow gets to Portland and hijacks that plane, I just. Yeah, man, when you escape, you kind of go underground. Yeah. And you just do nothing. Right. Okay, here's the name of some people you think.

Starting point is 01:13:02 You already went over Wolfgang. What about the, and you know, we're, we're pro transgender on this conspiracy.. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. to. to. the to. to. the to. the the to. the the the the the the thee. the. the. the. th you think. You already went over Wolfgang. What about the, and you know, we're pro-transgender on this conspiracy show. We have a lot of trans who listen to, holla at your boy girl, okay? Transgender suspect, Barba Dayton, is probably my favorite suspect. Not my favorite, like like most likely to be

Starting point is 01:13:25 D.B. Cooper but my favorite because it's the most interesting story. Robert Dayton was the first person to have gender reassignment surgery in Washington State in 1969. That's the money. You don't want to be the first person to get that done. You want to be, yeah, you want to be our guinea pig? It's not cheap, it's not cheap. He needed the money, dude. Oh, snaps! And he was, he was in the military, he was a merchant marine, he was in the Hells Angels. He was very conflicted because he was torn, like, you know, I feel like I'm a woman, but but I can also be this badass, bad-a-a-a-a-a-a-a-a-a-a-a-a-a-a-a-a-a-a-a-a-a-a-a-a-a-a-a-a-a-a-a-a-a-a-a-a-a-a-a-a-a-a-a-a-a-a-a-a-s, this bad-a-a-a-a-a-a-a-a-a-a-a-a-a-a-a-a-a-a-a-a-a-a-a-a-a-a-a-a-a-a-a-a-a-a-a-a-a-a-a-a-a-a-a-a-a-a-a-a-a-a-a-a-a-a-a-a-a-a-a-a-s..a-s.a-s. tha-s. tha-s. tha-s. tha-s. tha-s. tha-sa-sa-sa-sa-sa-sa-sa-sa-sa-na-s. tha-s. tha-s. tha-s. tha- gets the gender reassignment surgery eventually, and then becomes super unfulfilled. It's not what it was living life as a woman.

Starting point is 01:14:09 I just need to prove to myself that I'm still badass. She then dresses back up like a man, commits the skyjacking, essentially throws the money away, because it wasn't about the money at all, and goes back to her life as a woman. So she trans trans. Because she was a woman. And that's a great way to get away. Dude, yeah.

Starting point is 01:14:32 So basically she trans trans transed herself. She went trans once and then she trans back and then she transed again. Do you think she ever wore the Hells Angels vest with the pussy on? That's fucked out. I know th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th th tho tho tho tho tho tho tho tho tho tho tho tho tho that's that's that's that's that's that's that's that's that's that's that's that's that's that's that's that's that's that's that's that's that's that's that's that's that's that's that's that's that's that's that's that's that's that's that's that's that's that's that's that's that's that's that's that's that's that's that's th. that's a that's a that's a that's a that's a thoooooooooooooooooooooo' that's a that's a that's that's that's that's on, that's fucked up. I know they weren't happy about that. They probably would not be happy about that. And if any Hells Angels hears that, that is Xavier Guerrero saying that. I did not say any of that. I am pro-biker here as we are pro-transgender here as well. So live, I don't like that, XG.

Starting point is 01:15:02 We didn't like that XG. Yeah, XG. We didn't enjoy that. You might have to take a week off as a thing. But so we got her. Anybody else's interest? We talked about McCoy. John List. He- John List is a D.B. Cooper suspect for two reasons. He looks exactly like the sketch.

Starting point is 01:15:21 And he disappeared like six weeks before the hijacking. The problem is that you just, you didn't have the skill set to do it or anything. You know who John List is right? No, I do not. Oh, John List is great. As a family man, I really look up to John List. John List murdered his whole family in Jesus.

Starting point is 01:15:44 While they slept and then bounced. John List murdered his whole family in Jesus, Christ. Long they slept and then bounced and started a new life. Oh, that makes me sad. He did not see that coming. Because he wasn't, he wasn't caught for like 25 years. He was caught thanks to America's most wanted and was living like with some new chick in Florida or something. And you had kids with her No, no kids with her. You didn't kill them. He didn't want them. He fucked up. Yeah God and you're a family guy. I am a family man. Oh Jesus. I hope your family doesn't hear that part of the podcast that. That's okay. I love ghost a ninja. You don't have to ever worry about that. Um, the the the the th. Oh. Oh. Oh. the the the the the the the the the the the the the the their. their. their. their. th. to. to. to. to. to. to. to. to. to. to. to. th. th. to. to. to. to. to. to. to. to. to. to. to. to. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. t. t. t. to. to. to. to. to. to. to. to. to. to. to. to. to. tod. tod. tod. t. have to ever worry about that.

Starting point is 01:16:26 Ted Brandon? Ted Braden. Ted Braden would probably be if I had to rank them, the one who was most likely of all the suspects I know. Really? Yeah, Ted Braden was a commando, a green beret, just an absolute badass in Vietnam. He was doing covert ops. He had all these free fall and parachute jump experience when really no one else had kind

Starting point is 01:16:57 of high altitude, low opening experience. And he goes AWOL from Vietnam. He's caught in the Congo working as a mercenary. He gets brought back to the states sent to 4 Dix. Wall in Fort Dix, they mysteriously let him out. And I've spoken with one of the MPs at that place at the time. And he said it was so suspicious to walk by Braden's cell. And he was smoking a wooden tip cigar,

Starting point is 01:17:34 was in his full get-up and was watching a TV. And he said, absolutely none of that would have been allowed at the time. So I knew that this, whatever was going on with this guy was well above my pay grade. He gets let out mysteriously and then pretty much vanishes for most of his life. My friend Drew B.Cen has been working on kind of putting together where he was and when he was. Because a lot of the Special Forces guys at the time thought that DB Cooper was Ted Braden because of how bold and brazen it was, he kind of looks like the sketch, and he absolutely could have pulled

Starting point is 01:18:11 it off and would have been calm during it because he's special forces, you know, he's seen shit before, this isn't his first rodeo. Oh my god. Dude there's so many suspects I recall, and I, you'll have to, I hope I give you enough clues here so you can pick up on what I'm talking about. But I remember this, there's some suspect who's still alive or recently dead possibly that gets harassed by people investigating the DB Cooper thing. Does that ring a bell? Do you know what I'm talking about right away? Thank you. You're talking about Robert Raxra, so he passed away, I want to say it was December of

Starting point is 01:18:48 19 just last year. Thomas Colbert started this investigation into him. He'd already been looked into by the FBI. He was arrested for the murder of his stepfather. Jesus. father, mid to late 70s I think, and was questioned about being D.B. Cooper then. And, you know, I have to think if the FBI has you in custody, if there is anything that they could do to put this case on you, they would have done it. So there's nothing against Raxra. Again, he's one of the two guys that gets pushed a lot, that was too young. Raxra was like 28 at the the th the th th th th th th at the th at th at th at th at th at th at th. And th at th at th. And th. And th. And th. And th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. nothing against Raxra. Again, he's one of the two guys that gets pushed a lot.

Starting point is 01:19:26 That was too young. Raxra was like 28 at the time and was sporting a mustache. I gotta tell you, dude. It looks like him though. The Braden guy is so interesting. The Ted Braiden guy does look like him. Dude, that bra. Dude, that to pick. Hairline age.

Starting point is 01:19:50 Well, there's a William J. Smith really does a good job looking like the sketch. There's a side by side of a young Wolfgang gossip. Looks very similar. Who, which, which would you say, Smith? William J. Smith. Oh, this is unbelievable. Dude, we could go on forever about that. Dude, I've done like 45 hours on just this topic on my show. Do you have any other podcast that you do? No, I only do a D.V. Cooper. Oh, yeah. Holy sc. Yeah. that's William J. Smith?

Starting point is 01:20:25 Yeah, William J. Smith. Oh my God, he looks exactly like him. We should just arrest all three of them. But here's the problem with looking like the sketch. There's two sketches. One was done immediately after. That's sort of the Bing Crosby looking sketch. And then you had a sketch that was done a year later, which we refer to as the Kerry Grant sketch. Which ones with the giant

Starting point is 01:20:49 widow's peak? There is, well there's, there's really like eight sketches, but it's those main two that you go off of. The Bing Crosby sketch has more of a widow's peak. Yeah, yeah. There's one that is, I'm seeing here, it's labeled D.B. Cooper Composite C. And it's a pencil sketch, it looks like. And he looks evil. Yeah, yeah, is that, that one's the one that. That was done for unsolved mysteries. Florence Schaffner did that.

Starting point is 01:21:16 That's the one to me that looks the most like like the like Ted Braden. But I mean, those sketches seem to be so generic. And if you think about what the average middle-aged man looked like in 1971, they all tended to have the same haircut. Yeah, all the same. He does look like everybody in Mad Men, basically. Yeah. Go find a picture of your grandpa from 1971. He looks exactly like that. That guy Kenneth looks like him too. Kenny Christensen, he's another suspect that's been widely theorized.

Starting point is 01:21:53 He worked for the airline at the time. He looks like the composite sketch. Oh yeah. There's a weird photograph taken of Kenny Christensen a few years after where he is wearing the suit with the briefcase and a money bag like why would you take that picture? And there's a tie. And the tie is the tie that you use I'm confused it's the it's used in the when you fly. Seems like the sketches are better to exclude people than to include people right because you could just drive yourself crazy try to identify. the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the brief. It the the the the the the th. It's the the th. It's th. It's is the the th. It's is the brief case is the suit the. It's is the. It's is th. I the suit. I's is the suit. I's is the suit the suit the brief case. I the brief case. I the brief. I the brief. I the brief. I I the brief. I I is is is is is is is is is the brief. I I I I I I th. I th. I th. It is is th. It's is th. It's is th. It's is th. It's is th. It's is th. It's th. It's th. It's th. It's th. It's th. It's th. It's tie. It's tie. It's tie. It's tie. It's tie. It's th. It's th. It like the sketches are better to exclude people than to include people right because you could just drive yourself crazy trying to identify and this is who again? Kedip. Oh my god I decide all three of them did it.

Starting point is 01:22:33 Kenny Korsonson said it's another very interesting story worked for the airline for I want to say like 10 or 12 years after the hijacking so that might be tough to do. I'm not the th. the th. the the th. the the th. the th. th. the th. the the th. th. to to to to to th. to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to to use. to use. to use. to use. to use. to to use. to to to to to to use. to to to to use. to to to to to to use. to to to to use. to to to use. to use. to to to use. to to to use. the the to use. the the the the the the the the the they. the they. they. they. they. the. the. the. the. the. the. the. the. the. the. the. try. to. to. to. to. to. to. to. th. to. the hijacking. So that might be tough to do. I'm not certain on that. He also seemed to house runaway 18 boys at his house, which is sketchy. Interesting. Um. No, it's not interesting. It's creepiest shit.

Starting point is 01:23:00 But imagine being working at that airline. And every day you're like at the lunchroom and some new employees like they probably had D.B. Cooper up if you see this guy and they're just like staring at you. You're like, it's not me. Trust me. I've been through this a million fucking times. Wow dude. This is a great episode. Did we miss anything or did we nail it, dude? I think we got it all. I love this, this, this, this, this, I, this, I, I, I, this, I, I, I, this, I, I, this, this, this, this, this, th, th, th. I, th, th. I th. I, th, th. I, th. I, th, thi, thi, thi, thi, tho, tho, tho, tho, tho, tho, tho, thi. And, thi. And, thi. And, th. And, th. And, th. And, th. And, th. And, th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. the, thi, thi, thi, thi, thi, the. the. the. thea. thea. thea. thea. thea. thea. the. tha, miss anything or did we nail it, dude? I think we got it all.

Starting point is 01:23:28 I love this, dude. I can talk DB Cooper for the rest of my life. By the way, if I ever saw a band, it will be called DB Cooper. That's a great name for a band. I love it. This is big a good D.C. Cooper song? What's the biggest band to do it? Uh, Joshua L. Walker just had an album come out with a D.B. Cooper song on it. It's really good. But the main D.B. Cooper song, oh, I'm so embarrassed. I can't remember the guy's name. It's okay, dude. Don't be man. It's all right. You crushed him. Is there a movie. Like a the. the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the t. t. t. the t. the the t. t. the the the t. the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. B. B. B. B. B. B. B. B. B. B. B. B. B. B. B. B. B. B. B. B. B. B. C. B. B. C. B. B. C. B. t. B. t. t. t. t.. You crushed him. Is there a movie? Like a good movie made? Like an actual like cinema theater movie by D.B.

Starting point is 01:24:09 It seems doable, like you make up a story of him. In 1981 they released the pursuit of D.B. Cooper with Treat Williams and Robert Duvall. It's terrible. It's almost unwatchable. The first three minutes of the movie D.B. Cooper jumps out out out out out out out out out out out out out out out. the the the the the their. their. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. th. the the the the the the the the the the the the. the. the. the. the. the. the. the movie. the movie. the movie. the movie. the movie. the movie. the movie. the movie. the. the. the. their. their. their. their. their. their. th. th. th. th. th. It. It. It. It. It's. It's. It's.e.e.e.e.e.e.e.e.e.e.e.e.e.e.e.e. the.e. the. the. the. the. the of the movie, D.B. Cooper jumps out of the airplane. The next 92 minutes of the plane, he drinks beer in a pickup truck with some chick. Great. It's not a great movie. Can you talk quickly about... I'd like to make one D.B. Cooper recommendation that you guys would love. Okay, now I just have one more, we both have one more question. And that's D.Cooper versus Big foot foot foot foot foot foot foot foot foot foot foot. the the the the the the the the movie. the movie. the movie. the movie. There. There. There. There. There. There. There. There. There. There. There. the movie. the movie. the movie. the. the. the. the. the. th. th. th. the. th. th. It's. It's. It's. It's. It's. It's. It's. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. It. It. It. It. It. It. It. It. It. It. It. It. It. It. It. It. It. It. It. It. It. It. It. It. It. It. It. It. It. It. It. It. It. It. It. It. It. It. It. It. It. It. It. It. It. It. It. It. It. It's. It's. It's. It's. It's. It's. It's. It's. It's. It's. It's. It's. It's. It's. It's. It's. It's. It's. It's. It and that's DB Cooper versus Bigfoot. There is no DB Cooper content or Bigfoot content it's just shirtless guys working out.

Starting point is 01:25:01 It's it's quite the movie. That's like a sub genre of films. Eric Roberts is in it. Well that's I have to say get get me hooked. Johnny, what's your question? DB Cooper versus Bigfoot. It's just shirtless guys working out. The, uh, there's a letter that I'm looking at here that was supposedly from D.B. Cooper, sent to the Oregonian. Yeah, I'm sure you know about this. It says I am right here in Portland and the $200,000 is for the Revolution. What's the deal with that? Is that just something focused? It's one of five to seven letters

Starting point is 01:25:28 that were mailed into newspapers from D.B. Cooper. You can't prove that D.B. Cooper mailed any of those. And he asked for his notes back on the plane. Do you think he's going to mail a letter to a newspaper? Nothing credible about any of those. No credibility to any of those. Is there anything else like that that we've left? Is there anything like that, anything else that we've left out, any kind of physical connection to D.B. Cooper that you think is credible that we didn't mention? Like any artifact or remnant of the crime? No, I mean really the only thing we know about DB Cooper is what happened on the plane. There is zero story before he gets on the plane and zero story after he jumped.

Starting point is 01:26:13 I read, well I also read that they, a couple of years ago and you can tell me if you find this credible, they found what they think is a placard from the stairs in the forest? Does that ring a bell? It's been heavily debated and I'd say mostly in towclclclclclclclclclclclclcl tow tow towed towed towed towed towed towards towards towards towards towards towards towards towards towards towards towards towards towards towards thoes thoes thoes thoes thoes tho tho tho thi. thi. their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their their th. th. th. th. th. th. thi. thi. thi. thi. thi. toe. toe. toe. toe. toe. toe. toe. toe. toe. toe. te. te. toe. the. the. the. the. the. the in the forest? Does that ring a bill? It's been heavily debated and I'd say mostly towards that placard not being from the same plane. Okay. I've actually, I personally have seen two different placards that claim to be that one. What about parachute fragments? I know there have been rumors of those being found. Is that incredible? There are, there was a a parachute strap and a piece of foam that some couple found but they were part of like Tom Colbert's team so I automatically have some suspicion on that fine.

Starting point is 01:26:56 Shnaps! Shots fired. There was a shoot found an amboy but they believed it was an old cargo shoot and not a shoot found in Amboy, but they believed it was an old cargo shoot and not a shoot for a human being. So you said there was connection to the Golden State Killer. Did you go into that at all? I feel like is there any... Zodiac Killer. And that... I've had four guests on now that have different theories about Cooper and the Zodiac Killer

Starting point is 01:27:27 being the same person. Okay, and what general is their theory? Their general theory is all unsolved crimes were committed by one person. Okay. There's no actual like evidence to support their theory. They're just like, dude, this is just my gut feeling. And you're like, we're five minutes in this podcast and we got nothing. Oh, I've been there before. Oh, yeah.

Starting point is 01:28:00 If you look at like Ed Edwards, for example. Ed Edwards, there is a lot of really interesting, credible links and suspicion to a number of crimes. And he probably has killed more people than he was convicted of. However, I don't think you need to link in crimes where there's just no evidence. There's no evidence Ed Edwards was D.B. Cooper. None. Just the fact that he was interested in airplanes. That's not evidence.

Starting point is 01:28:34 So, do you get any sense that there's grifters involved in this movement, meaning people who are like trying to sell an angle to make a dollar like they contact you because You're like the best podcast On this subject do they are like oh man I got got in this so I could sell this book or anything like that have you ever a brand run into any of that? Definitely, I think a lot of the whole conspiracy theory True crime unsolved bullshit is that is people trying to make a buck? Is that? Is people? Is? you? you? you? th? th? th? th? th? thi? thi? thi? thi? You? thi? You? You? You? You? You? You? You? You? You? thi? You? You? You? You? You? You? th, thi? You? You? You? You? They? They? They? They're like, th, th, th- thi? They th- thi? They? They? They? They? They? They? They? They? They? They? They? They? They? They? They? They? They? They? They? They? They? They? They? They? They? They? They? They? They? They? th? They? th? They? th? They? They? th? They? They? They? They? th? They? th? They? th? th? thi? They? thi? thi? they're they're they're they're they're they're they're they're like like? they're they're like like? they're they're they're like? they're they're like? they're like? they? they? they? lot of the whole conspiracy theory, true crime, unsolved bullshit, is that, is people trying to make a buck. I'm in the room. I can hear you, I can hear you. Why you pitch certain angles? So, I mean, I've had people on that are trying to sell books that are just nonsensical. But my show, I want to hear what they have to say, and I want to hear them defend their thoughts on it.

Starting point is 01:29:31 You know, I don't question anyone on my show. I had a guest tell me that Frank Morris and the Anglin Brothers killed 25,000 people. And, you know, I just let it roll. I'm not there to question them. I want each episode to be to be to be to be to be to be to be to be to be the episode to be to be to be the episode to be to be to be the to say the the the the to say the to say the the the the the the to say say say say say say say. to say say say say the the the the the the to say say say say. toe. the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the it roll. I'm not there to question them. I want each episode to be a standalone story. If you want to learn about Richard Floyd McCoy, you can listen to the episode I have with Steve, or if you want to learn about Ted Braden,

Starting point is 01:30:01 you can listen to the episode, it would be Drew Bison. And so I leave it up to the audience to decide who's telling the truth and who's full of shit and just trying to sell a book. Well, dude, that's exactly what I do on this show. You know, there's an old saying, give people enough rope, let them hang themselves. So my whole thing, um, with this show is like, that saying some crazy shit and for me it's just like all right dude here's your here it is your platform got a lot of people listening don't fake the funk on a nasty dunk dog because people are gonna know and some people get destroyed and some people get

Starting point is 01:30:43 celebrated I I believe the swarm that listens to show are gonna love your episode so so I really do it thi thi thi the the the thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi it's th th th th th th th th th th th thin it's th thin it's thi it's thi it's thi it's thi it's thi it's thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi thi the the the the the the thi the the thin thin thin the thin thin thin thin thin the thin thin the thin the thin thin the thin the the thin the theeeeeee the thin the the the swarm that listens to the show are gonna love your episode. So I really do appreciate you coming on, man. And one more time, do you have a website? Tell them about your podcast, one more time, and your website, and anything else you want them to find you on. My podcast is the Cooper Vortex. I do it with my buddy, Russell Colbert. It's an awesome show. It's totally free.

Starting point is 01:31:11 Get it wherever you get your podcasts. The Cooper Vortex. We also have a Twitter page, Facebook, Instagram, all that stuff. What are the DB Cooper groupies called? Do they have a name for him? For sure, fly attendants. The fly will call the flight attendant. It depends on which camp you're in.

Starting point is 01:31:32 It's either Cooperites or you're inside the vortex. I love it. Now that's where I got that name from for the show. I was just going to call it the DB Cooper podcast, but when I started doing the interviews, these people started talking about the Cooper Vortex. And so I was like, oh shit, I got a name with that. Nice, nice. Well, you did great anytime you want to come back on if you get any new information that drops

Starting point is 01:31:58 on you or another subject. Another suspect, please let us know, man. We loved it. I've been wanting to do the show forever for the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the the to do to do the the to do the the the to do the the to do to do the the the the the tape. I, tapoomperaugh. I'm, the the th. I'm, th. I'm. I'm. I'm. I'm. I'm. I'm. I'm. I'm. I'm. I'm. I'm. I'm. I'm. I'm. I. I'm. I. I. I'm. I. I'm. I. I'm. I'm. I. I'm. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I'm. I'm. I'm. I'm. I'm. I'm. I'm going. I'm going.a.a.a.a.a.a.a.a.a.a.a.a.a.a.a.a.a.a.a.a.a.a.a. And. And. And. So. So. So. So. So. So., man. We loved it. I've been wanting to do the show forever, and you did not disappoint. And we appreciate it. Final thoughts, if you had to pick somebody on who it was, who would you say? Barb Dayton. We didn't talk about Barb Dayton. We did. That's the transgender one.

Starting point is 01:32:21 Oh, okay. Really? That's the one you think it is. It's because it didn't, she didn't. No, no, I don't think it's Barb Dayton. I pick that one because it's the best story. Okay, I like it. All right. If we found out tomorrow it was D.B. Cooper, it would be a wild story. That would be the one if I could pick, I want it to be that one. I'm because because because because because because because because because because because because because because because because, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I that, I that, I that, I that, I that, I that, I that, I th. I to be that, I that, I that, I that, I that, I that, I that, I that, I that, I that, I that, I that, I that, I, I, I, I, I that, I, I that, I that, I, I, I, I that, I that, I that, I, I that, I, I that, I that, I that, I th. I th. I th. I th. I th. I th. I th. I thi, I thi, I thi, I thi. I thi. I thi. I thi. I pick thi, I pick it's thi, I pick it's thi, I pick it's thi, I thi, I thi. All right Darren, you're the best. We appreciate you coming on and He's Darren Sherman, and we appreciate having you on dude. We'll do it again soon. Okay? Take care brother. Take care We go deep home boy Aaron open your mind Drink from the fountain of knowledge. There's lizard people everywhere That's some interdimensional shit. Wake up, Aaron!

Starting point is 01:33:12 This is only the beginning. You just blew my mind. Tim Foil Hack.

Tin Foil Hat With Sam Tripoli - #397: DB Cooper With The Cooper Vortex's Darren Schafer

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