Today, Explained - A concert? In this economy?

Episode Date: February 20, 2026

A thousand bucks to see Harry Styles. Who’s to blame for high concert ticket prices, and why some artists are ditching the tour bus altogether. This episode was produced by Ariana Aspuru, edited by Jenny Lawton, fact-checked by Andrea Lopez-Cruzado, engineered by Patrick Boyd and David Tatasciore, and hosted by Astead Herndon. Harry Styles performing at The O2 Arena in London. Photo by Dave J Hogan/Getty Images. Listen to Today, Explained ad-free by becoming a Vox Member: vox.com/members. New Vox members get $20 off their membership right now. Transcript at ⁠vox.com/today-explained-podcast.⁠ Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

What's the most you've ever paid for a live concert? I'll start. Floor seats at Beyonce's Renaissance tour cost me $450, which seemed crazy at the time. But these days, that could be considered a steal. Oh my God, the most expensive tickets are $1,100? And I think we need to go away what it is. It's greed.

It's gotten so bad. Kid Rock just went to the U.S. Senate to complain. That this industry is full of greedy snakes and scoundrels. Too many suits lining their pockets off ten. They never had. The fans they mislead. You got Ticketmaster in its dynamic pricing. And then there's the whole secondary market,

with resaleers jumping the line and scooping up all the cheap seats. The result? Some artists ditching the tour bus completely. And higher prices for everyone. So where does that leave us fans? That's coming up on Today Explain from Box. Thank you. Rock him.

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so you can feel confident that your data stays secure as your company grows. Find out more at OnePassword.com slash podcast offer and start securing every login. Today is going to be explained. See you. My name is Taylor Mims. I'm a senior editor at Billboard and I cover live entertainment and touring. Okay, so you are the right person to talk to because it feels like live entertainment and touring has changed a lot in recent years. I recently read that Harry Stiles was charging $1,000 for a concert ticket and, you know, no beef with Harry Stiles. But that seems like a shocking price.

Can you just tell me what's going on here? A thousand dollars is a lot of money for a ticket. If Harry Siles thinks that his fan should pay that amount of money to go see him on stage for an hour and a half, hard pass, ick. I don't even know what the price is. $7,000? How many dollars is that? What do you mean? $900?

I don't want those tickets. But if we're being completely honest, it's fairly typical for these big tours at this point to find tickets in the 1000s, 2000s, et cetera, especially for those really valuable seats. It's been slowly going up over the years, but it really became the normal, I would say, following the COVID-19 pandemic.

Concerts were so in demand, still are so in demand. and people really want to be there, and they will pay good money to have a good seat at a good concert. You know, I love a good stadium tour, but give me the experience kind of step by step. If you're a stand of Taylor Swift or someone who is playing these kind of big stadium tours, and you're fighting with your fellow fans for tickets, what's that process like? Oof, well, it can be really rough. You're going to try and get codes to be in the pre-sale if you don't get pre-sale. If you don't get pre-sail, then you're going to try to go to the general on sale, which should be a couple days later.

And you should be signed in, ready to go. As soon as you hit the queue, you're going to see a number that you do not want to see. 18,500 people, so feeling a little hopeless. I started 175,000 in the queue, and as you can see, I'm going down to 82,000 now. This account has all of them between 160 to 180,000 in the queue, okay? The demand is really high and the supply is limited. You know, I hear what you're saying, but supply and demand was true before the pandemic, too. Is it just that, you know, more people want to go to the concerts now?

What exactly has changed to make this process so much more a sticky? Yeah, you're absolutely right. There's always been a supply and demand issue. But people have figured out that there's a way to get in, to get in that queue, to jump that queue and make a bunch of money off of these tickets. It's become its own marketplace. So this is something that people do and make a ton of money because ticket resellers get in there, buy those tickets at a low price, and then mark it up as much as they possibly can for the secondary market, resell that ticket. And that's their whole profit right there. It's not, it's not that difficult

to make a bunch of money off of these concerts. So we know that people have been scalping tickets online for years. But now we're seeing huge ticket prices from the jump from the original seller, places like Ticketmaster. Who sets that initial price for a ticket? And who should I be blaming here? That's going to be between the artist and the agent or the promoter. So they're the ones that are going to set the ticket price. To be honest, one of the big things that happened over the course of the pandemic is that we lost a lot of good staff, a lot of good crew, because they couldn't make money when concerts were shut down. And the price of everything has gone up.

So the price of touring, so that could be a crew, that could be the price of supplies, literally everything, travel has gone up. And so that makes the price of the ticket go up as well because these artists have to recoup costs at some point. And when you're telling a fan, it's going to cost you this much to get into the door. They expect a show. Welcome to the heiress tour. So on top of that, that means more rehearsal time. that costs a lot of money. It costs a lot of money for these giant productions. I mean, loading in and out of a stadium show is incredibly expensive. And so is, you know, hauling all that

stuff across country, across oceans, et cetera. So there's a lot of costs that have made it more expensive just to be a touring artist. Is it also that artists are seeing these high resale prices and think, hey, you know, if people are going to pay it, might as well. Like, I mean, Could this just be a case of artists prioritizing bottom line over fan accessibility? Yes, but also it's not necessarily that they're prioritizing the bottom line over the fan. It's that they know the fan's going to pay that price either way. So that money might as well go to them, right? So if you're selling a ticket for $200, but you know it's going to go for $1,000 on a secondary market,

if you raise that ticket price to $500, it's a lot less. profitable for the ticket reseller, and that fan was going to pay that price anyway, if not more. But I've also seen some artists pushing back, like Olivia Dean. I think concert tickets are overpriced. I think that people should be able to come to the show, and it shouldn't cost your arm and a leg. Do you know what I mean? So, yeah, more of that. She called on Ticketmaster to cap what people can resell their tickets for on their own platform. To support Olivia Dean's commitment to,

to fair ticket pricing, Ticketmaster is capping all future ticket resale prices for the Art of Loving Live tour on its platform and refunding fans for any markup they already paid to resellers on Ticketmaster. So Olivia Dean was successful, but obviously a lot of ticket prices are still sky high and a lot of other resellers are out there. It seems like these artists using their public platform, their bully pulpit, haven't really moved the needle when it comes to these resale markets. Yeah, that's because these resale markets are entirely legal. Nobody's doing anything illegal, so what are you going to do? They're allowed to do this.

But the more people who make their complaints heard, I think the better it is because people understand that it's that parts out of their control. There's nothing you can do about the secondary market. You know, Taylor, you're kind of bumming me out because it sounds like there's really nothing we can do and that this kind of high-ticket price extortion is just here to stay. Like, what is the recourse for fans who feel like maybe, I don't know, that $1,000 for a live concert might be too much? Sorry to bum me out, but there's absolutely no reason to be this dismayed. There are things that can change.

So one of the things that's happening across the country right now is that a bunch of different states are trying to implement regulations on this, because it has gotten really out of hand. And so you'll see recently in California, in New York, what they've introduced are resale caps. A new bill called the California Fans First Act is taking aim at ticket price gouging. My bill, the Affordable Concert Act, caps all resale concert tickets at face value, among many other much-needed reforms. It's time for state government to step up and protect fans. So when somebody buys a face value ticket, if for whatever reason they can't go, they can resell that ticket for no more than 10% above face value. And what that does is take the wind completely out of the resale market.

Because if I buy a ticket as a ticket reseller and think I'm going to make a bunch of money off of this, but all I can make is 10%. That makes it so much less lucrative to be in this job, to be doing this for a career. So it's very possible. It's very possible, but only one state so far has passed the ticket resale cap, which is Maine. So I guess my question is, do you think there will be a tipping point where fans may say, hey, we had enough and this kind of road we're on for live music as luxury only reverses course or at least slows down? Yeah, I definitely think if we're not there yet, we're getting very close because I think people are really tired of it because it keeps happening. It's not slowing down. It's only getting worse. And so I do think that this legislation is really going to tell us where we're at because we've had almost 10 states introduced this, these resale caps. And I would say even just a couple of years ago, you couldn't even get those bills discussed. because there's so much lobbying money against it.

So I think if we see more states able to pass this, I think that should tell you right there that the tight is turning. I mean, you want to see your favorite artists succeed, right? You want to see them play bigger venues, have a bigger crowd. Everyone really appreciate them. But, you know, with that obviously comes a more expensive ticket and a bigger room. but also how exciting that you get to see that, that you got to see them in that small room,

and then you get to see them in a big arena or stadium, and the energy you can get in the stadium when there's thousands of people excited with you over one artist, that's also an amazing experience, and it shouldn't be just for the select few. Taylor Mims is an editor at Billboard. Coming up, if you want to see one of those big stadium shows this summer, You'll probably have to travel to get there.

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Join DeleteMe.com slash Today code today. I don't know what that is, so I couldn't possibly endorse it. You've never had today explained in your life. I can't say that I have. Robert Levine is based in Berlin, and he writes a column for Billboard. It's called Follow the Money. And it's basically about the music business and often the economics of the music business. All the dull stuff that doesn't involve celebrities.

Well, not all at all, because I just learned so much about just how concert ticket prices are changing. And it helped really explain to me the sticker shock I've been experiencing as someone who loves and enjoys concerts. Now, I'm based in New York, so the news of Harry Stiles' upcoming tour really perked my interest. He'll be here for a 30-night residency, and he has no other U.S. shows on his tour. I found that kind of interesting, and it felt to me like a signal of something changing in the music industry largely. Can you explain to me the business of Harry's staying put like this? Why has this become a thing for artists? What do we think this tour represents?

Sure. what's interesting is all the writing, all the talk about the concert business focuses on the money that's going in. Hardly anyone thinks about the money going out. Just as always, they have crew, they have musicians, they have expenses. The most expensive part is getting it all around. So imagine if you could minimize that expense and make the same amount of money. So is that why we're seeing someone like Harry Stiles sit for 30 nights at MSG? It's to lower travel costs?

Well, look, I mean, I haven't talked to Harry Style, so I'm just making an educated guess, but yes, I think so. And, you know, there's the sort of capital R residency that he's doing. He's declaring this a residency, and he's making an event of it. But if you look at the concert business in general, you are seeing a trend, and sometimes people don't notice it, so we're playing more shows at fewer venues. The same kinds of economic forces are changing the nature of what we might call regular. tours. Now you're seeing more two-night stands, more three-night stands, more four-night stands.

And this isn't economics, but there's also like lifestyle considerations. You know, all those classic rock songs about the romance of being on the road, like they could turn the page by Bob Seeger where he's talking about how burnt out he is. When you're riding 16 hours and there's nothing much to do and you don't feel much like riding, You just wish the trip was through. There used to be a romance to being miserable, and now there's not. Rock stars on tour, the crazy bus, all of that stuff. We're coming to your town will help you party down.

Now you have to come to them and help them party down. And it's just like, I think people realize, I mean, a lot of the performers are getting older. They might not want to move around so much. But also remember, when Elvis was in Vegas, You know, this is not Elvis the teen sensation who wouldn't be filmed below the waist. This is Elvis the middle class performer. And in Vegas, he could stay in a really nice hotel. I want to ask about the New York piece, though, when we think about Harry's style specifically.

Because, you know, I think back to the fame. And I don't have to go all the way back to Elvis for kind of famous residencies in Vegas. Think about Celine Dion. So in here, it's quality sound, quality time. You get your own stage built. Every seat is the best seat in the house. More recently, folks like Adele or even Usher. Well, being able to be here in Las Vegas has given me that opportunity to find more balance

because I got kids that are going to school, babies are learning how to swim, and I want to spend that time. So Vegas had an advantage in that a lot of people were there with expense accounts always. That's probably less the case today, but it's still a convention in a conference town. If you're charging people that amount of money, it doesn't just need to be a great show. it needs to be part of a great weekend. It has to be a city with a lot to do. It has to have great air connections

and a lot of hotel rooms. New York scores on all of those. Two summers ago, Adele did a series of shows in Munich. They actually custom-built a 70,000-seat venue for her. They built a little fairgrounds around it, Adele Spritzes instead of Aparel Spritzes, like a souvenir shop that was as big as a starter home. They had this display of all Adel's most iconic looks, which was so cool to see in real life.

We headed to Adele World and went to the Audrey Guantan, Chin Chin. A ferris wheel? A whole thing. And why Munich? Second biggest airport in Germany, but it's also close to a lot of places in Europe where people have a lot of money. Munich's probably the richest city in Germany. It's close to northern Italy and it's close to Switzerland. I think once you start having a... justify the price, the best thing to do seems to be to get people to spend more money, which is weird, but people love it. It seems as if from what you're saying, it makes sense for the artist in terms of reducing

travel costs. It makes sense because, you know, maybe resell markets have made it clear to entertainment industry that the demand for higher prices is there. But it does, as you mentioned, also raise expectations of what fans expect to experience at the concert. I wonder, in your opinion, are fans getting more for their money at these shows since they're more expensive now? I think that's so much in the eyes of the beholder, right? Like, I thought Adele, I think from Munich, they built the biggest video screen in the world. Bigger than a football field. I mean, it was gigantic.

To me, I'm not that much interested in a big screen. I don't care if it's the biggest screen. I'm not counting. She performed with fantastic musicians, and the staging was really creative. I thought it was an incredible show. You know, I took the train four or five hours to go from Berlin. I thought it was fantastic and well worth it. Now, was I excited about the Ferris wheel?

Honestly, not really. I guess I wanted to know does this model work for smaller artists? Like, what limits artists outside of the Adels or Harry Styles from adopting this residency model? I think it's less about the size of the artist and more about the implied specialness of it. it's about FOMO. These are the biggest concerts, but there's a lot of great concerts. How do you sell this as a special thing? Well, you play your Marquis album.

You promise two shows, two nights, no repeats. Metallica did that. And we do duets at every show, and it's never the same. That is so good. Because it's a no repeat weekend. The band will play two nights in each city with different set lists and different opening acts each night all performed in the round. You really have to create a sense of event.

You have to have a claim on people's souls. You know, in the modern concert business, you have to say it's not so much why do you want to see them, but why now and not next year or the year after? I mean, one question I have is how do you see these residencies having an influence on the way the live event industry operates as a whole? You know, part of what we've been looking at are the changes that have occurred in the industry post-pandemic.

where do you see this piece as fitting it? So I have to admit that a lot of people in the business and who write about the business have been very cautious about the boom in the industry. Look at the price spike post-COVID, but what happens when that ends? When will that bubble burst? Look at how high prices get.

Will people still have the money to go to other concerts? And the truth is, and I sort of hate to admit it, because I've been one of these people. The demand to see shows has proven all of this wrong. There's always this idea that it's a winner-take-all business. You're going to go to a big festival, the rest of your concert money gets taken away. You're going to travel to see Harry Stiles.

You're not going to see other shows. That money ought to be, logically, that money ought to be not spent on other concerts. But you don't see. that. And this is at a time when the economy is very, very good for some people and pretty lousy for most people. So that might be another reason why people are so interested in playing New York and L.A. because you get more people with disposable income. Other people can fly there. But at some point, I don't know what the limit is. We don't seem to get there.

People who might buy a cheaper pair of jeans or a cheaper television don't seem to look at, you know, concerts are not a competitive good. Like, who's your second, if you can't go see Harry Stiles, who's the artist most like Harry Stiles who's also playing a concert? Who's most like Beyonce, who's not Beyonce? The answer is, nobody. Yeah, yeah, yeah. It's not if Kelly Rowland was doing concerts, I would be moving in the same way, right?

Like, it's specific to that artist, and I can kind of see your point being that, you know, that has what has made this shift be more permanent than folks expect. By the way, I bet some of those artists that you would say don't compare to Beyonce, put on great shows. For sure. If you went, you might go to three of those shows and say, wow, I actually like those better. But let me not say yours. Our brains are not wired like that. We can't miss this thing.

And the regular spending logic that we all have seems to not apply. How long will that last? I'm very worried of predicting it because everybody's been wrong. Robert Levine writes to follow the money column for Billboard. Today's show was produced by Ariana Espudu, edited by Jenny Lawton, engineered by Patrick Boyd and David Tadishore, and fact-checked by Andrea Lopez Crusado. The rest of the team includes Hottie Mawaddy, Miles Bryant, Peter Balanin-Rosen, Danielle Hewitt, Kelly Wessinger, Dustin DeSoto, Noel King, and Sean Ramos Furham. Our supervising team is Avashai Artsy, Amina Alsadi, and Jolie Myers. Our executive producer is Miranda Kennedy.

We use music from Breakmaster Cylinder. I'm Ashth Herndt, and tune in tomorrow for Today Explain Saturday. This week, we're untangling the web of conspiracies and lies surrounding Jeffrey Epstein. This will be right here in this podcast feed, or you can watch it on YouTube too. Go to YouTube.com slash box to watch and subscribe today. Today, Explain, is distributed by WNYC, and the show is a part of Vox Media Podcast Network. For more award-winning podcasts, visit podcast.Voxmedia.com. You can listen ad-free by signing up to Vox.com slash members.

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