Today, Explained - Latinos after El Paso

Episode Date: August 9, 2019

In the wake of Saturday’s shooting, Latinos across the United States are questioning their safety. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

If you think it's starting to sound almost routine that this show opens up with an ad for an electric toothbrush, well, it's really funny you say that because the Quip electric toothbrush would love to be a part of your routine. Find out more at getquip.com slash explained, where the Quip starts at just $25 and your first set of refills is free. G-E-T-Q-U-I-P dot C-O-M slash E-X-P-L-A-I-N-E-D. This week, there's been a lot of talk about gun control in America. There's been a lot of talk about white nationalism. There's been a lot of talk about hate speech online. But there's a very simple and sad conversation that we wanted to end the week with. An outsider walked into a Walmart.

According to reports, he specifically targeted Latinos and in doing so, he wounded an entire city. El Paso is not like the rest of Texas. El Paso's in the Chihuahuan Desert. There are mountain ranges, which you don't find too many of across Texas, except maybe across the Big Bend. But it's very deserty. It's brown because of the desert climate. And counting El Paso and Juarez, the populations together, there's about 2 million people who make up this whole metroplex. And you can't really talk about one without the other. The fact that we have this combination of Mexican and Americans who have this interrelatedness between them with such a large population, crossing back and forth, shopping, getting together with families. The fact that there's 2 million people who are able to do that peacefully, I don't even

know how to explain it. And all my experiences are that, you know, we get along. There's really not any blatant racism that I've experienced. There's a lot of interracial marriages here that people don't blink an eye at. So El Paso might be a little bit different than other communities in that we're kind of giving people. You've seen probably on CNN, some of the other news sites who have been at the memorial site right behind the Walmart where the shootings were, there are people there who are bringing water, who are bringing food to the news anchors and to their crews because they're out there in triple digit heat reporting in their coats and ties about the tragedy that happened here. And I guess El Paso being such a peaceful place makes the shooting all the more shocking. It's pretty shocking. For one, the fact that there was a mass shooting in El Paso.

You know, sometimes we have as little as five murders a year. We've been averaging 18 murders a year in the El Paso region in the last five years. And it wasn't one of us. It was somebody else who came into town with that target on his mind. And that target was the Walmart in Cielo Vista in El Paso's east side, which is one of the busiest in the city. And if he wanted to target Mexicans, he really came to the right place because it's a hub. And that hub has gone eerily silent. I was at the memorial yesterday, and it was just really weird for me to see the parking lots empty.

It's normally such a bustling area. Just to have it shut down completely, it's really quite jarring. Norma, you visited El Paso this week. You talked to people. You got reactions. What did you hear? There was this one gentleman who I spoke to who was a U.S. Navy veteran. He says his family has been in the region since 1906, and they've been serving in the military since they were here.

We served our country because we wanted to be a part of it. And now you're tying us to go back to where we came from. You are validating individuals in your rallies to shoot them. Are you putting a target on me as well, someone who served his country? As a Mexican-American and as a veteran, he feels insulted that he's being told that he needs to go back to where he came from. It almost feels like his service and that of his family are being ignored. And so he feels like he almost has that target on his back. And then there was another

woman who I spoke with who had this beautiful Indian headdress. And she told me that her anger goes back generations because ever since colonization, Indians and Native peoples have been targeted. Because of the color of my skin and because of what I'm subjected to and because of my ancestors, that's what brings me here today. Along with all of the shooting that's been going on, not only in El Paso, but throughout our nation. And so there's this almost underlying historical anger that many people have when it comes to this kind of racism, which, again, is not common in El Paso. Did you get any sense of how they felt El Paso might have changed? I don't know if this is going to affect the psyche of the city. One friend who I texted and she told me that even though she was not at the Walmart, she lived on that side of town. She heard the sirens.

She heard the helicopters. She had seen on Facebook some of the unedited video and photos of some of the bodies in the parking lot. And she said when she was in line at a Whataburger getting a hamburger, she couldn't look people in the eye. She almost felt a sense of paranoia and maybe even a sense of PTSD. And I'm sure she's probably not the only one. I think people are going to be processing this in their own ways individually. But as a city, I honestly don't think the security of the city has been changed at all. I still think El Paso is going to continue to be a safe city. But we're on the target list of white supremacists

who think there is a Hispanic invasion of Texas when we've in fact been here the whole time. And historically, Latinos and Hispanics have been lynched and murdered along the borderlands by some Anglos, even Texas Rangers who have killed Mexicans just because they were Mexicans. We've been a target this whole time. The president visited Wednesday Texas Rangers who have killed Mexicans just because they were Mexicans. We've been a target this whole time.

The president visited Wednesday, and there were videos circulating of him being warmly received at hospitals. Look at this group of people. Can you believe this? Good-looking people. They're fantastic. I was here three months ago. We made a speech, and we had a statement. What was the name of the arena? That place was... I was up on a fan page. Right? I was for enrollment. Right? The judges have respected you. I was for state and what was the name of the arena that place was right the judges have respected what was the name i was from roland

that was some that was some crowd thank you and we had twice the number outside but you also went to a protest filled with el pasoans who weren't that excited about his visit which is more reflective of the sentiment towards him in the city? Well, there's two sides to this story, because Hispanics in El Paso are not necessarily all democratic. There is a large populace of Hispanics who are very conservative, and Hispanics are a pretty conservative people. Many are Catholic. I'm not sure if the Hispanic Trump supporters have maybe altered their views about what's happened since, or maybe they think that truly mental illness is to blame for a situation like this, and therefore their beliefs have not wavered. But I think the protests are what have dominated the headlines. So it may appear that the Hispanic community is anti-Trump, and that's not necessarily the case. I just imagine at this rally you were at yesterday, you must have

seen and felt and heard such a range of emotions. On balance, do you think there was more fear or more anger in people's voices? Absolutely anger and defiance. There were so many protest signs, I can't even tell you. They were genuinely angry about the rhetoric, but really not any fear. I don't think El Paso's afraid. I think we're just going to stay strong, like the motto. El Paso's strong. It kind of sums it up. Norma Martinez is the host of Fronteras. It's a podcast about life on the border from Texas Public Radio.

The shooting was a turning point for a lot of Latinos in the United States. That's in a minute. I'm Sean Ramos-Virum. This Is Today Explained. The weekend's a great time to fall out of your weekly routine, you know, like let loose a little bit, maybe forget to brush your teeth until like noon, maybe even, dare I say, go to sleep without brushing. It's happened before in my household. I don't know about yours. The Quip electric toothbrush would like to be a part of your routine and help you through the weekend even.

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weekend? I think I'm going to go see the farewell, maybe hang out at Beyond. Have fun. Esmeralda Bermudez, LA Times, you spent the week after the El Paso shooting talking to Latinos outside the city about how they're feeling in the wake of this attack. What were you asking people? How do you feel? That was the big question. What's going through your mind? One of the first people that I called was Pablo Alvarado, who's the executive director of the Los Angeles-based National Day Labor Organizing Network. And he's seen all kinds of things in Los Angeles over the

years and nationwide from, you know, Proposition 187 in the 1990s. The initiative, which would deny schooling and other social services to illegal immigrants, sparked student protests again today in Los Angeles. To the Minuteman protests, the vigilantes. We've got millions up here, not just thousands, millions. And it's only going to get worse if we don't put a stop to it. What's right is right and what's wrong is wrong. And what they're doing and what's coming across this border is wrong. To America's toughest sheriff, Joe Arpaio, and his hardline policing tactics. He brags about making prisoners eat bologna sandwiches so rotten the meat has turned green.

He's kind of pushed his way through all these things. And the first thing he said on the phone was, you know, this is the first time I feel as if our adversaries have declared war against our immigrant community. Nothing compares to what we're living right now. So Pablo's sort of like in the organization end of this community. What about just like regular Latino folks you called in California after this? What were they saying? A lot of emotions, you know, heartbreak, anger, indignation, fear, a lot of looking inward. Very simple but very painful questions about identity.

You know, should I continue to speak Spanish to my children in public? Will having my Latino name that I put outside my business on my sign potentially make me a target? Should I go to church today? Should I go to a Latino grocery store today? There was this one fellow that we spoke to that said, I'm watching everyone from the corner of my eye. It's come to this. You've got to watch where you shop. And this is exactly what happened in El Paso, right? I mean, the shooter apparently wrote in his manifesto that he was executing this attack as a response to the Hispanic invasion of Texas. He allegedly told investigators that he wanted to gunman target Latino shoppers while letting black and white shoppers leave the store, which I guess when you consider America's racial history makes this all feel especially targeted. in the days that followed has been about white nationalism more generally and not specifically about attacks against the Latino community. Have you heard that from people?

Oh, yes. Yeah, there's been frustration over the coverage, particularly in the first 72 hours. We deployed this small army of half a dozen reporters to specifically check the Latino mood. But I think on a national level, I was checking the front pages and it was just a lot of either conversation about either white nationalism or, you know, is this a mental health issue? Is this a video games issue? And meanwhile, the banner across the front page for many Latinos was that this was one of the deadliest hate crimes ever against Latinos that happened. And so when you wake up to that reality every single day, that's your front page in your mind. But the actual front pages nationwide don't say that explicitly in their

headlines. It becomes very painful for people, you know, that in this dark moment their voices don't feel as heard as they should be. My name is Melina Zavala. I'm from the Dallas area. I'm entering my freshman year of college at UT Austin. My name is Edna Parra. I am 36 years old. My name is Enid Moyeno. I'm 43 years old. I currently live in Maryland. I'm originally from Puerto Rico. My name is Estefanita Giselle Valdez. I am 27 years old, and I currently live in Austin, Texas. The past mass shooting out of El Paso really made me feel vulnerable.

It's just something that I'm always going to have to fight for, even at a Walmart. I've already had previous experiences. In seventh grade, everybody knew that I always brought up Hispanic issues or Hispanic problems or what it's like being Hispanic. This boy got fed up in a way, and he started calling me green card. And people would laugh. It kind of led to me shunning it out in a way for a really long time. And I'm just now kind of getting back to my roots because of what this small white boy said to me five, six years ago. It really made me change who I saw myself as and who I was and my identity. I am afraid to go into crowds. I am afraid to advocate or protest.

I just don't think that, you know, we're welcome. And I'm also very fearful for my child and, you know, his future. Just having to think about, you know, how I raised him or what I, even naming him was difficult. I felt that if he had a very Hispanic name that he would be targeted, even though I never would have thought that 20 years ago. Realizing that a Hispanic sounding name could hurt him in the future or he might experience racism was a really hard thing to understand

and deal with. I have been feeling anxious when I'm out in public. I speak whatever language I want to speak. If I'm with friends and we're speaking in Spanish, we're speaking in Spanish. The only thing is that, you know, I might look at this is the exit. Let's see how many people are around us. I am aware because I've had lots of experiences. All of a sudden, we're in a fast food restaurant. We're making a line to order food. We're all speaking Spanish.

And then there's somebody behind us who stops and stares at us just because we're speaking Spanish. As a Hispanic person living in America, I would really like to see gun control laws. This thing that has been going on that it's video games that perpetrate this, this is not a reality. You know how many kids play video games who speak Spanish and they're not out there shooting people. I don't think this event has shifted how I present myself. I've never shied away from my Mexican pride and who I am. And I would be doing a disservice to my ancestors if I didn't continue to share who I am. But for sure, I have the hesitancy and the suspicion of what will it be like if someone comes up to me because I happen to wear a embroidered shirt or, you know, my hoop earrings or anything like that.

I'm darker and I know I've been stared at when I've walked into places with my mom and they think that we all have to take more time to understand the different paths that we walk and why people are facing the certain situations they are and understand why someone might be angry and understand why someone might be angry and understand why someone might be ignorant. You know, I think it's just a matter of

realizing the whole quilt of it. And unfortunately, it's something that's going to take more than just a few years and a few policies. Esmeralda, you write about Latinos for the LA Times. That's your beat. And this feels like something unprecedented for Latinos in the United States. How does this shooting fit into the rest of your work? I've covered so many different stories about Latinos from so many angles. And there's often these themes, right, of being Latino in the United States means

constantly having to surrender, you know, whether it's your language, don't speak Spanish, or potentially your last name or your identity, or don't identify so much with your home country, your parents' home country, there's just constant erasure. And then also having to prove yourself. Are you American enough? Are you smart enough? Hardworking enough? I, myself, last spring, I was attacked on a playground for speaking Spanish to my daughter. Really? In Los Angeles? Someone chose to scold me for speaking Spanish to my daughter. And when we have those conversations, a lot of times you would think that this is a battle that live with more younger, newer immigrants, like maybe of my generation. I was born in El Salvador. But we've learned this week, you know, my colleague

Paloma Esquivel and I this week have been exploring a story about Latinos who have been in the U.S. anywhere between 100 and 400 years. And those same anxieties are just as strong. My colleague Paloma spoke to this woman actually from Texas, Mrs. Valencia, whose family's roots date back to the 1600s in West Texas. Her great-grandfather was killed by a white lynch mob 101 years ago. And, you know, she and her husband, they fought discrimination as teachers. They eventually, you know, moved to El Paso to seek refuge there. And Mrs. Valencia says that, you know, when she heard about the Walmart shooting,

she turned to her husband without knowing anything about the manifesto, without knowing anything about whether this was race related. And she said to him, it's here. They've come to kill the Mexicans. You know, her feeling at this point in time in 2019 is here we are 101 years later having to deal with the same thing that her great grandfather dealt with way back in the day. To think, my God, here's this Latino who has been here since before the U.S. was the U.S., and they're experiencing the same things that I see in Latinos who just potentially got out of a detention center

or who just crossed the border. Those questions about do we belong are just as strong. I spoke with Norma Martinez earlier today, and she said people in El Paso weren't necessarily fearful. They were angry. And you're telling me that people you're talking to are also fearful. And I'm wondering, do people want to do something with all that emotion? I've heard a lot of different things. I think one of the things that has come through pretty loudly from people is also a great sense of solidarity, people coming together,

whether it's on social media or through vigils or speaking up. And then, you know, as you saw in El Paso, when Trump was scheduled to visit, you know, one of the council members, I think it was there, who said, you know, we're going to be as more Mexican than ever. You know, they wanted to wait for them with this huge Mexican feast of food and traditional clothing and rancheras and who knows what else. And then, of course, there's folks who are buying guns or buying, you know, kind of backpacks for their kids for schools that are bulletproof. It's a whole mix of things, I think, that people are trying to do right now just to cope. You know, you brought up the president, who, of course, has been on this sort of bizarre unity tour this week. It was just like two months and four years ago where he declared his candidacy for president by saying that Mexico isn't sending its best people.

It's sending criminals. It's sending rapists. if you remember that, it doesn't seem that surprising that there's violence against Latino communities in the country. It doesn't seem that surprising that this is an outcome. But do you get a sense that people have forgotten that? Folks that I've spoken to, this has not been in any way forgotten. It's felt like a drumbeat. That sound has been getting closer and closer to their front door. And you know, you've got a whole list of things, right?

You've got him attacking a federal judge's impartiality because he's Mexican. You've got him chuckling and joking when someone on his rally jokes about shooting immigrants. You've got him consistently, you know, talking about using the word invasion, invasion. But you know, what's also interesting is that when I've talked to people, all this has been sort of packaged in immigration from that moment of like, they're not sending their best. We've moved on to, you know, conversations and debates over detention centers and asylum seekers and the border. And so I think for some Latinos, it was still feeling like, hey, you know

what, they're pointing that finger at someone else, maybe the Central Americans, maybe the more recently arrived immigrants. They're not talking about me. I'm feeling a little bit more stable over here. But El Paso, I think, really did something to shift that. When a shooter shoots, he doesn't ask, are you Central American, are you asylum seeker, do you speak Spanish? It really does make you feel that the blanket is much broader here for Latino based off of this manifesto on what happened in El Paso. Thanks to the Quip Electric Toothbrush Company for supporting the show this week. They're at getquip.com slash explained, G-E-T-Q-U-I-P dot com slash explained. That's where the toothbrush starts at just $25 and your first set of refills free.

They'd like to be a part of your routine, but in a helpful way, not in a way that might impede you. So check out the website if you're interested. Thanks.