Today, Explained - Testimony (Part 2 of 2)

Episode Date: September 27, 2018

Today, Brett Kavanaugh responded to Christine Blasey Ford's testimony that he tried to rape her in high school. (An episode on Ford's testimony was released earlier today.) Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

We're covering the Senate Judiciary Committee hearings today, and we're doing it in two parts. There's already an episode in your feed about Christine Blasey Ford's testimony, and this one's all about Brett Kavanaugh's. Thanks. Mr. Chairman, Ranking Member Feinstein, members of the committee, thank you for allowing me to make my statement. Dylan Scott, you report on politics and policy here at Vox. We heard from Christine Blasey Ford this morning. In the afternoon, we heard from Brett Kavanaugh.

Tell us about his opening statements. Kavanaugh is mad. My family and my name have been totally and permanently destroyed by vicious and false additional accusations. When this allegation first arose, I welcomed any kind of investigation, Senate, FBI, or otherwise. The committee now has conducted a thorough investigation and I've cooperated fully. I know that any kind of investigation, Senate, FBI, Montgomery County Police, whatever, will clear me. Nearly from the moment he opened his mouth, he was very aggressive. It was a stark

contrast to the interview he gave to Fox News a couple of days ago. We heard that President Trump was not particularly enamored with his performance on Fox News. He was too contrite. He appeared too remorseful, just soft, which we know President Trump doesn't really like. And so Kavanaugh really came out of the gate at the Senate hearing today, very aggressively defending his name, casting these as spurious allegations that had been brought on by the Democrats. This whole two-week effort has been a calculated and orchestrated political hit, fueled with apparent pent-up anger about President Trump and the 2016 election. And he spoke for nearly 50 minutes in a sort of at times rambling, at times hard to follow defense of not only denying that he had done what Dr. Ford said he had,

but going through his resume, talking about all these women he knew, all these women he supported professionally, and really trying to give, I think, as comprehensive and aggressive as possible a defense of himself and his nomination. And like Ford, in her opening statement, he also got very emotional. In particular, when he mentioned that his 10-year-old daughter had said the night before that they should say a prayer for Dr. Ford. The other night, Ashley and my daughter Liza said their prayers. And little Liza, all 10 years old, said to Ashley, we should pray for the woman. It's a lot of wisdom from a 10-year-old.

That was fairly early in his statement. And for another 30 minutes, he continued to, yes, be very visibly emotional, which was certainly an unusual look for a Senate hearing and for a Supreme Court nominee appearing before the Senate. And not only was this a stark contrast to his appearance on Fox News on Monday night, but it was a much starker contrast from his appearance before the Senate Judiciary Committee some weeks ago. Yeah, everything had been normal until now. We had, you know, there were obviously hard questions from Democrats and Republicans at times.

But this was a Brett Kavanaugh that we had not seen before today. And that contrast only widened once he started answering questions from Democratic and Republican senators. How did that go? At first, Kavanaugh was questioned by Republican outside counsel. This is Rachel Mitchell. This was Rachel Mitchell. Who also questioned. Who had also, yes, questioned Dr. Ford before. And it was very, you know, it looked like a

courtroom proceeding. There were yes or no questions. He gave very flat, one-word answers. But as soon as Democrats had their turn to't giving us any facts. So all we have... You're interviewing me. You're interviewing me. You're doing it, Senator. I'm sorry to interrupt, but you're doing it. At one point, he asked Senator Amy Klobuchar, one of the Democrats, whether she had been drinking. He clearly, you know, he gave the floor to Republicans to sort of make their points. But with the Democrats, he was combative, he was defensive, and he was clearly trying to show a sort of aggression towards the charges that they were bringing against him. He talked a lot about how much he likes beers as far as accounting for his high school actions. He said, I like beers a lot.

I drank beer with my friends. I liked beer. Sometimes I had too many beers. I still like beer. Other than that, he didn't really get into too much of admitting to any sort of wrongdoing in high school. And he, of course, vehemently denied any sexual misconduct. But one of the first really tense moments between Kavanaugh and a Democrat came when Dick Durbin asked him if he would hear in front of everyone, in your innocence as you project here at this hearing, then why not ask the FBI, an impartial body, to investigate these claims, and then we'll all know what the facts are. I welcome whatever the committee wants to do because I'm telling the truth. I want to know what you want to do. I'm telling the truth.

I want to know what you want to do, Judge. I'm innocent. I'm innocent of this charge. Then you're prepared for an FBI investigation. They don't reach conclusions. You reach the conclusions, Senator. No, but they do investigate questions. I'm innocent of this charge. Then you're prepared for an FBI investigation? They don't reach conclusions. You reach the conclusions. No, but they do investigate questions. I'm innocent. And you can't have it both ways. Durbin spent his whole five minutes questioning Kavanaugh on this point and did at one point

tell, ask Kavanaugh to turn to White House counsel Don McGahn and ask for an FBI investigation to be opened. And Kavanaugh was, he was evasive. He didn't want to give a flat answer. And at one point, Durbin asked him, Judge Kavanaugh, will you support an FBI investigation right now? I will do whatever the committee wants to. Personally, do you think that's the best thing for us to do?

And Kavanaugh was silent. It was one of the most striking moments of the hearing. It was a silence that was interrupted by Dick Durbin. I wonder if Durbin didn't speak, how long that silence would have continued. It was uncomfortably long as it was. So yeah, I can't imagine letting it linger much longer. And then Lindsey Graham speaks, the opposite of silence, I believe. I think what was notable about this too was, as I said,

Rachel Mitchell, an outside counsel, had been doing the questioning for the Republicans up until now. But as Democrats were interrogating Kavanaugh with their own lines of questioning that Republicans find offensive, yes. As forcefully as Kavanaugh defended himself at the beginning of the hearing, Lindsey Graham came out, accused Democrats of slandering a good man, of permanently scarring the process of Senate confirmation of Supreme Court justices. What you want to do is destroy this guy's life, hold this seat open, and hope you win in 2020. You've said that, not me. And he spent a good five minutes just railing into the Democrats in a way that we hadn't seen from Republicans up until that point in the hearing. When you see Sotomayor and Kagan, tell them that Lindsey said, oh, because I voted for them. I would never do to them what you've done to this guy.

This is the most unethical sham since I've been in politics. And that, again, just seemed totally out of place for what is usual in congressional hearings and testimony like this. I asked Lauren McGann, you know, the real audience here, though we're all watching this, is the Senate Judiciary Committee. This is about convincing senators on the committee one way or another.

Was anyone swayed by Kavanaugh's testimony? Did it seem that way? There's only one person I'm interested in, and that is Jeff Flake. So the Senate Judiciary Committee is almost evenly divided between Democrats and Republicans. I believe there are 11 Republicans and 10 Democrats. And Jeff Flake is the only Republican on the committee who has expressed any concern about these allegations or any concern about Kavanaugh's nomination in light of these allegations. Mitch McConnell can bring Kavanaugh's nomination to the floor regardless of how the Senate Judiciary Committee votes.

But it would certainly look bad politically if Kavanaugh gets an unfavorableulant as he was, you know, what anyone would agree on straight up rude to Dianne Feinstein, a ranking member of the Senate Judiciary Committee, was that he didn't seem very judicious. His temperament really came into question. Yeah, I think a lot of people look at a guy who, I mean, he was haranguing the Clintons in his opening statement. He very pointedly attacked the Democrats on the committee, not the Republicans. And that's not how we think of what our impartial judges are supposed to be like. They're supposed to be even-handed. They're supposed to just have self-control in their temperament, and they're supposed to treat both sides fairly. And Kavanaugh sounded much more like a partisan operative attacking Democrats and sort of kowtowing to the Republicans both in his opening statement and throughout the hearing.

And maybe that doesn't matter now. We live in a world where nobody has any illusions that the Supreme Court is some nonpartisan body where ideology never factors into things. But it's certainly – this isn't how it's supposed to work. The Supreme Court and Supreme Court justices are supposed to be impartial and Kavanaugh was anything but that during his testimony. It feels like this great irony of this political moment that if Christine Blasey Ford's accusations are never investigated and if all the Republicans vote to support Kavanaugh anyway, if he proved himself unworthy of the position just by behaving the way he did today.

Yeah, it's a great question. I think something that's important to keep in mind is, first of all, as I understand it, Clarence Thomas took more or less the same approach to the Anita Hill hearings. He was very aggressive in defending himself. And, you know, you can understand if somebody actually feels they're wrongfully accused, being angry isn't too hard to understand. But, you know, the point I want to make is Republicans are playing a very long game with the Supreme Court. These are lifetime appointments. Clarence Thomas has been on the Supreme Court for almost 30 years. And so it's really about getting through the confirmation process. In 10 years when potentially Justice Kavanaugh is ruling on a litigation about EPA regulations, nobody, especially if you're a conservative who wants him to strike down a

regulation or what have you, you're not going to be too worried about the temperament that he displayed at the Christine Blasey Ford hearing. At the end of the day, it sure seemed like Christine Blasey Ford was convinced that Brett Kavanaugh did this, and Brett Kavanaugh was convinced that Christine Blasey Ford was wrong. It doesn't seem like there's any in between. The Republicans and Kavanaugh have been as respectful as they can be when they're saying that they don't think her story is true, making a point to say she deserves to be heard and maybe something did happen to her at some point in her life. But as Senator Lisa Murkowski, a Republican from Alaska, put it, and she's one of the most important votes to watch if a Kavanaugh nomination comes to the floor. This is about whether a woman who says she has been assaulted is to be believed or

not. And as you say, she left no room to wonder whether it was actually somebody else. She said with 100% certainty that Brett Kavanaugh was the man who did this to her. None of these allegations are true. Correct. No doubt in your mind. Zero. I'm 100% certain. Not even a scintilla? Not a scintilla. 100% certain, Senator.

You swear to God? I swear to God. So I'll add, Judge. Judge Kavanaugh, thank you very much. Hearing adjourned. Thanks to Dylan Scott. I'm Sean Ramos for him. This is Today Explained. One last thank you to Quip Electric Toothbrushes for their support of the show today. Quip Electric Toothbrushes are less bulky

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