Tomorrow - Episode 68: Oi, It's Jesse Cohen!

Episode Date: August 30, 2016

Yo bae, are you down with Jesse? Yasssssss kween you luv his hot takes on the squad! Fleek! Just kidding, Jesse Cohen, member of the band Tanlines and host of the music podcast No Effects, is here to talk to Josh about knowing his place in the commentary on youth culture, his experience with babies, his beliefs about streaming media, and what he thinks about the VMAs. If you'd like to know what the two J's think about all this, then Episode 68 is going to be your jam – just make sure you have the Sunday New York Times with you. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Hey and welcome to Tomorrow, I'm your host Joshua Tvulski. Today on the podcast we discuss moguls, peanut butter, and the New York Times. But first, word from response. Imagine if you could order an extra bedroom for guests that you could remove after they leave. That's the idea behind Lenovo's next-generation data centers built for cloud computing. Lenovo servers are number one in reliability and performance because you don't have time for downtime. And Lenovo server systems allow you to partner with leading software providers to ensure

your cloud solution is best in class. Learn more about how Lenovo is transforming the data center at www.lenovo.com slash data center. Tomorrow is supported by city cards with Android Pay. Listen on your phone. Now you can pay while you listen using the same device. Just tap and go. Download the Android Pay app on Google Play

or visit city.com slash Android Pay to get started. Android Pay is available for eligible city consumer credit cards and debit cards. My guest today is an old friend, a great friend, one of my favorite people in the world. He's also a talented musician, a member of the band, tan lines, and hosts his own podcast called No Effects. This is the most professional intro I've ever done.

For anybody I'm of course talking about, my good buddy, Jesse Cowan. Hi, that was great. I love that. Thank you for me in here, Jesse. Thanks for having me. And thank you for allowing me to do the most professional. I think Ryan can attest to this. The easiest, the most professional and... And no point did you call him sexy, you know? No to do the most professional. I think Ryan can attest to this the easiestly the most professional and

And no point did you call him sexy? No sexy one take. I know this guy. I don't need to calm sexy. I appreciate it because I find him very unattractive Uh anyhow, Jesse Here's the funny thing. Jesse. I was like oh Well, so it's Monday The Monday following the VMAs. That's the video music awards that's put on by MTV. And I thought, who would be great to talk to you about music, my good musician friend and performer, Jesse.

And it turns out Jesse didn't really watch the VMAs at all. I haven't watched it in years. He's got a kid, he's busy reading presumably books probably doing a crossword. Catching up on New Yorkers. What were you doing last night? I'm curious, I'm watching the Americans now. Oh, everybody's talking about the Americans.

We started watching it, I don't know. Okay, I don't know, I mean, I wanna like it. I do, I think it's very interesting. I like the actors. You like the era? Yeah, I mean, I don't know. I mean I want to like it. I do. I think it's very interesting. I like the actors You like the era look. Yeah, I mean I guess so. Yeah, you know, I haven't watched the VMAs in years actually and I I've some I've one question I have and this isn't why I don't watch it, but one thing I don't understand about the VMAs is Who decides on who wins and why. My understanding is it's just a decision that they make.

Well, that's actually, let's actually drill into that a little bit. They gave out last night on the award show. They gave out, and Craig, if I'm wrong, Ryan, because I know you will. I want to say they gave out four awards. I think it was like five. And one of them was at the pre-show,

they gave Fifth Harmony Award outside the building. I like that. I think that's good. I would say that the award part of it is really more of a suggestion that they're gathered there for a reason, let's just call it an award. Yeah. And that's actually what the Grammys are becoming, too.

It was all about performances. You did watch some of the performances. I did partially on your own and partially at my request. As soon as you asked me to be on the show, I wrote back. I said by the way, I didn't watch the VMAs last night and I actually thought while I was Watching the Americans. Boy, I'm glad that I don't have a job where I have to watch the VMAs. It's it's perfect. I think it was just perfect timing and real kismet. They didn't even rate so I thought like Jesse I'm gonna have this musician like, like you know guys get always following music, knows what every time it's going on.

It has a podcast where I talk to musicians. It has literally a podcast, No FX, which is spelled just the way you say it, not like No FX, the band. Although it is a play on the band. It's a play on the band. Are you a band of the band No FX? I was, yeah. Where are you? play on the band. It is. It's a play on the band. Are you a fan of the band? No, a fact. I was. Yeah. Where you? That was when I was

a kid. I don't know that I've ever, and this is going to sound probably very embarrassing for me. I'm because I'm supposed to be like a guy who knows music. Maybe. It actually will make you sound cool. I don't know if you got that right. I've heard no effects. That's yeah. That's because when you were a teenager, you were into the rave scene. I was into rave culture and rave culture. Rave music.

Yeah. And I was into suburban, terrible pop punk music. Is that what they are? They're like Blink 182. Yeah, they're less poppy than Blink 182. Ryan, I suppose you can interspers A couple of lines and I can turn myself in. We'll be kicking it in hands and the punk rock show. Yeah.

Boxer going to guy. You know just what. Boxer going to guy. You know just what you do. When the doctor tells him to reach your drinking. Now the time will be ever one. Can you take one A2 without the songs? So like, Blikway and Tube are not catchy.

Yeah, exactly. What's their most popular song? What's the big, no effects kit? There we go. I have any guys who's like the waiting room. That's like song. Like I can read you the Google's top hits for them and you're not going to know any. Let me hear a couple.

Let me hear a couple. Let me hear a couple. Stickin' in my eye. No. Don't call me white. I think I know that one. The separation of church and skate. No. This is really not what I wanted to talk about. But I can do it. I can handle it.

Then you're having a tomorrow experience. Sorry. Don't call me white as a song. Yeah. Can we call me white? Yeah. Can we get? Can we hear the lyrics from Don't Call Me White? I just want to get a little taste. Oh, I would love to. It goes, Don't Call Me White. Don't Call Me White? I just want to get a little taste. Oh, I would love to. Oh, what? It goes, don't call me white, don't call me white, don't call me white, don't call me white. The connotations where in my nerves, then could it be semantics generating the mess or in? I understand the language breeds stereotype. Wow.

But what's the explanation for Malice? For the spite. Don't call me white, don't call me white. I'm sorry. Why do I mean the mess or it's going up? I wasn't brought here. I was born, circumcised, categorized, allegiance sworn. Does this mean I have to take such shit for being fair skinned?

No, I am part of no conspiracy. I'm just your average job. I'm going to skip over the course, represent everything I hate. No, I like that's enough. I think that's enough. I think we're good. Don't call me what? I hope I'm not expected to defend anything about that's enough. I think we're good. Don't call me what. I hope I'm not expected to defend anything about that. You don't expect to defend it all,

but that's how you know the song. I do know that song. Yeah, is there? Was there? I don't know. I think it was on, I had a couple, I think that's on Punken Drupalik. Which is their best out.

Punken Drupalik is a famous album time. Yeah, I think it was on that one. I feel like I can actually almost picture the cover of Pungan Drupalik. I wanna say, I'm just gonna, it's like, I wanna say there's a kind of silhouette, a side view of a person with like a mohawk of some type. I don't know, not at all.

Not at all what I was thinking. Do they have a noun like that at all? I wonder, Ryan can find it. I think they're still doing exactly that. Where they from? Do you know? I don't know. What is it Boston? Is that so right? I would say California. Really? Yeah. Okay. Um, I know. So how did you how did you end up listening to it? No, I fact, how does that happen? I grew up in the suburbs in the in the 90s. I mean, you were lucky where I grew up if you found that band.

Like that was considered, you were very fortunate if the band like that. What were your classmates listening to? Counting Crows. Dave Matthews, all great songwriters and great songs. It's true. I mean, I think we get a degree that probably in terms of like standing the test of time,

counting Crows will be with us longer than no effects. Yes. Right? Yeah. Dave Matthews band is like herpes once you've gone through college can't get rid of it. Is that something from a routine? No, I just said that.

That's just off the top of your head really. Yeah. It's impressive. Almost feels like a rehearsed bit Ryan. I wish it were. I'd have a better act at any rate. So your podcast is called No Effects, right? No relation to the band itself.

It's a play on. As you said. Yeah, on the main. But it's also, it's my interview style, much like your interview style. We're not putting any effects on this. Yeah. Literally or figuratively.

Neither one. That's right. So for it and wrong. So tell me about, talk about a little bit about, we are gonna talk about good back to the VMAs, but explain, talk about a little bit what you do on your podcast. It's a lot like this show,

but I talk to people who do music mostly. I do music also, my band tan lines, and you used to do music. Did you ever do interviews? When you were DJ. Yeah, I did a few. I'm disclosure, great band. They have never been on the show.

My brother have not been on either of these shows. My brother is a member of tan lines also. That's right. Anyhow. And I met you and your brother at the same day. Same day. That's right. Jesse was in a band called Professor Murder, which just celebrated its 10 year anniversary.

Yes. I saw one of the members put Tony, put a tag me on Facebook, which is a weird way to celebrate any kind of anniversary. But it's been 10 years since the record we produced together, the EP, Wow. Which is called Professor Murder Rides the Subway. That's right. Featuring such stand-out hits as... Free stress test. Free stress test. We'll be playing it in full on tour in

the fall. Are you going on tour? We're doing the 10th anniversary tour. We're just going to play the four and a half songs in their entirety and then it's incredible Wonderful and yeah, so yeah, we met the same day in I guess about 10 years ago at your studio Yeah, at our studio now defunct destroyed studio which has been turned into a Halfway house correct in Brooklyn. That's right. Yeah It was as most studios are yeah, it went from a most of the wayhouse to a halfway house. It's the difference between a studio and a halfway house. It's people know whether or not you're doing jobs.

Yeah. It's a good thing. It's a quarter. It's a nurse panel. It's a great note. It's got five of you in the fire over there. Yeah. Anyhow.

So no, I do a ton of interviews and everyone who does music does. And most of them, I think, are pretty bad, pretty boring. I think in general, if you have not a great promotion for the show, well, not my, that's why I started this show. Oh, you mean other interviews are boring. In general, I would say that interviews with musicians are more uninteresting than they should be. Okay. And I think that that tends to be, and musicians in general don't like doing interviews, because you get asked the same questions over and over again. And basically I wanted, I listened to a lot of podcasts that I wanted to show where,

unless you're, right now, unless you're famous enough to be on fresh air, pretty much no one will just sit and talk to you for an hour if you're a now, unless you're famous enough to be on fresh air, pretty much no one will just sit and talk to you for an hour if you're a musician. Zane Low. Okay, unless you're famous enough to be on Zane Low. His interviews are some of the worst in my opinion. I've never, actually, I've never listened. Oh, really?

If you want to hear a bad interview, listen to Zane Low. Yeah, of course, I'm not one to talk. I think most people probably think I'm terrible at interviewing, so. But you know, everybody's entitled to their opinion. That's right. So yeah, that's why I started my in interviewing. So, we got everybody's entitled to their opinion. That's right. So yeah, that's why I started my own show. And basically I just sit down with people and we talk for, it's a lot like this. We talk for a while and at the end of it everyone, pretty much everyone's on the show is

like, that was great. I would do that again. Yeah. Or my favorite, I should have a podcast. Yeah, that's a good, that's a good reaction. That is good. Like, oh, this is, it wasn't terrible. Yeah. That is good. Oh, this was inter-able. I enjoyed this.

So that's what the show is. So who is the last person you're on on? Casmicomes. Oh, Casmicomes. Yeah. I really like the Casmicomes record called, I think it's called Prefection. Yeah, love that.

I love that. I want to say it's from 2003 or something. Sounds right. Great record. Very good. I have no idea what Casmicomes is up to now. I should listen to a five or six album since then that are fairly similar. Is he Canadian? He's from California. Okay, close. Yeah, close. I had Tegan and Sarah on recently. Huge stars. Yeah, toward with Taylor Swift. Yeah, Neil Young. And

Neil Young. And when they first started out. And the last interesting, less important, Neil Young. Right. And they just released a record. It's called Love You to Death. Love You to Death. You know, Laura's a big teagant in Sarah Fenn. OK.

She in love the record. Really? Yeah. I think it's really good. Really? Yeah. Interesting. Do you feel the European Union of that is colored by your interaction with them? Well, my opinion is

colored by the fact that I would pretty much never say anything negative about a musician in any public forum. Really? Yeah. Oh, why? Because there are lots of people who do that regularly and as a musician, like I don't think it's my job to do that. Even if you hate something something I generally don't hate anything like I'm like boy music what about Oay band screwdriver for instance of racist You found my you found the line Your weakness you found my weakness. Yeah, I was happy that I could think of the day of screwdriver You did it really you did it

Suspiciously quickly I would say right but pretty amazing screwdriver cassette collection so I you know I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I love I in defensive oil music, I think it's not racist. I don't think screwdriver weren't oil bands. screwdriver. I think we're classically considered to be an oil band and are definitely racist. I I think they were definitely racist. We agree on that. But I think that oil music and I never listened to it, but I think they were defined by being anti anti racist skinheads. Is that true, Ryan? Can we get a Wikipedia? Why you work on that?

So, is that true? I'm actually surprised to hear that. I actually, no, I really don't. It says skinheads in the first paragraph. No, it's a white paper. Anti-racist. Anti-racist. Anti-racist.

So we just read here though. Let me just hear the whole first paragraph. Which is a idiotic way as a subgenre of punk rock that originated in the United Kingdom in the late 1970s. The music and its associated sub together and its associated subculture had the goal of bringing together punk's skinheads and other working class youth.

Okay. Good beginning, not totally clear. I'm right about this. I can feel it already. Just go to the subheading on racism. Well, it says, literal topics includedyrical topics included unemployment workers rights harassed them by the police and other authorities. They were less than the government. Well, okay.

Um, yeah, but I don't know. I feel like British left wing and race are I'm right. You're right. You're right. Fair point. Fair enough. Okay. So we're not entirely sure that you're not on it. It's featuring the business forcekins last resort was a neo-nazi event, although some of the music goers were neo-nazi or BM supporters, none of the performers were white power music bands. Okay, well, it's an important distinction.

There's left wing skin heads, black skin heads. I mean, I think it just, I think it's screwdriver. I think screwdriver. Can you look up screwdriver to see if there are our screws with a K, by the way. Our screwdriver considered oil. That's a big question.

Okay, that's a good way to get an answer. But no, the truth is, okay, other than a band like that, I just don't, I generally don't talk shit about other issues. Yeah, it says oil. Yeah, I lost this. Damn, that's rough. I'm down one. I'm down one.

Bringing it all the way back around. Oh wow, that's a logo. That doesn't feel, I feel threatened. They're definitely, they're definitely racist. But does it say that they're oi? Yes, I'm very proud of that.

All right, fair enough. But here's, here's it's funny. I learned about screwdriver and oi music on MTV. Interesting. They did a report, an MTV news report about oi music. I might have been part of 120 minutes, I can't remember. But that's, so, I mean, to go full circle, that's how deep MTV was in the 90s on talking about music.

And last night, not as deep. I was just put that way. But also, probably more enjoyable. Yeah, how was the show? You didn't see any of it? You saw some performances. I woke up and I watched the Kanye moment. Speech?

Yeah, and then the Beyonce moment and one Rihanna performance. So Rihanna, here's the strangest thing. Rihanna won the Vanguard or was given the Vanguard award, which is the Michael Jackson Vanguard award. It's like, what do they call the Oscars? It's like a lifetime achievement award. lifetime achievement. That's which is weird,

because Rihanna's 28. Well, the other ones are Beyonce and Britney Spears. It's not like they're giving it out to like the Lewis. They already has more hits than Michael Jackson. Here's a Tina Turner, we don't love the lifetime achievement award. We're not the same thing. It feels like they're definitely giving out to people

who are still very popular, which is odd. But it's not like they're giving it to like, Lionel Richie, which would make sense because he's been making music for 100 years. Rihanna had to perform four times, three times. Which is weird. No, no, that's what I'm saying. It's like she had to do an opening.

She did the opening performance in which she was wearing a hood by, that's what I'm saying. It's like, she had to do an opening. She did the opening performance in which she was wearing a hood-buyer or a ringer t-shirt. That's the one I saw. Yeah. And also she's wearing like hospital shoes with feathers on them or something, or like fur, which I thought was great.

But very 90s. And then she performed in the middle of the show and then closed the show essentially with a- Two in the middle. Two performances. Yeah, the show essentially with two in the middle. Two performances. Yeah, she's four performances. I don't understand this. You're being given this, you're being lauded as this great artist and you've got to like,

you know, you got to like do a four performances to get the award. It seems very strange to me. That would have been something as a former MTV employee. That would have been something she asked to do. Like Bernie Spears got it and she did it on the four performances I would think that she might have really think she was like I'd love to perform four times yeah I think I think if she could have had the entire show to herself she would have wanted that it's the maximum exposure well the important thing about Rihanna was that there's this huge controversial moment between her and Drake

did you see this? No. The Swerve. Well, it's great. So I don't know what's going on. Are they dating? Ryan, do you know? I think they are low-key dating, but it's not great for either of them to be like, I'm

in a real, like you're either Beyonce and Jay Z, or it's better to be a free agent. Yeah. And I think at the moment she was like, why are you proposing to me on the V. I think there was a lot, there was a lot of chatter on Twitter. You weren't paying attention because you were watching the Americans that there was gonna be a proposal. He was wearing a tuxedo. No one else is going to be participating.

I was telling you the truth. Like, I'm a 36 year old dad white guy. Oh, you're doing it? You're gonna own it? Yeah, I know. Like, I don't even wanna hear my own take on Rihanna. Like, just the thought of my own take on her is boring to me.

So, and I felt this way for years. Actually, no, no, it's true. Like I love rap music and pop music and, you know, music that's traditionally like the youth's music. And that's not, the youth's music. And that's not. The youth's music. Let's get your oxygen tank. You know what I'm talking about?

It's sort of just like, it's kind of just like, I'm a passive participant. I recognize that. Why can't you be an active participant? Because I don't want to be. I don't think, and I don't need to weigh, and this is something I feel a lot actually. There's, I feel like, sometimes there's a pressure

to weigh in on things like the VMAs. A hot takes. Yeah, and I don't do that, because I don't think that I have anything really to, it's not for me to comment on. Really? Yeah. That's such a strange opinion.

Is it? Well, you have an opinion that you don't have any. It's not for you to comment on the VMAs because it's the youth's music. It's just not. And you also have an opinion that it's not for you to comment on musicians negatively. Negatively because plenty of other people do it. Yeah. I feel like you're sure you a lot of responsibility.

No, I think I have a lot of your views. Like you're veering around your responsibility. Yeah, I just, no, I think I have a pretty highly refined sense of what I call share with all. That's a word I came up with. My sense of share with all. What is that? What is that?

Share with all is the innate sort of feeling of what you should put out there on Twitter or wherever. Like someone who has a terrible sense of share with all would post a photo of like a woman in her bridal gown before the wedding started. That's terrible. Share with all. Share with all. It's like where with all?

You know, I get the attachment. And some people like who just? You know, I get the attachment. And some people like who just, you know, are just constantly. They're oversharing. It's sometimes, sometimes, but sometimes oversharing is good. Like if your audience likes that,

and if you're oversharing like in a really interesting, vulnerable, emotional way that resonates, oversharing isn't a bad thing. Right. I don't, I don't think I'd be good at that, so I don't do that. Share with all. I don't oversharing. But yeah.

Share with all is a kind of standard for oversharing. It can be, but not necessarily. Well, you could, you could, you could, you could, you could, you could tweet once every three years and do something like really tasteless. What is it? And you'd have a terrible sense of share with all. So, is that how you use it? Yeah a terrible sense of share with all. So, is that how you use it? Yeah.

A sense of share with all. Correct. Like I tweet all day long, but I don't feel like I'm tweeting anything to personal. It's not this is that fall. It's, it's fine. It's just like, you know how some people, you're just like, take the phone away.

The people who you're just like, take the phone away. Give me that person a drum, Donald Trump. Donald Trump. Is it, is he's sharing with all of them? He's tweet about Dwayne Wade's cousin being killed and why you should vote for him. Yeah. Is a perfect example of like a horrible sense of that's not a thing he should have shared with his elevelling. Bad sense of share with him.

He has a horrendous sense of share with all. Who else? Who else? Anyone who's gotten in trouble and have any weener I mean no good bad share with all horrible yeah absolutely but it's all DMs I mean he's keeping in private that's true so but my actually I'm sorry let's just veer for a second Anthony weener just had a new scandal which actually started during the VMAs.

Were you aware of that at all? Let me ask you this. I actually, this is a testament to how washed I feel like I am, is like I live and die by Twitter moments now. That's fucked up and horrible. I know. Very bad for you. I agree.

Twitter moments is not even a thing. I look at it all the time. I look at it all the time. It's like you're letting someone else browse for you. No, it's like putting your browser on autopilot. I agree, but it's also the only place that I find certain new stories, you know, like that are outside of my network.

So did you find the Anthony Weiner story? I did, okay. Through my own network. Last night. Who's this morning? Yes, someone started joking. Like, it's never a good thing when Anthony Weiner's trending on Twitter. And then I was like, what did he do?

Yeah, right. So like, he's ready for president. That's not going to happen. But Laura and I had Laura, my wife, had a long conversation. Last night about this because we thought the most shocking item was he's co-sleeping. Was his son sleeping? I know that he posted a photo with a weird band. I do think, well let's just say this, I mean I think if you're not caught up on the Anthony Weiner, I'm going to like catch the listener up because they may not know. Though usually the tomorrow listener is very well informed about all important events occurring in the world Paul you would agree wouldn't you?

Yeah, um, Ryan do you agree with that? Absolutely. Yes, excellent. So it's good that everybody says. There's a skittiness part of the show. Definitely fast forwarding. But 20 seconds. See you in 30 seconds.

Is that his 30 seconds skip? I do 20. I do 20. Oh yeah. I do 20. I do 20. Oh yeah? I do 20. I think a 10. I do 24 or 10 back. I do 15 each way.

Cause I know four taps and I'm a minute. Wow. Great stuff. Good stuff. Great tips. But Anthony Weiner was DMing with a young lady, who is apparently a hardcore, right wing Trump supporter.

I think it was a mistaken ranking. It's true. It was trapping him, but he's easy to trap. He's like putting a mound of peanut butter out for a mouse. Let me explain. The DMs have been open to me. Let me be clear, mice love peanut butter.

I don't know if you're aware of that. You could have one with cheese. The air is the old, that's the old mice. The young mice. Cheese, that's the grandparents. Cheese is nothing for, actually, can I speak from experience? Do you have your head mice?

Yes. What do you put out for them? Peanut butter. That's right. You don't fuck with cheese, that's bullshit. That's something like cartoon, dumb and scary. Yeah, that exactly, Tom and Jerry. That's something like a lie that we've been told our entire lives. It might be a piece of Swiss cheese. Just put that in front of the

buck. The animals and the cheese. That is real. Then we give a fuck about Swiss cheese. You want to catch them out. And I mean catch and then release as I do. Because I love all animals. They're just gonna come right back, Josh. Catch and release with peanut butter. At any rate, speaking of peanut butter, if the weiner couldn't resist the peanut butter of this hardcore right wing, why were his DMs open as far as?

I heard that, that's fine. It's fine. It's separating from him. You heard this. This guy's like, you're living in some heard that. That's fine. It's separating from him. Oh, you heard this. This guy's like, you're living in some kind of New York Times life. Now, one thing I'll say about Jesse, one of my earliest memories about Jesse Cohen is that he had this ritual where he would, on Sundays, would go and have brunch with his friend, Yoni.

And they would like, read the New York Times together. The Sunday New York Times. Yeah, yeah. That's your impression of that. That was an early thing that I knew about you and I always thought was like so specific and I think as I invited you to brunch or something. And you were like, no, no, I go to brunch with Yoni

and we read the New York Times. Is it true or not true? Not true, not true. But so it's just a lie he made up to get out of going to brunch with me. I think it's just like a fake memory. I don't think so. Very specific. And I have the bad memory. I will, I will cop to a bad memory. I'm agreeing with that. But that one yeah, stands out to me as very specific.

Uh, did you go to brunch with Yoni? I have. Are regular basis? No. Really? Yes. Did you ever read the New York Times at brunch on a Sunday? Maybe, but not by design. Well, I think you must have made up a lot to avoid going to brunch with me in that case. That's possible. Which I took as a, basically, like your staple.

You're like, it's okay, he can't go because he has this thing that he does. Yes, exactly right. That's the only way. I think Laura had anything to do with it. I think Laura would back this up, actually, that this is the thing I was like, oh no, Jesse goes to brunch the young

and they went to New York Times or whatever. It's so it's fine that he's can't come to, yeah. Yeah, I think that's okay. Maybe you're a misremembering, is that possible? No, this is like a courtroom and your cross is like examining him on that. It's fine, it's a big deal. At any rate, I'm shocked to learn that I was lied to.

That's a big revelation. I've been, I'm shocked to learn that I was lied to. That's a big revelation. I've been for like about a decade. I've been assuming that's what Jesse does on Sundays. And I assume that Hannah, I assume that Hannah and the baby would interrupt that in some way, but maybe it's a failed affectation. One of those things you like try, try on your personality for a month and it doesn't fit. I actually, all the way back, Lauren, I were coming back from vacation this week and we went to a little trip to Shelter Island. And we bought a time, Sunday times.

And she refused to read the real estate section to me. I was like, let's hear that real estate section. She was like, no, it's depressing. I'm not reading it. It's the worst. I love it. That's the most insane part of that period. The hunt, my fault.

The hunt, the editorial board there is just fucking crazy. Yeah, it's crazy. I love the hunt. Yeah. So good. It's like they wanted a three bedroom with a lot of sun. It's been, they only had $12,000 a month, but today. Well, it happens.

Or when they say like, trend alert, young people are moving into poor areas. It's too big of a stupid, excuse me. I remember you either tweeting or speaking to me about that the New York Times real estate actually was only written for like the richest New York, like it was only for rich people. Did you have said that? What's what we're saying right now that together? I'm saying it all makes sense to me.

Yeah. I don't know what you guys are feeling when you read it. To me, it's like, of course they're having that problem. Who hasn't, no one wants a sunken living room. Actually, I would love a sunken living room. Yeah, I would love a sunken living room. Why, what do you really see in a sunken living room? Actually, here's a question.

What do they do with the sunken living rooms? Did they, they just put wood over them? Like, where do they go? Where's the sunken part of living in? I think the sunken part is the part you're getting back. I think the sunken part is like something they built, like they put the stairs in and the level in, and when they take those stairs out,

you're getting a few more feet to your ceiling. Wait, I'm confused. You're saying that the part that seems not sunken, sorry, the sunken is fake. That's a facade. They build it all into the game. That's all it's dream. That's the same thing.

You don't think they sunk and then build up. No, the Megan Draper said I want a sunken living or a regular apartment and then they made it into that for her. Okay, but I don't think that. By raising the floor, raising the floor. I think the only madman can be used as a kind of historical evidence of,

as he can on this podcast. In that case. All right, anyhow, we should take a quick break and we'll be back with more, Jesse Cohen and whatever it is we're talking about, which to me is deeply confusing. And part and a little bit upsetting. Wildly.

Wildly upset. This week's episode tomorrow is brought to you by Earth Class Mail. Earth Class Mail moves your snail mail to the cloud giving you instant access access 24 seven. And it integrates with the tools and services you use every day. It's crazy that we've moved everything we do for business over to the digital world, but we still need to pick up sort of managed physical mail, which I have been discussing me on several levels. I can't stand physical mail touching my hands. Luckily with Earth Class mail, you get all of your mail scanned and accessible online 24-7. You can search your mail, send invoices

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Correct. So I wanted to talk to you about music, actually. You have very strong opinions about streaming. Actually, we were talking about streaming a little bit in the break, but you and I, nobody heard that because it was during the break. They were listening to great ads that make this podcast a reality. Recently, I was talking about, actually, last week, I was talking about the streaming, the pressure of streaming

and how fucked up everything is now because there's these weird exclusives and that I feel backed into a corner by, if someone has a new release, like the Frank Ocean release, that I'm gonna like, oh, I've gotta subscribe to the service or whatever. And I think it's very bad.

Anyhow, but let's talk about like as a musician, you've got first-hand experience with the streaming world. Tell me about how's it been for you? I am pro. I'm I'm I'm you pro streaming. Yeah, I think in general, it's about as good of a time to do music now as ever.

I would say it. I think it's a very good time to do music now as ever, I would say. I think it's a very good time to be doing music. Not making money at it. No, making money at it. Not really. It might not be a great time to be selling records per se. I draw a distinction between the record business and the music business. And as a musician, you know, selling... Isn't the phrase music business? I don't musician, you know, selling... Isn't, isn't, in the phrase, music business.

I don't even like that phrase, yeah. But isn't it, doesn't it represent the concept that, that musicians are in a business? Well, yeah. So is there, so what's the, selling records is just a part of it. And selling records is like, nah, our thing that happens anymore.

Correct. I mean, it does, like you can say, oh, sounds can, right, says X amount of records were sold. But that's sort of ridiculous metric because everybody streams or downloads now. Correct. Like, it'll be physically buying a record. That's right. But that revenue stream for the record, the recording is still the record business, whether it's someone buying it at a best buy or whether it's somebody streaming it four million times on Spotify. It's art, it's art commerce. Yeah, right? Music commerce.

It's also something, okay, so when I say it's a good time to be doing music, I'm putting that in a historical context where, meaning like, the history of the record, but it's being able to sell music is less than a hundred years old, right? The whole history of... What proceeded to on sheet music? Sheat music. But that's, you know, from the same era as the beginning of the record business. Before that, you know, being a musician was generally, it was a job for...

It was a job for itinerant sort of weird, it was like being a chef or a cook. Or a pod, you were a... Hi, yeah, yeah, yeah. This is like, you were a wedding musician, you traveled, you had a, it was not a great job. It wasn't a wedding. It was like the theater was not considered a prestigious job.

Like, you know what I'm saying? We're talking about minstrelthee. Yeah, I mean, to some degree a bit, I mean, I, it was like working oh, we're talking about minstrelthee. Yeah, I mean, to some degree a bit. I mean, I, I, it was like working class less than working class in some way. Yeah. So the history of, you know, so in that context, like, then there was a big, I think the reason people are upset about streaming income is because there was about 30 years where people made a lot of money from selling records. A small amount of people made a lot of money. Yeah, a very small amount of people made a lot of money.

Yeah, a very small amount of, exactly. Well, not like, it seemed like people were making good money, but it was like 20 people. Yeah, exactly. And most of those people were label lawyers. Right, and it's why music trends were indicted by music. They were dictated by executives and labels. Yeah labels and now there are still those stakeholders. A lot of them are spotify or Apple or there are still, those decisions are still being

made by large corporations. Sure, big machines. By big machines. Like big machine, Taylor Swift label. See him at court. But as somebody who makes music, you know, it's right now you have an opportunity to just reach more people than ever before. Well, that's true. Oh, I think it's an incredible time to be an artist. It's an incredible time.

I mean, I do think from a monetary perspective, I mean, there is this kind of idea that the expectation that you should make money from being an artist seems almost insane. Like, in the world that we know, in the capitalist society that we live in, or capitalistic, I. Nothing either apply here. The idea that making art should be profitable

seems like kind of ludicrous, right? Like it's a vague commodity. It's a kind of like ephemeral and ethereal idea. Art is not a permanent, it's like, oh, let me, it's like not like, oh yeah, my family is eating this art, like they're finally able to sustain themselves. It's like, it doesn't mean anything,

unless you apply meaning to it. In the sense that art is not, it can be edifying, it can be joyous, it can be depressing, whatever, but it doesn't have a, well, it seems like a luxury, but it doesn't have a kind of like, I don't, I believe, and I think you're talking about art, including music and film and everything. I define art, I think what art is,

is it's, art's job is to make people feel things. Yeah, it's job is to, but feelings don't feed your family, and they don't close you, and they don't. They don't. But, and you don't close you. They don't. But you can't trade a feeling for something else. At the same time as humans, we can't live without it. Well, I don't know.

I mean, I've seen some sci-fi films where everybody's on some kind of drug. As shitty as this sounds, it's like that carry Brad Shuffling where she was like, I used to buy Kvogue instead of dinner because it fed me more. And that's like a shitty thing, but I sometimes will pay for my streaming services as a broke person and just eat shitty food

because I'd rather be in the conversation. And I see, I'm just at vogue versus dinner is a, I mean, Carrie Bradshaw can say that because she's a made up character in a fantasy world. But a real person can't say that. They're like, I can feed my family or buy an issue of vogue and they're going to feed their family.

Yeah, but there was art and culture in every society throughout the history of the world way before it was a commodity. I agree. So that to me says that as human civilization, we've evolved to demand and need it in some form or another. I don't disagree with that at all. Right. But it's not, it doesn't have real value.

Well, what I agree with is that it's always been a very tricky thing to commodify. Right? It's not, it's come with, and people get very upset about when it's commodified in a way that they feel is, that's what's selling it, they get upset, they feel like it's mean something to me, and it's being treated wrong. Precisely because it's job is to make us feel things. So when that feels like you're bastardizing it, something that's really important to modify

to make it into a sellable thing. Right, so if when it's done in a way that tweaks people, it hurts them more than other things. So, I'm not sure exactly why we're talking about that right now, but I feel like I made, I don't know, I mean, my case. I don't know either, but,

wait, how do you begin on this subject? Well, I mean, it doesn't come into the economy of like, lots of people can make a very little amount of money on podcasts or YouTube, instead of like, Diana Ross being a multi-millionaire off of a few hits song You know what I mean? Yeah, that's the difference in scale I think it's a great time to be you're saying it's great time to be a musician right that's great time for music and that's true and that's true and that's true in the sense of

if you make music and want your Your sound to be heard. Yeah, there's never been a more immediate and direct and a massive mechanism to allow that to happen. That's right. We've never had music moguls before, like now, like we have now. For example, Jay-Z, puff daddy. I mean, those are some of the original... Taylor Swift. Taylor Swift is approaching

mogul status. Why is Taylor Swift not a mogul? I just I'm not sure what she owns in terms of other of businesses. She has her own. Yeah, she owns her. About Kanye. He's absolutely. I mean, he's he's cares very much about being. What about Michael Booble? I don't know if he's a mogul or very successful musician. cares very much about being what about uh... michael boulay i don't know if he is a mogul or very successful what about david math use

mogul guy wouldn't call him a mogul you would know you don't think he's made massive amounts of money yeah he has a huge amount of uh... what's the definition of a mogul a mogul is a person who has gone from just being a very successful musician to also being a Boss and having ownership states a diversified. Yeah, so the day may have used to me. I don't know enough to know Maybe he owns his touring operation or something. How are the rolling stones? I don't

Maybe probably Metallica. There are several of them is the point and that's a relatively new The point is like this is the first time that there's like that's possible for a relatively large number that's a small number the kernel the kernel was a mogul I mean he was in a musician, but he ran Elvis. Yes. There have always been people like that But what we have now are musician moguls. Right. And I think that it's a very good time to be doing music, but you have to have a little bit of that instinct in you to be successful. Yeah.

And the people who are like pure, pure musicians are being left behind a little bit. Well, this really is very, very, I don't want to go back to the VMAs too much, but you did see Kanye's performance. Yeah. And he does, he does Kanye's performance. Yeah. And he does touch on this. Yeah. Pretty directly. Yeah.

And he cites Walt Disney and Steve Jobs as his Henry Ford, which is the problematic as the father of American anti-Semitism. Yeah, and Walt Disney is in there too. Yeah. Yeah. But Kanye is talking about Titans of industry. Yeah. White, racist, basically, Titans of industry, and comparing himself to them.

Just for example, our band, I don't think our, you know, tan lines, the success that we've had, I don't think would have been possible in any other time in history music No, and if in the 1960s or 70s people heard tan lines. They wouldn't have nobody would have heard them No, I would have heard even they would have made it because in 2003 people wouldn't have heard our music Oh, I don't know. I mean possibly If if a band down under the on Napster anything's possible remember Napster Yeah, I mean a band like, you would have had to have been a person who listened to independent radio

or read the alternative press or went to an independent music store if you even had one in your town. It was like 12 people. No, that's true. I mean, the opportunity was tiny. Yeah. And you know, even in the like the my space era, the opportunity for people to actually like hear your music was small. Well exposure was was and figured out yet, right? Yeah, and essentially like broadcasting.

You had a one-to-one relationship. Like, you would be like, oh, I'm friends with this person or whatever, but that was still word of mouth. It was still very direct. And now we have, in some way figured out how to broadcast a message. Yeah. And in broadcasting a message, it's allowed signals to get through that otherwise would not have made it.

I agree. And so tan lines could be one of those signals. Yeah. I mean, I still think there's a lot of problems. You know, it's very easy for people just to hear one song of ours, never know the artist who's doing it, never caring to find out the artist who's doing it, who did that song and or exploring further. But I think that if you have 10 million people hearing the song, you reach a larger audience

than you would in any other time. And enough of those people are becoming fans. So what's, yeah, so what is the, so it's a good time to be a musician. It's a good time to be making music in the sense that you can have your art heard. You can be, you can be, you can expose that art to a lot of people. But is it a career? Is it a job? Well, it has been mine for the last three years.

Yeah, it's insane. And I don't know that that's considered success in music. If you live off of it, it's considered success. Is that right? I believe. That's the metric. I think a lot of you're the exception. So I mean, yeah, percentage wise, how many people live off their music?

Very few, I would imagine. Yeah. I mean, 99% probably never get there. Yeah, I mean, you have to really commit to it being your job. I mean, even if you're, whether you're gigging, you know, and you're just a guy who gigs and does recording sessions or whether you just have a band that you make your living off of, it's still a relatively small number of people who play, of those who play music. But it's like writing, like, because of blogging and Twitter and bubble, bubble, blah, sometimes

they have to step, take a step back and be like, I'm a freelancer who like lives off of this. I'm so lucky I should and complain. You know, it's the same thing. Is this tie back into the sharing economy in some way? Is this like Uber? It was very hard to make a living as a driver and now Uber exists and so it's not so hard. I think that there's a comparison to make there.

And that's a lot of where the problems are. I mean, you have to, it's selects for people who are good at self-promotion, right? Like, so people who are really talented who aren't self-promoting. It's like a dang cook situation. They get left behind. Right.

Or like BuzzFeed personalities, the reason most of those people are employed is because they had a strong online brand. Anytime I got any free-lands writing job, it's because they think my Twitter is funny. Your Twitter is funny. You're very good. Follow this guy on Twitter, right? I'll throw you on. I'll throw you on. I'll throw you on. I'll throw you on.

I'll throw you on. Don't, please don't. Please don't. Please don't. Please follow him. That's a lot of drag race content. I'm very big. There was actually during the VMAs way too much drag race content. I can't help it. It's my brand. You know what? You don't do drag though do you I did a couple times in college but not did you have a like a character? No, I did a talent show and everyone was doing like I can play the spoons and I went in and I had brought backup dances in a fog Machine and I did a Britney Spears number and a culture singer number

I did this what I did at one time in college for a tension to get the most attention. I was fine. You didn't have a character. No. When I like a misbehave or something. No, I mean if I had a name it would probably be like Bay of Pigs. B-A-E. B-A-E-O-P. You went to college recently. Um, Bay of Pills. The pay list is very good. I mean, in some way, it makes no sense in a lot of other ways. Sure, none of them do.

That or I would be one of my favorite drag names. Drag names is Karen from Finance. Um, and I would do something like that where I would just be Julia Roberts. I would just be Karen. Because it's not Karen. What is Karen from Finance? It's just a person. She's an Australian drag queen.

That's like, have you ever seen the money pit? Yeah. There's a band who performs in drag that Tom Hanks is their lawyer. And they go up to him. They're like, we want to change our name. We want to change our name. He's like, I can't remember what their name is,

but it makes a lot of sense for their act. And I can't remember. Can you Google that? They want to change their name to Merrill Streep. It's like you can't change that. That's like free beers. Our band name is free beers. Yeah, yeah, yeah. It's all ideal. I think it's a lot like how you wanted to use Julia Roberts. Well, I mean, and there have been like there's a Trinity K.

Bonet, which is Trinity Kardashian Bonet, and she's like Kardashian, you don't own the name. Like they own the copyright for products, but as somebody's name, you can be Trinity Kardashian Bonet. Is that true? Yeah. What if that's your name? Josh Kardashian, that'd be,

I think that might be a little tougher because you're in the end. You can do it, Josh. Oh, well, judges have to approve it. And judges can say no to you. But it has to go to court. Yeah. That's a huge publicity move right there.

Black China knows what's up. She'd do it. She changes her name. I'm gonna find the name. Yeah, she's gonna be coming Angela Kardashian. Angela Kardashian. Have you seen the new paper cover? No.

Black China's on it. Okay. She's pregnant. I China's on it. Okay. She's pregnant. I can put it up. With Rob Kardashian's. How is this the fucking pinnacle of society at this point that we get the Kardashian child meaningful? No, I mean, one of my goals in life in general is to age gracefully.

No, I think it's really working out for you. Is it? Yeah, I guess so. I just, I never want to be aged to me. So I just never want to be the guy who laments what people are interested in. You want to like, it's like, fuck the 90s. That's bullshit. Like you don't want to be that guy, of course, obviously.

Yeah, I just, I, you can have opinions. You can age opinions. Like I don't, you know, I fucking hate new music. Of course I can. So do you? Yeah, there's songs I hear that I jazz. You don't want to say it out loud. What's the group called? DNC-20 one by cake by the ocean. Oh yeah, there you go. That's a terrible song. That's a terrible festival. You know, you know, yeah, that's not,

well, look, it's not from me. One of the Jonas brothers, you know that, right? Did you know that? Is that a group? Yeah, Joe Jonas, right? Yeah. Yeah. Joe Jonas. He made that band only so that he could have resubmit himself

for best new artist. He won best new artist last night at the VMAs. Yeah. Joe Jonas. Yeah, that's it. That's, that's, that's by the ocean, is the testable. The fat Jew, I mean, the fat Jew hanging around, you know, the fat Jew, of, you know, the fat Jew.

Yeah, fat Jew who owes me money because he stole some jokes from us. Oh, did he? Really? Congratulations, look at you. Thank you. I'm a fat Jew. That's a real compliment to be ripped off by one of the best.

I know. That's what it is. Fuck what's that guy, fuck Tony, or whatever his name is? Fuck Jerry. Jerry. Fuck Jerry. Yeah.

Very good. How did fuck Jerry avoid all of Fuck Jerry. Yeah. Very good. How did fuck Jerry avoid all of the criticism that the fat Jewish guy is not successful. He had successful. No, no, there is a fucking book. There is a book. There is equal. They have equal numbers of followers. Does fuck Jerry have a book?

I don't know. He is a publicist. He's trying to, he got a, he got a pilot deal with comedy central based on other people's jobs. That's why he got in trouble. This fuck Jerry have a book. No. Does he have wine? No. Did you hear the story behind that wine? This is interesting. No. So he started that wine called the white girl Rose with this girl he knew who ran an account that was like him. It was based on her, but a friend started this account that was like, you know, I'm a white girl, problems or whatever, but it was based on her complaining. So they cut her into the deal.

And then right before it was over, they just removed her from the deal, signed all the papers and said, oh my gosh, a legal hiccup will get back to you. They never got back to her. So these two guys are making all this money from white girl, Rosé. No, white girl problem is the person.

It's a guy, it's a guy who's making fun of a girl he knew. And so she's suing them saying That's my life story or something she's trying to make someone He exposes the meaninglessness of Twitter and the people who participate in Twitter including Ryan Hullahan And myself I should hang out with Ryan where I'm learning a lot. I don't see this is also where I'm learning a lot. I don't see you. This is also, you just put in the whole,

the useless environment. No, the entire world is happening and Ryan knows about. Yeah. You're sitting around with a kid. The baby, a baby. I know, it's true. How old is your child now? 10 months.

Oh wow. Yeah, how's it going? He's great. He's great. Yeah, I don't talk about his name, by the way. I know, I was, I was avoiding that. I forgot to mention that. I was, well, lucky for you, I was avoiding that.

I appreciate that. I thought, it's Ishmael after Moby Dick, right? I feel like it. Ishmael Cohen. Ishmael Cohen totally unexpected. No one saw that coming. I feel like you wanna, I mean, I'm not a big, I mean, I'm not like radical transparency,

but when it comes to your kid, you have ownership of that situation for 18 solid years. You can try to for a, well, I think within like 13, you're good. I agree. A 13, who know, fucking knows. But you're not anywhere near that. Yeah, I mean, so you're a dad. I'm a dad. Let's talk about it. Let's just, let's fucking get into this. Yeah, let's do it. Happy to. Here we go.

We're both fathers. Yeah. Zelda. Yeah. Whose name is out there. Out there. Big time. How's it feel to have people you don't know,

talking to you about Zelda? Well, it's very strange actually. We had, I'm gonna not do so on the podcast recently. I don't know if you know her, but her. I listened to that one. Yeah, call your girlfriend. Yeah. She, when I met her, she was like, oh, I love your daughter.

I didn't know her at all. She knew Zelda very well. Yeah. It's, you know, in a way, it's like, of course you do. You and your parent, your whole world is the kid. In a way, it's like, of course you do. You and your parent, your whole world is the kid. It seems obvious that everybody would know how great your kid is or understand your kid.

It's not surprising to me. Not strangers necessarily. No, I'm just stranger. What was a stranger now? A person who you've never met that just follows you on social media. The whole hierarchy of strangers has been altered. I know people very well who I've never met.

Yeah, that's true. Very well. And I meet them and we have a dialogue that's totally, it's deeply personal without any physical interaction ever. And that's the reason you know, though. That's the person you know, though. Kind of, but is it? Yeah. I mean, I interact with Aminatu on social media plenty of times, you've already met her. Not a stranger. No, well, but I mean, but she is a stranger in the sense that we had never been in the same room together Sure, which is I think your brain and your body have there's that kind of a discord there definitely where you know the person Yeah, you can hold that memory in your mind or whatever but like

and you can hold that memory in your mind or whatever. But like, and figure it out. She is an idea of you. And it's just, advice first. Advise first. Yeah, and she might meet you in real life and fill in all the blanks and decide, you know what, it's not the person I thought I knew.

Oh, I think it's quite the opposite. I actually would say. Actually, I'm not sure if knowing you in person first. So that'll never happen. That can never happen. I know exactly what you're saying. I'm actually curious. Do I seem on the internet?

The way I am a person I think I think I think so am I yeah like five minutes into meeting I was like oh, I already know him and you've now you'd never met me and I only knew you from the podcast Yeah, but I was like I feel like I know him well podcast is helpful probably so it fills in a lot of blanks I mean just spewing for an hour and a half straight. It's probably very useful. So I, yeah, I don't know. I, I, the kid thing, I, so yeah, how does it feel for people to, who, you, she's a bad example because she's some of you who interact with. I mean, like, my child, no, I'm not too, yeah, I'm okay.

There are probably a lot of other people who you've never met. Oh, yeah, and people and people all the time are commenting on Instagram, they're like, Zoda, whoa. How does that feel? It's a fucking disturbing. It feels invasive and upsetting. Yeah.

And you know what's, I think that human beings have a really good way of building up these walls virtual or otherwise where they feel like that stuff's not real. This is outside the wall and inside the wall, right? You're in the room or you're outside of the room. And I think that for me, you know, I don't consider it that much. I just say, well, oh, it's a person on the internet. Yeah.

It only crosses over into my reality in the worst kind of lifetime movie, nightmare fantasies. Based on the milk carton. Do you know what I'm saying? Yeah. It doesn't matter until you imagine it mattering, and then you're just using some kind of bad script

that you saw on cable television. I had a couple of reasons I didn't want to put my son on social media. Your son. I talk about him on my podcast. I talk about him on my podcast, and I put him, yeah. Fuck Jerry Cohen.

Jerry Cohen. Fuck Jerry Cohen. Jerry Cohen. Fuck Jerry Cohen. You're child. And I put him on Snapchat, but I have like 20 followers and I know all of them. So, very intimate. One reason was because I was actually inspired by the comedian Chelsea Paredi who got a dog

and has never mentioned the name of her dog. And I thought that was very- This is a very full disclosure. Chelsea Paredi, the sister of Jonah Paredi, the founder of Buzzfeed. I'm glad you disclosed that. That's what you said. I'm a full disclosure.

Well, Buzzfeed and the outline share an investor. Okay, well, there it is. Already, and then shout out to RRE, already are we and then the shout shout out to are we great investor and then the Of nameless investor very good very good and then the other thing and I was like that makes sense in some way Abstract way and I think it's cool and then the other thing was There are like a Chelsea braids dog has nobody my child should be like Chelsea braids dog But her listeners will try to trick it out of her, but she's very committed to saying that.

Yeah, it's private. She's a podcast. Yeah, I call Chelsea Brady. It's great. And I don't know anything about it. It's really good. It's very infrequent now. Is it good?

Yeah, it's great. And then what's it about? People just call it, she talks to her. And she has a sound board of like ironic sort of sound effects of her jingles and stuff. And she just sort of interacts with them based on that so they'll say things like like uh... what would you do jing well i went to anions and i got a pretzel and then i was calling my aunt who has cancer and she'll just play like this is very boring i mean you should be like this you realize how poor this podcast really is with you the effort that that's going to Chelsea Prede's podcast? You want a soundboard? Yeah. Please know.

Kind of. You want the Van Halen soundboard? You're getting what they were off soundboard? I fucking wish. That'd be so good. I'm sorry. Go ahead. And then the other reason was like I was thinking about the people who you're like, Oh, that guy as a kid, I didn't even realize that person had a kid. I can't name anyone specifically who falls in, David Lee Roth probably. Who falls in, I can't get it. I don't know.

Ryan? Okay, he's a Google. My dad is the world's preeminent, David Lee Roth band. Really? That's just the band out. That's not totally surprising, actually. We're at least, I don't know why, but.

Because we both like men and But I'm bah, it's a little I'm on tonight. Oh, Bobville there, but it's okay. I'll allow it. I am on So yes, you try name your kid Kevin. If you're a rock star in 2015, you can't name your kid Kevin. It's got to be like potato or something. I love that. I love the idea. Can you say, I love this.

You're like, no, no kids. Oh, yes three kids Kevin Brianna and Tony Cuz I couldn't believe that Kevin was one of the kids I thought that was his brother Cavitly Roth is up the name Haven't just Kevin Ross. He goes by Kevin Ross. Yeah, where's the lead was a little bit of middle name? Evie goes by Evie Lee Roth and Brenna goes by Brenna Lee Roth was a lie's a middle name. Well, if he goes by Avie Lee Roth and Brenna goes by Brenna Lee Roth. Kevin Lee Roth, who wrote a book called Between the Notes. He's Kevin Lee.

He's just Kevin Roth and he wrote this book called Between the Notes. I look at this idiot. Poor David Lee Roth. I wish my dad could get me a book deal. Well, you know what? All right, and then I'll go on. So yeah, basically, no, I just, I, my instinct after having him was just to not put him out there.

I don't know why. And at what point is he allowed to be out there? I mean, on his own, I don't know. He has to make it a decision about it. He's 10 months old. But you share the occasional Instagram. My wife does. Oh, we're stabbed by you.

She's in a very short time. She's down. You know, she's, well, she puts him on Instagram. Yeah. And then I've definitely seen you with him on Snapchat. Snapchat, where I have 20, that's why I signed up for Snapchat.

Why share those snapshots with my Instagram followers? Is that a problem? I have 20,000 followers. Is that, does that strike you as, problematic? I screen cap the Snapchat. Oh my God. I'm like,000 followers. Is that straight? You guys, problem bad. I screen capped the Snapchat. That's my show. I'm like, this is beautiful kid. Yeah, I would say that's a poor share with all.

Well, so you get a moment of panic anytime anyone adds you on Snapchat where you're like, should this person see anything? They can't see anything. They can't see anything unless you follow them back. Do you get a notification about that? I don't know. Yeah, you get added friends, you pull it down.

Yeah. So it's people who add an idea. Oh my setting, they can't see anything unless I add them back. Yeah, that's what you think. But once I get it on my Instagram, you know, why can't you change your username on Snapchat? You can, can you? No, you can't.

Oh, it's stuck with what you got. What do you have? LeBron Hubbard. Ah! Ah! That's fucking great, man's what I changed that for. I just love Brian. What's your rhyme?

What's yours? I'm Ryan Hulland on everything by Facebook. Yeah. I'm Josh with the poll. That's because you're the next general. You're the generation where I was cool to just get your name. Oh, I'm the generation where you would come up with like a funny name. I have this name.

I have a name just like anybody else. This actually proves to me that I'm youthfully minded. Because my handle is Joshua Topolsk, he's on pretty much everything. But you're a thought leader when it comes to these stories. I'm a leader. It is very true actually. Kind of a think-flue answer when you think about it.

Absolutely. So you knew. I was like, you know what, your sheep have to follow you. You knew which way the winds were. You have to bring them home. Yeah. Actually, the people who are interested in my content

are very free-wheeling, open-minded, and independent. You're a found-luencer. I think of myself as kind of a bright-bart meets of my low-yellow enopolis. I'm like a bright-bart meets the blaze kind of. Yeah, I don't, can I ask you about bright-bart? Like, please do. It was Jewish, right?

Who? Andrew, is that his name? The founder of bright-bart? I mean, I mean, he's, I don't know what he was. I think he was Jewish. I mean, he might have been Jewish, but he's a testable person. I know, but it's just, I don't know, I don't know enough about bright-bart he was Jewish. He might have been Jewish, but he's a testable person. I know, but it's just, I don't know,

I don't know enough about Breitbartons. What is it matter if he was Jewish? Because he is his adoptive mother converted to Judaism when marrying his adoptive father. He had a bar mitzvah, and he is now identifies as Jewish. Or did. He did. That's more like, I just wanna know how that

it became a site of the, you know, I can't tell you. Yeah. People who align with hardcore right wing thought and policy are their rhetoric and their religion is not centered around anything as temperate as Judaism or Christianity. It's centered around power. And so I don't think that Breitbart's interested in what the Jewish religion considers. You know, I've heard you talk about being Jewish. I have you. Yeah. And I'm curious, and we're probably going run out of time if we can get out of it. There is no out of time on this podcast.

But I've heard you describe, you say that because you're an atheist, you're not Jewish. Correct. No, I haven't said that. But an atheist can be a Jew, I'm so really Jewish. I'm socially Jewish. You're religiously completely atheist. Right, very simple.

All right, so I'm the same. No, most Jews are, to be honest, most Jews. Most of Jews I know were like, oh God's ridiculous. That's insane. But he's on conservative Judaism, sort of the more liberal areas and then up. Most rabbis would say even if you're an atheist, you can come to services and not believe,

or not do anything. Of course, you're still a very good at negotiating that. Kind of says that, Judy, so we can know God he's wrong. My understanding, and this could be wrong, by the way, because I'm not an expert, but my understanding of Judaism as a religion is, it actually wants, it wants and allows for atheism in a really clear way.

Yeah. The idea of Judaism is not a reward at the end of your life. It is that like the reward for being good and following the doctrine of the religion is like a good life. Yes. And which means that like when you don't put a like a heaven or hell situation at the at the back end of what you do, it's kind of like it leaves a lot open to interpretation. It doesn't lead to... It doesn't lead to interpretation is the essence of...

Like Jewish culture. Like Judaism's whole thing is that you can say to God, I have an opinion, God has an opinion, let's get a third. There are stories like that in the Talmud. Yeah. Specifically do that. But I was, by the way, I was a Yiddish archivist for 10 years.

This is true. When Jesse was working on the Professor Murder Record, he was only available in limited hours because he was archiving ancient, not ancient. Not a really ancient, historic. Historic, like Yiddish documents that were... Photographs. Yeah, 100, 200 years old.

Yeah. But I think of an actually religious Jew would disagree with you. I think they would say that you do, you do need to believe in God and you do need to follow the certain rules. Our religious people believe all kinds of fucked up shit. But I do think that the entire culture

has been a collaborative process. Well, here's what I know. I am the way I am. My parents were not atheists. They were not deeply religious, but they would mumble the prayers. They were they were they were they were they were seeing mumbles. They're practicing Jews. I am I have been surrounded by people in my life certainly in the last 20 years or so, by Jewish people who were raised in totally different ways, you're a great example, but have arrived at a similar conclusion, which is like they're socially Jewish but religiously kind of atheist. And something in the religion, whatever the fuck it is, has allowed for interpretation

at a more diverse and varied level than I think a lot of religions love for. All of the practices that are prescribed in Jewish, in Judaism, in the in the inaction of the religion come from the Talmud, which is a book of interpretation. So in that very premise, there's the idea that it's open to interpretation. It's like the original Four of War. It is going.

It's exactly right. It's right. Talmud is like Reddit. It's a lot like Reddit. And different rabbis upvote each other. Believe me, they wish that you could, and if they could have had hyperlinks, they would have. Ilinks, they would

have. I'm surprised that they would have saved everyone all the time. Please see this action. Yes, exactly. I mean, I do think that, you know, I have no explanation for it, except to say that this, I mean, be- I have an explanation for that. Do you?

Yeah. It's because we're a diaspora culture. So it was a people that were spread out and all they had with them was their book. Okay. And so they sat there with their book for a thousand years. And that's how they created their own separate identity wherever they lived was through interpretation of that book. Yeah, but the book was the same wasn't it?

It changed everywhere it went. That's also why there are different practices and different among us. The sound credible as I know I know two Jews. Ryan Hulahand and Leah Feningen. Yeah. Two completely separate people who have no relationship whatsoever. Whereas Sheldon Adelson has a very Jewish statement is in the meanwhile. I can't speak to that, but all I know is,

he's the largest Jewish Jew. You know, anyhow, we should wrap up. This has been a long meandering, totally pointless and highly entertaining podcast. Yes. One of my favorites of all time, which I never say ever. It's an original line for me.

Does it code you can find them in the band, tan lines, or if you're really into podcasts, no effects, that's said, no effects, the regular spelling, iTunes.com, or you could check out your favorite podcast app. But iTunes.com works. Just say iTunes. I did it. I did it.

And that's what we got. You know what's more. Jesse, you have to return to the podcast any time one of these days. Thank you so much. Thank you, Josh. Great stuff. Well, that is our show for this week. We'll be back next week with more tomorrow. And as always, it was you and your family the very best.

Although your family has been lured into very large traps. The peanut butter is the bait, and I fear they will never escape.