Tomorrow - Episode 74: Katie Drummond is Not Doing the Bone

Episode Date: October 18, 2016

This week Josh sits down with Katie Drummond, editor-in-cheif at Gizmodo and an all around swell person. As audio podcasts go, it's fantastic... but what if it were more than that? What if, through the power of virtual reality, you could hear them discuss Playstation, Ken Bone, and Soylent bars inside an active volcano, or under the ocean, or in whatever other scenario you can dream up? Soon enough you can, and it'll only cost you $1000. That is, if you can find Palmer Luckey. Enjoy the audio delight now, but before you know it... it'll just be the background noise to your adventures in the underwater sex volcano. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Hey and welcome to tomorrow, I'm your host Josh Witt Polski. Today on the podcast we discuss Ken Bone, Super Gods, and Hitler Jr. But first, a word from my sponsor. Marketers, the age of the customer has arrived, and Salesforce is with you for every step of your customer's journey with your brand. Blaze trails across your entire business to create one connected customer experience. The Salesforce, be smarter and more predictive with your marketing using an intelligent platform that integrates marketing with sales, service, and commerce by engaging your customers on

any device and channel in real time. Learn more at salesforce.com slash tomorrow. Oh, my guest today is an old wonderful friend, talented editor, writer, songstress, comedian. Oh, yeah. Of course, I hit about the fantastic and fabulous Katie Drummond. Katie, thank you for being here. Thank you for having me. This is so exciting.

Have you recorded in the studio before? Yes, one time. Oh, one second. We did one show with Leah Finnegan. Oh, or she talked about like her dad's lips or something? No, she had her lips. Oh, one time we did one show with Leah Finnegan. Oh, where she talked about her dad's lips or something? No, she didn't have her lips. Oh, her lips. We extensively.

Yeah, okay. That was last week's episode. This is a really, I just want to set the scene. Please do. Very small room. Well, we're in a booth. We'll be close. Really small.

That we call the crypt. There's no need to, you know, we're a startup. We don't have Gizmodo money. Oh, right, yeah. It doesn't matter. And their size doesn't matter. It's not the size of the vessel. It's the most of the ocean. The door to the crypt is closed.

Yeah. We're in a booth. And there are two lamps. Well, can I just say something? I feel like you're under selling. We're in a perfectly fine size. No, it's totally fine. It could seat many.

It's small. It could seat four people very comfortably. It's small. It's eight by eight. Just the two of us in here. It's an adult tree house. It's eight by eight. Just the two of us in here. It's an adult tree house. It's eight by eight. In case you want another dimensions.

Okay. It is, I've heard it's movable. It is a movable booth. I'm actually really sited about this. No, it's very nice. You can just drop this wherever you want. I was just trying to set the scene. John was very proud of it until you started

to shit-sorry. No, sorry. Like a complete maniac. Sorry, John. I mean, the guy's actually crying. Ryan doesn't care. It's got no dog in this hunt. No.

Is that an expression? So this is the first one of these I've done by myself. Yeah, no, is it? Yeah. We had it. No, we did it. The only other times we've done podcasts were with TC and a lot of wine.

Very loud. Do you want some wine? No, not really. What do we have in the way of wine here, guys? No wine. We have potato wines. No wine. No wine.

That's too bad. And I'm not like a very social person. Katie is not social, that's a very true fact about that. Not a big talker. So, let's get this show on the road. You want to just get through it? Yeah. Where our goal today is to try to get through is quickly and

painlessly as popular as you. Perfect. So we're just going to talk about topics that you can really speak to. Great. And speak on. OK. Now let's set the stage a little bit where it's it's

October 17th. Wow. Two days before my birthday and just two days before the next and final presidential debate. Is that your birthday falls on the same day? It does. It's like a gift. It's like a gift from Jesus himself. Yeah. And it is a we're at the outline office. Yeah, beautiful office. Beautiful office, thank you. It's trendy, so-ho. It's trendy downtown, so-ho. And we're in our crypt.

And Katie has just recently, now you've been Gizmo to Editha and Chief for how long for eight months? 11 months. 11 months, wow, time flies. Yeah, November 30th. Time flies when you're having fun. Oh yeah.

And now you're a recent employee of Univision. Univision. Okay, is that, I miss pronounced it. I can't say Univision. No, you can say Univision. Okay, well I'm going to say that because my accent won't be as good. Great. And there's been some tumultuous times, it's been some great times.

It's been some great stories, it's been some very gocker-esque stories. Okay. And we could talk about some very gocker-esque stories. No. Okay. And we could talk about some of it a bit all of it. Great. Let's get into it. We're gonna get into it. So, what do you, how are you, how are things going? Things are great.

You're crushing it. You guys have broken a lot of great stories recently. Thank you. You did. That's my favorite thing to do. Eve Pacer. Is it's pronounced Pacer? Pizer?

Oh, really? Eve Pizer. In my opinion. Wrote about, show you don't know you've never asked her. No, I have not asked. Okay. Well, maybe we can find out. I think we'll.

Maybe she can come and be a guest and we'll find. She'd be a great guest. We'll ask her. She just recently, but kind of broke a thing, the soilent. Kind of broke a thing. I mean, I don't know, I don't know the origin of all of it, but she wrote about the soilent bars making people sick. Right.

So, is she the first person to write about it? Yes. Okay, I didn't know if it was like, had been written about in some small places and then there was. It was sort of, she picked it up from Reddit and from Soil and communities and interviewed people and then sufferers had written about it.

Sufferers, yes. People who were eating. Suffering from diarrhea and vomiting. Soil and bar, Soil and. Soil and food bar. Yeah. And so this is, you know, sort of the next iteration of the Soilent food product line.

They have smoothies, powders. I just bought, can I just interject really quickly? Absolutely. I've already talked about this in the podcast, my purchase of Soilent. Oh wow. I bought a 12 pack of Soilent, a 12 pack of coffee, a switch is there. Oh yes. And I drank one of the coffee things and it made me, I don't know if the term is violent,

wheel. I wasn't throwing up, but I'll just say that, I didn't feel good. Sounds like a good lead for us. I didn't feel good. I'm gonna put, but you know, I was like first thing in the morning, I just kind of pounded it. Yeah, it's sensitive stomach. It's like 400 calories, so it might have been not the best.

I was just too much. It doesn't make a little bit like that vitamin sickness or you take a vitamin and you're like, if I ever take a multivitamin, I was like doubling over and I was like, you know, crying. Well, you're a delicate flower. I fell out of the floor in my house.

A gentle stomach. I fell out of the floor that my dog came over to see if it was time to eat my body. Wow. You know, she's just waiting. Penny's just waiting for me to die. It would have been very nutritious that day. She would have gotten a lot of extra calories, which she doesn't need, because, you know. Penny's just waiting for me to die. We're gonna be very nutritious that day. She would have gotten a lot of extra calories,

which she doesn't need, because, you know. She's a little fat. She's actually on a diet. Please don't fat shame my dog. Okay, she's working. She's looking a lot of thin spell on Instagram. Oh, great. She loves thin spells.

She's working on her thigh gap. So, I guess, did dogs have, I guess one thigh gap? Did dogs have two, did dogs have two thigh gaps? Yeah. Yeah. Front and rear. That's interesting. You don't think about that. No. We should all hope that we're dogs in the next life

so we can work on a dual thigh gap. A dual thigh gap? Anyhow. Anyhow. So these soylent bars were making people vomit and have diarrhea and be sort of extremely ill to the point that some had to go to the ER. They were hooked up to IVs with, you know, liquids to rehydrate them because of how sick they got from these energy bars. Oh, liquid's going in. Liquid's going in to replace the ones going out.

Wow, this is an ally when that was liquid's coming out. That's a, that's a, that's a, that's a, O-L-E-N, O-L-E-N. Oh, yes. So it's in the potato chips. Yeah. They don't use that anymore, right? No. Okay.

So you've found the batch number of that these bars had in common. And Soylent ended up recalling all the bars, telling everyone like, don't eat these. Every bar. Every bar. Yeah. Because it's pretty recent. Like, these are a new, they've only been producing them for I think a few weeks. It's kind of like maybe, maybe like we be a little where you're when like a startup

that's like you don't ever have to eat again like starts selling food they went from yeah only eat these ever to don't eat that don't eat that and so then you've tried one oh no we actually had some in the office wait this happen yeah on Friday you know that the sun she found a box of of soil bars in the office and someone had written all over the box, recalled, do not eat.

Um, okay, so she ate one. So she tried one just out of curiosity. She did not get sick. Okay. She said it was actually pretty good. So it's a shame. Kind of makes me want one. Yeah, she enjoyed it.

Just goes to show you the power of the press. First of tearing you down the next thing you know, they're like, actually this tastes pretty good. You should eat one. Yeah. If I not give you violent diarrhea. She was fine. The Donald Trump of food. There you go. It's all over the map, isn't it? Well, that's anyhow. That's that's a story. One of many. Sure. Thank you. You have been personally responsible. Yes. As the editor-in-chief, you can take all credit. And also, I receive a lot of shit. There you go.

As well. I get both sides. What's the last piece of shit that you received? Well, let me tell you Josh. Please do. On Friday morning, I woke up to find that one of my writers who is a tremendous, very talented reporter. Can you name this person? William.

Turton. William Turton. William Turton had blog. I call it, I made a fake name up for him a second ago. I called him like, William Tom Lee or something. Tertan. William Tertan. William Tertan had blog. I call it, I made a fake name up for him a second ago. I called him like William, Tom Lee or something. Yeah, you did. Which is also a fine replacement for Tertan. William Tertan, that was like a pretty good name for a order.

A Tertan? It's a good byline. Tertan, what is that? That's some kind of blue blood family. Oh, how does? Is he British? I don't think so. William Tertan sounds very British.

Don't you agree? I think Tumley sounds even more British. Yeah, that sounds like an arne a character. That's what I'm talking about. He's like, William. He'll be a Tumley sounds even more British. That sounds like an army of characters. I was like, what is Tumley? He feels Tumley, anyhow, go on. Yeah, he had written up, he had been the first to find and write up Ken Bones, Reddit history, Ken Bones, America's sweetheart, until Friday. Not mine.

Not mine either, I was at. Fuck Ken Bones. His motto was anti-bone from the beginning. Yeah, actually, I actually don't, I'm not anti-bone, I'm anti-anybody-given to fuck about Ken Bones. Yeah. Everybody's like, we just want a distraction. It's like, you know what, you don't need a distraction. You need to pay attention. Nothing can be like a little meme. It can't be like a little like, oh, a cute guy with a funny name. It has to

pay a loan. Ken Bone just transformed US politics. Yeah, it's like, Ken Bone is the president we need or whatever. Actually, his question kind of sucked. Yeah, it was kind of a cop out. Yeah. So, he did a reddit am a uh... unfortunately for ken bone he used the same reddit account that he'd been using for years it turns out he had also been commenting on naked pictures of Jennifer Lawrence describing the trade on martin killing as quote justified yes i got there was some pretty lot of porn auger can't bone is just like an undecided voter from st louis

yeah i'm sorry you're in fucking st lou is just like an undecided voter from St. Louis. Like, I'm sorry, because if you're in fucking St. Louis and you're undecided, like, is that where they were? So where he's from? I don't want to specify, I can't say at this point, it looked like Illinois. Is in he from St. Louis, isn't that where they did the debate? St. Louis. Wasn't the debate in St. Louis?

I can't remember. I'm what the fuck, I don't know what's going on, but I will say this, if you're an undecided voter, first off, if you're an undecided voter, like, what's wrong with you? Yeah. I mean, honestly, like, you're either a race, you, first off, if you're an undecided voter, like what's wrong with you? I mean, honestly, you're either a racist, you either are racist and support racist ideologies and maybe you hate women.

You either hate women and support racism and you're a xenophobic person or you're voting for Hillary Clinton or you should just like stay out of it. Like if you can't make up your mind at this point. You might want to vote for Jill Stein because you hate vaccines or maybe you might have a very Johnson because you don't like intelligence So that's also other options. I mean the two other candidates are fucking the worst I'm sorry if you like them you're making a grave mistake. Yeah, okay any help so so yeah So it turns out the Ken bone America sweetheart is not so sweet not so sweet actually he seems like he's a nice guy

That's the thing. He should not be a fucking celebrity. No. Like, Ken Bone can be, he can comment on Jennifer Lawrence, shakers, and think Trayvon Martin is, he's killing was justified in private, or he has like little world of Reddit. No one's gonna give a shit.

But it's this very interesting, and we talked about it a lot on Friday morning, because I woke up and was like, wow, 15,000 concurrence on this story that went up at midnight. That's a chartbeat number. Parsley, I think. I love parsley. I don't want to talk about it.

You don't like parsley? No, I'm a big fan. I like parsley, both the thing and also the service. Okay. This is not a paid spot for parsley. So we talked a lot. And so on that story, I got a lot of like what the fuck you letting your staff do What is this track who said this to this is a meeting vision?

No Actually our new CEO Raju Naraseki. I love I love Raju I thought he was credit tweeted that story three times on Friday I like him. He's a cool guy. I said we say about Raju We he always interacts with me on Twitter, and I was like this he was a modacons emoji I don't remember but like like, I remember thinking like, oh, this guy's from the, from a news court, which is like, there's a lot of squares at news point.

Oh, yeah. And he always seemed like he kind of got it. He gets it, right? Which I think was, He got that story. When I saw that he was taking over, I was like, this is pretty good. You can do a lot.

Oh, that's good to know. You can do a lot worse. Oh, great. No, I mean, that's a positive. Okay. You could do much for him. Coming from you, yeah. Of course, I'm a positive. Okay. You could do my short. Coming from you, yeah. Of course, I'm anybody, yeah.

Sure. Considered a positive statement. You could do a lot worse. It's like a thing. It's like, you got your work cut out for you. Okay. Right, isn't it? I thought it was kind of like a subtle.

Yes, but it is also a little shaky. A little bit of a jub. I didn't mean it that way. I didn't mean it that way. I meant like, he's pretty good. Yeah, okay. You could do worse. Yeah, sure.

So, just, it was a lot of, and there were. Roger, okay. You could do worse. Yeah, sure. So just it was a lot of and there were a lot of think and then a lot of other outlets picked this up and then there were there was the requisite round of like Friday afternoon think pieces that were like it is so wrong of us to hold Ken Bonup only to tear him down. And I was like, we never held Ken Bonup. Yeah, like you can't be you can't be held accountable for something you didn't do. We just reported on the news. Is that a true statement? You can't be held accountable for something you didn't do.

That's like a good album title. I think that's fair. Complacency is the sort of guilt. But that's a tough story, because that is, is it true and newsworthy, yes? Yeah. But there's this interesting line where you're looking at someone's behavior done in private when they were a private

citizen, and then this era of like the internet celebrity overnight they are famous. They're a public figure. It's scary. Scary stuff. That what they did five years ago on Reddit suddenly becomes news. It's hard to like grapple with, okay, well where do you decide to publish and where do you decide to...

It's just like Donald Trump, you know, all you wanted to do was be president of the United States of America. I mean, simple way. So why should we look back at his history and question what he's done? But isn't the line with Ken Bone like when he starts taking money to be the face of Uber for the next three weeks? Yeah, I think you do draw the, you do draw the higher of the public when you start to turn your momentary fame into a monetization.

Into sponsored content, yeah. Yeah, totally. But that's America. But also like I, That's what you do. You take, you bump into balloon boy believe me balloon boy capitalize on that somehow I mean I sort of had a feeling on Friday where I was like man This was gonna be Ken's moment to really cash out and and we may have robbed him of that and I kind of felt kind of bad

You welcome to being a journalist. I know it was hard a ruin or look You know Trump says the whole thing is crooked and rate and you're part of it. Yeah, I know That's why Ken Bone can enjoy his Uber money. And another thing on the hate on the Trump side, I get a lot of emails now that are like, how dare you turn Gizmodo into a political website. I'm so sick of hearing that. I didn't come here for your anti-Trump.

And it's like, if you like Donald Trump, you may choose to not read the site. Yeah. That's fine. It's like the same as Shimmer. That's great. The same as Shimmer thing I was reading about today. Oh yeah, where she got through.

She's like hundreds of people walked out of her show. It's like, first of, have you ever, do you know who's fucking show your at? Yeah. She definitely is not down with Donald Trump. She's definitely like, when did Amy Shimmer become some kind of feminist? Yeah, it's like, it's insane.

Like if you watch her show, it's like every joke is a feminist joke essentially. It's all about like women being like abused and subjugated and how shady it is and how shady the world is and how horrible men are. So like if you're surprised to hear that she's got a political view that is anti-Donald Trump, like you might be, you might be, you might be, you might be, yeah, like your brain maybe just like a tiny peanut.

Yeah, it's, but it's, it's, it's millions of people. Yes, it's the people who are voting for it. Now, you know, I don't want to blanket statement that's the people who are voting for it. Now, you know, I don't wanna blanket statement that all the voters who are voting for Donald Trump. But there are millions of them. I am getting tired of this. That's a lot of people. There's also this fucking like trope

where it's like, you don't, it's like don't badmouth the Trump voters. They have a point and it's like, okay, I get it. I mean, shit can be frustrating, but like, I think when you cross the line into voting for the guy who wants to like ban a religion and like send like get people take some kind of test to get into the country and like, you know, destroy like women's rights and destroy the rights of like immigrants here. Like I think just, you're voting for a racist and that's like, you've given up all of your

complaint rights. Yeah, this is like economic philosophy. Yeah, you can't be like, I am, but I still have a right to be mad. You do, but like if you vote for the guy who's like Hitler Jr., like you lose all of, nobody gets, gets, gives you any credit. Yeah. Cause you like, cause you did something stupid

and you're making a bad decision and you're damaging America. Yeah. So sorry. Man, what do I, what do I, it's very stressful. Here in this room. No, just what I'm very stressful here in this room No, just this election is horrible. By the way, but Ken bone is the fucking reason Donald Trump is a candidate Okay, and I don't mean undecided voters though. That is a problem also, but I mean our ability One the media's

Horrible stupid noisy bullshit that it does where it has to elevate everything to a fucking meme right where it has to like Everything has to be the Harlem Shake, literally immediately. And like, if the Harlem Shake people won't do it, you'll do it yourself. Like, the second most watched Harlem Shake video is one that Buzzfeed produced. Oh, I didn't know that. Yeah. And it might be the first most watched Harlem Shake video at this point. And it's like, we have to can bonify every fucking story that comes up.

So instead of actually spending time on things that are important, we're like, oh, can bone rules, man. That's sweater. Yeah, we're like, where can you get the sweater? It's like, people are telling you about fucking, people are telling you about fucking, Melania's pussy bow shirt. It's like, okay.

Oh, I totally missed that one. Yeah, maybe it was intentional that she wore a shirt that Gucci calls a pussy bow shirt. Oh my god. Or maybe not, but also, who fucking cares? Who cares? Because there's literally a maniacal psychotic dickhead running for president who wants to like destroy America. Or I don't know what. Worse. It's like the difference between journalism where there's ethics and responsibility. And like I work at BuzzFeed and I have to get clicks today. So like

the dress is a thing, Ken Bone is a thing. But it's just a feminine. But it's a discriminator between men. The dress is okay, fine, fucking do the dress. Just don't like Ted Cruz into the fucking dress. Ted Cruz isn't the dress. Ted Cruz is a dickhead who needs to be stopped. But I kind of feel like to that point.

I'm like, sorry. Like every outlet is, that wine is very blurry. Like there aren't very many outlets that are like, we're just doing this and we're not gonna do the bone. We're not doing the Ken Bone. Like the New York Times did Ken Bone. We're not gonna do the bone. New York Times was all over Ken Bone.

I think we were gonna podcast title. We're not gonna do the bone. We're not doing the bone. Yes, but that's, I mean, I don't wanna go into, I don't wanna go into my shbio, cause I think it's- Are you gonna give your mission statement? No, I don't, I don't have a mission statement except to make,

I want to try to make good things for people who like things that are good. Right. But like, I do think when your audience seems like it could be everybody, then like, it's hard to make things for somebody. Sure. Like, you end up making a lot of things for somebody. Sure. You end up making a lot of things for a lot of people and you just hope it all works.

And what you actually end up doing is creating a ton of fucking noise that a lot of it is not useful and is duplicative and is a regurgitation of somebody else's dumb story. And it's not useful to people. And so that's a battle that people fight every day. And it's a battle the New York Times has to wage because they're the fucking New York Times, which sucks, day and it's like a battle the New York Times has to wage because they're the fucking New York Times

Yeah, which sucks, but like you don't have to be the New York Times No, like you the New York Times is the New York Times. They also could just be the New York Times Like they don't have to also be Mashable right and Mashable doesn't have to be the New York Times Oh, I don't think Mashable is trying to be the New York Times. I don't know whatever I don't know what they're trying to be they work for a little while They're like, you know, it's like, we're going to be the times for millennials or something like that, you know.

But like, maybe don't do that. Maybe just be mashable. Whatever that is. I think that's the content funnel. Just somebody tell me what mashable does. That's all I want. They funnel, they funnel content. I don't know.

I know it's p cash more. Lovely, man. Very handsome. Okay. He got put on the suggested user's list on Twitter. Got a million followers. This is my remembrance of how mashable came to be. He got put on the suggested user's list on Twitter. Got a million followers. This is my remembrance of how Mashable came to be. He had a second Mashable that wasn't that popular. Yeah. Pete Cashmore got put on the suggested user's list when Twitter was

in its infancy. He got a million followers really fast. And then suddenly like I saw his links everywhere when it was his face on the Mashable icon might have actually been Pete Cashmore was the was the account, but it was like at Mashable. Oh, wow. He said Pete Cashmore, but it was at Mashable. That's the guy who founded it, right? Yeah, yeah, yeah. And then like from there, I just,

I never met a person who's like, I read Mashable, but it was like everywhere. It's everywhere. Thanks a lot, social media. Yeah, thanks Mashable. But this is what you're saying as Mashable is the Ken Bone of outlets. We're really popular because it was in the right place at the right time.

A real stretch there, buddy. Actually, that seems all right to me. That seems like it all fits. Anyhow, there are lovely folks over there. They just hired a great new executive editor, Jessica Khan, from Valkyrie. This is all inside baseball. Nobody cares. I get him back to Ken Bone.

Okay, more. Destroyed him. More bone. All right, what else has been going on in your world? Let's talk about the controversy with Univision. Should we talk about it? Let's get in there. Sure, what's the controversy?

So I don't know, you guys were bought by Univision, and now, and it's like a big corporation. Yeah. But then it looked like everything was going to be okay, but then there were post-deletions and everybody's very upset about it. And frankly, I'm tired. I love you guys, but everybody's very fatigued, I think, from hearing about the Gokker story at this point. It's really annoying. But you know, you've been made, you're in a very interesting position

because Gokker doesn't exist anymore. No, bye. Oh, sorry, that was glib. No. That was my more serious. Yeah, okay, we'll add that. It was bad. Don't add that.

I wanted to be all captured here out in the open. So now it's called the Gizmodo Media Group. It is GMG. Which means you hold a position presumably that is more than just an editor in chief. I wanted to be all captured here out in the open. So now it's called the Gismoto media group. It is GMG. Which means you hold a position presumably that is more than just an editor-in-chief. You are like a super god. Maybe.

You have the power to create and destroy life. I guess if I'm empowered to do so. You're like the villain from the last X-Men movie. Yeah, I didn't see it. What's his name? Apocalypse. You can like make Apocalypse a shit go down. Maybe. Can you?

I don't know. I mean, we're going to have to wait and see how it shakes out. I think, I mean, Gismoto as the name makes sense. It's the biggest site. Yeah. It appeals to... It's one of the biggest sites. Well, it's a big, really big site on the internet.

It's the 59th largest site as per Quantcas. What's 58th morning? 58th. I don't know like Probably like refinery 29 or something or bustle. Who do you think of as your biggest competitor? numerically and spiritually the verge oh interesting. Yeah, well Crushing them. Well really. Oh, yeah, really. Oh, yeah, you're crushing the verge. Interesting. Yeah. Well, crushing them. Well, really, okay. Really? Oh yeah. You're crushing the verge.

Every day. Really? Yeah. Like traffic wise. Traffic wise. Interesting. We break more stories. We're funnier.

And you know what? We have a full-time staff of 25. I think I read last week that they have a full-time staff of 70. They're only 82 on Quantcast, so. Wow. Wow. Tough stuff. Well, that's tough. Tough business. I read last week that they have a full-time staff of 70. They're only 82 on Quantcast, so. Wow. Tough stuff. Well, that's tough.

Tough business. I can't do that. I mean, I, of course, have been a diverge for several years. No, I mean, I love the verbiage. I have no dog in this hunt. I'm a free spirit. I mean, I'm a free spirit. I have a lot of friends there.

You have a lot of dog in this hunt. Work is work. Work is work. That's very true. Business is business. One of the things I like about Katie, she tells it like it is. Yeah, there are. Yeah, there we go. The point of punches. You know, after I left the verge,

one of the, when I thought about who do I want to be working with still. Right. Katie, top of the list. There you go. She came to Bloomberg. See how that turned out. Oh, it turned out pretty well.

I'm kidding. I'm kidding. It turned out great, actually. It's a great site. For everyone. It's a good site. I have regrets sometimes. Bloomberg.

It's because of me. Oh, Bloomberg. Bloomberg is a good site. I have regrets sometimes. Bluebird. It's a good gizmo. Oh, Bloomberg. Bloomberg is a great site. Yeah, Katie, you may not know this, Katie, and I worked with each other at both the Virgin and Bloomberg. Twice. Twice. And great, every time better than last.

Oh, yeah. Oh, really? You didn't think so? No, I did. You didn't enjoy your time, Bloomberg? I did, I did. Every time. We had a great time together.

Tumultuous. Don't ever forget it. Tumultuous. Was it everything's tumultuous? Yeah, I mean. I mean, does this seem easier now that you're a gizmodo? No. No. Just to mulch us, right?

Are you kidding? This is what it's like when you're in the big leagues. This company went bankrupt. Yeah. It just happens. Went bankrupt is being destroyed by a vindictive billionaire. Yeah. Was purchased by a massive.

By another vindictive billionaire. Right. Something like that. Yeah. Post deletions. Yeah, oh yeah, right. That. Something like that. Yeah. Post deletions. Yeah, oh yeah, right. That's what we're talking about.

It's funny how you wake up one day. No, you go to bed one night. John Cook pens a letter. John Cook, he did pen a letter. Did he? Did he pen a letter? Yeah, I fucking read it. It's like, hey, I didn't want people to delete this,

but. Oh, sure. And then so the Univision deleted like seven posts or something. Yeah, I think it then, so the Univision deleted, like, seven posts or something. Yeah, I think it was ended up being five. So I believe this is all on the record, so I'm going to... So according to them, it was because... When they agreed to purchase the company out of bankruptcy, they agreed to purchase all

the assets, not any of the active liabilities. So anything in active litigation, according to their legal mathematics, was deemed, I think a hot potato is the word. A hot potato. On was deemed unperturcible. They could not buy liabilities. So.

Or they didn't want to. Probably didn't want to. According to their legal. If I were to buy people, I'm cool with everything, but these liabilities I'm not gonna buy. Right. Which is what you would buy those. But like, from a business perspective,

I'll check it out. It makes total sense. From an editorial perspective, obviously deleting a story is a big deal. Yeah. A big, big deal. And particularly, I think at a company where the last time Gawker deleted a big, big deal. Yeah. And particularly, I think, at a company where the last time Gaucker deleted a story, it

was a very intense situation to senior editors ended up quitting, resigning, it really through the company into a lot of turmoil. So I think it's a particularly sensitive issue for us. Yeah. I mean, that was the, your referencing, of course, the story about the Condé Nass CFO, right, which was kind of a breaking point for a lot of like gocker, like the gocker way of doing things. I mean, I hated that story. Horrible story. I remember seeing that and was like, what are you fucking kidding? I was disgusted. I think we talked about it.

Yeah, it was awful. It was awful. Yeah, nobody Yeah, everybody was unhappy. Yeah, it was so bad. But anyhow, but everybody makes mistakes. Sure. Gawker should have really epic. Yeah, that was a big one. That was a big one. But yeah, so the, the posts were deleted and so that caused, you know, a ripple effect of,

you know, you have an editorial staff of 150 people who just got bought, went through all this drama. So you're telling the entirety of Gawker, is that number right? Of the entirety of Gokker. Is that number right? Of the Gokker Media Group? 100. 100 people total.

On editorial? No, no. All across. Total, 250. Oh, okay. Sales, product. Yeah, how many product people? Five or six?

No, but then where are the other, how many sales people? I don't know. Holy shit, but 250, but only 100 editorial? Oh yeah, small. Interesting. Cosmodo's 25, that's the biggest staff. We get it, it's 25. Well, that's the only number I have for you. You have a great work with 25 people.

I think you. Well, as a person who's just not to get into your stuff here, but as a person who's got a small team, and is trying to build something scratch, that's me I'm talking about myself. Yeah, that's, as a person who's got a small team, and is trying to build something scratch, that's me I'm talking about myself. Yeah, that's, as a person, usually that indicates. But you know, you do, you are like, hey, like, I mean, one of my things was like,

you don't need, there's like, there is a thing is having too many people. Oh, definitely. It was also a thing is having not enough people. Yeah, but you know, I don't strike the balance. I do think that, you know, 70s a lot of fucking people. Actually, after leaving Bloomberg, I very much felt like I'm cool with not doing something

really big. That's actually a lot of the outline is, sorry not to talk about myself, but. No, please continue. A lot of it is driven by this idea of like, I'm not really interested in doing like, trying to be like the biggest. Right.

That doesn't interest me. I mean, Bloomberg, a lot of talented people there, but what, 2500 journalists on the wire? A lot of untoward of people there too. A lot of lazy people. Really not. A lot of talented people there, but what, 2500 journalists on the wire? A lot of untound of people there too. A lot of lazy people. Really not. A lot of like horror. A lot of people catching a big paycheck.

Yes, a lot of people. Not doing much at all. It's just phony in, but they don't even use the phone. No, they use the terminal. Yeah. It's a cushy place to retire. It's a cushy place to work. Great 401k.

I don't know if any of this is like, contractually if I'm allowed to say it or not. Oh, still? I don't know if any of this is like, contractually if I'm allowed to say it or not. Oh, still? I don't know. I never know. I don't know. I saw a lot of shit on my way out the door. No, they're probably not listening.

A lot of hush. A lot of hushes. It's not the size of the staff. It's the most of the issues. It's true. You know, we actually need to take a break. We're taking a break. Let's do that.

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Be a customer trailblazer. Discover one connected platform for one connected customer experience with Salesforce, the customer success platform. Learn more at salesforce.com slash tomorrow. All right, we're back with Katie Drummond. Still here. And that was a great set of advertisements you just heard. Yeah, right? Oh, yeah.

Yeah, I want to talk about it. I've got to monetize this content. Definitely. Anyhow, we were talking about the media industry and that's very boring Nobody wants to be very turbulent very turbulent time. So anyhow, so any unit you never finish your story. Univision Deleted the post deleted some post. Yes, so they were liabilities. So yes, so the editorial staff obviously that's very upsetting They were very mad now because Moto media group is unionized So the editorial staff is in a union.

Interesting. Can I just note that recently Fusion or Fusion was unionized? No. Is unionized? Fusion is now in the... Which is part of Univision. Fusion, yes, is now in the process of unionizing. And fusion and univision was like, please don't do this.

It appears that way based on the letter that Fusion sent to their employees. They're like, we suggest. To consider alternatives. We suggest not doing this. Yeah, that was the suggestion. I know of one other media, large media group. Vice is unionized. That's right.

There's vice, there's gocker. Yeah, there's mode on media group. Sorry, can you not even say gocker? Do you get penalized for that? I just get angry. You have to send Teal a check for $10 or is that you say Gokker? What else is unionized?

Oh boy. Like new media. Yeah, those are the best ones. Is Buzzfeed union? I don't think so. No. Buzzfeed is actively fighting in the organization. They are? Well, at least their management and fighting organization. They are.

Well, at least their management and executives are. I mean, it's tough. I mean, listen, it's tough. There's plus and minuses. I'm a supporter of unions in general. Yeah. I think for a certain size business, you get to a point where you kind of have to look at it

and say when you have hundreds of people, you have to find some way to level the playing field. Right. Yeah, when I started this job, I was very dubious of the union and sort of like, what is this? I'm not a big union person. But since working here for almost a year and seeing sort of how the union was able to have an impact on the post-relation situation, which was what we wanted out of the situation was we knew the posts weren't going to be republished.

But what we asked for was written indemnity, which is standard at media companies that they provide it, which is to say they will defend a reporter or an editor in a lawsuit if the subject of a story sues. But it's very rare to get it in writing. And so we asked for it in writing from Univision to sort of feel like if we decide to, or if we do continue to do the type of journalism that GMG is known for, which we plan to keep doing, we need to know that you aren't just going to

delete a story or hang us out to dry, like we need written protection. You want to be backed up. We want to be backed up. So we got back up. And so that was a very good, it was a shitty situation. It wasn't a liability. Well, we'll pass that.

They already bought us a slay. So in the future liabilities are all good. Yeah, future liabilities are all good. You should test that theory. I have a habit. Have you thought of doing any liable? Any. You should do well.

I mean, look, you are tackling some pretty hot topics. Well, then like, we get rich people in the valley. Ken Bone. Ken Bone, Palmer Lucky. Oh, Palmer Lucky, we should type up Palmer. Palmer Watch, day 24. Fall from Grace. Where's Palmer?

I don't know, you know, Palmer seemed like a very nice guy. Have you met him? I've met him on the internet. We've chatted a little bit. Palmer, founder of Oculus Ratchet. Palmer Lucky, he started doing Oculus as a Kickstarter project in his like house or garage or whatever. Well, actually, Palmer Lucky worked at doing research at the Institute. I think it's called the Institute for Creative Technologies at UC Irvine. So he was a PhD, and so he was working on virtual reality there

with a team doing it for Post-Romantic Stress Disorder. Then I believe, I left academia to start his own private venture, and that is how Oculus came to be. She did. He did it. He did. He kickstarted the VR release. I don't know if it was in his garage.

I might not have been in his garage, but he definitely did a Kickstarter project that got like, pretty fun and in built. I've used the original and not the very first, but a very early version of the Oculus Rift, which had gaffer tape all over it. It was definitely put together. And where you,

I think we had it in the Verge trailer in like 2012 or at CES. I never went to CES. You didn't go. No, I didn't go. You missed all the fun. Yeah, I heard about it. But you also missed a lot of horrible shit. Yeah, it's all worked out for you, really.

You worked out for me. But I think that's the one I took on late night. And did you think this is the future? Everybody who tried it was like holy shit. I remember I remember putting it on Fallon and Gavincell who it was the producer there who joined Vox today And people are like oh my god. Oh wow, and I knew like as soon as it because we had that reaction when we put it on in the trailer Yeah, at that point it was like this is I remember I wrote something about it that year I said I put it on that. I didn't ever want to take it off. Oh, interesting. I took it off though

I put it on at CES last year. So this is like a much more advanced product. But I was just like, this is really cool. I would never buy one. Yeah, I was gonna say if you love it so much, have you bought one? I have an Oculus Dev Kit, an original one. I have been planning on buying,

I think I'm gonna buy the PlayStation VR kit. Yeah. They're not in stock. I wanted to buy one. But, I, because I took, I used the PSVR. I mean, the Vive is actually kind of the best of all of them. Yeah, that's right. The view is the Vive.

I have not used it, but our review was like, was very positive. The Vive is sick as fuck. Yeah. The PSVR, I haven't used the home version yet. I've heard that's very good. I use the prototype version. I think the home version home version yet. I use the prototype version. I think the home version, if it's anything like the prototype version, is really, really good.

And the fact that it interfaces with an actual console that exists right now. And you can play it on it. I don't really build a gaming PC for it. Oh, yeah. That's pretty important. Yeah. But I do also not want to set it up in my living room. So it's like, yeah, I don't know.

I don't know. It's a wrong. The best implementation I've seen so far is the Samsung Gear VR, because it's like, you snap your phone in and you know, no wires, you snap your notes seven in. Boom. And then, it belongs to our, and then your eyeballs get melted.

It's so real when the notes seven, you're like, whoa, this hell level is really so real. Wow. And it turns out you're scar, whoa, this hell level is really so good. Wow. And it turns out you're scarred for life. Thanks a lot, Sam's long. Literally. Yeah, anyhow. Wow.

So Palmer, bad few weeks. He said a bad few weeks. He said a bad few weeks. He turns out he's a shit lord, edge lord shit lord, who's been funding Republican shit post and, are like alt-right garbage. Yeah, and his, his, his, dank memes. dank memes.

His long-term partner is an avid gamer-gator. She's out online, tweeting like kind of horrible stuff. Female, I'm sorry, this may sound sexist, but female gamer-gator's blown my mind. Yeah, my mind was blown as well. That's like, I was like, really? That's like, you know they hate you, right? Yeah.

They are mad at you. Yeah. So Gizmo actually, That's like a, It's like you know they hate you, right? Yeah. They are mad at you. Yeah. So Gizmo actually, That's like a Stockholm syndrome situation. It's like the Gays for Trump. It's like the praise you get from them. It feels so good. There's the Gays for Trump.

There's a small pocket of premium Milo and some of his bodies. Yeah, like those who are both, it's because they get so much overwhelming praise from people being like, see we're not monsters that it just feels great. Interesting. Oh, teal, I guess.

Oh yeah, gay. He's gay for Trump. He is gay as a cop for reporting. And gay for Trump also. He's a billionaire first and a homosexual second. There you go. But importantly, he's an asshole above all else. Yeah.

Above all, he's a complete asshole. Yeah. Is that reliable? I hope I don't get sued out of existence. Anyhow, I don't think you can refute that. That's definitely not on your asshole. Yeah. It's my opinion. It's your opinion. It's an opinion piece. Josh's opinion. Hashtag head. He or T.L. is an asshole. Hashtag editorial. Yeah. All right. Anyhow, what were you saying? Did the

T.L. is begun? Palmer, Palmer Lucky. We had actually known for a long time that he was kind of a dick. I heard that also in our opinion and Then the Daily Beast published this explosive story good for them Wow, they found sounds so sincere the way you say that it was I mean, I was annoyed I woke up and was like wow this is an amazing scoop This is really good. I heard some other people were working on a feature about that and they got kind of Oh

Hopes got dashed see our story, we were kind of like on hold with what we had and trying to get more and then they went with what they had. And so then we published what we had and then Motherboard, Advice, published what they had and it turned out like a bunch of people were working on this. Yeah, turns out it was like an open secret. It was like an open secret that this guy sucked.

So he issued essentially like a non-apology apology on Facebook and then just disappeared. He just disappeared. And this is someone who, you know, Oculus had their developers, conference two weeks ago, every year he would go, give the keynote, hang out, Mingle. It's only been like one year though, hasn't it? Two years, maybe? Two years. So the last two years. Not as long history, palm or lucky. When Facebook bought Oculus, he was there, gave the keynote with Mark, et cetera. Yeah.

This year we sent a reporter to go check it out. Guy was gone. Like Facebook is trying to wipe him off the face of the social network. Why wouldn't they? And they had Zuckerberg present, right? He did the VR thing. Yeah, Zuckerberg presented.

He did the keynote. He did what I consider to be the world's most boring VR demo. It was very bad. I'm so bummed about, actually, it's lucky that Vive exists and like that the PSVR exists and everybody's working on stuff now because VR's are really cool concepts that can be destroyed really easily by something like Facebook. What do you think Facebook is going to do with it?

Well, I think Facebook showed a little bit about, he's really, we don't want to connect people and have them play card games together. So show. Yeah, and like monetize, like, oh, how monetizable. So I actually wrote about, you know, I wrote about a little, a little fix, a fanfic about Facebook buying Oculus.

But it turns out my vision for what Facebook would do with it while covered in ads, it was a lot cooler sounding than what Facebook has in mind for it. It's very underwhelming. Which is like, you can play cards with friends across the globe. Very innocent. And it's like, that's cool.

Well then I think, if you want a totally like, scrubbed version of what you can do in VR. Yeah. I want to do fucked up shit in VR. Well, Oculus wants you to play games like Westworld on HBO. Yeah, I want to do Westworld in VR. Do you want a game or do you want to hang fucked up shit in VR. Well, Oculus wants you to play games like... Westworld on HBA. Yeah, I want to do Westworld in VR. Do you want a game or do you want to hang out with people?

Both. I want a game with people I'm hanging out with. Yeah. I also want to do other stuff. Sex stuff. Oh my god. Yeah. Wow.

I want to do VR sex to a robot. Is that wrong to admit? This is grand. I want to get to... It's going to be pretty dark if your notes have an explosion. I know you're gonna get a VR underwear. Oh my god. Do they make that?

Oh, is that wrong? A little. Come on. I'm not the only guy who's thought of it. It's literally gonna be the number one use of that product. Of course, the only thing that's gonna make VR happen is sex stuff. Yeah, like, do it right. Barred by words, write it down.

No one wants it. No one, they won't talk about it. Oh, you know, I can play a space game. That's cool. Can I have sex with anybody during that game? That's the question that has to be answered. Well, I don't know, but if Facebook's responsible, the answer is no.

It's definitely not. The answer is like, you can't even virtually breastfeed anybody. Yeah, you can't show any nips. I don't know what virtual breastfeeding is, but I like the idea of it. Oh, boy. No, I mean, as a way to get people to get their heads...

Get your heads wrapped around the beauty and importance of breastfeeding. Yeah. That's all. You want to experience things you'll never experience. There you go. That's a great, great opportunity for men to see what it's like. To breastfeed. Think about all the crazy shit that's going to go down if VR really becomes as perverted and insane

as we think it could be. But who, but who is gonna, who is gonna do this? I don't know. I guess porn hub, I guess, because porn hub's gonna have to launch a social network. Yeah. A social network.

I think porn hub is. I think porn hub, I think porn hub is doing VR. It's a social network for sex. Yeah. I think we're not in the social network. Gay people have been building the social network for sex for 10 years That's just an earnest that's just that's just

That's just people. Yeah, you just put some Sims on top of Grindr and you go out yourself a party Sims on What does that mean okay Grindr is an app? I know what Grindr is Sims is also a game. Yeah, I saw today though This it this Bobby from Jeze. Bobby finger. Yeah, he wrote on he wrote on the all about about this new package that you can add to your sims game where they all have crazy sex. What? Yeah, I was like, oh my god. I should have download the sims. Oh, all of a sudden now you're interested in virtual sex. No, like I see your employer. It's cool. It's okay. I'm sorry. You want to watch people having sex. Sim specifically. You want to want well, but that's what it would be like

if you're in VR. If you're there and they're over there. VR feels a little too close for a little unvarnished for me. Well, it's going to get real varnish pretty soon. I hope so. It's going to get very varnished. I'd like to see some polish on that sex. Okay.

You know what? You took it one step over the line as far as I'm concerned. I don't think I did. Couldn't't keep it couldn't keep it in your Path anyway, I think the Sims thing sounds really cool The sims sex thing. Yeah, it's fine. Can you get that up on the screen? I'd like to see Yeah, I don't think they're showing us. Oh really? I'm gonna have to start to sell you about this. Yeah, that's kind of lame Why wouldn't you get when you get when you do? Yeah, I just want to see animated cartoons I was gonna say like like on South Park,

you can look at the kids are always naked. Why can't they? They did an episode where they all took their pants off. And I was like, you can show this on TV and I Google that you can show it on TV. That was the thing you should, I can't show this. You should like cartoon penises, is that what you're saying?

Oh, interesting. But their children's cartoon penises aren't currently there free to do that. So if they can do that, but we can't get adults. We can't look at naked sims. We adults. We can't look at naked Sims. We can. We can't. We can't.

We can't. We can't. We can't look at naked Sims. We can't. We can't look at naked Sims. We can't look at naked Sims. We can't look at naked Sims. We can't look at naked Sims.

We can't look at naked Sims. We can't look at naked Sims. We can't look at naked Sims. We can't look at naked Sims. We can't look at naked Sims. We can't look at naked Sims. We can't look at naked Sims. We can't look at naked Sims.

We can't look at naked Sims. We can't look at naked Sims. We can't look at naked Sims. We can't look at naked Sims. We can't look at naked Sims. We can't look at naked Sims. it sounded pretty intense. But is it just like, is it just like those, their objects like thrusting around like, what can you really see? I mean, I don't know. Can you, can you, I'm just giving you options of like, climax. I can't even zoom in, I'm just giving you zoom in. How far can you zoom in? Is it, is it, is it like, I think the Sims is pretty advanced these days.

I haven't, I haven't played the Sims. I mean, there's a version where you can make a movie. Like you can zoom in and have them like talking and low while. Wow, so you can make a Sim porn. Yeah, you can make a Sim porn. I'm gonna guess say, me like you. Yeah, it's interesting. You should ask Laura about it.

I'm going to ask her. She plays the Sims, I don't know. There you go. Maybe this is what's been going on all this time. Nasty simsex. Oh God. Yeah, you can get a bottle of this. Awful.

This is a conundrum. How's the family doing? Well, that's a weird and disgusting segue way. You're so great. The family's Laura's wonderful. Great. Zalda's wonderful. Zalda's my daughter. Yeah. Laura's very busy. She's writing a lot. She's working on a book.

She is very exciting. She is writing a lot of columns for New York magazines. Have a New York magazine. It seems like turbulent. It seems good to me. Oh, okay. I don't know. Just curious. I what do I know? I only hear the It seems like turbulent. It seems good to me. Oh, okay. I don't know. Just curious. What do I know? I only hear the sixth generation of a story. Right. And that generation, it sounds all good.

Great. Everybody's happy, well paid, satisfied with their working conditions, satisfied with their co-workers. So glad to hear it. They love the print publication. The print digital getting along swimmingly. I bet. Monatization is through the roof. No prolemo.

No prolemo. Yeah. It's all not having any. Sounds like utopia. What else we have to talk about? Uber, Uber, creepy driver ads. I don't know. Apparently you covered an Uber thing today

where people are going to advertise to people with drones. I mean, that sounds about right. Sounds like a good idea. It sounds like something Uber. People in Mexico that are stuck in traffic a drone would just come by the car and be like, want to buy stuff? Wait, I understand. Why is it a drone? Why is that Uber? Yeah, what does Uber have to do with it?

Seems like you made this up. Yeah. Also, if you've got a drone, what is the point of the drone? Couldn't you just have like a guy ride by on a bike? It's probably more efficient to use a drone. Is it? I doubt it. drone, what is the point of the drone? Couldn't you just have like a guy ride by on a bike? It's probably more efficient to use a drone. Is it?

I doubt it. Seems more expensive. Probably more eye catching though. Yeah. You have to charge the thing all the time. Looks futuristic. Do they have a drone that can go indefinitely using solar power yet?

No. How can they not have made that? I don't know. How come they haven't done that yet? Who, who's they? The people. No. Get Paul Marlucky on that.

He'll fix it right now. He's probably, that's probably what he's doing. What do you think his next move is going to be? Um, I mean, I think he'll probably resign. You do? Yeah. Why don't they just keep him tucked away? He probably has some kind of contract.

I think he is waiting for his contract to hire him in the interior. Probably a six and kind of sick. Earn out. Yeah. He's a billionaire. Yeah, say some kind of sick earn out. Yeah. Right. He's a billionaire. Yeah, we're close to. He's very rich.

Very, very rich. He has more money than you and I, or I ever see in our lifetime. I just wanna know where he is. Why don't you go to his house and wait for him. I mean, that's an option. Why don't you do that? Maybe we will.

Send Turton. He would love it. Send Turton over there. Where's he located? Where's he in New York? He's in New York. Yeah. Yeah Okay, so I have it says a few months ago drivers were stuck in Mexico City traffic and were

greeted with a strange site drones carrying signs advertising Uber pool the city would be for you Not 5.5 million cars one drone sign red driving by yourself This is why you can never see the volcanoes another red and about the smog that obscures the city surrounding. What? Yeah, here's photos. Who wrote this? I mean, this is from the verge, just as the first result. Excuse me? Sorry. Wow. What happened? And it's out of it.

It's actually got B too. I don't think we got B. It's not just a bloom burst tweet. Yeah, it's a bloom burst tweet. It sounds like it's got its ass handed to it by the verge. Wow, fuck you. Wow. The writing did not sound good great. I mean it wasn't not great pros, but that's creepy That's in a really intense photo

That none of you can see yeah, I mean I don't buy that happened that more than one time This is a bullshit This is straight up bullshit. I look like the origin story story of this. Maybe Gizmodo has more detail. Well, maybe we can dig into it. Yeah, if only this guy was able to find it. It turns out your SEO is not very good. Maybe the Univision thing has hurt the SEO in some ways. Why was that of hurt the SEO?

No, there's all sorts of dark arts happening. I don't, none of that stuff even is real. SEO. It's all fake. Search engine optimization. It's all fake. Search engine optimization. It's all just dark. You think it's made up? Darknet.

I don't know. Speaking of darknet, have you seen Westworld? No, sorry. Oh man. Who, what the fuck? Why did I have you on here? I don't know. Frankly, I don't know.

What's the point? I haven't potentially been interested in announcement around Westworld to coming up. Maybe not entirely sure. I'm not going to talk about that. Do you have a podcast guest from the show? I'm not going to make an announcement about it right now. We had Tony Hawk on Gizmodo last week.

Okay, listen, I get it. Gizmodo can do whatever it wants. You got a Univision money. I don't care. We actually have not seen a fucking dime yet. You know what the thing that you're wondering? You know what the thing is that's one million. I don't have any extra money.

You know what's wonderful to do is to go like, oh, okay, everybody's competing. You know what, 50 million, they want 100 million, they want X million. It's like, you know what, fuck that shit, they want a 50 million, they want a 100 million, they want an X million. It's like, you know what, fuck that shit, you know what I want? I want a couple million of the best smartest, most interesting people I can find. That's what I want.

Is this an ad? No, it's just me talking. I'm frustrated by this idea that everything has to scale to like 50 million or 40 million or 30 million in order to mean something. I didn't say it had a scale. No, I'm not saying you say that, but I understand that like the pursuit is like,

you gotta get a lot of people, so you gotta get a Tony Hawk on a podcast or something. We just thought Tony Hawk was cool. Tony Hawk's a loser and a chump. Well, he was really nice to us. You know what, he can do a means skateboarding. Yeah, he's a great skateboarder. Actually, Tony Hawk is pretty cool.

He's a cool dad. He heard he's into gadgets. Yeah, he likes gadgets. He's like a gadget freak. He's got a gadget video that's out there. Yeah, he likes gadgets, so we were like, come talk about gadgets. Is that true? He's like doing a book or something about gadgets, or he's got some new game that's out there. Yeah, yeah, yeah. He likes gadgets, so we were like, come talk about gadgets. Is that true? He's like doing a book or something about gadgets,

so he's got some new game, and that has some new gadgets. So we just did a live Q&A with Tony Hawk. He has a lot of talk, I've seen a lot of press in being in a gadgets. Yeah. He's like really, he's about to release a Bluetooth speaker or something.

Right. Hawk, Hawk sounds. Hawk, Hawk, Hawk sounds is pretty good, but I feel like it's like Hawk. What if it's a speaker on a drone and it falls you like skateboarding The hot star tunes. That's cool idea the hawkster drone. It's a fucking cool idea So you can hear like your cool punk music the whole all the time Hey, you're in the game you hear a system of a down

311 sorry like yeah, I don't know what skaters listen to Lincoln Park. I can't believe I thought of system of a 311 sorry like yeah, I don't know what skaters listen to Lincoln Park. I can't believe I thought of sissoma Fadina. They're pretty cool. Sissoma. That was pretty cool. Are they I don't know. Yeah, I feel bad that I installed the Tony hockey So you know, okay guy. Yeah, he's great. I mean, it's a little square and old for my taste But that's one man's opinion. Okay. Fine. That's one square old man's a picture. Yeah, exactly You know, you know, Katie was she used to be a little bit nicer in the old days a little bit She's been hardened by years of Gawka media. Working with men, I think.

Yeah, horrible men. Frankly, I work with a lot of annoying men. Where do I rank on the list of annoying men? Pretty high or pretty low? Ah, like middle of the pack. Yeah. It's not bad. I'll take that.

You're a little loud. I am loud. You could do worse. I could do a lot worse. I could do a lot worse. I could do a lot worse. All right, well, listen, Katie, unfortunately, we do have to wrap up.

Oh, darn. As much as I would love to use this chat, I have to go and have a drink with someone. Have a great time. I'm gonna have a really good time having this drink, partially because I need a drink, but also because the place I'm going serves food and I might order some food.

Have a little snack. Any, any parting thoughts for our listenership, anything you'd like to let them know about any big things happening against moto in the near future? Any exciting stories that you want to talk about that you've recently done? Any trips you're about to take? I'm going on vacation in two weeks.

Fantastic, where are you going? I can't talk about it. But it's a vacation. It's a vacation. Why don't you want to talk about it? My husband would prefer that I keep my wear about all the internet. Oh, you guys are going to one of those resorts.

No, I think he's actually worried about someone finding me and killing me. You're going to, what is it called? We're not going to a resorts. Sandals. You're going to like sandals. What sandals resorts? Cabo.

Please. Sandals and Cabo sandals. No, we're not doing that. This is bullying. I like to. So I would just say, Oh, I like that. This is bullying. We're just having a conversation. Obviously. I'm a bully men and I'm a bullying

I thought we were ending A lot of bullying this is awful All right, so you're going to sandals and Cabo San Luis. Yes I'm too. We're all be yeah, okay, and I would say just just Just car really worried that people are gonna like try to kill you Maybe not kill me, but like yeah, he doesn't want me like Projecting that's good. Okay, so I think you might be putting a little bit too much stock in that gives moto commenters though Oh, I can be a little careless about that stuff, so but you're not like here's my home address. No

I'm not I wouldn't I think you're pretty private. It's fine. You strike me as pretty private. Yeah, we're going to the southern US I wouldn't I think you're pretty private. It's fine. You strike me as pretty private. We're yeah, we're going to the southern US Oh, I don't even care. Okay. I just wanted to I was just talking. Yeah cool as you as you as you know I love to do so I would say gizmodo more we're gonna break some more news You get something big planned Yeah, we always have something big plan big scoop. Yeah, we always have a scoop plan really. Oh, yeah, wow I'm excited. I go to bed nervous every night. Do you? Why do you even go to bed? I wouldn't go to bed. I already need to get those pills they give for the army, the army guys. Ambien?

No, not Ambien. Nothing that keeps you awake. Adderall? No, what do they give them in the army? It's actually on a special like no sleeping drug. Oh wait, Ryan knows, right? This is a real thing. Yeah, there's like a nickname for them. It's some kind of crazy like I'm sure I've written about these. You take them. Well, maybe. I like to sleep though. Yeah, you do like sleeping. Yeah. I'm not a big fan. Well, it's good for you.

I guess it is, but if you have these pills, you don't need it. Yeah, that's not actually how it works. If you just see it as long-term, that's not how it works. You just skip sleeping, nothing bad will happen. No. You can just never sleep. No, because I think the military also gives you

like, downers when you're done with your up period. That was a nice time. Good. It's called ProVigil. Oh, ProVigil. You can go, they let you go a couple days with no sleeping and then they're like, please stop. But I think if you like,

they give you like downers. Yeah, I think it's like in a Batman movie where if you just kept going, I'm gonna do it forever and then you become some kind of super villain. You become a man, you become a bane. Yeah. Oh, back to bane. All right. I don't know. It's just probably my head. Well, Katie, thank you for coming in. Thank you so much for having me guys. I think a man, you become a bane. Oh, back to bane. All right, all right. I don't know, I just popped my head.

Well, Katie, thank you for coming in. Thank you so much for having me guys. I think you're doing a brilliant job with Gizmodo. Thanks, thanks. It's some of the best stuff that's come out of the not no longer Gokka Media Group, but that I think you've taken Gizmodo to new heights. Thank you, I appreciate it.

Maybe I've said this before, but I think you're doing it. I think it's really good. Thanks. And I love reading it. Oh, I'm sure. I do, I do enjoy it. I'm sure. Much more than I used to enjoy with it. Well, thanks, yeah. And I love reading it. Oh, I'm sure. I do. I do enjoy it. I'm sure.

Much more than I used to enjoy. Well, thanks. Yeah. And I I chucked that up to great leadership. Thank you. And to William Turden. Or as I had to call Bill, Bill Tomley. Anyhow, and so just keep your eyes tuned to it gets about a calm. Yeah. And do not vote for Donald Trump. Don't vote for Donald Trump. And you can follow Katie on Twitter. It is Katie drum. Yeah with two M's and Tweet at me and police she loves to be tweeted at Especially with aggressive rude comments by aggressive alt-right people You have an anime a. B. I or an American flag please If you're a member if you're an edge lord

Member of gamer gate Katie would love to hear from you. Can't wait. They must have had a field day when you took over as editor-in-chief. They must have been like really up beside themselves, the Gamergator. They were thrilled. Really? No. All right, anyhow, thank you.

Okay, thank you. And we'll, you know, you'll be, you'll be, you'll have to come back. I would love to. The next big scoop. Sure. Come back with the reporter. Sure.

And we'll do a, we'll do a, what do they call autopsy? Sure. On the scoop. Sure. Come back with the reporter. Sure. And we'll do a, we'll do a, what do they call autopsy? Sure. On the scoop. That sounds great. Okay, great. Okay, thanks. Bye. You're free to go. Bye. Okay. Okay. Well, that is our show for this week. We'll be back next week with more tomorrow. And as always, I wish you and your family the very best. Though, I understand that several members of your family are trapped in their virtual reality underwear while it's buffering, and that's causing heinous, heinous damage to their genitals. you