Tomorrow - Episode 85: Playing Games with Chris Grant

Episode Date: March 8, 2017

You awaken in a dark cave, gasping for air as you emerge from a pool of cool blue water. You're alone, it's cold, but you feel like you've slept for a hundred years. You go to leave the cave but, GASP, there are dozens of obstacles and monsters in your way. In desperation, you search the ground for a tool. You find a stone tablet from which light pours at your very touch. The light swirls on the tablet until it says in bold, ancient letters "Tomorrow Episode 85 featuring Polygon's Editor in Chief, Chris Grant." Your memories come swirling back to you. You're a hero who fights to save the realm. You love Josh Topolsky. You can overcome the fantastic and ancient obstacles and puzzles that have been stacked in your way. All you need is a sword, a shield, and episode 85. Don't worry princess, you're on your way. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Hey and welcome to tomorrow, I'm your host, Josh Wotspolski. Today on the podcast, we discuss gaming alone, sexy Pokemon, and squids, but first, a word from our sponsors. Whether you're a first time blogger or an experienced web pro like myself, AKA web professional, hostgator has all the tools you need to build a great looking website fast

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It's an organization that provides opportunities for you to collaborate, create, and lead. Find your purpose with USAAA. Visit USAAAjobs.com and join the team. My guest today is a lovely man, a beautiful man, a man that I am very fond of and have historically been very fond of. A man I've known, he's a man first off, a man I've known for some time. I'm of course talking about Christopher Grant, aka Chris Grant, aka the editor-in-chief of Polygon.com and also a human being. Chris, thank you for being here.

Thanks, Josh. You know what's rare about this is that Chris is in the, we are in, we're in the same room. Yeah. The last time we did this, I think we were, you were escaping. Yeah, I've escaped in. And I haven't seen him in a while. Yeah, it's been a long time. Do I seem, do we, you seem exactly the same to me?

You seem more, more worldly, really? Yeah, like you've done some kung fu shit. You've gone around the world, you've learned some new tricks and you've come back. Yeah, I'm like a doctor strange. Yeah, they call me professor strange. But you have your doctorate, you just don't like to. I don't like that, they'll send me a big deal out of it.

Yeah, I have my doctorate, but you know, I was actually watching Dr. Stray. Have you seen it? Yeah, I watch it on a plane. It was fun. I was, I realized I could pull off a Dr. Strange costume for Halloween, but I would have to shave my beard into a goatee, which is not a good idea, but also like I could definitely do a Dr. Strange costume. So I haven't even done an actual Halloween costume in a long time.

Do you know what the thing about facial hair is? What's that? Gross back. I mean, should do it. I haven't done an actual Halloween costume a long time. Do you know what the thing about facial hair is? What's that gross back? I mean they say that my facial hair Do you want to test it? I don't know that I have like you've never had a beard I can't grow beard you have a little line. I got a little stubble You should do a goatee. I can do one of the I can do a soul patch Down down. I can do the soul patch on the bottom. The mustache doesn't grow. It's a mess. Please don't grow any facial hair. I think do everybody a favor.

But Chris, so I want to talk to Chris obviously first because I think he's a fantastic person in the facial hair. And I think he is a terrible facial hair. And I wanted to discuss that. But also because there's a lot of gaming stuff happening. Games are, you know, in the age of Trump Trump games are increasingly important because we can escape into them. And I just, there's the Nintendo Switches out. And you are obviously you have to be your knee deep neck deep in this world. Yeah, waist, waist deep. Yeah. So um, all right. So let's, let's, uh, let's get into this. Let's just get right into it. Now,

I just want to preface this by saying, if you're listening, we're going to talk about video games and video game systems. If you're not into that, you know what? No judgments, but you probably should try to turn this off. It's a free country. I mean, tech. No. He's a free country. No, you're right. I mean, a few months ago, it was. Yeah, I take it back. Now, I think maybe, maybe not. Hey, it was a free country. We had a good run. It was a nice time in America. Let's talk about escaping into technology.

Let's do it. So I was saying before we started, I was talking about Resident Evil 7, AK, Biohazard. Is that the actual name? It's Resident Evil 7 colon Biohazard. Which is fucked up because the series is called biohazard in Japan. Yeah. So is it biohazard 7 biohazard? I think it's just, no, I don't know, it's a good question. I think it's a reboot, right?

This is a franchise reboot. Is it? Yeah, I'll for sure. Please, first boiler is, hey, first person. Is that first person? No, I haven't Japan. It's the first, it's called biohazard first person? No, I'm not saying. No, I haven't. In Japan, it's the first, it's called Biohazard 7 Resident Evil.

No, shut up. You're serious? Wow, that's good. That's actually very clever. I didn't realize this was a full reboot. I was like, see, I keep waiting for like a Jill Valentine to appear in a scene somewhere. Did you mention it?

No, no, don't tell me anything. But I'm like, here's what I feel. And I have no. Here's Wesker? No, no, no, don't tell me anything. But I'm like, but I'm like, here's what I feel and I have no wester. Yeah, a real Jill sandwich. Yeah. But I feel like it's so I think first off the game feels very influenced by the first season of True Detective. I feel like immediately I was like, oh, this is kind of like true to you. No spoilers, but if you should watch True Detective the first season, it's great. But have you seen it? Yeah, yeah. First season. The first season.

Second season. Second season. Very bad. It's like, what would it be like if you show we're bad? Who big resident evil 4 to resident evil 6? Like the one where they're in South Africa or something? No, that's 5. 5 is where they're in an African country.

It's not a South African country. Somewhere in Africa. Yeah, and six is the super bad one that looks like a draft getting a blow job. Oh, I don't think I've ever played this one. Six is the worst one ever. I avoided it. Yeah, the draft getting a blow job. Yeah, look at the cover.

It looks like a draft getting a blow job. Yeah, I know this one. Right. Ryan, what do you think? Do you agree you're closer to it, so? I would say it is a fossil of a giraffe getting a blow. Yeah, yeah, it's abstract, but there. So what was that one about?

It was like, it was super action game heavy. It was really long, it had these crazy. They fucked up, I mean, after four, it's all downhill from four. Four was like, so good. I think the thing that five did is it introduced Co-op to the game and did a really good job with the Co-op campaign. It was actually a really fun Co-op game

if you played it with somebody. But it was, I think we threatened to play that together. I think we actually talked about it. We're gonna play, you gotta play Co-op and I'm like, okay, cool. And then, yeah, we're busy. But it's a good Co-op game. Six just kind of lost the thread.

And I think they knew that. And so they a good cop game. Sixth just kind of lost the thread. And I think they knew that. And so they rebooted for seven. They took the first person. Which to me is, it feels like PT. What did you learn from PT? This is what you learned. You learned that first person is scary.

PT. PT. Josh, tell me. I've just- Where's PT? Oh, we're going deep here. Okay, so a couple of years ago, there's a thing called PT, playable teaser, so it's stood for.

Yeah. And if you finished it, it turns out it was a teaser for Silent Hills, which was going to be a new installment in Silent Hills series. I love Silent Hill. Well, the original. By, yeah, by Guillermo del Toro and Hideo Kojima. Oh, my God. It was just the thing I saw a trailer for.

Isn't there a, no, you're using it. Did he have Death Stranding? Yeah, Death Stranding, is hell. Death Stranding, which, yeah. Mads Michelson isn't it, right? And there's a Guillermo del Toro character. Yeah, and Guillermo del Toro,

and then there's Darrell, the guy from Walking Dead, what's his name? The hot guy. Darrell. Darrell. Yeah, the hot guy. Darrell, the hot guy. I don't even consider the hot guy. He's the motorcycle guy. Yeah, motorcycle hot guy.

Darryl. I start watching the walking desk. There's dad Darryl and he's holding this baby and the baby is weird. So he made so that he made that up for a guy fired from. We have to revisit death strand in a minute because it's like. It's weird shit. It's like the naming is so purely Japanese. The whole thing, you just put these words together, and it was like, I have no idea what had to do with him and it was doing what I'm in. So, Matt's make us then also the star of the BoConcept catalog if you're interested. Sorry. Yes.

You know BoConcept was a Danish furniture? I like picked up one of their catalogs and it's like, do you really want Matt's make us to tell you in your furniture? It's like, yeah, this shea seems nice, but there's a fucking serial killer on there. You think I'm gonna eat you? I don't want that. Okay, yeah, this Shay seems nice, but there's a fucking serial killer on there. He's gonna eat you. I don't want that.

Okay, anyhow, sorry. So PT, could you, Malito got fired from Konami, it was a big deal. Yeah, without a word. So P.T. He's saying, what are you thinking? I think I do it every once. They're making Pitchinco games.

P.T. gets canceled, but they made this demo. It was called P.T. Yeah, P.T. It's like, this P.T. It's, you like horror games. P.T. is, I love horror games. Where can really just PT. It's you like horror games PT is I love horror games. Where can I get it? Here's there's a couple catches. PT is one of the best horror games ever made. Okay, even if it's just a thing. Look at this. What is this? This looks fucking amazing.

PT. Okay, go on keep going. How do I not know about this? It got so here's the thing. You can't get it anymore. What do you mean you can't? It was a demo. They pulled it from the store. You can no longer know what store the store? The PlayStation Station? So you have to find somebody that has a PlayStation already installed. Yeah. And you can play it on that. And that's it. They made it the coolest game ever by taking it offline. Like it there's got to be a way to get it. I made that my game of the year. How can I get it? Norman Reedus. That's in Deathranding? No, that's a PT. So PT in desk-dranding have some relationship?

Yeah, I mean, they're totally different games, but some of the creative team was like, we wanna work together again. Wait, so you're saying there's the greatest survival or experience ever? It is, and I can't play it. It's hard to explain, but it's a loop. And so they're, oh, oh, it's like,

it's like Nightmare on Elm Street three when they're in the car and they keep going around and ending up in the same, you know what I'm talking about? It's just a, it's a teaser, it's just a demo, it's just this idea. It's a tone poem.

And so it was actually my game of the year that you're a came out. You're using every word that I would use to describe the best thing. Yeah. tone poem is like, it's like a tone poem and people are like, what?

And I'm like, no, it's cool. Yeah. So it was my game of the year that year. I think it's the idea that you could make a triple A game. You know what it is? It's the video game equivalent of like a Pixar short, super high production value, amazing thing, but it's five minutes long. It doesn't sound long enough for me.

And well, it's not. I wish it was a whole game, but it's the idea. The experience you get out of it is so unique and like special and you never get an experience like that. It feels like an indie game. So if I had downloaded this, when was this available? 2014. So if I had downloaded it in 2014, I could play it right now. But you would not be able to re-download it, but you would solve it. There are ways you can sneak it. I'll try and find, I think you can do like a proxy server and download it from like, I don't know, a Russian server somewhere. It's like, that's what I'm going to do as soon as I get home.

But it's really good, it's really freaky. I'm so angry. It's like, it's bed wetting. So I'm gonna read it. It's like at the end when you find out it's silent hills because you don't know what you're playing the whole time when they released it, it was like a secret. And at the end, the thing about this thing,

how did I miss this? What was I doing in 2014? I was very busy. It was really good. I'm sure I was like, had some crazy shit going on in it. So either way, I feel like the Resident Evil 17 learned something from PT. This idea that first person can be really scary. The first person is not, we think of it as an action, but it's actually not at odds with

horror. I mean, have you played Outlast? Yeah. That's like also terrifying first person. Like really upsetting. I basically had to stop playing it. I was like, I can't handle this. Well, there's parts of Resident Evil 7 that are like no hundred percent you gotta pause

No, well I was saying the reason I want to talk about it is because I was saying that and this is a real thing The only thing that's more upsetting than the reality we live in where every day There's some new tragedy happening in our government or whatever or with our citizens citizens is Resident Evil 7, biohazard, which is like, it's like literally the only thing that makes me feel worse than being out in the world is being confronted by mutating, like in bread, mutants who are trying to, like, did you get to the first boss part, yeah?

The dad? Yeah, yeah, yeah, way beyond that. I actually have to the first boss part? Yeah. The dad? Yeah, yeah, yeah. Maybe on that. I actually have to the second boss. Okay, so you the dot part. Yeah. Yeah. All this, I know, the bugs and stuff. All this fucking disgusting.

But it's also like, I don't love like graphic horror. This treads, this is like the fine line job. It's the fine line between like sort of linchian dread and full on like splatter. Yeah, splatter porn. Yeah. Yeah. It's like, it's kind of not quite, it doesn't go all the way too much. But I think Resident Evil 1 in the mansion,

it had that sort of ghost story vibe, where it was scary, there's zombies, but it was also like, what don't you see? Like, it's a dread idea. And they do an amazing job of like just imbuing the whole world with this unease. It's a dread idea and they do an amazing job of just imbuing the whole world with this unease. It's horrible. The grandmother.

Oh, don't even, I don't want to know. I'm sure she's the final boss, I would imagine, the grandmother. Don't ruin it, don't say anything. It is if you like video games, if you like horror games, it's an exceptional game. It's so good. It's easily in my game of the year right now. I don't have a game of the year because I don't write about games, but I will say, I did

write about a game the other day, but I will say Resident Evil has renewed my love for, certainly for the Resident Evil franchise, but also for survival horror as a concept. I think that was their job, right? Their job was like, we lost the thread on Resident Evil? How do we get it back? And they got it back. It's incredible. The Nintendo Switch was released, March 3rd.

I got mine delivered to me. I sort of forgot that I ordered it. And then I realized we were just saying this, but I realized before the show, people were like, oh, I can't get one, I need to get one. I was like, I don't give a shit about this at all, but I guess I'll order it because I'm an American

and I have money to burn and, you know, I don't know what it is. But, so I got the switch. It's a really interesting. So first of it's a portable game system. It's not at home console. But it is a home console. Oh, I mean, there's a way you can use it in the home.

It has a dock. Yeah. You can plug it into the dock. But it's not really intended to be a home system. I think Nintendo would tell you the opposite. It is a home system that can also be portable. So I like that idea, by the way. I've been on vacation in beautiful locales.

As I know. Oh, humble brag. As I want to to do vacationing in all the furthest reaches of the earth, the most this untouched beaches of sandals sandals to. But I've been in like a hotel room and I'm like I wish I had my Xbox right now. I really would love to play. So I like the idea that I've got like a real console or close to it with like real controllers, but it's like there's one fucking game for it. And they released it.

It's like, do you like Zelda? Because that's the game that you're going to play. And there's no other game to play. Oh, we have super bomber man, if you're interested. It's like, yeah, I don't need a fucking puzzle game on my $400 or Nintendo. It's like, so it's $300. Whatever, which is, you know, but like for a console, I think.

That's how much the Xbox is. Yeah, 250. It's more than the Xbox. Or the PS, how much is the PS4? 300 for the... Can't take it with you. Honestly, I think the Vita is still a pretty good portable system.

That's not a good thing, which set on, you know, to be fair, the switch has, has just as much Sony that support as the Vita does. The Vita has way more, way more support actually. No, the Vita's, the Vita's dead. I don't know. I'm enjoying a lot of games on it. So the Vita's a great system.

It doesn't have the support. I mean, it's gross, don't know where I'm at. Sony has always had difficulty and so is Nintendo in a way, supporting two product lines, supporting home and portable. What's the Nintendo soft is in it? Well, so for Sony, PlayStation 3 and PSP

was always this like, there was years where PlayStation 3 had nothing in PSP at the games, then vice versa. They would trade back and forth and they had trouble growing a base, rather. And Vita, they barely tried. They started with an effort. It didn't work and they just never went back to it. They started leaning on Indies to do a lot of the work. To that end of the year, 62 Indie games coming to Switch.

I think there's a chance, like, those Indie games might move over to switch. Can you name one that's good? Yeah, I mean, um, um, Thumper is coming out for it. Oh, that's they mean it's got Stardew Valley gone at rhyme, terraria, little inferno, thousand one spikes. I mean, those are all. Does it have any resident evil games? How about how about a new version of zombie you? No, zombie use good. Zombie use a amazing. People don't realize about the Wii U. It's a garbage system with garbage games pretty much, but zombie use is a transcendent experience. Transcendent. Yeah, it's great.

It's fucking crazy. So here was the problem. Ubisoft made a really good core game for Wii U. Nintendo failed every other part of that console. It never, it had some of the games. There's good games on Wii U. I was gonna say, like, if you ported the top eight or nine games from Wii U over,

you would have a skill line. And that's basically what they're doing. Yeah, like, they're bringing over, I mean, in a way, that's what Zelda is. Zelda is a Wii U game, straight up. Is it? Yeah, it's been done for, at least we think for a while. They were like, can we just,

we'll make the resolution. We'll take the resolution from 480 to 720. I mean, we, it for a while. They were like, can we just, we'll make the resolution, we'll take the resolution from 480 to 720. I mean, the Wii U was like crazy, it was like, they're like, I actually have a, I just found this totally random, I have an interview with Reggie, that we were at some round table thing I don't know, they did a showcase after the Wii U announcement, and he's like, this is gonna be HD, okay?

He's like, this is gonna HD system. It's like, what is gonna be HD, okay? He's like, this is gonna HD system. It's like, what the fuck are you talking about? It's like, this is like 2013 or something. As if that's a big deal. Yeah, it's like, we made an HD, because remember, it was like a thing with the Wii. People are like, this is ridiculous. It's like, yeah.

So I think the problem with the, I think there was a handful of problems with the Wii. One, it was this, middle of the road, nonsense compromise for a tablet. We want a tablet, but it's actually just a screen that needs to be wirelessly connected to this console. Right. It never made sense to anybody.

I think your average user, you give them that thing to say, oh, it's a tablet and you say, yeah, but you can't go in your kitchen with it, sorry. Like, it was a weird, really close. So where do you, it had a, it was a big DS. It was a big, it had not really. Well, so that It had a, it was a big DS. It had not really. Well, so that's not true. Another thing that they really failed at,

it had a resistive touchscreen like a DS. But one of the biggest things that they failed to do, which they didn't acknowledge until years later, was that it provided a unique input mechanism, which is a screen in your hand, and a screen on the TV. You get a people playing that game here, and a different game here,

asynchronous games, right? Or asymmetrical. I mean except for they never made asymmetrical games like They they just used it so you would be able to put what's on the screen on your handheld advice for right? Right Which sort of obvious the purpose of the system you can't take it very far So why do you want to put on the handheld like it didn't make a lot of sense? Well, it's really cool for zombie you. It was like, That was a good idea. The zombie you had to like deal with things

that would have been on your person while you were like zombies were coming after you. And it's like, yeah, that's what it would be like. You'd have a backpack with shit in it. You're like, my gun's in my backpack. I gotta get it. I gotta get it. How do I get it?

So the zombies are coming. And that fucking boom, they're on you. So that's sort of how Zelda was supposed to be, breath of the wild, except for, that's how Zelda was supposed to be, breath of the wild, except for, that's how Zelda was when they showed off E3 last year, but now that it's out for Switch, the Wii U version has basically become like the Switch version.

It is just an empty screen you play on a TV and if you want, you could put a tablet. If you're inventory in there. No, we're used to. They took it all off to match the Switch version. So I can't believe they're even supporting the Wii U. If I were them, I'd just be like, that's the last game. And it's the only reason they're even releasing

that game for Wii U is because they announced it for Wii U like four years ago. So you were sorry. And also, us Wii U owners have been trampled to death for several years. Have you still have your Wii U plugged in? I mean, I'm plugged mine like two years ago. I asked broke six months after having it,

and it was a hundred dollars to fix it so we never did. I'm just sitting there. Yeah. Or a testament to the high build quality. I just unplugged my Wii U though that I took up the switch. What are you playing on? I just had it hooked up because it's my job. You got it.

Yeah, I mean, I remembered recently, I was like, oh, I have that. Like is it a box somewhere? We moved a couple of years ago and it's like, I took it off the TV and then just put it in a box and that was it. So they had some good games. They had Mario Kart 8, which was a great Mario Kart game. They had Splatoon.

Splatoon is legit a great game. What is that? Splatoon. So Nintendo basically made a shooter. Like, the question of how can Nintendo make a shooter? Yeah, it's a third-person shooter, but yeah, they made a shooter like the question of how can Nintendo make a shooter? I mean, that's yes. Yeah, I mean, it's a third person shooter But yeah, they made a multiplayer shooter. It's the one paint. Yeah, it's doesn't interest me I'm not a baby. Do I look like a baby?

I understand what the fuck is up with Nintendo with even if you play with other people? It's fun. We play with other people. What do you play by yourself? You can play both places. My plane is all alone. Good. It's a fun game to play by yourself. I'm by myself. Okay. Well, it's coming out for the Switch. I think it's coming out with Splatoon 2, which is going to be basically Splatoon with new levels. Yeah, it's fucking, it's going to be lit AF. That's going to be so good.

I think, so here's what I'd say about Splatoon. Splatoon is, and this is also true of the Switch. What else do you say? The name is what? Splatoon. Splatoon. Splatoon. Or a Splatoon. Or you can have a Splatoon. Butatoon. Splatoon. Splatoon. Splatoon. Splatoon. Splatoon. Splatoon. Splatoon. Splatoon. Splatoon. Splatoon. Splatoon. Splatoon. Splatoon. Splatoon. Splatoon. Splatoon. Splatoon. Splatoon. Splatoon. Splatoon. Splatoon. Splatoon. Splatoon. Splatoon. Splatoon. Splatoon. Splatoon. Splatoon. Splatoon. Splatoon. Splatoon. Splatoon. Splatoon. Splatoon. Splatoon. Splatoon. Splatoon. Splatoon. Splatoon. Splatoon. Splatoon. Splatoon. Splatoon. Splatoon. Splatoon. Splatoon. Splatoon. Splatoon. Splatoon. Splatoon. Splatoon. Splatoon. Splatoon. Splatoon. Splatoon. Splatoon. Splatoon. Splatoon. Splatoon. Splatoon. Splatoon. Splatoon. Splatoon. Splatoon. Splatoon. Splatoon. Splatoon. Splatoon. Splatoon. Splatoon. Splatoon. Splatoon. Splatoon. Splatoon. Splatoon. Splatoon. Splatoon. Splatoon. Splatoon. Splatoon. Splatoon. Splatoon. Splatoon. Splatoon. Splatoon. Splatoon. Splatoon. Splatoon. Splatoon. Splatoon. Splatoon. Splatoon. Splatoon. Splatoon. Splatoon. Splatoon. Splatoon. Splatoon. Splatoon. Splatoon. Splatoon. Splatoon. Splatoon. Splatoon. Splatoon. Splatoon. Splatoon. Splatoon. Splatoon. Splatoon. Splatoon. Splatoon. Splatoon. Splatoon. Splatoon. Splatoon. Splatoon. Splatoon. Splatoon. Splatoon. Splatoon. Splatoon. Splatoon. Splatoon. Splatoon. Splatoon. Splatoon. Splatoon. Splatoon. Splatoon. Splatoon. Splatoon. Splatoon. Splatoon. Splatoon. Splatoon. Splatoon. Splatoon. Splatoon. Splatoon. Splatoon. Splatoon. Splatoon. Splatoon. Splatoon kind of younger tribe of Nintendo designers. And it has a sort of youthful vigor

that a lot of Nintendo games don't have. It has a sort of like counter culture aesthetic. Mm-hmm. It's sort of new. It's sort of new rave. Yeah, it's like, it looks really cool. It's got like a great identity and a great style. It's a lot of fun to play.

It's like, it's their Overwatch. Yeah, I mean, it is. They made a very fun competitive shooter that is non-violent and it's like very well balanced and it's just a really smart. So how do you win in that game? You cover the space, you're spraying a gun, you're spraying ink, because you're squid onto the ground.

Oh, of course. And you're basically kind of outfits, so you can walk around. You can jump into the ink and swim in it. You can't? No, really. Wow, that's pretty cool. Right, I'm so excited.

But the point is, you're covering the level. And so there's that also, it creates, not only you're not shooting other people, but you're creating a visual indicator of who's winning. Is there more yellow ink or purple ink? And like, which side are you on? You seem excited about it. It's a really good game.

And nobody played it because nobody had, were you? How the shit's on were you? It was, yeah, it's an Italian. And since I'm in Italy, it's a D. game and it nobody played it because nobody had We you and if they had you it was yeah It's a great and since we had a yes version right they didn't play it nope and um and the multiplayer on We you was weird and broken and it's a multiplayer game so yeah, we you had a had a Little thing yet to put on your TV right. Yeah, only if you want to use we modes, so you didn't have to use it Okay, I remember I just remember that fucking thin wire. Yeah.

It's like a sticker is on it. It's like always, it's like wrapped around something. You're like trying to get your remote. And it's like the wire from the bars on everything again. It's like Spider-Man's webs. The way you itself feels like Fisher Price, my first ever. Yeah, it's a little like a, so John said it's a flotation device.

So here's the thing about, it's a fry float actually. Here's the thing about Switch. Switch is a real piece of consumer electronics. Like it feels good. I'll tell you what's cool with those little controllers. I think, I mean, Here's my first,

can I say my first, sorry, go ahead. Yeah, where are you gonna say? I was gonna say, it's just, it's almost the first time, you know, even like some of the 3DSs that have some nicer features or like the new 3DS like feels better, it's still like a low-res screen. It's still, like they still like,

it's a toy for babies. Even if even the better built ones. I can't speak, I'm wearing the stupid eye-hows in shade, I don't know. Dude, I ain't fucking kidding. I don't know if you're not one of those right in my pocket here. What is it, you guys are, sorry to the listener at home,

they're the little Pokemon buttons. What is it? You point at the Pokemon buttons. So that you don't have to take your phone out to catch your mons. You can just catch your mons. From hitting the buttons. What happened to you?

By the way, I'm sorry, I don't want to be the old guy, but when you catch all the mons, then what, when you catch all the Pokemon. Then you find true and light. Yeah, I know, I know. Then you love yourself. Then you're a good person.

Josh, how do you see? I see these people walking around. I caught catching catching the mall. Incredible. I felt in Dorphin Rush. You could never understand. Really? That's true. All right, we should take a break. And then I want to, we were, I just said, I just about to talk about, I want to talk about some of my favorite features of the Switch. I know, I'm, listen, if you don't care about video games, I sure this is very boring, but I'm loving this conversation. So we're going to take a break. We'll be right back with more Christopher Grant of Polygon and also of Reality.

And so just stick around. We all rely on technology like computers, phones, and tablets on a daily basis. They're powerful tools and an essential part of our lives. But all that screen time can put a strain on your precious, beautiful eyes and lead to headaches, blurred vision and increased sensitivity to light. Thankfully, Crisol, no glare lenses protect your eyes from the glare of digital screens and the harmful effects of blue violet light, helping to safeguard them for potential damage. Crisol lenses also give you the clearest vision possible by offering resistance to scratches and smudges.

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But don't take my word for it because I'm a pathological liar and I can't be trusted. Try out the sandbox and see for yourself at braintreepayments.com slash tomorrow. We're back with Chris Grant, as I said previously a great person and a human being also. How about those products, huh? They sound great. Oh, all of the things that we just heard about on the sponsor side, crushing it. Yeah. Like I, this is, I need a Gary V. Instagram to describe how much they're crushing it. Um, that's an in joke for people on the internet.

Hey, you're, you're in the media, you got it. You keep fucking getting. Okay, so anyhow, uh, the switch, my favorite, here's my favorite thing about the switch. There's a mode. It has this disgusting kickstand. I think you guys wrote something about how it... Kickstand's a nightmare.

The kickstand is like, is this what it's supposed to do? You think you're breaking it? You feel like you're breaking it when you use it. You just don't use the kickstand. How can I make the kickstand so bad? I don't understand. I have a baby monitor, we'll start with that, but it's got a kickstand. How can I make the kickstand so bad? I don't understand. It's like, I have a baby monitor. We'll start with that, but it's got a kickstand.

It works pretty well. The baby monitor was like a hundred bucks. It's by some company called Infant Optics. It's a garbage heap of a company from Shenzhen. The kickstand unlike a five by seven photo frame is a polar quality that you get on your average long green photo frame. It's like a thing that feels like they 3D printed

as an afterthought. It's like, they're like, we want it. Oh, we forgot. I a kickstand technically. Apparently also the angle is like, it's like this. What is it? What is it? It's like, it's like, we, okay, it can hold it up,

but not that well in the table. You should the table it by dare you. You should have the table, it's gonna fall over 100%. I feel like the instructions basically say, here's how he just kicks in, snap it off the back. Why do you have actually ripped the thing off? It's like, well, it's got a lock, right? It's gonna lock somewhere.

There's an adjustment, can I get? It's like, okay, but you can, okay, you pop up, you got your little switch screen. Yeah. Which by the way, you got your little switch screen, which by the way, I wanna say has a fan, the fucking switch body has a fan, this sort of eventing. And it's kinda, it's a beefy, you know. Is it really better than the iPhone 7?

Only a little bit. I've never seen, again, this is good as old on the iPhone. I was gonna say, it's completely unoptimized and it does look gorgeous. No, it's not as incredible, but okay anyhow, so you take your little, take your little, by the way, battery life, incredible battery life.

I play like Zelda for 10 minutes. It's like you have 60%, I'm like 10 more minutes, it's like you've got 40%. I'm like all right. We were like, we were going to stop fully to rally, this is a battery driven machine. We were getting about two and a half hours for Zelda. Yeah, that's not bad.

That chart, that chart's pretty close to that. That is on the low end of the system. If you're using something that doesn't spin up those fans, it goes longer. Here's the thing, how the fuck, I'm sorry. How do the fuck do they not have Netflix or Hulu? I'm like, give me a fucking break. I'm like, this is so great.

I'm in bed. It's a six inch screen. No, it's like, it's in that insane. It's like, let me watch Showtime or HBO or something. So the 3DS has Netflix. On its 320 by 240 screen, that's a postage. That's where I watch all my airfaces on the DS. I think that like, oh my longmyer is going to that. I think what's the one with the, it's very dark bloodline.

Yeah, I like that because on the low resolution screen, you can barely make it. I'll play some new Mario and then just switch to Narcos and just get into it. Get into Pablo. Some sense eight right after you've been in a super Mario world. Sense eight, sorry, totally.

So I try Sense eight is full of, is there a lot of sex in that? Yes. Okay, so it was like, oh, I heard how it started us, listen to how it started the other day. And they were like, howard, you'd like Sense eight. I'm like, why would Howard like Sense eight? I was like, oh, I heard on Howard Stern as Lizard Howard, so the other day, and they were like, Howard, you'd like sense eight. I'm like, why would Howard like sense eight?

I was like, it must be a sex thing. Yeah. Yeah. Okay, I gotta check that out. So, so the things, I think the switch to me is actually, I mean, it's, it's, it's classic Nintendo, right? Like, they always want to, you know, blue ocean it, right? Stay away from the sort of red ocean blood bath

of Sony versus Microsoft. Stay away from the things that people want. I mean, but I think that like, if you look at the weed, the huge monstrous success of the weed is identifying things that people didn't know they wanted. And so, okay, sure, but where a little, I mean, we got, but like, we don't know what you don't know.

And so for Nintendo, they're sort of strategy of like, you know, zagging on this stuff is, I think a really clever strategy. And for them, it also includes, I mean, the 3DS is getting along in the tooth. Are you think it's an eight-bit processor or something? It's like, it's like the Masega master system. And the ins, the ins, the insides of that are like, it's, they are like, what do we do with all these old Genesis consoles

that we didn't sell? They said that they wanted to, I mean, it's effectively a beefed up DS, right? But like, DS is a very old system. It's 12 years old now, so. Three DS, that out of this grade, 3D functions that everybody loves. Zero people use.

It uses your, definitely not just sliding nothing down. I don't know how I would play the game if I couldn't be able to migrate 3DS that out of this grade 3D function. It's a zero-people use. It uses your own. Definitely not just sliding nothing down. I don't know how I would play the game if I couldn't be having to migrate my life away. It makes Super Mario better is when you're throwing up on like it. Yeah.

He was thinking, they don't know what the fuck they're doing. Isn't that the truth? No, I think that there's certain things that they're really good at. The 3DS never found the success of the DS and it's been kind of shrinking since then. When they launched the DS, they still had the Game Boy line, Game Boy Advance,

and they had the Game Cube. And so the DS, they called it a third pillar. They were gonna launch a new hardware platform. They weren't sure that this was gonna replace either, but maybe it was just gonna be a new supplemental form of revenue. And then like, spoiler alert, it sold a lot.

They killed the game boy line, DS forever. And for me, the switch is kind of like a third pillar, in this, it's like a second pillar, really. Right, you have third pillar to watch. It's like one pillar. So DS is, Well, so they keep two pillars now. And they've sort of had two pillars for a long time.

When they had a third pillar, they killed the second so they went back to two. It was DS and then we, Two New Pillars, Three DS and Wii U. So they had a third pillar, they killed the second, so they went back to two. It was DS, and then we... Two pillars. Three DS and we you. So they keep two pillars around. And my gut says that the two pillars going forward, they're going to collapse their console and portable business into one. So the three DS goes away, the we you becomes the switch, and the switch is now your home console and your portable console.

Well, that's exactly what it is. Correct. You just described the product. But the second pillar. But that's not what they're saying. They're acting like Pokemon's going to come out again. They are saying that it is the home console, and the 3DS is still a viable form. But who has 12 games on their Switch that they like

and then picks up a 3DS? OK, first off, there aren't 12 games. So I'm saying when you win, when you have them, when you have them, correct. They have for sale. Yeah. For sale now in the store nine get no six games and

Coming to nine games for sale and coming soon. There's three games in their fucking store. It is like it's like The PS4 had nothing but that shit. Yeah, they had fucking 40 games Okay, and they were all the different genres of games. It's like a puzzle game I'll think about a lot more an action game. I'll find it FPS. I don't remember any. Okay. I'm not going to say that. No, no, no, just anything you could expect from a they aren't going to get. So you brought zombie. Oh, sorry. I'm sorry. I'm not going to get third party support again by default. They have to earn it. Oh, Nintendo's dead. I disagree. I disagree. The dead in the water. I disagree. I think here's what they're doing. They're to earn it. Oh, Nintendo's dead. They're dead. I disagree. They're dead in the water.

I disagree. I think here's what they're doing. They're going to do. So Nintendo keep in mind at least owned part of the summers. And already one of gaming's biggest phenomenon of all time. What is that? Pokemon Go. Yeah, on a fucking phone.

So in their switch. So the second pillar is the phone. Okay. The phone. Totally cop. Get that. Their new profit center is the phone. Okay, totally cop, get that. Their new profit center is the phone probably. But guess what else the switch does? It's also a touchscreen device that can play those same games. But if you have a phone, if you have a iPhone 7 Plus,

do you need a couple more inches on the switch? Do you want to play Zelda on your iPhone? No, no. It's all your camera attachment, you get to play Zelda on your iPhone? No. No. It's only a controller attachment. You get to snap it on. Zero people are going to do that.

I mean, part of like this is the whole idea of consoles is that they standardize things and make it easy to adopt and to clip into. And so the switch, I think, so here's what the switch, I think does really well. From a strategic standpoint, it's really smart to collapse those businesses and to kind of create two new pillars, which is your console business,

both handheld and home, and the fun business, which is your console business, both handheld and home, and the fun business, which is a fun and only different thing. It's actually not even your marketplace. So you have to exist on the other side of the business. Right, I do feel this. The jumping off, you're gonna jump off from the DS to the switch. Like that's the transition.

But also from a first party development platform, it focuses their effort. It keeps them from distracting themselves between these two fundamentally different product linings, and they could focus on making switch games. Some switch games are gonna be very portable focus, some switch games are gonna be very home game focus, like Zelda.

But they actually, they have a clear vision, and Nintendo has had a clear vision a long time. Really? I mean, well like Smash Brothers, they made it worse because they wanted to make a 3DS version, so the Wii U version was kind, like Smash Brothers, they made it worse because they wanted to make a 3DS version. So the Wii U version was kind of shitty. And then they made a 3DS version that wasn't so great. Like if they had one game, they could make like one triple, like, great Smash Brothers game. Put all your focus on the Smash Brothers game.

I can't imagine being excited about Smash Brothers. So, but there's tons of people. Smash Brothers can play. Why do people like Smash Brothers? It's fun. It's tons of people. Smash Bros is- Why do people like Smash Brothers? It's fun. It's played competitively. I don't think I see. I guess if you don't have friends, that's the problem. If you- Dear, listen if you can't see my eyes at a roll.

You should have everything I did roll. You should have everything I did roll. From 92 to like 2003, you just- It's garbage, too. I'm all- You know, if you have to play with another person, how good can it be? People are fucking interesting.

Games are supposed to be the distraction from people. This is Josh's sex talk. Don't force me. So if you have to play with another person, how good can it be? People are fucking interesting. Games are supposed to be the distraction from people. This is Josh's sex talk. Don't force me. Don't force me to have to interact with human beings. That's the whole reason games weren't there. Oh, you're gonna love the switch because there's no online. No, I don't.

Oh, so hold on. Let's go to this. I know all about that. I think the switch is actually a very clever strategy, clever vision. I think it's a nice piece of hardware. I think where it really falls on the case. That's the case then.

For me, except for the case in here. Oh wait, I didn't tell you, sorry, go ahead. I think where it falls on its face for me is that Nintendo in 2017, fundamentally, absolutely needs to build a platform. Yeah. And they don't know how. Well, I was like, wow, I feel like

this could be a really cool indie platform, but I don't get any, I mean, I know you said there can be stuff ported that was like gonna be a Vita, but now it's gonna be, but it doesn't feel like there's any energy around it or behind it. It's such a cool, like, I feel like what Nintendo could do is like almost like an app store situation or like almost like an iPhone situation.

Except nobody's gotten there yet. Like I agree with you. Keep in mind, so when Microsoft announced Xbox One, do you remember every Xbox is a dev kit? It never happened. Yeah, but the difference is that the switch is this like portable, but micro thing that can live kind of anywhere.

Except building platforms is really, really, really, really, really hard. And like Sony can't do it in the same way. But they're Nintendo, but they can't. Nintendo can't build a whole line system. It's been like 150 years, like they should be able to build a platform. But they can't, but like Microsoft is having trouble doing it on Xbox and Microsoft

builds nothing but software platforms. Nintendo can build entertainment software, but they don't have to build a platform and I'll give you some examples here. When they announced, I wrote a piece for Polygon. I called it on the screen. I wrote a piece for Polygon Internet. In 2012, right the week after that Nintendo event where they showed off the Wii U, I said, hey, there's actually some neat ideas in here. Here's the biggest problem. The one thing, even if they themselves acknowledge that they need to do better, they didn't talk about at all,

which was online, at all. And so there was all this stuff that was just left open and then this was two months before release and then they released the system and spoil other, they still didn't figure it out. They really are the apple of video game companies. Yeah, I mean, Apple's bad at figuring it out. Yeah, yeah, and so are they.

So for Nintendo, you just failed. I mean, for example, we, you owners, you owners like we you owners put money down and they got Like they were failed by that That's the reason that it's set up in my living room is that I feel guilty that we spent a bunch of money We didn't have because I really wanted to play those games and how much I don't play 300 or I think it was even 50 bucks a game is so long ago Here's the thing $59.59 for Zelda.

Zelda's gonna win the game in the year for most outlets. It's okay. Is it that good? It seems okay. I love it. It's the fourth highest rate of game of all time. Yeah, right now. You're the little magnet thing.

I guess that's cool. But that's like, the game, the only games that have been higher rated already. It's kind of like Zelda. It's like, hey, Link, wake up. It's like apropos of nothing. Like, you're awake now and there's some shit going down. But, but like, you just, but you just talked about Resident Evil 7,

which is a game where you're like, hey, I'm gonna go and find my girlfriend. And then she's like, hey, I'm gonna stop and you're good stories. And she's like, I'm stabbing you and you're like, hey, as opposed to the old Zelda's, we were a child, that a fairy came to you and then you went with your sword. I just, you know, we're gonna We could have us all the but for me, the idea that Nintendo doesn't have answers, I'll give you a crazy, this is some good media goss. You know some media goss?

Yes, please. That's what I live for. So just days before the review embargo, the review embargo was Wednesday morning last week. Hey Nintendo, how does all this stuff work? Because we're about to write a review and publish it on our internet website. And this day one patch isn't live. We actually can't tell our readers how some of these major functions of your console work.

Such as online. Oh yeah. Period. Nintendo's answer was, hey, we're not, we have nothing to announce right now. That, guys, the review, we're gonna write a review. So we review the Virgil review and get your review, Kataku Rutter review, New York Times Rutter review, every outlet on earth, the Guardian review.

Every time we review it for the New York Times. It was Jack Times. The guy, the name, the J.W. Times. He's good, He's good. He's good. Jack time. On the actual author. So they wrote, they had this opportunity, right?

This is your, they set the embargo. They could have set the embargo for release date, which is what they did for the Wii U. They set it two days early and then wouldn't answer questions about how the console worked. Yeah. And like, that's, considering one of the fundamental flaws of the Wii U was this exact problem, not

solving it for Switch, and then not even having messaging for how they have or have not solved it. Do you think that means they didn't solve it? Absolutely. I think they have not solved it. So why the fuck is this going? The online multiplayer. So Nintendo is in bad.

They're in bad air. This is their quote on friend codes. It's like, yeah, they're not great. Well, we'll see. The weirdest thing is that friend codes, so friend codes are back on stuff. All right, what are friend codes? So instead of me adding, if you don't know Josh's

gamer tag is XXX, Josh smokes 420, but smokes with the ZXX. Correct, correct, Amanda. And so I could go add Josh smokes 420 on Xbox or PSN, because you have that name on all the systems. That's correct on on switch I would add SW dash Did you did you did you did you stash more digits? Okay, it's like a phone number but really long and hard just this is Nintendo is garbage. I mean, I don't just admit this I mean, you guys are like living on some fucking fumes of nostalgia. You love

Here's the thing. Zelda when you were fucking six years old and now we're still I'm still six. You know what? Here's the thing. I think you need to everybody needs to wake up the Nintendo's bullshit. They haven't made a fucking good pride in ages This is a guy on the fucking tombs of nostalgia for this fucking company. They make good games And the games are great. Are they? What they don't know how to make is a big platform. You know, it's a great game. He's right.

Like, they make a frame too. You know, it's a great game. Jesus. They should be poaching people from Google to build them some kind of game. They can't just people who are like, your technology is from a billion years ago. I think that's right.

They should be. And you know what, like, oh, what's your handle? So, like, so we have a 17-digit number from our handle. That's what's going on here. I'm 42856. Yeah. And Google's like, have you tried hanging out slightly?

It's great. So here's the thing about Nintendo and Nintendo. So mad. Failure. To get this right is that they have good products. I mean, good games. They have a good piece of hardware. They have a clear vision.

And they cannot execute against it. So to that point, when the Switch was first announced, it was announced as the NX, that was their codename. Yeah. And they announced at the same time in the NX. And the NX, of course. They announced next generation. It was. Yeah, it was good. As soon as they announced the NX, they also announced a partnership with DNA, D-E-N-A, the Japanese mobile gaming giant. Sure, why not? So the analysis partnership with DNA, DNA is a company that got like, for example, Super Mario Run. Like a lot of that stuff is DNA. Me Tomo, that garbage app that asks for a great answer.

So a lot of this was like DNA, Nintendo bought a certain percentage of a company and there was like this sort of trade. DNA was supposed to deliver a lot of this expertise that Nintendo basically was saying hands in the air, like, you actually can't do this. And it was a big acknowledgement from the company at the time to say,

you know what, we are gonna fall on our sword here and say, we, which Japanese very far started to have some really racist. Yeah. But there is a lot of pride. Like the Nintendo of pride like the Nintendo thing is very prideful like they're like It's very notable for them to to say like we can't do this We need to go and make a partnership with this other company because we don't know how to make online systems I mean that's the nianctic thing is too is it's like we don't know how Google Maps works

But we want a Pokemon game. Yeah, that's also like it so the Pokemon go I think it's really confusing because that's actually the Pokemon company, which licenses Pokemon to other companies. Sure. It gets very confusing. There's a whole thing with game free and Nintendo and Pokemon company. We give that later. If you want to check out my podcast, we just definitely. Um, so check out my podcast Pokemon secrets.

Um, so, uh, it's an adult themed Pokemon podcast. I do. Yeah. Um, so for them to admit that they don't know how to do it and that they were seeking outside expertise and help, I think was really notable and gave me some hope that they understood the scope of their failure on Wii U and that they were seeking solutions to remedy it. And then as we got closer and closer to the switch launch,

and they wouldn't answer basic questions about online functionality, and then when it launched, and it launched with, let's call it remedial, online functionality. I mean, it connects to the internet. Even that. There's a YVU download game over Wi-Fi. There are some problems with that.

You can download the YVU Wi-Fi. You can't back up your save games. I mean, they have this thing they're like, let's say, they're like, take a screenshot. I'm like, screenshots are actually work really well. It's one of my nice little stuff. I know they're like, take a screenshot.

I'm like, what? So here's the thing about, they seem weirdly proud of screenshots. It's like, it's like, oh, I can just grab a screenshot. They're cool. Like, other systems let me like record fucking video of what I'm doing and post it on Twitch. Like, what the fuck are, I mean, by the way, I'm not doing that because I'm all by myself.

Here's the thing about me. I'm human. Here's the thing about me. This is maybe game press focus, but I think screenshot features really. Yeah, for you're like, oh, that's a great challenge. Grab back for the article. Yeah. So if you don't have a really web site, maybe it sounds good.

But so the thing about the download stuff, like giving example of Nintendo sort of backwards infrastructure on this, you download a bunch of games, you buy all your games digitally, it takes SDXC cards, so you blow up a bunch of games on it. It's portable, you leave it on a bus, you get robbed, whatever. You can't go get a new switch and sign into your account and get your games back. Because, do they even have infrastructure at all? go get a new switch and sign into your account and get your games back. That does right for all.

Do they even have infrastructure at all? They kind of do, but your system, your games are tied to your account, but your account can only be activated on one system at a time, and you can only deactivate it on that system. So, if you lose your system because it's portable, what I hear is this is made from people in Japan. You have to call Nintendo and they will do it, and it's a bit unclear how many times they'll do it, but if you lose it again, what if you get a new one?

So there's this whole weird thing about like how do you, how do you take care of that, and how in control of your own purchases do you feel? But we're than that, you're save games. You're 45 hours into the New Zelda, you lose your system, you call Nintendo, you're gonna switch, you download it again, everything's fine, that game's gone forever.

You don't get that save game back, there's no way to back it up off an SD card, there's no way to sync it to a cloud account. You're done, you're free starting. And that to me is like, this idea, it isn't... Yeah, how hard could it be to just index? I believe it's hard. I do. I believe that's for the phone.

But because of the save file, it's a bunch of data that tells you where you are, what you have. You're still about managing online cloud infrastructure, and then Apple has a hard time doing it. That's true. And so I believe that's hard, but that's not an excuse. Like, it's hard. They were fucking it. They were, they were, they were, they were, they were, they were, they were, they were, they were, they were, they were, they were, they were, they were, they were, they were, they were, they were, they were, they were, they were, they were, they were, they were, they were, they were, they were, they were, they were, they were, they were, they were, they were, they were, they were, they were, they were, they were, they were, they were, they were, they were, they were, they were, they were, they were, they were, they were, they were, they were, they were, they were, they were, they were, they were, they were, they were, they were, they were, they were, they were, they were, they were, they were, they were, they were, they were, they were, they were, they were, they were, they were, they were, they were, they were, they were, they were, they were, they were, they were, they were, they were, they were, they were, they were, they were, they were, they were, they were, they were, they were, they were, they were, they were, they excuse. Like it's hard. They were fucking, they were fucking out.

They were fucking out. And then you can't throw your hands up and just say, like, it'll be on an SD card, you can transfer it, it's drag and drop. But you can't transfer it. But that's what they should do. That's what they should do. Yeah, it's like, we can't do it.

It's a solution, that's great. There's like, you know, so my frustration with Nintendo is that I truly do think that they made a really cool product. It has a really clear vision. I think they make amazing games. I think that they made a really cool product. That has a really clear vision. I think they make amazing games. I think that they have a dysfunction, like a rottenness inside the company that is preventing them from accomplishing basic fucking tasks.

Basic tasks. Like backup your save states. Or like, I mean, I think Netflix thing is telling, Netflix is on everything. Netflix is on your fucking toilet. No, if you, to me, I think this thing is telling. Netflix is on everything. Netflix is on your fucking toilet. Like, to me, I was like, I actually was like, oh, you know what, actually,

this would be a great reading device because of the size. Yeah, or a Kindle app or something. I was like, this could totally be the kind of, it's like, okay, I get all this cool game functionality, but then I can like watch movies on it, or like read on it, or not like, it doesn't be like full app functionality, but just like a little bit. or like read on it. Not like, it doesn't have to be like full app functionality,

but just like a little bit. There's no web browser. Oh, there's a web browser. Hidden in the, yeah, you have to. There's a web browser, but like they don't give it to you. You can get to the web browser if you go to the web. Is it built on Android? I feel like it's, I think.

Well, so it's running on, it's running on Nvidia's Tegra chip. But I think they've made their own operating system, but I'm not. So I just get a shield and basically. It's, yeah, I mean, it's a shield. But the difference is, for the shield, you get a bunch of Android parts and stuff, and on this one, you get a game of your win.

It's Zelda, but yeah, I guess so. So is it ideal that Zelda is the only game out now? To me, this entire thing feels like a big issue. No, super bomber man. There's also there's a shovel knight. There's a whole night. There's literally two different shovel knight games. They've seen fun.

No, there's a shovel knight DLC. Well, why is there a whole shovel knight version? Oh, so if I bought the $10 shovel knight, that's not the game. No, it'll be, it's standalone. But if you buy the $20 one, you get the full game. Plus that. It's not 20.

There's one that 40. Oh, okay. That's a lot of stuff. It's a good thing. It's a good thing. It's a good thing. It's a good thing. It's a good thing.

It's a good thing. It's a good thing. It's a good thing. It's a good thing. It's a good thing. It's a good thing. It's a good thing. It's a good thing.

It's a good thing. It's a good thing. It's a good thing. It's a good thing. It's a good thing. It's aita and I like this a lot of fun. Brian, we just actually had them on our Facebook video thing at GDC last week. The guy who made the game, Brian Bavrinch, you're very good. I bet you in a year, I picked up that switch and I thought Josh is going to like this in a year. I bet you in a year in a year. It's you're going to hear about how Nintendo has blown their opportunity with the switch and nobody's using it and they don't have any AAA games.

Here's what they have to do. So they've got more news coming to share. That's my favorite. This to me feels like a beta launch, right? There's a reason it's in March. Like not. Well this is the crazy thing. It's like dude, this is the fall, Christmas, what the, how the fuck do they do?

So here's why I think they've did it. I think there's a couple reasons. One, they couldn't hold Zelda anymore because we, you and I are in the world, we're like release that fucking game. So it can't contain. 100 years ago. And they also like, at some point if you're a company and you have like a,

you know, basically it's being a finished game, that's that size. Like, you want to start collecting your investment pack, like mine is still on the floor. So there's that, it's quarterly thing. There's a lot of money on where you like, let's start making some money back. Like, let's get some numbers on the books.

And it's also an acknowledgement that, you know, for things like the multiplayer, they don't know what they're doing. So the sooner they get it out, the sooner they can test and iterate. Right. Right. They have a beta version of the multiplayer. So the way multiplayer is going to work, which a lot of people think is a bad idea. I actually think this is a great idea. The way it's going to work is it's actually on your phone. So when you play multiplayer games, you'll actually do the chat and texting or communication on your phone instead of on the console. The console will do the matchmaking,

it'll talk to your phone app, and then you do it that way. That's complicated. I use Discord, I play on PC mostly, I use Discord, which is on PC, but it's also like a Slack, but for gamers, for true gamers only. Oh, okay.

So I use Discord on my phone, because it's really easy for me to say, hey, get in the Discord room that we have, we've set up our own Discord room for us and our friends. And we can, you know, we can talk there, we can communicate, we can set up a game, we can also have chat. Right.

And so they're doing this on the phone, which I actually think is smart, but it's not ready. So they're gonna release a beta version of it in the summer, which we free like a limited version of the app. And then several months. And then in the fall, the paid version of their online service will be out. I just feel like if you're Nintendo, you've been doing this for a long time, 150,000 years.

I mean, you've been, you're the oldest, most respected, most well-known company in the world. It's literally a hundred three year old company. 30 year old company in the world. It's literally a hundred three year old company. You could, you should be able to come out of the gate at full force. Like you have a problem, there are no problems. Like you've got a question, we have the answer.

Like we're fucking Nintendo. The Microsoft has done it. Sony has done it. Oh my, Microsoft. I mean, but they have, but they have like, okay, but there's some basic stuff. Now, no, no, I'm not saying like at the beginning, but now we are in 2017.

Several Microsoft's Xbox One launch in 2013 was, I'm sorry, four years ago. Yeah, but it was an absolute disaster. Okay, but still don't have a product. But that's my, but okay, but are they in around for 130 years? Are they a game, are they exclusively a game company? So okay, I'll give Microsoft like,

oh, you have all this other shit going on. You did Windows 8, whatever. I'm not giving them any credit, but I am saying Nintendo should have it buttoned up. It's funny that I am so nice. I'm defending Nintendo on this. You are defending it, too. If you talk to me, my staff, or read my byline on this site,

all I do is shit on them for making dumb decisions. Like, you think it's a smart company that just like, it's fun, I just realized that our mic stands are switch colors. Yes, they are. I like that. This is like, hey, let's play that game where you're like a paint of them just for this show. Let's play switch one, two, or the fuck the game is called

where you're like a cowboy. We're like, hey, I'm gonna shoot you a shootout. I'm not gonna add that article about like a blind woman finally playing a game. That sounds really heartwarming. Yeah, that sounds great. Here, okay, uh, hey, I'm gonna shoot you a shoot out. I'm article about like a blind woman finally playing a game. That sounds really heartwarming. You know, that sounds great. Here, okay, by the way, we need to wrap up, but you do sound like a switch of apologists

and an agenda of apologists. I understand that. But I'm, but I'm, God, I can't wait to for her. I'm a fan of whole. He's hopeful you just are shaded at this point. I'm like, if it doesn't have a Resident Evil 7, Biohazard, I'm not into this.

If I can watch Iron Fist, I'm furious. No, but I'm gonna have Bio it doesn't have a Resident Evil 7, Biohazard on it, I'm not into it. If I can't watch Iron Fist, I'm furious. No, but I'm actually... No, but I'm actually... No, but I'm actually... No, but I'm actually... Biohazard 7, Resident Evil on it. Yeah, exactly. I forgot to say my favorite thing about Switch, because we started with the kickstand,

and we went off on a... I want to know the mode, they thought this was a mode of play. Got my Switch. I'm untethered from the screen, from the main screen. From my switch down, flip the kickstand out. Pop off my controller. Roof top party. No.

I'm a solo gaming, for hands, the controllers are in each hand, and my screen's propped up on a table, so my little screen is propped up with my tiny little kickstand, and I'm just like playing a game. Zero people. Who, who, who, who? So the closest thing I can come up with my tiny little kickstand, and I'm just like playing a game. Zero people. Who, who, who, who? So the closest thing I can come up with that actually works well with that.

Yeah. It works. Cowboy game. Yeah, it works good with Mario Kart. Because you can just use like a steering wheel, with two buttons. And you can set it up. Why wouldn't you just hold it in your hands?

Because if you're playing with the second person, one person takes one joy card. Why would're playing with the second person one person takes one Tiny little screen because you're at your own rooftop party. I Had friends that just plugged the switch into the TV at a party and played Just dance and I mean it was fun. Wait, how did they plug it in? You just plug it into the thing like you take it wherever you're going you plug it into the thing, like you take it wherever you're going, you plug it into the TV and then you take the joy cons. You take the dog. Yeah, it's small. So you mean they just set it up at someone else's house. Sure, but I'm saying like it was just like a fun and it was really light and small and it was the joy cons are little things.

It was like a fucking brain that the dog. So I don't think I'm going to do that. I can bring on the power cable. Well, so for now, they had a backpack is what you're saying. You can't bring the wire because it has USB-C out on the bottom and the wire that's plugged into the switch is just HDMI. They're doing some translation. There's a power cable. Yeah, there's a USB-C power cable. So, in the back of the switch dock, there's USB-C power. And HDMI. Out of the bottom of the switch is just USB-C. Correct. So they are doing a conversion, right, to feed both sources there. If you hook up a USB-C to HDMI converter to the bottom of the switch, it will not work. They're doing some kind of like Nintendo specific variant of... Is there hardware in the dock?

There's gotta be some little chip. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Right. So presumably there will be third party USB-C to HDMI cables. No, yeah, yeah. Right. So presumably there will be third party, USB-C to HDMI cables. No, that's interesting. You're just like, okay, now that's interesting. If you can like, throw out,

you can switch, you know, grab the controllers, everybody has, each person has one. Intro front house, you stick it, you have a little adapter with you. That's fucking cool.

But it didn't do that. Not yet. Again, take the dog. Again, it's a beta. Well, you're right. He's like, look. I don't know, the dog is like, what? It's a paperback book. It's cool. There was a moment where beta. Lou Ryan, he's like, look. I don't know, the doc is like, what?

It's the size of a paperback book. It's cool. There was a moment where Doc was less than a copy of Game of Thrones. When I got it, when I got it, I was like, this is a cool idea. And then I was like, oh, there's definitely nothing I can do with it right now. Be please, Alda. You like, you like Skyrim?

She likes Skyrim? No, really, not a big fan. Okay. I'll like, fall out. You like, fall out. Where's fall out? But if you like open-world games, it's like a lot of fun. I love open-world games, except be fall out. No, fall out. You're like, fall out. Where's fall out? But if you like open world games, it's like a lot of fun. I love open world games, except,

you should find out though. Except he fights like, he fights the sort of. He fights the sort of. Like he's actually battling. Josh, your problem is that the art design is, I mean, it's very beautiful, but also some of it's like, he's fighting a beanie baby crab.

There's time. There's only his into games if he like shoots zombies in the deck. Basically, if there's like, if there's games if he like shoots zombies in the deck. Basically. If there's like actual 3D model dicks to be solved. Top top five games with removable dicks that you can shoot with detachable penises. Top five games, Resident Evil 4,

Fallout 3, Rock Man 2, just kidding. I don't know if I have. No, what are your top five games? Okay, then we answer rap. What are your top five? three Rockman to just kidding No, what are your top five games? Okay, then we have your rap. What are your top five go right now? Tell you my my number one game I'm sure is Legend of Zelda breath of no Whatever it's all wind of doom. Did you play doom the reboot last year? No, I don't like straight up FPS I don't go it's the most FPS fucking FPS ever made you know It's great is that wolf and Steinymery, but that's fucking amazing. I'm very excited about the sequel. Very good.

Doom is same publisher, but that's the fucking story, right? It's just you should. You grew an alien spacecraft. Here's the story. Shoot the fucking demon. Yeah, I don't care about that shit. I'm not into it. I want to know why I'm shooting the demon.

You know, yes, I do. I want to know what's my motivation. Shoot him. I need to know is my girlfriend who may or may not be possessed. So you like your porn with a story is what you're throwing? I like, I like 90 units of build up and then a very graphic sexy.

Just like real quick though. Yeah, he's like, like 30 seconds and I'm just out. All right, go ahead. Doom. I was just about to do. Doom, Doom All right, go ahead. Doom. That was a good one. Tim, Tim, Tim. Zelda, Breath of the Ancients or whatever it's called. What is it called?

Breath of the Wild. Breath of the Wild. Okay. People are gonna be so mad. You know what I said? When I said the switch looks stupid, when the trailer came out, people were like, you fucking piece of shit,

I'll kill you. Like, there's so, people stand so hard for the switch to out of control. Like, I seriously don't understand. Welcome to my job, man. You got a whole ton. For Nintendo, it's like, you know what? Don't be a Legion to a fucking brand B.

It's a Legion to yourself. It's a giant commit, can't figure out how to make a sea of games work. It doesn't know how to get Netflix to do an app for them. Yeah. Netflix is like, oh, hey, no name TV company. You got a smart TV app. We'll make a Netflix app for you.

They're like, Blinif? It's like, oh, you need the Z-Dith offshoot that got sold to this Korean, this North Korean offshoot of Z-Dith, Blinif. Do you want to do Netflix, no problem, here you go. Yeah, easy. You want to put like, spyware on there, okay? Didn't know kid do Netflix.

Yeah, somehow. They don't have Netflix on here, it's a man. They don't have FX now. I don't know kid do Netflix. Yeah, so they don't have Netflix on here. It's a matter of affects now. It's a matter of affects now. So I feel like I have a million places to watch Netflix. I don't really care. Here's the, I don't have a tablet on the go. What about on the moon?

I don't have this in my own phone or in your tablet and your other game consoles and your TV. Give it to six inch screen. It's so perfect for watching. If bigger than my phone. It's so good for watching movies. I guess. No, I feel like I have my phone with me. This is called your phone's a little denial is what we're experiencing right here people

Or just like I don't need it. Here's where I'm like hindle doesn't play Netflix like my e reader doesn't I don't think people that's like iPhone people it's like when there was no copy and paste like who needs coffee and piss That's stupid. You don't need that feature. It's like, you're just saying that because they didn't give it to you and you're just a, sort of, you're just a fucking, you're just a fanboy. All right, anyhow, I gotta write, I gotta write, we're gonna have,

oh, okay Chris, thank you for first off, I just wanna say, you've just listened to me berate you. I feel like about the switch. And you've turned it, we need to get to talk about Trump at all. I was just like, I wanna zombie you too, it comes out. I was just wondering how you want to. Your cover on ZombieU2 comes out. Okay, they really ZombieU2, I'm fucking in Switch,

new favorite console. I'm actually like, I think what I'm so upset about is I'm like, this is cool. Why don't you do something with it? I think so here's the right response for Switch. That's my anger. Here's what it's not for Switch. And this is this is the vision idea.

You had a great vision, you made a cool product. How did you fuck up so much of it? You idiots? Yeah, it's like I want to love it But you're making me hate it. Okay, you know what it's funny for all the for all the back and forth We are on the exact same age. Are we yeah, we're actually I mean I think the Zelda games really impressive, but I'm just like one game is not does not assist them make They'll have more games later and like you know, but it's just's always like that with them. Yeah, no, you're right. I want to know. I want to know.

The whole time we just found out. Incredible. It's like we had like a rough first date and at the end of it, it was like, actually, you want to come home? Really into each other. It's great. Turns out, it worked out perfectly.

So let me just say, oh, and I should just say this, we were talking about it before we started. I mean, Polygon, great. My, of course, my favorite games website on the internet. It goes more than just games, but also employees the Macro Royes, at least two of the seven, Justin and Griffin.

They had all the names with this end sound, is that the idea? And there's Travis, who's. But he doesn't count. But Chris is in charge of those guys. They're very funny dudes. Chris's can make them do whatever he wants. I can at least try.

And they write, what's the last thing that Justin are gifting us? So if you wanna check out, if you wanna get some good Macroi flavor. Yeah. Well number one, they have a new TV show on C. Well, I just, I don't wanna take away from Polygon because they have a lot of projects.

Yeah, but don't watch that. No, no, no. Go to youtube.com. YouTube. Well, I just, you know, I don't want to take away from polygon because they have a lot of projects. But don't watch that. No, no, no. Go to youtube.com, youtube.com slash polygon. Watch out. Watch monster factory. So is this monster factory is what everybody was talking about. John Lagen-Marcino who has maybe disappeared.

He's gone. Still in the room. Still in the room. Incredible. With saying this is the funny, who said this is the funniest thing on the internet? John did. I've never seen monster factory. Can you, Chris, can you tell me a little bit,

and this is a polygon product? Tell me about it. Tell me about it. Okay, so Monster Factory, Justin Griffin, I use character creators in games. We're looking at Black Desert online. This is the best part. What game is this? I can't tell. This is obviously Bart Simpson. Starting in Black Desert, it's an exact replica of Bart Simpson. Looks just like a Nazi. starring in black shows, it's an exact replica of Bar Simpson looks just like a Nazi. So they use character, monster factories, the name of the two, make characters, they joke about them, they call them their beautiful creations, and then they take them into games, and they mess around with stuff. So this is, you know, it's funny, it's like, this is to me, like, I always get a new game.

This is to me like I always get a new game. I'm sorry if you can see we should add some visuals to the post when this goes up. She said people know. That's so good. Whatever I get to do, Gabe with one of these character generators. Laura's like where you know she's always like watching me play. She's like are you she check she gets so mad because I'll be like an hour on the nose. You know, I try to make all the characters are exactly like me, so do it T.

All these things start with them like with a noble idea. We're gonna make this. And then it's just like they get frustrated and they're like, fuck it. You know what, like the unofficial motto of monster factor is no middle sliders, right? Like every slider to an extreme.

It's just like, how big can you make the nose? How asymmetrical can you make the face? This is, I have to say, I mean, I am legitimately at hysterics over what I'm looking at right now. It's very disturbing. Monster factor is like the time. Yeah. Anyhow, so I was just going to point out that Paul Gunn has many diverse products, including, but not limited to the Michael Royce, who else have a TV show and some other stuff.

We also did big, big 35,000 word. Oh, that's okay. We do a 35,000 word or a Final Fantasy VII oral history. If you saw that. I did not, didn't see that. I'm not busy, man, okay. I'm a jet set in traveling. If you like Final Fantasy VII and you wanna hear

all about how it got made and how it went from Nintendo to PlayStation, check it out. Okay, so anyhow, Chris Grant, you can find him on polygon.com. He's also a human being in reality. Yeah, find me at my home. If you're in Philadelphia, stop by.

I've lost my voice at my home and say, Chris Grant, you find him on polygon.com. He's also a human being in the world. Uh, so you can go to Philadelphia and arrive at his house and he loves surprise visits. Mm-hmm. Uh, his family loves surprise visits, so be sure to do that if you're ever in the Philadelphia region. Uh, and, uh, Chris, thank you so much for doing this.

Thanks Josh. I really appreciate it. This is fun. I know you've had a long day. Oh, it's been great though. It's all building up to this. You've been taking risks all day long. I'm enjoying this this little murder cube. We're in. You guys can't see it. It's so hot and so stinky and you're very small. Very warm. We don't have a lot of money. We're

a little startup. A little baby startup. Anyhow, Chris, thanks. You got to come back when the switch has real games and like a product is act product. When it, Chris, thanks. You gotta come back when the switch has real games. Yeah. And like a product. Is that a product? I don't know. You're gonna come back and we're gonna talk about whether or not it's fulfilled its destiny. Sure.

Thank you. Well, that is our show for this week. We'll be back next week with more tomorrow. And as always, I wish you and your family the very best. Though I just have heard that your family is missing the red joy-con to their switch, which means that only little Timmy can play. you