TONTS. - Jumping in with Sammy P

Episode Date: July 6, 2021

What if the very things that make our lives difficult, make us feel like outsiders or the oddball in the room actually are the things that will make us grow, feed our creativity and ultimately help us to fly? In this episode we talk about fear and the things that hold us back. We also talk through the stories we tell ourselves and whether they are helpful or true. My guest this week Sam Peterson (Sammy P) knows this and his philosophy is to just 'jump straight in' before you think too much about it all. Sammy P is a stand up comedian, producer, podcaster and film maker. His story will surprise you and encapsulates what it means to feel the fear and bloody get on with it all anyway.Subscribe here for – tontsnewsletterYou can find me on instagram @clairetonti or at www.clairetonti.comFor more from Sam Peterson head to www.theproducerboy.com or find his podcast Confessions of the Idiots hereYou can email me with suggestions for episode topics and guests to [e-mail]. Feel free to leave me a voice memo to be included in the show.A big thank you to this wonderful team:Editing - RAW CollingsTheme Music - Avocado JunkieGraphic Design - Emma HackettPhotography - Anna RobinsonStyling - Hilary Holmes Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Hello, I'm Claire Tonti and welcome to Tonts, a podcast about feeling all of it. This week, I talked to comedian, documentary maker, producer and podcaster Sam Peterson or Sammy P. I first met Sammy at a party and he seemed just so warm and funny and full of confidence and stories. Listening to his podcasts or meeting him in person, you would never guess the story he's about to tell about his life and how he became who he is. It's a reminder that everyone has a story and you just never know what really is going on in someone else's head. I'll also say that the other reason I wanted to talk to Sam is that everything he has achieved from making docos to stand-up comedy to producing and writing has all been through sheer determination and hard work. He's self-taught

and I think is such a great example of what you can do if you rally a hell of a lot of elbow grease, put fear to the side and just get on with making it. Just make the thing, make mistakes, pick yourself up and keep going. Putting aside some of those excuses that we give ourselves about why we can't do the things that we really want to do. And the stories we tell ourselves about ourselves, that we're too shy or, I don't know, not good looking enough or not clever enough or funny enough or that we could never achieve what we really want to achieve because we just don't have the time. I think Sam is such a great example of someone who just overcomes so many things in his life to just get on with making stuff.

And I just would love you to listen to this conversation and I think remember that we're all in this together. Absolutely. And we all have a story to tell. All right. Here is Sammy P. Hello, Sammy P. Hello, Claire Tonti.

Oh, my goodness, you're here. How are you? You're good, good. Very good. I've got a coffee, got a bottle of water. Oh, my gosh, you were waiting for me. I was late. So many beverages.

I don't care at all. You have so many beverages. I don't plan to ever do anything by myself. So when I have like a time to have a time, when I have a hell of a time, when I have a coffee or anything. When I have a hell of a time, yeah. When I have a coffee or anything by myself, it's just like the most luxurious thing in the world.

Oh, mate. It's so good. It's so good. The drive here was my luxurious time alone. Yeah. And it was wonderful. Yes. I have two children.

Oh, yeah. It's like when someone cancels plans and you're like, that's so great, thank you. I know. Like someone's like, oh, I'm so sorry, I can't make it to drinks. You're like, great. Good. Excellent.

Oh, my gosh. Well, speaking of time, that's great. I'll start there. Yeah. You do so, great. Excellent. Oh, my gosh. Well, speaking of time, that's great. I'll start there. You do so many things. And I was trying to figure out how you do all the things that you do. Because you podcast and you write and you do like comedy films and a documentary. Plus you work full time in a marketing job. Yeah, I do.

That's 8 till 5.30, Monday to Friday. Yeah, yeah. So how do you do that? How do you approach time management? I always give myself really harsh deadlines, which is ridiculous when you do stuff by yourself, like because I know that I've only got a certain amount of time in a week. And so I always give myself a really harsh deadline and lock it in with someone else because I know that I won't hit it otherwise. Like I'm really good at cramming. I was always one of those people that was cramming at school. Like the test would be tomorrow and I'd be like, holy shit, I better start cramming now.

Like I was always cramming at school, always. Do you need that adrenaline? I need that adrenaline, yeah. And people always think I do a lot and always, like, you know, think that I'm just always putting out stuff. But it's just like, nah, it's just like down to the wire. Like, I know I've got to release a podcast tomorrow. Like, you know, or I know that I've got to do something.

And whether or not there's people waiting for it is another thing. Like, I don't really care about that. It's never been about that. I'm just always like, I'll disappoint myself if it doesn't come out on time. Like the podcast at least, like I know if it doesn't come out on Sunday, there will be people. It comes out every Sunday. Where is it?

You know, because, you know, people expect that sort of stuff. But when you're making like a film or you're making like a thing, it is so hard because you don't have anyone calling up and saying, where is it? Yeah. You know, which you have in a normal job. You have people going, well, where the hell is it? No one's going, I want to see that four hour cut of your comedy film. Like no one's saying that.

So it's me going, well, I know I've locked in with a friend to show them a bit of it. So I know that it has to be at that point by Saturday at 12pm. Is it also that you are a really hard taskmaster in your head? In my head, in my head, yeah, yeah. Do you have an inner critic? Yeah, I do. I do have an inner critic and I'm really harsh on myself and I always thought that when I started doing stand-up,

I was always like, oh, I'm my own harshest critic. And then I was like, oh, no, there's some much meaner people out there. I remember once a friend of mine was like, I was doing a stand-up show and someone came up after it and she interrupted a group of my friends to walk up to me and she said, I just want to let you know, I did not find you funny at all. And I was like, I find that very hard to believe. And I like turned back and started talking to my friends. And I was like, well, one of my friends was like, oh, does that happen all the time? It's like, well, yeah, people, people, people can be assholes. There are a lot of assholes out there, but I'm way harsher on myself than that person's going to be. Like, I hold myself accountable for everything. And, you know, I swim four times a week just because I go,

you have to, There's no option. There's no choice. You have to do it. And no one is saying you have to do that. It's just you and you. It's just me. It's just me. You've just got like a real asshole in your head.

Yeah, yeah, yeah. It's going, you have to actually do that. But I'm way more critical on what I do week to week than anyone else. Like if my diary's not full, I'm just saying to myself, you've really done yourself a disservice this week. You've let the team down, Sammy. What the bloody hell are you doing? Team Sammy has let him. Get in the pool.

Get in the pool? What are you doing? You want to train for the Olympics or not? Yeah, exactly. And if you're not in the Olympics, well, you're shit, mate. You're shit, yeah. You can't live up to that. Yeah.

But I do have a very harsh critic in my head. Where do you think that comes from? I think it, I think it comes not to get too deep, but a bit of feeling of not being good enough. You know, there was always a thing when I was growing up, like I was born with facial palsy. And so I always, yeah, it wasn't a choice. But, but, you know, so I was born with that and so I always kind of felt self-conscious around people, like always just felt self-conscious. And when you go to, you know, I grew up in the country and kids can be mean about that sort of stuff, you know.

That might be surprising but kids can be mean. Yeah. And so I was always one step ahead of all the bullies. So I was always one step ahead of everybody, like, because you've got to think on your feet real quick. You've got to be like, you know, you've got to make the joke before they make the joke. Make fun of yourself before everyone else does.

Yeah, before anyone else gets in with the jab. So you're like, I'll go with the Grand Slam straight away and then they've got nothing. What have you got now? So, you know, I was always doing that. And then as I started doing things and, you know, I got interested in, like, film and then just started loving comedy, and, you know, I got interested in like film and then just started loving comedy, like, you know, loving comedy.

And then I would just write stuff just by myself, like pretending. I'd write plays. I'd write anything I could and everything would go in the bin. Like everything was like, well, that's not good enough. That's never going to be. Start again. Start again. Start again, kid.

Yeah. Yeah, like, yeah, it was always, it was always like, because I already felt self-conscious and then I didn't, like I had a dysfunctional family dynamic, I was always, I always felt this pressure to work and be better because I don't think, I didn't have that, I had a little bit of support, but my brother is a drug addict and that was quite a tumultuous home life. And so I always wanted to get out.

Is he older than you? He's older than me, yeah, yeah. So it was like that thing of being homesick when you're at home so you've got nowhere to go. So I would like be 15 years old getting on a bus and going up to the city because I'd arranged to film a sketch with Glenn Robbins, you know, and so I would be filming a sketch. I'd go, well, my friends, we get a bus up from Melbourne and there was a bus at 6am, 9am and 6pm.

They were the only buses that went to Melbourne. Wow. Where did you go up? Phillip Island. Phillip Island. Yeah. So it was like, yeah, you only had those buses. And if you miss those, they're not waiting.

Keith is not waiting for you. No, the bus driver. No way. He's going to get to. No, the bus driver, no way. He's going to get to Melbourne. He can't get there quick enough. So I was always like, well, I've organised to film a sketch with Glenn Robbins or Bob Franklin or all these comedy heroes of mine that, you know, I was just relentless in reaching out to them

because, you know, I was just too excited. Like I was like, you know, this is the most exciting thing and Channel 31 started to play them. So, you know, I was like 15 years old meeting all of these heroes. You know, a lot of them I've stayed in contact with but, you know, I was, yeah, only 15, filming in the city, not thinking about anything else, like, you know, not worried about anything. About what home was going to be like.

Yeah, yeah. And it was, you know, it was that nice space of doing things and I've just kept up that weird work ethic from that age where it's like you just have to do it and I've always, you know, people have been, I think a lot of my friends who are great comedians and everything, they just don't work that much. You know, like they're geniuses. They get up and they do what they need to do and that's it. And they don't work in the same way.

Like the filipuses versus the rafter. Yeah, exactly. You know, like naturally gifted and kind of get out there. Rafter slogs it out and kind of gets over the line. Yeah. And I'm not naturally gifted. You know, and I knew that from a young age. I was like, I'm not naturally good at comedy. Like I'm not. And I knew that when I started, like, you know, it was like, I saw people like Fiona Lachlan and Judith Lucy and Greg Fleet who are naturally brilliant, you know, and it's not until you start to go,

okay, well, there's two addicts right there that, you know, Greg Fleet and Fiona, two addicts that, of course, they're just brilliant because they're geniuses in that craft. And then, you know, Greg Fleet and Fiona, two addicts that, of course, they're just brilliant because they're geniuses in that craft. And then, you know, when I got to work with Judith Lucy, which was, you know, an absolute dream come true, I found out that she works fucking hard. You know, and she gets up every day and she writes and, you know, and you see all those people like Will Anderson and people like that, who you're like, oh, they just work really hard all the time and they never stop working. And I think I'm more of one of those people than the naturally. The naturally gifted.

Yeah. But in the end I think you can often get further with that work. I mean Barack Obama says that you focus on the work. Just to quote Barack Obama. Yeah, yeah, yeah. You know, you focus on the work because that's what propels you forward in the end and you can have all the natural talent. I'm sure there's lots of people who have lots of natural talent

and are not swimming in the pool four times a week and making documentaries. General Lachlan and Meet the Heroes at 15. Yeah, but, you know, that's the thing about some people that you see all these naturally gifted people that do it. You're just like, wow, I'd love to have that. You know, whatever that is, that spark, that little thing that you're like, wow, you're a genius, like, you know, to actually look at someone.

And I mean, I think it's overused. I think that word is way overused because I know a lot of people that have been called geniuses and I'm like, I don't think they are. But there are some people that you're just like, wow, like to have that brain and to have that. To be that quick with it. That quick with it. And just kind of stumble onto a stage, particularly in comedy,

and be half cut and just create this incredible show. Whatever it is. And, you know, obviously like, you know, the geniuses as they get older, you know, they might lose a little bit of that spark they once had. But to see people when they've got it and, you know, it's so exciting to see people now that you're just like, wow, you've got it. Like you've totally got it. And I would be personally, I know I'd rather work really hard for it,

but I know that some people who, you know, who kind of rock up and they, you know, they've kind of just got out of bed and they're like, you're there and you're like, wow, that must be amazing to have that. Yeah, to have that kind of thing. I wanted to wind it back a little bit and you cannot talk about this if you don't want to. Yeah. Do you want to explain to people who don't know what facial palsy is?

Yeah. So it means that people don't have some of the nerves in their face, wherever it is. So they have a lack of nerves. So yeah, so when I was born, through the forceps that we used, I had a lot of nerve damage on the left side of my face. So it basically means when I smile, I don't get the full lift on the left side of my face. It's not numb, but I am. Lol, no. But it is like, what I was worried about was that it would droop. Like that was kind of like, you know, it would get worse over the years. But I had an operation that wasn't exactly corrective surgery,

but it was to make sure that it wouldn't get worse over time. So it's different to Bell's palsy. Bell's palsy, I think from what I know of it, is that it's often temporary and the nerves stop working for a while. But facial palsy is basically, yeah, the nerves were never working or they were damaged at a very young age. So since birth I haven't been able to smile fully. Like I just haven't been able to do that and not through lack of trying.

Because you're in comedy. Yeah, yeah, yeah. But then, yeah, and then so, yeah, just half of my face, it just doesn't work. Wow. And I always knew that, you know, for me yeah. But then, yeah, and then so, yeah, just half of my face, it just doesn't work. Wow. And I always knew that, you know, from my mum kind of, I think my mum was very good with explaining it to me and saying that, you know, it's just different.

Like it's not that it's weird or, but, you know, it makes you feel self-conscious like all the time when, you know, I'm 29 now but like, you know, before, you know, like growing up and being, you know, I'm 29 now, but like, you know, before, you know, like growing up and being, you know, in your early 20s and everything. And it sounds like I'm kind of talking about something that doesn't seem to matter that much. Like, you know, I know that people are far worse off

and I know that lots of people out there have other things. But, you know, when I was like growing up and you're just not the same as everyone else, like, you know, you feel so self-conscious because, you know, like, even if I wanted to be an actor or something, it would always be a thing. Like, it would always be an issue. Like, if I wanted to act, I'd go, oh, this character just happens to have facial palsy as well. You know, like, he's very good, but he always, his characters always have this sort of droop on one side of their face. They're a bit slanted on one side. And it was always a thing with me where it was like, oh, God. And it was always a thing with me,

where it was like, oh, God. And my mum had read a book. I remember an article about Wendy Harmer. And Wendy Harmer, amazing stand-up who started comedy in Melbourne, pretty much. Like, you know, Wendy Harmer and Greg Fleet and all these people, Anthony Morgan and all of these incredible people. And Wendy Harmer famously was born with a cleft palate. And her dad pushed her to get up in front of people from a really young age. So like got her to perform constantly. And she hated him for it. She hated him for it. But it was about having that confidence always,

like about going, you might feel different, so we just want you to get up in front of people and show them that, you know, you can be whatever you want to be. And my mum did that with me. So she made me get up and do public speaking. She made me do play. She made me do all of this stuff. And I remember times when I was so angry at her, like I didn't want to,

you know, I didn't want to do Toastmasters. You know, who would? I didn't want to go to the Rotary Club, you know. to do Toastmasters. You know, who would? I didn't want to go to the Rotary Club, you know. What's Toastmasters? Toastmasters was a real crappy, sorry, it's not a plug on this podcast. Plugging Toastmasters, that's crap. It's just public speaking. Well, yeah, people might come at you and say it's actually not.

But, yeah, it's like a Rotary Club competition where people would get up and make a speech, like a seven-minute speech. And I remember doing Toastmasters and, yes, for the, I know you didn't ask, but I did go to GIS Toastmasters, and it was, I remember once the improvised thing came out, everyone wanted to be funny. Like, you know, so it could be the most serious thing ever and you've put together this speech about, you know,

Nelson Mandela or, you know, like, you know, my hero, everyone would go, Mother Teresa. And you go, what, really? Yeah. You from Warragul and your hero is Mother Teresa? I don't think so, mate. But, you know, everyone would try and do stand-up when they could because everyone wants to be funny.

You know, it's always that thing where I think everyone thinks they're funny or at least wants to be funny, you know, everyone would try and do stand-up when they could because everyone wants to be funny. You know, it's always that thing where I think everyone thinks they're funny or at least wants to be funny, you know. And so people were like, you know, would just become so disheveled and everything else. Oh, wow. Like people, you know, once they're in Toastmasters, like, you know, they can do whatever they want. The sky's the limit.

The sky's the limit at Toastmasters. Yeah, they opened up all these options. There's their plug. They did pay me to do that. Yeah, exactly. Thank you to Toastmasters. Thank you to Toastmasters so much. Thank you very much. Crappy Toastmasters. Yeah, opened up all these options. There's their plug. They did pay me to do that. Yeah, exactly. Thank you to Toastmasters. Thank you to Toastmasters so much. Thank you very much.

Crappy Toastmasters. But then, yeah, it was like I remember my mum just pushing me to do that sort of stuff and it was like, wow, if I do it, it felt more normal. It kind of felt like an acceptance thing as sad as that sounds. It kind of felt like because a lot of my friends were like, you know, growing up in Phillip Island, surfers, you know, like it was... Very beachy.

Very beachy. Quite a blokey culture. Yeah, yeah. And, you know, I think I was just the, well, I know. I think I was an odd person. No, I was fucking odd. But they're my favourite people. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

And that's the thing. It's like, you know, I was very odd at my school, you know, and I think I was kind of the funny one at my school. But then when you come to Melbourne, you are a very small fish in a very big pond. Very small, odd kind of fish in a very massive, odd kind of pond. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And little Nemo, half his flipper doesn't really work that well. It's all not me. It's kind of an analogy. Oh,. And little Nemo, half his flipper doesn't really work that well. It's all not me.

It's kind of an analogy. Oh, Sammy P, Nemo. Nemo, we're very similar. Two of Australia's favourite icons. Yeah, we're very similar, me and Nemo. Yeah, but I think just growing up with that, it's kind of like, well, you have a very different perspective of how other people treat you rather than, you know, and I think I always just thought

of things a little bit differently because I didn't, I was always so jealous of people's smiles. And I still am. Like, you know, like one of the first things I notice about people, which is really sad, I always go, God, they've got a great smile. And it's not that I'm jealous of that person now, 29 years old, I'll go, oh, I'm so jealous of your smile. But, you know, I was always kind of a little bit

like, oh, like, I wish I had that. You know, I wish I had that because it's such an expressive thing. You know, it's something that, you know, you see someone and you smile and, you know, I've, I had to develop a personality that made people think that I was real friendly because I was like, I didn't have that smile. You know, I didn't, I couldn't greet people in that way. You know, I couldn't because it would look a bit odd, like, you know, especially when I was a lot younger as well, you know. Because I wouldn't have even really noticed now. No. And that's because like, I don't hide it, but it's, but I think after having the surgery, it's been a few years of it kind of, I guess, getting, getting stronger.

I see. Like, it's like a muscle. Yeah, it's like a muscle and, yeah, but it always is still a self-conscious thing. Like, you know, if I was to go on a date or something and, you know, it is, you know, it can be a very big thing for me to still do it. To still do it, yeah. If people don't know me or, you know, or I'm meeting people because I'm a very socially anxious person anyway. So, you know, and that comes from that.

So it's like, you know, because of my social anxiety, like I, to go to a thing with more than two people that I know, it takes me a long time to do it, which is why, you know, I always just, it's like the workaholic thing. It's like just jump now. Yeah. You know, before it's really scary. Yeah, you just have to do it.

Yeah, it's like that bungee. Someone told me about bungee jumping. They go, the moment's really scary. Yeah. You just have to do it. Yeah, it's like that bungee. Someone was telling me about bungee jumping. They go, the moment before you jump is the scariest. Ah. And once you're in, you're like, well, I'm falling. I'm falling. I'm here now. I'm falling.

It's like if I pull up, I always make sure I arrive exactly on time and I walk right into the bar or right into the event because otherwise I wouldn't go in. Ah. Yeah, and that's one of the reasons, I think, why I just put stuff out because I'm just like, well, scary now. It's going to be scary in a second. So hit upload.

Yeah. Hit send. Just do it, Sammy. Just send. Yeah, yeah. That is so interesting because I think listening to your show and having met you at a social function, I remember I met you at Dave Warnicke's house party.

As James says, his 17th birthday. His 17th birthday. God, he's so fresh-faced. He plays like an intern in your comedy film. Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. And it's just so perfect for him because he just looks so young. He's a little gorgeous, man. God, he's gorgeous.

Little big wide-eyed. But I remember meeting you there and thinking you were super funny and great and you just seemed so comfortable in your skin. And on the show, on Confessions of the Idiots, you would never know that you struggle with that. Yeah, yeah. And I think it's the people that you don't think a lot of the time

that 100% are 100% worse off. I said 100% so many times. I don't know how many percent you just go into that. Let's just be in a podcast of Sammy saying 100%. He was pretty good at math, let's just say that. I think it's the people that grapple with the worst are always the people that I'm attracted to because I'm always like, wow, you're so confident. And I've certainly been with a lot of my friends that struggle with it

and aren't as full on as I am in a... Funny and like, yeah, gregarious, is that a word? Because I guess I just always want to include people because I'm always like looking at other people like, oh, you might struggle with this. So I start bringing other people into a conversation and talking and telling stories and everything. And I remember once I was dating someone that after a party just went,

you don't have to do that. And I was like, what do you mean? They're like, you don't have to make conversation for everyone. And I was like, I know. And they were just like, you just, you brought out all of your stories. You know, like I've got five. Yeah, yeah, yeah. It was like, oh, here comes the fucking clown with his props again.

But I think because my mum always did it. My mum was like that at parties and social events. She was on a table and she was telling people stories and always such a good storyteller. And I, yeah, I think I saw that and was like, that's just how you are at things. But even though you don't feel confident to do it, you're just like, oh, I've got to be that person.

But then when, you know, if it's a thing like Dave's party, I know that the people are going to be nice. Yeah. Like, you know, when you feel safe, when you're around Dave and I'm like, well, Dave is one of my best friends and I love him and so I know that he'll surround himself with people who are lovely, you know, apart from Jess Perkins. She's the worst.

But, yeah, I think when you know that you're surrounded by really sweet, lovely people, it becomes easier as the night goes on. And especially like, you know, meeting so many different people that night as well, you know, like I hadn't met a lot of people. You know, I hadn't met you and James and, you know, there's lots of people that, you know, kind of come in and out and, you know, it takes a while sometimes to kind of feel comfortable in those surroundings, I think.

Yeah, it's so interesting. What's it like to be the brother of a drug addict? It's a big question. Quite. It just meant that my parents' focus was on him. Because he was difficult meant that I never really had a good relationship with him. It was never really an incredible relationship. I loved him, but then you start to, I think the love doesn't go

but it's like loving someone you don't know. So once the drug affected and I think he started quite early, then he started getting violent and there were just so many sort of traumatic situations that happened when I was like 15. And how old was he? He was 16, so he was only a year older than me. Oh, so he's so close in age to you. Yeah, yeah.

I think I thought he'd be a lot older. No, no, but he, yeah, so he went down a different path and, you know, I've never touched a drug in my life. You know, I've always been terrified of drugs. Me too. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I mean, shockingly, having met me. Yeah, goodness.

Goodness, no, thank you very much. I won't be having any of your pot, thank you. No, thank you. Someone once said to me, because I was saying, oh, you must have just said no when people had offered you something. I'm like, no one has ever offered me anything. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. And I don't think, and that's the thing once you get into showbiz,

oh, my God, everyone's snorting coke. Everyone's, you know, and I've just never done it. Like I've just never wanted it because I always worried about myself having a chemical imbalance that, you know, one hit of something. That's how not into drugs I am. I don't think everything's a hit. But, you know, we're going to hit another hit on our hands, everyone.

But it was like, yeah, I just thought that I might have that chemical imbalance and then all of a sudden I would go down that same path or that I would be an addict or, you know, that I would have that problem. So I've just never, yeah, I've just never wanted that to affect me in that way. But, you know, I just had the police around all the time and, you know, mum and dad had to have restraining orders and then, you know, I had to have that, you know, and you're kind of,

it's a weird existence where you just kind of, you don't want to be at home but you can't really be anywhere else because you're like 15. And so, you know, it was just a horrible environment where every night there would just be something. You know, there would be a fight, there would be something smashing, there would be, there'd just be violence. Like, you know, and you had to deal with that all the time.

It was just kind of part of your life and you couldn't really do anything about it because, you know, you couldn't. Like I tried to stand up to him a few times and it just escalated into a fight. But there wasn't really anything I could do about it, I think. Yeah. At the end of the day. What's your relationship with him like now? We don't really have think. Yeah. At the end of the date. What's your relationship with him like now?

We don't really have one. Yeah, so we did, you know, try it a little bit. But I think, yeah, he's always got a different phone and, yeah, never really, never hear from him. Yeah, or, yeah, or there might be a nice thing and then there'll be a bad thing and then, you know, so at the moment, at this present time, I don't have a relationship with him, yeah. Is that to put a boundary in, do you think?

Yeah, yeah, yeah. And I'm always drawn to addicts, you know, like, you know, I'm always drawn to addicts, you know, so I'm always like, well, I can't, I've got to start to distance myself from those sorts of people, you know, like those sorts of people that are so draining and, you know, a lot to deal with or, you know, or giving them money all the time or, you know, like those sorts of people that are so draining and, you know, a lot to deal with or, you know, or giving them money all the time or, you know, trying to help them or fix them because, yeah, I guess you can't really fix people.

You can try and so many people do try to fix people all the time but it's never, you know, it's always, it's not a pursuit. I think that you can always go with and always be pushing shit uphill. Because they really can't get there themselves until they do it themselves. Yeah, yeah. They have to want to change, don't they? And a lot of people don't. You can't do it for them.

Yeah, a lot of people just don't want help. Yeah. I loved Lady O'Loughlin. Oh, thank you. I just thought for those who don't know, you should totally go and watch it. Fiona O'Loughlin, the comedian, Sam made a documentary of her life where it kind of tracks a part of her, I guess, alcoholism? Yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah. And her comedy and really how she came to, I mean, she's brilliant. Obviously, we've talked just before. Yeah. How did that come

to be? I met Fiona when I was, I think I would have been 15 or 16, and I was at the comedy festival, and I was such a big fan because my mum was a huge Fiona Lachlan fan. Like when I was 15, Fiona was the biggest comedian in Australia, and she'd made a name for herself overseas, and she just was so brilliant. Like her gala sets were like the funniest gala sets, and, you know, I always wanted to stay out to watch Fiona on the Like her gala sets were like the funniest gala sets and, you know, I always wanted to stay out to watch Fiona on the Channel 10 gala.

And I saw her at a bar and I don't know why I was allowed in. I wasn't old enough to be in there. But I remember I had a friend with me and we were filming, we'd filmed a sketch that day with Akmal Saleh and he'd said yes to be on a Channel 31 show. So interviewed him about comedy, did a little sketch with him day with Akmal Saleh and he'd said yes to be on Channel 31 shows. So I interviewed him about comedy, did a little sketch with him and then saw Fiona and I walked up to Fiona and I was like, hi, my name's Sam, I really like comedy and I want to film a sketch with you. And her manager, who's like a really big guy, put his hand in my face

and said, we're talking to networks, we're busy. And he, yeah,, put his hand in my face and said, we're talking to networks, we're busy. And he, yeah, just put his hand in my face and I walked off and, you know, a little bit like it's. It's terrifying. Yeah, yeah, yeah, especially when you're that young as well and, you know. And, yeah, I was like walking down the town hall steps and I was real sad and then Fiona came running after me and she was like, I'm so sorry, darling. What do you want to do?

And I was like, I just want to film a sketch with you. And she goes, great. Oh, how about I meet you at the Vic Hotel in an hour? I'm doing a show now, but it'll go for an hour and then I'll meet you there. And true to her word, she finished her show and she walked down to Vic Hotel where I was with a friend and we were sitting there and we thought Fiona wasn't going to come, you know. Of course you do.

Yeah, absolutely. I wouldn't have thought either. No. Also, it's so ballsy of you to show up and just talk to her. Yeah. Amazing. And we waited and, you know, Fiona came and filmed a sketch with her and then I thought that was it.

It went on Channel 31 and then, you know, I did not win a Logie or anything that year. Snubbed again. Lost out again. Lost out again. But then, yeah, and then she stayed in contact. She called me once a week and was lovely. And then I made a documentary on her one time when I think I was 18 years old

and I made a, I followed her to a comedy show and I filmed a very short documentary on her. And that went into a film festival. It did pretty well, I think, at the time. And it was called Lady O'Loughlin. And then it wasn't until six years or so later that we had the conversation again. I was like, do you remember when I filmed that thing? And I'd love to make a proper documentary about you.

And she was like, yeah, of course. But she had also just been in a coma with a 7% chance of living and her life was, it had changed so much since then. Like, you know, her addiction was really bad and it was just like it kind of felt weird to be filming that with a really close friend. And she went to a long-term rehab and I wrote a letter to her and I was just like, I think I started with like, new letter, who dis? Of course, classic.

Clever, classic Savvy Finn. Classic. And yeah, wrote a letter to her and I was like, I really want to make that documentary. And she was like, absolutely. And I got, when she got back to Melbourne, we just started and I filmed her over three years. And it was a story about a good friend of mine who was so big, like such a big comedian and then had this really public battle with alcoholism, really public, and then had struggled, struggled, struggled and kind of found it hard to keep the career together. Through all of that, found it really hard to actually, you know, get one foot in front of the other.

And through failure and failure and failure, getting back up and doing everything she could, we, yeah, we just kept, well, yeah, it was me basically. I had started filming it. Then I took it to a friend of mine, Emma Sharp, and Emma showed it to a friend of hers, Rebecca Holt. Rebecca Holt showed it to Jonathan Brough. And then Jonathan Brough, who, you know, directed Rosehaven and, you know, he's an incredible director, an incredible person. And he just loved the story. And he didn't know who Fiona was. And he was just like, this is an incredible person on screen, like just has such a presence. Yeah.

And she does. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Genius. Yeah, and she does have such a presence. And I just started filming her and one time she was in hospital. She'd gone into hospital and she said, come and film me. And I was like, oh, my God, like do you put your documentary maker hat on, Michael Moore style, am I right?

Correct. Correct. Always Michael Moore. Louis Thore, am I right? Correct. Correct. Always Michael Moore. Louis Thoreau. Louis Thoreau. Yeah. But, yeah, do I put that hat on or do I put my friend hat on? And the friend hat wouldn't go on film.

Exactly. You know, in such a personal space. But she said on the phone that this has to be seen because it's part of it, the relapsing. And so I went to the hospital and I had my camera with me and it felt very awkward. And obviously you can't film in a hospital. So, you know, I've got a camera with me and someone's like,

do you have permission to film? And you always go, yes. And then no other questions, no further questions. I'm not taking any questions at this time. Nothing at this time, thank you. But, yeah, if you kind of go with confidence into any situation, which is always what I do, you know, you can get through anything and especially making a documentary.

Like, you know, I got kicked out of so many places filming it, but you just keep going and you just have to keep going. And you can, you know, ask permission later. Like, you know, it's always a good idea. Go, ask permission later. Don't worry about that. But then, yeah, it was like three years of making it, three years of making it and, you know, a friendship in there as well.

And then. I don't understand. Sorry, my Siri does not understand what I'm saying. I'm sorry. I thought my Siri on my Apple Watch would at least be supportive, but no, still doesn't understand what I'm talking about. You don't even have a supportive Apple Watch. No, I don't understand.

Let alone just like the person in your head. Do you know your podcast comes out tomorrow? Oh, shit. But, yeah, it was just filming and filming and filming and Jonathan was editing it and I was kind of going, I don't know if I've got anything left in me. And then also a documentary, there's no ending. That's the hardest bit is finishing something like that because, you know,

I go, oh, great, like I've got this amazing story. But it's not an amazing story if you don't have an ending. It's just a, you know, like you can't just fade to black and go, six months later, which is what I did in other things. But I've certainly done that a lot. But, you know, it's so hard. And then Fiona called me and said I've been cast in I'm a Celebrity, get me out of here.

And I was just like, oh, this is the ending because otherwise I kept saying to her, I think you might just need to die. Like I got to that conversation where I was like, I think you might just need to die because we don't have an ending. And she's like, I'll do that for you. If you get this to Khan, I will do this for you. That's the kind of friend she is. Yeah.

But, yeah, it was just like, what do we do? Like I don't know how to end it. And then when that call came, and that's why it was three years, because a lot of great stuff happened in the first year, in the first two years, but then there just wasn't an ending. And then you go, well, wow, this is falling into place. Was she just struggling with her addiction during that year? Was it?

It was. I mean, it's a lifelong thing. Yeah, yeah. But, yeah, those few years were her coming out of long-term rehab, which was, you know, I think a pretty critical time to start filming because it was the road to recovery in a very, yeah, in a very, in a very sad way. It was like, well, you know, it's, it's make or break for her now. This is the last. This is the last time. And also like, you know, in the industry it's like how many more chances

are you going to get? Like how many people, you know, how many more people are going to trust that you're okay and you're doing okay, you know. And, you know, working in a bar, being an alcoholic, like fuck. Like one of the first things that people ask you is, you know, what do you want to drink when you go anywhere? And then she's also got that added thing of people going, who's looking after the kids?

You know, because she's got five kids. And, you know, it's like, you know, no one ever asks their husband that. But, you know, but for her to be out is irresponsible. And so there's always this thing as like, you know, comedy is very male dominated. That's my opinion. I don't care. Come at me.

But, you know, it is such a male-dominated area. What's the attitudes around her, like around that space? If you're a woman who's super talented in comedy, I mean, maybe it's different now, but in your opinion, what do you think the attitude is? I just, you know, I just think it's, I think it's just a different world now. Like I'm not in the stand-up world anymore so I don't really know. But, yeah, there's just certain – it just takes all sorts of people.

Like there's people that, you know, people that still say I don't find women funny and you're like, how? Like it's so intense. Like you go, how? Most of the best comedians are female. Like, you know, like it is just the way it is. Like it's not a question anymore. Like, well, it never should have been a question but it's certainly not with

how much we've progressed. It shouldn't be a question anymore. Like, well, it never should have been a question, but it's certainly not with how much we've progressed. It shouldn't be a question anymore. It's interesting. I was interviewing a journalist recently who did a study on heterosexual relationships and men particularly, which is so interesting. And she said that one of the things about comedy is that to laugh at someone is a transference of power because if you're laughing

at someone, laughing at their joke, you're kind of deferring to them and saying, I think you're great, that's hilarious. Yeah, yeah. And maybe subconsciously there are certain types of men, and not all men obviously, not hashtag not all men, hashtag come at me, no, that do find that transference of power difficult when it's a female. Yeah, yeah. I don't know.

I thought that would be interesting. Yeah. I've always been very attracted to funny women. Like always. Like anyone, you know, that I've been attracted to has been hilarious. You know? And so, you know, but that's I think that's kind of also me taking a backseat. Like going, you know, because I never want to be the funniest person in a room.

Like I'm terrified of being that person. So I'm just always like, great. No, if you're the funny one, that's great. Don't have to take out all my five stories and just keep on talking. You've got the floor now. You've got the floor. It's yours. Yeah, that's so interesting. So I think, yeah, maybe it is a shift of power.

Maybe that's the reason that some people find it attractive and some people are terrified of it. Yeah, yeah, because it's definitely happened to me. Jess and I, Perkins, I interview her for this show as well, and she was talking about that, that in a room sometimes she will make a joke and guys won't laugh. Yeah. Or they'll look at her

kind of puzzled, like what is she trying to do? Yeah, yeah. Some kind of, you know, I don't know, performing monkey that's like suddenly started talking and everyone's like, you're not supposed to talk. Yeah, yeah. Which is such an old school thing, and I'm hoping that that's really shifted. But I wondered about Fiona and how that impacted her. What's comedy and drugs and alcohol in your experience from that time,

like with Greg Fleet as well, is that a huge issue in the comedy scene? Yeah, yeah, it certainly was. When I started filming I I didn't really know, but I, you know, when I was, I did stand up for seven years and I, you know, it was always, it was always at a bar and you'd always have a drink before and after, you know, a lot of the time, like I started not drinking before because I was like, I don't want that to be an issue, you know, and something that would always be like a, you know, like a tradition that you go, I have to drink before I go on. But some people would. And I think Will Anderson says

in the documentary, he talks about comedy and addiction and how you can be the most charming person in the world. You know, it's always the addicts that are the most charming people in the world and they can twist and, you know, they can make you fall in love with them. And, yeah, it's really charming. But there is that rock and roll lifestyle that is there and it is those people that, you know, because it's kind of a hit, like that adrenaline hit of getting a laugh is incomparable. And so then you want that all the time and you can't get it all the time.

So, you know, it seems to me like, you know, numbing things is the way to do it, like numbing your other experiences because you're on stage for 20 minutes, maybe 10 minutes, maybe five minutes, like, you know, like maybe an hour at best, you know, but the rest of the day can be really hard because you're not getting that release, you're not getting that hit. You're not getting that hit. And if you don't have any other things that you like to do,

it kind of seems like drugs and alcohol seem like the option. And then you're out late, you're partying, you're out at clubs, you're doing things, you're constantly working. So it just becomes a huge part of the lifestyle for some people. Yeah, that's so interesting. Why did you stop comedy? I stopped because I had a heart condition. So I blacked out on stage one night. Oh, my God.

Sam, I'm so sorry. I was in a comedy club and I felt really kind of dizzy. My heart was beating really fast and I just blacked out. I just, you know, and, you know, kind of came to and was like, oh, and, you know, just had this audience staring at me, you know, and yeah. And then I had to go to hospital and I found out that I've got a thing called SVT which is a, it basically means that the two nodes in your heart don't talk to each other and so sometimes it just, you know,

through stressful times it becomes a problem. And I did stand up after that because I was just like I don't want that to be the reason I stopped and I just lost the love and the drive after that. It wasn't like it just didn't seem like a viable thing to be putting myself at risk all the time to do that thing. So four nights a week I was like, do I want to risk that happening again and do I want this to be an issue and do I want this to be me? And I started loving making things again.

So I was making films when I started and then, you know, did stand-up and that was a thing that I was doing but I was also doing that film stuff at the same time. Like I was, you know, always working. So I was working in a film company and doing stand-up and then I was just like, I'm just going to focus on the film thing and just do that because, you know, at least I know that I don't have to be out four nights a week doing that. What was it like to wake up on a stage having blacked out?

It wasn't waking up. It was like a millisecond of blacking out. And then I just didn't know where I was. I had completely lost where I was. So I was staring at a room full of people, but I didn't really know what I was doing, you know. So were you still standing? Yeah, yeah.

I'd kind of fallen because I was grabbing onto a mic stand and I'd kind of fallen. And I was grabbing, clutching onto the mic stand and then got back up and realised what had happened. But I didn't really know where I was at the time. So I remember looking at the people and they were confused. I think they were thinking, is this still part of the app? Like, you know, what is this? Yeah, they'd be kind of laughing or something.

Yeah. Wow. Did the MC have to kind of come on and help or did you cover it and keep going? Someone came and helped me. Ryan Coffey, who's a great comedian, I don't think he does it at all anymore, but he was a great comedian, and he grabbed me and took me outside. Yeah.

Yeah, he just grabbed me and took me and said, you need to go to the hospital. Yeah. But, you know, and, you know, at that age as well, people were like, you know, just assumed that I'd done a lot of coke or something, like, you know, it was like, well people were like, you know, just assumed that I'd done a lot of coke or something. Like, you know, it was like, you know. Yeah, just how old were you?

What was it, three years ago I would have been 26 or. Yeah, oh, right in that peak time. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Peak time guy or something. Yeah. Yeah, so, yeah, I think people just assumed that I'd taken something or, you know, I was just out of it or I was drunk or whatever. Yeah.

Yeah, it was a bit of a wake-up call that, you know, that I couldn't. And also that I was, you know, pushing myself really hard as well. Like I was, you know, always working really hard. So, you know, I kind of thought maybe working that hard and the adrenaline hit of going out on stage all the time and being nervous before a gig, maybe that's a sign that I need to stop. Yeah, it's like putting yourself in the line of fire all the time. It just strikes me like for someone that has social anxiety

and finds that situation kind of scary, meeting new people, and you're just constantly like bungee jumping, aren't you? Yeah, yeah, yeah. Like straight into all the fire, like walking straight towards it. Yeah, every time. What is it that you love about making film comparatively to the stand-up? I just think it's more of a relaxed pace. You know, it's a nice thing when you can create something and then, you know, you do one

thing and then you go, that's really great and you really like it and then the edit changes everything, you know, and then you go, oh my God, it's like solving a puzzle. It's like every time there's like one bit here, one bit there. And then, you know, you're rewriting a whole story, like documentary especially, like you're making a story, you're writing a story as it's happening, which is pretty exciting. Like, you know, when you can actually focus on that and kind of go, well, I'm, you know, writing this story as it's going and this piece goes here and then you change one little thing

and it completely changes the whole narrative. And so I think that's, yeah, film is kind of so exciting because the process of it can be pretty agonising and, you know, you can keep filming and filming and filming and while you're doing it sometimes you don't like it and you're like, I don't think this is going anywhere and then you take it back and you upload it and then you go, wow, this is actually, this could be something

or you film a scene that you go, that was amazing and you get back and you're so excited to edit it. Like I like the editing more than the filming. That's so interesting. But, yeah, you get it back and you're like starting to piece it together and, you know, you're making things work and then you show a clip to someone and they really like it and so, you know, you kind of get inspired over and over again.

And also it's not lost on one night. That's true, isn't it? Yeah, and it doesn't have that same kind of immediacy. Yeah, yeah. Because it's there in perpetuity, I guess. It's actually made a physical thing. Fraud Festival's really great. Oh, thank you.

Yeah, I love that. Is that the most recent comedy film that you've played? Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah. So that was, yeah, a completely improvised comedy film. So that was improvised? Yeah, the whole thing. Really? Yeah, yeah, yeah. So that was, yeah, a completely improvised comedy film. So that was improvised? Yeah, the whole thing. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Wow, talk us through it. So I had an idea when I saw the Fyre Festival documentary. I was like, oh, I'd love to. I just thought the idea of the Fyre Festival thing was such a good concept for comedy. Oh, it is so incredible, that story. Yeah. What a shit show.

Yeah, yeah, just a shit show. Like, how did it happen? How did all the people not stop? And, you know, just the idea of a music festival that was put on without any preparation and, you know, people were scrambling all the time. And when I was growing up, I loved Christopher Guest films. So, like, Best in Show and Waiting for Guffman and Spinal Tap and all of those films. And I was obsessed with the idea that they were just improvised. Like it didn't make sense because, you know, but then you go,

well, isn't that better than being written because it's more conversational and so I came up with the idea that it would be really funny if you had a music festival that was going to be held in a small town and they're trying to save the small town because a bypass is going through and they're like, we want to. Covert. Covert. So they want to save the town and they're like, well, what do we do?

And someone comes up with the idea of having a music festival. But, you know, it's a very small town and they're not going to get any acts or anything, like big acts. So someone comes up with a template anyway and it says, you know, on the poster it says Lady Gaga, Elton John, all of these big names, David Grohl. Is that Ryan Shelton? Ryan Shelton, yeah.

Yeah, he's carried up. Yeah. That's hilarious. And, yeah, and so people are just excited about seeing the poster for the first time and they accidentally release that poster and then they sell 40,000 tickets in 38 seconds or something ridiculous and then they have to put on the music festival. They're like, well, do we cancel it, refund all the money,

or do we just go ahead with it? And because the mayor wants to save the town, he goes, let's just go ahead with it. So I come up with that basic idea. So that was the idea and then I wanted it to be improvised so I had to write, you have to write like the start, middle and end of every scene, but then you don't put any dialogue in there. So, you know, I always knew where the start and the middle was. And then I wrote jokes that I would tell the people on the

day. And if they wanted to use them, they could use them, but that was up to them. And so I then had to go to, there's 22 people in it. I had to go to all of those people and ask them if they would be in it. And that's why everyone's name in it is their own name, because that was the person that I asked to play that part. And getting them to come for two hours at a time, film, I'd film every scene twice. That was it. Wow.

Yeah, I gave no opportunity for anything else. It was just, I didn't want to waste people's time because they were giving up their time for free. Like, I didn't opportunity for anything else. It was just I didn't want to waste people's time because they were giving up their time for free. Like I didn't have any money to make it. So it was just like, you know, just do it. And then every scene was improvised. So I gave them two opportunities. I went and bought another camera.

So I had two cameras all the time. And it was just filming everything. And then I'd get back to the editing room. So you were filming it as well? I was filming it and editing it, yeah, and directing it. Sam! Yeah. Oh, my God.

Sorry, I've just, like, made all this noise on a piece of paper. That is a huge amount of work. Yeah, yeah. So, yeah, I made it over about six months it took in the end. Yeah, so but that was, you know, going to these people and saying, you know, I'm a big fan of all of these people and, you know, these people who I asked to be in it are the best and funniest improvisers that I know. So I didn't want to restrict them, but I was like, you know,

can you come for two hours? And a lot of the people in it were maybe it was like a two-hour block. That was it. That's all I had to film with them. But then, you know, the main character, Wes Snelling, Genevieve Morris, you know, there were people that were around a lot more, especially Wes. You know, Wes was around for a lot and then Genevieve was like, you know, there were people that were around a lot more, especially Wes. You know, Wes was around for a lot and then Genevieve was like, you know,

maybe four days with her, you know, and you're just trying to piece it together as you're going. And rewriting it as you're going as well because, you know, when you don't have a budget and you're making something and, you know, you want an epic ending, you can't really get an epic ending. So you have to kind of rewrite depending on what that is. So you have to, yeah, when you get to it, you want an epic ending, you can't really get an epic ending. So you have to kind of rewrite depending on what that is. So you have to, yeah, when you get to it, you're like, well, I can get this space.

It's like $500. Do I want to spend $500 on this place? And then I'm like, yeah, okay, I'll spend $500 on that place. So like that big cavernous room. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, the big cavernous room, yeah. So it was worth it. Yeah, yeah. I was like I just wanted to find a really big space where the festival would be.

And there's like five people. Yeah, yeah, yeah, watching the whole it. Yeah, yeah. I was like I just wanted to find a really big space where the festival would be. And there's like five people. Yeah, yeah, yeah, watching the whole show. Yeah. So, yeah, so filming that and just going, oh, I just want it to be improvised and, you know, I had lapel mics and I was like I'm just going to do it. Yeah. And film it. That seems to me to be an incredibly stressful thing to undertake.

There were times when it was pretty stressful. Yeah. But, I mean, because I've watched it and if you haven't seen it, obviously, if you haven't seen it, you totally should. You can get it on Vimeo. Oh, yeah, I put it on Vimeo. Yeah, it's on Vimeo. But the pacing of it is just so brilliant. It reminds me a lot of The Office, actually.

Oh, right. Yeah, yeah, yeah. In the way that it's obviously like a faux documentary. Yeah. And I know we talked about the fact that The Office is a big kind of influence for you. Yeah, yeah. In general, the American one especially.

Did you, was that deliberate or was that just something that has come out? No, just something that came out, yeah. I hadn't watched The Office in a very long time. So I think Steve Carell is just phenomenal. Like, you know, like him in that series is just like you just see him playing and it just looks like the funnest thing. Just improvising.

Yeah, and he's such a good actor. Like there's so many layers to him, you know, like and I'm one of, I'd like to say I'm the biggest Genevieve Morris fan in the world. So Genevieve Morris, when I was growing up, I was like if I ever get to meet her, my life would be made. You know, like it was her and her, Fiona, Judith Lucy and Tony Martin were like people that I was growing up just going if I ever get to meet them.

And Genevieve Morris, my mum and I used to just go, how is she that funny? Because it's not possible that someone is that funny. Like her demeanour, everything, I watched her in Comedy Inc., I watched her in everything, anything I'd see her in, Scott Brennan and her used to be in Comedy Inc. together. I was watching those two and Emily Tahini and you go, these people are just incredible and on another level.

And then you go, why isn't there a vehicle for these people? Because these people are the best people. Like, you know, why isn't there a vehicle for these people? Because these people are the best people. Like, you know, like I love being in a room with them. Like, you know, like they're the funniest people in the world and there's just no outlet for them all the time. And there should be. And so my main thing when I was like, came up with this idea, it was like, how do I showcase all of those people, those people that I've grown up watching but also have gotten to know over the years and I find them just the funnest people to hang out with.

And I was like, well, what if you just gave them the scene and see where it goes and people maybe had never seen Wes Snelling before play a role? You know, like he's a cabaret performer and Tina Dahl Twist is one of the funniest characters ever, but him as himself, he is really funny. He's hilarious. He's such a sweet and beautiful person.

You can feel that. You can just feel it wherever it is. And then, you know, Genevieve, you know, so when I was sitting down with these people, I was like, I don't want anyone else to do this. Like, this is, it's either these people or nothing. Like, Ryan Shelton, people like that. Like, it was like, I actually, when I came up with the idea, I was thinking of you people.

And if you can't do it, then I'm not going to do it. You know, like, cause there was no, there's no alternative to Genevieve. There just isn't like, you know, you could, you could have someone that's kind of like Genevieve and kind of, you know, kind of hits the mark, but there's just looks she gives and, you know, the anger that she has for everyone she meets. And, you know, she's such a strong person. Yeah. You know, there's a line in it where Oliver and I,

my old housemate Oliver Clark, he's in the film as well, he's amazing, and he plays the MC of the festival. And Oliver and I had one day where we were filming and it was the first day. And I didn't really know what it was, but I knew that Oliver was going to hold one camera at our house and I was going to hold the other. And Genevieve and Jim Russell were coming around.

And I was such a big fan of Jim Russell. I'd never met him before. He'd never met me before. But Genevieve said, my mate's self-funding a film, come around. You know, and it was just like, and I had one conversation with him on the phone. I'd given him his, I wrote character bios for everyone. I was just like, this is your character.

And then Genevieve and him sat down and all the scene was that it was Genevieve and Jim talk about their sex life. Genevieve talks about how if you add it all up in time of how many, the period of time she's had other men inside of her, it adds up to this time. Like three years. Three years. And she just started.

Like she just went. So that's just it. Yeah, and she was just like, I was just like, that's it. That's all the scene is. And it was her and Jim, and Jim decided that he was just going to be really uncomfortable in that moment so he doesn't want to talk about it. And I was like, at the end of that, you need to bring up your micropenis.

That was how the whole thing ends. And he does this ridiculous thing where he gets his finger and puts it between his hands. And so that's just those two. And Oliver and I couldn't handle it. Like we could not film it. I had to cut so much around that scene because when I wasn't laughing, luckily I get his camera for a second where he wasn't laughing

and you have to just keep filming it and go with it. But those two people in a room, it's just electric. And then, you know, and then you have to go, well, yeah, I want Jim to talk about that he sells rocks with googly eyes on them. And Jim starts just going, he decided to say that he's doing a short course at RMIT in just self-confidence, just building up his self-confidence. And he just goes on this tangent about self-confidence and he picks up a packet of Tim Tams and he's like,

these are my Tim Tams, they're not for you, they're for me because it's my turn, just stand up and be proud. And that scene went for 20 minutes and I didn't want to cut anything out. Like, you know, that was the hard thing is that you have to cut that stuff down. Yeah, and I was just thinking the edit of this is so tight and the timing is so beautiful. It does that thing where it just leaves it hanging. Yeah.

I just love that so much. There's that funny scene with them in front of the fridge where they're talking about yogurt. Completely improvised. Like everything's obviously completely improvised. We have to take this fridge. All that scene was it said Jim wants to take the fridge with him to Coburg, like to Coburg on a, you know, what is it, a 22-hour drive.

And he's just saying, we're taking the fridge, we're taking it. And she's like, we're not taking the fridge, mate. They've got fridges there. They've got, he goes, what does this fridge do that no other fridge does that I've ever experienced? And she goes, something about your yogurt. He goes, not yogurt, mate. They've got fridges there. They've got, he goes, what does this fridge do that no other fridge does that I've ever experienced? And she goes, oh, no, something about your yogurt. He goes, not yogurt, yogurt. And it just keeps going.

It goes, which is my perfect temperature? Which is? And she goes, 3.6, 3.4, 3.4, and it just keeps going. And it's just like, I don't know. And Genevieve and Jim have worked together for so long that their timing, they just know each other so well. They already know where the other one is going so it's them getting to play but them getting to play in a circumstance like we'd filmed that one twice because I was laughing too much.

Like I couldn't handle the intensity of him talking about his yoghurt. It's too much, you know. But then, you know, like we filmed for maybe two hours that day and so 80% of the scenes that we shot aren't in there. Because, you know, when I was editing it, it was four hours and there were just scenes, little bits and pieces where, you know, I'd be showing it to someone and they'd be going, there's just no point for this.

Like, you know, it's so funny but there's no point. You know, them yelling at each other in a car park is so funny or them on the trip, on the road trip down, screaming at each other and him shitting himself. You know, like it's like it was so funny but it's like it doesn't actually add anything to the story and you have to start to cut stuff out where, you know, watching The Office growing up, I was just like it just felt like that was the environment that they got to play in.

It wouldn't have been because it was a very commercial, you know, NBC show I think it was. Like it would have been so scripted but it felt like it had that room to play. And I didn't think I could write a script that felt like it just, I didn't feel like I could write a script that felt like it just, I didn't feel like I could write a script that had that playfulness and I guess that freedom where people look like they're having fun. And the absurdity as well. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

Someone deciding if they want to crack it at someone in that moment. Yes. And they usually do. Talk about yoga. Yeah, yoga. Yeah, yeah, yeah. That's the funnest thing. I guess it's like Amy Pooler, right, talks about, I mean,

in Parks and Rec, quite a few of her scenes I think had an improv bent to them. Yeah. Yeah, and I mean I just think improvisation is the most incredible thing to watch. Yeah. Do you do improv? No, no, no, not at all. And I think I'd be terrible at it. I just don't have that in me.

Like some people are just so good at it. Like, you know, there's Honor Wolf and Patrick Dern and Silva who are in a duo called Hot Department. And just to watch them improvise together is incredible. Like, you know, they're such artists in the way they do it. I'm just not someone that can do it. But I love to, like, I can go with people on, you know, like doing a podcast or something, like, you know,

I do my comedy podcast and I know how to talk to people. But it's like, you know, it's not really improv, like watching people. It's interesting you say that because let's talk about Confessions of the Idiots. So that podcast is so funny and you do improvise with your guests often when you're reading the story out. Do you want to explain what that concept is? Yeah, so it's called Confessions of the Idiots and it's about basically I, a few years ago, so it's now been going for three years.

Happy third birthday. Thank you so much. And, yeah, it was like a year, yeah, before I started doing it, I just had this idea. I just started finding people just kept sending me all these really messed up online confessions. So messed up. Wow.

But there's just so many. And, you know, there's all these different messed up online confessions. So messed up. Wow. But there's just so many. And, you know, there's all these different websites that just have all of these confessions. And I started reading them and I was just like, oh, it's so weird that they all have this massive buildup that goes nowhere. And it's all these people that are just trying to say, I'm actually a really good person. You know, I give to charity and anyway, I shit in a bin. You know, like it's just every confession is like that, you know, and every week you just have these people there.

And so I was just like, basically I was like, I just want to record one and see what it's like, you know, and I've always had that thing of I get the confessions, I read them once and then I don't read them again. I just put them away and then I bring them out like six weeks later so they're fresh to me. And so I was like, well, I'll just put that away and then I got my friend, performer Scott Brennan

and Wes Snelling and I was just like, we'll just sit in a room and we sat in this very room and we recorded our first episode and it was so much fun that we were just crying, laughing, reading these confessions. And, you know, it was so much fun to see people getting the idea straight away. Like people just going, this is so funny and you can make fun of these people because they're anonymous. You know, you can actually go to town on them.

Yeah. But, yeah, and then I just started recording every week and, you know, just getting two people that I find really funny together in a room every week. And they may be well-known people, they might not be. It might be friends that I've had for a very long time or people that don't have, just don't have a profile for some reason and you're like, you know, they're so funny and it's so nice to introduce people to some people that, you know, you've never met before but you just find them so funny.

But, yeah, it's great to – it's like my favourite part of the week is getting to – I recorded one just before this and it was like, you know, just getting to do that once a week where you just bring – like all I have with me is my phone and it's just I've got four confessions on it and I'm going to read them to two people every week. And that's so freeing, isn't it? Because it doesn't have all of the added layer of like the tech and all the things.

You just kind of have this hilarious chat. Yeah, yeah. I mean that's the joy of podcasting. That's what I love doing, suggestive while we chat. Yeah, yeah. My partner. Because we do. We just kind of bring our things that we love during that week

and just get silly and ridiculous? Yeah, yeah, yeah. And because it's with people that you find funny and you're really comfortable with, then, yeah, it's just a joy. And I think that's why people love your show too because they want, you just want to be, everyone just wants to be in a room with people they find funny having a laugh. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

At the end of the day. Every time and it's like, you know, once a week it's just the funnest thing to do because you go, oh, and you look forward to it because you're like, oh, I've got these insane people coming this week. Yeah. And I know that they're going to do what they, you know, they're going to just say what they feel. Yeah.

What's in their heart and mostly it's rage. Yeah. Slash confusion and curiosity. What is one of your favourite confessions? Do you reckon? Is that like one of your favourite confessions? Do you reckon? Is that like choosing between your children or something? Yeah, it's so hard, but there was a confession a little while ago that the actor Stephen Curry is on most of the episodes of the podcast.

Like it's him and Dave Lawson alike on 38% of every episode, like all of the podcasts. But Stephen and I usually just do it, just him and I, and just because, you know, I've known him for such a long time and we just get along so well that I can say anything to him and he can say anything to me. So there's never a beat, there's never a moment. He can really go there, yeah.

Yeah, and there was one that it was about a guy that was overseas, his wife was sick. He decided to go to a haunted mansion. And while he was there, he saw a ghost. She offered a blow job. And then that happened. And then he went home and he didn't tell his wife, Susan. And then he came back to Australia.

Yeah. And Stephen was just like, you need to follow this up. I have questions. And so I did. I reached out to him on Reddit and then he responded. And so then it's just become this running theme in the podcast where then Stephen will come back and I'll just ask the guy more questions, Dave, and then Dave will then reply to that and just say. It felt like a vacuum with a water sprinkler in it.

And I was just like, wow. Because you never would have. Well, it's so unexpected. So unexpected. I was thinking it would be just cold. Just cold, yeah. You know, just like, yeah. Windy, maybe.

Windy, yeah. Windy and a bit of sort of sound effects like, ooh. Yeah, exactly. Something else is going. Yeah. But no, and so that's probably the one that just sticks out just because there's been so much interaction with it. Like writing to someone who, you know, I didn't think would respond

because it was like, you know, it's such an insane thing that they put out there. Yeah, like is that true? No. No, it's a ghost. No. But I mean, but, you know, but. But is it true for them?

I don't know. Or is it like a story? Like that's what I'm so interested in. Like do people, do they tell real confessions or is it true for them? I don't know. Or is it like a story? That's what I'm so interested in. Do people, do they tell real confessions or is it for fun? I think a lot of them are for fun. I think the ones that are real are the ones that have all this bullshit. There's all this detail for no reason. And a lot of it you go, well, it kind of has to be real.

Like if they're mentioning the colour of the letterbox and then they go on a tangent about how their dad never loved them and stuff, you're like, why is someone making this up? Like, you know, so it becomes, I think when there's way too much detail, I'm usually like, this is definitely. This is a real thing. This is a real one. Yeah.

And guests sometimes say that, like Jess Perkins, who comes on all the time, will be like, I think that one's actually real. Yeah. Which is real sad when they find that out. They're like, I think that one's okay real. Yeah. Which is real sad when they find that out. I think that one's okay. Yeah, no. Do you ever feel bad that you're making fun of people? Not really.

No. I mean, they put them out into a space and internet people are worse than, you know, anything you could ever say. Totally. Is that a human need? Like if you've done something terrible to get it? And if they can't get it out anywhere else, they're like, well, I'll just tell the void of the internet to millions of people.

I think so. I think if people don't feel they can tell anyone, then they need to get it out and tell someone. And, you know, some people write journals and everything and some people post on Reddit. It's just such a weird thing that it's like, no, I'm just going to. Dear Reddit, these are the most terrible things I've ever done. Yeah, it's so strange. Send.

Yeah, send. Some people are so odd with it that it's like, nah, I think I'll put this online. Okay. And they don't edit it. They just put it up as it is. Oh my god. I love it so much. I could talk to you about stuff for so long. Yeah, me too. It's so interesting. I just want to finish

with your kind of main philosophy on life, which I know is like a big question. Yeah. Do you have like a main driving force behind why you do all the things you do or a belief system? I think it's always been don't let fear be the reason you don't do something. I think that's been the, you know,

if fear is the only reason you're not going to do something, then you still need to do it, you know, because I think, I think it stops a lot of people from doing things. It just, you know, that fear gets in the way when they're like, oh, I can't, I can't actually do this. I can't actually go through with this. I can't, you know, and terrified because it is scary. It's like that bungee jumping thing. It's like, yeah, if you don't do it now, you're never going to do it. You just have to do it right now. It's like ripping off a bandaid. You just have to do it. You know, it's like when,gee jumping thing. It's like, yeah, if you don't do it now, you're never going to do it. You just have to do it right now. It's like ripping off a bandaid. You just have to do it. Yeah. You know, it's like when, you know, I go swimming and it's freezing out and it's so cold and I swim in an outdoor pool and, you know, and I'm sitting in my car and I'm like, oh, I could

just, I could just skip it. You know, like there was that moment. There's no idea except for that person in your head that's like, Sammy. Yeah, that goes, no, you get in that pool. Yeah, buddy, get in there, mate. Yeah, it's like that. I'm just like there's some times where I'm just like, oh, I don't want to do it. And, you know, it's not a fear so much, but it's that thing where it's like you also don't need to do that. And then you're like, well, I'm going to do it. I'm going to be dead one day. I'm going to be dead one day, yeah.

Got to get in there. I'll sleep when I'm dead. I think that's probably my main philosophy is that, yeah, it fears the only reason, then just keep doing it. What do you think people are afraid of? People are afraid of being embarrassed and rejection, I think, is a big thing, you know, being rejected from something, whatever it is, and, yeah, and just being embarrassed.

You know, I tried and I didn't do it well or I didn't. And everyone saw. Everyone saw, yeah. I think people just have a lot of shame and a lot of embarrassment. You know, I think, yeah, people who feel embarrassed just, you know, I think it just stops so many people from doing things. Do you think, in a way, having facial palsy and the childhood that you had is a gift because you don't have to, you've already had all that. You've experienced that and you're like, well, isn't that bad?

Or you've developed mechanisms to cope with it? Yeah, I think so. I think I just don't find anything scary. Like, I mean, I do. Like, I do have social anxiety and all that stuff, but I don't find anything. I know I can push through anything because I know that I've been through the worst stuff in my mind.

So I always find that, well, what's the worst that can happen? Like I don't have an embarrassed filter. I don't get embarrassed. So, you know, I know if I put something out there and someone doesn't like it, then I go, okay. Probably don't like you anyway. Yeah, I'll have something next week. So, you know, like I've always got something,

so don't worry about it if you didn't like it. You know, it's like a podcast, like doing it every week. Like sometimes people are going to find it really funny and sometimes people are going to find it interesting. Or, you know, it doesn't always have to be that one thing. Not every week has to be the funniest week ever. You know, you might have so many reasons why the podcast wasn't as funny as you want it to be.

It might be the confessions. It might be so many other things that just weren't as funny as another one it to be. It might be the confessions. It might be so many other things that just weren't as funny as another one you listened to. There's one out next week. You know, there's one that's going to be next Sunday as well. So, you know, you get a free podcast every week that you're like, well, that one you didn't like as much as another one because you prefer other guests or you prefer when I said something

or, you know, whatever it is, whatever that thing is. It's like, well, there'll be one next week. I think embarrassment, people just get so worried about what will other people think and the embarrassment out of it all. Whereas you've just got to keep doing it again and again and again. Yeah. Because the more that you do it, the better you get at it. Yeah, yeah.

It's not as scary. Yeah. That's what, like, you know, when I was making the fraud festival, you know, someone said to me, that's so weird that you're doing it. Like, why would you just do it? And I was like, well, I'm not going to get funding for it. Like, I'm not going to get funding for it. I've always wanted to make it. You know, like, it's that thing of going, do I want a house deposit

or do I want to make this thing that I've always wanted to make? Yeah. And that always wins because it's like, well, even if it gets played, like it got played on Channel 31, which is an amazing community station, but, you know, COVID hit and I wanted to put it in film festivals so that never happened. And then, you know, I was like, well, I need to do something with it because it's been sitting there for a year and I don't think a lot

of people would do something like that because they're just like, oh, it's so much money, it's so much time, it's so much thing, and then going, yeah, exactly, that's why it's so much fun. Yeah. You know, like that's why it's so much fun, it's so much time, it's so much thing. And then going, yeah, exactly, that's why it's so much fun. Yeah. You know, like that's why it's so much fun. What else are you going to do? You're like, I don't mind if I rent. Yeah, exactly.

You know, like I'm like, I don't have, I don't like material things. I'm always like, you know, my car is, you know, my granddad passed away. That's the car I have. Like, you know, like everything I have is like I don't need new things. I'm just like so excited to be able to do things with all those amazing people. And you're like, well, that's more valuable than anything. You don't want to be sitting back in your rocking chair at 80 being like, oh, I'm really glad I had a Mazda 3.

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. And, you know, and people that say, yeah, like this person was saying it to me. It was just like, yeah, what's the point of it? Like, you know, like you'll put it out and some people will see it and that's it. And it's like, yeah, well, you know, I hope that someone might see it who goes, what, this was completely self-funded? Like this was all, like imagine what you can do if you had a budget.

Like, you know, like if someone saw that and went, if this was all done because people liked this person who made it and gave up their time to do it and then he just went away and like I just went away every night I just edited. Every night I'd just sit in my room and edit. Yeah, there were times when it was hard but also like if I made one person look at it that would have gone, you know, if someone was in their head going, oh, I wonder why Australia doesn't make these really funny films like, you know, like America does. Like,

you know, the cush of a guest film sucks when someone doesn't make a best in show. When we have the talent, even more talent with our improvisers and comedians, like we've got so much talent here. And if an international audience saw that somehow, or someone saw it and just went, that was done without a budget, that's incredible. If it gave Wes Snelling an opportunity that he wouldn't have otherwise have, if it gave Genevieve an opportunity, like it's just, like I would love to have a budget to make another one but, you know, but you've just got to do that first and then if I'd...

Yeah, and see where it leads to the next thing because the next, nothing is wasted. No. I think no experience, nothing see where it leads to the next thing. Because the next, nothing is wasted. No. I think no experience, nothing that you've been through in your life that's difficult, if you use it and you learn through it and it pushes you to do something new, it's not wasted. No. And mistakes, oh, I'm so corny, but mistakes are that gift, really.

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. To keep going and then you're absolutely right. And because it's a film that lives in perpetuity in a year, you just don't know what will be the thing that leads to the next thing. Yeah. And what an adventure to be on. Yeah. You know, what are you going to do, sit at home in a house and watch Netflix?

Money comes and goes as well. That's the thing. It's like money can be there, it can not be there. Everyone's had those periods of time. It's like but when you've got it, like I was like that night that I came up with the idea, I bought a second camera. Wow. I was just like, I'm just going to do it. I asked one of the people in it to be in it. And I was talking to him about one week and got him to say, yeah, I'll do it. You know,

if I can do it in two hours, I'll do it. And then the next week I sent him a date to do it. And he was like, oh, you're actually, you're actually doing it. I was like, yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah. And he's like, 100%. He's like, well, if anyone's going to do it, you're going to do it. But, wow, you're doing it really quick. And I'm like, wow, if I don't do it now, I'm just never, ever going to do it. Jump in the pool.

Jump in the pool. Yeah, rip the band up. You think about it too long, it just festers and then nothing happens. Jump in that pool. Start swimming. I love it. Thank you so much, Sam. Thank you.

Honestly, that was such a great chat and so interesting. And I really recommend everyone going to watch Fraud Festival. Oh, yeah, yeah. Thank you. And to be honest, I thought of it and I thought, oh, you know, it's an amateur film. Not an amateur. No, it isn't.

It's just me. But it's on Vimeo, you know. And I thought, oh, I'll watch it. And immediately I was crying laughing at the kitchen table and James came in and he's like, what are you watching? I'm like, you have to watch this thing. I was just so clever and great. And just, yeah, the cast alone is just spectacular.

Yeah, the best of the best. Bloody congratulations. Thank you. I can't wait to see what you do next. Thank you. Excellent. Okay. All right, that's it for me this week.

I've been Claire Tonti on Tod's and my guest today has been Sam Peterson. You can find more from Sammy P at theproducerboy.com where you can find his podcast, Confessions of the Idiots, and there's links to previous episodes with me and also with James Clement. You can also find his documentary, Lady of Lachlan, there and watch his comedy film, Fraud Festival, for free on Vimeo. And if you do nothing else, go and watch that for the brilliant yogurt fridge debacle.

So hilarious. For more from me, you can follow me on Instagram at Claire Tonti where I occasionally tell stories. And also there's a link in my bio for my newsletter that comes out semi-weekly. We've had some sick kids this week. So anyway, it comes out semi-weekly and I'd love to write to you just with updates on what I've been doing and recommendations for things.

So that's in the bio down there. Also, if you love this episode or you think someone else would really appreciate it, please share it with them. That would just make my day. And check us a rate and review if you like as well, just like the wonderful Tia has. And this is her review. Humour and deep conversations, two of my favourite things. Another fantastic podcast from this lovely lady with a brilliant first episode. Charming, funny, engaging and so interesting. Hearing people's stories is

always fascinating and knowing that I'm not alone in my feelings about life and all its madness is such a relief. Oh, mate, I feel you too, Tia. It is. It absolutely is. I think it's the only way through really, isn't it? Life, to know that you're not alone. If you'd also like to write to me, you can write to me at tonspot at gmail.com. And this week I got a really touching email from a lovely bloke called Mattia.

He writes about our previous conversation with Jessie Stephens on heartbreak. I identify as a cisgender heterosexual male and I share some of the ways you mentioned that men process heartbreak. However, I also saw myself in some of what Jessie was characterising as stereotypically feminine. Growing up, I certainly protest heartbreak through verbal expression rather than physical reactions. I do, however, feel that many of my male peers tended to mock or look down upon my showing of fragility. In time, I built a shell and stopped talking about

my feelings, and I still found solace in expressing my feelings, but only internally or through writing or often thinking of myself as a character in TV shows or in books I loved. Throughout the years I had the luck and joy of getting to know friends who were fearless and open about their feelings especially but not strictly female confidants who allowed me to find the room to express and define my innermost hurt and desires. Overall it took me years to even admit the smallest hurt, let alone heartbreak, and I have to thank my best friend, my wife, and my most recent circle of international friends. So in summary, I'd say that I personally experience emotions

in a somewhat similar way as the two of you. That is via words and seeing myself from the outside. However, growing up, I never found a way to voice it to others and I'm still learning. Thanks so much for sharing with Tia. And I wonder if anyone else can relate to that. I really appreciated you writing in and being so vulnerable. So what a superstar.

Okay, that is it from me this week. Sending you lots of love and I'll see you next Tuesday. Oh, that is not a metaphor. That's what I actually meant to say. All right. See you then. Bye.