Tooth & Claw: True Stories of Animal Attacks - Bentho the Heroic Dog - News Stories Including Injecting Butterflies, a Fish vs. a Mermaid, a Whale Swallowing a Man Whole, and More

Episode Date: March 10, 2025

It's been a wild and unusual month for animal news stories, so the guys did their best to talk their way through a few and explain what we can learn from them. They then end things on a quick recap of their trip to India. ~~ To advertise on the show, contact us! ~~ Tooth & Claw is brought to you by QCODE. Support the show and get access to an extensive library of exclusive episodes like this by supporting the show on Patreon or joining the Grizzly Club on Apple Podcasts. For the latest updates on the show and all things wildlife, follow us at toothandclawpod.com and social:  Instagram: @ToothandClawPodcast Twitter: @ToothandClawPod Wes: @GrizKid Jeff: @jefe_larson Mike: @mikey3ds Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

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Everybody, welcome back to Toothin Club podcast. Hey, Mike. Hey, Wes. We have our news episode, this episode, and we have our bear biologist who is once named Top 10 hottest bear biologist in United States, Wes Larson. I don't remember that. I didn't give you my vote, but I am happy about it. And we have Mike Smith who eats ass. Hey.

All right. Finally. And I'm Jeff Lerner. Described me accurately. I finally got one right. Top 10 ass eaters in the United States. He was voted top 10. Hey guys.

You guys, you guys feeling okay? You know what? I'm feeling a little bit sick, but I'm feeling better than I did yesterday. That's shocking because you look great, actually. You would never be able to guess. We just got back from two weeks in India, and Mike and Jeff were feeling pretty sick on the way home, doing a lot of coughing. Well, you guys. Like that Pokemon?

Yeah. For people who aren't geologists, no, geology, no. What, the maps? Geographers. People who don't know those maps. Yeah, cartographers. Cartographer. India has the Himalayas in it.

And we were in the Himalayas. And that was pretty high up. My lungs are kind of like, dude, you just found out you have asthma and now you're coming to Hemalayas. Yeah. Yeah, we got up to 15,000 feet on this trip, which is pretty high. And we are camping at 13,000 feet, which is also pretty high to camp at. And a bad idea, in my opinion.

Yeah, we're going to get to that. We definitely, our categories are almost all about India and kind of our experiences there, all of the trip. So we're going to get to a lot of those details. But it was an amazing trip, in my opinion. Probably, I mean, wildlife-wise, I think it's the greatest trip we've done so far. No, spoiling. I'm just going to say it.

You're spoiling. I'm spoiling. We'll wait. We'll go bleep that part. Yeah, bleep it. Anyway, we're all back at home now, and we're excited to talk about the news, right, Jeff? Oh, yeah, we've been building it up. Yeah, I can hardly hold it anymore.

I personally have a story that I thought was really a good story. Okay. I'm excited for it. Great. Mike, do you personally have a story? I normally have bad ones. We've been waiting four years for that. We're not just hearing headlines.

Well, you get some headlines. All right, well, should we start it out? Hopefully it takes place in the past couple of weeks. Yes, serious. I can't laugh. Not a year ago. Yeah, okay. No jokes.

No more jokes. No more jokes. If you shot me in the chest and you made me laugh, that's what you're doing right now. It's tough because animal attacks are usually really funny. Super funny. No, but we should start it out on a serious note. Well, if we don't want to laugh, we might as well start with something that's not very funny. Yes.

So, pretty much right around when we left for India, I think like a lot of people in our country right now, we are being bombarded by news. And a lot of that news was stuff that seemed pretty concerning to us. And one of the things that happened was we were reading the Trump administration was cutting a lot of funding from a lot of the agencies that protect our wild spaces, our public lands. A lot of my friends personally lost their jobs, like bear management specialists, forest service workers, people that deal with like grant writing for different wild initiatives. And it made us pretty upset all three of us, I think. It's hard to be on a podcast where you talk about conservation and appreciating wild spaces and all these things. And then in just a manner of weeks, seeing a lot of that rug kind of being pulled out from under your feet. And for me, like personally, the hardest part of it is seeing it being done by a billionaire who, you know, billionaires famously don't care much about other people.

They mostly care about their bottom line. And it's hard to see a thing that's bipartisan in our country, wild spaces, public lands, being treated as if it's like a profit loss kind of scenario. Yeah. And so we just kind of want to say that sucks. Yeah. It sucks. I was going to actually do like a listener. advice at the end about that.

Oh. Oh. I feel like it would be repetitive now. Yeah. But I want to shout the person out. Well, yeah, I think we had our wires crossed a bit. It's all right. Because that's what I'm just trying to tell you.

We'll combine them. Yeah. So yeah, shout out Daphne. Just saying she's like trying to get in the field of science, but is pretty discouraged by the Trump administration and wants to ask Wes how to remain hopeful as someone who's trying to get into a science and conservation related. field, which I feel like a lot of listeners probably have that same question. Yeah.

And like, we definitely got a lot of questions about it and how it was affecting me. And I'm lucky that I'm pretty insulated from it right now. I'm not currently working at Yellowstone. The podcast is really... What are you doing? The podcast is pretty much a full-time gig for all three months at this point. Oh, man. We get that question a lot.

Is this what you guys do full-time? Yeah, I guide on stuff too. I'm always like I do, but Wes, no, he's like a... Your model. Yeah. I'm not a Dior model. I mean, technically you are. I was.

And now I also do a bit of biology. I'm still working with some nonprofits on some papers. But yeah, I, you know, our hearts go out to people that are feeling that kind of uncertainty. It's not fair. Especially like the national. Yeah. The national parks, for every dollar that goes into the national parks, they produce $15. Like this is a profitable part of our country.

And it seems a strange place to do a lot of these cuts. For me, it's like we have... Is that from all their oil reserves? It's not from their oil reserves. It's from tourism. And conservation. Tourism can lead to conservation. So it seems weird that we have, for me, the military industrial complex that sucks up billions and trillions of dollars.

And they're targeting these kind of things that people on both sides of the aisle love these places. That's not, it's not just left-leaning people. It's not just right-leaning people. Like, we all love our national parks. So this seems silly to me. It seems counterproductive. It seems like billionaire logic. Yeah.

For me, I know I try to stay maybe a little more agnostic than you two as far as political stuff is concerned. I just try. And it's to my discredit, I think. I just think it's a shame because there's so much historical precedent that these kinds of people are actually really important that we need to have people that are considering the environment and nature and animals. like that be the forefront of their minds. And we have people that know what kind of disaster can

ensue if we let those things fall by the wayside. I know I've brought it up a few times. It's getting a little weird how often it's coming up these days. But China's great leap forward. It was kind of in large part caused by an ignorant decision regarding nature. And I know we have experience to learn from, but I don't know. It's just something that I think is more important than a lot of people might give it credit for. So that's my two cents. I think everything's connected. Yeah, it's a huge conspiracy. Yeah. And for me, like, the thing that feels kind of gross to me and a little crass is how much we talk about this from like an economic standpoint. And some of these things have value that goes far. Like, it transcends money. You know, when you, when you're in the desert southwest alone, you know,

in Red Rock Canyons or you're like high in the northern Rockies at an Alpine Lake, that's stuff that is, invaluable. It's stuff that that shouldn't be treated as a profit and loss. It's stuff that makes America like what it is in my opinion. So it feels it feels very tragic to me and I think there's going to be a lot of things that we're going to have to deal with for a while. And hopefully people rally and and do what they can. And I think it's easy to feel helpless. But we do care about those things. And we wanted to make that known. Well said, Wes. Clap. All right. Well, and Jeff. Jeff, You know, me and Jeff talked about this a little bit, and he really, I think, feels very passionately about it as well. All right.

Never mind. Credit goes to Jeff. Like always. No, I don't know. I think it's good to question everything. I think it's good to question, like, all your political leaders and anyone who has control over your decisions. But I think I've talked to a lot of friends and people who, like, question climate change, too. And it's just like, listen, if you think the world is more political.

and less forested than it was 200 years ago, you believe in climate change. You just don't like the narrative around it because that's all it is. We're polluting the earth, you know? But anyways, enough of that. Hopefully we changed everyone's mind. Yeah, I'm serious. Elon's out there listening to this and he's like, you know what? I am an asshole.

I mean, they listen to a lot of content, so they might be. Yeah, who knows? But anyways, we got some stories for you to bum you out even more. So, yeah. I got one that's tragic, but also pretty funny. So should we start with that? Yeah. All right.

I call this one teen TikTok tragedy. And this is about Davy Nunes Morera, a Brazilian. He's 14 years old, who recently died in a hospital in Plano Alto, Brazil, which is in the state. That is funny. The state of Bahia. That's not funny. That's the tragic part. That's a really irreverent joke.

I won't make that one again. There's a lot of animals in Brazil that can potentially kill you. You know, you got lots of venomous snakes. You've got some spiders that can even kill you. You've got jaguars. You've got a lot of things. There are sharks. Gorillas.

No guerrillas. But there are some dangerous things in Brazil. And this teen was killed by a butterfly. Which seems a little crazy. So what happened How big was it? When it killed him it was very, very, very small. So in mid-February

This kid went to his dad And said that he was vomiting He was struggling to walk He was getting really sick And his dad took him into the hospital And on the way he told his dad That what had happened is that he had injected A solution made of crushed butterfly

Into his leg And obviously the dad was like, oh, why did you do that? And he said it was part of an online challenge, and that's why he did it. Oh, no. Yeah. So unfortunately, he spent a week in the hospital. He was in intense pain the entire time he was there. And then he did end up passing after a week of receiving really, you know, critical care.

Like he got butterfly in his bloodstream or something? So there's a few things that could have happened. It could have been an embolism. which is when you have some sort of foreign object in your bloodstream, like that can be a blood clot, it can be air, it can be anything, really. It can be a crushed up butterfly. It's not the vaccine. It could be an infection that killed him.

Like he could have had like a septic reaction to these butterfly bits or like even like a toxic reaction to them. Bad needle. Yeah, an allergic reaction. Yeah, maybe the needle is bad. Who knows? But something killed him. They're not really sure like how. crushed up this butterfly was, but he died from it.

So people on TikTok are doing that? Yeah. So that's the part. I was like, okay, I got to find out what this trend is. And every single article that reported on this said it was because of this viral online trend, I kind of think that's just what he told his dad to like not seem so stupid. Because there's no trend. This is being a dumb kid.

Yeah, there's no trend of like injecting butterflies into yourself. The thing I could find that. was the closest was people painting butterflies on themselves or something. But yeah, I think the trend is just like doing stupid shit on TikTok to try and get a bunch of views. I mean, it is, it's just crazy too that I'm more surprised that there wasn't a trend of that. Yeah. You know, like I thought like, oh yeah, there's probably a trend.

That's if he said that, there's probably a trend, you know. Yeah. And I think pretty much Jeff, all the news outlets believed it too. And they were just like, yeah, this is a trend. Because I think that's, that's kind of like the shark attacks in the summer and stuff. That's something they love to report on is saying like, oh, all the kids are doing this. It's like satanic panic in the 80s. Yeah.

Well, the kids nowadays are good at trolling too. Yeah. I feel like the Tidepod trend. Right, right. Most kids knew like not to do that, but they're acting like they're doing it. But then a few kids did it and got really. For sure. And, you know, those kids.

But that's kind of funny too. Those kids are probably going either way, you know. Yeah. They're not long for the. this world. I think gronk might have done it. Yeah, maybe baby gronk. Who knows? There are certain butterflies like monarchs, for example, that do feed on toxic plants. Monarchs will feed on milkweed and that can make them slightly toxic.

But I would have to assume that you'd have to consume a really large amount of monarch butterflies to actually get sick from them. And then to die, it has to be like the embolism or an allergic reaction or something. It couldn't be just toxic. Different than injection. Yeah, true. That is true. This is a very different means of transport, but I still don't think it would be enough.

We're definitely still gathering data on the injection, injecting butterfly. Yeah. Science. The nice thing is this kid did answer that question for us, you know? Like now we know. I mean, one result, I don't know. I think that's not a big data pool. Kids.

We need to test it. No, I don't think you need to test this one anymore. I think enough data has been gathered. I think I could survive it. All right. I don't want you to try, but I'm also, you know, one thing we've proved, Jeff, is I'm not good at stopping you from doing things.

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Mike, you go. I want to go, Jeff. Thanks for passing it to me. So this is, we got a little fish on fish crime in this one. Kind of. I have a little bit of our, I have a Russian theme going on both of my stories today. But yes, this first one does involve a mermaid, Jeff. You're right.

So, I knew it. For the 10 months leading up to when this story took place, 22-year-old Maria Zelenina, she's the main character of this story. She went by a stage name Masha. She was having a great time just working as a mermaid. She's not a real mermaid, just to clear that up. She was in an aquatic show that was put on

the primitive forest park in Shishwang Bana, China. Well, her workplace, was about to take a little bit of a hit on Tuesday, January 28th of this year. During a solo performance, she was gracefully doing a little solo dance under the water. She was in the tank with a bunch of these aquatic animals at this aquatic part, which is great. I just love this image, and there's videos, but. I'm already cracking up that you name this fish on fish crime. You don't think mermaids are fish?

Anyway, so yeah, she was doing a solo performance under the water And she is in my opinion She's very gracefully moving through the water And as mammals are wont to do She is heading up to the surface to catch a bit of a breath Before we're going back on her continuing We do love breathing Mermaid's not so much

Yeah, but like I said She's not a real mermaid I think She's a fish Right So when she was just inches away from from the surface of the water, there was a huge Chinese sturgeon,

just swimming gently, slowly overhead, when all of a sudden it took issue with her being down in the tank with it. And I actually have a couple of pictures I want to share real quick. I saw the video. It's crazy. It's great.

So I'll share this one first. How big is this sturgeon? Holy. That looks like a shark. Yeah, it's massive. Yeah, they're like shark-sized. Yeah. So just a little bit about Chinese sturgeon

for people who are uninformed. They're critically endangered, which is sad. It doesn't excuse this one's behavior. I just say that. I think it does. They can grow to be up to 16 feet long. Wow. And thankfully in this case, they actually don't have teeth,

but they're so big that their jaws, they're strong enough to, like, exert a huge amount of pressure. So it actually chomped down on her head. And this is the second picture. It's pretty amazing. It's like the whole head is in this mouth. Oh, my God. that's like Kirby right yeah it's gonna be it's gonna have mermaid powers after this and be able to

blow bubble rings or something so in this like keep in mind this is before she actually reached the surface to take a breath so she's like struggling to get it free and get some air and as you can imagine with a fish mouth over your entire head its mouth actually ripped the goggles off of her face and it left a pretty good scuff mark under her left eye and bruises all over her face. And in the video you can hear the crowd. They do almost the most stereotypical gasp of like shock and horror that you can imagine.

Just like imagine like the stock shock, shock crowd sound. That's what it sounds like. A lot of children in the crowd. It was in China, you said? In China, yes. So I'm imagining like a lot of photos taken, a lot of cameras out. Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah. So she was rushed to the hospital immediately. She said she doesn't hold it against her employers. I saw a lot of weirdly conflicting reports about how she was told to keep it hushed if she could and they try to pay her off, but also reports and direct quotes from her refuting all of these claims. It's kind of a weird fallout of this story. It seems like her employers treated her very well and she actually really enjoys working there. And she's going to get back in the water as soon as she's able.

And I liked her quote at the end of the story and all the articles I read. I guess I should have said this. I first found this in USA today, but it's a million different places. You can find kind of the same story. She's dealing with it with like a really good sense of humor. She's saying you can't take these kinds of things too seriously. Maybe it's a little embarrassing, but it's kind of funny at the end of the day. So just be cool about it.

And I don't know, I ended up liking Masha a lot. It's a good story to tell. Yeah. It's a great video. It's not. It's not like something you'd expect from a sturgeon to. No. Pretty slow moving fish.

Not that interested in anything. Man, I watched this. I'm trying to remember what it was called. I watched this documentary series on Netflix. I feel like it was just like three or four parts. And it was all about mermaids in mostly Florida. And how like competitive it is and how it's like a whole subculture that's not sexual. It can be sexual.

But it's like a this is something that. people devote their lives to being mermaids and mermaiding and like going i don't know it's crazy it's a great it was a great documentary i really liked it what does it mean to mermaid like you travel you go to parties you like work in aquariums or bars or whatever else if it's on dry land do you just like flop around kind of yeah there's jobs and gigs that are like the holy grail of mermaiding yeah it was it was a good documentary i'll try and remember Rorto was called. Okay.

It would be cool if she could add this in her act, you know? Just every time. Yeah. I'm a businessman, so that's where my head goes. Yeah. You're just trying to monetize it for. She probably made some money from the video. I'm guessing.

I wonder. All right, Mike, shut up. It's my joke. I'm done. I thought you'd never ask. Wes. Merv people is what that documentary is called. Sorry.

What's like your fallback, like, go-to thing for our news episodes when you just need a story. What do you type in? If you're just like, you know what? I need a, what's your old reliable? Tiger attack. What's you type? Tiger attack.

Tiger attack. Tiger attack. Uh-huh. Maybe India. Yeah. Tiger attack India. Sure. It's almost always in India.

The last. Where we were just in India. So I was like, you know what? I'm going to type in Tiger Attack India. Sure enough, you get a lot of results. You do. It's kind of sad how many results you get. So we just got back from India, and that's why I had it on the brain.

I was just kind of like, you know what? We saw a bunch of tigers. There's a bunch of people living right by them. Wonder what's been going on, you know? So have you heard of BandHavgar National Park West? Yeah. BandHavgar? That's not how you say it, but I also don't remember exactly how to say it.

So I'm not going to correct you. That's definitely not it. I mean, there's a lot going on in the name of it. They're hard names. Yeah, yeah. I think it's Bandragha. I can't remember. Yeah.

Well, in 2022, there were 135 tigers in this park, right? It's about 125 square miles. Okay. And they have all that we had in our tiger park that we went to, plus Indian wolf. So they got like leopard, soft bears. They got a bunch of cool stuff. some guirs. And to like, just to kind of paint the picture for people,

these tiger parks are like national parks. They're not fenced. This isn't like a safari park where it's like, oh yeah, I'll paint that, don't know. Okay, you got it.

Just the Picasso podcast. Okay, I'm sorry. So, I will hand him his brushes. Savam, well, actually,

I'll paint it using you. Okay. So you're doing the right thing. Just let me get to you, okay? All right. Frikan hand. Avant-garde technique. Chavam Bargaria in Barhut Village, Barha Village.

Okay? So I got something right there. Sure. We're going to just call him Chavam. Yeah, okay. Painting is taking shape. Yeah, so he's right out pretty much it's this village of like 250 people, like right outside this Tiger Park.

So at the, we were just in, oh, man, I keep free. in the name to dova to dova and i think it's pretty similar to the park that i'm describing right now so west very similar how protected from tigers did the farms we saw seem to you not at all really so like the scarecrows out in the farms you don't think would scare tiger i don't think they would no in fact the hotel that we were staying at was what probably like five or six miles from the park and they pretty routinely see tigers and leopards near that hotel yeah there's a village that we passed in the buffer area that literally sits against the park and the only fence i saw was about waist high which is nothing to a tiger like absolutely nothing so so farm crops in sections right

where we were seeing tigers one of my guides said the night previous there'd been a tiger in that village because he lived there and everyone had to go inside. So not very sheltered. So that field, that one like big field in the tiger park we went to, how would you feel working in the morning? I would be a little like, I would always be on edge, you know? You'd be looking around. Mike, would you be looking around at all?

No, not at all. I'm not afraid. You'd just be sitting there. Yeah, I would. I put on one of those masks on the back of my head. He wouldn't be on the field. to begin with. That's true.

Shavam knew to be looking for tigers because he grew up there. He knew how dangerous they were. They've learned to live alongside tigers, but it's in no means like a situation where they feel safe from tigers. It's just something they've adapted to, you know, this is our life. So he's being cautious all the time. He's got to do it. It's his job.

So he's out in the farm And on February 26th, his heart stops When in the morning he sees a huge Bengal tiger Come out of the jungle into his crops that he's working on That's bad So pretty scary stuff, huh? You want your heart to still be going in that scenario? Yeah

And you want the tiger to kind of be like Looking a little lost, Maybe wandering around Not the case The tiger's in like like full stock mode, crouched to the ground, kind of just eyeing him down, headed straight at him. Yeah, that doesn't sound good. Not where you want to be.

So Chavam doesn't really have any options, and he is just completely frozen with fear paralyzed. He can't move, and his mind's just like, this is it. I don't know what to do. This tiger's going to get me. But against all odds, he survived, but it is at the expense of his best friend and most loyal companion. No. No. Dude.

So, dog warning for, you know, all you dog heads out there. Okay, I'll be right back. Yeah. But it's a really, really inspiring story. Well, I don't know if inspiring's the right word, but it's like just such a brave, cool dog. Yeah. It's just like, what a cool dog. So anyways, a lot of our listeners can relate to, especially Mike and West.

Like, we've all lost a dog. Mine, though, I don't know, it's kind of a little bit different. But Mike and West were really connected to two dogs that they lost more recently than mine. Mine was like, I was still kind of a kid. But anyways, Mike, this is especially going to relate to you because the dog that Chavam had been raising for 10 years was a German shepherd. named Bentha. Please. Yeah.

That wasn't my dog's name. His best bud. Believe it or not. Yours was named Brock, like the rock Pokemon trainer. Or the, yeah, wrestling. Brock Lesner. So Bentho sees this tiger coming straight at his owner, who he loves so much, you know. Yeah.

And he interferes. He does what any good, huge dog would do. and this German Shepherd without fear, goes straight at the tiger and catches the tiger kind of off guard. I don't think tigers are very used to animals like really coming at them and like wanting to fight them, you know?

One Swiss family Robinson. Whoa, what is this? And then the tiger ends up, you know, putting out its claws, slashing up bento and biting him by the neck. And then the tiger's, still trying to go after Chavam and Bento digs his legs in and like stops the tiger again with its neck in its mouth.

Jeez. And it's just being as aggressive as possible in that situation. So again, the tiger has to like stop and reassess its situation. Like what is this animal doing? It's kind of big. And it's like really putting a bend in my plan here. It's really taking my focus off. of my prey.

So the tiger let's go of bento and just goes back into the jungle. It's like, you know what? Another day, another dollar,

I'm just out of here type of thing. Yeah. Another day, another dollar situation? Probably. I think so.

I don't know if that's right. But I, yeah. We get what you're trying to. Yeah. Say. And bento, such a badass dog,

stands up and watches this tiger until it leaves into the jungle. Like on all fours. Just like in between it and its owner. And then once the tiger is out of sight, Bentho collapses. So then Chavam picks Bentho up, carries him in his arms for 25 kilometers running to the nearest vet.

But they get to the vet. Bentho is in bad shape. I mean, a tiger just bit his neck really hard. And it's a deep gash. So the vet tries for a few hours and isn't able to save Bentho's life. and his owners obviously devastated. He gives bento full credit for saving his life. He raises him for 10 years as a pup.

And, you know, it's very tragic. But, like, I do think that's kind of, I don't know, it's too bad that they don't have, like, try bear spray or something in that area. Sounds like they kind of have a German shepherd as protection in those fields a bit, you know, like, you need a better protection for you and your dog. Yeah.

Like, I love Benther's first. for sacrificing himself. That's like such a badass way to go out. Yeah. And a dog facing off with a tiger and getting it to stop what the intentions were. It's just so cool. And, you know, really sorry to Chivam, but your dog's a legend. Totally.

For sure. Yeah. If there's a heaven for dogs, that dog's up there, you know. Eating lots of treats, chasing squirrels and rabbits. Just do what it's them. Great story. very sad. Yeah.

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Download the Priceline app or visit Priceline.com and book your next trip today. Happy price, price line. All right, is it my turn again? I think it is. It's my turn. Okay, so I'm going to talk about Bear Attack. It's one in the U.S. It's not necessarily something you expect.

My source was the Economic Times. Okay. Yeah, honestly, for almost all my stories, I consult like a bunch of different articles. So just take what you will for that. Yeah. If I ever just use one article, I'll let you guys know, but it's generally just a bunch.

Okay, yeah. All right, so on January 19th, Andrew Neer was enjoying a little, or Nyer, Andrew Nyer was enjoying a little walk in the town of Jim Thorpe, Pennsylvania, when something you don't expect to see in January emerged from the woods and started following him. And that was a 200-pound black bear. So this is kind of in the Poconos region of Pennsylvania. It's a place where it gets really cold. So you wouldn't expect to have bears out in about in mid-January.

That just isn't typical bear behavior. So when Nayer tried to run from this bear, it followed him, and then it got it close enough to actually mount an attack and bring him to the ground. There's actually like CCTV footage of this where he kind of avoids the bear and it just continues following him and he does a little half circle. And the bear just follows right in that half circle. And then he kind of stops and confronts the bear and it just jumps on him. And luckily for him, his neighbor saw and heard the commotion and arrived with a handgun. and this neighbor shot the bear, which did release its grip and ran away and died in some nearby brush.

And that same bear had been seen earlier in the day near the local market, and both its general behavior and the fact that it was up looking for food seemed pretty strange. And I agree with that. And when I watched this video, I thought, man, that's like a predatory bear, but it's kind of odd how casual it's being about this predation. It wasn't like stalking or really, it just seems strange to me when I watched it. And I fully think this guy's neighbor saved his life. I think had this guy not shown up,

the bear probably would have killed him. Anyway, one thing that I just want to talk about really quickly is that even though bears are hibernators, and you'll hear, especially in the past, you'll hear discourse about whether or not they're actually hibernators. Some people say, because it's more of a torpor they enter, it's not necessarily hibernation.

But I do want to just make clear that most bear biologists, myself included, do consider what black bears and grizzly bears do in North America and throughout the northern hemisphere, we do consider that hibernation. Their metabolism drops to a level where, you know, it's hibernation. There's different physiological processes that happen that happen in hibernation. It's just something that we really consider efficient hibernation, which means rather than like these other animals that essentially go into a coma when they enter hibernation, bears can come out of it quite quickly.

So they're really good at just kind of going in and out of these different phases. And when a bear comes out of hibernation in the winter, if it's warm enough outside, and if the bear kind of gets these context clues from the weather outside, sometimes they'll actually leave the den and even go looking for food during that hibernation period. That's not unheard of. Me and Jeff had one really warm winter where we were trying to get into bear dens and kind of check their collars and whatnot. And because it was so warm, we really didn't find many bears that were fully asleep. Almost all of them were partly awake and they would run away when they heard us coming.

So it really can't affect the depth of their hibernation and whether or not they're going to wake up or not. Anyway, that's just a little aside. Any questions before I continue? Mike? It makes me think of the movie, The Passengers or whatever, where Chris Pratt wakes up. What's her name? Yeah, I never saw that movie. You think any bears ever like, what did you think bears ever wake each other up and be like,

Like, well, I don't know what happened, but it's just because they were bored and lonely because they were supposed to be sleeping, but they're not. Wasn't that movie supposed to be, like, unfathomably bad? I'm not sure. No. I feel like it got, like, some of the worst reviews ever. I feel like it was just, like, it didn't live up to the hype. It was just boring.

Just mid. And it's, like, in retrospect, it's, like, actually not very romantic. It's more psychotic. It's pretty, it's wild because she ends up kind of just, she figures out that he woke her up. We don't have to get into this, but she falls in love with him anyway. And it's like, I don't know if that's a good message, but whatever. Persistence, man, you know. It's not even that. That's one word for it. Making yourself the only manipulation.

Anyway, this bear's behavior is far from typical, even for a bear that's coming out of its den midwinter. And sure enough, when they autopsied the carcass, they did find that this tested positive for rabies, which makes it one of a small handful of bears to have been tested positive for the virus since 1999. There have been like five or six bears total in the U.S. that have tested positive for rabies. So it's really not common. It's much more common in the eastern U.S. than it would be in the western U.S., but still they're not typical vectors for the rabies virus. Bats, foxes, raccoons, skunks, dogs. Those are the kind of, or dogs are not really anymore either.

They've kind of eradicated in dogs. Those are the animals that you generally see it in. Bears, it's not typical, but it is possible. And pretty interesting, actually, that this bear was rabbit. It really doesn't happen. Yeah. Near was fine, or Nyer. Sorry, Nyer was fine.

Didn't blame the bear. Good interview with him where he just said, you know, these animals have to eat. And that's what it was trying to do. But that was before he knew it was rabbit, I think. No, I'm actually really glad you said that because I responded to a listener who asked like, hey, is it common for bears to be rabid? I was like, no, it's really not.

But it's kind of like I probably shouldn't just say that. You got it right. Good job, dude. All right. Who's next, Mike? Yeah, let me take over real quick. So this is from WLBT.com reported recently. This one...

Ooh, I got one like that, too. Yeah, one that was reported recently. From from WW something Okay Yeah that's the WWW dot That's yeah

Anywhere page Jeff Great So I'm just realizing now that I didn't really bring to the table Many like true Violent animal attacks That's okay I'm going for it anyway

This is a good one So this one isn't so much an animal attack I guess unless you consider a crossbow an animal I don't Probably don't Not at all It's so Is there any argument that it is?

I can't come out of it. So this one takes place at a little shop you guys might be familiar with. Birds by Joe 2. You ever heard of Birds by Joe 2? I don't know. I didn't know there was a second one.

I know. It's like a sequel kind of thing. So it's in New Jersey and it's owned by Katerina Rukka Vishnikova. So again, another one by Joe. Yeah. No.

Interesting name for her. Odd. But, so this actually, the story takes place or starts on January 23rd of 2025. And this is when Katerina's. Birds by Joe does have a little bit better ring to it than birds by Katarina Vichnikova. Birds by, birds by cat. I don't know. Yeah, we could have done a better job.

Is two like T-O-O? Like she's saying, like Joe owns them too? Nope. It's just the number two. All right. She really should have consulted you guys on naming the store. She seems to be doing fine with it though. So she didn't need us.

So this is January 23rd, 2025. Katerina's bad look starts on this date. It started when a hooded man walked into Birds by Joe 2. Started asking after an African gray parrot that the store had up for sale. And what do we know? We know they're smart. They're smart. They talk a lot.

Yeah. And the thing that really kind of threw her for a loop at first was he knew all the right questions to ask. He was like, I don't know. Is it want a cracker? Yeah. If this bird's name was Polly, would it want a cracker hypothetically? Kind of thing. But so that kind of, that put Katerina ease.

She's like, usually people who are causing trouble don't really bother to do the kind of homework that this guy seemed to have done. But all of a sudden, he grabbed the bird, Caj and all, still in its, cage and he just booked it out of the store. And this is like a $7,000 parrot. And she was so stunned at first. She was kind of motionless and she freaked out and probably pursued. Like the tiger. Yeah.

Right. Like the guy at the tiger. Right. The bird. Yeah. Right. Very a lot of similarities now that you mentioned that. So he's gone.

He took off. She couldn't catch him. None of the authorities caught up with them, at least for a while. Thankfully, the store's cameras, did capture what happened. And they were later posted to the Instagram account, and it was returned to her eventually. All those parrots could be witnesses, too.

You know? True. Yeah. Just ask me what I'll tell you. Yeah. Actually, it made me want to ask the question. I know the ownership of exotic animals is kind of a no-go zone. What are your opinions on exotic birds, Wes?

Is that more of a gray area, or is that, like, okay, is it cool? I just, I don't know. For me, if they're like born in captivity and they're given a suitable enclosure and like enrichment and all the things you need to give a pet, I'm okay with it. But I'm not okay with like people taking them out of the wild or doing it irresponsibly. So yeah, take that for what you will. There's probably people that don't agree with me. That's personally how I feel about it. Sure. Okay. Well, like I said, an anonymous tip got the police to pursue and apprehend, not apprehend actually, sorry, I misspoke. The suspect was a 24-year-old man named Onix Calderon,

which is probably the coolest name I've heard in a long time. He actually remains on the loose. They never caught him, but they did find the bird and return it to Birds by Joe, too. They know who he is? They know his name. It seems like that's the hard step. Catching him's easy now.

Really? Just because you know his name, it doesn't mean you know where he is. Maybe he fled. Probably not a white-scale man-hunt for stealing a parrot. If that's what it takes, yeah, maybe he's going to try. I think they'll probably forget about this pretty quickly. Yeah, well, here's a variable that was inserted into the equation

that might help him get away a little bit easier because something much crazier happened at the same shop a couple weeks later. So this is February 18th, about a month later. cops responded to a call from birds by Joe 2 and what they found on the scene was something that I would personally call unexpected if you will so Catarina through a bloody mouth told them that she had just taken a crossbow bolt to the face from a store regular so interesting

it started when she heard again this guy was a store regular his name is Raymond Carey he was mumbling something in the back of the store and since she knew him, she kind of bustled down the aisle and asked him to repeat what he said. But when she got close, he pulled a crossbow out of a little bag. So I guess it's like a mini crossbow. And like almost from point blank just blasted her in the face with it. And it went through her face. Crazy Mike. Sorry. Sorry. So the arrow went through her face and ripped up her lip and her tongue. But before you could get a second shot off, she knocked the crossbow out of his hand and he took off. She ran out to a nearby bike shop and asked for help, told him to call the police and when they responded to the scene,

this is what they saw. They rushed her to the hospital and she had like a bunch of her teeth on her lower jaw had to be removed. They're thinking probably some more have to be removed in the coming weeks. That would be so surprising. I know. Like a guy you've known. What's he pulling out of this bag? Oh, a fucking crossbow. Crossbow. Yeah. So this case was closed quite a bit quicker than the last one, believe it or not. So 1 p.m. the next day, police found and detained Raymond in a small Jersey Shoretown.

And he's now being charged with attempted first degree murder. Wow. But just as he was found one day later, so too as Katarina found one day later back in the store working. She's just like all bandaged up. And that's pretty sweet. I don't know. Like, when I think about Russian women, I think about, like, very hearty, like, I'll take a crossbow arrow to the face and that's not going to even face me kind of thing.

A shot of vodka is all that need. I think of the lady in Golden Eye who, like, kills people with their thighs. Yeah, on a top was her last name. That's how I remember. That's what I think of Russian women. I remember watching that pretty young and kind of being like, what's going on here? I was like, that was like one of my first. first like, oh yeah, I got some feeling here.

Yeah, it's definitely where I, like, first kind of figured out that maybe I wouldn't mind having a girlfriend who could kick my ass, you know? Yeah. When they're fighting in that little bathhouse thing. Like, pain's not always a bad thing. Yeah. Maybe I'd begin to getting, like, dominated. Yeah, sure.

Girls. There you go. At least be willing to consider it. Yeah. I mean, I think that's, Famkee Jansen. I think that's, yeah, Phamke-Jensen.

Yeah, arena on a top. Is that her name? I'm looking it up right now. Yeah, that was a big movie for me. That also was some of my first awakenings, Jeff. Zinia. Zina on a top. Okay.

The end when they're doing like the heat camera and he's like on top of her. That far, I was like, whoa. That wasn't, was that golden eye? I thought that was the one with Christmas Jones. Oh, that is. That's one with Denise Richards.

Yeah, Yeah, tomorrow never dies. Christmas comes twice is the line that I remember. Oh, geez. What does that mean? I never understood that joke, Wes. Kids, don't worry about it. It's just James Bond.

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Yeah, really been a hard couple weeks. Jeff, what do you got next? All right, let's take a trip down south. All right. How south can we go? Pretty south. Until there's people. No, like South. Oh, South South. In the Americas, yeah. Sure. Tierra de Fuigo.

The most South you can think of. Ushwaya, Argentina. Like countries. Oh. Argentina, Chile. Yeah. We're going to Ponte Eres, Chile. Putta arenas.

Yeah. Putta arenas. Probably. Yeah. Putta Arenas Chile. Is that right? Is that right? Is that right?

I thought I nailed it. the first time, but then you sound like you're correcting me. Benda Punta Arenas, but... No, that sounds right. Punta Arenas. Adrian Samanca's was kayaking with his father Del in Bahia El Aguña, Aguilla. I speak Spanish. Yeah.

Bahia El Agia near San Isidro Lighthouse in the St. of Magellan. So everyone knows where that. That is, right? Eagle Bay. Yeah. I think Magellan found it first. Not first, but, yeah. He was there.

Recorded history, you mean. Sure, Western colonial history. Yep. No, recorded. Yeah, okay, sure, yeah. Some of these other cultures recorded stuff. I'm sure they were recording things. I don't think they recorded straights in the ocean.

I think that's maybe selling them a little bit short. All right. Okay. Anyways, you know what, I'm going to give a little bit of credit to Magellan for finding this. Magellan did a lot. Yes, very important to that region. But you know who found it before him? Who?

Before any of us with? Seals. Humpback whales. All right. Humpback whales have always known about Magellan straight before they even changed the name from what humpbacks had named it. Yeah. They just called it. They can't even say Magellan, I bet.

So anyways, father and son, they're kayaking. They're having great time. It's beautiful. You know, Chile, you get the huge mountains with the beaches. Beautiful place to be, beautiful place to be out in the water. They're just having fun. Yeah. You know?

Well, you know it wasn't so fun, Wes? What? When Adrian was swore. hole with his kayak by a humpback whale. Sounds fun to me. Good. Now that's a big mouth. That is a big mouth.

Like, I told a news story once where a lobster diver got swallowed for like 30 seconds by a humpback. And then it spat him out. In Boston. In Boston. But, like, he wasn't in a kayak. Yeah. This was what came out and swallowed the entire kayak with the kid. Which there is some other videos that we've seen of that.

happening. But this one's one of the more compelling ones. What color was the kayak? Yeah. Orange. Banana. Probably thought it was a banana. Was it yellow?

Oh. I think it was yellow. I thought it was orange. We also never agree on colors. That's true. Canalope. It's the least important aspect of this story. You needed to know my...

I regret. I'm going to just stop. Never mind. Listeners, I want you to know. Yes. Yellow. Very yellow. Banana yellow.

I forgot. I was wrong. Oh, man. So, yeah, that still doesn't make what Mike said true, though. It doesn't think it's a giant banana necessarily. No. You know what? Sometimes whales just don't see where they're going because they go a lot of places, you know?

Yeah, I don't think that makes any kind of sense. I've seen the video. And what I think happened, unless you were already going to talk about this. I mean, you saw one with an orange kayak. Well, I've seen a bunch. There's been a few of these. Humpback whales are eating really small things. They curtail all these things that are generally quite small.

But they also can eat schooling balls of fish. And they're really good at kind of corraling those fish into a certain area. And then they'll come up. And I forget what the name of the behavior is. But it's essentially they create a net with bubbles and what. whatnot and then they come up through the it's called a bubble net i'm pretty sure that with the what's the behavior is but they come up through the middle of it and they can consume a very large amount of fish in one gulp and if you just happen to be kayaking over that spot when that

whale comes up mouth open it would swallow you whole it would immediately spit you back out which i assume is what happened here but it would swallow you whole Adrian was in there for a few seconds and he was pretty scared he thought he was going to die I'd be terrified. Yeah. And like, it's especially dangerous in this one compared to the lobster diver because the lobster diver, you could just get blown out the blowhole. But with a kayak, that's not possible.

I don't agree with that. But so, like, he's stuck in there unless the whale spits it out. No blowhole. That's out of the equation. So it spits him out and he's like just panicked. Now he's worried about his dad. He's like, the whales are going to go eat my dad. and the whales, the whale's done eating them, you know, it's gone.

Yeah. And then he's like, I'm going to get hyperthermia, but he's just in a panic state. And now what I liked is Del, his dad, was just recording everything. He was like kind of chill about it. He, like, didn't lose his, like, focus with the camera. He kept recording. Praise to the cameraman. Good job, you know, you want.

For once he got a right. And especially now, like, I'm sure he was scared for his son's sake. safety, but like, especially now that his son's fine. I'm sure he's pretty happy that he got all the footage. Such a good video. You know? Yeah. It's kind of funny because when they're getting out of there, he just kind of drags him and his boat.

Yeah. It's not like he ever, he doesn't get back on the boat. The dad just drags him and the kayak away from the area. Yeah. No, you know, cool dad though. And that happened February 8th. And then just because that one's kind of short, I have one other little coyotes be wilding headline here.

Let's hear it. Oh, yeah. So a new study off the coast of Fort Bragg, California, led by UC Santa Cruz PhD student Frankie Garrity. Her and her team recorded that Harbor Seal Pups, that coyotes prey on Harbor Seal Pups in that area. And, you know, they had found some carcasses that were pretty torn up over the years. So then they put out cameras and did actual study. And you know what? God, it'll just be wild.

Not everyone knows that they're just killing seals. Clubbing baby seals out there. Yeah. Yeah. All right. Sorry, seals. Yeah, it's all right. There's plenty of seals.

Okay. Yeah. You loved that seal commercial for the Super Bowl? I didn't like it at all. You didn't? I didn't. Where seal was a seal? Did you get it?

Yeah, I thought it was lazy. Yep. I sure did. Are you sure you get the joke? I got it. Yeah. I guess I really didn't because I didn't think it was funny at all. Oh, no, it's because his name was seal.

Right, his name's seal and he's a seal. Yeah. All right. On February 7th, a 55-year-old Canadian woman was snorkeling and swimming off of Providenciales Turks and Caicos in the Caribbean in waste deep water when suddenly something bumped into her and then she was bitten on the thigh by a medium-sized six-foot shark. And the shark was never fully identified in any of the articles that I read.

But based off the behavior, this bump and bite behavior, the fact that it's the Caribbean shallow water, I'm guessing this is a bull shark. If I was a betting man, which I am, I bet some good money that this is a bull shark. I thought by Identify, you were like, we know it wasn't Jim, Jim the shark out there. It was, yeah. No, not the individual shark, the species of shark. And again, this is a reason why I think. Bull shark bite numbers are probably a bit underreported because they often are a hard shark to identify. They don't have markings like tiger sharks. They're not as universally well known as

Great Whites. So often they kind of go unidentified as some sort of Requiem shark. Anyway, I do think this was probably a bull shark. When she was bitten on the thigh, she put her hands out to try and either push the shark away or prevent another bite. And when she did that, the shark bid on to both of her hands. Like let go of her thigh and bitter hands? Yeah, and sawed through them pretty quickly. While it was biting them, her husband ran out, got to her side, managed to somehow separate her and the shark.

Some of the articles said he wrestled the shark away. Some say that, you know, just splashing out there was enough to discourage the shark. But he dragged her up on shore, and there are some photos of people gathered around her holding towels to her arms. And she was treated in a hospital on the island and then flown back to Canada for more treatment and surgery. She ended up having one of her hands amputated at the wrist and the other one about halfway up her forearm.

Oh my gosh. She lost both hands to the shark, which is super unfortunate. That's all you've got, I think. Completely life-changing. Yeah. And there's not really like, I think if you're being attacked by a bull shark in waste, deep water on your vacation out of the blue, there's no way that you can prepare yourself to really react to that, you know?

but I do think the more targets you give an animal like that, the more you kind of have to be willing to sacrifice those parts of your body. So that's just something to keep in mind. If it's already focused on like your thigh or something, maybe that's just where you let it focus while you try and get to help or anything else. And again, I'm not blaming her. I think I would probably do the exact same thing. I'd probably try and push the shark off.

I think it'd be almost impossible to not try to like do something with your hands. Yeah, but that's the only thing I could think of. They are thrashing around when they're biting. They're hard to keep a hold of. I think we've done a number of stories where people end up with some pretty crazy hand injuries trying to fight off sharks. So if it's possible, try not to get your hands too involved. Stick your head in there instead.

Yeah, try and push it off with your head. Yeah, that'll work really well. One thing that I thought was unfortunate is there's this narrative online. A lot of the articles, again, that I found said that she was trying to take a photo of the shark. and that's why it attacked. I didn't see any evidence for that. I don't believe it. I don't think a 55-year-old Canadian woman on vacation and waste deep water is trying to

approach sharks. That just doesn't really add up to me. That's a judgment call on my part, and she could have been trying to get really close to it for a photo, but I kind of don't. To me, it feels like, and again, this is another judgment call, it feels like something maybe the authority said to try and bring down panic levels for this particular bite. because this isn't an island that's known for shark attacks or shark bites. So I think that when they do happen, it kind of creates a lot of media frenzy.

Conspiracy West strikes again. You had flat earth. Got my tin hat on. I'm not a flat earth. Moon landing, who knows? Just kidding. Anyway, I looked up the Florida shark attack file for Turks and Caicos. They've had three attacks on record since like the 1700s pretty much.

So this isn't a high frequency place. This isn't a place where you'd expect to run into sharks or getting bit by a shark. But there was one just a couple years ago. It's the same beach pretty much where a woman got her leg bit off. So they have happened with a little bit more frequency. Buy a shark. Yeah. Anyway.

It'd be nice. Maybe that sharks collect building a Frankenstein person. That's a good thought. Yeah. It'd be great if all of our body parts started off with baby versions like we have with our teeth and you just lose them. and you can grow the adult version. Like you just have baby hands until you get your adult ones.

Then they'd grow back. That'd be great. Or like that Spider-Man villain who just wants to make us lizards. Yeah. Kurt Connors? Is that his name? I think sounds alliterative enough

to be a Marvel name. All right. And then my next story is another quick one. As you guys all know, as we've talked about a little bit on the podcast early this year, there was devastating fires in Southern California, mostly around Los Angeles.

hundreds, if not thousands of people, lost their homes. It was just crazy to behold, even from a distance, to see the kind of devastation and just truly apocalyptic sites coming out of Southern California. Just really quick before we launch in the story, our hearts still go out to those of our listeners that were affected by that. Such an insane tragedy. And we definitely were thinking about you this year. But someone that got pretty lucky during that whole thing is this guy named Sammy Arbid.

in his family. Seems like a genuinely lucky person. Because he and his wife had moved into a house in Altadena, California, not long before the Eaton fire destroyed large areas of that community. And his house was spared from the fires, but came within a block of being destroyed. Pretty lucky. He's also lucky because he had a 550-pound black bear denning in the crawl space under his house, which a lot of people might not think is lucky. I consider that pretty lucky.

You have a little space for one in your place. I do. We got a little crawl space just like this. He would love to have one in the day. Any bears out there that are listening come den in my crawl space. Happy to have you. He and his wife had discovered this bear prior to the fires when they'd heard clanking sounds beneath the bedroom.

They peaked in the crawl space and they saw a huge male bear. It had probably moved in while the house was for sale and unoccupied. And it seemed to be kind of settled in there. This is Southern California. So these bears aren't necessarily. Unless they're pregnant, they're not really denning the way they would in other places. In California, they probably have squatters, right? Yeah.

You will actually get to that. They slow down a bit during the winter, but it's probably still going out for food and stuff. It's not in a full hibernative state. Anyway, so they tried to see what could be done. They learned that this bear had been fed by a neighbor, so it's food condition, not really afraid of humans. That's bad. And it's mostly quiet under their house, but sometimes it would bang into pipes, and then their dogs would lose. their minds so they actually had to move where they were sleeping to a different

room with the dogs to try and not have these nightly barking frenzies that's crazy they're just like you got to keep living with it well so they called animal control and the California Department of Fish and Wildlife but they were told there's nothing they could do and hopefully the bear would leave in the spring it is crazy that's very surprising to me I don't think that would be the response here in Montana I'm pretty sure they would say oh yeah we'll come get rid of that bear. Anyway, the fires then happened. They were forced to evacuate their home, and the bear was still there, comfortably sleeping. When they got back to the house, their house was

spared. Bear's still there. The gas company goes to turn the gas back on. Can't do it because there's a 550-pound bear in the way of the gas. So the difference now is that their house was in a recovery area following the fire. So they were finally able to get the wildlife department to their house to remove the bear. This is a big bear. 550 pounds is a huge for a black bear. Yeah. Yeah.

So it's really too big to sedate and try and pull out there. So instead, what they did is they got a trap. They placed it near the crawl space entrance. They baited it with a rotissory chicken, sardines, and apples smeared with peanut butter. Oh, yeah. That works. That'd get me.

Yeah. Jeff, we've done some black bear trapping. How long would you guess it took for them to catch this bear? Like right next to it a day. Minutes. Yeah. This trap had been baited for minutes and this bear came out. And if this were a really wild bear, I think it would take days, if not weeks, to catch it.

This is a food-conditioned bear. So I think the second it caught whiff of that combo, which is a pretty... 550 pounds is like the biggest black bear I've heard of. Yeah, it's seen a lot of human food. So it immediately crawls out, immediately gets trapped. They put a GPS collar on it and took it into the Angeles National Forest and released it. And I would bet the farm this bear will be back in Altadena within, it's probably back already. Yeah, it's probably already there.

You have to relocate food condition bears a really long distance for them not to come back. Like I think you'd have to take this bear hundreds of miles away for it not to come back. So unfortunately, these departments often don't have the money or the manpower to do that. So they took it to the closest wilderness area. And I would bet a lot of money it's going to be back. Man, that's crazy. Yeah, it's a big old bear. Have a 550-pound black bear living under your house and you just got to live with it.

I kind of like it, but it's like crazy. Pretty amazing. The biggest grizzly bear I ever caught was like that big. and it was big. Like it was a lot of bear to handle. So, yeah, that's huge. What do you think? Do you think bears prefer smooth or chunky peanut butter?

Probably smooth. Really? I doubt they really care much. Yeah. Me too, but you're the expert. Second is a 10 sexist. They probably don't care either way. Introducing the new best skin ever,

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but we only recently learned about it because of some legal proceedings, legal developments. So last May, Craig and Lisa Manders were on a 10-day tour through Zambia when they were walking pretty close to a river and the lawsuit goes that there was not adequate protection or warning issued to them to alert them to the dangers that a hippopotamus could pose, which, you know, like a lot of people, I, for instance, four years ago would probably have last. critical information got myself into a similar situation if the situation presented itself as such. But a hippo came up from the river when it saw Lisa nearby. It kind of burst its head up out of the water and rushed right at her and started just going to town with its mouth,

munched on her, lifted her up off the ground and, quote, shaking her entire body, crushing her head and body with its bite. Which is just, I can't. And her husband was... Unbelievable awful to have to see that happen to someone in your family. I just can't even imagine it. And you're a stranger in a strange land. And all of a sudden, I mean, there's, it was over so quick, I'm sure.

Like, she had no time to even really register exactly or feel. Yeah, I'm hoping, silver lining. It's a tragedy all around. But like, it just goes to show that these animals are not to be trifled with. Males can get up to 3,000 pounds. And they're fast. know, they can move quick. They're not ungulate or cat speed or even bare speed,

maybe like 20 to 25 miles per hour they can get up to. Yeah, they are ungulates. Yeah. They are ungulates. That's right. Yeah. What do you think about their milk being pink? Interesting.

You know, it's cool. Is that true? Did we decide that that was? Yeah. I think it's true. Yeah. I think yak milk might be pink, right? That's what we're talking about.

Well, anyway, another interesting wrinkle to this whole thing is the number I saw thrown around that the tour company, not even like the guides over in Zambia, they're being sued for $15,000, which seems really, really low. Yeah, that does seem low. And it's a strange one. The debate's really been around whether the tour guides should have to, or the tour kind of middlemen that planned the itinerary, but really had nothing to do with what happened on the ground over in Zambia, whether they should have to assume any responsibility.

or not. It doesn't seem like it to me. Like they, maybe I guess there should have been a footnote or a bullet point saying like watch out for the hippos, but that kind of seems like boots on the ground kind of information that the actual tour guides maybe should have been providing. I don't know. Yeah, I do think there's some liability. I think that when you hire a company like this to do wildlife tourism and help you through this, you know, this ecosystem you don't necessarily understand, you are placing some trust in them for your safety. And obviously they can't You know, a safari has an element of danger to it.

That's kind of what makes it exciting. But on one of our safaris, I remember in Zimbabwe, one of our guests kind of was getting close to a waterhole. Not close, close. Like, they were still probably 60 yards away. And our guide was like, stop and was very adamant that they come back because of crocodiles. And I appreciated that. I think that you do need to, as a guide, you need to have your head on a swivel. So there is some liability, in my opinion.

Yeah. You need her to be like Linda Blair. Just heads spinning in around. Swive one around, dude. I've got to sell that soul to the devil. All right. Well, let's go under our categories because I want to talk about India. Are you guys ready to talk about India?

Let's go. Yeah. Okay. Before we get into it, let's give a quick shout out to all of our participants on that trip. Like the rest of our trips. Yeah, all of them, too. I'm not going to leave them out. Like all of our trips, we had really fun participants on this one. I just, I already missed them all.

Yeah. I want to text them, but I don't want to be annoying. So everyone knows it went on this trip We really enjoyed our time with you guys And had such a wonderful memorable time Yeah everyone thank you so much All you were great Yeah those people were Ben Kirsten Jackie

Cassie Chantelle Kristen Kara Julie Lauren Sarah Sam Haley Andrew Asha Asha sorry Libby and Christine We had a lot of K names

We had Kirsten, Kristen, Kera, Christine. Got a little confusing. And then our guides in Ahal and Sora, just a great time. Love them. We had the best time. So let's talk about it a little bit. Yeah, I did love them. The first question, first category, we had some amazing wildlife experiences on this trip.

I'm curious what your guys' favorite was, your favorite wildlife experience while we were in India. My favorite was the first tiger I saw on my birthday. and it was a female with three cups and I saw her scare like 15 deer out of the forest and then they went in like some deep grass and I think she saw where one went in but she couldn't see it in the grass because she like pounced into the grass

and was like looking for it in the air so that was really cool and then a little baby like came out of the grass and was on the road and the tiger was like right next to it and I was like turahe it Because I'm a sicker. Yeah.

I love a kill. I love a good kill. Mike? Tigers's been the top of my list of favorite animals ever since I can remember. It's top of my kiss list, you know? It's not even at the top right now, though, right? What do you mean? Isn't Cheetah ahead of it?

No, as far as favorite animals, no. It's still not even a debate. My favorite animal sighting probably goes to the Cheetah that we saw in Kenya. Yeah, but that's different things. But on this trip, a couple of our cars had the really, really good fortune of encountering a gigantic male tiger. I forgot his name. I should have written it down. Yeah.

But we were- The biggest tiger in Tadoba. It was huge. And we were hovering over it for maybe 30, 35 minutes, maybe even longer than that. But I think it was almost an hour. Yeah. It was amazing. It was so cool to watch it.

Just kind of plop down, even like, get in the water, take a little. little bit of a bath under the sun, get up and move around a little bit more. But there was this moment when we were parked perpendicular to it and it got up and it started walking directly towards our car and it locked eyes with me when it was about 15 feet away. And it was really, really getting close. And it just clicked in my brain. Everyone else in the car had their cameras up. And I know there's a little bit of a disconnect that happens when you have a device in front of your face and you kind of forget

like that spatial what it means to be that close to an animal like that. I didn't have anything between me and the tiger so I started kind of making sound nervous sounds about how close it was getting

and people started laughing at me but it just made me realize that if this tiger wanted to it very easily from that distance could have just pounced up and ripped my head off you know. Nothing's incredible.

Yeah. Our guides were getting pretty nervous too like they kept trying to great distance between that tiger. So yeah, that was great. I echo that the tiger sightings were amazing. I counted and I saw 16 tigers, including nine cubs, which is crazy. It's a lot. And we did five safaris in Todoba. My favorite was the snow leopard, though. We spent the first few days of the trip, really looking hard for a snow leopard, suffering some pretty cold, miserable conditions in the Himalayas. And when we finally found one,

It was one that had killed a blue sheep the night before. Blue sheep. Are you kidding me right now? My Kate's that name. It was kind of just hanging out of the mountain, just waiting for the cover of darkness to go back down and feed again. And for me, it was kind of a dream because I'm the person that wants to leave last from a good wildlife sighting. I really like staying for a long time to observe behavior. And our guides were pretty much like, okay, we're here until dark.

We got there at first light and we were there until it got dark. And for me, that was such a dream to know that we weren't leaving and that I got to just watch it all day. And we did. We watched it for like 13 to 15 hours that day, which was amazing. And happened to be the day I had diarrhea, which was poor timing. Had to dig a lot of little holes around that area. You started making a lot closer trips by the end. Oh, yeah.

At first I like wandered really far for privacy. and then I was just like crouching down behind cars at the end. It's really lucky. You told me I'd get deli belly. I didn't. I did get it. I still yet to have any diarrhea ever in my adult life. I'm sorry.

All right. Okay. Let's go on to our next one. Also, oh, go ahead. Should we shout out what we saw? We were like camping with a pack of wolves, which was really cool. Mm-hmm.

Saw Himalayan links. Eurasian links. Really high. Dole Frickens mic know To correct me there You guys We're gonna

Yeah He just pays it Yeah We're gonna get into that though We have another category to list Your top five mammals And top five birds Oh yeah

Shut up It's all right Next one though Is favorite place we visited In India We also saw some really cool places So what was your favorite place We went to?

I loved the Buddhist monastery That we visited in Ladakh I think it's just a byproduct of having grown up around Christian iconography and infrastructure. And I love just visiting other spiritual places. And there's something to be said for, you know, more typical cathedrals, churches, whatever. But I just don't have that experience all that often to visit like a Buddhist or a Sikh or a Hindu or even a mosque. You know, we visited kind of a little bit of all of those places. but the Buddhist monastery in Ladakh was pretty amazing to me.

It was just monks living there full time. It was just such like a pervasive. It was built into the mountain like on top of a peak. Yeah. And I could just feel the piece like sinking into me. It was great. Totally. That was my pick too.

But I'll do a backup, which was also a Buddhist place. It was really hard to like climb up it because we were in the high altitude. Yeah. Upwards climb. That was my day that I was feeling. like the best though so I it that one for me was like an easy one but later on I really felt it room back village where we were camping there's a tiny little village above us where sometimes they let people stay in like in homes and stuff and it just had this really quaint villagey buddhist

feel to it and we kind of got to interact with some of the locals there a kid with a dog some a lady that was selling these like wool, snow leopard dolls that she made. It's just a really neat little tiny village that we got to go to a couple times that I really fell in love with. So that was my backup answer. It was a roomback village in the Himalayas of India. Yeah. No, those were, that's my answer too, just because the people there were so cool.

Like in both of those, Ladok was just, I don't know. I really liked it. But since you guys said I'll go Hindi temple. I got my new number one favorite fountain show. I've ever seen. Awesome for the good fountain show. Passes Bellagio, passes Coalompore's fountain show.

Palace of Versa. Really just top-notch stuff using laser lights in the fountain. Pretty awesome. Yeah. Pyrotechnics, like, projections. It was pretty cool. We weren't allowed our phones,

which we did even better. Yeah. Cool. All right. Next one is most memorable or if you choose dumbest argument that we had while we were in India. Wes, I want you, you should go first and see. I'll go first.

We had some dumb ones. Obviously we went down some pretty dumb threads. But the one that I think I got, for whatever reason, like the most incensed about was when we were talking about fast food. And I can't remember which of you two it was. There's vehement that in and out's not fast food. And it's not I'm okay to be the minority in this one.

It's not. Yeah. And so for me, I feel like there's different levels of fast food, but something is quantified as fast food by like having a drive-through and being fast. It's not. When's the last time you went to in and out and the line was less than like eight hours long? There's like 50 million cars.

It's still built to be fast. But they get through the line, the cars fast. Yeah, each order is processed very quickly. They do. And I agree with you that it's elevated fast food. Like it is a higher quality than your McDonald's or Burger King or whatever. But it is the quintessential fast food restaurant to me. It's like it's stylized in a fast food manner.

Is Cafe Rio fast food? No. Why not? I think it can be. It could be. I wouldn't, you know, I would have died through one in Salt Lake. But, well, to me, like that line's drawn a little bit differently for everyone. A restaurant that you come into and you like pick out.

out what you want isn't necessary well i guess subway though and i would definitely say subway is fast food yeah i think it's a fuzzier line but for me like in and out is easily in the fast food category so that was one of my favorite arguments we there's no real big difference besides quality of food between it and mcdonalds right that's it it's just quality of food right and i have that that's a big deal to me all right fast food tastes like garbage in and out doesn't see that's where i disagree. It's a definite line. But then like when I say what's everyone's favorite fast food burger and where someone says like I really like in and out and you're like I don't even think that's fast food. It's kind of like well come around. Yeah. Well that's exactly how the argument went.

I know. It's pretty close. That's not far from it. Yeah. What Mike, why don't you go next? I'll go. So that was actually my first choice to you, but a very, very close second was from the other side. Yeah, right. Again, I'm willing to be in the minority, and it is a hill I'll die on. But this one is after we landed in Nagpur. I tried a bite of a sandwich that they're handing out on the in-flight meal for the in-flight snack. And I was asked to rank it on a scale of 1 to 10. And I said, well, the bite I just took tastes like nothing.

So I guess like a 4? And like fill in the gaps on this one, Wes. Okay. Because you're kind of the main opponent on this one. And then you said, then you said, what would be the number for neutral? And I said,

no, I never use the word neutral. You did. No, I did not. No, you did. And then I said,

no, you did. I said, are you, no one said, are you kidding me, Mike? No,

because I clearly remember saying, Mike, are you joking? Like five. But then Wes was like, what are you talking about? I was like, five is,

Clearly neutral. It's in the middle of 1 to 10. Like there's like by definition, that would be neutral. Would it not? But then I said, I don't think that's always neutral because sometimes like if you like way more food than you don't like, then the line might be like three or four. And that makes absolutely no sense to me because five is still neutral no matter what. It doesn't have to be.

Like if you have to be. If three is in the middle. Even if you have more ones and two. Like if you have like. half of your food are ones and two. Yeah. Let me set up an experience here though. Let's say you have a thousand different foods and you have to rank those thousand foods and

almost all of them are six, sevens or eights. That means that you just like a lot more food. But if you were to say, what number should I assign to one of these foods that's neutral, it would be five. Like there's no doubt there. Five is in the middle. It's halfway between terrible and the best. it's neutral.

Sure. I just want to make this very clear. I specifically remember to everyone in the group because the whole group was sitting there listening to us. I promise you I never used the word neutral. It doesn't even matter though. I remember. What did you say?

It tastes like nothing. That's what I said. It tastes like nothing. You asked us what number would represent nothing. Yeah, nothing. Like what would you give something that tastes like nothing? And I think there's a lot of, of different things.

Like Jeff already touched on it. Like presentation or mouth feel, there's a lot of things. I say something that tastes like nothing could be like a four or it could be a six depending on all the factors included. We did like get into neutrality though. I'll take my statement back. I'm not sure if he said nothing or neutral. Right.

I do know he asked like what number would represent. I did ask that. And then I did ask you what number would you say is neutral and you've kind of balked on like I said five. I settled on saying five, but I knew what you were trying to do because you're a manipulative. I wasn't trying to drive you. Oh, you were. I was appealing to your logic.

You're a logical man. All right. Yeah, not so much, it turns out. All right, Jeff. This is a fun category. Mine was more, I don't know, I can't think of like a really funny one, but me and Wes got in an argument about if lions are the king of the jungle or if tigers. are the king of the jungle. Yeah.

And I think we both had some good arguments. Wes, of course, I end up doing like the, I'm a wildlife biologist line somewhere in there. That's not a line. But I think, it's what I've devoted my life to. I think we're going to prep it. I mean, it's just kind of like, I feel like you just pull that out when I say a good point. No, but it's like, if you, if we got an argument about basketball and I would, like no no no I was arguing something you could easily say Wes I don't watch a lot more

basketball than I don't think I would be right in every argument we have I don't I don't think I'm right in every argument but I do I do respect that you know you know volumes more about basketball than I do I'm not going to argue Pokemon cards with you I'm not going to argue basketball with you, you know? I mean, okay. I don't know. I, so I think we're going to do an episode where I argue the case for lions and this argues the case for tigers being like the ultimate king of the jungle.

I posted a, I posted a video of that tiger, the big one that Mike brought up and said like, I don't agree that people say lions are the king of the jungle. Got a lot of comments. People were very, very passionate about this. lion that was in the zoo somewhere that got to like 800 pounds. Yeah. Lots of short kings out there. I got to save those.

But I did wanted to say like one thing really quickly. When we say like king of the jungle, that's just like a phrase. We don't think that lions are like jungle animals. They can be. There are jungle lions out there. There's lions in the jungles of gear, India. There's lions in the Congo and the jungle. in the jungles. There's forest lions, but we do understand, because there's so many comments

on my post that said this, we do understand lions are mostly in grasslands, tigers are in dry forests and jungles. That's understood. So don't come at us with that. All right. Exactly. Now that we're all heated, let's move on. Oh, I'm too pissed. We got to take a break. All right. Let's do something you watched on the plane. Just real quick. A little break from wildlife, something you watched on the plane that you enjoyed or didn't enjoy, you can talk about whatever you want. I started watching, re-watching the anime monster, Naoki Yorosawa, single-handedly lending the anime scene, manga scene mostly, but by proxy the anime scene, some credibility.

Masterful storytelling, it's about, it starts off as like a medical drama, quickly turns into pretty wild, psychological, and fairly violent thriller. Recommend it to anyone who, who's kind of thinking about maybe getting an anime doesn't know where to start. A lot of Western sensibilities are being sated, I would say. Just really fun story. It's great. I love it.

Wes and Mike got to choose one of my movies because of that. I didn't say negative 120 degrees. We got you. I ended up watching Conclave and I thought it was really good. I like movies. were like I like when people question things I like someone like devout to a religion questioning it so I thought it was pretty good and I really like Rome so it's cool uh I'm gonna say devil wars prada I'd never seen it uh and it felt like a gap it felt like something that is in the

cultural lexicon that I had seen and so I felt like I had to see it didn't really care for that much thought it was kind of boring really yeah wow I thought it was well acted but I didn't feel like there was really any drama or much that really happens. It just seemed like kind of boring to me. But I get why so many people love it. So that's what I watched. All right. What was the hardest part of this trip for you guys? Breathing. Just, yeah, respirating. Cool. Yeah, I had a really hard time breathing enough. Air. Yeah. For me, it was definitely, it was our first dinner in LaDoc, where we just kind of ate in this mess tent together. And I just, for whatever reason, came to that dinner pretty unprepared for the cold.

And I feel like that was our coldest night. And I remember my toes were getting super cold. And it was just kind of miserable. And we knew that we still had like, yeah, like three or four nights ahead of us there. And that was probably the low point for me. But then it got easier after that. Yeah, the first night for me as well, the sleeping bags were not quite built for some. And I'm not like a huge person.

They were kind of small. They were small, and I didn't fit in them very well. I hadn't quite figured out exactly how it was going to work out for me the following nights. I remember just laying there. It was like 3 a.m. and I hadn't slept at all. Just desperately longing to be home. I remember probably saying out loud to myself, I would do anything to not be here right now. And this is before any, like, interesting sightings or anything fun had happened.

We didn't know the group very well yet, and I was just, like, mad. I was so mad to be out there. Literally, meanwhile, we're in our tent, like, laughing because I was like, Mike told us he doesn't like camping and we brought him to the fucking hemalayas and they did like camp in this like cold ass pen and he's just never like camping net. 13,000 feet. Yeah. So the next question was actually, oh, Jeff, did you do yours? Yeah, breathing. Yeah.

But also shout out to those bathrooms at that camp. They dug like a six. to rough. Put two rocks next to it. The rocks were sometimes slippery with frozen pee on them. Oh, man. I saw those tent, the bathroom tents, and my bowels just shut off. They're like, nope.

We're going to hold everything in for the next four days. So the next category was funniest part of the trip. And for me, it was actually laughing at Mike having to camp in him. It's not funny. But what do you guys think? Did you guys have anything for that funniest? moments on the trip. I actually think our, so everyone's, I saw two sloth bears, but most everyone else saw

one sloth bear. But the first one I saw, I hardly saw it. And then the second one we saw, we saw it really well. And it was like in the forest. And then I was watching it. I was waiting to like get a shot of it once it came out of all the brush obscuring the view, you know. And for, I don't know, five minutes we're watching it.

and it's like about to go into the road and like get this clearing and I'm like ready to get the shot and the second it comes out our driver there's a car parked in front of us the entire time hasn't moved at all and our driver just like drives straight into it like the second this bear's head is out of the trees, we just ran the car ahead of us. And like, it would take a lot for me to lose focus of this bear. I completely lost focus of the bear and turned around. It was just like, what is going on right now? Did we just get in a car crash?

And then by the time I looked up, the bear was like halfway across the road. Like, it got startled and ran. There's a really funny video. I'll post on my Instagram of it once this comes. The funniest thing that happened to me is still Cassie, one of the girls in our group. She fell asleep with a couple of hard-boiled eggs in her pocket. And she tossed and turned and rolled around in her sleep. And the next morning she woke up and they were unbroken, like unfazed, and they were warm.

And she was like, wow, wow. Look at that. I got something to eat. I remember when I heard that, I was like, it's so funny. I was like, what? Yeah. Oh, man. Another shout out is Libby bringing a Nikon Cool Picks from like 2006.

And when you had to pay for cameras in Tadova, she went to like go pay for it. And they're like, no, you don't have to pay for that. You can just take that. Like three megapixels. Sara, too. So you guys don't know this one. But she's from Columbia. She's awesome.

And she's in the United States the last couple of years. But like she's Colombian. Yeah. And she's like teaching. English, I think, or teaching Spanish. I don't remember. But anyways, you guys could have a million guesses before you guess what her favorite

movie is. Black Hawk Down. Wow. There's no possible way. I just thought that was so funny. It's really just but doesn't fit her at all, but kind of fits her because it doesn't, like

you never know what to expect with Sarah. That's great. All right. Let's move on to our last category. We're going to say each of us quickly, our top five mammals we saw. Just your top five animals. If you want to put birds in there, throw some birds in there. Great. Top five animals plus one bird.

If you want an ad of bird as an honorable mention, go for it. Okay. My top five, the snow leopard was number one. Earlier I did say the bearded vulture was number two, but I do think I have to say the sloth bear was number two. Then the bearded vulture in number three. That was another funny. argument. At the time it was. Mike got mad at you and was like,

no, it's not your second favorite. He was really, really excited. Mike was right. He is now, but at the time, it was still the bearded vulture. It was. It was. I love it. Like, they only... Fine, I'm going back. The bearded vultures number two. Slot there's number three. And then I'm going to go,

I got lucky to see some dolls, which are a wild dog hunting sambar deer. which was really cool. And then my final one, I'm going to say the tigers, just all the tigers. We saw the male tigers specifically, but the females with cubs too. So, yeah, that's my top five. All right. Yeah, I would go tigers and then sloth bear and then probably the wolves just because I thought

is really cool how they were like camped right by us the entire time we were there. That was cool. And then the Himalayan links. Nope. And you can call it Hemelian links. I mean, honestly, what's going to stick in my mind the most is we saw a crocodile rip a deer and a half. Yeah, that was cool. Mugger crocodile.

Have you said the Snow Leper or is it not in your top five? I didn't say Snow Leopard. Yeah. It's not in my top five, that's for sure. Wow. I would probably have to put it. What was my fourth one? I don't know.

The lynx is out. Links is out. Snow leopard's in it for. Okay. What's your bird honorable mention? Uh, the hoopoo. Hoopo. Yeah.

Hoopo. Those things are sweet. They're cool birds. Austin on our Africa trip found one first, but they got like mohawks and I just really want to see one. And literally everyone had seen one but me. And then at the last second I got one. Nice.

Barnbee. All right. Number one for me is Taiga. Number two is sloth. Bear. Number three is going to be, I like that night jar a lot. It was just sitting on the ground like a rock. It was so cool. Yeah. Number four, let's go with the Eurasian lynx, just because it's just such an elusive little spotting that we had. And we were like a billion feet up in the sky. I felt like, well, it was tough to be up there even for just like 20 minutes. And number five, ooh, this is going to be tough. I'm going to go with the Paradise Flycrow.

It's this really beautiful white, long-tailed bird. And its behavior was really interesting. It was like dipping up and down into the water, just really quick. I thought it was just one of the most amazing. No snow leopard. Nope. Nope. If we'd only been looking at it for like two hours, it would have been up there.

But 15 hours of a snow leopard. Too much for you. Too much. I decided I do not care for snow leopard. I do find that my enjoyment is often based on the amount of time we have to spend looking for it. And the fact that we really put in time for that animal made it worthwhile. Yeah. Yeah, that's true.

No, snow lepers, they're great. Snow lepers are amazing. Yeah. Well, just wanted to say again, thanks to life. Thanks to everyone that joined us for all the people that helped us on that trip, our guides, Vana safaris, natural's journeys that put it all together. We had an amazing, an amazing trip. For me, it's one I'm going to think about for a long time.

It blew my expectations out of the water. So I'm really, really just super chuffed about it, you know? Just chuffed to the max. You left your mark all over it. Yeah, there's a lot of my poop out there in the middle of it. Especially. All right. Well, you guys got anything else before we wrap this up?

No, thank you. No, I think I'm good. Okay. If you want more content, check out our Patreon or Apple Gris Club. Mike, I think you just did one of our funniest episodes ever with your ancient Guys episode. The donkey drinking line. That's a good joke.

All-timer. Jeff had a really good one too right before that. I'm struggling to remember what it was, but it was a good one. That's not convinced. No, but it was. I remember that it was good. How was it? New Zealand.

Yeah, the New Zealand one was super fun. The Moa birds. Yeah. So check us out. It's 10 bucks a month, which any, you know, that's like three eggs these days. So. So you love comparing it to food, dude. I do, you know.

It's like one egg these days. Yeah, serious. My birds are out there laying gold. All right. Love you guys. All right. Love you. See ya.