Tooth & Claw: True Stories of Animal Attacks - Rattlesnake Attack - A Real Bad Bit in Yosemite National Park

Episode Date: June 29, 2026

Kyle was busy living his best life with his wife and newborn baby when disaster literally struck while in a remote part of Yosemite National Park. After a lot pain, vomit, and diarrhea, Kyle had another nearly unbelievable animal encounter that worsened his chances of survival. What a lucky(?) guy! Watch here: https://youtu.be/mde3mOe6UIM ~ LMNT: Get a free 8-count Sample Pack of LMNT's most popular drink mix flavors with any purchase at https://drinklmnt.com/tooth ~ To advertise on the show, contact us! Patreon - https://www.patreon.com/c/toothandclawpodcast ~~ Tooth & Claw is brought to you by QCODE. Support the show and get access to an extensive library of exclusive episodes like this by supporting the show on Patreon or joining the Grizzly Club on Apple Podcasts. For the latest updates on the show and all things wildlife, follow us at toothandclawpod.com and social:  Instagram: @ToothandClawPodcast Twitter: @ToothandClawPod Wes: @GrizKid Jeff: @jefe_larson Mike: @mikey3ds Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Hello everyone. Welcome to Tooth and Claw podcast. We are a wildlife biologist and we talk about animal attacks. We are one? Yeah. It's like we are Charlie Kirk. We are Legion. And we have Wes Larson, who is a biologist.

He's smart. He's handsome. Oh. He can run the hundred. in five seconds flat. Definitely not. Whoa. I'm not very fast.

I never have been. But how fast can you run the 100, Mike? You're the fastest of us. I wasn't a short distance sprinter. Okay. My coach only let me run the 400, and I wish, I still wish I were dead. Still.

400's the hardest, because to be good at it, you have to, like, sprint it all. But then it's, like, too far to sprint. I don't know. 400 it was awful truly but I think the 800 might be worse. That's the one I did but I was all competitive so it didn't matter. I remember when we first started hanging out Jeff, you had recently figured out how to run.

Yeah. So funny because like you showed me how you used to do it and like you'd clomp your heel down first. Yeah. And then slap the front of your foot down onto the ground. Some like unexperienced track coach in middle school taught us to like hit our heel first. And I don't know what they were, I think is for like super long distance. And I just put that to all running. Like sprinting, I would put my heel down first.

So fun. It was like the loudest I've ever heard someone move. Just a huge slap. For someone who played sports a lot, that was not great. I really put a dent on my abilities. Well, are you guys enjoying the World Cup? Yeah, you just told us a great story. I didn't.

It wasn't a good story. Tell us again. No. In fact, you told me that it was stupid, so I'm not going to repeat it on the podcast. I said you got to save that for the podcast. Yeah, you said it in a way that made me think that you thought it was stupid, so I'm not going to say it. It does. World Cup always makes me think of my favorite World Cup.

It was 2014. It was when me and Jeff were trapping bears. And in Bryce Canyon, they had, they were showing it on a projector at this hotel there. And because there were so many people from all over the world visiting Bryce Canyon, we would go and watch it with people from all these different countries. And it was really, really fun. Yeah, it's great. It was my favorite one because of that.

I saw my favorite story so far. Well, there's been a few in Mexico. But I love that Boston ran out of beer because the Scottish fans are there. Really? And they said that it's four times more beer sales than St. Patrick's Day. Wow. Nice. That's crazy.

And the only beer left is Bud Light. So I guess they didn't like that one ad. Yeah, who knows? My favorite story from Mexico was that there was that there was. was someone walking around on the street and all these team Mexico fans got all excited about him because they thought he was there for Japan because Japan has a game in Mexico. And it turned out he was just a Mexican. They like are holding a lot of and like cheering and everything.

The Mexican fans have been awesome. They're so fun. They like gave a Korean fan the stereotypical Mexican outfit with the. like the huge sombrero and a fake mustache, and it's just like one of the best photos ever. I kind of hope they win, to be honest. I would love to see a Mexico win. But U.S. is looking good, too, you know? U.S. is looking great.

Yeah. All right. Well, I got a story for us today, and it's a good one. I bet you don't. You're wrong. I do have one. I'll bet you $25. You don't have a story.

Okay. I'll take that bet. All right. All right. So our story today is about a rattlesnake bite. And I'm really excited to tell it because it's one that's been on my list for a while. And it just kind of felt like it was time to do a rattlesnake episode. And part of that is because this has been kind of a banner year for rattlesnake bites in the U.S.

There's been a lot in California and a number in other states too. And it's kind of just been a quick start to the year as far as rattlesnakes are concerned. and a few fatalities too. So we're already on track for it to be a record year as far as people dying and people bitten by rattlesnakes in the U.S. This one isn't from this year, but I wanted to start out with a question, what would you guys say are the three most beautiful national parks you've been to?

So not necessarily the ones that you personally like the best, but the three that are the most visually beautiful to you. Wow. What the heck kind of question is that? It's just one off the cuff. I don't find nature to be beautiful. Yes, you do. What's the one we went to in Alaska?

Catmai. That's number one. That's a good pick. I probably should have included that. Don't go too fast, Jeff, because I'm going to run out of parks if you just name all three of them right away. All right. Mike, you name one? Redwood's one.

Oh, that's a good pick, too. Is that one? Yeah. I'm going to say Glacier. Shoot. I think that was. We can say the same ones. It's fine.

No. I say Zion. I'll take Zion. I was going to say that. Oh, man. Yeah. I don't even like Zion, but I have been there and seen it. So that probably would have been one of my choices.

So we can't say the same ones? No. Is Bryce a national park? Right? Yeah. You could steal that from West. That'd be smart. I wasn't going to say Bryce, but I was now that you took Zion, actually.

Okay. I'm going to say Yosemite. Oh. I'll take Yellowstone. Okay. Central Park. That's not a national park I can't think of anymore

Good go gateway arch Yeah you could say Arches or Canyonlands Or gateway arch in St. Louis Death Valley Capitol Reef Grand Canyon The Ozarks

Sure we're just going to let Mike say the Ozarks And I'm going to say the Everglades Okay The reason I asked that question is because of my second pick, which was Yosemite. I think I had always seen photos and whatnot of Yosemite. I didn't go there until I was an adult. And I always thought it looked really cool,

but it never really made sense to me why it was so popular until I visited. And when I visited and I was wandering the meadows and seeing those huge cliff faces and the waterfalls, it really left an impression on me. Like, I really got it. I understood why Yosemite was so popular and why so many people love it so much.

West Free Soloed El Capitan before Alex Harn. Honnold? A lot of people don't know that. Sure. Yeah, let that become part of my lore. I'm happy with that. I think Yosemite Sam was the first, though, right? He just shot his guns all the way up.

Have you guys ever met someone that calls it Yosemite? I've heard that. Yeah, it kind of drives me crazy. Yeah. All right. They can't be serious. right? There are people that say it seriously. Like my cousin Eric, I believe, says it that way.

Vegemite. That's what it makes me think of. Shout out Australia. Yeah, shout out to all our Australians out there. No, we just beat them in soccer. I know, they need a shout out now. They're feeling probably sad. Someone else that really loved Yosemite is Kyle Dickman. If you're active in the outdoor scene and especially in the outdoor journalism scene, there's a decent chance you've heard this name before.

There's a joke there, but I can't think of it. Yeah, it's too easy. I've heard that name a lot. Low-hanging fruit, yeah. He grew up in Oregon. His parents said they were members of the Church of Seventh-day Recreationalists. And basically every weekend of his life while growing up, they would go camping, exploring, hiking, canoeing.

They would do it so much that once Kyle, when he was a kid, asked his parents if they could just stay home that weekend because he was tired of, like, going out and doing something fun every weekend with his folks. What's weird about that? I know that you would like, this sounds like your worst possible childhood, Mike. But to a lot of people, it sounds ideal. The appreciation for the outdoors really took root in Kyle, and as he got older, he started working in a lot of different jobs

that would put him in the wilderness. He's a hot shot firefighter. He's a filmmaker for National Geographic, a contributor at Outside Magazine, our friends. And then he wrote a book about wildland firefighting. And his different jobs took him around the world, and he had some pretty crazy adventures and close calls. Sorry, I don't mean to keep interrupting you.

Yeah. What constitutes a hot shot fireman? So that's a type of like firefighter. Wildlife firefighters. That's like an actual title. There's like a title like you're a hot shot firefighter. And those are the ones that are doing like the more technical kind of dangerous. Miles Teller.

Yeah. In that movie. Or like Adam Sandler and Chuck and Larry, he's like a firefighter, calendar model. Yeah. You guys remember that movie? That's a weird one. I never saw that movie.

This is a different kind. He's a wildland firefighter though, not like a red truck firefighter. That's a fireman and then a firefighter is someone that does it in the forest. Anyway, he almost stepped on a furtalanse in Belize. He almost got bit by a saltwater crocodile in Papua New Guinea. He was held at gunpoint by guerrillas in the Democratic Republic of Congo. Not the guerrillas you're thinking right now, Jeff. I know.

I know the question I was not to get. Oh, I was thinking of like the anti-government gorilla. So you're saying the animal gorilla is the mecca. It was the silver pack gorilla. Like the one in Planet of the Apes. Turn that one around on you. That's crazy. All right.

When he was 26, he got married to his soulmate Turin, who had a similar love for adventure and had also traveled the world in her role as a climate researcher. They made their home in Los Alamos. because she worked in a lab there. But the early years of their marriage were full of outdoor outings and adventure. And when Kyle was in his early 30s, Turin got pregnant with their first child. And although she even did a 145 mile rafting trip through the Alaskan wilderness during her first trimester,

they probably knew that having a baby was going to change their lives a bit because these are very active, very outdoor people. And having a baby is just, it's going to throw a bit of a wrench in that no matter what. Yeah. That's like their gender reveal is a 100 mile kayak trip. Yeah, right. I don't know how. Like the color of kayak that she takes.

Yeah, it just turns the river pink or blue. She gives birth in the kayak and then they'll figure out what the gender is then, I guess. I should mention that my main source here is an article called A Rattle with Death in Yosemite. It was actually written by Kyle himself. Then he's also done a number of podcast interviews, a few other articles. Like, there's a lot of information about this one. And I will say this is one of those episodes where he's such a good writer that it made my job really easy. I'm kind of just like telling his story almost in his own words.

But there is a lot of great information about this one. And he even like gets really interested in the science of snake bites. And we'll talk more about that too. But some great sources. Okay. Their son Bridger was born in 2017, and because of having a kid at her job, Turin got three months maternity leave from her job. And they knew that they probably were never going to have that kind of time off again and an

opportunity to really travel. So they decided to buy this old RV. It was kind of like a van, and they made it into this makeshift RV, and they hit the road for a month traveling around the Western United States. This kid's only a few weeks old at this time. And they're like, you know what, let's take him on his first road trip at a few weeks old, which is pretty crazy. And I admire that. Like, you got to be super tired when you have a newborn.

And they're like, yeah, let's go on a road trip. It's like one of those things where the kid grows up and the parents can be like, we did take you to your son to me, actually. You've been there. On their road trip, they did a lot of stuff. They surfed in Oregon. They explored canyon lands. They went canyoneering and the San Rafael swell in Utah. And they took pictures.

with their newborn son all across some of the most beautiful spots in the West. But they also realized that it was really hard traveling with a newborn baby. They didn't get a lot of sleep. He was kind of colicky, so it means when babies get colicky, they cry a lot. They're really hard to stop crying. And they were really tired as they pulled into their last stop, which was Yosemite National Park. Luckily, Kyle's family was already in Yosemite waiting for him. His brother Garrett actually worked in the park.

He was a botanist in charge of vegetation health. And his wife Aaron was also a botanist. And the two of them lived right outside the park. They were so obsessed with climbing that they just wanted to live around Yosemite for like the rest of their lives. I have a brother named Garrett. It's got to be a different person, right? It could be the same Garrett because this Garrett's also like a crazy athlete. and so is your Garrett.

He runs like 17 trillion miles in the desert sometimes for fun. Ultramarathon. I think this Garrett's similar. It's not the person you're saying. Yeah. Yeah. Her name's not Aaron. Okay.

Okay. That was close. So Kyle's parents are also there. They're in their RV. And because of this, Kyle and Turin finally have a lot of help with Bridger and their spirits are high. I spent a good chunk of my life not drinking. coffee. And then when I started, it really gave me a ton of energy, but I realized that I would

crash as soon as it wore off. And I also realized I was needing more and more as time progressed, and it became a habit, which I really didn't want. And the thing that I've learned is that tea really works differently. The caffeine in tea comes bundled with elthianine and polyphenols and the way it exists in the plant. And that's what gives you a noticeably steadier feeling. There's less spike and less drop. An element, lemonade iced tea, uses a full black tea not isolated caffeine. Plus, there's a meaningful dose of electrolytes. There's no sugar, no artificial colors, no other weird ingredients. It's built on the same formula as Element's core drink mix, which is sodium, potassium, and magnesium at levels that are shown to support optimal

hydration. You get that little bump in energy that you would get from tea, plus the really good hydration electrolytes that you're already getting with Element. And you don't have to take my word for it. Element is trusted by athletes, professionals, nutritionists, all over the world. Another thing that I really like about it is I love the taste and it kind of helps decrease my sweet tooth throughout the day, which is just great. And I love the lemonade iced tea flavor. I think it's delicious. It's just the right amount of lemonade and iced tea flavoring. And I just, I absolutely crave it. So you can get a free eight count sample pack of elements most popular drink mix flavors with any purchase of drink element.com slash tooth. That's

drinkl mn t.com slash tooth. Find your favorite flavor. share it with a friend. So they're starting to have a great time. One night on one of their first nights in the park, they're sitting up at night, they're having some glasses of wine, and Garrett proposes that they go on a walk to see some wildflowers in this remote meadow. Babies shouldn't be drinking wine. Are you serious right now?

The baby's not having wine. The baby, I don't know where the baby is. But Garrett says they should go see these wildflowers in a remote meadow above one of the entrance towns to Yosemite and below another. one of the towns. So it's on this mountain that kind of sits in between these two towns. And the group gets up in the morning and they're climbing through this beautiful, like classic Yosemite-type surroundings, big granite slabs, beautiful forest. And they get to this meadow. And it's early May and they're just dazzled by all the different types of wildflowers that are in bloom. There's

these big flooded rivers running down the mountainside. It's just a gorgeous, perfect spring day. And at around 1145 in the morning, they get to this really scenic. bridge that passes over this sliding waterfall. So a sliding waterfall is one that kind of cascades down the granite. And they decide it's a good place to take a break. And Bridger starts kind of letting them know that he's hungry. So Turin takes him over to this granite outcropping to nurse Bridger. And meanwhile, the rest of the group gets out some snacks. And everyone's resting and relaxing and snacking on this perfect spring day. And Kyle is kind of standing near the bridge and he's getting ready to probably changed Bridger's diaper, so he's spreading this little blanket out on the ground.

He steps off into the grass, and he feels a light tap just above the sock on his right ankle. And he briefly remembers seeing what looked like a dusty red coil with a diamond pattern in the grass, and then he starts jumping around yelling, fack. His parents rush over asking what happened, and he told them he had been bitten by a rattlesnake. His mom tells him to stop moving, to slow the spread of the venom, And then he leans into his dad's arms and he immediately passes out within a minute of being bitten. Whoa. Wow.

Our parents would be like, serves you right for saying the F word. Yeah, it'd be like, okay, but you shouldn't use that language. So Kyle starts vomiting violently on the ground, still unconscious. He then wakes up to the sound of his parents talking about how best to get him out of there. And Turin, who had been nursing Bridger and then had started, changing his diaper, rushed in and asked if he had been stung by a bee or maybe something else. And apparently, Kyle was severely allergic to bee stings. Maybe he just got bit by the snake on purpose to not have to change another diaper, you know?

It doesn't seem very fun. Have you ever changed a diaper? I've changed a lot of diapers. Yeah. I did once. I didn't have that much fun with it. I shouldn't say a lot, but probably like, I bet I've changed 30 diapers in my life. That's a fair amount.

Kyle's even more allergic to rattlesnakes than bees. Yeah, that he passed out immediately. That's a quick reaction to it, right? Yeah, and we're going to talk about that. Anyway, Turin thought it was probably a bee. I bet we won't. We are going to. How much do you want to bet me?

Let's add to it. That's what I thought. So she thinks it's probably a bee. He had been stung by a bee before and had had serious reactions. But she runs over and she asks, you know, was it a B? And his one word response was Rattlesnake, and she started shaking. No one in this group had ever dealt with a rattlesnake bite before,

including his mom who had been in an emergency room nurse, and had helped with a ton of search and rescue. Her and his dad have done a lot of search and rescue. But they did know that the main thing they had to do was get Kyle to medical help as soon as possible. And whoever wants to say it first, Do you guys remember the two most important tools when someone gets bit by a venomous snake? Phone keys.

Phone and keys. Call for help and get to help as quickly as possible. And the phone kind of has a double used to if you're able to take a photo of that snake. So you can idea it properly. Don't try and catch it. Don't try and mess with it anymore. But try and get a photo of it. You said, though, that he's right next to a water slide, right?

A waterfall. Yeah. Well, you didn't say waterfall. You said sliding waterfall. Yeah. So why don't they just put them down there? It would kill him if they did. That's why they don't want to do that.

Why did you bring it up? There was like such a check-offs. Oh, just you wait, dude. Just you wait. All right. Kind of. All right. So Kyle feels as sick as he ever has in his entire life.

And he's been really sick on some of his world travels. and he's hoping that maybe the only effect of the venom is going to be him getting violently ill. And he's lying on this slab of granite and he knows that there's a number of potential outcomes, even including amputation or death, but he hopes that this is just going to be a minor bite that he's able to walk away from.

And unfortunately, he's not going to be that lucky. So Kyle says something in the article that as he's talking about this bite, and it's something that he learned after he learned more and more about snake bites and venom. And it's a saying I really liked. And the saying is time is tissue, which basically means the longer it takes you to get to medical attention and

anti-venom, the more tissue you're probably going to lose. So just judging by the fact that he's writing this article. He's not dead. But you said he wasn't lucky enough to get up and walk away. Is he still there? I didn't say that I see what you're saying. But he's not going to walk away under his own power is what I meant. But thank you.

Thanks for keeping me honest, Mike. I appreciate that. Sure. All right. So the vomiting is now coming in waves every few minutes and it's getting worse and worse. And Kyle's family's starting to get really worried because none of them had ever seen anyone so violently sick before. And Garrett decides he's going to sprint to where he knows he's going to get some cell phone reception. He gets there.

he immediately calls emergency services, and they tell him they're going to dispatch a life flight helicopter and an ambulance. But they don't really know. They see that there's this road kind of leading up near where this group is, but they don't know that that two-track road leading up there is completely impassable. It's covered in logs. Kyle continues vomiting, turns nervously trying to comfort him, and his leg is now starting to just be burning with pain,

and there's these streams of blood that are running from his faying puncture wounds. part of that is because venom has an anticoagulant in it. So there are some types of snake venom that'll make you clot up, but some will also make their anti-coagulants. So you just continue bleeding. And that's what's happening to him. Garrett continues running toward this town of Floresta, which is the one up higher on the mountain.

And he's hoping to intercept this ambulance on the road at the furthest point that they could make it. And he gets to another waterfall, another sliding waterfall in a flooded creek where this old bridge had burned down over this waterfall, burned down. And there's only these four steel girders going over this waterfall, this raging river. They're kind of like these long steel beams that are going over it. And they're wet from the mist of this raging creek.

It's like a really dicey place to cross. But he knows that if he doesn't cross here, he's going to have to run like another mile to get across this creek on a bridge like up river. It reminds me of 9-11 a little. How so? The steel beams. Oh, yeah. Sure. No, but these ones are still

there. Right. The jet. They're not melting. The fuel didn't melt them. Yeah. That's why I said it reminds me just a little bit. Not in the way. Must not have been a jet that burned this bridge down. But yeah, he doesn't want to waste like another 20 minutes

running up to this other bridge. So he just decides he's going to go for it. And just to kind of paint this picture, if he were to slip and fall into this waterfall, a few dozen yards downstream, it goes over like a 200 foot waterfall. That's crazy. Dude. It's like the type that if you fall in, you're going to die. They need that on Ninja Warrior because it's gotten stale. Right. Yeah. Too soft. There needs to be certain death involved in that show. So he goes for it though. And he kind of scoots across one of these steel beams, and he manages to get across.

And then he runs two more miles through rough terrain, up 800 feet of elevation. And he does all of this in 19 minutes. So pretty amazing. Like two miles in 19 minutes, if you're running on a track, isn't that impressive. But if you're running through forest and crossing waterfalls and whatnot, that's like pretty incredible. It's crazy. Yeah.

It's really impressive. The head paramedic, whose name is Montoya, is speeding toward the area in an ambulance, but in the meantime, he had also tried to order a helicopter that was hoist equipped. And that pretty much just means one that can lower one of those backboards down and pick someone up, because not all life flight helicopters can do that. And he knew this area, this paramedic, and he thought, there's no way just any life flight helicopter is going to be able to land there. They're going to have to be able to drop a hoist to pick him up and take him out.

So he's trying to get one of those special types of helicopters. and he knew that also trying to get Kyle to move at all or physically exert himself at all is going to lead toward that venom spreading more than it needs to. Because remember, if you're bitten by a venomous snake, the other thing to remember, aside from getting your keys in your phone, is you want to stay as calm as you possibly can. You want to move the least amount.

You don't want your blood pumping through your body. So you want it pumping through your body, but not extra. I don't understand. why Kyle needs his keys right now. Yeah, you know, this is probably one where you wouldn't need your keys. Do you know what he could really use is like a water slide? To like get down the mountain quick. That's what I'm saying.

Just drop you over a few huge cliff waterfalls. You wouldn't even have to move. You're telling him not to move. That's like... It'd probably be a less painful death. All right. So apparently on that same day, and unfortunately for... Kyle, it was kind of a banner day for search and rescue. There's a lot happening in the park,

including someone that had found a blood-soaked sheet by one of the waterfalls, which is kind of an ominous thing to find. And then one of those towns, I think it was Floresta, had a big, no, it was the other town, had a big fire. So a lot of the different helicopters and personnel and everything are busy, and it led to Kyle having to wait longer than he probably would have otherwise. But finally, they do find a hoist-equipped helicopter, but it's in a town that's an hour and 45 minutes away. So Garrett finds the ambulance. Sure enough, they're stuck in this road.

The medics are getting out of the ambulance and they're loading up all the life-saving equipment they could carry because they know they're going to have to hike up to where Kyle is. And Garrett actually knows some of these guys, and they throw them some of the gear, and all four of them take off running down the road. And they get to this bridge that Garrett had just crossed, and the lead paramedic is like, nope, we're not doing that.

He's, you know, if any of us slip, we're going to die. We're not going to take that chance. So they sprint upriver like 20 minutes and find another bridge to cross. And then they bushwhack and kind of sidehill it over to where Kyle is. And they actually do manage to get back to Kyle within an hour of a snake bite, which is pretty impressive considering all the challenges that they're facing. when they get to Kyle he's not doing great

although Mike you might think that he was doing great based on what I'm about to tell you um oh I know when Garrett and the paramedics arrived Kyle's lying on the ground with his pants off

and that's because in addition to the violent bouts of vomiting he'd also been having violent bouts of diarrhea whoa his parents have been when I just got norovirus

maybe I got bit by a snake yeah could have been he barely even felt the snake fight. Yeah. His parents had been rolling him back and forth for almost an hour, depending on what end it was coming out of, and the ground around him is soaked in vomit and shit. He's pale, he's sweaty, he's moaning in pain, his blood isn't clotting, so it's continuing to weep from these feign marks. His poop isn't clotting either. Yeah. Is that what you'd call that?

Yeah. Coag, or anti-coagulated poop. There's starting to be some also pretty intense bruising and swelling on his leg, which is a sign that the venom was doing its terrible work and that he's hemorrhaging internally. Now, something that I really like about this article that he wrote and some of the interviews that he's done is he got really into learning about venom and exactly how it works. And he talked to a lot of experts, and he got some really clear explanations, and it really helped me conceptualize how it works too. So I really liked learning about this story

because I feel like I understand rattlesnake venom a lot better than I used to. So we're going to go over a few of his symptoms and then kind of explanations for what might have happened. And I just want to, we've said this before, not all snake venom works the same and not even all rattlesnake venom works the same. In fact, like even certain species,

their venom will be different depending on the elevation that they live at. So this explanation doesn't, isn't like a catch-all for all snakes, but it is going to fit the snake that bit Kyle, which is the Northern Pacific rattlesnake. We talked about Southern Pacific when we did that synon episode, the cult that put the rattlesnake in the mailbox, and this is the Northern Pacific rattlesnake.

Okay, so basically, when a rattlesnake injects venom into its prey or a threat, It's injecting a mix of proteins and peptides and enzymes that are essentially modified existing proteins that are often found in mammals. So these venom proteins are mimicking what our natural proteins do, but in like an inappropriate way or in concentrations that are way too high. To make that a little bit simpler to understand, proteins are responsible for docking with cells in our body and then they cause responses. So everything that you do, everything from like, smiling to digesting food to breathing is set in action by proteins and cells working together. So proteins are kind of like the light switch for cells to tell them what to do. Now venom proteins also attach to the cells just the way that our proteins do, but instead

of making the cells do what they would typically do, they sabotage how those cells work and they knock those whole system out of balance. So I think a lot of people have this idea of venom being like this foreign thing that's injected into us that kind of just melts your body away. And that's not what it's doing. It's actually really similar to stuff that we already have in our body, but it's just different enough that it tricks our body into doing some really crazy shit and kind of destroying itself, which is really interesting. And snakes have evolved that venom to be specific to mammals,

rattlesnakes have, because that's their main prey. They mostly eat rodents and small mammals. All right, so let's look at some of these examples based on Kyle's symptoms of what these proteins are doing in the venom. So pretty much immediately he went unconscious. It's interesting that venom from Marvel was able to do that because he was from outer space. So he wanted to have evolved alongside mammals. Yeah. We don't know that.

Maybe there's mammals in his planet. Okay, yeah. No, never mind. Okay. Can't venom turn into like anything, too? His proteins work on everything. Does he even have venom? I don't know.

He just bites people's heads off, right? I don't think he ever venomized anyone. Yeah. All right. So pretty much immediately Kyle goes unconscious, and that's likely because our bodies use proteins that regulate blood pressure and cause our veins and our arteries

to either expand or contract. So when they contract, like if your arteries and your veins get smaller and your vessels, blood pressure goes up because there's less space for your blood to move in. And when they expand, it goes down because suddenly there's a lot of space for your blood to move in. So Northern Pacific Rattlesnake Venom has a protein that sends that same message, but it tells the body to immediately relax all of the vessels to control blood flow. So they expand, they get wide open. and because of gravity, blood doesn't have the pressure anymore to reach his brain, and he passes out.

Wow. One of the more destructive aspects of Rattlesnake Venom starts working on Kyle at that point, and that's an enzyme called metalloprotonase. And what this enzyme does is attacks the cellular architecture of our bodies. So basically it attacks the proteins that hold the cells together, in our skin, in our muscles, and our tissue. and really key is in our vein walls. So your veins have walls, like the outer part of your veins,

and that's composed of cells and proteins that are connected together. And what this specific enzyme does is it breaks all those connections. So it essentially dissolves your vein walls. It turns your veins into mush. Yeah. That's so weird. And so when that starts happening, your body panics, and it sends a lot of fluid and clotting agents

to try and slow down this damage and repair those cells. But the snake venom actually has an answer for this. It has a peptide called Dysintagrin, which are proteins that attack and destroy the clotting agents that your body sent. So it's kind of like this game of chess where Rattlesnake Venom always has an answer for everything that your body is doing to try and stop it.

And a cool thing to think about is, like, we talked about the blood pressure changes. Like if that were to happen to a mouse, like if a rattlesnake bites a mouse and suddenly its veins open wide and it passes out, that's all it needs. The rattlesnake then slithers over and eats it. You know, so like a lot of these secondary kind of things that its venom is doing aren't really happening to its prey. It's happening to like big mammals that it's defending itself from. It's likely another toxin that made the smooth muscles in his digestive system convulse. And that's probably what led to everything in his stomach.

being pushed out through one end or the other end. Jeff, what are those ends? Mouth and butthole. Mouth and butthole, exactly. That's where everything's getting pushed out. Do a power ranking, your top two holes. Oh, wow. I mean, I would just go both nostrils.

Really? Both nostrils are your top two holes. Yeah. You don't want to pick like one nostril and like one ear hole. Oh, that's a good call. you didn't give me enough time. I know. That was my bad.

We can, we'll do another episode later and we can revisit that. Power-rank holes. Yeah. Let's not do that episode. All right. Let's have that one be one that you guys do while I'm gone. Sounds good. So I did mention that Kyle was starting to get bruising and swelling.

And that's that metalloproteinase destroying the vein walls and making him bleed internally. And then other proteins and enzymes are, attacking his muscles and tissue and also destroying those connections and those bonds, and it kind of turns it all into this gelatinous mush. So the destruction of these cells is also releasing a lot of fluid because cells have fluid in them, and that fluid makes you swell up really badly. Like you have a ton of fluid in your body when you're bit by one of these rattlesnakes. That's interesting.

Yeah. It's weird that you can just get more fluid in your body. Yeah. Like, it's already in there. How's it getting more? Well, it's because it's contained within cells. You know, it's like, it's in your body, but it's not free to move around. But once those cells rupture, then it is.

And then a really, like a kind of thing that makes this even worse is there as all that stuff turns into mush as you lose your muscles and your tissue and your veins and everything, it makes it a lot easier for the venom just to spread through your body. because it doesn't have to like take the appropriate channels anymore. It can kind of just pass through all this mush that you've created. So it starts spreading a lot faster too, which is terrible. Dude. I'm never picking up a rattlesnake again after learning about all this. It's like never getting close to him. I don't want to get bit by a rattlesnake.

Now, to answer your question earlier, Jeff, or the thing that you brought up like how fast this happened with him, Venom experts that he spoke with, thinks that they think that Kyle's bite, the snake must have hit a vein directly and delivered the venom directly into that vein. And when that does happen, the effects tend to happen much more quickly. Like the Steph Curry of rattlesnakes. How so? William Tell. Just how accurate it was. Oh yeah, very accurate. True. I really liked learning about that. It was really interesting to me. A really good analogy in one of the

articles I read was that if you picture your body is a city and there's all these streets and like your cells and blood and everything are moving on these streets. Rattlesnake Venom is like turning all the lights green at the same time. It's not like Fass and Furious eight. Exactly. And what happens, Jeff. Live free and die hard. That happens in that too. Yeah, Timothy Oliphant. Uh-huh. Yeah, it's, it causes chaos. It's not like they're changing the structure and it's not like it's a purple light on the stoplight, it's all green lights and it changes everything and it leads to all this chaos in your body. And that's what's happening to Kyle. So he's really just vomiting bile at this point. He's totally emptied his stomach. His mom looks at the bile and she sees blood in it.

But she decides not to tell anyone because she's like, listen, like this isn't going to help if I just make everyone more worried. Bile and Kyle sounds suspiciously similar. They do. Do you think that has anything to do with this? It could. Put a pin in that, Mike. Pin in that. Are we ever going to pull that pin out? We're not.

I just don't want to talk about it anymore. What's the snake doing, just watching all this? The snake, yeah, who knows where the snake is? It's like, man, this dude's being a little dramatic. Do you think it'd feel bad? It's like, oh, my gosh. An hour of diarrhea and throwing up, I didn't mean for this to happen. usually they just pass out and I eat them yeah so unfortunately these medics don't have anti-venom

and Yosemite is actually one of the few parks in the country where the paramedics regularly do carry anti-venom but they had used it on snake bites the year before and they hadn't restocked it yet and I have to assume that means like they didn't even have it in their like central office or whatever because otherwise I think they would have grabbed it when they left but they didn't have any anti-venom. It would be a terrible thing to just forget. Like, oh, we feel it. Yeah, like, oh, crap. So they hook him up to an IV when they get there, and they immediately give him a shot of fentanyl. And he starts feeling a lot better. He's in less pain. I think they gave him like an anti-naugia pill as well. And they put him on a backboard. They tie him down. They're ready, or they don't tie him down yet,

but they're thinking the helicopter is going to get there pretty soon. So they're basically just getting ready to get him out of there. They're doing their best to keep them comfortable and calm. They even have him take a little family photo with Bridger and Turin, where Turin's like doing a thumbs up and they put aviator glasses on Kyle. So this is a tough dude and a tough family, and they're handling it about as well as anyone ever could, even though this is a very serious invention.

And like you do probably want that picture. afterwards, you know. So it's not, it sounds dumb, but it's kind of like, yeah, why not? And if you're just waiting for the helicopter, you might as well. So they take them to where they think this helicopter is going to want to pick them up and they're waiting. And they're thinking the helicopter will probably be there in about 20 minutes, but it doesn't show up and more than an hour passes. And it's been more than an hour since they gave him this IV and the fentanyl. And everything is starting to wear off and his symptoms are returning. And everyone's getting a little panicked because they don't think they can give him more of these drugs or anything.

And it's this terrible situation and then a bee lands on his thigh and stings him. Are you serious? I'm serious. Unbelievable. Kyle looks down. He says, I'm allergic to the paramedics. And one of the first responders yells out for an epipen.

And Kyle immediately says, no, do not use an epipen on me. because he's really worried about what the epinephrine might do when it reacts with this venom. None of them have any idea what that combination is going to be like. And I don't either. I don't know if that's like a bad cocktail or not, but he doesn't want to risk it. Sure. He argues with the paramedics for a while. And finally, after like a good amount of time, they're like, you know what?

If you were going to go into anaphylactic shock or have like a really bad reaction, you probably would have by now, so we won't give you the EpiPen. And what he says that probably was, and what venom experts say it probably was, is that just like snakes, bees have a lot of different types of venom, and they think Kyle was probably allergic to different types of bees than these bees that stung him in Yosemite. So he kind of lucked out there because he was severely allergic. Yeah, he got really lucky.

Okay, yeah, super lucky. This is the luckiest dude we know. It's crazy. Go buy a lot of ticket. It's 4.30 p.m. when the cable finally lowers from the helicopter, and Kyle rises into the air on the backboard, had been over four hours since he had been bitten by the snake. The helicopter touches down at Doctor's Medical Center of Modesto.

He's wheeled into the emergency room where he finally gets his first vial of anti-venom, about five hours after his bite. In total, he would end up getting 18 vials of anti-venom. his leg is turning yellow and black. It had swollen to twice the size of its normal circumference. And he had these like baseball size blisters that were popping up all over his leg. And that's because your body has like nowhere to put this fluid. So it starts forming these huge blisters all over your leg that are full of fluid.

It's disgusting. Like these pictures are so gnarly. Apparently like one of the venom experts he talked to showed him a photo of someone that had that that metalloproteinase. break up all their cells and it just looked like it was a really bad one and he said it just looked like with mush with bones sticking out of it this can be really nasty nasty stuff okay nasty nasty nasty nasty law it says yeah doctors and nurses that helped him and the ones that had worked on other snake bites say that this was the worst snake bite they'd ever seen they're giving it they're giving him morphine every two hours but the pain is still so

intense that he's not able to sleep and he said it felt like the nerves were like breaking and popping in his leg and again this is someone who's experienced a lot of pain in his career who's like a pretty tough person so I definitely believe him when he says that this was insanely painful and intense not that I don't believe our other victims too but like I take him you know what I'm saying you guys sure I'm saying I gotcha so they continue to give him anti-venom but as they're doing this, and this is going to sound really familiar to you guys, his surgeon starts worrying about his swelling and thinks that he's getting compartment syndrome, which is pretty much where intense swelling prevents proper circulation, and it creates these compartments, like parts that are getting circulation and parts that aren't, and those parts that aren't start to die and might have to be amputated. But the fix for this is almost as bad as amputation. Rocky. Yeah, slice them.

Cut me. Cacheotomy. Exactly. You guys remember when we first learned about this? It was one of our first guests. It was Clara, the rattlesnake victim. Oh, yeah. Who was bitten in Joshua Tree.

And she had the same thing happen. She had pretty intense compartment syndrome. And they were saying they were going to do a fasciotomy. And she was like, no, I don't want a fasciotomy. I want more anti-venom. And that's what they ended up doing. And she didn't have to get a fasciotomy. And there's a reason people really don't want to get this procedure.

And it's because what it entails is they just make these really long and deep incisions all along the length of your leg or whatever body part to sever all the connective tissue. And that just relieves all the swelling pressure. So it's like a last-ditch scenario just to try and relieve this pressure. They just flay your leg. And it's totally life-altering. Like you might not ever walk the same way again. But it's just a way that they can try and see.

save your limb. So they were going to do it. The doctors had kind of decided that they were going to do it. And in the early morning, Kyle's night nurse found a weak pulse in his foot, which meant there was still a little bit of circulation,

and it was enough to stop the surgeons from doing this fasciotomy. They're probably a little disappointed. Yeah, they're mad. Not a lot of opportunities to do that. They're like rats. I thought it was finally going to get to do it. So he's in the hospital for eight days before the doctors thought that his blood

platelet levels were high enough to release him. He'd kind of had this like... The doctor should do it to some other guy in the hospital. They're like, well, just do it to this guy. I was all excited to do a fasciotomy. Just looking at everyone's legs. That one looks a little swollen. Apparently, though, this whole time he was in the hospital, he was having this issue where

his blood platelets would like crash and then they would go high enough to where the doctors were okay and then they would crash again and it's really serious it makes you really sick and it makes it so you you know have no blood pressure and all this stuff but finally they were at a decent level where they could discharge him from the hospital guess what his total hospital bill was 18 vials of anti-venom in eight days in the hospital uh-huh 300,000 Jeff, you have a guess? $286,000. $450,000 was his hospital bill.

Wow. Luckily, he, yeah, almost a half a million dollars. Luckily, he did have health insurance, and I believe it was mostly covered. Health insurance to the rescue. It did make me think, like, this is one of the rare people that's like, well, paying my premiums, was worth it. I got my money's worth with my health insurance, you know. Unfortunately, the snake bite had some really severe psychological damage for him. He really struggled to regain his confidence. He used to be a generally like kind of risk prone person. He was willing to take

risks to get a sense of adventure and he was very spontaneous. And the snake bite really changed his perception of life and kind of how he viewed risk. And he would see things slithering in the forest and get freaked out and not want to be in the forest anymore. And it led to some pretty severe depression and some real issues for him. Might be good for like James Winston or like a quarterback who throws a ton of interceptions to get bit by rattlesnake. Just take a little less risks afterwards. Yeah, they should try that. But from what I this was in 2017 that he wrote this article and I do believe he's overcome a lot of that.

I hope so. It seems like, you know, this is someone who's really living life to its full extent and I hope he's able to regain that confidence. And yeah, and like he has two kids now and I hope he's feeling a lot better. Me too. I don't. All right. Okay. No, you don't what?

I don't like that story. in that I hope it never happens to me. I guess is kind of what I was going to say, but I didn't do that very eloquently. So I apologize. Well, I kind of interrupted you. It would be a good excuse to try fentanyl. Yeah.

The more I learn about fentanyl, the more I learn that like what the media and the police think it is is completely different from what it actually is, which is like a very powerful painkiller. But it's not one that if you like touch or get like, residue on your fingers you pass out. Like it's just, it's a painkiller. It's something doctors use all the time.

It's just powerful. I hope my doctor isn't using it. Yeah. They use it on patients. Well, they probably are a lot of doctors. Just doing the fent lean as he's like looking in your earhole. Yeah. You'd have to try it a little, right?

Just give it a little try. I don't know. that show cops or whatever that show is, if you touch it, you die. Yeah, you just, you die immediately. Yeah, you pass out. I remember, I think I've said this before on the podcast, but listening to this show where they talk to a fentanyl expert, and he was like, if you put a pool of fentanyl in front of me right now,

I would swim in it and I would be fine. And he's just laughing about all these videos. All right. Okay, you guys got any questions about this? I actually want to echo what Mike just said about this, like, being terrible. I used to play it pretty fast and loose around rattlesnakes, and I used to just kind of think, you know, a rattlesnake bite isn't that serious as far as snake bites go,

and, like, I would be fine. And I think a big part of it is because my grandpa got bit by, like, a baby rattlesnake. And I grew up believing that myth that they were, like, the worst ones, which is not true. And just kind of thought that I'd be okay. And now I know, don't mess around with rattlesnakes. Give them their space. They are the gentlemen of snakes.

They warn you before they bite you generally. This one did not rattle. So sometimes you still get bit without a rattle, but typically you get warned. Just give them their space. We should make a tooth and claw flag or something with a rattlesnake that says, don't step on me. I like that. Yeah. What color do you think?

Like a good color for it would be. They like yellow. Black and yellow? Black and yellow. Yeah. Anyway, I think they're beautiful animals. don't like hate rattlesnakes. They are really important to their ecosystems.

They could do a lot of rodent control for us. They're incredibly beautiful, well adapted, well-evolved animals. And they deserve to be out there. But just be careful around them. You just got to be careful. Yeah, Ringo dealt with like an evil rattlesnake. But he still deserved to be out there, I think. He ended up kind of being a hero.

The rattlesnake? Yeah, he kills the bad guy. He is the bad guy No You need to watch Rango again You gotta watch Rango again Come over to my place We'll watch Rango

All right I've loved that movie Rango's so good Your fellow Dior model Voices him That's awesome dude He also did the same Fragrance Savage

Ryan did you talk to him About Rango No but he did He voiced the narration For the trailer Of the film they made with me Yeah But I never met him

Where do you Stand with his divorce. Complicated feelings about Johnny Dad. I'll say this. I was very much like, I just believed Amber Hurd. I was 100% on her side.

The guys that knew him that I worked with at Dior, that knew him well, said that they were kind of just like, both of them have some serious relationship issues. Yeah, and that's kind of how they viewed it. Sometimes both people in a relationship can be bad. You don't need to take,

you don't need to take either one of their side. Yeah, but I think I think like men have the ability to be a lot scarier and more threatening and dangerous in those situations sometimes. I do think that's what happened there, so that's why I still tend to come straight toward her side.

Was it the man or the woman who pooed on the bed? But that's not dangerous and threatening. That's funny. That's comedy. E. coli. That's dangerous. I think next time before Amber takes a dump on his bed again, she should get bit by a rattlesnake so it's all like liquidy so she can just keep doing it empty your entire bowels that'd be a good move uh yeah you know though i will say to answer your question jeff i don't know if he's like one of the celebrities that's like canceled enough for me that i wouldn't watch anything

that he's in you know that's where i kind of stand with him nothing came out that was like unforgivable i think there was some stuff that it did It was unforgivable. But it was like stuff where I could still appreciate his movies even if I really don't like him as a person. Dude, we all got her. I mean, I'm a Polanski fan. And that's like a million times worse than what death did. Sometimes I just can't help it.

I wish I could, but I can't. Chinatown? You're not a fan of him, though, as a person. It's the best movie I've ever seen, probably. You're a fan of his work. Exactly. And his clone. Yeah, a huge fan of his fragrance.

Polanskies. Yeah. That would be a weird fragrance. Just smell like old cigars and like probably, I don't know, pee. Okay. Let's do our categories. So they went on a road trip. So I wanted to know your guys' favorite road trip movie.

Yeah, the leaving Las Vegas with drop me dead. Fear and Loathing in Las Vegas. No, I'm just kidding. Leaving Las Vegas is Nick Cage. He won an Oscar for that for all you Nick haters out there. Come at me. I'm going to fight. last one of you and I'm going to win.

No, I went with, actually, I really, really liked the secret life of Walter Middy. Yeah. As far as like a road, I don't know if it's like a typical road trip movie, but it's like, I feel like road trip movies go to a lot of the same places, like Grand Canyon type stuff. And that one just showed you locations that a movie hasn't really shown you before. I can't think of any other movie where significant portions in Greenland Iceland and

you know he goes to Greenland he goes to Iceland uh oh I looked at it play it back let's go watch that movie real quick we'll be back in a minute I like that movie too there's definitely some parts in it that are like pretty cringy but I really it is a good movie it made me feel really good walking out of it

It was cringy in a way that's so forgivable, though, because it's just, it's so positive and genuine, you know? It didn't feel like it was, um. I agree. You know, yeah, I think you see. So we're both right, but I think I'm more right because you tried to correct me. Okay. How are we both right? Well, he goes to Iceland and Greenland, but he does go to Greenland.

Yeah, you are more right then. Yeah, yeah. I'll give it like 70-30 split. Nuka. Greenland. That's where he's at the bar with. the locals. Okay.

Yeah, it's a great pick. Mike, what's your favorite road trip movie? It's, it's E2 Mama Tambien. I just think it's such a beautiful, poignant movie. I talked about it recently,

so I won't go too deep into it, but I just think it's a really interesting coming of age slash political exploration of that little time window in Mexico that our guy, Cassie and Andor. Oh, man, we love that guy. Tigo Luna.

I do love him. He's a young, horny boy. in that movie. So good, though. I love it. I love that movie so much. I had a hard time with this, because it was really between three movies for me.

Mad Max Fury Road. Oh, brother, where art thou? And then the one that I decided to pick, which is Beavis and Butthead, Do America. Yes. That was a movie that my dad rented once when my mom left when I was probably like nine years old. And it was such a,

weird treat, like such an odd pick for my dad to get that movie. And I thought it was so funny. And I recently rewatched it and just thought it was so funny again. So yeah, I don't really like the new stuff they've been doing with Beavis and Butthead, but that movie is peak,

Beavis and Butthead. So, great movie. Did you see that recent S&L clip where like Ryan Gosley and I think like Colin or someone do Beavis and Butthead in the audience? And they're just like, we don't know what you're talking about. That's one of my favorite recent SNL clips.

Yeah. All right. Next category. So you guys are going to know why I came up with this category, but I'm still going to explain it for everyone. What would you name your metal band? And of course, the reason I thought of this is because his wife's name is Turin. And Turin is a character in the similar, the Silmarillion.

and he's like a very tragic character where his dad is cursed, he kills a dragon, the dragon puts a curse on him where he falls in love with his sister, but then when the dragon dies, his sister's broken from that curse, they find out that they've married each other, he kills himself, she kills himself. Really tragic story. Like one of the best parts of the Similar Alien though, and it's the whole purpose of the book The Children of Huron. But the Children of Huron was narrated by Christopher Lee,

who plays Soramon, and what else does he play? Instruments in metal bands. So it made me think of that. You said we already knew that. Of course you guys knew that's like where my mind went. So I wanted to know what you would name your metal band. Because I've always had a good idea for that. And I wanted to say it.

Dave Barry, one of my favorite writers ever, humor columnist. Every time he encountered a funny turn of phrase, he would always say that that would make like a fun funny band name or a metal band name. And my favorite one he ever identified was shark puke. There's just something about those two words together that's really stuck in my brain ever since I first read it forever ago. So shark puke would be my metal band name. Jeff, I went with the tooth and claw band.

That's really, that's solid, yeah. Don't tread on me. Don't step on me Could be our Our first album Mine's wet nightmare You know Because we've all had wet dreams

But this is a wet nightmare So Yeah What does that What does that Give me an example Of a wet nightmare You've never had one before

I had one Yeah It's normally just a wet dream for you I've had some wet nightmares I had one where I was like Rolling on this huge plastic red ball And it would like crush me And I like

had a wet nightmare. I can't explain it. That is pretty inexplicable. That's a great example, thank you. All right. What movie are you most excited for this summer? Can I go first on this one?

Please. I'm really excited for the movie, The End of Oak Street. I feel like it's the one with, why am I blinking on their names? Ann Hathaway and Ewan McGregor, where they're in the 70s or 80s

and their street suddenly gets transported to like prehistoric times. There's dinosaurs everywhere. It's directed by the guy that did It Follows. And it to me looks really fun and just like a totally unique idea. And I'm really excited to see a scary dinosaur movie that's not a Jurassic movie.

Like those have gotten really stale and this just seems like it's going to be a really fun time at the movie so I'm really excited for it I had the same choice okay uh I like that from what it seems like there's not too much explanation I don't need an explanation just give me dinosaurs in a suburb and I'm happy and they're just like hey one day you wake up and there's dinosaurs in your town yeah um really excited for Supergirl actually I'm still I've something of a fondness for Superman in his little universe, so

excited for that. But the one I'm actually most excited for is a movie called The Rivals of Amzai a king. It's a Matthew McConaughey movie that's coming out soon. It's about kind of this weird mafia type of organization that is very

controlling of bees and honey in this very specific region in the United States. It looks really interesting and fun and kind of authentic and rustic. It's a pretty cool. Yeah, I'm excited for it. It's like a bee honey caper kind of story thing.

Bee honey mafia. Yeah. Wow. Never would have thought. Some bluegrass music. Also, shout out Spider-Man. I love that guy. Yeah.

I like the new Spider-Man movies, so I'll definitely see it. I think they need to take it easy a little bit on the green screen and, like, film in some real locations. But I hope they did that on this one. So, yeah. All right. Would you rather take a bite from a Northern Pacific rattlesnake or vomit once a day every day for the rest of your life and you never know when it's going to happen?

I'll take the rattlesnake. Me too. Easily. Yeah. Yeah, I think I would too. It's not easy for me, though, because there's a decent chance you lose a limb or something. And I'd rather vomit once a day every day for the rest of my life than lose a limb.

But I think I would roll the dice. You don't know when it's going to happen. I know. Like I could just do it right now. It's so prohibitive. I know. Or it wakes you up in the middle of the night. Yeah, I think so too.

But it did make me think about it. All right. Really quickly, I just wanted to talk about conservation. Rattlesnakes in general are doing fairly well. They're animals that are able to adapt to a lot of the disturbances that we cause in their habitat and their environment. But they are animals that are feared by people still. So there's a lot of people that kill rattlesnakes on site. There are still those like rattlesnake roundups where they kill thousands, if not tens of thousands of snakes.

So there are species of rattlesnakes that are threatened. I'm not sure with the Northern Pacific what its current conservation status is. But I just want to encourage people to appreciate the good that these animals do for the ecosystem. And even more than that, I don't think an animal needs to serve an important purpose to humans for us to see it as, worthy of protection, you know? I think that's kind of a far too human-centric way of looking at things. They have earned their place here by simply evolving to be what they are. They're beautiful animals.

They're wonderful animals. Whether or not you're afraid of them, just let them be and give them plenty of space. I feel like all your S's right now sound like a snake. I'm popping my S's. I need to get one of those things that helps. I feel like that's happening to me is my teeth move or something. that I don't know. Move your microphone off to the side.

That's, okay. I've been trying to talk to the side of it more. Snake is saying it. And then the other thing I'll say is if you do happen to be bit by a rattlesnake, you are going to have this kind of desire to do these things that you've heard of before to try and fix it. Things like trying to suck the venom out or putting on a tourniquet. All of those things don't work.

Some of them can actually make things worse. So don't do those things. What you need to do is relax, make yourself as calm as possible, and try and get to medical assistance as quickly as possible. Those are the only things that work with rattlesnakes. Anything else, that venom is in your system already. Like, it took Kyle less than a minute for him to pass out as an effect from the venom. You are not sucking it out. You're not stopping it.

Calm down. Get to help as quickly as possible. That's what you need to do. Which is what makes it kind of. If you do get bit at the top of a water slide is if you go down, you have to stay calm the whole time. You can't be excited at all. Yeah. Yeah, that's a good point.

No fun if you get bit by a rattlesnake. Okay. I recognize it's been a minute since we've done listener questions, but we will bring that back soon. I promise. I just forgot to prepare it for this episode. You missed one of our categories. Which one did I miss? No, he didn't.

A favorite, most memorable rattlesnakes scene. We got one more category. Your favorite or most memorable rattlesnakes scene from TVs or movies. You better have a good answer, Jeff. He missed it. He probably has one. I have an answer. I have a worst and the best.

I think for best, true grit, the newest true grit with Matt Damon, where she falls in the little cave and there's a bunch of rattlesnakes. That's scary and is well done. And then my least favorite was the movie Babylon, where Margot Robbie gets bit by rattlesnake. And it just holds on to her neck the whole time and she's freaking out. And then someone cuts its head off and sucks the venom out of her neck. And it's just like that, none of that worked for me. Yeah, that is a bad scene. You picked my favorite two, too, too grit, even though it's kind of, it doesn't,

really paint rattlesnakes the right way. I do think it's a really good scene. And it's better than a lot of movies like Babylon. I kind of like Babylon. I like Babylon, but the rattlesnake scene isn't a great rattlesnakes scene. I like it because of the rattlesnake. Mostly. All right.

I'll just go with the one where Jean-Claude Van Damme punches it. That is a great one. It's pretty great. Is that hard target? I forget what the... Hard target. Yeah. Yeah.

Yeah. Yeah. I always get it. confused with hard to kill. Sagal. Which is Seagal. Much better movie. Two giants of action movies.

All right. Well, that's all I got. Thank you everyone for listening. I hope you enjoyed it. If you want to know more about this particular story, like I mentioned, there are other shows where Kyle tells it in his own words. Does a much better job than I ever could. So I think you should check it out if you want to hear it again.

Smart to say that at the end of the episode. Yeah. Outside has a podcast where he was on it. And then I think against the odds, he does an episode with them as well. But I mostly used his article and some other online articles. All right. Thanks, Kyle. I owe you $25. You do owe me $25. Yeah. I told a story. All right. See you guys. Love you, everyone. Love you. Bye.