Tooth & Claw: True Stories of Animal Attacks - Shark Attack in the Red Sea - News Stories Including a Recent Fatal Bear Attack in Yellowstone, an Otter Eating Surfboards, and a Boy Calling 911 About His Own Alligator Attack

Episode Date: July 31, 2023

Wes, Jeff, and Mike cover some more recent animal attack stories, most notably the tragic fatal shark attack that occurred in Egypt, as well as a host of other stories involving unusually aggressive black bears, a renegade sea otter, and more. ~~ To advertise on the show, contact us! ~~ Tooth & Claw is brought to you by QCODE. Support the show and get access to an extensive library of exclusive episodes like this by supporting the show on Patreon or joining the Grizzly Club on Apple Podcasts. For the latest updates on the show and all things wildlife, follow us at toothandclawpod.com and social:  Instagram: @ToothandClawPodcast Twitter: @ToothandClawPod Wes: @GrizKid Jeff: @jefe_larson Mike: @mikey3ds    Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

If the world were like a sleep number mattress, everything would adapt for your comfort. Because as your life changes and your body changes, sleep number mattresses adapt and shift to give you personalized comfort night after night. And now everything's on sale during our Memorial Day event. Save up to $1,200 on mattresses for a limited time. To experience a whole new world of comfort, visit a sleep number store or go to sleepnumber.com. Sleep number to a good life sleep. Welcome to Tooth and Claw podcast. I'm Jeff Larson.

We got my wildlife biologist brother, we think. Now, we know. We think I'm your brother? We think I'm a wildlife biologist. Which one of those? We think both things. Yeah. We know one of them.

We'll let you guys guess which one. And we got, I'm at Wes's house. Hey, look at that. Yeah. Yep, yep. I thought you were just trying to copy him like you usually do. But you're actually there. You didn't just do interior decoration in order to be more like your older brother.

I'm kind of copying him by being in his house because he's always here. Yeah, that's true. I'm hardly ever there actually. Jesse is here. Yeah. Okay. He tried sleeping in our bed last night. I was going to say it.

Yeah. I drew the line there. Jesse was into it. Mike, you're here too. Hey, what's up? Mike's here. Mike Smith, the one and only Mike Smith. Yep, the only one in the entire world.

We looked it up. Oh, man, I wish. There's no others. Hey, all your listeners out there, if you know any other Mike Smiths, just kill them for me. Kill them. I want to be the one and only. There's probably a couple millions, but I think we can do it. Someday we're going to come, like, we're doing our news episode today.

Sooner later, we're going to come across a Mike Smith victim, and that's going to be an interesting thing for us. Probably. We could probably just Google Mike Smith Animal Attack. I'm going to do that right now. Have, like, a year's worth of content. We should do a whole news episode just on Mike Smiths that have been attacked by animals. Oh, yeah. Vicious cow attack in Huntsville, Michael Smith.

Dang. Really? Yeah, that's real. Cow, too. I know. That's close to home. Yeah, I was going to look up news stories to share, but then I ended up just looking up. I mean, I found a thread of celebrities that have cheated on each other.

So then I just looked at that instead. Yeah, that's much more interesting. That's pretty interesting. Yeah. A lot of them cheat. Who are some notable ones? Well, oh, wait. Who was that dude who, that country singer who just, like, told everyone on Twitter that if he doesn't agree with them, they should die?

Jason Aldeen. Yeah, Jason Aldeen. Yeah, who wrote the really racist song? He's like a real stand-up guy, right? No. Not so much. He cheated on his wife, and then he's trying to tell us to be, you know? Yeah.

Get out of your, Jason Aldeen. Stay out of my mentions, right? So that one was pretty funny. He's not going to cheat with you on his wife. He's always up in there in my mentions, though. Mentioning me. Adam Levine had a pretty bad one. Oh, I remember that.

That was all up in the news, too. He, like, named his kid after the person he cheated on her way. Yeah. Oh, gosh. He was all desperate in her. Yeah, that was a weird one. It's just inconsiderate. It's got bad tattoos, too.

Yeah, you got more? The Kristen Stewart one. a classic because she was with Robert Pattinson. Who'd she cheat on him with again? It was like the director of the Twilight movies, right? Oh. Yeah.

That was messy. It wasn't a werewolf. I thought it was a wolf. Probably had a couple of werewolves in there. Well, they all kind of cheat if you count the movies they kiss other people in. Yeah. I don't think that counts. Oh yeah, the guy that was dating the new little mermaid,

Haley, I forget her name, but he was dating. the girl that plays the new little mermaid, and he did this big public rant about how she was cheating on him because she was kissing her co-star and stuff. No way? Yeah. That's some Jonah Hill energy there. Yeah.

Oh, man. We got so much. This is now a celebrity gossip podcast. The one that, the one that, like, got me started on it was freaking Ariana Grande cheated on her fiancee with the SpongeBob voice. Yeah. And the guy looks like SpongeBob, too. All right.

I just probably say that. Oh, man, so good. You know, we got way sidetracked, but we're talking about my house. You guys are considering moving nearby, right? We've been thinking about it, yeah. All right. Yeah. I'm just going to keep gently prodding you to do that because it'd be nice to have you in my neighborhood here in Montana.

You know, it's always fun when we're all together. It is. It's the best. I saw four skunks yesterday. Oh, nice. Good job, Jeff. You know what? I understand why people get sprayed by. Because they're cute.

Because they're just so stinking cute. Yeah, exactly. Sting cute? And they weren't like, yeah. And they weren't like super fast. I felt like I could have got close to them. Oh, they were all together. It wasn't like four separate sightings.

It was like a mom with three little baby skunks. Four separate sightings would be impressive. And they all had to. I really wanted it to be that. Tails up. It's the best I've ever seen skunks. I was pretty excited. Well, speaking of little miso carnivores, I saw six.

raccoons in our neighbor's yard last night. So we're just seeing all sorts of little critters around. They were. Yeah. One of them, I backed up because I wasn't sure what they were. Yeah, it was a mom and her mid-sized babies. You still wish you were in their family? Oh, yeah.

Raised by raccoons. The mom, like, stood up on her hind legs and watched me, though, as I drove by. It was pretty cute. Yeah. Yeah. I love raccoons. You've owned, like, 10 raccoons. I've had a few, but, well, should we get into this?

Should we do our news episode? It's been a minute since our last one. Yeah, let's do it. Okay. Our last one was with the nature's metal guy. But now he's not here. It's just the three of us. He's too metal for us.

Yeah, he was like, hey, you guys aren't metal enough. So it's just the three of us. But let's get into it. I'm going to start because there's one that I wanted to lead with that just happened that we're already starting to get a lot of people asking about. it's one that's really close to home for me, so I just wanted to start with it. Are you guys ready?

Ready. Let's do it. All right. So recently, I believe this was Saturday morning, so that would have been the 22nd. Let me double check that really quick. It was because me and West have Hawaiian cousins in town, and me and all of our Hawaiian cousins and my parents

were in Yellowstone the 21st, the day before this happened. Okay. So on the morning, of the 22nd, a woman was killed by a grizzly bear just outside of Yellowstone National Park in West Yellowstone. There's not a ton of information yet. I have been in contact with some coworkers out there and learned a little bit more about it, but as far as stuff that's out and available to the public, there's not a lot. There was a 48-year-old woman. Her name was Amy Adamson. She was a teacher that had taught English for two decades in her hometown of Derby, Kansas.

and then she got burnt out, she left the profession to start hiking around the country, and she even wrote a book about her decision to leave and her subsequent adventures while hiking. And her body was found on the Buttermilk Creek Trail in West Yellowstone, with injuries consistent with the grizzly bear attack. And then they did find both adult and cub tracks around the site. So they're very confident that this was a female with cubs. Whoever named all this stuff at Yellowstone is just the hungriest person ever? Buttermilk Creek Trail.

Yeah. Yeah. It'd be a weird thing to be super hungry for. Soda Springs. Yeah. Cook City. That's true. Yeah, a bear named it.

They seem pretty hungry. Yeah. She didn't have bear spray with her. She didn't. There is no sign of feeding. She just says yeah to that. Yeah. Well, this is a very new one.

There's no sign of feeding on her. So the general consensus is that this was a defensive attack that she was killed quite quickly by just like really brutal attack injuries and then exanguination too so i will say you know the one i think the one extinguination exinguination is bleeding out so i will say like the one comfort i think her family and friends can take is that this wasn't a really prolonged attack from what it seems it wasn't like the bear sat on her and ateer and we've talked about that how that's really like the worst possible way that you can go this seems much more like a really brutal, really defensive attack, where she likely surprised this female

with cubs and the female just hit her with everything it had to get her to stop. And again, like, if they treat us the same way, they treat other bears. So if that were another bear, that bear would probably like limp away from that interaction being like, well, I need to avoid this female. You know, she means business. But for a human, we're so soft and it's so easy for them to injure us that that kind of attack can be completely devastating to us. So unfortunately, that's what happened. She didn't have bearspray with her, which, who knows, like, how quickly this whole thing unfolded.

If she did, it likely could have saved her life. Game warnings did place traps on Saturday. This did take place outside of the park, so this isn't park personnel that's directly involved with this, although they're probably assisting. It will be University, or not university, it'll be Montana State Game Wardens that are doing this. and they're trying to trap the bear. They started trapping on Saturday, but it's gone, you know,

we're recording now on Tuesday. They still haven't caught this bear. So pretty soon they'll probably pull those traps because the likelihood of catching that same bear goes less and less, and the likelihood of catching a bear that's not responsible goes up. And that just creates problems for them.

This is an area that's close to West Yellowstone, so they don't necessarily want to draw new bears into that area. So pretty soon they'll probably stop trapping. If they do catch her, I'm pretty confident this is a bear that they'll euthanize. If this had taken place in the park, in a really wild area of the park, and it was someone hiking alone without bear spray, and a female with cubs killed that person in a defensive attack, there's a chance that bear would be granted a reprieve

because it's the national park. It's a place where you're supposed to be ready for those kind of interactions. It's wild. This took place really close to a city, and it's a really big liability for them, to leave that bear out there. And we're talking about the greater Yellowstone ecosystem where there's probably close to a thousand grizzly bears now.

They're pretty much at carrying capacity is what we think. So while this bear, you know, inherently its life is precious. As far as it's like contribution to the population, it's not as important as it would be if this were like a population that was really struggling because this is a female bear. So like, for example, the bear that we talked about in Italy last time, that's a really small population and that's a bear that you don't necessarily want to have to remove because it's a producing female bear here in yellowstone it is a decision you can make because there are so many bears in the population how many how many bears live like outside of the park and how far does that go at so inside

the park we think we have about 175 grizzly bears and outside of yellowstone then there's in total in that ecosystem, there's about a thousand. So really only a small percentage live inside the park. There's a lot that live in southwestern Montana, that live in Wyoming. In Grand Teton, there's a number of bears. So they're spread out. Yeah. But again, this is like, I think we're in a really good place where we can make those kinds of decisions and removing problem animals in a way as a conservation measure. Because the public knows that you're then dealing aggressively with animals that could be dangerous and they then feel like these problems are kind of being taken care of and then that behavior isn't necessarily like passed on to more and more cubs which can happen so

because these cubs watch their mom attack somebody too yeah and like it is it is different when it's a feeding thing like that's definitely a bear that gets removed defensive is kind of like a little bit more nuanced but i do think in this case they'd be justified in in getting rid of her unfortunately. I've been thinking about, and like, I kind of think that if a person's in grizzly bear country without bear spray, like, it's the bear's right to be able to attack them. And we have something that will protect them. So I kind of think, like, if they don't have bear spray, we should let the bears live.

Yeah. And I know that, like, I don't disagree with you. You know what I mean? Because it's like, we got to have people start using bear spray everywhere. Like, that's the real. In grizzly. especially. I don't disagree with you. I do think, I think the main issue here isn't so much putting blame. Obviously, like, we're not going to put blame on her. Like, you know, this is like a terrible thing.

But like there is something you could have done to help yourself. Yeah. And like, hopefully people can learn from this experience. Yeah, but what I'm saying is I think the main reason why they'll probably, if they catch the spare, they'll probably make the decision to remove her isn't so much like, oh, this bear is a bad bear. It's more of a liability. issue. Yeah. So and we've talked about this before. In case they attack someone else. Right. If they let this bear go and then it attacks someone else, that person has like, or their family has a really good legal standing to sue for a lot of money. So yeah. Anyway, I'm just, I'm the mindset where I'm going to think of any way to keep the bear, you know? Yeah, I agree. I was wondering what the

process looked like and I hope this isn't too much of like a morbid straight to go down. But like, what does the process look like when you euthanize the bear? Is it like they catch it and it's pretty immediate that they put it down? Or do they move it somewhere or is there like a trial? What they would do is because kind of in a way. Because they have obviously like the victim's body and some DNA evidence there, they would catch the bear and then they would test it against hairs, saliva, whatever other evidence they find on the body to make sure that they have the right bear.

and then once they're positive they have the right bear, they would humanely euthanizer. So that generally either involves an injection or like the no country for old men cattle bolt thing that the guy uses. It's really humane. It's like an air bolt. You just put it against the head and it shoots a bolt into the head.

It's how they kill cattle. So it's an immediate death. I didn't know that was a real thing. Yeah, those are the two things that in this ecosystem, at least in the yellowstone ecosystem, those are generally the two ways that. And if it's a situation where you don't have a bear in a trap, but maybe it's in a snare or something, then they would use a 12 gauge of slugs. So if you ever kill anyone, Mike, you just got to put your DNA on some, on a grizzly

bears claws. Not your DNA, their DNA. And frame it. Oh, yeah. Okay. No, that's actually a good plan. Yeah. But before we leave this one, I obviously just wanted.

to say, it's terrible for the victim. You know, our hearts go out to their family. This isn't a way that anyone ever expects to lose a loved one. But it does really sound like Amy had found her passion. Besides mom with you. Yeah, that's true. Besides mom. It does sound like Amy had really found her passion

and was really truly doing what she loved when she died. So I'm a big fan of people following their passions, you know. Yeah. This summer, serve up the cookout classics. craft mayo and dressing. Toss green salads with delicious ranch dressing or zesty Italian. Serve smooth, craveably creamy potato salads with mayo. We all know it's not a cookout without craft.

Okay, so that's it for my first story. Who wants to go next? Yeah, I'll go. I have a bear one, but I'll save that since we just did a bear. Mix it up a little, you know? Just teasing us then? Yeah. So I'm going to do a prairie rattlesnake.

Okay. So on June 16th, this happened. on June 16th. So Mike and Wes, you're riding on your bike and you fall off. What would you least want to fall on to? An atom bomb. Oh, man, that was my answer. Shoot.

A black hole. Okay. Well, no, those are better answers. What animal would you least want to fall on? A hundred of those spiny puffer fish. Mike? I had... Porcupine.

Orca. Well, maybe I shouldn't set that up because those are maybe worse than this. A prairie rattlesnake. Yeah. So Ethan Vogel and his father, Zach Vogel, we're going for an evening ride on the trails in the North Table Mountains in Golden, Colorado, on June 6th. So I guess it was 16th. Yeah. Because you made it very clear earlier that this happened on the 16th.

Yeah, the article was on the 16th. Oh, man. They get you that way. don't they? Yeah. So he's riding and Ethan clips of boulder and tumbles off his bike like about an hour and a half into their ride. Okay. So he starts looking for wounds and then he sees two puncture wounds and he starts to quickly lose feeling in his face and hands. He landed on a 30-inch prairie rattlesnake sitting beside the trail that bit him in the torso near his armpit. Oh, weird. Yeah. So he only saw the snake once he got back up and he was hoping as a thorn at first but then he heard the

rattle and kind of started piecing it all together he was like thorns don't do that thorns don't rattle um so the snake obviously didn't really expect this to come either right right so it injected a lot of venom and ethan began throwing up his heartbeat picked up he lied down and his heartbeat picked up to 165 beats per minute. Oh, gosh. Yeah, that's pretty fast. But he was riding a bike for an hour and a half. Yeah, I was going to say, I feel like when I work out really hard,

mine gets up to about 160. So his dad called for help, and they waited for 20 minutes, and then Ethan was taken to St. Anthony Hospital in Little Town. Little Town. And he was given 16. It's called Little Town, I think. Is there a W in there, Little Town? Yeah.

Yeah. Okay. I'm giving six, my, my auto correct even corrected it to Littleton. Okay. And I had to go back in and. Am I your auto correct? Is that what you call me now? You're working.

Yeah. And he's given 16 doses of anti-ventum. So that got me thinking, we should just increase how big one dose of anti-venom is with rattlesnakes, right? Because it's always like, 15, or like, yeah. Yeah. That's true. Like, it would be like,

if you were in a lot of pain and they were like, okay, I'm going to give you a 20th of a dose of morphine. Maybe you just give me all of it. Like a... Maybe I just won all 20 at once. No, but Ethan ended up taking a few days to recover and was looking forward to getting back on his mountain bike. And when they hear a rattle, they just are going to give them space.

But that's smart. When you fall off your bike and you don't see the snake, you can't really. do that. Yeah. You got to think of that. Have you guys ever fallen off a bike, like as an adult? Yeah. Yeah.

It sucks. It's really, it's not the same as when you fell off when you were a kid. For whatever reason, it's like a hundred times worse. It's crazy how, like, how durable kids are. I know. Because I just like, I see kids falling and I'm just like, man, that would just break my ankle if I did that, you know? I, there's a, there's another one that I read that I didn't do as a story, but I'm just

going to do is like a quick blurb. There's a girl in Idaho Falls who was, like, in the water in a reservoir boating, and she was climbing back into the boat, and she got bit by a rattlesnake that was in the water. What? That's so unlucky. Oh, man. You got to think about the rattlesnake in your story that pretty unlucky for it, too, that, like, an actual giant, like, speeding giant fell out of the air on top of it.

Like, that sucks for that snake, too. Yeah. Maybe it for biting. I'd bite. For biting. Yeah. Maybe it, like, slithered into his spokes and was. trying to get him off that bike, you know, so it could bite him.

Did the Indiana Jones on him? Yeah. Just threw 500 feet through the air. The snake had like a goal of not biting any humans anymore. And then he's just doing great. And then a human just fell on him. He's like, ah, shoot. He had a little bored at home that said like 600 days since biting a human and then he had to cross it out.

All right. That's it for my story. All right. It's a good story. Mike, what you got? I've got, oh, man, just wait for this one. So what do you guys think about national parks as a place to propose to your significant other? I think that's a pretty good place.

Depends on how busy is. If you're at Death Valley when it's 130 degrees, maybe not. Bad place. Yeah. Yeah, true. Yosemite's a good one. Yosemite. Yosemite.

That's what I said. Sure. Is that where Half Dome is? Because that'd be a cool place on top of Half Dome. That'd be great. One of my friends took, like, the coolest engagement pictures I've ever seen, and it's on top of half. Oh, really? Shout out, Cody.

She's, like, the person he was proposing to is probably worried that if she said no, you'd push her off. So that's a pretty good strategic spot. If you want to, like, really make sure she says yes. Here she. Okay, so this story begins. Chris Whitehill and Amber Harris were spending a nice day in Yellowstone, and while Chris Whitehill's plan was to make it an extra special outing by proposing to Amber, a bison decided to make it memorable in its own way. What do you think it was playing in Jeff?

Maybe like the, like, no, you should be with me. Yeah, right. So you were in Yellowstone, right? Just this past week. Yeah. You posted like your favorite geyser. Oh, yeah. Beehive geyser.

Old Faithful is like number five. Oh, really? Yeah, I would say, I would agree with Jeff. Beehive's probably my favorite and then probably an enemy. It's just soaking us. It's like, Almost twice as high as old faithful, but the boardwalk goes right next to it. So you just get drenched.

Oh, really? That's cool. Yeah. Gisers are sweet. Do you think animals ever use them as like a bidet? So there's no... I just wanted to talk about Geysers because I saw your toast. You did in that one artwork we just put out.

You're using one like a bidet. That's right. Oh, man. I'm so happy. So on the morning of July 17th, Amber was enjoying some coffee while out on a walk near Lake Yellowstone. with her daughter and Chris when they spotted a bison. Quote, we stopped and looked at the massive beast

about 50 yards away on the trail, hidden at first in the shadows of the trees. We watched him drop and roll in the dirt like a dogwood. Do you see bison do that much, Wes? Yeah, they do it all the time. They're wallowing, yeah. Wallowing. That's the word.

It cools them off, it gets rid of parasites. And then those wallows that they create, like these depressions in the ground, are actually really important to prayer ecosystems because they collect water and they create this little like mini water impression in the land and it helps vegetation. It will probably be helpful if bison lived like all throughout the country. Yeah, it would be.

We'd probably have much healthier prairie ecosystems and agriculture. Too bad they can't, you know? Yeah, impossible. Never happened. That prairie snake in your last story, Jeff, it would have had a place to be hanging out instead of right on the bike path. Yeah, exactly. Could have prevented a snake bite.

I watched a bison wallow while I was just in Yellowstone. It's cool. Pretty cool. Make you want to do it? It's like LeBron James throwing the chalk in the air before games. All right. Are we ever going to finish this story, Mike? Yeah.

So, continuing on with a quote. This is still Amber speaking. He got up on his feet and started walking and then running towards us. Chris said later on in an interview with today, we just kept moving away. Moving away. I told Amber, do not run. Is that good advice? No.

So you do want to run. Yeah, you just want to get away. Yep. So Chris said that despite their attempt to flee, quote, he struck her head on and she was airborne. I think she did one or two backflips in the air and I was screaming and yelling trying to distract him. She landed pretty hard on her back. That's pretty sweet. It is pretty fun, especially since she lived.

That bison's bragging. Yeah. I got a two and a halfer. I got a two flipper 15 feet. Yep. The National Park Service said in a news release that she was transported by helicopter to eastern Idaho Regional Medical Center. Amber later wrote on Facebook that she suffered seven spinal fractures, bilateral collapsed lungs, and bruising all over. Quote, glory to God, all my vital organs look good.

So at least got there. Not sweet for Amber. Sorry for you if you listen that I said that's sweet. The bison did that. Yeah. So this story, it has a pretty sweet ending. So even though she entered the hospital as White Hill's girlfriend, It turns out that she'll still be leaving at his fiancé after he went through with the proposal at her hospital bedside.

Quote, without any hesitation, I said yes. That's nice. And I saw there's this really fun picture. I saw in an article. It was the two of them at a Phoenix Suns game. So let me be the first to say congratulations on getting rid of Chris Paul. And congratulations on getting engaged. All right.

Yeah, they got a good team. I'm excited to see how they do. They got a really fun engagement story out of that. That is great. Yeah. As long as she recovers fully, then that's a fun story. It's more fun than just a proposal in Yellowstone. Yeah.

They did better than that dating couple we talked about that both got gored by bison and then broke up. Yeah. I guess the key is just for one person to get gourd, not both. All right. Started that way with ours. That's true. All right, so I've got another one that's a little bit on the somber side. Well, a lot bit on the somber side.

A pretty sad one that got sent to a mutine. I was a lot of the news. All over social media. A lot of shark biologists I saw talking about it. This is a tough one. It's always worse when you can see the video. Yeah. So this is a tiger shark attack in Egypt.

And again, like Jeff just mentioned, there was a viral. video circulating where the victim of this attack is actually seen being attacked by the shark. I think, you know, as more and more people are going in the water and more and more people have a really quickly accessible video device in their pocket, we're going to see more and more of this. We're going to see people being attacked by animals. And in some ways, I think like scientifically speaking, there's some good that can be done from that where we can learn insights about attacks. We can learn some things that I'm going to talk about later about behavior, but then it's also like really graphic and really hard to watch.

And I would I would just recommend anyone out there that's debating whether or not this is something you want to watch. Don't watch it. This was a hard one. This is one that really stuck with me afterward. It's one that's going to make me a little bit more scared to go in the water to be completely honest with you. So I would say if that's a fear of yours, if you're someone that through the show or through

whatever else has been able to overcome that to some extent, putting this kind of imagery in your mind isn't going to help because if just remembering the statistics and remembering how unlikely this is will help, remembering what you should do and what you should avoid will help. But having these kind of images in there isn't, isn't going to be a good thing for you. So I would say avoid it. All right. So the story. On June 8th, Vladimir Popov was swimming with his girlfriend, Anastasia, near the beach in the popular

ocean side city of Hergata, Egypt. I'm probably saying that wrong, but it's H-U-R-G-H-A-A-A. His father was also on the beach enjoying this really beautiful atmosphere of this beach called Dream Beach. And Vladimir had been living in Egypt for months with his father, likely to avoid conscription in the ongoing conflict with Ukraine because he was a Russian national. And he was getting used to the pace of life, the culture in the North African country of Egypt, and like a lot of people who moved there, he was especially entranced by the really beautiful waters of the Red Sea. So this part of coastal Egypt that does border the Red Sea, it does have really amazing beaches. And the Red Sea is this really beautiful reef covered sea that, you know, is great for divers,

it's great for swimmers. But it's also really great for a number of shark species. We've talked about shark attacks there with oceanic white tips, and then tiger sharks and another species that you sometimes encounter. So on the 8th of June, Vladimir was simply doing what he had already done a ton of times in his life. He's swimming in the ocean on a hot day. And as he moved a bit further out in the water from Anastasia, who was also in the water with him, he was suddenly struck from behind by a massive shark. And this shark was an 11-foot-long female tiger shark. And unfortunately for Vladimir, this was a shark that wasn't simply curious. It was in search of food. So it continued to attack him as he screamed for help from his dad.

For me, that was definitely the hardest part of the video is when he pops up. Shark pulls him under, he pops up and then starts yelling for help. That's when I... That's when I turned it off. I couldn't finish it. It was like there's... It's just not like a glamorous thing. It's not like in movies where there's like a soundtrack.

It's just like silent. I was about to say the exact same thing. Just horrifying. The whole attack and not to debase it by like comparing it to a movie scene. No. But like in Jaws where the... little boy is attacked on his on his float away from the ocean you have all these like cuts and you have all the like the music and you have like as it gets too intense it cuts away from it and this video doesn't

have any of that and so it is really it's very visceral it's really hard to watch but what you do see is you see him disappear under the water multiple times you see his arms and legs spin through the air anastasia swims to shore she turns to watch uh in this you know stunned disbelief with dozens of other onlookers as he's eaten in front of them. And the entire attack takes about 20 seconds. And again, it's captured on video by a few different people. And in the very end of the video, you see the shark surge four one last time. He goes underwater and you see the shark's tail slap the water a bit.

And then a rescue boat shows up seconds later. But he's already, at that point, he'd already been killed by the shark. So again, I do think the kind of silver lining of this whole thing is that it was really quick. I mean, we see it from start to finish. It doesn't last long. And it was a large shark, so really devastating bites that would cause him to not suffer nearly as much if it was like a bull shark or maybe something smaller. I shouldn't say that. Bull shark is probably about the same size.

So both his father, unfortunately, and his girlfriend watched it unfold in front of them. Later, his father was quoted as saying, we went to the beach to relax. My son was attacked by a shark. What kind of help can you give? This meat grinder happened in 20. seconds, he was just dragged under the water. The father was also quoted to say it was a ridiculous coincidence, which to me shows that he did understand that, like, this is a really unlikely thing.

Like, they'd probably gone to the beach dozens of times, swam dozens of times, not even seen a shark, and then it just so happened on this day that his son was attacked by a shark. Well, and then, like, when you take it out of context of just them, millions of people go in the Red Sea all the time, you know? Right, right. Yeah. So the thing, though, I do want to know. Not all at the same time, though.

That's true. Well, on an even day, there's probably a million people that go in the Red Sea, you know? Or I don't know. Probably not that many, but close. Yeah, I have no idea. Maybe a billion. Not a billion. So I will say, like, unfortunately this, you know, in a different way, this story gets even more tragic,

where the shark was in the area of feeding on the remains of this man. And so they went out and caught the shark. and it was dragged ashore by a big metal hook through its eye. It was pulled up on shore alive where people proceeded to beat it to death with metal rods. Oh, gosh. So, I mean, that also is just like terrible. It was opened up and they did find his body parts inside, parts of his head, torso, and arms. So it definitely, you know, was the responsible shark.

But in my opinion, like the really savage part of this whole thing, because like every article I read had words like savage, merciless. There was a few articles that said the shark toyed with his remains for hours after he was killed when it was just feeding. And so for me, the savage part of this whole thing was the way that the shark was killed in retaliation. Like that, that's the savagery. Should the shark be removed if they know which shark it is?

Yes, because it's likely that this shark could repeat this behavior. Not even likely, but possible. So yeah, I'm not against removing the shark. Should it be killed humanely? Definitely. You know, it shouldn't be beaten to death by a group of onlookers. To me, as brutal as it is and as like terrible of a way to go, a shark eating another, like a mammal in the water, isn't savagery.

That's not a feeding frenzy. That's not a shark that's like gone rogue. You know, it's not like full of rage. It's an animal that's taking advantage of a food source in the water. And like that's not our environment. That's not a place that we necessarily be. belong. So we're somewhat easy preyed for an animal like a tiger shark, you know. And so we're lucky that this doesn't happen more often, in my opinion. Like, this is something that could happen

every single day if sharks wanted to take advantage of it and they don't. And I think like we're so lucky that we are able to be as at home in the ocean as we are. But to me, there's nothing savage about a massive predator deciding to attack a potential source of food. Yeah. Hopefully, like, I don't It's really terrible they killed it that way But I'm just thinking like in America so many people have like guns and like easier ways to kill something like that too Right Maybe they just didn't have like a great way to kill it once they're possible Yeah, it's possible

Like you would think they would have like a knife or something you could kill it faster with There's a video of it though and you can tell that these people are like enraged just getting revenge That they're getting it's retribution I don't know I like to me that's the no it's the no it's part of the whole thing. Yeah, that's bad. So I will say I looked into this a little bit more, because it did seem like a lot of people were like, wow, this isn't that common of a thing around here. Why did this happen? And there was a fatal tiger shark attack not far from here last year. And the more I read about it, the more I read about these livestock ships. So there's ships that cross the Red Sea in the northern part of the Red Sea between Egypt and I forget what's

across there. Is it Oman? I can't remember. But they cross that straight right there and they often carry large amounts of livestock. And those livestock aren't in great conditions. It's really hot. They often die on this voyage. And when they do, they just toss them overboard, which is like a huge boon to sharks. And sharks will actually follow these boats. And so sometimes what they're saying is like boats will dock in areas near where this attack happened. And they essentially bring all these new sharks into the area. And these are sharks that are used to feeding on mammals. They're used to feeding on stuff that's not necessarily like a typical prey item to them.

So that's possibly a shark that's more interested in alternative sources of prey than what they would normally be feeding on. And it's likely, well, I mean, I shouldn't even say likely. It's possible that that's what happened here. It's one of these sharks that just had kind of diverted from its typical behavior and is now investigating new sources of prey. It's also just a shark, you know? Like, this is an animal that sometimes decides to eat us,

and that's the risk we take when we go in the ocean. And I think for context, we kill up to 100 million of these animals every year, you know? Like, if you want an idea of the scope of the brutality that we inflict on them, Google shark fins drying on rooftops, and you'll get a good view into, like, how devastating of a practice shark finning is.

A quick little bit of a bit of a practice shark finning is. biology here though this was a tiger shark so i do think often when a tiger shark decides to engage with the human and actually attack it is much more of a predatory attack than you would see in like a great white where we talk about with a great white it's often this exploratory thing it's trying to figure out if you're prey tiger sharks can process us they're not like great whites where they're like immediately like this is too bony for me it's not worth the energy tiger sharks have a much more robust kind of digestive system. They eat turtles.

You know, they will bite through turtle shell to get to a turtle. So when a tiger shark engages with a person, it's not nearly as likely to break off that attack as a Great White is. That being said, they're still second most responsible for attacks on humans. Great Whites are number one. But Tiger sharks are second. And we'll talk a little bit about what you, well, I guess I'll just get into it now. If you are being attacked by a tiger shark, you need to do your best to divert it to like push

it away, do whatever you can, and get to safety as quickly as possible, without splashing, without, like, acting like wounded prey. And then the things to avoid are obviously, like, places where they're feeding, murky water, places where sharks have been reported, early morning swimming, late evening swimming, those are things to avoid. But if you are actually have a shark coming at you, you want to put something in between you and the shark. And if it actually swims up to you and you don't have something, push its head away and divert your body. over the shark, which hopefully it doesn't come to that because that's a pretty technical thing to do. Yeah.

What about if you're a bystander? Nothing they could have really done? Not in this one. It just happened so quick. No one was close enough to him. People, like, they mobilize pretty quick to get a boat out to him. But by the time the bow got there, it was already over. So, yeah.

Yeah. Anyway, that's a rough one again. I don't recommend watching the video, but I'm not going to tell people not to because I watched it. But I don't recommend it. Wireless can feel like a world of traps. But not with Visible. It's one-line wireless with unlimited data and hotspot. Powered by Verizon for $25 a month.

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details. Well, should we just keep these sad vibes going for another one? Let's pump them out. Let's pump out the sadness. I got another sad one. It's a black bear, which typically aren't this sad. But on June 17th in Tucson, Arizona, a fatal attack happened to someone named Stephen Jackson. So not the basketball player who went in the stands and punched people, Mike. Right. This is a different person. A black bear in Arizona. Yeah. What's the population like there? Do you know? Northern Arizona, there's decent amount, right? I don't think

this was in Tucson. I think he was from Tucson. Oh, it says of Tucson. You're right. It was in Groom Creek area, south of Prescott, Arizona. Which is, yeah, near Prescott. So this is much, yeah, this is like more... Because Tucson doesn't really have much. No, when you said that, that didn't sound right. So Prescott is south of Flagstaff, which

that area is really great black bear habitat they have a lot of bears in there yeah thank you for that correction west so yeah and he was building a home in that area and he woke up early in the morning went out on his property just out in the trees at a picnic table they had set up and started brewing a fresh hot morning cup of coffee his partner of 15 years said that he would often come to me if I was still sleeping with a cup in hand and blow across the top of the cup to awaken me with a warm, playful smile. Good morning, Annie. Coffee is brewed.

So they just had a great, great relationship. You guys got a favorite coffee order? I like mine on the sweeter side, but not super sweet. I like a mocha. I like mine, like, a little, like, brown sugary flavored. It's kind of my favorite. Yeah. I don't know what type they like.

liked but it sounded like it was a good bonding like a good little relationship they had kind of yeah a little tradition yeah yeah well uh grouchy male 365 black bear that morning it came up to stephen attacked him and dragged him 75 feet down an embarkment according to officials i wrote embarkment it's embankment but that's okay i think jeff's right actually I'm pretty sure he's not. I'm looking at the exact same article right now. Embarked down the embankment. Yeah.

So neighbors heard him screaming and they tried to intervene. They started honking car horns. They were yelling at the bear, but the bear didn't let go. It kept attacking. And one neighbor went and got his rifle and shot the bear to stop the attack. Wow. But ended up being too late. And Stephen and the bear were both dead once officials arrived.

Oh, man. Stephen is remembered as a person who truly loved life and is missed by all who knew him. Yeah. So, Wes, what type of attack was this? I think this is very likely a predatory attack. Which is really, or like, it's a rare attack, but with black bears, it's more common. It's about one when it's an attack, right? Right.

When there's an actual attack where the bear makes contact with someone, and with black bears then it's almost always predatory, but then that's very, very rare. It's like one and a million black bears that decide to do this, roughly one a year. And we've had more than that this year. This has been a year where a number of these have happened. I think that's a combination of both more people and more bears,

and people are recreating a lot more in the outdoors than they used to too. But this one, the reason I think it's predatory is he wasn't doing anything to antagonists. recognize this bear. He didn't surprise the bear. Like he was stationary and the bear crept up on him and grabbed him, which is the biggest clue that is predatory. I think another really good clue is that these people trying to intervene didn't scare the bear off. So if it's a bear that's just trying to figure out a situation and maybe makes contact with someone, as soon as there's enough stimulus to convince it that it's not worth it, it'll run off. But we've talked about this. We talked about in our Liyard River story that when a predatory black bear makes the decision to attack someone,

it's kind of sometimes hard to flip that switch again, to get it to disengage. Once it's been flipped and it's like, oh, I got something. I've got prey. It can be really hard to discourage them from that prey afterward. So a bear that's typically. It sees red, kind of. Yeah. A bear that's typically shy and easy to kind of run off or discourage becomes really hard to

discourage. And that's very likely what happened here. It's just this bear. It was predatory. Who knows why. I mean, you can't say why, but it decided to attack him and then was really hard to discourage once it had him. Is there anything Stephen could have done differently? I mean, I don't think so. This is just like a fluke, terrible accident, you know, like, it's like not even a situation you could reasonably expect someone to have bear spray in, you know? No, like he wouldn't have been able to get to it in time. Like, the one thing I can think of. of as like having dogs around, but who knows. I mean, it's not one that he didn't do anything wrong.

It wasn't even like, right. It wasn't even like a campsite, like where you expect to really see bears, you know. No. So Todd Gillier, a member of the state gaming fish commission, said the attack was an especially aggressive and unprovoked attack that reminds us that wildlife can be unpredictable. Yeah. I think it's another good example of just like, as much as we.

talk about predictable behaviors and things you can do, it's still wildlife. Like every single bear, like Jeff, we know this from working with bears a little bit or me a lot and you helping me on that project. I think every bear that you meet, you kind of start to realize after a while if you spend some more time around that bear, they each have their own distinctive personalities. Yeah. There's some bears that are shyer. There's some bears that are more aggressive.

And there are bears that are born that are just much more aggressive than other bears. and you just can't. There's bears that, like, didn't care about being in our traps, and then there's bears that just wanted out and, like, didn't care that we were there. They were mad at us, you know? Right. So I just think you need to prepare for the worst and hope for the best. And according to the department, there have been 15 bear attacks on people in Arizona since 1990,

two of which were fatal, including the one on Friday, or, like, one on Friday according to this when this article is written so yeah right this was a month and a half ago yeah right right and then there's one other fatal attack in 2011 which do you know much about that one no i remember when it happened but i don't know much about it i'd have to look back into it maybe we'll look into that story and then i have another black bear story i want to share while we're talking black bears okay black bear's been kind of aggressive this year i feel like there's been a lot Black Bear stories, yeah. Black bears are wilding.

Yeah. They're learning from coyotes. So this happened on July 11th. A 35-year-old sheep farmer was out camping with his sheep. Don't get any ideas, Mike. Oh, too late. He woke up at 1 a.m. to some commotion with his livestock and went outside to find a 250-pound black bear had killed two sheep.

Oh, what? So the 35-year-old, there's no name to this person. that I could find. How about the bear? The bear was not named either. So the 35-year-old went to his tent and he pulled out a rifle and shot the bear in the chest. Now, West, shooting a bear with a gun has a 100% effective rate to stop an attack, right? Does not, no.

No, absolutely not. Oh, all right. Much less than that. I thought this was a first because the bear immediately charged him and mauled him. biting and scratching his head, left arm, and left hip. So, like, who knows, he might not have even been attacked had he not shot it. I would say very likely not. I think where the last one we talked about was a provoked or unprovoked attack,

you could qualify this one as a provoked attack because he shot the bear and then the bear attacked him. And, like, he does still kind of have some good reason to shoot the bear. it's his job to protect these sheep for like whoever he's working for you know but that's kind of what you sign up for if you shoot a bear yeah it's kind of a hard one for me because i kind of like for me even if someone's like at their farm with their sheep and a predator attacks i kind of feel like that's just the tax like that's your tax for like having sheep in a place where there's those predators but this to me seems like because sometimes sheep farmers will take it's funny you say tax because our Hawaiian cousins are in town and one of them's a fisherman and he was saying that

like when they catch a fish and a shark takes the fish that while they're bringing it in they call it the tax that they have to pay yeah i'll say this though like with sheep farmers and sheep ranchers um and i think this is what happened in this story they'll often take their sheep up to like a summer pasture or something like up in the mountains and they just are in BLM kind of wild areas and they'll have someone they had like a permit to have it up in these yeah for me at that point it's like you're taking a really easy prey item up into wild habitat i feel like at that point personally i don't think they should be allowed to shoot predators that attack sheep in that kind of situation yeah that's a good point because it's like you are you're literally bringing this animal

to their doorstep you know there's no fencing there's no anything like i just don't personally I don't believe in that. So I just like, I don't know, I have a hard time. And I wouldn't blame this person so much as like just the laws around it. And then maybe even like the rancher who owns the sheep. Because I'm sure because it's a law, they can shoot it. He's like, hey, if a bear's attacking my sheep, you got to kill it, you know? Right.

This guy was doing his job. Right. But like that just shouldn't be allowed. Yeah. So he's attacked by this black bear. His head's like really bitten. And then like I said. His left arm is kind of scratched up and is hit.

So he crawls back to his tent, radios his cousin, and is airlifted to a nearby hospital in Durango, Colorado, which is where two of our artists live for Tooth and Claw. Yeah, shout out Durango. And where I got my tattoos. Yeah. And then he's taken to another hospital for surgery. State wildlife officials worked with an agent and team of dogs

from the U.S. Department of Agriculture, animal and plant health inspection service to track the bear. A male bear with chest wounds weighing 250 pounds was found and shot, and the parks official said, this is a difficult part of the job. This is according to Adrian Archeletta, who is David Archeletta's dad. Okay.

Is that true? It's not. I mean, they have the same last name. It's got to be right. They might be related. who knows. He's the Parks and Wildlife Area Manager. But when it comes to injuries to humans as a result of a predator attack,

human health and safety is our top priority. So that's kind of what Wes has told us a lot of times is it's the getting rid of liability is taking out a bear who's attacked a person. Yeah. I thought this part was funny, though. The bear also killed two sheep and fed on them, A Parks and Wildlife spokesperson, John Livingson, said on Friday, wool was found in the stomach and human DNA was found on its claws.

But further testing is needed to confirm that the DNA matches that taken from the human. So we don't know yet if that's the right thing. Interesting. I like that they're being thorough, you know? Yeah. And then I just had one quick little headline, too. Do you guys have anything else with that story? No.

On July 8th, a woman who was planting trees in British Columbia was bluff charged by a grizzly, and then she left and made her way to a road, and then the grizzly forlon charged her and just kind of demobilized her. It seemed like a defensive attack, and then it left. Okay. All right.

So those are my bear stories. Thanks, dude. Yeah. Mike, what do you got next? Well, I got one that'll maybe lighten up the mood a little bit, unless you guys want to just keep being sad and stuff. No, my next one's lighter too. Great.

I'm done with dark ones. So you're Hawaiian cousins. They came up to Yellowstone with you, Jeff? Mm-hmm. Cousins, nephews, aunts, uncles. No. In Yellowstone? No.

They didn't. Yeah. I had to think, though. So this story takes place. place, well, it was reported on July 13th in Santa Cruz, California. It's my birthday. Hey, and that one bald guy and that one old guy. Yeah, Patrick Stewart and Harrison Ford.

Yeah, those guys. A 60-year-old Santa Cruz native and photographer Mark Woodward said he has photographed hundreds of otters over the years, but has never seen anything like this. A five-year-old female otter has been making trouble for surfers at Steamer Lane, a popular point break on the shores of Santa Cruz. And in one recent week, he's seen her bully three different surfers out on the water. So it was a busy week for Otter 841 is her. The true locals only.

Yeah, that otter's like, locals only. Yeah. We are local. We are local. Yeah. Quote, I saw the first incident on June 18 and I didn't know what was happening. Woodward told NPR. It was quite astounding.

So Otter 841, that's her official name. Her M.O. seems to be targeting surfers in the lineup, waiting for a wave, and then either chewing on their board, or sometimes she'll either, like, even clamber up onto the board, and the surfers will just sit there on the other end of their board, like wondering what they should be doing? That's kind of fun. What would you do, though?

Like, what could you even do? Just, like, tip or, like, whip them with your surf leash or something? I think I really would just watch it. See what it does, yeah. And be ready. I don't know. Would you, if it ran it, you would you jump in the water?

Yeah. I think I would. Does that help? I mean, it's like, what's your other option? Yeah. Maybe fight it on the board. I would try and get away from it and then if it went in the water, I'd get back on the board. But, yeah.

I think I'd just do one of those barrel rule moves where you, like, just flip all the way over with your board. I'd just catch a huge wave and, like, surf together. Do some sick aerials off of it, too. That's what I would do. And you can do those tricks where, like, the otter is standing on your knees and you're holding its paws. Exactly. She clambers up on the board, and at times she's even been able to chase surfers off their boards entirely. But while this seems mostly harmless and pretty cute, officials with the U.S. Fish and Wildlife Service say that the otter poses a public safety risk.

So they're always the buzzkill, ever the buzzkill. U.S. fish and wildlife. Unbelievable, those guys. They can't catch her, though. Right. They're having a hard time. So they said, while there have been no confirmed reports of injury due to the highly unusual behavior of this otter, surfers and others recreating in the area should not approach the otter or encourage the otter's

interactions. And that's because, so if they were to catch her after an incident like that took place, it's more than likely that she would have to be euthanized. So like, it's mostly for the otter's protection, which I think we can all be happy about, even if it does seem kind of like a buzzkill kind of move to catch her and her re-home her. But it's mostly for the otter's protection in this scenario. That makes sense. The interesting thing, though, is that she was born in captivity because her mother, the biological, I don't know, it's not her adoptive mother, I'm saying, her biological otter mom.

She had also been too comfortable around humans. So, like, they rehomed her mom because she was also kind of getting into similar situations with humans. So I thought that was kind of an interesting, like, I don't know if you can say it's an inherited trait that she would be so comfortable and playful around humans. But, like, I don't know. Is that like a thing you think could happen, Wes? I mean, it's possible. I think it's kind of like, you know, we talked about in the Russian fox experiment that like, like the really playful, nice foxes were more likely to have playful nice foxes.

So I do think those behaviors can be passed along. It's that whole nature versus nurture thing. But yeah, and then also like that behavior can be taught too. Some things are just born surfers too. Yeah, she just hates cooks. It's not a choice. It's something you're just born with, you know? Right. Yeah, she hates cooks.

Yeah, just go ask John a Utah, dude. There actually has been a pretty quickly growing contingent of supporters that are petitioning for her to remain free and out in the ocean. And last week, Mark Woodward, that photographer guy, I brought up at the beginning of the stories, he snapped a photo of an activist dressed up as an otter on their surfboard with a sign that said, keep 841 free. She has her own Instagram fan page at The Surfing Otter. And one of the memes that was posted there reads, she's the hero Santa Cruz deserves, but not the one it needs right now. So we'll hunt her because she can take it. Because she's not our hero.

She's a silent guardian, a watchful protector, a dark night. I love that. Well, I hope she continues to evade authorities, even though I know I probably agree with you that they probably have her best interest in mind. I feel like we can afford to give this otter that one surf break, you know? Yeah. All right. So my next story is titled, we're going to need a bigger bucket of sand.

And it's about dingo attacks on Fraser Island. Because, you know, that's how they prove that these things are able to attack people as buckets of sand. All right. So 24-year-old Sarah Pete was running on the large sand island of Kagari, Australia. So Kagari is the indigenous name for Fraser. Island and I'm going to stick with Kagari from here on out. This was July 17th when she noticed she had company. She's being chased by three or four dingoes and they typically curious but really shy wild dogs were quickly closing in. She ran into the surf to get away from the dingoes, not realizing

that pushing larger prey into the surf is actually a strategy that dingo packs will use to make a kill because they know that they can still kill animals in the water, but it's harder for animals to get away once they're in the water. So they began attacking her in the water, biting large chunks of flesh from her torso, arms, and legs. And things actually really weren't looking good for Sarah. This wasn't like, I think usually you hear about a dingo attack and it's like a nip or maybe a bite or two. This was like a very prolonged, really aggressive attack. And suddenly two tourists, Shane and Sarah Moffat arrived in their SUV and they ran out to help. Shane said that she had two dingoes literally hanging from her when he arrived and she was pleading for help and he ran up and got

himself in between the dogs and the woman and even punched the lead dingo in the face cutting his hands in the process so they managed i like the idea of punching instead of kicking a dingo because they're like so much harder i feel like to punch it that's true yeah Australians love punching things though they they successfully got her away from the dingoes she was flown by helicopter her to a nearby hospital. No updates were given on her, but she was listed as stable. Kagari is one of the only places in the world where pure dingoes still exist. So it's a place where domestic dogs have not been allowed, so these dingoes haven't been

mixing with domestic dogs. Although in our dingo episode, we did talk a bit about how this may be a bit more exaggerated of a problem than we think, and that dingo bloodlines actually maybe aren't quite as mixed with domestic dogs as we might think. But anyway, dingo attacks are increasing since the pandemic, and some researchers think that this break in visitation on the island has made the animals boulder. People are also habituating the animals by taking selfies with them, feeding them,

and just habituating them in a bunch of different ways. And then one more thing I wanted to say is there are fenced areas on the island that are safe for running and activities, and people are encouraged not to run or travel in the unfenced areas because a running person is attractive to dingoes. Inherently, that's like something they see is potential prey. So I kind of, like there's now all this pressure to call these dingoes to kill some of the Qigari dingoes because of the spate of recent attacks. There's been other attacks too.

The leader of this particular pack was euthanized. Honestly, to me, and like this is coming from someone who doesn't live in Australia, it seems to me like maybe dingo should have this little stronghold like maybe this is a place where when you visit you just need to realize like there's an increased chance of you running into dingoes and you need to prepare for that because it seems like everywhere else in australia they've really been pushed to the side and this is an animal that we like brought over people brought to australia and then became wild and they've managed to kind of carve out this existence and now to be like oh they have this really strong great stronghold but now we need to even further push them away, seems a little short-sighted to me.

Could we just start selling bear spray out there and call it dingo spray? Dingo spray. It'd probably work. I mean, yeah, I think it's a good idea, Jeff. It's a good business plan. And I will, you know, me saying that, I will say that's coming from an American, and we've done plenty of this to our own wildlife here too. I'm not trying to, like, point fingers. But I do know, like, the indigenous peoples of Australia have coexisted with this animal for a long time, had a great respect for it. And it's just recently with like a lot of people visiting a lot of these places that we're starting to have problems.

So maybe we just need to give these animals a little bit more space and a little bit more leeway. Yeah. All right. I have a couple of alligator stories. I'll go quick, though, here. So one that just stuck out to me because it's something I kind of forget about is this happened on June 16th.

but a pregnant mom with like a seventh month old in her stomach, you know. Seven months breaks. I'm born. A third trimester. Not in her stomach. But that's fine. Yeah, inner uterus. Yeah.

She's driving with her dad. And all that stomach acid can't be good for a. Three kids on June 16th. And she smashed, her truck smashed into a 12-foot alligator in the road. Which part are you forgetting happens? Oh, just that, like, people hit alligators in the road. Oh, yeah. That's true.

Yeah, I should have been more clear there. But, like, I think about, like, what the worst animals to hit in the road are and I kind of forget about alligators. Because there's, like, so heavy, but then, like, they're harder to see, you know, because there's low. If you had asked us, like, you asked us at the beginning of your first story, like, what animal would you least want to hit on a bike? Yeah. Like, I don't think we would have come up with. I thought about asking that, and then I'd be like, that was just going to say. say elephant, so then I didn't.

Yeah. Yeah. We're no fun. Blue whale. Adam bomb. I'm still laughing about how Jeff said, you know, pregnancy. You know how that works. Oh, I've tried this article. Terrible.

Terrible. I, like, tried to make it faster, so I tried to, like, just read pieces of it, and it ended up so much worse. And now it's taking longer. But she's 33 years old. and the truck rolled like a bunch of times. Her three kids and her dad survived, but she died and they tried to save her baby,

and it wasn't able to be saved as well. Oh, no. So, like, you know, if you are driving fast by alligator country, just keep an eye out because that's just something you don't really think about having to avoid. Nature's spike strip. I always think, like, moose. I'm always afraid of moose because they're so top-heavy. Yeah.

It just goes straight through your windshield. They just go into your car. But alligators, look, he kind of a bad one to hit on the road. Yeah. And then on June 26th, a 13-year-old boy named Gabriel Clemiss in Winter Springs, Florida, was walking with his little brother and some friends by a creek after swimming on a rope swing and having a good, just a fun day. And they were walking back by a creek when a big old alligator popped out of the creek

and bit him on the hip. So in his mind, he's thinking, go, go, go, trying to escape the gator's jaws. That's a direct quote, go, go, go, go. And he found a nearby stick. It must have been a good stick because he started hitting the gator with it and got it to release its grip. So then his little brother and his friends are all just crying and freaking out. And Gabriel calmly calls 911 and casually ask for help. So, Mike, I'm going to have you.

you like put in the call right here because it's kind of funny just hearing like he's just like yeah it's bit by a gator one one i just got bit by gator okay and what part of your body was bent oh like my right hip i'm okay though i can walk and i can stand i'm fine okay i have the paramedics on the way once at the night they're like wait are you hurt he's like yeah but it's pretty funny it didn't say the weight of the alligator but it was big i saw a picture of it and like it filled up past the bed of a pickup truck. So I'd say it's probably about as big as a truck. It's got to be.

What kind of truck? Does it have a hemmy in it? A hemie truck. A heavy truck. A low rider, though. Nice. It sits close to the ground. It's that long, and I would guess it's heavier than like one of those two-seater smart cars.

Yeah. How many cylinders this baby have? 50. The two-seater? Four. Yeah. Four. Nice, dude.

That's a good truck. All right. And then on July 4th, a 69-year-old woman was killed by an alligator while walking her dog by the edge of a lagoon in Hilton Head Island in South Carolina. Rescue efforts were made and the alligator was guarding her body. So it had to be killed and removed from the spot, according to the local sheriff's office. And that's kind of crazy because not even a year before that, an 88 years. year old was also killed walking her dog in Sun City, South Carolina. There's actually a video of that one that's like pretty crazy.

Yeah, you see the alligator go across like the entire lagoon to like go at the dog. Not great. So those those are the gator stories I got. All right. When you need to build up your team to handle the growing chaos at work, use Indeed sponsor jobs. It gives your job post the boost it needs to. be seen and helps reach people with the right skills, certifications, and more.

Spend less time searching and more time actually interviewing candidates who check all your boxes. Listeners of this show will get a $75-sponsored job credit at Indeed.com slash podcast. That's Indeed.com slash podcast. Terms and conditions apply. Need a hiring hero? This is a job for Indeed sponsored jobs. Mike, do you have any more? I could do a quick one about a tiger if you guys think we still have some time. Sure. Only if it involves peeing.

I got a real. Only if there's peeing involved. And then I got a real quick shark week update after that. Cool. So this happened in... Listeners like a long episode. Usurisk Eastern Russia. There was a woman by the name of Darya Ulyanova,

who claims that she was simply out in the woods searching for her lost dog with her husband when that good old-fashioned feeling hit. What do you think I'm talking about there, Jeff? Pee. Yeah, you just needed a pee. So she stepped a little ways off the trail to pee. and just as probably things were getting good out of the corner of her

out of the corner of her eye she saw a huge Amur Tiger coming towards her so she started to run away but after three steps she fell down that sucks yeah probably the pants weren't all right up peeing mid pee

it hurts to do that you know yeah it's and then like your relief is just instantly cut off yeah she said that quote he flew at me from above and started to tear me, he pulled me, pulled my hand towards him, and I could not escape because the beast was so big. And this is where the story gets a little suspicious. So reportedly, Darya says that her husband, Mikhail, saved her life when he quickly hopped into his Zill truck,

or ZIL truck. I don't know if you guys know what those are. They're like the massive, almost like military-looking trucks with a huge flatbed. And he rammed the big cat off of her, causing the tiger to flee back into the forest. But the police and tiger experts are scrutinizing the story, and she didn't help herself with. her testimony appeared to be, quote, confused by those who heard her. So, Wes, let me give you another reason to like Vladimir Putin more than you already do. I don't. The reason this is such a big deal is that President Putin had recently taken,

has recently taken initiatives to protect the animal, which is on the brink of extinction, or at least endangered to an extent that the state felt like they had to take some measures against poaching. And that's what these authorities are suspecting that this guy was actually out there doing, which if true means that he could be facing a fine of up to 20,000 rubles. But whatever the case might be... It's a lot of rubles, I think. I don't know, the value really dipped after the war with Ukraine. That's true.

It might not be a lot in the rules. Yeah, yeah. So Sergei Aramiliv, Director General of the Amur Tiger Center, said that, quote, the version of the story that a man crushed a tiger with a truck that grabbed his wife is unlikely, based on the nature of the injury and the experience of lightning attacks by you.

these predators. It is impossible to jump into a truck, turn around, and run over the animal. I think there's maybe something lost in translation because that doesn't sound like impossible. But probably because like the space with the trees and the size of the truck, it just like didn't make logistical sense for all this to happen exactly like they were saying. But the quote continues, but there is blood on the spot, traces of a struggle. Now panstaking work is beginning to establish the circumstances. We will wait for the expert's opinion. So will we. But whatever the case may be, Darya did, she did survive the encounter and is in medical treatment at the hospital after

suffering severe lacerations on her arms and shoulders. Yeah. Her soldiers. You know, I'm going to believe her. I think there's no, there's no great motive to lie about that. Unless, yeah, unless it was like a domestic thing. Anyway, it's probably not. Oh.

Like, uh, he scratched her up like a tiger. Detective Wes. They should call you in. You know, you brought up Putin for all his downsides. The dude loves big cats. He does bring a good job protecting bears, it seems like, too. Russia's got a lot of bears. He's a big fan of like a more leopard and a more tiger conservation.

All right, I got one more quick. Let's put on the record after that. Bad guy. Yeah. Stamp it. Bad guy stamp. Yeah. We got our fair share of bad guys over here too.

All right. So my last one is called cocaine sharks. I hate titling it that, but that's what I'm titling it. Shark Week is doing a show called cocaine sharks because, of course, they are. And it's about cocaine that has gotten dumped by drug runners near Florida coast that may get eaten by sharks. The word may is doing a lot of heavy lifting in that sentence. So just cocaine is in the ocean. Yeah.

They're making sharks involved now. Exactly. Like cocaine bear came out this year, so they have to do cocaine sharks. In my opinion, the problem with Shark Week is that they constantly need to up the ante. So I think it's really good that people are genuinely excited about like programming, programming featuring sharks. But we don't need all this like fake sensationalist stuff. I think the one highlight of the show is that it highlights how much of our trash ends up in the ocean and the animals inherently are going to eat that trash.

But I just feel like, you know, I've been a part of a few documentaries. I've been able to host a couple shows about wildlife conservation. If, like, Discovery Channel producers came to me and said, hey, we want you to be a part of this program called Cocaine Sharks, I would say no. And I would invite other sharks, like, I'm not a shark biologist. I'd invite shark biologists out there to also say no to this kind of thing because I don't think.

Wasn't it Jason Mamoa this year? He's like the host of Shark Week this year. I like that guy. Yeah, me too, actually. You know what, though? I'm going to zag on you a little bit and just say, if you need to say that sharks might be eating cocaine that has once been dumped in the ocean, in order to get people who wouldn't otherwise watch, like you give actual valuable information about garbage in the ocean and, like, sharks being killed, then I think that's okay. as long as like you're getting out a good message in the mix.

Yeah, if the good message is like the, the prioritized message. But if the message is like, oh, these sharks are eating cocaine and now they're crazy and like we have to be careful because there's cocaine sharks out there, then it's doing more harm than it's doing good. I don't care what the positive spin on that is. And I guarantee you that's their like main angle they're hitting with this show. Yeah. So just do better.

I mean, that's like we don't need that stuff. Like sharks are inherently fascinating. We don't need to put them on cocaine. All right, that's it. I think we're done, right? We're done. Okay, we did it. So let's go into some quick categories.

I might cut a couple of the ones that I had, but we'll do the rest. Quick one, though, I had to, I watched this, this tiger shark attack in Egypt a few times. Really didn't want to. Like, I saw it when it first came out, and then when I was preparing this, I had to watch it two more times. And I was like, actually legitimately dreading it because this one did. kind of haunt me. So I wanted to ask you guys about a movie that you've watched that really stuck with you. And if you want to put a positive spin on it, you can, but I kind of meant more in like a haunting way. So. Okay. I can start us off. Yeah. I'm going to go with the lighthouse.

And there's an interesting one because like I wasn't even super engaged with the movie. I thought I was like moving a little slow. Yeah. But then like the end hit me really hard and there's just like a few scenes that really stuck in my mind and just kind of lingered in there for a long time afterwards. It helps that we watch that in the cabin, like on a cold night with like a fire. Up in the woods. It's the scene that stuck in your mind, Pattinson, Jane off. Was that it? No.

It's the crow's eating. Just couldn't shake that image. What's his name? Defoe? Yeah, William. Oh, William. Mike, you want to go next? Yep.

It's Requiem for your dream. I don't know how much more needs to be said. but that's a, the end, especially like the last little stretch montage of everyone's life falling apart is just brutal. And it almost feels like it was a really important thing to watch, but also something I'll never need to watch again. Like, yeah, I love, I actually really liked that movie, but in the worst ways. Yeah, it's, yeah, it's harrowing because of everything that happens and because Jared Lettow's in it. Yeah, too, yeah. All right.

But Jennifer Conley, they balance each other out. I love her. Oh, man. She's so awesome. Mine is midsummer or midsummer, however you want to say it. Yeah, I, like, I'm a huge Ariester fan, although I haven't seen Bo as afraid yet, but I will say, I read about a short film that he did called like the strange thing about the Johnsons. And I was going to watch it.

I found it on YouTube, I was going to watch it. And then all the other YouTube clips were like, why you shouldn't watch the strange thing about the Johnsons? So I was like, you know what? I'm going to break my rule and just like read the Wikipedia article before. before I do this. I'm really glad I didn't watch that movie because it sounds awful. Anyway, I am a fan of his wide release features and Midsomer for whatever reason. When I saw that, I walked out a different person. Like, I just, like, could not think about

anything else for days. It took me a long time to rewatch that movie. On the second watch, it didn't affect me the same way, but just like the bright scenes and this like really beautiful cinematography and this kind of like really like really nice seeming festival that has this incredibly dark backstory or not even backstory but like you know the stuff that's actually happening behind the scenes is so dark it really yeah really messed with me it's but i think he's a genius like he's one of my favorite filmmakers so that's my pick um our next category we're just going to say something that's overrated Jeff, why don't you go first?

Yeah, I'm going to go with Indian food. Oh, interesting. I love Indian food. So good. So does Mike. Yeah. I think it's good. I think it's good.

But I think Italian food's better. I think that steak dinner's better. I think that Mexican food's better. It's just not in my top five of food categories. Okay. What is your favorite cultural cuisine? Can you say? Probably like Italian restaurant.

Yeah. It's always good. Yeah. High floor, high ceiling kind of thing. Indian food, like, the more I like it, the worse it sits in my stomach. Yeah, I'm going to kind of. That's a you thing, but yeah. Yeah, I love Indian food.

It's probably my favorite. That's my favorite. Probably my favorite. So I'm going to build on Jeff's because mine also has to do with eating. and this is one that is going to be unpopular, I think. For me, it's eating in restaurants. I think it's overrated. I'm on with this take.

You get at home guy. Like during the pandemic, when everyone was doing takeout, it was like the best thing for me. Because I just love like getting good restaurant food, but then like taking it home and eating it in front of the TV, which I know sounds super lazy. And like, I know, like, don't get me wrong. I know the appeal of.

like a really well like a good ambiance in a restaurant how much it can bring to the whole experience the food is fresh you get this whole like social experiment or experience but like for me i just i don't care that much about food so i love just being able to like eat on my own time so i love eating at home but i go out to restaurants a lot because jesse loves it so i'm willing to do it you're such a good you're going to make a wonderful husband someday west thanks i had a hard time picking just one. I was just perusing my list, my doc. The ones that really just stood out to me were log rides. I think log rides are horribly overrated. Your mom slash dad's pancakes. Not yours specifically, but you and generally, everybody else's, you know, you're overrating. I love a lot. I love both

of those things. Songs whose lyrics consist of telling you how to dance to the song. Why are there so many hit songs that do that? I hate those. Slide to the left. Slide to the right. The one of the right. The one I settled on those. This one I've been working on this one. Two hops is done. Recently. And I talked to Wes a little bit about this. But I think the doors, the band The Doors, are so horribly, I hate the doors. Jim Morrison is, I told Wes this, but I think he was the original Scott Stap of Creed with his stupid, like, vocal inflections and stuff. People call him a poet. His lyrics aren't that deep. People go read them on wherever lyrics.com or whatever. The stupid, like, harsh keyboard tone that their keyboard player uses is, It's grading. I don't know how people can stand to listen to that music. They're awful. They're terrible. It's a hot take.

All right. Lizard King is a great nickname, though. Good for him on that one. Yeah, that is good. Underrated nickname. We gave Mike like 15 minutes to prep for this category, too, and he's just ready. He's ready to come. He pulled up his dock.

This one was made for me. Jeff, do you have a random animal fact for us? I do. So this is from Reddit, but it's also from Emperor. Prodivers.com. Okay. All clownfish are born as males. So one female lives with a group of males, but only mates with one of them.

When she dies, her mate will become female. This change is irreversible. Well, that's crazy. It's a good fact for a lot of you, you bigots out there to think hard about. That guy who was messaging on Instagram that people can't be trans because bears aren't trans yeah yeah such an stupid argument yeah you know what tooth and claw we support we're we're we support our trans friends allies yeah all right so there's a example of nature nature

yeah doing yeah doing cool stuff you know it's a natural yeah it's an interesting thing nature just being natural uh-huh right that's what it thanks i couldn't think of how to say that Jeff, do you also have a listener's story for us? Yeah, should we do that? Yeah. Okay, I have one listener's story. Hey, fellas, been listening to a podcast for a while now and loving it. I have a funny story to share about a camping trip I took with my family back in the 90s when I was about eight or nine.

This was a trip to my whole dad's side of the family to either the Sierra Nevada's or Gold Country of California. Can't remember which. Where there was, of course, Black Bears. We set up our campsite so that the adults had their own tents, all of us cousins, about seven in total, all under 10, were camping in a big tent together. That's kind of fun. That is fun. After a fun day, playing in the woods and nearby river, all of us cousins went to sleep in a big slumber party tent. This night, I shared a sleeping bag with my little boy cousin.

Unfortunately, in the middle of the night, I was awoken to the feeling of cold wetness that it slowly permeated our whole bag. Yep, my little cousin had peed in his sleep. Now making this bag completely gross, wet, and cold. I looked around the tent for another sleeping bag I could jump into, but all of them were full with sleeping kids. So I had one good option left, my nana, grandma, Louise's tent, which was closest. I sheepishly walked outside, woke her up, asking if I could sleep with her. Being the sweet, sympathetic grandma she was, she let me in, and I immediately fell asleep.

Maybe 30 minutes later I woke up with my nana saying, Shoo, go on, get. Shoe bear, go on, get. Pretty good. That's great. There is shuffling and snuffling noise just outside our tent for a hot minute. I was scared thinking there was literally a black bear outside our tent, and my 75-year-old sweet nana was trying to just shoe it away.

I literally thought of a huge black bear was a yard away, and there was nothing between us except a wall of the tent. Bravely or stupidly, my nana finally stuck her head outside the tent and began to laugh. That's a good sign. It was my little girl cousin who apparently had also woken up and decided she wanted to leave the big cousin tent too. Nana let her into the tent and we were all three happily slumbered in the morning. No bears present. It still cracks me up to this day that my sweet Nana Luis,

literally tried to shoe away what she thought was a freaking bear from our campsite in the middle of the night and they ended up just being my crying four-year-old cousin. Anyway, that's it. Thanks, guys. I wonder for cousins, feelings got her. That's a good story. Thanks. It's a pretty good story.

Yeah. And you know what? The peeing the bed part, so it reminded me, I didn't ask for permission, so I'm not going to say this listener's name, but they wrote me a message saying that they had a kid who, who was peeing on the floor in their house, and they immediately thought of me because I told a story of how I peed on the floor like for every night,

even though I was right by the bathroom. Yeah. And I was thinking we should have our listeners write in and just tell us embarrassing stories that happened to them as kids that we can share on the podcast. Or to our kids. So tooth and claw mailbag at gmail.com.

Send us your most embarrassing stories of your, kids or you when you're a kid that you're okay with us sharing on the podcast and if you're not okay with it change your name so we can share it still yeah thanks all right should we do a couple listener questions too like three i got some good one so let's do a few thank you everyone for writing it this is porter bergman and he wants to know tacos or burritos oh i'm a burrito guy well it depends like if i'm in mexico i want tacos if it's like u.s mexican food i want burritos i like tacos because you can change up the meat in style and like have some variation and I'm a big variation guy is it true that brittos aren't even like a mexican it's like a u.s invention kind of

that's what i've heard yeah i don't know yeah i'm a taco guy though for sure tackle t'clock tuesday all right dude that's mac and yeah lebrons go sue us mac and max wants to know would you still love the listeners if we were working Worms? Would we love them more? Yes. No, would we still love the listeners if they were worms? I'm kidding.

It would be different. I don't think we'd have nearly as good reviews. I wouldn't. Yeah, I don't think I would, actually. Unless they have like the same consciousness, but if they're just like a normal worm, like I'm never going to love a worm. No, and also I wouldn't feel like we're really making much of a difference. I don't care. Think about it this way, though.

I'm not going to love you if you're a worm. If every single one of our... I love who you were. If every single one of our listeners were worms, we could just cut them all in half and double our listeners and just keep doing that over and over again. That's a good point. We'd be the biggest podcast so fast.

But we do... We love our listeners who aren't worms. Well, Mike's convinced me that I wish we had more worm listeners, though. So... I like this one. Who a... ...in C-A. said, not a question as much as I just want to appreciate that Jeff says in one episode

that he has no time for a girlfriend. Then a couple episodes later, when Wes asked him and Mike what he's been up to lately, the answer is playing a game where Kirby eats raspberries. Listen. We all have our priorities on how we spend our time. Exactly. You know, it's a fun game. I'm prepping content for the podcast by,

like playing those games, you know? Yeah. Justin Epps wants to know what's the largest body of water you think you can cross at night just by looking at the stars. Like swimming or in a boat? I think in a boat. I don't know. Not large.

I think I could cross any of them. You just need to know the North Star and you're good. I don't know. I'm not a sailor. So like, yeah. I can for sure go north. It seems like it's important to know more than that one star. but I don't know enough to tell you your role.

I will say enough to like if I was on a boat and no one knew what they were doing at all, I would probably feel comfortable stepping into a role of being like, let's follow that star and just see what happens. But I wouldn't be like confident at all. I'd pretend I am, but I wouldn't be. Let's do one more. The other Isabelle's. Well, what about the first of the first year isabelle?

Finally, we're tired of the original Isabel. Ask, should I text him? Yeah, why not? Life's short. Other Isabels, go for it. I say no. Text him. He sounds like a dirtbag.

All right. I'm going to say no, but just like, because, you know, less is more. There you go. Not always. All right. Well, thanks. Great questions, guys. Great stories.

I want to do a quick conservation corner just before we go. We talked about sharks a bit. I think one of our scariest stories this month was about sharks. A lot of people are in the water during the summer. Shark attacks tend to go up this time of year. I just want to briefly say again, this is an animal that we have inflicted insane amounts of harm to, like, across the species of sharks, there's a number of, like, especially the big macro predator sharks,

that we are just systematically wiping away from this planet. They are insanely important to. their food, to their ecosystems, they're insanely important to the ocean as a whole. They're incredibly beautiful animals. So this is not an animal that we, like, I understand why people are I do love sharks. I do love sharks. I understand why people are afraid of them. Why don't you marry them? Yeah. I understand our listeners if they were sharks. I would. Yeah. Not as much, but I'd still love them. I stumbled upon this thing called the, it's like a new shark map, an interactive shark map that this group called the Florida Panhandle released.

And it's like all these little shark fins across the globe that you can click on and you can see the incident that happened whether or not it was fatal. And it highlights all the attacks that have happened in these different places. It's a useful tool for you if you're going swimming somewhere to know the history of that place. But the thing that I really just wanted that I gained from like reading about and learning about it is that there's only been 3,000 shark attacks with less than 300,000, fatalities over the past 30 years. That's globally, according to this project. So that's, you know, that averages, what, 300 or 100 shark attacks a year for 30 years and 10 fatalities a year is the

average for those 30 years. So people in the United States are 50 times more likely to die by a lightning strike, 10 times more likely to die by fireworks, even flying commercial airlines, which is considered to be like the safest mode of transportation out there, sees more deaths a lot more than shark attacks. So this isn't like I understand the fear. I understand why going in the ocean, a place where we feel so vulnerable is scary and being eaten by something that seems so different from us and like unfeeling.

But sharks are wonderful, beautiful creatures. They have a lot of predictable behaviors. There's a lot that you can do to prevent anything. bad from ever happening to you. So let's just give them like the space that they need to continue to live in their ecosystem. That's my pitch. This podcast I listen to part in my take, it's a sports podcast that's like silly and whatever. But they do like in the sports off season, which is now they do like Mount Rushmore of different

things, which is just like a top four. Yeah. And they did Mount Rushmore of the best triangles. And the number one pick was shark dorsal fins. Was their, like, first pick? That's a good pick. Those are, like, the coolest triangles in the whole world. And I have to agree with them.

Just seeing that triangle go across the water. Cooler than pyramids? Probably. Or Doritos? Yeah, and pyramids is kind of controversial, because is that triangle? Yeah. That's a good. You got to take, like, one side of a pyramid.

Yeah. I feel like you got to be kind of running out of stuff to talk about on your podcast. They're very open about that. All right. Well, anyway, that was just a quick conservation minute. Don't ever eat shark fins. Don't eat sharks unless you know it's from a sustainable shark fishery, which there are examples of those in the world. But you've got to be really careful.

So, all right. I think that's it for this week's episode. Thanks, everyone for preparing stories, guys. Thank you guys. And thanks to our listeners that aren't worms. And if you are a worm listener, thanks to you, too. You know? Cultivate that dirt for us.

All right. We love you guys, except the worms. We sure do. I guess I don't love the worms, but. I do. Love you, worms. Mike only loves the wormless. Hit me up.

That's from now on when me and Jeff say love you. Mike's going to say love you, worms. All right. See you guys. Bye. See it.