Tooth & Claw: True Stories of Animal Attacks - The Orangutan Escape Artist

Episode Date: August 26, 2024

Jeff takes the lead this time through to tell us about Ken Allen, an orangutan who made a name for himself by repeatedly escaping his San Diego Zoo enclosure. His antics caused the zoo staff no shortage of headaches, and even spawned a hate group for his arch enemy. ~~ To advertise on the show, contact us! ~~ Tooth & Claw is brought to you by QCODE. Support the show and get access to an extensive library of exclusive episodes like this by supporting the show on Patreon or joining the Grizzly Club on Apple Podcasts. For the latest updates on the show and all things wildlife, follow us at toothandclawpod.com and social:  Instagram: @ToothandClawPodcast Twitter: @ToothandClawPod Wes: @GrizKid Jeff: @jefe_larson Mike: @mikey3ds Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

We're recording. Now we can do 10,000 million seconds. The silence I wish. Stop talking. Hello, subscribers. Welcome back to Tooth and Claw Podcast. We got our bad boy, Wes Larson with us. Oh, that's me. We got our good guy, Jeff Larson with us, Wes's little brother. And we got our ladies man, Mike Smith.

That's interesting. I remember specifically introducing myself as the bad boy back in our first polar bear episode. I'm stealing from you own. I'm stealing from our content. That's great. You can't make up your own labels. I've learned that. You can't give yourself nicknames or labels. It's got to be, you know.

I think you're the ladies, man. Because you're so hard to get, it's impossible. I do play hard to get. Like, they can't even get a response from you. Don't even try. Harder you try, the less likely you are to get one. Right. Mike, you said you wanted to do $10 million.

seconds of silence before this episode. Yep. Which comes out to 31.7 years. That's not many. It's not enough years. That's not going to take me through to the end of my life, hopefully. It's a lot of seconds. And that just helps you get the sounding right, right?

Right. Get the ambient noise. Well, we have, so we brought on your friend Braxton, who might call him Bill. I refuse to call him Braxton. Do you know why Mike calls him Bill? No. Because Bill Paxon. Oh, that makes sense.

Yeah. It's like Braxton. So he just calls him Bill. I call him Blixen and Blixen. But I will never call him Braxton. Yeah. So, Brxton. He's helping edit, right?

Yes. He's doing his best. Braxton, put in a sound effect right here. Whatever you want. Whatever you want, Mama. But yeah, I don't want to be too specific. So that's really hard for him to choose. Because I feel like if you give him like any kind of hint.

Yeah. Hins. Okay. Braxton's the kind of guy that'll have been fixating on a sound effect, and he'll be like, oh, that's easy. Correct. I got that. Yeah.

Can't wait to hear it. That'll be a fun little surprise when we listen to this episode. So, I'm not going to listen to this. So I'm going to do the episode, but I just found Mom's notes sitting on the table still. We just did Mother's Day. So I just thought it was funny. This top note says, Funny Story, hyphen, Jeff Easter. Oh yeah, I remember that one.

Jeff running for president. So she just has that as a note. Yep. And then under it it says Homecoming Prince. Interesting. Who? Yeah. I was Homecoming Prince.

I think. What's Prince? Yeah. Is it like runner up? Freshman. Oh. Whoever wins freshman. Okay.

But. Nice, dude. Yeah. Yeah. I think 80% of the votes were like a joke. Simpsy votes. Yeah. Not sympathy.

Like, it'd be funny. to get this, like, to work up there. You were very handsome, Jeff. I didn't have friends. Speaking of ladies, you did in high school, right? I did, like, senior year. Okay. But I still, it was still like, not enough of, yeah, I don't know.

It was funny in its own way. I feel like you really hit your stride when you turned, like, 15. Nowhere close to being the popular kid in my freshman year. But there's, Colock would nominate me both times. Like, we were friends, and he just, like, Thought it was funny. Thought it was funny to nominate me. Seeing Mom's notes kind of breaks my heart a little bit.

It says West Seafood right here. Yeah. You want to talk about that? No, she just looks forward to that episode all year. Yeah. And then it just makes me wonder, like, I hope she got what she wanted out of it, you know? I don't think she did this year. No.

She's regretting it how it went this year. I think we'll make it pretty good. We came back in. We started recording again because she had something she really wanted to talk about. The question, the canyon question. Like, it was pretty basic question. Yeah. It was a pretty good discourse. After we got done recording, I was sitting on the couch with her,

and she was just like, oh, I just want to do the whole thing again. It's like, it was great. Everyone loves you. It's all that's going to get to be fun. She's like, oh, I forgot to see Jeff's running for president. Well, we'll have to have her on some other time, I guess. Yeah. Mother today.

Well, let's move into our categories. Great. Okay. So what's the best prison escape you can think of? We're really moving into them right now? All right. I don't have a prison escape, like a real life one? I could come up with one.

Yeah. Well, you told us escape, so I didn't come up with the prison escape. Well, that's a different category. But when you text us, you didn't say prison escape. Yeah, I know. I'll go think of one that was like really clever. Dillinger. I'll go with Dillinger.

He escaped a bunch. Okay. The one thing in particular, like someone did that was clever in real life a prison escape move that you i don't know that many real that changes everything it doesn't have to be real life oh okay uh you want me to do all of you andy andy putting the rita hayworth poster over his hole yeah perfect thank you yeah or the guy in prison break tattooing the blueprints for the prison on his body i would push back on that being clever okay because they do strip you down first day yeah but they were

hidden in like a intricate code of tattoos. It wasn't like they were obvious. Okay, that's right. How does Trevolta escape prison when he is wearing Cage's face and face off? How does he get out? I think he... Well, it's Nick Cage, technically. Or no, it is Troultta.

That's right. I'm sorry. He does something with like the magnetic shoes. The boots. He beats everyone up. What's Castor Troyes' brother's name? Pollux. The two Greek brothers.

Well, Greek named. Pollux helps him somehow. Pollux is supposed to be scary in that movie. He's not scary. I don't remember what he does. Yeah, I'll go with that one. You know what? I don't remember how they did it,

but I remember this show called Escape from Danamora. It was based on a true story of an escape from a prison in upstate New York. And it's Benicio and Paul Dano in the movie or in the show. It's really good. And I remember a big part of their plan was Benicio del Toro like seduced the art instructor or something at the book. prison. Not everyone can pull that off. No, and he, but he like really seduced her to the point where she gated and abetted them in escaping. And then she was like waiting for him afterwards and he just

never shook up. That's tough. I'll go for like the Ted Bundy sneaking through the light hole. He was a little sneak was he. He just sneaked. He jumped out of a court house. He just love murdering. And we'll get back into these. Yeah. But I want to set the tone with just talking escapes, moves that We like. Yeah. Oh, we talked about raising Arizona recently. They did the mud hole. John Goodman, his little buddy.

That's true. Like the most mucusy mud. Yeah. I don't know how they did it, but like, whatever got them there is my pick. Yeah. That was gross mud. It was so gross. It was such a good movie.

I think I'm going to watch that tonight. I'm in. You know the first Guardians movie? Yeah. Rocket is like a very, that's going to be my pick later. But spoilers for this episode. Okay. But Rockets like a very handy.

I'll get tools and I'll escape from this. Yeah, right. You know who's like that in RL? That's real life. Right. I do orangutan. Orangotans. Do you say orangutan?

Because I've been doing it. I used to say orangutan and the ringatan. Because I think that's become. There is no G at the end. No, it's become like a popular way to say it. But it's the rink powder. I think the drink powder led us all astray. Tang.

It could be too that maybe in places where they live, they get pronounced tang. Arringotan is how I say it now. Same. Yeah. I kind of like orangutang. Me too. I think it sounds better, but I try to say it the right word. It rhymes.

It's a rare word that rhymes within itself. Yeah. Rang tang. But it's not a real word, though. That's true. So, orangutan, maybe this will help you like just the normal way to say it more. It means old man of the forest. Yeah.

Which is pretty cool. Yeah. I think they like kind of grow out of it, but when they're babies, they look like an old man. Yeah. And it's really cute. They're on the short list for me for the cutest baby animal. Me too. We had them in our bracket.

I had them going pretty far. They're definitely in my top five. They're on my longest list of cutest babies. Okay. Near the bottom of it. Yeah, I think they're cute. No, I don't. They're my favorite great eight.

They creep me the hell out. Really? Yeah. Have you seen a baby at Rangintan, though? I have. I think we need to refresh. They're old men. Are old men cute to you? They're so playful and like bobbly and just swinging around.

Behaviorally, that's fine. They're really cute. Come on, Mike, I want you to be honest about it. That looks, I don't want to be. That's cute. I'm not going to say what that looks like to me. Well, maybe we're going. My lock screen is a baby.

We're going to Borneo this week and I'm hoping we see a baby. Does change things for me. I will say when we saw koalas in Australia, I was like, okay, I get it. Me too. When they're in the wild at least. Yeah. Hell yeah. Well, Foo Manchu.

All right. Let's tread lightly here. Foo Manchu was a famous orangutan in the Omaha Zoo in the late 70s. 1965 to 1983, Fumanchu was there. Oh, he died when I was born. Maybe he reincarnated as me. You could be Foo Manchu. I might be.

Do you guys, people might not know what Foo Manchu is. Can you give them an example? Well, there's a mustache that's called a Fumanchu. Yeah. But it sounds like a good longotie with it. It's like the... In Kill Bill, the Kung Fu instructor. Yeah.

That rips out... Hulk Hogan is a famous one. Yeah. Well, yeah, I was going to say it's like the Asian variant of Handelbar mustache. Yeah. But way cooler. Me like in one piece. A little bit, yeah.

Handelbar to me looks like someone's trying too hard. Foo Manchu makes me think like... This is like someone who knows a lot more about... life the night. The Kill Bill 2 is the best one. Yeah. It's so good. He's just stroking it all the time.

Yeah. Is that way they called this orangutan, Foumanchu? They had that kind of facial argon off? So male orangutan can get a real good Foo Manchu. I can get a full-on beard too. Interesting. A lot of times it's like a mustache with a little Foo Manchu.

So Fu was a sweet, friendly, playful orangutane who liked to like help the zookeepers. but one day he decided to get a little rambunctious, right? And he started escaping his enclosure, but you'd also bring the other orangutang with him and they would go hang out by the elm trees right next to the elephants inside the zoo. Why not? Sure, yeah. So they have the biggest enclosure.

I mean, if you're the zoo manager and you see the orangutans out by the elephants, what's your first thought? Hmm, they're not supposed to be there. They're not supposed to be there. Yeah. I had better fires. put them back. Oh yeah. I think my first thought would be let's fix this and then after the dust settles, I'd probably be like, might have to fire someone. Yeah. Well, I think that's probably how it

happened. And they didn't fire anyone, but they were like, we want you. You know, let's figure this out. Who left the orangutan door open? Yeah. Right. Right. There's no way. Who let the orangutans out? There's no way these. That song. That was the first draft of the song. We're like, we got to find something that rolls off the tongue a little better. There's no way. There's no way. these dumb apes are able to figure it out on their own. Oh, but they can, Jeff. They're not so dumb. They're intelligent.

So, turns out that Fu had found just a little piece of wire and then closure. That's all he needed. Yeah. Wow. And he went to, like, the furnace door in the dried up moat and just, like, put it in the keyhole until it paid the lock. That's incredible. That's so cool. Yeah.

They must have observed, I'm guessing, zookeepers use the key. and like known that was where it unlocks the door. Yeah. So he just started sticking things in there until it unlocked. And then he would hide the wire inside of his lip too. Oh, that's classic. Yeah. So it's like, it is funny because that's like a total prison thing, right?

Yeah. Like hiding. Like he knew he had something that he wasn't supposed to have. Yeah. Making your escapes. But then when they would escape, they'd just kind of chill. They'd just wait to get caught. They were just doing it for fun.

So Fu went on to have 20 children and 15 grandchildren. Wow. And had some great grandchildren, too. Very impressive. Yeah. Considering, I think orangutans only have a baby like every five or six years. Yeah, I think they're cycling a lot of females. So he was.

A lot of females. Yeah. So, Wes, why are zoos important for orangutan and just animals in general? Yeah, I'm glad you asked. For animals? 10 seconds. 10. It's not enough.

I think. For me, the most important reason is their ambassadors for their species. So people that don't have the ability to travel to Borneo or to go to Africa or wherever else to see different animals, they get to go to the zoo. They get to see those animals in person, form a connection with them. And then that does truly make people care about wildlife. So I think that's the overarching most important reason. But there's a lot of other stuff too. A lot of these zoos put a good portion of their proceeds into conservation.

And I know, for example, the Hogo Zoo in Utah, which is the zoo me and Jeff spend the most time at, one of their main conservation species efforts is directed at orangutans. They are really putting a lot of money and effort into orangutan conservation. That's a big thing. The other thing that I think people often don't realize is that most of the animals in zoos nowadays, at least AZA-accredited zoos, come from places where they were either born in captivity or there was something that happened with the animal where it could no longer survive in the wild or safely be in the wild.

So they put it in a zoo to serve as an ambassador for the species. It's not like people are just going out and catching wild animals and throwing them in zoos anymore, at least in these accredited zoos. So yeah, there's a lot of reasons, but I think that's one of them. There's also a lot of research done in zoos. We learn a lot about animals from zoos. Like that story you just told, we know that a ring attends use tools. They'll stick things in termite mounds to pull out insects and stuff.

But that example you just said is like far beyond what you would probably ever observe in the wild. Yeah. And it teaches us about them and their capabilities. And I think that's important. And I do think some animals probably do get a little bored in zoos. Oh, without a doubt. But like humans get bored all the time too. You know?

Like it's hard to not get bored. I'm sure wild animals get bored sometimes. Yeah. Right. When they're not getting bored. eaten by like a tiger. Yeah. We have a listener question that we'll do today that goes into that a little bit too.

Okay. Yeah. It's probably what set Ted Bundy off, right? He's just bored one day? There's nothing to do. I mean, yeah, maybe he's even bored killing people by the end of it, you know? Probably not. Excema is unpredictable, but you can flare less with ebbglis.

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hate the zoo though as much as like they're playful animals they're smart what else are they going to do yeah you know one yeah one last thing i wanted to say about it too is that with some of these animals i think we have this idea that they want a huge area to roam and they want to be able to like have this incredible freedom to go anywhere they want but if you give that animal like food shelter and mating opportunities it's pretty happy in a small space it doesn't need to be who's getting that much action outside of the zoo. No, there's no way he's siring like 20 babies. Yeah.

So some of them, especially like a bear, would be really happy just having all of that. Well, this takes me to the star of this episode. Ken Allen. Ken Allen is one of the most famous zoo animals ever. Oh, it's an animal. Yes. Ken Allen? Mike, you love the movie Lockout.

Oh, yeah. What zoo would you say is like the lockout of zoos? The lagoon The zoo at lagoon Like the most Like the best The biggest best San Diego

San Diego Yeah that's why So as far as quality That reference So people Lockout is Space Jail It's the best movie ever made

Guy Pearce Guy Pearce Just one liners The entire movie Literally I think only one liners It's amazing So Ken escaped from his enclosure

At the San Diego Zoo Nine times in the mid-80s It's because he didn't like his surname. Like, why would they give him a last name? Yeah, that's impressive. I think it's both first names. I don't think it's his last name. Alan's a last name. It can be. Yeah, but you think he has two first names? Okay. Oh, like not even hyphen, just like all together, just one. Ken Allen? It's, like, two different names. Okay. It's, it's a good example. Charles Wallace in a wrinkle in time. Sometimes people just go by two first names. Yeah, that's true. Yeah, Jean

Claude. Last time I was at San Diego Zoo, they had an orangutan named Karen, which I thought was kind of funny. That's fun. Yeah. They give it a cool swoopy haircut. Probably. Now, Wes, you're a 250-pound male orangutan that just escaped from his enclosure at the San Diego Zoo.

Okay. What's on your itinerary for the day? I'm going to ride the little sky tram. Oh, that'd be sweet. Yeah. I did find a story where they like climb the cables of one of this. Really? Whoa.

But there was. wasn't enough juice in the in the story to tell it until right now and you do it for the juice yeah uh i also would probably go to the panda area because they're getting their pandas back uh i'd want to go supposedly i'll believe it when it happens yeah i would i don't know i'd just like walking around seeing all the animals okay yeah yeah why don't we let more animals just wander on the zoo you think it's dangerous dangerous for people Yeah, and for the animals. Because we let the peacocks do it.

Yeah, I think. A lot of zoos. I think it's pretty dangerous for the animals and the people. Yeah, like in the case of an orangutan, it'd be much more dangerous for the orangutan, right? They're not really aggressive towards people? Or am I making that up? They can. They're not.

But, yeah, it'd probably be more dangerous for the orangutan, but it would be a huge human safety concern to. Sure. Well, from what I learned in this story, well, I don't know. I kind of think just from what I've read with Ken Allen, that we could just, like, Let the ring of tans walk around like peacocks in the zoo. It would probably be okay for a while. Ken was a star, and he knew it. He was already popular before his escapes

because he was just constantly flipping off little kids. Okay. Yeah. I don't know how. Maybe kids would flip him off and he just thought that meant hello. Yeah. Or maybe, you know, he wanted to say like, F you little kids. Yeah.

Yeah. That's a lot better than what the Gibbons were doing when we were at, the San Diego Zoo last time in front of all the kids. Just prying off. Were they? Yeah. Just like three of them in a row. Oh, wow.

The circle. Nice. Once he got out of his enclosure, he's just a total people person. He'd walk up to visitors that were brave enough to like hold their ground and meet him. And they just wanted to meet visitors, take pictures, have a good time. But he also wanted to go to all the enclosures. He's in San Diego Zoo, you know, why not? If you, I was thinking, like, he was born in captivity.

Probably doesn't know a lot of these animals. Like, he doesn't know any animals besides orangutan and human. Yeah. So if you were an alien and you landed on Earth in San Diego Zoo, what animal would you be like most WTF with? At the San Diego Zoo, maybe the hippo. You just because that enclosure where you can, can see it underwater and above water.

Yeah. I think I would just be mesmerized by that. But I don't know. I feel like we got much we're more animals than that. Hippo's very unique. Yeah. The big ones are the ones I'd be immediately most interested in. Elephants, stuff like that.

The trunk that you would probably assume is its nose. Right. But once I got like deep down into all the deep cuts at the zoo, there's like a little insect spot. The trunk is its nose, right? It's not its mouth. It's its nose. Yeah. Or like the reptile house, all the weirdly colored reptiles.

Spider. Yeah. I think I'd be most into that. Well, unfortunately, who knows what Ken was most interested by? It depends on what the aliens look like. Because if they come down, they look like a weird lizard, they'd be like, oh, that's pretty normal. Cool. It's a tiny version of us.

Yeah. Or maybe they're tiny lizard size. Maybe it's a big version of us. And they can't see anything. Right. Yeah, or a tiger or leopard. A giraffe. giraffe would be a good one

Maybe Ken looked at the drafts You know But all I know Is Ken liked wandering around And just staring into enclosures As if he was a visitor Yeah Which also if you're the animal

And the enclosure You gotta be like Whoa You're one of us What's going on? That's a hairy human right there Yeah Some Melvin animals

Like pushes up his glasses That's not allowed You got it I'm telling Zookeeper What animal would that be? Oh, for sure that would be like, I don't know, the tapir or something. Yeah.

I can see tapir being like a little nark. Yeah. So Ken, I mean, was a little escape artist. He didn't have the best mom. She would try to smother him sometimes. But he got really good with his mom in like their little pen when he was like a baby learning things and wasn't out with the other orangutans. He would take the screws off the vents and go. explore his nursery and then go back in and like replace everything wow so ken was born and raised to

escape right right so in the zoo as an adult he made his first escape security zoo people didn't know how he got out at all just saw him wandering and people freaking out a bit you know so they ramped up security on his pen and they put in a jungle gym with utility poles to keep him like busy put in a moat in the back and then a massive wall, which they extended by four feet. Uh-huh. But it wasn't enough. A few weeks later in July, he managed to climb up the wall again. This time is a bit more irritable when he got out.

Zookeepers found him in front of another ape enclosure for orangutan, and he was tossing rocks at Otis. Otis. Otis is the Tattletown. A fellow orangutan and former penmate, who, according to Los Angeles, Angeles Times was not known to be aminable amicable am there's no C amenable amenable amiable amiable amiable amiable that's what I said yeah I kind of sure so that made me Google Otis right yeah right and you would never guess what I found okay there's an entire subreddit devoted to Otis Otis uh-huh that It's called, fuck you Otis.

Wow. Okay. And they're just mad at Otis. At Otis the orangutan? Yeah. It's okay. Because Ken doesn't like them and everyone rides with Ken. Really?

Oh, man. I'm Team Otis. Me too. We'll see. It's a joke. Yeah. Because like there's a Jeff subreddit too. And like, fuck us.

What if Jeff's ever. Frike. Uncle Joe from Willie Wonka. That's one of my favorite ones. That guy. He deserved one. He does suck, doesn't he? So, I don't blame him.

One person wrote in, Bitch ass ape, I'd beat you in a fight. That was the whole post. Not true. Yeah. Okay. There's no comments. Just like 12 up votes.

Unless that's Mad Dog from the raid, I don't believe it. No, yeah. He's the one guy who I believe could. Could probably win that fight. Then, um, so same person wrote in again a little bit later, like a year later. Yeah. My second post on the subreddit to reiterate that I fucking hate Otis. What the heck?

Is this just one person that hates Otis that writes on the subrat? No, because then a different person, the Cheezinator, wrote Otis, more like O Tits, am I right? Interesting. That's, there's about 10 total posts. Okay, so this is an inactive suburb. A couple people that really hate this or anything. So why did O Tits Gardner so much hate? Otis.

Well, I was using the name. I think Otis. Oh, it was rhetorical. Oh. He wasn't a friendly or. orangutan. Now, that's pretty much it. But the other thing is he had, were you about to say this? He had three female orangutang with him. I guess that there was some sort of like mate. Nice. Yeah. Jealousy. So that's why Ken hated him. So Ken went over there. So they had three

orangutans with him. Yeah. And started throwing rocks at him. Like, I got the testosterone going too. I could handle. Or he's just like an in-cell. Ken is. Ken sounds, that's in-cell behavior. It is. So, yeah, put a pen in that. Okay. A pen or a pin? A pen. Okay. It's going to be a little harder, but I'll do it.

Pin it in with a pen. Gotcha. The escapes again continued, and that August, Ken found a crowbar in his pen that workers had left behind, and he tossed it to another orangutan, Vicky, who used it to pry open a window and let Ken out. Wow. Oh, wow. I'm picturing like a really, swift cool toss like it would be in a movie.

We do. But it's probably more like flung it. I don't know. They can be pretty good tosses. Vicky catches it without looking. Yeah. And immediately prides something up. Yeah.

That it was a little, a little derpier than that. They, zookeepers at this point, like, it stopped being funny, you know? Yeah. They should stop leaving their crow bars laying around. Yeah. But they were also like, they hired rock climbers to come into the enclosure. To try and climb. Try to climb this wall and just get every nook and cranny they could find.

And then they started walking around the enclosure to like see what he was doing. And he wouldn't ever move when he saw a zookeeper. So then they would like go in disguise to like try to like. That's a ring and taste. What kind of disguise? Just like as visitors. Oh, okay. Like a gilly suit.

But he like knew who they were. And he would never try to escape when there was a zoo. Zookeeper watching. Yeah. Which made me think of this time at the Hogo Zoo, which is the zoo in Salt Lake that I go to a lot. The zookeeper walked up to the orangutan enclosure while I was like just looking at him. And this orangutan immediately saw him, swung like over to the glass so fast. And then they like put their hands against the glass and then you left.

So like they're just keyed in to their keepers. Yeah. Yeah. So eventually, the zoo spies did catch him climbing like Spider-Man up the exterior wall. Spider-Man's in quotes. Like, that's what they said. Okay. So they put up an electric wire and the new security measures worked, you know, according to a report, Ken Allen settled down as a family man.

Yeah. Really? Yeah. Okay. Except that was just a ruse. He is playing the long con. This guy, Ken Allen, got an entire family going for two years. Yeah.

Just to get these keepers off his scent. Wow. That's what I think. That's dedication. So two years later, family man, Ken Allen, now retired from escaping, escaped again. Of course he did. This time, his enclosure's water pump got clogged, causing the moat to dry up. Before anyone noticed, he walked across the dry moat, hoisted himself onto the rocks outside the enclosure.

Once again, he wandered around the zoo, posing for photos with tourists. He just wanted pictures with tourists, you know? He's a celebrity. Yeah. A zoo gardener spotted him and cleared the area. As security guards converged on him, guns ready, Ken Allen bolted, headed towards the lion pens. Before he reached them, veterinarians managed to corral him back into a. enclosure nervous and agitated but unharmed is the farthest of his enclosure he'd gotten wow but now he knows

what lions look like you know yeah pretty cool happy for him i like to think that he he really did earnestly want to settle down with a family but once the on we sets in after a couple years he's like his old life starts calling to him again yeah he was just trying to wake odis up you know yeah yeah man this isn't it there's a whole world The speakers were wondered maybe he is jealous of Otis. Uh-huh. So they gave him four female orangutans instead of three. Yeah.

Which we can unpen that now. Okay, it's un-pinned. Unpenned. Sorry. That's like him, unpened. Yeah, so they gave him four. But turned out Ken was just a bad influence on these new orangutans. And months later, two of them, Jane and Cooming, found a five-foot-long squirrel.

Queeji left behind by some window washers. Yeah. And they used it to climb up the wall. So Jane was found walking near the flamingos and was tranquilized. And Kumig was just corralled back to the pen. It's crazy how much shit is getting left in their enclosure. Yeah. I'm starting to think there's like someone trying to help these orangutans.

Yeah. Maybe the orangutans are like hoarding their food, not eating it all and like giving it to these people for like, hey, you leave this window. washing stuff and you can have this banana. Yeah, I feel like your next story is going to be like they found an AK-47 that was left in their enclosure. Or maybe it was a PETA sleeper cell agent that rose through the ranks of the San Diego Zoo staff and kept leaving like little instruments to help and get out. If you're like a PETA person, this would be a very easy.

You just drop a crowbar in the ring tank enclosure. This episode is brought to you by Netflix. Most valuable promotions in Netflix are hosting a block. Buster triple headliner Saturday, May 16th. Rhonda Rousey returns to face fellow woman's MMA pioneer Gina Carrano in the main event. Plus co-main's Nate Diaz versus Mike Perry. And the best heavy weight in the world,

Francis Ngano versus Felipe Lins. Watch Rhonda Rousey versus Gina Carano, live only on Netflix. Saturday, May 16th at 9 p.m. Eastern Center time, 6 p.m. Pacific time. So after this one, the zoo was kind of like, all right, we can't allow any more. escapes. So they spent like 45 grand, which was, I don't know, a million dollars back then

on new security measures and the escapes finally stopped. There were nine total breakouts according to the Lodi New Sentinel. And crowds would always cheer the apes on as the keepers ran after. If I'm at the zoo when the orangutan gets out, I'm taking a picture I'm so stoked. Yeah, that's the best day of my life. So that's it for my stories. Wes, here's a question for you, though. What is orangutan biology? Well, I didn't know this was going to be my question, but I do know a bit about them.

I got some tears. They're great apes. There's like pretty much two species. There's Bornean and Sumatran. They are one of the more intelligent animals. There's actually three types. Well, there's one that I thought they think is like functionally extinct. There's like 800 of them.

Okay. And they only discovered them in 2017. Yeah. The tap anule. Okay. And then one thing that I know about them that I just think is like endlessly fascinating. I don't know if you're going to get into this. They're one of the only animals that we've ever documented using plants in their ecosystem to like heal wounds as medicine.

Like they'll get plants and they'll put it on wounds or inflammation. It helps. And they know the right plants to grab and they know how to do it. And scientists learning about that, it kind of unlocked a whole new level of what we think animals might be capable of. Yeah. So I just, I think they're really amazing animals. They're mostly fruit eaters.

One other thing I know about them is they are the longest nursing animals of any mammal. So they'll nurse their young until they're up to eight years old. Yeah, I didn't know specifically. Nursing, but it is like they care for their babies for super long. Yeah. But nursing especially, like they are the long. The longest of any animal, including weeds. We'll get into a lot of this in a sec, too.

But, like, that is, like, a lot of why they're so endangered. Yeah. Is the moms hardly ever have more than one baby. Twins are very rare. And then it's six or seven-year commitment until they're able to have a baby. How long can they live? 30 to 40 years, I think. So they can live up to 60, but, like, 30 is a lot more.

I was wondering that about the Otis sub-Rubric. it like is Otis even still around no but he would be gone by now right yeah okay but that's probably why it's not active it's like you can say like ted bundy for example right the same concept sure no i get it all right so let's go to jeff sure bring in ted bundy up a lot of this episode i could have done another one but i was like i already mentioned yeah bring him back Jeff's orange orangutan facts. Okay. Threw in a little secret one in the title, you know?

Yeah. They're orange. Wes thinks a lot of animals are orange. We can get into that later. Oh, yeah. That was a bad hint. That wasn't. I'm sticking to that being a good hint. Clownfish?

You did some bad hints too. I did a lot of bad hints. That yours was bad. I don't think mine was bad. I really don't. That's all right. He just wanted to deflect onto me, which I get. I mean, snakes was a bad one.

It was the, I panicked. People don't know what you're talking about. Yeah, they don't. Camillion. When it comes to orangutan physilod, physiology. Physiology. Yeah, physiology. There's two types of males.

There's flanged and unflanged. Flanged. That seems right to me. Flanged. Flanged. You want to see it? It's like the big facial pads on the males. I've been spilling drinks a lot more recently.

I don't know if it's because I'm like, got brain tumor or I just maybe got more stuff than I've ever had. I just knock. You just like have hit critical mass on stuff, unspillable things. Like knocking things into things. Yeah. The one that you just did was it was pretty obvious. I was kind of like, oh, he's just going to knock that over.

Oh, he got it. You can see the drink here. Got it. For me, I saw it in like slow motion. Yeah. So anyways, flanged orangutan are just so much cooler. Yeah. They get the food man chews.

They're cool. And with them, it's only the dominant male that gets that characteristic of the big. Like, the males that are breeding are the ones. Not necessarily only. So that's what I read. It said, all right rangutan males look similar in childhood. Yeah. But due to an increase in testosterone during sexual maturation.

Yeah. Some males develop secondary sexual characteristics, such as a large cheek, Such as large cheek pads and a largenal throat pouch. Okay. From what I thought it was only like the dominant ones that are doing the breeding, they get that. Because the unflanged flanged males will also breed. Like they'll go, but they have to force themselves on females. Whereas females will willingly breed with the large flanged males.

Yeah, I don't know. The way I read it was a little different but similar. Okay. The flange male arrangetans are much larger and they're like generally preferred by females. Yeah. Because, you know, they want, they're young to turn out that way as well. Yeah. I didn't, I didn't see that there's only one flanged in a group of orangutan.

I think it's just like how much testosterone they get. Yeah. Well, they're not social. They don't have groups in the wild. So they, I didn't mean that it's like one dominant male with a harem of fiend. females. But what I'm saying is that in a given area, there'll be one big male that's flanged, that will, or flanged, that will have sex with a bunch of females. But it's not that there's one. There can be a bunch, but one of those big males will assert his dominance over an area.

Okay. Yeah. This is from, my facts are from World Wildlife Foundation. Cool. And it said, while the development leading to the presence of absence of flange is known, the specific trigger that leads to the, the difference is relatively unknown. Interesting.

That's really cool. So another fact. You got any flange question at Mike? No. I would even know how to start off. What human you think has the biggest flange? Ron Perlman. No, he's got more of like a awesome jaw going on.

It's like a big poofy face. Like John Candy. Or like an underneck. John Candy kind of had flanges. Yeah. People made it with him. That guy, I would have made, I won't say that right. But I can understand.

Something cool is they make nests every night. And when it's rainy, they'll even, like, make themselves a little roof. That's cool. And that's, like, a major way they are able to count the orangutan populations, too, is just, like, count nests and trees. Because I guess, like it said, they make them every night. So I'd assume they dissemble them in the morning. Interesting.

Yeah. It doesn't seem very effective. efficient. But we don't need some. I mean, we all. It only takes them like 10 minutes to make their little nasty. Sure. Like Wes was saying,

they have the longest birth interval of any animal. It's seven to nine years. Yeah. That's interesting. And yeah. And like what I was reading is that their young will start kind of exploring on their own after two years. They'll still stay with their mom for like up to six to nine years even. And sometimes she'll nurse.

up to eight years during that time. So it's like the longest nursing period too, which is crazy. Wes, you believe in evolution? I do, yep. And you think we came from primate? I think we share a common ancestor. Yeah. Well, like us.

So we didn't come from them. Oringotans have four fingers and a thumb and fingernails. So that would argue to your point. Yeah, I think it's some good evidence. But their feet look almost exactly the same as their hands. How do you explain that? that. If you don't believe in evolution, maybe you could argue that.

Yeah. You know? Well, this is... Because we don't have hands for feet. I'm glad you brought us up because really quickly. I think people do use that argument that don't really understand evolution, saying that we evolved from apes. And that's not the case.

The case is that we share a common ancestor that we all branched off of. Right. So, like, God. There's a hominid a long time ago, millions of years ago. ago that we all kind of branched off from the great apes did and we are part of the ape family and that having hands for feet makes it just really good for climbing and gripping trees and they're super long arms so they're just this is the most arboreal of the great apes well they're also the heaviest tree dwelling animal wow that's cool do you think people that don't believe in evolution point towards ken allen

and be like, well, why does he have a human name? Yeah. Or wait, what that'd be people. I'm not sure. Yeah. Do believe in it. I don't. I got mixed up.

Okay. The answer's no either way. Yeah. Right. So when males are fighting for a chick, you know. Oh, yeah. They will. You saw it with Ken Allen.

Yeah. Just moments ago. Yeah. They charge at each other and break branches to intimidate the other one to just like, just give up before we even fight. It's like pushing, pushing kind of, but not ever fighting. It's like flexing your biceps at each other to see like, you know, you've done that. Oh yeah, I do it all the time.

But sometimes your biceps just look pretty similar, you know? So then they have to grapple and bite each other. They're more solitary than any of the great apes like you're saying. And they don't have as complicated as a vocal repertoire as a lot of the other primates. but they rely heavily on facial expressions, which is cool. And body language to communicate. Yeah.

And I think even in zoos you can like see that. They'll do like signs and they're pretty good with like sign language or like trying to communicate. Yeah. Like I was reading about someone who visited a zoo with the Ken Allen story and orangutan was like gesturing to them like to throw it. He was like pointing at his hand, the apes. But the person was holding a bag of, like, food. Oh. So he's like, give me, or no, it's a Snickers bar.

So it's like, give me a Snickers bar. Right. And then the person was like, like, why wait? And then the person pointed at the sign that said, don't feed the apes. Uh-huh. And they immediately lost interest in them and, like, moved to the next person. I wish they was like, yeah. That sign doesn't mean anything.

And that wasn't the Snickers one. That was a different food yet. Because a different person was saying that they saw an ape and they were eating a Snickers bar and the ape like gestured towards it. This is an orangutan? Oh yeah, the orangutan. Sorry. And then the orangutan grabbed a stick in its enclosure and threw it out of the enclosure at the person's feet to like show them like how to throw this skaters to it. Yeah.

I think if I'm in the zoo and one does that to me, I'm throwing a nice stick. I think that's a lot. Don't actually do that. Yeah, we're not doing that. And then they also have, especially those big old orangutans with the, where are they called the flanges? Flanges. Yeah. They can make like a really loud, deep, long call for like long distance communication and to just like let all the ladies know.

It's time. It's business time. Check out my flanges. Yeah. Yeah. It's like walking into the club and just being like. Gay West is in the house or something. Kanye West?

Do you don't think he's ever done that? Just yelled it out. Let everyone know. I didn't know if you're talking about him or... I was talking about him. Sure. He's not who I'd use, though. Well, who would you use?

Who walks in a club and just yells their name so that all the women know he entered? I don't know. He's just got a lot of baggage. It's not like a compliment to him. On Saturday Night Fever? Yeah, perfect. Does he do that? I mean, he goes in and dominates.

Okay. The dance floor clears. Yeah. And then my last fact is that they are really good with tools. Like Wes was saying, they can use tools to get termites. But the one that I really liked is that they'll grab leaves off of trees to, like, make shift gloves for their hands to, like, handle really spiky fruit. Okay. That's cool.

Another really interesting thing about them, and this is like another kind of test they use with animals to determine intelligence, especially like cultural intelligence. They have self-recognition in a mirror, and most animals don't do that. Like most animals, when they look in a mirror, they can't figure out that that's them.

They think it's like another animal. And orangutan's when they reach a certain age, recognize that it's them. And that's like actually really significant. All right. Do we have any questions? We'll go conservation and categories. No, I really like this.

I like the image of an orangutan putting a pin or something in its lip to break out later is really going to stick with me. Yeah, that's cool. So orangutans, at least the Bornean, they're endemic. Is that the right word to Borneo? They only exist. The only two countries in the world where you can find this animal are Malaysian, Indonesia. Well, I have Borneo and Sumitra. Sumatra.

But those are both islands that fall within those two countries. Okay, sure. Yeah. But it's just those two. But those are the two islands are the only place. That's wild. And they used to be more in like South. Southeast Asia and stuff.

Every species is critically endangered. They're all doing. And we're like I just said, we'll do conservation in categories. Right. Okay. I'm sorry. I know. I was a little mean on that.

No. I didn't hear you say that because I was like, I got to come up with a smart question here. Okay. I haven't been doing much to live in here. We'll definitely dig into conservation because it's a pretty bleak. Pretty bleak picture for that. I don't want to be sad about this. Not answer your question, but I did just say like, I was not listening.

We'll talk about conservation categories. It's a good one because it's one where people can do something. It's not like a hopeless, like, climate change kind of thing. There's some stuff that can be done for this animal. Yeah, we might as well. But can we do anything to help them? Yes, we can't. Yeah, and like Malaysia's actually been pretty proactive recently, which is great.

They've been really going hard at palm oil farmers are the biggest thing. Right. And like, um, so yeah, that's like the, that's the thing that's worse for them right now is like palm oil farms are taking a lot of their habitat. Farmers just kill a lot of orangutan that are like on their property. And the reason behind that is because they know that they are putting pressure on the palm oil industry. So if they can get rid of the orangutans, then they don't have any barriers to increasing the size of the palm oil plantation. But it's monoculture and there's just not any kind of, there's no habitat there in palm oil for orangutans.

They can't survive. Some of what I read too is that they're like steel crops. Yeah. But even if they were to eat palm, you know, whatever, they're making the oil out of, I think it's coconuts and other things. it's not enough for an orangutan. It can't support a healthy ecosystem with orangutans. Okay. So the lesson there is be really careful what you use that has palm oil in it.

Like you can avoid palm oil. You can buy products that don't have palm oil. Right. And that, yeah, there's like Rainforest Alliance and a few other companies that they'll put their stamp on stuff that's, like, healthy for the world's rainforest. And that includes not including palm oil. I always get so, I don't even know what the right word is, sad. Obviously, but when people kill animals like that, people that live in Africa that can look at a rhino and be like, I'm going to kill that thing. Yeah.

It just doesn't even compute with my brain. Yeah. I could never be able to do that. But obviously, I don't live in their situation either, so I don't know what it's like. America definitely is guilty of that with bison as well. Yeah, for sure. Yeah, totally. Grizzlies for a while, too.

A ton of animals. Well, and we're the ones fueling most of these industries, too. Yeah. You know, we're the over-consumers. So let me just read my conservation notes. Wes kind of said it, but this will be a little more clear and concise, maybe. Okay. Well, like, you just weren't.

You didn't have notes on it, is all I'm saying. Yeah. But, yeah, so this is from World Wildlife Fund. Fund, yeah. The, well, is it Federation? Fund. World Wildlife Fund. World Wildlife Frikers.

That's not. It's definitely not the right letter. But the Borian, Sumatran, and recently. Sumatran. Sumatran and recently confirmed new species as a 2017 tapanoulli are the three types of orangutan. All three orangutan species are critically endangered. It's difficult to determine how many aringotans are left in the world, but estimates suggest that there are just over 100,000 in Borneo, Borneo. There are estimates that are a lot lower than that, like 50 to 65,000.

That's still more than I would have thought, actually. There's fewer than 14,000 of the Sumatran. Sumatran. Yeah. Sumatran. We'll get there. Sumatran. And less than 800 tapanuli.

I'm not going to try and help with that one. Orangutans left. So those ones are critically, forget about them. Yeah. Just kidding. You're not bad to say. Borny and orangutans have darker red coats and rounder faces. They're really important to their habitats.

They're nicknamed. like the gardeners because they eat a ton of fruit. Like that's what they eat. And then they poop out seeds everywhere. So it's really healthy for the jungles that they live in. Yeah. I'm sure it's hurt South Asia losing all their orangutans. And like it definitely hurt this ecosystem as well.

And on average 2,000 to 3,000 orangutans are killed every year. So, you know, that's like poaching, bushmeat, illegal pet trade. those are some of the other threats. But deforestation and habitat loss is their number one. There are a lot of experts that think, like, at this rate, they could go extinct in 50 years from now. I do agree with West, though. I think there's enough that it's not this animal is going extinct.

And I think that at least Malaysia's government, you know, they don't, they're trying to protect them. They got the right mindset. Well, what I was going to say, though, is, I do think sometimes with them, with animals like this, the number isn't what we should focus on. It's more like the threat. And for them, it's deforestation. And Borneo specifically is losing their rainforest at such like a fast rate because of palm oil that even if there are 60,000, 70,000 orangutans there are still, we could lose them all really quickly if they lose all their habitat.

It's kind of like polar bears. There's 25 to 30,000 polar bears in the world. but if suddenly they lose all their sea ice, then we're going to lose all of them quickly. Well, it's kind of like Avatar too. Yeah, just like Avatar. They're trying to get the... Unobtainium.

Right, and if they get all that unattainment. If they obtain all of it, it's over. Isn't that what inspired James Cameron was the video of the orangutan, like versus that excavator in the jungle? Yeah, that was part of it. Because there were scenes like that in the movie. I will say, though, this is an animal that's so charismatic that kind of like Jeff was saying,

or Malaysia's doing a lot to try and protect them, it's because this is an animal that people deeply care about. You know, it's not one that's just going to disappear and no one's going to talk about it. This would be like a huge tragedy. So I do think that's what they have going for them

is they're so charismatic and loved. I love them for ring and tents. Yeah. Not the baby ones, though. That's my favorite kind, but all right. Lots of places can expose you to identity theft. Oh, no. That's why LifeLock monitors hundreds of millions of data points a second for threats to your identity,

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Yeah, let's go. Mike spoiled it. What? You started with categories. I spoiled it, too. Yeah. We've kind of already done them all now. But do you guys have a favorite escape in real life we haven't talked about?

I was going to talk about D.B. Cooper. That's one of my favorites. What's that one? He was a guy in the 70s that, like, somehow robbed something and got $200,000. A ton of money. Like a bank or something. And then he got on a plane in Seattle and hijacked the crew. and then parachuted with the money 30 minutes later over Washington and then just disappeared.

No one knows. No one knows what happened. They found a little bit of the money so they think he might have died, but no one has any idea. To this day, it's an unsolved mystery, and it's like the greatest ever. Like heist, get away. No, that's nothing. Okay. Mine is the Alcatraz escape.

Oh, yeah. That's a great one. There's like three people in on it, but one person had like a pipe in their way. and they planned for so long because I just feel so bad for that guy still but two brothers were able to escape or I think four people were in on it three people escaped one of them like got

recaptured captured or drowned in the water but two brothers were able to like swim from Alcatraz to the San Francisco or the other side of Golden Gate right to the mainland yeah and like they probably moved to Brazil but then when their mom died there was two really suspicious women at the funeral.

It's so good. Case file did a really fun episode. Case file is where I like learned that is really good. Didn't Pablo Escobar have just a whole series of tunnels that like went under borders and stuff? Chopo. Chopo. That's who I'm thinking of. Yeah, that's right. Chopo.

Yeah. That was great. I like that. Those rascals. Yeah. Chappo had a good one. Yeah. It was just like thrown in prison and already had like a tunnel.

Just ready to go. Just right onto the golf cart. Just relaxes for a few weeks and then leaves. Escobar, like, he went in prison, but he built his own prison and, like, made it just like a party. Like a resort. Yeah. All right. So I also had favorite pop culture escape.

I had the Guardians one. It's not necessarily favorite because I think we've done that. I did, like, Count of Monte Cristo last time where he switches the body with his. But I just want to shout out. I love that first Guardian's prison escape. My really accessible answer is Shawshank, just because I think it's a great movie and a wonderful escape. But one that's a little bit more of a deep cut is the book Papillon,

which I think is actually a real life escape, but is the guy who was put in a penal colony by France and pretty much worked his entire life to escape. He just kept escaping and they'd recapture him. But he just had like a really kind of undefeatable spirit. I feel like there might have been something problematic about him too, but I can't remember. Good movie, Dustin Hoffman. I always appreciate just people who refuse to be in prison.

Like, no matter what. If they're terrible people, I just like that mindset, I guess. Well, he got, like, tortured, too. The escape from Camp 14, I guess he's kind of backtracked on some of his stuff in there, so it's hard to believe. I have a hard time with all the North Korea ones. That one was a crazy story. But anyways, I was just going to say, I really like Indeatron. Germany. Did you know that if you escape from prison, they won't charge you for escaping?

Like you get rewarded for escaping? You don't get rewarded. Like you still have to serve the sentence you had. Yeah. But in every other country, they add on like punishment for escaping. Yeah. And Germany said it's human nature to like want to escape. That's cool. That's great. I think there should be a country where it's like if you escape, you're free. Yeah. That was our bad. That's on us that you got out. I'll go with the end of O'Connorin of time. Zelda, Nintendo 64. You beat Gannon, you run off the tower. Zelda's helping you with her little magic.

Just a great sequence to wrap things up. Maybe I'd be interested to hear what you think. Maybe I should bring... I'm always interested to hear, like, so that's held up as one of the greatest games ever. But is it really for like a new player that didn't play it back in 1997 or whatever? Oh, that's not the open world one.

No, that's Breath of the Wild. Okay. Yeah. It's fun. You love Zelda. Yeah. Yeah. I'm like half and half these days.

Do you like Link or Zelda more? I'm ready for just a Zelda game where you're playing a Zelda. What do you mean you're half and half? There's a lot of Zelda games I don't particularly care for. You don't like the open. I'm not crazy about Breath of the Wild Tears of the Kingdom. But you're excited for there to be a movie. I'm very curious.

Wes Ball, the director of it, he's doing the new Planet of the Apes movie. Oh. So, like, that's why I want to see that movie. purely out of just like scouting. Yeah. Yeah. What's going on here? And yeah, just to like say before the next one, I don't know if I said it.

Like the whole reason I wanted to do orangutans is we're leaving to Borneo. Yeah, I mentioned it. Like tomorrow. Yeah. So. It is tomorrow. Oh, I hope we make it. I know.

What, you want to see a sun bear more than anything. But they're hard to see. Sun bear number one. Because we're going to both a sun bear and a. Borneo Conservation Center. Yeah. And I think, or sorry, a sun bear and an orangutan conservation center. And I think the orangutans there are somewhat wild still.

Like, they can come and go as they please. But the sun bears aren't. They're ones that are in enclosures. So. I read a sad story about the orangutan's at one of those where they're kind of wild. Yeah. Where they, like, killed a female, a male. Like, they mated in front of her and then killed her.

Wow. And it's like one of the, like, primates don't really kill. kill each other. It's like one of the only primates that I think there's a few that get pretty, but it's like a small list of primates that have like killed. Chimpanzees will do it. But yeah, but Sunbears my number one, then probably rang a 10, then blue elephant, pigmy elephant or whatever. I'll see that bird. The blue-headed pitta. I really want to see it, but I think I want to see the bird more. What's it? The blue-headed pitta. What's its head look like? Mike? What am I, what's the question? Huh? I don't know. We just asked.

What are you most looking for it to sun bear? Yeah, sunbear. That would be cool. All right. So what's your favorite name for an animal? I wasn't very clear on this, but like I meant orangutan. I think people like that name. I like it more as orangutang.

But I put fox. I think fox is just a good name for an animal. I'm going to answer it the way I thought it was, which was like a named animal. Like Ken Allen. Yeah. And mine was. Is it Ken Allen? No, mine was going to be like kind of a little self-congratiating.

But I had an orphan raccoon named cricket and that was my favorite named animal I've ever had. I like Mrs. Norris in Harry Potter. It's like the groundskeeper's pet cat. Oh, Mrs. Norris. Yeah, that's right. But if we're going like actual species, axolottle is fun. Oh, yeah. And Dungbiel, you got to give it up for Dumbed.

That's great. Yeah. Screaming Harry Armadillo is a good one. Oh. Do they scream? Yeah, they do scream. Starfish is kind of fun. Yeah. Starfish.

Orange, too. Bearded dragon. Yeah. It's cool. Sure. I'll let you know. I'll explain it again. Yeah, I'm not going to fight you on that.

Favorite steroid user or story? Jose Canseco. Yeah, me too. Oh, man. Ask Me Anything. Reddit is the funniest thing I've ever read. Yeah, his book. Legendary.

Juiced. He, that dude loves steroids. Like, he, that book is like all about how great steroids are pretty much. I think he's not stoked about him anymore. Really? But, yeah. Okay. I went with the villain in Bloodsport.

Bolo Young. It's just like, I don't even know. He had to have, but it just like all went into his pecks. Dude, his chest is like a. Like he can't like lift his arms up. It's crazy. You know who's another good one is the liver king. Yeah.

Oh, gosh. Because he like said that it was just from eating liver. And then one of his pictures had steroids in it or something. He had, like, promoted ads from Hidden. We're popping up on my Twitter like crazy. Yeah. And he looks like he's dying. And that one always had, like, the listener.

This information's incorrect. Yeah. He uses steroids. Yeah. What are the reader? Community notes. Yeah. All right.

Do we have any listener questions, Wes? Yeah, we do. We'll start with the one that I teased, which is from Ashley. And Ashley says, hi, guys. So I'm at the Houston Zoo today. They had the most beautiful Jaguar. My question is, why was it pacing back and forth at the glass most of the time?

It had a beautiful enclosure, but kids were running back and forth in front of it, etc. To me, it looks stressed or hungry. I don't know. So my guess is that it was probably about time to feed this jaguar. And often when, especially big cats at zoos, they have a routine, they know it's about time for them to be fed,

they're going to become much more active and display that kind of like pacing behavior. So that would be my best guess. The more leopard would do that in front of, of glass it. Totally. The tigers do, like almost all, the lions do it there. They know that it's almost time and they get excited. But the other thing it could be is sometimes when an animal does have a hard time kind of adjusting to life at a new zoo or something, they'll develop what's called a stereotypy where they repeat a behavior over and over and over again. And sometimes

that's what's happening. But my guess is with this jaguar, it's probably just about time to be fed. So that's why it's doing that. This one is from Alyssa. Alyssa says, hey guys, if you could harness all the animals on a continent to wage war on all the animals of the other continents, which continent would you choose? Taking air, land, and sea, animal attributes only. No machine gun wielding spider monkeys. I'm biased, but Australia would win. Wrong. Saltwater crocs, great white sharks at amortas, stealth kangaroos

and wedge-tailed eagles would flank the enemy. throwing Sydney funnel webs and box jellyfish kamikaze style. Brown snakes would ride cassowary steeds into battle. Oh, okay. Plus bio-warfare chlamydia and Tasmanian devil face cancer. A lot of comedia. We're missing big cats. It is, but I do think it's wrong because Asia has like most of those same animals.

Yeah. Plus massive elephants. Tigers. Rhinos. Huge brown bears. Cheaters. Yeah. I mean, I don't think you can beat Asia.

they have like kind of everything Don't they have cheetahs? Yeah there's an Asiatic Jita They're fast I would even put Africa over Australia I think I think Australia would probably be last Besides Antarctica I guess Yeah

South America has the most Species I think I've read that somewhere But none of them I mean there's only a handful That would be particularly polar bears Dangerous No they don't They have leopard seals Asia though has like

Most of the bear species are there They have almost all the big cats. Yeah. They have all the megafauna, elephants and rhinos and everything. Right. I just can't beat them. They have great whites.

They have saltwater crocks. They have all of it. I would put Australia above Europe as well. Yeah. Yeah. Australia is middle ground for me. This one is from, let's see, Mike T. Hey guys, I've asked this question in the past, but after listening the most recent episode,

I don't know when this was. And hearing Jeff say he's been watching Norm McDonald lately, I thought I'd ask again. Who's your favorite comedian and what's your favorite bit from their standup? On the flip side, who is a popular comedian that you can't stand and why? Thanks. It's your favorite comedian and bit. I mean, it's Norm, but if a runner up is Mitch Headbrick for me, he doesn't really have bits. It's all just kind of weird non sequiters and one-liners.

Yeah, it's norm for me too. Norm with the moth joke would probably be my favorite. I will just say just to make it different. I really love the recent roast of Tom Brady. Yeah. Mike and Wes haven't seen it yet, so I'm sure they're annoyed that I've just, like, told them every joke from it so far now. No, I want to watch it.

But yeah, Grancowski is a great comedian. The second part of that question was a comedian that is popular that you don't like. That's pretty... Yeah, like that Matt Reef or Rife guy. I don't like that. He's actually had a few clips that I haven't hated. Huh. What's his name?

Well, I mean, Dane Cook's the easiest answer. Yeah. I think for me, more so than like a comedian, the recent thread that they're all on where they're like fighting against like wokeness. And I'm like I'm not like a woke person. No. Well, I shouldn't say that. Like I just think that's a stupid term to begin with. But the fact that they all, that's like their new thing is I'm not woke.

They're just making like millions of dollars saying like, I can't say this anymore. I can't say this because I'm going to get. canceled it's so stupid like just stop talking about it i'm changing my into the bert kercher guy oh crisher yeah he just had one funny story like severely embellished and like made a movie about it'll like put it's on tom bray's roast and it's like oh wait this guy is not actually funny yeah yeah i'm with you there i can't really think of a comedian that i i mean i know there are comedians I dislike. Kevin Hart?

No, I, like, I don't, that's the thing. If I don't like a comedian, I just don't really engage with their stuff. Like, Polly Shorter, I mean, some of his movies were fun back in the day, but, like, his comedy is terrible. Yeah. But, I mean, I don't like Roseanne Barr. Well, sure, yeah, there we go. I'll pick Roseanne Barr.

Yeah, it's just not for me. Matt Belia or whatever, right? Who's to say my humor's better? than someone else is. Yeah. You know? Right. When all it is is like politics and cancel culture and stuff, though, it's just to me

is so tired. I just have a hard time with that. Even if they're like my politics, I just like, that's not why I want to access humor. Like I want to like think about something else. Right. So you don't think it's funny when I say I'm going to run for president for shark? It's too political. That's not political to me.

That's politics. I guess. All right. We good with questions? Yeah, I think so. So last question, orangutans. How much do we like them? They're my favorite of the great apes.

Like more than a gorilla? Yeah. I think I'd rather see a gorilla just because it seems so special to like hike way into the mountains and like see a gorilla. But I think orangutans are my favorite still. So they're either a nine or a ten. But I'll give them a nine just because I think I've been giving away tens a little loosely lately. So I'm going to go nine. I have a hard time picking.

They're like pretty even with gorillas for me. I think there may be more unique, but gorillas are... So impressive. Yeah. But, yeah, I'll put them more hair above a gorilla, an orange hair above one. Okay. Just because I'll round their faces get. All right, sure.

So, yeah, let's put them at 31. What's your claw rating for him? I mean, 31, that's got to be 10. Okay. Holy mackerel. I'll go with a seven. All right. That's, it's, I like them.

I like gorillas more. I'm not crazy about apes in general. Yeah, but they're an exception to where I could be like pretty stoked about them, especially if we see them in Borneo. I think that'll be a big deal. Yeah, they'll probably bump them up to attend for me if we see them. Yeah. But all right.

Thanks, Jeff. Yeah, it was fun. Yeah, thanks. Thanks, Ken Allen. Yeah, thanks for all the hijinks. Yeah. All right. We'll see you guys.

Love you guys. If you ever get in prison, and just know you can escape. That's what I want you. That's what I want you to take away from this. No, I want to go to prison. I just get to like chill and watch TV and read books. Yeah.

All right. All right. See you. See ya.