Top Story with Tom Llamas - Monday, August 21, 2023

Episode Date: August 22, 2023

Tonight's Top Story has the latest breaking news, political headlines, news from overseas and the best NBC News reporting from across the country and around the world. ...

Transcript
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Starting point is 00:00:00 Tonight, breaking news, President Biden touching down in Maui late today touring the wildfire devastation firsthand. Biden walking through the burn zone in Lahaina, meeting with first responders and families whose lives have been forever changed. His message to the people of Hawaii as the difficult work of searching for the 850 still missing continues. Tonight, we'll speak to a doctor in Hawaii who is part of the team tasked with the grim assignment of identifying those remains and bringing some closure to so many looking for answers about their loved ones. Back on the mainland, Southern California slammed with the remnants of Hurricane Hillary. Residents trapped as massive mudslides overtake roads.
Starting point is 00:00:42 Drivers forced to abandon their cars in the surging floodwaters, search and rescue efforts still underway. Also breaking tonight thousands under mandatory evacuation orders because of this, wildfires raging out of control in the Pacific Northwest, hundreds of homes destroyed as crews raced to contain the flames. The battle for Iowa, a new NBC news poll showing former President Trump with the commanding 20-point lead over Governor Ron DeSantis, but with the majority of Iowans open to the idea of a new Republican leader. Can a dark horse candidate emerge to take him down? What we're hearing from voters on the ground?
Starting point is 00:01:18 And the bail just set in Fulton County, Georgia as Trump prepares to turn himself in. Plus, killed over a pride flag? California shop owner and a mother of nine, shot and killed by a man who police say was angry over a pride display outside her store, when a neighboring store owner tells us she heard in the moments after the deadly shooting. And a driver doing stunts in Atlanta hitting bystanders as he fled from police the moment one cop took him out with a pit maneuver, jumping into action with a gun drawn to take that driver down. Top story starts right now. And good evening. We thank you tonight for joining us here on Top Story. We begin our coverage once again tonight with the devastation in Hawaii.
Starting point is 00:02:05 President Biden on the ground getting his first look at the devastation there after catastrophic wildfires tore across the island, leaving more than 100 people dead, and 850 still missing. The President and First Lady, Jill Biden, landing in Maui late today, nearly two weeks after the deadliest wildfire in modern American history first broke out. The president boarding Marine won to view the massive burn site in Lahaina from the air. On the ground, the Biden's walking along those burnt out buildings and charred cars that we have shown you here night after night. The president shaking hands with the first responders carrying out the incredible, difficult task of searching through that rubble. And Biden addressed the people of Hawaii and the nation late today. Let's take a listen. Well, hello, people of Maui.
Starting point is 00:02:52 I've shown such absolute incredible courage. That's not hyperbole. I want you to know on behalf of the United States of America of all the nation, the American people stand with you. To my left is the banyan tree, beloved by this community for over 150 years. Here in the former capital of the kingdom, Hawaii, that has stood for generations as a sacred spot of exceptional significance. One of the people who took me under his wing when I first got to the Senate was Danny Noway.
Starting point is 00:03:27 He used to talk about the kingdom of Hawaii. He came from Japan, but it was amazing to listen to him. Today is burned, but it's still standing. The trees survive for a reason. I believe it's a powerful, a very powerful symbol of what we can and will do to get through this crisis. And for this, for as long as it takes, we're going to be with you. the whole country be with you. You know, we will be respectful of the sacred grounds
Starting point is 00:03:58 and the traditions that rebuild the way the people of Maui want to build, not the way others want to build. We're going to rebuild the way the people of Maui want to build. But, you know, it's going to be hard. America's deadliest wildfire in over a century. And Jill and I have what's left, walked front street, what's left of it.
Starting point is 00:04:20 We've surveyed the damage from the air as well. Well, the devastation is overwhelming to date, 114 dead, hundreds of people unaccounted for it. I remember when I got the call of my first wife and daughter, I was a young senator, and I got a call in Washington. I hadn't been sworn in yet. I wasn't old enough. And I was hiring staff in the Capitol at Teddy Kennedy's office. And I got a phone call saying from my fire department and a young first responder kind of pansy. You got to come home.
Starting point is 00:04:50 There's been an accident. I said, what happened? He said, your wife, she's dead. Come home, come home. The tractor trailer had broadsided her and killed her in a car accident along with my little daughter. And I remember all the way down from Washington home wondering what a lot of people here are wondering. What about my two boys? How are they? They were in the car. I never got to read on that. Where they're going to be all right? They were badly injured. Were they going to make it? they made it. It wasn't until I walked into the emergency room that I saw they were there. The difference between knowing somebody's gone and worrying whether they're available to come
Starting point is 00:05:32 back are two different things. You know, and I remember what one of the people who helped me the most was Danny and Oway. He helped bring me back, so I know the feeling that as many of the people in this town, this community, that hollow feeling you're having your chance. like you're being sucked into a black hole wondering, will I ever get by this? You know, it's one thing to know, but it's quite another thing to have to wait to wonder whether your family member is going to be okay. Imagine being a parent wondering whether a child is and where it is. I remember, as I said, you know, press reports of grandfather's crying for lost neighbors
Starting point is 00:06:13 while trying to be strong for the ones who survived. Of a woman distributing clothing to survivors who says she didn't lose her home, but she lost her hometown. That was President Biden there, getting incredibly personal, speaking about the pain. So many in Maui are feeling tonight. That was just a portion of the president's remarks telling basically the people of Hawaii and of Maui that America stands with them and vowing to rebuild their community the way its people want. The president also touring some of the ruins left in the wake of those devastating wildfires,
Starting point is 00:06:45 as officials reveal more than 850 people are still missing after days of searching at least 114. people are confirmed dead, but that number is all but certain to rise. For more on the president's remarks and how people are reacting there, I want to get right over to Dana Griffin, who's been reporting there from the get-go. She joins us tonight from Maui. So Dana, what have you been hearing from people there in both Lahaina and all around Maui about the president's visit? Well, Tom, some have been a little concerned about the president's visit, taking away from the search and rescue effort that has been the main focus since day one. But I think a lot of people wanted to hear some of those things that he promised that the federal government
Starting point is 00:07:23 is going to be with Maui until as long as it takes. That was a promise that we heard from President Biden that the town will be rebuilt and the people of this town will have the input and they will honor the sacred traditions and the sacred ground here. I think that's something that a lot of people wanted to hear. You know, he touched on the fact that FEMA has given tens of thousands of meals, water, shelter, and that they're working on plans to make sure that they have temporary housing, more permanent housing, and also that the infrastructure is rebuilt to help get this town back to how it once was, Tom. Dana, I do want to get to some news that has happened over there.
Starting point is 00:08:01 The president's visit, obviously a big deal, but there's a much bigger headline, right? And that's that 850 people are still presumed to be missing. How is that number hitting people there? Because, you know, having been there and reported on that story right by your side and coming over here and thinking about that number, nearly a thousand people missing could potentially be dead. How are people dealing with that number? Well, Tom, I know you know this, but people are still holding out hope. They want to know what happened to their loved one. Unfortunately, we've heard from officials, including the governor,
Starting point is 00:08:33 that some of these victims will never be found. That's because this fire burned so hot, up to 2,000 degrees, the governor estimated, that it turned remains to ashes. I've actually spoken to one of the search and rescue teams with their cadaver dog trying to get a sense of how does this process work? Like, where are you finding people? And they say a lot of times they cannot tell. It's when the dog finds that pile of ash and sits that they notify officials that this could be a potential remain. We know a lot of children are among the missing and among the people that we that are feared dead at this point. That 850 number has been tough for a lot of people because that's how many people remain missing but only 85 or excuse me 85% of the burn zone has been searched so when
Starting point is 00:09:18 you think about the numbers 114 dead only 15% more to go people are are holding out hope but it's turning very grim and it's just a very tough thing for people because they want that closure and tom unlike and unfortunately some of them may not get it yeah we're going to speak to a doctor who's actually on that forensics team there in hawaii trying to identify these remains and also locate some of these family members. It is a very, very grim assignment. Before you go, I do want to acknowledge some new reporting that's been out there and sort of an admission from the governor saying that he had wished and hoped the sirens
Starting point is 00:09:53 had been used. That is something that is very new. Yeah, he said those comments over the weekend pretty much, you know, addressing the fact that the recent head of the emergency management agency resigned and had stood by his decision not to sound them. And the governor is saying no, that decision is not what he would have wanted. And I think that he's also
Starting point is 00:10:16 hearing from a lot of people who say, you should have sounded those alarms. We've spoken to so many people who say, look, we're not stupid. If you would have sounded those alarms, we would not have run toward the flames, as Indiah had pretty much alluded to, saying that people would have gone toward the hills. They said that would have alerted
Starting point is 00:10:32 people enough to get outside of their homes and to likely evacuate wait. And as we know, the flames came in so quickly. People had seconds or minutes to either flee or to jump into the ocean. And we might have more people who were found if that were the case alive. Tom. Dana Griffin for us tonight, Dana, we appreciate all your reporting from Maui. For more on the search for the hundreds of people still missing there, I want to bring in Dr. Robert Mann, a forensic anthropologist and the professor of medicine at the University of Hawaii. He's been assisting with the search efforts in Lahaina and is joining us tonight from a lab.
Starting point is 00:11:06 in Oahu, where he is working on DNA identification for some of those victims. Dr. Mann, I know this is an incredibly busy time for you, so thank you for taking the time to speak with us just a few minutes so we can understand and help our viewers understand your process there. So Dana alluded to how difficult this is. If you can sort of walk us through the process, because when you think about 850 potential victims, it's such a big number, and we know they've searched 85% of the burn zone. So explain to me how those two numbers either add up or they don't.
Starting point is 00:11:36 Well, good afternoon. Good evening. Again, I'm Dr. Bob Mann from University of Hawaii. I am a forensic antipologist, and I've done several mass disasters and mass fatalities over the years. The process of finding, of locating, recovering, and identifying victims of these mass disasters is just incredibly difficult. There are a million different variables that go into this. There are so many environmental factors. There are, there are so many environmental factors. There are, there's so many things that can help us to do these recoveries and to have a successful recovery and successful identification. And there's things that thwart us that make it much more difficult. With this, what we've got, of course, is a relatively contained area when we talk about would we ever find all of the individuals. This is not as though we're trying to find people that are lost somewhere in the state. These are people who are unaccounted for in a specific area where we've got some boundaries. And so going out and trying to find the remains, searching for the remains, when we go to the scene and we're expecting to find individuals,
Starting point is 00:12:43 we are not really certain what the condition of those of the bodies of the remains are going to be in. So what we think about we're going to find there may not at all be what we are going to encounter. So the condition of the remains, how complete the remains are, how badly burned they might be, how fragmented they may be, those are all factors to go into what kind of methods are we going to use to identify the individuals? So we're going to use fingerprints? Yes, go ahead. No, I was going to ask you, but are there cases, at least in Lahaina, that you're finding where a dog is, it sits, it's found something, but there is nothing you can use to identify those remains? I have not encountered that myself, but we have to remember now I've not gone
Starting point is 00:13:28 to the scene. I've been in the morgue the whole time at the Maui police forensic facility. And so I'm working side by side with the forensic pathologist and radiologist, the dentist, the photographers, DNA specialists. And we're exactly, actually examining the individuals. And we're trying to figure out who these people are, who is each one of them, how many people represented by those remains, and what methods are we going to be able to employ to identify them. So if there is skin, if there are fingerprints, fingerprints is what's going to go first. And that's what we're going to utilize. Then we'll go to dental.
Starting point is 00:14:02 Then we may go to DNA. We may have to go to an implant in the body or a broken bone. So there's a lot of different methods and techniques that we can use to identify individuals. And the DNA is a tremendous asset in all of this. Again, in 1992, we weren't really using, in 1990, we weren't able to identify anybody with DNA. 1992 and 93, we're able to identify people from DNA, from bones and teeth. And now we have the increased technology, where they're using rapid DNA, and they're able to get DNA out of charred remains, which is a remarkable accomplishment and a remarkable technology. Dr. Mann, how do we understand the figures, though, right? I was there for a week last week. It's devastating. And I commend your work because I can't even imagine what you guys are going through. But if we say that more than 85% of the burn zone has been searched, we know that there's about 114 victims.
Starting point is 00:14:57 so far that have been identified, but there's 850 still missing. Obviously, we can't assume the 850 are in that 15% that has not been searched. What happens there? Well, that's true. We can't assume that. Well, I mean, again, there's so many variables. How many people have moved out of the area? How many, you know, got on a bus and went somewhere?
Starting point is 00:15:19 I mean, those are the variables as a scientist, as an anthropologist. I don't have that information. I could only speculate, and speculation is not a good. thing. I've got a feeling what, typically what happens is you can go through a search area. And if you don't move everything out of an area, there could be an individual underneath that piece of metal underneath that vehicle. So we're surprised sometimes where individuals turn up, where they are found when we don't expect them to be there. And my guess in all of this is, and I think what the teams are doing is they've gone through and they've done a
Starting point is 00:15:52 first good search, sometimes preliminary search, and then you've got teams that are going to follow up and they're going to do a second search and they're going to do a third search. And with each of those searches, my gut feeling is we are going to find more individuals. Just because we've gone through 85% or 95% of an area, it doesn't mean that they, the responders, are not going to go back and research some of those areas. I think you absolutely have to. But that's going to come with a case-by-case basis. You know, Dr. Mann, the chief of police has said they're not going to do this fast.
Starting point is 00:16:23 They're going to do this right. What's your message to all those relatives out there, all the people who, Maui who are searching for answers right now. Can you tell them just how hard your team is working and how many hours you guys are putting into this? It is extremely difficult. I mean, I've worked with the military lab for 23 years. I worked this Smithsonian. I've worked some really difficult field cases and laboratory cases. It is arduous. It's, you know, you're leaning up against the wall just going, let me catch my breath. People are just, they'll catch a breath together. And then, you know, five seconds later, it's like, we've got to go back, and so we continue on. It is extremely
Starting point is 00:17:01 difficult. There is no training that I know of in the world that prepares you for this mentally, you know, the physical part you can do. The mental part is difficult. The emotional part is very difficult. So, I mean, and I've said this before in some interviews that, you know, I'm just a person like everybody else. Okay, I'm a scientist, but I'm lucky that I can go in and I can contribute some aspect to, hopefully, to the successful recovery. and the identification of the unaccounted for. But if I were missing somebody in my family, and I have said this before, I'd want people to move heaven and earth to find my loved one
Starting point is 00:17:37 and the people of Maui expect the same. So we have families. We're human. And I mean, we've got our own family members. And I would say we're standing together in all of this. And we have to continue to do that. Patience always helps. Patience is an easy word to say.
Starting point is 00:17:52 It's not an easy thing to do. But hope is always there with us. Dr. Robert, man, we appreciate all your time. We appreciate you walking us through your very difficult assignment and everyone on that forensics team. Thank you. We do want to move on now. The two other major weather headlines we're following tonight on the West Coast.
Starting point is 00:18:10 Tonight, dangerous floods and an earthquake and now out-of-control wildfires taking hold. The remnants of Hurricane Hillary triggering a mudslide in the mountains of San Bernardino. You see it here outside of Los Angeles. Firefighters there in much of the town cut off as roads remain closed. log with debris. And as rain poured from the skies beneath the surface, a 5.1 magnitude earthquake, you see the rattling there in South California on Sunday, Southern California, to the north multiple wildfires triggering emergency evacuations in Washington and Oregon, the road fire,
Starting point is 00:18:41 which you see here already burning more than 100,000 acres. Jesse Kirsch will have much more on that in a moment. But first, NBC's Aaron McLaughlin reports from San Bernardino County. Tonight, across the southwest, they're doing their best with the destruction, tropical storm Hillary left behind. In San Bernardino National Forest, panic and devastation. A massive mudslide barreling down the highway Sunday evening. Firefighters stranded the debris narrowly missing resident Vicki Jelly Ross's house. The mud is all the way across and all the way down the street. What did it sound like? Force and thunder. I didn't know if it was going to come over the top of this hill or into the house. Now the race is on to clear the road and
Starting point is 00:19:25 Free a town trapped by the mud. Residents say the mountain just gave way and came pouring down this road. What's left about six feet of mud. You can see just this is like quick sand. And officials say that until this is clear, an entire town is cut off. Across the southwest, officials assess the damage. In the Mojave Desert, an 18-wheeler up to its windows in mud. With rainfall records set across the region, Palm Springs narrowly avoiding disaster.
Starting point is 00:19:54 after the 911 emergency lines temporarily went down as 50% of their average annual rainfall fell in only six hours. Entire neighborhoods blanketed in sludge. Residents evacuated by bulldozers. The 10 being washed out both directions, that's not a good sign. In Mexico, water rushed the roads. While Los Angeles avoided the worst of the storm, the rapid rain did leave firefighters pulling this car from the L.A. River. Elsewhere, others looked on in disbelief. And then you come and then out of nowhere, your car's floating. Incredibly, no injuries or deaths reported in the U.S.
Starting point is 00:20:30 Tonight, a sigh of relief. This could have been so much worse. Here in San Bernardino County, the water came rushing off this mountain and carved its way into this field. See all of those rocks? They weren't there before. Further up the mountain, crews are working to free homeowners from the mud. Tom? Yeah, and that highway looks completely devastated.
Starting point is 00:20:52 Okay, Aaron McLaughlin for us. And as we mentioned, the severe weather out west, not just limited to California. In Washington State tonight, firefighters are battling a series of large wildfires that have left at least two people dead and forced the evacuation of thousands and destroyed hundreds of properties. Jesse Kirsch is there for us tonight. With thousands of people under evacuation orders and dozens of homes destroyed, tonight unpredictable wildfires are testing eastern Washington state. As I turn 180, it's just from here. It's gone. Bokane, the gray fire devastating, multiple communities.
Starting point is 00:21:28 We had about a half an hour maybe to get out. Sandy Hastings and her husband fled their vacation home. When you saw this for the first time. Did it cry? Now they're staying in a red cross shelter waiting to see what's left in the rubble. You get upset thinking about all the stuff that you had of memory-wise. And before pictures of it starting out, And in the after pictures of it just being gone.
Starting point is 00:21:56 And in nearby medical lake, officials estimate roughly 100 homes are gone. In this city alone, at the peak, roughly 5,000 people ordered to evacuate. I just see a fireball up behind the white building. And my reaction was like, oh, crap, I need to make sure they're evacuating. Among those in danger, a group of roughly 50 residents who use wheelchairs. Josh Bartholomew says he and others pushed the group uphill for about a quarter mile to safety. It was scary. I needed to get people out. It was a merger. It was dire life or death because it was coming.
Starting point is 00:22:30 Tonight, authorities say hundreds of firefighters in the region are still racing to contain the fires, imploring people to follow evacuation orders. Not everyone chose to leave, and some people are going back. The problem is at any point in time, fire can flip, change, especially with wind. Officials worry winds could reignite hotspots, even in already hard hit areas like this one. but winds are also sending smoke far beyond the fire zone, and that's contributing to dangerous air quality across the northwest. Tom?
Starting point is 00:23:00 Jesse Kirsch for us. Jesse, we appreciate it for more of the severe weather we're seen across the country. I want to get right over to NBC meteorologist Bill Karens, and Bill, I know you're tracking a new threat in the tropics. What's the latest? Yeah, we're going to have a tropical storm making landfall in South Texas come tomorrow morning, roughly about 12 hours from right now. So rainbans are already approaching the coast.
Starting point is 00:23:19 The hurricane center's new forecast has it going just north of Brownsville, just north to South Padre Island, south of the Corpus Christi area here, north of Brownsville, and then it will be a big rain event. It looks like beneficial rain, though. There's been a big drought in this area, so the rain will be beneficial. The wind shouldn't cause too much damage by South Texas standards. Then we have Franklin. I don't like these storms that just sit here and linger. This is going to be a huge rainmaker over Haiti in Dominican Republic. There's 8,000-foot mountains here. This is going to be a problem for the island. And then after that, it should regenerate. Hurricane Center has it becoming a strong tropical storm to a category one
Starting point is 00:23:51 hurricane south of Bermuda. But notice, this is three days in a row, Tom. It's barely moving, sitting here over warm water. You know, Bill, we're going to talk about the heat in the continental United States, but I've got to ask you on that storm right there. What happens after Saturday? What are the models showing? Because we know that water's so warm. Yeah, well, any of these storms are over extremely warm water, obviously, if conditions are right, they can get much more intense. So this lingers for about three days. It's going to wait for something to pull it. It does look like after this point, it should drift towards the North Carolina coast. We don't know if it'll get there or not and then turn out, but that's seven days away from now.
Starting point is 00:24:22 So we'll be talking about that a lot in the upcoming days. But yes, anyone on the East Coast will pay attention to what happens with Franklin. As far as the heat goes, we set records today. Hottest heat index ever in Oklahoma today. 126 was measured. Sioux City was 122 degrees heat index. It's still at this hour feels like 117 in Kansas City. St. Louis at 113.
Starting point is 00:24:43 This is like back-to-back days. It's just brutal heat. Some of the hottest we've seen. And there's a few spots here. You know, 123, and just outside of Omaha, I mean, this has been incredible, you know, you feel bad for everyone that's just day after day time that's living through this. Oh, yeah. Okay, Bill Cairns, this is going to be a summer.
Starting point is 00:24:59 We're not going to forget it. I can guarantee you that. Okay, we turn to politics now in the battle for 2024, and GOP frontrunner, former President Trump's ongoing legal troubles in Fulton County, Georgia, Trump's bond set today for $200,000 for his election interference case. but the former president still dominating the GOP field. A new poll shows him holding a commanding lead among potential caucus goers in Iowa.
Starting point is 00:25:24 NBC's Kristen Welker spoke with voters there. With just under five months until Iowans have their say, we came here to get a new snapshot of the Republican race. We need a person that can unite the nation. I think I can make a difference, even though it's just one vote. I think without a question of a doubt, he is going to be a Republican nominee. Former President Trump's lead in Iowa is dominant.
Starting point is 00:25:47 According to a new poll of likely Republican caucus goers, Mr. Trump is currently 23 points ahead of his nearest rival, Governor Ron DeSantis. Who are you backing for president in 2024? 100% Donald Trump. Jordan Vandermolen is one of several poll respondents we spoke with. He's a cattle farmer and father of two who says his mind is made up for former President Trump. He just is 100% supporter behind a lot of things we do in the Midwest. And while Mr. Trump has pleaded not guilty to charges in several indictments, two-thirds said they don't believe he has committed serious crimes, according to the poll,
Starting point is 00:26:22 including van der Mullen. I think it's blown way out of proportion. Rachel Murdoch, a college professor and self-described moderate, says she's disappointed with President Biden, but does not believe Mr. Trump is right for 2024. President Trump caused chaos and was self-serving in his, office. More than half of likely GOP caucus goers said their minds aren't made up, including Murdoch. If someone has a good point, I'm willing to hear other perspectives, but not if you're yelling
Starting point is 00:26:55 at me. And while the new poll showed 41 percent think the Republican Party should continue to be led by former President Trump, Whitey Stang is not one of them. Do you think former President Trump should be the leader of the Republican Party? No, not at all. Why? I don't think He's trustworthy. Stang, a father and grandfather, voted for Mr. Trump in 2016 and 2020, but says January 6th was a turning point for him. There's no doubt in my mind that he helped incite those people that he did little to stop them.
Starting point is 00:27:29 That's something Mr. Trump denies. And while Stang says his top pick right now as former U.N. Ambassador Nikki Haley, he could still change his mind. And for all their differences, these three Iowa voters agree their number one is. issue is the economy. The economy is strong, but inflation is still high, and things are not easy for a lot of people. Farm fuel is extremely higher today, almost four times higher than my bill used to be four years ago. Things are just a lot harder to make work. Kristen Welker joins us tonight from Des Moines. And Kristen, you mentioned that 41% of GOP voters
Starting point is 00:28:02 want to stand by Trump. But I guess the flip side, of course, to that argument is that 57% of Iowa GOP caucus goers potentially could be open to someone new. That is what is so fascinating about this poll, and frankly, Tom, about the conversations that I had, which is that those caucus goers who are not staunchly behind former President Trump say they are keeping an open mind. And one thing they'll be watching very closely for is the first GOP primary debate, now just two days away. Of course, we don't expect Mr. Trump to be on that stage. We expect him to have a counter-programming interview. But everyone I spoke with, those who support former President Trump and those who don't say they wish he was going to be on that stage. because they think he should be a part of this conversation,
Starting point is 00:28:45 and they think he should make his case to caucus goers and voters. And, Kristen, as you know, that caucus system, it is so unique because you can go in there wanting to vote for one person and come out, and you actually like someone else because you like the arguments made by their caucus instead. So who else do GOP caucus goers in Iowa like besides Trump? If you look at the net favorability ratings, Tom, Senator Scott does quite well. Governor Ron DeSantis is doing well also, and just taking you inside some of my conversations a little bit. I've been talking to people on both sides of the aisle, Democrats, Republicans, independents,
Starting point is 00:29:22 who all say they think Senator Scott is really gaining momentum. I've been talking to folks within the Scott campaign, and they say, look, he sees this first debate as a chance to really introduce himself to the American public. So high stakes in just two days on that debate stage, Tom. Okay, Kristen Walker, in Iowa on the campaign trail. and thank you for that, with less than five months to go until the Iowa caucuses. And the first debate, just two days away, can candidates start to pull ahead of the former president or at least catch up? I want to bring in our panel tonight. NBC News political contributor, Steve Hayes.
Starting point is 00:29:54 He's also the CEO of the dispatch. Sarah Matthew, she served as White House Deputy Press Secretary for the Trump administration, and Democratic strategist Amisha Cross. We thank you all for joining Top Story tonight. Stephen, I'm going to start with you and that question. Does this poll actually show that there is some hope for another candidate in the GOP field? Yeah, well, Tom, I think the way that you broke it down illustrates that the answer is yes. I mean, 41% when asked of likely caucus goers, said that Donald Trump should be the leader
Starting point is 00:30:21 of the Republican Party. 57%, almost 6 in 10, said it was either time to consider others or that the Republican Party should chart a new path and take a different approach. What's been fascinating is if you look at the Republican primary to this point, most of the contenders are running to win over to that 41 percent. of the non-Trump candidates, including Ron DeSantis, Vivek Ramoswamy, Tim Scott, and others who have been afraid to challenge Donald Trump head on have been running to peel off a small part of that 41 percent, rather than target a message to the 57 percent of likely Iowa caucus
Starting point is 00:30:58 goers who say that it's time for something different, time for something new. Fascinating poll result. Sarah, you know, we know that the former president is not going to do the first debate in two days, so it's going to be all these other candidates that Steve, was just mentioning there. Do you think this poll changes his calculation whatsoever? Do you think it sort of solidifies that it cements his decision that he does not want to take part in these debates? I think you're correct, yeah. I think it solidifies his decision. He sees this poll that he's dominant in it, and he doesn't feel a need to go on stage and give viewership to his opponents. Obviously, Trump is going to be a draw for viewers if he were to participate in the
Starting point is 00:31:35 debates. And I think that that's insulting to Republican voters, though. We deserve a healthy and robust and to see him defend his record against his opponents, but it appears that he's too scared to do that. But I can't say I disagree necessarily with his campaign's reasoning. I think it is smart for him to sit it out. He's kind of out of practice when it comes to debating. Obviously, he debated Joe Biden in 2020, but he really hasn't had to defend himself against a large group of folks since the 2016 election in that primary. So I think that it was a correct decision for him, but it's a shame for Republican voters. You know, I guess you could argue the debates maybe were important in 2016.
Starting point is 00:32:15 Maybe they weren't. I don't know. If you liked Trump, you probably liked them more during those debates. If you didn't, you probably didn't like him at all. But do you think this is a smart strategy for him? We saw how, you know, President Biden was able to come from behind in his race for the Democratic nomination in 2020. He did finance some of those debates and other debates they came after him. Do you think this is a smart play by Trump?
Starting point is 00:32:36 Absolutely. Trump is currently out on bail. He is someone who's been indicted in four different jurisdictions. He's someone who recognizes that he has a double-digit lead over everyone in the Republican primary. The only thing that's showing up to this debate would do is allow there to be fueled to the fire about the investigations he's currently under. He knows that he can bring the base to him, so he has agreed to sit down with Tucker Carlson, former Fox News host. Irony is that Tucker Carlson is no longer employed by Fox News because of the exact same thing that Trump is caught up in in Georgia. election fraud lies. So I think that he is utilizing what he always has, playing against the
Starting point is 00:33:14 media. He's going to a new media source. He's using social media. But in addition to that, he's able to kind of skirt his opponents because he, quite frankly, at this point, looking at his sizable lead, doesn't even consider them opponents. And this isn't exactly a new strategy. We've seen it from the top of the ticket on down to a lot of city level races as well across the country, where you may have someone who has held an office before who decides not to debate others, when they are that far ahead of them. It doesn't do him any justice to show up. Now, I do think that Republican voters, quite frankly,
Starting point is 00:33:45 many of them have already made their decision. We've seen the polling. They too are still in the bed of Trump, whether he shows up to this debate or not. So he's not really gaining or losing anything here. At best, he's just moving his conversation to a much more friendly moderator. Stephen, you know, I want to ask you about the debate
Starting point is 00:34:01 because we know former Governor Chris Christie, he's a great debater. He can definitely do some damage on that stage. He also is the least like, candidate by far in Iowa. I mean, his favorabilities were just, they just tanked in Iowa. So what does someone like Governor Ron DeSantis or Senator Tim Scott have to do at this debate to win over that more than 50% of the GOP caucus scores would be open to someone else? Yeah, look, I think if you're advising one of the other Republican would be contenders,
Starting point is 00:34:28 the argument isn't to take a sledgehammer to Donald Trump on his record, as you heard in some of the interviews that Kristen conducted. You have Iowa voters who like him or think he was a good president. They just think many of them, that it's time to move on. It's time for a different approach. I think that's the argument. And if I were Ron DeSantis, I would be making a case based on two primary arguments. One is electability and one is effectiveness. You know, Ron DeSantis could say, Donald Trump promised that he would build the wall. There's not a wall. Donald Trump promised he would rid the country of Obamacare. Obama care is still here. You could pick off a list of issues which
Starting point is 00:35:02 Donald Trump promised, over-promised, and failed to deliver. I also think there's a lot of hay to be made by pointing out that Donald Trump has hurt the Republican Party, 2018, 2020, 2020. Down ballot Republicans have struggled because they've associated themselves with Donald Trump. What works for Donald Trump in a Republican primary is poison for many Republican candidates in general elections. That's got a matter to Republican primary voters. Sarah, real quick, because we don't have a lot of time.
Starting point is 00:35:30 If he loses Iowa, former President Trump loses Iowa, you think he gets into some of these debates at some point? I don't know if I see that happening, him losing Iowa, but I do think that while he might be sitting out this first debate, I don't know if he can resist the spotlight for that long. Obviously, he has kind of a personal vendetta against Fox News, and he's teaming up with Tucker Carlson to try to counter-program this first debate. But I don't know if he necessarily wants to continue to allow his other candidates to have this airtime without him there, and knowing him, he won't be able to stay away.
Starting point is 00:36:03 So my bet would be that he might participate in future debates. Sarah, Steve, Amisha, we thank you all. I wish we had much more time, but we had to take the president's comments at the top of the broadcast. We do thank you all for joining Top Story tonight. Still ahead, a murder shocking a California community, a beloved store owner, killed by a man who police saved was angry about a pride flag she had displayed out front. Tonight, what the owner of a neighboring store saw and heard. Plus, jumping into action, look at this video,
Starting point is 00:36:29 how an Atlanta cop took out a driver doing dangerous stunts in the middle of the road, We'll show you. And a deadly Listeria outbreak reported in Washington State would officials say three people ate before falling ill. Stay with us. Top story just getting started on this Monday night. We were back down with a fatal attack in California, a beloved shop owner, fashion designer,
Starting point is 00:36:56 and a supporter of the LGBTQ community shot and killed by someone allegedly enraged over the pride, flag she was hanging in her store. Maggie Vespa has the details. We're all suffering. The whole community is. Tonight in what's being called a senseless act of violence, a California community in morning after authorities say a shop owner, designer for the stars, wife and mother, was shot and killed by someone angry about the pride flag hanging outside her store. There I had units respond to the shop fired.
Starting point is 00:37:27 San Bernardino County deputies say 66-year-old Laura Ann Carlton died Friday at her store, Magpie. near Lake Arrowhead. Investigators say the suspect had moments earlier, made several disparaging remarks about a rainbow flag that stood outside the store. Robin Liles owns nearby shops and says others in the neighborhood had noticed a man peering into store windows and ducking between cars, but she had no idea things had turned violent until a customer came running, panicked. Basically, a scream, Lori's been shot, closed your door. He might still be out there. And I said, oh, my gosh, is she okay? And she said, no, I think they're saying she's been killed.
Starting point is 00:38:11 And hearing the words is something very shocking. Authorities say the suspect fled on foot, leaving Carlton to die at the scene. Deputies found them more than a mile north of the shop. They say the suspect was armed with a handgun. Authorities writing, when deputies attempted to contact the suspect, a lethal force encounter occurred, and the suspect was pronounced deceased.
Starting point is 00:38:33 Tonight, authorities have yet to officially dub this a hate crime. California Governor Gavin Newsom calling it absolutely horrific, adding this disgusting hate has no place in California. The shop still marked by bullet holes, now surrounded by a rainbow-colored memorial. Carlton, an outspoken ally of the LGBTQ community, leaving behind a husband of 28 years and a loving, blended family that included nine children. Two of her daughters releasing a heartbreaking message on social media, remembering their mother as fearless, cool, and compassionate, always putting others first. Tributes also pouring in from celebrity customers and clients, including Jamie Lee Curtis, sex in the cities, Kristen Davis, and Frederick Sewell.
Starting point is 00:39:16 Renowned director, Paul Feig, posting, Lori Carlton was my friend. If people don't think anti-gay and trans rhetoric isn't dangerous, think again. How do you make sense of this? You can't make sense of it. It's senseless. Hate is senseless. There's no making sense of it. Senseless is absolutely right.
Starting point is 00:39:39 Maggie Vespa joins us tonight from Chicago. Maggie, really powerful interview there with that shop owner. Friends told you Lori had been harassed for her pride flag before. Do we have any idea if that was tied to this attack? We don't at this point. And actually, Tom, it's almost more troubling. Friends were telling us that she had been harassed on several occasions by several different people. over the years, saying that her flags had been torn down, they had been defaced, but every single time
Starting point is 00:40:03 they said Lori, in her friend's word, was defiant and would always replace it with a larger pride flag. A lot of the people who have spoken out, especially the celebrities who knew her and kind of that she had designed for them, tying this to experts say, a mounting wave of hate against the LGBTQ plus community. In fact, a new study out from Glad and the Anti-Defamation League tracked between June of 2022 and April of 2023, more than 350 incidents of extremist hate and violence against the LGBTQ community. Tom. That's terrible. Okay, Maggie Vespa for us,
Starting point is 00:40:39 Maggie, we appreciate your reporting on that. When we come back and update on a deadly hot air balloon crash, you may remember. Five people were killed in this when the balloon collided with power lines in New Mexico in 2021. The new report just out revealing what may have caused that crash. That's next. All right, we are back down with Top Stories News Feed, and we have an update tonight in that deadly hot air balloon crash in New Mexico.
Starting point is 00:41:09 A new NTSB report saying pilot Nicholas Moleski made several mistakes, which caused that balloon to hit power lines and crash into a busy intersection in Albuquerque in June of 2021. The report showing there was no mechanical issue with the balloon that crash killed him, and all four of his passengers. A previous report found that the pilot had drugs in his system, including cocaine, at the time of the crash. Three people are dead, and at least three others hospitalized after a Listeria outbreak was traced to a Washington restaurant.
Starting point is 00:41:38 Washington State Health Officials finding Listeria bacteria in the ice cream machine at a restaurant in Tacoma. They say the bacteria grew because the machine was not cleaned correctly. Three other people were hospitalized. And a Georgia state trooper pulling over a driver doing dangerous donuts in a crowded Atlanta, intersection. Here's the video. It shows the truck in the intersection doing burnouts. The driver trying to flee when a cop showed up. Apparently, he hits bystanders, injury at least one person,
Starting point is 00:42:05 the trooper then performing a pit maneuver to stop the truck. He gets out of his car, jumps on the hood, and pulls that suspect out, arresting him at gunpoint. Okay, we turn out of new details in a high-profile murder case. Just hours ago, a wealthy dentist was sentenced to life in prison for murdering his wife while on a big game hunting trip. Prosecutors say he tried to make it look like an accident. Valerie Castro explains. Tonight, a life sentence for Larry Rudolph, a wealthy dentist convicted of murdering his wife while on an African safari. His attorney telling NBC News in a statement, Larry is innocent. He did not murder his wife. We are looking forward to the appeal. Rudolph learning his fate today in a federal courthouse in Colorado, a year after a jury convicted him of murder and mail fraud.
Starting point is 00:42:51 bianca rudolph was shot in the heart at the end of the couple's trip to zambia on a big game hunt in 2016 we heard the gun back and a yelling voice at the time local authorities ruling her death an accident there's no proof that larry rudolph pulled the trigger but a friend telling nbc's date line the experienced hunter wouldn't have made that mistake she was way too comfortable with firearms and how to handle them how to clean them how to put them away for her to put a gun away and get shot by accident, I don't think that could ever happen. Rudolph's quick cremation of his wife's remains, as well as cashing in on nearly $5 million in life insurance benefits, got the attention of federal investigators, which federal
Starting point is 00:43:35 prosecutor said was part of a plan to set up a comfortable retirement alongside his girlfriend Lori Milliron. She was also convicted in the case charged with being an accessory to the crime and sentenced to 17 years. She has filed an appeal. He didn't confess to her. She didn't know about what he had done in Africa. She had nothing to do with any of that. She doesn't feel he, you know, was guilty of this crime and she knows she was not. During the trial, one key witness, a bartender, testifying he overheard a damning conversation between Rudolph and Milliron.
Starting point is 00:44:05 He said to Lori, I killed my effing wife for you. Rudolph testifying the comment was taken out of context, clarifying that he said, quote, they're saying, I killed my expletive wife for you, referring to investigators. It was overheard. It was during a conversation at dinner. It wasn't some torrid confession here just out of the blue, which is, I think the government wanted it to painted it to be that, but he heard what he heard, but he only heard part of it. Prosecutors say Rudolph made his wealth through a Pittsburgh area dentistry franchise business.
Starting point is 00:44:36 Now he could forfeit his fortune and potentially the rest of his life. Rudolph was given a life sentence which was mandatory under federal sentencing rules. He was also ordered to pay out more than $15 million in penalties, including forfeiting some of his properties. Tom, back to you. All right. When we come back right after this break, two U.S. service members accused in the stabbing and killing of a German national, what happened? Plus, the show of force in Niger and why a new bloody battle may be right around the corner. We'll explain. Welcome back. Time to see what's happening around the world, and we start with Global Watch.
Starting point is 00:45:17 Two U.S. service members arrested for fatal stabbing in Germany. Police say the two men who were stationed at a nearby Air Force base were visiting a fair when they got into an argument with a German national that escalated into a fight. The 28-year-old German stabbed and later died from his injuries. German and U.S. officials say both suspects had been handed over to U.S. authorities. And their shocking new video showing a deadly missile strike in the northern city of Cherneve in Ukraine. Video posted to social media and verified by NBC News shows the missile exploding behind a woman taking a photo near the town square, that strike killing seven people, including a six-year-old
Starting point is 00:45:54 girl, the mayor of the city calling out Russia saying the attack is a war crime against civilians. And a mass show of support for a military coup in Niger, thousands of demonstrators taking to the streets in the capital city after a regional block made up of West African countries said it had chosen an undisclosed day to restore democracy in the country using military force. However, the leader behind the military junta now in power warning against that, saying it has received so many civilian volunteers to defend against a possible intervention they've had to halt recruitment. Okay, coming up in the Americas, Ecuador still reeling from the assassination
Starting point is 00:46:31 of a presidential candidate, as voters head to the polls will bring you a full report on why so many are watching this election. Stay with us. All right, we're back now with the Americas in the closely watched presidential election in Ecuador. Citizens heading to the polls this weekend, just over a week after a candidate there was shot and killed in broad daylight. This critical election happening as the country faces a major uptick in both crime and gang violence. NBC's Marissa Parra reports. In Ecuador, a special election under armed guard.
Starting point is 00:47:10 Voters headed to the polls this weekend. This time, under the watchful lie of over 100,000 officers and soldiers. On every ballot, a printed reminder of the nation's most recent political violence slain presidential candidate Fernando Villavicencio still listed on the ballots for the election he died running for him. Just over a week earlier, he was shot dead outside a campaign rally. He was running for president on a platform promising to fight organized crime. His brazen murder in broad daylight, confirmation to many residents that the country's recent crime wave is spiraling out of control. We're just a
Starting point is 00:47:47 country of peace. Here, nobody never, never had a need to get to make a company, to enter to a place, to take a coffee.
Starting point is 00:47:57 Days later, another politician was fatally shot. This time, an organizer for the leading political party's Citizen Revolution, making him the third elected official killed this summer that began with the assassination
Starting point is 00:48:08 of Augustine and Triago, a mayor for the city of Manta. Security, becoming the primary issue for both voters and candidates. Just one day before the election. Shots rang out as a different presidential candidate was talking to voters over breakfast. The candidate and his family rushed out of the restaurant in Guayaquil. National police say the shooting was connected to a robbery not directed at the candidate. And on election day itself, Mia Vicencio's replacement, Christian Suita, voting with a bulletproof vest on. In the end, no candidate received.
Starting point is 00:48:43 received enough votes to be declared winner, and instead two candidates with ties to the nation's political elite are now moving to a runoff. Leading the polls in a first for a female candidate, lawyer Luisa Gonzalez, a leftist backed by fugitive ex-president Rafael Correier. Gonzalez will face off with Daniel Noboa, the son of one of Ecuador's wealthiest businessmen. With more than 23% of the vote, his second place finished surprised many, despite polling in single digits for weeks. Voters head back to the polls this October, with crime and security still top of mind. All right, Marissa Para joins us now from the Telemundo Center in Miami. And Marissa, in your report, you have those pictures of the police and the military guarding polling places.
Starting point is 00:49:37 Were there any violent disruptions or incidents of voter intimidation? Well, it's an interesting question. there were no reports of physical interference or violence, at least that we've heard of, but there was still disruption. In fact, the head of the National Electoral Council said that there was a cyber attack that actually shut down the website that people used to cast their ballots remotely, particularly in foreign countries. And so Gonzalez, who is one of those candidates who is up for that runoff coming up, is actually advocating for those who were overseas who were impacted to get a second chance to do so. But Tom, certainly in this election, there has been so much disruption
Starting point is 00:50:12 and it is still far from over. Yeah, it's such a critical time for that country. Okay, Marissa, we appreciate all your reporting on that very important story. We thank you for watching Top Story tonight. I'm Tom Yamerson, New York. Stay right there. More news on the way.

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