Top Story with Tom Llamas - Thursday, October 16, 2025

Episode Date: October 17, 2025

Tonight's Top Story has the latest breaking news, political headlines, news from overseas and the best NBC News reporting from across the country and around the world. Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See https://pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

Breaking news tonight, John Bolton indicted by a federal grand jury. The former Trump National Security Advisor turned fierce critic, now facing federal charges. Bolton charged with mishandling of classified information. The indictment after the FBI searched Bolton's home and office, and the president publicly called for his prosecution, the documents he's accused of sharing with his family, and through his AOL account. Also tonight, the second summit, President Trump announcing plans to meet with Russian leader, Vladimir Putin as he looks to end the war in Ukraine. What he said to Putin today and the key weapon Ukrainian President Zelensky

will ask for tomorrow as he meets the president face to face. The urgent rescue mission underway in Alaska hundreds airlifted days after remnants of a typhoon left people stranded. Entire village is wiped out, houses swept off their foundations. And breaking tonight, kiss guitarist Ace freely has died. The founding member of the legendary rock band suddenly passing the late statement from his family. The split-second save caught on camera.

The woman pulled to safety, wow, moments away from being hit by a tram. Plus, why are Taylor Swift fans flocking to an art museum in Germany? The answer is in her latest music video. The heated debate-taking flight to recline or not to recline on a plane. We'll tell you which airline is now charging passengers who want to lean back and relax a little more. And the surprised military shakeup, why is this? The Admiral overseen strikes against those alleged drug-running boats in the Caribbean, suddenly stepping down. Top story.

Starts right now. And good evening. We are coming on the air tonight with Breaking News. Former Trump National Security Advisor John Bolton, indicted by a federal grand jury. Bolton facing 18 counts of transmission and retention of national defense information. Prosecutors say he shared hundreds of pages of classified materials with, family members during the first Trump administration, putting them into word processing documents and sending them on non-governmental email accounts, including his AOL email account. They believe someone with ties to Iran hacked one of his email accounts after he left office gaining access

to those state secrets. This indictment comes nearly two months after Bolton's home was searched by the FBI. Tonight, Bolton said in a statement, in part, I have devoted my life to America's foreign policy and national security. I would never compromise those goals. I have have become the latest target in the weaponizing of the Justice Department to charge those President Trump deems to be his enemies with charges that were declined before or distorted the facts. Bolton was once a member of Trump's inner circle of advisors, but was fired by the president in 2019 and has since been a vocal critic.

It is worth noting that Trump himself was once accused of mishandling classified documents by special counsel, Jack Smith. He pleaded not guilty to those charges and his case was dismissed after he returned to office. Bolton now joins a growing list of Trump opponents to face an indictment. Former FBI director James Comey, New York Attorney General Letitia James, have also been charged with federal crimes. Our Laura Jared has been combing through the charging documents. She leads us off.

He once served as the national security advisor to the president, but tonight, John Bolton facing 18 counts of mishandling national defense information, indicted by a federal grand jury in Maryland. President Trump reacting tonight just as the indictment was made public. I think he's a bad guy, yeah, he's a bad guy. Bolton's feud with President Trump well documented. The former National Security Advisor publishing a scathing memoir in 2020, detailing his time in the first Trump White House, the meticulous notes he kept while working for Trump,

now at the center of tonight's indictment. Prosecutors alleging Bolton often took handwritten notes on a yellow pad, later transcribing them into word documents, and then secretly emailing two family members diary-like entries, including details about future attacks and foreign adversaries spanning over a thousand pages. Prosecutors adding that years after Bolton left office, someone believed to be associated with Iran hacked Bolton's personal email account and gained unauthorized access to the classified information. Bolton's attorney tonight saying he did not unlawfully share or story. any information, adding Bolton kept diaries, that is not a crime. For years now, Bolton and Trump have traded Barbes, with the president criticizing his handling of classified documents. Classified information, that's illegal, and you go to jail for that. Bolton has maintained the book he

published contained no classified material and a lengthy FBI probe ultimately ending during the Biden administration with no charges. But this summer, the FBI conducted searches of Bolton's home and office. Officials seen with boxes in hand, also seizing his phones and computers. He's already come after me and several others in withdrawing the protection that we had. I think it is a retribution presidency. All right, with that, Laura, Jared, joins us now. Laura, we heard the statement from John Bolton, but he's really going after President Trump tonight. He is coming out swinging tonight, Tom. He's basically making an allusion here to Joseph Stalin, talking about Trump to, obviously second Trump administration saying he embodies what

Joseph Stalin's head of secret police once said, quote, you show me the man and I'll show you the crime. Apparently suggesting that he's weaponizing the justice harm and obviously making an allusion there to the fact that he's obviously now indicted former FBI director James Comey, along with the New York Attorney General. We should note here, though, the charges are quite serious. The mishandling of classified documents here, Tom. We're talking about serious prison time, if convicted. Okay, Laura Jarrett for us. Laura, we thank you for that. Okay, we're going to move on now, but keep on top of this story. as well. For more on this, I do want to bring in our panel tonight. Tom Dupree, he's the former deputy

assistant attorney general who worked in the George Bush administration and Greg Rosen, a former prosecutor who investigated the January 6th riot at the Justice Department under President Joe Biden. I thank you both for being here tonight in top story. So Tom, I'm going to start with you. How strong of a case do you think the Justice Department has here? They lay out a lot of evidence in this indictment. They sure do. And look, this indictment is far stronger than the other two indictments that we've seen recently those against Jim Comey and Tish James. The government went the extra mile, I think, to put a lot of detail into this indictment. It is long. It is substantive. It's 26 pages. It was signed by six prosecutors as opposed to the one who signed the Comey and James indictment.

So this is a far more serious effort. And I think, frankly, a case that is supported, at least based on the indictments, supported with more evidence than we've seen in the other efforts. And then Greg, critics of President Trump and his DOJ have said the case is brought against Comey and Letitia James, two other vocal critics of Trump, were bare bones. But there's a lot more to this indictment. Do you agree with that assessment? Yeah, I do. I think the reality is that they are trying to institutionalize this indictment by way of what is typically called a speaking indictment.

And they're walking through the investigative steps that is far different than the tenor and subject matter that we've seen in the other two indictments. So, Tom, Bolton's legal team is saying there are personal diaries that the FBI has known about for years and do not unlawfully share. or store any information in them? Is that a strong case to make? Well, let's see. They really have two arguments here. The first is they basically said, look, this is old news. These are charges and allegations that the Justice Department looked at years ago and declined to prosecute at the time. Why revisit it? The second argument they're making seems to be that, look, this just wasn't unlawful. I think that neither argument is going to carry the day automatically. I think that what Bolton is going to need to show

is simply that this information was not classified, that he didn't act with the requisite mental state to commit a crime, or that they simply weren't unlawfully transmitted or retained. So I think he is going to have to do more than simply say, these are charges that the prior administration looked at and passed on. He's going to need to engage the merits and rebut these allegations. I think, Greg, we've seen several high-profile classified docs probes in recent years, first involving President Trump.

Those charges were eventually dropped. President Biden was investigated, but never. ultimately charged. The U.S. attorney seeming to feel sorry for President Biden when he talked to them. Is this case going to be any different? So, yes, I think it is going to be indifferent. I mean, look, we have an indictment here. The indictment, four quarters of the indictment lay out probable cause with respect to the unlawful transmission and classified and the retention of classified information. Obviously, as the national security advisor within the First Trump administration, there's going to be a lot. And in fact, you saw that in the indictment, a lot about the knowledge

of the individual with respect to whether or not that knowledge will translate into willfulness, the mens rea that Tom was talking about. With respect to former President Biden, you know, the factual scenario there was quite different. There was a voluntary disclosure, as well as extensive cooperation between then the White House, as well as the various agencies involved. And then obviously, as you know, there was President Trump's prior indictment, which was disbursed, which does have very significant similarities between the two. Yeah.

Okay. What options does Bolton have here, moving forward to both of you? Well, one thing he could do is take a quick strike and try to knock the indictment out entirely on some threshold ground, such as this is a vindictive or a selective prosecution. I wouldn't be too optimistic. Those types of defenses are notoriously difficult to win on, so I'm not sure that would carry the day. But look, if I were Bolton's lawyers, I think I would try to find some way to get this indictment

knocked out at the early stage before you ever get close to a jury. Greg? I agree. I think selective prosecution is obviously a high hurdle. The other aspect to this is there's obviously going to be classified information procedures act processes, so what they call CEPA litigation that's going to accompany this. Because whenever you deal with a classified information case, you have to protect the equities of the classified information. And so the reality is that this is going to be a highly technical, highly complex trial.

And so if I were Bolton's team, I'm going to be diving deep into those classified issues, whether they were classified. And importantly, whether or not the Federal Bureau of Investigation had reason to believe that that material existed, for example, during the pre-publication review process when he was going through his book signing and book writing process. All right, Greg Rose and Tom Dupree, we thank you so much for joining Top Story tonight. Now that President Trump's major announcement that he will hold the second summit with Russian leader Vladimir Putin. Trump, of course, also set to meet Ukrainian president Vladimir Zelensky tomorrow as he looks to end this war. NBC's Peter Alexander reports from the White House tonight. Tonight, after securing that historic but fragile peace deal between Israel and Hamas that freed the last remaining hostages, President Trump is turning to the Russia-Ukraine war that shows no sign of ending.

I thought it was a very good phone call. I thought very productive. Today, a two-hour call with Russian President Vladimir Putin. The president announcing that second meeting between the two in Budapest, Hungary, no date has been set. It follows their face-to-face in Alaska that made no progress toward ending the fighting and fueled President Trump's public frustration with Putin. I thought this would have been an easy one to settle. All of it a day before President Trump hosts Ukraine's president Volodymyr Zelensky. Zelensky has been pressing the president to approve the sale of U.S. Tomahawk missiles that would allow

Ukraine to strike deeper into Russian territory. But tonight, no commitment from President Trump. You know, we need tomahawks for the United States of America, too. We have a lot of them, but we need them. I mean, we can't deplete for our country. So I don't know what we can do about that. And a new warning from the president about his Mideast peace deal, responding to those disturbing videos showing Hamas conducting public executions. President Trump posting, if Hamas continues to kill people in Gaza, which was not the deal, we will have no choice but to go in and kill them. While again saying U.S. troops would not be involved in a fight against Hamas. They also said they're going to behave. We're going to find out

if they behave. If they behave good, if they don't behave, we'll take care of it. Peter Alexander joins us tonight from the White House. Peter, I want to ask you about another major headline from the president tonight on a new deal involving fertility treatments? Yeah, that's right, Tom. President Trump said the cost of drugs for IVF in vitro fertilization will decrease, in his words, dramatically announcing that his administration has now negotiated lower prices with the maker of several key fertility drugs, one in particular that's important to the process. Without the discount, as it exists right now, each IVF cycle can cost tens of thousands of dollars. Many women, many families, need to be.

to go through multiple cycles to have any successful presidents, to have a successful pregnancy. And to be very clear here, though the president had promised it during the course of the campaign, insurers will not be mandated to pay for IVF. Tom, back to you. Okay. Peter Alexander, we thank you for that. We're also following breaking news tonight from the Pentagon in a surprise move the head of the U.S. military in Central and South America, suddenly retiring. Admiral Alvin Halsey announcing today he will step down from the role in December. Holsey is the admiral that has been overseen U.S. strikes on the alleged drugboats near Venezuela. I want to get right to NBC News National Security correspondent Courtney Kuby. Courtney, this move was

a bit unexpected. Walk us through what we know at this hour. Yeah, absolutely unexpected. He's been in the job about 11 months, so less than one year. Generally, combatant commanders like this serve for at least three years in these sorts of positions. So definitely a surprise, announcing it on social media today, but not giving a reason for why he announced his retirement. He says he'll step down in December officially. As you mentioned, Tom, the U.S. since he has been in this job in just recent weeks, has taken strikes against at least five boats that the U.S. claims are carrying drugs and cartel members killing, according to the Trump administration, 27 people. But it's causing a lot of consternation, particularly on

Capitol Hill, including from Republicans who question whether in fact these sorts of strikes are or whether the individuals on board are due their due process, as is U.S. law, Tom. Yeah, and then it's important to know the timing of the resignation, right? Just yesterday, the president revealed he had authorized CIA operations in Venezuela. We've gone over this, right? Threatening to strike on land as well. But we don't know really the calculation that led to this stepping down this retirement. Exactly.

What we do know is exactly what you said. The president has made it clear, as have people close to President Trump, that there is no sign that they are stopping with this aggressive military action against these cartels in Venezuela. And in fact, it seems as if they are escalating. As you mentioned, the president making it clear that he is open to strikes on the land, not just at sea. You can see there with the video on screen. Those are in international waters.

The president's saying that they may strike on land in Venezuela is definitely an escalation of the situation. And then that stunning announcement yesterday where he said that the U.S. had authorized, he had authorized covert CIA action inside Venezuela. perspective. We generally don't hear about those sorts of operations until years, even decades after they've occurred, Tom. All right, Courtney, Cuby from us. Courtney, thank you. And now to the urgent rescue mission in Alaska. Hundreds airlifted after remnants of a powerful typhoon wiped out villages, homes swept off their foundations. And tonight, one of the state's largest

airlift operations ever is underway. Here's Liz Croix with the effort to get people out. Tonight, one of the largest airlifts in Alaska history, hundreds of people packing into millions. military planes and helicopters to be flown 500 miles to safety after a massive storm hammered the state, leaving people trapped in several low-lying villages along Alaska's West Coast. A lot of mists right here that washed all the way up. Remnants from a typhoon triggered widespread destruction. According to state police, a 67-year-old woman was killed and two of her family members are missing. She was the kindest person. She opened her doors to people. people rescued. Some communities like the village of Kipnuk nearly wiped out after water levels

rose more than six feet above normal high tide. Here you can see one of the many homes that was swept away. A lot of houses were taken off their foundations. A lot of houses are floating, floating down the river with people in them. Unable to return home as many as 2,000 displaced residents overwhelming makeshift shelters in the remote communities, prompting an urgent evacuation. The National Guard airlifting evacuees to Anchorage where the city has set up a large shelter. at the Alaska Airline Center. We're anticipating upwards of 1,400 people, I think, is the number. This is traumatic.

Folks are coming in here with just clothes on their back in some cases. Liz, Croix, joins us tonight live here in Top Story. So, Liz, how long are these evacuations expected to go on for? Well, Tom, the Red Cross says that these evacuations trying to get these folks from these villages to Anchorage could go on for several more days. These are really remote areas we're talking about. Some of these villages can only be reached by air. or by water. And officials say the destruction is so bad that it is unclear when many of these people

are going to be able to return to their homes. Officials are calling this a prolonged relief operation and they say it could last for months, Tom. All right, Liz Kreutz for us, let's thank you. Next tonight to some warning signs on Wall Street, months of record gains in the AI sector, fueling fears we could be in an artificial intelligence bubble. Analyst drawing comparisons to the first internet bubble burst, bust of 2001, or worse, the housing crisis of 2008. One of the major voices waning on this Jared Bernstein. He joins me now. He's the former chair of President Biden's Council of Economic Advisors. Jared, thanks so much for being here tonight. You co-authored an op-ed for the New York Times titled, Warning. Our stock market is

looking like a bubble. And in it, you write, while investors are always making bets on an unknown future, bubbles form when large swaths of investors continuously pour ever more into assets with seemingly little regard for how much it could earn and when. A.I. Investment fits that pattern. What about this current market makes you think we're in a bubble and what concerns you the most? I think it's precisely the kinds of issues you just mentioned. You know, when the level of investment in a particular asset, whether it's housing, the internet, tulips back in 1600, railroads in the 1870s, and now AI, when it becomes detached from the amount of returns or profits that that asset could plausibly generate for investors,

within a reasonable time frame, that's when you start to worry about bubbles. And if we look at these valuations and if we look at the revenues of some of these companies, we begin to see the kinds of dynamics that have characterized some past bubbles. Yeah, but isn't this different from, say, the dot-com bubble, right? Because everyone always points to pets.com, right? And they weren't making any money, and everyone was investing in them. And it was like, what is going on there? I mean, that, to me, is a classic bubble.

With chat, GPT, yeah, they want to treat. That's what they want to raise, but aren't they also making money? Well, that's really an interesting point because we had that in our piece where we mentioned that chat cheap, GBT intends to raise and invest a trillion dollars this year, and their revenues are 13 billion. So that's a thousand billion or a trillion against 13 billion in revenue. So that's very much the type of gap I was talking about. However, a key word here, we both talked about it, is this issue of when, when do the

these returns come to pass. No rational investor expects to get a payout from AI, a potentially transformational investment in one year. So that's why timing is also a key factor here. I want to play some of Secretary of the Treasury, Besant Sound. Here's what he had to say. Let's listen. I think we are, could we be in the third inning? So I think this is just taking off. The inning of investment in AI? Oh, sure, sure. Jared, what do you say to that? You think he's too early?

You think he's late? One of the challenges we face in this context is we never know what inning we're in until the game's over. We could be in the third inning. We could be in late innings. I happen to think that he's probably closer to where things are. And what we tried to do in our article is not say this is an imminent bubble that's about to burst. we actually draw some pretty important distinctions between this one and the housing bubble.

We think that one was infinitely more damaging because its impact on credit markets. What we're trying to do is point out these valuations and just how large they are relative to expected returns. Now, you know, there's a quote in our piece from a Microsoft executive saying something like, I hope it doesn't take 50 years. And what she means by that

is that if these returns take too long to show up in investors' portfolios, they could start to worry that these lofty valuations are too risky. And that's the sort of thing we're worrying about. You know what really concerned me in your piece that stood out to me the most? It was a great op-ed. But what really stood out to me and what I talked to our team about was this point about spending, right? The middle-class spending is flat, but for the wealthy, it's up 17 percent

because you sort of wonder and think about inflation and, you know, anecdotally, you go around, you're like, you ask yourself, why are things still so expensive? And I wanted to ask you, you sort of add that little nugget in the piece. but to me, I think it tells a bigger story. What can we draw from that data? Well, thanks, Tom. I think that that part of the piece is intended to be kind of a value add from this is it or isn't it a bubble kind of argument.

The facts on the ground are, as you just said, middle income, low-income consumers, according to the data that we have, their spending is pretty flat. While those at the top, and they're the folks who mostly benefit from the wealth effect, from an appreciating stock market, they're the ones who are spending most aggressively. Therefore, if we're right and a bubble should burst, we're going to see a pullback in spending from the very folks who are spending the most.

And that makes us worried about the impact on the real economy, on jobs, on wages, on incomes. And in fact, it is this channel of a wealth effect that led to a recession after the internet bubble burst and, of course, after the housing bubble burst. And that's why it's so important to track these bubbles because if they burst, everyone is affected. All right, Jared, it's so great to have you here.

Thanks for being on today. And breaking news out of the music world tonight, some sad news. Legendary Kiss lead guitarist Ace Freely has died. Freely co-founded the rock band known for its wild costumes and makeup back in 1973. His family confirming his death to NBC News, saying they are completely devastated and heartbroken. He was reportedly hospitalized for several weeks before passing late today. Freely was 74 years old. Okay.

We are back in a moment with the team. arrested for allegedly faking his own abduction and shooting himself in the leg, how police say they uncovered the hoax. Plus, why a judge just ordered federal agents in Chicago to wear body cams. And in our top moment tonight, how Pope Leo didn't miss a chance to troll some sports fans over a little hometown rivalry. Stay with us. Okay, we're back down with a stunning twist in a case out of Florida, a teenager arrested for allegedly staging his own abduction, texting his mother he had been shot and taken by four men. Deputies tonight calling the story completely made up. NBC's George Solis has this one.

This Florida team arrested and tonight facing charges after police say he shot himself in the leg and faked his own abduction. The initial details that K.S. texted to his family were proven to be false. Completely made up. The 17-year-old from Marion County attempted the elaborate hoax in September. A massive search launch and a statewide Amber Alert issued. After he allegedly texted his mother, I need help, being shot at, four Hispanics armed. White van, one driver, I'm hit after an overwhelming number of tips. There was a boy, a young man, I believe to be the guy they're looking for was getting something out of the back of his truck, like shoving it into a book bag. Crime scene technicians found his truck, but the teen was nowhere to be found.

Police say they observed a bullet hole through the windshield of his vehicle, suspected blood, a severely damaged cell phone, drag marks in the dirt, and bicycle tracks leading away from his truck. Police also say that teen had just come from a Walmart less than four miles away, according to GPS data. Purchased a bicycle, a sleeping tent, a sleeping bag, and I believe he has a backpack with him, wearing jeans and a t-shirt. With the search ongoing, this stunning update. All right. Thank you. All right, so update now. This is just coming in. We are with him right now, and he is in good health. Police finding the teen under 24 hours after he was first reported

missing, his tail quickly unraveling. Authorities saying one part of his story was not a lie. To continue the ruse, who had a handgun with him since the beginning of all of this, chose to shoot himself in the leg, causing a non-life-threatening injury. According to police, the teen also fired the shot through the windshield, splattered a mixture of blood in the truck, and destroyed his cell phone. And according to his arrest report, investigators found searches for info on blood removal at Mexican cartels on his laptop. His parents refused to allow my detectives to speak with him so that we could come to a true final conclusion in all this.

We reached out to his attorney and his parents and have not heard back. All right, George Relese joins us tonight from Miami. George, how do police say a teenager stayed such an elaborate crime scene? Yeah, hey, Tom, and we should note that we are not identifying him because he is a minor. But authorities say outside of the crime scene, they found a gatorade bottle containing blood. Now, they're saying that blood matched the teen's blood there, and they believe that he used that bottle to put blood inside of his truck and on the ground there. Tonight, the state's attorney telling us that he's being held in.

and a secure detention until his court date next week. All right, bizarre story. George, thank you. Still ahead on Top Story tonight, The Rise in Robo Calls, while you're probably getting hit with more spam and what you can do about it. And a carjacking in Florida taking an unexpected turn, what this suspect found in the backseat

that made him think twice. But first, Top Story's top moment and this one involving Pope Leo, the pride of Chicago and noted White Sox fan. The Pontiff was waving to a crowd at the Vatican when a fan of the cross-town rival Chicago Cub, shout it out to him. He had this playful response. There you go. You heard him there. That, of course, a lighthearted joke about the Cubs

getting eliminated from the postseason. Stay with us. More news on the way. We're back now with power and politics in the race for New York City Mayor. My front-runner Democrat nominee, Zorham Mamdani, will participate in the first mayoral debate with his opponent's former New York Governor Andrew Cuomel running as an independent and Republican Curtis Lewa. This is coming on the heels of Mondami's interview on Fox News when he was asked whether Hamas should disarm. Take a listen. I don't really have opinions about the future of Hamas and Israel beyond the question of justice and safety and the fact that anything has to abide by international law.

And that applies to Hamas, that applies to the Israeli military, applies to anyone you could ask me about. All right, Mandami has been outspoken on the war in Gaza and will certainly be pressed on the issue tonight. A strong show of support for the frontrunner who marched from Trump Tower to 30 Rock ahead of tonight's debate. Look at that support there. I want to bring in NBC Sam Brock more. Sam's been covering him like a madman. Sam, I do want to ask you. I mean, you say you have some breaking news.

He was just asked about the same question. Ten minutes ago, Zaran Mamdani was just asked, what is your position on Hamas? Should they lay down arms? He said, of course they should lay down arms. The reality, though, Tom, is that he was asked the same question. last night as well. And he did not say that in that Fox News interview. It did generate a lot of headlines. Let's put a pin in that for a second. The first thing that he said at the beginning of this debate, when they were asked, the candidates were asked, what's your headline a year from now?

He said, Mamdani continues to take on Trump and deliver on affordability. Affordability has been basically the lynchpin of his entire campaign. It resonates with New Yorkers, and frankly, it resonates with people outside of this hyper-expensive city as well, right? So it's prompted the question is the sort of populism and the roots of that that he's developed here. exportable to other cities based on what he's doing. But with respect to the Israel-Hamas conflict, there is no question beyond affordability that that is one of the pivotal points of this campaign.

And so New York City has the largest Jewish population anywhere in the world outside of Israel. And I want to point something out to you because we just sort of laid out what he said with respect to Hamas. Quinnipiac just did a poll after Eric Adams left the race to see how people feel about the candidates and what their positions are specifically on the conflict.

The question was, of how they intend to vote, who they think has views closest to their own on the Israel Hamas conflict? Mamdani, 41 percent Cuomo, who has been virtually unconditionally supportive of Israel, 26 percent, Sliwa, 13 percent. What does that tell you? It tells you that this democratic orthodoxy that for years has been pretty much full-throated support for Israel has shifted, especially among younger voters. And with respect to Mamdani, he has made a real point, obviously, of being very critical of the Israeli government. I'm going to give you that we've seen in Gaza, but also has said,

vehemently that there is no place for anti-Semitism. He's tried to build bridges with orthodox rabbis and leaders in the New York City area. So this is an ongoing conversation. It's obviously very important to New Yorkers across the board, but that's where things stand. Going to give you a little pushback here. Number one, the Quinnipiac poll was done before the comments were made, correct? Yes, it was done. And then he's clearly having a mulligan. He said something last night. Now he's saying something today that's completely different. Let me be very clear. Hamas is a terrorist organization whose explicit purpose is to eliminate the state of Israel and to kill as many Jews as possible. So there is no question

that when he was asked specifically on Fox News, should Hamas lay down arms and he refused to respond to it, it generated a lot of headlines. It was very surprising for many. And it wasn't a mistake because he was sort of, there was a follow-up. It was like, it was clearly, it was clear what he was doing. Let's move on, though. You've been out there tonight ahead of the debate. You've been talking to New Yorkers, getting the pulse of the people around here, at least in Manhattan. What are you hearing? I think what's important to point out, a lot of people like Mom Doni's ideas, which is to say that if you could tell someone they would have free transportation, universal child care, which, by the way, is a $6 billion plus cost estimate,

they would love to do that. They just want to know how is it feasible. And what Momdani has laid out is a raise on taxes for millionaires and a corporate race tax that would be raised to what it is in New Jersey. So that's sort of his plan. People are wondering, how are you going to get that done? It would require state approval. So Kathy Hokel and the New York State Assembly would have to sign off on any sort of significant revenue generation. That's really where the rubber meets the road, because a lot of folks feel like these are fantastic ideas to make things more affordable for everyday New Yorkers. But how exactly are you going to do it? Before I go, I do want to ask you this. So, but the name recognition, everyone knows who he is.

It wasn't like, hey, who's this guy. I'll tell you what, everybody knows who he is. Yeah. And everybody knows who Cuomo is. The issue in this race is not recognition. But that says a lot about him, though, because Cuomo was a governor. I mean, that says a lot about him, you know? It is one of the untold parts of this. Mamdani, no one knew who he was a year ago. He is a rock star in political circles and a highly polarizing figure, and it's only a year later. Sam Brock, a rock star in news circles. So good to see here. Sometimes. Always good. You can watch the

full mayoral debate right here on NBC News Now starting at 9 p.m. tonight. It's going to be good. Watch it right here on News Now, the top stories, news feed, starting with the judge ordering federal immigration officers in Chicago to wear body cams. The U.S. District Judge says she was, quote, a little startled after seeing recent clashes involving tear gas and

other tactics in the city. No word on if the Department of Homeland Security will appeal this ruling. Chicago is the latest city targeted in the Trump administration's immigration crackdown. And tonight, we're learning the death of beloved actress Diane Keaton. The reason a death certificate says Keaton died of bacterial pneumonia. The Oscar award winning actress was known for her rules in Annie Hall, the Godfather, and Reds, among numerous other films, tributes continue to pour in. She was 79 years old. And a Florida man stealing a woman's car at a gas station only to return it seconds later, and here's why. So he looks both ways before Bolton.

to the running car and speeding off in it, but not for long. He noticed a baby in the back of the car and immediately threw it in reverse. Here's mom running to confront him. The man reportedly said he wouldn't have stolen the car if he knew there was a baby inside. How about just don't steal cars? He's now facing charges of grand theft and kidnapping. And California taking a shot at selling affordable insulin. The governor announcing the state will begin to sell the drug under its own label in January.

The pen will cost $11 for a single and up to $55 for a $5 for affordable. five-pack. A single pen can typically cost well north of 100 bucks. It comes three years after Governor Gavin Newsom just announced partnerships to sell the state-branded generic drugs at lower prices. Okay, time now for the cost of denial our series on the challenges Americans face with their insurance companies. Tonight, the viewer who saw one of our previous reports so similar to his case that he reached out to our team, Ann Thompson with his battle and the care he finally got after we investigated. Bernie and Diane Hoffman are avid high. In years past, walking Spain's Camino de Santiago.

123 miles. So no back pain on the commo. No back pain. Pain free in Italy and Ireland, too. Now the 68-year-old grandfather in Wichita, Kansas, can't walk more than 10 yards. How fast did this back pain come on? I used the term it went from zero to holy crap.

Since December, adapting nearly every activity to live with pain that's literally turned him upside down in search of real life. in search of relief. I've got shooting pain. I've got burning pain. I've lost feeling in about half my foot. Even going so far as getting a human dog bed. When you're in this position, are you in pain?

Yes, but it's minimal. His doctor says he needs spinal reconstruction. This is the vertebrae that is moved. To fuse vertebrae and take pressure off nerves. His insurer, Aetna, said no. Good boy. had dates penciled in in early May for the surgery, then we get the decline for the procedure. They declined it in part because you hadn't had physical therapy.

Correct, to which my doctor said, we can't physical therapy or back into, you know, position. Bernie did it anyway, but the surgery was denied again. It's so hard to watch someone you love go through something like that and think, okay, we can fix this, though, and then not be allowed to get that done. The physician says, well, we'll appeal, right? So there is an appeal process. An appeal, Bernie says, didn't seem to be going anywhere. Then he turned on the news.

One family struggled to get coverage for the surgery needed by a young... So we see the story, the cost of denial, right? And it's about a woman who has severe back pain, who's had multiple denials from the same insurance company. and we look at each other like, that's us, right? And like that story, within 24 hours of NBC News reaching out, Bernie learned this. I get an email from Aetna saying, we've approved your procedure. So I don't think that was a coincidence. Etna tells NBC News that Bernie's doctor had two opportunities to engage with its medical team and declined to do so.

After NBC News contacted Aetna, the company. Bernie says it proactively contacted Bernie's physician for documentation that had not been previously provided. They now say they plan to cover the spinal surgery. There we go. Bernie disputes that the information was not provided when Etna requested it, and his doctor declined to talk to us. Now Bernie looks forward to the day he can pick up his grandchildren again. What has this denial cost you? Well, if I get the surgery on the 21st of October, which is the schedule. By the time I recover, I will have lost an entire year of normal life. Time, he will never get back. Ann Thompson, NBC News, Wichita, Kansas.

All right, now to a frustrating at times dangerous trend that nearly every American experiences, those annoying robocalls and texts, it feels like you're getting more than ever. You're getting them more than ever. New data shows you're not alone. Here's Tom Costello. Nearly everyone with a cell phone gets them. I'm calling in reference to your federal student loans. This message is from the loan department. It's imperative that I speak with you as soon as possible before this pre-approval expires.

Spam and scams. Ked you not every day all day, I keep getting spam calls. Consumer watchdog Perg says spam robocalls are up 20% to a six-year high. These calls come from multiple different areas. all throughout the country, and they're non-stop. 420 million more calls each month as criminals use AI to trick their victims. And they only need just a teeny tiny percentage of them to work, and all of a sudden they've got thousands of dollars that they didn't have a couple of minutes before.

Most people hang up, but the average victim loses almost $3,700. Researchers say fewer than half the phone companies have installed the FCC-required caller, ID, or filters to block the calls. The U.S. Telecom industry tells NBC News, robocalls have actually been declining, and phone companies have rolled out blocking and labeling tools for their customers to successfully trace these malicious scammers and fraudsters to their source and work with law enforcement to shut them down. The expert advice don't answer any call or text from a number you don't recognize. Delete and report them on your cell phone and never provide personal information

or your credit card info to cold collars. Tom? Okay, Tom Costello, we thank you. Coming up, a close call on the tracks. Look at this, a woman rescued at the last second after stepping in front of a tram. Plus a museum in Germany getting a big boost in visitors. Can you tell why? Well, thanks to the fate of Ophelia

and a little swiftly star power. We'll explain. Now at Top Stories, Global Watch, starting with the political crisis in France. The country's prime minister surviving two no-confidence votes today. Lawmakers rejected the motions after Sebastian Le Corneux offered to slow the roll out of a pension law which raises the retirement age. The move prevents another government collapse, but it also sets the stage for what could be an even tougher fight over the national budget. And another massive fire ripping the through a garment factory in Bangladesh, emergency crews battling the flames for more than four

hours today. No word yet on what sparked that fire. Officials say it's unclear how many people were inside the building or if anyone was heard. This comes just days after at least 16 people died in a separate fire at a factory and warehouse in the country's capital. Okay, moving on in Turkey, a terrifying close call caught on camera. Take a look. A woman wearing headphones seconds away from being hit by a tram. When a security guard pulls her out of harm's way, both of them fall. to the ground just as the tram comes to a complete stop. Local officials warning passengers to be more vigilant. Okay, Taylor Swift fans are flocking to Germany, not to see the superstar perform, but to see a painting that may have inspired her latest smash hit, The Fate of Ophelia,

is the number one song on the Billboard Hot 100, and now a century-old painting of the Shakespearean character is drawing visitors from around the world. NBC's Camilla Bernal has this one. The fate of Ophelia is Taylor Swift's latest hit, topping the billboard Hot 100 charts with lyrical references to the song's namesake Shakespeare character. But look closely at the music videos opening shot, eagle-eyed fans noticing the similarities in Swift's video to another. work of art over 100 years old. It's very ethereal and you can almost see the water flowing, the movement of it, the movement of the fabric. It's just, it's beautiful. It's breathtaking. This is Friedrich Heiser's Ophelia, currently on display in the Hezai Sheet Landis Museum in Germany. Yeah, Swiftis. The museum's director says, yes, Swifties have flocked to see Ophelia's original fate, even coming from the U.S.

excited to see it in person. Shakespeare's Hamlet has inspired generations of artists. To be or not to be. And is among the most quoted works in the English language. That is the question. As the bard tells it, Ophelia madly in love with Hamlet. But her unrequited love leading her to lose her mind before drowning herself in despair. What's so neat is Taylor Swift is able to take something that's iconic or has huge influence in the past.

We've seen that with Shakespeare. We also saw it with Elizabeth Taylor. And she puts kind of her own touch on it. Taylor's version of Ophelia turning the fable on its head. Instead of tragedy, a love story. Taylor Swift is saying in this track that Travis Kelman, sees love saved her from the fate of Ophelia. Instead of drowning and being alone or miserable, she was able to be happy and keep it 100.

A new twist on a timeless tale. Camila Bernal, NBC News. We thank Camila for that story and that Shakespeare history lesson, but we want to stay overseas as well with a group of athletes taking over the UK. Japan's top sumo wrestlers flocking to London ahead of one of the sports biggest competitions, which is being held on foreign soil for the first time in more than three decades. And in between training, the wrestlers are taking to the streets and seeing some of the most iconic sites. NBC's Molly Hunter is there for it all. Across London this week, they are impossible to miss. About 40 elite sumo wrestlers known as Rikishi, some tipping the scales at more than 500 pounds, have come to town with great fanfare.

Spotted crossing Abbey Road, riding e-bikes, strolling with another Japanese superstar Hello Kitty, taking in the city's sights and greeting very, very eager fans. I can't wait to go, we're so excited. It's been really exciting seeing them over here and being like, that's so close to us. Yeah, it's great. We thought we take the opportunity to try and bump into a few of them. Let's go, let's go. Let's go. And mid-conversation, an opportunity presented itself.

You're the best. He's your favorite? Yeah, absolutely. Ure, he's brilliant. He's very unconventional fighter, isn't he? That's his style. Very acrobatic. These tickets have been sold out for months,

and the last time Sumo came to London was 34 years ago, selling out Royal Albert Hall in 1991. And NBC News covered that event then, the first grand tournament in 1,500 years to be held on foreign soil. The British fans love this samurai superstar. You win by forcing your opponent out of the ring, the Tokyo, or throwing them down inside of it. Outside rural Albert Hall, eight-year-old Huluto from Nagoya, Japan, knows all the Rikishi names.

And tonight, for the first time, along with those lucky enough to nab tickets, he'll see all the heavy hitters in one place. Molly Hunter, NBC News, London. Those are some big dudes. All right, we thank Molly for that. When we come back, the great debate over reclining your seat on airplanes. Is it rude to other passengers or simply the cost of comfort? Our panel of frequent flyers weighs in right after this. I never checked my bags.

I can't stand that weight baggage over it. Great. Help me. Help me is right. That scene from Seinfeld may be more than 30 years old, but the plight of air travel and cramped airline seat still rings true today. And tonight, a new headline is stirring.

up fresh debate over reclining seats on flights. Before we go any further, ask yourself, is it okay to recline? Canadian Airline WestJet announcing that they're getting rid of the reclining option in their economy sections and only offering reclining seats for a higher price in their premium cabin. The move reigniting the age-old question to recline or not to recline, travelers on social media extremely divided. The person in front reclines their seat and my knees were immediately crushed. My feet. has the option to recline, I'm going to recline the seat that I paid for. I never recline my seat on the plane, and I don't think we should.

I don't understand why, if it's an overnight flight, why you wouldn't be allowed to recline your chair? Like, everyone reclines? All right, to help me answer that, I'm joined tonight by Clint Henderson. He's, of course, the managing editor of the points guy, and is pro reclining. And Liam Nelson, he's a stand-up comedian, and he's going to reveal something to us today. He's also seven feet tall. William, thank you for telling us that. He's anti-reclining, which is crazy.

No, it's not. I'm not taking a side of this debate. I want to show our viewers the average seat room on a plane. Let's take a look right now. It's about 30 to 31 inches from one seat to the next, and seats can recline about two to three inches. So we all know it's cramped on planes. Clint, let's start with you.

Tell me why you're pro-reclining. So it's not in every situation, but if it's an overnight flight, you've got to recline a little bit. You've got to at least try to get some shut-eye. you paid for the seat. That's why I think it's so egregious that they're taking away that ability on some of these seats. It's a growing trend. But, you know, if you paid for the seat, you should be able to recline the seat. And the button's there. Okay, Liam, I got to hear you. You're

seven feet tall, dude. Set them straight. For sure. So I think it's a nuanced, it's a nuanced opinion. I think I'm not necessarily anti-recline. I'm anti-reclined within the current circumstances of how we're living. You know, I think the recline is kind of a tool that the airlines use to redirect the anger at the lack of space at one another versus the plane as a whole. So I think it's as of right now, it's a courtesy to your fellow passengers to not because that extra two inches of space you get doesn't necessarily make you that much more comfortable. It makes the person behind you that much more uncomfortable. So why, I mean, you're a tall drink of water. I got to think you want to like just like spread your stuff out, man. You're your big guy there. I mean like you don't. You just

you resist. So the recline doesn't help me at all just to make that clear. So if you take a look at it's a good example to have me on this chair. My leg doesn't physically fit in a coach seat. And so a lot of times when I'm taking smaller craft that go to smaller towns, when I tour to stand-ups, yeah, you know, little puddle jumpers type of thing. I, none of the seats are big enough to accommodate me. So I have to kind of physically jam myself diagonally into the seat. And then if someone in front of me chooses to recline, which happened once, and I had a story go pretty viral on TikTok about that story. Would you do? So initially it was a for them to recline their seat.

I was like, excuse me, ma'am, I'm so sorry. You can't recline right now. My femur is too long for that to happen. So she waited for me to fall asleep and then thought I was faking or pushing my legs forward or something. And then I wake up to her throwing her entire body weight into the chair, trying to get it to recline.

And I end up having to get a flight attendant to come over and threaten her to put on the no-fly list in order to get her to stop. That's crazy. Oh my god, Liam. That sounds like a crazy story. When you hear a story like that, did you sort of change your perspective? change your perspective a little bit.

And I know it's obviously he's a seven-footer, but, I mean, clearly it's an issue about, like, people reclining in your space. Yeah, it's common courtesy. So if you've got someone in this situation, they ask you nicely, of course you accommodate them, you don't recline your seat. It's just in general, you know, we should have that right. Of course, circumstances dependent. What are the airlines saying on this?

So, you know, they don't really come down on one side or another because the truth is they're going to make money if they can see. segment the cabin more and more and more. So they want these super basic no recline seats to be able to sell them as a special product. But it just puts consumers in a bad way. And my argument is, hey, the airlines are making so much money now on credit cards and loyalty programs. They should be giving us a little bit more room in the cabins.

Liam, what do you do? I mean, what is the, what would you feel okay with? Like, is there a polite way to do this? I think if there is a future version where we need to have this recline, I understand if there's an ideal world where there is more room available, that the recline would be a tool. that I would utilize more, for sure. But I think if there was some way to the person behind you to indicate whether or not the seat could be reclined

instead of the person's... So that conversation, like, hey, you're okay of a recline my seat? Hey, I'm no, I'm not. Okay. Maybe some tool to make that not a conversation because I think that's a big part of it is like the burden of being kind is put on the person reclining the seat.

And so if you just have some sort of button that keeps it from reclining, if you're too big for that to happen, then you don't have to have this, back and forth, where it's like, come on, can't you just, you know. I think part of the problem here, though, is that we're fighting for everything on the airline. You're fighting for overhead space. If you got on the flight first, sometimes people take your overhead compartmental flight attendants sometimes.

And I fly a lot. I'm a million-miler. Sometimes flight attendants, they don't always treat you well. Sometimes people don't treat flight attendants well. It's already a rough atmosphere going into the plane. Yeah, no, and it's gotten worse. We've gone from 36 inches of pitch on average, down to 31, 32 inches at the most. that's just a lot of strain you're putting on passengers.

And the airlines, they're not being great friendly to consumers, people, because they want to sell every single thing, including overhead bin space. You know, someday it's going to be bathroom access. Liam, I'll give you the last word here. Yeah. What do you think? I think that's, I totally agree with the issue stems from lack of room on planes and them trying to maximize the cabin.

You've seen those articles about them potentially trying out standing seats and all that kind of, Which is we're moving in the wrong direction. I think I agree with all the additional things that now people have to pay for along with flying. There's so much more that can go towards making the experience more comfortable for people. Yeah, Liam, oh my God. I've learned so much here. I really do appreciate it. Something like I really have never thought about, but I want to be thinking about it now.

Clint Liam, thank you so much for being here, as always. We thank you for watching Top Story. I'm Tom Yamis, New York. Stay right there. More news on the way.