Top Story with Tom Llamas - Tuesday, September 15, 2026

Episode Date: September 16, 2026

Tonight's Top Story has the latest breaking news, political headlines, news from overseas and the best NBC News reporting from across the country and around the world Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See https://pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

Breaking tonight, music superstar Ed Shearin's tour throwing the chaos after opening acts ditch his show in protest. Ed Shearin under fire, his backup band and other musical acts quitting his tour after rap star McElmore was forced out due to his free Palestine comments. The Kennedy Senator shut down and the president's vow it won't be renovated to reopen unless his name is on it. Also breaking the moment a Pennsylvania man is arrested over an alleged terror plot. images of the AR-15-style weapon and ammo for a possible violent attack. New video of a teenager launching fireworks from a pickup truck that allegedly ignited a deadly wildfire in Washington State. No laughing matter, Texas Longhorn quarterback Arch Manning under fire

for his reaction to an AI-generated video of his coach slapping a female sideline reporter. A helicopter spinning out of control and crashing on the tarmac. How did this training flight suddenly go so wrong? We'll break down the video. And our shark attacks being undercounted. What our deep dive into the numbers found about the threat lurking on our waters, we'll get into that debate about what needs to happen.

Top story. Starts right now. We begin with breaking news out of Washington. The iconic Kennedy Center set to shut down for two years for repairs or possibly even longer. The performing odds are overdue for those repairs, but the president tonight says those repairs will only happen if his name is added to the building's facade. Hallie Jackson leads us off with the late details. A stunning shutdown effective immediately for the iconic Kennedy Center, the main building, set to close for two years for repairs.

To fix issues like this ceiling collapse, a security guard seen feet away after a key vote today by the Trump-backed board. But there's a new catch, President Trump, now saying unless his name ends up on the building, the renovation of the Kennedy Center will not take place. That's after the president himself dialed into today's meeting. blasting his chief critic there as incompetent as she did the same to him, according to a source familiar with the call. It is being held hostage. Every time there's an issue that comes up, it has been connected. We will consider to do this, but or unless it has Donald Trump's name on the building.

The Kennedy Center, an American cultural institution, a national stage for the country's most prominent performers. But recently plagued by problems from water damage and the threat of bankruptcy. And when the president, after overhauling the board, tried to attach his own name to the center, a federal judge ordered it removed. Again today, ruling it cannot be added back without Congress's blessing, since by law, the center is named after former president John F. Kennedy. Still, administration lawyers have argued without appropriately recognizing President Trump, donors will flee and financial contributions will dry up. To help the center stay afloat during the

$250 million renovation the board has tried to push through unsuccessfully multiple times. Now, the president's setting up a court battle, betting the building's future on a win. The board's pledging to appeal today's ruling, blocking the addition of the Trump name with the Kennedy Center saying they want to move forward with recognizing what they call historic contributions by the president. As of tonight, the center's main building is closed to the public. Tom. Hallie Jackson for us, Hallie, thank you. Also developing tonight, the FBI says it stopped an ISIS terror attack, arresting a suspect who was stockpiling weapons, and preparing to unleash a mass casualty event before his arrest in Pennsylvania. Aaron McLaughlin reports. Tonight, an alleged ISIS attack foiled. This image obtained by NBC Channel 11 in Pittsburgh shows the moment a terror suspect is arrested by the FBI.

accused of planning a mass casualty event in the name of the Islamic State. These actions demonstrate a sustained commitment to ISIS and a clear intent to conduct a violent attack in the United States to harm the American people. These are the weapons the FBI says they found during the arrest of 21-year-old Jonathan Kramer, including a semi-automatic rifle, 190 rounds of ammunition and two loaded rifle magazines. This guy approached me and was a real odd person. This hotel guest who asked not to be identified says he'd seen Kramer in the hotel. As he was walking away from me, I overheard him say today's today. And that just was really unsettling with me. According to court documents, the FBI had been watching Kramer since March.

Shortly after, he'd been released from juvenile detention for his role in a 2023 plot to commit a mass casualty incident. The FBI then tracked Kramer's online. activity. On September 9, 26, he expressed his intent to prepare for his, quote, mission, claiming, I just need a weapon, and as soon as I have that, I am ready. Aaron McLaughlin joins us now. So, Aaron, do we know who the intended target was? Well, the court documents do not name an intended target, nor does it state an intended date. However, we are able, from the court documents, to piece together a timeline. We know that they

had been tracking Kramer, the FBI, since March of this year. As soon as he left juvenile detention, moved in with his parents. They followed his online activities and behavior for months. Just recently, that's when he left his parents home and checked into that hotel. They followed him to the Walmart, saw him as he purchased a disposable phone. And then in the parking lot, according to the court documents, that's when he obtained from an unknown individual, the semi-automatic rifle. And after that, That's when they moved in and made the arrest. All right. Aaron McLaughlin for us with those new details. Aaron, thank you.

We're going to turn now to a major headline out of the music world. Superstar Ed Shearren is in crisis mode. His tour crumbling as major acts on the road with him quit in solidarity with McElmore, who was dropped over his pro-Palestinian comments. Right now, these are the acts packing it up, including Phineas, the 11-time Grammy Award winner, notable for his work with his sister, Billy Eilish, even Shearin's backing band backing out. It was these remarks by McElmore on stage earlier this month at a New Jersey MetLife Stadium that sent the dominoes falling.

Take a listen. I wanted to stand up here on stages and stadiums across America and say two words that are very near and dear to my heart, free Palestine. Those comments drew criticism from pro-Israel groups who petitioned to have McElmore dropped, but it was Patriots owner Robert Crick. who said if McElmore stayed on, Shearren would not be allowed to perform at Gillette Stadium. Shearin broke his silence earlier today on social media, writing in part. Macklemore coming off tour was the promoter's decision was not mine. McElmore's contract for the tour was with the promoter, not me. So the big question, will this force the global superstar to pull the plug on his own tour?

Our Emily Aketa has more. Tonight, more fallout over Ed Shearin's loop tour with a thinking out loud singer, supporting acts now withdrawing in protest of McElmore being dropped from the tour after comments like this. Finneas, who has publicly supported Palestinians alongside his sister, Billy Elish, posting today, artists must not be silence when they speak up for the oppressed. Bioga, Shiran's house band, Danish band Lucas Graham, and Irish singer Aaron Rowe also announcing their departure on social media. Roe thanking Sheeran for the opportunity but writing, I cannot stand by and allow billionaires to use their position of power to silence the rightful voices of those who speak up against Israeli genocide, referencing New England Patriots owner Robert Kraft.

McElmore said Monday that Kraft had rallied some of the other stadium owners and warned Shearin, if McElmore stays on the tour, you will not be allowed to play. Kraft has previously said this decision is not about diminishing the suffering of innocent Palestinian. With backlash growing, Shearin now breaking his silence, clarifying he's been trying to build a bridge. But McElmore's removal was the promoter's decision. He wrote, there is a reason I do not use my professional platform for politics. My audience includes young people, often children of all backgrounds. Adding, I respect McElmore's strength of purpose to stand up and shout for what he believes.

However, there is room for multiple approaches to the same end. Peace. Well, Emily joins us now as well on that. So, Emily, do we know what's going to happen with the tour? So his website indicates that he's still going to be performing in Philadelphia on Saturday. The North American leg of his tour is set to run into November. But this undoubtedly will plunge at least parts of the concert into chaos. Because you think about it, a band like Bioga, he actually would perform alongside several songs during his concerts.

As part of a lengthy statement, Sharon said he would never let down fans who had made plans to see him. Okay, Emily, we thank you for that. For more on this, I want to bring in entertainment journalists, a good friend to Top Story. Brian Balthasar, Brian, so how worried should Ed Sheeran be right now? I mean, he still has a massive fan base. He's been selling a lot of tickets, but there's obviously a lot of momentum against him right now. Oh, certainly, yeah. This is a conversation he did not want to be part of.

And, you know, there was a time when staying out of politics was the safest choice for entertainers, and now staying out of it is viewed as a choice unto itself. You know, we're seeing in social media that he's lost about 100,000 followers since the backlash and McLeor gained 400,000. But we've also seen third-party tracking sites saying that he was losing followers actually prior to this. So the true test of this will be in Philadelphia this Saturday, where I am currently.

And there are certainly a lot of tickets available for resale, but we don't know why that is, and that's very standard for resales and concerts of this nature. So we don't know what the long-term effects of this are. And that remains to be seen, but you can certainly say that right now he's upset about this happen. He doesn't want to be part of this. conversation. Yeah. How much of this, and I know this is happening a lot online right now,

how much of is Malcolm Moore's previous actions, right? There was that video of him wearing a costume that many perceived it to be him making fun of Jewish people. He said that that was not his intention. Is that getting any traction at all in this as well? Because it's not just the free Palestine comments. I think people like Pink are pointing out there was there were more than just one act here. Right. There's certainly been other activity from McElmore that is going to leads to some of this backlash, but then you have the combined actions of the other opening acts that are saying that they're kind of standing in unity with him. So those actions aside, it's this one in particular that's leading to this massive change in Shearant's concert, which he's

going to go forward with, but it remains to be seen, you know, what the real reasons are, because we can't get in these people's heads. We can only see how they act with their wallets and with their social following. And Brian, it's sort of interesting because this almost feels like this was last year or maybe even longer than that, that this debate was playing out on college campuses and everywhere and in the entertainment industry. It's sort of come back right now. Do you think artists are going to have to be forced to choose a side publicly? We're seeing this more and more. And it's really the social media followings that are calling them to task. There's an area celebrity post that goes on where someone doesn't

post in the comments for them to take a stand. People are no longer standing for neutrality. Okay. Brian Balthasar for us. Brian, always great to see you. Thank you. Netter new details about the man who tried to assassinate President Trump at a rally in Butler, Pennsylvania. Newly released document shining a light on the hours leading up to the attack and reveal that an anonymous donor paid for the attempt at assassins cremation. Stephanie Goss reports. Take a look at what happened. Tonight, alarming new details about the 20-year-old who nearly assassinated President Trump at a 2024 campaign rally in Butler, Pennsylvania. This chilling video showing Thomas Crue.

Crooks walking through the crowd less than two hours before he got on a rooftop and opened fire with an AR-15. According to FBI documents released today, one rallygoer says Crooks was making hateful comments about Trump. And the FBI says Crooks had also posted a video saying he hated Republicans, including Trump. Crook shot three men in the stands, killing 50-year-old Corey Comparator and wounding then-Candidate Trump before Crooks was killed by a Secret Service sniper. Tonight we've learned Crook's father told FBI investigators, an anonymous donor paid for his son's body to be cremated. The donation arranged by a family attorney, according to documents Senator Chuck Grassley showed to the New York Post. Matthew Crooks also told the FBI his son was obsessed with guns, ordering parts on Amazon using the pseudonym Bob Dole. He spent five years improving his aim, the post reports, focusing on accuracy at long distances.

This DOJ document shows Crooks went to a firing range the day before the shooting, setting up targets at a range of 100 yards. Crook's father described his son as quiet, someone who rarely laughed or showed emotion and had no known friends, according to the post. The Butler shooting was the first of three assassination attempts against President Trump, who has often recounted the harrowing moment. By the hand of Providence and the grace of God, that villain did not succeed. in his goal. It led to an investigation, the final report accusing the Secret Service of a major security breakdown, including not securing that rooftop, 400 feet away from Trump's podium. With that, Stephanie, Goss joins us live in studio.

So, Stephanie, what else did Crook's father tell the FBI? Well, he talked about this timeline with the guns, Tom. And his son was not very good with a gun five years before the shooting. And he said he could barely shoot anything. But then he said his son went to fire. and practice a lot and then started practicing from distances at 100 yards. And he would come back to his father when he had a good practice and show him that he had done well. And his father asked him at one point, why are you shooting from so far away?

And he told his father it was because he wanted to get good at using basic sights on his rifle. Father also told the FBI, according to the New York Post, that he was the one who gave him the AR-15 that he used in the shooting time. All right. Stephanie Goss, thank you. You're welcome. The final sprint to the midterms is on, and a new poll shows Democrats gaining an edge over Republicans, as some Americans grow frustrated with President Trump's handling of the economy. Steve Kornacki is in the House, and he's at the big board to break it all down. So, Steve, the momentum seems to be on the side of the Democrats.

Walk us through this poll. Yeah, from the New York Times here, I think the most significant number is the bottom line number. This is the generic ballot. We're always measuring this here. Pollsters are, would you vote for the Democratic or the Republican? candidate in the election. And the Democrats now opening up an eight-point advantage, 51 to 43 over the Republicans in this poll. And the key here is the gap has tended to be a little bit smaller than this throughout the year. The Democrats have had the advantage, but a lot of folks were saying, look, in a wave election, and that's what Democrats are hoping to have here in what Republicans are fearing, a wave election. Usually the generic ballot starts getting closer to double digits. Now this poll suggests that maybe it is. And if you go inside that, what's behind. I think two things jump out. First of all, the president's signature issue, immigration, actually by a seven-point margin voters saying they prefer the Democrats on that, and the issue

that voters say is the most important. This has been the story of Trump's second term, the economy, the Democrats now with a seven-point advantage there. This has been an issue. When you go back the last couple years, until recently, the Republicans had a strong advantage here. Now it's the Democrats in this poll. Yeah, and with oil up, gas up, mortgage rates up, it's all going to hurt the Republicans. Come November, Balance of power will come down to state races, so let's talk Texas where Democrats are trying to win their first statewide in 32 years. And recent polls show Democrat James Talrico out in front. Steve, we do this story.

Every election cycle. Will Texas in some way turn blue? Is this real? Is this momentum real? Yeah, this has been fools gold for Democrats more than once over the last three-plus decades here. But if you average the polls right now, this is what you're looking at. Talarico, the Democrat 47, Paxton, the Republican 44. Now, qualifiers on this, obviously, this is close.

And Talarico, while he's leading in the poll average, that is still less than 50%, less than a majority. And there's always going to be a question for a Democrat in Texas about is there a ceiling, even if he can get ahead right now when all the undecided folks come off the fence here, could Talarico actually get this to a majority? So there's certainly questions about Talarico, but I would say when you look at the close calls, there have been a few close calls Democrats have had in Texas over the years. This is about as good position as they've ever been in in modern times in Texas at this point. Do we have any more data? Do we know voting groups who exactly is going towards Tau Rico, who he's attracting?

Yeah, I think there's two key groups here. And what you'll see here, this is what has to go right for Democrats, not just in the polls, but in the election. If Tala Rica is going to win Latinos, that's a quarter of the electorate in Texas. Look at the presidential elections here. Hillary Clinton had won the Latino vote over Trump by 27 points. And then you know the story in Texas. Trump made huge inroads with Latino voters. winning them in Texas by 10 points in 2024. Well, now in this poll, that's all washed away. This poll, the most recent poll, has Tala Rico up 33 with Hispanics. That has to be true for Democrats if they're actually going to flip Texas. And the other one is this, it's that degree divide, college-educated voters, thinking of the higher-income suburbs, a lot of those around Dallas, Fort Worth, and Houston.

This is a group that's been getting less Republican with time. Trump won them in Texas by eight in 2016. Biden won them by two in 2020. Trump actually made some. gains forced a tie in 2024 now in the polling. Again, Tala Rico opening a double-digit advantage with this group. I don't know if that's going to hold in November for Democrats, but if Democrats are actually going to win Texas, it would have to. All right. Steve Kornacki for us tonight here on Top Story. Steve, we thank you. Got it. We're back at a moment with the terrifying hit and run, a driver barreling down a boardwalk, people jumping out of the way, how good Samaritas jump in and chase down the suspect. Plus a major health alert tonight. Measel's cases.

in the U.S. hitting their highest levels in decades, what you need to know. And the latest controversy in college football, Texas quarterback Arch Manning, facing backlash for his reaction to an AI video, manipulated to show his coach slapping a sideline reporter, how he's responding ahead on Top Story. Back now with a wild video out of San Diego, and it was all caught on a pair of meta-glasses. Good Samaritans chasing down a man accused of speeding down a boardwalk

and slamming into a woman. Steve Patterson has more. Oh, get him, get him! Two good Samaritans jumping into action, chasing down a man whose San Diego police say stole the vehicle, struck a woman, and fled the scene on foot. What the fuck is this guy's problem, girl? Get the fuck on the ground. A meta-sanglasses camera capturing them knocked down and pinned the suspect now identified by police as 39-year-old Juan Gonzaba. That's Dejure Hardway, seen leading the charge barefoot.

Tripped them up and grabbed them down and held them down. It's for the greater good. and I'm not, you know, scared of any type of altercation. I've been there. Police say it all happened shortly after 1230 yesterday. Heroing surveillance video showing that stolen blue Tesla speeding along the boardwalk. Watch again in slow motion. You can see a woman leap for cover just in time.

Everyone was like jumping like to the sides. We saw people like jumping to the beach. And yeah, it was crazy. Police say another woman wasn't so lucky. The driver striking her. leaving her with serious injuries. Police say they tried to stop that Tesla before it reached the boardwalk, but ended their pursuit because of the safety risk. Gunzaba now facing multiple charges, including DUI, hit and run and vehicle theft. He's scheduled to be arraigned tomorrow.

And Tom, some good news tonight, that 25-year-old woman still in the hospital, but in serious condition, not in critical, she was upgraded. She's expected to survive still, though, with broken vertebrae and broken ribs. Tom. Wild story. Steve Patterson for us. Coming up tonight, a helicopter spinning out of control and crashing during a training flight. We'll break down the video and what went wrong. Plus, how this suspect in handcuffs escape from the back of a police cruiser. Stay with us.

Back now with new video of what police say was reckless teenage behavior, firing off fireworks from a moving truck that turned deadly when it sparked a fast-moving wildfire. Liz Kroits with that video. This is the moment. Police say fireworks launched from the back of a pickup truck ignited a deadly fire on 4th of July in Washington State. Authorities say in the cell phone video obtained from law enforcement by our affiliate, King 5 in Seattle, you can see multiple people riding in the bed of a truck while driving on a highway three hours east of Seattle. They say a suspect in the car is seen firing at another vehicle with what's called a trooper turret that rapidly discharges fireworks. We had somebody traveling in the opposite lane of travel with individuals standing up in the back of a vehicle discharging aerial fireworks.

Prosecutors say these fireworks are what sparked the Shalan Hills fire, which destroyed more than a dozen homes and killed one person. 69-year-old Robert Lister died in his car while trying to escape. His family tonight telling NBC News they hope justice will prevail. We will miss his sense of humor and his laugh. Police arrested 18-year-old Michael Yakimov, who they say is the person seen. in the video aiming that firework. He faces multiple charges, including first-degree manslaughter, first-degree arson, and six counts of third-degree assault due to injured firefighters. This is a type of fire that will live with us for the rest of our lives.

And NBC News has reached out to the teen's attorney, but not heard back. Authorities say they believe five other people were also involved and could face charges as well. Tom. Thank you. Net at Top Stories News Feed, starting with the growing measles outbreak in Pennsylvania. The State Health Department now reporting four people have died in the last month. It's been decades since the U.S. recorded this many measles-related deaths in a single year. Data shows the last time it happened was 1992. The most recent death an 18-year-old who officials say was not vaccinated. In Texas, new video of a suspect escaping from the back of a police cruiser watches the man kicks the back window,

smashing the glass. It happened just moments after he was taken into custody and while he was wearing handcuffs and as that cruiser was moving, That suspect, six foot seven, but somehow he manages to get out the window. The escape was short-lived, though. Police say they quickly captured him, and he's now facing even more charges. They had a new video of a helicopter crashed in a training flight in Utah. The chopper spinning out of control just moments after taking off. You see it right here slamming into the ground.

Investigators say both the flight instructor and students on board were hurt. I want to bring in Tom Costello now, who covers aviation for us. Tom, walk us through the video, and what went wrong here? Astonishing. This happened back on May 23rd in southwest Utah, Cedar City, not far from the Nevada border. A flight instructor was teaching a student how to fly a Bell 206 chopper. And very quickly, you can see the helicopter lifts off and then it seems to lose control very quickly. The NTSB says the chopper hit the ground and quickly began to spin out of control. It rotated to the right and it slammed to the ground, causing the tail boom and the main rotor system to separate from the chopper. amazingly, both the 32-year-old instructor pilot

and the 25-year-old students suffered only minor injuries. Typically, the pilot sits in the right seat on a chopper, right? But in this case, it looks like he was in the left seat, the student was in the right. Today, the NTSB says the crash happened because the instructor failed to maintain control while he was reaching over to manipulate the engine RPM controls on what's called the collective.

That's that pitch control lever that's located on the pilot, left side. The instructor apparently reached over that collective to push the button, but in the process failed to control that middle level, the collective, and then that sent the chopper into this wild bucking bronco kind of move. It all comes down, though, to controlling that middle lever, the collective that controls the chopper's pitch. By the way, the belt 206, widely flown, very reliable. The NTSB makes the point. No suggestion that a mechanical issue was to blame here. Embry-Riddle University finds that a helicopter, helicopter accidents related to instructional flights, made up 299 accidents from 2010 through 22. That's about 4.7 per 100,000 flights.

Yeah, and then, Tom, before we go, I know in our news meeting you mentioned, you had a similar incident in a helicopter just like this involving a lever? Well, years ago, I was in a Border Patrol helicopter along the border in El Paso. I was in the left seat. My cameraman was in the back. I was holding the cameraman's equipment bag, bad move. I messed it on that lever, on the collective. That immediately began pitching the chopper down. The pilot quickly told me, move the bag, so that stuck with me. If you're ever in a chopper sitting on the left-hand side, keep your hands to yourself, Tom. Yeah, and move the bag. All right, Tom, we thank you for that. Also tonight, controversy in the world of college football, star quarterback Arch Maining, apologizing for

joking about a violent AI video manipulated to show his coach Slash Slash. dropping a female reporter. So on social media demanding consequences, and tonight the reporter is speaking out as well. Here's Maggie Vespah. How's a good one? Of him slavin, Holly Roe. Tonight, star Texas quarterback, Arch Manning,

apologizing, calling that off-the-cuff riff with reporters insensitive, adding there's nothing funny about this disturbing AI-generated video. Hook on! That fake video from, from an unknown source circulating online showing Texas football coach Steve Sarkesian slapping sideline reporter Holly Rowe. It's a digitally altered AI version of this real clip.

Rose expression and the interaction after the Longhorns win over Ohio State Saturday going viral. Manning Monday saying this about the altered version. I've seen a few AI edits of stuff. You all see that one? How's it going? of him slapping how I wrote. You can hear others in the room laughing. Backlash online against the college quarterback,

grandson of NFL legend Archie Manning, and nephew of Eli and Peyton Manning, was immediate. This is an awful look for Texas, an awful look for your quarterback, an awful look for your coach. Why do we have to media train a man that is 22 years old that hitting a woman is wrong? That should require no media training.

Though some argue anger at Manning is overblown. You don't, you don't, You care. You act like you care because it makes you feel important. Some online pointing to other instances of women mistreated in sports media. Including this recent Good Good Golf ad for a collaboration with Callaway showing one of Good Good Golf's co-founders shoving a woman to the ground. The Texas company last month apologizing and taking it down. About this AI controversy, tonight the University of Texas declining to come. comment. Roe posting she's accepted Manning's apology, adding we move forward with respect and

kindness for one another. Maggie Vespah joins us now. So Maggie, Manning is one of the bigger names in college football and he has sponsors. Have those companies weighed in? Tom, in short, not yet, but it's something we are closely watching because a lot of these social media users read that as the angry ones are commenting on a lot of ads that Manning is posted with his sponsors. And he's sponsored by multiple companies, including Red Bull and Warby. Parker and these users are demanding that these companies say or do something, potentially dropping Manning as a sponsored athlete. We're out to these companies. Again, so far, no response from them, but I cannot stress this enough, Tom. In a post-NIL world, again, these college students make so

much money or can from these deals. One estimate puts Manning's earnings from these deals at around $2.5 million. Tom. Nice chunk of change for being still in college. All right, Maggie, we thank you for that. Still to come on top story. sharks attacking more people. We talked to one surfer who survived a bite, but whose case is not counted in the data. So why are these attacks going unreported? We press the experts and go deep into the data right after this. We're back down with a deep dive into a topic we cover a lot here on top story, shark attacks. Every summer we do report after report on the violent encounters, swimmers, surfers, even fishermen bitten by sharks in our oceans. The data widely cited by news

organization shows that the rate of attacks has remained flat. But we found not all shark attacks are created equal in the eyes of those who count them. And one category is actually on the rise. Jesse Kirsch explains. It might feel like shark attacks are soaring. Tonight, the violent shark attack caught on camera. With close calls going viral and bites shutting down beaches. Still, the headlines quote experts is saying attacks are not increasing and were actually declining for most of the past few years. But NBC News found that not all shark bites are counted the same way. I could absolutely feel every single individual tooth. In 2019, Don Walsh was surfing Florida's New Smyrna Beach. As I hit the water, I landed on top of a shark. A bull shark tearing into his left

leg and hand. Time stopped while my hand was in its mouth. That year, experts reported a decrease in unprovoked attacks, but they did not count Walsh. That's because his attack is categorized as provoked, which means a human initiated interaction with a shark. While I'm paddling on this surfboard, if my arm hits a shark and that shark bites me, that's considered a provoked attack, even if I had no idea there were sharks anywhere near by me. If a swimmer's attacked near fishermen, even on the beach, that can also be considered provoked. How often do people reach out criticizing this and saying, you're, you're, you're You're blaming me for something I didn't intend to do.

A lot. And perhaps we should call it human-induced behavior. Gavin Naler leads the international shark attack file, or ISAF, the world's top shark database. Their annual trend reports do not include provoked attacks, which are up. So we're not in beach safety. We are understanding the animals. We're a museum. Some researchers see a need to dig deeper into the data when informing the public.

If someone gets attacked by a shark, they're still attacked by a shark. Ross Busak is a researcher for the fishing industry, which he says is increasingly threatened by sharks. Look at the size of that bull shark. I mean, I'm constantly interacting with sharks now, and I never did before. Still, ISAF says even if you account for increases in provoked attacks, overall, biting incidents are essentially trending flat. Since his attack, Walsh has not shied away from the ocean. I love sharks. I don't hold it against a shark. It was 100% my fault. Still, he does want to see a change. To put it in a classification like I did it intentionally,

that, no, that's, that I do find offense with. Jesse Kerr joins us now from Miami. Jesse, what more do we know about why provoked attacks are going up? Yes, so Tom, ISAF says that you've got people becoming more familiar with the animals. You've got influencers trying to be seen with them. And if you get close enough to a shark on purpose, you can imagine you're starting to maybe tempt fate there, right? And then something else to keep in mind as this debate continues. And we talk about what kinds of shark attacks are happening more versus less and how the trend lines are going. ISAF says that we are seeing the beginnings of the population of sharks growing, a resurgence beginning. So this is something that certainly

will be something we'll be debating and talking about and have under scrutiny for years to come, I imagine. And then Jesse, before we go, I don't know if we can call it surfing. We didn't really see get up there at least not in the video I saw but I mean what was it like to be out there in the shark bite capital of the world yeah we'll call it paddling in an attempt to serve I will say I have been able to get up on a surfboard before it was not my lucky day that time but definitely knowing we were in an area that has seen its fair share of shark bites knowing we were talking about this I would be lying if I said it wasn't in the back of my mind Tom but thankfully we got in and out of the

water smooth sailing no problems out there. And again, I think something I'm trying to stick to and taking away from the surf where we spoke with is, you know, if you enjoy the ocean, you're going to keep enjoying the ocean. But of course, you always want to make sure you have your wits about you when you're out there in the open water. All right, Jesse Kerch for us. Jesse, thank you for that report. To keep this conversation going, I want to bring in two experts. Will Benson is a charter fishing captain out of Key West Florida. And Liz Parkinson is a board member at Shark Angels, a Shark advocacy group. And in full disclosure, Captain Ben said, I haven't seen you in 25 years, but

we did attend the same university. So good to see you again. I'm going to start with you. For people who might not know, explain what you do and why someone like yourself is seeing more sharks day to day. Well, Tom, as you know, what I do is I'm a charter fishing guide. I take people out on the waters around the Florida Keys in pursuit of the big three tarp and bonefish and permit. every single day that we are encounter sharks, you know, of all different varieties, we have lemon sharks, nurse sharks, bull sharks, black tip sharks, bonnet head sharks, just a large variety of sharks down here in the Keys. We see them every single day.

So, Will, I grew up in South Florida, as you may remember. I fish, too. I mean, not as much as you do. This is purely anecdotal from my standpoint, but I don't remember in the 80s and 90s, up until I'd say like maybe the early aughts, the amount of sharks that you would get. When you're out there fishing, you call it the taxman, right? The taxman comes and gets your fish as you're reeling it up. Do we know why there appears to be or it feels like there's more sharks, especially in Florida?

You know, it's hard to say exactly why. Obviously, we've had some updates to some of the fishing regulations with the elimination of long lining. But I would agree with you, Tom. You know, back in the day, we didn't see quite as many sharks. But it feels like there's more sharks now. I will say that what I encounter are more, you know, shark encounters directly with the fish that I'm trying to catch and release, particularly after releasing the fish. We call that depredation. And it's so much so that it's really affecting my day-to-day routine when I'm going around, you know, looking for these game fish.

I'm, you know, taking into account, am I seeing sharks or the sharks present in the area? And what do I need to do to make sure that the fish are released unharmed? and I'm adjusting some of my fishing techniques to accommodate for that daily. It is just a constant theme. It seems to be increasing. I don't know why we're partnering with science organizations to figure that out, but I can tell you that it is just a constant theme on the flats these days. Can you draw a straight line from conservation efforts to what you're seeing now as far as the rise in sharks?

Look, conservation efforts are supposed to get the shark populations back up. Across the board in Florida, they seem to have worked. Are they working too well? It's hard to say, I know when, you know, in my guiding career, I've been guiding for 27 years since we went to college together. And it's hard to say you see things in the ocean that are cyclical, you know, there's waves, they come and go. So I can't speak definitively of this as directly correlated to the conservation measures, but

I will say that there seems to be, you know, a much higher prevalence of sharks these days. And with more people fishing and more people boating, those encounters are increasing as well. So I think that's really the reason we need to partner with science organizations, really get the data, do the hard work to understand and get clarity of what's going on here so that we can determine what to do about it. Liz, how do we get to a point where we're still protecting sharks, right, but also protecting commercial fishermen, charter fishermen, and swimmers and surfers at the beach? Yeah, that's a great question.

This is going to be a question that stands a test of time, right? trying to find that balance in between the two. Working with shark angels and a nonprofit based out of New York City, we do a lot of education. I grew up in South Africa where we were taught from a really young age how to protect ourselves in the bush when we go out against insects to larger animals that could hurt us. And I feel like there should be a movement towards education. Science has only really been around in the world that we live in with the sharks for the last sort of 50 to 60 years. People have been fishing forever. So I think science just needs a little

bit of time to catch up. Florida is an amazing place to dive with sharks. I've spent the majority of my life diving in the Bahamas, which is now a shark sanctuary. And the Florida Keys, the Florida East Coast, is a gateway to the South Atlantic and to the Caribbean. So it's a massive passageway and migration route for a huge number of species. It's going to be a constant battle with conservation and working with fishermen so that everyone can live in that world where everyone's happy. But sharks are apex predators, and that increase of population is so exciting. We're seeing species of sharks we've never seen before in that part of Florida, and I think it's a balance, but I think education is a key aspect of that.

You know, I got to ask you this. Is there a point, at least in your opinion, where there could be too many sharks, or is that never a problem? because it's something that's essentially natural. I think in the way that our environment is working at the moment, the way that global warming is increasing the temperatures of the water. I think in the past years, we've seen influx of animals in places of the world that we don't generally get to see them. Sharks are fished worldwide.

I mean, statistics like 100 million sharks are killed a year. I don't think Kelling is the answer to this question. It's a hard question to answer, but I do believe that working with scientists and trying to figure out a way where we can cohabitate is more realistic over the long term. Explain the global warming argument to me, right? Because maybe I'm just not smart enough, but I need someone like you to kind of explain to me. If global warming is part of it, why are Great Whites than coming down to places like Florida where the waters are warmer, where we never, ever would see Great White? growing up, and now there's reports out of Florida. People are spotting Great Whites in really the southern part of Florida. Right, and that's a really great question. Here in California,

we've been having Hammerhead sightings, which is extraordinary for this part of the world, because the waters tend to be a lot warmer, I mean, sorry, a lot colder here in California. You know, Great Whites have frequented the coastline of the eastern United Seaboard forever. There's a huge current line that flows up the Florida coastline and heads over to the Azores and then over to Ireland. You know, I think that even though the waters are warming, their food is coming more south. There is a growth in population, and they are huge migratory animals. Great white sharks travel huge distances. They don't have to stay at the surface either. They can dive down deep. They can be seen at extraordinary depths. So temperature,

for them is not really something that we have to worry too much about. Will, something I don't understand, right? And we've covered a lot of stories about this, is the surf casting, the fishing on the beach. I'm always sort of in shock when there is a packed beach with families and kids and everyone's swimming at the beach, and there's somebody who's out there fishing right by these families. Because in that situation, you've got to say you're inviting sharks.

Is there a reason why the laws aren't tougher? And maybe there's not a concern as much on the surfcasters with people that are fishing while people are swimming? You know, it's hard for me to say, you know, surf casting's not my, you know, expertise, but I think, you know, you can look around and see, you know, how many shark attacks are happening because of it. I would offer, you know, that's perhaps the case, but also, you know, sharks are really smart animals. I've spent a lot of time in the water with them, you know, they know the difference a lot of the times. So, you know, just the act of fishing in and of itself, I would say, doesn't necessarily.

INVYOR MOYE HECTS PER SEA in that situation. It is surprising how often you're in the water and the sharks can really tell the difference between a diver, a human, and, you know, a natural prey. Liz, I do want to ask you the same question, right, because there have been sort of reports of people not only fishing from the beach, right, but chumming at times, right? Or they'll go out on a kayak maybe and they'll chum the water and they'll be not right next to swimmers but pretty close. Do you sort of have a take on that and then, you know, sometimes there's attacks in these areas? Yeah, I mean, excuse me, chlamming the water, both for fishing purposes, as well as for diving purposes, has always been controversial. Having a lot of people in the water, the gentleman who spoke prior to us talked about,

there is more people, there are more people in the ocean, there are more people doing water sports and activities. And then there have been in the past several years. So that increase of people around those areas. I'm not a massive fisherman, so I can't really speak for the fly fishing side of it, more the ocean side where that controversy of chumming the water and shark feeding on shark dives in comparison to that of chumming for fishing purposes, I feel is quite a contradictory conversation. There are more people in the water, and this, I think,

Tom, where it comes back to education, not only for the people in the water, but for those who are doing the activities on the sidelines, the fishermen off the beach, the fishermen off the bridges. There should be a regulation on both ways. We should be able to have that conversation so that it protects industries like mine, and it protects industries like wills. They're both important for economy. Fishing and diving brings in a huge amount of money into our economies every year. The Bahamas has been a shark sanctuary since 2012. And one of the reasons why that came about was because they said that sharks dead were worth about $50 to $100, whereas a live shark from an eco-tourism standpoint is over a million

dollars per year. And in a country like the Bahamas, that's massive for families and for income. So I think really it does come down to an education. Why can't we have these conversations in schools? Why do we always have to victimize the shark? After all, the shark, it is their environment. It is their ecosystem. It drives me nuts when people say shark-infested waters.

How can waters be infested by sharks where that's their ecosystem? Do you think it's misleading the story that we did about provoked and unprovoked and telling people how many shark attacks are happening in a certain area? I mean, we were kind of surprised when we learned about that, that you could just be surfing, and if you're attacked, that is considered a provoked attack. You think that that is fair? Is it misleading or is that just the way things are?

I think, Tom, that's a language. I think in some ways it's the words that you use. A shark attack. I have a friend who was attacked by a shark. He survived it, but he lost two limbs from it. That, I would say, is a shark attack. I've been in the water and been bumped by sharks loads of times. I know influencers who have rubbed up against whale sharks

and have got a graze on the arm. They're like, oh, I got a shark attack. I got attacked by a shark. These animals are instinctive. They're not cognitive thinkers like us. They're not like mammals. They don't have emotional draw to their young or anything like that. They're there to survive. They're there to reproduce. And they're there to eat. They're opportunistic feeders. They will come in to bait if it's there. So I think it's the responsibility of the people who live in these amazing places of the world. I've spent a lot of time in South Florida. I went to Florida State. I think it's the responsibility that we have. It's a privilege for us to enjoy the ocean. It's a privileged place. So therefore, we should use that as a guiding force to educate kids, adults, anyone who is in the water from both sides of the argument. I get it.

But with any other species, whether it be deer or anything else, anywhere you are in the United States, when there's too many of them, right, you try to get the populations under control. Will I'm going to let you have the last word here. You talk to people all the time on this. Do you guys have any solutions? Is there any ideas you've heard or any theories that you're like, let's try this. This might be able to work? Well, first off, I agree education is key. I also agree that this is their ecosystem.

You know, it is their ocean that we're visitors in. I would disagree with the categorization of provoked versus unprovoked. I think that's a little bit black and white. And everything that I've learned is that it's a little bit more nuanced than that. That I think we need to use science. We need to use the expertise of fishermen, the researchers, the other stakeholder user groups to really start to understand better what the dynamics at work are in the ocean. If we're going to figure out how to best strike the balance between, you know, sharks and their rights to be there

and to continue to perform the ecosystem service that they have and the traditions of fishing on the beach in South Florida, fly fishing on the flats in Key West, going offshore and catching, you know, snappers and groupers for dinner, and continue to have both what's good for the shark, the shark populations, because it's needed, frankly, but we also need to recognize the interests of these user groups, the swimmers, the surfers, the fishermen, etc. And really, I'm advocating for more science, a better understanding of that,

and saying that it might be a little bit more complicated, and if we use those tools of science, we'll be able to peel those layers back and understand the dynamics better and then better regulate it. Yeah, okay, Captain Will Benson. Liz Parkinson, we thank you so much. This was a robust conversation. Great to have it here in the show. Just ahead tonight, giving back to a player who gave it all on the court, the college basketball team coming together to surprise a walk-on with a full scholarship. That's next.

Finally tonight, a college basketball team coming together to surprise one of their own, presenting a senior player who started as a freshman walk-on with a scholarship for her final season. The Fairfield Women's Basketball team is used to celebrate him. Typically for big moments like this on the court. But on this day, inside this restaurant, they got a surprise in store for senior shooting guard Casey Pryor. It's the final day of a preseason trip abroad. The seniors giving scripted remarks thanking donors and event organizers.

But at the end, Casey is given one more piece of paper to read. One more thing. staff out it would be a great time to share to have me share with everyone that I've received a full basketball. Casey surprised with a full scholarship for her final season. Her parents overjoyed. Mom wiping tears at the table. They've supported me through everything and pushed me to like be my best throughout these years and I'm like so grateful for everything they've done for me. She joined the team as a walk on her freshman year giving it her all for three seasons. Now the team. The team, giving back to her.

I like don't even really fully like remember what I was thinking in that moment. And I truly like felt like the love from every single person in that room. A great moment. All right. Thanks so much for watching Top Story. I'm Tom Yamis in York. Stay right there. More news on the way.