Toronto Mike'd: The Official Toronto Mike Podcast - Acie Earl: Toronto Mike'd #1385

Episode Date: December 7, 2023

In this 1385th episode of Toronto Mike'd, Mike chats with OG Toronto Raptor Acie Earl about the inaugural Raptors season, dropping 40 against the Boston Celtics, his new book 135 Of The Most Influential Hip-Hop & Rap Songs Of All Time And Why and 13 Rules. Toronto Mike'd is proudly brought to you by Great Lakes Brewery, Palma Pasta, Ridley Funeral Home, Electronic Products Recycling Association, Raymond James Canada and Moneris. If you would like to support the show, we do have partner opportunities available. Please email Toronto Mike at [e-mail]

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An award-winning podcast from Moneris. Hosted by FOTM, Al Gregogo and Ridley Funeral Home, pillars of the community since 1921. Today, making his Toronto Mic'd debut is OG Toronto Raptor AC Earl. Welcome to Toronto Mic'd OG Toronto Raptor, A.C. Earl. Welcome to Toronto Mic'd, OG Toronto Raptor, A.C. Earl. How's it going, sir? It's going well. May I call you Big Ace?

That's a blast from the past, but yeah, of course. I got that from your book. I didn't realize what a prolific author you are. I mean, you just wrote a book about the 135 significant hip-hop songs. I'll get the right title here. Hold on. I want to get the right title here.

Most influential. Right. Most influential. So 135 of the most influential rap and hip hop songs and why, and we're going to get into that. But how many books have you written? Oh, I think I'm on 16 now. I just finished my Coach Earl's Rules of Basketball book for kids and parents.

This is my latest. So I wrote four this year. So I'm just, I got the bug, man. I just, I sit and watch games and just write. I got the bug. Watch out, Stephen King. No, I doubt that. What is your, I mean, again, we're going to get into the book

because I'm a huge hip-hop fan. And there's one hip-hop band, if you will, that I want to get into it with you because it's my favorite of all time. And I had the pleasure of having somebody from this group on Toronto Mike. So we're going to get into the book, 135 of the most influential rap and hip-hop songs and why. What is the process when you write a book? Because when I read your book, because I read this one, and it's almost like we're in your brain man like it's a stream of consciousness like it's almost like you write the way you talk and i i quite dig it yes um i've had to work on that because

it's like you're you you assume the reader knows what i'm saying. So like I'm writing it as I'm talking to my, one of my best friends, Hans, you know, who was my college roommate. And as I'm writing it, I have to kind of like I'm talking to him and he's talking to me. So we're like going back and forth, like make sure you get this, make sure you get that.

And without him, I would have never been able to write it because, you know we grew up on hip hop he's from New York or he's from Vermont but he's an avid New Yorker he lived in New York he's the one who got me into that whole east coast like super hip

hop like I was you know being from the midwest you know like we loved everything. Anything would it be anything that was new. So, I mean, like, you know, like we got into the West Coast scene just as much as we got into the South scene or the even the Michigan scene, you know, with MC Breed, you know, before Eminem. And so like him being from the East Coast, he didn't get into any of that, you know? And so it was like, we were educating each other every night. Like we'd stay up till three, four in the morning.

We'd have eight o'clock classes. And he, he just basically worked. He worked at a, he worked at a bookstore, which got me into writing later and reading. And he would just save his money and buy music. And he'd buy music his money and buy music. And he'd buy music every Tuesday at the record store. And we'd just be debating, debating, debating if this is good, if it's not. You know, who produced it?

Who's the DJ? Right. And like, yeah. So Hans gets a co-writing credit on this one. Yes, yep. Hans, yep. Hans, yes. Right.

Now, that's like a teaser because we're gonna get into this i can't wait to mix it up with you 135 of the most influential rap and hip-hop songs and why but it's not every day i get an og toronto raptor on the program my friend i i recorded that first game to vhs that was a big deal to me that Toronto had a NBA franchise. One of my best favorite games of all time. Well here, let me ask you about one game in particular and then I'm going to pick your brain

about that first season. This is what I wrote on TorontoMic.com. I don't write books, but I write blog entries. The eve of the Raptors' first NBA championship, I wrote the following, and this is a direct quote.

Win it for A.C. Earl, who got me all excited when he dropped 40 points against the Celtics. Against my old team in the New Garden. You're the first Toronto Raptor to score 40 points in a game.

Yes, and Tracy Murray did not take to that very kindly. Okay, well, we're going to get into Tracy. Sorry, go ahead. Yeah, and I think he got the record like, I think I had 40 for like a week and a half or something like that. And he broke my record. And that was like the tail end of the 1996 season, right? I think it was April 12 when you dropped the 40.

Okay. So a lot of places I want to go. By the way, if people are curious, game one, Alvin Robertson scored 30. So he was the first Raptor to, I think he's the first Raptor to 10, 20, and 30. You're the first. No, I was first Raptor to 10.

Okay. Yeah. So I believe I have four records wrapped the records i'm the first raptor to score double digits in a game or yeah to get to 10 first raptor to make a free throw first raptor to block a shot and i think i had i was first raptor to score 16 grab 16 rebounds in a quarter or in a game, and then Marcus can't be beat at like a week later. I had a couple records. I have a couple records.

Okay, but that first Raptor to score 40, and I know you said that record didn't last for very long, but did you get that box score printed, and is it in a frame somewhere? I'd frame that box score. Yeah, I did keep it for a long time. I think I did. I didn't frame it, but I did keep it and note it in a frame somewhere? I'd frame that box score. Yeah, I did keep it for a long time. I think I did. I didn't frame it, but I did keep it and note it.

Yeah, it was just weird. I looked up. It was like you're having one of those games, and I look up, and it's like five minutes to go in the second quarter, and I had 22 points. I was just like, wow. Then all the rest of the guys were like, hey, this is your night. This is your night.

And that's one fun thing about the NBA. It's like when it's your night, the guys are just going to keep feeding you, you know, just feeding you. So they ran everything for me that night. And, yeah, it was a great night. But they have to like you to do that, right? Like you must have been. Of course.

Of course. Of course. So, yeah, I mean, like that that like those first two years were just it was like a i remember we we were just together and with um the og rappers reunion and i remember marcus camby we were we were talking and he goes it was like a ut it was a bad team, but we are going to revisit. There's only a couple of highlights, really. You know, that big opening day win, and then you guys, you beat the Chicago Bulls. Yeah, I mean, you know, for what we had to go through, like, you know, talking to Isaiah,

like I end up later on, I went back to get my master's, two master's degrees, and I started teaching at the university, and I taught sport and rec business for a while. So I got into the business of sports. And one of the things that I did not realize is the NBA made our salary cap under half of what every team was. And so Isaiah had to continue to tweak the roster by cutting and trading guys to get under the salary cap. And so, I mean, if we didn't have to trade and get under the salary cap, we were on pace to have the best record as an expansion franchise.

I had no idea. That sounds like the game is rigged. That doesn't sound fair. Yeah, so I think Isaiah told me that year the salary cap was $30 million or $32 million, and our salary cap was $17 million. And I asked him why was the case, and he said because they were afraid the new teams would come in and outbid the other teams. And we were like, well, who cares? It's like if you are the Kings or somebody on the other team, you've had years to get it together,

so why penalize the new teams if they want to spend money? And we were already kind of behind the eight ball because a lot of players didn't want to play in Canada, right? 30%, yeah. That was the other thing. For me, being from Iowa, I had a good relationship with B.J. Armstrong. Right.

And I was super psyched for him to be, you know, to come in the draft. And I was like, oh, this is going to be great. And all the Iowa fans were all, you know, were all giddy about it. And I was like, and then I heard like B.J. wasn't coming. And I was like, oh, man, you know, because it was so much. Uncertainly, people didn't know we were I was like, oh, man. You know? Because it was so much uncertainly. People didn't know if we were going to get paid in Canadian dollars, if we didn't know what the tax rates were. So agents were, like, super leery.

Like, I'm not sending my guys up there. You know, do the Nike deals, crossover, because you're signed with Nike or Adidas. Right. But not Nike, Adidas, and Canada. And it's like, you know, it was so much, you know, that a lot of guys didn't want to go. I heard once Michael Jordan saying that his kid's favorite NBA player was B.J. Armstrong.

Well, yeah, you know, B.J. had a great relationship with Mike. Michael told him, hey, in order for this to work, we're going to put you in the corner and be a shooter off that triangle. And BJ was probably the first modern player to hit the corner three. And he basically, for lack of a better term, he started the corner three, like making the corner three. And if you go back to one of the times they went to the White House, I can't remember. I think it was Bill Clinton.

He asked Michael to make a shot. And Michael didn't want to do it. And he played BJ do it. And he said, BJ, go to the corner. And they passed him the ball and he hit a corner three in the corner at the White House. Amazing. passed him the ball, and he hit a quarter three in the corner at the whiteout. Amazing.

And just, I did read this in the book, but remind everybody, like how you came to know BJ at such a young age. Like high school, right? Go ahead. Yeah, I was recruited from, you know, to go to Iowa. And he was a senior, junior, senior, you know, or a sophomore when I was getting recruited. So I knew him and the other, you know, better players, Roy Marble and Eddie Horton, some of the other players that were there.

So I knew B.J. from very, you know, young age in high school. And then when I went to college, obviously, and then playing with the Celtics during our conference. So we played them four to six times a year. So we had a very good relationship. And he'd come back and he'd do golf things with us for the university. And he came for football games. And he came to play and watch us play in the fall before he went.

So we had a great relationship. So like I said, I was super psyched and hoping to go to Toronto with him and play. And it was like, boom, at the drop of a dime, it just disappeared. Oh no, tell me about it. So let's talk about the Celtics leaving you unprotected in that expansion draft.

How did you feel when A, they left you unprotected, and then B, when the Raptors actually selected you? Well, here's some, like, some little funny parts about it. So the last game of my Celtic year, my second year, we play in Miami, the Heat. And John Sally was there, played against him. And as I'm going out the door, Sally tells me, I'll see you in Toronto and I said what

he goes oh I'll see you in Toronto so apparently he had been talking to Isaiah like Isaiah knew what he was going to kind of do and he had been talking to players that he might get. And so Sally knew that. And Sally was kind of being the recruiter of Isaiah. Interesting. And so I had an inkling I could go to Toronto. And then obviously when they left me unprotected, nobody knew what was kind of going on. Agents were very mum about it. They didn't have a lot of insight.

So, yeah, it was kind of a slap in the face a little bit, being a first-round draft pick. But to their defense, each team could only protect eight players. So eight of the twelve. So four players of each team were unprotected.

Right, right. Now, okay, so if you don't mind, I'm going to maybe ask you about uh your fellow day oners with the toronto raptors in 1995 oh but before i do that actually so the celtics leave you unprotected and that's you know you got a you got pride that might have hurt a little bit does that you know add to the uh the 40 points you drop on them on apr 12, 1996? Oh yeah. Because I looked around at that roster and I said, a lot of those guys

couldn't guard me in practice. So I don't think they can guard me in the game. So it was funny that night, I think eight guys guarded me. I'm glad you pointed out that you're the first Raptor to 10 points. I feel like that should be more widely known,

but everybody just remembers Alvin Robertson dropping, I think it was. Yeah, yeah. One of the original Raptors. He's a great guy. He was a great locker room influence. Isaiah brought him in from Detroit. But more importantly, Isaiah knew this. Alvin had somehow had a good relationship with Michael Jordan,

and they had battles in Milwaukee, and Alvin was a great defender. So Isaiah brought him in specifically to guard Michael Jordan, and that's what he did. Now, I have noticed as a big Toronto Raptor fan that they sort of kind of semi erased Alvin Robertson from the history of this franchise because of some difficulties he had in life

but in your experience Alvin Robertson good guy yeah Alvin Robertson would do anything for you man he would he helped the young guys he taught us how to work out Robinson would do anything for you, man. He would, like, he helped the young guys. He taught us how to work out. You know, he taught us how to come early, stay late.

I mean, Alvin was like a pro. Alvin was a pro. Alvin was in the NBA 12 years. Maybe more before he came to Toronto. You know, he came from that San Antonio tree. He came from that Milwaukee tree with those. I mean, so. You know, he came from that San Antonio, you know, tree. He came from that Milwaukee tree with those.

I mean, so, you know, he knew how to play. He knew how to win. You know, I was in Detroit. It kind of messed up a little bit. He had some injuries. And so, I mean, bringing him in was a smart move on Isaiah's part, for sure. All right. So what was it like playing with, you know, Mighty Mouse himself,

Damon Stoudemire? Well, you know, for a lot of us, me, like, we didn't see a lot of the Pac-12 games because we were East Coast in Midwest. So, like, you know, you heard about this guy, this little guard. But, you know, early on in those years before, he wasn't the best player, right? It was those other guys that came from Arizona, like Gilbert Arenas

and some of those other guys. And you're like, you know, Mike Bibby, and you're like, okay, he wasn't the best player. So he kind of had to woo us over, to be honest with you. The only one who maybe really knew about him was Tracy Murray because he was a West Coast guy. But the rest of us really didn't really know his game. Yeah, well, famously when he was drafted by the Raptors, Raptor fans booed him.

They said, no, we don't want Damon Stoudemire. So you're right. He was a big unknown here. Right. And that's to Isaiah's credit because Isaiah was a small guard and Isaiah loved guard. Everywhere Isaiah went, even with New York, he brought in Marbury and Steve Francis. Isaiah is a guard guy and so um Isaiah saw something in him that obviously nobody did why didn't you start that first game

well the the rotation was pretty much set like Oliver Miller was our starting center I think Tabak was the backup. And then I was fighting to be the third backup with a bunch of guys. And, you know, some of the veteran guys like Sally and Massenburg and Sharone Wright, I think maybe, I don't know if Sharone had came there or not. But so the first year, the first game, our last exhibition game, people don't know.

And this is why I got that opportunity is is we had a bench-clearing brawl, and those guys got suspended for a game. I think Oliver got suspended. Maybe Sharone Wright got suspended. At least two or three guys got suspended, so everybody got kind of bumped up. I probably don't get those records if those guys don't get suspended. So everybody got kind of bumped up. So I mean I probably don't get those records if those guys don't get suspended. So

I tell guys all the time, stay ready. Stay ready because you never know when your opportunity is going to be. Right. You never know when opportunity is going to knock. You're full of mind blows today. You're the first Raptor to 10 points. I did not realize that and I didn't realize that that all came together. So the starter, by the way,

the starter in that first game was Jean Tabak. Yeah, I was going to say, yeah, Tabak. It should have been Oliver Miller, but he was suspended. Of course. All right, another guy I remember from those early teams here, and again, we're going to dive into that book very, very soon, but Doug Christie.

Doug Christie seemed to be kind of the glue of those early teams. What was it like playing with Doug? Yeah, you know, Doug came from Toronto. I mean, I'm sorry, came from New York. And so he came in that whole Pat Riley, which was kind of like a mesmerizing thing. Like, what do the Knicks do? Like, how do they operate? Like, how's Pat Riley?

And, you know, So when he came, he was like all business. Like he was taping for shoot arounds. He was working out early, working out late. And I, we were like, what, what's going on? And he was like, man, that's the, that's the, that's the Nick way. That's Pat Riley. So he brought in all that Pat Riley, New York professionalism. And so that kind of taught us a little bit more about, you know, what the higher echelon is, you know, of basketball. So that was great to have that, you know, with Doug Christie.

And he was a pro, man. He was there. He was kind of in the same boat a little bit. He had been discarded by the Lakers. He felt being discarded by the Knicks. So he was there to get his career back on track. He wasn't here for any games. Right.

Who was your best friend on that OG Raptors team? I wouldn't say I had a best friend. There was about five of us that were really tight. Tracy, which I've known Tracy since I was 16, playing AAU and playing basketball camps together. Tracy, Damon, Popeye Jones the next year, I think maybe. Popeye, me and Popeye knew each other since 18, 19, playing in the Olympic tryouts together.

Carlos Rogers, Big O, Jimmy King, who played at Michigan. I love those Michigan teams, I'll just say say I was a big fan of the Cavs. Yeah, so he was my rookie. So I took care of Jimmy. So he was my rookie. So, I mean, it was about four or five of us were really tight. It was like four or five of us that were kind of like the core guys. Well, one of the names you mentioned, Oliver Miller,

I always felt he was quite the character. What was it like being on the court with oliver miller he was he was a character so one of the best stories i put in my 55 best earl story book is uh you know he battled weight issues a lot of his career and so one of the things like in order for him to to eat healthy is the team would have a fruit basket sent to his room on the road. And so he knew I ate fruit. I love fruit, right? And that's like my healthy snack. So he would pay me to come down or he'd knock on the door. And it was funny because Hans was in New York one time. We're staying at like the Dumont Plaza or somewhere downtown and Hans is

there visiting me on it. And sure enough, the door knocks and it's Oliver Miller with the fruit basket. So he gives me the fruit basket. My job is to eat the fruit. And then, so I gave Hans like a pear. And I said, no, no, no, no, you can't throw anything away. We got to save it because the trainer is going to come back to his room to see if there's any peels and cores. That's amazing. That's amazing.

That's amazing. Okay, I love it, man. For a year and a half, I got a free fruit basket. That sounds like I'm a big fruit junkie, too. Oh, listen, that one in New York was the big one, right? With the nuts and the bananas and the coconut and the pineapple. Oh, it was funny, man. Sounds amazing.

What was it like when you beat the Bulls? Because they only, what, how many, they didn't lose, I think they lost nine games that season. Nine or ten. Nine or ten, yeah. You know, we were built for that because people don't realize Brendan Malone was the assistant for Detroit. He's the one who wrote the Jordan rules

so like every day in practice he would reference like something about the Bulls something about Scottie Pippen something about Phil Jackson something about Jordan and it's like we were subliminally beat over the head like how we were going to beat the triangle. So, like, we knew how to beat the triangle. We just had to execute it. So it was like a relief because we did it, but it was like it wasn't a surprise because, like, I'm a big X and O guy, you know, when I coach.

So the stuff he was saying made perfect sense. You know, he was like, hey, when Pippen catches it here, they're going to do this. When Kerr's here, he's going to the corner. When Jed Bushler's here, they're going to do this. And we just executed it. So it was like if anybody was going to beat him, it was going to be us because of Brendan Malone.

I mean, it was all Brendan Malone, to be honest. And we just lost Brendan, sadly. Yep, yep, yep, yep. It's fun to see his son coach because he has the same mannerisms and the same fire that Brendan had. So when you do end up beating the Bulls, that was like your NBA championship, I guess, back in the 95-96 season. Yeah, and the other part about it, as people don't know,

is, you know, Alvin and John Sally threw the party. And so that was the whole thing is, you know, can we get them out? And, you know, and so, like, I think half the team was out because I think, like, Tabak's job was to take Tony Cucco out. So, you know, because they played with each other in the Olympic things. And so, like, you know, so, like, I remember I walked into that party and it was unreal. You saw Rodman.

You saw Pippen. You saw MJ. And it was like wild. Apparently those guys were out until like 4 or 5 in the morning. Oh, you know what, man? That's a wild little tidbit here. Keep them coming. Oh, you didn't hear about the party.

You got to talk to somebody about that party. That party was one of the most unbelievable parties I've ever been to. Yeah, that's unbelievable. I got to get some more detail on that. So do you remember any of the Toronto-based media that was covering that first Raptors team? The CA, what is it, CATV? Oh, CTV.

Yeah, CTV, yeah. I think CTV was the big one. So do you remember, like, for example, do you remember, you know, oh, Rod Black was calling games, or Leo Rodens? Oh, yeah, yeah, for sure, Rod. And, oh, yeah, and we loved, you know, we didn't put it together at the time, Oh yeah. For sure Rod. Oh yeah.

We didn't put it together at the time but Mark Jones' brother. Yeah, Paul. So Paul was on the plane with us all the time. Right. He's still calling games. Absolutely.

With Eric Smith. Yeah. Amazing. We're about to talk hip hop, but I do want to touch on your post NBA, your post NBA career, because I was unaware, but then of course, before I talked to you, I did a little homework and it's kind of wild. Like your career overseas, you played in France, you played in australia you years 12 countries yeah turkey i could run them all down russia poland austria montenegro you ended up coaching in mexico

like that like what was that like and how do these uh you know international leagues compare to the nba well you know for talent wise it's not overall 1 to 12 it's not there's no comparison but um this a lot the style of play and level of play is very very good especially at the euro league level and so like um you know when i was playing on most of those countries you had one or two amer Americans playing on each team that had NBA experience. So like my first year in Turkey, I believe there were 12 or 15 guys that were on an NBA roster the year before. And that's not even including some of the European players.

And so, yeah, my first year in Turkey, I played against four European guys that played in the NBA. Mehmet Turchan who played for Houston. Hideo Turkoglu obviously played for the Kings in Orlando. Mimit Okur who played for Pistons. I played against those

guys overseas. It's like there's some players, like I said, 1-12 there is no comparison. You had one or two guys on each team, on each league, that could play or had played in the NBA, for sure. I mean, I had a good run.

I had three MVPs in eight years. Good for you. Okay, yeah. That was fascinating to read up on. By the way, lest we forget, Hedo, Turkoglu, and you have something in common. That, that was fascinating to, to read up on. By the way, less we forget Hito Turkoglu and you have something in common. You're both former Raptors. Did he play for the Raptors?

You know what? The best quote ever from him. Cause at some point he kind of quit on the team and then they were in the post game interview. Uh, they were asking him about a play or something and he just said the word ball, ball.

Like that's all he would say. It's like, he was just like quiet quitting or something. But yeah, he did play for the Raptors. Really? We're trying to, we're trying to forget about it, but it did, it did happen. I would have lost that bet. Wow.

Did you think back in 1995 when you're, and by the way, condolences that you had to play in that dome, that's got to be a terrible environment. I loved the great man the dome was great what did you like about it because it just seemed so cavernous for a basketball game um i love that it had so many people and it was just it it made it feel like we were on a stage it made it feel like we were so important and and i remember the guys used to talk about that like alvin and john sally and some guys were like hey man we got to put on a big

show and there's a lot of people here and this is like their only time seeing us so at home man like we we kind of took that to heart i mean i mean i liked it i didn't really like a couple times you know we played in the where the Maple Leaf played. Maple Leaf Gardens. Yeah, a couple of times we played there. I didn't like that. That was, to me, more compact. I liked the Skydome.

Maybe it's because that was our first year, but, I mean, I really liked it. Okay, okay. Well, yeah, I guess in 1999, I guess it was called the Air Canada Centre, but now they call it the Scotiabank Arena. Yeah, Air Canada. Okay, so did you dare dream that back in 1995 when we had that strange salary cap and we didn't have a great season because how could we?

But did you think one day that franchise would win the nba championship i would say a hard no i would say even we didn't even know if it was gonna survive um you know what we were doing was a lot of us were trying to resurrect our career. Like, and that was our only, like, goal. Like, a lot of us were like, hey, we're out. If it don't work here, it ain't going to work, right? And, like, you know, we joke about the first week of training camp, Isaiah cut two guys that were guaranteed maybe $8 or $9 million with eight years on their contracts.

So it was like it could be over really fast. And nobody wanted that. A lot of guys were like, no. So it was like you did anything you could do, right? And so it was like even though you're out here playing and you're out here trying to build a franchise, you have no idea where it's going to go. You know, we're just kind of streamlined to get our careers off the path.

You know what I mean? So it was like, we don't even know if this franchise is going to be here next year, right? I mean, nobody knew how they were getting paid. The banking stuff wasn't even set up. People didn't know if you had to send your checks back home. I mean, people didn't have work visas still. People were filling out paperwork for that. I mean, it was like people had girlfriends and wives who still had to come up.

They hadn't had any housing, anything set up. We all stayed in the Sky Dome. So it was like, you know, championship is way far off than just trying to live. You know what I'm saying? People trying to live. You were trying to survive. How do you get your car across the border? Like, does anybody have a car coming? How do we get a car across the border? Like, does anybody have a car coming?

How do we get a car? Do we license it there? Do we get a Canadian driver's license? Like, what do we, how do we operate here? Like, yeah. Wow. And of course, the Vancouver Grizzlies don't make it. So that could have been our fate, I suppose.

Yes, yes. I mean, we're all this close from being a Vancouver Grizzly. You know what I mean? It goes one way or the other. You know, that was the other part of it is like the NBA made both teams draft from every team. So we went into camp with like 22 guys. Each team had 22 guys with 12 roster spots. It wasn't that hard to figure out.

12 roster spots, 22 guys, guaranteed contracts. Somebody's not going to be here. Wow. So in 2019, when the Raptors, you know, make the NBA championship, do you feel, uh, any, any pride that, uh, you know, you were there? A hundred percent, a hundred percent. I mean, the last, the last five, you know, five to eight years have been very great for me as a former player, you know, being the Raptors had won it, the Boston Celtics success, the Milwaukee Bucks success, all my former teams.

So it's like, it's like, it kind of like gives my career some validation, right? Like, hey, I played for an NBA champion, you know? So even though we didn't, you know, we weren't as near as good as any of those teams when I played. But I mean, yeah, so I can say all three of my former teams in my adult life have won an NBA championship, which is great. Amazing. Uh, and I, I touched on your coaching career real quick, but, uh, the Tijuana dragons, like, so what was it like managing the Tijuana dragons?

Um, well, you know, it's like, as I was playing overseas, I had tons of my former teammates and ex-teammates and players i played against all went into coaching i was like one of the last guys to still play and so a lot of my friends were like hey man you got to get into coaching you got to get into coaching and so i tore my achilles tendon in croatia that last year, 2004. And so I was going to do high school to kind of get back in and see if I really wanted to do it. And nobody would hire me in high school. So I just started going like, okay,

emailing semi-pro and pro and college guys. And so this is, that was the first organization that hired me. So it was great because it taught me about organization and management and recruiting players, you know, because we had to recruit players. So I kind of felt like Isaiah, like I'm recruiting guys to come down and play in Mexico. So I made sure, like I had to make sure I had all this stuff. So people were asking me, where am I going to live? How am I going to

get around? How do we get paid? Where do we eat? Where do I need to get in the country? So like, I was doing all that for the players. And so, you know, I had an owner, I didn't really want to spend any money. So it was kind of hard. And I had a manager who really wanted to play, who never played before. So I had to save a roster spot for him so um it taught me a lot and i was able to go and you know coach and a couple others to my pro league playing coaching the cba as well so he got he got he got my coaching career started okay so here we are in 2023 it's been 50 years of hip-hop and you and you you you've been around for all 50 of those years. When did you first fall in love with hip hop?

Do you remember the first song? Like, do you remember the first hip hop song? Yeah, I probably had a couple. I probably had a couple moments. I don't know which one was first. I remember one time going back to my grandmother's house. They were from Cameron and Gary, Indiana. We were there in the summer, and we used to go out to the park and play, you know, hoop and everything.

And that was like the neighborhood place. And so, you know, you'd see guys shooting dice and pitching pennies. And then you would see guys break dancing, and somebody had a jam box. And I think the first song I may have heard was Curtis Blow the Breaks. Or basketball. One of those two. That would make sense if you heard basketball, right? They're playing basketball.

We love that basketball. They're playing basketball We love that basketball They're playing basketball We love that basketball They're playing basketball. We love that basketball. All right, basketball, number one, Earth Flow. Basketball is my favorite sport.

I like the way they dribble up and down the court. Just like I'm the king on the microphone. So is Dr. J and Moses Malone. I like slam dunks and taking it to the hoop. My favorite play is and Moses Malone. I like slam dunks, I'm taking it to the hoop. My favorite play is the alley-oop. I like the pick and roll, I like the give and go. Cause it's basketball, Mr. Kirch's show. They're playing basketball.

We love that basketball. They're playing basketball. We love that basketball I used to go to dinner to take the girls To see Tiny play against Earl the Pearl And Will, Ringo, and Jerry West Play basketball at it's very best Basketball has always been my thing I like Magic Bird and Bernard King And number 33, my man Kareem Is the center of my starting team TMLX 14 is Saturday.

That's Saturday, December 9th from noon to 3 p.m. It's at Palma's Kitchen in Mississauga. We're going to drink Great Lakes beer. We're going to eat delicious Palma pasta. Al Grego, the host of Yes, We Are Open, the award-winning podcast from Mineris, will be there. Brad Jones from Ridley Funeral Home will be there. Cliff Hacking from EPRA.

They're the good people behind RecycleMyElectronics.ca. He'll be there. Cliff Hacking from EPRA. They're the good people behind recyclemyelectronics.ca. He'll be there. Chris Cooksey, the host of the Advantaged Investor Podcast from Raymond James Canada. He won't be there. Boo. I just hope that you'll be there. I can't wait to see you. I just hope that you'll be there. I can't wait to see you. Cam Gordon has some tricks up his sleeve. We're going to have a great time. So carve out a little time between noon and 3 p.m.

I carve out all three hours, but I'm not the boss of you. Come to Palma's Kitchen on December 9th for TMLX 14. See you there. They're playing basketball We love that basketball They're playing basketball We love that basketball They're playing basketball We love that basketball. They're playing basketball. We love that basketball.

Yeah, so that was like the song, like basketball. And I was like, wow. And he's talking to all these players and all my dad used to talk about. So that was a defining moment, hearing the message. Grandmaster Flash, the message, that was a defining moment. And I think Rock the, or not Rock the Bells, but Run DMC, it's like that you know and Crush Groove

which most of those songs I know to this day I can lip sync all the words to this day so like that was like the moment where I was like this is like man like I want to do this like I want to like

have a Kangol and have a big gold chain and have a nice sweatsuit. And this is what I want to do. Like, basketball was not there for me yet. I didn't know if I could play. I mean, I was good, but I wasn't that good. But I wanted to be a rapper like that day. That's what I wanted to do.

You know, you don't have to choose right you can be both right right like Shaq right like Shaq now okay so on that note did you have a sudden growth spurt like I'll never know what it's like to be what are you 6'10 what are you I'm 6'11 I was tall. I was the tallest kid in kindergarten. My mom used to have the picture where you go to kindergarten and you have the vision and the hearing. And you have all the kids lined up. And it was all these kids. And it was me right here. So I was always a tall kid.

I did have a growth spurt, though. I had a growth spurt at my sophomore year in high school. I grew six inches. I started out at like 6'2", 6'3". And then by the end of my sophomore year, I was 6'8". I'm still waiting for my growth spurt. So maybe it'll come on any day now. Yeah, man.

Just drink some milk. Well, you know what they say, man. You can't teach height. So that was... True. I'm sure that seeing you after that growth spurt, particularly, uh, everybody's trying to put a basketball in your hand, right? I mean, I mean, I was, I was, I was, by that time I was, I was kind of good now by that time.

So I was started at sophomores, but I played varsity at the end of that year. So I played varsity as a sophomore in the end. I was starting to be good, and I was starting to get local recognition. I started getting invited to some summer camps, some exposure camps. So it was starting to kind of take place, right? Like basketball could be a thing. So I was on my way. but you wanted to be a rapper like how was your flow like how did you sound i mean i mimicked i mean i've made like i wasn't good

as ll i was more like a run dmc like run dmc was my favorite group until wu-tang so like i was more of a russell, DMC type of guy. I aspired to rap as good as LL, but LL's vocabulary was, like, impeccable. So that's also started me to get into more, like, English and vocabulary because LL. So it was like, I mean, the bar was high. I mean, you had, like, Rakim and Big Daddy Kane and then Chuck D with Public Enemy. So like, you know, 85 to 88, like rap was really taking off. And it was like tons of guys coming out.

Like that was the era of rap where all you had to do was come out with a single. You came out with a single or sold record labels would record your album. So it was a single coming out all the time. Like the first guys who came out all had singles, like Big Daddy Kane, like Rakim, like Biz Markie. All those guys had singles, nice and smooth. You know, then the album came, you know, Stetsasonic. I mean, you could go, you know, for days on all these guys

who just came out with singles. And that was the thing. It was a single. The DJ would spin it and play it, and the record label would give an album. That's how the rap game started. Why 135? Like, why not 150 or 100?

Because you run down, basically. It was funny. Yeah, go ahead. Yeah, so me and Hans, we talked. Like, I don't know, like, you know, when you start to kind of research and stuff and you're talking about rap and all that stuff, stuff starts coming up in your feed, right?

So, you know, I see the top 10 hip hop, top 10 of all time, top 10 of all this, top 10 East Coast, top 10 West Coast, top 10 modern. So then I'm, you know, I'm talking to Hans and he goes, yeah, man, that's hard to pick top 10. And I go, yeah, you know, like what if we did a book of all time? So we did all time. We got to, we got to 20, then we got to like 50. And then as I'm talking to other people and I'm bouncing, we're bouncing in more and he's texting me,

we're texting back each other on this, on tech chain we got to 7500 so then i'm like okay but we're still missing some people so i think i was going to go to 110 and then i got to like 125 and i had five or ten people i thought still i bounced it off of hans i said hans you know you know give me these last people that could be in. So we went to 135. So we went to 135, and I think that was probably enough. I think if you go to 150, I think now you're just kind of scraping the bottom of the barrel. So, yeah, I got to 135 because I think that everybody had something.

There's a lot of guys that have something, not a lot of guys, a lot of people or groups, individuals that had something to give. And it's not a ranking. That's the thing people are trying to go at me like, hey, man, why do you have them at this number? No, it's impossible to rank. It's impossible to rank. And it's impossible to pick their best because their best to you is is different than me sure but what i noticed is uh speaking of hans is that every once in a while you you'll you'll be honest with us and you'll be like you were on the fence with

a song but hans wants it in there like one of the and i happen i happen to love this song but black sheeps the choice is yours like i feel feel like Hans got that on the list. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Hans is the one who put me on Black Sheep. I was not on Black Sheep early. And that was not one of the most popular songs that were played. That was the one that kind of got it going. So that's why we put it in there,

because that kind of got that whole movement going right and that's with chia lee and i think another group that else was you know in that hole so i mean yeah i mean like i said if i couldn't have done this without hans right you know because he's he's the hip-hop aficionado like you, in the later years, since he kind of went underground, and I still kind of follow rap a lot, but, you know, the early hip-hop, like all the Black Moon, like he got me on Black Moon. I wasn't on Buckshot Shorty. He got me on Helter Skelter and all those guys.

Like, he got me on Company Flow. He got me on a lot of groups that I would have never got on, you know? So the book is called 135 of the most influential rap and hip hop songs. And why? And I'm going to ask you about one band in particular that we both love. But why don't you tell everybody, you know,

how can they get a copy of this book? Like, how would you like it? Amazon. Thank God for Amazon. Okay, so Amazon. And then you'll discover A.C. Earle is the next Stephen King. He's got a whole bunch of books out there. I'm working on my spy book.

I'm working on my overseas spy book. Wow. I had no idea. I think we're going to educate a lot of people in the greater Toronto area today. Would you mind, and you go into great detail in your book, but can you tell us about Public Enemy and your love particularly for Flavor Flav, but you wore a clock around your neck. Yeah, well, actually, BJ gave me that nickname of Flavor, because I was, so like, after after run dmc like they kind of faded out

then my next group was public enemy and i love chuck d the stuff he was saying and he was kind of educating us with the whole black power movement and so like i you know since i really love rap i could always rap the song and give you the ad-libs. And so I was always rapping the song and doing the flavor phrase. Like, yeah, boy! And so BJ gave me the nickname, Flavor. Right. Cold, chilling in effect.

And then I used to always wear, like, I love a lot of flashy colors. Like, I love flashy colors. And so, like, you know, people are like, man, you always wear, like, you like flavor. Like, you're just flavorful. So, like, so BJ gave me that name. I used to wear the clock. I used to have the license plates even on my car. So all my cars said flavor one, flavor two.

cars all my cars said flavor one flavor two wow even some of my old some of my old um college roommate or college friends and teammates still call me flavor or flay because of that um and so yeah public enemy public enemy was hard for me because to me i liked um i like bring the noise like bring the noise and uh rebel without a pause yes those two when i heard those two i'm like yes like you know and when you heard that like on the street or people driving it was like yeah like you know what i mean but i think for the movement and what it meant for rap it's i mean fight the power is the song right for the movement to put it on the national level but i'll tell you where else you could have gone you could have went to brick i'm coming back to arizona like oh by the time i get to arizona Oh, by the time I get to Arizona. Oh, yeah, by the time I get to Arizona.

Yeah, my bad. Yeah, so you could put that one because that brought that to the political. Like, and everybody doesn't know what was going on in Arizona until that time, right? Right. And you could honestly say that song probably had an effect on what has gone on in Arizona

to this day. I could do a whole episode with you about Public Enemy. My two favorite hip-hop albums of all time are It Takes a Nation of Millions to Hold Us Back and Fear of a Black Planet. And I'm with you.

The song everybody goes to is Fight the Power, but i would say that uh it takes a nation of millions to hold us back with things like night of the living base heads for example oh yeah yeah i mean you could have gone with that one because it put the it could put the whole crack pandemic up into everybody's face like people didn't know what crack was and how you did it and what was you know what I'm saying so I mean I really love I remember the first time the first

album which was when I jump in my car people keep like cream Abdul Jabbar no matter who you are when you're up to par yeah sorry yeah yo bum rush the show. Right.

You know, and also we didn't even mention Black Steel and the Hour of Chaos, which, you know, might be my favorite Public Enemy song. Right, right, right. So it's a lot of stuff you could go with um with public enemy i mean they're just they're just i mean timeless right there's some groups that are timeless and they're like they're timeless have you ever met chuck d i think one time like that was one of the best things about playing in the NBA is you saw rappers at games.

I'm in my first away NBA game. I met C.L. Smooth from Pete Rock and C.L. Smooth. Wow. Which Hans put me on that. Hans put me on them. And I was like, I almost couldn't wait to get home and call Hans. I was like, you're not, that's who, you would not believe who I just saw. CL Smooth.

And I talked to him, and he was the coolest dude. But back to your original question, I don't know if I've met, maybe Chuck one time. Have you met Flav? I've met Flavor a couple times um I've seen a lot of guys I mean a lot of groups in person like the time I I call back and tell them I saw Wu-Tang um live and that was like the craziest concert I've ever seen in my life so my buddy RS uh Ray Dog, who's from Boston, they used to wear all the gold and hockey stuff because they hated the Celtics.

You know, he ended up making the group called Made Men, and then his buddy was the guy who vented the swords, right, Dave Mays from Harvard. So he was from Boston, and he used to take me to all these shows. And so he called me up one like Tuesday night and Thursday night and said, Hey, I'm going to work. We're performing in Providence. I said,

with who? He goes black sheep, which I did not have never heard of Wu Tang clan, which I have not heard of. And maybe helps us feel. I don't know and I said fine I'll go so I'm like watching Wu-Tang

and they're doing like Method Man and it's all nine of them on stage doing Method Man and I don't know who is who so I call up Hans after this I said man I don't know who this Wu-Tang is he goes yeah man I think their album comes out next week I said don't buy it man wow i said i said man you know they got this one guy like the

old dirty something and all he's doing is growling running around i think there may be one guy who was really good like method man maybe who had lyrics. But everybody else was just running around, jumping around, and screaming. And so he goes, all right, good to know. So actually, my stepbrother got me on. I didn't listen to Wu-Tang when it came out. I come home for the summer. My stepbrother had Wu-Tang on every day. And I started listening to it.

And I was like, okay, Riz's production is pristine. And then Hans got me on Ray and Ghost's Glaciers of Ice. He got the EP. He bought the cassette EP, Glaciers of Ice. That summer, we were, like, riding in my car, and we banged that Glaciers of Ice. And, like, oh, my God. Like, yo, yo, stay on the block. We run Guncock, Avalanche Rock, Get Paid Off, Mass Murderer Services,

Chef Make Em, Watch the Auto Cap Bake Em. Like, we listened to that every day. And then I became a Wu-Tang aficionado. So, like, I have pretty much every Wu-Tang CD ever made, every spinoff. I have Sons of Man, Killer Army, Shaheen, the group that was from Virginia. I can't remember them guys. The group that was from LA. I have the Venoms.

I have everything. So I'm a Wu-tang aficionado it's too funny to hear that uh initial take of yours that's called one of the great cold takes of all time which is uh yeah don't buy this okay that's hilarious here hey you you reference something in your book and i got to follow up on it uh you you mentioned that dj easy rock and rob bass the they were commissioned to do some kind of a raptor song yeah so um our second year coming back in the summer they got paid to come do some song for the raptors and so they they they flew a lot of us who wanted to do it. I think it was me, Tracy Murray,

Carlos Rogers, and maybe one other guy, maybe Jimmy King. So they fly us back to Toronto to do this for one day. They paid us, and we rapped on this song with them. I don't know if it ever came out. That's it, man. I didn't know about it.

Ask Elaine Kwan. Elaine Kwan, if you have Elaine Kwan stuff on Instagram or your email, Elaine Kwan was the one who put it together, so she might have it somewhere. Because I was searching YouTube, like, where is this, and how do I not know about it? And I can't find it,

so I'm going to have to do that, because if there's a DJ Easy Rock and Raw Bass Raptor song from, like, 1996 with all you cats on it, I need to hear this. Yeah. Yeah. I was a feature on there. No, I got to dig this up. That's amazing.

All right. What will be your next book? Oh, you mentioned you're already working on it, but you're prolific, man. What's your next book? So the next book is me playing overseas. So like, you know, I've pretty much written every genre of book basketball-wise. So I've written how to play overseas. I've written how to create a college athlete.

I've written books on like basketball drills. I've written, I've now gone on to my family history. I had, you know, we had a lot of passings in the past three or four years with my family. So a lot of our Earl stories, I'm the oldest of all the grandchildren and of my brothers. So I have a lot of Earl stories that were passed down. So I wanted to put them to paper so they're somewhere for our know our young you know siblings and everybody to walk to read so i have 55 of the best earl stories and 55 more so and there's some of the other some some stories that also pertain to me in basketball some of the funny things that's happened in my life

and so as i'm talking to other people they're like i don't i'm not into basketball not into sports i'm not into real life stuff because it makes me emotional i'm into like spy or thriller or you know something that is not real i want to be entertained can you write that so i'm just thinking like okay what can i write so like growing up like my my brothers, but my dad was a big James Bond guy. We used to watch all the James Bonds. And my dad was a big mystery guy. They used to watch Barnaby Jones and Mannix and Spencer for Hire and Columbo and Kojak and Perry Mason.

And so like all the, you know, all the mystery and cop movies. And so I said, you know what I'm going to do? I'm going to do myself as a spy as I'm playing overseas. So I'm playing basketball, but I'm a spy. I'm not really playing basketball playing basketball is my cover so in each country I have a secret mission I'm digging it

I'm digging it you can probably license that I'm thinking there was a TV show on in this country called Private Eyes which was Jason Priestley playing a hockey player who became a detective. And I'm thinking your premise there would make for an interesting scene.

Yeah, I'm smuggling treasure back. So in every country I went to, there's something that's really neat about the country. Like I played in Paris, and so in Paris, I'm smuggling back some Knights of the Templar stuff. In China, I'm smuggling back something from the Ming Dynasty. In Turkey, I'm smuggling, I'm doing something with like the King Sultan, like a King Sultan. So like every country, I'm doing something that could be true, but obviously it's not true. Okay, amazing. You're an OG Toronto Raptor,

but let me ask you about a OG Raptor co-founder, David Strickland. Yes. Tell me about your relationship with David Strickland, and then I need all the information you have on 13 rules. This is a funny story. Okay. So like he was with, you know, the ownership group and you know, back then we didn't really see those guys a lot. They came around and you have to understand they were only 30 something years old.

I mean, we were 20 something years old. So, you know, for a lot of it, it, it kind of, especially the older older guys they're the same age as those guys so it's like they kind of stayed away because they didn't want to kind of like seem that they were too young right which they were kind of in a sense right so yeah you saw them around but you didn't really see them around you didn't have a lot of interaction with them so you know strick had like some tv roots and some soft drink roots i think with some bottling companies i think later on we got with labats or molson i think he may have been instrumental in that so i think he always had some vision to do a song with the raptors but it never came to you you know, fruition.

And so when we went for this last Toronto Raptor OG reunion, so Elaine, you know, who was our PR lady and was a great person, Elaine Kwan is just the best. You know, she was doing all these interviews. And, you know, we're at CATV with this, you know, CTV here, this, and it's just, you know, it's five minutes here, it's two minutes here, it's cut and dry. They're not letting us get into anything less than what they want to do. You know, they have it all lined up.

So it's me, Tracy, Jimmy, I think came a little bit. And so, you know, we're trying to catch up with each other, but we can't because there's cameras around and we're laughing and joking and then, okay, stop. We've got to be serious. We've got to go to the next place. So finally when we're done, Elaine's like, hey, I need you guys to go over to this guy. He's doing a song. He wants you guys to do the chorus. So we have done four of these now from 7 a.m. to 11 a.m we didn't go to sleep the night before because we stayed up all night seeing each other you know hans was with me

as well we're talking about the book till four in the morning so we go there and we're like you know the music's going and then denage is there who was an ex-dancer and then there's another Raptor gal who was there who was an ex-Raptor gal. There's singers on this. So we're all catching up. Music's going. We're kind of unwinding now.

We're kind of being ourselves. And they're just like, got the cameras going and they're like, hey, do this. Say this. say this. So we're saying it and we're kind of like, you know, me being like the hip hop guy and like the creator, I'm like 13 rules. I'm kind of saying it like cash rules. I'm like 13 rules. You know, I'm kind of putting on like my rules. I'm like 13 rules. You know,

I'm kind of putting on like my Wu tank. Yeah. No part of it. So it's like the producers are like catching it and they're like, yeah, like, and I'm starting to add a little bit. Then Tracy's feeling it.

Jimmy's feeling it. And we're like, yeah, we're going to do it this way. So we kind of flip it and it becomes it takes its life of its own and so we just basically you know ad-libbed it flipped it a little bit made it a little bit more modern and there we go 13 rules in the winter of 1891 something had to be done 13 Rules We made the game, they love now From a small place, Almonte, came a ball game that went buck wild Who made the game?

James Naismith, he made the rules, the game came with 13 rules, the arrangement that we played with before they changed it 10 feet up, they lobbed the ball, at first they played with a soccer ball He got a degree in philosophy and Hebrew and he moved to Montreal Then he made a move to the States for school where he sparked the flame for the game we know Put the bird place no matter where it goes, it's Canada, Ontario We sparked that fire, we started the game We the north in our hearts before it had a name Thirteen rules, thirteen rules

From the Huskies to the Raptors, we run things this Accord Trust me, no cat boy we above rims above backboards we've been on we on it again like Vince Carter with his arm on the rim to all the vols show honor to them for bringing the team to Toronto to win we giving our best never comes slack every year we on that the message is clear like raw black raw black Stoudemire with the starting five and all the guys when they all combined took us on a hike, gave us our desire To spark the flame and start the fire 13 rules I can't hear you

13 rules What y'all say? 13 rules Say it again, say it again 13 rules Black or white or brown, it don't matter now Living life together in our hometown Celebrate the win like a champion In our mighty song, that's the real goal 13 rules. I can't hear you. 13 rules. Don't say 13 rules. Say it again.

Say it again. 13 rules. I guess it just goes to show what you can do if you have to. Okay, and the origin of the term 13 rules, of course, is James Naismith, who invented basketball. That was his original 13 rules of course is uh james naysmith who invented basketball that was his original 13 rules of basketball yeah so you know naysmith had a lot of ties to toronto and you know the kansas tie in basketball which i didn't know until you know strick was telling us about it so it's his kind of tie-in with the whole toronto and the whole franchise and the first game and you know and you know it's got the song has this i think in today's music and me and hodge

talk about this in old school hip-hop and music like you had to have some elements to make a good song back then back then you had to have a catchy chorus you had. Back then, you had to have a catchy chorus. You had to have some scratches. You had to have deep bass line. You had to have drum kicks. You had to have something, you know, to make it a sound, a sample. Like, it's just like with that public enemy, remember, without a pause, you hear that?

Like, so, like, with this song, this 13 Rules, he's got the beat. He's got the bass line. He's got the catchy chorus. He's got the singing. You know, it's like that singing now. Like you got to have somebody singing a little bit now, harmonizing. And he's got the rap part of it. And he's got the things in the rap. Like he's got the rap part of it and he's got the the things in the rap like he's got

the vince carter with the hand and like you know he's got some elements of the song that you're like yeah this can work this can work this can work so to me it checks all the boxes to me okay wild that's that's uh very interesting uh the goal Rules, Inc. is to bridge the gap between music, basketball, and cultures. So good on you for being part of that mandate. Yeah, I mean, any part of music. You know, with me, I love music. I love to take the culture anywhere you could take it, you know. And shout out to Drake.

I put him in the book. I struggled with Drake. And then I said, you know what to Drake. I put him in the book. I struggled with Drake. And then I said, you know what? You got to put Drake in the book because he legitimized Canadian rap, you know? And I mean, I'm, you know, I'm old enough to remember Snow, right? I met Snow. I met Snow at a nightclub in Toronto one night. And nobody knew who he was.

And I'm like, you're Snow. He's like knew who he was and I'm like you're snow he's like you know me I'm like yeah man I got your album 12 inches of snow yeah 12 inches of snow so I'm like yeah man I said I know you like what are you doing now he's like uh I don't do

anything I'm like man you ever have a show let me know man I'm come watch you we exchanged numbers I never heard from him again. Oh, well, listen, I can hook you up. I just talked to his manager about him coming on Toronto Mic'd and sitting in the basement here. So, yeah, big Snow fans here. Yeah, I think I called Hans

that night. I go, yo, man, guess who I saw? He goes, who? I said, Snow, man. He goes, really? I said, yeah. By the way, you mentioned scratching. I just want to go put on the record now that I, maybe it's because I'm an old fart here, but I miss scratching in my hip-hop. It seems to have gone away. You don't hear

the ones and the twos anymore. Hans, when we used to go to like, I used to come to New York, Hans was big into the DJ scene. So he'd be like, hey man, we're going to go see Stretch and Bombito. We're going to go see stretching Bombito. We're going to go see, um, uh, who was the talk? Was there another guy like Green Lantern?

We're going to go see like, I'm like, who, what are we doing? He's like, trust me, man. And you go there and these guys would be scratching and playing like all the best stuff, man. Yeah. All right. Here's how we're going to close a big ace, bringing back that nickname, big ace. We're going to close with a couple of Frank questions here.

First is this. What did you think about the nickname Raptors? And be honest, I'm talking about in 1995. Like it seemed to be, to me, it seemed like at the time I wrote actually on Toronto, Mike.com,

uh, I wrote somewhere. I guess I didn't even have TorontoMic. I liked it. I liked it because it had that Jurassic Park tie. But that's what bothered me. I'll just be honest with you that it felt like it was a fad because Jurassic Park had just come out.

It was huge. But I felt like we should have been the Huskies. But you liked it. I liked it. I liked it. Because I thought the Huskies was, you liked it. I liked it. I liked it. Because I thought the Huskies was, you know, isn't that UConn, right? That's UConn, right? Yeah, but that was the name of the original Toronto NBA franchise.

I know that. But I was like, you know, I'm a guy like you almost can't take another name. You know what I mean? Right. So I'm like, no, I didn't want to do the Huskies because it's UConn Huskies. Gotcha. Yeah, gotcha, gotcha. Now, one more question about the early Raptors teams. So I'm like, no, I didn't want to do the Huskies because it's UConn Huskies. Gotcha. Yeah, gotcha, gotcha.

Now, one more question about the early Raptors teams. What did you think of the purple? I mean, there must have been many a Barney joke hurled your way. It was. It was. It was like they said it was Barney on steroids or a mean Barney. But I love the purple and the magenta because, you know, me, I'm flavorful. That's me. So, like, I love that purple and that magenta.

And so, to me, that was cool. I loved it. Well, I loved this, AC. This was amazing. Whereabouts are you, by the way, in the universe? Where are you right now? Iowa. Iowa City, Iowa.

So, yeah, I coach junior high there and high school there. I do a lot of camps and training. That's my home base. I have some real estate interests there. Yeah, back in Iowa. What was the song you were going to put on with the scratching? I was curious. Oh, no.

I wasn't going to put on any specific song. I miss it. I miss scratching in my hip who's your favorite like deep like that like i was telling you how oh terminator x oh okay yeah remember valley of the g beats dude yeah a hundred percent do you remember juvenile delinquents uh school is boring made for ignoring sometimes sitting in class i'd be snoring yes listen so like when we all had trucks, like that was the thing, right?

In the 90s, you had the trucks, right? And you had, you put the speakers. Like we would get, we would all put on like Valley of the Jeep Beats and everybody would be blowing fuses and you'd have to go to the gas station to get fuses because you'd be blowing your fuses. I have, absolutely have Valley of the Jeep Beats

in my CD collection. And yeah, I have Valley of the G-Beats in my CD collection, and yeah, I bought anything related to Public Enemy I was picking up at the time, so I was a huge fan. That was a big deal to me, and again, I actually had Chuck D on this program and it was an absolute thrill, but AC, this was a thrill. Good luck

with the new book. Next time you're in Toronto, let me know, man, and we'll meet up. Yeah, I think Sash is trying to hook up me presenting at the Juno Awards. Amazing. That's amazing.

So yeah, let's definitely try to hook up for that. Yeah. Absolutely. And again, everybody, the new book there is called 135 of the Most Influ and hip-hop songs and why

i'll be digging up 13 rules it's you tracy murray jimmy king and david strickland uh can't wait to to play it on this uh episode yep yep yep it denies sings a great r&b hook on it too so i mean like i said it's got it's got everything you need, I think for a song to take off. I'm hoping it does. Remember, TMLX 14 is this coming Saturday that's only a couple

of days away. Much love to all who made this possible. That's Great Lakes Brewery, Palma Pasta, Raymond James Canada, Moneris, Recycle My Electronics,

and Red Lee Funeral Home. See you all later today when Jim Shedden drops by to kick out the jams. from a tin Cause my UI check has just come in Ah, where you been? Because everything is kind of

rosy and green Yeah, the wind is cold but the snow wants me today And your smile is fine and it's just like mine and it won't go away Cause everything We'll see you next time.