Toronto Mike'd: The Official Toronto Mike Podcast - Antonia Zerbisias: Toronto Mike'd Podcast Episode 1646

Episode Date: March 8, 2025

In this 1646th episode of Toronto Mike'd, Mike chats with Antonia Zerbisias, longtime writer at the Toronto Star, about the state of the world, her fascinating career, and the Disputes section of her Wikipedia page. Toronto Mike'd is proudly brought to you by Great Lakes Brewery, Palma Pasta, Ridley Funeral Home, and RecycleMyElectronics.ca. If you would like to support the show, we do have partner opportunities available. Please email Toronto Mike at [e-mail]

Okay. That means quiet on the set, AZ. Can I call you AZ? Sure. At work they used to call me Zurb. The Zurb. The one and only Zurb. Welcome to episode 1646 of Toronto Mic'd. Proudly brought to you by Great Lakes Brewery,

a fiercely independent craft brewery who believes in supporting communities, good times and brewing amazing beer. Order online for free local home delivery in the GTA. Palma Pasta. Enjoy the taste of fresh, homemade Italian pasta and entrees from Palma Pasta in Mississauga and Oakville. RecycleMyElectronics.ca. Committing to our planet's future means properly recycling our electronics of the past. Building Toronto's Skyline, a podcast and book from Nick Ienies, sponsored by Fusion Corp Construction Management Inc. and Ridley Funeral Home, pillars of the community since 1921. Joining me today, making her Toronto mic debut, it's the Zurb Antonia Zurbisssius. Holy crap. I butchered that, didn't I?

Antonia Zurbisssius. What a pleasure it is to meet you. Thank you. Nice to meet you. It's weird when I see you, I'm like, I've been like a square in the Toronto Star, this photo, I saw it for decades. Do people go up to you and say, like, oh my gosh, you're like human size, because you're just a picture in the paper. There's Antonia. Yeah. Well, you know, it kind of freaks me out still that people know who I am.

I live just off the Danforth and I'll be sitting there at Second Cup, just watching the world go by, and people, strangers come up to me, go, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, and I'm like, are you gonna kill me? Are you one of the bad guys? Something you wrote about like 20 years ago, they wanna call you out on it.

Well, you know, that's the other thing. There's a lot of film and production people who live in the neighborhood, and they'll go, oh, you reviewed my documentary or whatever and I'm like oh shit was it a good review? Do they hate me? And then I find out I gave them a good review when everything's fine. Well you were fair at least. Now we're gonna cover all this the Toronto Star so much I want to talk to you about excited you're here, but I follow you on blue sky and I saw you post.

Hello to Nicole, Nicole, Nicole, Nicole Robertson. Hello, Nicole. How do you know, Nicole? Nicole plays. Well, I know, Nicole, for a few reasons. He's played with my partner's son, Luke Doucette, Whitehorse. But I'm a fan because he plays with one of my favorite bands in the city, Philonia's Hank. Yes. Yes. One of his ten bands. Yeah. And the Hoolagoons. Yeah. So that's how I know Nicko and yeah, that's how I know Nicko. He's a great guitar player and there are so many in this town that I love to go and watch

and groove to. You're a big fan of live music. I am a big supporter and fan of live music. I have been all my life Well ever since I saw the Beatles in 1964 at Maple Leaf Gardens. I'm from Montreal 1964 in the Reds for five bucks and and and I went with my sister and my sister's best friend, Francis, and my other sister, my late sister, Danny, who was 12 years older than us and the lawyer at the time, and my mother was very concerned that we would get hysterical and PR pants or something. So she

put us all on Valium. We're sitting there like, how old are you on Valium? How old are you? I was just 13. Wow. That's the good old days, right? We don't even think to drug our kids up like that. And I've seen everybody cream Hendrix, the beach boys of the stone several times. I've seen them everything. Everybody who came through Montreal and growing up in Montreal being into music. We had a great blues scene Rockets paradise. Every person who toured through the northern states would stop off in Montreal which was like a wide open great city. My uncles used to call this town hog town.

Oh, you know, hog town was Toronto's nickname. Absolutely. So when do you leave Montreal? How old are you? Hogtown. Oh, you know, hogtown was Toronto's nickname. Absolutely. So when do you leave Montreal? How old are you? I'm how old I am. I am 74 as of last month. Okay. You know, like the radical reverend was just here.

Yes, I know. And you used to be on is it called the three women? What was the name of this? The broad squad. Well, I'm hot and show on W TN. Okay, this was called three women with Sherry de novo on CI UT. You know what? Maybe I've done so many things. Like if I were to write out everything I've done, I don't think I would remember

everything. Well, we're gonna see we're gonna jog that memory today. But you mentioned you're 74 I was actually asking how old you were when you left Montreal Oh, he said 74 so I wasn't gonna how old do you know? But but I know the radical reverend also 74. So Yeah, I you both look I have a lot of time for Sherry in 1974 was the first time

With my first husband and I went to work for Columbia Pictures here in Toronto and then we went back in 75 and I joined CBC in Montreal. And then with my second husband we came here in 1985 and in 1991 I wanted to go back to Montreal for personal reasons. And the star recognized that I could handle the Charlottetown referendum and sent me back to Montreal because I'm bilingual and I covered Canadian politics for the CBC while I was a reporter there. And so I spent two years in Montreal. And then they dragged me back here in 93.

You can see the ruts on the 401 where my heels were as they pulled me away from my hometown. And I don't regret it actually now. How was the audio at that Beatles show at the Forum? How was the audio? Do you have any memory of the audio or you were just screaming so loud you couldn't hear it? I was on Valium. That's right. No, but here's the thing. I was never one of the screamers. I was into the music. I wanted to be able to... I had binoculars and I was watching, you know, Paul on the bass and you know, that's what I wanted to see. Infamously, Maple Leaf Gardens, Harold Ballard booked an extra show or something. And they did like a doubleheader at

Maple Leaf Gardens. They did that in Montreal to Okay, I'm at an evening show. And the audio and I was I wasn't there a shocker there. But I have I know I talked to the Diane Sachs and some some FOTM who were there. And the audio I guess they were using just the public address announcer audio they'd use for like hockey games or whatever. So you know, you're not going to get too much dynamic range there. I don't I cannot comment on the audio. I honestly don't remember it was a while ago. Okay, so

years ago, I'm going to play I'm going to play some audio that you will comment on. Are you ready to go back to this? You ready? Sure. Can I blow my nose? You blow your nose and I'm going to play this audio. Okay. Our guest, Mr. Bergen, our host, Larry Solway. Oh my God. How did you dig that up? To go to the movies or to play cards or to lie in bed with a good book. It was for tens of millions the night for Jack Benny and Fred Allen, and the biggest of them all where you got all in one package the music of Ray Noble, the voice of Nelson Eddy, the rivaled wit of W.C. Fields, the brassy-voiced boy Charlie McCarthy.

Together they all must have sold billions of gallons of Jason Sanborn coffee. It all came from the quietest one of them all, Edgar Bergen. In the 20 years of weekly shows, no one ever played for a bigger audience than Edgar Bergen and Charlie McCarthy and Mortimer Snurd and it began at least 50 years ago. Well, I guess so. Charlie did certainly. The radio started at 37. But the beginning, well, Charlie started with high school. I was fooling with ventriloquism when I was in the eighth grade in Decatur, Michigan. Then high school is where my senior year I got Charlie McCarthy.

What are we listening to here? I think we're listening to the Larry Salway show, which I worked on in. That's the reason we came to Montreal, sorry, to Toronto in 1974, because I got a job at the Larry Salway show as a researcher in Booker. And yeah. So what's it like to hear that audio? It makes me feel old. And I don't often feel old. No, I don't mean to make you feel no, no, that's okay. It

actually it was, it was a difficult time moving from Montreal to Toronto in 74 was really a culture shock. And doing that show as interesting as it was, and I met so many people, like so many incredible people, and I remember some of them very well. Good and bad. Doing that show was very hard because we had to travel a lot. And, you know, you'd book into a hotel and it would be very intense for like three weeks or a month. I spent like for example a month in London, England and I only had one free day.

It was running around and booking this, booking that, pre-interviewing, writing the questions and then there would be like these marathon studio taping sessions that would go on for like 12 hours and I would escort the guests into the green room and make up and then keep them company and make sure they were happy and then escort them into the studio. It was hard and then I would come home which was not home. It was like an apartment in Toronto and I mean I had my husband there, but it was difficult. And you clearly you loved Montreal. I love Montreal, you know, taxi drivers when I used to take the taxis to the airport or whatever in Montreal to come back here. They would ask me, you know, which do which city

do you like better? And I would say, well, you know, Toronto is like my husband. Montreal is my lover. Woo! Never shall the two meet. No. I'm not sorry. I'm here now. So don't get me wrong.

But I do miss it. Okay. So you went back to Montreal, then you came back to Toronto. In 85, because my then husband, Mark Blandford, the late Mark Blandford, he was the first person to do a television series in high definition. He did that for the CBC in cooperation with Sony, which was trying to promote high definition TV,

HDTV as we called it back then, or Hi-D actually, we called it back then, or Heidi, actually, we called it back then. And so I got a job on CBC's business show then, which was moving to Sunday night prime time after the national that's venture, right? Ventures. So I co hosted with Patrick Watson, and produced and fronted my own documentaries. I did that for a year. But you know what?

I mean, I got a master's in business administration in the early 80s at night mostly, and did very well. And I thought I wanted to do business reporting, but oh my God, it's so boring. Especially for TV. Well before, so Antonia, is that correct? Yeah, perfect.

Okay. It's Greek. It's all Greek to me. Okay. It's actually a Latin name, but yes. Antonia. Okay. Love it.

Now, before I get you to the star and we spend some time at the Toronto Star, and that's when I'm introduced to who you are. I'd see your photo as I read your piece in the Toronto Star. Do you think we could chat just a little bit because you're so sharp and you have such interesting opinions on this world at large? Could I ask you a little bit about current events? Sure. I just concerned that we might date this show by talking about what's going on today that might change like in the next 10 minutes the way Trump is going. Well here, so all we do is we timestamp it. So we're talking at 2 21 PM on Friday, March 7 2025. So if news breaks at, I don't know, 4pm today,

we didn't know about it. So we're talking about what we know now. Yeah. But if Donald Trump were listening to us right now, what would you say to Donald Trump? Get help. Get help. The man, there's something wrong with the guy. You think so? He has absolutely no empathy for anybody. And anybody who does not have empathy does not fit into civilization. We would not have civilization unless we all got along and cooperated with one another. He doesn't get it no compassion for

Those he shares his planet with it's he seems to be all about Donald Trump And he doesn't care who dies or who gets hurt in the process. Yeah exactly. I mean he's an I'm not a psychiatrist I can't diagnose people, but he's He's a sociopath like seriously, I really believe that he's probably bipolar as well, and not medicated. Have you seen the movie the biopic The Apprentice? Have you seen it? Yeah, I did. I did watch it. Yes. Well, that was basically more about the lawyer. I was going to say Roy McCarthy. Thank you, Roy Cohn. Incredible performance

by Jeremy Strong, by the way. Yes, I did see that. But there was really nothing new to me in there. I read a lot. So it's one thing if we we both agree that this is likely a sociopath, but how does a person like that gain such a loyal following? Like, how did we arrive at a point where he has not? He has this power? Like, this is a perfect storm. I wouldn't even if this was a dystopian future novel or something I was reading 30 years ago, I wouldn't believe it that this person could ever assume such a position where he could have such a influence

over the world? First of all, he is really good at television. You know, he had a lot of practice at that. So I watched the I hope we don't take this too much. But this is trying to make date the hell out of it. Okay. This moment now we're talking. All right. Well, I watched the speech on Tuesday night that he gave to the joint session of Congress and, I mean, he made no sense. He lied every three seconds. He kept saying, it's going to be the most incredible, so incredible, incredible.

You won't believe how incredible the guy's vocabulary is extremely limited and getting more limited by the second, which is a sign of a problem. But he does know how to work the camera. And he's, you know, he's entertaining in the sense that it's like watching a constant car crash, right? It's like, bam, bam, bam, one after the other. So, you know, what happens when we see car crashes? We slow down, you know? In terms of why so many people buy into it, there are a lot of angry men, especially. There's a huge backlash against feminism.

So I think that's part of it. I watched this series on CNN recently that it wasn't on CNN. It was a CNN series that's being replayed on Amazon and YouTube. You can find it online. And it was the soundtracks of our life, like basically baby boomer lives. And they were taking certain news events like Hurricane Katrina or the Vietnam War or whatever and you know focusing on the news but also the music of the time and they kept saying well America was divided then when has America

not been divided I mean look at the Civil War like a million soldiers were killed in the Civil War. Bloodiest war in American history. I mean, it's divided again along race, along gender, along class. I mean, so many ways, red versus blue, East versus, you know, the middle. And it's crazy. Transgender mice. I believe this was from the not state of the union that was like cause playing as a state of the union, but he talked about saving money, they were going to transgender

mice and it turns out it was a transgenic. Yeah, that's right. I mean, that's how I don't know if that was deliberate or not. That's my question. I just conversations my wife, I said, is he does he know his followers are dumb, so he's serving up the slop for them? Or is he so dumb, he believes that this was x million dollars going towards making mice transgender? You know what, I think he has a very short attention span and somebody must have said transgenic mice to him or he basically like read some briefing note and said saw transgenic.

And in his mind mind he heard transgender. I don't think yeah because either he deliberately lied or he's an well I'm not going to call him an idiot because I don't think he's an idiot but he he he is losing his mind and no the sad fact is that the media And no, the sad fact is that the media made him like back in the 80s, you know, Vanity Fair was all over him. I don't know if people remember National Lampoon. National Lampoon was the only magazine or news thing to it was a hysterical thing to take him down. But everybody else was like, Oh, Donald Trump.

I mean, he made two appearances on Sex and the City, you know, with Samantha drooling over him. Right. Art of the Deal and a big deal. Oh, yeah, yeah. And so they created him because he's clickbait, he's good ratings, but now I think they're wising up. I mean, I even saw stuff on Fox this week,

like freaking out over the stock market. It was great. So let me ask you about no Donald Trump, we've talked about him, but this 51st state rhetoric that we've been inundated with for the past several weeks. What are your thoughts on that? Antonia? I I'm afraid he really means it. I don't think he'll succeed. But I think he really means it. And I've, I have been afraid of this all my adult life because I've always recognized the strength of Canada,

you know, in terms of resources. I mean, I didn't know about these fancy new minerals, right? But I knew about water and I knew about timber and gold and all that stuff. It only makes sense, you know, that they, especially now with the, you know, the South beat suffering from climate change, you know, like we're starting to look good and not so polar to them, you know. It's so insulting, the the governor Trudeau talk and the fact that you know, you mentioned that he's got a short attention span,

but he's not letting this go, right? There's something here. I think it's personal. I think, I think- Trump's too good looking, Trump, oh my God. Yeah, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, I think he's even taller than Trump and Trump likes to pretend he's tall, I love him.

He wears lifts from what I understand, you know. And diapers, I heard. Well, yeah, I remember that shot of him in the shorts, the back shot. It was like, yeah, I don't know, maybe he sat in a mud pile. I don't know. Well, there's an FOTM named Noel Castler who worked on The Apprentice and he talks about, yeah, it was he smells like a guy wearing a diaper. He wears a diaper and there's no judgment to anyone who wears a diaper here, but he's an adderall addiction. It's quite the well, I don't, I don't know about that, but here's the guy who eats nothing, nothing but like Big Macs and French fries. So he's gotta be

making, you know, smelly things. I don't know if it's in a diaper or just generally, you know, he who smelt it, he who dealt it. Are you? I'll speak for myself. I can't speak for Antonia. You'll speak for it. Okay. I wake up every morning and hope I'm gonna go online and read his obituary. Here's the thing though. Vance, like, but I don't care. I know. Yes, of course. There's a worse. I think Vance is worse. He's a puppet of Peter Thiel, this tech billionaire who created him. He's a religious fanatic. Trump is not religious. Trump just pretends to be God's vessel on

earth, but I don't think he's ever really darkened the doorstep of a church unless he's had to. Um, or as I, I, I'm always concerned about white Christianity now in the way it's being used, um, to attract certain voters. Uh, he frightens me Vance. I mean, and here's a guy who cannot stick to his own principles. He called Trump Hitler a few years ago, and now he's like, right up his butt with all the other gang and up on the lens, Zelensky in the oval office. That was so tacky, like so tacky. But you know, it's all a performance, right? But I think they crossed a line there, not just internationally within, you know, the diplomatic and the political circles. But I think, you know, there are a lot of people with Ukrainian backgrounds

in the United States, you know, and in Canada, but it doesn't matter. But Canada, who would have been grossly offended by that? Well, any, any human being, I think on this planet would be grossly offended by that. Well, the man is a gross offense. I mean, there's nothing else to say about him. I can't imagine what it's like to be Melania. Like, well, there must be a deal in place, right? Like, without it, I'm there's some agreement. I'm sorry, but there's not enough money in the world for me to do what I figure she's doing for him.

What if because I was trying to understand this too, because she was at that not state of the union address that took place the other night. And I was wondering because I often thought of this with Alexander of etchkin when he had this social media photo of him and Putin, that he just simply left there when Putin invaded Ukraine. And I wonder if there is a legitimate fear for her family's lives. Like if perhaps there's some deal in place

where if she doesn't, like, because I don't, again, I don't know anything. I'm just speculating with my new friend, FOTM Antonia. But, but if if there was some threat to her parents, for example, United States, but you know, deportation or some something worse, obviously, that perhaps she would tow the line for X dollars until he dies. Well, you know, there were the rumors that his first wife, Ivana, was a Russian spy or Soviet spy. I don't know about Melania. It could be, you

could be right. There's no question that the Ukraine, while it's the one being invaded with, you know, and being bombed and people are being killed, there's other things going on in Eastern Europe, for example, in Romania. They just had this quote-unquote election with some Russian-backed politician assuming control of the country. And it's scary, you know, what's going on with Russia. I worry that Russia wants us more than the United States, because then they can control the top of the world. And they're all over the Arctic, they've got more nuclear ice breaking submarine, whatever's up there than

the Americans and Canadians do to put together. So you have a couple of years on me, you made an illusion earlier that you're always afraid of this. I know when I was growing up, they often said, Oh, the next world war will be fought over drinking water. Like this was the thing we often talked about. Like, so did you ever think though we'd be having this conversation in 2025 where we're both legitimately worried that perhaps, I don't know, we'll, we'll Trump call in the military to annex at least part of Canada? I don't trust him not to. Okay, well, there's a lot. There's a lot there. So let's just start, start with the water. I started writing about

this while I was still at the star. And I can't remember the name of the book now, I'm sorry. But it was all about when the Colorado River dries up. And as we know, it's drying up. There's a real problem through the, you know, the southwest California and Arizona and Colorado, that they're going to come after us. And I used to joke that if I ever win, you know, the big, big lotto, like $50 million, I would buy all the real estate I could buy in Buffalo because it would be on the right side of the lake at that point. So I've always been worried about that. Did I think that we would come to this point? Absolutely. And that's why in, in 1969, when I read a book called the population bomb, I said to my mother I'm not having children and

she went, you can be selfish, a little bit of grandchildren and I'm like, no, not having children. I do not want to bring children into a future where they're going to be suffering. And I, you know what, I hate to say it, but I think it's going to come maybe not this year, maybe not this decade, but it's coming. That's fascinating. So you made a conscious decision. I'm not I'm not bringing any more human beings into this world. That's right. I mean, I didn't know about climate change at the time. It was, you know, too many people, not enough food. A lot of that problem has been solved with, you know,

modern agricultural techniques and factory farming and all that, which is problematic in its own sense. But yeah, I did make a conscious decision. And if I may bring this up, it became a problem for me in the early 70s, after I graduated with my BA, that I was looking for a job. And back then in those days, you put your birthday and your marital status, you know, on your CV. And, you know, I would sit there in front of male interviewers, like I can remember one it was a startup advertising agency with two guys like these two renegade ad guys,

and they were became extremely successful. And I had applied for a job as a copywriter here in Toronto and they and they looked at my resume and they went oh you're married and I went this was 1974 oh you're married and I went sorry 1975 yes I said I got married last month as a matter of fact and they went and when do you plan to have children and I'm like I'm not having kids Of course you are every woman wants kids and I went I Don't like the first time I held a baby by myself was last year with my grand Yeah, like I don't know what to do with babies

and my brother left his daughters when they were young with me for a weekend. And the two year old was still in diapers. And I'm like, oh shit, I got to change a diaper. And the five year old was like saying, no, you're doing it wrong. I was like, do it like that. Oh, okay. Thank you. Yeah, I give them to me when they can talk and go to the bathroom. Wow. Okay. So that's them to me when they can talk and go to the bathroom. Wow. Okay. So that's fascinating to me. Uh, that, that, that, that conversation. So where are we back to just to wrap up the current event part I needed, I had an episode this morning with the morning show host for Zoomer radio and

the vibe there was in a great episode if you care anything about Toronto radio. So that's for like, well, I do. Well, then you and I will love it. So it's a great episode for that. But I chose to like keep any current events stuff. But really, like I'm so it's such a big part of my day to day right now. I'm like, Antonia is somebody I can talk to about this. Oh, sure. That's why I'm unloading on you right now here. But okay, and then some news today about the Great Lakes Treaty and annexing the Great Lakes, America annexing the Great Lakes. Right. Well, I didn't have much time to to to to Yeah, because I'm a night person and a late sleeper and I had to put my makeup on to get here.

All right, you're off the hook for them. But bottom line is, it's every day something new. I did post a story on my Facebook profile from the New York Times, with some like sort of like, you know, deep sources on the conversations between Trump and Trudeau. And, and, you know, and how I remember this, in particular, how Trump was talking about abandoning, that was the word the New York Times use, abandoning all that was the word the New York Times used, abandoning all the Great Lakes water treaties and such. Well, I don't know how easily that's done.

I'm not concerned about an invasion and here's why. I don't believe that Americans, like the cannon fodder is there like it used to be, serving their country to attack Canada, I don't think that there's that kind of animosity against Canada, especially along the northern border states. Like I can't imagine somebody from New York or Vermont or Minnesota or even from Michigan feeling, I'm gonna go out there and kill some Canucks you know like they used to say about the Vietnamese. I don't see that you know and and also you know a lot of them are like too much processed

food and they're all diabetic. Never mind Mr. Bone Spurs you know the president like this these guys are really out of shape. Geez Mr. Bone Spurs and you mentioned eats You know, it's Big Mac combo every day or whatever He's pushing 80. So he's on the clock, right? I mean those those 74 shut up. No, but you are do you live on Big Mac combos? Very rarely very rarely. That's a big difference here. My goodness gracious. Okay. No, you look great You're gonna live to be 110 No, I hope so. I love to be in good. He's his mom is my new hero Marilyn Gross Peter Gross's mother

He lives on her own cooks for the family at special occasions Completely independent still full of vigor and energy and she's 101 years old Wow. Well, you know what I I Went after I broke my neck and back. I mean, I was always working. I had times where I gained a lot of weight. I mean, I grew up in delicatessen. Food is like family.

Schwartz's? But I was at a private dinner, closed with tablecloths and champagne, just for me at Schwartz's in 1978. I have photographs. Wow. Yes. How did that come to be? Because the owner of the Schwartz's at the time was a Montreal composer and conductor named Morris Brieger, Z-B-R-I-G-E-R if you want to Google him. And I had to interview him because he was giving free concerts in Park Lafontaine. And he kind of got a crush on me this old guy.

Blame him. Anyway, he wrote a symphony for me. I have the score for it framed in my office. And they performed it. And then afterwards, we had a private party at Schwartz's, which he closed down. And yeah, yeah, we had champagne and smoked meat, and we're steaks. You've lived a life. That's why you're here today. We're capturing the much of it. But you and now I just remembered. So again, work with me here. But I'll come back to all these

other stuff. But I need to hit a Kleenex. You hit the Kleenex. And I'll just say that you told me before we press record that you had heard Mike Stafford's recent visit, which was a couple of weeks ago. Yeah. Mike Stafford. I don't know if you heard, cause he's been over here three times since he was fired from his gig at six 40. And I felt this was the happiest actually this most recent episode a couple of weeks ago was the best version of Stafford I've met since he was fired. This is my observation. I've never met Mike, I have only listened to him on the radio back in the back in the back in the day. But I felt very bad for him because he seemed so how what's the word limited by his injury? You know, I, I should

have been paralyzed from, you know, the boobage down. And I took a long time to recover. And I just made my mind up that this was not going to put me in a wheelchair or limit me in any way. And as you know, when COVID happened, I built a gym in my den, and I started with the whites. I need to know what happened. So this that was my next sentence was to point out that Michael Stafford broke his neck. Yeah, but he already has a disease, which I forget the

name. It's a very complicated medical name, but it basically his spine is fusing together. So he walks very hunched over with a cane before he broke his neck. Oh, I did not know. So he has this already had mobility issues with his spine disease he has, and then he broke his neck. And now I want to hear how you how did you break your neck? You know, I've worn high heels all my life and everybody would say, Look at me and go, you're gonna break your neck and those shoes and I would go, no, I'm not. And then I was wearing Birkenstocks and slipped Birkenstocks

and I slipped and I went bam, like this, like it's lucky I hit from my forehead because that's the hardest part of your skull and snap slipped one flying into a concrete wall and did this and I broke four ribs for crushed for vertebrae in my upper back and four in my neck. I lost four inches of height overnight. Like I used to be five six and then I was five two. And now you can fit in the basement. That's right goodness and where he sounds extremely painful it you know what I didn't lose consciousness I don't think thank God I don't think I had a concussion amazingly because I I know a lot about head injuries and the damage they do long lasting damage. So I think I'm fine. I think I was able to catch my breath with great difficulty. Get broken. Yeah,

yeah, get up, go to the phone, call the concierge, call me an ambulance, call one of my neighbors, come up and get me because she had a key to my place. Go to the hospital. And the hospital was like a horrible experience. I was there for five weeks and the things I could write about how they treat women who fall, you know, I was 60 something. I don't know. I was in my late 60s and they write you off because they know that if you're not young, you're not worth saving. Like it's Oh, yeah, I there were three, I shared the room with two homeless guys, two

homeless guys, which I learned a lot about homelessness, which really woke me up. I thought I knew about homelessness, but I learned a lot more. in the next bed there were a series of women my age overweight out of shape and they just they just packed them off and sent them home and I'm like You're not sending me anywhere until I'm ready to go You know, I couldn't go to the bathroom by myself. How am I supposed to count? You know, I couldn't for six months, I couldn't hang up a coat. Because I couldn't do this. I couldn't make a salad. I couldn't. Like, I couldn't even type. So I just watched TV for six months, you

know, and I couldn't drive, I couldn't do anything. And you're gonna send me home? No. I'm very, very privileged, Mike, I have to say, I am very privileged. And I'm very grateful. I was able to have private care for four hours a day, come in, help me bathe, because I was like in a brace like this, and make my food and stuff like that, because otherwise I could not have survived.

But here you are, you walk down my stairs, you're up and about. I'm wearing heels. You can do this now. I was wearing heels. I was afraid to look. I was assuming that you can't wear Birkenstocks again. That's for sure. No, no, I hate them. It's deadly Birkenstocks.

But firstly, I get that sounds, I'm sorry that happened to you. Were you on really good pain killers? Like I separated my shoulder. They put me on Percocets and they were too good. Percocets hurt my stomach. So I was on dilated, which is morphine. And I, you know, I don't get like I smoke pot.

I'll admit it. I've been smoking. It's legal now. Yeah, since 1966. I've been smoking. I used to do TV like I used to do like live hits on TV and I would be like, Visine, Visine is my mascara. Hi there. This is Antonia Zerbecia, CBC TV, Montreal.

That's the real talk right there. My goodness. Okay, so Yeah, so I was it's morphine, right? I just didn't get it. And I used to joke to my doctor, you know, just give me more pills, and then I'm going to take them downtown and sell them for $10 a pop. Oh, geez. Okay, but you you did. So yes, you have some privilege there that you're able to get. What did you learn, by the way, about the unhoused? Like, there's a lot of chatter in this neighborhood right now. I did a full episode about it with the guy who's responsible for communicating to the community about it. But there's going to be a shelter

in this neighborhood for the unhoused. But what did you learn from these two guys? I forget we're calling it unhoused. It's I'm I apologize for that. Well, you're forgiven. Okay, one of them was a chef, a baker, actually, he worked for what was the name of the big of the one that made the only decent rye bread in Toronto. It's closed down now. But anyway, he worked for a big bakery. And, you know, people get fat for a lot of reasons, you know, and some of it is genetic. I truly believe that you cannot help it. Um, I read this book, the secret life of fat, and it was an eye opener, but

anyway, I'm don't want to digress. He had become enormous, so enormous that he couldn't really walk mobility. Yeah. So when they, you know, and so, you know, he got this terrible infection because he had these folds of, I hate to say it, but it was kind of gross because he would lie there with his gown open and everything exposed and red, gooey. And, you know, my girlfriends would come in and really like, no, you know, but he couldn't help it. Like he was a good guy. He just couldn't help it. And, um, you know, he, he would complain

about the food in the hospital, which I don't blame him. Um, and then he would manage to somehow go downstairs where there was like a Tim Hortons in a subway and all the usual things and, you know, buy like five donuts and eat them, you know, and then they would come in and they would have to weigh him in a special thing. And how come you're gaining weight and then he would just say, I don't know. But he he could not work, he cannot function. And I don't believe it was just because he was eating five donuts there was something else happening with him so there are all kinds of reason and then

the other guy he had a head injury and he would not do much except yell fisherman's platter and buckwheat pancakes every time the other guys started talking about food and that's all that ever came out of his mouth. And it's not his fault, you know, that he had a head injury, right? It's not his fault. So, you know, people blame, you know, Oh, get a job. They say you're lazy, you're lazy, or, you know, get a job. I don't buy that. I've known people who were homeless because their parents kicked them out because they were gay. You know, like kids on the street, that kind of thing. It's just like people need to have more empathy. We, you know, my, do you see the back of my jacket? No, I didn't see it.

Yeah, there's a love and there's a peace symbol. That's right. I mean, that's what he's in love. Well, you heard in the Stafford episode, Mike Stafford, and I truly believe that if Mike Stafford didn't have the help of his sister, who is taking him into her apartment, right? So Mike Stafford lives with his sister in Toronto. And without that support, does Stafford have a home? Exactly. Like he's lucky he has a sister who cares for him, right? Right. A lot of people don't have family at all. Right. And especially, you know, Boomer women, you know, a lot of us chose

not to be married or have children and we're alone. And, you know, and now a lot of them are landing on the streets because things have gotten so expensive. So you can't, and then there was of course, the indigenous people. I never knew about the 60s scoop. I don't know if you want me to explain that or not, because it wasn't something in Quebec.

It was an Ontario thing. And I only learned about it when I started covering it, you know, the plight of... Well, for those who don't know, I of course know everything, you know that, but for those who don't know, just summarize it because this came to light recently with the Buffy St. Marie... Well, actually came to light when we started advocating for me, murdered and missing and you know... I didn't say it first came to light. Yeah, yeah, yeah, sorry. and missing and you know, I didn't say it first came to late. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Sorry. I okay. Very defensive there. Yeah. So yeah, I'm kind of bossy. Yeah. So in this in the 60s, they were just literally taking kids, you know, from from reservations and families

and placing them in white homes in Mississauga, wasn't Mississauga back then, but you know what I mean? And, and totally uprooting these kids and it screwed them up. And well, not all of them, but it screwed a lot of them up. And I learned about it when I started when three women died mysteriously in Toronto here in, I think it was around 2010 when I did that, and one on railroad tracks in Rosedale. One came out of one of those high rises down by the the Gardiner Expressway and another one a high rise at Sheppard and Young. And like, why were these girls falling out of balconies when there were parties inside? And that's when I learned about it.

But how did we get here? So there's a lot of problems because of that and alcohol. And if you can't have clean water, if you can't have clean water if you can't have jobs if you live in remote areas where it's hard to make a living and if at all possible how are you going to function in a in a society like this did I move you'd skate you're drifting there but it's fine you're great where you're getting my legs you know what you're getting comfortable which is the whole goal here. I get you comfy and then I'm bam there you go you get hit. Can I ask your opinion because this is kind

of recent news but Polaris music prize and the Junos I want to say I hope I don't get my groups wrong and more recently the Order of Canada have taken prizes awarded to Buffy St. Marie, away from Buffy St. Marie. And Buffy, I wondered what's your thoughts on the CBC documentary about her being a pretendian and these decisions to take away her Order of Canada and Polaris Music Prize, etc. I'm gonna say I have no opinion and I didn't watch the documentary and I didn't get like the big fuss over it. I feel bad. I had admiration for Buffy St. Marie back in the late 60s, especially when you know her music was really all over the place when folk music was big. I'm not a big fan of folk music, by the way. And

I feel that if you get somebody a prize for what they've done, and not who or how they were born. And that's all I have to say on the matter. Okay, fair enough. Except you're such a well read person who's consuming so much news and information programs. I'm mildly shocked what I'm highly shocked you skipped. Yeah, this very don't I'm a mildly shocked. Don't be shocked. And here's why. Yeah, when I stopped working. I turned off the television. Oh, okay. I stopped watching the news. I killed my subscriptions to MSNBC and Fox. I just I when I was recovering from my broken neck, I did renew them because I had nothing else to do and I couldn't do anything else. So I watched that was great. That was the whole Brett Kavanaugh, you know,

Supreme Court thing. So that was fun. But then I stopped, I watched the Biden inauguration, the elections live. And I didn't really watch any TV news until this week when I was laid out by this cold. I prefer to read online. I subscribe to if you follow my Facebook profile, you see I subscribe to everything, right? Everything. And even Frank magazine. And I try to share all that with people. But I stopped watching news because I couldn't stand the gatekeeping anymore. There's too much corporate concentration. They've lost the plot, as far as I'm concerned

on television. It's all about They're desperate because they losing the audience, but I'm much more disturbed really by You know like I have a lot of 40 year old women in my life for various reasons and You know they have no clue what's going on like none like when I say tariffs to them I look at me what and they're here. They're Canadian. Oh, yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Like, none. Like when I say tariffs to them, I look at me what and they're here. They're Canadian. Yeah, yeah, yeah. That's shocking. Yeah. Business women like women with their own businesses who look at me and go, Oh, what? What's it? What's a tarot? What? What? And I go like, you don't know

what's going on? No. Like I can see Americans being clueless to this tariff talk. But the Canadians you think would be pretty dialed in on this. You know what I I don't get Instagram. I mean, I'm on it. I've been on it since day one, but I don't post much. And I certainly don't get stories like what is the point? Oh, no, I don't even check them.

I don't. I don't get disappointed. They just you know, like they disappear into the abyss. Exactly. Yeah. What was the point of that? You know, so you're trying to post, you know, like, for example, my, my man's daughter, she posts a lot of political stuff on stories. And I go like, what, you know, can we not

engage somewhere? Can we not like, Instagram, which I post, that box is going to have something in it for you. And I'm going to tell you about that in a moment gonna have something in it for you and I'm gonna tell you about that in a moment. But Antonia, when you post on Instagram, which I'll post a photo of us by the tree and say, Hey, there's an episode with Antonia, the Zurb, you're gonna love this. I will do that. I will post that. That will be like, I guess what I would call this would be like a link you could go to in five years. But these things that disappear in a short period of time,

whatever, please, like, what's the point of you're not archiving anything? Yeah, well, like my niece, one of my nieces, she posts, you know, pictures that on vacation and stuff like that. And I get that, you know, you flash them and you don't really want a permanent record of them, especially when they involve their kids. Okay, sure. That I get, but I don't get putting political messages, you know, and like, no, I don't get that put nail it. You're not with you. I'm agreeing with you. I just want to clarify something really quickly with the Buffy thing, just because, uh, just real quickly, because you mentioned it doesn't matter where you're born, but I will say the Polaris Prize and the Junos were earmarked for Canadians. And it was it has been confirmed

by Buffy herself that she's not Canadian. Oh, well, I didn't even know. Well, there you go. So those are like a black and white. You're not Canadian. You know, we're taking back the awards. Okay. But the Order of Canada, believe it or not, the Order of Canada doesn't you don't have to be Canadian to get the Order of Canada. You just have to be like a benefit to Canadians. I don't have the... No, no, no. Let's hear it. And I will tell you why.

Tell me. I'll tell you why. Sid Edelman. Doesn't that mean anything to you? He was a columnist, like the most prominent entertainment columnist at the Toronto Star. He was Canadian editor of Variety, which is how I met him when I was in Montreal and doing my MBA. He hired me to cover the film and television industry

in Montreal. And then when I moved to Toronto, he hired, well, after Venture, he hired me to be, he got me my job at the Star because he was entertainment editor at the Star. And he wrote a column. He did more for Canadian culture, like movies and television, and well, everything,

theater, everything, but especially movies and television, than anybody in this country in building up this industry. And when he retired, I tried to get him an Order of Canada, and you need to have recommendations from other Order of Canada winners. And a couple of people, you know, couple of dancers, and they were willing to go along with it. But when I called the people who became multi multi millionaires, I won't name names, but, you know, famous producers, for example, producers, for example, they all said no. And I thought, Ah, this is the Order of Canada. I don't care about it. You know, it's bullshit.

Well, it is it is bullshit. But and this was never so Mary Simon, the governor general who rescinded the rescinded the Order of Canada from Buffy St. Marie didn't give a reason. They just said there was no reason published. But I will just tell the people who need to hear this, that it was not because she's American, because Americans can actually win the Order of Canada, but it is most definitely because she is a pretend Ian. I've had indigenous people over here, the eyes are rolling. So you you didn't see the doc, but you must have read about the Oh, God, it couldn't get away from it. But this is a this is a woman who basically pretended to be indigenous and

Was celebrated as such and took a lot of oxygen from actual indigenous people over the decades and much like you I had nothing but mad respect for this woman I love this woman But the reason the reason you would take away her order of Canada would have nothing to do with the fact she was born in the United States of America. That's why she was like Connecticut or Rhode Island or something. Yeah, somewhere there. Right. But she didn't she talks about being adopted into decree. And that's wonderful, except that happened in her 20s. Right. Right. She's been so so she's an American woman, American descent Beverly is her name who then

pretended to be indigenous and did a great deal of effort to con us. And this documentary you haven't seen gave overwhelming evidence that she is not indigenous. She's a pretend you okay. So that's why the order of Kennedy should was taken away, right? Well, I mean she was a fake person, right? Right, but I'm gonna I wonder how much ox you said she took a lot of oxygen away from you know, real Actual and yeah real indigenous people. I don't know how we measure that. I don't know you can't measure it But but whenever somebody like the CBC needed to talk to an indigenous person, going to Buffy is the path of least resistance because she's the most famous person to represent the indigenous people.

Yeah, listen, whenever the CBC wants to talk to a conservative pundit, they call Andrew Coyne. There's a roll, it's still a little Rolodex like this thick. Okay. Oh, oh, oh, we need a, we need a conservative. Let's call, you know, or if cross Canada wants to talk to somebody, a Canadian who's interested in becoming the 51st state. Well, Kevin O'Leary is your guy. Oh yeah. You know, so it's just lazy journalism as far as I'm concerned. I, I worked there. I know, listen, that's why you're here. You know, but okay.

So you just gave us a little taste of how you ended up at the Toronto Star. So I want to spend I mean, this is where I would read your work. And I have some questions, obviously, but maybe share a little bit about, I don't highlights of your time as a columnist at the Toronto Star and all the different work you were doing at the Toronto Star. Because you get there in not in 89. Yeah, it started in January of 89. Correct. Okay. And in my very, very, very first week, the seed asked me to do a story on who might be the next president of the United States

of CVC. Yeah, it was George Bush, then the the original. Well, the next Yeah, yeah, dad. So to who would be the next president of CBC, because I knew CBC really well. And well, I knew television really well. You know, I can I just open a bracket here. A lot of people thought I got all my information from my ex husband who was also at CBC, you know, and he knew nothing.

I had so many friends at CBC who also went on to global and I mean, I used to live with the producer of news at global TV here in Toronto. I mean, he was a roommate, not like not that kind of live guy. But I knew everybody. So I had my own sources. So anyway, so so speculate on who would be the next, whatever. So I don't remember I did big Saturday front, it was my big first Saturday front, and entertainment front. And Monday morning, I walk into the star and there was like a staff bulletin board and I

see my name in a headline and Barbara Emile's photograph like and it was her column in which she just crapped all over me and I don't know what the CBC should be abolished and who is this woman saying that so- so and so was I don't remember who I named. Maybe Patrick Watson, maybe Paris, you know, I don't remember. But anyway, so, like totally crapping all over me. And I was like, it's like I was never used to being crapped on by people I didn't know before. And I go sit on my desk and I'm like, and the next thing I know, I don't know if you remember him. His name was Frank or he was a giant like the man was like, eight feet

tall. And he's looming looming over my desk and he goes, you have been pissed on from a very low height. Don't feel bad. Congratulations. Yeah, so I mean, the highlights like there there were many I mean, when I won a national newspaper award for 96. Oh, my goodness. Yes. You did your homework on me. I didn't know. Yes. I was going through a very hard time at the time because I was writing about media and there was a managing editor. I couldn't stand and shall remain nameless. Oh, the good he knows I hated him. Who was always trying

to get me to do stuff that had nothing to do with my job but was more about finding intelligence for his own gossipy or whatever purposes. And I would just say to him, you're not going to run this story, so I'm not going to burn my sources and call them up. So it was a constant battle and he was trying to get me fired. He had talked to my entertainment editor, God bless you, John Ferry. I still love you. John is now head of current affairs or VP of current affairs at TVO.

He was a very big supporter of mine. You know, so this guy was trying to fire me. So then comes the National Newspaper Awards and I get the award for critical writing and I'm standing on the stage and I think so and so John Hondrick and yada yada and then I go and thanks to blood for not firing me. And that was just like me being just like good for you know me right at the dinner afterwards at the Royal York Hotel, we were all sitting on a bunch of star people and he went around congratulatory we won the record number I think that year 13 awards, and he went and congratulated me leaned in to me

like this and he went, we haven't fired you so far. And I'm like, thank you. Thank you for that. A month later, I'm in Banff covering the television festival in the bridal suite at the Banff. I love that. I love that I had those. The star was fantastic when there was money. And and I get a phone call from my editor who says to me, guess who just got fired? And I literally broke the bed in the hotel jumping up in the bridal suite. It was a king size bed, but I didn't care. Karma is a bitch. Yeah. Yeah.

Karma is a bitch. Yeah, yeah. Karma's a bitch. Wow. I mean, you know, I can tell you stories about people I've met and things that happen. But I have to say the star in its hey days was just a fantastic place to be. You know, I mean, and to do my job, especially before all the corporate concentration, when there was a baton broadcasting, when there was a standard broadcasting, you know, when the you knew who the owners were, the slates, the wall, waters, the you know, the, I would open the Globe and Mail every morning, and there would be the ro b index of business and I would, you know, I would open the Globe and Mail every morning. And there would be the R. O. B. index of business. And I would, you know, they would list all the companies they covered that day

in both ways kind of thing. And I would go, okay, bait on broadcasting, you know, I've gotten all the names now. But I could call up, like john Bassett, you know, and have a phone conversation or have lunch with him or or get drunk with you know, like Moses Neimer, what you these were actual human beings. So covering media was a lot of fun until this one bought that one and that one bought this one and this one and and and I don't have to tell you like what's happened to radio in this city. There's very little, you know, playlists that you know, it's like the last DJ like Tom Petty, you know, saying in the 90s, I think it was, you know, the last DJ is gone. I mean, I listened to jazz FM, CBC radio, and that's pretty much it now. Oh, and rad can, when I listened to radio, because the rest of the radio just doesn't appeal to me.

Yeah, it's very cookie cutter. There's no creativity, no imagination. And like you said, you know, bells got their cluster Rogers has their cluster chorus has their cluster and then you got your public broadcast. Well, I remember when album oriented rock started, you know, in the late 60s in Montreal with show and which was then not standard guy in Newfoundland, I've forgotten. But anyway, so yeah. And you know, people like Doug Pringle and who knew music and would talk, you know, they would go on and on about T-Rex or Hendrix or whoever.

And you know, you knew the names of who, everybody who was in cream and what they played and when they cut this record and how they cut this record and blah, blah, blah. And now, you know, I it's like movie stars, right? All these women, they starting to look alike. They all get the same faces, you know, it's like the Twilight Zone. Right. Fascinating. At some point, in fact, maybe I'll introduce this question right now, because you had like, the

first Toronto Star blog. Yes. Well, yes, technically, I did. David Olive, who still writes a great business column, he did a quote unquote blog, but he was basically posting his columns online. Right. That was really at the beginning of the WWW. But I did the first real blog. And did you talk to Mark Weisblad about this? Well, no, but I have a case funny because I have I got an offer Mark Weisbott, I do talk to Mark Weisbott a lot. But this question did not come from Mark. This question came from a gentleman named Cam.

And Cam writes, when did Antonia start talking to bloggers for her scoop and what other bloggers, aside from Mark Weisblot, did she connect with in the early 2000s? Were Cam's interested in this? I'm interested. I had Toronto Mike Doc. I've been blogging since 2002. It became a blog. But it was personal blogging. Early

days. You know, you had Rami the minks. I mean, I go Rami the minks and then there was all the war bloggers, right? The but you were there. Yeah. And Mark Wiseblood, of course, was there and Mark Wiseblood is no stranger. He's in the FOTM Hall of Fame for goodness sakes. But maybe a little bit about Mark Wiseblood. Like what was your communication like with Mark Wiseblood for your blogging meet? Um, I remember talking to Mark about radio a lot. Sure. Um, but most of my communication was with other left wing bloggers in Canada, people

like Canadian cynic and in a john bagel, who did dogs blog, and there was a whole bread and roses group which were feminist bloggers. Those were the ones I had time for. I did, I was constantly being slagged by the right-wing conservative bloggers, the war bloggers as I came to know them. And then they had a blogger fest, I remember it was a snowy night, I can't remember, somewhere on Queen Street, and I decided to crash it. And oh my god, all those boys, they all wanted to take their pictures with me and I decided to crash it and oh my god all those boys they all wanted to take their pictures with me and I'm like standing there like doing the cleavage thing and you know and and and one particular blogger I think she died she was horrible she was like this right wing horrible woman she just went you it was disgusting how they all lined up to have their picture taken with them.

I had one guy drag me onto a pool table, lie down on a pool table with him, and it was like, yeah, all those pictures are online somewhere. Yeah, so you know what, I didn't take it seriously. And one of the things I learned is, I don't care what people say about me is I don't care what people say about me. I don't care what people think about me, honestly, I mean, except for the people in my life. Sure. But you you learn to have rhino skin, as Tom Petty put it, I have rhino skin. Geez, I'm looking for more wise blood dirt here. So like, would wise blood just send you an email about

I haven't talked to Mark in like 15 or 20 years, just so you know. Yeah, I know. I'm only curious because he's always, like if I have somebody coming on, and not this episode actually, but he'll often say, hey, get this story. Like we haven't got this story yet. What story is that?

Oh no, there isn't one. Like he didn't actually send me any, he didn't seed any questions for you actually. But again, the cam wrote in because of course, who's cam cam cam? Who's can I dog? Okay, cam Gordon. He's also in the FOTM Hall of Fame. So back when there was a Twitter Canada, he was the director of communications at Twitter

Canada, but some guy named Elon Musk decided we don't need a Twitter Canada, let alone a director of communication. Are you still on Twitter? I hate that app, but I looked for you on Twitter, but I couldn't find you. I'm Steph at Toronto Mike, I didn't delete it because I still use it to copy it. What I do is I go on blue sky and I send up things saying, hey, you know, Antonia's made her debut, here's

a link or whatever. And then I copy and paste what I put on blue sky and I just drop it into x, but I don't actually read X. I don't read my feed and I don't I just check my mentions if I mentioned and I'll check my DMS of somebody like the radical reverend kept communicating with me via Twitter DM. And it was like the only reason I had to go in there and check it out. But I don't know what your what are your just kind of ties in nicely because I'm I was a big fan of the blog and the blog is fear as we called it back in like the mid 2000 It was a beast. Okay, it was a beast. I couldn't stop. It's like what I'm like on Facebook now

I couldn't stop I would be blogging at 2 a.m 3 a.m. 5 a.m you know and once I blogged while drunk and that was not a good thing because I was talking at something to do with porn and good thing because I was talking at something to do with porn and Online porn and how online porn really drove the web and blah blah and I linked to some really bad porn sites and I go into the star the next day and It was like the worst Possible thing I could have ever done in a million years is you know know, and I would say, well, you know, the kids are not reading my blog.

It's not like it's, you have to get into the blog, see what I blogged at four o'clock in the morning while drunk and, and then click on the link to get to the, you know, these, these are the good old days. That's what I say. These are the good old days. These are, these are the good old days. Now every day I say these every day. Well, that's what my boyfriend says. These are the good old days. These are these are the good old days now every day I say these every day. Well, that's what my boyfriend says. These are the good old days. Who's this boyfriend? boyfriend

Whom I met on Facebook, by the way, his name is Roland Doucette. He's a singer and a guitar player He lives in in Gatineau just across the river from Ottawa And the connection was that I was a huge fan of White Horse, which you guys you should have on 100% I would do that. Yes. Yeah, Melissa just finished touring with Blue Rodeo, right. And Luke is his son and I was a huge fan and we connected through politics Roland and I but then long, very, very

long story short, at some point, I made the connection and I went, Oh, you know, and, yeah, and one thing led to another. And here we are, you know, like, and you're happy. I'm, you know, what do you would around here? I think this is IKEA would does that count count? No Swedish Swedish wood not Norwegian wood Yeah, I'm I count myself very fortunate Very privileged. I'm I have a great life. I've got good health except everyone's so awesome back pain I have family still not much but you but you know, they're gone. I'm comfortable. I'm secure. I'm yeah, I'm in a good place.

And I live on the border of East York. And now it's on again. I hope you don't have like a dentist appointment. No, no, I'm fine. Because I know I'm taking a little time. No, no, I'm fine. So you just alluded to the fact when you first arrived, you said that you had heard Stafford appointment. No, no, I'm fine. Because I know I'm taking a little time. No, no, I'm fine. So you just alluded to the fact when you first arrived, you said that you had heard Stafford and that you knew a few things you knew insider stuff that FOTM is no like you knew about

the low ceiling. You knew I don't want to chat before we press record. Like I said, this woman knows stuff. So did you listen to more than just the Stanford? Yeah, I didn't go through a lot of them, especially if they were sports. I'm not big on sports. No Gretzky talk from you. Oh, I got Gretzky talk, but that's not sports. Like, well, talking about Gretzky, I you know, I, I, he was on Saturday Night Live hosting Saturday, I think it was 1989. Yes. He hosted Saturday Night Live. And you know, of course, every all the guys because they were all guys on the news. You got to review that. So I'm like, Okay, right. So I watched Saturday Night Live. And I it was for the

Monday papers. So I, I wrote it on Sunday. And I came in on Monday, and Frank or was at my desk again, you have pissed into a vase. And I'm like, he was terrible. Like, yeah, he was awful. And you know what, as I wrote recently on Facebook, he's pissed in all over Canada, as far as I'm concerned. And I think Frank would agree with me. Yeah, you know, he hasn't yet made any statement of any kind, neither like written or on social media or, you know, verbally, no statement from Wayne Gretzky since this 51st state rhetoric started coming out.

Yeah, well, it's pathetic. He has people talking on his behalf saying, oh, he didn't really mean it. Oh, please. Even Doug Ford was like, you know, leave him alone. I'm like, no, no, don't tell me who to leave alone. Yeah, really. Like, you know what?

Actions speak louder than words. Say something. Yeah. But he's already said it in his actions. Right? You can say whatever you want. Like Doug Ford's ripping up the Starlink concert contract. He's not ripping up the Starlink concert. It's the cold meds. The contract, you know? Yeah. Yeah, it's like, and what about that tunnel? Who's building that tunnel? Right? Well, guess who owns a big tunneling company? Yeah, the boring thing. Yeah. Geez, if that contract goes to Musk, geez,

well, first of all, rile me up. Yeah, come on. It's never gonna happen. I know. That's right. That's right. Keenan comes on once a quarter. We talk about that. And yeah, this doesn't make sense on any level. And we talk about that. And yeah, this doesn't make sense on any level. This tunnel under the 401. Yeah, well, neither does the spa in Ontario place neither does destruction of the Ontario site. None of it makes any sense to me. Not even just win another majority third in a row. So are we majority of what a majority of the people who bothered to vote? Yeah, but that's the system we have. Like I know what you're saying. I agree. Except that's the freaking system. Like, so it's, it's the only way you're defending him because you know, in a tuba. No, because I am in a rioting here,

you're sitting in a rioting, which had a prior to last week had the MPP was a from the progressive conservative party. And she lost Christine Hogarth lost to the liberal MPP candidate here right click so you're in one of the very few places that flipped from PC to to liberal so I just want you to know that Antonia well that's what happens when you know GenXers can buy million dollar homes this home was not a million dollars when I bought it. No, not when you bought it, but it is now. It is now. That is true. Well, that's true.

I have nothing I could say about that, but I paid much less than a million dollars. Okay, I'm going to give you a few gifts here. And then I'm going to ask you about a couple of controversies and then we're going to share you were amazing now. And I'm glad I'm wondering like, did you have a moment where you wondered if you'd ever walk again? Like, did this ever cross your mind? Oh, no, I, it took a while the first two weeks. I'll tell you what I learned. What diapers aren't as bad as you thought they were. I said no

judgments on the day. No judgments. You know, if you need that choice, right, but no, I could walk because I, which was amazing, because every day they would come and stand over my bed and rip up the sheets, which my girlfriends would make like, it was so bad, you needed friends to come in and do your bed and help you with things. I'm so short staffed. And that was 2018. And it's much worse now. But anyway, and they would rip off the sheets and then start poking my feet to see, can you feel that? And I would like stop bleep bleep bleep touching my feet. Well, that's a good sign.

That's a good sign. Yeah, no, but I was worried that I could never drive again, that I, that I could never slice an an onion again that I could never, you know, I just this all these things you took for granted suddenly ripped from you. Yeah, and now I can deadlift my weight. Okay, yeah, don't fuck with Antonia. Okay, fuck with Antonia. You don't need to worry about this place for your 74.

You've got a good 40 years before you got to worry about it. But Ridley Funeral Home. Oh my goodness. Has sent over a measuring tape for you. Oh, well, thank you. I use it to measure how big my biceps are. Okay, biceps. I was wondering what you were going to say next. Well, I don't know if this is family program. No, you can say anything. Yeah, but anyway, I guess I do measure all of that. All right, I won't ask my next question. I'll skip that and go straight to this. I want to go shopping.

Do you like Italian food? I know you're Greek, but what do you think of Italian food? That sounds Italian to me. Okay, means one face one race. Yes. In fact, I did my DNA thing. and like 30% of me is Italian. You're going to love, but what you say, well, you're so you're 30. What percent of you is Greek?

About 40%. And then the rest is Balkan. Zerbesias, I believe, means Serbian. And there was a migration of people, it's a long story, but it had to do with the Venetian Empire against the Ottoman Empire and blah, blah, blah. So, and if you meet anybody with the name Zerbeni, Zervini, Zervulis, whatever, Zerbs, Zerv, some of those great, it means they really came

from the Balkans. And then usually fair and not dark. Well okay, is this like a giant? Well, this is an empty box. No, in my freezer upstairs. So before you leave, you'll have it is a large lasagna, a frozen lasagna from Palma pasta. A meat? Yes.

Okay, I'm good. I eat meat I'm so much. Yes. Okay. I'm good. I eat meat. I protein now. Okay. Okay. I was like, it is a years. Well, okay, because Mike Wilner is coming over next week and he has specifically requested

a vegetarian lasagna. And if you were going to tell me now you're vegan, I would have switched it up and just got him another one. You know what? When I was in the hospital, I realized that if I had to, if I didn't eat protein, I would never get out of bed. This is beef. Okay, it's in my freezer.

You're taking it home with you. Thank you. Thank you. Palma pasta. They are going to feed us at TML X 18, which is a free event where all listeners, all guests can collect at Great Lakes Brewery 30 Queen Elizabeth Boulevard. This is in South Etobicoke from six to 9 p.m. on June 26th and not only will we eat Poma Pasta, our first beers on the house, thank you Great Lakes

Brewery for that. I don't know if you consume the beer, the craft beer, the fresh craft beer, but this is craft beer from Great Lakes Brewery also going home with you, Antonia. Oh, I better put it in the trunk if I have to drive. Oh, just don't crack it open. Okay No, don't drink that on your way home, okay, it's not even cold so no Well, that's for maybe that pairs nicely with the uh pairs nicely with the lasagna so you enjoy that uh, just want to let everybody know there's a new episode of uh, of uh, What are we talking about, Building Toronto Skyline, which is the podcast from Nick Aynes from Fusion Corp.

The new episode is all about One Young. Pinnacle International is developing One Young. I know. Do you know One Young? You ever been? Yeah, they're tearing, I passed by it today driving here and I thought, you know, it's just the last time I'm gonna see One Young before they tear it down. So that is a huge, as you know, it's a whole last time I'm going to see one young before they tear it down.

So that is a huge, as you know, it's a whole community. They're building that this pinnacle international, but we talked today to somebody from pinnacle and it's that's the one of the big tower is going to be 105 stories. Can you imagine living up there? The penthouse, which is going for 30 million, I believe, is 345 meters in the sky, which means you're the same height as the observation deck on the CN tower. Wow.

Can you imagine? I have 30 million tower. Did you? Yeah, I've climbed the CN tower. Well, then you could walk up to your new penthouse. Yeah, no, I won't do that again. So everything you wanted to know about one young is in the latest episode of building Toronto skyline.

And last but not least, I urge everyone listening to take note of RecycleMyElectronics.ca because if you have old electronics, old cables, old devices, you don't want to throw that in the garbage and have the chemicals end up in our landfill. You want to go to RecycleMyElectronics.ca? Put in your postal code and find out where you can drop that off to be properly recycled. Do you have that Antonia? Oh, you know what, I'm, I'm out to buy a new Mac and a new Mac laptop and a new iPad. So no, seriously, I am my Mac is like groaning and looking at me and going software sells hardware. Yeah, they keep upgrading the OS and then the the Mac book comes to insufficient. Well, the Mac I have now says Spotify comes up and says you your operating

system is out of date. I'm getting a lot of that. So Yep. And then the olden days way back when we might add new memory or new RAM or new hard drive or something. Today, you basically get a new one like it's a completely that's why you can't throw this tech in the garbage. There's a lot of dangerous chemicals in there. Okay. So on our way out here, how has this been going for you so far? This is fun. I mean, I know I'm all over the map and I'm talking

like I'm stoned. Listen, I'm all over the map friendly, like it's all about the tangents and then coming back. But you know, have you been have you been to your Wikipedia page? Not recently It would have upset me a lot what back in the day because there was constantly people calling me anti-semitic on my Wikipedia page and I just And you're not anti-semitic. I'm like the least anti-semitic person on earth Where does that come from? Does it come because I mean there is a section on your Wikipedia page called disputes

Yes disputes disputes Okay And it talks a lot about positions you have with regards to the Middle East and the Israeli Palestinian conflict and I was right Wasn't I well, can you tell the people like what did you say thatestinian conflict and I was right wasn't I well can you tell the people like what did you say that was so controversial and how are you right there were a lot of things you know when Al Jazeera first started to try to get on the cable dial and by the way I ended up working for Al Jazeera after I left the star that was a great break that was such a good gig why did you leave the star? Because they were offering I was sixty

three and a half. So I was close to, you know, pensioning off. I had enough years to get my pension and they were offering us a year and a half's pay, you know, and I figured. And then and then a month

later I get Al Jazeera which was paying me $1,000 US a week for a column. It was like dirty oil money but l l t. You know and and it was great working but anyway so that's why I left the stock. I also wasn't very happy at that point. There was too much editorial control over, you know, they thought I was too left wing. Like, were you getting memos for management about like, like, no, they don't work that way. They work in a much sneakier way. But yeah, because you know, they

were getting a lot of pressure from what the editorial board called the organized Jewish community about me because well, as you say, disputes, right? So I argued for Al Jazeera, because Al Jazeera is excellent. And I will keep saying that. And the fact that Netanyahu wants to ban it, and even a lot of Arab countries tried to ban it, Netanyahu bombed it, says a lot about Al Jazeera. Also there was a dispute with a former justice minister who pretended to be for human rights for everybody, except the Palestinians, who gave a speech at an Israeli university in front of a huge poster of Netanyahu to supporters of the Israeli army,

boasting about how his daughters were members of the, or had served in the Israeli army boasting about how his daughters were members of these or had served in the Israeli army and I thought anyway I tweeted something and it turned into you know I pissed off Alan Dershowitz over Israel yes you know I you know what my older sister God rest. She was like a mother to me. She used to say to me, you got to stop this. I mean, she was very involved with the Jewish community. She was married to a Jewish man. Her daughters were Jewish. And you know, she would say, you got to stop this, you got to stop this. And I, I dream of her coming back and I say to her, you see Denny, I was right. I look at what's going on now

and I could have told you this was coming. These were the disputes. They were almost always about my views on Palestinian rights. I'd been there, I'd seen with my own eyes the checkpoints, Hebron, the settlers in Hebron, the settlers walking around with I don't know what they were AK-47s or semi-automatic rifles. No, no, it's not right. Do you find that in this day and age if you are If you speak against Israeli

The country Israel their their policies that some people may equate that with anti-semitism Oh, they're trying very hard to make it anti-semitic. They're trying to limit speech People should not stand for this. Like, why can we say all kinds of things about China and not be called, you know, anti racist or racist or whatever, like, stop it. It's bullshit. Like, like Israel is not Judaism, like the one is a country is the opposite of Judaism. I grew up surrounded by survivors on my girlfriends. I went to a high school where there were only 31 Gentiles in a high school with 1600 Jewish

kids. Okay. I people think I'm Jewish, you know, like Jewish people think I'm Jewish. I have a friend now she lives above me. That's how we met. She was my neighbor. She's very late. I won't say her ultra Zionist, but very concerned with Israel. And she thought I was Jewish, you know. So I, I understand the culture. I spent time I spent like six weeks there. I, I know, I feel I know it. And let me put it this way, I found a kitten in a bush while staying with my friends in Jerusalem. And I took it to a vet. And I said to this vet, I will pay for you to keep this cat until you find a home for it. And he said to me he was leaving. And I asked him why and he said this was shortly after was I Netanyahu had been in power for

two years maybe. And he said to me because they're turning right wing and it's not going to be a nice place anymore. There was a shawarma shop in Ben Yahuda Square. I used to often go for lunch. I wandered a lot around by myself. And he was a Moroccan Jew who had gone to New York first, left, came to Israel. And he told me he was closing down his shop and moving back to the States.

And I said, why? And he said, because every Friday, the religious Jews come at sundown and scream for him to shut down his shop, because it's Shabbat, Shabbat. So I could see it coming. And that's when I started to get really radicalized, I wouldn't say radicalized, but to understand the situation and what was happening to Israel, and it had nothing to do with Judaism. You know, Peter Beinart, who's written this fabulous book about being Jewish

now in the wake of Gaza, you know, he calls it idolatry. It's the golden idol, which is expressly forbidden in Judaism. It you walk into synagogues and you see the Israeli flag. You know, when I used to go to Greek church, which I hated, and I would see the Greek flag and I would say, no, no, no. I mean, I was forced to go. So I would say, what does this religion have to do with the Greeks versus the Turks? So it's not like I'm focusing especially on Israel. It was also the same thing with, you know, Greece, I don't give a damn about what happened 125 or 50 years ago in Greece, it makes no difference to me. You know, Cyprus has nothing to do with me, or my religion.

I'm not religious, but at the time, sure. Sure. I find I appreciate you sharing those thoughts. I have these conversations with Ralph Ben-Murgy. Oh, Ralph. I produced this podcast for years. Did you? I didn't know that. Not that kind of rabbi. And I have a lot of time for Ralph. I have a lot of factors that double date in my calendar. Ralph and his wife and me and my wife are going to an Italian restaurant. So it better be Palma pasta, right? Would I go anywhere else? Come on, if you see me at any other Italian joint, that's it for me. But Ralph's a great guy to talk to you. Ralph, very proud Jewish man, adherent to the faith, so takes time for Shabbat,

the dinners and all the practice, everything. Yeah, very proud Jewish man despises Netanyahu and policies of Israel. These are mutually exclusive things I have witnessed in my personal life. People equate if you were to suggest you disagreed with an Israeli policy with regards to Gaza, for example, the palace. How can you not disagree with an Israeli policy towards Gaza? Seriously, Right. But even some again, I won't name names, but there's FOTM on this list. But even that suggestion, you are anti semitic. And furthermore, essentially, we're not friends anymore. Like this is this this nuance is completely lost. And you mentioned like, why is the flag flag flying here? The separation of Judaism,

this religion, and the policies of the country Israel and Netanyahu. They are two different things. They're mutually exclusive. Zionism is an ideology. It is a political movement. Judaism, you know, I used to say, and I still say that when I die, I want a Jewish funeral, right? I have more time for Judaism than I do for being Greek, Orthodox or Christian, right? There's, there's something about Judaism that I have, I mean, quite a part from the rituals, I have no time for rituals of any kind.

rituals. I have no time for rituals of any kind. But it is not what is going on. You know, it's there's like, for example, Mimad Nis, you know, one of the great Jews, you know, philosophers or whatever you want to call him. You know, he said you should never besiege a city on all sides. That was he was, look what they've done to Gaza for decades. And now there's no escape for those people. They can't even go into the water because they'll get shot at from the water. You know, the fisher boats used to go out and if they went a little too far, they would get shot out of the water. On the live stream I just popped over because we were going to wrap I just want to see what there's a live stream. This is a live stream. Yeah, there's just the live stream I just popped over because we were gonna wrap I just want to see what there's a live stream this is a live stream yeah there's just the live

stream for the the diehard FOTM's that we love from the whatsapp hey ref has a question for you hey ref yeah he's a referee he referees hockey games are you Gretzky fan hey ref are you Gretzky fan hey ref it out. Do you support Hamas? No, what a stupid question. No, of course not. Like, why do you have to support Hamas to be pro Palestinian? That's ridiculous. And it's and it's bullshit. And it's lazy, lazy. You know, do your homework. Yeah, just just reading the questions, just on our way out here, but it is a contentious issue here.

He says, he points out that Israel has free speech. He says there's multiple exclamation marks at the end of that. Oh, wait, stop. Okay. If Israel has free speech, why is that Netanyahu attacked Haaretz? You know, the progressive newspaper. If Israel has free speech, why

are they arresting the families of hostages who are protesting in the streets? If Israel has free speech, why did they kick out Al Jazeera? Should I go on? All right, I'm at the Broker, a future episode with Hayref and Antonia. I gotta say here I'm gonna knock him into the intellectual boards He'll give you a Charging penalty would that be a charging penalty? Sticking here. I'm from Montreal, man My goodness your Toronto make Mike debut with pure fire and it won't be the last time I get you on this show

But I love this very much. Thank you, it was fun. And I'm sorry for blowing my nose throughout the whole thing. You know, I didn't even notice. Oh my God, I got like, It was quiet, quiet blowing going on here. Hey ref says, families aren't being arrested, he says with, but obviously we don't have time to solve the,

to make peace in the Middle East in this program, but I love that we can have the open dialogue and have this discussion civilly. And I love this conversation with you and I appreciate you taking the time to visit and you're more than just that photo I'd see in the Toronto Star. Yeah, I'm bigger than a photo.

Larger than life. Bigger than a bread box. And that brings us to the end of our 1646th show. Who's gonna be a liberal leader this time next week? Who's gonna win the liberal leadership race?

Is that a question for me? Yeah, that's like a prediction question. I think it's like Carney hands down. Shoo-in, right? Done deal. Yeah. Who, if Mark Carney wins and there's a quickly, they call a federal election, what do you think happens in the battle between Pierre Poilé and his Conservative Party and Mark Carney and the Liberal Party of Canada?

Have you ever seen anything more pathetic than Pierre Poilé the other day following Trudeau's incredible speech that made worldwide headlines. The man is desperate. He has no game. And that brings us to the end of our 1,646th show. I had to check the numbers there. It's a, cause I recorded twice today. Congratulations.

This episode won't actually drop until Saturday morning because Andy Wilson record this morning. So we'll see how dated all of our current event chatter will be if people are listening to this on Saturday, but stay tuned for that. Much love to all who made this possible. That's Great Lakes Brewery, Palma Pasta, RecycleMyElectronics.ca, building Toronto Skyline, and Ridley Funeral Home. See you all Monday when my special guest... Here's a right winger who worked at the CBC.

Bruce Dobigan's in the basement Monday. Bruce Dobigan was like a left, self-professed leftist who worked at the CBC, who moved to Calgary and became radicalized. Shame on you bros to be discussed Monday. See you all then. So So So Music