Toronto Mike'd: The Official Toronto Mike Podcast - Damien Cox: Toronto Mike'd Podcast Episode 1745

Episode Date: August 14, 2025

In this 1745th episode of Toronto Mike'd, Mike catches up with Damien Cox. Topics discussed include Wayne Gretzky, Ron vs. Don, Victoria Mboko, Summer McIntosh, Masai Ujiri, Brendan Shanahan, Mitch Marner, Dave Stieb, the PWHL, Argos, Buffy Sainte-Marie, Rogers and TSN. Toronto Mike'd is proudly brought to you by Great Lakes Brewery, Palma Pasta, Ridley Funeral Home, Toronto Maple Leafs Baseball, the Waterfront BIA, Blue Sky Agency and RecycleMyElectronics.ca. If you would like to support the show, we do have partner opportunities available. Please email Toronto Mike at [e-mail].

Welcome to Toronto Welcome to episode of 7, 745 of Toronto Proudly brought to you by Great Lakes Brewery A fiercely independent craft brewery who believes in supporting communities, good times, and brewing amazing beer. Order online for free local home delivery in the GTA. Palma Pasta.

Enjoy the taste of fresh, homemade Italian pasta and entrees from Palma Pasta in Mississauga and Oakville. Toronto's Waterfront, BIA. Check out what's happening on Toronto's Waterfront this summer. Blue Sky Agency. The official distributor of Cylen's quiet, comfortable, and customizable office pods. Create sanctuary within your workspace. Toronto Maple Leafs Baseball. Get your butts to Christy Pitts.

We got one more game Saturday night and then the playoffs. Best baseball in the city outside the dome. Recycle MyElectronics.C.A. committing to our planet's future means properly recycling our electronics of the past. And Redley Funeral Home. Pillars of the community since 1921. Today, returning to Toronto Mike, it's Damien Cox.

How are you, Damien? I said I would show up for episode 1,745, and here I am. I'm just leafing through this. Oh, pun intended, because you're leafing through it. Yes, correct. You haven't missed a beat. Listen, that's a broadcasting expertise right there.

Yeah, so. This is very cool. How long has it been since you've been to Christy Pits for a Toronto Police game? I've never been to Christy Pits for a Toronto Police game. And you're a Toronto guy? Well, you are now. Well, I'm a Hamilton guy transplanted to Toronto. But of late, I've been thinking more and more about, well, and have been going to see different kinds of sporting events other than the highest professional level and really enjoying it.

And so I'd actually said to my son, we should go to a Toronto Maple Leafs game this summer. And now you say that our last game is tomorrow night or Saturday night. Playoffs. So, like, let's, so we're in the, the funny thing about this IBL, okay? And I, I was at the last two Saturday night games, and I was thoroughly entertained. Ask me what my ticket cost to see the Leafs at Christy Pet.

Mike, what did your ticket cost? Nothing, Damien. Oh. Zero. So the best value, you can have a beer, you can have a hot dog. It's a great time. But I was, so I was at the last two games, great times.

But every team in the IBM, except for one, makes the playoffs. Like, this is the, so it's, like, you know, we make fun of the, the CFL, because, oh, you know, everyone makes the playoffs. But literally, almost literally, one team does not make the playoffs in the IBL. So the Leafs have made the playoffs, even though they didn't have a great year. But I think, Damon, this is what I think. We collect at Christy Pitts for the playoff game.

We're guaranteed to have at least one playoff game at Christy Pitts. That should be the game you attend. So that'll be next week? Well, that's the thing is yesterday I would say, what's the schedule? We're going to have that schedule, like, within the next week. I'll email you the day and time. That would be great. And if you'd have a great time.

And you'll know the history of the team because I'm giving you a book from Maple Leafs. You can brush up on all your Butler Leafs, Spolgerick history. Well, I was going to say that here in episode 1,745, it takes like 20 minutes for you to announce all the sponsors. And at a certain point, you know, me now being of a certain vintage, I start to nod off. So you might want to get that done before I actually sit down in the chair. Would you reveal your vintage? Would you reveal your age? How old is Damian Cox now?

I'm going to be, I'm going in another week and a half. I'm going to be, in fact, my daughter, or I think it was my daughter said to me, one of my daughters said to me recently, Dad, didn't the Beatles write a song about when I'm 64? And I said, yes, they did. So I will be 64. All right. Well, you look great.

I think you look good for a 64-year-old. And we were joking before I press record of the Passion Returns, Damien Cox, who had that big, that head of hair, like a mullet, basically. It was a mullet. And you made a joke because I think you're one of the only Toronto-Miked guests who left blood on the ceiling. Like you smashed your head so hard.

Like, did you get concussed? I mean, have you had any cat scan since then? Are you okay? I have not. I have been concussed more than once in the course of living. But I don't remember being concussed that particular time. Although I think I had to do a TV thing in the relatively after that.

And so the makeup, people were busy covering up the gash in my head, not the first and only time they had to do that. Well, my lawyer, Lauren Honickman, wants me to tell you, the statute of limitations, it's expired. You can't sue me for that wound. Is Lauren still practicing? Yeah, he's trying.

Okay, so Lauren and I are good friends, and we communicate often. And he's for years now. I remember him on City TV. Oh, absolutely. And then he parlayed that into like legal specialist on CP-24, when um when they when um when um chum city launched that good media career and then he said hey i'm gonna make some real money and he just uh practiced law but you know his heart's in radio like i mean i think

i think i don't want to tell like the powers that be at bell or rogers but i suspect well it'd be bell i guess because he'd probably end up on either 10 10 or 640 but i suspect he would do shifts on those stations for free like that's how much he loves being on the radio i think everybody's uh everybody's heart is in radio, you know, and which is, I mean, radio is changing. Well, I guess radio and is pod, our podcast radio? No. Well, there's no like CRTC interference here. Right, right.

But I think, I mean, it's, it's the best medium for long form discussions that probably exist now. Yeah. Whether it's radio or podcasts or, you know, or some merging of the same. So, and it's kind of always been that way, but now it really, really stands alone, I think, more than was ever the case. Well, we're about to do six hours as evidence that you can have a long-form conversation in this medium. I'll be here for the next 15 minutes of that six hours.

You'll nod off and I'll just keep going. So we'll catch up here. So how are you doing? It's been a while. I'll briefly run down like appearances, but I'm just checking your last visit, which was December 2023. How is life for Damien Cox? life is fantastic i mean it's uh excellent um wonderful very fulfilling uh what are the other words i can use uh all those things i'm you're nourished i'm happy as a as as a clam i'm going to be uh

a grandfather for the first time in the coming months so that's incredibly exciting all four kids are doing amazing my wife uh who is a lawyer is doing amazingly well in her work and uh in and running the entire group of us. And, yeah, we've had some family things like everybody does with aging parents and all that sort of stuff. But things are very, very, very good. Well, I'm happy to hear that because I'm a Cox fan. Okay, I got to be careful how I phrase that. But I am a Cox fan.

And whenever you're on, it's always the same reaction, which is a lot of people are like excited to hear from you. And a lot of people are excited to tell me they won't be listening. I'm sorry for that. No, listen, I made this happen because I wanted to catch up with you. So quickly, because I have many questions. One question before I even do this recap is, did you catch any of the cold play shows at the new Rogers Stadium? No, I did not.

Well, I'll tell you two things. One, I did see them, I think, the previous time they were in Toronto. I went with three of my kids, and we had the best time. That was at Rogers Center, and that was fantastic. So I would have gotten to see them. And the new stadium really doesn't have anything to do with it for me. But I find the prices for a lot of these concerts absurd. Just absurd.

And so I'm less inclined to participate. I think it's just a huge money grab. Now, I've seen some really good concerts this year, but at really cool things. I went and saw Matt Anderson, who's fantastic, up at West Bend Music Festival, up at Peterborough Way. Saw James Taylor down in Ontario Place, 77 years old, amazing, still going. And this weekend going to see Cheryl Crow up at the, what's the name of the, it's up at the, up at Woodbine. They now have a small concert place there, which I've never been to. So I'm going to go there.

So I'm very much into music. I would love to see Colplay, but I ain't paying that money. So I'm with you. Like I'm avoiding these monster big expensive shows. I did buy myself a lawn to see Neil Young this coming weekend because I love catching a Neil Young show. So it's like, I can't remember now, 50 to 60 bucks or something gets me in the place. Where is that? That's at Budweiser stage.

Okay. This coming weekend. I had tickets last summer and he, he, he canceled the show like he was like, I need a break or something like that. But he's coming back. And I'm into like, I love the watchman at the day. Danforth Music Hall. You know, trans-Canada highwaymen are coming to the C&E, and I'm going to try to catch them,

because I love all four guys in Trans-Canada Highwaymen. I don't know if you're up to speed on these guys. I don't know them, who's in the band. So, Chris Murphy from Sloan. So he plays all his songs from Sloan. He'll sing. Stephen Page, formerly of Bare Naked Age. So he'll do, like, Brian Wilson and all his songs.

And who else is in there? Craig Northy from The Odds, who will do some odd songs, and Mo Berg. from The Pursuit of Happiness. So it's like you get the best of the four bands, pretty much. It's funny. I didn't go.

I was invited, but I did not go to last night down at, I call it an Ontario place, whatever we want to call it now. The stage, the dust bowl down there. And it was sticks. Yeah. With some members of Ario Speedwagon. But the singer.

And, um, Don Felder. Okay. How was the show? my wife said it was very loud and they didn't play she said she was a bit confused because they didn't play a lot of the sticks big hits

you know like they didn't play babe they didn't play blue collar man they didn't play I think she said they played come sail away but they didn't play something else she said Larry Gowan is now great as the front man for

for sticks he did a great job the Don Felder part whereas they played lot of Eagle stuff. So she said it was a great show. And it's still a great venue and it's so sad that they're going to remodel it and it'll never be the same. I think they're going to turn it into a four seasons kind of event, which means it'll never be like it was like it is now.

So probably we should urge people if you want to know what, I mean, I think it was probably and has probably been the best place to see a concert in Toronto for a long time. I mean, the shows I've seen there, Zach Brown Band, you know, a pile of sub-blue rodeo if there are a few times.

They've played that venue more than any other artist. Have they? I just had Colin Cripps on and we confirm, yes, so no artist has played that. Who's better?

Who's better than Colin Crips? He's, well, awesome Hamilton guy, amazing guitarist. I know Colin a little bit, although I haven't seen him in a number of years. And that's very cool that he's...

Kathleen Edwards wrote a song about breaking up with him. Yeah, did she? Yeah, and they were a lovely couple when they were together. That's when I knew them and that I knew Colin a little bit. One of the great music experiences

of my life was Dave Hodge and I went up to Barry, I can't give you a year what this would have been, and it was Kathleen Edwards was opening for the tragically hip. So, well, in Olson Park. No, at the arena. It was in the dead of winter.

Okay. And went backstage, met Gord. Of course, he wanted to talk more about hockey than about music. And then sat there as Gord and Kathleen worked out, and Colin was there, worked out what they were going to play together. And it was an amazing musical experience. So Cripps, fantastic, because not only he's got the Kathleen, he did a lot of production of her work and played with her, of course,

and they were married seven years. But of course, in Kathleen Edwards leaves him for Bonnie Vair. So this was like, it's funny talking to Colin's open book about it all And it was quite a conversation But he was also in Junk House With Hamiltonian's great Tom Wilson I think I know

I think he's still living in Hamilton Down Hamilton? Tom? No, Colin? Oh, I think Colin lives here now. I think he moved to Toronto. And then, I mean, Kathleen, I've seen a bunch of times, a bunch of places

And I thought her, she's been through a lot, I think, and some different. And I thought her last album was maybe her best. So maybe a little bit of living has done well for her. And Colin's obviously done great with Jim Cuddy and those guys. Yes. It's great to see them still going, still sounding great.

So yeah, he's always had a relationship with those guys because he was in Crash Vegas with Greg Keeler back in the days. That was great because Greg Keeler was dating Michelle McAdory. Nice of Bob McAdory, by the way. So we're going to connect only done. So yeah, so it's also. This is like turning into one degree of separate. It's like...

That's the Canadian music biz. It's all one... That's kind of what I'm trying to do here is connect all these dots. But, because his first professional gig, if you think of a big band, was he was a member of a touring member of Spoons with Burlington band.

Oh, yeah. Nova Heart. Well, yeah, except this is... So, yes, they have their heyday, right? The peak of Spoons, and that's Nova Heart and romantic traffic and all that. These spoons are the Spoons. I ask Gordep that in this basement,

and he says either or... Okay. So whatever. I was playing golf. with some Westdale guys yesterday and all these dots do connect and we always start talking about who knew this guy and who knew this guy

because we all knew each other growing up in the Hamilton-Birlington area. And then it's all, it all comes back to the Lanwaws whenever you're doing these one-degree things and you start in the hammer because Jocelyn Lanwa was the person who recruited Colin Cripps

for Crash Vegas, which was Greg Keeler and Michelle McAdore's band in Toronto. So that's what brings him to Toronto And he's in Crash Vegas until he's in Junkhouse with Tom Wilson for that big second album. And then basically does the stuff with his wife, Kitty, as he calls her. And does a lot of stuff with Jim Cuddy and then gets recruited to replace Greg Keeler because Greg Keeler has tinnitus. And there you go. Now you've got it all.

Okay. So I'm going to burn through. See, that's why I come here to learn stuff. Well, the thing is, I could have you over and we could, I don't even know. How closely are you falling? Halloween sports these days. I have my wife sworn to secrecy. Don't tell people how little I watch,

which is not actually true. You got to own it, man. No, I mean, I watch lots, but I'm pretty selective. I'm watching the Blue Jays a lot these days. I actually went down to the ballpark two nights ago. I did too. I think they did a great job with the stadium. I was shocked because I'd heard all this stuff.

Oh, they did this and it's fantastic. And I went, yeah, yeah, yeah, it's still the dome. And I went down there, and I thought, boy, they really did do some great stuff down here. And this was Tuesday night? You were there? Yeah. Were you beat the Cubs? 80,000 hot dogs.

I contributed four. My daughter took me to that game. Yeah, so we were in the same building. Yeah, it was a good night, wasn't it? We had a friend up from Costa Rica who was there, and he was just blown away. It was the most amazing. Firstly, the dome was full. Like that's so, and it was a stormy kind of night, so they closed that roof, unfortunately.

Which is too bad. Yeah, but it was like the forecast looked like 40% chance of thunder showers or so I get it. But okay, I guess that's why you have a dome. But it was full and it was a passionate loud crowd and the team played well. Like, I mean, and the team's in first place. And we're going to cover, here's what we're going to do. So we're going, I have things I want to, you know, check in. You ask me a question.

Then you don't even get to answer. Your question was how much do I follow sports? Oh, yeah. I thought you were kind of, you know, I selective and I thought we kind of uncovered as we go along. But if you have more to say on that subject, Damien, please. No, carry on. So I'm now going to burn through previous Damien Cox episodes of Toronto Mike. And if there's anything in the description you want to touch on, you can, of course, chime in.

But then I have my, uh, my little, like ancient history. Yeah, well, it starts 10 years ago. So your first visit, and maybe this is when the blood was on the ceiling, February 2015. So we're going back a decade. Episode one 10. One year after I'd left the star or a matter month, after I've left the star on the full. and was gone full-time at the Sportsnet. You got it.

So here's the description. Mike Chats of longtime Toronto Star Journalist and Rogers broadcaster, Damien Cox, about his years at the star on the fan 590 and on TSN and Rogers Hockey. And then we also talked about your Twitter behavior. And there's some great old audio of you, I think, from Bloge Salming, if I'm getting there right, and down goes brown that I played for you. But are you still active on the Apple? formerly known as Twitter?

No. How long? I don't have to give me the exact date because I have also abandoned my X account, but how long ago do you think you left those? I've been winding it down but probably

six to eight months that I really, I don't even look at it anymore. No, I, when I, I don't look at it either actually. Once in a while, like I don't have it on, I have it on one of my devices now.

And actually, I opened it the other day, and I was kind of like, man, there is nothing here. Now, I don't sort of go actively searching, so there's probably more of interest there, but so I have no reason to go back. But, you know, I think it has evolved. I think it was such a big deal in media when it first came out, you know, how many followers people had and all that sort of stuff, until people started understanding there were ways to do. generate huge number of followers, and a lot of it was kind of bullshit.

Excuse my language. I work of guys who bought followers. Yeah. And it was, it ended up being kind of a way to both make yourself a target and be targeted. And, you know, we are all kind of rookies at it at the same time. And now you look back and say, why would I have written that? Why did I care about that? Why did I respond to this?

Why did I get involved in that? But at the time, it seemed to be the thing to do. And media companies were pushing people like myself to be involved, to be active, to be, have a profile. Whereas I don't get the sense that's the case anymore. No, I think you're, I hope you're right. But I haven't really looked at my account much since April. But so February 2015, we had that great chat. And then you came back in October 2017.

It was episode 270. I was boycotting those three. years. Two years. I was boycotting. Well, I don't think I recorded as often back then. I mean, I had a job until 2018. So I feel like this was a, you know, less regular.

This was more of a vocation. This was like a side hustle until 2018. So October 2017, this is episode 270, Mike and Damien Cox, play and discuss his 10 favorite songs of all time. Yes. We did have another chair. So you kicked out the jams. I enjoyed that very much.

And, I mean, even from our discussions, I mean, you know, I love. music i spent a lot of my time i probably spend more time with music and uh reading about music than i do in sports in a lot of ways uh right now but uh um me too by the way florence and machine was maybe the best show i ever saw it uh ontario place by it does it was coming to me i was thinking who is the one it was an amazing show dog days are over for damon yep um so yeah that was and you know it's funny i've i've gone back and revisited that a little bit and a couple of times I thought, I wonder if I changed that now in the 10 years, because I hope I have. I hope I would.

I mean, I don't, I'm not one who still listens to darkness on the edge of town over and over and over again and only music of the 70s or whatever. Um, and I try to. My kids are hugely helpful. It was always sending me music. So, um, you know, I'm, I'm, I'm, I'd like to think my list is evolving. But there was some new, like I know there was cold play on there and you talked, that's why I asked you about cold play.

The, uh, and I know that you had a cold play t-shirt. shirt on in our photo by did I? Okay. So I took mental notes and all. Yeah. So once in a while you got to my daredevil teacher. I see that. Okay. The man without fear. That's what you need when you come on. He was kind of my guy when I was growing up. I love the daredevil comics. Awesome. So the

people should check out the Damien Cox kicks out the gyps. I have to say I did, I felt I learned more about you as like a human being person in the world from your jam kicking than I did from your initial visit. And I think it's because you opened up about some things. You talked about, you know, I can relate completely, too. I'm a divorced dad. You know, I remember the shared custody years, you know.

I'm glad they're in the rear view of mirror, but I know how that feels. And then just hearing you talk about the, you know, the Bruce Springsteen song and the cold play and the different memories. We learned a lot about you in episode 270. Well, that's, well, I think that people, when they hear you or read you in the newspaper,

or hear you on the radio and they think they know you and and they don't and you know and i'm as guilty as that when i see actors and actresses or musicians or whatever you think you know them but you don't and so uh i would say it's uh nice to be asked about other things right that's why we did 20 minutes of music talk off the top and we'll get some more music in later but november 2018 and you came back no only you know what am i leaving soon you're god i have only if you have a dentist appointment or something. I think they're going to like happy kind and the mirth makers. You're going to strike up the band here soon?

That's the, yeah, that's the Jim Cuddy line. I actually packed up my studio, put it in my bike trailer, biked to Leslieville, and I basically set up in the woodshed where the famous woodshed, where Blue Rodeo records and rehearses and something like that.

And then I had Jim Cuddy. So just Jim Cuddy one on one in person at the woodshed. And we're cooking with gas. This is a great chat. I don't know where an hour in or whatever. And he looks at me and he goes, I have a dentist appointment in 10 minutes. So I have a, now I have this, like, thought in my head, everybody.

Like, this guy's, you don't, I always, I didn't say it to you, but I'm like, you don't have a dentist appointment in 10 minutes. Do you like, this has just become code? No, but I have two pretty good Jim Cuddy stories. Tell me. Well, I mean, I wouldn't say we're friends, but we are acquaintances through other people. And so one, and both of them were, one night, we're down, I think it was like the skydiggers somewhere on Queen Street. and we're taking, maybe it was a Christmas show.

Oh, a horseshoe. Because the Skydeans do the Christmas show at the horseshoe. And then, somehow Jim Cuddy was there with some, I was part of a group. And then we went down the street to hear his son play. So we're with, we're with Jim walking down the street to go see there. Actually, I have three good stories. And then we see that.

So that was a night spent with Jim Cuddy. I don't know if he recognized me if he walked in the room. now he might because he's a sports fan but he's a big hockey fan we also i was part of a dinner one night at the gray cup in at a great cup in calgary where incredible wine was drank and i remember him making fun of me at the end of the night for how bow-legged i am um so that was that was that was a highlight and then i always remember so springsteen was at the dome and it was rogers had their big box going and this was during the keith pellier and uh so lots of people and Jim was there

and I remember being just fascinated by watching him I mean he's an accomplished artist and we you know you know I don't know if he's in the Canadian Music Hall of Fame I'm sure he is but I was there he is he is he should I mean he's one of the

great in my opinion Canadian music but you know despite all that him sitting in a front row seat and watching so intently watching the boss do his show and being and so into it. And I thought, okay, that's cool. Not sort of standing aside thinking, you know, yeah, he's already, he was in there and

part of the show. And I thought that was, so there's three Jim Cuddy stories. He probably has none about me. You know what? Next time I talk to Jim, I'll ask about you. That'll be my first question. What do you know about Damien Cox? Have you heard the Tom Wilson, Bruce Springsteen's Tits story?

No, I've heard a lot of Tom Wilson stories. I love listening to Tom Wilson tell stories. He tells this story on my show, and it was great. And then I'm at the horseshoe to see Junkhouse. And this is, I don't know, a couple of winches ago or whatever. And he tells the same story verbatim. And I remember being disappointed. Like, oh, that was like a just, he's just calling these stories.

It's not an exclusive. Like, it bugged me. Should I have been bug that it was like told verbat? It's a great story. But it wasn't just a, a Toronto mic, I'm going to tell you a story, whatever. It was like, this is a story I'm going to tell in multiple places. Well, and I think you see that more. Like, I now see that.

with, I mean, obviously, I'm not, I'm not the same as Brad Faye, but I'm a big, I'm a big Springsteen guy. I've probably seen him 25 times. That's a lot. But I, and I was so lucky to see him from the fourth row at Springsteen on Broadway. And that was an incredible show. I went with my wife, she's not even a Springsteen fan, and she cried like five times. It was just an amazing show but the next show i saw him in it was kind of scripted almost like now that idea of the of the springsteen on broadway was now part of it it wasn't spontaneous um that was still great he's still a boss he's still my guy but it wasn't and i and i and i at that point i thought okay i think this is where i get off going to the concerts because now i'm going to see

a scripted concert as opposed to when I first saw him in 1979 or 80 the river tour and he played for three hours, four hours, whatever it was. And you really got the sense back then. They were kind of figuring it out as they went along. Well, that's not the case anymore. Now it's like you're going to see like almost like a Broadway show. Kind of.

That was the feeling I got. And you get that. The more you see an artist, the more you kind of like, I've seen Zach Brown band a few times, and I kind of get the feeling with that a little bit. You know, the more you see an artist, the more likely, because they can't pull out a brand new set of circumstance. Now, I will say, went and saw James Taylor, and he was, he had some, like, he just, first of all, he's 77 years old.

I mean, this is a guy who, how was he alive? He was a heroin addict for, what, 40 years? right um he the show begins by him just quietly walking out on stage nobody he says ladies and gentlemen james tail not nothing i mean this guy is an icon in the folk music scene he just sort of kind of quietly walks out on stage grabs his guitar he starts saying he goes hello Toronto great to be here he said uh so sorry that's about all i can say you know his nod to the whole The old Trump thing, yes. And then he went out, and then he had a few moments that seemed, it felt spontaneous.

He was very quiet, very soft-spoken. Boy, did he have a group of players with him. He had some outstanding musicians, so. You know, he's got one of the great Simpsons cameos, James. Oh, does he? He sings. I've never watched the Simpsons. Oh, my goodness.

There's a great episode where Homer goes to space. And James, to entertain the astronauts in space, James Taylor is singing a song. And he's doing fire and rain, I think he does. But it's great. Now, so I will tell you since your last visit, and I'm still running through these descriptions here, but I have seen Springsteen finally. So basically because of you and Brad Faye and all these people

who kept telling me, like, I got to go check this out. I finally had the pleasure of seeing Bruce Springsteen. It was the night after Trump was reelected. So this was the night after. And it was like a religious experience. Where was it? It was at the Scotia Bank Arena. Okay.

And I actually recorded a special episode of Toronto, Mike, like the next day where I talked about the experience. Because I, you know, you can talk. I just heard you do it. Like, you know, I've been hearing guys your vintage tell me forever about what it's like to see Bruce and everything. And you're like, okay, I kind of, you know, I've been to some big shows. It sounds like it'd be nice.

But honestly, it was like a religious experience. It was unbelievable. And I totally get it now. But you have to go see it to get it. Yeah. And not to say you missed something. Boy, did you miss something? I mean, in the decades before, it was even more of that.

But I did get three hours and it felt, and maybe it's rehearsed and polished, but it was high energy and. Yeah, yeah. Well, and he's got such a collection of songs. I mean, you know, and, and the, the thrilling thing for me, and I mean, Brad and I, we just, we did a golf trip to Northern Ireland early this summer, so we spent some time. Well, I was going to ask how Brad's doing. Brad's doing great.

And he, he hit the 100 mark long ago, right, with Bruce. Yeah, yeah. And he's, in fact, on this trip, I met him in, we picked up a car in Dublin, and he'd been to see Bruce in Paris. I mean, he is just over the top and just loves it. I got to get Bruce. I got to get Brad back on the, I was going to say, I got to get Bruce on the show. I got to work on that too, but you got to get Brad on the show.

Brad's still going strong and, and, and all that. But, you know, we can talk about music. But the great thing about Bruce is, like, you know, you'll get a lot of people who just want to hear Born to Run and Under Road and stuff. I've loved his last three or four albums. So this is the guy who's now, whatever he is, 76, whatever he is. Yeah, around there. I mean, his last few albums have been outstanding for me.

So he's still producing great music, and he's got an album coming out. So, you know, it's not like, I mean, you mentioned Neil Young. I know he came out with an album last year, but he hasn't produced the same quality of stuff, I don't think, in a long, long time. Most of these guys have their sweet spot. And, you know, James Taylor hasn't had a great, I mean, Bruce is still churning out, in my opinion, outstanding stuff, which makes it pretty cool. Long may he. He was born to run.

Long may he run. Shout out to Neil Young. See you this weekend. Uncle Neil. Now, November 2018, you returned. And this is episode 403. See, obviously, I like chatting with you because I keep getting you back every year or so. Mike chats with Sports Nets, Damien Cox, about why he's no longer on primetime sports.

changes at Hockey Night in Canada? That's evergreen that one. Okay. His new book about the 92-93 Leafs, speaking of the passion returning, and much more. So we had another great chat. And do you have any relationship today

with the host of primetime sports, Bob McCowan? I'd have to look on my phone, but I'd probably exchanged messages with him a few months ago. That's recent. Yeah, I mean, you know, Bob and I were never friends, friends.

we were business associates. But is anyone really a friend, friend of Bob McCown? I don't, you know, I can't say. I can't speak to that. But I know he had some health challenges. I'm hoping he's doing well. You know, and, you know, I mean, I've been kind of out of it since 2019 since I left SportsNat. I mean, I still write and do stuff.

But time really does give you some perspective on the whole thing. It really, really does. And I'm not one of those people who will tell you how great it was when I was doing it. And I'm definitely not one of those people who would be, who has bitter or this happened, this happened. Right. You know, I'm thrilled I got to be on Hockey Night in Canada for a couple of years. I've thrilled to be co-host of prime time sports, I think, on three different occasions, plus a million other appearances. I'm thrilled I got to work with Bob and Dave Hodge and, you know, just a ton of really,

really, really good people, some of the best, and, you know, be part of writing staff with Dave Perkins and Milt Dunnell and Jim Proudfoot and Wayne Parrish. And, I mean, I've been so blessed in that regard. So, you know, I think at that time, probably in 2018, it would only be another year or so that I was at SportsNet. Well, glad you mentioned that.

Because on April 2019, you returned for episode 451, Mike chats of Damien Cox about why he's no longer at Sportsnet. Yeah, and, um, uh, uh, yeah, um, I think at that time, I, I, I can't remember what I said, um, but I was both disappointed and kind of relieved. I, I think looking back, I was pretty burnt out. I've been going pretty hard since 1985. Um, and in fact, last December was, I wrote something in the star and it was, was the 40th anniversary that I'd been writing things for the Toronto Star.

So, you know, I think you're always disappointed when your association with a company you enjoy ends, but it was, it was over. You know, there's probably more I could done, but I didn't really have the role there that was, you know, was perfect. And, you know, to be honest, I was getting paid too much. And I think what we've seen and what's, happening with a lot of those companies now. If you get paid too much, you become a target.

Isn't that shitty, though, because the goal is to, you know, make as much money as you can, your value and everything. But what it does is puts a big target on your back, where it seems like the way to last is to be undervalued underpaid. Work for less. Yeah. I think that's shitty. And I think there's people out there who are good evidence of that.

Now, that said, when I left the start as a full-time employee in 2014, I left with a handshake agreement that I would continue to write columns for them. I continue to write columns to them 11 years later. We have no contract. We have no other than we just keep going. So, you know, who gets to have that relationship with a major media company where, like I said, I don't even have a contract. I don't have anything.

I just do stuff. So there's the good and the bad. November 2021, this is episode 945. And that gap might be like a COVID thing. We're in COVID times now. But I guess we were allowed in the basement because I did a lot of backyard episodes, but you never did a backyard episode, right? Okay.

So you were down here. Yes, I did. Did I do one with Gord? In the backyard? I think we did. Okay, so, because I do have Gord coming up here. So November 2021 was episode 945, Mike chats of Damien Cox about his Twitter persona. So clearly you were a polarizing figure on Twitter back when I used.

used to, you know, enjoy being on that app, which seems like a long time ago now. But we talked about why you bother, you're blocking, that's great question, you're blocking strategy, sports media in 2021, Angelo Mosca, and your new book, A League of Our Own. So that was another catch-up in November 2021. July 2022, this episode, 1884, this was, I wrote here, the description, Mike reunites Gord Stelick and Damien Cox, And just to tie that with your most recent visit, which was December 2023, that was episode 1387, Mike chats with Gord Stelick and Damien Cox about the Otani hype, John Lennon, the 7778 Toronto Maple Leaves, because you guys wrote a book called Revival, John Kordick, and more.

So the last two times you've been here in Toronto, Mike, you've been with Gord Stelich. Well, he's always crowding me, right? He was never let me have the stage to myself. Gord, he's just always, you know, getting into the spotlight. So this is a nice opportunity to set you straight on our relationship. Well, here's a surprise for you. Gord, come on down. Hit your head on the way down.

Well, that is the kind of thing I would do. But still good friends of Gord? Oh, yeah. I mean, Gord and I are lifelong friends. We don't see each other or spend out each other. We kind of travel in different orbits. He's up cricket club way and playing lots. of tennis, doing lots of curling, lots of family stuff he's got going on. I'm in the West End

and have my whole thing. But, you know, Gord's one of those guys who I love them and we'll be friends forever. Awesome to hear that. Okay, I'm going to give you a couple of gifts here and then I'm going to start hitting you of the questions that have come in through. Now the intro's over. No, you know what? I never wore a watch. I haven't wanted to watch for decades, but my wife bought a new Garmin watch and she had this one on my wrist. And she said, do you want to try this? And I For cycling or for golf? So it does the heart rate, so it's kind of neat. I don't know, just like some fun.

Are you going to give me a Garmin watch because I need a new golf watch? When Garmin becomes a sponsor, you're going to be the first recipient of a Garmin watch. But I got the hand me down here and it was vibrating because I was getting a phone call and I might have glanced at it to see who was calling like out of like habit. But I'm not taking a call. I'm not taking a call. I wouldn't do that too. This is, you have my full attention here.

What's my gifts? I wish I could say the same. Do you still enjoy a fresh can of craft beer? I do. Would you like some Great Lakes beer for you? I would. Would you like for you? Okay.

Well, I have some fresh cans here of Great Lakes. Oh, what a surprise. Is that why you're here, Damon? They make good beer. And it's in South Atobico. They make that beer. I like their premium and lager I particularly, I'm not a pale ale guy. What's this summer?

Oh, it's called summer ale. It's quite nice. It's like ginger and it's quite nice. Well, you know what? I'll swap out. So if you're a bigger logger guy, I'll swap. Without the pale nail. I'll swap it over you.

I'm actually excited to see local brewers do well. And everywhere I go now, I'm always looking for the local loggers. So hopefully people are doing the same when they come to Toronto. Hopefully. They're fiercely independent, you know. Those big conglomerates, they park the Brinks truck in the Great Lakes driveway. And Peter Bullitt tells them to get that off our property. We don't want that here.

They're fiercely independent. So love working of Great Lakes. Speaking of Fiercely Independent, I've been working with Palma Pasta for years. And I'm excited to tell you, Damien, there is a frozen lasagna in my freezer for you. Excellent. Thank you, Palma Pasta. I don't want to know what else is in that freezer. It's all lasagna.

Having had it before, it's outstanding. And Ridley Funeral Home, pillars of this community. We just released a new episode of Life's Undertaking yesterday. Brad Jones from Ridley Funeral Home records that episode, that podcast, with me, but Ridley Funeral Home is sending a measuring tape for you, Damien Cox. It goes to exactly six feet deep. Is that the whole idea? You got to make sure you're six feet under. Did you ever see the show six feet under? No.

Okay, excellent show. I don't know if you watch TV. You have no time for TV. I watch TV. Okay, well, six feet under is only like one of the, I'd say it's one of the top three shows I've ever seen in my entire life. That's how much I enjoy six feet under. Top three show for me. What's it about? It's about a family that lives on the premises of the family-owned funeral home. Oh. And similarly, Ridley Funeral Home,

they live on the premises of their funeral home. And Brad tells me they're the last family in the city to live on the premises of the funeral home. Okay. Like back in the day, this is how it was.

But nowadays, I think they're the last family standing with a Ridley Funeral Home. Okay. Here's a name I'm going to ask you about because my guest yesterday was a rising, aspiring country singer. And we had a great chat, actually.

her name is Bree Taylor and she was telling me about her grandfather and she dropped this name and told me what he was up to and I'm like how come I don't know this name and then I find out it's because I'm too young I missed his era if you will but do you know the name John Batam yes so I so John Batten's sportscaster yeah like covered Argo's games yeah yeah yeah yeah so this guy's been around he was apparently the yep the voice of like great the wolf and Peterborough great great set of pipes yeah he I think he worked in Saskatchewan, and then he came here and covered the Argos

and called Argo games, Argo games on the radio, I think, for years. So I missed John Batten, but I just wondered if you knew him because apparently, if you're a little older than me, you definitely know John Batten and his granddaughter is an aspiring country singer who was here yesterday.

I'll have to have a listen. There are some, I love those relationships. It's like, you ever listen to Colter Wall? Yes, because my barber plays Coulter Wall. Every time I get a haircut. Shout out to Andy. Outstanding. Hi, Andy.

And his father, you know, his father is. Tell me. Was the former Premier of Saskatchewan, Bradwell. Okay, see. So he plays this Coulter Wall for me. And it's very good. But that voice is like, there's a voice for you. Yeah, no, he's great.

And he's, you know, you speak about Great Lakesboro being fiercely independent. I think Colter Wall is, and one of his things is he does not come east. When he performs, it's in the West and in Saskatchewan, Alberta. He's not interested in Ontario. So, there you go. But, yeah, some of these, I mean, obviously, the Neil Young, who you mentioned, of course, the son of Scott Young. Yes. So, yeah, these relationships are always interesting.

Always interesting. Okay, first question for you, Damien Cox, comes from Brian Gerstein. Brian, a longtime listener and contributor to the program. You might have come over at least once when you got a. property in the six mug or anything. Have you ever got a glass for me, like Property in the Six? Or maybe you missed it.

Okay, well, shout out to Property and the Six. Shout out to Brian. You probably gave it to Gord. Gord took two home. He's like, screw it. These are mine. Here's, I'm going to read Brian. It's a little long here.

I'm sure Damien, as a huge tennis fan, he's making some assumptions. I don't actually like the assumptions. I feel like ask the question and you tell us whether you are. Like, it's like they assume things. I don't think it's a good move, but I'm going to read it.

Sure. Okay, I'm sure that Damien, as a huge tennis fan, is very bullish on Victoria Mboko. And what lies ahead for her? What impressed you the most? This is for you. What impressed you the most? Was it her actual tennis skills highlighted by one of the best backhands in the game

right now displayed on the court en route to her championship? Or her ability to focus on every point, Rafa like, what praise that is, with her mental toughness to wear her opponents out, even after falling behind a set. Please talk to me about Victoria. Well, probably a bit of everything. I mean, you know, she's probably,

I mean, she's a different player than Bianca Andrascu was or is, but she might be the most complete female player to come through in maybe ever. And, I mean, when I look at young players and, you know, in their potential, I always look for weapons. do they have weapons because in tennis today to really get there you've got to have weapons you can be a great all around player and fast and you can compete but without weapons you're going to have a hard time getting to the top and you know he mentioned her backhand but her serve i mean she can really serve so it's going to be fascinating um to see where she goes because it's way too early to even project i mean she hasn't even played 20 professional or uh wTA matches yet Right. So, you know, where she's headed, I can't exactly say, but it's sure exciting.

And I know at some point you were doing work with Tennis Canada. Yep. A little bit. Do you still do work with Tennis Canada? No. No more than. Just did a little bit with them after I left Sportsnet, but there wasn't really, you know, I, at that point in time, particularly, I don't think I was so ambitious to go out and start mining new possibilities. You weren't going to go hustling.

Uh, no, that's probably, that's probably fair. That's probably fair. Well, as I said to you, I think I was kind of burnt out too. I think I really was. I sort of had enough. No, I mean, you put in some time, right? Some, some hard time. The follow-up, though, about Victoria, it's M-Boko. Can you say the name for me? You say, Victoria M-Bocco? So you just M-Bocco. I want to make sure I get this right. Okay. Alan Gold writes in, And I think it gets this term actually from Hebsey on sports because he refers to this, particularly if it Bianca, but any chance Victoria is a flash in the pan slash one hit wonder. So do you have a crystal ball there, Mr. Cox? No, as I said, we just don't know. She's 18.

Yeah. I mean, all the great signs are there. She seems to have her family and a great group around her. So those are huge things. but the nature of professional tennis and particularly women's professional tennis is it is a grind. Traveling is hard.

Traveling is lonely. And those are factors that have a lot to do with. And the number one thing, the number one thing in tennis is injuries. I mean, so many great players have seen their careers undercut by injuries. And then you could name a bunch of Canadian players as part of that, Bianca Andrescu, Milos Rohnich, all that sort of stuff.

Bouchard? Yeah, yeah, Genie Bouchard. So to me, it comes down to can she stay healthy? Can she stay healthy? One of the biggest keys to Roger Federer's greatness was he stayed healthy. Raffa would have won even more if he'd been able to stay healthy. Joker's been, you know, pretty darn healthy and has really taken care of his body, so he's still going. That's a huge, huge part of it.

And we saw her hurt her wrist and still win the National Bank open. So I think that's as much a part. But all the good signs are there. I think there's reason to be excited. And now we'll watch her career unfold. And it's way too early to say whether she's going to be one of the greatest ever or a flash in the pan. We just don't know.

Time will tell. But speaking of Canadian 18-year-old women, have you been following this tremendous meteoric rise of Summer McIntosh? Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. So, I mean, I was going to ask you, what's going on there? That's quite a, like, she's poised to kick ass in the next. She'll very quickly become the most decorated Canadian Olympian of all time if she stays healthy. I mean, so with her, I mean, she is the reigning Northern Star Award winner.

Used to be known as Lou Marsh. Right. I speak to her family a little bit, just in relation to that. um i know she's uh she's actually i know she's getting her wisdom teeth out next week but then she's heading down to austin to the university of texas where she's going to work with a professional group of swimmers um down there um and one of the coaches is was michael phelps's um coach so i think she's really she's really got her eye on making history and we're going to see if she's able to do that at the olympics next year

It's so exciting. Okay, 18-year-old Summer Macintosh from these parts, the Tobico gal. Yeah, from, like, phenomenal. I, you know, I said that recently. So somehow, I was talking about this, it was guys when I was playing golf down in the hammer yesterday, somehow Hamilton produced the world's best basketball player. Right, right.

Atopico produced maybe the greatest female swimmer in history. We'll see, but probably the greatest Canadian female swimmer. Right. And then we've got somebody like Vicki M. Boko, who was born in North Carolina, but now is, I think she lives in Burlington. That's right. So, you know, it's kind of amazing all these athletes from this area. Look, I'm now on episode 1,745, so I'm going to show you the kind of segways I can now execute. This is going to blow your mind, Damien.

Because you'll think you're on primetime sports with these segways. But I often, a recent guest, Devin Harrow, do you know Devin? Yep. So, Devin, he's kind of like the Summer Macintosh whisperer. I know of him. He does a great job on CBC. And he's, I consider Devin now, he's kind of like my Summer Macintosh whisperer. Like he's seen, he was telling me that Phelps News months ago.

He's right there talking of Summer Macintosh. He seems to trust him. They have a good relationship. And similarly, do you have a relationship, Damien Cox, of Joe Warmington from the Toronto Sun? No. No relationship, but you know of Joe Warmington and the Toronto Sun. Unfortunately, yes. Joe Warmington has become sort of the Don Cherry whisperer.

Okay? So if you want to know what's going on in summer, talk to Devin Hero, if you're taking notes at home. And if you want to know what's going on on Don Cherry, you've got to talk to Joe Warmington. It seems to be the Don Cherry whisperer. Are you still friendly? Because the reason I had this gentleman on the show in the first time is a recommendation from you, are you still friendly with Gear Joyce? Yes.

Yeah, although I haven't talked to Gare in quite a while. He's in Kingston now. Yep. He moved down there a couple of years ago, right after COVID, I think. Pandemic thing. I mean, in my opinion, still, you know, one of the most talented Canadian sports writers as far as writing ability in particular. And he's a real researcher.

I'm a big fan of Gair's, and he's a great guy. Agreed on all counts. And they brought back that Jason Priestley private practice thing. There's a new reboot, so maybe he got a little e-transfer. He's got his fingers in a lot of money. There's a guy with a lot of hustle. He's got the hustle. And he's writing for the wig standard.

Yeah. And he, so he had a call with Don't, sorry, he had a call with not Donne. That's Joe Warmington territory. He had a call of Ron McLean. And this became a big story across this country

because Ron talked about that, Remembrance Day coach's corner that was like his, that ended up being Don Cherry's last coach's corner, that this was part of a Don Cherry exit. strategy because in 2019, Don Cherry had a very bad bout with, I believe, pneumonia during the Stanley Cup playoffs, and he was hospitalized, according to, well, Ron McLean credited the source, the state of the source as Gary Bettman. So it was like, I was told by Gary Batman. He was in the hospital. Bottom line is, this became quite a story. I, because you're, you know, you had the pleasure of being on Hockey and Canada and because you know these principles Ron, Don. Could we have a little check? out here about like Ron versus Don like do you do you think Ron is right that in any way this could have been a Don Cherry exit strategy because he wanted in 2019 to wind down due to a health scare well first of all I don't know I've never talked to Don about it and since I've never talked to

Don about it I would never ever go and say something about that so why Ron would be talking about Don by things from Gary Betman you'd have to ask Ron like that makes no sense to me at all um and i also by the way i mean we can go back to whether they were right to fire don or not right to fire don and in my opinion what he said was was wrong and if he had apologized he probably would have stayed on but i watched that show and ron was just he was as complicit in the whole thing and then danced away from it at the end so look i mean i i don't know either guy really well I know Don better than I know Ron. I've always liked Don, despite the fact that we have very different opinions.

And he was always nice to me. I just don't understand why Ron would be going down there. It's not his business to be saying stuff like that. And he shouldn't be saying it. And apparently this call between Gear and Ron, because I've had Gare on the show to talk about basically the story. Like, well, how did this happen? Gare just wanted to talk to Ron McLean about a cottage that Don owned on Wolf Island,

that he sold in 2019. So he was like closing that deal the week he was being fired from Roger Sportsnet. Yeah, and I also think, you know, I mean, what is Don now, 91? Is that, is that sorry? Yeah, I think he's 91. I think at a certain point, how do I want to say this? I think we start, we have to be very careful we're not taking advantage of people when they're not in the limelight quite in the same way.

anymore um and using them and uh i think if don has something to say he's got more than enough ways to go out and say it um that's what joe warmington's for yeah i guess um i guess i'll leave it at that i i noticed that this this research because joe ron versus don was 2019 right so we're going back now six years or whatever if my math is right but like it seems like it percolated back up because of the fact that the Don Cherry podcast, which I will confess, I've never actually listened to the Don Cherry podcast, but I'm sure it's wonderful, but that, you know, it was promoted on Don Cherry's X account and by his son, Tim, I believe is Tim, on the podcast that this was like a finale, like the final episode of the Don Cherry.

So there was kind of news about the final episode of the Don Cherry podcast. So it kind of brought it like, okay, end of an era kind of deal, like he's done broadcasting. He's going to live out the rest of his life. with his family or whatever. And then the Ron McLean volunteering this info when he was just chatting with Gare about a cottage on Wolf Island, just this exit strategy.

And then the disclosure of the health scare in 2019, which Ron's smart enough to know, that ain't cool. Like if I happen, Gere's a good example. Gare has given me permission to speak publicly. He had a health scare with pneumonia. And he's gone on the show,

he's been very public about it. He's okay with me talking. Yeah, I think that's part of the reason he went to Kingston during COVID was to get away from, I'm like people. Real health scare. He almost died, he tells me.

So Gare made the choice to be public about his health scare. Don Cherry has the right, in my opinion, to privacy when it comes to his personal health. I think as a basic rule, you don't talk about other people's health unless you're talking to them or, you know, or if they were ever to give you permission to talk about it. But, yeah, I mean, I, I've seen that whole thing played out and I, and I, and I, and I, not I'm not impressed with any of the, well, of the principles involved in that. And I just feel like, like, why are we doing this to Don Cherry? Just let him do his thing, you know, and that stuff.

So I don't think he, like when I saw him interviewed on, somebody interviewed him. Well, it's got to be Warmington. I don't think he's done. No, no, but I think I saw him on TV being interviewed by one of the, anyways, he doesn't seem to really want to get involved. in this whole thing. He doesn't want to start fighting with guys and all that sort of stuff. So I think it's in the interest of Joe Warmington to stir it up. And so he's going to stir it up.

And that's his business. And he's been doing what he's been doing for a long time. And I'm not going to, I'm not his keeper. He can do what he wants. You know, but, yeah, it's all sorts of, let me say the word I would use is unfortunate. I think it's unfortunate, very unfortunate that Ron decided to talk about it, and I think it's unfortunate that it blew up into a thing. And it's worth noting Don suffered some personal loss recently

because he lost his brother and his daughter in the last, you know, years. So it's been a... Well, and you know, sorry, now I'm sort of going on about the... Well, I've had a lot of experience. My father died last year. Oh, I'm sorry. You know, he had dementia. He was 94.

or I know lots of older people and I've seen the situations they get into and how vulnerable they become. And I'm not suggesting that Don's vulnerable or needs somebody looking at. That's not what I'm saying. I'm saying, you know, I think we need to be very careful and show really great care and respect for people as they age to make sure we're not taking advantage of them. And again, Don would probably say, well, no one's going to take advantage of me. and I'm not saying that, but I just, I get very uncomfortable, I mean, we've seen this before.

I get very uncomfortable when, with interviews with older, whether they're singers, athletes, executives who may not be, you know, able to articulate their point of view or protect themselves in the way they once were able to do. and then I think you're you're sort of exploiting people and I don't like to see that happen. Do you know the name Jeff Lumby? Yes, he's a radio guy. He was a long-time radio guy. Yeah.

He's actually, he was in Montreal co-hosting a show of Humble Howard Glassman when Humble Howard Glassman was recruited. I see Howard all the time now, by the way. Because you're a golf guy. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I see him all the time. He's a good golfer.

He's a very good golfer. and he's absolutely addicted to golfing because so, like I even invite him over here and stuff and golf comes first, like this is party one. Yeah, he's intense. I kind of get it because I have the similar addiction to cycling the city, so I actually totally get that he's got to, it's kind of like his medicine,

he's got to be out there. But Humble Howard was recruited to Toronto to co-host a show on CF and Y with Fred Patterson while he was, while Howard was co-hosting a show with Jeff Lumby in Montreal. So Jeff Lombie, long-time radio guy. He actually did a summer doing mornings on the Fan 590, like interim, I think he was replaced by,

I think it was like Andrew Crystal came in or something like that. Shout out to Ridley Funeral Home. But I'm mentioning Jeff because he passionately believes that Don Cherry should have the Order of Canada. And I personally, I mean, I have my thoughts on this, which is no way Jose because of the fact that he was so disrescent. respectful of Quebecois.

Like, you know, ask your friend and my friend Dave Hodge about Don's refusal to pronounce even the names properly, like Petroix.

You know, it's Patty Roy or whatever. I think that alone will, you know, exclude you from the Order of Canada. But what does Damien Cox think about Jeff Lumby's plea to give Don Cherry

the Order of Canada? I, you know, first of all, I'll say two things. One that, um, I don't know enough about qualifications of people for the Order of Canada to speak on it. I would be interested to hear people's why they think he should and why they think he shouldn't

before I really had an opinion on it because I don't know. I mean, I know people who have received the Order of Canada and they were outstanding people. You know, and they range from, I mean, we, and people have lost it, right? Buffy St. Marie. Sure. Well, yeah. the Order of Canada. So I think it's a, it's certainly a thing that,

I'm not sure what the Order of Canada exactly recognizes. Don Cherry is without question a very famous Canadian. Sure. And I believe that he has made a contribution to the game of hockey, probably more as a broadcaster than as a player or a coach. And I think he definitely, definitely should be recognized in the, the Hockey Hall of Fame with the Foster Hewitt Award. And I think it's a joke that the Broadcasters Association are far too dedicated

to making sure each person and all their buddies and play-by-play guys get in the Hockey Hall of Fame and not recognizing the very, very tremendous contribution he brought to hockey broadcasting in Canada and the United States. So I can't speak to the Euro or Canada. I have said for a long time, even though I disagree with almost everything Don says about hockey, I have said for a long time, I think he most definitely,

particularly when you look at some of the people who are in the Hockey Hall of Fame, I mean, my God. Are you in there? No. And I really believe that he deserves to be there. So I'd like to see the Broadcast Association and stop patting themselves in the back

and doing their buddy-buddy thing and recognize Don Cherry. I have a text here from Kevin Shea who says your mullet is in the hockey hall of fame. Oh, is there a, is the passion returns in there? The passion returns VHS is frozen on your mullet. I've been to the hockey hall of fame. I paid to get in there.

Did you have to buy a ticket? I did, I have paid to buy a ticket. I've done broadcast from the Hockey Hall of Fame and I don't. I remember when the hockey hall of fame was on the C&E grounds and I was working there and there'd be a thing like, okay, at noon today, Ed Olick is going to sign autographs. And I just think many a time, depending who was there, I would absolutely line up just to get like an autograph from Ed Olson.

Oh yeah, the first professional hockey player or first NHL player I ever met was at the Hockey Hall of Fame on the grounds of CNN, Pete Mahavlich. Wow. And he was a second professional athlete. the first professional athlete I ever met came to my Cubs meeting in Hamilton. That was Tommy Joe Coffey of the Tiger Cat,

so I go back. I go back away. Yeah. All right. Now, we, you know, earlier when we talked, James Taylor, you mentioned. Did I mention Don Cherry should be in the Hockey Hall of Fame? I really believe that.

That's probably the strongest thing I have to say. I can get behind that before I can get behind Order of Canada. I have a quick question about Buffy St. Marie since you mentioned that name. Quite a polarizing, item because there are many, mainly it's on, I notice it on Facebook, but people who have been on this program who are kind of angry

and I don't blame them for being angry, but I don't know if it's directed at the right people, but angry at the CBC for this Fifth Estate piece and feels like Buffy, it doesn't matter. This is, again, I'm paraphrasing this sentiment that I've noticed from several people

I know and trust, particularly expressed on Facebook. But, like, it doesn't actually matter to them that Buffy St. Marie is an Italian American who pretended to be an indigenous person because of the good that Buffy St. Marie has done for indigenous people. And I wonder, do you have any thoughts on this? I know my thoughts, but I think people would have heard those before. But what do you think of the fact that the fifth estate story on Buffy St. Marie and the subsequent, you know, taking away the order of Canada, taking away this, that,

the other, many of these things because she's not Canadian? I think it was good journalism. You know, I think we always want to be trying to uncover the truth. And to see if you can't in all, if you're a journalist, you can't in all good conscience know something and then just say, I'm just not going to tell people, although that happens a lot. Print the legend. Yeah. And I think she was given an opportunity to explain herself.

And a lot of people who were canceled did not have an opportunity to explain. themselves. And I think from everything that I understand, the explanations never made a whole lot of sense and never made. So I think it's, I think it's really sad. I think it's sad that she decided to present herself in a certain way, knowing certain things. And I'm not a fan of her music, but I know a lot of people were. And look, I think they can still be fans of their music. You know, you can, Lord knows, from Woody Allen to Kevin Spacey to any number of actors and movie people, you may not agree with what they've done and stuff, but you may still enjoy their performances or their movies and stuff like that. So I certainly wouldn't

say, I would never listen to Buffy St. Marie. But I think you, you listen to her and then understand this was her story. And I think it's a very, unfortunate it's obviously been very embarrassing for her and i'm sure heartbreaking um but she made certain choices i think you know right she um and if you're going to build a famous career on what was essentially an untruth that's going to be that's going to be a tough one to run away from you mentioned when you saw james taylor that he made a like a brief reference apology i suppose for his president's 51st state rhetoric and we just talked about the Order of Canada

and Hockey Hall of Fame and there is a guy who's got the order of Canada although apparently this gentleman never picked up his like pin at the ceremony but he has got the Order of Canada and he's in the Hockey Hall of Fame that's a slam dunk if there ever was one but I'm wondering what are your thoughts on the recent fall in the eyes of many proud Canadian of the Great One who I now call the Great Ones

Number 99, Wayne Gretzky. Disappointing. Really disappointing. At a time, I think, when the country, we didn't even need them to go to bat. All he had to do was say, look, I support this guy because I think he's a great president, but I also support a free and independent Canada. That's all he had to say.

Why he would not say that, I have no idea. You know, I've heard lots from lots of people about the wise and the where force i haven't talked to wayne since oh maybe before covid or maybe during covid i can't remember he was all he's always been good to me so i'm not going to trash the guy but hugely disappointing um in the same way as bobby orr and uh um you know jack nicholas for their support of of a guy who's you know convicted felon who's now president in the united states they choose to look the other way um that's their business but you know i think there was one thing to support trump and then another

to not support a free and independent Canada i think that was he went too far and um i think that is going to injure his legacy in this country for a long long long time which is really unfortunate because he always answered the call to play for Canada. He answered the call to to, you know, run the Olympic team and organize the team that ended the 50-year drought. All those things, obviously, he's an incredible player. But, you know, and look, he's an American now.

He's lived in the United States for 40 years. You know, he's made all his money in the United States. His family that lives in the United States. I understand he comes at it from that perspective. as Canadians, I think we had a reasonable right to hope that he would at least say Canada is not for sale. Canada is a free and independent country and will always stay there and must always stay that way. And the fact that he didn't is massively disappointing. I agree.

And I think that statement you just made is exactly what I was hoping we'd hear from him, particularly as things came to a boil with the, what was it called? again. What was that cup called again? Oh, yeah, the festival. The four? The fearsome four. I'm calling it a new name now. But bottom line is... Festivus. I think it was the Four Nations Festivus. The Four Nations Festivus for the rest of us, which, of course, Connor McDavid scored an overtime and Canada won, yay. But yeah, I just wanted to hear it because we heard from

everyone else on his behalf, right? Like, Doug Ford, his wife, Janet, Bobby Orr, so many people chiming in on behalf of Wingres. and I said many, many times on this program. Like, is this man unable to speak for himself? Like, there's something we don't know. We just, we don't need him. I don't, people are like, oh, don't get so, he can, I don't personally really, like, I'm disappointed.

I don't really care if he's a Trumper and he wears a MAGA hat. And he's, I care. I care, but it's a different level of care that I care that he simply refused to support the sovereignty of this nation that made him. Yes. Yes. I think that's, so disappointing. You may use the word disappointing.

Well, and the reality. is if you choose to say nothing that it's going to then be taken as he believes that what Trump was saying is true that maybe he believes Canada would be better off as a 51st state and as you know that and and you know my goodness that if if that were the case then that would be shocking and if that were the case I would say this if he were ever to say that he is support of Canada becoming the 51st state, then I would be the first one to say he should lose that order of Canada or that he's never bothered to pick up, I understand. So I agree.

You know, I mean, you're either you're either with us or against us when it comes to basic things like sovereignty. We can all have different political opinions. We can all have, you know, ideas on economics or immigration or. or all these issues that, you know, are difficult and can have multiple points of view. But, you know, you don't get to have a different opinion, in my opinion, on whether Canada should be a free and sovereign nation. The president in the United States literally has stated and is doing his best to

to economically devastate this country of ours, Damien, until I guess I can't remember how he worded it, but until we basically, I don't know, we want to, become a part of the United States. Like cripple us economically until we come crawling, begging to be a part of the United States. And that's, that disappointment is not the right word. That fucking pisses me off.

Like that, that, that makes me want to, like, start a militia group here and get ready here, because who knows what's next? Who knows what's next? Can I call on you and I start my little, you know, a renegade force to protect the sovereignty of this nation? Are you in good shape here? Let me think about that. Get back to me.

here. Also, similar. Buffy, who I loved because as a kid I'd watch Sesame Street and she was on it when I was watching and I like, I consider like a second mother. I loved Buffy St. Marie. And I loved Wayne Gretzky.

This was the guy. I grew up in the early 80s. Life is full of disappointment, isn't it? That's why we can always rely on Damien Cox. He'd be consistently crusty and that's all I ask from you here. Okay. You used to work for Rogers.

Yep. I still I still appear on the fan from time to time. Do they compensate you? Do they give you lasagna beer, anything? I can't say. I'm going to say no. That's my guess.

I don't know everybody. I'm speculating. But Rogers now, since your last visit, we can now say Rogers owns almost everything in this country. I mean, thankfully they don't own the Toronto. They may own your militia group if you're not careful. They own almost everything. Like they own the,

we already did own the Js, okay, but they own the Leafs, the Raptors, I mean, 75% are signed. Leaves, Rappers. Raptors, Argos, TFC, all controlled by Rogers. Is this good? Is this bad? Is this ugly?

I can't think it's good. And if you look at the success of those teams, other than the Raptors six years ago, it would be hard to say it's been good for, you know, the competitive. I mean, look at the state of the Argos right now. Look at the state of TFC. But the Argos are defending Great Cup champions. Yeah. No, I said right now, though.

Um, and, and what have you done for me lately? Well, not just that. Well, whether they won the Great Cup or not, they got 13,000 fans the other night. I mean, it's sad. I mean, if not for, it's hard to know where TSN ends and the CFL begins, but if not for TSN's sponsorship, basically, of the entire league, I don't, I can't imagine the Toronto Argonauts would be around. They can't be covering their own bills.

That's for sure. Jeez. Well, now they're in the Rogers MLSE bucket. Well, and the thing is, since moving to BMO, that was supposed to save them. MLSC, Larry Tanabon, that was supposed to save it. None of it has. None of it's made any difference at all for the past decade. Well, I think part of the problem talking to my friends and my kids and my brothers is this city of Toronto, for better or worse, thinks of the Argos as minor leagues.

I think that's probably true. And there's a lot of NFL interest. That said, you know, the Toronto Scepters have been able to come in and carve out their niche and sell out their games. We'll see how the Toronto Tempo do. I think there's way too many excuse makers for the Toronto Argonauts and not enough people making, you know, trying to really find out why. Why the city has abandoned them in the way they have. And I think it's sad. I'm a huge CFL fan.

I've been a CFL fan since 19. 69 was my first great cup game that I watched. You know, I have tickets to the Hampton Tire Cats. I'll be at the Labor Day game. So, you know, I'm as big a fan of this league as anybody, but I'm tired of people saying, oh, well, you know, they don't get the coverage or, oh, they don't do this. You know, there's a million reasons as to why they are the way they are,

and I don't think it's coming back. I used to think maybe, maybe, maybe, it's not coming back ever. Well, that's sad to hear now. 13,000. What did they get there? Like 25,000 can fit in that BMO? Maybe a bit more than that, I think. I know TFC can get like, yeah, 26 or something like that.

TFC is averaging just over 20. And that's a bad team. And the Argos are a bad team. So, but, so, you know, the Argos can't even draw what a soccer team can draw in this town. And you know what? Part of that's a reflection of the city. Part of that's a reflection of football in Canada. You know, part of that is the nature of the NFL.

What a polished, spectacular product. It is the people. Marketing machine. Yeah. You know, and it's something that people want to buy. You know, it's like, it's no different than, you know, lamenting the fact that Starbucks does so well and the local coffee shop down the road doesn't do as well. well people are going to the customer's never wrong that's what people want why didn't mLSC want the tempo

like why don't know i don't i don't know all of that um and i'm going to be fascinated to see how that team does um the scepters really did something special and they they you know they they caught i mean why could the toronto septors get that kind of reception that they had to move from a small arena to a bigger arena and yet we've seen junior hockey fail and fail and fail and fail and fail and failed and fail and failed and time and time again so what was it about the sceptors and i think part of it my wife is is a season ticket holders i think there's this pent up frustration among women that uh female sports um weren't being appreciated but i i said to my wife for years you know when female sports Women's sports will do better is when women start going.

And let me tell you, women go to see the Toronto Scepters. They go in huge numbers. It's a unique and special atmosphere. I love going on their game. I was walking with my two older kids in the junction just the other day, and there's this Tim Hordons that, like, or St. John's hits Dundas. And it's completely pink. Like, it's decked out in pink with some kind of a co-lab, as the kids would say,

between the PWHL and Barbie. Like it's like it's quite a big, like you know, everything's pink. Like they were re-skinned the whole store. And it's really a big marketing push. And you're like, oh yeah, that's the SEPTors. Like it is a, it seems very big.

And the other thing is is the SEPters are extremely queer friendly. And there is a chunk of the GTA market that is queer. queer friendly or queer allies and we're more than happy to find someplace that welcome them with open arms and I think that's part of what creates the really cool atmosphere down at Scepter's games it's not exclusively queer people by any um you know by any stretch but they're they are very representative and from what I've been told um by members of the queer community that I know they feel really comfortable and welcome and celebrated. I'm glad to hear that.

Very exciting. I was hanging at a Leafs game, a baseball style like Christy Pitts. Got to be careful when you say Leaves game with Rob Delmundo. Do you know this name? Rob Delmonde, but he's been covering PWHL games. And he was telling me about,

and again, Ed Keenan comes on every quarter. He's a colleague at the Toronto Star there, and he's got the season's tickets, and this is a happening thing, the SEPters. I've got to get myself to a game because I haven't actually seen it. I'm embarrassed to tell you I haven't been to a Septer's game.

Well, and have you had somebody from there on your show? I have not, but you know, I'm... Natalie Spooner or one of them, you've got to get one of them. I would love it. I, you know, the way I'm happy, I do pursue people. I say, hey, Damon, do you want to come over? But Mike at Tronomike.com, like, I am so receptive to pitches. Like, it's like I would love to do an episode about the Scepters.

Absolutely. I want to welcome a new partner here because then I have a big question now that we've introduced the hockey leafs. I have a big. question for you. But Blue Sky Agency is the newest Toronto Mike partner in Blue Sky Agency. It's a gentleman named Doug Mills who owns Blue Sky Agency. He's forged partnerships with established office furniture brands like Silen and Green Furniture Concept and Ruleyard. And Doug Mills is eager to chat with any and all Toronto Mike listeners who are looking for dynamic and creative

work environments. So you can reach Doug, Doug at bluesky agency.ca. Send him an email. I'll thank them for fueling the real talk over here and let them know you're an FOTM and then have a conversation with Doug about dynamic and creative work environments. People are being called back to the office, Damien. Do you know this? Yes, I am very well aware of this.

I got a woman upstairs, my lovely wife who works for one of the big banks and effective, I guess, the day after Labor Day, they're expected in the office four days a week. Ouch, that's going to change a lot of people's situation, and particularly people with younger families because daycare is such a massive issue. I have four kids too, Dame.

I know this. And the other thing is a lot of people did this move. Maybe they thought the pandemic would last forever, but there was a move to leave the city. Yes, now they've got to come back. And now they're on the go train for an hour and they got a whole massive commute because, yeah, they've been called back,

which, you know, I work out of this basement here, Damien. I've always been in them. This is your permanent studio. This is it. something bigger. This is the studio you get to visit. The A-listers meet me at my downtown studio here. I don't mind being a B-lister or a C-lister.

Well, you get your lasagna, you get your beer. A, I want to just give you a piece of advice that there is a cool event happening on the waterfront, August 22nd to the 24th. It's called Taiwan Fest. It's the 20th anniversary of Taiwan Fest at Harborfront Center. And this year's festival is a dialogue with Portugal. It explores the unique connections between the two cultures.

You can discover how artistic traditions connect through Portuguese tiles. You can experience the rich flavors of Haka culinary traditions, and you can enjoy live musical performances. So, learn more about the shared histories and celebrate the vibrant cultures of Taiwan and Portugal, August 22 to 24, a free event at the harborfront. And, of course, before you know what, the air show will be back. There's so much going on on the waterfront.

Do you ever ride a bike by the waterfront? other than going to Budweiser stage, you ever find yourself at the waterfront? I do, and I do cycle, so I do find myself down there. On the Martin Goodman Trail? Yeah, the, well, and I'm certainly one of those people who thinks these move to remove bike lanes in Toronto was the stupidest thing I've ever heard of.

But, I mean, we should be building more. But anyways, that's what I agree with you on that. And I will just speak, again, because of where we live, I'll speak specifically to the bluer bike lanes, which, you know, what is it? The Crooked Q, there's a whole bunch of these businesses that are passionately against ripping up, want to wipe up these bike lanes.

And I'll just say, as a guy, you know, I got all my kids cycle, I cycle every day. And there is no more, people are like, get it off bluer. And I'm here to show you a map of Toronto. Please tell me the east-west route that can have the bike lanes instead of bluer. This does not exist. This is not how the, you look at a map of Toronto.

You can go up to Eglinton, which is five kilometers north. You can drop down. They don't care. They don't care. They don't care. They just don't want us on the roads. No, it's part of this Toronto mentality, and particularly in West Toronto, which it is my right to drive my car. And my right to drive my car supersedes your, I'm surprised they let sidewalks, you know, that we don't let cars go on sidewalks.

Great opportunity was missed on Bloor. Look, I think that they probably made some mistakes in how they did. designed it and maybe they could have done a better job and one of the things is like do we if you're really talking about utility do we really need the flower beds down the middle and wouldn't that be a great bike lane right down the middle of blur right there right down or use that for cars and leave the bike lanes you know there but you know there it's the usual thing let's be loud let's yell um you know and there are people who don't ride bikes and the people say well i don't see anybody on them oh yeah well well and also you don't see anybody on them because we do everything

we can in this city to discourage bike riders because we they're likely to be killed you know and so if you make it safer then people will do it if you make if you make a clean lane all the way from the west end of toronto downtown Toronto people will use it because it's a lot of faster because you can't drive your car you know it took me to get to somewhere on spadena the other day took me an hour and a half i can't imagine if i'd ridden my bike it would have taken me 25 minutes so but that's a fight i don't know whether we're winning or losing i'm glad to see uh justice paul shabas with his ruling uh recently i know him and uh i was thrilled to see that whether that'll i mean this government wants to use notwithstanding clause to do anything it

that's wrong. So I'm sure they'll do that and then start building their tunnel into the 401 or whatever idiotic idea the idiotic Doug Ford has in mind. Well, when your only tool is a hammer, everything looks like a nail. Yeah, that's a good point.

Okay, and here's a nicer piece of advice, which is that if you, Damien Cox, have old electronics, old devices, old cables, maybe you have a drawer or a room full of this stuff, I don't know, but don't throw that in the garbage, Damien, because those chemicals end up in our landfill, go to recycle myelectronics.ca, put in your postal code and find it where you can drop all of that off to be properly recycled.

I take mine to the dump. No, well, is it... The disco, I can tell you, not to promote the Toronto landfill, but the disco road landfill, they're great people up there. They're the nicest people. If you ever want to go to the dump, the best people work at the dump. And that's where I take electronics because they'll be disposed up properly. And next time I'm talking about Great Lakes, you'll tell me about how.

How much you like a good Budweiser? Well, I'm just saying. Or these are these people that you're promoting. That's also great work. It's all good. Just don't throw it in the garbage. That's all we're asking. Exactly.

That's the point. We're on the same page here. You know you're a good man. You know how to play ball. Shanahan. Brendan Shanahan, Mimical Guy. What were your thoughts when Keith Pelly relieved Brendan Shanahan of his duties?

Well, I didn't understand why. It wasn't articulated well. Keith's a friend of mine. And even more to the point, I don't understand not replacing him. Like, basically it seemed to me a body to throw overboard. It was a scapegoat.

Let's look at, let's, you know, people, oh, 10 years and they didn't do this. Well, David Poyle was, in Nashville for 20-some years and he's in the Hall of Fame and so you know if your only thing is well he's been there and okay so now that now he's gone so apparently he was the reason his mere presence and the presence of anybody holding the role of president of the Toronto Police was the number one reason they didn't win the cup last year okay now go win the cup well there's another scapegoat sort of because the question came in from hey ref

Hayref writes in, did the Leafs make a mistake in terms of not going after Mitch Marner? Yes. Or should they have let him go? Yes. But do you think Mitch would have stayed? I had a vibe.

I don't know. I think that was, I don't know. But I mean, I think they made it clear that that's not what they wanted. And they were looking for scapegoats and they found them. And like, I look at the Toronto Maple Leafs,

and I see a team that in the final four games against the Florida Panthers or the final three games, three or four games, they scored four goals. So the answer to this is to fire the president and get rid of your leading score. Right.

And this makes sense to somebody? Well, I think there was a consensus that you can't keep running back the same core because clearly they can't get it done. Everybody runs back the same core in the league because you can't, the nature of the salary cap and the contracts, name me a team that's not running back the same group next year. Like, it's so ridiculous to say, you can't keep doing this.

Now, I understand that they wanted to get away from the model of if this was the case. I mean, they don't articulate any of these things. They just sort of go blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. If they wanted to get away from the model of spending a huge chunk of their payroll on just high-scoring forwards, I get that. So why is John Tavares back? He didn't score in six of seven games. But he's back at a discount, right?

Right, but like if the whole idea is, and he's 37 years old. But his production was as weak or weaker than Mitch Marner, and he's older. Like, I just don't understand the logic here, and look who they're bringing in the guy. So, you know, we'll see, we'll see what they're going to do. their general manager has a thoroughly mediocre record everywhere. So now maybe this is the point in his career where he's going to blossom into one of the best in the league. That could happen. They've got good goaltending.

And I should say as well, you know, when people, oh, they lost to Florida. And, you know, it's time for a change. If Anthony Stollers doesn't get hurt in the first game, what happens then? I agree. We went seven games with the Stanley Cup champs. Edmonton didn't take him seven. So why did all these people, why did Brendan Shananath be fired? What did that accomplish exactly?

Do you think maybe it was just, 10 years, good run, let's move on. Maybe it was a mutual decision. I think since Keith Pelly arrived, Brian Manning fired as running the Argos NTFC, Masai Jiri. Well, I was going to ask you about him next. Fired. Brendan Shanahan fired. None of them as of yet replaced.

Now, the Raptors are going to play. So, to me, that looks like big cost savings. Those are Ujuri and Shanahan probably making $10 million or more between them. That's a nice little thing to be able to say to Edward Rogers, look, we're saving you some money. I know, except that in the world of MLSC, I feel like $10 million is like if I lent you $10 or something, you know? Yeah, well, you know. But every dollar matters at Rogers. The Big Red Machine, oh my goodness gracious.

Okay, so just to wrap up the hockey talk, you've been amazing. Always, now I remember why I invite you on every year or so, because I enjoy this, Jen. I'm still wondering why, but anyway. Well, it doesn't matter what you think. It only matters. Haven't you learned that yet, okay? I have learned. It only matters what I think.

So, Hey, Ref, had a follow up, which is, will the NHL ever have female officials on the ice? I would think so, yes. You know, I'm just calling you. Is that Gare, Joyce? Is it Gare? No. Because he's watching live. So he heard the praise reaped on him.

I'm glad to hear he's alive. He's alive and well. Staring the shit and Dawn versus Ron. I'm sure he is. And the best part about that, right, is Gare's not really a shit disturber. So I'm sure he didn't go out to do that. He was talking about a cottage. He's the best part is right.

He's talking about a cottage. And it was a great, by the long. But he is smart enough to know a news story when he sees one. That's it because he took that and made it a standalone thing, which makes the noise. And then his long form. thing about Dawn in the cottage was actually excellent. It was a really good... Yeah, he's a well as...

I think it was in the national. He's a good writer, but I'm done stroking gear, and I'm not going to say anything nice about Gord either. I'm done talking about all these other people. You know, they're not so nice. So we will eventually, in your opinion, in the near future at some point... Oh, I think so. I think so. You know, why wouldn't we?

Good question. Good question. You know, I mean, and it probably is overdue. And now you've got a league, women's league, quality women's league in North America, which has a lot of female officials, so I would think somebody's going to get an opportunity at some point. What did you think of the Maasai usually firing? You know, it seemed to kind of be in the wind.

You know, and again, contrast that with the Leaf situation. So you can say, yeah, Maasai won a championship. Shanahan didn't. Yeah, it's true. But if you go fast forward to now, the Raptors have been out of the playoffs for having it, at least for a first place team that challenged the Stanley Cup champion.

So I guess everybody goes. I have yet to understand, and I can honestly say I have not had an opportunity really to sit down and talk to Keith. What is the plan here? What is there an overarching plan here for MLSE to make all these teams champions? Because, you know, deleting qualified,

and talented executives has to have a point at some point. And, you know, I guess obviously he feels that streamlining the organization, making these various teams, general managers report directly to him is one way to do it. Keith's a very competent and confident and talented executive. and so that puts a lot on his plate, and we'll see what he can do. You know, all these teams are facing real questions. And the, you know, the most successful team right now,

it seems right now in the city is the team that is not affiliated with MLSC, and that's the Blue Jays. Yeah, we're going to get a little, my last question is a little Blue Jace talk right now. What role do you think Edward Rogers played in the dismissal of, let's face it, a guy who's beloved in this city, Messiah, you're I don't know. I mean, I, who

knows, I'm assuming he was in agreement with it. That would be all I could. I just wondered, forget agreement, I wondered if maybe he was a catalyst. Yeah, I would not know. So I wouldn't even. Gary, get on that story, buddy. Okay, we want that story here, please. Okay.

I had an episode recently Hamilton and Stephen Brunt was my guest and we had some guys from this day in Dave Steve history. Do I have to say now to say nice things about Stephen? Is that way you just bring up everybody?

And then I say nice things. No, because I'm going to ask you a question. Do you have bad things to say about Stephen? I have no bad things to say about Steve. Okay, Stephen, Stephen Brunt, probably in Newfoundland right now. It's August 14. He is.

And in fact, we're almost that, or are we in the middle of his annual music and literary festival? Woody Point. Which I have attended a couple times, which is fantastic. And I would recommend anyone to go. And I often say I want to go. You should go.

I want to go. I want to go, damn it. Okay, I've never been in Newfoundland. Oh, it's that, the west, the west part of Newfoundland is, it's mind-blowing. It's fantastic. It's on the list here, okay. But we did an episode, basically making the case for why Dave Steeb should be in Cooperstown in the baseball Hall of Fame.

Okay. You. He believes that? He believes that, yes. And many others do, too. And if you look at the, the analytics, they support the case. I wondered, I know you're the hockey guy back then, but you were watching a lot of of Jays when Dave Steeb was the ace.

Do you think Dave Steve belongs in Cooperstown? I don't know. I mean. I'm putting you on the spot, Cox. So here's the, that's the difference between the Cooperstown and the Hockey Hall of Fame. The Hockey Hall of Fame is inclusive. Everybody gets in, except on Cherry. Right.

You're right? Everybody gets in. The, I mean, now they're even letting Alexander Mogilney get in, you know, after shunning him for ridiculous reasons. It's the Hall of Very Good. And it has, and it's, it is not accountable. They have a secret handshake. They don't tell you who gets nominated or why anybody does.

So that's the Hockey Hall of Fame. Now the baseball Hall of Fame is exclusive. And they tell you exactly who voted for who. I'm going to, when it comes to Dave Steve, I'm going to let those voters because they'll, they'll tell you exactly why they think so. certain people get in. As a Toronto Blue Jay Observer and to some degree a fan, it'd be great to see Dave Stephen.

He was an outstanding pitcher, you know, for this team for a number of years. But I don't really have a strong feel of who gets in. I think the numbers, it's all about the numbers in baseball. Either you have the numbers or you don't have the numbers. And if he has the numbers, then he should be in. But historically, they overvalued numbers like wins. Right. And therefore, when it comes time to look at awards, like Say Young Award, for example,

people like Dave Steeb don't win Say Young Awards because they finish like 17 and 10 or something like that. And the guys like a Jack Morris, for example, that's the guy I always compare them to. If you look at the numbers and you get on your experts, you'll hear Dave Steeb had a better career than Jack Morris. But one is in the Hall of Fame. And the other got like less than 5% of the votes or something. It wasn't even close. So it's just interesting to compare and contrast Because Dave Steve for a couple of quick things

As one is, you may know his best years were spent playing In Toronto, Ontario, Canada Back in a day when would you see a Jays game back then, right? And then secondly, maybe you know this as well. Dave Steve was not a very friendly guy When it came to the people covering him. Yeah, but neither was Steve Carlton, right? So, you know, I think if the numbers are there,

the numbers should be there. Baseball's full of guys who weren't friendly. And so I don't, I, I'm trying to think, have I ever dealt with Dave, Steve? Maybe, maybe once upon a time. But, yeah, like, I will say this about halls of fame in general. People get all tied up in knots about them.

And I just made a strong case for somebody in the hockey hall of fame. But they really are kind of anachronisms and really what they are. are vehicles through which their sport sell stuff. Sell the game, sell merchandise, sell, you know, their stars, so you will buy, buy, buy, buy. People treat them like they are museums, and they are museums because they have sticks and bats

and all those sorts of things in them. But in terms of who gets in and who doesn't, it's kind of like, for me at my stage, I don't really care. I really don't care that much. You know, there will be, I don't like to see injustices. I did not like to see. I was a huge proponent of getting women in the hockey Hall of Fame

because that just seemed fair. I will always fight for fairness. It didn't make sense to me that Alexander was, McGilney wasn't in and other people of less talent were in. I don't see Dave, Steve at this point, as a huge fairness issue that I'm willing to go. to bat for in the same way that I'm willing to go to bat for Don Cherry

being in the hockey Hall of Fame. Well, speaking of people not going to bat for Dave Steeb in Cooperstown, Rogers doesn't seem to give a shit. They're completely quiet on the whole thing. I don't think Rogers is eager to push Dave Steve for Hall of Fame for whatever that's worth. But more importantly, Dave Steeb,

you know, there are players in the Hall of Fame who were like their greatest advocate they would basically make the rounds explaining how they were slighted and this is why I belong in. Dave Steve never promotes himself as Hall of Fame worthy. Maybe he doesn't care.

I don't think he cares. Maybe that's where I got a good life, right? Because I did this episode and the guys from Len Lumber's and Blake Bell, the two gentlemen from today and Dave Steve history who were in the basement for that episode. They're so passionate about this and doing so much work to get some traction going

because it's, you know, for Dave Steve to be in Hall of Fame. But where it ends for me, where the buck stops for me is if Dave Steve doesn't care, like I don't know how much I have to care. Like maybe I don't care, but it is a fun conversation.

It doesn't change anything, right? It doesn't really change our memories of Dave Steve as a pitcher, you know, the one hitters and trying to get the no, you know, and I mean he was a character in this town for a long period of time. There's so many people

here, and I see this from media people all the time who think it's about legacy and leaving behind a legacy. Once you're dead, you're dead. You know, and... Shout out to Ridley Funeral Home. Yeah, there you go. So, you know, do what you can.

Play your career. Do your writing. Do your broadcasting. Do your podcasting. You know, and then whatever it is, you know, the halls of fame and all this sort of stuff, I kind of start losing interest at a certain point. Yeah, it's all different layers of bullshit.

Who cares? Okay, I'm going to... That's my words. Okay, you can quote me on that. I'm going to close with the Blue Jays because if you would talk to me and people did. I had over Keegan Matheson and I did a Mike Wilner episode and I had no hopes for this particular Blue J team back in April. And as we speak on August 14th, 2025, they're in first place in the American League. Here's the question that came in from Brian. I'm curious, as with the Jays now being the story here, use more commas.

Brian, it would be easier for me to read this. TSN begrudgingly, this is Brian's words, TSN begrudgingly has to cover them more. Clearly, I see it on overtime, overdrive, sorry, this is overdrive, with them leading with them and having Kegan Matheson

as part of the panel now, where in the past they would have be reached for a segment. Have the networks now realized that regardless of what rights they own, they have an obligation to cover properly for their audience, what is most newsworthy for them?

No. No, I mean, look at, I mean, Sportsnet doesn't cover the CFL. That's a great reversal. That's a great example. Although we'll see what happens now. Rogers owns the controls MLSC, which controls the Argonaut. So you do wonder if that'll change, particularly when the TV deal comes up next year. I think that has not served the CFL well to have all, you know, all their ducks in the, and I'm mixing my metaphors, all their eggs in the TSN basket means nobody else covers the league. Um, no, I mean, networks cover what's in their interests.

They don't know or where the, they don't have a journalist. It's the toy department, right? They don't have a journalistic responsibility. Yeah. And I mean, you know, I mean, how many, how many people other than how many people were over watching Summer Macintosh when she was, you know, performing in Singapore a couple of weeks ago?

Right. Right. But, but, but when it comes to swimming, so, because I, I'm, I'm a Olympic swimming. fan like so if it's olympics i'm tuned in for all the no but what the point i'm making is this is not an altruistic enterprise they're going where they think the viewers or the readers are so they can they can bring them to their advertisers right and that's what it is all about and so the reality is is in when it comes to the canadian football league and the toronto organauts rogers believes there's no audience there for the canadian football league

that their advertisers are interested in. So they're going to go do something else. And TSN now believes that there's so much interest in the Blue Jays. They have to be covering it for their advertisers. It's like this is sports entertainment. This is a business. People think it's all about right and wrong and character and legacy and winning and losing. It's business.

And that's what TSN is doing, I assume, by, you know, signing a good reporter. doing good coverage of the Blue Jays. And let's face it, in this market, you can probably get away with not covering the Argos, but when your Blue Jays are in first place in August, yeah, TSN can't really get away with not covering it because that's what people want to talk about. That's what people want to hear about.

Absolutely. So they have to cover. They basically, it's in their own best interest to cover the Blue Jays. Yeah, I mean, I think right now in this town, it's, I haven't seen any, it was always the Leafs, number one. Yeah, yeah. and then the Blue Jays, and then the Raptors

kind of overtook the Blue Jays, but now I think the Blue Jays would be back in second. You can't consider yourself a serious news organization, sports news organization, not cover the Blue Jays if you're in Toronto right now.

Interesting. So TSN hasn't called you up and said, hey, Damo, we need your hockey analysis. No, they have. The phone's not ringing? They've got lots of hockey people. So what is...

I haven't got a call from them or the Hockey Hall of Fame. So there you go. You could be in the builders category. What is the, is Milton L in the builders category or something of the Hockey Hall fame? I don't know. I don't know. Just asking the big questions here.

Yeah, I don't know. Since you are, I'm talking to a guy who actually knew Milt, which is cool. The greatest. He was the greatest. Do you remember what you told me your first visit when I asked you, what was it, when Milton L told you that John Cord, no, Bill Barocco, you become of Bill Barocco? Remember this? It was that he told me he skated like,

you reminded him. No, it wasn't John Cortick. It was somebody else. Anyways. Like, I just thought it was a funny company. Maybe it was John Codick skated like this guy.

I think it was more like, I think I think, this is how I remember it anyways, a copy of a copy. But I think I was asking you if you and Milt ever talked about Bill Barocco because Mill would have seen Bill Barocco play. Because we've got him now,

because of the hip and because of this legacy, we've got him as like an angel of some kind of hockey guy saying who died young. and was going to be the next Bobby Orr or something. And then you asked Milt, like, who in the modern game would you compare to Bill Barocco? And I believe Milt told you, John Cortick. Yeah, that might, that sounds, that rings a bell. And I bring it up once in a while, because I think we have.

I really do think we've decided some of us youngsters, as Jen Xers, who love the tragically hip, I've decided Bill Barocco was like, this is the next Bobby Orr. And he wasn't. John Cortick. Yeah, he was kind of a rough and ready character who had played his hockey. in Hollywood, in California, before finally getting called up to the league. Like, my understanding was,

even though he was playing for the Leafs in a 16 league, he wasn't a great player. Now, whether he would have become a better player, I don't know, but he wasn't a great skater, but he, you know,

he figured in a very famous goal. And more important than that, a very famous picture. A very famous goal. And now a very famous legend. And a very famous exit. You got to, it's like Seinfeld,

right? It's like, that's it for me. Yeah. Is that time for me to go now? Well, it is pretty much time for you to go. It's even amazing. Is there anything else that, I mean, I guess my big question for you is, do you think this Blue Js squad, which is overperformed and is entertaining,

will they, could they win the World Series? Okay, here's what I'm going to say to that. A, I don't know. But they need George Springer back. And if Shane Bieber can come in and really shore up that starting staff, and be, you know, a regular pitcher for the rest of the way, then, yeah, they could win. Can you think of a bigger, like, let's pretend this happens,

okay, this is a big hypothetical. Blue Jays win the World Series in 2025. Is there a Toronto example of overachieving and exceeding expectations that you can compare to that? Because we thought the 2019 Raptors were going to be competitive, and that TFC team that won, whatever that was, 2017. But that Toronto, the Raptors team that won was not the favorite. against Golden State.

Not the favorite, but it was a, it was a, with Kauai Leonard, it was a potential. There is a certain amount of the 92, 93 Leafs about this Blue Jay's team

and everybody loves a team that kind of comes out of nowhere. Sure, but that team didn't even make the finals. Right. So if they were to win, that, you know, I just don't think there's,

I can't think of, unless we go way back to the original six error or something, I can't think of a Toronto comparable where, although I live in Toronto, we've got the two World Series and the one Larry O.B and in my lifetime

Zero Stanley Cup final appearances. So GoJ's Go. Thank you for this. I enjoyed this. You'll be back in about a year. I'll put in your calendar. It's good to know.

I'm going to run out of things that are going to interest you. No, I got lots of music stuff. Eventually, I'm going to be calling you and you're going to say, I don't want you want anymore. You have nothing more to say. I feel that that's just around the corner. Nothing more to say, he says, an hour and 52 minutes later, so we fill the time.

I was entertained, and really at the end of the day, Damien, that's all that matters. And that brings us to the end of our 1,745th show. Go to tronomimeck.com for all your Toronto mic needs. Is there anywhere in the social media

universe that you actually keep a presence, Damien Cox? No. So you've got to go through me if you want to know what's going on. I'm the Damien Cox Whisperer. Gee, what an exciting thing for you. Worms can talk to cherry. Okay. And I can talk to Cox.

So, okay. Much love to all who made this possible. That is Great Lakes Brewery. Damien's got his beer. Palma pasta. You're going to pull some of these out and put some more loggers in there. Remind me. The pale ale, which is like their biggest seller.

Is it? Yeah, the Canuck. It's coming out and I'm going to get you some premium loggers. Great beer. Palma pasta. Yep, right here in the box. Well, that box is empty. It's in my freezer.

I got the book. You got the book on Toronto Maple Leafs Baseball. I'll let you know when the playoffs are, and I'll talk about it here because I'm going to be at Christy Pids for playoffs. You got the tape measure that is Ridley Funeral Home. Recycle MyElectronics.ca has to start giving something away. Where are they? And of course, Toronto's Waterfront VIA gets your butts to the waterfront this summer.

And the newest sponsor, once again, welcome Doug Mills and Blue Sky Agency. See you all tomorrow. This is going to be exciting, I think. Dropping by is Tom Brown. You might remember Tom Brown from Toy Mountain and CTV Toronto personality, big personality. He's going to come by tomorrow. Tell me where he's been, what happened, and all of that. Tom Brown makes his Toronto mic debut tomorrow.

See you all then. You know, I'm going to be the