Toronto Mike'd: The Official Toronto Mike Podcast - Gil Moore from Triumph: Toronto Mike'd Podcast Episode 1667

Episode Date: April 8, 2025

In this 1667th episode of Toronto Mike'd, Mike chats with Triumph founder, drummer and co-lead singer Gil Moore about the band, Metalworks Studios, Music Monday and more. Toronto Mike'd is proudly brought to you by Great Lakes Brewery, Palma Pasta, Ridley Funeral Home, Silverwax, Yes We Are Open, Nick Ainisand RecycleMyElectronics.ca. If you would like to support the show, we do have partner opportunities available. Please email Toronto Mike at [e-mail]

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And Ridley Funeral Home, pillars of the community since 1921. Joining me today, making his Toronto mic debut, is Gil Moore. Welcome Gil. Hey, nice to be here. Awesome to have you here, man. We're going to talk about Music Monday, but I'm told I get you for an entire 60 minutes. So I've got my Gilmore questions loaded up.

Are you ready? I am, let them fly. Well, firstly, I produced the Humble and Fred show and Humble Howard Glassman tells me that you guys have done quite a bit of golfing. Is that a true or false statement from Humble Howard Glassman? Yeah, that's absolutely true.

Yeah, we're golf buds, so. How good a golfer is Howard? Because he keeps winning these awards. Is it like when Donald Trump wins an award and he just makes it up, or is this real? No, it's real. Howard's outstanding in golf. You won't find...

You just have to put the qualifier in golf. You won't find... You have to put the clarifier, the qualifier in golf. Well, you won't find anybody else, I don't think, in the music business that can keep up with them. You know, maybe Tom Cochran. Well, I was going to ask about Tom, who I got to meet last summer at the Joe Carter Classic. Tom Cochran, Humble Howard, who's the better golfer? Oh my God. That would be like a cage, or one of those UFC cage matches. I mean, right now I'm talking to Tom a lot,

and I know that he's had six or seven successive rounds under 75 in the last 14 days. So that's a serious run, that is. Now, I don't know if Howard's playing right now Is he up here and Howard's well, he just came back from Mexico. Okay, so he played like six times in seven days I think he was out yesterday. Yeah, so then there you go. Those guys are playing so much, you know Thompson in Arizona, you know Humble's been you know doing his tour Hard to say I mean it would be it would be. I mean, it would be, it would be,

like I said, it would be a cage match between those two. How's your game these days? Well, nonexistent this winter because I've been working on other stuff, right? And I don't like travel. Anybody that knows me knows I can't stand it. So, you know, I've sort of foregone the Florida, the Arizona, the usual stuff I used to do. So my game gets pretty rusty, but I got a gym in my house. So I'm swinging one of these weighted swing aids trying to, you know, stay limber and things like that.

And I'm looking forward to the ranges opening soon. And then we'll see how rusty or whatever I am when I get out there. I'm thinking of you said rusty and I'm thinking of, you said Rusty, and I'm thinking of the, the can rock band, Rusty. Has Rusty ever recorded an album at Metalworks Studios? Don't know that one. Check that out. That's a trivia question for future reference. I'll ask Ken, I'll ask Ken or Scott maybe.

But Tom Cochran, there's a guy who has recorded at Metalworks Studios. Yeah, many times, many times. Some big albums too. Great stuff. I mean, we're very proud of the work that, you know, we were involved in, very proud of Tom, obviously. I mean, he's my buddy and so on,

but just respecting him as an artist is a whole other kettle of fish. You know, what he's done in Canada with his music and so on. So yeah, Metalworks has been a little part of that legacy and we're very proud of it. Well, later in this convo, now that I have you held captive, we're going to get back to Metalworks Studios. It's such a mind-blowing list of albums that have been recorded there. It's that we're going to get back to it, but here's a fun fact. So, Gil,

yesterday sitting in that chair was Glenn Milcham, who is the drummer for Blue Rodeo. Tomorrow sitting in that chair is Ian Blurton, because Change of Heart has a new album. And here's the fun fact mind blow for you. And I think you might know where it's going. But Glenn Milcham, obviously Ian Blurton and yourself, you all played on Change of Heart's classic album Smile. You're credited with playing the gong on this album. Do you remember playing on Change of Heart's Smile in 1992? Stomped.

I don't. See, that's wild. So you're credited as playing the gong. And then I asked Jason Snyder, like, what track is he playing the gong? And Jason's like, whatever track has gong on it okay so I'll be asking Ian tomorrow but you don't have any memory of contributing your gong plane to smile no but let's let's face it you know gong is there is essential and you know I don't have more gong you gotta have more gong I mean

that's a certainty. Who's calling you? Is that Tom Cochrane? If it's Tom, put him on speaker phone. It could be. No it's not. We'll just shut that right off. All right, that's okay.

No, that's okay. I need to let Ian know that the gong contribution to Smile wasn't memorable enough, but you've done a lot of stuff in your career. You're forgiven. Yeah, and to this point I have not suffered from spontaneous combustion, which is another amazing trivia fact. Also, when talking to drummers, you should always consider that. And you know they filmed a sequel. Yes, I've heard. Okay, well, we'll see if I'll meet you at the premiere. We're gonna see the the spinal tap, spinal tap sequel. And you, my friend, as a singing drummer,

so we're going to get into this, the origin story. Of course, we're going to talk about Music Monday and we're going to get back to Metalworks. We're going to cover a lot of ground. But I think personally, I think singing drummers are kind of rad. Like when I think of Leavon Helm back there, you know, of course, Phil Collins, yourself,

I mean, Dave Grohl, pretty cool. Like, like, like we don't think of drummers as singers, but when you do see someone behind the kit singing, it's killer. Well, you know, I've been asked about that many times and I've always said the same thing. It's like being a plumber and an electrician on the same construction site. At a certain point, you try to do both things at once. You're gonna have your hand on the drain and you're gonna have your other hand in the 240 volts

and something really bad's gonna happen. But it was a lot of fun. Geez. Do you wanna go way back with me? You wanna go way back? Cause I feel like we need to capture this and this will be like the definitive Gilmore. Sure, take your shot.

Hey, when people say Gilmore is coming over, do you think they expect, uh, the killer Doug Gilmore? Like they're like, they, you know, it's interesting. Like I've had a lot of, uh, confusion with Doug Gilmore and I, and Doug and I've talked about it and it's quite funny actually. Um, but, uh, yeah, I guess yeah I guess they have to temper your expectations I would play I played hockey I wanted to be Doug Gilmore I was

just not good enough that's how I got into drums as I had to you know do something that I thought I could do because a lot of musicians I feel they play hockey like I know there's a lot of like a lot of Canadian musicians play goaltender for example or still play hockey like I know there's a lot of like a lot of canadian musicians play goaltender for example or still play hockey like i just hung up from andy curran on my way over here i'm envy of none and you know he's a really good hockey player still is all right and yesterday's guest glenn milcham played on the solo release 1990 solo release for andy curran yeah there you go it's all coming full circle this is going going to be good. Shout out to Monkey Bars.

Tell me just a little bit before we get to the Triumph origin story about Sherman and Peabody. This is sort of the pre-Triumph Gilmore band? Well, you know, I was just a kid and, you know, Buzz Sherman, God rest his soul, was sort of leading the rock and roll troops at Streetsville High School, so to speak. You know, Buzz was kind of ahead of his time and ended up, you know, encouraging me, I'll say, with drums because I started out with my buddy Fred Powell asking the band in the high school at the time called the Bo Street Runners, you know, can Fred and I be roadies?

Because we were just trying to get into something and the only way to get into something was to hang around. And they said, well, not if you want to get paid. And we said, well, we don't want to get paid, we just want to be there. So Fred and I became free roadies and the drummer, uh, I got to, I got to watch the drummer in the band up close and set up his drums and tear his drums down and so on.

And buzz started to notice me and eventually he recruited me. Um, when Wayne Wilson, who was a really good drummer from whiskey, how who was in Sherman P Sherman and Peabody at the time Wayne left The band was you know, oh like a lot of bands in those areas There's a lot of fights a lot of guys getting kicked out a lot of guys getting pulled in and so on and so forth So I went for the audition and that was the first that was the first audition. I passed as a kid drummer I'd failed a couple auditions prior to that.

So you kind of lick your wounds after you don't make the grade. But when I got the call up to the major leagues, I guess that's what it felt like. Because they had a real agent, they had real jobs, they were, you know, looks like they were going to record. It was all this big time stuff. Greg Godavitz is in this band. Oh yeah, Greg was, he was amazing. Like, Greg was, he kind of took me under his wing and we're still very good friends. And it was quite the experience learning to eat spaghetti every single day in that house up in

Willowdale. Greg was a pretty good chef as far as spaghetti was concerned. Shout out to FOTM Godo, by the way. I feel like you've now served enough time. You're officially an FOTM. That means friend of Toronto Mike. Okay. So you're in another esteemed hall of hall of fame here, but so you're in Sherman and Peabody and then I'm wondering, is it at some point you realize you want to start your own thing and you, you want to start Triumph?

Well, I realized in Sherman and Peabody that one way or the other I either had to get moving or I was gonna get killed because there was a lot of violence in that band and it was... Real violence? It was kind of like, no it was it was fake violence but it was nonetheless real at the same time you know there was a lot of throwing of guitars and you know heaving of this and he's at this kind of violence. Yeah. Is it a work or a shoot like a WWF style? Like at a rehearsal, you had to duck occasionally. Right. So it was, it was, it was a way to sort of learn, uh, you know, uh, like I said, I was, I was kind of a kid at the time. And,

uh, but I loved all those guys. And, uh, you know, when I got, when I got out of that, um, I just kind of, you know, bounced around with, uh, a few more versions of that band. And then a few more versions of another band called Abernathy Shagnaster that was closely associated with it. And, you know, Greg and I played together, you know, various times and some of the other guys as well. And it was, you know, it was an assortment of scoundrels. Let's put it that way.

Okay. Abernathy Shagnaster rolls right off the tongue. Who came up with that name? An agent. A guy named Larry Cuthbertson. Okay. Abernathy Shagnaster. Is it fair to say that that is triumph?

No, but it is the seeds. Let's put it that way. So where that band ended up, you had Mike Levine who I had recruited to play in that band, which was a not serious band. Let's put it that way. It was, it was go play the gigs and figure out another way to make a living because trying to be a rock star is just too hard to do. And we had a phenomenal guitar player who's left us a few years ago, god rest his, Freddie

Keeler, whose son plays in Death Below 1979. Of course, Death From Above. Death Above 1979, excuse me. That's the cover band from below, but the above. Yeah. So, so Freddie was one of the greatest guitar players played with David Clayton Thomas, for example, and the Shaves, one of Toronto's greatest guitar players, along with Dominic Tranow and some of the other great players. And Freddie was in the band and we had a keyboard player as well named Peter Young.

So we were, we were at a point where Mike was a sort of, he knew what he was doing when it came to records and so on. So he was a little more advanced than we were, he was a few years older and he got us into the studio and we recorded a single and that single was the first triumph single and that's Freddie Keeler on guitar and Mike and I, song's called Hobo. And this is on Attic Records, right? On Attic Records, and that song, actually the history there is some of my friends from Rhinoceros, which became Blackstone Rangers in Toronto. John Finlay, as fact, I think wrote the song or perhaps John and some of the other guys

who were ex John and Lee and the Checkmates members Peter Hodgson, Mike von Farah, folks like that. And I mean now we've lost them both sadly, Shadow to Ridley Funeral Home, but Al Mayer has been on the program and we talked quite a bit about Attic, but what was it like, you know, just tell me what it was like signing to Attic. I guess we're going back to 1975 here. Yeah, maybe it was uh, no it would have been 74. 74. And you know, like I said Mike was a little more advanced so by that time we had we had found Rick and that's when that's

when Mike and I decided okay we're gonna take we're gonna take this seriously again. You know, part-time bands and you know, playing covers and all that, forget it. We're gonna really do something here. So we recruited Rick and getting signed to Attic was, which was Mike's doing, was kind of a master stroke because that got us going, got us, got that single out. Which by the way, little known fact, that song was number one in of all

places, Dryden, Ontario. You know what they say, no Dryden, no triumph. It was like, we got the call from the label, they go, guess what guys, good news and the bad news, you got a number one record. The bad news is, it's only in Dryden, Ontario. Everywhere else, it's a stiff. And there's a B-side, got to get you back in my life. But like you said, non-charting the single hobo. But I mean, sounded great there, but I need you to dive into, I'm sorry to Gil, I'm gonna need more detail on the we added Rick Emmett element there

because you also, you know, you shed Fred and Peter, right? Like you become a true trio. So like, how does that go down? That you become a trio and you add Rick Emmett. Well, so we kind of just stopped doing what we were doing. So there was a gasp in between where Mike and I let the other guys know, hey, we're gonna go do something different.

And we went through, we had another guitar player before Rick, which did not work out. And then we had a couple of guitar players that we considered before Rick that didn't work out. So the whole thing might have just collapsed as a Mike Gill dream that never happened, were it not for Neil Dixon who said, hey, I have a guitar player and you guys should check him out. And Rick was playing in Act 3, a band at the time, and they were playing right near where we're sitting right now.

They were playing at the Hollywood Tavern. Right, yeah. Yeah. And so Mike and I went to the Hollywood Tavern and we saw Rick and he was mind blowing. We just went, yeah, that's the guy. Like he's exactly what we envisioned. We always thought we want to have a three-piece band. You know, we're kind of thinking of, you know, like Hendrix, Cream, you know, that sort of thing where you have, you know, power trio with a Mondo

guitar presence and, you know, we wanted to have sort of an outrageous well an atmospheric show I'll say something that would really provide a lot of theater to sort of enhance what was going on musically create a lot of excitement and also surround a three-piece band because you only have three guys on stage if Rick was singing this is part of the reason why I ended up singing so much, was because if Rick was singing he couldn't move around the stage. He couldn't, you know, really kind of, he just stuck at his microphone and so that was the idea that with the three-piece as long as I could carry enough vocals

then you know Rick and Mike could, and Mike could be at the stage front, work the lights, work the audience, work each other. And you've seen Leavon Helm do it, and you've seen Phil Collins do it at this point, right? Yeah, I mean, Leavon was legendary. They all were, all the guys in the band were legendary, and Leavon had a great singing voice voice and he was one heck of a drummer. The same time he's an inspiration for sure.

Okay. Very cool. Now was it easy to convince Rick? Like was Rick eager to join you and, uh, and Mike or did yet? Like was it, did it take any convincing to get Rick Emmett to come on board and join, uh, triumph? It took, it took jamming, you know, to see if there was a musical, you know, secret sauce that was going to emanate from the three of us playing together.

Mike and I were blues guys, and Rick was not. So Rick was sort of coming from the more progressive side of rock at the time. Like he was, the bands that had influenced him were more likely to be you know European bands that were playing sort of more avant-garde music whereas Mike and I grew up as soul brothers and you know and more in the more in that vein so it was really kind of an interesting group of chefs in the

kitchen so to speak, musically. Do you think, like looking back, do you think it was tough for Rick because there was an established duo and he's always going to be a new guy in? Well I think he felt like we had something already going. I mean, because we already had, this was the crazy thing. Before we even were in a position to have a band, we had a record deal, if you know what I mean. And we also had posters that we had made.

And there was, there was no band members on the posters because we didn't have a guitar player. So, so Mike and I had this crazy idea. I know we'll make up a poster that just looks really compelling. People will want to come and see us because of our poster and, uh and we'll figure out the guitar player part when we get around to it. So when we find that guitar player. So that's what we did. So quick hello to those joining on the live stream. So podcasts can't be live. This is, as you know, the technical guy, because I got a, I got a link to an MP3. So this drops

as a podcast after we record, but we are live streaming at live.torontomike.com and I'm just checking in really quickly. I want to say hi to Andrew Ward, who says this is amazing. He's loving it. Burlington Rob, AKA Rob Pruse. I'm about to play his favorite triumph song in like

10 seconds. So Rob, hold on tight. He just says, check out the glasses on Gil, man. Those are cool glasses. Well, back to golf, you gotta have glasses like this to play golf. Those are golfing glasses. And same thing for fishing, by the way. My son, Miles, is an incredible fisherman.

So he dialed me in on shades. He goes, dad, what are you doing? Like, you can't fish without shades because it changes what you see in the water, like being able to finesse your vision in the water water and so then I got it dialed in on golf and I was like why did I ever play golf without shades and then it was like why do I ever drive a car without you know it I'm in a similar boat and that pun intended but like I bike a lot and I used to bike just just go for bike ride

and at some point I think that's my wife he said you know you should be wearing shades out there this sounds bad And I just switched the shades and I'm like why did I ever bike about shades? It's one of those things where you're like until you you get there, then you realize like what was wrong It's like switching to black coffee, and then you're like how did I ever put like cream and sugar in that thing? It's one of those. I'm a black coffee guy to me too. Are you always a black coffee guy? No no no We started out like all the idiots right double double double double And it's like then when you try black and you realize, Hey, this is what coffee tastes like. You're like, what was I thinking? And then you start looking

at people doing the double double, like what an idiot, right? Like suddenly you see somebody, I don't know, fishing or golfing without shades. You're like, what a dummy. Well, yeah. I mean, I was confused as, you know, as a kid, I thought double, double coffee. And then when you're an adult, you realize, no, no double double means scotch on the rocks right neat now VP of sales He's on the live stream. Hello to you Midtown Gourd I'm gonna get to a question from him later, but you're his favorite band of all time triumph He writes hi Gill and Mike. Sorry to just pop in and say hi

I am at work just wanted to to say Triumph is the greatest and I miss the band. Look forward to listening to the episodes." Oh, by the way, 1236 points out, Mike von Farah was later in Rough Trade. Yes. And we just lost Kevin Staples from Rough Trade. Yes, we did. Yeah. Kevin, I was just an acquaintance. Mike was a dear friend. Mike, I actually have the organ at metal works was hand selected by Mike von Farah who helped me out. And also our C seven, uh, Yamaha piano, uh, hand selected by Mike von Farah. And he backed up Lou Reed as well.

Yeah. And he played with, uh, he, Mike played with those variations of the Sherman and Peabody's and Abernathy Shagnaster bands. He played with me in those bands as did John Finley. Go back a long way with those guys. Amazing. Okay, so Rob Proust who played keyboards for Spoons and Honeymoon Suite as well. Shout out to Proust. Proust, I'll see you in a couple weeks, I guess, for Toast. Let's play his favorite triumph song of all time. A cover. We spent the last year rocking mountain waves We couldn't get much higher Out the pasture, I think it's safe to say

Our time to open fire And we don't need the lady Crying cause the story's sad fire Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah Alright, there's some Gil on lead vocals there. That's of course Rob Crews' favorite triumph song. But here we're going back, Rocky Mountain Way. Is that like the first triumph hit in this country? Are we excluding our number one single in Dryden at this point? I think we have to make a ruling. Yes, we're gonna exclude the Dryden dominance. Okay, okay. So now that we're not talking Dryden, yeah, I think Rocky Mountain Way, and especially in the GTA here, there were other markets too. I mean, you know,

back when radio was regional, you could have a number one hit in one city and, you know, a hundred miles down the road that no one's ever heard of it. But Rocky Mountain Way was pretty pervasive across Canada actually. And I've noticed, just, just noticed chatting with people, the late great Miles Goodwin, for example, that like early hits for a lot of

Canadian rock bands are covers. And then they're, they put out their original material, which is kick ass. But I'm thinking'm thinking you know could have been a lady was a cover Dark Side of the Moon? No. Whatever the second big hit by it doesn't matter April Wine, Shout Out to April Wine but Rocky Mounted Way a cover I'm just wondering you didn't write that song but how do you determine in triumph? I'll give credit to DJ Dream Doctor here how do you give credit to how do you determine in triumph? I'll give credit to DJ Dream Doctor here. How do you give credit to,

how do you decide who's singing the songs in triumph? Like, is it who wrote the song? How did that get determined in triumph? It was just a natural flow. I don't know, we'd start a song and within the first, you know, little back and forths in rehearsals, it would be, Rick, I think this is you, or it'd be Gil, I think this is you, and it just kind of flowed. That was really it. And it was based on, I guess if

something was a little heavier or bluesier, it fell to me. Right. And some of the stuff that was, uh, the floatier, higher melodies, uh, you know, Rick's ballad ballad-y stuff. Ricks. No, not ballad. I wouldn't say, I mean, Rick Rick's a tenor. Okay. And I'm a baritone. So there's right there is sort of a dividing line.

Uh, yeah, sometimes I would have to sing too high as a baritone, which was ill advised, uh, but nonetheless, that's what a lot a baritone, which was ill advised. Uh, but nonetheless, that's what a lot of baritones do. And you know, it's ill advised for tenors to try to sing below their range. So we worked it out. You worked it out. And so it didn't matter who wrote the song. Uh, it just, whatever made sense.

If it's a, a rocky bluesy rocker, that's a Gil jam. Well, I suppose in the case where Rick would write a song, a lot of times he would write it on guitar, acoustic guitar. So he would write a song or start, start writing a song, at least in the key that he would sing it in. So it more naturally fell to his melodic sense and, and his tenor voice. And, uh, the songs that were more or less jammed out on guitar a lot of times were heavier songs and those would be more likely to have you know gone my way or

in some cases I had the original idea and I would work with Rick and I'd go hey I got an idea kind of goes can you play a guitar part that goes like you know, and I've got this idea for a vocal or whatever. So he would then, of course, when the guitar, he would say, okay, let's figure out what key this is for you. So that like a song like rock and roll machine, for example, like that's how it would start. Like it'd be, okay, I had an idea.

Here's the, here's the sort of lyrical thing. Here's, you know, here's the tempo of it. A lot of times drummers start with tempo. Surprise, surprise. And you know, so it was tempo of it. A lot of times drummers start with tempo. Surprise, surprise. And you know, so it was just that kind of jamming it out on the floor thing that would evolve into the outcome as to who the vocalist would be.

Now I know Triumph was nominated for multiple Juno awards. Um, did you ever win a Juno? Just the hall of fame, the Canadian music hall of fame. A lot of people don't know that's a Juno in and of itself. Um, but no, for group of the year, we were

great contenders. We just never, you know, it's like a lot of boxers. You know, those guys that never won, but they were contenders. Yeah, that's what, that's what we were. It's kind of shocking. I think you would win a lot of bar bets. If you said, uh, you know, other than the

Canadian music industry hall of fame in 2007, if you were to say, Hey, how many Junos did triumph win? I think we'd all be guessing. Was it four or five, six Junos? Yeah, everyone thought that everyone thought that, but there's a lot of, there's a lot of statistics in Canadian music that are, that are not understood. You know, I remember, you know,

we were just talking about my, my, my late great friend, Miles Goodwin. And someone was telling me about, you know, these lists that come out like, Oh, the best Canadian bands of all time, blah, blah, blah. And I remember saying about, about Miles, who was a good golfer as well, by the way. And I said, you know what?

Uh, my buddy miles just happens to have sold more records than anybody. And they're like, no, no, no, no, you can't be right. And I said, yes, I'm right. And you can look it up and, and you go back statistically and you look at what, what they were selling in Canada.

I'm talking in Canada here, not in America, but they were knocking it out of the park, album after album after album. And you know, people say, well, what about the guess who? Well, okay, well go look it up just Prove it to yourself right you know there's a there's records at What was at the time the Canadian Recording Industry Association now music numbers don't lie they keep all those stats

Right and interestingly now I just remember chatting with miles and him telling me that he felt there was a in you are Toronto I know would you call yourself a Toronto band or a Mississauga band? How are you guys identifying? Well, I'm a Mississauga boy through and through. I know this, I know this. Okay, GTA band, can I go with GTA? You can go GTA.

I mean, Rick was in the West End and Mike was in Agent Court. So, I mean, we're kind of a crossover. But Miles felt like the Juno people, the heartbeat was in Toronto and they were a Maritimes band who then moved to Montreal and he felt they were slighted from the Juneaus because I don't think they ever wanted Juneau either, April 1. And he felt that was because of a bias against anything east of Ontario. I don't think there was a bias but you know, there's always a kind of a political trend in organizations and I think April wine really got the short end of the stick. I really do I think April wine were

You know, they came before us. I remember being at would before they were they were bigger and they were playing bigger venues I remember being at a high school in Etobicoke, as a matter of fact, right near here, Martin Grove Collegiate. Oh sure, yeah, Eglinton and Martin Grove. Yeah, and standing in the audience and watching Miles Goodwin, this is of course, I didn't know who he was,

just a kid in the audience, but I'm watching him and I'm going, this guy is unreal and this band is fantastic and you know that was before they were really on a roll and they started having records and hits and being all over the radio and and so on. Yeah a lot of sneaky big Canadian radio hits from April Wine for sure for sure underappreciated but I think I can make the same argument for Triumph like Triumph I wonder now look time for real talk I've warmed you up but do you feel like maybe you were

overlooked or slighted because of Rush being a trio from the same place? No, I don't think so. I feel like Rush, you know, first of all, I have tremendous respect for Rush, for Getty and Al and Neil, one of the greatest of all, I have tremendous respect for rush, uh, for Getty and Alan and, uh, and, and, and, and Neil, one of the greatest of all time on drums. And, uh, they, they actually opened doors for us, uh, in a way.

And the reason was the timing of their emergence in America, uh, which was just literally, uh, and it must've been six months before triumph, you know, maybe nine months. And so their managers, first of all, helped us, uh, Ray and Vic at the time with some advice on, you know, do this, don't do that. And I think American audiences were used to spurning Canadian acts for the most part, and they have since then as well, like Canadian acts have never really had an easy time in America and many of them just been shut right out.

Whereas rush was accepted. So whether it was that we were from the same city, that we were the same number of musicians, maybe the fact that, you know, uh, Ged and, and, uh, and Rick both had high voices. I don't know, but you can see in the mix online of the people that talk about the two bands. And so it didn't, no, it didn't hold us back

or anything like that. I think if anything, it helped us. Okay, awesome. And I know that Rush, I'm sure they recorded multiple times at Metalworks Studios, right? Yes, they've been at Metalworks many times and recorded some great stuff there. And yeah, we're proud of that as well. But how is it that Rush and Triumph never shared the same stage?

Like that to me is wild. Yeah. Well, I think a lot of that is we were we would be on tour at the same time. A lot of the times, like I can remember many, many times, you know, we'd be playing, you know, somewhere Albuquerque, New Mexico or St. Louis, Missouri or whatever. And you'd see, oh yeah, three weeks it's Rush or three weeks before you were here it's Rush. And so we cross paths all the time. It's like a lot of bands that people would assume that we shared the stage with and you know and some we did you know like you know big bands with like ACDC for example or Journey or whatever but it just never happened with Rush. Just never happened. A few quick hits. Dawn wrote in and said,

Gil wrote Disco sucks on my rock and roll machine album cover at a record store appearance in 1977. I still have that album. So I'm now gonna ask you the hard-hitting question. Here it comes. Do you still think disco sucked? Yeah, I guess my opinion hasn't changed. I like R&B. I mean, I love R&B. Right. And I just thought it was, you know, give me the real R and B, you know, give me the, you know, give me the guys that really, really did it. And I don't know, somehow to me,

disco seemed like taking R and B and, and, and just like, I don't know, putting it, putting it through the washing machine with Tide or something and taking the real feel out of it and making it monotonous and yeah that's not for everybody well you know what you know what little kids say I have a granddaughter now there's a special word that little girls learn at a certain point because both of my daughters learned it which was yucky when something wasn't good they were daddy that's yucky so I'm gonna say about disco to me was yucky and

if you're signing albums today you just just sign the Disco is yucky. There you go. All right, we're gonna cook. I realize now you didn't realize you're like, Mike, I don't have seven hours here. So I'm gonna cook with gas here, but I'm going to ask you if you have any memories of Canada Jam Festival at Mo's Park.

Mo's Park. Mossport. Mossport, yeah. Easy for you to say. I almost called it Molson Park and Berry. That's a, that's a different place here, but, and that's the wrong brewery. Uh, I'm going to send you home a fresh craft beer from Great Lakes brewery, by the way, right here, not in Mississauga, but South Etobicoke. And that's close enough, right?

Right. Just don't drink it in the car. Don't drink that in the car. Drink it when you're at the studio, maybe. But what do you remember about August 26th, 1978? 110,000 people. Yeah, it was the biggest show, as far as I know, the biggest crowd ever at that point in time in Canada. And it was, you know, the guys that ran Cal Jam, Sandy Perlman and crew that put it on. And it was overwhelming for us,

because we weren't really ready for primetime at that stage. So that was the biggest gig that we'd ever played at the time. And yeah, a very different group of musicians and groups. That was another thing that the theme was different, in that they had groups you know, groups of all different shapes and sizes from the Doobie Brothers to the Village People. So they were big bands, right, but different genres. Yeah, yeah, different genres entirely and I never I don't think any drummer likes outdoor shows. I don't know. I've never done a survey of drummers

but you know when the wind blows your cymbals start moving, you know? You know, I never considered this. Yeah, so when you're even you're trying to sing and play at the same time, the last thing you need is your cymbals to be like wobbling on you, you know? Yeah, that's no good. I remember that and was we played at we went on last so we was it was the head as it was dark and uh... the crowd was just you know really going strong and uh... it was a great memory there's some fuzzy video of it online and uh... yeah great memory but not the largest crowd you played in front of right

no i mean that would be the us festival and nineteen eighty three three times that size yeah i was reading you know i was a bit young in 83, although that is the year, that is the summer I discovered blue Jays baseball 1983 and fell in love. Okay. So they were going way back. Although I guess Rick Emmett is more the ball player. That guy loves his baseball. He does. And he's good, good at it. And yeah, he was into baseball from the entire, the entire career of triumph.

Rick had played on baseball teams. Yeah. I had him out to Christie Pitts. No, he sang the national anthem, I believe, for a Toronto Maple Leafs baseball game at Christie Pitts last summer. Wow. Yeah, and it's funny, everything's connected, but Blair Packham was recording with Rick,

and Blair Packham drove to pick up Rick and bring him to Christie Pitts, and you can imagine that drive. And I just, here to say and Blair Packham drove to pick up Rick and bring him to Christie Pitts and you can imagine that drive and I just here to say Blair Packham is my guest on Thursday so Blair Packham from the Jitters will be here on Thursday just a small world story okay so six hundred and seventy thousand people at the US Festival yeah I don't know what there really was there because they lost track of it you know the lowest count I've ever seen is I don't know three it. That's wild. The lowest count I've ever seen is, I don't know, 300,000. That one's probably the highest count I've ever seen.

But it was vast, you know, from the stage, it looked like a city that just went out and extended out into the mountains, and the mountains were the backdrop. So it was- And where was this again? This was in a place called, it was really near San Bernardino, California, in an area called Glen Helen Park.

And Steve Wozniak had reconstructed this park, like he had moved, you know, things with earth moving equipment around to create this area for the concert, where they could erect the stage properly and so on and so forth. So there was a tremendous amount of preparation that went into this. But yeah, it drew from, well, of course, California, I would say was mainly, but really there was people flying in from everywhere around America. And I've met people that went from Canada, Canada that went down there that heard about it. Yeah it is wild though to say yeah we headlined Canada Jam festival for 110,000 people but that's nothing. Wait till you hear what we did in 1983. Yeah it was again it was we were ready for it though I mean when Canada Jam we were we were rookies but by the time the US

Festival you know rolled around we were old pros at that point. So it didn't seem that different. And the day before the us festival, we played at the tangerine bowl. There was 55,000 people at the T bowl. That was, was easy top. And so, you know, you, you play that and you see a stadium full of people at 55,000, which seems gigantic, say compared to an arena at 15,000. But then when you go to this outdoor show, it just, you see, well, this is like nothing

I've ever seen before. No, I'm trying to think. I guess we had a couple of big things at Downsview Park. I'm trying to think, I guess, where would you go in Toronto or the GTA to even get close to a hundred thousand people? You got to do some big thing at Downsview Park, like the Pope's got to come or something like that. Yeah.

So are the, uh, SARS Fest. Yes, that was massive. I don't know what the numbers were, but it was massive. It was probably in that range. Why didn't Triumph play SARS stock? Well, what was the date? I don't think we were performing at that.

When was it? Maybe, uh, 2003. Yeah. So we weren't performing at that stage. We performed again to get to... We wanted to do a show for our kids. So when we did the shows that we did in

08, which were in... down near Dallas, at Rock, Oklahoma, and we did Sweden, that was the next time that we got on stage. Okay so that's like a teaser of things to come here but we well I guess I can ask the big question now so forget Sarastok that's nothing to me what I am very interested in Gil and

this is really the reason you're here I haven't even started recording yet I'll start recording right now here's the big question you ready why do I not hear any Gilmore or Rick Emmett on Tears Are Not Enough in 1985? What do you mean, why don't you hear us? What's the best Canadian, you guys are top shelf Canadian musical talent, okay? Neil's there, Joni's there, Getty's there,

Gordon Lightfoot, you name it, right? Where were you? Huh, good question. I'm upset, man. I'm trying to remember now, because I know that Rick was on one of those. But not that one. Okay, but not that one.

So probably, I'm gonna guess we were on tour. So you were on, so do you have any memory being asked to be a part of it? And then of course we're not available, we're on tour in Dallas. You know when you're touring, you get so many asks for so many things I can't honestly remember Mike. I don't I don't know like who produced it again was that

Bob Ezrin or who else no no no no so it was David Foster. Oh god. Yes, it was David Who's a lovely guy by the way and and has been really Affectionate tour when we went into Canada's Walk of Fame, David was there that night and he never realized how much he really knew about Triumph and stuff and we had some really nice conversations. But okay, so I had a chat with Randy Backman fairly recently and I asked him the same question because he's another guy. Where's Randy Backman on Tears are Not Enough? And he says Bruce Allen was pissed at him, so Bruce Allen blocked him, okay?

Did Bruce Allen have any beef with Triumph that was gonna block you guys from Tears Are Not Enough? I don't think so. I love Bruce Allen, you know? But then again, I'll say this. We went through most of our career self-managed. So like if you were a manager, think about it. Like, would you be really a big fan of bands that manage themselves? I mean, if you were a manager, think about it. Like would you be really a big fan

of bands that manage themselves? I mean if all bands manage themselves you'd be out of business. Right. I'm not saying that's what Bruce thought. I mean you'd have to ask him. But I tried. I actually went to Joe Faluna who's on the 1021 episode, works directly with Bruce and asked him straight out. There's a guy in South of forget South of Toa. There's a guy in Toronto who is very interested in Tears Are Not Enough. I'm so interested. I literally have. You can just, you know, I you can hold on to that for a second. That is that is the official documentation handed out to everybody who attended the recording of Tears Are Not Enough back in 1985. I think there was a unless you guys were unavailable

because you're on tour which is a great reason not to do it. And that might be the reason I'm here to find out the real story. Is this a conspiracy? Is that where you're going with this? Well, it's a conspiracy of one. We should ask Alex Jones. Why?

He's my next guest. How did you know that? Okay. No, just kidding. So now, now let me tell you the truth. Bruce Allen has the best, uh, he has the best has the best person in his office that does a lot of things and her name is Sandy Bathgate and I want you to plug in for her okay she's Andy Bathgate the greatest hockey player greatest hockey

player yeah yeah his lovely daughter who also worked at Metalworks with me and she's a dear lady and she's done a phenomenal job this is a mind blow to me Bruce okay there you go so there's a connection lady and she's done a phenomenal job. This is a mind blow to me. For Bruce. Okay. There you go. So there's a connection there. So we should ask Sandy. Like I think Bruce actually loves Triumph, but you have to ask Sandy.

Would you have Sandy talk Bruce into maybe just a half an hour via Zoom with me? I ask a few questions about Tears on My Mouth. I really want to know where the hell was Triumph and what's the deal with Randy Backman? This is for a good cause. Famine relief in Africa. We can't let bygones be bygones for famine relief in Africa? Yeah, well you're gonna have to pose these tough questions I suppose Mike. That's my role in all this. Okay, back to Triumph. Thank you for answering the Tears Are Not Enough question. Hamilton Mike wrote in, I'm definitely curious about any, I'm gonna read this question, I'm going to read this question,

I don't know if I agree with it, but any animosity that Gill may have had when Rick left Triumph and how it felt to put that behind him when they reunited. And then he also wants to know what you thought of working with Phil X who replaced Rick and is now enjoying his time in some indie group. I never heard of them Bon Jovi. I never heard of them. But what can you tell me about Rick deciding to leave Triumph? Well, you know those things are never easy and you know, we all we all had feelings, you know Rick had feelings Mike had feelings on I had feelings and it's tough because you're the three musketeers your brothers and

Then you know somebody you know wants, you know, somebody, you know, wants to, you know, get off the island. So, uh, yeah, we went through some tough times. There's no doubt about it. It's, it was like a family fight, I guess. And then when it's over, everyone is so relieved and so, you know, I, I was talking to Rick on the way over here as a matter of fact.

So we're, we're in touch all the time. I was at his house a week or so ago, spent three hours in his new, he built a beautiful studio in his house and it's really magnificent. So I was over there hanging out with him in his studio and we'll be brothers forever. So we had a squabble, we got over it

and now we're brothers in arms again. As far as Phil's concerned, we had a great run with Phil. Yeah. You know, Phil is one of the greatest guys out there. I mean, not only is he a great guitar player, he's a great singer and so on. I understand why John Bon Jovi loves him so much,

but he's just a good, good guy to hang. When I was on the road with him, we would go jogging and stuff every morning. That was our thing, cause he thing because he likes to be healthy. And you know, I love Phil. And actually now we're, you know, getting back together on a lot of projects we're working on and Phil's involved with Rick and Mike and I again. So it's, you know, kind of a full circle thing that's starting to happen.

Like I am so happy to hear that you and Rick are so tight now that you were on the phone with him today like that just makes me feel good to know. Yeah well. You kissed and made up. It's life you know life's too short. It's sometimes it's hard in a family or in a marriage or in a band you know to always agree on everything and you know sometimes people get feelings hurt or they have different opinions. But you have to get past these things in life. It's just part of what Triumph always was.

Mike was very positive in terms of lyrics. And then in terms of when we toured, I said this in our documentary, when people said, what was the key to the band? I said, the key was humor. What do you mean by that? I said, I mean what I said. It was, we didn't get too serious.

We always realized that, you know, when you're lucky enough, when 99.999% of bands all flop, including every band I had, every band Mike had, every band Rick had, and then you're lucky enough to happen to get a band that takes off, well, you better be happy You better not be miserable when you're out there and you better appreciate your fans because wasn't for them You would be a flop like you were previously. So you got to be kind of gracious

I think with your respect for the people that will actually shell out, you know money to come and see you and applaud and all the rest of it and So we took the lighter side of the whole thing. We looked at it like, isn't this amazing? Like we're kind of floating on helium and it's actually working of this is like a dream that's come true. So that leads to kind of playing around, goofing around. And when I think of the number of jugs of orange juice I poured in Mike Levine's hair, I can't, number of jugs of orange juice I poured in Mike Levine's hair. I can't... You know, or some of the other antics that we would do to keep each other laughing on airplanes. I mean these were the things that were kind of magic.

Otherwise what happens on the road, like a lot of bands, you lose your mind. Do you think everything's gonna go right every day? Of course it isn't. Of course the limo driver's not gonna show up. Of course the catering is going to get, is going to be cold. Whatever it is that you want to complain about, your hotel rooms not ready, all of these things. You got to, you know, roll with the punches if you're going to tour. And the way we rolled with the punches is by keeping the jokes flowing. Great documentary by the way. It was fantastic. It was fantastic. Well the credit goes to the directors, you know. Sam Dunn and Mark Riccordelli they really and and

Don Allen his contributions and Ralph the writer Ralph Chapman they did a magnificent job because to me it was like a patchwork quilt it was like I remember seeing you know a puzzle when I was maybe five years old and and my my mom put it on the kitchen table and all the puzzle pieces Were all strewn over and I looked at it and I thought well mom that's it's nothing It's just a bunch of parts right and she said yeah well, that's it you have to put the puzzle together to see what the picture is and When you're five years old, that's a good lesson

But this was the same as an adult doing this documentary. I saw the puzzle pieces and I had no idea what was the picture going to be like when it was finished. But we were very happy with it. Well I'm happy to report that we can let Bruce Allen off. The poor Bruce Allen, we were about to attack him. Where the hell's Triumph on Tears Are Not Enough? Well my correspondent, my very special correspondent 1236 reports back that the day they recorded Tears Are Not Enough, which was February 10th, 1985, you were at the Beaumont Civic Centre in Beaumont, Texas. I told you there was a gig.

So I feel better about that. And I will report back to you that Molly Hatchet was opening. Yep. And tickets were $12.75. That sounds about right, you know? The boys in Molly Hatchet, they were quite a robust crew. And I think Dave just passed away, if I'm not mistaken. And the Winter Brothers, maybe I'm wrong about that. I hope I'm wrong.

You know, that's one of those things, I've done it. You report somebody's passed away and then they send you a note like later that day to say, hey, I'm right here. Like I'm not dead. Yeah, I guess when I'm thinking of Beaumont, I always think of the Winter Brothers, you know? Yeah.

The Johnny and Edgar because, you know, that's where they hailed from. And I love Texas so much, I still do. And there's no such thing as from and I love Texas so much I still do and there isn't there's there's no such thing as a bad city in Texas. Are you as warm and fuzzy about Texas today than you were six months ago? Oh yeah yeah to me like I don't You're gonna ride or die. Oh yeah I mean you know what's going on politically is not in my opinion have anything to do with us as people it's

it's it's an outcome that I get it resulted from an election but when you look at the American people and as I have done because I've been to every state and you look at the Canadian people as I do because I've been to every province and you realize you know what we're really lucky we live in a great part of the world and there's an awful lot of nice people and sometimes we elect representatives that do the right things and sometimes we make a mistake

and we elect the wrong people. And let's face it, politicians are like musicians or they're like anybody else, there's good ones and there's bad ones and there's some that lose their direction and so on. So right now, this negative discourse that's going on, I think it's good that we're debating the direction of our country or their country or tariffs or these sorts of things.

But I think we need to remember that, you know, we're all God's children. And we have a lot of friends in America, and the Americans have a lot of friends in Canada, and we should respect each other So I'm not into booing anthems or anything like this. This is to me disrespectful See, I agree if you 100% in part of that respect is that you respect our sovereignty Yes, independent nation. We have no interest in joining your country. Yes, and I don't think Americans

Think any differently than than you do or I do. I think that they do respect our sovereignty, you know, even if it's in political circles, you know, not being respected at the moment, you know, for whatever reason, whether it's negotiating tactics or, you know, tariff strategy, whatever you call it. I don't know, I don't have any American friends that want to take over Canada anytime soon. I'm glad to hear that because I'll have my hockey stick at the board ready to fight, man, ready to fight.

Okay, Moose Grumpies on the live stream just wants to know quickly if Phil X still lives in Mississauga when he's not touring, because in her teens, she was friends with some of Phil's high school band members. Is Phil X still a Mississauga man? Well in his heart I think there's a side of Phil, you know, Phil you know really learned to be a great guitar player at his dad's restaurant which was in West Elmall, literally a hundred yards from where I grew up, a hundred yards.

Wow. And Phil's a very proud Canadian. He lives in LA full time, but he does come up here. He comes up here for a certain family. He's got to come to Metalworks, right? Oh yeah, yeah. I mean, if Phil comes to Canada, I know about it and we get together. So I've been out to see him a couple times

He's played up here, and I go out just to see him play So we got a good relationship there, and I anytime he's up here. Yeah, he'll be at metalworks Or we'll be hanging out someplace well speaking of Phil X. I promise Midtown Gourd I'd read his his message here because biggest triumph and I know know. Triumph and Lee Aaron, those are his two favorite musical artists of all time. This is Midtown Gourd talking. I won't imitate him, I'll just read it, okay? I have been a fan for a long time. Thank you for all the great years of music. The first Triumph album I bought was Progressions of Power, but loved hearing the songs from Just a Game on the radio, from just a game on the radio.

I was too young to see you in high schools. I started high school in 1980, so I'm not one of those guys who can say that you played my high school, but I've seen you live many, many times. My question is, how realistic was it that you could have continued after Edge of Excess, which is an amazing album, either with Rick Santor's or Phil X, or did it just not feel right? Yeah, he kind of nailed it. It was, I wouldn't say that it didn't feel right. The band we had with Phil really rocked.

Like I said, he's just completely different, yet equally kind of phenomenal guitarist, I would say. And so, yeah, it felt really good, but it might have been too soon. After Rick, or maybe the audience's memories were too strong from the previous band. It could have just been Mike and I were just getting to that stage of life where we'd kind of been there, done that. And we're starting to think differently about our future and what we wanted to do, how we wanted to spend our time.

So it was a, it's hard really to put it in words, quite honestly. I'm not certain. It's hard really to put it in words, quite honestly. I'm not certain. I know in my case, like I had interests in, you know, seeing the studio progress, for example. So, Metalworks Studios became a big thing for me at the time. And, you know, Mike had some other things that he'd started on that were in different directions

and so on. I think the other thing too is just touring. So to really make a success out of a rock band you've got to be willing to travel and tour. And my father had passed away in 1987 and so by the time we're talking about Edge of Excess, you know, my mom had been alone for about five, six years at that point. So she was getting older and for me to be away as an only child, uh, there, my guilt meter would go, and I don't want to be away from my mother cause she might need me. You know,

she needs, she needs, uh, her son. So there was a lot of things going on at the same, at the same time. So it's kind of hard to to give you a concise answer So I guess this is a bit of blah blah blah here, but that's the best I can do No, I think Midtown Gord appreciates it and thank you for that thoughtful answer I would and I realize I'm coming to the end of the time But I want to talk about metal work studios a little bit more and I definitely Definitely want to talk about the coalition for music education that will host music

Monday on May 5th, 2025. But just before I do that, I want to give you a gift. I want to give you multiple gifts. Gild, you accept gifts from independent podcasters. Well, I already accepted the beer. So where's the Scotch? Well, you know what goes good with the beer? I don't have Scotch.

Yeah. Listen, I need a Scototch sponsor. Thank you. Hook me up, boy. Hook me up. What pairs nicely with Great Lakes beer is I have in my freezer upstairs a frozen lasagna from Palma Pasta. And I know you're a Mississauga man. Palma Pasta have three locations in Mississauga and another location in Oakville. And go to palmapasta.com. You'll love this lasagna. Oh, thank you so much.

I know, I know my wife actually shops there. So yeah. Your wife has great taste in, in husbands and in pasta. I was going to say at least in pasta. Well, you know, it depends who you talk to. Okay. So don't leave without your lasagna. It's delicious.

Thank you. Palmapasta. Palmapasta will feed us at TMLX 18 on June 26th at Great Lakes Brewery Ridley Funeral Home, who, by the way, I learned they only sell caskets made in Canada. So they they support Canadian casket manufacturers and they're, you know, fiercely independent here in New Toronto, but they have sent

over a measuring tape for you, Gil measure. That's perfect. And as a matter of fact, from the whole, when you're golfing, I don't know. Well, I was actually shopping for a casket. So this is very timely. Thank you. Well, you know what? They have kiss caskets. Why don't you sell Triumph caskets?

Well, you know, there's now there's a Triumph pinball machine, just like I saw a kiss pinball machine. So I thought I could take the Triumph pinball machine, turn it into a casket. I could be buried in it. Perfect. I'll hook you up with Brad Jones from Ridley Funeral Home. We'll make that happen. Okay, wireless speaker from Minaris. And with that, not only will you listen to great music,

but you're going to listen to season eight of Yes We Are Open, which is an award-winning podcast from Minaris, hosted by fellow musician, Al Grego. He's with the Royal Pains and the Weekends. Shout out musician Al Grego. He's with the Royal Pains and the weekends. Shadow to Al Grego. Al Grego went to Regina, Saskatchewan, and he collected stories from small business owners. And I took a note because episode one just dropped. This is exciting. I can tell the world that they can listen right now to Kevin Toth, president of Prairie Flying Service, and Al and Kevin delve into the storied history

and rich legacy of the company which began in 1946, founded by four World War II pilots. So listen to Yes We Are Open from Minaris. I've never gotten this many gifts in one interview. You know what? You got anything else you want to lay on me? Yeah, I saved the best for last. You ready? Oh, I'm ready. Yeah. Okay. Do you, I know you got a nice automobile out there. Do you like driving a nice clean car? Uh, well, yes, obviously. Obviously. Cleaning is only a hassle if you make it one. That's how they feel at Silver Wax. Silver Wax

makes pro-grade auto care and cleaning technology easy for everyone to use. They have kits for beginners, experts and professionals. Everything you need go to silverwax.ca. Use the promo code Toronto Mike 10 at checkout and you save 10% in your next order. Silver wax also proudly Canadian since 1999. They sent over, I'm not kidding, oh my god, That bucket and these two spray bottles right here, right here actually. Holy smokes. That's a very robust kit from Silverwax for

interior and exterior detailing, cleaning of your automobile. Yeah, that looks like it has my son's name written all over it. You know what? Miles, this gift's for you. Miles, you will be a, and why didn't you name him Kilometers? Why Miles? Well, we'd have to ask Sunny because she was in charge of naming our

children. She had the naming rights. Yes. Well, actually the truth of the matter is my eldest daughter Lauren, when she was very young, she would say, daddy, what's the chances we can call him Miles when the baby's born? And then the next day it would be, dad, what's the chances we can call him miles when the baby's born? And then the next day it would be dad, what are the chances today we can call them miles? And they just went on and on and on and on every single day until finally I said to Sonny, I said, you know what, I think Lauren's actually cast the winning vote. I think it's miles. I did a similar. So my son, my third born turns, uh, 11 years old tomorrow.

That's why there's balloons behind you, by the way. He's not supposed to see them. They're hiding down here. So you can surprise them tomorrow. That's why there's balloons behind you by the way. He's not supposed to see them. They're hiding down here so you can surprise them tomorrow. But I started sort of my wife was lukewarm on the name Jarvis and I started calling the baby the bump in the belly. Like I started calling the bump Jarvis and I would sing to Jarvis and talk to Jarvis and at some point she said she couldn't think of the baby as anything but Jarvis. Like that's sort of a good technique. Yeah there you go. So yeah your daughter knows what's going on. Okay two more quick shout-outs. One to Nick Ienis. He's from Fusion Corp and he hosts the show

Building Toronto Skyline and we're recording on Friday morning an episode all about the CN Tower turning 50. It was the you know the tallest building in the world for quite some time. We're gonna celebrate the CN Tower on building Toronto skyline Thank you, Nick. I enies and last but not least. I know you've got a studio So you probably have old tech old electronics old that devices that break don't throw them in the garbage Gill go to recycle my electronics dot CA and put in your poster code and find out where you drop that Electronics the the cabling even where do you drop it off to be properly recycled? You got it?

That's good. I'll have to pass that on to our operations team at Metalworks. Yeah. They're always looking to recycle properly because we take that pretty seriously. Oh, glad to hear it. Match made in heaven. Yeah. We don't need, we don't need plastic or transistors in our water or in our land.

Do we? We've done a very terrible job over the last few decades. So it's time to clean up. The magic of the melody runs through you like a stream The notes that play flow through your head like a dream Like a dream Like a dream I sing this song for the common man and for the people in despair I bring my song into the world and I sing it everywhere The simple truth lies waiting here for everyone to share So hold on

And I will take you there Hold on And I will take you there You You Gil, I don't want to fade it down, but I want to ask you a tough question. Do you know what's happening May 5th, 2025? This is less than a month away. Do you know what's happening with the Coalition for Music Education?

Yeah, I do. And they're a great organization. And of course, because we have a school we also built many years ago now, adjacent to Metalworks. Music Education has been a real passion for me. I've started actually a charity now called Sounds Unite Canada, which is another free learning resource for young people in Canada. And the coalition has got that mission to increase the awareness of music and the great

things that it does in society. And, you know, back to your question about some of the strife that we're feeling right now, all of us politically, you know, I look question about some of the strife that we're feeling right now all of us politically you know I look to music as as being a great healer in society and a great bridge it's one thing if you think there's almost nothing else that you could mention where you can take any culture any group and you can play music and it doesn't matter that it may be a totally different genre style or instrumentation or whatever, but it brings people together and makes them feel good. Well, the coalition really emphasizes this and doubles down on it with this Music Monday event by having kids in choirs all

across Canada from every province. There are over a,000 participants in this and this year we were honored that they're using Triumph's song Hold On as the Music Monday anthem. This is a song that Rick wrote quite early in his career and Rick's re-recorded it with some kids, also with some musical instructors from our school and a couple professionals were involved as well, it was produced at Metalworks Studios. So it's a rebirth of the song so to speak and it's meant to inspire all the kids in elementary schools and high schools and universities for that matter to get into music, learn why music is so important in our community,

in our society, and just push that music message. Love it so much. I'm so into anything right now that unites Canadians. And this nationwide celebration will unite Canadians in a simultaneous sing-along. Everybody is going to sing, sing hold on this iconic anthem wild okay, and I was learning more about music Monday and it's

Pretty awesome like we're all seeking connection We're all seeking unity and this annual celebration which started here in Canada, has resonated with communities nationwide and is now being embraced globally. The collective act of singing together fosters a sense of belonging and reminds us that music can bridge divides and unite us all. And it's awesome that we're going to hear this new recording of Hold On with Rick Emmett and a children's choir. That's awesome. Yeah. The Coalition for Music Education is what you want to check out. They're a great organization headed by Stacey Sinclair and she works tirelessly to help

music educators across Canada and in turn help music students. So all kidding aside, this is, because I like to joke as you know, but this is a serious effort that's doing a lot of good, I think for a lot of people. So I'm going to close, Rick, by asking you just a little bit about Metalworks Studios. One fun thing is, of course of all these students across the country are going to sing Hold On. So I found on YouTube one music teacher had a little tutorial for their class. So basically published like a little video to teach the students because students are at home right now across this country practicing Hold On. Like that's happening right now. Do you want to hear a little bit about this? Just a little bit. Okay. Sure. So musicals, the secret to know it can make you whole. It's not just a game of notes.

It's the sounds inside your soul. The magic of the melody runs through you like a stream. runs through you like a stream. The notes that play flow through your head like a dream. Like a dream. You know, not an easy song to sing really. Like this is going to be tough for the kids. It's a really tough song to sing. You know, I'm glad that was Rick and not me. Well, I know you don't like I know I could tell by if I could see your eyes through those wonderful sunglasses, I could see your eyes. I don't think you like the word ballad.

Is it my right to say that? Like you sort of your back got up when I said ballad. Oh, I like balance. I'm not. But I feel like Rick Amit is he's the ballad guy. And you're the bluesy rocker guy. And to each, you know, some people like the ballads, as you're the bluesy rocker guy and to each you know Some people like the ballads as you know some people want more hold on some people want the allied forces Give me some gil. Well, I guess it depends what you call a ballot

So I wouldn't call hold on a ballot, but I understand why you might say that it's melodic and dreamy and that sort of thing It's like poison when I think of when I think of a ballot. I think a slower tempo, right? Okay, I hear you but that's a drummer thing. I's like poison. When I think of when I think of a ballad, I think a slower tempo, right? OK, I hear you. But that's a drummer thing, I guess. You hear the drummer get wicked. OK, so Metalworks Studio, I was looking at a lengthy list of artists and albums

that have been recorded at Metalworks. So when did you when did you start Metalworks a long time ago, right? We started in 77 and it was nothing more than a cassette recorder and you know a couple of microphones. And we very very quickly the very next year we moved to our current location. So we're now kind of the oldest recording studio in Canada as far as I know. Or if not the oldest we're certainly one of the very very earliest studios.

Over 40 years right? Yeah well think about it we're hitting for fit we're closer to 50 than 40 me too uh so here are some acts okay I'm gonna just this is a little list you don't even have to respond but Drake Aerosmith Katy Perry black-eyed peas Jonas Brothers let me switch to CanCon for a moment you know I love the Canadian band some 41 they just played their last gig at the Junos. Feist, Chaos, Sam Roberts, he's an FOTM, Billy Talent, Bare Naked Ladies, Metric, Johnny Reid, Simple Plan, your buddy Tom Cochran, Our Lady Peace, Tea Party, Backman Cummings, Nelly Furtado, Anne Frickin Murray, she's a hell of a golfer. And a great golfer. And she recorded her most successful album, which was a double

album with 27 songs on it with Tommy West at Metalworks. And she wrote the nicest, the two nicest letters that we ever had from artists because I was always with Anne I just thought she was you know a Queen a goddess like she was just something else She wrote us the most beautiful letter after that record the other letter we got was from Ronnie Hawkins. That was equally Romping not not lowest of the lows Ron Hawkins touch touching well, Ronnie was Ronnie spent a lot of time at Metalworks and I still remember being a kid and being at the Hawks Nest and just looking up on the stage

and seeing how exciting he made the room. Well you're bringing it all back to where we started, Lee on helm. Yeah, yeah, with Anne it was just, I don't know, just always thought of, I have thought of the trilogy of Ronnie and Anne Anne Murray and Gordon Lightfoot as being three of my personal Favorites idols, whatever you influencers, whatever you want to say all three played on tears are not enough. Yeah Beaumont fucking Texas I'm getting pissed off over here. I'm gonna ask you

about two artists in specifically before we play out here. So Prince recorded at Metalworks? Yes, Prince was really great in the studio. You know, he's diminutive to say the least and East and very private as well but very very polite and and he worked with several of our engineers L. Stu Young being one Chris Carrar who's still with us today another did some great recording there and musicology is an album we'll always be proud of now here's a I went I remember going downtown the the day this album dropped It was a two albums actually but use your illusion one and use your illusion two by guns and fucking roses recorded at metalworks studios

so only part of that record was recorded at metalworks, but our dear friend Mike clink who just Did the tribute album on triumph? He was the producer and had a history with Triumph. And so he really brought Axel and crew up to Metalworks. That's how that happened. Amazing. And I just chatted with a buddy this morning about the tribute album, Sebastian Bach, and he was just running down some of the artists. Have you heard this album? Yeah, I've heard all the tracks, so Mike and Rick obviously. And yeah, we're just really humbled with the great players and great singers that are on there from Nancy Wilson, the guys in Envy of None, Larry from Styx, and Joey

from Anthrax, and Sebastian of course, who's always been kind of a extended family to Triumph. Just an amazing group. Slash played a guitar solo on there as well. And some great drummers, Kenny Aronoff, Tommy Aldridge, you know, some great guitarists as well. Just a fantastic lineup, to be honest. Like I can't wait to hear it. So you said you were humbled, right? But enough about humble Howard Glassman. We know he's a good golfer, okay? I hear more about humble Howard Glassman in his golf game. I'm telling you. They don't pay me enough. Well, do you know who was humble Howard before humble Howard? I've heard, I didn't know. I don't know, but I did hear there was a

humble Howard. Howard Cassell. Was he humble Howard? Yeah. Ask humble Howard too, if I'm not wrong. I will. Just say, was there a humble Howard before you were humble Howard? Yeah. Ask Humble Howard too, if I'm not wrong. I will. Just say, was there a Humble Howard before you were Humble Howard? Now he's a kinder, gentler Humble Howard, and he's a great golfer Humble Howard, but there was Humble Howard 1 was actually. Well Humble Howard Cosell broke the news to America that John Lennon had been shot and killed. Oh, I didn't know that. Monday Night Football.

Yeah, because it happened on a Monday and he broke the news and John Lennon had been shot and killed. Oh, I didn't know that. Monday Night Football. Yeah, because it happened on a Monday and he broke the news and John Lennon had been on previous Monday Night Football kind of learning the sport. He's from Liverpool for gosh sakes. He's kind of learning the sport, American football. Gil, you were awesome, man. You were awesome. Do you know that?

Can you tell my wife? What's her number? I'll call her live right now. I'll call her live right now. Seriously, that was just a great chat you were very giving and you're welcome back here anytime for a sequel and then I'll really get into it. I got more questions about some of these, I know, I mean the cranberries. Tina Turner, did Tina Turner really record at Metalworks Studios? Yeah, in all three studios at

once. She had multiple projects going on and our three biggest studios, she had them all rolling at once. She was an absolute queen. I can not say enough good things about Tina Turner and how gracious she was. And her manager, Roger Davies too, was just a real gentleman. I feel I started my extra too early because David Bowie recorded at Metalworks Studios? Yes we had him there and I would say the same thing. We were we were the young guns on RCA Records in New York

when we first crossed the border as a recording artist and David was on RCA at the time and their artist relations man who was the late great Pat Kelleher, had David Bowie and Triumph and Elvis were his three clients. So we heard all the David stories before we met David and they were all, Pat was, don't believe anything you hear. I can tell you David Bowie is a great, great guy and he will, you know, some of the stories you hear that are kind of outlandish are mostly garbage and kind of the same with Elvis. He gave us all the great stuff that, you know, it's funny when you find out the truth about people. And so when David finally ended up at metal

works, we got to see, uh, up close and personal, what a wonderful person he was to, uh, to work with and, uh, no, very, very great. Sorry. That's Michael Williams telling us no Cleveland, no Bowie. That man would love Michael Williams. And that brings us to the end of our 1667th show. Go to torontomike.com for all your Toronto Mike needs.

Much love to all who made this possible. That is Great Lakes Brewery, Palma Pasta, Monaris, Silver Wax, get a lot of swag man, RecycleMyElectronics.ca, Building Toronto Skyline and Ridley Funeral Home. See you all tomorrow when my special guest is Ian Blurton. We'll be talking change of heart. See you all then.