Toronto Mike'd: The Official Toronto Mike Podcast - Goodnight Sunrise: Toronto Mike'd #1203

Episode Date: February 13, 2023

In this 1203rd episode of Toronto Mike'd, Mike chats with David Kochberg and Vanessa Vakharia of Goodnight Sunrise about their music, opening for Bon Jovi at the ACC, the challenges in getting radio play, and the missing comma. Toronto Mike'd is proudly brought to you by Great Lakes Brewery, Palma Pasta, Canna Cabana, Ridley Funeral Home and Electronic Products Recycling Association.

Is that your real laugh? Why would I have a fake laugh? Oh my god who is that? What did you hear? It was a thump Do you have a pet? No I don't have a pet Oh my god should we be concerned?

Is there a break and enter happening? Possibly All live on the pod Alright here we go Okay Deal with it in an hour Toronto VK on the beat Check I can deal with it in an hour.

Welcome to episode 1203 of Toronto Mic'd. Proudly brought to you by Great Lakes Brewery. A fiercely independent craft brewery who believes in supporting communities, good times, and brewing amazing beer. Order online for free local home delivery in the GTA. Palma Pasta. Enjoy the taste of fresh homemade Italian pasta and entrees from Palma Pasta in Mississauga and

Oakville Electronic Products Recycling Association Committing to our planet's future means properly recycling our electronics of the past Ridley Funeral Home Pillars of the past. Ridley Funeral Home.

Pillars of the community since 1921. And Canna Cabana. The lowest prices on cannabis. Guaranteed. Over 150 stores across the country. Learn more at cannacabana.com Joining me

today, making their Toronto Mike debut, is David Kochberg and Vanessa Vaccaria from Goodnight Sunrise. Welcome. Thank you. Okay, now Vanessa can talk. Somebody let her know. Vanessa, how are you doing? Oh my God, so good. So excited to be here. Have you finished eating the peanut butter square you just put in there? I have not.

It's here in case I need a little nibble in the middle of our interview. You got to have a snack all the time. Is that a peanut butter chocolate mix there? That's a good combo. What's going on there? It's our favorite combo as a band, right? Yes, David. Speak for yourself here.

No, that's not true. What if you had to pick one ice cream flavor, what would it be? Go. That was not the question that was posed. No, but it's kind of the question. Yes, if it was an ice cream flavor I was selecting, then yes. Peanut butter, chocolate, obviously. Told you.

Sure, and square, whatever. Hello, thanks for having us. Hi. Honestly, it's a pleasure. And although Vanessa said nice to meet you, I'm going to remind Vanessa something that she could never remember this because it was such a brief moment in time. But I was at the, where was I? I was at Sneaky D's.

No, no, you're not getting. Could you? Can you get canceled? We'll see. We've got a lot of interview ahead. Sneaky D's. I'm there. I was there with my buddies from Rusty. And you, Vanessa, and I, and FOTM Lee Beef Eckley, took a photo together.

Do you have any memory of this? I 100% remember that. But what I'd like to just back up on is, sorry, what was that nickname and why? Oh, you don't know? Lee Eckley's nickname is Beef. Why? Wow. So this is news to you? Okay Eckley's nickname is Beef. Why? Wow. So this is news to you? Okay, that's exciting to me.

This is great news. Hi, Lee. Hi, Mom. Okay, wait, why? Why? He told me the story when he came over and we had a long talk. I believe this happened when he was at, I'm going to say Q107 or Chum FM. I think it was Chum FM. I can't remember the origin of the story, like how he got the nickname Beef, but absolutely forever

in the Toronto radio circles. Lee Eckley has been known as Beef! Oh my god, huge reveal. Huge reveal on the pod. Next time we talk to Lee, we will get the scoop. Is this a call-in show? Can he call in right now? I will phone him. He'll take my call. I love that guy. But anyways, I see

him at Sneaky D's and we take that photo. I never saw that photo. Like, I see him at Sneaky D's and we take that photo. I never saw that photo. Like, I don't know whose camera was it. Yours or Beef's? It's definitely Beef. Beef jerkingly actually. Are you thinking like there was a character named Beef in Porky's

because he was well hung. Like, this was a thing. Like, is that, you think that might be the origin of the term? I can't remember. Literally, my mind did not even go close to that corner. To be honest, I thought it was potentially a food preference. OK, well, he does like he does like meat lasagna. Do either of you enjoy lasagna? It's a real question.

Give me the truth. No, I'm just kind of like who in their right mind would answer no to this question. Like, of course. All right. Well, lasagnagnas are delicious if it's gluten-free big reveal number two okay that's that's okay that's gonna be shitty here because uh there's a lot of gluten in this lasagna i have made a pretty killer zucchini lasagna like as the pasta zucchini slices yeah thinly sliced to replace the okay i'm sure there's's many a gluten-free option at Palma Pasta, but the lasagna I have in my freezer, it sounds like that'll be for Vanessa here.

Oh my God, yes. Also, I'm half Italian. Everyone should know. Okay. Palmas, what's up? So they're the Picucci family, straight out of Italy. So they make really authentic Italian food,

and there is that for you. And also there's some fresh craft beer from Great Lakes Beer. Wait, hold on Lakes beer. Hey, you're giving us in a lasagna. Yeah. Like this box will be full when you leave. My God, that's real.

The best news. Thank you. Lasagna. And, and, and again, I, I don't know if you drink beer,

but there is fresh craft beer as well from Great Lakes. This is a glutinous podcast. Sponsored by Gluten. There's a lot of glutin here. There's a lot of glutin here. But we do appreciate the kind gesture. Thank you. Alright, let me see if I have something

for Mr. Gluten-Free David here. Hold on. You talk amongst yourselves. Talk amongst ourselves. If it gets to an emergency situation, we do still have three-quarters of a peanut butter square.

Wait, what is that? I'm actually really scared. Is that a weapon? This is for David Kochberg here who can't have gluten. Okay. Ridley Funeral Home. This is a flashlight for David. Don't eat it though.

Okay. Can I just say that when you said pillars of the community, I thought you said killers of the community. And I was like, what is that slogan? Well, that's how they keep in business. Keep creating clients. Okay. Oh, my God.

Oh, yeah. Don't blind yourself, David. But this is also a measuring tape from Ridley Funeral Home. You need that, too. So that's for you. Okay. So thank you, Gray Lakes, for the beer that David can't have. And thank you, Palmapasta, for the lasagna that David can't have.

But Ridley Funeral Home did give David some takeaways. Thank you. Oh, my God. Very, very practical. It's like we're at a trade show right now. I've never seen a flashlight like this. It comes in handy. Well, that plus the measuring tape will be really good for loading.

Like, I feel like loading gear, right? Like, we could do a whole thing with that. Well, that's the idea here. Absolutely. Absolutely. Vanessa, so much ground I want to cover with you guys. We don't have unlimited time. But I do want to talk about that most recent episode of Toronto Mic'd

and how it ties into what happened at City Hall, what's going on in Toronto City Hall. But I want to know about the Def Leppard T-shirt that Vanessa is wearing right now. Vanessa, are you really a Def Leppard fan or is that meant to be ironic? I'm so glad you asked. So I will tell you how I got this shirt. Okay, first of all, everyone should know I'm a huge Def Leppard fan. I still think one of the greatest songs, greatest love songs of all time is...

Love Bites. No, have you ever needed someone so bad? I used to like cry to that song so good. But I will say the reason I got this shirt for $7.99 is because it was on the rack at Forever 21, where for sure everyone shopping there is an imposter Def Leppard fan. And no one wanted it because all the kids were probably like, what is this? You know what I'm saying? Is it velvet?

It's velvet. Okay, because I just noticed with the light reflecting off it that that's an amazing shirt. You should know that I wear an item of velvet every day. You're like George Costanza. He liked velvet, right? What? Did he? David, do you remember this? I don't remember his...

Is that my spirit animal? Fashion proclivities. Kind of. I love hair metal. I love everything about Def Leppard. I love the hair. I love the music. I love the guitar licks. I love how high their voices are. I love the cheese of Leppard. I love the hair. I love the music. I love the guitar licks. I love how high their voices are. I love the cheese of it all.

Like it's. Right. Yeah, no, great. They had a couple of monster albums back to back, right? The Mutt Langers or whatever. What was it? Hysteria was the last one. But Pyromania and Hysteria back to back were big 80s rock albums.

Big. They're staples. Hit laden. It's one of those things too where you can always tell when it's a Def Leppard song because they all kind of sound the same realistically. But like why fuck with a good thing? You know if you have the formula just keep pumping it up. That's what ACDC does.

They don't fuck with their formula. I don't want to talk smack on the pod but that's right. Talk smack? This pod is where you're about to talk smack about ACDC? No not about ACDC. I was about to be like, well, I'm not going to say, but I'm like... Most successful bands build

success on a pattern. No, he's right. Led Zeppelin always sounds like Led Zeppelin, right? You can say, oh, even the Stones, they have a sound, right? And what I was going to say, and I just want everyone to know I'm a fan, but I'm going to say is basically like country music as a whole.

All of it. All of it. All of it. There's that steel guitar thing and there's like a twang. There's a twang, steel guitar thing, chord percussion, whiskey, trucks, women. You know what it is. Well, I don't know that you can. Tears in the beers? Generalize any genre like that. Of course you can, and, you know what it is. Right. Well, I don't know that you can... Tears in the beers?

Generalize any genre like that. Of course you can, and it's horrible to generalize. No, I really apologize, actually. What happened to your comma? I'm just going to go for it right off the top. Oh my god, finally! Finally someone's noticed! Well, it's gone, and I know it was there,

and I want the true story of where the Good Night Sunrise comma went. Do you know where it is? It's on Amazon because they haven't removed it yet. Oh, it's on Amazon. Come on, David, you must,

I need the real talk either or. No, this is David. Yeah. Oh, David's got a nice mustache. David's mustache. What does that have

to do with anything? That is the comma of our band that's gone on its upper limb. It metamorphosized. hiding in your mustache? The comma was

like a little caterpillar that when we started the band cocooned itself and then finally it turned into the butterfly.

But why? No, real talk here. So you did have a comma. It was Goodnight, comma, sunrise. And say it with a comma.

How would you say our band name with a comma? Goodnight, sunrise. That's like Goodnight Moon, right? Yeah. Is say our band name with a comma? Goodnight, sunrise. And now how would you say it? That's like Goodnight Moon, right? Mm-hmm. Yeah.

Is that the name origin? No. Vanessa's, okay. I love that. But sure, that's a classic. But yeah, so now you would just probably say, like if you don't see a comma in there, you would probably change the inflection with which you.

Goodnight, sunrise. Yeah, see? Aha. So it does have kind of a different meaning. So yeah, initially, because we were so pretentious and cool, we were like, we're going to have a comma in our name because it's so artsy.

And yeah, there were times where we were like... It's like when Motley Crue does the umlaut. Exactly the same. Yeah, so we were like a way less cool punctuation addition to this. Very similar to Motley Crue in ethos. Right.

Yeah. Okay. Sure. Unnecessary punctuation. She says as she takes a bite of her peanut butter square. Okay. So when, when I need the origin,

like the band finds a superhero origin. Okay. Okay. This is a good, well, this is, and we'll get to John Tory later. David spit it out.

Well, do okay. I did see. We'll not stop talking. So you actually have not been able to get a word John Tory later. David, spit it out. Actually, me and Mike will not stop talking because you actually have not been able to get a word in. Yeah. You both sound great, by the way. You should do something together. Okay.

David, tell the story. I'm trying. Everyone's interrupting me. This is my life. Okay, well, I was trying to say and this has nothing to do with John to say it has nothing to do with john tory um it has everything to do with toronto because many many years ago when we were starting the band and then we were as every band does argues about what the band name should be and comes up with all sorts of dumb name options um we were out i think it was during canadian music week and this is like over 10

years ago now um and so we were out seeing shows just as as fans and then we just started the band and we were checking out showcases until like four or five in the morning as one does during cmw yeah and then uh and then i think well i don't know there's arguments because vanessa likes to kind of rewrite do a little revisionist history on our stories from time to time but i maintain that I ended up going to Franz, a classic, of course. Why didn't you invite me? I don't know.

I think, you know, I'm just probably... I don't know. Why do you have to make it up about you? Okay, David's at Franz. So, Franz is great. Had a great, you know, and then I'm walking home as the sun is coming up. This was... And then, so then at the time,

going to bed as the sun is coming up, and then I went onto Facebook, and I typed out goodnight, sunrise, which was just a factual statement. Right. You were saying goodnight to the sunrise. Precisely. And I didn't think too much of it aside from

basking in my own brilliance. But that's just a normal name. So then I woke up the next morning and I noticed that my bandmates had commented under this eloquent status, possible band name. And then further below

there was a series of agreeing statements and so then we decided that that was it. So then we made that our band name but then forever after it was just then, especially as things became completely

digital for bands then having punctuation in your band name became just a total pain in the butt. Because you can't put a comma in a domain name. Well, and also on CBC, we would show up as Sunrise, comma, good night. Like it was like first name, last name. Or if we're on a festival, then it's like we're two different bands. I see it now because they pump it into the system and it's a CMS.

And it's literally, yeah, it takes like Sunrise as your surname. Exactly. And a festival poster or like when Facebook events were a thing it would always look like we were two different bands. Good night. Do you remember what calendar year the comma rest in peace went to Ridley Funeral Home? The killers of the community.

Since 1921 so they've been at it a long time. We have a TikTok commemorating it. I made a TikTok about it when I took it off of my keytar because it's bedazzled on the keytar. But it was 2020? It was just last year.

Or 2020 or 2021. A recent death. But by the way, it took... I think 2021 because when we were finally... That's 10 years after you started Good Midsummer Night's. Yeah. Oh my God, you did hear's. I did a lot of research because I want to ask you about the big deal.

What's the deal with the big deal? Oh my god. Silence. Yes. You can go ahead. It was the band where me and David met and basically we met in this band. How it started is

I walked up to these guys when I was super drunk at a bar and I was like, oh my god, you'd be so much better with a female singer. And I totally forgot about it. And then the next day they were like, do you want to come jam with us? And I was like, what does jamming mean? Ah, anyways, then I ended up in that band because they were like, we're brothers. We don't want to sing. Now we need a drummer. Then we went on Craigslist and we found David because Craigslist was a thing. David ended up in the band. We were in that band for a year. The band broke up because they kicked David out of it because they didn't think he was a good drummer. And then I felt super bad. He couldn't have gluten.

They said, that's no fun for pizza night. I think I was, I don't think I was gluten free. He wasn't gluten free yet. Was gluten free because you're celiac or is it a health,

like something else? Is it private? You can tell me if it's private. I don't really care. You should eat a piece of bread and then show them your stomach. Give me that lasagna. Give me that lasagna.

What would happen if you had a slice of this palm of pasta lasagna? Well, I mean, it's hard to predict. Would you be lasagna. What would happen if you had a slice of this palm of pasta lasagna? Well, I mean, it's hard to predict. Would you be nauseous? What would happen?

You'd be sick? I mean, I'd probably, like, maybe, like, in an hour or two, I would have some,

like, stomach cramps, and then, and then maybe, like, over the next day, like, maybe I'll get some headaches,

and then, and maybe I'll just, and probably just get more cranky than I normally am. You don't seem cranky to me. Okay. So the big deal breaks up because they kick out David or whatever. So you two are in, you guys meet in the big deal.

Yeah. We met in the big deal. We had no idea what we were doing. We never, neither of us had been in a band before. We didn't know what was up. I played drums. Yeah. And I just sang.

And I was like, but because these brothers were kind of like, you know what? You guys like we're cool with you writing the songs and like whatever. We learned everything. We wrote the songs together. We booked. I did all the show booking. We learned everything in that band. I had also played guitar casually for a long time and had tried to write songs. So this was an opportunity to actually collaborate and then try to really write songs. So yeah, we ended up building all of these skills and doing all of this stuff together and becoming friends. And then when, yeah, so when the band broke up, then after getting over that crushing. It was crushing, honestly.

It was pretty rough Honestly, it was. Yeah, I mean, it was pretty rough, but whatever. We still, we made it through that and decided that we wanted to still be creative together and try making a band. So like it's a real band. It wasn't just like YouTube plus some, you know, some musical performers that would join you on stage. No, no.

Good Night Sunrise. Like the name, it's a real Like, who's in this band? Wait, sorry. Like, you mean to this day? Or are we just... No, like at the beginning. At any point over the last decade plus, have you been in a real band?

Let me tell you. That's not what I'm saying. That is a question we ask ourselves every day. Every day. When we started the band, actually, it was a full band. It was us. That's what I mean.

It was Chowder, who was the bassist from Glue Leg. Somehow we got hooked up with him. Hey, I like Glue Leg. Sure. Yeah, he was great. He was awesome. Chowder. It's Chowder.

Exactly. Yeah, Chowder. We had a drummer. We had an initial drummer for a couple shows, but then... But then he was always late. No, you're thinking of me. Who was the drummer? The original? Yeah, Quincy. Who was the drummer? The original?

Yeah, Quincy. It was his name. We still see him around. Yeah, we knew him. So we got started in the whole Rancho scene. The Rancho Relaxo scene, R.I.P. And so he was in another band and we just had become friends. He was? I can't remember what the name

of the band was, but that's how we met him. But he was only there for a bit. We played a couple shows and we were like this is awesome we want to really keep doing this more and more and then he got overwhelmed and was like oh I actually don't but then we found our real drummer off of you guessed it Craigslist

that's true actually and he was our drummer for like 5 years and name check him Paul Weaver so there's 4 of you you're a happening thing And he was our drummer for like five years. And name check him. Paul Weaver. Paul Weaver. Okay. So there's four of you. You're a happening thing. You know, lots going on.

Oh, by the way, I did load up some jams, but I don't have any sense of the chronological order. Oh my God, what are you going to play? No, you have to ask our permission first. Do I? Can I? Okay. Whatever.

Am I? Can I? Okay. Well, I want consensus here. Could I play a little bit of, uh, from the video, uh, deal with it? Why?

Why? I don't have to. It's your music. Like, I'm not going to do it if it makes you uncomfortable. you can't know. It's like there, it's public domain.

It's just, I'm wondering why. Well, I would play a little bit. Maybe to show the progression. The listeners can hear a little bit. Sure. Because he's interviewing us about the history of our band,

I think is the why. Like, it's not like I'm playing Def Leppard, right? What do you mean why? Are you Vanessa from Goodnight Sunrise? Yes or no? Okay, so I'll put it down low then. So I don't want to make you uncomfortable or whatever

because this is literally ripped from the video here, which I think you're hosting on your official YouTube channel. I mean, I can explain Vanessa's reaction. Okay, let's hear a bit of it. Then we'll talk about it. Oh, now you're getting into it. Oh my God. Oh my God. go and run a game I'll hang that noose around your neck just like an accolade deal with it

oh my god okay it's coming down it's coming down talk to me about firstly I want to know why you have this reaction and then talk to me about this jam

like do you want to go like I just keep thinking of that line I am a calculator and I I think I think this is

the reaction I would sum up is that Vanessa is a lot more line, I am a calculator, and I think this is... The reaction I would sum up is that Vanessa is a lot more easily embarrassed by our previous work compared to our more recent work. It's not embarrassed. Look at your face. We're all going to start somewhere. Look at your face right now. Yeah, it's not embarrassed.

It's, it's, it's like, first of all, it's always cringey to listen to yourself sing. Okay, so like, always no matter what. True, yeah, even our current stuff. Even our current stuff. it's like, first of all, it's always cringy to listen to yourself sing. Okay. So like always, no matter what. True. Yeah. Even our current stuff. Even our current stuff.

I'm like, if someone's like, play it right now. I'm like, I don't want to like watch you listening to me sing. Like, you know what I mean? Like right now. But to listen to the past, I mean, I hope I can say we've come so far. Like I can, all I hear because I'm working with a vocal coach right now. All I can hear are all my like horrible vocal habits. Like I'm like, oh, like why do I have an accent? What accent is that?

Well, you know, there are like this professional broadcasters who can't listen back to themselves on tape. Like I work with a couple of these guys. Like they can't hear themselves back. And I'm like, what? Like you expect everybody to listen to this stuff, but you can't listen yourself. Like, but this is you a decade ago.

This is from our second album, which we, I guess, recorded in like 2015, 2016. Yeah, eight years ago or so. That's a long time ago. That's like five vocal teachers. And we kind of produced it ourselves. So yeah, if we want to make us cringe even more, you can play a song from our first album from 2013. But I'm at peace with it because connecting it to the origins of the band, when we started out, okay, yeah, this is better.

So when we started out, we didn't know what we were doing. We had never written songs or been in a band before. And so we just have been making it up ever since. And it took us a lot of years to start to get really good and confident. I guess also, too, like I wonder what your thoughts are on this. We've seen, like I wouldn't do this, but I've seen. Wait, here, let the drop go. Remember now.

This is the song that got us chosen to open for Bon Jovi. It was this song. So this has a soft place in our heart. It does. Okay, let's give it a moment here. You can sing along if you want. This is a good song. That's what I've been trying to tell you.

But we were in a huge fight when we recorded this. Not when we recorded it. Well, probably at all points of the process. Well, let's hear it. I know some time has elapsed here. So here we are. I guess this is what? Is this 2018?

2018. Okay. What's that story about the fighting? There's some in-band fighting going on here. And then I need to know how this gets you to open for Bon Jovi at the Air Canada Centre. I need that whole thing. Yeah. First of all,

we're usually in a fight. So this isn't news and I don't even know what we were in a fight about. You too? Yeah. We're always in a fight. Yeah. We were kind of in a fight on the way over here. Yeah. We were were kind of in a fight on the way over here. Yeah, we were. We got in a fight on the way over here. But like a loving fight? Well, I thought he was mad at me and he wouldn't say no.

And then he was like, sometimes I'm mad, but not at you. And then I'm like, well, then why can't you just say no when I ask you? Like, that seems like a pretty basic thing to do. But he's like, no, it's more complicated, right? It's always more complicated. La, la, la, la, la. Anyway, so I think we were. But I actually think when we recorded this we were breaking up. Didn't we break up

right before this? Yeah, it was connected. We were dating and then we broke up and I think it was right around this song. Wait, wait, wait. When has this become romantic, this partnership? Like

what year was it? Oh my God, if you don't remember. It's not the big deal. It's like halfway through Good Night Sunrise. Yeah, like we had started Good Night Sunrise and then had become best friends and then like years

into it, we're like, oh, well maybe. I feel 2014 because we broke up 2018, didn't we? Yeah, that checks it. So we dated for four years. Didn't work out. But you broke up around the time of recording this song. I mean, this song did come near

the end of our relationship, I think. And I think the lyrics... Yeah, I think you were just kind of playing around at the piano. We were dating when I wrote the lyrics, but we were in some other fight. Yeah, that's, well, okay. So we wrote. I actually dig your dynamic.

Like you two need a podcast. That's what I'm saying here. Please continue. That's going to start a new fight because we're going to be like, because then Vanessa's going to be like, see, let's do it. And then I'm going to be like, I don't have enough time. Okay. Anyway, so the point is, so fine. to be like, I don't have enough time. Okay. Anyway, so the point is,

so fine. So we write the thing. But I do think we could do a good job. Okay. Who cares? We want, okay. It doesn't matter. Who cares about anything?

Nothing matters. I say that all the time. True. Technically. Because nothing matters. Nothing matters. All this bullshit. We're going to talk about

this great music and this bullshit and Bon Jovi and Air Canada Center and John Tory and the City Hall staffer who now works at MLSE and none of it matters. None of it matters. We're all specks on the planet. It's an accident that we're even alive and then we're all going to die. I totally agree. And these unidentified

flying objects and nobody will tell me what they were. You know this? They're shooting. Somebody I saw in Collingwood actually then on the Collingwood group thing was talking about like a UFO over Georgian Bay and there's like 50 comments and some of them

I don't know about that one but over in the Yukon which is like there's one that was just shot down over the Yukon Was there a person in it? No. Oh okay good. That would be a whole different thing but like a cylinder and they're like I think maybe they're looking for it or whatever but like I once and there's been others shot down. America shot one down

recently. I would just like to know what these are. Do you have a theory? These are not balloons. I don't think they're from another planet but I still would like to know what they are. Do you have any theories? No.

This is the first I'm even hearing about it. You got to listen to CBC News. This is a big thing going on here. I can't have to. No, this is the first time I'm even hearing about it. You got to listen to CBC News. Come on. This is a big thing going on here. Okay. I can't listen to CBC News. Yeah. Okay.

Okay. So find the song. Remember now. Okay. So we do the song whenever there's a bunch of fights. Who cares? The song gets recorded. Who cares about the song?

There's unidentified flying objects being shot down. Okay. Tell me about the song. I would say it's when we release that song, it is like for sure one of the best songs you've ever written it's produced really well by this guy named derrick hoffman who's awesome he did such a good job and it was like a new step for us fine cool who cares meanwhile in the background david has secretly applied for us to open for bon jovi because bon Jovi being the cute little Italian mensch that he is on his tour always gets a local

band to open for him to give them the break that he got when he was younger. How cute. This is a Q107 contest? Yes. David doesn't tell me about it really. Okay, that's a good move I think. This is a surprise. We're opening for Bon Jovi. I'm sneaky because I know her excitement levels

are, as you can tell, they swing wildly. And then also I also have learned that if I don't want her to prematurely be too excited, I gotta be careful when I tell her. He gets you.

So since 2018, you haven't been romantic? Ew, no. We're like fully. What's that ew? Yeah, kind of. Like we're like, we've moved. You know, when you're like, we are like fully in sibling territory.

Like full. Okay, but you were lovers. No? That's so gross. That's not personal. No, but that's a long time. It's fine. It's true.

But that is so in the past. Like, you know, like your head's like. David, what do you think of that reaction though? She's gagging, thinking of being romantic with you. It's pretty hilarious. David, wouldn't you gag? Valentine's Day is tomorrow. Well, I didn't gag.

I keep trying to get him to celebrate Valentine's Day with me. Do you have other people that you're with right now? No. You're both single. Well, yes, we are both single. But you have no interest in each other romantically. Who? Sorry, I don't. interest in each other romantically. Ew. Sorry, I don't...

But it wasn't always you. No. No, but we, like, are... The whole point is that we argue way too much to have a functional relationship, but we argue enough to have a functional band. I mean, you think it's gross when you think about us making out. Okay, well I mean, I'm not going to get all roped into a

little gotcha interview here. Now I have my lead, okay? Oh my god. When you have an ex, though, right? I think it's actually quite normal to look, like, I actually look back on some of my exes and I'm like, ew.

Typically with an ex, you break up and then, ew, like not, but you don't, you don't typically have an ex, you break up and then you go on with your life. You don't have this partnership you guys have. No, it's for sure not. And we made a very conscious decision to figure out how to make it work. Largely. And I mean,

for the kids, it's, it is crazy. Like, I mean, for sure, like all of our friends think that, have always thought we are crazy for doing it.

But I think it has paid off where we have made it work and like really, we're very important in each other's lives. Oh my God, cute. Well, whatever. But we're not, but we are not, don't like rely on each other romantically. We actually lived together for two years during the pandemic. That's true. That is... Which is crazy. We never lived together as a couple. No. That would have not

gone well. No. And yeah. I find you guys fascinating. So why... Wait, let's get to it. But before, are you a couple when you're on stage at the Air Canada Center? No. So this was like a year... Yeah, I think we were

we broke up in 2017 we had broken up and then i think and like we had so our drummer paul because it for a long time like we had been between bassists for a number of years and then so it was down there was a a few years where it was like functionally just a three piece and then we would hire a bassist so right then we told paul that we were breaking up but we were like don't worry we're gonna keep the band going and we thought he was going to be so upset and then he was like okay no problem and then it turned out that a year later

he started to have other life priorities so then we wanted to push the band further and then he was like I just can't I don't think I can do that anymore so then he so then he left and then we were like, well, now we're really fucked because now we don't have a whole rhythm section.

Now we got to start hiring people. But then when we got the Bon Jovi thing. Wait, let me tell them, let me tell them how we get it though. Oh yeah. Oh yeah. So listen to what happens. No, but then, but your point is good too. But I just want to say, because this is the chronology is where we've just played at CM cmw and we've just played our biggest show to date which is opening for matt and kim at the

phoenix and we're like riding a high we're like this is so fucking awesome whatever we get up this the next morning i slept over on david's couch don't worry audience okay we go goodness we go to get we go to get our coffee the next morning and we're in the coffee shop we're in what's it called almond butterfly almond butterfly one of the top gluten-free bakeries the next morning and we're in the coffee shop. We're in what's it called? Almond Butterfly. We're at Almond Butterfly. One of the top gluten-free bakeries in the city. And we're there. Maybe that's who we should get to sponsor when we start our podcast. Oh my God, we should.

Yes, Almond Butterfly. Okay, but then listen. The killers of the community don't kill, but not. Okay, never mind. Who cares? Okay, so we're there. We're standing there. It's eight in the morning.

People are getting ready for work. And David's like, fucking David never has his ringer on his phone okay you need to know this about him he never picks up his fucking phone so he's we're in line and he's like i have a voicemail one second he's like oh my god and i'm like what he's like it's it's q107 they're saying we're we're one of the top three finalists for bon jovi i lose my mind i'm like screaming but at this point you don't know that he entered you right well he had like kind of mentioned it at some point. I told you, yeah, there was like, there was an initial call that was like, you've made sort of the finals.

But then, yeah. Wow. Anyway, so we're freaking out and losing our mind. I'm like, David, I'm like, why the fuck was your ringer not on? I'm like, we need to call him back right now. And he's like, oh my God, relax. So we call them back and we leave this message and we're like, we just want you to know we're so excited.

Like, we hope it's us. Fine. Fine. Okay. That's the end of excited. Like we hope it's us. Fine. Fine. Okay. That's the end of that. We leave, we get chosen. And then the best part is we get to call our drummer,

Paul, who's left the band like two weeks ago. And we're like, do you have time for, because we were opening in three days. They were like, you're opening for Bon Jovi in three days. You're doing this on May 12,

2018. Yeah. That was mother's day. And we're like, so we just started 2018. That was Mother's Day. When we found out that they actually picked us, then we just went into a complete panic and we couldn't think. We were like, we have no idea how to actually pull this off. How do we play an arena?

We went into a panic. We hadn't played with Paul for a long time. We had been playing with one session player for a few shows. So we had played with one guy who had played the Phoenix show with us, but then we ended up talking to Paul. And then he called me and we were pranking him. I was like, what are you doing Saturday? Well, I guess, yeah, obviously it should be. Well, that would be a good prank, actually.

Yeah, I would think so, too. Do you remember who left the voicemail from Q107? Like, was it one of their on air jocks no was it like an administrative person I think it was like a production manager but we ended up going in John Derringer left us a voicemail

no no he was not involved in the story you were going to say thank goodness well why is that T he wouldn't yell at you. You're talent. That's different.

Okay. In light of recent events, there's been some news. She doesn't know any news. Yeah, I don't know. How do you know about the John Tory thing? Well, of course.

Okay, because the Derringer thing was just as big, I think. It was. Well, in certain, you know. Yeah. We'll educate her later. That he was a total jerk in the workplace.

Yeah, they parted ways because a number of women came forward to say that he was verbally abusive and an asshat. I would love to act surprised. Have you ever met John Derringer? No, I'm just like, in general, I feel like this is a theme that keeps popping up. Men behaving badly? Yes. That's my reaction. Some of them said they're

ugh or uh. I'm just like, uh. Yeah, like, I mean. Over it. Well, tell me about this night, May 12. This is Mother's Day in 2018. You guys are playing the Air Canada Center opening for Bon Jovi. That's fucking wild.

Our mothers were in the audience. Our mothers were there. As were our fathers. Well, mothers love Bon Jovi. Love. I'm trying to think how my mom actually feels about Bon Jovi. Your mom was like, the sound of the ADT isn't very good.

That was the best part. See, I don't like Bon Jovi, but I liked them in 1987. I know. In 87, I had Slippery When Wet on cassette. And. In 87, I had Slippery When Wet on cassette. And I was actually, I loved Slippery When Wet on cassette. But for some reason, something between 87 when I loved them in like, I don't know, Bad Medicine or something around that period where I started to passionately dislike their sound and Bon Jovi.

I don't know. I'm just telling you, I don't like Bon Jovi, but I like Goodnight Sunrise. But okay. So at this time, you guys. I don't know if I can continue this interview. You guys, the comma, and Paul Weaver, you're all at the Ercanus Center. Give me a little taste of

how did that night go? How was your performance at the ACC? The first thing you should know is Bon Jovi true to form, came out before our set and gave us a pep talk like he gave us a full pep talk he said I was so stressed though because we had been waiting for like

half an hour because the production person was like okay John's ready to see you and then I'm always so stressed before a show and so then she guides us through the hallway and then she's like okay wait here then John's gonna come out and time was really ticking she's like okay wait here then John's gonna come out and time was really ticking yeah and we were it's like

it's like 45 minutes to before our set and like I always have to like think I gotta go pee before the show you know so then I'm like standing out there it's an anxiety pee yeah always and there's probably like a false one like there's one then you probably have to go again yeah yeah that's common I think you know that

so then we're standing out there waiting for for John to come out and it's like half an hour that we're standing there just getting more and more stressed and having to pee more and more and more. I was so stressed. Like I was like,

I've never been more nervous like in my life. Like I was like, like just the feeling like I'm reliving it now and it's so physically uncomfortable. You look really stressed right now. Yeah, like I was like,

oh my God, like all the things. I have a special surprise for you. John, come down. Oh my God. John Bon Jovi, everybody. Also, there's his bathroom around the corner a special surprise for you. John, come down. Oh my God. John Bon Jovi, everybody. Also, there's his bathroom around the corner, so we're okay. Also, I had made him a care package.

So I made him like this like package and there was all like, we're like a very glittery band. So there's all this glitter. And when he finally showed up, I was like, oh my God, here. And he was like, whoa. He was like, my wife's going to have a lot of questions if I show up with glitter all over. He's a handsome man, isn't he? He's so handsome. Oh God, you have no idea.

He's also such a great guy. Like he gave us his pep talk. He's like, listen guys, he was like, do you want to know why your set is only 20 minutes? And we were like, sure. And he's like, because back in the day when I got my big break and we opened for ZZ Top, our set was 30 minutes, but we were so nervous. We played the whole thing in 20 minutes. Interesting.

They didn't have a click back then. Is what I was getting from that. But you know, Bon Jovi is, Bon Jovi, the band, is a company

owned by John Bon Jovi and everyone who plays in the band is an employee that he pays a salary to. Like, that's not a band. Really?

He is like president and CEO of Bon Jovi Inc. And then he hires people to be, you know, sort of like when you guys need like a drummer or whatever. I guess we kind of are like that. Yeah.

But at least you are co-owned. We don't pay anyone a salary. That's for sure. But I mean, it is his name. Well, anyways. Okay. So when you need your drummer, because you're going to play, let's say you're going to play Sneaky D's and you need a drummer.

Does the drummer get paid? Yes. I know. So you do pay. I'm saying you pay. I'm just contradicting what you said. She looks angry at me. Also, we always need a drummer, so if you know

any drummers. We always need a drummer. But also, Phil Axe, too, came in the middle of our band handshake. We're doing our band handshake, and he comes up. Yeah, he was backstage in the little... He's Canadian, right? Yeah, he's from Mississauga or something, I think. He's from here. Yes, he is. Is he the new Richie Sambambora or am I confusing he took over yeah for Richie yeah okay Richie was like a like an OG okay yeah he was like just chill out this he was like this

yeah I was I was back back there and that he was standing there and then he he I think I asked him if he had any advice because I just was like so nervous. So I just said how nervous I was and how stressed I was and asked if he had any advice. And he just like gazes up just with his long flowing walk of hair. And he just looks up at the stage. He says, it's just another field to frolic in. Really?

Is that the words tattooed on Vanessa's arm? We should get that. That is a good life mantra. I thought he was going to look at you and say, you were born to be my baby. What is tattooed on your arm, Vanessa? It says, so she set herself free. What does that mean exactly who is this person this is just

is this a city in Russia no what Sochi is where they had the Olympics Sochi So She So

She So She the girl set herself free no no no worries as a result henceforth. Yeah, it's just something I saw written years and years ago.

And as I progressed on my path to sobriety, I was like, one day I want to. Oh, wait a minute. You just said sobriety. Okay, because there's three beers. I'm going to drink all these fucking beers. So let's talk about it. So the first thing I need to know, David, do you have any ink on you? Are you tattooed or not?

I am not. I am way too indecisive to commit. I have no ink on me. I'm waiting for a tattoo sponsor and then I'll do it. We're going to get best friend tattoos. When you guys start your podcast and you get an ink tattoo sponsor, then David will get one done maybe.

Can I ask about your sobriety? I know we have a hard stop, but we're going to cover a lot of ground here. How long have you been sober for? Four and a half years. I did a bit of homework, but we're going to cover a lot of ground here. But how long have you been sober for? Four and a half years. I did a bit of homework, but not enough, clearly, because I gave you a bunch of gluten. I was going to say, when we were talking about this, Vanessa...

She'll eat the lasagna, probably. Here's how it's going to work. So, David can't have any of this. Fine, I'll drink that beer. Give me that beer. Really? No, he's going to get sick. He's not going to get sick. It's not worth the risk. If he's gluten intolerant, he shouldn't have beer. But our band will drink this.

The rest of our band members will drink this. Are we going to lug it around? Our next show is not for like six weeks. Well, bring it to our next show. I'll bring it to your next show. Bring it to the horseshoe. Oh my God, I'll bike over Great Lakes beer to the horseshoe for the band. Yes. Yeah, I will. I don't know how the horseshoe. Oh my God, I'll bike over Great Lakes Beer to the horseshoe for the band. Yes.

Yeah, I will. I don't know how the horseshoe will feel about that. But still, the band's drink for free anyways at the horseshoe. That's an authentic laugh. Okay, that was authentic. No? Wow. Only in the movies, I guess. I'm sorry. I mean, yeah, you know, the, we're not, I mean, the band, the, yeah, craft services

at the ACC for Bon Jovi were quite impressive. Oh my God. You didn't have to pay for that. Smoothie station. But until, yeah, anyways. I realized I want to talk to you about this crazy Canadian music infrastructure. Are you a Gemini? No.

Really? Should I be? No, I'm just like so curious. I'm not a Gemini. Okay, hold on. You get one more guess if it's wrong. It's all bullshit anyways. I said nothing matters. That really doesn't matter. But you get one more guess

and then I have some questions for you. I want to ask you about somebody you worked with previously. Pisces! No. Fuck. Alright, I do want to ask you because he's an FOTM. Do you know what FOTM stands for? It means Friend of Toronto Mike. You guys are both FOTMs now.

I did not think that's what it was going to be. You're an FOTM. Another FOTM is Noah Mintz. Can I just ask you about your experience? Did you actually, I don't know, is it all digital now where you just send him stuff

and he masters it? Like, I know. Any Noah Mintz memories? If not, it's okay. Not really because we didn't really have that much interaction. He did master our first album in 2013. So I, yeah,

so I did meet him because I went in, because I've always along the way I've always been curious to learn as much as I can about the whole production process. So anytime we're working with a producer or a mixer or the mastering part, I always want to go meet the person and learn about the process. So I had gone into a lacquer channel and met him.

And then there wasn't really anything for me to do because I still don't understand how mastering works. Well, I don't know what mastering is either, except he's the master of mastering in this marketplace. Yeah, he is definitely a very well-known name. Even like Broken Social Scene and a whole bunch of stuff, obviously.

He's got the in there from Head. Do you guys remember Head? I, yes, only because I know that he was in it. You need a second age

on Head here. But here, can I ask you about this? I hope Vanessa doesn't get mad at me, but. I love this song. Oh, good.

Because I feel like I dodged a bullet there. This is probably close to my favorite song off the new album. Yeah, this is one we're very, very proud of. Feels like a mess Is anyone even listening? These days Everyone's a flame And I'm just over it All those times they told me no You said stop but I heard go I'm still here because I'm not there yet

So just look for it Wait for it. Okay, Vanessa, can you critique your singing on this song? I mean, it's definitely improved. I mean, I feel I've improved so much since then. Actually, when I recorded that song, I remember the hard parts were really hard to sing live. I was like, fuck, how am I going to sing them live?

But now it's such a breeze that I guess that's, yeah, I'm actually going to take live. I was like, fuck, how am I going to sing them live? But now it's such a breeze that I guess that's, yeah, I'm actually going to take this moment to be like, wow. You should be proud of yourself. You guys sound great. Do you think you're in Toronto Mike's basement because you're a shitty band? Do you think I have shitty bands over here? No, you have such high standards. I'm shocked

that you even returned our DMs. Well, I think I initiated the DMs. I slid think I initiated the DMs. I slid into your DM first, as I recall. It's honestly the biggest compliment. We are honored. Even though I've never seen my... I want Beef to send me that picture. Beef's listening.

We'll track down that. I wonder if it's because he starts Beef. Maybe. I feel like that... I should remember the story. That nickname probably was given to him long before the saying, starting Beef. Right. Was. Right. That's a really good point

I'm thinking late 70s for the nickname Beef How old is Lee, can you tell us? Older than us It's like our mystery He's a legend I mentioned Chum FM I mentioned Q107

I think he worked at CFNY for a a bit and uh he's been all over the place man and now he's at the rock yeah in all honesty he's been one of the oldest most like biggest supporters of ours really he really has done so much for us a lot of it just being in the form of genuine encouragement he's really really, he's really been awesome. And he's a sweetheart. And I, not all FOTMs are sweethearts, but he is definitely a sweetheart.

Okay. So May 2018, you open up for Bon Jovi. That's amazing. Your moms are there. It's mother's day. Paul is there. Is that the last time he played with you?

Yeah. Yeah. So that was it. That was it. After that, everything changes. It's like, you guys

are the two co-owners of Goodnight Sunrise, Kama and all, and when you need other musicians, you just hire them to pay as you go kind of deal.

And we never thought, we were always like, no, eventually we'll find like a, you know, full-time members, but once we started getting in the groove, I mean, there's a lot

of annoying things about playing with session musicians. Like it's just hard, right? Like you're switching people around. You've got to train people. Like it's kind of unstable,

but we've fallen into a good rhythm now. And it's, you know what? Honestly, the best part of it is just less people to have to agree on. Less cooks in the kitchen. Less cooks. And then me and David can barely agree.

You guys are the decision makers. Even though you might argue a lot, you usually reach a consensus fairly quickly. Cause I think you get each other. Yeah. Oh my God. That's so cute. that'll be your next tattoo david we gotta get matching like good night sunrise tattoos no thank you if you guys did that good night when you get good night when you get right i'll get the comma oh my god that's my uh my promise i love this i don't know where i'm gonna stick that comma hit the table all you want want. That's why you get the unidirectional mics here.

Oh, wow. Holy, we covered so much. Now you broke everything. Okay, now you owe me. Okay. So where do we go from there? That's 2018. We're not far now.

Maybe you guys walk me through. At some point, we're going to hit a pandemic. So much has happened. 2018, we're like little babies. Over the subsequent couple years we just started doing like a couple singles at a time and because yeah we had recorded an uh an album our second album in 2016 and then we were just kind of experimenting working with different people working with different session players writing different kinds of songs like writing stuff more poppy some stuff more alternative and just like playing around and learning more about it

and slowly getting better. We were like teenagers trying to find our identities and kind of like copying everyone else, trying to find ourselves. Like I did a lot, like when I say copy, but being inspired by for sure.

Being inspired, but I will say for sure, I was definitely trying too hard and I think this is a pattern I've had since I was a teenager. Like, not anymore, but of like being like, I want to like wear the same clothes other people are wearing. Like, I think I was doing that with me. Yeah, everyone wants to fit in. Exactly.

And that was such a learning lesson because with this new album, we were like, fuck that. We're finally making what we want. But that's why I'm kind of embarrassed maybe about some of the old stuff. Like, especially don't want it to end. But it's a journey. Like you can't get here from there without walking through that path. Like that's how you got here. Like you should own it.

You're right. I also feel like our, our albums, like our album, both albums, even our first one where you like listen to it and I'm like, oh man, my voice sounds like shit.

But I don't feel like with our second album or even with the singles that we played around with after like they're a different sound and they're very alternative and like we were looking for specific sounds but I don't feel like we did anything that wasn't genuine like I think all of our songs that we've written still felt authentic and meaningful

and true to ourselves but I think in terms of the production we were definitely chasing what is popular on the radio. Cause we wanted to get on the radio. So I think it's fair too. I think, I think you're right, but I think it's that fine line that everyone talks about of like,

when are you being inspired by? And when do you feel like you're inauthentically copying? And I think you're right. Actually, I think I'm giving myself not enough credit. I think I was copying more than I was actually like, no, I really love Florence and the Machine right now. And like, I want those sounds.

Or like, I really want those little rave noises, not because I'm copying, but because I like them. So you're right. And I will never say those two words again. I recorded that. I recorded that. You can make that your ringtone. Although his ringtone never rings.

Exactly. It's true. I always have it on silent. So annoying. I had to call him like four times to be like, where are you? And I made it. What is this?

Yeah. You don't know. Say again. They're all jumbled up. I normally go in chronological order, but I love it. I know what this is. I don't even know.

Can Vanessa name this tune? No. And there's going to be a good reason for it. That's not Vanessa's voice. Is this the other fucking Goodnight Sunrise? How did you find this? Okay, so talk to me about this. I had never played.

I had these all loaded up. How did you know what it was? Because he's probably Googled himself. No. This is the biggest fucking pain in our ass. loaded up. How did you know what it was? Well, because I Googled himself. It was. No, it was. Yeah, it was. This is the biggest fucking pain in our ass. OK, well, Tom, tell me what's going on here.

In terms of social media handles. Oh, sure. A little bit. So this is another band. Nothing to do with you guys. This is a band. Called Goodnight Sunrise. Where are they from?

They're from the States. Like middle America. Montana. Montana. Montana. Let me hear a bit of them. Hold on. Make sure they're not

better than you. Hold on. That was pretty good. I'm into it. Yeah, they were like really behind the emails, guys. Who had the name first? Well, they did.

I think that was another reason why we kept the comma in because we were like, okay, that makes us distinct from this other band. Well, why did we pick the same band name as someone else? So... Did we not know? No, that makes us distinct from this other band. But why did we pick the same band name as someone else?

Did we not know? No, I think we knew, but I think also this was very early. This was like MySpace times. Just after MySpace times. And I think it was definitely before Spotify. So it was before it really, really mattered. And before you could know what

every single band in the world's band name was. Before every single person could very easily just get their music up online. Whoa, this makes us sound like we're 2,000 years old. Well, you know. Okay, so 2013, when you name yourselves at that time. These guys aren't on TikTok. You don't know that there's a band in America named Goodnight Sunrise. I had looked at, when when we decided when we all finally

agreed that we liked the name yeah I think I looked up and I saw that this band had existed but they were not very active

and it was it seemed like actually they were they had broken up or they were on hiatus so then I thought okay we're cool there's not a big conflict

because they are not very active and then they ended up changing their name to The Good Night how crazy is that out of nowhere yeah conflict because they are not very active. And then they ended up changing their name to The Good Night. How crazy is that? Out of nowhere. Yeah, so I was like,

oh, great. Maybe they changed their name because of this Toronto fan. I have a t-shirt of theirs. Our drummer Paul bought me a The Good Night t-shirt. We got in touch with them even, remember? I can't remember for what reason.

We were like, we should play a show together. And they were like, who are you? Also, we're breaking up. We don't care. Wow. Okay, that's another ripple to the story. But they opened an Instagram. I think it was just an Instagram. Someone has

the fucking Goodnight Sunrise Instagram account and we cannot get it. It's inactive. There's no followers. And you've DM'd it and said, hey. We've DM'd it. We've contacted Instagram. We've done it all. Oh, that's a meta company, right?

Okay. Like someone get us Good Night Sunrise. Yeah. I used to have a connection at Twitter, but I don't have a connection at meta. And even my connection at Twitter got musked. So I'm kind of a. That's another story for another day fuck this goodnight sunrise

but I will this one I know is you so that one there yeah okay whatever they're American's goodnight sunrise but this is the real motherfucking deal right here oh yeah Yeah. One girl to wake you up. One girl to help you sleep One girl to hold you captive One girl to set you free

You know I'm just trying to get by Everybody's on their own supply. Doesn't matter what you call it. If it takes you high, yeah. We're all just living a lie. Nobody gonna ask you why. There you go. Not a bad, not a bad song. I'm so fucking digging it.

Way better than that shitty American Goodnight Sunrise. We have to shout out Brian Monkars for that. Because one of the, and Lee told us that Lee actually beefed good old beefy beef. He's the one

who introduced us to the producer of this album Brian Moncarz and beef said I can't do that seriously. He was like you guys need

and we've always known this we need someone to help us translate our live show because our live show was so high so high in energy he was like

this guy is going to help you bring that live energy to your recording and fuck he did. This album finally I think is our first. This has been our for 10 years we've been chasing that energy. So did you, is this like your pandemic album? Is this the, okay. And bookended by this

song because we recorded this with Brian and March 2020. Yeah we were in the studio finishing it up early march 2020 and then the pandemic hit and then he mixed it like after the the first lockdown and then i was just just listening here like some of the like those uh those gang vocals yeah we did them remotely, and then we just tracked a bunch of them in our living room and sent them to him to mix in. Well, good production job.

Who is the bassist on this jam? The bassist on this jam is an up-and-coming young whippersnapper named Duncan Kutz of Our Lady Peace. Well, yeah, and the drummer too. And the drummer is Jason Pierce, also of Our Lady Peace. Well, it's gonna... Yeah, and the drummer... And the drummer is Jason Pierce, also of Our Lady Peace. Our Lady Peace are hoping one day they'll get some radio play. They're crossing their fingers

and hoping radio discovers them. Radio is dead, so give it up, boys. Alright, that's where we're going next. So that's One Pill. Yeah. And what's the name of that? Is that your most recent album? Yes. One Pill is track one on our album Against All Odds.

So Against All Odds came out in October of last year. Okay. And we put One Pill out as the lead single in like February of 22. Did you cover Take a Look at Me Now? Not yet. But because that's a good Phil Collins song. It's a jam. Yeah. Did you cover Take a Look at Me Now? Not yet. Because that's a good Phil Collins song. Oh, sure. It's a jam.

Yeah. You could add your little style to it. We've never thought about it, but there's a way we could rock that up. We could probably put that in a song. That song's begging for a rock spin. It's just sitting there waiting for you. And you did name your album Against All Odds. We did. We did.

We did. Vanessa, what are your thoughts on this? Just to see if we could start beef with Phil. Well, I just was like, if we're talking about Phil Collins, I'm like, that is not the song I would cover. Like I would obviously... I know, but you did name your album Against All Odds.

But what song by Phil Collins would you cover? Oh, think twice. It's just another day for... I did a lip sync to that in grade two Grade two? I distinctly remember this That was a socially conscious song And it's such a long song

There's a lot of verses, the story goes on and on But I remember that Right, okay She walks out to the So you always knew you were destined to be a performer I guess. Grade two. What was I doing?

These OLP guys, that's amazing, you know? Again, thanks to Brian. Yeah, Brian has done a... Brian Bonkars. Yeah, he's done a bunch of work with OLP. Like, he mixed a bunch of their recent stuff. And so he had become friends with Duncan and Jason. And so to start...

Yeah, he would start so yeah because we had been working with a few session players for our previous tours and we had like played around with different different players for previous recordings but then we were chatting with him and we were strategizing how to get this like rock sound that we were shooting for

he suggested that big sound like okay so now I want to talk about radio and I know you said radio I really want to get into this. We're really trying to keep it positive today here, Mike. But I'm here. This is the home of the real talk. There's no room for positivity. David was like, we've got to be positive.

Let's not talk about radio or the industry. I really do want the truth. Like you said, does radio matter? Like, are you still chasing those radio plays? Everything matters and nothing matters. Everyone thinks they got all the answers and all the answers are wrong. And then, you know, all you can do is just keep trying.

Because you're not asking the right questions. What are those balloons? Oh my fucking God. David's like worked up. I don't even have to say anything. Like, are you okay? What was the question again? So let me be specific.

There is a alt rock station in town called Indie 88. Yeah, I listen to it often. Indie 88 should be playing one pill on the reg. You would refer to yourselves as a Toronto... Vanessa's muzzling herself. You're a Toronto band. We do live here and have lived here our whole lives.

What neighborhoods are you guys coming from? Oh my god. I don't need an address or anything. I'm an uptown young girl. She's an uptown girl. And she's living in a downtown world. In a South Etobicoke. I live in uptown Toronto.

I'm like downtown-y. So you're down. How far down are you? I just moved recently to, I don't even know what the neighborhood's called. I think you live near Cabbage Town. Yeah, ish. We don't want to tell people where you live, though.

No, that's very generic. No one's asking for like street names. Yeah, I don't know. We're getting close. No, that's very generic. No one's asking for street names. Yeah, I don't know. We're getting close. No. Neighborhoods? Vanessa's parents. She always be paranoid.

I used to live in Little Italy. Did you think someone was going to come and kidnap you? Yeah, I mean, that's a general. Have you been watching the news? We had someone break in upstairs, and I didn't even flinch. I'm like, well, help yourself. I don't want to get into why you probably didn't flinch, Mike,

but the point is we are different people. Yeah, they're being respectful of the interview. They're going to let us finish the interview before they kidnap us.

They're just waiting, waiting. They're going for the lasagna. They're like, if I find out that lasagna is gone, I can't believe I was trying to give lasagna

to a guy who can't have gluten in his asshole and then I can't be here to a personal recovery. Oh my goodness gracious. I'm sure that the,'ll eat it. I'll probably eat it. I'll have a bite at least. A personal recovery. Oh my goodness gracious. I'm sure that the, I'm sure Palmas makes a killer lasagna. God,

they're killers of our community. Yeah, exactly. So quickly then, before I forget, then I'm going to come back to this and then I know we have the hard stuff, but do you guys smoke weed?

Eh. Are you allergic to cannabis? Not allergic. Yeah, on occasion. The only time I really like smoking weed is when we're at NAMM once a year in Anaheim. When we go to NAMM.

When you were in NAMM. I'm like, how old are you? I'll go maybe smoke weed after we're playing a show before we see another band but things can go sideways and I might need ice cream like immediately and a bed. So like peanut butter and chocolate. Yeah. Peanut butter.

Unless I have immediate access to a bed, like walk, a walk away. I'm not smoking weed. Okay. Okay. Yeah. You don't have to smoke it. There's edibles and there's, you can drink it. So those who do partake, I just want to let them know that Canna Cabana will not be undersold

on cannabis or cannabis accessories. Shout out to cannacabana.com. And real quick about your tech. You probably have a lot of tech in your home. I don't know, for recording or for everything. You probably have an 8-track player. I don't know. But what you got going on when it dies, when that tech dies, your old smartphones, whatever, don't throw it in the garbage.

This is me telling you, go to recyclemyelectronics.ca and find out where you can bring it to be safely recycled. There's a lot of chemicals and dangerous stuff in that tech, and I don't want it in the landfill. Do you understand? This is very valuable.

I have at least one small box of old crap that I have not thrown out because I want to be responsible, but I don't know how to do so. Recyclemyelectronics.ca What does he, but I don't know how to do so. Oh, you just go to the website. They have accredited places that they verified and checked with that.

They're actually going to properly. There's a lot of garbage in that tech that cannot garbage. Well, we don't want it in the garbage, but there's a, you got to safely recycle that. So thank you. EPRA and recycle my electronics.

That's the eight is where you go. So just to wrap up that radio thing here, I'm not trying to get anyone upset here, but back in the day the idea was, back in the day was you wanted your song on the radio because that would give you more fans who would buy your first of all, this is back in the day when you might have a physical

piece of media to buy or whatever and you can make money on album sales, but they might buy your album or more importantly, go to your concert and buy a t-shirt or whatnot. So is it no longer, like, how has it been for you guys

trying to get radio play? Is it frustrating? I mentioned Indie 88, but I could have also mentioned 102.1. We have two stations in this market that should be playing

Goodnight Sunrise without the karma. Let me say this tactfully. Unless, do you want to say it? No, go ahead. I'm curious now to see how you were going to pull that off. I will say this.

She's never heard you tactful. I do all of our radio talking. Okay, so since day one, I have done all of our, I do all our submissions. I get in touch with all the music directors. Which is, radio tracking is radio promotion for those in the audience who might not be familiar with the industry lingo.

I love it. Keep going. I will say there is a marked difference between let's say, let's call it 2017. Actually, this is really good because the throwback you played remember now. So let's say 2017 ish when we had remember now, which is a good track. It's fine. Like it's, it's okay. It's okay. But at that point when I was doing my radio tracking, I got so many bites. There were lots of music directors around Canada saying, hey, listen, like, we're totally following you. We're down to play your stuff.

We're kind of waiting for the one. But like, I even got a bunch of spins on Remember Now. Fast forward to 2023, where we have arguably like, well, not arguably, we have for sure our best, best, best stuff. And now it's the climate has changed so much that most of these radio stations and the connections i've made you know this most stations are owned by rogers or bell media or chorus right so now there's like it's just basically like imagine any business going from a small business to a business with a head office where

the people at the business aren't allowed to make the decision so it's very different so i like i don't want to get into the whole nitty-gritty of it corporate it's corporate and also like cookie cut do you think like because they have the same kind of stations throughout the country that they're all playing the same like you know what i think it is instead like because back in the day 102.1 back in the day when they had their music committee and stuff wanted to break new like i'm thinking of two bands particularly they're just jumping in the top of my head one is the bare naked ladies okay okay we're going way back here obviously and the other is lowest of the low okay which actually ends every episode of toronto mic'd we're gonna hear every episode wait till you hear our lowest of the low story i apologize to ron hawkins again i want your lowest of low story because lowest of

the low are the reason i got introduced to Altered by Mom. Uh-huh. And we had the same radio chat. Okay. Like, because they're pushing a new single now. And like, we're now basically talking, although you're trying to be tactful. I say tactful is for the weak of heart. Just go for the jugular here.

These local stations, although Indie88 is not owned by Chorus Rogers or Bell, they have a smaller outfit owns them, but they really shouldn't be the same cookie cutter playlist across the country. Like there should be some favoritism, if you will, for people in your own backyard that are producing music. but don't you think, there's a lot of different factors.

I think the biggest factor, honestly, is no one wants to take a risk anymore. Like, I really think that's the biggest thing is, I'm sorry, but nepotism and no one wants to take a risk. So it's like, and, and... Wait, what's the nepotism though? Okay, wait, hold on.

So it's like, I would say... Like who you know. Like knowing the right person. It's who you know. It's people doing favors for their friends. It's no one wants to... We are the entire band. We don't currently have a manager or a label or anything.

are the entire band we we don't currently have a manager or a label or anything and like so many opportunities in whatever wherever some bit someone can be exposed to a potentially new fan you only get that if you know the person who makes the call like there there is a lot of gatekeeping and also finally i will say just the supply and demand like there anyone there is so much more music available now people can produce so Like there are anyone, there is so much more music available now. People can produce so much easier. Like, you know, there's so much. So I think those three factors are like, when we wrote Against All Odds

and that was not that long ago, we were like, we're going to make an album that is ready for rock radio. By the time- And it sounded like it in my headphones. It is. I'm so like, I'm not like, whatever. I'm not, I don't want to be like,

oh my God, our album is so good. No, that's not the point. But the'm not, I don't want to be like, Oh my God, I'm so good. No, that's not the point. But the point is by the time that album was released, there was no longer a chance really of an independent band breaking on rock radio. That's just not how it works anymore. Okay.

So let me ask about other FOTMs like Mono Whales, for example, are Mono Whales an independent band? Mono Whales got their first hit in their first radio hit came out. They had a radio tracker, number one, and they're awesome. Fucking love Mono Whales their first hit in their first radio hit came out they had a radio tracker number one and they're awesome fucking love Mono Wheels great music it was in 2019 or 2020 that really

want to let you down charted it was during COVID it was during COVID that was before it was right before COVID right yeah I only bring them up because that's a modern rock band that's coming out of this market and they're up and coming kind of whatever.

And they seem to get radio play. They are awesome. And that is a rare success story. We're all talking about Mono Wheels, right? Everyone's kind of like, oh my God, but Mono Wheels did it. And good for them for talking about this. They keep saying this. They are one of the only independent

bands who's been able to do that yeah it's very homogenous and there are there is a lot of like playlists being set down set sent down from above so like vanessa hears from a lot of mds music directors who who say like this song is awesome i really would love to play it on the radio, but I can't fit it in anywhere. And then I, we also know like pre pandemic, there was tons of stations across the country who would have, even if it was just like 11 PM on a Monday night, you would still have the indie hour where they would play.

And then that's now a fraction. There's a couple of stations across the country that still do it, but like most of them. And I think like Y108, I remember there was, there was like Nick Chino was, was the announcer who would play, I think it was Sunday nights or Monday nights. And there was always the indie hour.

And then I think, and I can't remember the details, but he was like, oh, and then that, that hour didn't exist anymore. And those kinds of opportunities even just to, to have someone because and it would make a difference like so like 94.9 the rock they still do that kind of stuff and that and they create an opportunity so like when they play one of our new songs a few times a week then like someone hears it and if they dig it they shazam it and then

they follow us and then become a fan. Like it really makes a difference. And they'll be at the Horseshoe possibly. March 31st. So March 31st. That's the next like scheduled live gig for you guys. In our dear city, Toronto, that loves us so much. Our favorite place to be. Well, maybe some FOTMs listening now are going to be like, I'm going to support these guys at the Horseshoe.

Come on out if you like. And I feel it. I feel for you because you're doing it all. I root for you hard because you're independent artists who are rolling your own and doing your best. And you're just like swimming upstream. It's got to be tough. I mean, I know how corporatized radio is now. And it's like.

I think our biggest hesitation to be complaining and to get like to seem cynical about it is because it's so easy to like we don't want people to think that we like feel entitled to some sort of success or something or that we think

that we're amazing and like people are holding us back also you don't want to piss off these people because they are listening and that part we've kind of given up

like for a long time we did it but it's like no it's more what you're saying yeah it's more I think it's just like you as a person have told us that you love this

song we made and you think that it's good enough to have a shot on radio and that's kind of all we're asking from whatever opportunities and like it, for a long time it was just radio itself and then it's shifted now the importance is on streaming and getting on playlists.

And like, that's so hard to crack into. Okay. So that let's, before I get to the, uh, Ron Hawkins, you made us talk about that.

Yes. Okay. So here we are 2023, right? You, you, you work hard on your new music. You got,

Oh, LP, by the way, the original drummers, uh, an FOTM as well. Jeremy Taggart. So shout out to Jeremy Taggart

I think he's a friend of the whole country he's a bod as they say indeed indeed so here we are 2023 we just discussed the frustration trying to get on Canadian radio we don't have the nation's

music station anymore you know you can't be like Moe Berg dropping off a VHS cassette of I'm an adult now filmed at the, at the parking lot. It's queen and Spadina and getting that in high rotation across the country where people like me were literally drinking it in on the daily. So you don't have much music radio. We just talked about that frustration.

I know. Don't get stressed out. So I, I, I legit want to know like why you haven't just quit your jobs and become like like like uh i don't know like plumbers or whatever like like like what is the path like what is the goal like i know we we jokingly said nothing matters and maybe nothing matters but is it just for the art? Or do you still have grandiose dreams that this is going to make a living for you?

I mean, like... And I don't mean to sound so down, or I sound like a fucking... No, no, it's... I am really stressed, so I'm like a wop-wop. No, we ask this question of ourselves all the time

over the years. But, like, nothing brings me more joy than getting on stage with my pal, my best friend, and fucking just rocking out and singing these songs that you've made and creating those moments for people.

Like really nothing is more fun. So I think like when we get this down, which I'm feeling right now actually after this conversation, we know that what we have to do is either create, like it's like making a song together that arts and crafts of it is so fun.

Or every time we play a show, we're reminded of why we're, we're, we're doing all this admin, which is really what it is. It's admin work. So it's like, and our goal is.

You can't afford to outsource it because it's a chicken and egg thing. Well, and it's not even an afford. Again, this is a supply and demand. Like there are only so many booking agents. There are only so many, like there,

there are like five radio trackers in this country, five, five reputable ones. Like that's not enough. I had no idea. It's, it's like, so many, like there, there are like five radio trackers in this country, five, five reputable ones. Like that's not enough. I had no idea. It's, it's like, so it's like our goals are to one day not have to do that admin. But like what keeps us going is like, what makes us happier? Yeah.

Yeah. I mean, we really do talk about this all the time and like, it is easy to get down about it, but I mean, just as a recent example, and I've been trying to change my attitude about it, but a recent example, we just played a festival in Prince George, British Columbia. The Bash! Which was way up north.

Well, that's the hub, right? They say that's the geographical center of British Columbia. I think that's the hub. I think that's its claim to fame anyway. Could be. I think so. I think I heard that from a resident to fame anyway could be I think so I think I heard that from my resident friends okay

alright why would they lie to you yeah so we played so it was a very small town so we played Cold Snap Festival in Prince George

and after the show the show was amazing we had so much fun and the people in the audience had so much fun and then we had gone over to the merch table

after and then one guy came up to us and had bought a CD and then we had gone over to the merch table after and then we're and then one guy came up to us and had bought a cd and then just wanted to like say that he really liked the show and then i guess he was like a little bit nervous uh but then so we were just chatting a little bit and he said he he had said to me that he really loved our show and he found our music and our performance really uplifting and that he had had a really really difficult year the lot like the last year has been really tough like a full year and he had not really felt like he hadn't had as much fun in like a year as he had had that night

because of being at our show and so to know that we had that effect on a person and brought someone joy while also experiencing joy ourselves is ultimately the main reason why we do this. What else is life about? How much better can it get? Velvet Def Leppard shirts as well. Exactly. Exactly. You gotta be,

you gotta be comfortable. I want my body just covered in velvet. Just do it. It's so easy. Go to forever 21. Like literally track suits. You're fine. Yeah, that's true. Like I honestly velvet, like I'm going to do it. It's so easy. Go to Forever 21. Like literally, tracksuits, you're fine. Yeah,

that's true. Like I honestly, velvet, like if you do that, you should get that shirt but in velvet. Woo! I would totally do that. You know,

I just heard, we're not being robbed now. Oh my God, what's happening now? I heard my wife and kids came home but my wife is a seamstress. Like I feel like

we could go to fabric land, buy a whole shitload of fucking velvet and she could make stuff. Like I feel like we could go to fabric land buy a whole shitload of fucking velvet and she could make stuff. Like that's what she can do. Well, not her job, not seamstress.

That's her hobby. Her passionate side hobby thing is seamstressing and I think there's a future with me and velvet and I've been inspired by this Def Leppard shirt I've been staring at.

I'm telling you, once you wear velvet, once you wear velvet, you won't go back because it's like so soft. This is George Costanza. You can just pat yourself. I didn't know that once you wear velvet, you won't go back. This is George Costanza. You can just pat yourself. I didn't know that he was into velvet. He's into Gore-Tex.

That's so different. That's a completely different material. I'm trying to think of the episode with velvet. There is an episode with... I think he wants to feel it. If I reached over to Vanessa and felt it... Do you want to touch it? Don't you want that on your body? It's like you're just wearing a pet.

You just cover the walls of the studio with it. It could be everywhere. It's very comforting when you're feeling stressed to pet yourself. Oh my god. Tell me about it. No, I just saw the clock. I need the Ron Hawkins story. Oh my god. You brought this on yourself.

You really did, actually. It's a public apology to Ron Hawkins. Okay. He's a good FOTM. I'm going to make sure you listen. Here's what happens. Yeah. This is fucking forever ago.

First of all, forever ago, backtrack to high school. My friend was obsessed with Lois and the Lo, okay? Obsessed and dragged me to all of their shows. And I was like, I don't know, like whenever I find Ron Hawkins. Cool. Fast forward. This is like maybe eight years ago. We get off a train.

We've played a show in Montreal. And somehow we meet this random guy who's like i'm doing this thing for now magazine and we're getting bands to like cover songs from some of their favorite bands like and you want to do lowest of the low like so out of nowhere and i'm like that's so weird lowest of the low i actually love fucking you know damn damn the circumstance anyways cool bleed a little while bleed a little while tonight so i'm like oh my god we should Cool. However, because I'm young and innocent, I don't realize this song is not at all in my register. Like literally not at all in my key.

But by some complete sheer coincidence, Lois of Lo is playing a show at Cadillac Lounge that weekend, a week before we're set to record. I bike down to Cadillac Lounge and from the audience where I am with my friend who's obsessed with them, I'm like, you should let me on stage to sing like Bleed a Little While. And for some reason, them, I'm like, you should let me on stage to sing like bleed a little while.

And for some reason, Ron Hawkins is like, okay, like come on stage. I get up. I start in the complete wrong octave. Like I'm just in the wrong octave entirely. Like I sound fucking horrible.

Okay. And I'm like doing it. And I got off stage after, and my friend is like, I think like kind of mad too. She's like, why? Like it just was so embarrassing, but that doesn't stop us.

We're supposed to record this at like Now Magazine studio that they had. Remember? So we go the next week to record it. Sadly, I do remember. I do a horrible job. All of us did. It was, but like I really did cause I was singing it. They posted online and I mean the comments were, the comments were hateful.

They were, they were, they weren't wrong. They weren't wrong. They were accurate, the comments were hateful. They were, they were, they weren't wrong. They weren't wrong. They were accurate, but it was like a bad scene. And I feel like, I don't know if any of their,

cause they, they would get, they did like 50 of them and they got a bunch of local bands to pick a different Canadian song or something. And then I think eventually they just scrubbed all of them from the site. They're not, thankfully not on the internet, but I always, I haven't seen.

The story of now is a whole episode. Yeah, exactly. And then it's all been scrubbed the site. They're not, thankfully, not on the internet. The story of now is a whole episode. Yeah, exactly. It's all been scrubbed. Right. So maybe we're the only people that benefited from that. I hope he doesn't remember me. Well, you know, okay, so I'm not sure. Ron Hawkins, great friend of the program.

He's played a Toronto Mike listener experience, for goodness sakes, with Lawrence Nichols, who I know is listening now. Like, Lawrence doesn't miss a Toronto Mike episode. If he sees Good Night Sunrise on his smartphone, he's listening right now. I think the best way to reach Ron Hawkins

is through Lawrence. I've been doing this forever because Ron's not a smartphone guy. You have to go through Lawrence. Does he tweet? No, he Facebooks. He does not tweet. Lawrence does the tweeting. Of Lois of the Lo. Lawrence Nichols tweets Lois. Of Lois to the Lo. Should we tweet? Should we apologize?

Well, this is your opportunity. Lawrence, I can guarantee, will hear this and then hopefully he shares it and gets Ron to listen as well. But yeah, go ahead and apologize here. This is your moment right now, Vanessa. Dear Ron, your song Bleed a Little While is a beautiful masterpiece and I'm

so sorry for butchering it. On stage with you, and then again on the internet. I will do better. I now know what my register is and have been working with a vocal coach. Please give me another chance. That's a great song. I don't know about your version,

but the Bleed a Little While tonight is such a great song. It's so good. But with the multiple voices and the way they come in and staggered or whatever, whatever that musical term is, it's like row, row, row your boat. What's that called, music people? Oh, it's called Round Robin. Is that called Round Robin?

Yeah. Round Robin? I think just rounds. Round Robin is like a sporting tournament where you got to play each team once and then rounds. Ron, I apologize for messing up the terminology of your Harmony Sacks. It's a showstopper, and you ruined it that night at Cadillac Lounge.

But Love Low Slow, I always do that album as Shakespeare in My Butt, and every episode of Toronto Night closes with Rosie and Gray from Shakespeare in My Butt here. But as we... I saw Ron do some acoustic tunes a couple months ago with the El Macombo. I was there.

Well, there we go. Okay. Did you apologize to him? No, because I didn't butcher his song. Well, actually, I guess I did, but it scrubbed from the internet. Because I've had Sky Wallace over here to play the bass.

We are very good friends with Sky and with Gina and Devin. So Devin, who is working with Ron, like production work, I guess, with Lois L. Lowe. So this is, yes, okay, so this is the inter-circle. So I was there that night because FOTM Roddy Comer invited me to the Elmo for that night that you're describing. And I went to see Ron, but I also saw other acts, including Altered by Mom.

And that's why I reached out to Altered by Mom, because I heard about, they were great that night. And then for some reason having altered by mom the duo in this basement and they performed live and we had this great chat and I think I came out of that episode saying to myself

I want goodnight sunrise why? it all just that's like that was the germination of this and then I know we've been working on this

for a while Vanessa and we finally made it happen and I'm so glad you guys made the trek how's our we? This has been a real full circle. I don't know where the circle starts or ends, but I feel

like we've been through a lot in this basement. May the circle be unbroken. Wow. So deep. I just made that up. No, I didn't. On the way out here, before I hit the before, because you guys got to get out of here, right? Where are you going next that you are giving me the hard stop? Like, where are you going?

I just have a dinner reservation with a friend. Oh, it's a dinner? It's a dinner fucking dinner. Seriously? I thought you had like a big gig or something. No, but you know what? I had canceled on her twice and rescheduled and I could not. This must be some friend.

You're like, Toronto Mike, we're out at this time. Well, we've been here for an hour and a half. Well, we are wrapping up. But I was going to ask if you had any thoughts at all about the whole John Tory thing because I have one thought I wanted to share. Tell us the thought. What do we have to say? I don't know.

Is it a citizen? I'm excited to see how you're going to tie this into our interview. I don't know how to do that. But the last episode of Toronto Mike was with David Ryder about the Toronto Star investigation into the John Tory affair with a staffer, a City Hall staffer in her late 20s. And today I learned, even though John made a speech on Friday saying he was going to resign, today I learned John wants to, John Tory wants to preside over the big budget meeting on Wednesday.

And I think for him and his super mayor powers to be leading that meeting on Wednesday with a budget he won't be around for because apparently he's resigning, I think that's an absurd abuse of power and complete bullshit from John Tory.

Either get the fuck out of the way. This whole thing, can I just say my friend who I'm going for dinner with has this theory. It's not, but we are really desperate

for drummers. So John, no, I'm kidding. We would never have him in our band, but she plays drums. No, but she said she thinks the whole

affair with the staffer thing is a lie. And I was like, what? And she was like, no, but she, I was like, affair with the staffer thing is a lie. And I was like, what? And she was like, no, but I was like, why would someone make that up? And she was like, I think he's fucked up so badly that he's actually using her as a cover up. Tell your friends she's wrong. I'm all over this story. Okay, so it's true.

It's true. And then he put her in a job at Maple Leaf Sports and Entertainment, which is 37.5% owned by Rogers. at Maple Leaf Sports and Entertainment, which is 37.5% owned by Rogers. Meanwhile, as mayor of Toronto, John Tory, who's very close to the Rogers family, continues to earn $100,000 a year as an advisor to the Rogers family trust. The whole thing smells,

and we're just pulling out a few threads here. It's like the Canadian radio industry, very nepotistic. Is that a word? No. Yeah, it is. Or maybe. Well, yeah, I don't know that we're qualified. We're not qualified. We have strong opinions Well, yeah, I don't know that we're qualified.

We're not qualified. We have strong opinions about everything, but I don't know that we're qualified to really comment. But I think I'll say... What? I'll say it's good that he's taken accountability for that, but I would like him to take accountability for other major issues across the city

because there's a lot of things that we really should be fixing in this city for all of its inhabitants. Oh my God, David, you're so sweet. Well, this is definitely a discretion and very inappropriate, but it would be nice if the whole city made as big a deal about all of the problems with the lack of affordable housing and challenges that people

face every day in addition to making big deals. Consider this David's official pledge for mayor. And that! Yeah, wow. Bombshell! Good night, Sam. A real band runs for mayor. Good night, Sam. Area band. Runs for mayor.

Oh my God, our whole band? Could we run for mayor as a band? Because Andrew Cash is a politician. There's a lot of examples. But as a band. Like the band. I'd love to figure that this had a charter. If you guys could tag team it.

I don't know. Now that we got rid of the comma, I think if we still had the comma, they'd be like, no. I think that's against city council rules. Probably, you know, the punctuation, they just wouldn't be able to probably their internal digital

systems just would crash. And that brings us to the end of our 1,203rd show. You can follow me on Twitter. I'm at torontomic.com. It's beautiful, right? You guys should play this in your concert.

Come on. And the wind is cold and the smell of snow warms me today. You guys are GN... And your smile is mine and it's just like mine and it won't go away. GNSR band. Good Night Sunrise band. Unfortunately, we have a different handle on all of our different social platforms. Okay, but Twitter, Twitter, it's GNRS.

GN, Jensen fucking Rose's. GNSR, Good Night Sunrise band. we have a different handle on all of our different social platforms. Twitter, it's GNRS. GNSR, Good Night Sunrise Band. However, Twitter's the platform on which we're the least active. That's the only one I'm on. It's just people know. I don't know. What's your Instagram? Instagram, Good Night Sunrise Band. Okay, Good Night Sunrise Band. Facebook, we are also GNSR Band.

And we are on TikTok. And we're going to go viral any day now. And on that, we are good night sunrise. Our friends at Great Lakes Brewery are at Great Lakes Beer on Twitter. Palma Pasta is at Palma Pasta. Recycle My Electronics are at EPRA underscore Canada. Ridley Funeral Home are at Ridley FH and Canada Cabana are at Canada Cabana underscore. See you all. I want to get this

right as we close up here. See you tomorrow. See you Wednesday when Chris Finn and Blair Packham are my special guests. See you then