Toronto Mike'd: The Official Toronto Mike Podcast - Hannah Sung: Toronto Mike'd #1107

Episode Date: September 8, 2022

In this 1107th episode of Toronto Mike'd, Mike is joined by Hannah Sung as they discuss her years in media, from MuchMusic to Media Girlfriends. And yes, there's BTS talk as well. Toronto Mike'd is proudly brought to you by Great Lakes Brewery, Palma Pasta, Canna Cabana, StickerYou, Ridley Funeral Home and Electronic Products Recycling Association.

Welcome to episode 1107 of Toronto Mic'd. Proudly brought to you by Great Lakes Brewery, a fiercely independent craft brewery who believes in supporting communities, good times, and brewing amazing beer. Order online for free local home delivery in the GTA. StickerU.com. Create custom stickers, labels, tattoos, and decals for your home and your business. Palma Pasta.

Enjoy the taste of fresh, homemade Italian pasta and entrees from Palma Pasta in Mississauga and Oakville. Electronic Products Recycling Association. Committing to our planet's future means properly recycling our electronics of the past. Ridley Funeral Home. Pillars of the community since 1921. And Canna Cabana. The lowest prices on cannabis.

Guaranteed. Over 100 stores across the country. Learn more at cannacabana.com. Today, making her Toronto mic debut is Hannah Sung. Welcome, Hannah. Hi, thank you so much, Mike. What a pleasure it is to meet you. Yeah, same here.

Oh, you have to say that, okay okay because you know gifts are coming your way now i here let me let me get this out of the way if you don't because uh when i said like i put on twitter hannah is making her toronto mic debut and not one not two multiple people all kind of chimed in and said, I'll give credit to some specific FOTMs. Hold on. So Brian Dunn, I want to shout out Brian. He says, get the BTS loaded up. Thank you, Brian. Here's another name that'll come up later.

But Garcia Bailey, Garvia Bailey, Garcia Bailey, uh, Garvia Bailey, Garcia Bailey, Garvia Bailey. Beautiful. She says, Hannah is a joy. I'll be the judge of that Garvia, but,

uh, she loves BTS. If you're looking for a jam that will make her feel at home. So this is to relax you. Welcome. Uh, you tweeted, you were a bit nervous.

Are you, is that true? Yeah, it's totally true, So this is to relax you. Welcome. You tweeted you were a bit nervous. I did. Is that true? Yeah, it's totally true. But I appreciate the BTS welcome. Thank you so much. When did you first fall in love with BTS? 2020, in the pandemic. I was on YouTube, and I don't know what I was searching up

and what my algorithm was doing, but it served me. The VMAsmas maybe i was trying to watch the vmas the mtv vmas and and bts was on of course and yeah and i saw their performance and i was just massively hooked i was watching it over and over and over and then of course youtube just basically took over and now it's embarrassing actually um what my youtube looks like yeah once that algorithm gets a grip on you you're kind of screwed right hannah like like now It's embarrassing, actually, what my YouTube looks like. Yeah, once that algorithm gets a grip on you, you're kind of screwed, right, Hannah? Like now they're going to just, they said, oh, we found out what she digs. Here, let me hear a bit of this one.

So I went to YouTube and I searched BTS and I just decided how do I choose like what song because I don't actually like I know the popcorn song. Which would be? Is it called popcorn?

Don't they have a song called popcorn? I mean do they? They have like a million songs. I feel like there was a big hit called popcorn. Do you mean Dynamite? No, wait a minute.

I'm going to Google it. Okay. See, I'm very like, I only see what you'd see on the MTV VMAs or something. I am but a student of BTS knowledge, so you can school me. Maybe. Why do I think they have a song called Popcorn? Hold on, stand by here. At least you have a song called popcorn hold on standby here at least you have a good jam in the background maybe i mean dynamite like maybe that's exactly

what i mean why do i what the heck maybe i'm confusing my leona boyd and my bts this is uh maybe you're right maybe it is dynamite okay well they should have a song called popcorn here i'm looking here uh a lot of popcorn pops like dynamite i don't know i'm thinking of the emoji no you're the expert here and uh i apologize to bts fans throughout the world that i've messed this up you were having us think that there's some secret track and none of us i'm thinking you're right i must be thinking of Dynamite. That was their big kind of, they already had so many big hit singles, but it was kind of a, But that crossed over,

like that was a top 40 jam, right? That went to number one, I think, I'm looking at here. Yeah, okay, so you know what I'm thinking of? Butter. Oh yeah.

That's why, because butter, oh my goodness, butter. Yes, they go together. Now we know how your mind works. Is butter about popcorn? It's not.

But you could sing it every time you eat popcorn. Okay, that explains it at least how I got my signals crossed. Yeah, I'm looking at the picture. It's butter. And when I think of butter, I think of popcorn for some reason. Okay, so I went to Google, not Google, I went to YouTube and I said, what's the most viewed BTS video? And it's this one.

That's a good one I picked? Yeah, it's awesome. This was one of my gateway videos as well, except that I was really into their dance practice video for this song. Okay. What's that song called? A Boy With Love. And that's got Halsey on it?

It does. Wow. Okay. Basically, my introduction to any artist who's come out in the last 10 or 15 years has been through like their features on bts songs that's funny um the same brian dunn who told me to load up the bts so this is weird i'll yankov. We'll give him a moment and I'll explain why I'm playing Weird Al for Hannah's song. So this song is called Bob and it's like the palindrome anthem. You, my friend, are a palindrome.

Yes, I am. Thank you. And thank you. I guess we can credit your parents. You tell me, but the spelling of your name is palindrome, but some Hannahs spell it differently, and they ruin that. And I would think if you're going to be named Hannah, don't mess with the palindrome, because that's pretty cool.

Yeah, how dare those don't mess with the palindrome because that's pretty cool. How dare those Hannah's mess with it. I love having my name forwards and backwards in every way. Okay now we're going to get into your career I want to find out what you're up to now media girlfriends of course couple of notes off the top

one is like as we speak Hannah the queen is dying have you heard this? Well we all knew like i mean i heard a news update on my way over and like yeah like this might be the day like i mean i mean media outlets have been preparing for this day for like probably since the 80s or something like uh what are your thoughts like i'm just curious what does hannah sung think of all this like what are your thoughts in the final days? I mean, this is the only queen we know.

She's on our money. Yeah, she is. What are my thoughts on the queen herself or on the monarchy? Yeah, all of the above. How are you feeling about all this? Well, I guess I was kind of surprised to hear in the news update that she's 96 because she's always just been around at that elderly state and 96 is very old um she looked old like when i started looking at money in like the late 70s early 80s she looked

kind of elderly yeah i mean her earlier photos like she was a very elegant woman she's still very elegant i wish her a peaceful you know know, a peaceful exit. Yes. Shout out to Ridley Funeral Home. Do you think Ridley Funeral Home is going to get this, uh, this, uh, service? Uh, they're, they're here in New Toronto, pillars of the community. No, they probably going to do it in London. Probably not going to bring her to New Toronto. Okay. Probably. Yes. Come on, Hattie. You're supposed to laugh at my silly jokes. Come on, don't leave me hanging. I'm laughing, I'm laughing. One more note, because you work with Garvia, and we're going to talk about her later,

but she, of course, was on Jazz FM. And I saw a tweet from Jazz FM about James B. James B., he won the grand prize in the jazz category at the 2022 John Lennon Songwriting Competition. Now, I can't pretend I know if that means anything. Like they could have invented that and just like it just sounds impressive. Like I don't know what the John Lennon Songwriting Competition is, but he won for his composition Nails. So just a quick yes or no question for you before we move on to your illustrious career.

Hannah, do you think James B is famous? Well, yeah, because when you say his name, I know exactly who he is. Thank you. That's all I needed for the record. What a random question. Ongoing, no, FOTMs. Okay.

No, this is like a thread through the years. I think he's famous, but I have this argument. Some people think he's not famous. He's like a tiny niche in Toronto. And I'm of the opinion that James B is famous. I think you have to be of a certain age, which I am. And he had a moment at a certain time.

So. Which moment is that? Are you referring to the swing resurgence after swingers came out? Yeah. Would that be like around the year 2000? In the year 2000 in the year 2000 wow amazing i feel like we have all the same cultural references i saw conan o'brien do uh he he was at the winter garden elgin theater whatever that's called on young street there and in 2003 he came to toronto you might recall and i

got tickets my brother steve and I went to see his show live. And actually watching, because I don't come from your industry, like watching Conan O'Brien record his show, it was live to tape essentially. Everything that you see on TV, which I was, it was appointment viewing.

I loved Conan O'Brien's late night talk show. Like it all happened live, including like when they went to commercial break, then like the length of the commercial, like they were just kind of like off camera talking and chatting. And then they came back. So it was like, there was, looked like nothing was going to be done in post. Like it was all going to be live to tape. And that's when I started this silly little thing 10 years ago. And it was exactly 10 years ago. I had seen that and I thought, oh, I can do it that way where it all happens live. Yeah. I love it. You know, I sat down in your

studio and I saw you preparing and you gave me the quick cold notes of what was going to happen. And I was like, wow, you're doing live radio, basically. It's just the format is a podcast, but this is totally live. And also Conan O'Brien watching like a studio taping of his was my first kind of like in-person introduction to a TV environment as well. My goodness, we have so much in common. Yeah, in New York. And I think I was like 20 years old and I had never stepped foot into anything TV related before. So it was exciting.

And that sparked your passion that continues to this day to be like that. Sure. Okay. I do love him. Even if that's not true, let's just rewrite this narrative because that's perfect here. Okay. Go for it.

When did you realize that you wanted to become a journalist? Like when did you get that bug? Oh, well, I would say when I was really young, like in grade seven. So I was a total keener kind of student. And our English teacher gave us an assignment to do a newspaper. Like each student made a whole kind of newspaper. Oh, cool. Yeah.

And I got more than perfect on my assignment because I did like bonus things and stuff. Oh my God. It's so extremely nerdy, but it's because I had been already reading the newspaper for years and it was like my dream assignment at school. What paper did you read? The Toronto Star, obviously. Yeah. Yeah, for sure. Same here. By the way. So another one, I'm just going to keep a checklist over here of like commonalities but that was the paper that arrived at my home i would read every day was the toronto star yeah well we didn't get delivery i would walk down the street and put four quarters in wow and uh yeah and then i would get the news actually sounds pricey for uh although i think that was saturday i think it was like 25 or 50 cents right because saturday had

the tv the tv uh, whatever they called it. TV Guide or Star Week. Star Week. Oh, needed that. And it had the comics. Yes. Like it had the For Better, For Worse and all that good stuff. Garfield.

Yes. All those things. Dear Ann Landers. I basically learned how to be in the world through Ann Landers. And then I learned at an older age, I learned that Abby and Ann Landers were sisters. Yeah. Did you know this? I did. That's a mind's a mind blow right yeah no i i think they're twins and they hated each other like the gallagher brothers in oasis uh something like that do those guys really hate each other i think so i actually think i think uh i get the sense i don't know them personally i think noel really resents the way

liam treated him and i think liam Liam might be a borderline sociopath and enjoyed torturing his brother. I think there's some real issues that I think... Don't mix them up, Mike. I think Liam would forgive and forget and do something. I think Noel's the holdout because I think he's really carrying this in his heart.

Wow, you follow it like... They're my BTS, okay? Yes, okay. Okay, gotcha. Very seriously. See, that makes sense to me now. When you, like, just relate everything through BTS. Oh, yeah.

They should rename Butter, it should be called Popcorn. And I'm going to send an email. We've established that, yes. When I'm finished with you, I'm going to send an email here. And as I told you, you were impressed, and I want you to be more impressed by me. So you were impressed off the top before I press record, because you asked when this would go,

like, when does this go into the public realm and the Toronto Mike feed for all the subscribers? And I told you like literally 10 minutes after we take our photo outside. That's wild. And, uh, and we're going to like,

again, we're going to jump around and then we're going to get back to like chronological order. But, uh, like, like if you, you got a wealth of podcasting experience yourself,

like what's typical in your podcasting universe for like time between completion of recording and public consumption? Well, at minimum, a couple of months. Really? Yeah. But these are heavily produced heavily edited podcasts yeah and i you know we're kind of on the opposite ends of the spectrum with the immediacy but i love what you're doing because sometimes you'll be sitting on something for so long and overthinking it you

know like i i like i would definitely say that i tend towards a territory I want to think something through and edit it over and over. And I love the immediacy of like, just have the conversation and get it out there. You're not even the only Toronto Mike episode today, Hannah. I know. I saw that. It's like you, Mike, work very hard. So that little for the FOTM. So are you familiar with the 1236 newsletter?

Yeah. Okay. Well, you want to say more words because he's listening right now live and just say nice things about it. Do you know that because you see it on your... No, because I know this gentleman well. I saw him last Thursday at TMLXX. Shout out to Mark Weisblatt.

But what do you think of the 1236 newsletter? Oh, I think it's... Don't be nice just because he's listening. Be real. Hi, Mark. Nice to meet you. I think it's great. I subscribed quite early on.

I love that it's snappy, informative. It's got... It's saucy. It's spicy. Now it's like I'm describing like a sandwich or something. And it's no longer... It was under the umbrella of St. Joseph's Media. And that stopped last week.

So literally like today when Mark Wiseblood, he's doing a very rare evening recording. Normally we record for three hours on the first Thursday of every month. This is like clockwork. But this time, the first Thursday coincided with TMLXX. And you're like sitting there like, Mike, what's an FOTM? What's TMLXX? Hannah, you're going to have to figure it out, okay? Okay, I'm not going to just give you a glossary of terms, okay?

But TMLXX happened last Thursday, as all good FOTMs know. And therefore, we couldn't do the Mark Wiseblood three-hour deep dive because I had to get to Great Lakes Brewery. Thank you, Great Lakes Brewery, for hosting. Hannah, you're taking home with you some fresh craft beer from Great Lakes Brewery. Thank you, Great Lakes Brewery, for hosting. Hannah, you're taking home with you some fresh craft beer from Great Lakes Brewery. All right, thank you. True story.

And more, but I'll save it. Okay. Nice. So he's coming over tonight and that'll drop as well 10 minutes after he leaves. And it's also super time sensitive. But it sounds like when you're holding on to these episodes for two months,

you're not talking about, oh, the queen is dying. No. Because that queen died two months ago as far as you're concerned yes sadly i suppose i won't be doing a podcast about that um i i kind of can't imagine like the pressure of doing a daily news podcast or doing what you do mike you know like i like to think about topics that are maybe a little more evergreen than daily news. I mean, if I had to be in daily news, I think my head would explode. And I, um, I like thinking about things that, um, um, are kind of more cultural and, um, social issues that don't change every day, like according to the headlines. Deeper conversations.

So it just kind of takes a level of thoughtfulness that unfortunately takes a lot of time. Fortunately or unfortunately, you know. But I like that. I like to get really deep into a topic. Well, different strokes for different folks. And I think there's absolutely like an appetite for what you're doing. And I'm finding out there's an appetite for what I'm doing. And I love the fact that we're like

all in the same gang yeah and it's kind of beautiful right like this and this universe we're in right now and we'll get into this everybody will dive into more media girlfriends and your podcast and everything and we'll talk about what you were doing with Globe and Mail and everything we're going to get to it but like that this

universe we're now in and this pond we're swimming in Hannah it but like that this universe we're now in and this this this pond we're swimming in hannah together it like didn't exist when we were in university or whatever like this this is like a brave new frontier that we're like like technology had to kind of like you were making that newspaper in grade seven like you at the time i mean you know shout out to dave badini who's on the show next week actually but like not everybody can just start up a newspaper like but you can start up a podcast yeah absolutely like I think our age category I think maybe Mike you and I are similarly aged I'm 45 I'm older than you are you but like we're not like so different right um yeah I think it's such a weird, cool generation to be in because my parents had an extremely

different life from me and I had an extremely different life from what my children are going to live through. And I mean, it's just wild. The pace of change is totally bananas. Now I want to sing the Scorpions, Winds of Change. Did you ever hear the, I won't call it a conspiracy theory, but there is a theory out there or some, I don't know if it's ever been proven.

I doubt it has, but like that was part of like the CIA, like propaganda machine to try it. When, when the USSR was breaking up in the late eighties, that they use scorpions, wind of change, winds of change to get to the Russian people.

Have you ever heard that? I mean, I have heard that it's ringing a bell, but I really could not say back to you what you just said to me. Like, I don't know the ins and outs of that. I think, why do I think, I think that's a German band.

I'm now going on the record. Scorpions are a German band, but shout out to the Scorpions if they're listening at home here. Okay, so what's next for you? You're in grade seven. You've made your newspaper. You've got the bug now.

It's like an itch. You got to scratch that itch. So where do you go from there? I don't know, I go to Woburn High School in Scarborough, and then I go to U of T, and I went to Trinity College, because my Korean parents very much wanted me to go to a very specific school. So I did. And so I didn't go to journalism school. And so I didn't go to journalism school. Right. And I did do a zillion activities in high school and in university too.

And, you know, some of that was like newspaper related. So what did you take at U of T? Well, I got a degree. Like this is a general arts degree? Yeah, exactly. Okay, so you and I, again, this is on my checklist. We both have general arts degrees from U of T. I hope you're writing this down. I am.

Yeah, it's good. Yeah, English, women's studies history that's what is officially officially on my diploma um on my degree so yeah and then you know but i was like super raring to get out and to work um so in my fourth year my classes were all lined up in a certain way that one of the semesters I just had a lot of time. And I started interning at iWeekly. Do you remember iWeekly? Well, Kate, you know who was at iWeekly at the time you were at iWeekly? Did you just ask me if I remember iWeekly? Yeah.

You have no idea where you are, do you, Hannah? No. Not even a cursory, like, let me listen to a little Toronto mic here. I am so hurt. I listen. I listen. Do I know? Do I remember iWeekly? Mark Weisblatt was at iWeekly when you were writing your rave party reports.

Oh, my God, lol. I've done my homework. Okay, let's talk about this now. I appreciate you doing your homework. Okay, so what are these rave party reports and pictures or whatever? Tell me what this was all about. Okay, so iWeekly was a Toronto alternative weekly which I loved um they had great editorial and creative direction and they had a party pages

pick and um I was like exploring the world of nightlife and I was like I can do that so I don't even know how it started but I I was an intern for them like a regular intern who didn't just go to nightclubs but I said can I do that and they said sure we'll pay you $75 to go to a club every Friday or Saturday night you go with a photographer you talk to the people there you get a sense of the vibe of the party you can interview the DJs you can interview the party promoters and i was like this is amazing and so i did that for maybe like i don't know if i reached two years but i did it for long enough that i remember mary dickie like she said to me i i don't know how you're doing

this and it's like i love this yeah but i think everybody in the music department there and in the editorial department was like ew you have to go to these parties i was like you don't understand this is what i'd be doing anyway i love it so i weekly was sort of like a like a tour star response to now magazine essentially and now magazine just died shout out to ridley funeral home like while we're talking about our alt weeklies like uh any thoughts from you hannah on uh the sad end of uh like an institution in this city as far as i'm concerned i'm only being a couple years older than you but i had michael holland on the show and we kind of talked about this a bit the other day and then uh richard chaponsky just want to shout him out because

he's one of those uh people who you know they stopped paying but we're still you know working this is kind of the sad reality of what happened in 2022 at now magazine but what are your thoughts on the uh the late now magazine oh rip i think it's so sad for all kinds of media and consolidation of media and views and the lack of like a really viable kind of business structure like Like I get sad when I think about the big newspapers of the world just being funded by rich people. That's like how media works, you know? And yes, there are fewer barriers technologically. Like we make podcasts, et cetera,

but that's not all it is. Like just having these doodads and the technological ability to like get your message out there. Like media, news media, cultural criticism is so much more than that, you know. So anyway, I yeah, it's sad. It's also sad that people had to continue working without being paid. And I think that's a sign of like the faith that individuals had. Well, if you love what you do, it becomes like a labor of love.

Yeah, but it shouldn't. I know, of course. Labor, labor should be compensated. Yeah, there's, I mean, I'm like, I follow a lot of these cats, like Glenn and a lot of these guys on Twitter. And it sounds like there's like a, like ongoing attempts to get compensated for,

like we're talking a significant, significant chunk of time that they worked on the paper without any money you know dropping into their bank account and yeah i i did not follow that because i was on a total twitter fast this summer i don't know exactly what happened um but i that's interesting i'll have to bring you up to speed on everything you missed oh i mean mostly don't please but um yeah it i mean was there some sort of stringing along of a promise of their of compensation that would suck and yeah we should not be working for the glamour

of the industry or for the the noble cause like we need to be compensated for our work period agreed and then it's sort of watching it all kind of like it was like a like watching a car wreck in slow motion because you know we again back to wiseblood but we talked for three hours a month and you know we talked we've been talking through the years about when i got sold and then when the the whole cannabis thing and then he had trouble finding actual paper copies of like you know wiseblood couldn't find the printed copy anywhere like they said they were still printing it but it really seemed to be more of a digital effort because they couldn't find the papers where the heck are the papers anyway we kind of watch it unravel and stuff and then one by one you'll see like okay norm wilner just announced he's working for tiff and then you know one by one you'll see

the pieces fall and then now it's kind of it's all collapsed but uh yeah very sad very sad so you're at i weekly oh yeah i Oh, yeah, I was. Okay, so back to the timeline. I was interning while I was still a student. Let me see. I was doing like, I was just hustling, right? I was writing a column for the Toronto Star. I was on this radio show that I know Farah Nasser mentioned to you as like the beginnings of her career as well. Is that 1010? Yeah. Okay, tell me a bit about that only fara by the way is going it's going to be back here next week so uh that'll be cool to reconnect and find a high five for me um i love fara yeah so um back when far and i were little babies basically we

were uh on a panel on a show called generation next which I always felt like sounded like a Pepsi, like a new version of Pepsi or something, on CFRB Talk 1010. And that was, I guess, my first foray into, well, live radio for sure. But, you know, one of my first kind of experiences of working in a real media place, like iWeekly and CFRB were both happening at the same time. I was writing for the Star, but it was like email. So I wasn't in the environment of a newsroom, but I was there at CFRB. It wasn't for me, it was a little bit like anticlimactic

because I would be going in Saturday nights. And so nobody was there. It wasn't like a bustling newsroom at all. Is this 299 Queen? Where are you going here? No, no. Where are you here? Okay, we're way before that.

St. Clair and Young. Right. Like to St. Clair or something. Right. I thought, okay. I once, a humble Howard Glassman was appearing on Jim Richards' show on 1010. Love Jim Richards. Do we know what's up with Jim?

Oh, I mean. I'm looking you in the eyes, Hannah. You've had some correspondence with him? I haven't talked to him in a while but i love him because he's been he's been radio silent on uh like it's it's he's not on 10 10 but he's never like there's never been that you know tweet or that announcement or that like okay he's moving on or we wish him well in his future endeavors like they just sort of like stopped mentioning him on the air and he just stopped appearing on the air and he's decided and i like jim quite a bit i've met him i'm a fan of jim richards but he's just decided he's not going to like tell us what's going on like so i don't know what's going on i just wondered if you had any

which is his prerogative well i mean i'm not gonna twist his arm over it but yeah no i will uh drop him a line find out what find out what's going on with jim richards that's your homework and report back to us okay well you know i'm a keener your homework. And report back to us, please. Okay. Well, you know I'm a Keener student, so. Well, come back here at 7 p.m. and you can jump in on the Wise Blood episode and give us the Jim Richards update. Okay, I'll see you then. Okay, I can't promise, actually, no.

Okay, I'm just kidding. All right, so you're at, that's kind of cool that you get to be at, in the newsroom at, and at that time they had like a newsroom, like this was. Yeah, but it was like empty. It't it was saturday night and i would just go in and we would do our show it was a call-in radio show and we'd be talking about um issues that were important to young people and

then i would i don't know jump on the subway i guess and go downtown and hit a club and write it up for i weekly and um I guess I was doing this while I was at school but then also after I graduated I graduated in the year 2000. Well I don't know why I keep even mentioning that year but I love that it gets that response. It doesn't come up much on this show and it triggers that in me. Yeah no that's good that's good. Do you remember hearing that like let's say I. That's good. Do you remember hearing that? Like, let's say, I don't know, 92 or something. You're hearing that and thinking how far off it felt. I don't know. It felt like the far off future. What do you mean the year 2000? Absolutely. I was always calculating what age I would be in the year 2000. And I thought, I'm going to be 23. I'm going to

be married with a house and a career. I'm going to be a lady reporter at whatever newspaper. I'm going to be doing all this stuff. And it's like, wow wow i was so not like when you're 23 you can't get shit together like i and so it was hilarious when that year came and passed and then every milestone birthday you're like wait do i have it together now do you have it together now um because from where i'm again i only see what you what's in the public realm, but it seems like you have it together. I don't know. You seem to be doing cool shit. Thank you.

Thank you. I think that it's always a it's like a thing bobbing in the water. Like you're always trying to get there and it's a moving target. So where is there like like you're doing you are it's a balancing. Yeah, you're scratching that itch, right? Yeah, I'm trying. I'm trying i'm trying like the way that i kind of figure if you've got it together is if you like your how your day went and you like how yesterday went and you're looking forward to tomorrow like literally do you like how your

days are going if you do and you like the shape of your life you've gotten it together so i think right now basically i i do i do in um the broadest sense of the term i guess so let me ask you what does your necklace mean oh well because it says best oh well then maybe you can't see that it says best mom oh my goodness okay okay i mean the o is a pearl because i told my son i thought it was&M. I thought you were just a big fan of Marshall Mathers, to be honest with you. I mean, like. So you're a mom. Yeah, I'm a mom.

I know. That's, so how old is your, you have one or how many children do you have? I have two. How old are these children? And 11 and eight. I have an eight year old. I'm going to put that in the checklist. Yeah, do it.

I do. That's amazing. Okay. And that's, I mean, that's, that's amazing like it's a cool age yeah i'm enjoying all the ages are pretty damn cool but absolutely because at that point they're kind of independent and you know for sure cool okay so you're you're the best mom and that's definitive i'm looking it's on a necklace number one the best don't you know once it's on a necklace i feel like that's better than like i know you we're gonna get we're gonna get to all this we're just

getting to know you but like like you've won i want to get this right hold on here you've won like awards you want okay yeah right you won uh what did you win and you're an award-winning journalist uh shout out the award you won okay um well I guess the awards I'm proudest of would be, can I even name them? With Media Girlfriends, we made a podcast called Strong and Free. Strong and Free. And it's about black Canadian history.

And we won the Digital Media Award gold. We won the Canadian Online Publishing Award gold. Amazing. We won another gold. Yeah. So I don't, I mean, I'm very proud of these awards,

but I kind of am happy to get them. And then I don't really think about them. But then they go in the bio. So I can't even name them. Because now it's not just Hannah Sung is a co-founder of Media Girlfriend's podcast company. It's Hannah Sung

is an award-winning journalist and co-founder. Like you can add it there. It's like, I think that's cool. I mean, that's what the website is for. So, but I don't go around in life saying, do you know that I am?

Like I can't even. You should, you should get a necklace for that. Yeah, I should. Because you're not just the best mom. You're also an award-winning journalist. Okay. Tell my son that please. I will, I will.

Okay. So what's after, you know, you're doing something. And what are you doing for the Toronto Star? Like, what are you writing? I was writing a column about a young person's life, basically. And that was really fun because, again, as we've established, the Toronto Star was what we grew up reading. But, you know, my first real job in media was at Much Music.

And I landed that job in media was at Much Music and I landed that job in 2002 and so I was their pop culture reporter and I hosted a couple of shows including Much News and the New Music for a couple of years. Yes. Where's this coming from? Oh my god. Can you name the artist? Thank you for queuing it up. Oh my God, now you're putting me on the spot. I used to be able to. Yes. You know, I can't name the artist. You're going to shame me.

No, I mean, it's not exactly like, oh yeah, don't you know this is the Beatles? No, but if you didn't say it now, I would walk out your front door. And you'd know it. And I would instantly, this happened to me yesterday on a call. Yeah. Yeah.

There's got to be a word, maybe there's a German word for that phenomenon. Because as you know, I do these live. I don't edit. So yeah, like sometimes there's a name, I can picture the face and I can tell you their entire likeDB page, resume, or whatever. But I can't pull the name out.

No. And I wonder, oh, is this how it begins? Like early onset of dementia or something? Probably. But then the minute I stop recording, I know the name. Of course I know that name. Yeah. It's the pressure we put on our own brains, our dumb little brains.

Because you know you're live somewhere. Like you know this is not something you're doing in your basement and you can edit it later this is uh the way i like to do it so what is your studio like and then we'll get back to much music because i have much music questions oh yeah um so i don't have like a studio per se it's kind of amazing so i have a mic set up as well at my desk um with a like a focus right scarlet um Scarlett audio interface. The mic is so unidirectional that I don't need

anything. That was the idea here. You're right. It works out. I just record at home in my home office. What neck of the woods is home office? What neighborhood? I live in downtown Toronto, like Westside. Okay, cool. Cool.

All right. So this is Pig Bag. Oh my God. Yes. Wow. See, I never would have been able to get that out. Yeah, well, you know what? You don't think, except for this jam, which I only know from the new music.

Yeah. Like, I don't think they're like maybe in England and they talk more about Pig Bag or something because it's like a British instrumental band or whatever. I don't think they're, maybe in England, they talk more about Pig Bag or something, because it's like a British instrumental band or whatever. But we're not really talking about Pig Bag a lot in Toronto here. No. But this jam is like, so, okay, so, this show, by the way, you were the second last host of the new music. Was I?

Do you want to name check, who do you think was the host of the new music before you? Oh. That's not a hard one. Well, i mean george and i hosted together yeah okay so when do you arrive when do you start hosting the new music i guess when i started working there which was 2002 oh my god it sounds like so long ago when i say this this is wild okay might be right, but I think you started in 2004. I think you're probably right because you are looking at some real information. So, Strombo, you, okay. Can you name the original hosts of the new music?

Well, Jeannie Becker and John. Yeah, you got it. You got it. He used to host Toronto Rocks. Yeah, we called him JV. Roberts. Yeah, you got it. Yes, yes, we called him yeah we called him jb roberts yeah you got it and that was way back in 1979 so here's a fun fact here and then we're gonna i'm gonna give you a few gifts and then we're gonna talk a bit more about the much music so much music's where i i gotta admit that's where i discover hannah's song like that's sort of my introduction to you

is the new music and much music so So I wasn't doing anything before. So I could have been listening. I could have been listening to you and, uh, you could have been far Nasser on a 10, 10. I could have been, uh,

checking out the, uh, I weekly, I probably did. I just didn't read the byline checking out these pictures or whatever. What's going on in the, I wasn't cool enough to be part of that scene. I probably was checking that out,

but, uh, much music was, was a big, still a big deal in the early 2000s. Yeah. So here's the mind blow. Not a big mind blow.

But this, of course, Pig Bag. That was the theme I knew from, although not the original theme of the new music because they had that Rush 2112, speaking of palindromes. Okay, have you ever heard this? You cool chick in the club. This was the number one dance hit for Thunderpuss.

And I haven't heard of them either, but Thunderpuss covered the Papa's Got a Brand New Pig Bag. What year was this? Oh, shit. I don't know. But it was fairly recent. Like, I don't know. Maybe it was 20 years ago, actually. I have no idea.

This song is a bit aggro for me. It, like, makes me scared. I will bring it down then. What was it like at Much Music? Like, what was the experience like? And please remind us of the era because there's, like, the Moses era and then Moses is kind of pushed out

and then at some point, you know, Chum City or whatever sells it to Rogers. Rogers? Bell. Bell. Can you please remind us who the heck's owning Much Music at this time? Okay, so it was... Bell. Bell. Can you please remind us who the heck's owning Much Music at this time? Okay.

So it was, it was still called Chum City when I was there. Moses was no longer part of Much Music. The person who hired me, her name is Sheila Sullivan and Neil State and David Kynes was running the shop. David Kynes is an FOTM as well, by the way. Oh, nice. Love David. Shout out to David Kynes. an FOTM as well by the way Oh nice love David Shout out to David Kynes What was the era like

It was Britney Spears Christina Aguilera I guess Backstreet Boys I guess That wasn't really my thing then It was also the era of like Indie rock whatever that means Having a huge surge And Canadian indie rock Specifically too of like indie rock whatever that means having a huge surge and canadian indie

rock specifically too but british indie rock too and um but what was your thing back then so we're talking like oh four to oh six you're hosting the new music like because now it sounds like that you know you're you're kind of like oh that wasn't my thing back then backstreet boys and in sync and all that jazz but meanwhile you're listening to bts night Hannah so yeah I know it's like what's happened to you you used to be cool no I think it's so cool to just love what you love and whatever you connect with and I'm trying to teach that to my my older child right now because he's getting a lot of music recommends from his friends and I'm like whatever like like whatever you want and um you know actually the story is that some of the songs were too mature for him and I was and he didn't want to show it to me and I

was like you got to show me your Spotify and well let me just click on these lyrics and he kind of was like no and I was like all right well then you already know if you can't share it with me that it's like not appropriate but um I'm never going to be that person who says you can't go to your friends and like you have to say my mommy won't let me listen. Like that's not what we're doing here. But you need to fall in love with something yourself and go back to your friends. Be like, this is super cool, you know. So, I mean, what was I into back then? You know, I just I just was having like this young adult reaction to a lot

of pop music so i wasn't into um a lot of the what i felt like was manufactured pop um but and that's like christina aguilera i mean yeah i don't want to be like sometimes people at work would say hannah you're such a snob and i'd be like yeah I am a snob I would just like own the fact that I was and I don't feel that way anymore like I I do feel like um I should have just been having more fun but there was just something about um stuff that felt I just I was a little bit too against the grain to like just unironically like that stuff but um but there's so much music that counts as pop music you know and I loved everything Missy Elliott was doing and Timbaland and um you know uh what else

was I into I mean I was into a lot of the I was into MIA I was into La Tigra I was into um yeah I guess like the British bands that were coming over, but interviewing them was really annoying. Any particular like band that was annoying? You want me to call out like the bands? They're okay with it. I mean, I made Erica M do the same thing. Yeah.

Well, okay. So first I'll just start with a type. I was given a type of interview to do all the time, which was the next big thing, like the hot new band, the cool new indie rock band. That was always what was assigned to me. Right. And it actually did overlap with a lot of my interests, so I get it.

But there's a type of band which is like four young white dudes who've been told that they're the shit and are you referring to like arctic monkeys and that kind of thing i don't even know if i interviewed them i think i probably did but generally there's a type of interview that i was always doing where it was like i felt like i was babysitting a box of puppies and the egos were out of control and like nothing would be a real conversation and and and again sometimes I look back and go like why couldn't you just relax and have some fun with it but um often you'd be a part of like their own ego stroking and I don't want to participate in that way so sometimes these interviews were super annoying um like and

then sometimes i look back like and like what were the issues going on like you know i'm okay so i'm gonna mention a band because you asked me to i'm ready the vines yeah so it wasn't the worst interview in terms of it was malicious or anything because there were plenty of interviews that i did that were like extremely uncomfortable it's just like the lead singer was the person that i was matched up to interview at the venue before the show was happening it was empty and he was just running around the venue like like literally running jumping up on oh he's probably on speed right right so i'm just kind of standing there not knowing what to do. And, um, basically nobody there knows what to do or is like, there's no grownup driving the bus. So situations like that,

it's kind of like, Oh, and what goes up must come down. So it's like, uh, yeah. But then when, when they crash down, you just, you don't want to be anywhere near that, that mess. Yeah. And you get your 20 minutes and then you're done and then i go back to the station and go i didn't get anything you know and um i never liked not doing a good job again why can i just let go of that so did you ever feel like maybe uh you know covering these you know like you said the next big thing these four white dudes from england at every they've been told they're the next big thing or whatever they're the next oasis or whatever they are like like maybe there's more substantial journalism out there that somebody like yourself could be uh sinking her teeth into like now you

mean yeah like like i just you know i can you know first of all i'm not no judgment here i think it's cool you did it all but uh like like you know covering those artists whereby there there are like there's substantial issues that needed to be covered and need to be covered now that you can sink your teeth into for, you know, those podcasts that you're spending a couple of months polishing and refining and everything. Like at the time, I'm just wondering,

like were those itches being scratched by your much music experience? You didn't know this was like a couch and that you'd be in psychotherapy well i love it though let's talk about i do remember writing for the website for much music.com and occasionally when i had the time to do this i'd write little essays on my thoughts and so I really enjoyed having the opportunity to do that like this is like me and my natural habitat like kind of synthesizing what's happening in my own world and then like looking at the culture and um just laying out my observations so I did have an opportunity to do that a bit now that was something that was on the website

when I had that was the heyday of blogging. Well, that was the heyday of blogging. Like, that's the heyday of blogging is like 2004. Yeah. Was anybody looking? I don't know. I mean... No, I was.

Okay, cool. Thank you. Like, I still subscribe to blogs and I often wish people would... I loved the format and I don't know why we all stopped doing it. Social media took the blogging like soul.

So now people send the tweet or do the Instagram and it all kind of... Well, I write a newsletter because i could not deal with just um writing in tiny little tweets you know you needed more characters to yeah and so okay is it substack what is your newsletter tell us the newsletter it's called at the end of the day at the end and that's the name of your podcast right it is so you go end of the day dot ca That's where you go. Okay. So once you've subscribed to the 1236 newsletter,

make sure you're also subscribed to At The End Of The Day, a weekly newsletter with a people-first perspective on the news. Yes. How's that? You can use that because I stole it from you. Okay. Thanks for letting me use that. You can use that.

How did you get the gig at MuchMusic? There was a, speaking of newspapers, there was an ad in the back of the newspaper saying pop culture reporter wanted. Which newspaper? Well, this was, I think, either now or I, again, RIP. Right. And my friend cut it out for me and circled it, like in an old timey movie. Hannah, this is you.

This is you. Yeah. But you know, like before that, I had already sent in tapes because I wanted to audition to be a VJ. And I'd sent in one or two, maybe one that I remember. And I got a form letter back saying, thank you, but no thanks.

And I was like, cool. They got my demo tape, you know. I was just kind of like of that mind back then where I wasn't really hearing no. I was hearing like, oh, you heard me and you saw me. And now I can try again. Did you get along with the sock? Sure. Yeah, like I would see him around.

And we never did anything together that's the funny thing about the on-air folks at at much is that the on-air folks didn't get to work together very much unless you were paired up for a show right um but otherwise you know like my very good friends Jennifer Hollett and Nam Kiwanuka like we developed our friendship after we left because when we were working there you're with your producers you're with your camera person like you're not hanging out with another on air host there's like no time you know so nam's an fotm by the way that's awesome i don't know how holland's escaped me because she's she was at twitter and of course cam gordon there is uh on toast which is a every month on tor Mic. He did Pandemic

Fridays here for 76 weeks in a row. Oh my God. In fact, he got me. I'm going to be at this TIFF. Viola Davis has a new. I'm going to be there tomorrow. Are you going to be there? I need to know somebody. I think Nam will be there actually. That's so great.

What am I doing? Oh, I'm doing a podcast conference at that time where is no one ever you don't know this is the difference between you and i nobody's invited me to any podcast conferences by the way i invited myself to that one because it's this company called multitude in brooklyn and i love what they do and their ethos so um when they like sent out an email blast saying they were doing this, I wrote back and I was like, Hey, I love what you're doing. And then they were like, would you like to be on a panel?

I was like, yes. So it's not necessarily that I get invited. It's that I, um, you invited yourself. Okay. See, I, my ego is such that I'm like, uh, I don't want to be a member of any, no, that's not true. That's a, that's got your marks there. And it's the opposite.

But like, I like, Oh, you, you didn't invite me. So I guess you don't want me. You don't get me. I got me I got in yeah but but I was invited to this TIFF thing tomorrow how was Strombo Strombo uh is an FOTM as well and we had this like super great chat like I had a great experience of George Strombolopoulos what was your experience like with George oh it was awesome I mean we worked together for years and uh oh I can't even remember who left Much Music first. He went to the CBC, right? He left Much for the rest of his history at the CBC. Yeah. And I mean, our paths cross occasionally, but very rarely. He's a nice person to work with. He's got a real gift as you know i don't need to say

that because everyone can clearly see it um yeah he's got a real connection yeah yeah yeah yeah and he's probably hanging with the aforementioned jim richards as we speak they seem to be uh thick as thieves that's how i know jim yeah and then you knowo Jr. too, if you get in that. Yeah. Who's also an FOTM. Yeah. Great. Okay. Now, any other, just, I know we're going to move on from much music, but that's where I first discover Hannah Sung.

So obviously I'm lingering a little bit here, but the new music was an institution. There was only, I don't actually, I think there was only, yeah, there was only one host after you. I have to check out who it was, but eventually it run its course, I guess, and they kind of killed it. But I, which is kind of too bad. I have to check out who it was. But eventually it run its course, I guess, and they kind of killed it, which is kind of too bad. I really enjoyed the new music. And the new music, of course,

John Martin creation that sort of led to Much Music. It was sort of like before Much Music. That was like sort of a bit of the prototype of what they wanted to do with Much. But okay, so we talked about there's a sock. Shout out to Steve Kersner. He's an FOTM. There's George.

There's Nam. Jennifer, you mentioned, who will one day get in the hot seat here. walk uh shout out to steve kersner he's an fotm there's uh there's george there's nam uh jennifer you mentioned who will one day get in the hot seat here but uh is there any other vjs you can recall from your time there that you can just name check before we move on well yeah amanda walsh and i still keep in touch we had um a a random late dinner together this uh summer it was so nice to see her. Rainbow Sun Franks was there at the same time. Wow. Lovely person. Bradford.

We don't really keep in touch, but I wish him the best. I hope he's doing well. Bradford Howe, right? Yeah. Okay. Matt Babel and I crossed paths a little bit. He was kind of part of this newer crew that came in towards the end of my time there. Who else? I mean, Devin Sultendeak was there. Same deal. newer crew that came in towards the end of my time there um who else i mean devin sultan duke

was there same deal he was kind of like towards the later time of when i was there um yeah well much like now magazine um except now i think you know the signal exists it's just like i don't know if it's simpsons or seinfeld but it's like friends reruns like it's just there's no like the the much music for all intents and purposes is merely like a a signal that's like re-rolling syndicated content over and over again. There's no there is no much music as we knew it. I mean, but what about the TikTok? What about tell me? I haven't I haven't ever logged into TikTok. Oh, you've never? Yeah.

No, no, no. I don't feel like I mean, I'm older than you, but not much older than you. But I don't feel like I belong on TikTok. Is that my own issues? I need a couch to sit on. Well, I do love TikTok content. Like the creators on TikTok are amazing. Um, but I try hard to not go there because I, I. It's so good. I avoid it. Like, Oh, well, you know what? You can't avoid it because it's in my group chats. It's in my other, like it's in my Instagram. It's a, you see them on Twitter,

like things go viral and spin out into your own feeds. Right. Um, yeah, I kind of just don't need this new time suck for me and a new algorithm to like the AI is so powerful. And I know that there's no avoiding this stuff, but like, I just don't need to introduce it right now to. No, I mean, I've never logged in. Like, yeah, I just, I just, my, my 18 year old kind of

gave me a heads up, like maybe 40 something dudes don't belong on TikTok. Oh, really? Well, so you have an 18 year old? Yeah. And a 20 year old. Oh, wow. Like, so i look forward to that uh stage because i feel like it'd be super fun and um i don't know i kind of feel like i want to do tiktok with my kids and not not making tiktoks like no never that's like not consuming consuming it because i do feel like so my older son is about to get his first phone he's not allowed to do social media, not allowed.

We'll see what happens. But I want like, this is way earlier than I wanted my kids to be in that world. But I know that it's my responsibility to, to live in that world with them, to understand what they're going through and to like help them understand what all this content is. So I feel like I'm just kind of like holding off for when I inevitably do get into all that stuff

with my kids. Well, yeah, you know, it's inevitable, like you said. So 11 years old is, yeah, okay. Now times have changed, but I do know my firstborn got a phone and he was 13. And I distinctly remember me and my ex-wife having a conversation where I felt it was too early. And then apparently all of the kids in his class had a phone and so this is anyway he got a phone

at 13 and then my daughter managed to get one like a little early like a 12 and a half like she's like i'm almost there whatever and she was great student anyways and she got a phone then and now that i've got the eight-year-old and the six-year-old i'm like uh oh wow like like it's it's the tart the the finish line is moving like are these kids gonna be like 10 year olds with like with an android in their pocket or whatever i know well you know what hold off for as long as you can like for me it was just trying to respect my child like he was really asking for one and he said his friends have one which is true that some of his friends do and i felt like just trying to close that door and lock it was like socially punishing him for no

reason and so my husband and i like had a lot of conversations he was really against it and honestly i am the kind of person who would be against it too but um it was just in this individual circumstance like i had to just respond to who my son is. If my daughter, when she gets that age, does not want a phone, I will be like, awesome.

That's great. Hallelujah. But I think in every kid has their own thing. Some kids are not into it actually. And this is why you, Hannah earned that necklace you're wearing. Okay. Because you're,

you're the best mom. You're the best mom you're the best mom quick question about amanda walsh real quick okay because uh i've been told for many years that they filmed the the pilot maybe you know where i'm going with this but for big bang theory shout out to the bare naked ladies by the way but okay and that the original pen oh do i have the right show yes i do i think i do i never watched big bang theory did you watch big bang theory i did not very popular show i missed it completely okay i feel the original penny i hope that's her name i hope i haven't butchered that was was amanda walsh and then they re-shot the pilot with a different actress and that's the show that became like the

most watched sitcom on tv have you ever heard Well, I'm wondering where you heard this. You've never heard this then? No. Okay. You know, well, here. So here. Amanda Walsh, Big Bang Theory. Hold on here. Her name is actually, maybe it's Katie? Anyway, why do I think it's Penny? Is Penny somebody else is penny somebody else is it in some sort of imdb thing where it's like the pilot was i've heard it many times i've heard this many many times oh it's penny okay so katie oh before penny they called her katie maybe i don't know much about big bang theory but yeah there's an unaired pilot of the big bang theory and i believe amanda walsh here i'm just going in here yeah amanda w Walsh played this character. It's one of those yeah, I'm looking at it now. There's a photo of her.

She was known as Katie and she was like the same character. Yeah, I'm on like a Big Bang Theory wiki so you know you can trust this Hannah. But I've heard of multiple sources through the years and it's one of those, okay it was 06, 07, okay so he was played by Amanda Walsh, a street-hardened

tough-as-nails woman with a vulnerable interior. But they decided to refilm it with a different actress and the rest is history. But this is one of those sliding doors. It'll drive you crazy if you even think on it. But like how close you are

to basically whatever they were making, a million dollars an episode. Not that money is all that matters, Hannah. Money is not the primary motivator, but that would change things significantly, I would for amanda just an interesting i'm happy to report that amanda's living a great life very happy two great kids and a great partner and is still in la and uh you know um yeah i mean well next time you're chatting with her you can ask her about this like well you know you should ask her about it because it's her story. Okay. Well, yes, it's out there.

Look, once you make the Big Bang Theory wiki, it's everyone's story now, Hannah. It belongs to the masses now. I'm going to give you a gift. You've been doing amazing. And I want to talk about the Globe and Mail. And I want to talk about a New York Times article I recently read from you. And I want to talk a little more about At the End of the Day and our mutual friend, Garvia Bailey.

But do you enjoy Italian food I love it okay good I was sweating for a moment what you gonna say here I hate Italian food nobody nobody hates yeah exactly there you go you're in your two kids and your husband uh are gonna love you when you come home you're gonna get another necklace because you're gonna come home with a lasagna it's's frozen. It's in my freezer right now. I'm going to put it in this box before you leave. You're going to have a lasagna from Palma Pasta.

Thank you so much. And thank you, Palma, for feeding over 100 of us on a TMLXX last Thursday. That was so amazing. They fed us all just for free. You got to love a business that supports the good work

that you do, you know? And they're hosting tmlx 11 and hannah you're invited to this this is on the first saturday of december which is like december 3rd at noon at palma's kitchen we're going to collect and it's going to be awesome thank you palma pasta i already mentioned great lakes has beer for you sticker you.com has a toronto mic sticker for you hannah i can't wait to find out where that goes. Wherever it ends up, I hope you take a photo and send it to me.

Will do. Can't wait to find out. Wrigley Funeral Home. Just yesterday, Brad Jones was at TMLXX and just yesterday he recorded an episode of his podcast, Life's Undertaking. And he talked about community and the value of community and the community of FOTms he witnessed

last thursday okay good it's working okay this is like a i don't know you're in the dark you want to be safe so you don't end up at ridley funeral home this is a flashlight for you hannah thank you now i can read in the dark and not disturb my partner and this is a loaded question which you can we don't have plead the fifth in this country but but in this room we do. Okay. I know you're, you know, you're 11 year old might at some point hear this, but do you consume cannabis? Oh, um, like,

like not on the regular, which I kind of wish I did. It's not too late for you. I have, of course. Canna Cabana has over a hundred locations across the country and will not be undersold on cannabis or cannabis accessories. They've been amazing supporters.

Uh, they had a big gift, uh, big gift basket for actually my local candidate for my local account for Toronto council. Cause that election is coming up in October. Amber Morley is like the best bet to replace the incumbent Mark Grimes in this ward three that you're in right now. And she was at TMLXX and she won the Canada Cabana gift prize and she was very excited. So shout out to Amber Morley. Thank you Canada Cabana and

thank you EPRA. The newest sponsors of Toronto Mic'd. I think at TMLX11 at Palmas Kitchen that we're going to have like recycle your old tech. You know, how many like old phones do you have in a drawer somewhere? Like what do you do when you replace your phone?

Because the battery, it doesn't last more than, you know, 20 minutes anymore or whatever. Hannah, what do you do with it? Do you throw it out? Like, what do you do if you're old tech? It's basically my kid plays with a BlackBerry. It becomes a toy. It becomes a toy. Okay.

Well, if you want to safely and properly for Mother Earth here, recycle your old tech. That's where EPRA comes in. And they're going to be at TMLX 11 to collect old tech that FOTMs bring. What did you do at the Globe and Mail, Hannah? I was a video producer there. I actually got hired as a video host. So randomly, it was like a full circle kind of I was standing in front of a camera again for this newspaper, which was odd.

But it's what I did. Because they pivoted to video like so many uh did uh okay so maybe before I realized how did you leave much music like what you got like did you I just left you just left I just left yeah like you're on national television I know is that weird um is it because they uh you felt they weren't compensating? No, God, no. There was like no drama. No, I know. And if there was drama, I will tell you because like, why not? It's like a million years later.

No, I was just not enjoying my life. Like I was saying, like my day-to-day life, you know, and you work there on yearly contracts if you're a VJ. And so I knew my contract was coming up. And I thought, I've got to figure out a way to not resign. And I didn't get like, a new job. I just took on this volunteering situation with Care Canada and they, um, it was just like my way out. And so when the time came, I said, you know, I, I don't, uh, like, thank you for everything, but I don't want to sign on for another year. And, um, I was actually thinking about this time of my life, like on my way here. And it was like a really nice parting because like at first they said, well, can you rethink that and stay?

And can you stay for a year? And I was like, no, can you stay for a shorter amount of time? And I said, no, because I'd made up my mind. Now, looking back, how weird is that? Because you're right. I didn't have a plan um well what about money like uh yeah did you need some yeah and and so but just to finish that thought like after like i knew that they valued my work because they didn't want me to go but they wished me the

best and it was perfectly nice and so when i did leave people were like did you get fired and it's like that that was it's an interesting mindset that that is the only way people could imagine you would leave a plum job like that or the strombo way which is like yeah i'm quitting this job because you're gonna see me at like on cbc next week yeah yeah no so that didn't happen to me and like what about money i was saving and planning frankly smart yeah that's what i did do you invest in resps for your kids i do smart listen best advice okay you're way ahead of me on that one okay sorry yeah no it's all good i mean i believe in um planning financially and so i do let me 20 bucks before you go um well are you good for it um maybe i i i did start actually investing went like soon after

i got my job at much because it was my first regular paycheck and i paid off my student loan i paid off my credit card that i'd maxed out because i wasn't paying attention and then i was like oh i better grow up and i started investing and you know it's that financial um cushion that you give yourself for the kind of like taking away the like panic and terror that allows you to make some choices. So like maybe not all choices are open to you in life or, you know, everybody has a different amount of choices, but at least give yourself as many as you possibly can, you know, and that's how I felt. So I did save to leave. And then the next few years I lived extremely frugally.

And I kind of traveled the world just paying for my expenses and freelancing my writing to just get out of Toronto and get out of Canada. And then I started to need a job. So what was the job you took when you realized you need to get a paycheck again? Well, you know, what i wanted to do was to work at the toronto star i wanted or or one of the weeklies like or a magazine i wanted to have a real full-time job working in news or culture cultural commentary like i wanted to work in journalism specifically with text i wanted to write and I could not get hired anywhere and the kinds of people who were coming to me were like kind of like radio or tv and um you know even like it

I found that the much music brand especially at that time in Canadian media preceded me into the room so they either just wanted me for that or they didn't want me at all because they didn't know me and they didn't want to even get to know me. Like what I was capable of doing and what I'd done before going to a Mudge was like not really on anyone's radar. So it's like, you know, not to sound ungrateful because I definitely don't want to be like that because I loved all of my TV experience there. But it was like this crazy blast of hot white light that just blew out everything else. And I could not get hired. I could not get hired anywhere. See, I'm as a guy who's never worked in your industry. Like I find that fascinating, but it does make sense when you put it that way.

Like, and that's even a great analogy. People didn't see me as a writer. so I was like all right and and um yeah and at the time I was like 30 years old and I called up the star and I was like really knocking on the doors of the arts editors and stuff and they were like well maybe you could try our internship um and or or maybe you should go back to school. Like a lot of recruiters at CBC were like, you need to go back to school, like go to journalism school. And I was like, you know, maybe I could have done that because I was only 30. Like now I look back and 30 is young.

But I was like, I don't I I felt too conspicuous at the time. And I should have not let that get in my way. I should have just done whatever I wanted to do. And I'm not saying that I should have necessarily gone back to school, but, um, I felt too conspicuous to do something like go back to school basically. So what did you, what did you do? Oh, I freelanced for many years. Um, and that's when I really learned to hustle and I learned that every

little job I got every short-term job I got was extremely useful for like learning different worlds and different teams and and how things operate so I worked on Project Runway Canada for a couple of seasons so and then um so I got some experience in like the independent tv production world um I wrote a lot for different like travel um travel sections of like basically AOL and MSN and um the star and stuff like that because I was traveling and um what else did I do I worked for the CBC for a couple of years uh doing their digital book club so I was um interviewing authors um I was cobbling together a lot of work and I had the energy to do it then and then I had my first baby and after that it's like I didn't go back to that way of um working

but I don't know that I would have been able to anyways. Okay. Fascinating. So when about is the Globe and Mail chapter of your career? Yeah. So I was 35 years old. I had a one-year-old baby and I got hired there and it was my first full-time permanent job in Canadian media. Wow. Yeah. Wow. Well, what about the much music would be the first? That was a contract job. So it was definitely like I got a salary and benefits. It. Wow. Well, what about much music would be the first? That was a contract job. Okay, contract. So it was definitely like I got a salary and benefits.

It was great. Yeah. But I knew that my time would be up in a year, every year. Right. Okay. So you're coming in during the great pivot, as we look back at the media landscape, the great pivot to video. And you come in to do videos.

But at some point, how does that morph into production of podcasts yeah well so they hired me as a video host um so I did that even though after much I had said to myself I'm never going to go in front of a camera again but for the opportunity of working at the Globe and Mail I was like yeah I can do it and then over time I was able to work with know, my manager to morph my job into being more about production. So I was producing videos, which is way more in line with what people wanted to watch in terms of like videos on Facebook and Twitter and all that stuff anyway. And then in 2016, so I had been there for a few years, my colleague and I, Denise Balkasun,

we pitched a podcast about race in canada and the powers that be in the newsroom were like yeah sure go for it and nobody had made a podcast before at the globe okay and it was not a business interest of theirs at the time but now it's really going strong i'm very happy for them um and so we made this podcast and it was like a grind because it was everybody was doing it for the first time we didn't really know what we're doing but it was like a grind because it was everybody was doing it for the first time we didn't really know what we're doing but it was also extremely exhilarating and gratifying and I bet you learned like a shitload from that experience yeah amazing okay so I love this okay so so you and Denise just and were you like doing it all yourselves or yeah there was a small team so she and i were producing and hosting it and then there were like

um maybe like tim moore was like recording it for us and danielle webb was um creating the interactive and then a marketing person worked very closely with us which is like you know back then that didn't always happen that a marketing person would be working with you from the beginning katrina bolak, shout out. She was just so smart about podcasts. And honestly, now it seems like a no-brainer because you can't just create something really wonderful. You need to connect it to people and you need to have someone whose job it is because they know how to do that. So that was our tiny team. And then we also had the support of managers who would listen to our first drafts and be like that's garbage or that's great you know and uh yeah so I felt like in ways we were very supported in other ways we

were not but um ultimately I was happy with the way it turned out so I okay I have a question about podcasting okay so uh a woman named Cece Wong and I have been chatting lately because she started she just started a podcast like on her own. Like, and, and, uh, much like when I started,

like we're just people. Like, I know that sounds like, I'm not saying you're not a person, you are clearly a person, but like what I mean by that is like, so I, this morning I was on Humble and Fred cause I produced their show,

but Humble and Fred were famous in this market because they were on the radio in the morning. Like this is, uh, like, so, so like, okay,

so if you're just if you're an independent regular joe or jane or whatnot and you're in you're starting your podcast how do you cut through the noise when you know nowadays like okay maureen holloway and wendy mesley no longer have mainstream media gigs guess what they started a podcast. Okay. Bob McCowan's no longer on Primetime Sports on the Fan 590. Okay. He's going to start a podcast. Don frickin' Cherry. Okay. No longer on Hockey Night Canada. He's going to start a podcast. Like these are super

famous people in this country who are starting podcasts. So what would like Hannah, what do we say to the people? Like what would you say to me if I were going to start a podcast and I was going to start Toronto Mike? I'm just a guy in my basement and I have no mainstream media experience. I'm not famous. Like, how do you cut through the noise?

I would say clearly state your niche. Like, who are you? You know, if, if those folks that you mentioned already have a relationship with a Canadian audience and we already know who they are, it's like, they've got a leg up, obviously, but you are also your own person with your own interests and your own whatever you're going to bring to the table. So tell people who you are and what you do. And if you need to be very specific, too, because maybe you want to just show one slice or you want to explore one slice of who you are and what you bring to the table.

What is your unique expertise? What is your unique access? Tell people what that is. And, you know, even if you only start with 100 people listening to your show, that's amazing. Because if, if they're listening, if they're getting something out of it, it will grow. Well, that's for sure. Like the best, I would always say the best referral system for an independent podcaster is word of mouth, like that, that FOTM who loves what they hear and then they're telling their like five buds you got to check this out you'd love it and the next thing you know it all six of them are showing up at a TMLX event like it's it's it's word of mouth because they like what they hear and they want others to enjoy it as well absolutely word of mouth that's

what community is right okay good segue Hannah this is why you're from the tv world you're good at this okay so the segue and i did mention brad jones and i were talking about community on life's undertaking yesterday because he was apparently at tmlxx for three hours watching me interact and and with the people coming and everything and he had a lot of things to say about the community he witnessed meanwhile rob pruse rob pruse was the keyboardist for Spoons during their heyday. Okay, Nova heard all that romantic traffic, all that good stuff. He was at TMLXX, came all the way from New York, by the way. That guy's awesome.

Rob Pruce, shout out. But he wrote me a note when he heard you were coming on. Hi, Toronto Mike. I just read Hannah's New York Times article. It's great. The thing about group chats, my wife has multiple group chats going on at all times, different groups of friends and colleagues. He goes, I have more, maybe one or two sporadically, but after reading Hannah's essay, I think I understand more about group chats and the value. And he goes, hey, he wrote this in a group chat for FOTM, it's called the TMU, Toronto Mic'd Universe.

he wrote this in a group chat for FOTMs called the TMU, Toronto Mic'd Universe. And he says, this is a group chat and I'm in one right now. Thanks, Mike. So I was wondering if we could, before we wrap up with at the end of the day and what you're doing with Garvia, which I think is super cool. That's that whole, maybe I'll let you talk about it,

but how, but you just submitted this to New York Times and they said, oh, this is great. We're going to publish it. Like, how did you get this article in the New York Times? Okay. That's a great question. Because actually, um, I pitched this editor at the Times who I actually know from a previous life, um, Indrani Sen.

She's amazing. And, um, I have a friend at the Times who said, you should pitch our opinion editor and gave me her name. And I was like, I know Indrani. So I pitched her multiple times about BTS. Okay. And I wanted to write opinion pieces on BTS. Okay.

And Indrani did not write me back. Because enough of this butter nonsense, it should be called popcorn. She said, okay. Yes. That's, that's,

how did you know what I was writing about? Um, but you know, I, I pitched something to her about BTS and she wrote me back and said, don't want this, but you mentioned group chats in your pitch. And I think she's familiar with my writing. And so she knows I can write.

And she said, are you interested in group chats as a topic? And I said, hell yeah. I mean, that's basically, it was my lifeline during the pandemic you know so we um had a meeting which I know is like an amazing gift to have with a great editor because everybody's like go go go slam for time you don't always have time to have a meeting um but we talked about it together she said well what are your thoughts on group chats and i gave them to her and then i wrote a draft and boom boom goes the dynamite so this yeah and again uh there is a uh it's not so secret i guess but there is a uh like a twitter dm group uh for toronto mic listeners it's a fotm group chat and i yeah all day long it's going

speaking of popcorn it's going off like popcorn you have to turn off the notifications for that one because there's a lot of activity but it's like checking in there's a great yeah it's a great value especially during the pandemic but uh even even beyond so that was a i i agree of rob it was a fantastic article you wrote there hannah thank you so much thanks too. How do you know Garvia Bailey? I, okay, so I. Do you know her? Do you want me to introduce you to her? Just kidding.

I love Garvia. She's the person that I maybe see most in my life, maybe more than my husband. I definitely talk to her more than my husband because we work together. So I think the first time I met met garvia she's just one of those people who's like when she walks around she like knows everybody and we used to live in the same neighborhood oh she knows everyone and honestly i don't remember not knowing her like i don't even

remember how we met but i do remember walking around the neighborhood and i'd see her with her daughter um this is before i even had kids and now her daughter is this beautiful adult and so i just knew her from the canadian media well yeah like from cbc and i should say the corner of like where i lived world um but uh and then and then our mutual friend in naba duncan who is a you know the founder of media girlfriends um they're close friends and naba and i became close friends so professor now and I became close friends. Is she a professor now or something? She is.

She's the party chair of diversity, inclusion, and equity studies and journalism at Carleton. I used to hear her on CBC Radio. Exactly. Yeah. And so Garvey and I and Nanaba, the three of us founded Media Girlfriends as a podcast company.

It did pre-exist as a podcast that Nanaba started. And yeah, we just like took the leap into building a business together as friends, which was a little bit scary because they are good friends of mine. And I was like, what if this doesn't work out, you know? But it has worked out. Thank God. So that's how i know garvia is just from around okay so now it's you and garvia are basically the the partners involved with media we do the daily work and we have um a staff uh producer as well uh elena hudgens lyle who is

amazing and um and then we work with a constellation of folks and yeah, we're a small shot, but I like to think that we punch above our weight. Oh, for sure. And what, what exactly is at the end of the day when it comes to like podcasting? Like, so obviously you mentioned earlier, it's a weekly newsletter, but this is also a podcast, right? Yeah. So, um, uh, okay. Um, basically COVID happened and I was filled with just the need to connect with people and talk and write and synthesize what I was taking in, in terms of the daily firehose of news. So I started at the end of the day as a newsletter. I wrote it every single week, still to this day, like it's been two and a half years and in the spring um we

started a podcast with my producer olivia trono and so that's that's what that is it's it's like me trying to make sense of the world through talking to other very wise people and learning from their experiences and now you and i uh even though my checklist hasn't been updated in a few minutes here, but now you and I are kind of in the same universe. Like I spend my days basically immersed in the podcast universe, be it my own podcast or helping other people podcast and producing podcasts for other people. Like, so we're all in the, like I said, we're all in the same gang here. It's kind of cool. Yeah love that amazing okay you've been amazing like this has been awesome and uh i was don't want to let you go though i just wanted

your opinion on this and i'll be don't worry it's not scary but farah nasser's on next week and i'll be hitting her up with the same same question because i'm naturally curious what are your thoughts about what's gone down at cTV News with Lisa Laflamme? Like, I'm just naturally curious in your particular perspective on this firing, I guess. I don't know. They bought her out of her contract and she's gone by Bell Media. But what are your thoughts on the Lisa Laflamme story? I think that my thoughts are not different from like every person in Canada.

It makes no sense as a business decision like none so clearly it wasn't and there's been a lot of great reporting on um the issues that underlie of like um such an unceremonious firing like when Robin Doolittle uh reported for the Globe that um this former Bell Media executive was talking about gray hair. I mean, it was so important to get it documented in a newspaper of record what all of us were already talking about and suspecting, right? It's like, yeah, get people who were there in the meetings to talk about it and to speak to you on the record about the sexism and the ageism that's involved you know like why would you take somebody who is um this extremely decorated anchor who the public loves why would you take her off the air that's not a business decision that's something else you know so i love that canada's talking about that now but it's it's like it's a shame

for you know viewers who who liked watching lisa laflam. And I, I hope Lisa Laflamme is doing okay. I'm sure she's great. I hope she just, you know, like, um, comes forth with something like the exactly what she wants to do with her work and her energy, you know, but it's such a stupid situation and it's, um, it's just a disaster of, pr and publicity as well well i know that he's on leave now the gentleman you're referring to uh for sure he's eminem mm yeah mm's on leave now it's i i'm i'm just i again i have no insight into this i'm so far removed but uh watching it closely and just naturally finding it all rather fascinating.

This is apparently the most viewed show Canada produces is this CTV national news. And she was, like you said, well decorated. Like apparently she won awards as recently as a big award. The thing to me that spoke the loudest immediately after she put her Twitter video online is how many people spoke up about how she mentored them, how she treated them at work, the environment she created, that when somebody leaves that everybody from their colleagues to viewers to just random people in the industry all speak up on your behalf to say this person took the time out to talk to me and to, you know, field questions. Like, she was clearly a very community minded person in her industry and cared about like who was coming up behind her. And so that to me speaks volumes, you know, about like who was coming up behind her. And so that to me speaks volumes, you know, about what kind of a person she is. I just think like, what happened is chilling for younger people in the industry who are like, if this can happen to her, you know, and I think that the industry has, like, deservedly has a reputation of being quite cruel and heartless.

And it's like, why do people have to work like that together? Why can't we work better together? I don't get it, you know? No, I don't. I mean, I don't get it either. But I do know that the woman in charge of the news until, like, December 2021 was a woman named Wendy Freeman. And then when this Michael, and I can't remember his last name,

or I'd say it, but do you know Milling? Milling, yeah. Eminem. Eminem here. When Eminem takes over, and I won't even, I mean, there's a lot of smoke here,

but I won't assert that he's misogynist or ageist, even though there's some smoke there. I don't know. I don't have a clue. But I do know this does reek of a personal nature. Like this is a, sounds to me like there's some smoke there. I don't know. I don't have a clue. But I do know this does reek of a personal nature. Like this sounds to me like there's something personal between Wendy Freeman's replacement and Lisa Laflamme and that he wanted her gone.

And that's what happened here. So it's just interesting. We'll keep watching this. I know that Wiseblot's going to want to talk more about this later tonight. So I got to save something in the arsenal here. But I'm always interested in your perspective on these matters. Yeah, it stinks, right? It smells.

There's something rotten in the state of Denmark. Right, Hannah? Yes. I don't know how Denmark came into it. Well, you know, I'm always quoting Shakespeare on this program because at U of T I majored in English, so you never know what you're going to get here. Hannah, you know, I'm always quoting Shakespeare on this program because at U of T I majored in English. So, you know, you never know what you're going to get here.

Hannah, you're now an FOTM. Do you remember what FOTM stands for? Friends of Toronto Mike. Okay, wear this badge of honour with pride. You and Garvia are in the same club. Hello to Garvia if she's listening at home. We missed you at TMLXX. And Hannah, this will be in the feeds five minutes after our photo.

So thanks so much for dropping by today. Thank you so much for inviting me, Mike. I had a blast. And that brings us to the end of our 1,107th show. You can follow me on Twitter. I'm at TrottoMike. Hannah, are you at HannahSung on Twitter? Yeah, that's me.

Follow Hannah. Even though she took time off this summer, you took a Twitter break? Yeah, but I'm back. She's back, baby. Our friends at Great Lakes Brewery are at Great Lakes Beer. Palma Pasta is at Palma Pasta.

I'm going to get you lasagna for you. Sticker U is at Sticker U. I'll help you put that on your car. Electronic Products Recycling Association are at EPRA underscore Canada. for you. Sticker you, that's sticker you. I'll help you put that on your car. Electronic products, recycling association, or at EPRA underscore Canada. Ridley Funeral Home, or at Ridley FH,

and Canada Cabana, or at Canada Cabana underscore. See you all later today, when my special guest is Mark Weisblot. Yeah, the wind is cold, but the snow wants me today. special guest is Mark Wiseblood. Well, you've been under my skin for more than eight years It's been eight years of laughter and eight years of tears And I don't know what the future can hold or will do For me and you

But I'm a much better man for having known you Oh, you know that's true because everything is coming up rosy and gray. Yeah, the wind is cold, but the smell of snow won't stay today. And your smile is fine, and it's just like mine, and it won't go away. Because everything is rosy and gray Well I've been told that there's a sucker born every day But I wonder who Yeah I wonder who

Maybe the one who doesn't realize There's a thousand shades of gray Cause I know that's true Yes I do I know it's true Yeah I know it's true How about you?

All that picking up trash And then putting down ropes And then brokering stocks The class struggle explodes And I'll play this guitar Just the best that I can Maybe I'm not And maybe I am

But who gives a damn Because everything Is coming up Rosy and gray. Yeah, the wind is cold, but the smell of snow warms me today. And your smile is fine, and it's just like mine, and it won't go away. Because everything is rosy and gray. Well, I've kissed you in France and I've kissed you in Spain And I've kissed you in places I better not name And I've seen the sun go down on Sacré-Cœur

But I like it much better going down on Chaclacour But I like it much better going down on you Yeah, you know that's true Because everything is coming up rosy and green Yeah, the wind is cold but the smell of snow

warms us today And your smile is fine and it's just like mine. And it won't go away. Because everything is rosy now. Everything is rosy. Yeah, everything is rosy and great. guitar solo