Toronto Mike'd: The Official Toronto Mike Podcast - James Mirtle and Sean Fitz-Gerald: Toronto Mike'd #211

Episode Date: January 4, 2017

Mike chats with James Mirtle and Sean Fitz-Gerald about their new roles at The Athletic.

Welcome to episode 211 of Chronomiked, a weekly podcast about anything and everything. Proudly brought to you by Great Lakes Brewery, a local independent brewery producing fresh craft beer. And Chef's Plate, delivering delicious and locally sourced farm fresh ingredients in refrigerated kits directly to your door. fresh ingredients and refrigerated kits directly to your door. I'm Mike from TorontoMike.com and joining me this week is James Myrtle and Sean Fitzgerald from The Athletic. Welcome, gentlemen. Michael, thanks for having us. Thank you.

Now, James, this is your second visit to the Toronto Mike studios. Yeah, I see you've upgraded a little bit. Oh, but just a very, very little bit. Yeah, last time you were here, there was no swing arm boom things. But my buddy, Andrew Stokely, told me I need to have these. Because, Sean, you're going to have a bad back at the end of this hour. The really sad thing is this is usually my posture anyway, hunched over, pretend there's a keyboard right here.

So this is why that, you know, by the time I'm, say, 60, I'm going to look like the letter U except sideways. That's what we all look like in the press box every night. A question mark almost, right? That's a very good one. I don't know if my spine will be quite that straight, but something approaching that, yeah. So right off the bat, if anybody needs

to go back and hear the true Hollywood story of James Myrtle, it's episode straight, but something approaching that, yeah. So right off the bat, if anybody needs to go back and hear the true Hollywood story of James Myrtle, it's episode 119. So go find 119 and you can find out his life story up to the Globe and Mail.

And that's where we'll pick up with you. But Sean, I'm going to need to do a little bio with you, a little bit of this is your life to start this sucker off. But I got to ask you right off the bat, what's with the hyphen in Fitzgerald? It's a long and boring story. How many hours do we have?

It's a good story. Just tell the short version. It's a good story. You said this podcast goes for four hours, correct? Four and a half if I... Okay. I won't inhale, so we'll get it done in four hours. It's a good thing there's beer here then.

That's good. We'll just crack this. This does look like delicious Great Lakes Brewery beer. Yeah, so my dad was a journalist. My great-grandfather was a journalist. My great-grandfather did not hyphenate his name. His name was J.P. Fitzgerald. He was a sports editor at the now-defunct Toronto Telegram.

My father was a journalist at the Hamilton Spectator, the Mississauga News, and somewhere along the way decided he wanted like a pen name. So rather than going for like, you know, F. Scott Fitzgerald, you know, his name's Anthony, he decided, hey, why not hyphenate the Fitzgerald? So Fitz hyphen capital G Gerald was born. Not long after that, I too was born. I'm the first in my family. And the family legend is that my mother,

who only really knew my dad after he became a journalist, saw his name in the paper, got married. You know, she took his surname. So her name is Fitz hyphen Gerald. I'm the first born, Fitz hyphen Gerald. And somewhere along the way, between the time I was born in 1977 and my sister came along in 1980, they had the conversation of, you know, that's not legal. So in my family, my father legally doesn't hyphenate, my sister does not legally

hyphenate, but I and my mother have a hyphen in our name because of that, because of newspapers, so blame the media. It's a great story, but is that the short version? I just want to clarify. That was the short version, right? That is the shortened version. Later, I got to hear the long version. Sure. That's great.

Now, it's really confusing to guys like me, though, because this Fitz-G, it's very unnatural. And pretentious. It looks pretentious, doesn't it? Most of us only know, we think, okay, F. Scott Fitzgerald. That's like the reference we have. And it's like, why are you different? John Fitzgerald Kennedy does not hyphenate the Fitzgerald.

There you go. By the way, that episode 119 with James Myrtle, that includes his infamous run-in with Steve Simmons over analytics. Is there any update on that front? I just need to know, has there been any contact with Steve Simmons since then? No. No. Okay.

You know, I had him here. You're sitting in his seat there. Okay. Just, that won't cause any problems, will you? I don't want any trouble. We're okay?

He's giving me an evil look. All right. Was the seat autographed? Do we autograph this? Is it like the TSN radio studio? Do we sign things as we leave? I would say sign the wall, but I'm actually going to paint it soon.

Oh, well, then we should absolutely sign it. By the way, the Maestro Fresh West autograph that we're looking at, that's amazing. When was he in here? Okay, he was in here like, I'm going to say three months ago. That's amazing. There's even, hold on,

I'm staying on mic for this. Drop the Needles also back. These are my, like, I didn't buy these because Maestro's come in, and I've had these since 1989. And when part of the, this is back. These are my, like, I didn't buy these because Maestro's come in. And I've had these since 1989. And when part of the, this is my long-born story, but this whole podcast is a ruse to get Maestro to visit me in my basement

and answer my questions. It's like a front. Like, you know how the mafia has that coffee shop and they launder all the money through it? This podcast was just to trick Maestro to come in over. Those two albums were basically, I mean, growing up in Burlington,

Ontario, they were basically the soundtrack of Life at the Roller Gardens every Friday night for many, many years. Oh, no, you're singing my tune.

I dropped this one. This is a throwdown, a showdown. Hell no, I can't slow down. It's gonna go. So every once in a while I have to let one of those rip.

I can't see why you wouldn't. Every once in a while, I have to let one of those rip. I can't see why you wouldn't. All right, let's dive in. By the way, we're going to concentrate heavily on the athletic. I have a bunch of questions about this new venture, and I have your titles here. So right off the bat, James Myrtle is Editor-in-Chief, which is a great title. Do you introduce yourself now as Editor-in-Chief James Myrtle?

I usually say I'm running a company. Same difference. Same idea. And Sean Fitz-Gerald is Managing Editor. Also very exciting. That means I get James's coffee when he wants it. That's great. But we're going to get into that. First, I'm going to, you mentioned the beer in front of you. This is a new development since James was last here. I still have the low ceilings, much to his chagrin, but I have free Great Lakes beer for each of you. You're going to take that home. Hell, you could drink it now if you want, but you're going to take it. It's a little bit warm right now, to tell the people listening at home. It's a little bit warm. I don't know if I could drink it, but it does look

delicious. You know, I can swap it out, actually. I have some in the fridge upstairs. I could swap it out. So you give us the warm beer, but you keep the cold stuff in the fridge upstairs? Do you know how many hours we've been on the road to get here? You're offering us warm, delicious beer. Who's the designated driver there? Who's driving? We're not going to comment on that, but one of us is. Well, the other one I would get cold beer for if you

wanted. Okay. We'll stay. So, yeah, I'm happy to announce, this is exciting for me personally, these guys, Great Lakes Beer, just yesterday, renewed for a second time. We do six-month contracts. So they're going to be a guaranteed 18-month sponsor of Toronto Mike. So big ups to Great Lakes Beer.

Everyone listening, get your butts to southwest Toronto. Get to Great Lakes Beer near like Royal York and Queensway and buy good local craft beer. I wonder if they want to sponsor our podcast at all. Well, listen, you can't poach my sponsors. Maybe they want multiple podcasts. That's okay. As long as it's an in addition to and not instead of,

I'd be supportive of that endeavor. I'm happy to celebrate your sponsor. It does look just wonderful here. Good. Thank you. Thank you. And if anyone wants to crowdfund this project, patreon.com slash Toronto Mike. Give what you can. Help keep this sucker going

because I got like long form questions that people like Sean and James need to answer. And no one else is doing it, so I'm going to do it, right? You have a Kenny Rogers CD down here. Why is there a Kenny Rogers CD? On an Andre the Giant beer stein, you have a Kenny Rogers CD. Can we do a podcast on exactly

what we're looking at? I hide for nothing, yeah. It's like I'm in a flea market here. This is amazing. John came to ask you a question. No one's ever actually asked about the Kenny Rogers CD. For the people, again, listening on your run or at home, there is an Andre the Giant beer stein that's roughly the size of your thigh and on the top there's a kenny rogers cd but it looks like it's maybe i don't want to out anybody but it doesn't

look like it might be the one that you buy from the store it's a bootleg okay i don't want to say and then look look there's a jason mask jason vorhees mask on the wall too i don't want to look at that right now but can can you explain the Kenny Rogers first? Yeah, yeah, yeah. My mom loved Kenny Rogers, loves Kenny Rogers. She's still with us. And I was like, in the early 80s, she would put on Kenny Rogers' greatest hits on the record player and just play it over and over again.

So like when I'm like in my formative, like when I'm like, I don't know, five and six years old or whatever, all I hear is you picked to find time to leave me and ruben james and coward of the county and the uh the gambler all it's a gambler what's that called is that the thing all the uh you're the one with the kenny rogers bootleg man i mean all the kenny rogers songs when i hear it and then she believes in me everybody just shut it down because that was out of key or whatever. But yeah, so that's there because that's a bootleg of that greatest hits that was spun incessantly in like 1982. So we now have, we have a Kenny Rogers

CD that is approximately two and a half feet from the two Maestro Fresh West vinyl copies that are autographed. This is an eclectic set. Well, in the Under the Giant Glass, and that's that guy, I got that guy in 1984 or 85. I got that glass and I've had it ever since. Inside is actually the St. Louis Blues card of Brendan

Shanahan is actually living inside there. Naturally, of course, because what else would you have in there? Because he went to my high school. So it was a big deal when he broke out. It was like, a guy in my high school is scoring 50 goals in the NHL. What's going on? Him and Drake Barahowski are the two claims to fame. Was the Andre the Giant mug last washed in 1989? Well, I don't drink out of it anymore. So that's probably true.

And I never did actually drink out of it because I was afraid you'd have to, and you have to wash it and then you lose the color. We brought the tough questions here to the Toronto Mike basement. Anything else? The wire,

then that's my ride to conquer cancer tag when I rode, I don't know, 225 kilometers for Princess Margaret Hospital. Anyway, anytime you have a question, let me know. So patreon.com slash torontomike. Go get your Great Lakes beer

and go get your chef's plate if you look for a healthy meal kit that gets delivered to your door. It's pre-portioned, locally sourced, farm fresh ingredients and easy to follow door. It's pre-portioned, locally sourced, farm fresh ingredients and easy to follow recipes. Even James Myrtle could follow these recipes. So what I'm going to do is, you guys, I'm going to send you a link after this recording. They change the menu

like every week at this place. You tell me your favorite meals. Each of you get two meals and a shipping address. I'm going to get Chef's Plate to complimentary two free meals to your door. Even if you're not home, that refrigerated box is good for like 24 hours. It's a really good deal. And it's tasty. And you can put this meal together. I'll take care of you. If anybody else wants to get two free meals from Chef's Plate, go to chefsplate.com and use the promo code Toronto Mike. Do it. All right.

We're going to dive in. I'm going to start with Sean, okay, James? Because we had your 101 and I need a little bit of 101 on Sean here. Get to know him a little bit better. You ready, Sean? I'm kind of nervous. Kind of nervous.

My first question... Kenny Rogers will steal me for what's coming up, I'm sure. Yeah. Let me know about this National Post gig. Like, how did... You had two stints at the National Post. I did.

So how did you... The first stint, how did you end up there? Blind luck. I was... I did an internship there. I graduated from Ryerson University in 2000. And part of your course curriculum requirement was that you do an internship. And I landed just because my professor set me up at the National Post. I was

working in the Toronto section in January. And then a few months later, I'm putting out the final issues of the campus newspaper, the Ryersonian, and I get a call in the Ryersonian offices from a voice I'd never heard before. It was a British voice, and he offered me a job saying, how'd you like a job covering the Leafs, Raptors, Argos, and Blue Jays? And I thought somebody was pulling a prank on me because even in 2000, you just never got those calls. So I said, well, I'll need some time. And it turned out that it was a guy named Graham Parley

who was a sports editor, and he hired me right out of school. Wow. Okay, but why did you leave the first time? Well, I was at the National Post for 10 years and it was the only full-time job I'd had. And the Canadian press, Neil Davidson reached out and said, hey, how'd you like a job, you know, with a bit more of a hockey focus and a bit more of, you know, a bit more travel, that sort of thing. And so I said, you know what? I love the National Post, and I still love the National Post, and I still subscribe to the National Post. So I said, you know what?

Life's full of different experiences. So I moved to CP. Okay. So you're at Canadian Press, CP, and it's a solid gig there, right? This is a great gig. Fantastic people. You're having a great time. So here's the big question. Why do you then

leave this solid gig at CP to return to a quote somebody whose name I will protect has called it a shaky vibe at Post. Who called it a shaky vibe? I can't just tell you. Shaky vibe as in how? Like, I don't know.

They did end up getting rid of the whole sports section. Not that long after But shaky vibe James makes a good point I think they mean like shaky financially I mean Job security wise That always existed at the Post

I worked at the Post at one point for a few months And one of the things that scared me to the globe Was the shaky vibe By the way That unnamed source is James Myrtle. No, just kidding. Just kidding. That wasn't James.

It was Andre the Giant, wasn't it? I wish. Andre's talking to you. Rest in peace, Tony. That's the problem. No, I went back because just by happenstance, I happened to start communicating with a couple of the editors, and they said, hey, how'd you like to come back and do this general sort of feature job?

And that's basically what I've been doing ever since. And I thought, you know what, the ability to go in and find the most interesting story, whether that be, you know, finding just one person and spending a ton of time with them and being able to tell their story properly, really appealed to me at that stage of my career. And I went back and I think I stayed for another many, many years, another five years at the Post. And then you leave the Post for the Toronto Star. How does that, tell me how that works. Again, it's basically do the same thing you did at the National Post, except we can offer you, you can travel a little bit. So rather than, you know, talking to Toronto Mike over the phone,

you can go to Halifax or wherever it is Toronto Mike might be. That would be Halifax Mike. So wherever the Scottsdale Mike or whatever it would be, go there and even more so spend some more time doing those stories. So what happened at the Star was, remember the movie Youngblood? Of course, yeah, Rob Lowe. So one of the favorite stories I was able to do, I'm like, you know, it's the 30th anniversary. Whatever happened to Carl Racky?

Like Carl Racky, you look, he had a hockey DB page. He's from Etobicoke. He never did a movie before. I think he did a cameo in one after. He never did any press going into that movie. Whatever happened to him? And the star said, Jennifer Quinn, who is my editor, fantastic editor, said, yeah, absolutely. Go track him down. And I tracked him down to a place in central New York, not far from Syracuse. He was living on Lake Oneida or Oneida Lake. And he was just sort of

retired. He was just sort of happy. And I sat down and spoke with Carl Racky for an afternoon. And that was the fun kind of stuff I got to do with the star. And by the way, that's the kind of stuff I like. I like these stories. Tell me a story. to do with the star. And by the way, that's the kind of stuff I like. I like these stories. Tell me a story. Tell me a good story. That's what I'm looking for. I can find out the score anyways,

but anywhere, but tell me, tell me a story. So that's cool stuff. So you mentioned the Toronto Star gave you an opportunity that you embraced. Tell me how long

were you at the Toronto Star? What's the average gestation period for a human child? Nine months? Yes. I was there for about nine months. Yeah, it's rough times in the industry you're talking about. What was the off-the-record quote you got about the post? Shaky vibe.

Yeah, so shaky vibe at the Star. But that same person referred to the CP as a more stable gig was how this person referred to the Canadian press gig. Well, it depends what year you're talking about. I mean, a lot of people didn't know if the Canadian press was going to be around long-term based on, I mean, if paper's in trouble, Canadian press is probably in trouble

because they're the ones that are using it. So I know there were people at the Canadian press who weren't sure about its future, and then now it seems to have come back. Yeah, but I mean i i was playing hockey in i think it was august 6th at maple leaf gardens playing shinny um and fell and shattered my elbow on the ice and then had reconstructive surgery on the sunday i got home from the hospital on monday and on tuesday morning my mom i mean i don't know i'm recovering from a broken elbow i don't know what she's gonna do but she's my mom so she wanted to be down so she came

down we were watching Black Mass the Johnny Depp movie in the basement and I got a call that afternoon and it was the Toronto Star saying I'm sorry but because of union um the union seniority list we're laying people off and since you're at the bottom uh thank you very much but you know you're done so that's a uh what do you call it, LIFO? Last in, first out. Yes, that would be. That's the accounting term? I believe that would be.

It was never given to me in exactly that phrasing, but that seems like it. Fun fact is my accounting teacher in high school was a Shanahan. I don't know, I think a cousin, I believe, but a first cousin of Brendan. There are a lot of Shanahans around here. Yeah. And I used to go to St. Cecilia's for a little bit, which is at like Runnymede and Annette area. And there was a bunch of Shanahans there.

Like, you're right. And you're not far from Mimico, where the like is the Shanahan hub, if you will. The Irish are known to breed, I guess. Yeah. Well, Fitzgerald would know that. Yes. What can you do?

Okay. So let's just tell it like it is. This is a raw deal, right? Because you leave a gig, now in hindsight, of course, hindsight's 20-20, so the gig might not have been, it was on,

what was it called? Shaky Ground? We should put that up, write it down on the CD. The shaky vibe. So you leave the shaky vibe for the star, which by the way, I believe it's still Canada's biggest newspaper.

I mean, shrinking every day or whatever. And I know 10 years ago it had like, I can't remember the number I read. It was like there was 470 people writing. And then now it's 170 or something. I can't remember the exact numbers. But it's shrunk a great deal in the last decade. But the Toronto Star, you know, it's, yeah, one young street. This is a big deal to work at the Toronto Star.

I'd worked there before. I was working in the radio room, which is where they listen to the police and fire and ambulance scanners. I had left the job at the radio room to go to the National Post as an intern in 2000. So I had left the Star more than a decade earlier to go to National Post. So maybe it was their way of getting me back. I don't know. Were you bitter when you got this news

as you recovered from your elbow? The elbow shattered? Broken, shattered. Left or right? Ruined right elbow. So I can't reach it from here. You broke it in like four places. This was a fun tournament we were playing

in a Costco cup, it's called. And it's kind of like, what is it, bloggers and a whole bunch of hockey people from the Twittersphere do this tournament every year, and they say, you know, you don't need to wear full equipment, so Sean didn't have elbow pads on. Yeah, I never shattered my elbow, but I did separate my left shoulder playing like a beer league hockey,

and I couldn't get my sweater off. It was the most pain I ever felt in my life. I just can't imagine. Yeah, I think shoulders are worse than elbows. I wouldn't wish a shoulder on anybody. Elbow, at least you can sleep. Yeah, that's true. That's true.

Sorry to hear that. So that's even sorrier to hear that the Star let you go just because of their union LIFO rules. But it does suck. I think it sucks. And I meant this with David Alter. Was it David Alter? Who was it?

Somebody else who kind of starts somewhere and then right away they wipe. That happened to Dave. Yeah, yeah. And Dave's been here too. And he's a friend of a friend. There's some Western connection or something. And that's a raw deal, man. When you start somewhere and then, like you said, nine months later, let you go.

That sucks. I think that sucks. And to answer the earlier question, I'm not bitter. I'm grateful for the opportunity. It sounds like I'm spinning you. But the reality is, is working in media anywhere these days,

there is no guarantee. I love the National Post. I love the fact I was able to spend 15 years there. And I still read it and I still love it. And the star, like Jennifer Quinn, is one of the best editors I've ever had. And I've been lucky to have a lot of really good editors. So I'm not bitter.

Because she's Irish, right? Is that what it is? And we're both from Burlington, too. But I was just more sad because the opportunity, and I thought that every story that I got into the star, I was happy with. I was proud of. Some of the most enjoyable stories I was able to find and tell were at the Star. The Youngblood story. I got to go to Grand Prairie to cover a week of Scotties, but not do a single game story,

to go and find the most interesting stories I could. There was a couple on Team Ontario who were together. They were partners. And you're able to tell the story of what's it like to be partners on the ice and off the ice. And as soon as the Scotties were over, they're going to go fly to, I think it was Thailand or somewhere else in Southeast Asia and go have fun. And you're talking about living and really embracing life.

And these were the stories I was able to tell at the Star. And it was more, at the end, sad that, you know, that opportunity had passed. Well, there's a good thing there's a happy ending coming here. But before we get to the happy ending, what was I going to ask about? Hold on here. I had such a fantastic question to ask you.

What were we talking about? You're at the Star and you're packaged out. Oh, yeah. So Bruce Arthur, can I ask you a question? I'm just a guy, but I'm curious about this. When somebody like Bruce Arthur joins a company like the Toronto Star, does he negotiate in experience? Can you actually, like, in your contract say, I'm not going to be one of these LIFO guys? Because he comes in recent, but, you know, does he get to, like, have time put in there as part of the negotiation?

Yeah, there's different designations. So I was in a journalist classification. He's a columnist. So it's a different designation. They didn't lay off anybody from the columnist designation. They laid off from the journalist designation. Okay, I'm just curious.

Because if he had a bit of weight, could he come in and say, okay, but we're going to pretend I have 15 years experience here because I'm not going to be victim to any life. No, you can't do that. But you can be in a different category.

Okay, so he's a columnist. My buddy Ed Keenan. Ed Keenan, he's been on the show a few times. I guess he's in the columnist. It sounds like that was a better place to be at this time. Well, I mean, they didn't pick anybody from the columnist list. So, I mean, the columnists are the one that, you know, they draw a lot of traffic, a lot of eyeballs. And, I mean, full disclosure, Bruce Arthur is one of my closest friends in the world.

He was the emcee at my wedding. And he is, in my estimation, the finest sports columnist, general sports columnist in Canada. Yeah, he's very good. I got nothing but good things to say about Bruce. No, he's great. And I follow him on Twitter and I watch you two interact. So I figured there was some kind of relationship. Yeah, no, he's one of my closest friends on the planet. Okay, so we have you packaged. I don't know if nine months is as much of a package or whatever, but you're no longer at the star. I drove here in a Mercedes SUV. Yeah, your nine-month severance.

That's startup money, though. That's right. Well, we're going to get to that, eh? I got a question about that. So let's, James, who's been very patient here while we got Sean up to current day here.

Can I drink a beer in the Andre the Giant mug now that I'm waiting? If you want to rinse it first. Yeah, you have to clean that up. Can I drink a beer in the Andre the Giant mug now that I'm waiting? No. I get it. You want to rinse it first? Yeah. I don't know. I want to get the full Toronto Mike experiences. I think, you know, drinking the beer with whatever detritus is in Andre the Giant after 30 years. You ever met Mike Richards from TSN? Well, formerly of TSN radio. I have listened to him. I've not met him. So I think he was recording it like we were recording at like 830 or 9am or something, maybe right after his morning shift at maybe 930. He cracked

open a couple like bang, bang, just good. And he's like, and I look at him, he's like, well, you know, I've been up since 4 a.m.

And he's like, you're doing the math. You know, that's his noon or whatever. It's all good. That doesn't shock me. He's a good time, Charlie. He's a good time.

He keeps threatening on Twitter that he's making a comeback soon and he's going to tell us all details. Yeah, I've seen the threads. Yeah. I wonder where that, I wonder if he'll be back

in Calgary or I don't know. He told me he was going to, this is before, I've seen the threads. Yeah. I wonder where that, I wonder if he'll be back in Calgary or I don't know. He told me he was going to, this is before, he was going to buy a station. Like he was going to buy a radio station. That's one way to get a gig if you're looking for a radio gig,

which you're not. It might be a way to lose a lot of money too, the way radio stations are going. Oh, that's true. All right, James, you were at the Globe and Mail last time we talked to you. And I liked your work at the Globe and Mail as well.

And you, tell me if I'm wrong, but you quit this gig. Yep. So you, this is not a, hey, because a lot of newspapers right now are doing the voluntary buyout stuff. I keep seeing it. Bob Elliott missed one by three months, he tells me. He up and quit and then he retired and then... Anyway, this is an actual... I quit as opposed

to taking a voluntary buyout? Yes. The companies decide who gets those buyouts, right? Is that right? Yeah. I don't know. I could have applied for one, but I don't think that would have been in the cards anyway.

And it all has to do with timing. It's not like you can take that at any time. No, I mean, this opportunity came up. I really wanted to do it, so I did it. So, I mean, I'm going to spitball here, but you had what I call prime hockey writer gig with the Globe. You had that. And you quit that.

And you were probably making some decent cheddar at the globe in mail, I can imagine. Some good scratch. That's what cool guys like me call money. Scratch. Yeah, that's a Mimico thing, I think. Well, this is not Mimico. What? I will lose my shit on you. Mimico is...

What are we then? I'm so upset. This is called New Toronto. It's between Long Branch and Mimico. The government of East York doesn't formally recognize New Toronto as a thing. This is Mimico. Where the Leafs practice is Mimico, right?

No, absolutely not. They always call it Mimico. Lie. You know the McDonald's on Lakeshore? It's at like First Street in Lakeshore. We're from the East End.

Okay. What about Burrito Boys? I know the Burrito Boys. Here's how you know. Here they go. We won't say which number, but you're on a numbered street right now. Yes.

True, true? 69th Street, yep. Yeah, I wish. The numbers are all west of Mimico, 69th Street. How old are you, Sean? 69th Street. Nice. Yeah, that's what I was going to say.

That's juvenile. James and I are mature you, Sean? 69. Nice. Yeah, that's what I was going to say. That's juvenile. James and I are mature adults, okay? Nah, we're drinking out of the Andre Giant mug. Yeah. Don't drink out of the Andre Giant mug. Once you hit the numbered streets, you are west of Mimico. You are not in Mimico right now. The Leafs do not practice in Mimico.

This is New Toronto. The Leafs practice in New Toronto. I forward the theory that west of there is Mississauga. We're in Mimico right now. In fact, west of New Toronto is Long Branch. Can we get John Tory on the phone or somebody just to confirm this? Because I don't believe it. New Toronto might need a new name because it doesn't look that new around here.

It's true. We have the only byway. It's a rogue byway because the byways are officially gone. But there's a byway that exists on Lakeshore near here. Yeah. Mimico is frozen in time here. We just lost our beloved coffee time. They converted it into a two-for-one pizza.

You know, that was there for, come on. Maybe the podcast should be called Mimico Mike. Neutron Mike. Mimico Mike. I think we just rebranded it. It'll have wider appeal. Mimico Mike. All right. So Myrtle it. It'll have wider appeal. Nemico Mike. All right, so Myrtle's dodging the fact

he's making the six figures. He's got a prime hockey writer gig with the Globe. He up and quits for a startup, The Athletic. So, Sean, you go to the... I have so many questions. I don't know, but let's start with this. James, tell us why you felt the confidence in the startup, The Athletic,

that you would quit a gig at the Globe and Mail in order to become chief editor in charge of everything. I met the guys from California that were starting this company. I did my due diligence on them. I talked to people that knew them. I studied the business background of what they were doing. I looked at how much capital they had behind them. They made me a guarantee of a certain amount of time that I'll be employed there.

How long? I can't say. Three years? These things take three years. It was long enough. Three to his pension. It was long enough. So everything I looked into with these guys seemed legit,

and it's such a great opportunity. It's kind of a once-in-a-lifetime opportunity. I feel so lucky that this came along, that these guys came to me with a big budget and said, let's start a new media company in Toronto. I mean, I can't think of that ever happening. I don't know if it will ever happen again. And I knew that they had been talking to Sean. Sean and I, before I decided to do it, we talked. And we kind of agreed that this makes a lot more sense if we both do it

as opposed to one of us does it and one of us doesn't. If we both do it, I think there's going to be this groundswell of people supporting this and it has a much greater chance of working if we both do it. You're like Chris Bosh and LeBron James. Let's do this together. Could I be Dwayne Wade in that situation?

There is no Dwayne Wade. It's the guys in Chicago, I guess, are Dwayne Wade. So, yeah, yes. Is this right? This is out of Chicago? Am I right? No. No.

Chicago is just one of the other cities. Chicago was... So they have some kind of a formula. No, it's not some kind. They have an elaborate formula for all of the markets, all of the major markets in North America that they looked at. And it looks at all kinds of different things, like how big is the media landscape? How many people are available to hire

that are talented sports journalists? How well are the teams doing? Do the teams look like they're on the rise? What kind of level of fan interest is there? The number one city they picked was Chicago, and that's where they went in February or March of last year. And they had to build kind of the business case. They did that, and that's why they have the capital all coming in

in August and September. They have investment from some pretty heavy hitters in venture capital. And they're going to be going into more cities. Toronto just happens to be their second choice. I mean, I'm biased, right? But it sounds like a great choice. A fervent fan base for a number of teams. I think it's a great choice.

I know that I subscribed to the RSS feed for The Athletic. So I get, and it's funny, I couldn't find a way to subscribe to Toronto only. So there's this one XML file feed which has the Chicago and the Toronto. So I get the two coming at me. I don't ever see any other cities. So is that the only two right now that are live?

Yes. Okay. But we'll get that coming at me. I don't ever see any other cities. So is that the only two right now that are live? Yes. But we'll get that fixed for you. We'll get it so there are two RSS feeds. You should have told me that because I haven't seen that yet. You know why? Because no one... I think I'm like a dinosaur in the web world where I subscribe

to RSS feeds. I don't think... The average Joe sure doesn't do it. I know this from my RSS feed. It's almost like that's my preference. I've been working that way for like over a decade now with RSS, but most people have no clue about, you know, since Google Reader died or whatever. Yeah, right. That's how I used to use them. Feedly, by the way, is, I found Feedly came along when Google Reader died, I went to Feedly, like it's feed.ly, and it's actually better than Google Reader. And I swear every day

I check my feed and that's how I follow lots of things, including The Athletic. We're all using Twitter now to kind of... Yeah, well, I do that too, but you're right. Twitter has replaced RSS in terms of having stuff pushed to you, like a syndication model, I'd say. But it was better in a sense having... There's this thing called Nuzzle. Have you seen Nuzzle? No.

It'll give you kind of like the highlights of your Twitter feed, all the people you follow, the most retweeted or liked. So it'll give you the highlights of your Twitter feed, all the people you follow, the most retweeted or liked. It's kind of the same idea, except it doesn't... So it emails me every morning, here are the top stories from your Twitter feed from yesterday.

So if you write... Because I read your piece about Auston Matthews, because my appetite for Auston Matthews stuff right now is really high. I can imagine. We've been talking about, maybe we should just write about this guy like every two days. Honestly, it reminds me of when was the last time there was a time when like my Blue Jay fever,

not even last year, but the year before when we had that like post, was it July 30th or something? Whenever the trade, we made the price move and we did, you know, we got to Lewicki. Everything, there was a period there where the hype train was in full effect with the Blue Jays, where I, everything written about the Blue Jays, I had to like absorb, like whether it was a podcast or any, it didn't matter if it was good or not.

Like I had to take it in and like everything. But of Auston Matthews, and part of it is I have almost, he's 15 in a couple of weeks. So I have a 15 year old who for Christmas got an Auston Matthews jersey, who is obsessed with Auston Matthews. who is obsessed with Auston Matthews and just seeing like Auston Matthews is like his

I don't think I had an equivalent because I was a Gilmore guy but Wendell Clark and Gilmore is not this. Like this is something special. So I read your piece about like he might be even better than we thought he was going to be and I absorbed that and if that had a lot of traction on Twitter, a lot of people linking that

which I think they did, that would show up in this guzzle? What did you call it? Nuzzle. Nuzzle. Yeah. So if the people you follow really like that Austin Matthews story, it might come in as the number one. And you can set a threshold. If 10 people retweet this, send me an email right away as soon as 10 people retweet.

So I have that set at 20. So if something big happens. Okay, cool. Yeah, yeah. That's cool. It's really useful. So the athletic launches in Chicago, they approach you, you do your due diligence, you decide these are people I want to be in business with.

Like you said, it's a unique opportunity. It doesn't come around every day. Yeah. But you're the, I noticed you were the only guy of note that was poached from a full-time gig,

if you will. Like everybody, who are great writers, by the way. Sean's right beside me, so I have to make sure. So far. Go ahead. Yeah, so far, so far, so far. I know you're negotiating with Bruce Arthur right now to see. I'm just kidding.

All right, so Sean, you were, of course, available. So this is, to me, an easier choice for you to make because you're available. See, I've got the right arm right now. I appreciate that. Yeah, I know, my left shoulder, not the broken not broken one um yeah i still had i mean i was talking to other people too i had i mean they they came to me i think in september and we started chatting um there are other opportunities i hate using the word opportunity it sounds like i'm a

marketer um but yeah no there are other things this is the sexiest one i think it's fair to say no no no there are other ones that were really interesting. There are opportunities in this. This was, I think the way James phrased it was better. It was just, it turned out just to be too good to turn down. Like, this is the first time something brand new has really launched, arguably. I mean, Sportsnet the magazine launched, but it was part of, you know, the broader Sportsnet brand. Maybe since National Post launched, that's something this new and the ability to sort of, you know, really try and shape it and use everything that you've learned to try and, you know, build something new and hopefully

find the key that will unlock everything that, you know, media needs to find to keep, you know, to become sustainable. The upside with this thing for us is massive, if it works. And if it doesn't work, obviously the downside is massive, too. But, you mentioned this earlier, the founders or whatever, you have the funding to give you, and you won't give us the timeline, but I'll make up a number. This is me making up a number, everybody. But let's say they said to you, we're going to

guarantee three years. I'm just making up that number. But they're going to give you a, because this is the kind of thing where you can't bail on this thing after nine months. You've got to have a certain amount of guaranteed time to fight for readers, if you will. And these things won't work if you don't give

them enough... What's that? Runway? Runway, yeah. That's a good term. Runway is a good one. Thank you. So you're sure you can't tell... You don't have to tell me that number, obviously. But this funding you mentioned, can you tell me anything about where the funding comes from? I heard maybe Stratva, the app? The Athletic uses because he's a programmer. Just a brilliant guy. You know, I met both of these guys, and I was blown away. Just incredibly smart venture capital people.

And the fact they were able to run this business in Chicago, show incredible growth over an eight-month period, six to eight-month period, and then meet with all of these investors and get them to put millions of dollars into the idea. I mean, they're very impressive. The one guy's 29 years old. The other guy's about 36. They're young guys. They really kind of, I think, understand that there's a need for something like this in a lot of markets, that the papers have been weakened, especially in sports, to the extent that there's an opening. And the people that are investing in the company see that as well.

Absolutely. There is an opening. Because like you said, all we see are cuts. And I think of David Alter, for example. So why don't we do this right now? Can we run down the current roster of writers at The Athletic Toronto? In addition to James Myrtle and Sean Fitz-Gerald. Do you mind?

Do you ever get confused with the other Sean Fitzgerald? At the Sun? There's three Sean Fitzgeralds in media in the Northeast. There's one who works in New York for Thrillist, for Vulture, writes for New York Magazine, I believe. He's from USC, and we crossed paths

on Twitter the year Notre Dame and Alabama ended up playing for the BCS. He was editor-in-chief of the student paper in USC, and we crossed paths. And it turns out he's born in Vancouver, but his parents raised him in Southern California. So there are times where I'll get email pitches for him

and for the other Sean Fitzgerald. But the other one, I think for sure, because he's in Toronto. Yeah. The Toronto Sun. We briefly worked at the same company. He was an intern at the National Post many years ago. And that's why you hyphenated your name. No, I'm just kidding.

That's absolutely it. Because that Sean Fitzgerald once wrote a top 10 podcast, Toronto podcast thing for the Sun and put me on that list. So I believe the other Sean fitzgerald he's got the lead yeah he's he's in my good books and he's like he's younger he's better looking he has hair like i mean that kid just owns it i gotta get that kid on here i actually uh uh would have him on just to ask him the questions i'm asking you to pretend like i thought he was you like i thought that might be i thought about that like what if I just pretended I thought this was

the other Sean Fitzgerald? He'd be smarter. He'd be a better interviewer, frankly. And he wouldn't keep staring at the Andre the Giant Kenny Rogers combination. All right,

so I won't call you Fitz hyphen Gerald. I appreciate that. We might just start calling him hyphen. Hyphen. The hyphenator. The hyphenator.

I haven't heard that since university. Sean's giving me a death stare. No, no no no that's probably like I was called Myrtle the turtle

it'll be a fun walk home James it'll be good you'll like it actually for fun real quick before we I have some more

athletic questions here but I thought if you guys had theme songs I played of this I wasn't going to do it because it's not very good but then I'm going to do it now

because you said Myrtle the turtle but I was thinking like like when I introduced James Myrtle, like editor-in-chief of The Athletic, James Myrtle. And then your song would be

Partners in Crime's Turtle Power. Oh, yeah. No, because Myrtle Turtle is not so good. Was this like the Ninja Turtles song? Yeah. The first one? I believe this was the first one, like the Ninja Turtles song? Yeah. The first one? I believe this was the first one

because the second one was Vanilla Ice. Oh yeah, that's right. And he had the cameo. Secret of the Ooze. Right. Ninja Turtles 2. I remember lining up

for that one. I didn't line up for that one. You guys are older than I am. I am, but I had a media pass. Not that I was in the media or anything, but I got a media pass

to see the sneak preview of the first one. And I really liked it with Casey Jones and everything. This one's okay. Yeah, it's pretty good. And you know, I made a funny splinter, you know. Come on. I made a funny. Yeah. You've seen that recently, haven't you? How old's your kid now? No, I just know it. How old's your kid now? He's almost two.

Yeah, because he was just like a newbie when you were here last time. Okay. Two. So a little young for introducing him to Secret of the Ooze. Oh, well, the second one's terrible. Well, two-year-olds are stupid. I can say that with authority. It's too violent for Minnie Myrtle. And for Sean Fitzgerald, I was saying, what do I introduce Fitzy with?

Fitzy, that's what I can call you, right? Fitzy is my nom de plume, yes. The wreck of the Edmund Fitzgerald. Very nice. Right? Very nice. Hey, the Fitzy. So that's how I was going to...

I think Sean won that competition. I got a Ninja Turtles theme song. I just get something that's super depressing. Gordon Light, yeah, a lot of people... Absolutely not going to get you fired up for this. It's a tragic story, actually. It is. And by the way, I should point out,

so I decided I'd do this, and then I decided I will not do this because it sucks. So all of this was like cutting room floor stuff. Right. I'm honored. I'm honored. Yet it's still here. Yet I did it anyway because I felt like a good rapport with you guys.

I think Fitz is a big Metallica guy. Metallica? We're just in town, right? It's weird. It's one of those things that I've sort of fallen back into the Metallica rabbit hole with the new release. I mean, there's only really three songs off the new album that I really like. I don't even know if you call them an album anymore.

What it's done is it's just I've just started listening to all of the old stuff again for the first time since high school. It's very strange. I remember the rockers in high school with the jean jackets and the Metallica, the big Metallica logos and stuff. They would have the big Metallica logos. They would have pen or something or markers.

Ours were, it was definitely pregame in the football locker room in high school. That's where you got your Metallica education. And that video for one, I remember on Much Music,

it was a long video, but when that came on, it was epic. It's like going to the movies. It's like, let's go. Yeah, it's like 116 minutes long. Yeah, I know. It was good stuff.

Okay, so in addition to you two, who is writing for The Athletic right now? Our associate editor is Caitlin McGrath, who has been like kind of the backbone of the whole operation. She's only written a couple of things, but she's doing things like a newsletter. She's running our social feeds.

And she came from the, she was, correct me if I'm wrong, but she was with Eric Kareem at the National Post? Actually, there's an example of someone that has been hired away. She was at Yahoo Sports. Okay. Yeah. We aren't all washed up reclamation projects is what you're saying, Michael, Mike. I wasn't saying that because I was saying

he was the key example of somebody. Fantastic. Dave Alter's covering the Leafs with me at the games. We have Josh Cloak, who is a younger up-and-coming guy who's also been writing some hockey stuff. And he's going to be our TFC soccer guy when TFC gets rolling again.

We're excited to have a bigger presence there than I think a lot of outlets. Eric Koreen on basketball, Blake Murphy on basketball. You're going quickly there, but I just need to point out that Eric Koreen is excellent. I'm not saying that guy's not, but Eric, I'm more familiar with his work. His basketball stuff is

great. And I'm glad he changed his Twitter avatar. I thought it was time to change it. But he's, in fact, he was coming over one day, Eric Kareem. And then I got this like almost game day, like we were going to record and I get this message. I didn't realize how far you are. I can't get there. And I'm like, I'm done with this guy. Like, you can't get here. Well, like, when were you going to figure out how far it is? Like, we had this date committed for weeks, and now you can't. He thought, when you said New Toronto, he thought you were in the city.

He didn't realize you were in Mimico. I'm going to ignore that, Fitzy, but my blood is boiling. I can see that. I can see that. And we have John Lott, who is, he has been amazing to work with, and I can't wait for the season to start just so that I get to spend more time with John and learning from him and talking with him. And he is our mentor and our veteran conscience and all kinds of different things. And he is so fired up to be part of this that it's really exciting.

And we're going to hire another full-time person to cover the Jays with him and work with him. And I think our Jays coverage is going to be fantastic. Okay, I'm going to say, and again, you guys didn't pay for any of this. This promotion is not paid, I should point out. I actually just am sincerely interested in this venture and I'm here to say, John Lott is excellent as well. This guy's top-notch,

Blue Jay stuff. And a recent guest on this show was Bob Elliott, okay, who retired. But I even talked to him, we talked for two hours. You guys are only going to do close to three hours, I think. But two hours for Bob Elliott, okay, who retired. But I even talked to him, we talked for two hours. You guys are only going to do, you guys are going to do close to three hours, I think, but two hours for Bob Elliott. And I could tell by talking to him,

he's got an itch, you know, he quit his gig at The Sun. He thought it was time or whatever. But he has an itch to keep writing. And I even mentioned you guys, and he mentioned John, he read some John Lott stuff and thought it was good or whatever. But I'm just saying, he and John Lott as a double duo

covering Jays, best in the city. Yeah, we're really looking for some... Younger person? No, no, no, no. Let me say what I was going to say. I'm trying to create

some ageism here. Well, we have John Lott who's, you know, in his 70s, but is amazing and we love working with him. And what I was going to say is we want to have

all kinds of different voices. We want to have, so, I mean, you know, Bob could be a possibility as a columnist or something like that, that we could use. And we're looking for that. Like we would love to get, we were talking about this today. We'd love to get a really high profile person, even if they're based in the U.S.,

to write about the Jays for us every two or three weeks or something, and just give a different perspective. Get like a really big name on baseball to go into that. We'd love to get some younger people writing as well. We'd love to have some analytic stuff written about the Jays. You know, we're going to, they're a very high priority for us. Did I see Down Goes Brown doing something with you guys recently? Yep.

So is that like an example of somebody who can kind of come in and do something now? He's a regular. He's every second Friday, he writes for us. I'm a big, I was a big fan just when he was a blogger on downgoesbrown.com, so I think he's fantastic. He's very funny, too. Now he's everywhere. Yeah, now he's everywhere.

But I'm glad he's also on The Athletic. So I see that you added TFC to the main menu. So you had Jays, Leafs, and Raptors, and now I see TFC is there. Yes, we had some complaints. Well, here's my question. Any Argos fans complaint? Have you heard from any Argos fans? We are working on our Argos strategy. We have we had some complaints. Well, here's my question. Any Argos fans complaint? Have you heard from any Argos fans? We are working on our Argos strategy.

We have things in the mix. It's possible that we will have someone doing that for us this year. Alright, great. In the Venn diagram, where you have people who would subscribe to The Athletic and Argos fans, two circles side by side, because the Argos fans are

older school guys. i don't know if you know this they're not they're not as savvy with the technology so we've had some older people sign up but yeah i mean generally speaking yes our audience is pretty young i mean the under 40 crowd is is big on the athletic so far but i i think that we like the idea of covering the cfl we're just gonna we have to make sure that it makes financial sense for us to do it. When does the free preview, because it's free preview still at the Athletic Toronto. When does that end?

I think you'll see a lot of stuff. We're putting kind of the archive material is behind the paywall. If you sign up for the app, I don't know if you, have you seen the app? I've definitely heard, I've read about the app, but I haven't tried the app.

If you get the app, you'll run into the paywall faster well then I don't want noise kidding well for subscribers it's for subscribers but the apps in the top 30 in both the Apple and the Google Play Store it's been a hot commodity the thing with the everyone's worried about the free preview we're still gonna going to have a ton of stuff that's going to be free. Even like the whole site's not going to be closed down as a paywall site. We just need enough stuff behind the paywall that we're making. We're getting subscribers and we're making an income. The more people that subscribe,

the fewer articles we will pay. Well, do you have any, like any concerns that people are used to getting this stuff for free? Like, you know, if they go to, I don't make to make it up, like sportsnet.ca or something. Well, we have to give them something different and something better. I mean, that's the bottom line.

So that's your differentiator is the quality of your writers and the scope of kind of the content you provide. We hope so. That's the goal. But like I said, we're not going to put everything behind the wall. So we're going to have, you know, if we break a big story, it's probably not going to be behind the wall because we want everyone to read it and we want everyone to come see our site and get to know our content. I mean,

in the early going, I've only been part of The Athletic now for a month. We're just trying to create awareness about it, you know, and do shows like this. And we want people

to hear about the brand and it's, we've had great response. We've had a ton of people sign up, even though they don't necessarily have to, to read everything.

Sean, I got a question for you. As a former Toronto Starian, do you know, and I hope I say this name right because I've only ever read it, Raju Mudhar? Yes. Am I saying that correctly? Raju. Raju Mudhar?

Mudhar. Mudhar. Okay, so I butchered it. That's fine. Raju Mudhar? I don't know why I can't get that but he wrote an article in the Star and I hope you guys will respond to this I'm going to read what he wrote in the Star

and I think it's important to know that he's writing in the Star which I think is would be somewhat and some level would be threatened by a venture like the Athletic because if you guys do it better and people go there, then it's sort of like your competition, I think, on some regard. So let me just see what Rahul wrote.

Generation Next. In terms of technology and sports media, the biggest things on the horizon include virtual reality headsets and more stories written by computers with machine learning. That said, The Athletic, a subscription-based online-only startup focusing on local sports, which started in Chicago and launched in Toronto in October, is a very intriguing addition. It's no secret that traditional media are getting beat up all over. All of the major newspapers in Toronto downsized this year.

The Sportsnet magazine just published its final print edition. The Athletic scooped up a number of the free agents let go by more traditional outlets. Hockey writer James Myrtle recently left the Globe and Mail to become the outlet's editor-in-chief, which was a high-profile defection. I like some of the writers, but so far I haven't seen much that makes me want to pay for it. It's early, but at this point the coverage is fairly nuts and bolts. That said, a new player with some really talented sports writers is a good thing. Hopefully it hits stride and causes everybody to up their game. So at first you're thinking, it's sort of a backhanded compliment in a way, right? Because he's saying, oh, this is good, the competition, but he's basically saying,

it's nothing I'd pay for is what I think he says in there. Like, what do you think of that? I think we'll be okay without him. Nuts and bolts. I mean, you read the Austin Matthews stuff. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Is that nuts and bolts? No, no, no.

Is John Lott or Eric Kareem or, I mean, I think a lot of, you know, we do have some stuff that is, we want to provide the information to people. We want to tell them what happened at practice, what the Leafs lineup looks like. We do have some of that nuts and bolts kind of stuff, but no, we're aiming high with stuff that isn't that at all. And you're going to do some more stories and stuff

that are definitely not nuts and bolts stuff. I try to type words into sentences that form paragraphs, and those paragraphs, when threaded together, can turn into stories. Yeah, there was one not long ago. It was hockey players and their strange language and how they wheel-snipe Selly and Toey and bar-down-ski and fur-da-boys and fur-da. And the story used Letterkenny, the Crave TV series,

as the jumping point that they have two characters that Jared Kiso, who's the creator and co-showrunner, has entire characters built on hyperbole of what hockey players speak. So we had a story in, what, maybe a week ago, 10 days ago, using linguists to say, is hockey its own language? Well, no, it's not. It's jargon, but it's still based in English. But just sort of exploring in a fun kind of way how the hockey dressing room can be a petri dish for something like this.

You know, how, you know, when words are introduced, how they can spread so quickly and, you know, how something that somebody says in Vancouver can become, you know, en vogue in Florida just because of the weird way that hockey presents itself. That was a hugely successful story for us. It was one of our most popular stories. Analytics, man.

How often are you looking at, like, site analytics? I've always done that, though. I mean, I was doing that when I ran my own site. And I was doing that. I worked for SB Nation and Vox. And even at the Globe and Mail, I was looking at all my stuff all the time. I did.

Yeah, I find it really helpful. Like, I can imagine, like, when you see, oh, look at the apathy for Austin Matthews, it does suggest to you that we should produce more Austin Matthews content. And on the other side, too, I mean, if you write something, like, I've noticed, like, really, like, if you pick some esoteric topics, sometimes people don't care. Like, if you're writing about how the peak penalty kill works or something like that, it doesn't always do a huge amount. You know what I mean? Right. Conversely, you can see what people,

what does not resonate with people and where the interest lies. Which, yeah, I mean, you're talking to a guy who has ran a site for a long time and I've always been interested in the analytics and what people click and what they don't and what they read and what they don't and all that stuff.

So it's cool that you're at a place now where you can see it in an operation that in time will need to generate its own revenue at some point in time. We're generating. Well, I'm going to assume. Come on. I'm assuming when you start a venture like this, you rely on the investment money and stuff and that you have a certain amount of time before you actually have to, you know, hit certain goals. Our goal is to be breakeven at the end of 2017.

And I mean, we're on pace to be well past that right now. Oh, good. But I don't know. We don't know if people are going to continue to subscribe at the rate they are right now or not. But that's the goal. And when you hit this target, this goal you refer to, you can afford to keep the number of writers that you've...

Absolutely. You said you're going to add more. Absolutely. So this is... And Sean's not doing this for free. Are you, Sean? The podcast, you mean? Yes, I believe I am doing the podcast for free.

I think we get this beer. I'm taking that Kenny Rogers CD and staring at it. No, you guys get six-pack each and you get two meals. Like, that's actually... You get less for most podcasts. I think you guys... Speaking of podcasts, I saw a tweet from Jeff Merrick to you, James Myrtle, about now that you're not with The Globe, can you come on his podcast or something to that effect?

And I was just curious, does the Rogers podcasting stuff have rules about like certain companies? Obviously not Bell, because Bell would be like a big rival and I could see them having that rule. But was there anything where like a Globe and Mail employee couldn't appear on a Rogers podcast? No, the complication was, I think a fan had asked him that or something and he was responding to... Maybe. A fan said they wanted to have me on their podcast. The complication is I've got to deal with TSN

and I have for a long... With TSN radio. Okay, okay, okay. That I've had for a long time. So that's still in effect though because that's not tied to the Globe. That's tied to James Myrtle. Right.

Is that right? Okay, okay. Yeah, so I appear on 1050, you know, two or four times a week or whatever it is. Is there any chance maybe for some alliance via that channel, like some athletic alliance with TSN and to kind of get more exposure?

Anything expanded beyond James Myrtle to like the athletic people? Well, I mean, Sean's been doing, I mean, you've been on frequently. Where have you been? I've been everywhere. I'm the wind. No, I mean, they've been doing, I mean, you've been on frequently. Where have you been? I've been everywhere. I'm the wind. No, I mean, they've been great. I was on The Breakfast Club, TSN radio yesterday. I was on a couple of weeks before that.

I've done radio hits regularly with the new TSN affiliate in Hamilton, as well as the one in Toronto. Eric Corrine's been doing radio at 1050. I think Alter has been on. So they've been hugely supportive of us, for sure. Eric Corrine's been doing radio at 1050. I think Alter has been on. So they've been, they've been hugely supportive of us, for sure. No, that's great. And I guess you make sense.

If you're doing a lot of TSN stuff, is it safe to say the Rogers stuff, you're sort of... No, I was on for the Lou Marsh Award in early December.

I was on the Tim and Sid show. I was on The Fan. I mean, because we're not affiliated on either side. I mean, we're basically. That's my advantage. Exactly. I mean, I don't have an affiliation with either of the telephone companies, so I can really appear anywhere.

And outside of Mr. Myrtle, I think that's pretty true of all of us. Oh, no, wicked. Is there any plans to have athletic podcasts? We already do. Do you? Yeah. I feel silly. Like, hey, tell me

the athletic podcasts you have right now. And I don't know why I don't know that. I'm going to fire my research staff. Well, we've moved, I've been doing

a Leafs podcast with Jonas Siegel for years, and we've moved that under the athletic umbrella. We have done some Leafs ones with David Alter, which are kind of

his updates from what's happening in the dressing room and things like that. We have done some Leafs ones with David Alter, which are kind of his updates from what's happening in the dressing room and things like that. We announced, I think it was yesterday that the Raptors podcast is in the works. That's going to be Eric Kareem and Blake Murphy and maybe sometimes special guests. That's going to be, I think it's going to be a weekly podcast.

So for sure, we're going to have Leafs, Raptors. And of course, once we have our new hire on the Jays, John Lott and the new hire and some of our other staff are going to be doing a Jays podcast in the summer. So we're going to have three on the three big sports.

John Lott, I invited him on the show before The Athletic. And he told me he's strictly a print guy, doesn't do broadcasting. So when I hear that John Lott got a podcast, my potatoes will be boiled. I will be as upset as I was when you called me Mimico Mike. I'm going to be very upset. I didn't know that. Did you know that, that John wouldn't do it?

I did not know that. But it is a long drive out to Mimico. Well, you know, before, we didn't even get to geography yet. It was basically a print-only, I'm not a broadcast guy. Well, we'll see. We'll see.

I got the same thing from Rosie DiManno, by the way. We have a lot of staff that... Like, Caitlin is going to cover some of the Blue Jays. Fitzy's going to cover some of the Blue Jays. Blake Murphy's going to cover some of the Blue Jays. The new person we're going to hire. We have enough people that will have a good podcast. And we can do special guests.

We can bring people on kind of like this, but not in a Mimico basement. Wait, Fitzy, McGrath, Murphyphy is this an irish only or am i is this an irish only myrtle is not irish myrtle is scottish is this a correct is this a british isles irish only organization anyone outside there no is korean irish by any chance no he's thinking he says no you can't shake your head at a podcast. I just assumed you were on camera somewhere. No. Are you kidding me?

I'd be wearing my makeup. All right. So that's the podcast. They exist. There's going to be more. If John Lott does a podcast, Toronto Mike will be very angry. But I'll still read his stuff. I think he'd be fantastic on a podcast.

He would be very good. Yeah. Well, maybe he was just being nice. Maybe he didn't. I don't do Toronto Mike. Maybe Kareem told him how far out you have to come to get here. Most of you, except for you two, you athletic guys have been evading me before.

I'm telling you, Kareem makes up some lousy excuse on game day. I got the John Lott excuse. Although David Alter's been on, so maybe... We drove in here from East York. We had to leave at 9 o'clock in the morning to get here. It was worth the drive. Okay, let me just see here. I got a few more tough questions here.

I got a question about Twitter. So you guys are both active on Twitter. I've been following you guys for a long time, especially Myrtle here, who I've been following forever. Just to learn, I was trying to educate myself on analytics and hockey. At first, it was a little confusing, but he put it in a way that I could even understand, which I appreciate it. So I have a question about blocking on twitter so how come some sports

writers uh like on twitter seem to uh go on block rampages so everyone's different with how they block maybe tell me your personal rule of start with you sean what's your personal rule for blocking someone on twitter here's the thing is that i don't, I mean, I don't, I'm not a columnist. So I, you know, my opinions aren't necessarily always out there in what I write. I mean, not, not actively. No hot takes? I mean, I do hot takes on Twitter. I'll say this is silly.

But I think the audience that I've been able to develop, I mean, frankly, I've become friends with a lot of them. I've, I've, I've t've become friends with a lot of them. I've tipped some adult beverages with many of them. So I think the folks that I get to interact with and my interactions on Twitter, generally quite light and funny, interesting discussions. I don't get a lot of anger. Not like Mike Willner is what you're telling me. I do understand and appreciate that not everybody's Twitter experience is anywhere near mine. I think maybe I'm very, very lucky at the community that I've found my way into because I do see it. Other folks have just really angry exchanges on that medium, and I see it.

But I've just been very lucky that I haven't become sort of, I don't know, victims, the right word maybe. Maybe you're flying below that. I don't know. I don't know if I'm flying below it. It's just the interactions I have. I keep it light and breezy on Twitter usually. Sean's just beloved. In the eight years or whatever, however long I've been on Twitter, maybe I've blocked four people.

Okay, that's nothing. That's nothing. Absolutely. I think I could beat that number. Maybe it might just be as low as four people. Okay. Absolutely. I think I could beat that number.

Maybe it might just be as low as four people. Okay. Now, I'm assuming, James, I'm assuming you get more anger on Twitter than Sean's explaining. What is your policy for blocking? Have you had to block people in the past? Oh, yeah. More than four? Yeah. Yeah.

I would say it's probably in the hundreds, but not like the, I don't know, maybe 200. I'm not 100% sure. I haven't looked at that number. I had to set a line a few years ago just so that there was, and there's also muting as well, which is helpful. The line for blocking is someone insulting me or going after me in a way that I think is way over the line. I'm totally fine if people disagree with the story.

I actually like having conversations and debates about stories. And I find a lot of times people will disagree and I'll explain my position a little bit more. And they'll be like, okay, that makes a little bit more sense. Or, you know, I think the back and forth that Sean's talking about and getting to know your audience and talking to people. I mean, for all, there's so much coverage of Twitter in this very negative sense. I think it's been a huge positive. I mean, I love interacting with people on there. It's great. And, you know, I posted the other day, the day after the, uh,

Centennial Classic, I said, how was everyone's experience with the game? Like, and people were sending me videos of them watching the game and the winning goal. And people were sending me all these pictures. And, uh, I, I had hundreds and hundreds of, of responses and I, it was great. I mean, it's like, what a powerful tool that you can reach right out. I couldn't believe how many people following me were at the game. Like there were tons of them. From a it's like, what a powerful tool that you can reach right out. I couldn't believe how many people following me were at the game. Like, there were tons of them. From a fan's perspective, it's just amazing in this day and age that you can kind of read something somebody wrote. Somebody like yourself wrote about Auston Matthews.

And you can now, you can tweet directly to that person with like a question that will be answered by that person. Like, if you told Mike that 20 years ago, I'd be like, no way. Milt Dunnell, how do I, I don't write a snail mail or whatever, put in the mail. And I respond to like, especially like if you're, if you say good story or whatever, it's,

it's, it's fantastic. I mean, the vast majority of what I get is, is positive and that's great. But I mean, I think the, the people that I have to block most of the time are like Habs fans or Canucks fans that just hate the Leafs.

And it has nothing to do with me or the story I've written or whatever. And it's usually vulgar and it's usually has swearing in it. And they're telling me to do such and such and whatever. I mean, then it's goodbye. Okay, let me wheel and deal with you, James, here for a moment. So I mentioned after this podcast, I'm going to send you a link to a menu from Chef's Plate and you're going to pick two free meals and a shipping address is going to come.

So all I ask for in exchange for these two free meals from Chef's Plate, all I ask is there's a young lady in British Columbia named Karina with a K. Oh, I already unblocked her. Did you? Yeah. I already did that yesterday.

Oh, then I don't have to give you the meals. This is perfect. No, I'm just kidding. That's fine. I'm giving you the meals anyways. But okay, so this deal, if Karina's listening, because she's actually a patron of this podcast, that's why I go above and beyond for Karina.

You are unblocked now by James Myrtle, and this guilt thing I'm doing now is irrelevant and unnecessary because the work is done. That's usually how it works. I've actually had a lot of people email me and say, I said this to you two years ago. I realized I shouldn't have done that. Can you unblock me?

Because I want to read your coverage and I want to read your tweets. It's like, okay, that's fine. You repented. That's beautiful, actually. Okay, so Karina's good. She's back in your good graces. By the way, you mentioned this to me, I think, via DM or something, James. But Jeff Blair blocks everyone, right?

Because I'm blocked by Jeff Blair. And I've never done anything in my life. I don't say negative things about you guys generally anyways, but I sure have never said anything negative about Jeff Blair, who I kind of like. He blocked me. I know you're not Jeff Blair. Yeah, I think you should have Jeff on to talk about that.

I can't tweet at him to invite him. It's a very difficult Catch-22. All right, I promised you guys an hour. We're at an hour, but I'm going to end with the Nike ad. So we were watching the World Juniors are airing this Nike ad all the time. And it's the words on the black screen and the robot or whatever computer voice

reading these words about celebrities, celebrities, whatever, whatever. Sean, you hate this ad passionately. It hurts my face. It does. I mean, there's some ads that grow on you. This one's not growing on me. I'm not going to lie. It just seems like it's... I was there. I took my little guy to the Denmark-Russia quarterfinal. We sat in the lower bowl,

and the ad came on, I think, once a period. And even he, he's five years old. He looked up, and he sort of cocked his head to the side. Like, what am I watching here? What am I listening to? Why are they doing this to me? Okay, I'm here to not, I'm not going to defend the ad, except to say that there's so many repetitive ads when I watch the World Juniors. It's the only time I see ads are when I watch live sports.

I happen to watch a lot of live sports. So I've been watching a lot of the Juniors. I'm going to watch tonight in the semifinals against Sweden. So I've seen a lot of ads, and they're repeating these. Scotiabank ads and this, and there's nothing particularly creative or interesting. At least I found the Nike ad was at least on some level thought-provoking. It at least evoked some kind of an interest. Like, oh, what's that?

And then when I heard it again, I'm like, oh, at least it was something of substance of interest. I don't know. I just don't want to shit all over it because so many words add. It gets you noticed, but I mean, so does passing gas in a crowded elevator. It doesn't make it right. James, do you have any hot takes? By the way, Kareem invented the term hot take, right? He did.

We did research at that, I think, when we were all at the Post. And it was determined that, I don't know if we did it or if the Washington Post did it and cited it, but Eric Carin did, in fact. Really? He was the very first one? He was the very first one to use hot takes. This is what I believe to be true. Wow. He doesn't get enough credit for that, right?

If he does listen to me, he's going to kill me for almost slipping Mike Carin. I guess that could be a claim to fame forever, I think, if you coined a term like that. It might have been part of his Twitter bio briefly. Who here has coined a term that became commonly used? That's it. The hot take is Eric Carin. That's it. All right.

So do you, James, have any hot take on the Nike ad? Or are you going to abstain from this one? I don't think I've even seen it. Okay. That means you've been lucky enough to bid at the games. Don't even watch the commercials. There you go. So no opinion.

But I know that Sean hated it. And I don't think it was commercials. There you go. So no opinion, but I know that Sean hated it and I don't think it was so bad. But hey, to each his own, right? Will Auston Matthews be the captain before the next season begins? James Myrtle. Maybe. I don't think so, but maybe.

I'd say probably not yet just because he is too young and he's got enough on his shoulders. I could see them waiting one more year. One more year, yeah. Shani will do what's right. Mimico Shani will do what's right. Hey, thank you guys. How much, if I right now, if I'm listening to this podcast and I want to go to The Athletic,

tell me exactly where to go and how much it will cost me to become a subscriber to The Athletic Toronto. The Athletic.com is where you want to go. And we can come up with some kind of a discount if people are listening to this. Maybe just shoot me a tweet and I'll send you back the discount link. It'll be a very good deal. Promo code Toronto Mike.

We'll see. We'll see. But, you know, one of the things we want to do is we want to make this a really reasonably priced thing. I mean, we're talking $3, $4 a month. and that's more than enough to support us and in the starbucks culture that's like one drink come on and just for like the app alone i think people are going to get their money's worth and we're doing it we're actually doing our first subscriber event on january 11th it's free for subscribers okay free alcohol january. Which, what day is today? Next week. Next Wednesday.

Next Wednesday. Where is it? It's like Blore and Shaw, Blore and Christie kind of neighborhood. Okay. Yep. You can check the Athletic Facebook link for the details. Yep. Yep.

We're going to be promoting it a lot on Twitter. So if you sign up for three or four bucks a month, you can come, you get free drinks, and you can hang out with us. But it's not Great Lakes Beer. It's another brewery. Is that? No, I'm just kidding. But it's free.

Yeah, I think we have a different sponsor. That's all right. That's excellent. That's cool. That's next Wednesday, and that's near Christy Pits there, whatever, Christy and Bloor area. Very cool. And that brings us to the end of our 211th show. You can follow me on Twitter.

I'm at Toronto Mike. James is at Myrtle, M-I-R-T-L-E. Sean is at... You're not going to go through the whole one for me, too? I'm offended. Well, there's an underscore instead of a hyphen. You don't have it memorized or written down? Come on.

I have XXX, so this is my bad. I'm sorry. You were a little bit early. Sean Fitz underscore Gerald. There you go. I have XXX. Oh. So this is my bad. I'm sorry. You were a little bit early. Sean Fitz underscore Gerald. There you go. See, I know. Sean Fitz underscore Gerald. And our friends at Great Lakes Brewery

are at Great Lakes Beer and Chef's Plate is at Chef's Plate CA. See you all next week. Well, I've been told that there's a sucker born every day. But I wonder who. Yeah, I wonder who. Maybe the one who doesn't realize there's a thousand shades of gray. Because I know that's true. Yes, I do.

I know it's true. Yeah. I know it's true. How about you?