Toronto Mike'd: The Official Toronto Mike Podcast - Jay Ferguson from Sloan: Toronto Mike'd #712

Episode Date: August 26, 2020

Mike chats with Jay Ferguson about his kickass rock band Sloan.

Welcome to episode 712 of Toronto Mic'd, a weekly podcast about anything and everything. Proudly brought to you by Great Lakes Brewery, a fiercely independent craft brewery who believes in supporting communities, good times and brewing amazing beer. CDN Technologies, your outsourced IT department. Garbage Day, weekly reminders for garbage, recycling, and yard waste pickup. Visit GarbageDay.com slash Toronto Mike to sign up now. StickerU.com. Create custom stickers, labels, tattoos, and decals for your home and your business. The Keitner Group.

They love helping buyers find their dream home. Text Toronto Mike to 59559. Pumpkins After Dark. Save 10% with the promo code Toronto Mike. And Palma Pasta. Enjoy the taste of fresh homemade Italian pasta and entrees from Palma Pasta in Mississauga and Oakville. I'm Mike from torontomike.com and joining me this week is Sloan founder and swell dude Jay Ferguson. Hello. Welcome Jay. Thanks very much Mike.

Thanks for having me. Episode 712 like that's is there that impressive it's very impressive is there a podcast or anything that has had more than 712 episodes? Oh, I'm sure. Like I'm sure. Have you done the research? Uh, yeah. For, I produce a podcast. Uh, Humble and Fred have a podcast.

Oh, okay. You produce, I produce their podcast and we started, so that's actually what inspired my show is that I was the backend producer guy and I watched them do their thing in 2011. They were doing it every day of the week. Wow. And that's, what is that? That's like nine years ago. Yeah.

Long story short is I'm like, I can do that. Like, let me try to like, maybe I can leave my comfort zone and speak into a microphone and have conversations with fascinating people like Jay Ferguson of Sloan. We'll see. The jury's still out.

Eight years later, here I am am so i guess that's a long-winded way of saying i produce a show with more episodes than i have like they have more episodes that's uh to use the word that is overused epic i suppose isn't it uh i like the word epic uh use that uh early and often please sprinkle the word epic liberally throughout our conversation but you're so uh like i'm really like impressed by the fact that you looked at the weather the forecast and you saw that we were originally going to record at 3 30 p.m and you saw that there was rain in the forecast and you would you adjusted your schedule to get it in before the rain like to me that's a very

thoughtful move on your part well thanks and also And also, I was looking forward to it happening and I didn't want it to get rained out. And I knew that we were going to be recording in your lovely backyard here. Well, thank you. Are we in Mimico? Is that where we are exactly? No, now I have to mute you.

That's an offense. Oh, no, really? So without giving- I don't even know where I am. Okay, I'll tell you where you are. I'm good at this, okay? Yes, once you get west of the Humber River, you're in Mimico in the southern part of the city okay so but then when you reach and we won't give specifics but

when you reach the numbered streets yes so there's numbered streets from like 1 to 40 or something yeah now numbered streets you're out of mimico so the numbered streets belong they're shared between new toronto and long. So right now, Mr. Jay Ferguson, you're sitting in New Toronto. Really? I had no idea. I didn't know there was a New Toronto. I'm so happy to be here. I don't know if I knew there was a New Toronto until I bought a house here. Right. Okay. Well, anyhow, the area is lovely and this backyard is lovely. So yes, I was concerned that we'd get rained on. So I did a little research. No, thank you so much.

This is much better because the skies look like they're going to hold up. And I got a big umbrella. I was worried about you burning. Thank you. I'm fair-skinned and of Scottish descent. So the closer I am to the equator is not where I should be. So this is a good day for you because this is kind of no humidity and there's not too much sun today.

And I got a big umbrella, but I don't have the umbrella here. So it's like I have like no joke because I had, last week I had Stephen Del Duca. He's the leader of the Ontario Liberal Party and he was there. And it started to rain out of nowhere, like one of those sudden things. And I like frantically like raced to find an umbrella. of the Ontario Liberal Party, and he was there. And it started to rain out of nowhere, like one of those sudden things. And I frantically raced to find an umbrella. This gear is expensive, Jay.

Well, that's what I was so worried about. Like you have a recording studio on your deck. So I did not want... Like I won't run down the itinerary, but the cameras alone are this much, and this board was really expensive. Don't let me tell you what a MacBook Pro costs these days. The microphones are expensive. I'm like, this rainstorm could cost me thousands and thousands of dollars.

That's what I was really looking out for was your gear, basically. Thanks, man. That's all I had at the top of mind. You must have made some noise here because I noticed, once I announced that my next guest was going to, or my upcoming guest was Jay Ferguson from Sloan. I saw on Twitter thatloan was trending all weekend right for all of the well depending on what side of the line you fall on or multiple lines that

maybe that's a good thing or a bad thing but uh in a venn diagram yes of sloan fanatics the band sloan and fans of the uh i guess he's an MP, Derek Sloan from the Conservative Party. I have a feeling those are two separate circles. Yes, you know what? Who knows? I don't want to necessarily isolate anybody from following us. But yeah, I don't know if those circles will collide too much. I like to think they won't, but you know, there you go.

Yeah. Yeah, you're right. You don't want to like, it must be tough because they won't, but, you know, there you go. Yeah, you're right. You don't want to, like, it must be tough because you can't, you don't want to, like, piss off a potential concert ticket buyer who loves your music, but at the same time, you have to be true to your own values. That's, of course, yes, that's right. And I have steered clear.

I feel like I know a little more about Peter McKay, since he's out from the East Coast, than I do about Derek Sloan. But I think Derek Sloan was also trending a few months ago over some comments or something. And I think that Sloan had begun trending and people were like, hey, what's going on? Are we randomly getting buzz from new fans?

But sadly, no. It was just due to a politician. It's not like a twice removed reissue or something that everyone's very excited about that's right yeah no we've we've we've done that one already so uh those people have already been excited and gone past that um okay so i mentioned to you before i press record that ron hawkins from lowest to the low is coming over tomorrow okay and uh he made he makes a joke like that the lowest of the low followists, most of whom are in the city or maybe just over the border in Buffalo or whatever.

But he made the joke that they've now sold them, all the loyalists have now had to buy like Shakespeare My Butt three times. Three times? Yeah, three times he says. They would reissue it and then there'd be the box version or whatever. So is there any, do you ever feel like, I'm just curious because i thought that was a funny remark like oh we can't like we can't sell them the same art again just repackaged i don't know if sloan has those uh same concerns uh i mean we do have concern a little bit like one thing is take for example

twice removed which is uh an album of ours or one chord to another that would have come out in... 96. 94, 96, yeah, exactly. That's one chord, yeah. I'm a professional Sloan scholar here. I appreciate it. I'll be here if you screw up. I appreciate how quick you got to the date before I did.

So what we have done over the years, and probably most recently, was in... Gosh, what year is it? 2012, we did a reissue of Twice Removed that came out in a box set where it included demos and outtakes that weren't released at the time, as well as like a nice book and everything.

So Chris and I, I mean, everybody in the band has probably saved stuff, but Chris and I have probably saved the most in an archive of photos and recordings and everything like that so that we're able to produce these things. and i feel like we've approached them from a real fan perspective and and in that year 2012 we did a tour where we played twice removed from front to back and reissued the box set so we have sort of taken advantage of those similar things that lowest

of the low have done but i like to think that you know i haven't seen the lowest of the low have done, but I like to think that, you know, I haven't seen the lowest to the low, uh, reissues or anything, but, uh, for our band, I like to think that we've, uh, taken the fan perspective into account and tried to make them as, uh, as good value as possible and high quality, which, and, and they're limited edition. So, you know, we don't, uh, you know, if you want to get them, you sort of have to get them soon. And they're a little bit more expensive. So we don't know if we're going to have, you know, 2,000 people or 3,000 people want to buy them. We've sort of, we've done three of these sort of box sets. And we've sort of found that 1,000 to 1,200 is kind of the range for these expensive items kind of thing, you know. Well, didn't Gene Simmons have that thing going where if you bought it from, if you bought the big box set of Gene Simmons crap,

I don't know who would buy it, but he would personally deliver it. Could you do something like that where Jay Ferguson shows up at the door with the box set? I like to think that my dignity... No, I'm just kidding. No, I don't know if I would go that far. But yeah, Gene doing that. The big joke that we have is that Gene was going on about how it was, whatever,

10 CDs, like CDs. Like, so it's basically free. You know what I mean? Yeah. Cause you can buy the spindles. Remember we used to buy those spindles, 50 CDs for like,

I was like, I don't know, 20 bucks or something. Anyhow. Yeah. No, I, Gene,

Gene has his own ways of, by the way, it was just his birthday, like yesterday or today. I didn't know that. I feel... There you go. I can say, as I mentioned earlier,

I produced the Humble and Fred show. Once we booked a phoner for Humble and Fred to talk to Gene Simmons, and Gene Simmons was over the phone to promote some nonsense. What a dick. I'm just going to say that. A real bad experience.

That's too bad. I mean, I'm not shocked. Not even surprised. But whatever. It's too bad. Yeah, I think'm not shocked, not even surprised, but whatever. It's too bad. Yeah, I think a lot of people feel the same way. Gene's not invited on Toronto Mic, only cool cats like you. I'm going to go way back. So, we're going to go way back in that I'm literally going to play something from when Jay Ferguson was 12 years old. That's literally going to happen, so prepare yourself. But I'm going to

play something else. I'm just going to play a little of this, and then I'm going to ask you the first question from my good friend, Mark Hebbshire. First of all, do you know. I'm just going to play a little of this and then I'm going to ask you the first question from my good friend Mark Hebbshire. Yeah. First of all, do you know what I'm listening to? Yeah, it's a little song

I wrote when I was about seven years old. Okay, so do you know what this is? Thunder Island. Of course, I wrote it. I know. No, I'm just kidding.

No, but the first question from Mark Hebzer yeah have you ever been confused with the US musician songwriter Jay Ferguson who played in Spirit and Jojo Gunn

Hebsey wants to know absolutely and it happens on a regular basis on Facebook so I have an account on Facebook and I get regular messages from people like, Hey man, I saw you play in spirit and 71 and blew my mind. How are you doing these days? And, and I don't know whether to answer or, I mean, some,

I think some of them I answered and I just stopped answering them. But even like one guy from Black Oak, Arkansas, if you remember that sort of hard rock band from the 70s. No. Do you remember that band? Anyhow, I think they were kind of like, I don't know if they were like, well, I was going to say Black Oak, Arkansas. I was going to say Southern, but Southern-ish anyhow,

kind of rock band. Like Mountain? What are we talking about? Definitely like handlebar mustaches and long hair, leather cowboy hats, like that kind of look. So one of those guys reached out to me and said, hey man, remember touring back? I was just talking with so-and-so from Black Oak,

Arkansas the other day, and we were having a great time. And remember those times we parted? And I've often wanted to write back and say like, you know what? Just jokingly like, you know what? I never liked you guys.

You guys were, anyhow, that's a, that's a mean thing to do, but I would not do that. But no, that's terrible. But yeah,

no, I get a lot of people reaching out to me and I've sort of given up answering them. But I think he's a composer now. Okay, I was going to blow minds, please. Let's hold this up because I'm going to fade out of the wonderful Thunder Island, which is a pretty good jam.

Okay, it is great. Do you know what song this is? We're going to learn if you own a television now. I own a television, but I... We'll give it a moment. Yeah. Is this like an ABC after-school special? No.

And this is the full version, so the TV version's a little shorter. Like, this part's not in the TV, but I the TV version's a little shorter. Like, this part's not in the TV, but I'll bring it down a bit. But this is the theme from the very popular NBC sitcom, The Office. Oh, is this the American Office? Really? Yeah.

Oh, wow. Okay. And the composer of this theme song, which is, yeah, but it's okay. I mean, a lot of people like The Office. And composed by Jay Ferguson. Is it the same guy? Is it the same guy? Is it the same guy from? Yes.

Okay. That makes sense. Cause I still, I get people in the film, uh, like television and music, uh, licensing community reaching out to me saying,

Hey, uh, I love that. Are you still working on blah, blah, blah. Right. Like NCIS or whatever.

Sure. Yeah, exactly. So I've not seen either, but no, I haven't seen, we're too young. We're too young for that. I think, I think you gotta be over 60. I think I'm too young. Right, like NCIS or whatever. Sure, yeah, exactly. Which I've not seen either, but whatever that is. No, I haven't seen it. We're too young for that, I think. I think you gotta be over 60. I think I'm too young. No, I'm just kidding. Yeah, sorry, I should recognize, I have seen The Office, of course, many times, but I don't recognize it. But maybe if you watch it on

Netflix, for example, you might be skipping the intro. Right, yeah, fair enough. Because that feels like if you watch a show on Netflix, you don't see the actual opening theme. Yes, that's true. Yeah, you can sort of skip right over it. I feel like I was more, I loved the BBC version, of course, which was fantastic. And I never really continued with the American one, even though I saw it many times. But I haven't watched it in years.

But yes. Okay, I know that this is about the Jay Ferguson from Sloan, but my last little Jay Ferguson American songwriter, singer is, okay, so his big band was Spirit. Yeah. This is the famous Spirit song that people think Led Zeppelin ripped off. Yeah. Stairway to Heaven.

Stairway to Heaven. I only heard this for the first time last Friday. Are you kidding me? I'm not even kidding because I was Chris Murphy, my compadre. Who's been on Toronto Mike. He's an FOTM. Yes, I heard. I heard these.

He had a cool jacket. Right. FMOC, is that the word? Famous man on campus? Is that what it is? I don't know. But you're now an FOTM. Okay.

But he played it for me last Friday, and I'd never heard it before. That's unbelievable. Yeah. So here, did he tell you that Jay Ferguson composed it? That's amazing. So it does have the feel what what are your thoughts when he played it for you do you think uh led zeppelin uh because they apparently toured with spirit uh so there was like an opera they had an opportunity to hear it

like on stage and then shortly thereafter they you know release, release Stay With Heaven. It makes sense. There's that little, like, descending figure that I can see, but it doesn't really... I feel like the the lead's up. Okay, listen. Here it is. It's pretty freaking close, Jay. Yeah. But then the chords are different there.

It's just the descending part yeah like yeah this part all the tears are gone and she's gone yeah is this taking you back to high school dances

it does they always played this song or Telegraph Road by Dire Straits because it was longer like as the last dance you know what I mean of course

because people want the longest song for the last dance and yes it was stairway to heaven that was my only exposure to led zeppelin until like maybe university oh wow good i didn't know not your uh not your cup of tea no i love like i love led zeppelin now but i kind of missed out on them in uh in high school but what were you listening to in high school before i play uh maybe i should play something uh maybe i should play some jay some Jay Ferguson when you were 12 here. Let me do that. Okay, so let me move over to, I'm going to Jay Ferguson's Instagram account.

And let's listen to this in its entirety and then get your response. So 12-year-old Jay Ferguson. You have some in your own collection. Show us a couple of those and tell us what they're worth. All right then. This one right here. This is the last Beatles album that they got out it was let it be naturally um it was only issued this way in a box as in a little box here the um was only issued this way in canada

and it included a little 150 page book 150page book, which is quite rare. And it didn't sell that well, did it? No. Because it was too expensive for the day. It was $9.99 when it originally came out because there was the record and the book, which made that price. You have some in your own collection. As Instagram does. It's funny, my voice has not even changed.

You know what? some in your own collection. Show us a couple. As Instagram does. It's funny, my voice has not even changed. You know what, but you were a natural born, like,

I don't know what you call that, musicologist, or like archivist, or you were clearly like, I guess now they might say you were a music nerd, but I think that's a compliment, I think,

but pretty cool. Or just eager for attention, being on television. What show was that? So that show was called, that show was called that show was called switchback and it was a

kids program on CBC TV that would have been on Sunday mornings and I think they had a different version for each area of Canada you know like

you didn't have Stu because Stu Jeffries yeah yeah was on and you know ready for this the

what do they call the prairies yeah what do they call yeah Humble Howard Glassman from the Humble and Fred show no kidding was the host of switchback in the i had no idea that's great do you remember the host's name uh of course it was uh stan sorry stan johnson and i don't know

what happened to him i've always wanted to reach out to him and find him again but i think he got kind of disappeared he's hard to find online but i think he was selling real estate at one point or something like that but but my story was i worked uh i was 12 years old and i worked at a used record store in halifax it was called old dan's records and this is like 1981 yeah uh that's when i got my job there in august of 81 and um i was just i just was hanging around the store so much that the owner basically offered me a job and I was making $3.75 an hour, $3.50 an hour when I started, I think with a 25 cents credit or 50 cents credit as well.

Okay. That sounds about right. Yeah, that's about right for that time. But so it was, I think it was just such a, an unusual, like an anomaly.

So very unusual that someone my age was working, working under the table at a used record store, but also who was into the Beatles and the Who. You knew your shit. It sounds like you're an authority. Well, I was hanging out with so many people who knew all of that stuff, and I just absorbed it all.

And I loved it. I was just such a big Beatles fan at that point. And it was a wonderful opportunity. And I think somewhat, you know, it got back to somebody. I was even on, so our store actually put on an early record show in halifax at the lord nelson hotel and i remember being on i think it was called information morning

or something like that a cbc radio show i did that i was interviewed for that and then i think someone had switched back heard that i worked at that store and then they ended up contacting me and then you had a recording of it so somebody had the good sense to record yeah no my mom was psyched to uh put them all on vhs and i still have them and everything so yeah no it was i was so embarrassed to watch it for years and years until like a few years ago i was able to sit and watch them and not be completely you know uh beat red in the face or whatever but i'm i'm very glad i'm very yeah i'm very glad uh i have them now they're pretty hilarious amazing and uh the uh who is your favorite beetle

oh gosh you know i have to ask that i feel like i have to ask i mean it's always going to be i mean you know you have a soft spot for ringo but you know john or paul it's always going to be john or paul on one of the days and i know people always like to say george but i don't think george would be my favorite he's yeah a lot of people want to be John or Paul on one of the days. And I know people always like to say George, but I don't think George would be my favorite. Yeah, a lot of people want to be really cool and say George, for sure. But you're right. It's always usually the true answer is Paul. Because Ringo was popular with kids

because he did a lot of those kid-friendly songs. Sure, yeah, yeah, yeah. I mean, he was just, he had a, whatever, a wonderful personality and everything like that, and he was funny and everything, but so was John. Like John was hilarious and cutting and whatever. But Paul is the one who, you know, held it together. And it was probably the most musical of all of them.

But, you know, John was fantastic too. It's hard to choose. It's like Sophie's Choice. What do you do? No, I know. That's why I ask the tough questions on this program uh, on this program here for sure. For sure. For sure. The, um, so you're, it's funny cause, uh, you're, we think of Halifax when we think of Sloan, at least I do, but you're the only guy who was actually from Halifax, right? Right. Yeah. Everybody, you know, Chris and our band,

Chris Murphy was born in PEI. Andrew, I think was born in Ottawa, but, you know, grew up in Halifax. Chris kind of did time in Scarborough and then also lived in Virginia for a little while, but, you know, spent his youth from maybe grade five on or so, somewhere around there in Halifax or just outside of Halifax. And Patrick was born in Ireland and also lived in Jamaica for a while as a child. in Ireland and also lived in Jamaica for a while as a child. And then he grew up in Sackville, which is sort of the suburbs of Halifax. But I was born and raised downtown Halifax, yeah. Does Patrick still have the big beard?

It still exists, yeah. He might have trimmed it back a little bit, but yeah, he's still sporting that. There was a moment in time when Patrick expressed interest in coming over for an episode of Toronto Mic'd. I need to pick that up again. Now I need to collect the whole set. So it's funny how you have your love for the Beatles, right? Sure.

Let's face it. I know you're going to be humble here and say the comparison is going to embarrass you. But there are some comparisons to be made between Sloan and the Beatles. Well, thank you. I could say, of course there are. No, but I could be. That's obnoxious. But no, thank you. Well, thank you. I could say, of course there are. No, but I could be, that's obnoxious. But no, thank you.

Well, now what would they be? Would they be the four singer-songwriter kind of thing? Yes, and there's periods of time. I was one of those guys who bought every, you can say thank you now. I bought all the Sloan CDs. Thank you. I spent a great percentage of my disposable income

went to music. I still appreciate it, yeah. And there were definitely albums and songs that were Beatles-esque. Definitely. I would not deny that musical comparison or influence. I think everybody in our band would like the Beatles to different degrees, and probably Chris and I the most,

but definitely Patrick and Andrew would like them as well, for sure, yeah. And it's hard when there's something that you love so much or something that really got you into music, which I would say The Beatles is for me. It's hard to not let that influence shine through, and those records are still wonderful to this day, for sure. But it's funny to think there's Sloan albums that are Beatles-esque.

Meanwhile, the first song here, let me play the first song. I know it's a Chris Murphy jam, but don't want to be a lot of Jay Ferguson stuff. But here, this little song, so I listened to, as listeners of Toronto Mike know,

I listened to 102.1 throughout the 1990s, I think from, throughout the entire decade, I think. And this little jam got my attention the first time I heard it.

Okay. She was underwhelmed, if that's a word. No, it's not, because I looked it up. That's one of the skills that I learned in my school. And by the way, I still, I mean... I was overwhelmed, I'm sure of that one Cause I learned it back in Venezuela When I was young

Okay, so this song's from Smeared. I kind of need to step back, actually, but we'll have this in the background. It's a good starter here. But give me the Sloan origin story. The origin of the band, kind of need to step back, actually, but we'll have this in the background. It's a good starter here. Sure. But, like, give me the Sloan origin story. The origin of the band, kind of? Right, exactly. Yeah, well, shoot.

Okay, so I played music. Everybody in the band kind of played in different bands. Chris and I were in a band called Kearney Lake Road from 87 to 1990. And that was a band also that had, I sang and wrote, and Chris played drums in that band, and he sang and wrote, and then Henry Sangalang, who went on to be in a band called The Flashing Lights. I don't know if you would have been familiar with them. So Matthew Murphy, who I went to school with as well,

had a band called The Super Friends, which were on Sloan's Murder Records label. And then when The Super Friends broke up, he started a band called The Flashing Lights. And Henry ended up playing in Flashing Lights. So Henry played with, this is a long family tree here. I'm trying to get you to visualize. No, actually, I need this, okay? Seriously, slow it down, in fact.

This is good stuff. So Henry originally played with Chris and I in Kearney Lake Road from 1987 to 1990. And, you know, we even played here at the Rivoli in Toronto in 1990 and got interviewed by Erica M. And I felt like Kearney Lake Road was like, you know, maybe we're really going to make something of this. But it's hard.

And, you know, the music was not... Did Chris have this song already or was there something... Oh, for Underwhelmed? Not at this point. No. I mean, he... When did he write this? It probably would have been... So Kearney Lake Road broke up in 1990. Chris and I were still friends and Chris And then around 1991, early 1991, Patrick's band broke up.

Chris and I started talking about playing music again together in late 1990. And he already knew Andrew. And Chris taught Andrew how to play drums. And immediately, Andrew was a better drummer in five seconds. Chris is a great drummer. Well, he still gets back there. Chris is a fantastic drummer like in five seconds and chris is a great drummer but andrew still gets back there chris is a fantastic drummer but andrew is so musically capable on multiple instruments great piano player super guitar player and a fantastic drummer the best drummer in the world and um so that's it was almost like musical chairs in in halifax bands would stick together for as long

as they could and then it's like well we've played the flamingo 15 times and we've played every benefit for ckdu the college station and we can't play anywhere outside of town or we can but we you know it costs us money what do we do now that band breaks up and then you start another band so it's almost like musical chairs so that's what so our band started in 1991 with chris and i and uh pat we invited patrick or talked to him because his band broke up and andrew had been playing music with chris so it seemed natural that he would come and uh play drums and um we sort of made some recordings over 1991 and one of them was on a compilation called here and now

which originally only came out on cassette. It was like a compilation of Halifax fans. Did this have Eric's Trip and Thresh Herman on there? What's on there? Do you remember? Shoot, were they on that? I feel like I have. On this note, I'm going to ask a question

real quick here from DJ Dream Doctor. It's a cool handle on Twitter. My favorite Sloan release is the first EP. Yeah. So he wants to know, A, is that okay? Is that okay to like that? Yeah, that's his question.

Yeah, no, I love it. I think it's a great recording. It's called Peppermint, yeah. His second question is, he wants to know, whatever happened to Jail? Are you, what happened to Jail?

Sure, Jail, so our band once, our band kind of took off. We had Murder Records, which we released other bands. You mentioned Eric's Trip and Thresh Hermit. So in the early 90s, our band, you know, we got successful by, we signed to Geffen Records and we sort of got out of Halifax and a lot of other record labels came to Halifax and signed bands.

And we also put out a lot of records by bands from out east. And one of them was Jail, eventually. But Jail had already signed to Sub Pop. So they put out two lot of records by bands from out east and one of them was uh jail eventually but jail had already signed to sub pop so they put out two records on sub pop and then an ep on our label then they changed their name to the v's and i think they became a trio at that time but they kind of just i think a lot of bands you know there was an exciting gold rush era in 93 94 after our band kind of got out and we were lucky lucky that, you know, we were able to get out and we had a little bit of money put behind us and we had radio, you know, as you were saying,

102 Point the Edge played our records. And we were able to continue it almost as a, we were fortunate enough to almost continue it as a business so that we could keep going and make records and we developed enough of a audience that we could keep going maybe some of the other bands that uh you know signed to sub pop or other independent labels they they reached a certain plateau and then it was maybe they just didn't have that uh you know a breaking point where they can make it over the hump to the next right the next stratus because it could be it could be very expensive yes exactly

to be an artist in this country. Certainly, yeah. I think there's a lot, I don't know if it's easier or harder these days. I'm very grateful that we were able to build up an audience, especially during the 1990s. But there were bands, so a band like Jail, for example, they just sort of went as far as they could and they kind of hit a wall.

And they didn't really have that, oh, that hit song that took them to a broader audience. Or, you know, were able to play to more people and more people. They kind of just probably hit a plateau. And we're like, you know what, I'm in my late 20s. Am I going to continue? Or, you know, maybe I want to get married. Or maybe I'd want to have a job or pursue other interests or whatever.

So that kind of happened to a lot of bands from out east. And, you know, our band was fortunate enough that we were able to, you know, have a big enough enough audience to continue what's the best band from this uh we'll call it the uh the east coast indie rock explosion but what was the best band that didn't make it i don't know that's too hard to say they're all fantastic uh there was um i mean the super friends they had three strong songwriters especially matthew murphy's like one of my like i went to school with him since grade one and i remember being in high school or junior high and learning how to play guitar and i feel like i could play pinball wizard and matt was just learning how to play guitar and i remember thinking like i'm better guitar player than matt then literally a year later matt was 10 times better than i was and still is and he's

a fantastic songwriter he's written way more songs than I have. So maybe Super Friends are probably... But, you know, Thrush Hermit really had everything going for them. But maybe, you know, there's certain reasons why they didn't make it. You know, you could really... You could go down... That's another podcast there. Like why certain bands didn't make it. But I think those...

I'm going to need to get you back, I realize. Otherwise, this will be a five-hour episode. Right. this could go very long if we get a 90 minute cap you will have to do a part two at some point

no problem make my way back I love it out here it's nice I'll come to the back there but there is another band actually

Hip Club Groove who were like a hip hop act very you know style of like Beastie Boys maybe a little bit of De La Soul

and we put out a record of theirs in 1994 95 okay because Classified's from out east I know he is when I think of my East Coast rappers maybe a little bit of De La Soul. And we put out a record of theirs in 1994, 95. Okay. Cause classifieds from out East. I know he is. When I think of my East coast rappers,

I think a classified. It went like, it went way before that. I remember there was like local hip hop in the eighties in, in Halifax. And, uh, anyhow,

hip club groove were from Truro. And, uh, which is like in the middle of Nova Scotia. You know, I've been there. I've been to Truro. Yeah I went to pizza because well two people that have two I had pizza there uh I think Arash Madani. Do you know what Arash Madani? He's a Sportsnet personality. If you watch Blue Jays

baseball or whatever he's all over the place. He's from I believe he's from Truro because I call it when he came on I called him Truro Arash because I'm Toronto Mike. Okay it's hard to say that's say it do you want to say it? Truro Ar there you go and the other fotm uh shout out to uh street sense his own uh jonathan torrens certainly yeah yeah so the jonathan torrens hip club groove uh connection is that cory bowles who was on uh sorry uh trailer park boys trailer park boys was in hip club oh my god and him and jonathan torrens you know, and Jonathan Torrens was on that show. He was J-Rock. I love it when all these lubes get tied together.

Are you kidding me? Such a small world. Okay. But Hip Club Groove, sorry, they were fantastic live and put out a great record. Very, you know, like, check your head, Paul's Boutique era, Beastie Boys. But, you know, if that record was reissued today, it would be a bit of a litigation nightmare. No, yeah.

That same with Paul's Boutique, though. Yeah, for sure. Certainly, for sure. But, you know, it's hard to say. There's so many. I don't want to. It's hard to name names. But there was always great music in Halifax throughout the 80s,

underground-wise, and into the 90s. But it was so hard to get out of there, you know. Okay, so this is, I remember this in real time. You have to tell me, a very recent episode of this podcast, I had over Stu Stone and Cam Gordon. We do this thing every week during the pandemic

called Pandemic Fridays, although we did it on Thursday night. Don't tell anyone. But we kicked out, we basically each brought five songs to the table that are our favorite grunge songs. I know musicians hate this label.

Sure. It's like a marketing of a grunge. Yeah. But let me ask you definitively, there are songs on Smeared that are very grungy, including the Underwhelmed. Sure.

Would you at the time have considered that, and I know labels, labels, and music, whatever, but is that a grunge song? For the record, Jay Ferguson of Sloan. I would say no. No. I would say, no. No. Definitive answer, no.

Well, now it's official. No, I think it's a pop song in a way, but I would say it's not that we didn't like those records

like Nirvana when, I mean, we were already all familiar with Nirvana and sub-pop stuff even before, you know, Nevermind exploded.

Oh, Bleach. Of course, like Bleach and the singles in between and everything like that. And I don't think our band was so much into the Pearl Jam side of things,

but definitely Nirvana and Mudhoney made good records. And I know Patrick was a big Dinosaur Jr. fan as well as I was. And I liked Sonic Youth very much. And I think Andrew would have liked them and everything. But I think the big touch point for, I mean at the time grunge was such a, you know what I

mean, I'm sure it was the way. It was so hot. It was hot but also the term we sort of rejected it. The way that like if you look at an Elvis Costello

interview from 1979, people are calling him new wave and he's like I hate the term new wave. Because it's limited, you don't want to put yourself in a box. For sure.

Because you guys need to be able to sound like the Beatles. You can't do that if you're a grunge. Exactly. We're coming next year. We've got a Beatles record for 94. Right.

But to be honest, a lot of the music that we were into, or the bigger touch point for us was bands from England at the time, which were on the Creation Records label, which would have been My Bloody Valentine or Ride or Patrick Riddle, like Swerve Driver, or even Teenage Fan fan club and i feel like that was more the music that we were ripping off more so than american grunge but not to say that we didn't like those records or you know i don't want to speak for everybody but i'd say that we all liked nirvana at the time for sure okay so because i mean they're label mates right like so geffen like i'm just trying to think so smeared yeah

geffen put that was was was geffen uh because i need to know about the the overlords in this uh you know this blood blood sport or whatever but i don't know i only i'm not a musician i only talk to musicians so now i have this bad idea about music you know okay but uh like like uh were they pleased with the commercial success of Smeared? I think in Canada, it was fine. In America, it probably could have gone further, to be quite honest. I think they were happy enough with the sound, and it was timely enough for them to release it.

Do you know what I mean? Smeared was basically made in a living room in Halifax before we signed to Geffen. So the record was already done. And when we signed to Geffen, it was like, here's the record. And we went and mixed it in Los Angeles. So the record was done and it wasn't, so it wasn't really made with the influence of a record label. They were happy enough to put it out. And I think they thought, oh, this will probably do well enough in this musical climate. And, uh, you know, I think it could have done better in the United States. But once again, at Geffen, there was a bit of a musical chairs, the guy who was the head of radio, a guy

named Mark Cates, who we're still friendly with, ended up moving into the A&R position because Gary Gersh, who signed Nirvana, got an offer to be the president of Capitol. So everybody moved around. And then the new radio guy who came in, he wasn't as fond of Sloan and he just sort of moved on to what's next. Oh, it's the the urge overkill record or the whole record right i mean so i like to think that underwhelm it did well enough at alternative radio but probably if there was someone who was really quarterbacking it a lot better i think probably could have done better and i don't mean to that doesn't hope that doesn't sound like i'm saying that bitterly it's more just matter of factly you know what i mean but uh when we made Twice Removed, which was a much different record,

with Geffen and our guy who signed us was very behind the record. I think when marketing people heard Twice Removed, they were like, we can't build on this. This doesn't sound like Smeared. Like, why did you hand us this record? Well, this is where I'm going, obviously.

And again, I loved Smeared, I'll be honest with you. Sure. I loved Smeared. And then this twice removed, you almost have a tiny bit of like, there is a moment, my favorite television show of all time is The Wire.

And the second season of The Wire, they leave the streets of Baltimore for the port. Yeah. And it looks different, it feels different, there's a new character. And it takes you, it took me a couple of episodes in the season two. At first you're like, oh, I miss my old friends.

Like I miss, and then it's like, and then, then, then it's like, wow, this is amazing too. I can't believe it.

That's a great analogy. I appreciate this analogy and I know Chris would as well because he loves The Wire. I like The Wire as well. It's fantastic. Best show in the history of television. There you go.

There you go. So this is how I felt twice removed. Next to Fawlty Towers though, right? Well, you know what? I've never seen Fawlty Towers. I know it was on PBS.

I know. Now we're changing the direction How many, because I know you mentioned earlier the UK version Fawlty Towers. I know it was on PBS. Now we're changing the direction of this podcast. How many, because I know you mentioned earlier the UK version of The Office. Yeah. I think there's like 12 episodes or something.

That's right. It's short. So how many episodes, same thing of Fawlty Towers, right? Which I will do at some point. At the most, yeah. There's hardly any. That's how they roll in there.

That's their thing. Anyhow, sorry I didn't mean to distract you. But yes, twice removed. I love the tangents. But twice removed, I remember at first it was,

oh, it sounds different and then but then all of a sudden you're like wow this is better like it's one of those things there's an initial reaction though almost and i think if you didn't give it i think if you were uh unwilling to give it you know that third or fourth spin sure you could be like i'm out if you were looking for another smeared or whatever where were you in 1994 working for you know you should have been working for geffen Records in LA. You would have had a better chance of success. I was in, oh no, I was in university in 1994.

That's fair. Okay, fair enough. That's fine. Yeah, no, it was, well, that's a great analogy and I appreciate that you like the record, Twice Removed. I like it as well. I think when we were making it,

it was more just like so many bands were piling on that sort of uh over distorted guitar sound you know there's so many major labels just signing these kind of bands that it was starting to become a bit of a faceless sound when it seemed special you know when we were making smeared now it became much less special so i think we kind of do wanted to do a left-hand turn and maybe let some other influences creep in whether it's beatles or even like Fleetwood Mac. If you take the drum pattern on Coax Me is basically, you know, go your own way. And also listening a lot to, for me anyhow,

like the third Velvet Underground album, which is sort of the quieter record of their catalog and letting those sort of influences shine through a little more. Fair to say, and I'm going to play a jam. I think it's one of your jams I'm going to play in a second here. But is it fair to say, what's the expression I always hear? Critical darling commercial bust or something to that effect?

For sure, yeah. Okay, that's probably fair for Twice Removed. Because when you, you know, I mean, critically, Twice Removed is, I mean, critically, Twice Removed is, I mean, who was it? Chart Attack? Who is it that said

it was the best Canadian album of all time? Was it Chart Attack? That's probably Chart, yeah. Are they still around, by the way? Chart Attack,

I don't know. You know, they were a big deal, right? They were, Chart Magazine, we did well by them over the years.

They were very kind to us, yeah, and yes, I think they had put that atop of theirs once or twice, so it's very flattering yeah no pressure here I have to say a word That's the best thing that I ever You have left a fingerprint on me

Just test and then you'll surely see I've got my reservation And I hate my generation If I was born in the 40s I hate my generation. If I was born in the 40s, I'd be a teen in the 50s. This is a Jay Ferguson jam. Right on. With help from Chris, it's almost like a little bit of a duet. Chris's voice comes in right there.

And he helped with the melody and the verses and stuff. How does that like just when you have a band of four guys you can all kind of write music uh like how does it just you just each bring x number of songs to the table like how did it work for twice removed i think i you know uh everybody i think i really only had a couple of songs i might have had one other one for twice removed but uh yeah everybody kind of brought their songs to the table, and there was some left over by... Chris and Patrick probably had the most left over, to be

honest. But you know, the reason I like Hey My Generation is because of the back and forth between Chris and I. We can work it out Lennon and McCartney style, not to put it on that level, but I like that back and forth duet. But you just did. Don don't stop me uh okay let's listen a bit later

very sky diggers of you i think uh Could you both possibly share? Other than the color of your skin. Very Sky Diggers of you, I think. Sky Diggers, really? I know. That's just a Ken Con reference. No, very... By the way, do you mind if I crack open a Great Lakes beer? Is that okay?

Please enjoy. Yes, exactly. And you are bringing some home with you. Oh, yeah. Thank you very much. that's very kind of you courtesy of Great Lakes Brewery they're a local craft brewery fiercely independent wonderful thank you very much

I've fallen in love with the Hayes Mama so cheers to you and is that your wife or girlfriend? my girlfriend dropped me off. Yeah, exactly. Okay, let her know you're going to be another four hours.

Okay, right, we got a lot to talk about. Yeah, exactly. That's fine, I'm enjoying this. And it's fun hearing, I hate my generation, I don't listen to it that often, but it was very, it's a great sounding record.

Not to say that that is on us. We recorded with a guy named Jim Rondinelli. And I think he, we made that record in New York City. And he, you know, I mean, we had, it was a long time making that record. We were there for a couple of months. But I really feel like he did a great job engineering and mixing that record. Yeah. Without a doubt.

And it's, I have a quote here from Spin magazine. In 1994, they said it was one of the 10 best albums you didn't hear. Yeah, I think that was the lone bit of American press that we got for Twice Removed. So when people think of it being the critical darling but commercial failure, it was more so in the United States

where I don't think anybody heard about it. And that was Geffen, because of course it's such a massive market. So obviously Geffen was keen, I'm guessing. Geffen was keen on breaking you guys in the States. I think they were keen on hearing Smeared 2, you know, and building upon what they had. But in Canada, the record did all right. Cokes Me did okay at radio and People of the Sky,

we had a video that was played for that as well. But, you know, probably not as good as expected. Maybe it could have done better. But, you know, we made a video for Coax Me that I don't think much music liked very much at the time because it was shot on video as opposed to film. And, you know, there's always little things stacked against it. Or it could be, you know, I don't want to say it's going to be the music

because I think the music has stood up, or I like to think it's not the music. But, you know, it was less of a failure in Canada than America. America, Geffen didn't know what to do with it. It was almost like we don't know how to market this in this climate. Go, you know, better luck next time. It it wasn't like but i hear this all the time like kim mitchell was on this show recently and okay go for soda was they were pushing it hard in the states really okay go for soda yeah i guess that was the first solo album i guess wait yeah um yeah i think so and um bottom

line is uh they decided they also represented twisted twisted sister okay which we're not going to take it was doing better i guess in certain markets than gopher soda and they put all the resources behind that and ended up dropping kim like i hear these stories a lot like it just seems like a like somebody called it a blood sport like i mean it is but it's i i think there's a certain amount of realism to it i mean i think there's so many great records that have followed fallen uh during their era, whether it's, you could take the Velvet Underground or Big Star, records that people still name check or listen to these days or used in television or commercials that were, you know,

were completely either misunderstood or not marketed at the time. And I think that's been true, you know, since probably whenever they started making records. But I think you just have to be realistic about it. It is a music business and that just happens sometimes. So there's also, there's some, I feel like even coming from Halifax when we did, there was a lot of our peers who we thought, even when talking about Matthew Murphy, like someone who I think is a great songwriter and great guitar player. And our band has had more success than he has specifically with his bands. And I think a lot of it is luck and timing and maybe the song at the right time and everything. But here's another thing. I always, my feeling is that American record companies like a single charismatic frontman.

Like one, the face, you know, like the Eddie Vedder. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Or the Kurt Cobain. the eddie vetter yeah yeah yeah or the kurt cobain sure yeah yeah you guys don't have that right like i i if somebody put a gun here and said who's the lead singer of sloan i'd be like all four of them like i don't have an answer sure and i think i mean i think chris would probably be maybe the most identifiable maybe because he does maybe the most interviews or has sung the most or you know what i mean i mean in the early days i think there was the the bigger hits you'd what I mean? I mean, Patrick- In the early days, I think there was the bigger hits you'd hear in the radio, like Underwhelmed and stuff

where Chris Murphy- Sure, but also Patrick. Like Patrick, you know, I think people think of Chris more as the, for the non-Sloan fan, it would be like, Chris might be recognized, but, you know, Patrick has sung our probably, you know, I don't know, our biggest hits. If I looked at it on paper,

it's probably pretty even between him and Chris. But then you take, for example, Kiss don't know, our biggest hits. If I looked at it on paper, it's probably pretty even between him and Chris. But then you take, for example, Kiss and the Beatles, who are, you know, four-headed monsters, and they were like two of the biggest acts of all time. But yeah, I think... It all comes back to Gene Simmons. Sorry about that.

Sorry, I feel like we're talking a little too much about Kiss these days. But I mean, you could use that rationale or, you know, Fleetwood Mac or could use that rationale uh or you know fleetwood mac or something like that as well you know but um yeah maybe or the eagles right like eagles had multiple that's a good point but i guess like the biggest you know bon jovi okay well that's bon literally right you could not get any more clear who's the leader of the band exactly it's my last name yeah right uh right but yeah, no, I think you could,

you're probably right that it's easier to market a certain one, a solo artist. Steven Tyler. Now I'm going to just name American bands. Yeah, exactly. Chris Cornell. Yep, there you go. Yeah, exactly. So, I mean, maybe we would have had more success that way,

but I like, from my perspective, I like the model of our band, and I think it's, you know, it's also, I think Chris used to use the analogy that it's like a mutual fund. It's like, you know, if one person was the main songwriter and the face, and then maybe they ran out of ideas

by album three or four, then it's like, what do we do now, guys? At least with our band, everybody's contributing over a long period of time. And then therefore you can have a longer career. And not to get too personal because we're about to go, I'm going to, I have a section here of real talk after I thank a couple of other sponsors

here, but are you, are you happy with your, so here we are in 2020. Are, are you happy with your, your, you know,

your place in the world and the art of this country? For sure. I mean, I guess you could, that's a big question. the art of this country? For sure. I mean, I guess you could. That's a big question, right? Sure. I mean, I guess there are days

when you're thinking like, oh, should I have done something else? Like, I mean, but in general, no, because.

Should I have been a plumber? Is that something like that? I don't know if I would have been a plumber. Because you have a cool job. But although a plumber is pretty, you make a lot of money. They're doing all right. I mean,

maybe that could have been an interest. I don't know. But money isn't everything. What's that? Money is not everything, you know. But money isn't everything. What's that? Money is not everything, you know. No, you're right. No, I understand that. Okay, you convinced me.

No, I like to think, I think when I was a kid and when I was a teenager, I was mad about music and bands and obsessed with rock magazines, records, record covers. I worked at a record store. I loved it.

And I dreamt about the idea of playing music and playing in a band. The idea of, the very first show that I played was in grade 12 at the Halifax Grammar School when I went to school. And I remember in the afternoon,

someone said, hey, do you want to go get a bite to eat? It was like, sorry, I have to take my amp to school and go to soundcheck. And that was like a dream for me just to utter those words. You know what I mean right so I feel like if it hadn't happened if if playing music or playing in a band or a successful band hadn't happened I might very well have always wondered to at this

you know what I mean growing up and maybe I would have you know had another job and and uh you know a career successful or otherwise, but I think always in the back of my mind, I was been like, oh, I would have loved to have played music. And the fact that that came true, I feel very fortunate. And I think our band has worked hard as well. Uh, and so I can't, I have no regrets at all. It's, it's what I always wanted to do and, and I got it and we're successful. And even sometimes when you think on the hard days we're like like even in this covid era it's like we can't play shows you know it's frustrating and you know you're in a band with four other people and sometimes you argue about what you're going to do or what to do but i have to think back to being a teenager and being like this is what

you wanted and i think i would have i would have always wondered and regretted or not necessarily regretted but just always been curious. And so I'm grateful. There you go. That was a long spiel for me. Sorry about that. No, I'm glad, because I'm always interested in that question, like any regrets, essentially.

And you, I mean, the one regret you never have to have is that you actually, you went for it. Like, you went for it. And we're going to get post-twice remove. I want to get a little real with you, but I'm going to just take a moment to say,

do you, here's another loaded question. Do you eat lasagna? Is this a food that you eat? I sometimes, yes, I do. You know, not all the time, but I do. I like lasagna. Well, you don't have to eat it all the time. Okay. Oh, so you didn't mean every day is what you're talking about. No, not every day. Okay. Yes. But would you eat, so.

I enjoy, I enjoy Italian food and lasagna would be in that category. Okay. Cause the, uh because the good people at Palma Pasta, and they're in Mississauga and Oakville, go to palmapasta.com. They would like you to take a frozen large meat lasagna home with you. Is that okay as a parting gift if I

give you that? Absolutely super kind. So thank you very much. So you got the beer and the lasagna, which is more than you get at the CBC. I should have been out here. Where was my invite before this? I can't believe it. You know how this came to be? I have a monthly episode with Mark Weisblatt

from 1236. I've heard that before. Yeah, exactly. And like literally well he knows here's how big a Sloan fan I am. I was at the Phoenix show in December

the Indy 88. There was an Indy 88. I was there with my brother Steve. Shout out to Steve. Hello. And I'm there just like I've been there, you know, for how many decades at Sloan shows.

And remind me later to ask you about Molson Park and Barrie. I just remember I did an episode yesterday where we went down Molson Park and Barrie concert memory lane and just make sure I come back to that. Don't let me finish okay so thank you palma pasta uh there's a sticker on the table for you a toronto mic sticker that i'd uh love for you

to take home no pressure where it goes i i of course i want it on the guitar but you can stick it on a garbage can or wherever you want so that's courtesy of sticker you.com thank you sticker you well manufactured it's in my hands right now. It's really well manufactured. You're going to love it. And Austin Keitner, if you're looking to buy and or sell in the next six months, the GTA real estate expert is Austin Keitner. Text Toronto Mike to 59559. Have a chat with Austin. I'd appreciate it. Pumpkins After Dark. These are, excuse me, I'm going to do a great legs belch here on the microphone that would be very rude but pumpkins after dark is this amazing event it's happening in a big park in milton ontario and it's a drive-through event because of covid uh covid's effed up everything

and now you drive through but it's it's like three kilometers of driving with with thousands of sculptures illuminating the night sky and there's a tunnel and they're bigger and better sculptures than ever and you should really save halloween for the kids buy a ticket at pumpkins after dark.com but use the promo code toronto mike and you save 10 so everybody wins so thank you pumpkins after dark cdn technologies are there if you have any computer or network issues. They're your outsourced IT department. I was talking to Barb earlier today.

You can talk to Barb right now at 905-542-9759 or write her at barb at cdntechnologies.com. The next guest on her podcast is Fred Penner. So F-O-T-M is Fred Penner. So FOTM Fred Penner, love that guy. And garbage day.com slash Toronto Mike is where you go to download the garbage day app or to sign up for your free curbside collection notification. This is my garbage day. And I had a yard waste pickup and I knew all of this because I got a text last night from garbage day. So that was pretty darn awesome so thank you garbage day

okay jay ferguson so you have your uh you smeared and then twice removed which is critically acclaimed but uh i would say maybe commercially disappointing to geffen please be very honest with me the sense i have is that sloan at this point post twice removed sloan is all but broken up please speak to this uh this is i guess 95 where am i now yeah at the end of 1994 our band kind of had a meeting like we had twice removed came out in 1994 we did a long we did good shows in canada but you know a long tour of the united States to, you know, dwindling audiences and no real support from our label. And we sort of knew what we were getting into when, when Twice Removed came out. And we sort of had a meeting thinking like, okay, what are we going to

do moving forward? And then, you know, Andrew was already living in Toronto and I think Chris was a little bit frustrated. And we ended up having this meeting and we kind of thought, well, okay, we're just going to end it. And I remember Patrick and I being quite surprised that that's the direction that the meeting took. We still had shows booked for Canada in early 1995. And we decided to honor those. We went and played those. And they were great.

And then we got offered to play. So we were essentially thinking like, okay, this is it. We're going to end the band. it we're gonna we're gonna end the uh the band but we're gonna do these shows but we still kept getting show offers throughout 1995 like uh playing like an edge fest edge fest 1990 and molson park and barry uh no this was one at the sorry the molson amphitheater but we did play molson park in barry oh gosh like a couple years later as well. So we have played there.

Well, you played the last bash in Barrie because I was there and it was like you tragically hit. That's right. Yes. I don't remember when it was. And I think if his last bash in Barrie is like 2003, I think. That sounds probably about right. I was there, Jay. Well, thank you.

Thank you for being there. I appreciate it. Thank you for being, I don't know how many, like those shows were fun. We also played there in 1998 for that Edge Fest when it was like the Foo Fighters play. The Foo Fighters and Green Day.

And Green Day. Yeah, that was a big one. Yeah, that was fun as well. But in 1995, we played at the Molson Amphitheater. Okay. And we got to headline it and Elliot Lefkoe,

who's the promoter, sort of came to us and said like, hey, if you guys do this show and we'll let you curate it, make it like a murder record show. So we had Super Friends played, Thresher had played, Local Rabbits played. We were able to bring a lot of our friends there. And it made for a really fun day.

And we pressed up a special seven-inch single that was a giveaway at the door. So I'm hearing you correctly that basically you have this meeting of the band where you're kind of the consensus is that Sloan is done, but you have these like obligations because you get these, you get paid for these gigs. Right. And you need to kind of stay together to perform that summer. Yeah.

Yeah. So we were kind of, we weren't doing anything. Chris and I were spending a lot of time in 1995 working on murder records and releasing other records and looking, you know, to, you know, push murder records further and uh so yeah we were we were kind of broken up not really doing anything new but we had all these shows on the horizon that we couldn't turn down you know what i mean it would have been foolish to turn down headlining the molson amphitheater you gotta

get paid you gotta get paid but also like what a fun day that would be for you and your friends and and everything so right and then by the end of 1990, and then we ended up playing Buffalo the next day. And then we played another show maybe in September down in Windsor. It was a show with Julianna Hatfield and the Killjoys. Yeah, Julianna Hatfield 3, of course. So we couldn't, there was a lot of really fun opportunities. And that also, of course, helped pay the bills.

Towards the end of 1995 i remember talking with chris and and you know patrick and we thought like let's make one more sloan record and put it on murder records okay but wait tell me the deal though like like don't you have a an obligation to geffen or did they want out of the deal like how do you get out of the geffen deal so what happened uh at the end of 1994 and we thought we weren't going to continue our manager Chip sort of told Geffen so our deal with Geffen would have been in two LP increments so we're at so we've done two albums yeah that's right so then the next option would be pick up the next two Geffen were willing to pick up the next two they were they still thought of us as a band with some kind of future and I think they were willing to continue with us. Chip,

our manager said, you know what, don't bother because I think they're not going to continue and we don't want to drag on this process. So we kind of basically got let go of the label of Geffen. When we decided that we were going to, and we all had, we had murder records running at the same time. Later in 1995, when we decided to make another record, we actually went back to Geffen and said, by the way, just so we don't look like we ripped you off. Right. We're going to make another record. And we went back to our A&R guy, Todd Sullivan, and said, we're going to make another one. We kind of want to put it out on our own label in Canada. But do you want to put it out in the United States? And they were like, sure, we'll do it. So I have promotional copies of One Chord to Another that have the Geffen logo on it. Interesting. Okay. So you had like a distribution deal for the States. We were going to do it through them. Yeah. Or just, I mean, it wasn't even distribution. It was going to be another, another issue. But then we kind of realized after talking to them that like nothing was really

going to change. It was probably, they were putting out more. Well, they're looking for smear too. They're still looking for like. Yeah, still, even though that time had already passed, you know what I mean? But anyhow, so we were just going to put that out

and then we got approached by another label called The Enclave which was run by a guy named Tom Zutaut who used to work at Geffen. He started his own record label under the EMI umbrella.

Okay. And he worked at Geffen. He signed Guns N' Roses to Geffen. And when he was like 20 years old, he signed Motley Crue to Elektra. He's in the Motley Crue movie played by, shoot, the kid from Saturday Night Live who, sorry, what's his name?

Pete Davidson? Pete Davidson, yes. I watched that movie. You know what? Maybe because it was streaming, it was in my living room and it was streaming on TV. I thought it was a fun movie. I didn't have high expectations.

Okay. All right. Okay. And I had a good time. Maybe I had higher expectations. No, I, because I wasn't expecting Rocketman

or whatever the Freddie Mercury one was. Sure, yeah, yeah. Or Bolivian Rhapsody or whatever. Anyway, my bar was really low and I had a good time. Well,

that guy, Pete Davidson, so he played Tom Zutaut in the, in the Motley Crue movie. And Tom Zutaut, so he left Geffen and he started his own label. And I think he was interested in releasing our Sloan record almost as like, here's what, you know what,

Geffen couldn't break the minimum in America, let me try and see if I can raise their fortunes in America a little bit. But the enclave didn't last for a long time. But anyhow, sorry for that long winded family tree explanation. I'm archiving the Canadian music history here. It's great. I'm into it.

This is a good time maybe to play a song, a Jay Ferguson song from one chord to another and then talk about that. But I do want to just bang home this point like i think a lot of yeah okay no one people don't realize how close sloan came to breaking up sure it was kind of it was kind of done but it was it was we just kept getting we were lucky enough that there was a fan base and and and interest from promoters who wanted who thought

like there's a lot of people who like this band in Canada. I want to put on a show by them. And we're grateful for those people who probably, you know, if we didn't get any show offers from 1995, maybe we would have stopped and maybe we would have not felt that encouragement to continue. And this is because Chris seemed, and you would know better than I do,

but Chris seemed peeved that, who is it? Andrew, who moved to Toronto? Yeah, Andrew moved first, but he moved early on. He was here by 92, 93. And now you're all here, right? Are you all here? Yeah, everybody's been here since 1998. So he was just ahead of the curve or whatever.

But it was hard. We couldn't really rehearse or anything. Sometimes we didn't really feel like a band and I understand the frustration in that. Okay, let's play a Jay Ferguson song from One frustration in that. Okay, let's play a Jay Ferguson song from the one portion of it. I said you found a way to end it peacefully I remember finding shoes near the lake under a tree And I'm sitting on the shore

I thought I saw your charm float by It doesn't matter now Cause all you want to do was die Yeah If only you stuck around I know you made a sound But now you're on the ocean floor And I've opened a brand new door You know, it could be, I could argue this is your finest composition. Really?

I could argue it. But based on that reaction, I'm not going to do that. No, that's fair enough. No, I like it. And it still goes over well in concerts and things like that. So yeah, I'm grateful for it, for sure. So tell me about, okay, so how do you go from we're done to putting together a fantastic album like one chord to another?

So we kind of thought we were done. We were playing shows in 1995. We kind of thought, let's do one more record, put it on Murder Records, mainly as a thing to sort of bolster Murder Records' bank account. Because we thought, like, oh, if Sloan puts out a record, people will buy that, and we can fund Murder Records.

But it's good you had this. It's good that you built up this independent arm in this country arm is that i don't know if that's right branch branch there you go yeah that's better firm yeah you're smarter than me no no no um so yeah no i'm glad that we i mean it was fun to play record label to put out other records by bands from our community eric's trip and thrush remit and Al Tuck and everything like that but it did sort of serve almost as like a backup for you know if things

didn't if with Geffen didn't work out and they didn't work out so I was glad that we had Murder Records ready to roll and set up so that Sloan could be just plugged into it. I think Indy's cool man I know it thanks man I just think it's cool you know I always talk about the Great Lakes people.

I like to point out they're fierce. They're not owned by Molson or Levats or whatever. You know, I can talk to the owner of that company. And Palma Pasta, too. Like, I can pick up the phone now and talk to the Picucci family, Anthony, and the ownership. And Toronto Mike, you're now on a completely independent podcast. I just like the spirit of Indy. It's very punk, very cool. Mike, you can pick up the phone. Call me anytime as well. You can get me. Wait, I don like the spirit of indie. It's very punk, very cool.

Mike, you can pick up the phone. Call me anytime as well. You can get me. Wait, I don't have your phone number. I need your phone number before you go. Oh, that's right. Okay, we'll sort that out. So I like it too.

I like independent businesses, and I like the spirit of it. And also it's investing in yourself, and I think that's, I don't know, it's important. It's also, you can, I mean, it's harder, I suppose. And I don't know it's important it's also you can I mean it's harder I suppose and you know there's always temptation to take a buyout

or whatever and that can be helpful at certain points but for Sloan's perspective I mean we've had to sell off certain things maybe whether it was like do a publishing deal in the early days or do a distribution deal but you know in the end we own the majority of our publishing and our that's everything man

and our recordings and it means that we can make decisions for ourselves and uh and do and i'm and i'm i'm glad that we have our uh content our music and our songs so that uh you know we don't have to ask somebody you know somewhere else about do you mind if we do this? We just do what we will want. You know, I think it's, and I, and you saw the documentary on Anvil.

I saw it years and years ago. Yeah. So I guess it was lips, I guess, and Anvil or whatever. I think that, I don't know where they live now, but they're like an etobical band,

I think, but really, I think so. I don't want to, I feel like that's true. And I feel like now people are going to point out that I'm, what am I talking about? But I think so. Anyway, the quote to, I feel like that's true. And I feel like now people are going to point out that I'm, what am I talking about? But I think so.

Anyway, uh, the quote I read, sorry, the Twitter, look, you're, you're trending again.

Um, okay. So long story, this, this basically he said, you're better to own your shit and sell 10,000 copies or units or whatever. Then you are to be with one of these big record companies and sell like a hundred thousand. He said, you'll make more money. Like this was the, the Anvil thing. And the, the, the idea was that, or whatever, than you are to be with one of these big record companies and sell like 100,000.

He said, you'll make more money. Like this was the Anvil thing. And the idea was that, and I don't know how this works, but I guess they get their cut off the top or whatever. And then you have to pay for all your promotion and you're making the videos and stuff. Like the way it was explained, it sounds like the deck is stacked against the artist. And again, how would I know? I can't keep a tune or whatever. But it just seems like this would be,

to own your own shit and to have your own independent record label feels like a savvy business move to me. I like to think that it worked out for us. I'm sure it's hard in different cases. And I wouldn't knock, like, an artist who signs to a major label and gets a massive, tons of cash up front,

and maybe that's hard to turn down. Yeah, if you're Taylor Swift, maybe, or something like that. Although, you know, it's like, yeah, it's worked. I think it's been the best mode for us. And Chip Sutherland, who was our manager back in those days,

he thought that starting murder records and keeping it alive by releasing records by our friends, even though they might not sell tons, but it was just a good insurance policy to have your own murder records label up and running. And it was also fun for us because we could play record label and also build a community and show people from, you know,

Ontario and other parts of Canada and America and the rest of the world that there was great bands from Halifax and Nova Scotia and the Maritimes that might not have been noticed otherwise. So in Canada, One Chord to Another is dropped on your own label there. Yeah.

And I have a question from a gentleman who signs his comments on TorontoMic.com as Hades Dweller. Hades Dweller says, regarding that lyrical name dropping of Ringo Starr's photograph in the lines you amend. Sure. Is that his, this is you, you're the his, Is that his personal favorite solo Ringo track? And if not, which song fills that particular spot? What's your favorite Ringo solo song? Well, I don't know if there's... It's pulling from a small cache of tracks.

I'm going to say Photograph. Yeah, totally. It's so great. It's written by George Harrison, basically, or co-written or whatever. It's fantastic. It's great, great melody. It suits Ringo's voice, wonderful sentiment. And yeah, I love it. And it's nostalgic for me. I used to hear it being driven to, you know, early, sorry, I was about to say early childhood school,

primary or whatever. And like, it's super nostalgic for me, but it don't come easy. That's a great one by Ringo. Back Off Boogaloo? Does anybody know Back Off Boogaloo? I don't. Okay, it's great.

It's a one-off single, very T-Rex sounding. I like that one. It Don't Come Easy, though, is great. And there's other good songs on Ringo's, yeah, third LP that Photograph is on. But yeah, Photograph would be top. Is Ringo underappreciated?

As a drummer, I think so. I think it's like super, a lot of people would roll their eyes and be like, he's not even the best drummer in the Beatles or whatever, but I think he defined the, it was a big part of defining the sound

of the Beatles for sure. You know, he's wonderful. Yeah, he's great. But did he make a lot of crappy records? Yeah, he made a lot of crappy records. Hades Dweller has a song about this song as well. So I'm just going to play a bit of this. This is another Jay Ferguson gem. The death that you thought was exhumed It's buried beneath us

Since I wrote the thesis I think I know better than you Who taught you to live like that? Who taught you to live like that? Who taught you to live like that? I know we jumped ahead here, but the question from Hades Dweller is, was there any particular band or song that musically inspired the composing of the fantastic? Who taught you to live like that?

Thank you, Hades Dweller. I don't think there's a word I've ever said in my life. Anyhow, yes, Hades Dweller, thank you for saying. I don't know. uh although yeah anyhow uh yes hades dwell uh thank you for saying uh i don't know it was very it was like a combination of trying to be a little bit bob dylan-ish or t-rex combination and uh maybe a little bit of uh uh there's a rolling stone song called uh it's called who's flying your plane i'm sorry i'm blanking on it right now. But it's, yeah, I would say definitely T-Rex would probably be the top of the heap

on inspiration for that song. I'm going to, I'm so glad you're here because when Chris Murphy was on, I never got to this topic and this is very near and dear to my heart here. So let me fade out this excellent who taught you to live like that. Oh, hold on, like that oh hold on not

yet hold on who's shredding there on guitar who's that that would be me so that's very uh i was trying to channel the sort of ear blues, John Lennon style guitar there. So I'd throw a little John Lennon in there. Awesome. Awesome. Not that I'd come close, but whatever. There you go. Try it.

So I want to set this up. So this is 2008. And there was a Canadian version of a very popular show. And I was thinking, of the judges on this show, no spoiler yet, but I've had three of the four judges on Toronto Mic'd because I've had Farley Flex but I've had three of the four judges on Toronto Mike because I've had Farley flex. I've had SAS Jordan.

Wow. And I've had Jay gold. Okay. So all this is to, I'm going to play this and then we're going to talk about this moment in Canadian idol history. Ladies and gentlemen, here are your top six. Thank you. See the reason for at the heart of the traffic

van, you'll have to understand that there's a traffic need in the L9. And the joke is, when you walk in, the body is covered in coke tips. And the joke is, when you walk in, Hey, you You've been around for a while If you'll admit that you were wrong Then we'll admit that we're right

Hey you Come along for the ride I will hit the money city To take us all night And the joke is When he walked in His body was covered in coke And the joke is Now I'm going to let this play, okay? This is important to me, Jay. You'll be around for a while You'll meet that

you will run and we'll meet the real life In the heart of a traveling band You'll never understand that all we know is the yellow light

Nice! And the church is where you will get Nice. The crowd goes wild. So I need, where do I begin? It's funny, what is your reaction to that? Patrick's voice changed so much throughout that song. It was like doing... So what do you think? If you were a judge on Canadian Idol,

like how did they do? I know you don't know who was who or whatever, but some were better than others, it's fair to say. Yeah, there was a gentleman in the second verse they do. I know you don't know who is who or whatever, but some, some are better than others. It's fair to say, but, uh, yeah, there was a gentleman in the second verse who I think came in on the wrong beat. Basically the,

the Gene Simmons character and that, that, that guy. Yeah. Yeah. I took note of that guy. He's the, he came in the wrong spot.

That would be my little criticism. I'd be like, sir, excuse me. Yeah. Um, yeah, I don't know. i mean really the only thing

you can say is like it's all downhill from there like how like we've re that's the pinnacle of canadian pop culture right there yeah so i need to know like okay so when this do they ask permission like do they need permission do they ask permission to play money city maniacs on canadian idol i vaguely remember that happening i don't think i i might have seen it after the fact, but I believe I think they even did Rest of My Life at one point on one of those shows. Because this is, the way that Canadian Idol worked, just like American Idol, is that

they would all, I guess there was one night where they would all sing a song. So they're all, all the contestants that are left are singing that Money City Maniacs. Ah, yes. Okay. And I just wondered, like, when you guys know that you're gonna have, like, they're gonna be, I just wondered, when you guys know that they're going to be, I just wondered, do you watch that night?

What's the reaction in the band to this? I think, I didn't, I guess, I didn't watch a lot. Like just crickets? I'm so disappointed. I'm sorry.

I don't know if I have a big story about this, but yes, I think we would have been informed or told that this was going to happen. You own this song, right? This is your song.

Sure, yeah, yeah, yeah. So we would get royalty-shrunk. I don't know if they paid us to do, I don't remember, like to be honest, I don't know. Did you get a check in the mail at some point because of it being on Canadian Idol? It would. For like $8.99?

Something like that, yeah, I think so. Yeah, something like that. No, I don't remember a lot about that. That would be, I would have to defer to our manager, Mike Nelson, and say like, what happened in this kind of thing? But that would be

an example of someone, if there was permission to be asked, we could be asked and we could say like, sure, yes or no. Whereas in a lot of other situations

for maybe some other artists, they would be like, we have no control over that, but whatever. It's fine by us and kind of funny to have that sort of thing happen. You know what I mean?

Well, because you know, typically it was like, uh, I don't know, like whenever that show would play things like, I will always love you by Whitney Houston or like, like it just, it did seem strange to hear money city maniac.

Definitely. That's why I feel like it's almost like bum rushing the party. It seems like we shouldn't be there, but it's, it's comical to hear it. And, uh, whatever,

I'm not knocking those people who could, I feel like the the kid who sang the first verse did a did a pretty good job and then you know the others were fine but i thought he was probably the best of the bunch but it's and it's it's i'm not knocking anybody it's humorous of course but uh but also it's just fun to be associated yeah are you flattered it's flattering to think who chooses it I'm guessing maybe they had a say in it. Jake Gold? I don't know. Who would he be choosing?

No, because then it would be like a Watchmen song. Ah, yes. Okay. Yeah, that would be. Or a Tragically Hip song. Yeah, perhaps. You're right. You're right.

But I don't know. Yeah, no, it's flattering. But for me, it's mostly funny just to be included in that sort of echelon of other. Because that's Ben Mulroney introducing Money City Maniacs. That's a big part of Canadian history right there. That's what I said. It's all downhill. I was going to say, just listening to that live with you

is like a highlight of my Toronto Mike eight years of... I think that's the first time I've heard it all the way through, so thank you. I'm glad I'm here. It doesn't sound bad in the headphones. They're no Sloan, but it's kind of interesting. So I'm going to, because of time time constraints i'm going to read todd b's todd b is a big fan of yours and this is i'm gonna read a verbatim here because it's a bit long here but for mr j

ferguson's visit tomorrow mr when you're this big they call you mr you should message him i should have messaged you apparently and say that when you have a guest on who is a musician, it's customary for them to bring a burned mix CD of unheard and unreleased songs from their band's archives. On a serious note, would you please be able to ask him about the deluxe releases of their back catalog? Twice Removed Deluxe was released on vinyl and then they put it up on Topspin,

which was recently shut down, he says. Both one cord to another and Navy Blues were released on vinyl, but have yet to be released in digital form. Please let him know that I have some money that's burning a hole in my pocket and I would love to use it to buy digital deluxe versions of, uh,

anyway, I don't know. I, cause I'm too O C T A. Can you please help me? I can't. And, and,

and Navy blues and one court, one court to another. Of course he sorted it. Secret language. Kind of when you were disguising. Okay. You're an F O T M. That means friend of Toronto Mike.

Oh, okay. Not flavor of the month. You're, you're a friend of Toronto Mike to means Friend of Toronto Mike. Oh, okay. I know. Not Flavor of the Month. You're a Friend of Toronto Mike. I meant to be Flavor of the Month. Yeah. Okay, yes. And now I have 50% of Sloan in the FOTM club,

so I'm working on the other half. Yeah. Okay, thank you, Mike, Todd B. says. So you, please, Jay, respond to Todd B., who has money burning a hole in his pocket. I'm glad you have money burning a hole in your pocket. First off, that's good to hear um but um yes no uh one chord to another and navy blues will likely uh and maybe we'll put twice

removed we did those box sets that were expensive and we kind of uh there was digital downloads included in the box set so someone who bought it could get a digital version but you couldn't except for twice removed you couldn't buy just a digital version uh and one of the reasons for that was because we were trying to encourage people to buy the box set the physical vinyl itself instead of just getting the uh digital downloads now what i think we're going to do in the future we just haven't done it yet is we'll probably we'll likely put those box sets up on Spotify, etc., Apple Music streaming services. But we haven't really talked about it. So maybe we will in the future.

I don't know if we're going to sell digital versions of them because I think, I don't know if, you know, I know iTunes still exists, but I don't know if it's kind of on its last legs because I think everything is moving towards streaming. I don't know if many people are purchasing MP3s. No, I think you're right on that. I think that's right.

This whole concept, because I have teenagers, I can tell you the whole concept of owning music, be it digital or CD or vinyl or whatever, it's gone. Yeah, definitely. Like you don't own it. You rent it? I don't know what streaming is. Sure, it's just you pay to access it basically. Correct. That's all.

We found that a lot of people still like to just with the resurgence of vinyl over sure it's just you you pay to access it basically correct that's that's all but you know we found that a lot of people still like to just with the resurgence of vinyl over the past whatever uh you know eight to ten years or whatever it has um you know it definitely caters to an older audience of people who may have remembered owning records and buying records and i think also a lot of younger people have got into the concept of records as something cool or new and and exciting and and also it is sort of uh it is a a lovely format especially if you want to do a gatefold or you know poster and I'm going to guess from an artist's perspective yeah because I'm going to ask you about this is that uh the margins are better right like I can't imagine I just can't imagineloan can make any money on streaming there's uh

we have be very honest with me i'll be honest like in the early days of it like it was it was nominal like it was very small but the more people that are subscribing to spotify apple music etc uh there is more money going into streaming and we've noticed that the those checks are slowly getting higher and higher. But you don't have to give me numbers or anything, but can you buy groceries with that money? I don't know the exact numbers. I mean, how do you break that down?

Like we get checks that would be, you know, they're not monthly. They're, you know, different points of the year. So I don't know how to break it down in those terms. Groceries, we can buy lasagna and beer. Let's put it that way. Well, no, you come here and I'll feed Sloan. So thank you. This is basically what I'm looking at right here. These cans of beer. Yeah. And that's actually an empty box. So don't take, but I have one in the freezer for you. So the one that's in the freezer and the sticker, this would represent, I'm going to say about 15,000 plays maybe on. Yeah. And

you're not Drake or whatever. You whatever, you know how it is. There is. No, but we've noticed that it's gone up a little bit. But you're right. Like when we make, say, the box sets or vinyl, those are things that we're manufacturing with our own money and then selling direct to fans through our own mail.

So like to dumb it down for idiots like me, but let's say you paid, let's say it cost you $10 to make a box set and let's say I'm going to make all this up. You sold it for 50. I'm doing the math in my head. That's, you know, $40 per unit

that goes to Sloan Incorporated or whatever you are. Sure, yeah, yeah, yeah. And I guess, I mean, we talked, you mentioned it briefly, the obvious fact that we're recording

during a pandemic and Sloan isn't on, normally in a summer you'd have gigs lined up. Yeah, so this is the dead summer for sure. We would,

it really has eaten into the main, excuse me, the main way that we really make our money which is through

playing live shows. That's where I'm going. I'm guessing your biggest revenue stream is concerts. Definitely, for sure. So are you guys okay?

Like, do you need help? I feel like we should do a Patreon or something. Are you guys gonna be okay? No, no, no. Well, you know, we Like, do you need help? I feel like we should do a Patreon or something. Are you guys going to be okay? No, no, no. Well, you know, once again, we sort of operate with a low overhead, and we have money saved. But you live in a very expensive city, whether it's low overhead or not.

This is Toronto. You're not in, where am I going to pick on today? But you're not in Aron, Ontario. I thought you were going to say Mimico, but maybe Mimico is expensive. Mimico is expensive now. Is it? Well, I drove through here to get it. I was like, wow, this is nice.

Okay, can I tell you, this is because I bought seven years ago. This is nice here, but by the way, this is lovely. This home, which is a very modest home in the southern west, but if I were to sell this now,

not that I could because I couldn't afford to buy a new one, but it really is a million dollar home now. Think about that. I'm only here because I couldn't afford to live in High Park or whatever, Roncey's or whatever. So I'm here because all those other areas were out of my price range.

And seven years after I bought, I couldn't afford to buy my own house. I just think you guys all live in Toronto. And I think COVID sucks. And I'm anti-COVID. I want to put that on the record. I'm anti-COVID. I don't put that on the record. I'm anti-COVID. I don't like it. It should go away.

And I hope that's controversial because I know a lot of people. But I hope, I just hope you guys, I know it's tough sledding for, even though you're Canadian rock gods and rock stars and we all, and I mean, everyone, I know all my friends and my family members,

all our big Sloan fans, but we buy tickets to see you in concert. We can't do that right now. So like, like what do should we go to where should we go like should we buy the uh those those uh collector vinyl like tell us what to do to help sloan incorporated uh to help sloan incorporate let's see uh i should have brought a list that i could well a lot of those things buy t-shirts or something definitely. Like you can go to sloanmusic.com, which is our website. And then there's like a link to a store if you felt like you wanted to buy shirts or vinyl.

We have lots of vinyl. The box sets are kind of mostly long gone, basically, because they sell out quickly and they're like a limited number. But there's lots of other stuff you can do. For our band, I feel like we're lucky enough that we've saved some money and you know hopefully we can get through a good portion of the pandemic to be honest chris is going to start doing some live solo shows on the internet i don't

know if you're familiar with the uh side door side door exactly so he's gonna page uh that's right he's doing that he's doing he's doing that he's doing very well he might be doing zoom is he doing side door i know that uh someone i know is doing side he was doing doing that and he's doing very well. Oh, he might be doing Zoom. Is he doing Side Door? I know that someone I know is doing Side Door. He was doing Side Door and I think he does

he does it through a different avenue. Zoom, I think. Is that right? I don't know. I had him on the show. I think he sells a thousand seats

via Zoom and then they're like but he's like eight bucks a pop and you can do the math and okay. He's doing great. So Chris is going to do

some solo. Maybe we will do so Guided by Voices who's another band that we really love, did a concert in June, I think. They just sort of rented out, you know, a venue, played, you know,

they were all socially distanced and they played on stage and they sold tickets online for that. And so we may do a show like that. That's just something we're talking about. No, I mean, you got to think like that. And I think maybe it's time for Sloan to enter the same pod. I think so. You don't have to be six feet apart. That's well, Chris and I, we've been having backyard meetings with our band and Chris and I were in a studio last week with

our engineer, Ryan Haslett. And I think we're going to work on a new song that might come out in the fall. And then also this fall, we're hoping to record either, you know, even think we're going to work on a new song that might come out in the fall and then also this fall we're hoping to record either you know even if we're in pairs not all together a new Sloan album which would come out next year because next year is the official Sloan 30th anniversary so it'd be lovely to be start playing shows next year but we're you know we're just uh seeing how things go but yeah if you want to help not only our band, but your favorite band, go to Bandcamp and maybe buy a digital album

or buy shirts or buy vinyl from your favorite band. And I think it's just, if enough people do that, I think it helps to go a long way. So sloanmusic.com, because we need to help our artists get through the pandemic here. When the main revenue source disappears,

that's tough on everyone from the restaurants to the breweries to the artists like yourself. Okay. For sure. And because I would feel bad if I missed it, I need to really quickly bang off rapid fire here. Questions from listeners. Sure. Yeah.

I actually had a question from a Michael Coffey. He asked if there was any tons plans. And I reminded Michael that that's actually Chris Murphy's thing. So my question. That's all right and I reminded Michael that that's actually Chris Murphy's thing. So my question, you can answer that, answer that. But then are you guys cool with the side projects? Like,

because, uh, speaking of Steven page, he's in trans Canada highway men. Yep. All four of which have been on the Toronto Mike program, by the way. And I've got that whole set.

I got to work on the Sloan set. Uh, but, but, but, uh, like, is it cool that Chris Murphy's in a bunch of other bands

in addition to Sloan? How does that work? You know, in the earlier days, or even through the 90s, and maybe even through the 2000s, I think we never really were into the idea of solo projects or things like that, only because we kind of thought, oh, maybe you might not take your best material and put it into Sloan. Maybe something that you think is, like, unusual,

and like, oh, this won't fit Sloan, then I'll do it with someone else, or do it either on a solo project, or as Chris did with, like, Tons or something like that. I don't think Chris's Tons songs are that radically different than what he would have in Sloan, but we kind of just thought, originally it was back to the days of Eric's trip

when Rick White and Julie Dwaran, she had her own solo Broken Girl thing. Rick had Elevator and it was called Elevator to Hell and Stereo Mountain. And so he was releasing stuff that I thought was interesting and would have fit really well on an Eric's trip record. So I kind of thought like, oh, it's too bad. Like it's cannibalizing it.

It is a little bit, yeah. So I think we thought that way for quite a while. But I think after a while, I don't want to speak for Chris. I think, you know, Matt Murphy was one of his closest friends, or is, I shouldn't speak in the past tense. And I think he just, and same with Mike O'Neill. And I think he just really thought it would be fun to make music with, you know,

with those people who are great musicians and also really close friends, and I think he kind of wanted to do a project like that. And I think those songs, while I think they were not necessarily, I mean, maybe they were completely written before they went in, but I think they

were really written collaboratively. Like they'd go in with a riff. Okay, because I was going to say, do you ever hear a great song and say, hey, that should be a Sloan song? Well, I can't really do that, you know, but definitely like the Tons record is an excellent record. And, you know, so once he did that and then Trans Canada. Oh, yeah, they don't do original.

Right. They only do the songs from their bands. That's right. That's different. I think that was just an opportunity that was put together and brought to Chris's attention and Stephen Page and stuff. And like, hey, do you want to do this? Craig Northey and Moberg.

Moberg. All wonderful guys. And I think when that, I don't think they dreamt up that idea, but it was more like someone came up with the concept and like, here, play these theater shows in smaller towns. And it's like, you know what? I can go play this show and pocket, you know, a few thousand towns and it's like you know what i can go play this show and pocket you know a few thousand dollars and he can do underwhelmed and a bunch of

yeah a bunch of this i don't think it really takes away from sloan shows and i don't think there are people who are dying to uh you know not see you know i don't think someone would go to that and be like okay i don't need to go see sloan i think that's a good point you'd see both you'd see both or you know uh and especially, we did the Navy Blues reissue tour last year, and there are some cities we haven't played to that many people in 20 years. So it's still encouraging that people are

still coming out to see our band, for sure. But I think, oh, by the way, and for Tons, for his Tons question, I think they did record another record, and I think Mike O'Neill, at this point, is mixing the record himself. And I talked Mike O'Neill at this point is mixing the record himself. And I, I talked to Chris about it on occasion and Chris,

I think was sort of hoping the record would be out this year, but it looks like maybe next year there might be a new tons record as well. Oh, exciting. Okay. And real quick, I hope I'm not spoiling anything. No, that's a exclusive Toronto Mike content there.

Jerry, the garbage man. That's his name. Jerry, the garbage man. Do band members of Sloan ever record duplicate solos or slash instrumental tracks and then just pick the best one for the albums?

I don't... I'm not sure if I understand that question exactly. I guess, does he have Chris Murphy? Do multiple people do a drum part and then you pick the best drum part for the song? I think he wants to know. Or do you know going in who's going to do a drum part and then you pick the best drum part for the song? I think he wants to know like, like,

like, or do you know going in who's going to do which? Sometimes you go in and maybe sometimes like, uh, I think maybe on occasion that has happened where maybe Chris would play the drums for somebody and it's like, Oh, you know what?

And then Andrew comes in and play and tries it. And it's like, Oh yeah, okay. It's way better. Or sometimes vice versa. If the feel, you know what I mean?

Because Andrew is very, obviously Andrew's the drummer and fantastic, but Chris is very capable and sometimes just has a different feel for the song you want. Or honestly, sometimes it's like, oh, there was a mistake on that. Andrew's busy. He can't come in to fix it. Chris is here. You record it. You know what I mean?

So that does happen from time to time, you know, that, that someone else might, you know, do something. But I think, you know, you usually go in sort of hoping that you know who's going to do the part. But that's a, that's an unusual question.

I haven't really thought about that before, but it would probably be up there. And Jerry, the garbage man, he comes up, he brings the heat. He brings the heat. I know I'm sweating from that question.

And last question from Phil sounds, Phil is his name phil sounds on twitter uh slow no i think he okay i copied it wrong saw sloan many times live including opening for the rolling stones last summer okay ask jay yeah which band sloan enjoyed opening for and which were the worst you don't have to do the worst if you don't want to. I know it's tough, but who was the best opening band, a band that you opened for? Sorry.

Uh, in your opinion. Gosh, uh, that's hard. Like it could go a bunch of different ways. We did a bunch of shows with the strokes. Oh,

I love the strokes. Me too. I love, I mean the first album and the second album in particular, I loved and we played. And, and, uh,

last night and all that. Yeah, fantastic. I think Julian Casablanca, they're a great band, but also Julian Casablanca I think is a great songwriter, great lyrics, great melodies. We played a bunch of shows with them in between their first record and their second record, some on the West Coast and some on the East Coast. And I watched them every night, and I thought they were great.

We played with Guided by Voices for the first time in 1997 in Boston and met them, I guess, for the first time, and that was very exciting to be on that bill. But he mentions the Rolling Stones. We've had the good opportunity to play with them four different times. Wow. Twice in Boston in 2006, and again in Halifax when they played outside on the Common.

And then last year we played the side stage when they did their show up at... Oro Medante. Oro Medante, yeah, exactly. Did you get a moment with Mick? Or Keith? None of those ones. But when we played the Boston shows,

I think they work it into their schedule because I think every opening act always asks, hey, can we get a photo with the Rolling Stones? So what they do in their daily schedule, they have it 10 minutes before playing, they do a photograph with the opening band. And so we got to meet them in Boston and get to take a picture with them.

So it was just meeting, seeing Keith Richards face-to-face is out of this world, literally out of this world, very unusual. But yeah, meeting all of them, but meeting Mick Jagger and just, you know, you don't get a lot of time with them, but it's wonderful

and it's just so unusual. Like here's the guy who played at Altamont in 1969. Here's so-and-so who played at the Marquis in 63. And anyhow, it's, and seeing them play, I still love it.

I loved the show last summer and uh i gotta i gotta hand it to them i gotta hand it to mick jagger basically for being his age and carrying that show it's uh are you guys gonna be playing at that age sure why not man yeah why not right that's what i say if you can do it do it i know i gotta work out a little more i feel like he's gonna do it there you go yeah uh but yeah it's yeah it, it's inspiring to see them for sure. Awesome, man. Long may you rock, honestly. We're all going to go to slonemusic.com

and buy all those t-shirts now and help you out while you can't tour. But thanks for doing this. I love this. Thanks so much, Mike. I appreciate it. Thanks. By the way, did you ever play with the lowest of the low?

I think, did they play at the Molson Amphitheater in 1995 show? I'll ask tomorrow. Can you ask him? Because I kind of forget the full line. You get confused with Jay Ferguson. Ron Hawkins told me a story when he was on one time about he checked into a hotel and there's another

Ron Hawkins. I don't know if you know that. Oh yeah, old Ronnie. Very good, yeah. So you both can commiserate. So I'll ask him if he played what, 95? 95 at the Molson Amphitheater. I have to go and look at my crib notes or whatever. Or go to chriswasary.net.

Exactly, I will. Thanks. And that brings us to the end of our 712th show. You can follow me on Twitter. I'm at Toronto Mike. Now, Jay's on Instagram, and it was jayferguson.iii. Am I right on Instagram?

Am I right about that? Yeah, it's like it's supposed to, my name is Jay Ferguson, or my real name is John. It's John Ferguson III in our family, so that's why I have the one, two, the three little, that's why it's there. There's other Jay Fergusons, so I had to do it that way. There's a lot of Jay Fergusons.

And he's not on Twitter, but go to Sloan Music on Twitter. You can follow Sloan Music on Twitter. Our friends at Great Lakes Brewery are at Great Lakes Beer. Palma Pasta is at Palma Pasta. I'm going to get a lasagna for Jay right now. Sticker U is at Sticker U. The Keitner Group are at the Keitner Group. CDN Technologies are at CDN Technologies.

Pumpkins After Dark are at Pumpkins Dark and Garbage Day are at GarbageDay.com slash Toronto Mike. See you all tomorrow with Ron Hawkins from this band, Lowest of the Low. This podcast has been produced by TMDS and accelerated by Rome Phone. Rome Phone brings you the most reliable virtual phone service to run your business and protect your home number

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