Toronto Mike'd: The Official Toronto Mike Podcast - Mark Hebscher KOTJ: Toronto Mike'd #241

Episode Date: June 14, 2017

Mike and Mark Hebscher play and discuss Mark's ten favourite songs.

And right now, right now, right now it's time to... Take out the jams, motherfuckers! Welcome to episode 241 of Toronto Mic'd, a weekly podcast about anything and everything. Proudly brought to you by Great Lakes Brewery, a local independent brewery producing fresh craft beer and propertyinthesix.com Toronto real estate done right. I'm Mike from torontomike.com and joining me for the fourth time, I believe,

Mark Hebbshire. Welcome back, Hebbsy. Thank you, Mike. This is a different Toronto Mike, though, isn't it? This isn't Toronto, you're interviewing someone, finding out about their career, what makes them tick. This is strictly about, pretty much, about music, though, right? I am psyched because, yeah, this is the very first in a series.

I'm calling it X Kicks Out the Jams. So this one is Hebsey Kicks Out the Jams. So this is the first of the kicks out the jams property? Correct. Franchise. Yes. The kick out the jam franchise.

And don't even tell me, I tweeted about this because this came to me, came to me, this original thought, nobody's ever thought of this before, came to me,

Mike Wilner tweeted about Pearl Jam's 10. Yeah. Okay. And I'm reading this tweet somebody's criticizing him like 10's weak or something and I just wrote 10 is fantastic I was a teenager when 10 comes out

you don't have to tell me how old you were but I gotcha it's great but the music you love as a teen never leaves you and I'm thinking Wilner people love him people hate him he's a polarizing figure but like what music does willner love like what are his 10 favorite songs love it love it and because you think of i mean and most people do look you think of someone in a certain way you think of mike willner as he's a baseball guy he knows everything about baseball

why should he know anything about anything else right like why why would he know anything about anything else, right? Like, why would he know anything about finances or the opera or whatever the case is? So, yeah, I think whenever I've interviewed musicians, they want to talk about sports. They're tired of music. That's their job. Sports is their release. And in our case, when we're talking about sports

or whatever else type of thing, you don't look at someone and say, I wonder what they feel about the financial thing but when you find out someone's musical taste you immediately connect with them if they have the same even if it's one song like i heard the song coming over on the radio today uh a couple of minutes sublime you heard what i got or something i know i heard uh foot in cold water make me do anything you want now it i mean i was 15 that summer it was oh the girl she was gorgeous joanne armstrong i i can picture her face whenever i hear that song that's it it humanizes

dare i say it humanizes the beast you know and i'm thinking who should i who would be a great first step and then you and i had already been chatting about you coming back but and i don't remember the number off the top of my head, but maybe you do, but you already had your initial, like, this is your life, Hebsey. We did the whole A to Z of Mark Hebsey's illustrious career. Yes, guy. And then we did the,

I made you bring me stories. Like, you're a great storyteller, so tell me stories about, like, George Bell and the Dominican Republic. Bring me stories. Dave Steeb, was he a prick? Whatever. Bring me stories.

So you brought me stories. And then I was, I know this number, episode 150, I have David Schultz in here doing his This Is Your Life, David Schultz. But the whole CHCH debacle had just happened that week. And you had a fantastic story about being in the

wrong room. You came and crashed the party and we got that great story. So this is now, and I think that was your third visit, so this is your fourth visit. But the first, again, I'm very excited about this new franchise. Kick out the jam. This is a franchise.

This could never end. I mean, at what point do you say, well, that's it. I don't want to talk to anybody semi-pseudo-famous about their musical tastes. Of course you do, except for, to me, the musicians. I don't want to hear a musician's musical taste because then it's too much, oh, were you thinking of that when you wrote that or when you recorded that? That way, that's all out, the musicians. I don't want to hear a musician's musical taste because then it's too much, oh, were you thinking of that when you wrote that

or when you recorded that? That way, that's all out of the way. I am interested in musicians' favorite sports people. You know, the opposite of what their area of expertise is. Do you want to hear who has agreed? And I've only extended this invitation to four people so far, but all four have said yes,

they'd love to come in and do it. I know I tweeted it earlier. Have you seen my tweet? Are you cheating? Do you know how many people already are like, when am I going to get the call from Mike? When am I going to get the call from Mike? People are waiting to be called to go,

we'd like you to come on. Come in and kick out the jams. Yeah, and I think a lot of people, once they hear about this, because it requires a lot of thought, this isn't something where I took casually, what three records were taken on a deserted island is different because like you say this is music that had an effect on you at some point somewhere right you remembered it because it was your first love right or you were doing this when it happened or you could listen to it when you're down whatever

the case is and it's strictly subjective there i could never like if you said i love the bay city rollers i would never judge you on that. Never! You like what you like. I'm actually so into this idea that I'm going to do an episode with myself. Toronto Mike kicks up the jam. Can I be the Joan Rivers on that episode? Can we talk?

I'll be the Joan Rivers. I'll be the substitute when Johnny's not there. Who was it for Letterman? Did he ever have one? No, he never did, did he? Johnny's was Joanie Rivers or right. Who was it for Letterman? Did he ever have one? No, he never did, did he? No, I can't remember. Johnny's was Joni Rivers or Joey Bishop or... And then Jay Leno, of course. And then, yeah, of course, Leno. They were the stand-ins.

Yeah, of course you can. Of course you can. Okay, thanks. So the other people... I'm too enthusiastic. You'd be fantastic at that. Who do I have? I have you and Wilner going up first.

Then I have Sofia Yurskovich. Lives in my new neighborhood now. Is going to bike. Did you know Sofia Yurskovich who's going to Lives in my new neighborhood now. is going to bike. Did you know the Kings Mill Park almost done? Did you know

they shut it down to repave? Redoing it all. And I took a photo today because it's basically it's almost done so that'll be nice to have that open up again.

But she's going to take the Kings Mill path or whatever to the Humber Bay Bridge and head west. Here's what I was going to do today. I was going to kayak. You know what? I was going to kayak the Humber Bay Bridge and head west. Here's what I was going to do today. I was going to kayak.

You know what? I was going to kayak. You saw the picture I took. The Humber is so calm that from where I am, I could launch the kayak right near where South Kingsway and Bloor is, take it right down to where the Humber Bay Bridge is. Exactly right. And then hang a right. And then hang a right.

And I come right along the shoreline of Lake Ontario, and I'm coming up your street. This is my dream. And my wife's like, oh, when are you going to have time for that? And she's right. I got the four kids, full-time job. I'm doing too many. Don't have time right now. But when I'm 50 years old, for my 50th birthday,

I'm getting a kayak, and I'm going to be kayaking. Because I can walk to the lake with the kayak. Oh, my. It's beautiful. It's so gorgeous. And then I can, you're right, you can take it down, take the Humber River. Talk about taking the lazy river. I mean, really, I would love to do that. I mean, it's beautiful. And then I can, you're right, you can take it down and take the Humber River. Talk about taking the Lazy River.

I mean, really, I would love to do that. I mean, I would take a pole like they do, you know, like when you see in Vietnam War, right? Yeah. And you see those old footage

of, you know, you're on this, it's like a raft with like a stick. Like Apocalypse Now. Yeah, exactly. Lawrence Fishburne. The Mekong River, yeah.

When he was like 14 years old or something. Yeah, yeah. Something crazy. Yeah, so Sophia's going to come in, and Damien Cox. Hey, listen, he knows, listen, again, he's a great writer, but he loves music. Yeah. And, you know, when I listened to the Dave Hodge episode you had on.

Oh, yeah, he's a music fan. But he's a nut, though. I mean, he's, you know, he's older than me, and he'll still go to these loud screaming concerts. He's like, I can't do that anymore. Plus, I've become spoiled over the years. I love live music, but man, I can't take the sound. But I mean, Hodge, are you kidding me? He's like, he knows everything about today's music.

My musical education stopped in the early 2000s. I don't mind learning a bit, but most of it, like you say, was when you were a teenager, maybe in your 20s. And at that point, you were established. I'm going to make a total guess here. I sensed the White Stripes were the last current band that you really loved.

And I'm pulling that out of my ass. Am I even close? Oh yeah, for sure. They were great. But the thing is, I have heard a lot of artists since then, a lot of them, but not to the point where I've had a chance to really follow their career, like really want to learn more about their music. Sometimes it's foist upon me. A lot of times my kids in the car will say, hey, dad, can I plug in my iPod?

And they'll play something and I'll go, what's that? My Morning Jacket or whatever. Yeah, my Morning Jacket. I saw them open for Pearl Jam twice. Oh, my God. So I'm going, wait a second here. It's like jam music. Who are these guys?

And it was really good. And so if you introduce me to any kind of music, I'll listen. I would never say no because, as you'll know when we finally get to the songs here, I like just about anything. I liken it to baseball. I like the subtleties and the differences. Sometimes I want to change up. Sometimes I want the high heat.

Sometimes I want to slow, take Sometimes I want the high heat, right? Sometimes I want to slow, take time to develop, pitch and duel. Do you know what I mean? And then other times I'm like, let's go. Give me two minutes. Scream your lungs out for two minutes and off you go. I agree so wholeheartedly. It's baseball. Like baseball, punk baseball was around the same time as punk rock.

There was an attitude. People started getting attitudes, you know? It was like, hey, it was around the same time as punk rock. There was an attitude. People started getting attitudes. It was changing the game. People were growing their hair longer, or they were more revolutionary. Look at the Bryce Harpers of the world. What do you mean I can't give the finger to somebody? What do you mean I can't do that?

You couldn't do that back in the day. They'd throw it at your head. So my musical tastes are kind of like my baseball tastes. Just before we dive into you kicking out the jams, you mentioned the Old Mill Humber Bridge. So since you relocated from that, what was that area called? Dundas? Dundas, Ontario, yes.

Because every time you say Dundas, I think Dundas Street. So Dundas, Ontario. Well, it is actually Highway 5. Dundas Street becomes Highway 5 the further west you go. It is. It's a curvy sucker, right? Yeah, it's Highway 5. And then it's just Highway 5 all the way till, I'm trying to think where it ends. Highway 5. I don't go. It is. It's a curvy sucker, right? Yeah. It's Highway 5. And then it's just Highway 5 all the way

till... I'm trying to think where it ends. Highway 5. I don't know. I'm trying to think. It's west. I can tell you it's west of Paris, Ontario. I think it might be out near London. And I think it might go even further than that. So you've relocated, though, because now you're in West Toronto. And ever since you relocated, I've been bumping

into you. I know. It's funny, isn't it? And in Toronto, think about this. I mean, there's a lot of people. It's a big freaking city. I mean, the area that we're in, probably, I've been bumping into you. I know. It's funny, isn't it? Yeah. And in Toronto, think about this. I mean, there's a lot of people. It's a big freaking city. I mean, the area that we're in, probably, I would say, 600,000 people from between where you are

and I am within a couple of kilometers. And we bump into you at the gas station. That's right. Right at the entrance to High Park. That one time,

I was taking my son to George Bell Arena for a hockey game. And he's like, hey, Hebsey. And then another time, I'm on a bike ride coming on High Park Avenue going into High Park. There's Hebsey. And then another time I'm on a bike ride coming on High Park Avenue

going into High Park. There's Hebsey. You're coming out of High Park. I'm walking into High Park. Yeah, well, no, you're walking out. I'm coming in, right? Something like that.

Yeah, I was coming in. Of all the cyclists, okay? Of all the pedestrians you're going to run into, we ran into each other. And then you send these pictures. I saw your picture on Instagram of the Old Mill Bridge

and I'm like, in 40 minutes, I'm biking by that bridge. This is happening. I love it down there. Beautiful. I know.

ATN Brulee Park is, I was there like an hour ago. It's fantastic. You just mentioned High Park and ATN Brulee Park, which is right on the banks of the Humber River, right where that Old Mill Bridge is. Those are two areas where, when I moved here, I thought this, because remember, I used to climb the peak, the Dundas Peak, and go to Two's Falls, the waterfall every day, really beautiful area. So that's what I had to have. I have to be able to go somewhere where you don't see other people for a while,

or you're really at one with nature. I know that sounds like, what do you mean at one with nature? Dude, I get it. I need it. I love it. You're right. I love it too. And I don't know how far north you go through A.T. and Brulee,

but my personal destination is I like to get to James Gardens before I kind of flip back. Oh, yeah. And you're on a bike, though. See, I'm running. I'm running or walking. Yeah, yeah. But still, it's great. Cool, man.

And tell us a little update before we dive in on your podcast of Liz West, because I'm not sure what it was called last time you were here. Oh, it's called No Fun Intended. You see, we had a problem with Square Off because the former owners, or the owners of the television station, sort of had the name Square Off, and they said, well, you can't use it on the podcast. So did we want to go through the courts with these guys

for the name of a show, for the name? So we changed Square Off to No Fun Intended. Sort of like No Pun Intended, but it's No Fun Intended. And what's the reason for that? And it's sort of like, why did they write the lyrics? Or what does that song mean? What's the real meaning of that song? Well, you know, really, only the artist really knows that.

And everyone will just call it NFI anyways. Yeah, whatever. It's like KFC. Nobody's calling it Kentucky Fried Chicken. I guess so. Whatever it is, it's NFI, no fun intended. It's me and Liz West. We drop two podcasts a week. You're doing one a week. We're doing two a week. So, you know, a little more work involved. But there's two of us.

So probably an equal amount of work. And you have to get a guest for your show. So we have to, you know, we're going to normally will have a guest sometimes on the phone, sometimes not. And we talk about all kinds of stuff. But you have some big guests. Yeah. Well, it's all relative, right? What's big?

Who's in there? You had Joe Warmington in there the other day, right? Joe Warmington. We had Brian Vollmer. Okay. Warmington turned me down, I just want to say. So Warmington declined my invitation, but he was on your podcast.

Should I take that personally? You shouldn't, because I've known Joe for a long time, and I think back in the day, we probably did some favors for each other, or we did some favors for him and got him some publicity when I was on television. I don't recall, but it's a good relationship. So much so I can phone him at 7 a.m.

because I know he's up with his kid and say, hey, I need you on the podcast today. And you can't. And that's got nothing to do with you. No, I mean, I can't. I developed a relationship with him over a number of years. Absolutely. I can't compete with that.

That's through history. I was in the mainstream media. He's in the mainstream media. You're not in the mainstream media. I'm in my basement. Who are you? I'm in my basement. I'm sorry. All right. I'm the Bob McAllen of in the mainstream media. Right. You're not in the mainstream media. I'm in my basement. Who are you? I'm in my basement. I'm sorry.

All right. I'm the Bob McAllen of basements here with my shades. Okay, let's do a couple of plugs here. So firstly, I want to promote the Toronto Mike Patreon campaign. If somebody wants to help

crowdfund this campaign, go to patreon.com slash Toronto Mike. If that's too much to remember because maybe you're in your car or you're walking or biking right now, go to torontomike. If that's too much to remember because maybe you're in your car or you're walking or biking right now, go to torontomike.com and hit the big orange button

that says become a patron. It'll take you right there. Give what you can, a dollar a month, five dollars a month. I appreciate all the help I can get. How's that going, by the way? It's funny.

Ed DeSoc was in here and we had this discussion. I was underwhelmed by the response, if that's a word. So were we. So were we. So you did a Patreon? Oh, sure, we still do.

And again, how often do you promote it? And look, my parents kicked in the first couple of bucks. Did they? And my husband kicked in some bucks. They should send you the money directly so you don't have to pay Patreon. Well, the other thing is, if I'm going to donate to a show,

which I like, what am I getting out of it? I think people expect something for the donation, right? Like, you know, a mention's nice, but also, too, like a tax receipt. I don't know. Everyone's different.

To me, it's free programming. You could choose to not pay a penny towards it and keep listening to it, or you could support the artist. Like you said, new microphones, whatever, new chairs. The server. I had to get a new hard drive.

There you go. Folks, if you don't know this, it's going to cost you $100 a month plus tax just to have your podcast thrown up there so that people can download it. Is that about right? It begins with a difficult thing where I have podcast thrown up there so that people can download it. Right? Is that about right? Well,

it begins with a difficult thing where I have a relationship of Humble and Fred where I do free support and I'm on their server. Generally speaking. Absolutely. I can tell you

the price of the server that's hosting this MP3 file right now is more than that per month. There you go. It's big money. And so you need Patreon and you need sponsors.

It's kind of a funny world where it's actually more expensive the more popular your podcast is. Like if your podcast is for your 10 buddies or whatever. I know, I know. And then if it's 10,000, now you've got a problem. Oh, you've got 1,000 downloads. They turn on a mic.

Oh, guess what? Ding, ding. Right. It costs you more money. It's funny. We learned that the hard way about six years ago at the old Humble and Fred podcast where the more popular you are, the more expensive it is to have a podcast. It's the paradox. Now, you enjoy a beverage,

a cold alcoholic beverage periodically. That Great Lakes beer is yours. You're taking that home with you? This five-pack here? The five-pack? Now, wait.

There's one missing. I'll slip you a six before you go. But the thing is, it's got to be different from these other ones. There's one particular brand that I slip you a six before you go. But the thing is, it's got to be different from these other ones. There's one particular brand that I only drink.

What's that? It's called Red Leaf. Is there a Red Leaf? Actually, if there's not a Red Leaf in there, we'll double check. There isn't. No,

you don't have to double check. I already checked. because I drink, that's what I drink. But when I go to my local bar, which you almost ran me over one day, it's next to the gas station there. Is that the Bryden's?

The Bryden's. Yeah. So I go in there and that's what I drink. Anyway, so that's what I drink, but we drink it in pitchers when, next to the gas station there. Is that the Bryden's? The Bryden's. Yeah. So I go in there and that's what I drink. Anyway, so that's what I drink, but we drink it in pitchers when we go out, all the guys.

So we drink pitchers of it. What do they charge for the pitcher of Red Lee? Oh, do you know what? I think it was like eight bucks on the Monday night or the Tuesday night. Is that possible?

Because it's five bucks, right, for the pint? Yeah, no, but this is, I think it's on, was it Monday night or Tuesday night? I think it might have been Monday. Monday is a slow night

at most bars, right? Wow. I was in there and I said, listen, I'll run a sports trivia night Monday night. Guarantee I can get 100 people to come. What did they say? Because Bryden's is good people there, right? Yeah, it's great. Especially if it's $8 for a jug. $8 on Monday

nights for a jug. Beautiful. That's incredible. Fantastic. I would invite people I don't even know. Just come on. We'll share the jug. That's funny. I mean, I would promote the hell out of a Pepsi night at Bryden's with Ray Ligs beer. If you could get me a can of the Red Leaf, then we're the jug. That's funny. I mean, I would promote the hell out of a Hepsi night at Brydon's with Grey Legs beer. If you could get me a can of the Red Leaf, then we're good.

I will do so. And let's listen to this here. Now that you've got your toes tapping, I'm going to give you Brian's tip of the week. Brian Gerstein, by the way, is a real estate sales representative with PSR Brokerage. Brian says, the current market favors condo owners over detached homes. Now is the time.

Now's the effing time. It's the perfect time to move up by selling your condo for a maximum price and being able to buy a house for less than a million, call Brian at 416-873-0292 to find out how, as time is running out for this rare opportunity. Give Brian a shout, have a convo. There is no obligation to do anything of Brian. Just have a conversation, and I'd appreciate that. That piano is one of your 10 favorite songs. Am I right? Is the Property in the Six jingle one of your 10 favorite songs? It's getting there.

It's getting there. You know what? It is catchy. I agree. That is toe-tapping. That's toe-tapping music. And no lie. Brian's a good guy.

Yes, he sponsors the show, so there's an inherent bias there, but I have caught myself doing the old propertyinthesix.com. I've caught myself doing that. As long as you're not doing the Spence Diamonds jingle. That yell at the end, right? Wow! Or whatever it is. Oh, yeah. You know what? I just do the Fabricland one

sometimes. Fabricland! Fabricland! You've been hanging out with the guy from Retro one sometimes. Fabricland, Fabricland. You've been hanging out with the guy from Retro Ontario a lot. All those old jingles, Molson Golden, and oh my God. See, those are the things that are actually in your mind. Just like the songs. If you know the lyrics to all the songs, you know every beat and everything from when you were a kid.

You remember if I was to play all the commercials you heard back then, you would know all the words to them. You would know. Even if it was a jingle from 1988. Oh, yeah. I know that one off by heart. You recently tweeted a picture of you beside Jerry Howarth in the Blue Jays broadcast booth.

Right. So I listened to so much 1430 Blue Jay baseball that there were certain ads that would play that are still stuck in my head. There's one CIBC ad that would always run, it would go like this. CIBC, get us working for you. CIBC.

There's a bunch of these ads that are just stuck in my head from the 80s, 1980s, 1430 Jays games. Have you gotten copies of them? No, I haven't. The copies are in my cranium. Sometimes I find, if I'm really bored and I'm on YouTube, something will pop up, you know, usually in the sidebar there.

And you'll go, what's this? And because it's similar to what you were just watching. And it's a jingle. It's something from that exact same time period where you go, oh. And pretty soon you're back in, you know, whatever year it was. That's what music does. Listening to Fleetwood Mac and going, hey, man, this is what I was drinking. This is what I was smoking. this is what I was smoking,

this is what I was reading, this is the girl that I wanted her to love me, these are the jeans that I was wearing, the cereal that I was eating, the kind of car I wanted to drive,

but never the bank I wanted to bank in. It was never that, never, geez, is it TD, is it the Royal, oh my,

Bank of Montreal was never an option because I never liked Montreal. Right. Just wouldn't. Bank of Montreal was never an option because I never liked Montreal. Right. Just wouldn't. Bank of Montreal. What are you, a traitor? Right.

Makes sense. Are you ready, Mark Hebbshire, to kick out the jams? You bet I am. I am. I am. You say you want a revolution Well, you know We all want to change the world You tell me that it's evolution

Well, you know We all want to change the world. But when you talk about destruction. Maybe the first grunge song, right? Maybe. Yeah, this would have been the first song ever to use feedback intentionally and gnawingly, annoyingly to another generation. This is double, two fuzz guitars, two guitars put right through the board at Abbey Road. This is because John Lennon's original version of Revolution, which is called Revolution No. 1,

was a soft version. You've heard that before. And then the other guys went, John, this is, you should play this harder. And he was very much against it. He thought the original version, the slow one, was going to be their Beatles' next number one song. The prior one, I believe, was Lady Madonna. And he thought that the

slow version of this would be better. And they went, no, no, no, no, no. They said, let's really jazz it up. It's so dirty, right? It's got that, you know, you can draw a line from this to, like, the Neil Young stuff that, no, no, no, no. They said, let's really jazz it up. It's so dirty, right? It's got that, you know, you can draw a line from this to like the Neil Young stuff that like, they call him the godfather of grunge

with the cinnamon girl and all this. And for sure, but you can hear it in this song. This is just a heavy, cool rock track. This was the,

again, this was the first. I can pretty much guarantee that one. I think that, I think they called it Distractive Distortion or something like that.

But yeah, man, it was fantastic. And to me, it's the rockinest Beatles song. And the message in it is the same tone as the song. That's Nicky Hopkins, by the way, on electric piano. One of the great session men. He's just flying here. Love it. Yeah.

This is great. Now, the real reason I love the song is not just the message, because around this time, Muhammad Ali was speaking out. There was a lot of talk of, you know, revolution. I didn't know the word, but they simplified it. Fantastic, man. You know, the Beatles, what, they have like, whatever, 250 songs or something, but this is definitely, yeah, maybe their heaviest track.

And this was on the flip side of the song I hated the most by the Beatles, which was Hey Jude. And I hated Hey Jude because at that time I was about 12 years old, grade 7. This was the song they would dance to. It was the last song of the night in all the Sadie Hawkins dances or whatever. And I hated it because Hey Jude was like seven or eight minutes long, right? And the B-side of the singles, in those days you would buy the single, right?

For 79 cents or a buck or whatever. Yeah, the 45. The 45, right, as opposed to the whole album. That sort of came later. And this was the flip side. This was the B-side revolution. It was Hey Jude, number one. No, no, no, no, no, no, no.

And then this on the B-side. And this was the side that the cool kids listened to. Right? This was the rocking side. And listen to the end here. Yeah. So he tore his voice, basically, to that song. That's John Lennon at his screaming his best.

Right at the beginning. Right? And then at the end. All right. Like, that is a great song. That's not my number one song. That is a great selection. And as I will point out, so this is- Oh, by the way, before I go on, in that song, Rolling Stone did a thing, the top 100 guitarists of all time, I think it was in 2011 or 2012. And it's sort of been the list that everyone goes by, you know, Jimmy Page, Eric

Clapton, you're at the top there. But anyway, this featured the number 11th greatest guitarist in the world, George Harrison, and the 55th greatest guitarist, John Lennon. Paul McCartney, not on the list, even though Paul could play a pretty good guitar. He was the bass player in that band. So I kind of took a note here because out of my 10 favorite songs, there are some very, very, very good musicians, individually and collaboratively. It's Keith Richards. Yeah, you got Satin shoes

Yeah, you got Nasty boots Y'all got Dorky eyes Y'all got Doki eyes Yeah, you got Sleepy time I can't hear me nothing On your window

The Rolling Stones Hot. This was during their greatest period. This was from Sticky Fingers. So, 72, I believe. Yeah, 1972. The album cover was a guy in jeans and a real zipper. One that you could actually zip down.

Yeah. And it was extremely controversial, of course, and banned after a while. And if you know anyone that has the original album cover, that's pretty cool. But this is where the Stones were at their absolute best. This band was, Brian Jones had been dead for a number of years. So this was Keith Richards, by the way, the number four guitarist of all time. Right. Mick.

And a guy named Mick Taylor, the number 37 guitarist of all time, was the other guitar player, having replaced Brian Jones. And of course, you've got Bill Wyman on bass, Charlie Watts, and featured players such as Bobby Keys on the saxophone on this song. Spectacular. This is an awesome song. This, to me, is the greatest Rolling Stones song. I can never get this song out of my head. I can never get tired of it.

It's been covered a few times as well, quite well, by a number of bands. And it just rocks. I grew up listening to Hot Rocks, the double. Now, that actually, I think it ends before this song is recorded. It does. I believe it's like 67 or whatever, 60, whatever, 66, 67 to, it ends in 71, I think. This is part of more Hot Rocks, right? I never got more Hot Rocks, unfortunately. But the two discs in Hot Rocks, right? I never got more Hot Rocks, unfortunately.

But the two discs in Hot Rocks, and now I'm talking about when I was 12, 13 years old. I spun like crazy. So the tunes that appear on the Hot Rocks double disc, I just heard them a million times. And then everything afterwards, I heard far fewer times. But this is fantastic. Yeah, this is such a great track.

This is a really great song. There's a transition in the song. I learned a lot about the Rolling Stones listening to these albums. They were in their prime. Now, a lot of people, is this a... So this is a nice bridge in the song, right? And then they bring in the saxophone, the Bobby Keys. They say, you know what?

You go ahead and do a fantastic kick-ass solo. Go ahead. All right, we'll let you. This is a jam part, right? It's rare to hear Charlie Watts playing just the cymbals. He doesn't usually play the cymbals. That's cool, man. Now, a lot of times in the 60s, you hear people, like, had to pick a side. Like, are you a Beatles guy or a Rolling Stones guy? I was both, for sure.

I was going to ask. Very much influenced by it. Because your first two tracks are Beatles and Rolling Stones. Well, a lot of people who wrote in about this said that by default they wouldn't include the Beatles or Stones because it was either before their time or they're too overused. They're absolutely my number one and number two. They have to be, right? Because my age, look, I was born in 1956.

So when I was 14 in 1970, the Beatles were finishing up. They had stopped touring. And they were fighting and beating each other up. And the Stones were in a lull. A little bit of a lull in there. And then they picked it up again a few years later. But yeah, this is where

Mick Taylor, the second guitarist, he comes in and kind of does his thing. So this was a real community, the Stones. You know, Mick could sing, of course, but Keith had to do his thing. Charlie had to do his thing. And the other guitarist in this case before was Brian Jones, who thought he was the leader of the band. He's the one who drowned in the pool.

He drowned, yeah. And that's a whole other story there. But, I mean, he was a screw-up, too, because he was heavily, heavily into the drugs. These other guys survived it. And this is where Mick Taylor comes in, right? It's kind of a... It's his guitar. Let's hear this.

Now, he was a blues player. He played with John Mayall's Blues Breakers. He was an accomplished blues player before he joined the Rolling Stones. Very different. Yeah, it's kind of like almost that Doors feel, you know, that breaks down and you just kind of want to go. And a lot of these jam bands, I don't want to call them jam bands, but like Pearl Jam, for example, who I've seen like several times in concert, they'll be in the middle of a

song like a live or whatever, they'll kind of do this for like five to ten minutes, you know, just kind of do a jam like this. It's just cool. You mentioned My Morning Jacket, they do this. Yeah. My Morning Jacket will take one of their cool singles and 20 minutes later, they'll kind of wrap it up. It's just jamming. You could never have heard this on regular radio.

It was just too long. But I mean, look, if you're going to pay musicians, right, to be at their absolute best, give them the floor. I mean, all the great bands, let them play. Let them show their virtuosity skills. What happened there? That fade out was not very it's not very elegant. Oh my God.

If Mick Taylor ever found out. Please forgive, please forgive me, Mick. My apologies. It is a long song. It could have been your censor basically saying, you know, okay, Mike, this is log of the day I'm radio. Whatever allow you to play a song. Yeah.

It was my, maybe my producer said, okay, on to song number three. Now, you changed the order on me at the last minute, so I have to make sure. No, but it's not your fault. My fault for not rearranging it, but I have it now ready. You ready to hear? Yeah. Yeah, I never liked this part of the song. I thought, you know what, I considered editing it out and said, no, that would be

sacrilege. You cannot edit this out of the song. Well, in actual fact, it was. It was, I think when it first, when the song first came on the radio, they said, you know, let's cut this part of it out here because people might tune out and go to CFTR instead of Chum AM, you know, something like that. It's a valid point because sometimes it's so subtle that maybe you don't know

what instrument it is. This I know. But everyone's familiar with this part. We heard you're leaving, that's okay. I thought our little wild time had just begun. I guess you could have scared yourself. You turned and run. Ricky, don't lose that number You don't want to call nobody else Send it off in a letter to yourself Ricky, don't lose that number It's the only one you want

You might use it if you feel better When you get home Man. So Ricky, don't lose that number. So everyone, what does that mean? What does that mean? What is that song all about? And there are many theories, of course.

And when you're a kid, you always want to figure out what the song's about. You feel better about it. No, I know what he's talking about. You're on the same level as the writer, I guess, right? But in this case here, there were many theories. One of which was, it's a song about a fellow who's gay, and he doesn't realize he's gay. He had a little wild time the night before, and he kind of got scared, and he took off and he ran.

But here's a phone number, and if you have a change of heart, you know, call me, kind of thing. It's like fan fiction. Ah, so it sounds, you know, when you listen to it, you go, okay, it's about, you know, a gay experience. This was 1974.

Number one song. But the spelling of Ricky. R-I-K-K-I. To me, that sounds like a woman's name Well Ricky Lee Jones was Ricky with a K But Ricky Fata from the Beach Boys The drummer was also R-I-K-K-I Ricky Lake is R-I-C-K-I

Now I told you last summer They had that cover band that does... Did you ever go listen to that? Pretzel Logic. You told me about it, right? You went. It was like a Tuesday night. Yeah, yeah.

They were down the street. Yeah. I wanted to go. Yeah. And you said they were awesome. They were awesome. And I'm a little bit younger than you. I miss the 70s.

Let's put it that way. I was listening to... See, they didn't tour. I mean, you would have never seen them, even if you were around them, because they didn't tour. They hated the road. I think they toured for like one album and then said, screw it. They just went into the studio for the next decade or so. And then they started touring

again in the 90s, maybe. Because they needed the money or whatever. There was the demand for them. Steely Dan. This song I knew very well. And of course, FM. No static at all. Which wasn't on any album. That was a soundtrack from a movie. This song I knew very well. And of course, FM, no static at all. Which wasn't on any album. That was a soundtrack from a movie.

There was a movie called FM. Right at the height of FM radio, I guess, where you could play your own stuff. And their commercials were different. And there was sort of a counterculture type of a... Like the old Chum FM? You got it, man. From the Marsden years? Absolutely. And here's such great things. I missed this. See, here's the thing. You would have. Absolutely. I hear such great things.

I missed this. See, here's the thing is that you would have heard Steely Dan on AM radio pop. You would have heard Reelin' in the Years. Yes, absolutely. Get Back, Jack Do It Again.

You would have heard this song. Yep, yep. And like Pegged, let's say Pegged from Asia. But every other song by Steely Dan had to be on FM radio because they were longer and they were different deep cuts.

They used to call them deep cuts. The other band I always associated with Steely Dan is Chicago. Like in my head, they're cut from similar cloths, I suppose. Is there, am I off base there? As a guy who missed,

who was listening, I was listening to Big Bird and Oscar do that, they had a disco album. That's what I was listening to in the 70s, the Grover disco album. They were both very jazz oriented. You're 100% right.

Very jazz oriented, very tasty horns. Horn arrangements were quite different than anything you had heard really up to that time, unless you were a jazz fan. I mean, most of it was guitar bass that you listened to. All the bands we're talking about, you know, the Beatles, the Stones. I mean, they incorporated some horns and stuff like that. But in this case here, Becker and Fagan from Steely Dan, very similar to the guys from Chicago.

They were accomplished musicians. Well, no no I shouldn't say they were accomplished musicians that's wrong they were accomplished arrangers and producers I found out later that in a lot on a lot of songs they didn't neither one of them played a lick not a lick they produced made for radio they were called Steely Dan but they just you know they just brought in the greatest musicians in the world that okay play this here's like a broken social scene yeah here's the arrangements here's all the music written all the world. They're like, okay, play this. Like a broken social scene. Yeah, like a collector. Here's the arrangements. Here's all the music written,

all the sheet music. Here it is for you. You're arranging the horns. Here it is for you. You're arranging the strings. Here's the part for the drama. Here it is. And go ahead and play.

And then play and play. And they spent millions of dollars in the studio because they had to get it just right. But I love Steely Dan. Big fan. That song and that band, basically, they sound great in the headphones man

like that's just an optically sound performance so let me tell you so this is so Becker and Fagan played a little bit on that

so on that album Jeff Skunk Baxter plays guitar went on to play for the Doobie Brothers for years and years Jim Gordon was the drummer

Jim Gordon was Derek and the Dominoes Jim Gordon played for every single band one of the great drummers session drummers,

murdered his mother and went to jail for 18 years. He was a schizophrenic. But they didn't know that, of course, at the time. But a hell of a drummer. And Timothy B. Schmidt, backing vocals from the Eagles. So they bring in some great musicians, like fantastic session players. And they put some wonderful albums together.

Earlier, we talked about jam bands. And let's hear your number four. I don't think too many people know this. This is the first song on your list that I was unfamiliar with. And I'll be very honest, when we play one of your songs, I did not know.

I'm going to let you know. This is the verse. There's more to come. I lit up from Reno, I was trailed by 20 hounds Didn't get to sleep that night till the morning came around Set out to run, but I take my time A friend of the devil is a friend of mine I get home before daylight take my time, a friend of the devil is a friend of mine. I get home before daylight, just my guess is he tonight.

So yeah, that's The Grateful Dead, Friend of the Devil. That's Jerry Garcia. That's a young Jerry Garcia. And that's, yeah. So the Grateful Dead, I think a lot of people think of them as a psychedelic band from San Francisco. Hate Ashbury era. Everyone taking LSD. And they probably were, too.

Smoking pot, free love, and all that. These guys were really good musicians. Jerry Garcia was a special talent. And much more popular since his death, of course, than he was when he was alive. He was popular, don't get me wrong. He was a popular touring band. People followed the dead on tour. This was the Deadheads. Right.

Here's the thing with the dead. Bill Walton basically gave up his NBA career to follow the Grateful Dead. Think about that. 1975, 76. He's like, man, I'm going to see the dead in Egypt at the pyramids. I'm taking, I don't want to play basketball for the Portland Trailblazers.

What? Are you crazy? And the other thing with the Grateful Dead was they were a community before the expression even came along. And that came from the days in San Francisco. They would allow you to plug your portable cassette player into their board, into their board, in order to take your own bootleg copies of the concert.

Wow. And they also encourage the trading of bootleg tapes. It's like, oh, have you got the Seattle concert? Way ahead of their time. Way ahead of their time. But that's why they had the most loyal following. Way before Jimmy Buffett and the Parrotheads. And they're great.

I mean, you know, think of the followings of certain bands and what they'll do. Two each of his own. Yeah, but the Parrotheads have a loyal. There's a loyal fan base. Loyal is loyal. I mean, you know, think of the followings of certain bands and what they'll do. Two each of their own. Yeah, but the Parrot Heads have a loyal, there's a loyal fan base. Loyal is loyal. Loyal is you'll follow them anywhere. Loyal Blue Jay fans will follow them

wherever they go. I see a lot of those with Pearl Jam, the Ten Club. 100%. Yeah. You love them, right? Yeah.

So Deadheads were the originals. The original Freakazoid fans. The original ones that would follow the band anywhere were the people that followed the Grateful Dead. And a lot of them were gnarly looking people. And especially the day, Freakazoid fans The original ones That would follow The band anywhere Were the people That followed The Grateful Dead

And a lot of them Were gnarly looking people And especially The hippie era Scary People were scared of them And they associated The Grateful Dead

With the motorcycle gangs The bad guys Drugs But these guys were great These guys were bluegrass This is a bluegrass song Yeah I know This song has been covered

As the most covered Grateful Dead song Friend of the devil You know it's funny Because The most covered It's been bluegrass song. Yeah, I know. This song has been covered. It's the most covered Grateful Dead song. Friend of the devil. You know, it's funny because... The most covered. It's been covered by more than any other Grateful Dead song. It's been covered by Bob Dylan, Tom Petty, Elvis Costello, The Counting Crows, Loggins and Messina, John Mayer,

every bluegrass band out there. It's a great song. Ask a guy my age to name a Grateful Dead song. Guess which one we name. Oh, Touch of Grey. Correct. From 1987. Because we saw the video. They played that video a lot, and to name a Grateful Dead song. Guess which one we named. Oh, Touch of Grey. Correct. From 1987. Because we saw the video.

They played that video a lot, and it was a catchy tune. I never saw the video. It must be. In effect, I know it is the Grateful Dead's biggest hit. Which is kind of interesting, right? Because look at the vast career they had and the great songs, and that's the song that breaks. Casey Jones, to me.

I mean, there's, yeah. But again, I think a lot of people misunderstand the Grateful Dead. And I think when you hear their music, you go, wow, these guys good. And that's what it really comes down to. They could play. I mean, you know, stage presence aside, legend aside, can you listen to them? Are they good on the ears, good on the soul? And yeah, listen to some Grateful Dead.

Listen, go get Skeletons from the Closet, which is one of their greatest hits collections, to me, one of their best ones. Give that a listen. Or Terrapin Station or Shakedown Street. They do a fantastic version of Good Lovin', like a really great jammin'. Let's have a good time. I'm going to play number five.

I did not know this song before I listened to it when you put it on your list, but I just recently saw a documentary on this gentleman, so I know a great deal about him. Let's hear Mark Hebbshire's Fifth Jam. Do you know what instrument that is? Xylophone. I have no idea. Nor do I.

Okay. But I've heard that in other songs. I've heard that sound. I'm trying to remember which song I've heard that in. But it reminds me of another song. It'll come to me, I'm sure. Yeah, we could talk over the whole song because it's an instrumental. But it's just so basic. Right, that's right. I listen to all of your song. It'll come to me, I'm sure. We could talk over the whole song because it's an instrumental, but it's just so amazing. That's right. I listened to all of your songs.

Many I was familiar with, but this one I was not. Tell me about your admiration for and by the way, it's Frank Zappa because we haven't said that yet. Frank Zappa. Give me the title. Peaches on Regalia.

Right. Peaches on Regalia. I. Peaches on Regalia. I had to come up with a title. What instrument's this? He was, I mean, it's your story. I don't want to interfere, except I just saw the doc, and this guy was just so avant-garde and ahead of his time and musical genius.

It's almost like he didn't want to be mainstream popular. He wanted to be a musical genius who yeah just interesting guy who died way too young yeah he was funny he was cynical and he was he was a genius um and he was again misunderstood and i think a lot of the artists that i like they were great musicians were misunderstood and maybe that's one of the attractions for me but this this song peachesaches on Regalia, is from an album called Hot Rats. Now, if you said to your mom, I'm going out to buy an album, she'd go, what are you going to buy?

The Beatles? The Monkees? You're going to go to an album called Hot Rats. Oh, and who's it by? Frank Zappa. What does he look like? And now you show a picture of Frank Zappa. Big Fu Manchu mustache. Scary looking.

Really long hair. A really tall, skinny guy. Grungy looking, odd looking guy. But you've seen that clip where he's, is it the Novak show or whatever on CNN where he's debating Tipper Gore, is it? Amazing. Yeah, he's so smart. Yeah, he's a brilliant guy.

He's so smart. So this is from an album called Hot Rats. And I just, like, listen to this. What the hell is that? And the drummer is... And this is jazz music. This is like... What is this?

This isn't rock and roll? But I will say this. It is not for everybody. You can see why people would have no interest in Frank Zappa music. You can appreciate that. You appreciate Frank Zappa for his genius, but you can also appreciate why somebody would say, oh, it's just noise.

I feel like it's a little bit tough for some palates. Of course. Yeah. It wasn't for mine. You won't hear this on the radio. No, you wouldn't. It wasn't for mine because I got a lot more out of this song than I probably have any other.

I'm not listening to lyrics trying to figure out what the song's about. It's an instrumental. I'm listening to all these different instruments and I'm going, this guy, Frank Zappa was rated the number 27 guitarist of all time. He doesn't play the guitar in this song. He doesn't play the guitar. He plays percussion

and vibraphone. He doesn't play the guitar in the song. He was an accomplished guitarist. He decided in this song, no, I'm going to arrange something that I don don't play in i play other instruments in or something like that anyway it's called peaches on regalia the band and i mean you're talking about some spectacular musicians um he plays octave bass and percussion in this song and by the way yeah this song won a grammy in 2009 when his son dweezil zappa, and his band Zappa Play Zappa, won for that song, Peaches on Regalia, their version, and won a 2009 Grammy for Best Instrumental.

Wow. Many years after Frank had passed away. It was Dweezil and Moon Unit, right? Dweezil, Moon Unit, Ahmet is the other brother, yeah, and they're in a big family fight now. And the big hit for him, of course, was the Valley Girl, right? Which must have drove him nuts. Anyway, that song, Peaches on Regalia,

the most covered Frank Zappa song, covered by Phish twice. Phish is what I think of when you mention Grateful Dead, I think of Phish. Covered by Dixie Dregs, and that song is also on six other Frank Zappa albums.

The original was Hot Rats, but it's on six other Zappa albums. He really liked playing it. Wow, that's great. Your sixth song, now that fifth song there, I just heard for the first time the other day when you sent it to me, but this sixth song was on my Sony Walkman

on a continuous loop, that album anyways, for a long time. I'm looking forward to hearing number six. We'll be right back. You said you loved, that's a lie And then you left me, said you felt trapped Well, some things you can't explain away But the heartache in me still lives today Stand by me, not at all Stand by me, not at all So when you first heard the song, did you not think the song was called Stand By Me?

Yeah, yeah, yeah, absolutely. And it wasn't because there was a song around the same time by Benny King from the movie Stand By Me, the music soundtrack. Okay, well, this came out in 79, and Stand By Me is like 86. Stand By Me the movie? Yeah.

But the song Stand By Me, though. Yeah, of course, Benny King. It was from well before that. Well before then, yeah, absolutely. Yeah, so this is called Train In Vain. Why is it well before that. Well before then. Yeah, absolutely. Yeah. So this is called Train In Vain. Why is it called Train In Vain? You can't go stand...

I remember John Lennon covered Stand By Me too and had like a hit within the 70s too. Yeah, that's exactly right. Yeah. So anyway, it's called Train In Vain.

But it's from London Calling, which is a punk album. I mean, this is not a punk song. So this song originally was not going to make it to the album. This was like... Oh, wow. No, they're going, no, it's too commercial.

They all basically said it's too commercial. Mick Jones, Joe Strummer, it's too commercial. And then sort of as a last minute thing, as the album sleeve for London Calling was already, the art was done. They went, oh, geez, we're going to put this in. And they stuck it in there. And it was, I think there's,

I think it was the third hit from the album. London Calling was number one. I'm trying to think what else. I never, I can never come up with a song, another song on the same album

when I'm listening to it. The Supermarket one, was that a hit? No. I remember that London Calling was a playthrough. I know it.

It's, oh man. I can't do it. But anyway, it was a great album, London Calling and this was not a punk song

this was not it wasn't it was too commercial and they decided to put it they wrote it one night and they recorded it

the next day and then they put it on the album just the other day I was thinking about this obscure HBO show called John from Cincinnati yeah

have you heard of this I have okay I watched this it was so surreal and bizarre. Okay. I watched this. It was so surreal and bizarre to me and I watched it but it only lasted

one season and it was kind of out there but I enjoyed it. Yeah, it was good. It came on, it debuted right after The Sopranos ended

so it's like I had the time slot available to me like I was used to tuning into The Sopranos anyways and I started watching the show. Anyway, it's been...

You made a Sopranos reference. We got a little more later on The Sopranos. That's good. There's a little more on one of my later songs about the Sopranos. By the way, Sopranos. Thank goodness for the Sopranos. Without the Sopranos, I don't

get Six Feet Under. I don't get The Wire. The Sopranos changed television. Oh, for sure. Definitely. Fantastic show. So where am I going with it? John from Cincinnati. The theme song was Johnny Appleseed by Joe Strummer. That's right. And the, what do they call mescaleros? Mescaleros.

I can never say that word. Oh, fantastic. Yeah. You ready for number seven? I am. All right, 80s kids, this will bring you back. Holy smokes, did I love listening to it again. Oh, yeah.

So I had this song playing in the car on the CD when I picked up my now wife for our first date. We were going out officially. So this is what I got going on in the car. And she steps into the car and she's like, I love this song. Now the party's over I'm so tired Then I see you come

Out of nowhere Much communication In a motion Without conversation Or a notion A conversation, a renunciation. Avalon. Beautiful. Gorgeous, and it gets stuck in your head, so all day you're, Avalon.

It's a great track. Roxy Music, Avalon. So a great track yeah Roxy Music Avalon so that's their that was their last studio album Avalon it was their best as far as I was concerned

but they had a great run there from you know the early mid 70s as a glitter they were like a glitter band like they were David Bowie type of you know

glammy well what they wore what Brian Ferry wore what the guys in the band wore the type of music they played it was there was a Genesis David Bowie you know that in the band wore, the type of music they played. There was a Genesis, a David Bowie. You know, that was the era.

That was the mid, late 70s. And this is 82. But this song in particular, the title track is sensational. And the woman who sings high backup in this, I found out her name is Yannick Etienne a Haitian girl who spoke not a word of English and they had gone for a break in the studios playing one floor below them was Bob Marley

and then in the studio next was a Haitian band and this girl here was singing and they went we gotta get her they had never heard her before and we gotta get her so she sings all the high notes here. I wondered who that was

only because it really adds to the song. It really adds to the Avalon Delivery. So Brian Ferry. Great track. It was a three-person band, basically. It was three guys and they added a lot of great musicians

but yeah they were they were perfect for their and when Brian Ferry went out on his own he did very very well Slave to Love and just tons of stuff

after he left Proxy Music so here's Etienne Yannick Etienne. That's the saxophone. I was gonna say it's not the first time we've talked about Etienne in this episode. We talked about Etienne Brule Park earlier. So there you go, two Etienne references. Two for one. I don't know. You mentioned off the top about moods, right?

Like sometimes you're in the mood for a rockin' number. Sometimes you're in a mood for something more mellow like this. It's not the same way. Like sometimes I want something more ballady or lighter. Sometimes I want something to make my ears bleed. It's all about mood. This sounds like something you might have heard on Ziggy's mush music, right?

Absolutely. This is a romantic song. If you're not dancing real close with your partner during this song, there's something wrong with you. I'm about to dance with you. That's so good. Yeah, there you go. That whole album is'm about to dance with you. Yeah, it's there you go. I mean, that whole album is fantastic.

Avalon, Roxy Music, they're great. And Brian Ferry, maybe one of the most compelling onstage figures I've ever seen. Just captivating. He'll stand, he's about six foot six. He'd stand up there and you'd just be like, Peter Gabriel was the same way. Like, wow, man, you're just amazed by the guy. It's interesting you mention

that because the Peter Gabriel, Kate Bush song. Don't Give Up. Yes. Wasn't that like the mush music theme song or something like that? Fantastic. You know what? Because Ziggy's on my brain

because I just did homework on her because Ziggy is coming over later this month. So I've got Ziggy on the brain, which is not so bad. It sounds like it might be bad, but it's good to have Ziggy on the brain. It's interesting that at the time maybe that her show was on, you weren't into that type of music.

No. It wasn't macho enough or whatever the case is. But now you go, you know what? There was some pretty – I mean – Like Sade, for example. Sade is great. Yeah, Sade is great. It's Sade, right?

Sade. No, but that's just it. S-A-D-E. No, no. It's Sade, and I don't know how you get Sade from S-A-D-E, but that's a whole other story there. I'll have to take your word for that one. Well, you'll ask Ziggy about that when you have her on.

I'd be interested, yeah. I will, for sure. This is the hardest one for me because I love reggae music, and I've been listening to it for a long time. And I know, and I love Bob Marley, of course, and Jimmy Cliff. But this is the first non-Jamaican band to win a Grammy for Best Reggae Song. They're not Jamaican.

That's right, they're not Jamaican. So we should tell people that this is Steel Pulse, dubbed to my roots. So another instrumental here. But just the reggae vibe, which I first got into when I first heard Bob Marley music. But, you know, Peter Tosh in the mid-70s. Vibe, which I first got into when I first heard Bob Marley music. Peter Tosh in the mid-70s.

The Police, I think, really brought it mainstream. Just the reggae sound, right? That sort of ska, whatever you want to... Or who's the Israelites guy? Oh, Desmond Decker. That's what I think of when I think of first time you hear reggae, whatever. Bunny Whaler, Bob Marley. There's a ton of that if you go back. I really like this

because it adds a lot there's trumpet I love that trumpety sound so where's he from did you mention yeah you guys are from Birmingham England okay

yeah Steel Pulse yeah because they had the big ska like the specials and everything they had that whole that's right and again

it's from they're from an area where it was a multicultural area a lot of you know West Indians a lot of people from

like here like in Toronto you had a booming West Indian scene here. Huge. And they wrote a lot about racism, this band, because they suffered more so than perhaps more so, and I don't know enough, but more so they felt that they

were persecuted because of the color of their skin than, for example, people in Jamaica, which is largely made up of dark-skinned people. In Birmingham, England, when people emigrated there from the West Indies, there was a natural racism that was going on. And as a band, they were not allowed to play certain clubs, stuff like that. I love it. A lot of protest songs, a lot of songs making you very aware of the plight of the black person, but also just the plight of the underprivileged, the downtrodden.

And they're really interesting guys, interesting philosophy too. Steel Pulse. Now, not well known, I would say, amongst folks my age and younger, I would say. Again, not stuff like Much Music. Considering you introduced me to the fact that these guys existed. Right. Much Music, no, they never were on Much Music or anything like that. That's right.

And I thank a friend of mine, Aaron Rand, who's a disc jockey. A disc jockey? Is that the right expression? He's a radio host in Montreal. And many, many years ago, I was over at his apartment, and he had some music on. And you know, sometimes you're introduced to music, you're at someone else's house, or it's a big brother, or whatever.

I'm at his place, and he's got this on, and I'm, well, what's this? And he said, well, here's the album. And I just went, this is great. It's so key to me. Sex Pistols, my buddy Tim in primary school, my buddy Tim introduces me to the Sex Pistols. At the time, I'm listening to George Michael and stuff,

OK? And he's like, listen to this. And I'm like, holy shit, I like this. How else would I ever discover this? I'm not going to discover it from much music. You need to have sometimes these coaches, music coaches to try different things. See, when I hear something that I like,

I now want to hear the entire catalog by that artist. The same way if I read a book and I like the author, I got to get that author's entire body of work. Because you're a curious cat, and that's what makes you a good broadcaster as well, because you're curious. So you ask the right questions and get the stories. Well, yeah, I think also I want to know,

and I would hope that my listening audience is as inquisitive as I am. You know, sort of like, you know, come up with, like you'll tweet out before a guest on your show. You'll say, hey, I got so-and-so coming on the show. Tweet me your questions. What would you like me to ask guest on your show. You'll say, hey, I got so-and-so coming on the show. Tweet me your questions. What would you like me to ask him on your behalf? Right.

By the way, have you ever just put this on and lit a fatty? Do you ever partake? Yep. I can see you now. This was actually my wedding song. This was the first song you would have heard when you came in for the reception after the ceremony. Oh, wow. Yeah.

Again, it's as you're in the reception line, man. This is your second marriage, right? Yeah. Okay, can I tell you, with my second marriage, picking the music was the best part. Like, because now you're an adult. Like, you're not young. Right. And now you can kind of have some perspective. Like, this is the song we want for this.

This is the song for this. That's why the most fun part of your second wedding, I think, is the music. Yeah. You mentioned Pearl Jam 10. That entire album was featured at my friend's wedding in 1994, I'm going to say. Yeah, around that.

They had their wedding and they played literally, they had the band play like every song from Pearl Jam 10. It was great. Some of it was tough to dance to, like not traditional at a wedding, but nonetheless.

So this was sort of our cocktail music. And I don't think anyone said, hey, it's just nice background music. It's nice lying around. You know, I think we put on, I think for that, we had Bitches Brew, I think, is what we used. Miles Davis? Yeah. Oh, my God. Don't even get me started with that.

So you're going to need another top 10. Well, you know what happened was, when you mentioned it to me, and I took it seriously, I think I had 25 or 30 originally, and then scratched this and added that. Yeah, you culled it. My wife said, what about this one? What about that one? What about the significance? I'm like, oh my God. The other thing was, and I forgot to mention, when you played the Grateful Dead's Friend of the Devil, that was the first song I ever played when I was a real paid-for disc jockey. I worked for a country music station in Kitchener ckkw and i played the all did the all night show on the weekends so that's midnight to 6 a.m usually by about 4 a.m nobody listening

there's no one listening and you can probably get away with i figured you could get away with stuff so i had a um in those days when you played any kind of uh at any commercial radio station you had a hit list the top 30 hit list or whatever it was right and you had to play during your shift you had to get in all these songs. So there were 30 songs I had to get in. And the rest was kind of like, okay, if it's traditional, go ahead. So I'm like, you know, I'm not that hardcore country. Can I get away with Gordon Lightfoot?

Is that country music? You know what I mean? Stuff like that. So that song by the Grateful Dead, which is a bluegrass song to me, I put it on, but I was afraid to say it's a Grateful Dead, of course. It's a country music station. So here's a new one by the country maladeers. was like 4 a.m i played this song and i got a phone call on the hotline and it was the station manager's wife who had been on a bender or whatever the case was and happened to be listening to her husband's radio station

who are they and i'm going that's the country maladeers they're fabulous right and then monday morning i get a phone call from my boss saying yeah you well, that's the Country Maladeers. Oh, they're fabulous, right? And then Monday morning, I get a phone call from my boss saying, who are the Country Maladeers? I go, huh? And he says, yeah, my wife said she was listening to it. I said, oh, some new band. How come I've never heard of them before? I'm like, he's caught in a lie. And I said, all right, it's the Grateful Dead. He goes,

you played the Grateful Dead? Are you out of your mind? Stuff like that. So that was the first song, and I kind of got into it. The Allman Brothers, sure. But Grateful Dead, now you're stretching it. Actually, I played Eric Clapton. Eric Clapton was in a real country phase in the mid-70s, right? No Reason to Cry, Backless.

So he played a lot of Tulsa Time, stuff like that. And there was a real sort of twangy sound to Eric Clapton in the mid-70s. And I would play some Eric Clapton songs. His parents are Canadian, I think. Who? There's some Eric Clapton's parents. They are? One of his parents, I think, is Canadian.

I didn't know that. I know. We're not recording this, are we? Because I'm 95% sure. We were not recording it. This is your first kick out the jam show and already you're... I just wanted to hear some tunes of my buddy Hempsey here. Are you ready for number nine?

I am. who's this rocket bag mike i can tell you i've seen these guys live. This is from the Sopranos soundtrack. Get out of here. There's a scene at Bada Bing where the strippers are stripping. This is the song. So we're the good people at home. It's Los Lobos. The song is called Viking. So you've got that distortion, distorted guitar there.

You've got the sax in there. And they're just, this is supposed to be a span. These are the guys that did La Bamba. Okay, let me tell you, Los Lobos. So I saw them open for Neil Young. They're a rock and great band. They can play anything. They're almost unknown in that regard amongst

mainstream music rock listeners. Guys like me who know them from La Bamba soundtrack. That's not them at all. This is them. Cool band, but nobody knows that. The irony is that the number one song in the world

in 1987 was La Bamba, which they performed for the music soundtrack, but that's not their song. They didn't write it. That was Richie Ballen's song. And they didn't get any writer's money. I'm sure they did okay with it, certainly. But they didn't want that song to define them.

So their next album was a song of traditional Mexican music in Spanish. All of it in Spanish. The next album, because they totally wanted to get away from this departure. That's a Frank Zappa move. Let me do something that will make me less popular. Well, yeah, but more popular for the right reasons. The last thing they wanted to be known as was a pop band that was...

A cover band, too. Oh, my God, right? So it was a curse and a blessing at the same time. And they've been, I think, fighting for the last 30 years or so to try to... you know and even when people come out we want to hear labamba when they play it in concert now they don't play the song they play it as part of a medley they kind of get into it i didn't even hear it they kind of get into it because people want to hear that song but this this here song viking uh is just you know another example of you know

the their roots they grew up listening to rock all kinds of music but They grew up listening to all kinds of music, but they grew up listening to rock and roll. And David Hidalgo and Cesar Rosas are great guitarists, and so is Luis Perez. Three guitarists in the band. And they can just kick ass. My wife, bless her heart, because she knows I love Neil Young.

You'll see the Neil Young picture in the hallway. I love Neil Young, and she gets tickets for us to see Neil Young. This band's the opening band, so she's there for me because she knows I love Neil Young. You'll see the Neil Young picture in the hallway. I love Neil Young and she gets tickets for us to see Neil Young. This band's the opening band, so she's there for me because she loves me and we're at Neil Young. Nice. And Los Lobos, she knows La Bamba. She loves the movie La Bamba. She's sitting there.

She wants to hear La Bamba. She gets stuff like this, which I'm like, wow, these guys are really good. Poor Monica never gets her La Bamba. Tell her next time, okay, to let me know. And I mean, I've got an in there. Well, Steve Berlin, the sax player and the keyboard player, is a good friend of mine.

He's the one who comes up with the set list. Like, they leave it to him. Steve, you come up with the set list. Next time I see Las Lobos, I'm going to give you a call. So just let me know, and I'll tell him, and it'll be part of a medley. They usually have a medley with the song Good Lovin', right? They go from Good Lovin' into La Bamba, and then back into something else, that kind of thing. So yeah, great, great

guys. That's from that particular song. I'll never forget watching the Sopranos, right? And I hear the song, and the strippers are at the bada bing. They're nice strippers, I guess. And so I call him up, and I just said, you know, they're nice. They were nice strippers, I guess, for, and they're like, and so I call them up and I just said, you know, your song is being played like the strippers

are stripping to it. He's going, yeah, isn't that great? That's fantastic. Yeah, yeah, that's great.

So I thought that was pretty cool. Oh, it's a great show. I was thinking of the finale the other day because personally, I enjoyed the finale, but that's,

that's one of the more polarizing ends to a series, I think, ever because of how open it is. But I want, that last 10 minutes or whatever, when they're having the, they're at the diner, just, I think, ever because of how open it is. But that last 10 minutes or whatever,

when they're at the diner, I can watch it over and over again. Every time that bell rings and Tony looks up, the members-only guy jacket. Figure it out for yourself. Go ahead and figure it out. Multiple things could have happened to let your imagination run wild with it.

And metal parking in that damn car. Have you ever been so tense with parallel parking in your life? It was good. It's just great. And journey playing in the background, right? Don't stop believing. Yeah, it was terrific. Yeah.

You know, the funny thing is that I used to, I binge watched that series because I used to have a satellite dish and when it was on HBO and I don't remember what night it was, but it was like 10 o'clock on a Sunday night, I think it was. Yeah. And so I would tape the shows on VHS. So I would have a bunch of them on tape or have a bunch of tapes. And I remember loaning them to a friend of mine.

He said he had heard about The Sopranos. He thought it was about a bunch of singers. He said, no, it's about a mob family. Anyway, so I had three VHS tapes. So I had the entire first season, 13 episodes, on three VHS or four VHS tapes, right? So I loaned him the tapes. So this is on a Friday.

So now I talked to him on Monday or whatever. And he goes, you son of a bitch. I go, what? He goes, you didn't tell me. I go, what? You didn't like it? He goes, you didn't tell me it was so good. I go, what's the problem?

He goes, we just kept watching it. We started watching Friday night at 730. Our babies woke us up in the morning. You know, like they wanted breakfast. They had watched like eight episodes woke us up in the morning. They wanted breakfast. They had watched eight episodes or nine episodes in a row. Because remember, too, the beauty of it now

is when they download stuff, you get them all. You get the whole season right there. You can watch as many as you want at a time. That's real. It's like when I hadn't listened to your show in a while. I don't know, for whatever. Now I'm going for a hike and I'm like, okay, oh my God, look who I missed.

So I got a choice of like 10 or 12 great guests. Which one do I listen to first? And how much do I listen to the whole one? Right? Do you have a favorite since we're on that topic? Do you know what? I really enjoyed the one with Dwight Drummond. I thought, I just, you know, to me,

anyone that's got good stories to tell had an interesting life. And the story that he told about being carted by the cops was great. So to me, any great storytellers. And you've had some people on that aren't as good at storytelling. See, that's the danger of is that you'll get a great guest on and I'll know in your feed. I'll listen for a while. And I won't tell you which ones, of course, but I'll listen for a few minutes and go,

hey, you know what? I think I want to try this other guest right and i'll try that and then you know you'll click with someone you'll kind of go oh that sounds great i'm interested in that person the one with uh jim van horn was very interesting to me because i used to listen to him when i was young because i wanted to be a radio dj like him so there were certain there are certain guests you have that i have a a real interest in and then the other ones where uh okay you know maybe in 10 years their life will be more interesting on that note very interesting just today i had a conversation with someone who

listened to every episode and his term for those episodes you're describing he calls them the kid craig episodes that's the term because uh kid craig who's a dj on 102.1 came in here yes and that's one of those episodes that i think the latter that you're describing where you know maybe in 10 years yeah that's one of those like that I think the latter that you're describing where maybe in 10 years... It's like if Sidney Crosby wrote his biography now, I go, no, wait a second. Can we wait until you're retired and you get a chance

to... your career gets a chance to breathe a bit. And then we can sort of talk in retrospect. But again, why would I say, hey, why would you get that person? Tell her to wait for 10 years. I think I know the types you're talking about. But let me say that so far we've done nine of your 10.

And I got to say this, for being the first to kick out the jams, I'm thoroughly enjoying this. I just love playing the song. Some I like, some I don't know. And hearing you talk about it, I love this concept. Like, I love this format. I hope we're okay with this. You and I didn't know. And hearing you talk about it, I love this concept. Like, I love this format. I hope we're okay with this. We didn't, you and I didn't discuss in advance

are we going to play the entire song and just sit and listen to it and let the audience listen to the entire song? Well, I didn't think I should do that. No, no. As I recall, when I used to listen to songs with my buddies in the basement

or whatever the case, and we are in your basement, what I remember most was you'd listen to a song and while the song was going on, some people would be like, like, no talking while the song is on man it's a record if you want you can put it back on again later when you're by yourself and listen to it all but we're here we are chatting we're you know it was never when there's music playing everybody shuts up

there was always conversation going on i love this part i love that part blah blah blah so i think what we're doing here is what a lot of people would do and that is especially if you don't know the song it's like oh you hear some of it it's on the background and we'll talk why do you like this song why what is it about this who is that well so yeah i've always sort of been that way so uh no apologies whatsoever to people who thought they were going to hear the entire song without any see i uh never intended to play the entire song because i think i don't think that's i think you're right, they can seek out the song, Spotify or YouTube or whatever.

Let's play a little bit off the top and give them maybe 30 seconds uninterrupted and then let's hear about it. This is what I think works. While it's still playing. Yeah, while it's still playing. Except for one where for some reason your programmer cut the song off.

Was that the Frank's, no, what was that one again? Oh, that was the, I don't know. Oh, I know, it was the Rolling Stones. It was the longest song actually. It was Can't You Hear Me Knockin'. Yeah. That's a really long song. My apologies. Nah, don't worry about it. I apologize for that. It's on know. It was the Rolling Stones. It was the longest song, actually. It was Can't You Hear Me Knockin'.

Yeah. That's a really long song. My apologies. Nah, don't worry about it. I apologize for that. It's on Sticky Fingers, folks. Go get it. It's good.

Your 10th song is by my favorite band of all time. Let's hear it. Not one of their big hits. That's okay. It's really haunting, this song. I wore this shirt for this song. So we got to get a photo after. Sure. I can tell the people you've been videotaping.

Is that what you call it? You don't call it videotaping. There's no video anymore. You're recording. That's the word. Yeah. Most people say filming. You're filming this, right?

You're filming this. Awesome score. This is Thugs. Yeah. By the Tragically Hip. This is from their best album, as far as I'm concerned. If I had to pick an album. The Tragically Hip. It's from their best album, as far as I'm concerned. If I had to pick an album,

and I know that that's not part of this show, Kick Out the Jam, is give me your favorite album, because that would require an album front to back that you would want to listen to over and over again. We're not talking about that. Yeah. Although Day for Night I could listen to over and over again. Yeah, because it's got Grace 2,

and it's got Nautical Disaster. It's got Greasy Jungle. Yeah, yeah. Right? Impossibilium. But the one... Yawning or Snarling, which is a great song.

An Inch an Hour. It's a terrific album. It is, and I think if you ask... Oh, and wait a second. And Scared, right? Yeah, yeah. Scared. I think that's on there.

Yeah, yeah, yeah. Because Weak Kings is on fully completely. That's right. Scared is on day for night. Yeah. If you ask the average Joe favorite hip album, I think that's on there yeah yeah yeah because Weak Kings is on Fully Completely that's right Scared is on Day for Night yeah if you ask the average Joe favorite hip album

I think they go Fully Completely I think because that's got more of the big would you though the monsters I wouldn't

but I I'm a big Road Apples guy me too listen I'll tell you I'll be honest with you I think In Violet Light

is a great album I think My Music at Work is a great very underrated album and I think maybe the most Work is a great, very underrated album. And I think maybe the most underrated of them all is Phantom Power. Phantom Power, front to back,

is a spectacular album. You've got fireworks on there. Oh, it's a fabulous album. Fabulous album. And nothing wrong with... And Up to Here, by the way, don't discard your first love. I won't.

And Trouble at the Hen House is also an underrated album. Anyway, yeah, there's lots of good... So anyway, I love this song because I don't know what it's about uh the video confuses the hell out of me it's about thugs obviously they're robbing it's cool video though it is cool it's pretty cool it's got that noir that film noir exactly and the story behind this is um i used to play tragically hip music on sportsline my tv show

unknown at the time the songs i were playing like wrote um little bones from road apples so 1991 i got a call one day from a friend of mine jake gold who says hey mark you know that music you're playing the tragically up i go yeah he goes you know that's my band i go what do you mean it's your band because i manage those guys get out of here and that began a long association with the band where i got to know them pretty well traveled traveled with them, you know, and a good bunch of guys. And of course fell in love with their music. I, I lost count at 120 times I've seen them number of concerts and most of them either side stage or in the first couple of rows. I'm insanely jealous right now. You take your number of 120 divided by 10 and you're at my number. But I enjoyed every time. And this shirt I'm wearing is from the last time I saw him,

which was they did the three nights in Toronto. I was in the middle. So whatever that was, Saturday, whatever it was. How was that? Did you cry? Really? I went alone. Yeah, I know.

I remember reading about it. You cried. Did you cry? Did I cry? I think there's certain lines in certain songs where I definitely swelled up moisture escaped the eyeballs

for sure certain lines resonated differently I heard them all hundreds of times and they sounded different that night I'm trying to think

off the top of my head some of the lines it's hard to when you're listening to and we're heading for home in nautical and they're headed

for home and in Ahead by a Century century uh this is uh this is no dress rehearsal this is our life right like that whole line like all of a sudden it screamed something different at me and it like it just got me like rain falls in real time yeah rain fell through the night yeah it's even now talking to you about it now like thinking of some wearing the first episode ever i wore shades by by the way. But yeah, it's tough. Getting the chills.

You know, it's funny. I really enjoy this. I like this song because for a number of reasons. I just, I had asked Johnny, I had asked one night if they would play it

when I saw them in Washington and they agreed and they played it as an encore and they sort of dedicated it, which was pretty cool, but they played the hell out of it. And it was the end

of a long night. It was a long, hot, hot night and it was their third song of the encore. And they're blitzed, man. They're tired. And they played the hell out of this, which I thought was really nice. But I wanted, it was between this and A Head by a Century.

And the story of A Head by a Century was, I heard the song before they ever recorded it. Wow. And I cried. They, Paul Langlois, I think it was Paul Langlois' sister, was getting married in California. And they were going to play this song at her wedding because Gord was going as well, right?

I don't know if it was Paul's best, whatever the case, but Gord was part of the wedding or was invited to the wedding. And part of the reception was going to be that Paul and Gord were going to get up and they were going to play this song. It's Paul playing acoustic guitar,

Gord singing. I don't know if Gord played acoustic as well, whatever the case. And they got up and sang this. So I heard a primitive version of it prior to the record coming out. And I'm just telling you, I got chills. It was like beautiful. It's a gorgeous song. It was beautiful.

But with just the two of them doing it and sort of rehearsing it for Paul's sister's wedding. So I remember afterwards, how did it go? Oh, it rehearsing it for Paul's sister's wedding. I just, so I remember afterwards, like, how did it go? It was great. They loved it at the wedding and they might've thought it was, you know, their special wedding song or whatever. And then when I heard it and when you hear it in full, you know, full effect, you go, wow, man, that was great.

So I just always, you know, thought it was a great song. So that was, it came down to thugs in a head by a century, but it could have been any one of 50 songs. Oh, that's, that's the thing. It's impossible to pick your favorite hip song. And I had to have a Canadian content, too. And again, you know, saw them so many times. And I know all the guys, you know, know them, know their families.

I didn't know this. This is a fascinating fact for me. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And I was very privileged. And this is the reason why I really can't go to concerts anymore unless I'm comped or not competent unless i'm backstage or but comped helps it helps you know you get spoiled by stuff i i can't go and enjoy it the same way if i'm sitting 40 or 50 rows back when i'm used to being like right there yeah i hear that yeah it was like almost like almost like sort of a groupie slash roadie do you know what i mean like i'm there to help i'm not that they needed my help

or anything like that moral supportal support, whatever it is. You weren't tuning the guitars? No, I wasn't doing any of that, but I was sort of there. I was sort of part of the gang. In fact, I met Cato Kaelin and they were there in 94, 95, the OJ trial. And they played the House of Blues in LA. And after the show, and there's tons of, after the show, there's a guy at the door and he's trying to get in. And it's Cato Kaelin.

He's trying to get in. He's going, I love these guys. And he's waving at Gord Downie. He's an honorary canadian gordon is going that guy looks familiar yeah we've been watching him on the trial every single day that's him he's what anyway it was uh yeah stories tales tales from the hip is was part of their you know the hip.com was probably one of the first websites that really was ahead of the game when it came to concert footage, when it came to interacting with their fans, special deals on concerts, you know, that kind of a thing.

First download you could ever get, you know, of the songs was allthehip.com. So they were ahead of their time when it came to relating to their fans, I think. I'm glad you had a Canadian song in there. But luckily, I'm going to close with a Canadian song. I'm going to close with Lowest of the Low. Yes.

Rosy and Gray. Very nice. Again, I know I said this after Song 9, but thanks for doing this. Thanks for being the first to take the plunge. You've set the bar now for Wilner and Cox. I got to hear if their musical tastes are similar to mine. I'm sure they are both

big fans of whatever. Well, Wilner had a list of 10. Now he's culling it and he's changing it up. It gets in your head, right? He's going to hear this one. He's going to hear this because this will go first, right?

This will be the first one to air. Yeah, I've got to post it in like 10 minutes. So he's going to hear it and go, oh man, am I up against it with Hebsey? He's going to hear you breathing down his neck. You're going to be hosting Jay's Talk next season.

Don't worry, Hebsey. I did back in 1984. I know. It's a small world, a small world. And that brings us to the end of our 241st show. You can follow me on Twitter. I'm at Toronto Mike, and Markbshire is at Hebseyman. Our friends at Great

Lakes Brewery are at Great Lakes Beer and propertyinthesix.com is Brian Gerstein. Sorry, at Brian Gerstein. See you all next week. Where you been because everything is kind of rosy and gray. Yeah, the wind is cold, but the snow wants me today. And your smile is fine and it's just like mine and it won't go away. Because everything is rosy and gray.

Cause everything is rose and green Well you've been under my skin for more than eight years