Toronto Mike'd: The Official Toronto Mike Podcast - Peter Howell: Toronto Mike'd #573

Episode Date: January 17, 2020

Mike chats with the Toronto Star film critic Peter Howell about his career as a music and movie journalist before discussing the movies nominated for Best Picture at the Academy Awards and comparing them to Peter's top ten films of 2019 list.

Welcome to episode 573 of Toronto Mic'd, a weekly podcast about anything and everything. Proudly brought to you by Great Lakes Brewery, a fiercely independent craft brewery who believes in supporting communities, good times, and brewing amazing beer. and brewing amazing beer. Palma Pasta. Enjoy the taste of fresh homemade Italian pasta and entrees from Palma Pasta in Mississauga and Oakville. StickerU.com. Create custom stickers, labels, tattoos, and decals

for your home and your business. The Keitner Group. They love helping buyers find their dream home. And Banjo Dunk from Whiskey Jack, one of the most celebrated roots, country bluegrass bands in Canadian music history. I'm Mike from torontomike.com and joining me this week

is the one and only Toronto Star film critic, Peter Howell. Welcome, Peter. Thanks, Mike. There is no other film critic at the Toronto Star. That's right. How long has there been one guy doing this at the Toronto Star? Well, it's officially been one guy for quite a few years, but I had a couple of colleagues helping me do some interviews, do some reviews,

but times are changing. It's very much a one-man operation now. I get worried for guys like you at the Toronto Star. So do I. I appreciate it. Have we done a wellness check on Ben Rayner lately? He's okay? Ben's doing okay. He's a pal of mine.

He sits right next to me, like kitty corners to me. He's okay. Ben's doing okay. He's a pal of mine. I mean, he sits right next to me, like kitty corners to me. He's an FOTM. FOTM is a friend of Toronto Mike. Oh, that's good. That's good. Let me check my watch. You are now an FOTM.

Well, thank you. Thank you. You're a friend of Pete's. Ben's a good guy. He's really a proud dad. It's funny because my kids are all like millennials. His is very young. His daughter's very young. So how old are my kids are all like millennials. His is very young. His daughter's very young.

So how old are your kids? I have three. My youngest is 27. My daughter, my son Jake is 30, and my oldest son Joe just turned 34. Yes. Okay. Yeah. So they're all millennials.

Yes. That's right. And yes, you're right. Ben's got a young child. I think she's about three or four, something like that. Because I have a three-year-old, because Ben was on. Yes, I think you're child. I think she's about three or four, something like that. Young daughter. Because I know, I have a three-year-old

and I, because Ben was on, yes, I think, yes, I think you're right. I think she's like three years old. But the reason I, I mean, obviously is that Mark Weisblot,

I'm going to give him a shout out early from 1236. Do you subscribe to 1236? I see. I read it. Yeah, I see it. Okay. Yeah.

He now owes me five bucks. Every time I tell somebody they should subscribe to 1236, the newsletter, owes me five bucks every time i uh tell somebody they should subscribe to 1236 the newsletter i get five bucks so it's a good deal but uh uh he there was an article by raju mudhar uh about podcasting and i was quoted in this and it was yeah sunday star it was in the entertainment section or whatever and then mark came on and thought maybe that will that's the final the final entertainment article of like, I can't remember exactly like his qualifiers on this,

but he felt like the entertainment section was going the way of the dodo bird. Do you have anything? Is it? I'm not trying to be coy and please believe me. There's a lot of things changing and I honestly don't know. I mean, the star is going through what they call the transformation. That's the official name for it. It's like a sci-fi thing. I don't have to tell anybody what the reality is for newspapers these days. And their priority is primarily news. And I think in all sincerity,

they're trying to figure out how to accommodate. They obviously can't do everything they used to do. So I honestly don't know what the future is. It's obviously not sunny days ahead, but I'm hoping that there'll always be a very strong Toronto Star commitment to the arts. Well, here, here, and same here. I remember when I grew up and the Dead Tree paper would arrive at the front door.

I loved the entertainment section. I loved reading. You were a music critic at the time and Peter Goddard, for example. He was ahead of me, yep. Right? And then later when Ben shows up, because he's been there a while now.

Yeah, he's an old-timer now. I kind of joke about, he was in his 20s when he first came and now he's in his 40s and I kind of kid him about that. Yeah, he's an old-timer now. So, okay. So I'm going to just read a quick quote

off the top from somebody who calls himself sports masochist. Aren't all sports fans kind of masochist in a way? But the only film critic I like, I'd like his take on going viral for the Mad Max question that was misinterpreted. Can you tell us a little bit about this? Are you talking about the can thing?

I don't really know because sports masochist, that's all he wrote as they say. But is there a story with a misinterpreted tweet about there's not a story you can tell that the um it was it was one of these exercise and frustration and it was also a real uh education in how desperately wrong twitter gets things and social media i was uh at can can is a great experience going to can film festival Film Festival because the press conferences attract people from all over the world. And the trick is to try and get the people to say something interesting. Right.

And I love Mad Max Fury Road. And one of the things I love most about it was that there was a really strong female component of it. For sure. With Charlize Theron. Big time. But it was different than the usual Mad Max thing. Although, you know, Mad Max Thunderddome, if you know it, had...

Tina Turner. Tina Turner, yeah. So anyway, I was... You're always trying to think of a question that will pique their curiosity as opposed to just asking another what I call the jukebox question. Right. Like, how is it to make this movie type thing? You know, you're trying to ask a question that they haven't heard before.

So I just said to Tom Hardy, you know, when you're reading the script, were you surprised how many women are in this thing, seeing as how it was traditionally seen as a male movie? Sure. And he just said, no, I never gave it a second thought. So that question was up and down, right? And I thought, oh, well, I tried. But then somehow that got perverted and percolated.

Two weeks later, like after Cannes ended, it turned into this whole thing like I was somehow saying that this should be an all-male movie and that it was bad to have women. Oh, wow. That's Twitter for you in a nutshell, though. And then I realized something I learned very early, and you probably learned this too, is no matter how much you try to explain yourself or apologize, it's never enough. Right, right, right. So you just don't even respond. That was a very valuable lesson.

Right, right, right. So you just don't even respond. That was a very valuable lesson. It was actually, I think it took five years off my life because I was deluged from around the world. Oh, no. And all of them assuming I was. They give some horrible misogyny. Yeah, and a lot of people willfully misinterpreted it.

But here's an interesting follow-up that most people don't know. Later on that year at TIFF, Tom Hardy came, gave me a big hug and apologized. He said, that should not have happened to you. Oh, good for you. And that was,

that made it all worthwhile. I mean, getting a hug from Tom Hardy, what else could you ask for? I'm going to let the listeners and even the viewers now because you're the first, no,

Steve Pagan's the first. You're the second episode of a new live streaming tech piece that I've introduced to the whole thing. So some people are watching us because now when you watch us, we sound as good as we sounded on the podcast.

That's like a new thing this week. But I'm going to tell people how tall you are because I'm now thinking like, can this even go up high enough? Like, is that? Yeah, no, I didn't mean to move it on you. But yeah, so tell us your height. 6'6".

Okay, so I was thinking, okay, you were coming in and 6'6". Okay, so I was thinking, okay, you were coming in, and 6'6 is very tall. What percentage of the world is 6'6 or higher? I don't expect you to know the answer. I can tell you a story. It seems like everybody's either 6'6 or 6'9 because I meet a lot of guys who are 6'9. And guys who are 6'9 don't have a sense of humor.

Is that right? Yeah, because I say to them in an elevator, how's the weather up there? And they look at me like, what's wrong with you? Like, you know, I always think tall guys should have a sense of humor because most people see it as a plus, except for when you hit your head. But I always find it funny. I usually don't do that anymore because I've had such a bad reaction from guys

who are 6'9". And my son Jake actually is 6'7", but whenever I'm out in the wild, so to speak, I encounter guys who are either 6'6 or 6'9". It's weird. Only at Raptor Games. Well, yeah, I don't go to many Raptor Games, but I guess you get a greater range there. That's actually where they're all there. But is your son still doing movie reviews? Yeah. Well, my son Jake does a lot of things.

He does the website. He's the website editor for the Toronto Film Critics Association, of does a lot of things. He does the website. He's the website editor for the Toronto Film Critics Association, of which I'm the president. There's the plug. There is. I told you it would come out naturally. It's just like organic.

It's organic, yeah. See, I've done this enough times. I know how to pull the levers or whatever. Yeah. Okay, so that's good for you. So your son's kind of falling in your footsteps, really.

And so, cool. Almost by accident. He never wanted to be a movie critic, but he got so fascinated, which is, it's really nice to see that. You by accident. He, he, he never wanted to be a movie critic, but he, he got so fascinated, which is, it's really nice to see that. You're, you'll discover that too with your kids.

Well, you forced movies down, down his throat. You didn't have to force him. Right. Did not have to force him. Well, there's,

I always think if you can get paid for like reviewing movies, is there a better job on the planet? Like, think about that. I mean, I've been a really lucky guy for the past 30 years. I been able to indulge my two biggest passions which are rock and movies you know and get paid for it so i'm a very lucky guy yeah and you stuck around long enough that if they do get rid of all the fun stuff in the trot star you had a good run i may be chasing fire engines

a month from now so yeah that's right okay so i mentioned your height because of course i again even if you're five foot eight i warn you to watch your head because you could hit it here but you're always watching your head we're in a dungeon by the way in case he's never told you this but it's better lit than it used to be it used to be it really used to be but you uh you you didn't need to watch your head because you're on default mode is to watch your head just like leo routins told me but then it came out, Peter Gross came up just before I pressed record, and because I'm doing so much work now with Peter Gross, we just launched a new podcast

about horse racing in Ontario, and he's got the Gallagher and Gross Save the World of John Gallagher. We have five new episodes coming, I think, next week. We're going to record them. But, of course, Peter Gross is probably half your height.

Yep, that's about right. How do you know Peter? This was a great story. Well, in the 1970 probably half your height. Yep, that's about right. How do you know Peter? This was a great story. Well, in the 1970s, it was actually 1978, there was a band called Battered Wives, and they became very controversial because of their title. For sure, yeah. So as a joke, I had a couple of friends, there was a guy named Jonathan Gross, who's now like a

music executive type of guy. As a joke, we thought, why don't we start a band called Battered Newsmen? We were working at the Toronto Sun then. Right. And we were complete rock heads. I mean, Jonathan was basically at that point, I think he was at that point the pop critic

or working as a pop critic. He's also an excellent photographer. He'd take amazing photos. Anyway, we started a band. The Sun actually gave us money. They gave us 300 bucks, which in 1978 actually was real money. And we went and rented,

we rented, I think it was Longham Equcquade on queen street we rented guitars and everything um and we played a gig at an old band an old club called the turning point at uh avenue road and bluer and added wives heard about us and wanted us they thought it was hilarious right people had a sense of humor back then and um they wanted us to open for them at the elma combo so i mean we for about six months we got to live as rock and rollers or pretend we were rock and rollers and peter gross was then the guy for city tv he was doing the sort of the man in the street kind of stuff like world according to gross right i think that's what it's called and he just phoned me up one day and said can i come out audition for your band and i said

yeah okay so he came and we were we we'd rented this um really crummy warehouse it was like the backside of hell but he showed up as camera guy we spent about an hour maybe two hours doing this i mean he was doing the whole shtick and um i actually never saw the episode i mean it airs i mean this is like the dark age right i never saw it it aired once peter probably has it on a tape somewhere well i'll make a call to retro ontario and see if he can dig it up. Anyway, he auditioned for the band and we had a few

laughs and that's how I got to know him. And I've run into him over, I mean, because I've also been a news, a regular news reporter in my time as a journalist. And so I've run into him at various events and things, but that was the main one. Well, I just think you look interesting together because just one guy being 6'6",

and I don't know Peter's height, but I've never warned him about hitting his head down here. But that's a wild story. So you, yeah, that's back in the 70s, right? Now you mentioned the sun. Like what were you doing at the sun? I was, how long? I was at the sun for 10 years before I was at the star.

I went to the star in 1988, but I started as a summer student in 1977. Actually, I tried out for the Blue Jays, believe it or not. Really? Well, I got to qualify that. The Blue Jays were brand new then, right? And one of my editors thought it would be hilarious. And people who know me don't need to be told this,

but I am hopeless at sports. The only physical activity I was ever good at was running. I run a lot of marathons. And I was pretty much a middle distance, kind of like middle type runner. But is it common for a 6'6 guy to run a marathon? One of my brothers says not, but then my brother's only 5'10, so what does he know?

But, you know. I've run 12 marathons. Wow, you're living proof. Okay. Anyway, my editor thought it'd be hilarious. The Blue Jays, and this was 1977 as I was a summer student, the Blue Jays were doing some kind of audition. And I don't even know if it was really for pitchers, but I ended up auditioning for pitchers at Exhibition Stadium.

And I just went and they took pictures of me. In the Sun files, there's pictures of me throwing the ball across the plate. And people said, I can't believe how bad this guy is. Why did he come? But I got a funny story out of it, so that's all I cared about. Just to tell people you tried out for the Blue Jays. It would be great at dinner parties when the Jays come up. Oh, I tried out for the Jays. It's like, what?

People were thinking, what made you think you could possibly do this? And I'd say, well, yeah. It was fun. This is a fun fact. And again, I've already mentioned his name, but I'm going to get another five bucks out of him by mentioning it again.

But Mark Weisblot, I like to tell him who's coming on the show and he takes more of an interest in some guests than others, but he was very interested in you coming on because we, like myself, we've been reading you forever. We love your stuff. So in 1979, this is the first time Peter Howell was in the Toronto Star. The first time you appeared.

Ready for this? Okay. I don't think that's right. Right. Well, okay. Let's hear it out and then you can tell me it might be right. Okay. So you were working for the Sun and it was a story about how you were a subway busker

on the side. So it's right. He's right. 1979. He's never wrong. Well, he's right. Yeah. That was another one of those things where you see,

one of the great, the sun used to be really fun to work for. I can't speak for it now because I've been gone for so long, but it used to be one of these great places where any crazy idea you came up with, you could do. It was fantastic. So in 1979, and you've got to remember, Toronto used to be a lot different, you know. They used to refer to it like God's frozen people, right?

They did not like buskers playing in the subway. They thought it was an affront to people's sensibilities. Right. So they actually had like an audition where they gave you a license. I still have it. I have the official subway busker. I was one of the first Subway buskers. Is it like a lanyard or is it like...

It's like a lanyard with an ID tag and everything with my picture on it and it's just official busker. And we actually, there was an album, believe it or not, which I understand to my astonishment, Ben found this, Ben Rayner. Yeah. The album we made, there's a local guy that made this album.

It's one of the hot things you can rent at the Toronto Public Library. It's like one of the top three rentals which is incredible but anyway um i tried out with my friend tom who's now sadly deceased a few years ago uh tom was tom was an incredible singer and an amazing guitarist i was an okay singer and a mediocre guitarist but together we sounded good and we what we did we went to a thrift store and we bought skinny ties. This was a new wave, right? Of course.

And we bought black jackets and we called ourselves the Beatle Brothers. So we went and we just, we played two Beatle songs and we just, we knocked them dead. Which two songs? Do you remember? I've Just Seen a Face

and The Ballad of John and Yoko, believe it or not. Yeah. And this got into the star and I just get a, we have a quote from you, okay? This is a, this is some. The quote from me in the star? Yeah, you're okay. from you, okay? This is a, this is some. A quote from you in the Star?

Yeah, you're, okay, yeah. Quote, this is a Peter Howell quote. Torontonians are really hung up on the top 40 charts. He was explaining why, you were explaining to the Toronto Star why you made more money playing popular songs. Yeah.

This is a, there you go, that's your first It's funny, I don't even remember this story because I was working for the Sun then, and I'm amazed that they would, I'm amazed that they'd want to talk to a Toronto Sun reporter because, you know, there used to be competition between the papers in town. Right.

Like you didn't acknowledge the other papers. It was just not done. So I'm, I'm actually kind of amazed by that. Recently, there was an, there was an interesting article. I think Mary Ormsby wrote it on Cash Palmer and this was in the Toronto Star and quotes all over

the place from Cash's buddy, Steve Simmons. So I thought, no, Steve Simmons is a sports comment for Toronto, but a long time sports guy at the Sun. And then I just found it interesting that Steve Simmons was all over this article. Well, I think things have changed.

I mean, newspapers, there's old stories, when you're going back to the 50s, there's stories of the When you're going back to like the 50s, there's stories of the Toronto Star renting cabs to block Toronto Telegram reporters, right, on the street from meeting their deadline. But I mean, it's changed. The internet has changed everything. The internet has indeed,

especially in the newspaper industry, it's trying to get back into closed Pandora's box. But now, what I find interesting, okay, so the Toronto Sun stuff happens, and then you're mentioned again, before you get to the star, you're mentioned again in the star. This is incredible research.

I know. I know. I give full credit to this stuff, too. You do all this research yourself? Well, I do a lot of research myself. That's good. These particular Timbits are coming from Mark Weisblatt.

Wow. Who's a big-time FOTM. But you were mentioned as the new, in 1986, the new 30-year-old editor of the Catholic Register. That's right. Yeah, very good. And apparently,

I'm told that you interviewed the Pope. I did. Is that the biggest celebrity you've ever talked to? I even received communion from him at Downsview when he was at Downsview. There's a picture of me receiving communion from him. And this is John Paul II. John Paul II.

Of course. I've actually actually also met one of the other popes, the one who's in the new movie called The Two Popes. I watched that. It was great. What did you think of the new popes? Benedict came to Toronto, and I actually interviewed him just as a reporter. He just showed up, and we scrummed him in a church.

This was before he was the pope. Wow. Yeah. I never got a sense he had any sense of humor, that guy. He seems a little... He was considered to be the Pope's hitman, you know, in ecclesiastical terms. I mean, he was the guy that... He was the...

Pope John Paul was the velvet glove and he was the... And Benedict was the brass fist, but... Wow. Yeah. Now, okay, so I watched, again, on Netflix, I watched The Two Popes. Yep. Great movie. I thought it was fantastic. And I actually watched it like the day so I watched, again, on Netflix, I watched The Two Popes. Yep. Great movie. I thought it was fantastic.

And I actually watched it like the day after I watched Jojo Rabbit. And then in my mind, it was like a sequel. Like Benny there, Benedict there was the kid from Jojo Rabbit. Well, I think Benedict was in the Hitler Youth. He was forced to be in the Hitler Youth, yeah. Again, it's so similar. I know, I didn't make that connection, but yeah. It's because you have to watch them back to back to make the connection.

And I did. I got them in the right order. Yeah, you did to watch them back to back to make the connection. And I did. I got them in the right order. Yeah, you did. By the way, back in, this is a really big tangent, but we're talking about movies. I saw back to back in theaters one weekend apart. I saw, this is 89, 1989.

I saw Scrooge. So I saw Scrooge. Yep. No, no, no. Other way around. I saw The Naked Gun. Yep. In theaters.

Bessie Nielsen, yep. Literally, and again, I was a teenager at the time, but I literally, you know, it's one of the rare movies where I literally laughed out loud. And I was kind of,

I want to say I was rolling in the aisles. I doubt I was really rolling in the aisles. But I watched that. And then the very next weekend, I saw Scrooged. And watching them back to back really ruined Scrooged for me. Like, because I had just come off Naked Gun,

it's like, it's almost like I was, anyway, this is a, I just remember that when I was thinking of sometimes when you watch certain movies and it's close to each other, it can have a big time effect on how you. That happens at film festivals a lot.

Like at film festivals, you see like four movies a day, four or five movies. So that, that happens. How did you, so maybe tell me briefly, like how do you get the job at the Sun

and then do you leave the Sun for the Catholic Register or what's going on there? Oh, you're really going deep here. And then we'll get to the start. I got the job at the Sun just by really wanting to be there. It was sort of counterintuitive

because I went to Carleton University Journalism School in Ottawa and there was this kind of snobby attitude that the Sun being a tabloid was just like beneath the dignity of our profession. We were all of like 22 then, so kind of ridiculous. But I was going the other way. I thought, well, actually, I think the sun sounds like a great place.

And I did my internship there. And on the strength of the internship, one week internship, they asked me, do you want to be a summer reporter? I said, great. And it just went very – it was a tremendous experience. I have incredible memories of it. In 1986, there was a priest named Sean O'Sullivan.

He originally was the youngest, I believe he was the youngest person ever elected to Parliament. I think he was 22 when he was elected to be a member of Parliament for Hamilton at the Hamilton Mountain. He was a protege of John Dievenbaker. He became, it was, Google it all up,

but you'll see that he was rather famous for becoming a priest, leaving Parliament, becoming a priest. He somehow got involved with the Catholic Register which has a reputation and then and now as being incredibly right-wing,

like incredibly conservative. Right. So they were trying to take a more liberal approach by bringing me aboard. They knew I was a Catholic. I don't like use the word devout, which I think is kind of pompous. I don't use that word. It's just like, I'm a practicing Catholic. I was a journalist. I was a practicing Catholic. There's not, I guess there's not a whole lot of those. So anyways, Sean O'Sullivan asked me to

come and do it. I was all of 30 years old. I just had my first son, you know, and it was an honor to be asked to do this. But I walked into like a hornet's nest where I was perceived as being like the antichrist by a lot of the readers. They literally thought, who is this guy? How does he have this nerve to do this? And it was an unhappy six months. It was like the proverbial six months. And I went back to the sun, but what I always say, there was kind of, there's an old saying, God writes straight with crooked lines. If I hadn't done that, I wouldn't have gone to The Star because I was so loyal to The Sun and so in the mindset. And when I came back, everybody said, Pete screwed up. That's how they saw it.

And I thought, no, he didn't. He just changed his mind. But that opened my idea that maybe I should try the star. So one of my previous editors at The Sun was working at the star so I just called him up and said, Bob, can we talk?

And that's how that went. And what year is that when you joined the star? I joined the star in 88. So I'm in my 32nd year now. So you don't start... I started the day Ben Johnson lost his gold medal. And you covered that story. I did cover it, actually.

That was one of the very first stories I did for the star. And on that file, there was also Kevin Donovan, just to shout out. Kevin Donovan used to sit behind me, yeah. I just bumped into him the other day, and we were talking about the Sherman murders. Yeah, I know. I was talking about that yesterday. I had a theory I was laying on him

that he's found interesting. Maybe when I stop recording, we'll share our theories. Yeah, absolutely. Because whodunit, yeah. But okay, so you're at the Toronto Star, but yes, so when do you start covering music? Like when do you cover music?

In 1991, what happened was, I've been the beneficiary of a lot of strange occurrences. Like the Star was a big enough paper. You know, itiary a lot of a lot of strange occurrences like um the star was a big enough paper you know it was a huge that biggest paper in canada yeah it was big for canada it was biggest paper in canada still is and it was one of the biggest in north america in terms of presence what would normally have happened when the rock critic would leave they would have go and hire somebody at a big doll they probably would have hired an american person you know is that kind of it was back, that's the kind of thing they did.

But in 91, the first inklings of recession, just before the internet hit, they were kind of pulling back a bit, and they decided they were going to hire inside. I was then the paper's transport reporter. I was writing about TTC and all that kind of stuff for about two years, attending TTC stuff. Ignore that. how dare i not

turn i can't if a guest had not turned off their ringer i would be furious but now i'm on vibrate anyway the um now he's checking his phone they posted they posted the gig and i said i thought you know what if i don't apply for this i'm never going to get it so um i went and said to ian urquhart who was a managing editor and and I said, I want to be the rock critic. He says, why should we make the transit writer the rock critic? And I said,

Ian, I said, if you give me this gig, I promise you a month from now, you're going to say, Peter Howell never stops talking about rock. That's exactly what happened. And you know,

that was 91, right? I still get people coming to my desk, asking me questions about rock. And I go, you know, I'm not the rock critic, right?

It's Ben Rayner over here. I will say, even in my mind, and I know you're the movie guy, but in my mind, you're still the rock guy. In my mind, I'm still the rock guy too. I mean, that was the most wonderful part of my life, I think. The thing about the rock beat was that you

could write whatever you want. They didn't care what you wrote as long as you didn't use any swear words and as long as you covered Billy Joel and Elton John. I'm care what you wrote as long as you didn't use any swear words. And as long as, as long as you covered Billy Joel and Elton John, I'm not even kidding. Right. As long as you, you color, they couldn't, like I was writing about Nirvana and Pearl Jam. I hit with grunge.

Like that was my era. Right, yeah. And so I'd be talking about, Kurt Cobain died. There's a story about Kurt Cobain. When he died, the sked, like a newspaper has a sked, and a 30 item sked, item number 30 was some grunge guy dies in Seattle. Yeah. Wow. the sked, like a newspaper has a sked, and a 30 item sked, item number 30 was some grunge guy dies in Seattle.

Yeah. Wow. I walked to the editor, who was Lou Clancy, really great guy. He was the guy actually who hired me, and I said, Lou,

I said, you remember when John Lennon died? He said, this is like John Lennon for Generation X. I called him Generation X. Yeah, that's my generation.

This is like John Lennon. It has the same impact. Yeah. I said, we got to do something about this. It was a Friday afternoon. He said, well, if you can give me the copy by six, we'll go with it. And they. Yeah, yeah, that's my generation. This is like John Lennon. It has the same impact. Yeah. I said, we got to do something about this. It was a Friday afternoon. He said, well, if you can give me the copy by six, we'll go with it.

And they put it page one, ran like full page, page two. You want to hear something interesting? Yeah. So I'm pointing now to a closet. In that closet is some Tupperware containers. I have a scrapbook because I had a scrapbook. For example, I was a big John Candy guy.

So when John Candy died, I cut out the thing. And I have, there's a whole bunch of stuff in that. The drive of 85 was a big deal to me, you know. But I still had it when Kurt Cobain died. I have the Kurt Cobain Toronto Star stuff cut out in that closet right now. It's probably me, right? Yeah.

It's you. Yeah. Unbelievable. Yeah, it was, that was, I always used to say that Kurt Cobain was the main thing that happened on my watch,. It's you. Yeah. Unbelievable. Yeah, it was, I always considered Kurt Cobain was the main thing that happened on my watch, sort of like that. Right.

But I also went to Woodstock 94, which is another great event. Right, that's the one, the Green Day, When I Come Around, with the muds. We call it the Battle of Green Day. I was right up near the front

where they started throwing saws around. I got hit by saws. I was covered in mud, but it was a great show. I was a big mud music guy at the time. And yeah, I remember watching it and they took,

they used to play because when I come around it was a single off of Dookie, but they took the video from Woodstock and played it as the live, that was the cut.

Yeah, that was the video you saw much music and it was really cool because Billy Joe's doing his thing and like a sling of mud would kind of hit

his guitar strings and you just kind of throw it away and it was just cool. Yeah, well, it was flying around the state. it was it was quite a day wow by the way the so you mentioned the the transit file and then going to rock or whatever

so ben spur sorry ben spur is the he's a transit guy now yeah yeah i he just wrote about neil peart so it's all because he's a rock guy right so i know i i actually saw that i said why isn't ben rainer writing this but but whatever right it's like it's all one it's all, because he's a rock guy, right? Right, I know. I actually saw that and said, why isn't Ben Rainer writing this? But whatever, right? It's all one happy circle, you know, circle of love. Well, I noticed in the Toronto Sun, the best piece they wrote about Neil Peart was written by FOTM Steve Buffery, who is the sports guy there.

That's right, I know. So I guess in this day and age, it's like necessity is the mother of invention. Yeah, I mean, I would have happily written about Neil Peart as well. I love Neil. He was a mean, I would have happily written about Neil Peart as well. I love Neil. He was a real gentleman, a great guy, tremendous lyricist.

It's surprising to some people how incredibly intelligent and well-spoken maybe some rock musicians are because they have obviously the you know, there's the rep of being kind of wild and all that stuff. I think my most interesting interviews have been with rock musicians.

So how does it feel now that you're kind of, and you're not the rock guy anymore, you're the movie guy, but you're the, to be the old timer now when you were the grunge guy back, like how does that feel? How does it feel? Well, you don't really get a choice, right?

You can either die or you can become the old guy. Yeah. You know, it's, I remember when I, I became the rock critic when I was 34 and then I's, I remember when I, I became the rock critic when I was 34 and I turned, I'm going to be turning 64 next week,

January 22nd. So, but when I was 35, I remember reading people saying, these 35 year old, old guys, which is hilarious now when you think about it.

I actually interviewed, here's some outrageous name dropping for you. I was interviewing, I interviewed Mick Jagger when I was 35. I've interviewed him several times but the first time i think was when i was 35 and he said oh well you're so young right it's all relative it's all relative at that point he was like 50 i think and he taught me his job but now i'm 64 and

it's like you know actually people are going to be singing a certain beatle song to me for the rest of the next i was about to tell you paul's got a song for you uh when i'm 64 yeah absolutely absolutely okay so what so tell us then how you how do you transition from or why like what happened I was about to tell you, Paul's got a song for you, When I'm 64. Yeah. Absolutely. Okay, so tell us then, how do you transition from, or why? Like, what happened that you're the rock guy and you became the movie guy? Well, in 1996, yeah, 1996, the movie job came open. There was some shuffling of personnel at the Star. And actually, the editor at the time, Kathleen Cannon, she came to me and she said,

I want you to be a movie critic. And I said, you know, I really like being a rock critic, but I had just turned 40 that year. And I thought, this job doesn't come around very often. And I really love movies. And I just thought,

okay, let's do it. And it was, I did sort of the rock beat for the next six months as well. There was a bit of an overlap. It was kind of funny. I ended up covering the Juno Awards that year while being movie critic as well. But by the time we got into 97,

it was full on. It was full on me being the movie critic. I went to my first Cannes Film Festival. So again, it was very organic and very kind of serendipitous in many ways. Can you tell me a little bit about back in the 90s, right? This is back when the record companies were throwing lots of money around, right?

Because those days are over. I don't know if you heard yet. Oh, yeah. I know. Okay, so flying you here and there for press junkets or whatever? Well, the Star has a very stern policy, which they still have, that you can't go in and pay junkets. So it had deep enough wallet

that you could go to some of these things but not all of them. I never went in any of the more outrageous junkets, but there were some events where I got to go to New York and LA quite often. I covered the Grammys and things like that. I was at the last Grammys of Frank Sinatra's when he started crying.

That was quite something. He just started crying. Right, right, right. Now, maybe before we get to... I have a great question again. Again, my third time for Mark Wiseblood. I'm getting rich here, actually. The guy loves me. Yeah, well, yeah, but what's not to love, right?

But I was going to ask you about Peter Goddard. Can you just spend a moment maybe? Because he was doing freelance until maybe five minutes ago. I don't know, a couple of years ago. Are you talking about the current state of Peter Goddard. Can you just spend a moment maybe? So, because he was doing freelance until maybe five minutes ago. I don't know, a couple of years ago. Are you talking about the current state of Peter Goddard? Like just what was it like working with him? And yeah, then the current state. Well, you know, Peter,

it's hard to describe the arrangement of the desk. I was sort of in a corner desk. So I had like, this goes back probably 15 years ago, but Peter used to sit like right behind me. He had kind of built like a, he had all these old posters and he made himself a wall he had his own his own like little place right we we were always very cordial i wouldn't say we were pals or anything but you had the same first name and you must have been uh and also he became movie critic as well so he was he was the

star's rock critic way ahead of me um and then he was the star's movie critic way ahead of me um but we don't socialize we We see each other extremely rarely, but it's one of those work colleague kind of things. Gotcha. Banjo Dunk, who's a sponsor of the show, I'm going to give you a gift from him right now, actually, since I brought him up, but he was telling me a story about trying to get Peter Goddard

to review the Whiskey Jack. There's a Whiskey Jack release in early 80s, I don't know, 81 or something. And it was this exchange, and I guess Goddard wasn't too nice to him on the phone or whatever, but he's calling up the reviewer directly to see if he'd review his thing. But

I have, and maybe you have a story. If you have a story, let me give you the gift first. So this is a new thing. Duncan has sent over his great book, My Good Times of Stompin' Tom. And he's got a copy. This is for you. This is Duncan Fremlin's book. Stomp and Tom is a great guy.

I only ever talked to him once. You know, it's funny. You often get, when you talk to talent, you get the handlers. You can't ask this question. You can't ask that question. No personal questions. Actually, that used to happen a lot more.

Surprisingly, it doesn't happen much these days. I'm kind of surprised. Although I got it recently. The only time I ever got it in my life was interviewing Chuck D. Really? Maybe it's because I never go to that stature. I know.

I think that's the difference because you're not going to do that. But now Chuck D is a whole different. But the guy who was manager for Tom was concerned I was going to mock him. And I said, I love stomping Tom. But he had kind of a renaissance in the 90s. But he was afraid that I

was going to be some hipster just taking the piss on Stompin' Tom. I said, I love Stompin' Tom. Stompin' Tom is a Canadian institution, right? So I got to chat with him. And he was, I guess he was like talking to my dad. It actually looks a bit like my dad, but it's, I have a lot

of respect for the guy and what he did. And he's a true Canadian character. Absolutely. It's come up quite a bit lately, obviously because we talk about Stompin' Tom now every episode, but that resurgence in the 90s and Margo's got the cargo on much music, like on high rotation, right?

And then the hockey song and the rest is history. But if people want to... Actually, I'm going to play. It's a brand new recording by Duncan Fremlin. And I can't remember if this is for the Stompin' Tom or if it's something else. So let's listen to Dunk, Banjo Dunk, and then we'll find out together what the heck he's talking about.

Banjo Dunk from Whiskey Jack here. And sitting right next to me in the studio is my co-conspirator in the band, guitarist, singer, and the best damn flosser in the city, Douglas John Cameron. Duncan and I and our band of all-stars have spent the last six years touring with our show, Stories and Songs of Stompin' Tom, and each year we kick off the new season with a star-studded show

at Moses Nimer's beautiful theatre, Zoomer Hall. Stompin' Tom's birthday parties were legendary, and more often than not, Whiskey Jack was there to supply the music. We've kept that tradition going, and on April 16, 2020, our Zoomer Hall show will be the 7th annual Stompin' Tom birthday celebration. This year, from our first show in 2014, we're bringing back Mr. Improv himself, funny man Sean Cullen. You know he's great, because no one anywhere else in the world knows who he is. Also returning this year is the great Murray Foster from Great Big Sea. The biggest star on stage at our show will be the genius of Stompin' Tom Connors. You can be there in person by going

to hellooutthere.ca and getting your tickets. This is a Banjo Dunk and Zoomer Media production broadcast live on AM 740, 96.7 FM, and streamed on the internet. We'll see you on April 16th. So there's a brand new, brand new hot off the press. But did you remember the song in the mid 80s, Mona and the Children? Mona.

And so that's by Douglas Cameron. So that's the doogie. There's some royalties there, eh? Yeah. And Bernie Finkelstein was just here. And it was True North that put that out. Bernie Finkelstein was here? Yeah.

Wow. And it was True North that put that single out. So the synergies are everywhere, Peter. It's unbelievable. Bernie, I used to have a cottage near Bernie Finkelstein's. I rented a cottage near Bernie Finkelstein's cottage. Oh, okay. That's not the Prince Edward County home he now has.

Well, he might have a home. But he sent me an email once a couple of years ago saying that he was up, where was he? I used to have a cottage at Barry's Bay for many, many years. They sold it for condos, believe it or not. Trust me, I believe it. We're all equivalent condos, yeah.

I just saw the Galleria Mall. Yeah. It's gone. Yeah. I believe it. Yeah, and Bernie was great, actually. Yeah, Bernie was great. He's quite a character.

But I'm enjoying this just as much. You know, and Bernie was great, actually. Yeah, he's quite a character. But I'm enjoying this just as much. Here's a story for you. I did a, the Stones, who I love, the Rolling Stones, they had a show called Exhibitionism, and they put a lot of stuff, like all kinds of curios. They had the set list from their famous Elmo show. And actually, they had the band list,

and who should be on that band list? Like the guest list, I should say. Right. Bernie Finkelstein. I'm there inondon england looking at this thing and there's bernie finkelstein's name on a roll on a rolling stone singer that's the bruce colburn hook up there i think that's that's amazing that's amazing okay what gift do i give you next and i'm gonna i'm gonna lift it up so the cameras can hear that's the winter ale but i have a six pack of fresh craft beer for you peter to bring home with you. It's courtesy of Great Lakes Brewery. Thank you. So if you haven't had the

pleasure of tasting some Great Lakes beer, now's your chance and it's going to ruin you forever. You're going to love it. So you take the six-pack of Great Lakes. And thank you. There was an announcement. I think they tweeted about it this week, but Great Lakes just renewed their sponsorship for the rest of 2020, which

is fantastic. For you. That's great. For me. You're doing great, man. Thanks, man. In this day and age, that's quite an achievement. Thanks. I'll see if I can talk Great Lakes into helping out the Toronto Star as well.

Yeah, please. Yeah. Just buy some ads. You mentioned you're a meat lasagna guy. Yeah. So that, and again, I mean, so now that, you know, it used to be I had a wide shot and you could see everything on the table,

but right now the shots are tight and you can't see it. So that is- Nicely packaged and everything. It's a beautiful red box. Palma Pasta, that's a, they have a location called Palma's Kitchen and that's a frozen meat lasagna

and you're taking that home with you as well. Thank you. Is that like a West Toronto tradition? Is that like a… Well, you know what? I can't even claim it here in West Toronto because they're Mississauga and Oakville. Yeah. Close.

Okay. You got to go a little further west, but we had a Toronto Mike listener experience at the Palmer's Kitchen location, which is near like Mavis and Burnhamthorpe. It's around there. Yeah. Go to palmapasta.com to find out and it was a the perfect facility like it's 10 000 well-lit square feet of retail and hot table uh tasty italian food and just tremendous so they're they're fantastic partners as well and taste great which is the most important thing. So you got your beer and your pasta and your book. Thank you. All right.

StickerU.com have made up a Toronto Mike sticker for you. Thank you. And I have a special message about January 30th. So January 30th, they're going to have a, it's like the launch

of their sticker museum and a permanent sticker art exhibition at their store, which is 677 Queen West, like Queen and Bathurst. And I'm going to be there. In fact, my date for that evening is Humble Howard from Humble and Fred.

And we're going to go to the grand opening there. And I'm told Dr. Draw, are you familiar with local electric violinist Dr. Draw? Yeah, he's apparently, Steve Paikin says he's pretty good. I was on Humble Howard's show once, and NY as we used to call it, right?

Okay, so what era? Because this is the- 90s, 90s. Yeah, well, that would be the whole decade pretty much. Humble and Fred, and they now, I produce their podcast, so they're still, they don't work Fridays, I noticed. Yeah. That's pretty good. They go Monday to Thursday. Good gig if you can get it. I produce their podcasts, so they're still, they don't work Fridays, I noticed.

Yeah. It's good. That's pretty good. They go Monday to Thursday. Good gig if you can get it. Yeah, I'm going to say, this is a Friday. I'm working Fridays. Yeah, so am I.

And Hebsey on Sports was broadcasting on Friday, but they go Monday to Thursday. And let me know if you'd ever want to go back and shoot the breeze with these guys. Sure. Because I know the guy who books the show. Yeah. I don't think I've talked to Howard in 20 years, though. You might not even remember me.

Because Howard's one of those guys. I work with some people who, when they were back in the 90s, they had fights with people. Right. And then now they're older and they've calmed down and they're more mellow. But still, I have a couple of clients. One, John Gallagher, you might have heard of him.

Yep. And one, Mark Hebbshire. And unbeknownst to me, they still have some kind of a thing left over from back in the day. Wow. You know what I mean? Like, so you never know. And Humble, there's some people like, oh, that asshole, that jerk, and it's like, you never know. But, so you and Humble

are okay? There's no... I hope so. I mean, you know, one of the... Here's my life advice to your jerk. And it's like, you never know. So you and Humble are okay? There's no feud? I hope so. Here's my life advice to your listeners. Once you get into your 60s, you stop caring about a lot of this stuff. You sort of forget why you were mad at people, if you were. And you also realize,

there's not a whole lot of time left, and so you might as well just enjoy what you have. Right. I promised a question from Mark Weisblatt. I'm going to read it to you. The lost art of the lousy movie review.

Toronto legends of them, he goes, Jay Scott and John Harkness, who both died young. Let alone Siskel and Ebert, but ask Pete if publicist ever yelled at him or froze him out over one. Like,

is there a, like, did you ever give a bad review and then, uh, get heck from the, I don't know, the PR firm or something? Well,

I can tell you one, one interesting story. Um, this is actually, um, this is, this is actually a funny story and it shows you how,

how, uh, you can, you can be dead wrong sometimes about a movie. I mean, I, I have this in my heart, I had this list of 10 movies that i think i got totally wrong okay and one of them was the big lebowski but um you know the coen brothers movie you were negative on it originally well you know it's funny i i made the classic mistake that a film critic makes is

that you try to compare it to its previous film the previous film was fargo which which had been my favorite film of that year. And I loved it. The Big Levowski was like a total left turn, right? And I saw it at its Sundance World Premiere. It was the first Sundance festival I went to. It was 1998. Coen Brothers were showing it at the Eccles Theater, the main theater there.

And I was there and it was like, there was no advanced buzz on it at all. Like it was just, things really were different back then. And so I saw it like, what was that, right? So I wrote, I wouldn't call it a total pan, but it was definitely things were things really were different back then and um so i signed like what was that right so i wrote i wouldn't call it a total pan but it was definitely i was disappointed i was more i was running for more disappointment so six o'clock in the morning um because it's two hours difference utah time sometimes it's park city utah right i get a call from the uh the publicist in toronto like screaming at me like how could you do this um

you know i thought we had a relationship. I said, relationship? What are you talking about? It's like, they always say that, right? It's like payola.

Yeah. As I got in with my accreditation, I said, calm down. It's like, you know, it's, I like,

actually sort of like the movie. I just didn't love it, but she was freaking out. But the funny thing was when I came back, I, I went and saw it again and I liked it. I liked it enough that I interviewed, who was the guy who plays the cowboy Sam Elliott

that was the guy that really impressed me the most I actually talked to the Coens about 8 years ago in Cannes and I asked them about The Big Lebowski, it was the 15th anniversary and I said are you ever going to do a sequel and they said no even though people want us to

but what's happened is that it's gone from that incident to it's now one of my favorite movies. Whenever I talk about my favorite movies, because I really love that movie. Any chance I get, I watch it. It was like a slow burn. It was classic slow burn because I got into its wavelength, but it caught me off guard the first time.

That's the same thing about me not liking Scrooge. I've seen Scrooge many times since and I actually like Scrooge today, but seeing it right after Naked Gun because it was the fun. Anyways, that's the same thing about me not liking Scrooge I've seen Scrooge many times since and I actually like Scrooge today but seen it right after Naked Gun because it was the fun anyways that's the same thing with you and Fargo because you're right Fargo is one of the great you know greatest movies of all time and I suppose if you're in that context of

okay what's the follow up to Fargo and then you watch Big Lebowski I can see you being disappointed your first round and then you revisit it and the charm kind of sinks in and next thing you know you're telling people that that rug really pulls the room together

or you know. I use that line all the time. The thing I learned about movies was sometimes the movie that you don't like there may be a reason for that.

It could be because it's giving you information that you're not ready to accept and that doesn't mean it's a bad movie. It means you're just not ready to accept it.

So if you and so that's actually that was actually a really good're just not ready to accept it. So that was actually a really good experience. It taught me something about it. So what I often, like frequently at a film festival, you're going to see a movie that's a bit out there. That's what they do. So I try to see them at least twice before I review them. In those cases, if there's a movie

that I think might have something more going on, I'll try to see it again before I review it. Can you just drop another movie on me that you were wrong about like that you acknowledge you were wrong about that you maybe you were harsh on and then later realized actually it's actually a really good movie

is there another one top of mind? That's probably the most significant one that I can think of it's extremely rare that you go from like a one star to a four star I mean I don't think I've ever done that like where you just completely change your mind and it's also extremely rare that you go from a one star to a four star. I don't think I've ever done that, where you just completely change your mind. And it's also extremely rare where you go four star to one star.

But you'll have some play in the thing where there'll be... Maybe you gave it at the festival three and a half, and it's really more like a three type thing. Right. I can't think of one off the top of my head, but I resisted... For TIFF, I resisted giving stars to movies because I said, you know, I want to see the head, but it's, it's, I resisted for Tiff. I resisted giving stars to rate to movies because I said, you know,

it, I want to see this again when it comes up, but we, we ended up going with stars. Now the Coen brothers, they've never done a sequel, right? No,

but, um, uh, they were, there's a lot of talk about spinning off the Jesus character, you know, the John Turow, Turow,

Turow, he was desperate to make a spinoff and they were going to let him do that. I don't know if it ever happened. I know, I know it's, I think I've read like a hundred stories about how it's in production is going to happen. I don't know if it actually came out.

Awesome. Uh, yeah, the Coen brothers are fantastic. I mean, we're going to get soon, by the way, soon,

very, very soon. We're going to get to the, uh, the Oscar nominated movies. Cause there's a, well, there's some heavyweight,

uh, directors, but, uh, not that you could see it because I put a curtain up, but my Pulp Fiction is a movie that totally blew my mind, and I have a giant Pulp Fiction poster

around the corner. He's a director, so we'll get to this when we talk about, he's got a movie nominated for Best Picture, so he's going to come up later. But thank you, Mark Weisblatt. That was my number one movie of the year. You know what?

We agree 100% on that. Spoiler alert, but that's coming. what? We agree 100% on that. Spoiler alert. But that's coming. We're going to dive deep into that. Before we get to that, I wanted to ask you, because you mentioned that tweet that got you in trouble for Mad Max. It wasn't a tweet. No, not a tweet.

Sorry, you're right. But there's a tweet that got you in trouble for Moonlight, right? Oh, God. I know. You're trying to erase this. I'm sorry. And I'm almost regretting I brought it up, except, and I don't actually understand it,

but completely. Maybe that's because, maybe I'm naive here and I don't understand these things. But could you share briefly, like it's a coat switching? Yeah, this must be from Wise Blot. Yes, actually, yes.

I interviewed Barry Jenkins in 2016, I guess, it was TIFF, and he kept using the term, which I thought he was saying, coat switching. C-O-A-T. Yeah, which to me was this kind of poetic coat of many colors.

That's what I was thinking, right? He was saying code switching. Neither term was I familiar with, but I have my son, he transcribes my tapes. I'm not trying to throw him under the bus. I'm just saying that anyways, he transcribed it all as code switching. And what I do when I see an unfamiliar term, I put it in Google to see whether that's actually true.

I wanted to check, but I didn't go deep enough in Google. I should have done that. But anyways, I saw, okay, it's a real term. Anyways, I put it in the thing and he was really saying code switching. There was this hilarious reaction of people who thought, oh, I can't believe it. I think Mark had some fun with that as well on 1236. But we changed it within the space of an hour.

Like, it was online briefly. Not fast enough, Peter. Not fast enough. And it's now enshrined in history. And now every time you do a podcast with an idiot like me, they're going to bring this up. No, no. I mean, I ask people questions, too, they're going to bring this up. No, no, it's, it's, I mean,

I ask people questions too that they don't want to answer. It's, it's, it's, it's amusing and also vexing because it's like, like, wow, that's, it was like, it was like a flash that, but, but the, the nature of the internet is that it never forgets, never forgets.

Right, right. And the screen grabs and all this stuff. But, okay. So just so I understand, and we won't dwell too long on it, but you thought he was saying COAT switching, which you thought, you know, meant that you're, yeah, switching your...

Switching your code. Like to me, in my mind, it was like, okay, sure. I just like Joseph and the amazing Technicolor Dream Code. Anybody remember that show? Of course, of course. But what he was saying was code switching. So it's like, for example... CODE.

Let's say you're from Toronto, area code 416 or 647, and then you start... Do I know, do the 905ers have a different accent? But let's say you're pretending to be a 905er. Okay. That's code switching. Okay.

This is more American than Canadian. I've never heard... Because I got to plead complete ignorance, and I sort of feel for you here because I actually am unfamiliar with that term as well. I believe NPR uses it all the time, but it was a term I was totally unfamiliar with, and I thought I checked it. My son, who I would think had better hearing than me, he had it as code switching.

It was just one of those things. Is it like if I start talking in a Texan accent as if I'm from Texas, that's code switching because I'm putting on a, it's almost like appropriation of a different. It's like, you know, there's a whole book about malpropisms in rock music, right? Like the Jimi Hendrix, excuse me while I kiss the sky.

They're called Mondo greens. Right. Yeah. Mondo greens. Yes. Excuse me while I kiss this guy. Right. It's one of those things.

Yeah. There's a bathroom on the right. That's right. There's a lot of great Mondo greens. That's fine. And the one that, because song two by Blur, right? we all know it because you know the aforementioned 102.1 played it every hour i think but uh this goes i got my head checked by a jumbo jet that's the

lyric and uh forever it was heard as a i got my head shaved i think that's you know there's a million of these right you're right and uh they made, I remember Four on the Floor. What are the, do you remember, what's the comedy troupe they did Four on the Floor? The. Frantics. Frantics, yeah. Right. Yeah.

And they did a whole great bit about the Bruce Spring, Blinded by the Light. And what he, what's really. Like a douche in the middle of the night. Yeah. Right. It was douche. I see it. Racked up like a douche.

Yeah. Another runner in the night. Another runner in the night. Yeah. I mean, that was, that was a Manfred, no, it was a Springsteen. I think Springsteen wrote it. He wrote it. Racked up like a deuce. Yeah. Another runner in the night. Another runner in the night. Yeah. I mean, that was, that was a Manfred man. No,

it was a Springsteen. I think Springsteen wrote it. Manfred man recorded it. Right. Springsteen recorded it. But it was like, um, when I was,

I, that came, song came to me when I was in my teen, teen years. And it's wrapped up like a deuce in the middle of the night. Right. But there was a million different opinions on what the heck they were, they were saying there.

Okay. Oh, by the way, what's the, like, like, like what, like you, you obviously don't know what the future holds, but you're still happy doing this at the Star and long may you run. As you said, I have the best gig in the world.

I mean, I don't know what the future holds. I honestly don't know what the future will let. I love the Star and I want the Star to carry on. And everybody who's listening, please get a subscription to the Star, digital subscription or print or both. Both. Both. Yeah. I mean, it's funny. It's totally by coincidence I was reading Fahrenheit 451 today.

I was just sort of killing time, and I was reading Fahrenheit 451. And there's a whole section in there about how the whole book-burning thing began with newspapers, where they got rid of the newspapers first, and then they started getting rid of the books. And I thought, wow, that's heavy. No, here, let me forget Neil Young, but Long May You Run is what I say to you here now. And there is power there.

Neil Young song, yeah, okay. Yeah, right, it's about a car. Yeah, yeah. Yeah, but I- But it's about me too. Right, it's about Peter Howell, actually. Neil's writing about- I'm sure he was thinking of me.

Right. Oh, I got a note from Lorne Honickman. You remember Lorne Honickman? Right? From City TV and CP24 and stuff. He was at, like, I think he was at his kitchen table or maybe he was at his dining room table. I don't know. He's at a table in his house and he's reading his

Sunday Star. And he's reading this thing and then he's reading an article about podcasting in his Sunday Star and he's, I'm quoted in this thing and he wrote me a note and said, you know, come by for a meeting. Like, it was a really, there's still great power in the, you know, being

in the, you know, the Toronto Star in the newspaper. Well, you know, what happens now, just to do a plug for the Star, is like, some people go out digital and people will react to the digital and then it'll come out in print, sometimes maybe a day or two later, like later, and you'll get a different reaction. Glad you mentioned this because that article I'm in

is a good example of something that never made it to the website and I guess it's print only. I'm with you. You want a theory that I'm working on? Okay. In this article, Raju has the CBC podcast people,

I can't remember who's it, Arif Durrani? I hope I got the name right. But anyways, there's a gentleman quoted all about CBC podcasts in the same article. I happen to know because Raju Madhar has let me know that there is now, as you might know too, an effort to have Toronto Star podcasts. Like, you're right.

So, I don't know. Whoever makes the decision to press the button and put in the CMS or whatever, if they just thought maybe it was promoting too much of competition. I don't know. This is just my pet theory, Peter. That's an interesting theory. I mean, I wrote a column about my dad in movies a couple of weeks ago and they wouldn't run the picture

of my dad and I thought, was it because he was holding a beer? But I mean, these are great conspiracy theories. But it's something that would just cause, I won't press the button on this one, but they thought your dad looked too much like Stomp and Tom Connors maybe. There would be some confusion. Maybe. You've gone down some very dark and twisty

roads here. That's what we do. Have you ever heard an episode of John Mikey before? Which one have you heard? The Ben Rayner episode? This is the Ben Rayner one and I heard the one with Steve Paikin. I thought it was very interesting because I know Steve. Oh, the first one or the one that happened just a couple days ago? Yeah.

Cool. Yeah, he was wearing his Toronto Maple Leafs jersey. His Ron Ellis jersey. Yeah. Well, he's a big listener of the program, so we should say hi to him. Hi, Steve. Say hi to Steve Paikin.

He's a good boy there. Okay. It was unfair what happened to you, Steve. Well, yeah. Actually, I didn't bring it up with him and I think that's good because I felt like if you get screwed over that,

like that was so unfair and then for the rest of his life, you know, I'm still mentioning your Moonlight thing because I think it's a whole different story. It was an innocent mistake

but for the rest of his life, every time he comes on a podcast, there has to be a Me Too discussion for a guy who's innocent. It was unfair. That's not fair. We got enough people we can have the Me too discussion with that.

So we don't need to do a pick in there, but let me, uh, thank the Kite-ner group. They, uh, jumped on board as a proud partner of Toronto Mike, uh,

in January, 2020. And it's been great working with them. I had Austin Kite-ner of the Kite-ner group over for a Toronto real estate minute. And I'm going to play that for everybody right now. And then we're going to run through the nine movies nominated for Best Picture and chat about them.

So here's Austin. Welcome to another Real Estate Minute with Austin Kightner at the Kightner Group with Keller Williams. Kay asks, if you're selling and buying, which should you do first? It's a really good question and we get it all the time. Ultimately, it depends because if you're buying something that's rare and you're selling something that is in high demand, you're better off finding the place that you want first because it's less likely that you're going to be able to

find it in the time period that you need if you sell first. If you're selling something that might not fly off the shelves, or if you need a certain price for the sale, you might want to do that first. But ultimately, you're going to be doing both at the same time, because the buying process takes time to find the right place, and the selling process takes time to get the house ready. But for more information about what's best and what's best for your specific situation, just text Toronto Mike to 59559 and we'll assess your specific situation and then let you know what the best course of action is.

So do that, everybody. Let Austin know that you're listening and help the program. Peter, you brought me a little gift. So now's a good time. Now, I'll pretend you just gave it to me right now. So, okay. That's my top 10 of 2019.

Top 10 films. I do this postcard every year. I do it as a favor to friends and family. They're always asking me, what's your favorite movie? And I said, here's my postcard. I mail it to people. So here's what we'll do.

Let's go through the Oscar nominated films and then some of them will also be in your top list. That's right. And then the ones later at the end, we're going to just let people know the movies that made your top list. That's right. And then the ones later at the end, we're going to just let people know the movies that made your top 10, but were not nominated for Best Picture. Sure.

What a plan. Yeah. What a great production. It sounds complicated, but I'll do my best. Okay. Yeah. All right.

So I just right now Googled, I'm staring at the Oscars nominated movies, and then maybe we'll just go one by one. And did you want to, would you mind telling us like what you thought of it? And then maybe i'm going to then i'll throw in my two cents on whether i saw it and what i thought of it sure so we'll start with a movie i actually have not seen yet so that's simple on my side ford versus ferrari you got to see that i want to yeah uh it's good it's good this is according to you based on a true story it's uh you know is according to you. Based on a true story, it's, you know, been a 1966 Le Mans in France,

you know, the Ford decided to want to take on Ferrari for, you know, the hegemony of the world racing thing. And it's really, it's, it's great. It's a lot of action,

great personality. It's like sort of a, a kind of a, an odd couple picture with Matt Damon and Christian Bale, who I interviewed those guys at TIFF actually. They were, they were a lot of fun to talk to. It's just, it's a really well done movie. That's They were a lot of fun to talk to. It's just,

it's a really well-done movie that's also got a lot of drive and action to it, like drive, obviously, but it's, see it. I promise I will see it. I will see it. And I will let people know, though, that Ford versus Ferrari is not on your postcard. It's in my runner-up. I also have 10 runners-up.

That was in my runner-up list. I see. You could have put the runners-up. I could have. Scroll them on the panel. I don't want to make it easy for people. I want them to read the paper. Well, everyone, I guess I should say this. The best way to find out more detail of what Peter thinks these movies is to subscribe

to the Toronto Star digitally. Also, I have Twitter, at Peter Howell Film Twitter. You can also follow myself. I've got my top 10 link there. Okay. And also, I'm always interested in like snubs or surprises. Were you surprised

Ford versus Ferrari was nominated? I'm sorry, which one? I'm still on Ford versus Ferrari. No, I mean, there was about five that were considered to be absolute locks. And then Ford was in that kind of,

Ford versus, that was in kind of that area that could be, and it got in. All right, I'm going to see that. Here's a movie I'm interested in chatting with you about because it was very long. I think that was the big controversy,

but The Irishman. Yep, three and a half hours. And you watched it, I'm going to guess. How many times have you seen it? Twice. Both in a theater? No, once in a theater, once at home. I'm a member of a couple of guilds so i get the

the fabulous oscar screeners and have your screeners ever leaked onto the pirate bay or never and they can tell whose it is right oh yes very much so it's yeah that's pain of death stuff so i was asked my next question is if if one of your screeners leaks onto the pirate bay and they can identify it because of that whatever the little marks they put in it or whatever. What is the punishment? I probably would just kill myself rather than wait. You know, there's only I think I'm right here. I think there's only two people that have ever been drummed out of the academy.

I'm not in the academy, by the way, but there's only two people. One is Harvey Weinstein and the other one is a guy who sold his screeners. That's how seriously they take it. Because I mean, let's call it, let's be honest the screeners leak onto these torrent networks every single year they do but if we can identify who they are then there should be more people banned uh or maybe it's not publicized or something like that it's it's it's

not what i do i mean it's like i respect the process i mean it's it's first of all i respect artistic integrity and also it's like it's it's would run against everything i stand for so and in the risk reward scenario, uh, where's, there's a lot of risk for you and where's the reward? Like, uh,

you know, exactly. You're just trying to screw the man. This is just a power move by Peter Howell here. Okay. Now the Irishman, tell us what you thought of the Irishman. It's like the,

uh, summation of a very long career of Martin Scorsese with some of his most revered players, Robert De Niro, Al Pacino, Joe Pesci, and it's actually a story in one of my other lives with the son. I used to be the labor reporter as well. I covered the aftermath of the Jimmy Hoffa assassination. I actually went 10

years after he was taken away and killed and interviewed his son in Detroit. I drove to all the places. So the movie had extra special resonance for me. But it's almost like an alternate history of the 20th century, as told to the eyes of a mob hitman played by Robert De Niro. I called it a masterpiece,

and I would stand by that. I thought it was tremendous. I would happily watch it again. It's just take all the great strengths that Scorsese has of storytelling and character building, tells it at epic length, and it's one of those movies that deserves to be epic length,

and it just completely shows you a guy who has sold his soul to something that he thought was important but ultimately realizes it wasn't. I thought it was fantastic too, but I need to ask you this. When you watched it on the screener, did you watch it all in one shot, or did you break it up? I did, but I mean, I've heard of people breaking it up into two or three nights

and I've actually heard of people kind of blocking out certain things that they think, which I think is unfortunate because it's not a miniseries. Right. It's a film experience. It's meant to be taken all in at once.

Although they should probably have like a bathroom break intermission. Yeah, but you know what I did though? I've never done this. I've never done this. I actually brought a pillow with me. They screened it in a Tiff Bell light box for the press, and I thought,

I'm going to really settle in for this thing. So I actually brought a pillow with me so I'd be even more comfortable in it. It was a good idea. And I mean, people, the nice thing, well, I guess, I don't know if it's a nice thing or not. Maybe I'll ask you. But the fact that people listening to us right now,

most people listening to us have a Netflix subscription or at least access to one. I would think so, yeah. And it's sitting right there. Like, there's unlike, you know, Ford versus Ferrari, there's an effort involved to do it right now, or money at least, and you've already probably paid for The Irishman. So it's sitting there. I watched it in two chunks because I simply just couldn't.

With kids. I got four kids. I couldn't find that time for us all to enjoy. That's perfectly okay. Okay, good. I want people to enjoy movies. I have a good time at movies. I try not to lay down rules.

I'm seeing a movie tonight, and I actually have not seen a movie. This is no joke. I have not been in a theater in 2020. No, 2020. Of course not 2020. I haven't been in a theater since late 2018. Wow, that kind of scares me.

I know. I know. A lot of that has to do with the three-year-old. What are you going to see? Bad Boys for Life? me. I know. Yeah. I know. A lot of that has to do with the three-year-old. You're going to see Bad Boys for Life? 1917. Good choice. Excellent choice. That's one of my top of the year.

That's a really moving picture. Hold on. We're going to get to it. Yeah, we'll get to it. We're going to get to it. Spoiler alerts. But I want to happily report to everybody that The Irishman made Peter Howell's top 10. It did, yeah.

I'm looking at the scorecard. So we're two for two right now. You're in alignment with the Oscar Academy. The third movie nominated for Best Picture is Jojo Rabbit. Yep. What did you think of Jojo Rabbit? Loved it.

I saw it at TIFF. I was really impressed. It reminded me of like, it was like a Mel Brooks movie made by Wes Anderson, you know. Yeah, there's a very Wes Anderson equality to it. And it was just, it just was such an interesting, you know, and actually there's a very Wes Anderson equality to it. And it was just, it just was such an

interesting, you know, and actually I went out and got the book, the original book, and the book, it's quite a departure from the book. Like when you talk about adaptive screenplay, he really did adapt it. He basically took the kid, the Jojo Rabbit kid, who has this mystery friend, who's Hitler, and he made something out of it.

I thought it was great. I loved that movie. And it was funny, this happens with critics. TIFF, for some reason, it seemed to set off some other critics as like, oh, we can't like this, you know. But now that it's gone the distance,

all of a sudden, some of the people that didn't like it are turning around. Now they're like, okay, I guess it's okay to like this movie. Same thing about your next movie that's coming up too,

Joker, especially with that. Okay, so I will let everyone know first that Jojo Rabbit is also on Peter Howell's top ten films of 2019. So we are now, there's three for three. This is great alignment, but let's see how that continues. The fourth

movie nominated for Best Picture at the Oscars is Joker. Yeah, eleven nominations. That's the leader this year. Were you surprised by that? I was surprised by how many nominations it got. I wasn't surprised that it made Best Picture, although I didn't consider it to be a sure thing, because it came out in quite

a bit of controversy, as you might remember. People were afraid it was going to kind of set off copycat stuff. But anybody who remembers Do the Right Thing in 1989, I mean, Rolling Stone wrote an article in 1989 saying that there was going to be riots because of Spike Lee's movie. Because Mookie threw the garbage can. Yeah.

Yeah. And that never happened. I mean, movies don't start riots. Movies, there's never been a case in recorded history of a movie starting like a riot, right? They influence people in many ways,

but not that way. But anyway, I thought it was really well done. I thought tremendous performance by Joaquin, Joaquin Phoenix and deserves the best actor. And it's not the movie I would give the best picture to, but I'm happy to see it in there. And another De Niro movie. So we've got so far the best actor. And it's not the movie I would give the best picture to, but I'm happy to see it in there. And another De Niro movie.

So we've got so far the fourth movie, and De Niro's in that one as well. And somebody else made the interesting point. It wasn't me that made this, but it's an interesting point where he obviously, Todd Phillips, who's director, he obviously really admires Martin Scorsese. Because you can see your taxi driver in this thing.

So you have the master in this lineup, and also the admirer, like the most devoted admirer in this Best Picture lineup. That's a good point here. And along the way, if there is an acting performance you think is actually worthy of winning an award,

let me know too because The Irishman has acting nominations, right? Yeah, Joe Pesci and Al Pacino. They're going to cancel each other out though because they're best supporting actors. Oh, that's true. That does happen. By the way, the Pesci... Al Pacino. They're going to cancel each other out, though, because they're best supporting actors. Oh, that's true. That does happen. By the way, the Pesci...

And also, Brad Pitt's going to win that. I mean, they might as well just send the statue to Brad Pitt now. We'll get to that, too, in a moment. We'll get to that, too, because I have a lot to say about that movie. But I will say, Keitel is also in The Irishman,

speaking of Tarantino movies. So, yeah, that's well... It's the greatest hits of Scorsese all in one movie. Yeah. I heard Bell Media. I can't remember who's in charge of Bell Media right now, but they were. Randy Lennox?

Randy Lennox. Maybe it was him. I don't know whose quote this is. I was reading, but. The Crave announcement? Right. But the SCTV. This is what, they filmed an SCTV reunion.

Recently? Scorsese yes because the big news was that Rick Moranis was going to appear at this even though he hadn't done much lately and it was Winter Elgin Theatre or something like that was this the benefit they had?

Scorsese is directing a SCTV reunion documentary thing a couple years ago ago, maybe. Isn't this an urban legend? No, this happened. This absolutely happened. It actually happened, okay.

Absolutely, yeah, it's funny. This happened. I have, there's eyewitnesses. This happened. But Crave was supposed to have this Martin Scorsese directed SCTV thing. Yeah. And this is happening.

But Scorsese has got so like engulfed by the Irishman stuff that he simply it's been on this it hasn't been completed yet but it's been years we've been i mean we all at least i want to see this this sctv thing so anyway i was just reading that whoever it was randy lennox or whoever was blaming the irishman essentially for the fact they don't have it yet because scorsese's been busy okay so the fifth He also did the Rolling Thunder review thing with Dylan. He's been a busy guy. Yeah, and how old is Scorsese?

I think he's pushing 80, if I'm not mistaken. So good, man. You know, I'm still pissed. Dances with Wolves is the movie that beat Goodfellas, right? Yeah. Like, looking back, do you think possibly the greatest atrocity in these Oscars? They get it wrong quite a bit, but... You know what?

The Oscars broke my heart when I was 12 years old and I learned a lesson and I never take them, I never take them that serious. I never let them do that again. In 1968, when I was 12 years old, I won a 2001 Space Odyssey to win Best Picture

and it was an Oliver. Oh, yeah, yeah. Won like eight Oscars and I couldn't believe it. I was like, I was stunned. Like the little nerd that I was, I was stunned.

And so ever since then, I don't let the Oscars crush my heart. They don't have that power anymore. They've lost their grip on me. There was another year, Crash got it instead of Traffic, and I was really big on Traffic. That was ridiculous. It also broke back Mountain. It broke back Mountain in 2002.

That's probably more egregious than The Dances with Wolves, because Crash wasn't a very good movie. The Dances with Wolves because Crash wasn't a very good movie. The Dances with Wolves actually is a good movie but Crash is like a TV thing. Maybe you're right. Maybe you're 100% right

but The Goodfellas is a movie. It's one of those rare movies I could watch every day and enjoy it. For me, I really have difficulty watching movies more often but if I stumble upon

Godfather or Godfather 2, I really have difficulty watching movies more often. But, you know, if I stumble upon, like, speaking of, if I stumble upon Godfather or Godfather 2, I'll watch it till the end. And Goodfellas is in that little club there. What was I going to say? A real quick aside on getting it wrong. The Grammys, I think it was 67, I think. The big record of the year went to

Sinatra. Grammys always get it wrong. But Sinatra beat out Sgt. Pepper. Not that I was around, but that I read about. You know why that is, by the way? Tell me. You know, the Grammys, something people don't know this, Grammys were started as a reaction to rock.

They saw rock as being the devil's music. They were, the Grammys were to say, this is the real music. Right. So from their point of view, Sinatra is better than Sergeant Pepper. I mean, it's insane. I mean, I love Sinatra too, right? But it's like that, if you don't know that history, it's like, how could they possibly do

this? I mean, the Grammys were a reactionary thing. That makes sense. Right, right, right. Okay, so we'll sprinkle more fun Oscar facts as we go. Okay, so now we're going to the fifth movie, because there's nine of them. Fifth movie nominated for Best Picture.

I have not seen this yet. Little Woman. Yep. How is it? It's great. I mean, it's Greta Gerwig. This is her second feature. Both have been nominated

for Best Picture. She's an amazing actress, amazing talent. She's actually a very nice person. I've interviewed her a few times. She takes the Louisa May Alcott story about a family of women in the Civil War and shakes it up.

She changes the timeline quite significantly. So if you don't know the story, you can be confused. And if you do know it, you might be confused. But she does a very, very nice interpretation of that story. And I haven't seen the movie yet.

And I didn't see the previous incarnations of the adaptations of this book. And I haven't seen the movie yet, and I didn't see the previous incarnations of the adaptations of this book. And I haven't read the book, but I learned that it does not finish with the line, they were no longer little girls. No, they weren't little girls anymore. They were little women. It doesn't end with that line. It doesn't.

Most is lack was wrong. Yeah. You know what? I actually blank out the endings to movies because I'm so aware of the whole spoiler thing that I actually, a lot of times I'll blank out an ending

because I don't want to ever refer to it. Interesting. Yeah. That's one way to keep yourself honest, if you will. Yeah, for sure.

Now, the little woman, remind me, how do you pronounce the first name of the star of Little Women? Saoirse. Saoirse. Saoirse.

Saoirse. Saoirse. Saoirse. Irish, yeah. She is the De Niro to Greta's. She is, yeah. Right, Scorsese. She actually went up to her and said,

I want to be your Joe. And I think Greta said, okay. But she actually, I actually interviewed Saoirse at TIFF about five years ago when she was doing the movie Brooklyn. And at the time we were doing, we were doing something with a lot of interviews. It was a little fun thing

where you said, what skill do you have that people don't know about? And she says, I can do a really good Valley Girl accent. I said, really? She's Irish, right?

So she did it. And then right after that, she did Lady Bird with Greta Gerwig. It was like, wow. Yeah, it was kind of neat. And Lady Bird was fantastic. Yeah, Lady Bird was my favorite movie

of a couple of years ago. That was my number one of 2017. Because of Aunt Jackie. No, it was great. It was fantastic. Lady Bird was my favorite movie of a couple of years ago. That was my number one of 2017. Because of Aunt Jackie. No, it was great. It was great. All right. Now, Little, I don't see, and yes, Liva

Fumka, I can't, my woman and my woman, I say them the same. I mean, I liked Little Woman, but there was a lot of good movies in 2019. It was a really good

year. So it didn't make the cut. It didn't make the cut, but you know, sometimes you got to slay your darlings, as they say. But it's a great movie.

Maybe I'll see if my 15-year-old daughter there, maybe. Okay. Here's another movie I watched on Netflix. Marriage Story. Yeah.

What did you think of Marriage Story? Beautifully done. I mean, it's funny. I've seen it referred to as a comedy and there's some comic bits in it,

but to me it's an absolute tragedy because here you have two, what seemed like very nice people who love each other. Like, I mean the beginning part of the movie, they, they established how much they love each other. Right. And yet seems like there's some kind of indescribable force that's tearing

them apart. You know, that one wants to live in the West, wants to live in the East, but it's like anybody who's ever been married, particularly if you've been married for a while, you know how you have to keep working at it. I mean, marriages don't just,

they don't go on autopilot. And I think that's the message of this movie, but both of them could have done more. Both of them aren't to blame, but everybody's to blame and nobody's to blame. And it's just such an incredibly, it really resonates. Anybody who's ever been in love

or who's ever been married or just thinks about life will find this movie very deep. Well, I've said on this podcast before, I'm a guy who's been divorced. And I always say for divorced guys, there's like a special trigger warning on this one. I found it a really tough movie to watch.

Oh, yeah. I can imagine. I mean, especially that scene where he's going trick-or-treating and he's sitting in the hotel room with the thing on. Honestly, there's so much stuff

and, you know, it's, you know, yeah. And there's the moment in the movie

where Laura Dern's character gets the gig, so to speak, and it's like, it's like, okay. It's sort of like,

it's sort of like Shakespearean, like, what that sets off. It's sort of, you know. And they have the good lawyers and the bad lawyers

and Alan Alda's a good guy and, you know, Ray Liotta's the sets off. Oh, yeah. That sort of. They have the good lawyers and the bad lawyers. Now and then Aldo's a good guy. Yeah. And Ray Liotta's the bad guy. And yeah, and of course, Adam Driver, who's very good in this film. But the moment I watched Girls on HBO, it was a show I watched with my wife. The moment I saw him, that's the first time I saw Adam Driver, there's something about him, something about him where he just seemed like he was going to be great. That's where everybody discovered him.

He was a Marine before that, right? I didn't know that. It's a guy from Girls, and now he's a Han Solo's kid. I know. Here's a plug for a movie. Jim Jarmusch does amazing movies. He had this one called Patterson that is one of the most poetic, and it's also about a relationship as well. He's a very kind of kooky wife. Okay. But he's just a guy who works in Patterson that is one of the most poetic and is also about a relationship as well.

He's a very kind of kooky wife. Okay. But he's just a guy who works in Patterson, New Jersey. He's a bus driver and he also writes poetry. Get that one out and watch that. That's great, that movie. I will.

No, because that's why you're here. You're telling me what I should see. Okay. So it's not the Freddie P story from Humble and Fred. This is a different Patterson. Okay. Yeah, that's for sure. Now, I'm happy to report to everybody

that Peter, once again, agrees with the Academy because it's, Marriage Story is on your, so only one so far, right? Joker didn't, Little Woman too, because neither Little Woman nor Joker. Ford versus Ferrari and Joker. I think Joker was in my runners up. I'm forgetting my runners up now.

There'll be somebody out there. Oh yeah, in Ford versus Ferrari. So I think I've been, all this time I've been saying you're four for four or whatever, I've been lying. It's because we're live and I... The bait and switch.

I forgot. Ford versus Ferrari is not in your top 10. But okay. Yeah. Feel free when I'm wrong, which is often, just jump in and say,

Mike, you're wrong again. So Marriage Story is also just like... Noah Bambaugh. Great movie. Just like The Irishman, though. It's sitting on your Netflix if you have access and you can see it.

But again, there's a rule, of course. I think we all know this by now, but you have to release it in theaters in 2019 to be eligible for these Academy Awards. You can't go straight to Netflix. Yeah, and I hope they keep that rule because if they don't, God help theatrical.

You know, I'm not too far from the Kingsway Theater. And those are two movies that have been, you know, Irishman and Marriage Story have been in there for, yeah. And also the New Paradise, right? That's just up the road, I would think. Dover, yeah. Yeah, I was there for the Dave Hodge

and the Reporters thing. Yeah, Dave Hodge hockey talk, yeah. And my lawyer, Ron Davis, who's a great jazz musician, lives like two minutes from there. And he's a suspect because when I locked my bike outside the Paradise recently, my bike light was stolen. So the bike was there, but the light was stolen.

Right. Yeah, so you got to watch out. Okay. All right. Here's the movie I'm seeing tonight. Yeah, good choice. 1917, nominated for Best Picture. What did you think?

I loved it. You know, stories about the First World War I loved it. You know, it's, um, stories about the First World War tend to be incredibly sappy, romantic ones, you know, like, um, it's, or they tend to be, like, horrifying stories about, um, the First World War, they called it the war of

inches and meters or something, or inches and feet, because you just never advance at all. But what this one, this is actually like a thriller. It takes you out of the trenches across no man's land into occupied territory, the German occupied territory.

And the mission is these two regular soldiers are told by their, by their commander, who's played by Colin Frode, says there's going to be a German ambush, 1600 men will die, including your brother. One of the things, unless you tell them. And that's the setup. That's all you need to know.

You've got, their telephone lines have been cut. Yeah. You unless you tell them. And that's the setup. That's all you need to know. The telephone lines have been cut. You've got to tell them. You two guys. So there you go. And it's all shot. The conceit is that it's shot in one take. It's not really, but it looks like it. And it's very mobile. Sam Mendes, great director. He's a great actor. Is he the American Beauty guy? He's the American Beauty guy. Also the Skyfall guy.

The Skyfall guy. Right. I think it was Skyfall. The Bond movie Skyfall. I'm pretty sure. Okay, but american beauty uh i have a question when when somebody is a what do we call but we talk about cancel culture and uh kevin spacey's an example of a guy who you know right it there's several kevin spacey movies i love yep i'm still allowed to love them peter i need permission from you can i can i say can i like american beauty quite a bit am i allowed i mean i you know i wrestle with that topic as well, but it's like, I think it's up to the individual

to decide how you feel about it. I mean, you know, I wouldn't go to a Hitler art show unless it was like some incredible news value to it. But I don't know. I mean, would you watch a Woody Allen movie? Well, that's another great example.

People have accused him of something. That's the more common example. I mean, everybody loved Woody Allen in the 70s and 80s. He could accused him of something. That's, that's the more common example. I mean, everybody loved Woody Allen in the seventies and eighties. He could do no wrong. And now he's been accused of stuff, never been convicted of anything, but accused of,

so I don't know. I mean, I think it's a personal decision of how you feel about it because a lot of movies offend people for all kinds of stuff. I mean, bad boys for life has a tremendous body count. My wife came with me to see that, uh,

bless her soul. And she says, I can't believe how much bloodshed there is, you know, but it's a comedy still. But I mean, it's movies, your reaction to movies is very personal. So it's hard to give a, I'm not inclined to give people dictums about how they

should conduct their life. I'll tell them what I think a movie is good or not, but I'm not going to tell them whether they have to go see it or something. Okay. But then in that vein though, like if somebody, let's say myself, I really liked Baby Driver quite a bit and Baby Driver's got Spacey in it, but we shouldn't be judging people who still like art.

Your Hitler example is too extreme. I can't do the whole comparing Kevin Spacey to Hitler. You know what I mean? I know, I know, I know. So I can't, like Hitler art exhibitions aside, Hitler, by the way, is fantastic in Jojo Rapids.

And that's the director who plays Hitler, right? Right. Here's a funny story. When I was in journalism school in the 70s, can I tell you this story? Yeah, yeah, go ahead.

I took a course, it was on propaganda film, right? Yes. The course was called propaganda film. I was majoring in journalism, but I was minoring in film. The course was on propaganda film. right? Yes. The course was called propaganda film. I was majoring in journalism, but I was minoring in film. The course was on propaganda film. There was a film about something to do with South Africa

that went apartheid, was like raging. And somehow a student union on campus thought that our minds would be poisoned if we saw this thing. So they picketed the screening. We said, the whole point of the course is to see these propaganda films and study them. Like we saw Triumph of the Will and to see these propaganda films and study them.

Like we saw Triumph of the Will and nobody picketed that, but they picketed this. I thought, this is crazy. That is crazy. So even back then, it's nothing new. But it was like, you take a course to study propaganda and talk about it and you're not allowed to see it. So, I mean. That is not so. But I'm looking at your postcard, your top 10 movies and 1917 is there.

Yep. So there you go. Another, more alliance there. So yeah, more, you're agreeing more than you're disagreeing. But again, every movie nominated for Best Picture by now, you loved anyway. So I'm going to do this one last. So I'm going to do now, let's talk about Parasite. Yep.

Parasite is nominated for Best Picture. Yep. Fantastic movie. It's Bong Joon-ho, the South Korean director. He's done amazing work Snowpiercer was like a sci-fi kind of movie, apocalyptic movie Mother

what was that movie, Okra about the giant animal research, but anyways he's an amazing guy that crosses all kinds of genres this one is sort of a class satire really dark class satire about a poor family called the Kims. I think they're called the Kims.

And a rich family called the Parks. And they live in Korea. And through a series of interesting developments, they end up together under the same roof. That's probably all the only walk-up you need for that. I've talked to people who claim they knew it was coming and I say, I don't believe you. There's twists in that movie that you cannot...

Have you seen it? No, no, no. But I'm definitely going to see it. There's twists in it that you can't see coming. I can't wait to see it. My wife has been very keen on seeing this as well. Very well acted, very well put together. Production time is incredible.

It's got six nominations. It's the first South Korean film nominated for Best Picture, and it has a solid chance of winning, which would make it the first foreign language film to win Best Picture for Oscar if it wins. Did, what, okay, was Roma nominated for Best Picture? Roma was nominated last year, yeah. Okay.

That was supposed to win, but the Green Book won, right? Right, right, right, right, right. Yeah. It's amazing, though, the movies that are now what I consider Netflix movies, even though you have to go into theaters before you go, like Roma I consider a Netflix movie. Yeah.

The caliber of some of these Oscar-nominated movies being Netflix movies is very interesting. There's a story today that Netflix is going to spend $17 billion this year. With a B. On original content that they make. $17 billion. That's like up two from last year.

Yeah. It's incredible. Yeah, I guess that's probably heat from the Disney service nipping at the heels and everything. What a world we live in. Okay. One more movie nominated for Best Picture and then we'll talk about the ones

you had on your top 10 that did not get nominated. But this is the movie that we both seem to like the most, Once Upon a Time in Hollywood. Yep. Tell me about this Quentin Tarantino movie. Well, it's one of those movies that

every time you see it, I've seen it about four times now, every time you see it, you can almost see a different kind of movie because there's so many different things happening, but the essential story is Leonardo DiCaprio plays sort of a kind of played out TV star. He's like Chuck Norris, if you remember The Rifleman. Well, you probably

wouldn't, but I do as a kid. Loved The Rifleman, right? Yeah, I don't remember The Rifleman, but yes. Google it. Go to YouTube and The Rifleman. The opening segment was great. He's a TV star, but also could be analogous to Clint Eastwood. Clint Eastwood had a pretty successful career, you might imagine, but he's trying to break into movies,

but the times are changing. It's 1969, and there's a different kind of thing happening. He has an extremely loyal friend named Cliff, who was his bodyguard. And he's been with him through thick and thin. And these two guys are going through all

this, you know, changing times, changing life. And in the backdrop, the Manson murders are falling. The set-ups of the Manson murders of August 1969 are falling into place. The Sharon Tate stuff. Yeah, all the same. And Margot Robbie plays Sharon Tate, who is the actress who

was tragically murdered, which I remember that when I was a kid. The summer of 69 was crazy. Speaking of the Beatles, you had Helter Skelter, right? Woodstock, you had Apollo 11, you had the Manson murders. I used to deliver the channel telling it. I would sit on my bundle of papers before I delivered it and read it. I was just blown away. But

this is really well put together. And I invite you to study the title where it says Once Upon a Time. And if you know Tarantino, he doesn't feel welded to the strict historical fact, but it's more like the way he wants things to be. Well, we all saw Inglourious Basterds, right? Right.

Yeah. So he's not afraid to take liberty with facts. I don't think people need more than that. But it's just, you know, they often talk about a movie being a ride, which is an expression I avoid, but this is a ride. Like, I love everything about,

I love the whole, like, hearing the radio from 1969 in the Cadillac. Like, I, and this is also not as long as The Irishman, but it's a long movie. But this is a movie where I did do it all in one take and it was effortless to do so. I actually wanted it to be longer, believe it or not.

But I am a big time... Here's a real nerd thing. Yeah, please. I saw it in 70mm as well. If you see it in 70mm, you can see really interesting details that he's layered in there. Like when Brad Pitt is opening up

the dog food for his dog, who plays a dog, Brandy, that plays an important role. Brandy, by the way, won an award at Cannes, believe it or not. The palm dog food for his dog. Yes. Who plays a dog, Brandy, that plays an important role. Brandy, by the way, won an award at Cannes, believe it or not. Oh. The palm dog.

That's funny. You can read the labels on the can. Did you see what the label said? Yes, I did. There's like rat flavored. Yes. And raccoon flavored. There's all kinds of like Easter eggs,

stuff like that in there. Wonderful. And we won't do, I would not allow Peter to drop a spoiler. I would punch him in the nose if he did not that he would because that's you obviously never do spoilers but uh once upon a time in the holly and hollywood is my favorite movie of 2019 and it sounds like it's also yours and i know that because it's the biggest picture and it's in the that's how that works number one

is uh that one number two is parasite and then the other ones are sort of like scattered but they are all uh okay so to recap now, so now we've done that is, by the way, what's going to win? Wait, no. What do you want to win and what will win? Well, I want the Tarantino to win, but you know,

any number could win. I think it could be 1917 actually, because you know, the Golden Globes aren't necessarily the best indicator, but 1917 won Best Dramatic. Tarantino won Best Comedic. They don't always work out that way,

but I'm also part of a group called the Critics' Choice Association and it went for the Tarantino. But I'm also part of a group called the Critics' Choice Association, and it went for the Tarantino. So I think the Tarantino might because nothing the Academy likes better than a story about Hollywood. That's a good point. That's a good point.

He has never won a Best Director. He's never won Best Picture or Best Director. He's only won... Screenwriting. I think he may have won two screenwriting awards, but he's definitely won for Pulp F Director. He's only won, well, Pulp Fiction won this. Yeah, he's won it a few times. I think he may have won two Screenwriting Awards, but he's definitely won for Pulp Fiction, yeah. Okay, so I'm rooting for Tarantino. So I'm going to now talk about those.

So I'm going to go through your list to remind people. So you have Once Upon a Time in Hollywood, which was nominated for Best Picture. Parasite, which was nominated for Best Picture. So tell me, you have on your list Apollo 11. Oh yeah, amazing doc. If you haven't seen that, rush out and see that. You know, it's funny, my wife is not really a space geek

and she saw that movie and she said, now I understand why you're so crazy about that movie. It's like, about what happened. I mean, that was probably the biggest event in my life, sort of having kids, was watching Apollo 11. Neil Armstrong coming down that ladder, 13 years old. Speaking of Oscar snubs, I was shocked. I think it was last year, but it could have been the year before.

You'll tell me when Best Man, First Man. First Man, yeah. Right. I was shocked it wasn't nominated. I was not because I was not impressed with that movie. Okay. I thought it was great. I've actually met Neil Armstrong, and I hate to be such a name dropper.

No, I like it when people are dropping names. But the movie was not the Neil Armstrong that I had met, and not like I knew the guy, but I mean, I followed, I worshiped Neil Armstrong, and that was not the guy that I knew. And the story was meant to be that he was laboring into some incredible tragedy,

and that's, it just didn't seem very accurate. But I have to say, the moon landing part of First Man is fantastic. The last 20 minutes of that movie are fantastic. Okay, so, but that was another Oscars. We're out of data now. Apollo 11, Doc, did not get nominated this year.

Do Docs ever get nominated for Best Picture? Oh, yeah. Michael Moore's Fahrenheit 9-11 got nominated. And I think, I can't think of one. It's rare, but it does happen. I'm pretty sure it did. I may be wrong, but I'm pretty sure it did. Okay, there was a Doc, as you know,

because you're a movie guy, Hoop Dreams. Hoop Dreams. We're going way back now. Should have been, yeah. Should have been, yeah. That was the one where I felt like after that, I felt, well, maybe they don't nominate docs. Well, they rarely nominate. I'm starting to question now whether Fahrenheit 9-11 got nominated. I think because prior to 2009, there was

only five slots, and those never went to animation, or once went to animation, and they rarely went to docs. Okay. So after Apollo 11 11 you had the irishman which was also nominated for best picture as was jojo rabbit and 1917 and marriage story but here's another uh peter howell choice that did not get nominated pain and glory yep tell us a bit about peter all motive peter aldemovar um stars antonio banderas who interestingly, first Oscar nomination ever. First one for Best Actor. Hard to believe, right?

Yeah, yeah. He's basically playing the director, Pedro. He's a guy who is a filmmaker whose best years are in his past, and he's sort of coming to grips with all that, and he has an actor who is in one of his films that reenters his life, and there's sort of contentious stuff happening there,

but it's a bit also like Woody Allen's Stardust Memories, but not quite as kind of vicious, I guess. It's a very melancholy movie and very personal to the director. So it's really well done. Pain and glory. Okay, and your last two movies, neither of which were nominated for Best Picture,

The Last Black Man in San Francisco. Yeah, I saw that at Sundance last year and was just blown away by it. I'm blanking on the name of the two directors, but these two guys come from this neighborhood in, I think it's the Mission District of San Francisco. And it's just almost like there's Serbial take on it. But it has to do with this house

that's very meaningful to the main character because it was the home he was raised in and it's about to be turned over. It's about to be sort of sold and he wants to be, so he becomes involved in that and it also incorporates all kinds of stuff. There's a scene where, you know, Jello Biafra, Dead Kent Kennedy, he

cameos as a guy leading tourists on those, what are those things called? The things that you ride. Oh, yeah. Mall cop things. Right. They're called Segways. Segways. It's full of great moments. And there's this incredible tracking shot

where the two characters are going on a skateboard through San Francisco. It has so much energy to it. It really makes you think about the concept of home and city. And there's a great line in it that makes me think of Toronto all the time where it says, you can't hate it unless you love it.

Just sort of how I feel about Toronto. It'll linger with me. It'll linger with me today. Now, your last movie here, I hope I say it right, Antigone? Antigone, that's right. I've heard it pronounced as Antigone, but Antigone, the Quebec movie,

Sophie de Raspe, tremendous performance. It's based on this play by, this Greek tragedy about, hard to describe, but it's about an immigrant girl in Montreal I think she's 16 and she does a

very dramatic bit of deception to aid one of her brothers. It's a very dramatic and very touching movie and I thought that was the best Canadian movie I saw last year. And my final question because I'm curious do you think that Adam Sandler should have been nominated

for Best Actor? No. No, I thought it was the best thing Adam Sandler ever did. Even more so than the... Punch Drunk Love? Right. Yeah, I didn't look...

I thought Punch Drunk Love was overrated, but Uncut Gems, I know it's become a critical darling and everything. To me, the character is a bit of a stereotype and it was...

I'm not a huge fan of Adam Sandler to begin with. I like The Wedding Singer, though. But there were so many other really good performances that I would have, Adam Sandler would have been maybe in my top 15, but not my top 10. And it's only five, right? So I don't think he got robbed.

The guy is as wealthy as Robert Kelly. He's got, yeah, his money will keep him comfortable. Do you want to predict the best actor and best act? Do you want to predict really quick? The acting ones are almost lead pipe since. The best actor is going to be Joaquin Phoenix for Joker. Best supporting actor will be Brad Pitt for One Punch Time in Hollywood. Best actress will be Renee Zellweger for Judy.

And best supporting actress will be Laura Dern for Marriage Story. I mean, that would be seismic if any of those four didn't win. And what are you picking for Best Picture again? Well, it's actually going to be interesting. I think it could be Tarantino, but it could also be The Irishman. It could be 1917. It could be Parasite. And it could even be Little Women.

Little Women because I think they very successfully created the narrative that somehow it was robbed, although it's got six nominations. I think Greta Gerwig is going to win for Best Adapted Screenplay. So she's going to do really well. But that could be the biggest surprise of all on Oscar night is if Little Women wins Best Picture. And that brings us to the end of our 573rd episode. Now, Peter, you know what's going to happen now.

Every year after the nominations, I'm going to want you to come back. And if I get you the beer and the lasagna, maybe you will. Sure, yeah. When you're bribing me with lasagna and beer, how can I say no? You know, Michael Apted, the guy who does the 63, he does the Up movies. Yes. I'm the same age as those people. I'm 63 now. Okay, because I haven't seen the new one yet. Yeah. I'm the same age as those people. I'm 63 now.

Okay, because I haven't seen the new one yet. Yeah. But I've seen all the others. So that whole series has really resonated with me. And anyways, I said to Apto, I interviewed him about a month ago, and I said, okay, when you do 70 Up, I'll probably be retired. I'm sure I'll be retired. But let's talk when you do 70 Up.

I can't wait to see. I've got to see the newest installment because I've watched them all and love that series. That's an amazing series. You can follow me on Twitter. I'm at Toronto Mike. And Peter, what's your Twitter handle again?

At Peter Howell Film. Peter Howell Film. Our friends at Great Lakes Brewery are at Great Lakes Beer. Palma Pasta is at Palma Pasta. Sticker U is at Sticker U. The Keitner Group are at keitnergroup.com.

That's K-E-I-T-N-E-R group.com. And Banjo Dunk is at Banjo Dunk with a C. See you all next week. This podcast has been produced by TMDS and accelerated by Rome Phone. Rome Phone brings you the most reliable virtual phone service to run your business and protect your home number from unwanted calls. Visit RomePhone.ca to get started.