Toronto Mike'd: The Official Toronto Mike Podcast - Remembering Larry Millson: Toronto Mike'd Podcast Episode 1992

Episode Date: October 8, 2026

It wasn’t long ago that we’d joke about how an appearance on Toronto Mike’d would help you live forever. FOTMs didn’t die. Then one did, it was Andrew Krystal, and then over the next few years we’d lose another and another, but this past couple of weeks has been awful.First we lost David Marsden, then Sass Jordan, and now Larry Millson. Larry visited me twice, once solo to talk about his visits to Maple Leaf Stadium, his years at the Hamilton Spectator, Toronto Star, Toronto Telegram and Globe & Mail, and the many Blue Jays teams he covered, then he returned to join Bob Elliott and Dave Perkins so all three could regale me with Blue Jays tales of yesteryear.Larry lived by Christie Pits, and he loved to photograph the Toronto Maple Leafs, so I’d even see him there and we’d chat about the current Jays. Larry was a gentle soul who covered more Blue Jays games than anyone else. So he had stories, and was more than happy to share them.My condolences to all who knew and loved Larry Millson. They don’t make them like that anymore. Here’s an extended excerpt from his first appearance on Toronto Mike’d, recorded on April 3rd, 2023. Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

It wasn't very long ago that we'd joke about how an appearance on Toronto Mike would keep you alive forever. FOTMs didn't die. But then one did. It was Andrew Crystal. And then over the next few years, we'd lose another and another. But this past week has been awful. First, we lost David Marsden, then Sass George. And now Larry Milsen.

Larry visited me twice, once Solo, to talk about his visits to Maple Leaf Stadium, his years at the Hamilton Spectator, Toronto Star, Toronto Telegram, and of course, the Globe and Mail. And then there were the many Blue Jays teams he covered. He'd return shortly thereafter to join Bob Elliott and Dave Pratt. Perkins, so all three could regale me with Blue Jays tales of yesteryear. I urge you to check out episode 1,271. That's 1271 of Toronto Mike. It's over two hours of Dave Perkins, Bob Elliott, and Larry Milsen telling me stories. Hook that to your veins.

Larry lived by Christy Pitts, and he loved to photograph the Toronto Maple Leafs baseball team. So I'd often see him there, and we'd chat about the current Jays. Larry was a gentle soul, with an infectious giggle, who covered more Blue Jays games than anyone else. So he had stories,

and he was more than happy to share them. My sincere condolences to all who knew and loved Larry Milsen. They don't make them. like that anymore. Here's an extended excerpt from his first appearance on Toronto Miked. This was recorded on April 3, 2023 in the TMDS studio. Welcome to episode 1,231 of Toronto Miked, proudly brought to you by Great Lakes Brewery, A fiercely independent craft brewery who believes in supporting communities,

good times, and brewing amazing beer. Order online for free local home delivery in the GTA. Palma Pasta. Enjoy the taste of fresh, homemade Italian pasta and entrees from Palma Pasta in Mississauga and Oakville. Season four of Yes, We Are Open, The award-winning podcast from Maneris. Electronic Products Recycling Association.

Committing to our planet's future means properly recycling our electronics of the past. The Moment Lab, brand marketing and strategy, PR, advertising and production. You need The Moment Lab. And Ridley Funeral Home, Pillars of the community since 1921. Joining me today,

a man who has seen more Blue Jay games than any other Toronto scribe. So says Bob Elliott. Larry Milsson. Welcome Larry. Oh, good to be here. Is Bob right, Bob says to me. Straight out, he says,

Larry has seen the Blue Jays more often than any other Toronto scribe. True or false, Larry? I think that's probably true because there are some seasons I basically did 162 games. And I started out in 1980 doing the Blue Jays. And I saw a few as a spectator before then. So I'm sure the total is high. I'm afraid to count it up.

That's quite the claim, though, because, you know, I'm thinking now of, like, I'm thinking of Dave Perkins. I'm just thinking of some of the longtime scribes. Dave, who I was hanging out with last week, by the way, but we'll get to that. Dave's an old friend of mine. We used to be neighbors. Okay.

And we also worked at the Globe. Both kind of a little bit of cynical. We used to take on the Leaf fans. He was on the desk and I'd feel like, I was a reporter, but I'd feel it on the desk once in a while. And they didn't like us very much. So last week, and I'll probably reference it a few times, because it just happened on, I want to say, Thursday night. So just last Thursday night, I was with Dave Perkins. And he says to me, he says,

call me anytime. And I said, careful, Dave, like, I might do that. And he goes, seriously. Like, he's like, call me anytime. So now I'm envisioning an episode with Bob Elliott, Dave Perkins, and Larry Wilson on the three mics, just talking about covering the Blue Jays. Oh, that'd be fun. You know what? I can make that happen. Let's do it. Okay, we're going to do this. Okay. We'll do it. I'll do it. All right, that's it. Done. Well, Dave said anything. And, yeah, I just got to get Bob Elliott. He spends some time in the Maritimes now. Like, I think he's got a grandkids in London, I think.

I've just been chatting with Bob via email up until last night. I was just joking about, do you think Chris Bassett needs another pitch? And Bob says, well, I heard he's had eight, has eight of them. That was quite the Toronto Blue J debut. For a little while, he had no ERA because he had allowed, I don't know, three or four runs without getting an out. Yeah. We need an out, yeah.

We need an out to get an ERA on this guy, but hopefully it gets better from there. I think it will. I think that's the nature of the game. I mean, that's his worst game. I guess he's ever had, but I'm sure coming to a new team and et cetera, et cetera. And I think St. Louis is a really good hitting team. Right.

And maybe when you have so many pitches that maybe you need to narrow it. it down a little bit sometimes, you know, go with, let's work in that day. He was getting this pitch as, I know that you threw a change up for his first pitch of the game, but you got it high. If you threw a high change up to a decent hitter, it's gone. And even to a bad, they always say, don't throw a change up to a bad hitter. I don't even think you should start a batter with a changeup, because the whole idea of a changeup is that you've thrown some velocity and now you throw something.

You want to speed a guy's bat up, I think, and then, you know, and then get them to go for it. Because my fastball is like a change-up, right? So it's like, you know, here's my heat. And it's like, boom, okay. That's about all I ever could hit was change-up because it was a bad hit. Right, but only if it was the only pitch that the pitcher had. Okay. So, Larry, we have a lot of ground to cover.

A lot of people wrote in when they heard you were coming on. Brian Gerstein writes in, he says, Larry was in the Blue Jays press box for five of the club's division titles and both World Series triumphs. And he has likely written more articles about the club than any other reporter from the, he says, he reminds us and congratulations that you won the 2016 Jack Graney Award.

So he was curious. Firstly, do you have any idea of how many articles you've had published in the Globe and Mail about the Blue Jays? Like, do you have, you don't have any concept of the number, do you? No. I know I would lead the whole newspaper and bylines some years.

But I did other sports too. And I'm still doing them. I'm still covering the Blue Jays. Okay, who do you cover the Blue Jays for right now? I work for field level media now. Like, I left the Globe in 2009 and never stopped working. I worked for MLB.com. Right.

Canadian Press. I covered a lot of games for Canadian Press, Blue Jays games, and a lot of other sports. Then in 2013, I went to the Sports Exchange, which we had to cover every home game of the Blue Jays. raptors and maple leaves. And then that went kaput in December 31st, 2017. And now, but out of that sprung field level media,

which I still do, I think I did 92 Blue Jays games for them last year. Wow. So, yeah, I'm doing, so I'm still doing, take the three teams. I bet you I'd do a 180 game stores a year. Half of them would be on the blue jays. Any plans to retire? Like, is it no point in retiring when your job is covering sports? Is that the deal?

Like, Larry, would you ever consider retirement? Retire, what's that? How do you spell that? So that's a no. I can pronounce you retire. No, I'm only 80. What the heck? You're 80 years old?

Yeah. Okay. I was going to say... And somebody still hires me. How do you like that? Okay. So no ageism in sports media in this country, as far as you're concerned. No ageism.

No. Just maybe sometimes younger people roll your eyes when you tell them something. But sometimes it turns out to be right. Do you ever get like an okay boomer? Is that the reaction you get? No, no. I'm a little older than a boomer, I think. Yeah.

Okay. Yeah. I'm doing the math in my head. So if it's post-World War II, it means you've got to be born in 45. No, no, I was born in 43. Okay. Then you are, that would be the greatest generation. I think so. I think we were.

Okay, you're the greatest chat. I just had this chat with the head of gentlemen over. The greatest energy. Congrats to you for remaining active into your 80s. That's awesome. But, you know, Richard Flohale was here the other day. Yeah, you know what? I actually worked with him.

You know what? I worked with him once, and I was going to Ryerson. And I also knew his sister. His sister worked at the same place I did. So anyway, when I was going to Ryerson, the first time I met, Richard was at a furniture show, I think, was some kind of a show like that. And so being a journalism student, I decided to practice journalism because we were putting out a daily newspaper for this show.

And so I wrote a story that said it wasn't positive. It sort of raised questions. I don't know, you know, the guys were saying, well, I don't know how this is going to work out and all that sort of stuff, which is not what they wanted. And poor Richard, he got it from the guy who was running the thing. And he had us all up there and we got, we were, we were, we were vilified pretty well. And he kept calling Richard an idiot. So we had to write a story the next day saying, everything's perfect.

This story, this show, this is going to be great. So, yeah, I know him from way back. Oh, that's wild. Okay, because, yeah, he was pretty, I don't know, maybe that was three weeks ago. I've lost track of time. But, yeah, 89 years young and still still. Going. Good on him. Good for you. Now, Mark Hebscher writes in, just one word, legend.

Okay, Larry, how do you feel being called a legend by a legend, Mark Hebscher? Um, I don't know. No, I mean, it's, that's for things that other people to say, you know, I just keep going. That's all. All right, question came in just this morning from Gere Joyce. Gere Joyce is going to be here tomorrow. Oh, you know, Gare, right? Oh, yeah, really well.

From the globe. Gare was at the globe? He was at the globe at the same time. He was at the globe at the same time. He said, I hope I said a lot. That's right. Yeah, okay.

So Terry Hansy, they always did spring trainings together. Take a moment, and Gare would love it if you could talk a moment about Terry Hansy. Well, Terry and I were good friends, and he would, I would let him stay at the Globe Mill condominium.

We'd rent a condominium. and then but then because I don't have a driver's license he would do the driving so it was a trade-off right and so we'd go to every game at spring training we went to every game not just the home games

and he's a terrific photographer and he was doing it a lot of his work was for the team program that he was obviously doing at spring training and yeah we had some pretty long drives including flat tires and the one flat tire,

I remember right on the, going to Lakeland there. And anyway, that worked out okay. So Terry was pretty handy with that. And we always, I remember with Terry, we always had the park close because he had all this camera equipment to look, you know.

And then we also had some good times at Eddies, which was the kind of our local hangout in Dunedden. It was a great bar when it was, just normal people right now they've tried to on their new ownership you know they always try to upgrade and they've got great stuff and it's still okay now they're not normal people they're trying to get rich people is that what they're not necessarily just people who think they're trendy somehow oh no you know not not all of them

but it's just a little too fancy now you know I don't feel comfortable in fancy bars but I used to shoot the hoops there Terry would be at the bar and I'd be shooting the pop a shot game putting up records and if you got a if you got a certain score, they gave you a free beer, right? Right. So I kept hitting the score and getting a free beer, so the next day the total that you had to reach would go up.

And I got to know the owner really well, Eddie. And so anyway, he finally gave up on that because I got pretty good at that game. I actually challenged quite a... This is supposed to be about Terry, but he was at the bar. and I was doing this and I played that Pop-a-shot game with people like David Wells and Oh wow boomer

Grewber Wow lots of people I remember once I was I'd beat those guys Merrick Icorn could shoot with either hand And we came to a standoff he had He could shoot with either hand equally he did that when he was a good basketball player junior college And he could he was totally ambidectr he could probably have pitched left hand Wow

And so I remember once Boomer got a little frustrated because he wasn't beating me. And so he missed one in one of the balls and he threw it against the rim and it bounced. So it bounced and I could see people's valuable beers maybe getting knocked over, right? Right. So I'd go and dove for it to make sure the ball didn't get too far into the table area. And I came back at Boomer said, I bet you never seen a guy die for a ball and, um, Pop a shot.

So it sounds like with that game, you know, you could get a free beer. So you're a man, you like free beer, right? I did. Yeah, I have not in the last 20 years or something. Oh, not in the last 20 years. But that might be part of the legend. Yeah, I could, I did consume a few. Okay, can I send you home today with some free beer?

Could I do that? Sure. Okay, so thank you, Great Lakes beer. They sent over some fresh craft beer for you, Larry. Thank you, Great Lakes. And you're going to go home with some fresh crab beer. Now, coincidentally, I was at, they have a location here in southern Atobico that I frequent,

but they also have a new brew pub. It's at Jarvis and Queens Key, and I was biking there just today because I'm going to record live from there next Thursday. So I'm doing this ride on the Waterfront Trail, which means I'm passing like Lakeshore and Stadium Road, they call it. It's really close to Bathers. And they have the condo tower that has the tip-top tailor sign on it, where the tip-top tailors used to be.

And guess what I start thinking about? but I start thinking about a place I've never been to, the stadium where the Toronto Maple Leafs played. Yeah, okay, Maple Leaf Stadium. Yeah. Tell me about your relationship with Maple Leaf Stadium and the Toronto Maple Leafs that played there. I probably went to my first game when I was seven years old with my dad.

And I remember the first game, they didn't play very well. And my father were yelling out, you bunch of clowns. But I went to games a lot, and eventually I ended up selling programs there. And I could have sold a lot more programs if I had the outside the stadium as the people are coming in. Right. I could have stole a lot more programs, but that's not what I wanted. I took inside. That way I could watch the game.

Smart. And they would never let me come back into the room and cash out until I had sold all the programs. I'm sure by about the sixth or seventh inning, because, you know, people are going to buy it outside, right? I think I'm sure some people bought that program either to shut me up or out of sympathy. But I did that for a while. And at the last home game, we didn't know that at the time in 67, I caught a ball, foul ball. Awesome. It hit one of the beams there and bounced right back and I put up, it was cold, I put up my hand and got it. So, and you know what? Of course, not thinking that we should be a treasure.

Of course, we went out for a few beers after the game. My friend, well, friend of mine, Paul Vickers and I were playing catch with the ball on Youngstreet. Right, right. Right. And then, and then I put it in my glove, which I had oiled, so all of a sudden I realized that I I still have the ball, but I'm not sure which one it is, because it got a lot of supermiter baseballs. But it would be nice to have International League if I could still see it. Right. I think Shaughnessy was the commissioner, president.

So can you remember, I'm a guy who never got to go to Maple Leaf Stadium. I've seen photos in some footage, and it looks really cool. Terrific ball. Tell me what you can about Maple Leaf Stadium, and then you got to see Sparky Anderson there, right? Because he was managing the Leafs. Yeah, and I got to know him too. I, um, it, it was like what you expect, uh, the romantic, uh, picture of a ballpark.

Um, the closest I've seen since, like, you know, since we, since, um, Toronto had a major league team. It went to the Dominican and I went to a stadium there that was very much like it. It was, um, short down the right field line, but it was 425 feet to center field. Wow. But Rocky Nelson, who was the first baseman, he'd been with, the Montreal Rose before that, and so it's sparky, actually. But he had that nice little pull swing, you know, lefty, and he popped a lot of home runs over that short porch there.

I'll bet. And it was, it was a, it was a really classic stadium. And when it was built, it was considered, I think, state of the art, you know, in the 20s. It was, it's what older people in, like me, in vision. of baseball park is being not so much it's like fancy bars well we have fancy ballparks now you know and I know you need it but this is what a real ballpark looked like but that 420 foot 25 foot to center field and I remember was it Mac Jones they're playing the Little World Series I've never seen

at that time I'd never seen a ball hit that hard it was a line drive it went right off the center field wall and you got inside the park home run And, but it was, I never seen anybody be able to hit. It was, it was, it was, you wouldn't believe the line drive it was. Like it was, it wasn't, there was no arc to it at all. It didn't seem like, just kept, you know, obviously it wasn't, didn't keep rising, but it was a frozen rope. Yeah.

And they had a center fielder in that same year in 1960, I believe, Jackie Waters, who was just under tremendous defensive center fielder. And I remember once he ran in a ball. caught it and kept running, stepped on second base and got a double play because the guy thought for sure it were going to drop in and he was straight far from it. I also, Sparky, I remember him, I remember it might have been his last game. I remember he took a dive for a ball when he was playing second base and injured his shoulder. And then he became manager maybe the next year. And I remember one game of the doublehead after the first game

coming out, he took the line up for the second game, and I remember he just kicked dirt all over the home plate because he was rather annoyed with the call that had gone against him in the first game. He scored, so he was thrown out. Did Sparky always have white hair? I need to know. Yes, yes, it seemed like, if I remember right, it was always, yeah. Yeah.

He was like, yeah, forever, yeah, sort of like a Steve Martin type thing. What a great guy. I mean, I remember when I was at Harrison, I did a lot of stuff for CGRT, which was the station. that, you know, still FM station. And we brought him in for an interview, and he was terrific. And then I went to Maple Leaf Stadium to go through their clippings because I was doing some sort of story.

This is, I'm still a student. Okay. And I know Sparky was in the next office to me, and I could hear him selling seasons tickets and stuff like that. Wow. But you knew the way it was going that it, that's 60 team won by 17 games. They won the pennant by 17 games. They won the International League playoffs,

but then they lost in the Little World Series. They called it a junior world series. Junior World Series. But from that time on, the attendance kind of seemed, it dwindled, you know. I don't know whether people lost interest because they just ran going away, you know. Mel McGeigh was the manager of that team, and he went on to manage the Cleveland Indians. So I have a lot of memories from that place. You know, taking my father there in Father's Day was good.

That was a nice memory. Nice. And actually being able to pay for it. And also, I was able to get free tickets at times from, I knew somebody who knew, like, some of the Bisons players. So I would get tickets and sit with their families. Because, you know, being close, their families, they have quite a few people from Buffalo would be there. So that was when I was about six. 16. And so I've seen numerous games there. I love that place. And, you know, even when I was

studying for exams, yeah, I used to take, I used to live in East York, and I used to take the bluer streetcar to Bathurst and the Bathurst Streetcar down. But even when I was studying for exams, I'd read it on the, on the streetcar. And then, because it was fairly long, right? And then, you know, sometimes between innings, I'd crack the book open again. But I was, I was, I was, I was, I was, I I always found a baseball park, a restful place. I don't feel, now that I'm working at one, I don't feel that it's worked, and I always found a baseball park, somehow comforting. No, beautiful.

I often wish I could go to Maple Leaf Stadium. Like, it kind of ticks me off a little that they blew this thing up. Yeah, I have a picture of myself. I can't find it, but I will one day. I saw it a couple years ago. A picture of myself, and when I was at the Toronto Telegram, They took a little desk for me and a typewriter, and we put it at the old home plate.

This was after they destroyed the word. Had flat in the place. And so here I am. I got a picture of me sitting at home plate at my typewriter. And I mean, so you mentioned you were born in the 40s, but when this team was birthed, this team was birth before, this is back when it was the Toronto St. Patrick's, right? So before the hockey team was called the Maple Leaf.

So there was the Toronto Maple Leaf Baseball team before. there was a hockey team. Yeah, that's right. I believe that's right. I think a few years prior, I think, when I do my research here. Is it true that you interviewed Casey Stengel? Yes. And Yogi Berra.

Okay, I got to hear this time. Give me this story here. There's not much of a story, but I was working for the Hamilton Spectator, and I got an old friend of mine and Dan Proudfoot. We room together, so I was supposed to cover a baseball game that weekend. It was either Inter-County League or Halton County League, the other. And I got Dan to cover for me and I said, I'm going to go to New York and I'm going to go see the Mets. And I've done it before actually, but this time I decided that I'd like to talk

to Casey Stengel about a prospect named Dennis Ryband, who is a Canadian. And so I ended up getting a media credential for that for one game. And here I was, I was chatting up with a couple of other players, and then I see Casey, and I went over to him and asked him about Dennis Rybant. And he says, oh, I think you better ask our minor league people about that. You know, a real great interview. But we chatted a little bit. And then I saw Yogi, and we talked a little bit, and Yogi says,

yogi says I said yeah I came down by train he says well you know next time kid why don't you try the plane it's a lot quicker of the wisdom of yogi right I like it what's his line he goes yeah it's oh that place it's too busy

no one goes no one goes there anymore oh yeah or how about the pizza you want it better just just better cut it in half I don't think I can eat eight pieces oh they're too good to be true Oh, my goodness. Okay, it's deja vu all over again. Now, this Hamilton Spectator gig that brought you to New York there,

is that your first newspaper job? Yeah, I went to Hamilton Spectator as a summer student. Then I, twice, and then they couldn't get a full-time position for me after I graduated, so I went to the St. Catherine Standard, and I was there until I saved it. up too much money and really wanted to get back to Toronto. So in 66, I quit. I did a lot of courts. I liked St. Catharines. I didn't do sports at all on St. Catharines. But I knew Jack Gatecliff, the sports that are a great guy. But I did a lot of courts and managed to get a lot of people mad at me

because I wrote stories about these rich people with their yachts and stuff like that, you know. And I thought I put a humorous twist on them because, you know, these people get fined in court. It was kind of neat. And I don't think anybody else had reported on things like that when they covered the courts because I was told by another reporter says, I talked to someone so at this cocktail party and they said they're going to sue you. And there was nothing wrong with what I wrote, you know, it was all factual. It's just magistrates court, right?

So, but I got kind of restless. I wanted to go back to Toronto, and so I did. It became a racetrack bum, which I always wanted to do for about three months. Okay, but pause right there, Larry, because Garnett Barnsdale, he's a good FOTM. That means friend of Toronto Mike. And Larry, you're now an FOTM as well, friend of Toronto Mike. Okay. So you can put that beside your Jaguarine Award.

By the way, what is a Jack Gwini Award? Is it a medal? Is it a certificate? it? Is it a trophy? It's kind of like a silver plate kind of thing. That's not bad. Yeah, it was nice. I had it done at Olympic Stadium.

I got my presentation rather than at Toronto. You know when the Blue Jays played the... Anyway, they would play exhibition games there. Yeah, yeah, that was called... What was that called? Not the Prentice Cup. That was... No, no, the Pearson Cup.

No, that was the Pearson Cup. No, I guess I don't know if they still called it. He called it that for many years. It was a Pearson Cup. Yeah. And, you know, we used to trap the baseball players by asking them, you know who Pearson is. And they didn't.

And then Buck Martinez, when he was still playing, he got wise to it. And he would warn them all the next year, you know. Listen, they're going to ask you. And then he was, you know. Oh, Buck, uh, Buck, uh,

buck blew it. Okay. Um, all right. So we, uh, what was I going to, what was I in the,

I was in the, I was a middle of, uh, taking you somewhere here. Oh, yeah. So, so, This is from Garnett Barnesdale. He wrote,

I'm pretty sure Larry covered horse racing and was the paper's handicapper. Yes. I am interested in that part of his career, and if he still has an interest in that sport. So let's make Garnett happy. He's a huge horse racing fanatic. So talk about the horse racing part of your life,

and I just want to let all the Blue J fans listening know that I have many Blue Jay questions and it's coming soon. Okay, go ahead, Larry. All right, I started covering horse racing. First of all, standard red racing for the tally, and then I did thorough red racing, and then I did a combined. I did both of them for the tally,

and then the tally folded in 71 November. And after a while, the globe, they put me on the horse-facing beat again. Again, I did both. And it's a beat I really enjoyed because I enjoyed, because I enjoyed the backstretch and meeting the grooms, the trainers, especially the trainers that a lot of people didn't know really well.

There's just a lot of really good stories there and just good people to talk to. And people who really love their horse. I know it's a gambling, it's a business, it's a big dollar business, and it's, you know, And it, but I found that the people who look after the horses genuinely love them, you know. Right.

And I feel they're kind of underpaid, you know. It's like a lot of people who do those jobs, but they're so important, you know. And I used to know, get to know the exercise riders. So I used to cover the races, except for the big stakes races. They used to try to cover it from the backstretch and get stories like that. And so just as my way of getting back at all the pageantry of the queen's plate, for two or three years running there, I did a story, and the main story going into the queen's plate would have been about all the grooms.

I'd do a little thumbnail as part of a feature of each of the grooms of each of the horses in the queen's plate. And it was good because it all had good stories. And, you know, I used to go to house. a few beers with them. They're the people, you get the real stuff from them anyway. You know, they'll, and once another time, I do the same with the standard brids, and there's a guy named Shaky Louis. He used to look after Trotter, Grandpa Jim, and he was a character.

He's a Canadian. And another time, I got to know another groom, I can't remember his name now, but he looked after Mayor Trotter named him. Delmonica Hanover and you said would you like to jogger one day? This is at Greenwood. Right.

And she's getting ready for the Maple Leaf Trotting Classic. And I said, sure. So I got there one where I had to go to Ford Erie to do the thoroughbreds that afternoon, but I went there early in the morning. So I got to do a lap with Delmonica Hanover.

Okay. And, you know, now this is the story. And the one thing, is you don't realize I didn't have goggles on, but I just had my glasses, and you wouldn't believe that what comes back from a horse sticks on your glasses like for a long time. I'm talking like days, maybe even weeks. But the shame of it all is that in the race, the big Trotting, Maple Leaf Trotin Classic, she broke stride, which he never did, you know. And I kind of felt weird. I wonder if it's just becoming strange hands, holding the reins that

one day kind of throw, yeah. Who knows? And luckily, I felt vindicated two weeks later or a week later when she won the Roosevelt International Trot, which is like the World Championship of Trotting Horses. Wow. They bring them all over from all over the world. She was one great marriage. One of my favorite.

Her and another one was Fresh Yankee, who was driven by Joe O'Brien. And Joe, Joe was such a great driver, you know, he's an trainer. And, you know, he's a Hall of Famer. He's from the Maritimes. So then there's the other part of it was, so I got to the point where I'd rather talk to those people than the big names. Although in harness racing, the guys are so good, even like great names like Billy Houghton and they were always really good.

And you could call them up if you needed something. And I also got to cover, I covered the rose, I don't, The Roosevelt International once, when I was at the telegram, and Fresh Yankee had not won, she'd been close for a couple of years, and I was haggling with them to let me go cover it. And Doug Creighton, the managing internet wasn't so sure. And I said, look, give me an advance for a hundred bucks. I'll put it on her.

Let's how confident I am she's going to win. And that'll pay for my expenses. He says, no, you don't have to do that. We'll send you. Anyway, she won the race. And, you know, I had a few dollars. I'm not a big better, but I did have a few dollars on her. That was a big thrill just to see.

You know, you have to remember in those days, it was kind of the international aspect of it was really important in horse racing because it was just, you didn't get that in the thoroughbred so much, you know. So then, like also, I got to cover a lot of big thoroughbred races, besides the local ones. I did my first Derby, Kentucky Derby in 1976. I did 77.

I got to cover Seattle Slu's Triple Crown. And I covered all the races. And in 1978, lo and behold, another Triple Crown with Firm. One of the greatest duels with him and Alidar. And that Belmont Steaks is one of the best races I've ever seen live. And I got to, I mean, just think they hadn't had a, a triple crown for like 25 years or something. And I get to cover them back to back.

And we almost had another one with spectacular bid a couple years later. And, wow. I remember, but he, Delp was a trainer. We just got him spectacular bud. And he was really against the, from Maryland,

he was really against the New York Press. So once again, I am a backstretch. person, right? Right. So when Spatucketer Bin wins, and he wasn't going to talk to the New York Press. So, or the general press, media, I was, because he has this resentment against New York Press. So as soon as he won, I hightailed it to the backstretch at Churchill Downs, went right to the barn, and there comes Buddy. And I'm sitting there. He says, I'm not going to talk to those guys. I'm not going to talk to those guys. And I'm saying, yeah, don't do it. Don't do it.

To myself, stay here. Give me the story. So, finally, he got talked into going to the press conference and all that, but I tried. What year, remind me, what year does Greenwood shut down? I can't remember now. Early 90s, though, right? Yeah. Early 90s. And I spend a lot of time there. I'll bet. I'll bet. Hey, did you ever, I'm going to shout out my friend and my client. I probably produced down the stretch, which is the definitive Ontario horse racing podcast. And I just want to shout out FOTM Hall of Famer, Peter Gross.

I know Peter. Hello Peter. Any good Peter Gross stories? No. Can I tell you a story about one of my great triumphs of the Kentucky Terrible? Yeah, of course. Well, Philly hadn't won it forever, right?

This is about 1915. And I'm looking at this Philly genuine risk who didn't look like a Philly, you know. She looked like a Philly. You know, she's, she was a very strong, strong horse, and she was really doing well.

And Dave Stevenson, who had been director of racing at the Ontario Jockey Club, has now, had gone on to New York, he was, but I saw him at the Derby, he says, take a look at this Philly. She is really training well. I have to give him some credit here.

and B. Roy Jolly was a trainer. He did not want to enter her. He wanted to enter it in the Kentucky Oaks, right? But the owners, the Firestones, they wanted to put her in the derby. And I got to know the exercise rider pretty well. So after conversing with those people, I put her on top.

I think the headline was, The Philly is a genuine risk. She won and paid a $28 bucks. A friend of mine said he had a book, who took six bucks six bets on that derby and five of them were on genuine risk he was not happy with me so and i was happy and then another another thrill like as far as betting goes i mean would have been covering sunny's halo winning the kentucky derby in 83 and i had so much money from home and I had to do an expo.

The expo was after that. So my wallet was so big, I barely get it in my pocket because of all the money I cashed. And not a lot of it was mine. But every time I'd phone home, like you'd phone the office, somebody else would put another, wanted to put another bed on Sunny's hay.

But that was... Anyway, it was a lot. But it was kind of nervous, though, because here I am going to, to St. Louis covering the Expo series, right? And, you know, I wanted to go to East St. Louis for the all-night bars. I got this wand in my head. I kind of nervous.

Pops, we may close, we may doze, but we never closed. 24, and you, St. Louis, they have a 24-hour bar there. There's nothing like being after a World Series, like in 1982, and being in Pops at 7 in the morning, and they're cleaning the place out. Wow. They said, we better get home, Bill. That was Bill Liever, who was at the sun. better go home bill because they're going to have a parade.

He might get caught in the traffic. Man, you've covered some, some events here. Okay, so let's get some nuts and bolts taken care. Firstly, you mentioned the expos there. You covered the expos at Jari Park. I did. Okay, tell me a little bit about that. Another stadium I'll never get there.

Great park. Well, it was good. I covered, let's see, I covered the last series of the season, of their first season. in 69. And Kurt Flood was playing for the Cardinals. And unfortunately he didn't play.

I think he might have played just a couple of innings, if at all, because he was injured, right? And that was memorable for that. But it was also, I love the crowd there. It was really, it's only, I think, a Montreal crowd can be compared to Toronto. There was a certain joy, you know? And, you know, it's the end of the first season.

and, you know, it was just a lot of fun there. Gene Mock was a bit of a sour puss, but that's okay. I mean, he always was. I tried to talk to him a little bit, but I guess I got there kind of late for his post-morum on the season, right? And I guess with him, I think he knew he was getting into, but the thing is, I don't care if you expect. losing for these guys is difficult, right? Right.

And John Robertson was there, Montreal was the funniest people I've ever met. And great writer. And he later came to Toronto. I just liked the atmosphere of the place. And I covered, I did cover other games at Jerry Park, like, say, opening days and stuff like that. and I cover them a lot more when they were in Olympic Stadium, which was routinely voted by, when the players,

New York Times studio, a players poll that was routinely voted, voted as the worst baseball park, you know, going, you know. Somehow beating out to exhibition stadium. They had some, yeah,

but exhibition stadium was quirky. I liked it. I know, I mean, well, it's not a facial park. Yeah, I loved it because that's what my blue jays played.

Yeah. The desk would, I was, I was, I was referred to the confounds of exhibition stadium, and they'd always change it to the confines, you know, and I'd say, no, no, no. Confounds because of the way the ball would bounce, the terrible tur. And confines is Wrigley Field.

You can't. I know that. You can't take that. You can't argue with that's guys sometimes. They have a lot of say, right? Oh, my goodness. Okay, so I got to get you covering the Jays, but firstly, you mentioned that you were at the Toronto Telegram, and then the telegram is shuttered in 1971.

Yeah. Yeah. Is that the same year you joined the Globe and Mail? Yeah. Yeah. Yes. Okay. It took a little holiday and went to the racetrack and stuff like that, aqueduct and Garden City,

and came back and the first assignment for the globe was a Chinese ping pong players were visiting Toronto. Okay. Okay. Now table tennis, right? Table, I call it ping pong. Table tennis, whatever you want to call it. That's quite the first venture there. Because 1971, obviously, there's no Blue Jays yet.

November, and I was on the desk, and John Bassett had closed the paper, and he also owned the Argos, right? And I used to cover quite a bit of Argo stuff. So I got, I'm on the desk when the Argos lost the gray cup. And I was probably pretty happy about that. Just because of what had happened. You know, it's kind of tough when you get a three-year-old daughter and, you know, you don't have a job. Well, yeah, yeah. And it was...

It's karma, right? It was the second time that it's happened to me. But you get a job so quickly. Like, that's relatively short. So how do you get the gig? You're Larry, come on over? Like, how do you end up? Yeah, basically, they called me up.

I could have gone to the Montreal Star too. Okay. And do you think about... And I could have gone to the Toronto. Actually... But you wanted to stay here. You're a Toronto guy. Well, I could have gone to the Toronto son.

I was going to be their first hockey writer. Wow. And because George Gross and Doug Creighton, they asked me. And I said, sure, I took it, okay? But what happened was the Globe also called, and Doug Creighton said to me, he said, our financing has fallen through, so if you get under the job, you might be, you might as well,

don't turn it down, you know, because there's nothing certain with this new paper we're trying to start. Right. So I went to the Globe and did an interview with Clark Davy, the managing editor, and I said, okay, And I got off for the job, but I said, I waffled, and I said, I'm going to have to, can I get back to you on that, right? You know, and I'll get back to you kind of thing.

I don't like to do that. But then, because I was still having hopes that I could work with, because Doug Creighton's one of the best bosses you'd ever have. And Gross was a lot of fun. And so I had to make a decision, right? And when Doug came up to me and said that we've got the financing game, we're on. But by then, I'd said I had to tell the globe that I had them. And in between that, I got a call from Dennis Harvey.

He used to work for him at The Spectator. He called me up and said, look, don't go to that new tabloid. He said, it's not going to work. And he says, you can come here. Because there was Rick Matamot, I think a couple of other people, Bob Johns, they went to the Montreal Star. Oh, the Star. Yeah, yeah.

The old Montreal Star, right? Right, right. That's what it's important. Youngsters realize that the sun, the little paper that grew. It was no sure thing when it was... No, it wasn't. It was uncertain.

You know, if I didn't have a family, I would have gladly have taken the chance. But my good friend, as it turned out, Eden Howitt, became the hockey writer, which is good... I was glad that, you know, that at least he got. And then John Iaboney, another friend who, he also did a lot of hockey. He did a very good job for them.

Now, go ahead, sorry, Larry. The thing is that the son, they really develop a strong sports section, you know. And, you know, the globe, we had a good sports. We had, at one time, we had a great sports section, but, you know, as years went on, they kind of de-emphasized it more. funnily enough, we'll talk more about these Globe sportswriters, but funnily enough, just today I confirmed the return of Stephen Brunt to Toronto mic. So listeners will be interested in late May,

Stephen Brunt back in studio for his third visit, but his first since leaving Sportsnet. So that's happening. So tune in for that. I was going to say, because that's Globe Mail triggered the memory there. But any Stephen Brunt stories while I drop his... name? No, I think most of the stories are about me.

What about David Shultz? He used to go to the World Series and all that, but those guys always went home early. I didn't go home early. What about David Shultz? He wouldn't go home early. Do you have any David Schultz? Only because he's here tomorrow. You know, with David, I didn't really cover a lot of things with him more in the office. He was to hockey and I was into baseball. Right. David, he was on the desk when he first got there. And so I got to know then. I remember, but usual desk reporter exchanges. Yeah, nothing spectacular

there. Okay, so once I get you assigned as the Blue Jays beat writer, it's going to be a lot of Blue Jays the rest of the way. So before I get you assigned as the Blue Jays beat writer, which I believe happens in 1980, Olympics. How many Olympics did you cover? Just the one. Okay, which one? Eighty-four. Oh, that's the boycott Olympics. Yes. So that was, I was fooled by that because I was very young, and Canada was dominating,

and I was like, we're like world beaters. And then it was like, oh, yeah, but, you know, these particular countries weren't there. That was a great Olympics. I lucked into a lot of really good stories because nobody knew, because of the boycott, nobody knew who the real favorites were, you know. So I remember Jim Christie and those guys, like I was kind of the last guy. and so they made out the assignments and they tried to go obviously you know the columnists and the and the guy was the regular Olympic reporter they tried to go to the spots where they're going to

get the medals right right it turned out it didn't work out that way but they sent me a member to the um cycling and because the women were supposed to win a medal at least and they were favorites but they didn't they didn't um get to the podium but but they didn't um didn't get to the podium but But that's on that same card, the next race was the Steve Bauer, one where he just missed a gold medal by a nose. So that turned out to be a great story, you know, because that was totally unexpected. I got to a few others like that, and I had a lot of fun with that because I wasn't like the main guy. I did a lot of offbeat features and stuff like that, and I would stumble into stories where a Canadian win a medal. I ended up being the Lake Casitas expert.

That's where they held the rowing, and the Canadians did well. The Canadian women cleaned up, and so did the men, the, was it the eights or something? And then there was twins on that team, and I'm still not sure yet if I was quoting the right twin. And I remember once there was the bus to Lake Casitas, and the rowing, those events were held early.

Right. So it's four in the morning. I didn't bother going to sleep one night. So I hung out in the press room there at the press center. I remember I had a few beers of the guy from New Zealand. There's a hoot. And so now it's four. I'm going to get that early bus.

So it's four o'clock or something like that or five o'clock in the morning. Whatever. And there's this other guy that's taking a snooze on the lawn there. He was waiting for the bus too. But all of a sudden the sprinkler system went... The poor guy jumped up. And he's got his notes in that. They're all soaked and everything.

Oh, the poor guy. I fell in for him. Oh, okay. So now it's time to learn. Who was the, I don't even know the answer to this. Who was the Blue J beat writer before you? Because the Js start in 77. Paul Patton and Neil Campbell.

The real Neil. Like another Neil Campbell we had at that was Neil A. Campbell. He was younger. He came on the Blue Jay Beat later. Right. But Paul Patton and Neil Campbell. And then Jim Gala was on there. He took over from Neil Campbell.

And then Paul Patton got, I think, a car accident or something like got injured. And I was covering a tennis tournament. And C. Stennings of SportsCiddle had called me up at the tournament and says, look, I got an offer. I hope you can't refuse. So we need somebody to go down to spring training. And I was a baseball fan. but, you know, had been away from outside of, you know, the experiences with the expos, hadn't done all that much, actual covering it.

So I took and went down there for my first spring training. And naturally, I found my way to the racetrack a few times, too, because there was a trainer from Woodbine. A lot of trainers, they would, at Tampa Bay Downs, that had a nice deep, deep track, so it lgged up the horse as well, you know, for the regular season on Ontario. And Donnie Campbell and I used to get together quite a few times when he's down there.

It was a very good trainer. And that was Steinbrenner's track. Okay. But the first spring training, so I would do, I did it about the first two weeks. I did it right up until there were games, and then I had to go home. First question, I got many, many questions.

Many are from me, but some come from FOTMs like Hebsy. Hebsy wants me to ask you, Larry, what's the best road city when you're covering the Blue Jays on the road? I like them all. There's always something good in every city. Milwaukee might be, for instance, considered a dull city, but it's great for neighborhood bars. And I can remember Alison Gordon and myself and Bill Lever playing with a bartender, we play this dice game for rounds, you know, stuff like that. But I would say Boston because I love Fenway Park. And also my cousin, my late cousin, he was director of histology at the Fourth Seventh Dental Center, which is Harvard University.

Okay. And so I get to visit him. So I always got all the Boston trips, okay, I hugged him. and so I could visit him. And there's a story with him, if you don't mind me telling it. I don't mind, of course. This is your life, Larry. It's my first game, no, my second year of, I guess it was Peewee Baseball

in East York at Cedarville Park. It's called Wadlow Park now, where Robin Rich Butler also played. Of course. My first game was against a team that he coached. He was about 10 years older than me. And very first bat, I hit a two-run home run. I batted second. Lead-off guy, Roy Appleton, classmate of mine.

He got on base, and I had an opposite field home-running. It wasn't as cheapy. Okay. And I had a really, really good game. Now, this is where my cousin John psyched me out. It was a high-scoring game. I was on base the whole game. Every time, you know, one way or another, I don't know if I hit for the cycle or not,

but I had a lot of hits, you know, four or five, whatever. So I come up and it's the last inning. Yeah. And we got runners in scoring position, two out. And my cousin John goes out, okay, here's the guy we got to get. He's the big guy. And sikes me right out. So what did I do with the clutch situation?

I took a fastball right down the plate for called strike three. And you know what? He knew how to psych me out. You got in your head. He got in my head. And so that was, but anyway, and we lost the game. Oh, oh, Larry. Okay, well, you can't win them all.

You can't win them all here. All right. And I want to tell the same team. Yeah. You should know that John Hiller was one of our pitchers. Oh, Tiger pitcher. Yeah. Yeah.

In the Canadian Baseball Hall of Fame, man. Yeah. one of my classmates too. Okay. What a stack team. We, um, uh, it's a story here, like we're in the class, but he wasn't our starting pitcher. One of my neighbors, um, Ray Carter was a starting pitcher because John had a paper route. He had a star of paper route. Okay. He had the late papers. And so our whole strategy was, hold them, Ray, hold on until John gets here. Wow. Because not only was he our best pitcher, obviously, he was our best hitter, right? He could crank a ball.

Hey, let me ask you a John question. Didn't he have a, like, a, like, in his 20s, he had a heart attack? He did, yes, when he was with the Tigers and came back. He came back, right. And he had one of the greatest seasons of a reliever ever had. I, you don't have the stats on the top of my head. And he's a Toronto guy, East York guy. East York, he's always, they always say he's from Scarborough because after grade

six, I think it was, either six or seven, he moved to his family, moved to Scarborough. But I can remember sitting there at shortstop, and all of a sudden, I'd say, He's drawn in his bicycle with the empty, you know, thing out, basket out front because he'd gotten rid of all his papers. Right. And here he was. So we knew we had some hope. I love that's a great story. And, you know, as you know, you're in Atobico right now, home of the greatest Canadian baseball player of all time.

And there's a question coming up later about him. And then I have a little story about his mom. Okay. Hold on to that. Dave Steve, I get, so I do host a sports podcast and we record every Friday morning. It's me and Mark Hebshire. It's called Hebsy on Sports. And so I love talking about these 80s Js, right?

Because it's like those were my teams. That 85 team was my ride or die team. I loved it. Listen to every game. Watched what I could. But was Dave Steve as difficult to deal with you as a member of the press as a legend has it? Yes, sometimes he was. But the thing is, you could wait them out.

And especially if an afternoon game, you could wait them out because we had the time, you know, because of deadlines at night. it's a little harder. But I will say that he always gave some of the best stuff because he always gave pretty honest answers. Which is great for everyone. You know, yeah, and he would say things like, yeah, we'd ask him about the home run ball and he gave up saying.

And he said, yeah, he said, I threw a slider to make him look bad. So I wanted to make a slider. I wanted to throw it even a better one. And of course it flattened out and it's like a bad fastball, right? My guy hits it out. Right. No, he would give some good at. He was difficult, but...

Because he was super competitive. Was that part of the... I think so. And, you know, everybody's different. He's got his personality and maybe, you know, you just had to, you have to learn how to deal with people, that's all. I just can't believe we... Like, he was an outfielder.

Like, the whole... He started his, when they signed, his, um, they had to play him in outfield because his mother said he's going to be an all-star outfielder. He was a center fielder. Yeah, Bobby Maddock and, um, um, Al-Lamacquia scouted him, and each one takes credit for him. But they saw his future as being a pitcher.

He would come in and pitch, but they humored him. They let him prove, show to himself that he couldn't hit at the professional level. It's wild to me. It's also, you know, it kind of reminds me of how, although much more impressive than this, but Wendell Clark was drafted as a defenseman, right, and became one of the great left-wingers and may believe history. So, of course, there's a low bar for that. Okay.

So Dave Steeb, man, in your opinion, having watched the bulk of his prime, should he be in the Hall of Fame? You know, maybe by today's standard, yes, but when he was up for voting, it was things like 300 wins were important and all that. He played on some bad teams. You know, yeah, and he really probably would have had a lot of, But wins aren't as important now.

People look at other things now. And obviously the way the game has changed, you don't get as many 20 win pitchers. He never won 20, but that wasn't his fault. Right. I think he's the best Blue J pitcher. So better than Roy Halliday? Yeah, it's, you could make an argument for both.

You know, I mean, I was, I guess you could say, you can make a case for both. of them as being the best. But I just think that Steve, when he was on, we just expected him to go the distance. And he was so nasty. His slider was so nasty. And I remember Buck Martinez would get mad at him at times

because he didn't use his fastball enough. And the other thing, he did have a lot of hard luck. Oh, yeah. And the thing is that people were starting to think that it was just whining, you know. by him or on his behalf. So this is the days before computer, so he had to do a little work.

So I went back and analyzed all his starts, right? And it turns out he did pitch in bad luck. If it wasn't blue pits, it was, you know, fielding things or, you know, various things that went wrong, you know, or the bullpen giving it up. So I went through all this, and I went to Buck. He was still catching, and I said, you know what? Steve's right.

He says, he said, it's ready. He is pitching it hard luck. And Buck says, please don't show it to him. Please don't show it to him. Because it's just what he needed is confirmation, you know? Well, I know he eventually in Cleveland, he finally gets his no-hitter. But how many, you were there at the... Yeah, and I was also there at the two near misses.

Yeah, I was going to say... The one that bounced over a man at least head, and then the one where Fred McGriff couldn't quite get to a... Yeah. To a ball in the ninth inning, yeah. I'm so glad he got one just because, like, to be that close and have those circumstances rob you of your no-no.

We were all worried because Junior Felix was under the ball for the last out. Okay, when he drops it, is they going to call an error a hit? But he caught it. He caught it. Famously, his book, of course, was, Tomorrow I'll be perfect.

Well, it wasn't a perfect game, but it was a no-hitter. That was probably, yeah, he walked a few people in that game, but it probably wasn't, I think he's pitched one hitters where he pitched better, you know. Right. But it was really good to see him get that.

All right, Dave, Steve, love it. Now, would you take a moment and talk? I'm actually wearing a faux retro George Bell jersey, and George Bell was my guy, in fact. This is my opportunity to play this for us all. Hi, I'm George Bell. You listen to Toronto, Mike. A little promo, thank you, George Bell.

Can you just tell us a little bit about that outfield? Shaker Lloyd Mosby and Center, and of course, George Bell, and left and Jesse Barfield with the cannon for an arm and right field. Yeah. They were good. They were, I don't know if they're the best outfield in baseball, but when they were coming up,

they were called the best young outfield in baseball. They're all like the identical age, like two weeks apart or something. Yeah, and it was, they were good. I don't, uh, Jesse was just, just an incredible arm. And it helped being an exhibition stadium.

I mean, the, you know, the, you know, the, if the ball gets to him quicker, it was short. It wasn't, it was shorter than the dimension said there was a mistake made. It was probably about three or four feet shorter than the three, whatever was on the wall. What was on the wall? Because it was on the, they put the fence on the wrong side of the flagpole. Oh.

Yeah, anyway, but that's a fun fact. Guys went first to third and at their peril, you know, and I've never seen a guy, you know, with the accuracy as well. He could throw a strike. I'd see him throw a strike to home plate from... Yeah, he was just really good. George, when he first started out, wasn't that bad defensively,

but he became not such a good defensive player, you know, but he could hit. And I remember his first, very solemn do you see. Jose did the same thing. Very often you don't see a guy have a really, hot spring training where it was 400. And then they just keep hitting the same way

when the season starts. But George Bell did that his first year. And, man, he was, he was, I love that guy because he's,

he was a team player. I know he had a bad rep with some people, you know, for, you know, and he was, my purple ass? Yeah. That's what he said.

And the Globe Mill published that and not purple, but. Well, I know it's asked because I've had enough of you scribes on to confirm it but yeah, it was always reported to a young Mike that it was purple butt. No, no. The globe, we had

it down as purple ass. Okay. So the thing is that I think Beeson will tell you this too, that he felt that between him and maybe Todd Stalmer, they're the two guys of Beeson's era there who really, really cared about

the Blue Jays, you know. George, I remember when Buck Martinez dislocated his ankle and broke his leg in Seattle. Right. And George was the first guy over to help him, you know. In fact, he was too enthusiastic kind of helping him. Mark says, you're hurting me, you know, when he's carrying the stretcher, you know?

And this is when he throws the guy out, right? Yeah, oh, that was the greatest plate. Yeah. Wow. Throw two guys out at the plate. Wow. He got, the first guy, Phil Bradley, knocked him over. That was when he was injured and he's on the ground. And Gorman Thomas, an old friend of Bucks with the Brewers,

wasn't going to, he just kind of went softly into home plate and Buck was able to tag him. But what had happened is Buck's on his back and Gorman's going to third base and Buck throws the third and it goes wild, obviously, because he's on his back. Right. And George Bell, I think, got the ball and threw it in and it was a strike. And they got him, yeah. It was one of the...

And you know what? It wasn't even the play of the week if I remember right. Carlton Fist tagged two guys at home. But, you know, the Carlton Fist swipe tags, and they made that play of the week. You know, how could they not make this one play? Because it's Toronto, Larry.

It's Toronto. But I was amazed by that. You know, it's, you know, Carlton Fisk. Okay. It's because it's Carlton Fist. I know. You know, you mentioned Beast in there. Do you have an email address for Paul Beeston?

He doesn't answer his email. Only because I was with him last week. And the Jay's season opener. And we were watching the ninth inning, Jay's win, and we were together for that. And we had a really good chat. But I didn't have the courage to say, Paul, get in my basement.

I got to collect these stories. And now I want to follow up with something, but I need an email. I'll get it for you. Okay. So, shout out to Beeston. Absolutely. Okay.

But getting back to that outfield, that was, oh yeah, we haven't got to Lloyd yet. He was, Lloyd, like, I like them all in their own way, different ways.

Lloyd, George is funny. I've got to get, tell this George story. Tell me any George Bell stories you want. Are you kidding me? He would always say, I'm not talking to you guys.

I'm not talking to you guys. Guess who he hung out with at the hotel bar after the game? Us. He hung out with the reporters. So one day I told him, I said, George,

you know, I've quoted you eight times since you weren't talking to us? Okay, let me ask you another question. here. Is it true? I believe it was Fergie Oliver used to give $50 bills. Yes. Okay.

And they take it and casually stuff it up their sleeve, you know, kind of thing. Yeah. Yeah, I love those stories too. Okay, so shout out to Fergie Oliver. Lloyd Mosby, like, he, I think he envisioned, thought he was, thought of himself more of as a

basketball player. He always told me, I said, what player would you be if you were a basketball player? You know, and he says, because he got his shaker or Nick name from him basketball. He says, Norm Nixon, who was a really good guard with the Lakers. And so... You know, I don't think I knew this, Larry.

I don't think I knew the origin of the shaker nickname. He could shake him big. Apparently. So basketball is where he got that nickname. You probably never knew that Cecil Fielder was an All-Star Point Guard in high school in basketball. No, because he's huge.

Yeah, we never thought of that, would you? Okay, okay, now listen, I'm going to jump around chronologically, but Jason Elliott did write in with a question for you, Larry. He wants to know any explanation for how Cecil Fielder left Toronto for Japan then Detroit and became such an incredible hitter. He just wants to know how do you go to Japan and then become 50 home run guy? I think he, I don't know.

I think he just got a chance to play, you know. Don't forget, he had Fred McGriff was here. Fred McGriff was here. And they were good friends. And, you know, Cecil, I remember we had lunch together once near the end of the season, nearing the end of the season. Yeah.

And he was talking to me, and he was, he really wanted out of Toronto because it was a dead end for him, right? And so he talked and about it. And then I said to him, I said, okay, he says, you know, you know who I am. You know what I do. Can I write this? And he said, well, tell you what? He says, you can write it when we're eliminated from the playoffs. So they weren't in the playoffs, but eliminated from contention.

Contention, right. And so him and Fred were always playing cribbage together. So I remember when they finally were eliminated from the race, I went over to Cecil and said, okay, we can do that story now? He says, okay. He said, wait a let him finish playing cribbage with. Fred. And, you know, I can remember there was a competition

when they decided that Fred would be the full-time, I think at the time, D.H., ahead of Cessel, maybe 87, whatever it was. But this is how close those guys were. So when they announced that, Jimmy Williams announced that Fred got the job over Cecil. I phoned up Fred in this hotel room, and Fred said, can we talk later?

Can we talk some other time? And I didn't understand. I thought he was stolen, you know, putting me off or something like that. So I said, I had no other choice. So I said, okay. What I realized that, didn't realize what I found out later is that he was playing cribbage with Cecil, and he did not want to talk about it right in front of Cecil

to make him feel bad, right? And, you know, it's kind of a classy actor. Sure. And the funny thing is, they had Fred McGriff penciled in. It was the opening day. And I said to Jimmy, did you, the starter? I can't remember the name of the starter, but Sessel had two home runs against him last year. I said, do you remember how Sessel did against this guy last year?

And Jimmy. So, anyway, when the lineup comes out, there's Sessel in there. Ah! Because he didn't realize. He's like, well, he forgot or something. Or whatever. No, okay, Larry, so lots of ground to cover here. But just first base alone,

if I think of these four guys who kind of took over for each other, you had Willie Upshaw, Fred McGriff, Johnny Allerud and Carlos Delgado, like back to back to back to back to back. That's quite the run at first base for this franchise. That's quite the force on there. And, I mean, I think I'm of the opinion, I'm very biased opinion,

that Carlos Delgado deserved, serious Hall of Fame. I think so. I think you didn't get enough votes. I mean, obviously, you didn't, to survive one ballot, which is surprising. Yeah, I mean, he's,

I don't know, he's also a hall of fame person, you know, so. Right. Right. Yes, he is. And I think, I think what we're going to see is, is it standards seem to be,

with the Veterans Committee, you know, the standards seem to be changing a little bit, too. of it used to be it seemed like you had to hit a a milestone you know and stuff like that and he never quite hit that that milestone but he was um he was really i think deserving of it i voted for him anyway so ask this is bruce walker who sent in this question not larry walker that's this is bruce walker i know bruce okay well bruce walker from east york i probably probably i'll ask a question you know he goes ask larry one hell of the journalist. That's you, by the way. Which Blue Jay player was the biggest jerk he had to contend with,

Bruce Walker? What do you think? Dave Revering. I don't even remember Dave. I'm waiting for a name I know, Larry. Dave. Dave. Okay, well. Remind me who Dave is. He was with the Blue Jays and he went on the one of the pregame shows when he was with the Blue Jays and he thought he was too big for this expansion franchise. It was maybe Bobby Cox's first year. The team still, it was still early in the, fairly early in the season. They actually started getting good in the second half of the season.

And Dave said that he would really like to play for a better team. I mentioned it's what he said, basically. And he topped the ball, during the game, he topped the ball off, like it just trickled in front of the plate kind of thing,

and fell. And never got up and bothered running to first base. So coupled with that coupled with what he'd said, he went to Bobby Cox and said, well, what do you think of that? He says, I'll tell you one thing. He says, we're going to get, we'll trade. If he wants a trade, we'll give it to him.

He says, what would you get back for him? He says, a huge glove and a bottle of skunk oil. That'd be fine. And they had an off day, and I had the pleasure of having dealt. with him before. He was like, he was like he, he didn't want to be there and he was better than everybody else, you know. I don't like to vilify a guy, but I mean, that's the impression he was, you know, that he gave us. And anyway, they, they brought up Adams to replace him that they did, after that road trip, the day off. And so they got rid of him just, just like that. They just

released him. So that was, he was one of the biggest, uh, I wonder if I can do better. Yeah, I get along with so many. Well, let me do the converse here, because Rob Clark Williams wrote in, and he wanted to know who's the best player you've dealt with on the Blue Jays. And it could be a tie, but who are the solid, sweetheart, good, good people

that you've dealt with this franchise? Well, Delgado's one. Mosby. Bell and Barfield, I mean, those guys, I go back to the 80s, and they were your favorite team. As far as a team to cover, they were my favorite too, because things hadn't gotten so corporate, you know, that you could actually chat with people,

and, you know, you could get there one in the afternoon and go in and talk to a guy like Rance Mullinick's about hitting for... Right. You know, and now it's like 4 o'clock, and they go see the manager, and then the guys are getting ready to go hit. And everything is a scrum now, you know? There's no access anymore.

The access isn't as good. And, you know, I don't know whether I'm not, yeah, we've given up a lot of access. So they would be among those. I mean, at one time, Garthoridge and Rance Mullinix were two good guys. I mean, Ernie Witt. I mean, I know I'm giving a big, long list here, but it's hard to pick out an absolute favorite.

But I would say, Dalgado, I remember interviewing Dalgato once, and he had a phone call, a message or something like that. He says, look, I've got to go in. to answer this call. He said, so I said, that's fine. I got all I need, you know. And so I went out and I'm on the field there near the batting cage. And, well, 15 minutes later, Carlos comes into the dugger.

He says, Larry, said, you need anything more? You know, just being thoughtful, you know? Yeah, I love it. And Lloyd Mosby, I loved his sense of humor. You could tell a joke, maybe a little bleak, you know, but he'd get it, you know. Great sense of humor. A hell of a rapper, too, by the way. Shaker had a good rap style to him, too.

I've heard some rap songs from Shaker. Go ahead. And Jesse Burfield was always like kind of a sweetheart guy. George was, say, a little more. A little prickly, right? Hard nose, but we got along with the great. And, you know, George is one of those grumpy guys with a heart of gold. I've seen him do things for people, like, away from the baseball field.

just little thoughtful gestures to people who are just working class people doing their jobs at a hotel or something the little things he would do and there are kind of things that impress you about somebody you know. Nice to hear that, nice to hear that. All right, so we talked about some of the people you worked with at the Globe.

Andrew Stodin's question is what's your weirdest Marty York story? Oh, do we have to get into that? Well, you don't have to do anything you don't want to do. Absolutely not. Well, weird is one story. No, I don't know, of course, my goal here is not to make you uncomfortable, but you did work many years of hard you work, and the stories are kind of legendary.

The stories were, okay, well, the kind of things I would have to deal with, because I used to phone Pat Gillick every day, even in the off-season, okay? And if I'd missed a couple of days, Pat would call you and say, you haven't called me for a couple days, you know, that's the kind of thing it was. But it asks Pat a question sometimes when we, and he'd say, okay, who is this for? You were Marty York. Because a lot of times, because he wouldn't talk to Marty, so I would have to be the go-between, you know, to get the quotes from Gillick. And finally, Gillick didn't want to do that anymore.

So it put me in an uncomfortable position, you know. Well, I think Andrew Stodin just put you in an uncomfortable position by asking you for you. I don't like to talk about, you know, colleagues too much. I don't want to sound like I'm waffling here. I am. It's okay. But that's the truth. But the thing is, I don't like telling tales out of school kind of thing like that.

No worries. Let me get you back to something. I'm sorry, Andrew. I'm sorry. I apologize. Andrew's also an FOTM. So hello, Andrew Stodin. I believe he's in the Peterborough area of this fine province.

Jason Elliott. Again, he had a question earlier, Cecil Fielder, but he has a second question. Since you wrote a book on the business and economic side of baseball, what's the name? Is that ballpark figures? Yes. Okay, that came out in 1987. The Blue Jays and the business of baseball.

So since you wrote that book, he's wondering what you think about, how practical it would be for the, for the Montreal to get a major league baseball team again, for the return of an MLB team to Montreal. I think that would be, the important thing would be to get a stadium. And maybe they could get away with playing an Olympic stadium for a year or two, knowing that the stadium was being built.

I think that's going to be, would be a key. I mean, I think I'd love to see a team back in Montreal. And because I, but I think that's going to be the key. And to getting the type of ownership that, Toronto was very lucky to have, you know, Labat Brewery and the bank and all that involved, you know, because they had great ownership to start out with. And that's, that was part of the story,

is that they were a lot different than other owners. And I think, so that would be a key for Montreal to get, to get, you have to get solid ownership, but maybe guys who are great owners too, you know, how do you quantify that? But that's, that's, that's what you'd have to have to have a stadium. Now, I'm not so sure what the public appetite is for providing public funds for a stadium now

because, you know, there's a lot of other things that we need some money on. But the stadium, if they could find somebody who wants to pay for a stadium, and I think they would get a team. Well, here in Toronto, we're busy spending our public funds on, you know, private spas at Ontario Place. We're too busy investing in such ventures. Just don't wind me up, okay, Larry. Okay, you don't want to get me going on that stuff either. I was at Jarvis and Queenskey today, and I was biking by Trillium Park there at Ontario Place.

I was thinking, seriously, Larry, if they mess with that, I love that site, and it belongs to the people here. If they mess with it, I'm going to chain myself to the synosphere, and they're going to have to bulldoze me. You want to join me, Larry? I will. All right, so we got you, me, and Ben Rayner. You know what? When I lived in, before I moved in a, I believe, Christy Pitts now, right next to Christy Pitts, that's my backyard in the front yard.

There was, I used to live in an apartment building. And they were bought up a whole bunch of houses across the street and they were going to, to build townhouses, except for one guy. He was actually my daughter's guitar teacher. Hey. He was a musician. He held out. and I think he

when he brought the bulldoze I think he was even out on the front lawns and no way you get my house that's wild which is great I mean I and they never did that house is still there

love it I just delivered something to Midtown Gord he's at like I'm gonna say Christy and St. Clair I'm gonna say and I took a bluer to Christy and went up Christy on my bike on the weekend I love Christy Pitts

okay Mike from Kate dub says Joey Votto to Toronto to wrap up his career of the Blue Jays. He's a character guy like no other and he says Larry, yes or no? Yes. But is that less, yes,

that was some inside here. I know you're the journalist in the room, not me, but I was recently at a dinner. I like the name drop on the show. So Donovan Bailey and I were at dinner, okay? And the Somali who was, you know, helping Donovan choose his expensive wines was Joey Votto's mom.

Yeah. So this is only, a few months ago. And she starts talking about how, yeah, Joey just, you know, he was playing chess in the annex or whatever. Joey had just left to go to spring training, and there was talk about how Joey Votto would absolutely love to wrap up his career of the Blue Jays,

but the interest level from the Blue Jays was nil, zero. Yeah, that doesn't surprise me. So, it's funny. If Alex was here, if Alex was here, there might be a better chance. Right, and Alex is. not here. No. It's busy winning World Series.

Yes. All right. So now I'm going to hit some greatest Blue Jay hits here. Okay. And by way, I just, we ran through your thoroughbred part of your career.

And I just want to point out that you won a Sovereign Award in 81, which I know what a Sovereign Award was because Peter Gross was nominated, in fact, has been nominated for a Sovereign Award against like these huge, like, like I think one was like Woodbine Entertainment and the other is some other,

maybe it's TSN or something big. Like, it's a huge outfit. And meanwhile, it's just Peter Gross and I, and we're like only three nominations or something, and we're nominated for a sovereign award, which we cannot win because of who we're up against, but I just wanted to point out that you did win a sovereign award in 81, and that's for Best Thurrow Bread Racing Story of the Year.

So where is that sovereign award right now? Do you have it? Yeah, it's a lovely trophy. Is it on display in your home? It's in my front room, which nobody goes into. The trophy room. I remember, we had a veterinarian over

when I look after one of the cats and she was a horse lover too so she saw that and thought it was a lovely it's a really good trophy it's one of the best you could ever get okay good good good and now because we're got a close of jays and again you've been amazing we've already shock you if I told you how long you've been chatting

you've been amazing we're going to wind down just a few quick hits on Blue Jays because we've got to get him to the World Series years but Mike okay we covered him so no I wanted to point out something I learned when I was researching you, Larry, that when you were in Seattle on a baseball assignment in 1984, you covered the Green River murders?

Yeah. Okay, because I, I mean, I happen to be a big Pearl Jam fan, and I know the guys there were in a band called Green River based on. And I do know about these Green River murders. How did you, a baseball scribe, end up covering the Green River murders in Seattle? Well, they just asked me to do it. They needed a front page story anyway. It was the big story at the time, and they were coming up with bodies and stuff like that.

It was a new discovery and all that. So I talked to the police. I dealt with the police. And it turned out it was interesting. And my daughter was in theater. And I remember talking to one of the police guys I talked to, his wife was a playwright. It was interesting. So we had a lot in common.

So that kind of broke down some barriers. I also, you know, dealt with one of the reporters who was covering the case. And the paper's out of business now, but the Seattle Post Intelligence, or I think it was called. They were very helpful with me, too. But anyway, that's one of those things. I was, I've never considered myself, say, a baseball writer. I'm a sports writer, but I've also worked news. And I never thought it was going to be a sports writer.

The reason I got into sports is because Jim Proudfoot said that the star needed a bowling columnist because their bowling columnist had Noel Bates was a law student and he was leaving for them. So Jim says, Chester says, because I was doing something else at the time, He said, if you really want to get back in the newspapers, do you want to do that? And I said, well, he said, yeah, I would be interested. He said, well, call him Miltonnell. Talk about legends.

Yeah. So my knees buckled a little bit. So I get in a pay phone, and I called milk. And he says, yeah, I'd be interested. Jim told me, you know, and he says, yes, we need somebody. When do you want me to start? I asked him. He says, how about right now?

Wow. So I went to the star and what it really was is best lines from the lanes and what it was a collection of top scores from the various leagues, right? And of course, my biggest challenge was sorting out the, especially early, was sorting up in the difference with five pins and ten pins, right? Because that was no bowler. So that's how I started. And that ended up doing a lot of fun. freelance. I covered a lot of high school basketball and stuff like that hockey.

That's where I meant to Mimico, which is appropriate. Yeah. Mimico, I had, I covered their team winning the lacrosse. The championship, no, basketball championship. Oh, basketball. Okay, because Mimich was a big lacrosse. Ted Schmidt, someone I still, all these years later, Ted Schmidt, I still am in contact with him. I was on occasion. He calls me up once in a while, or I email him or whatever.

I was invited to the 50th, was it the 50th anniversary, whatever it was, anniversary a few years ago. And I took pictures of Ted making the speech of the reunion of the team and all that and sent them to them. So isn't that something that you can keep friendships that are. No, that's beautiful. And he played at Christy Pitts too. He played baseball, I remember.

For the Maple Leafs? No, he played in other leagues. Other leagues. But don't bury the lead here. At some point, there were so many sports writers at the Toronto Star that they had a bowling columnist. Yeah, it was freelance. But still, but still, like today...

Today you don't have that, right? Even the Toronto Blue Jays, they have... Well, Mike Wilner's there now, and you have Gregor Chisholm. I don't... I think that might... I mean, Dave Fes... Who else is covering Blue Jays baseball? And bottom, bottom line is...

Oh, Rosie DeMando, she does? She steps in and out, you know, depending what's going on. But, you know, I've had this... chat with other, like Dave Perkins, for example, will tell you, you know, when the Jays won the World Series in 1993, this is how many people, how many bodies, the Toronto Star sent to Philadelphia. And you get the number, and I can't remember the number right now,

but it might be a number like 40. Oh, it was a lot of, well, you're including... Photographers, everything they sent. Everyone, yeah. News people. I remember once they were, somebody told me that the star had so many people at spring training that they were one or two bodies short of, qualifying to be a bureau.

Everybody wanted to go to spring training. So that's how mighty our newspapers were at some point. The coverage is a lot less now. You know, the sports departments have shrunk, you know. Well, the advertising's gone digital, right? So it's when everyone's putting their money into Google AdWords and Facebook ads, etc., etc.

There's less print ads. But okay, so I do want to check. So again, I'm going to burn through a few points. One is I want to ask you about Kelly Gruber because a few. a few years ago, several years ago now, I suppose, Kelly Gruber was at this pitch talk event hosted by Ashley Docking, and by all accounts, and I've seen the footage,

but Kelly Gruber appears to have had one too many wobbly pops, if you will. He might have been enjoying some alcohol. And he absolutely acted what I would describe as misogynist, particularly towards Ashley Docking. And since that event, he's been persona non-gradis at all these Toronto Blue Jay events. So if the 1992 World Series is reuniting at the dome, there's two people who won't be there.

One, of course, is Roberto Alamar. Yeah. Well, they had a reunion in August. Yeah, and there was no Alamar, of course, but no Gruber. But there were a lot of people who weren't there either, you know. Yeah, but only two they were invited, I think. Anyway, yeah, that doesn't surprise. I guess I'm curious, what are your thoughts on,

because although we've been funny, the Alamar thing, obviously they haven't told us anything except to say, trust us, you'd want him banned too, man, if you knew what we knew. That's the kind of deal there. But with Kelly, so we'll put Alamar aside, they ripped his name off the level of excellence, for goodness sakes. But Kelly Gruber, I just find it interesting that, by all accounts in my research, he's not invited to these reunions, and it seems to be because of that event, that pitch talk event. But I'm just curious what your thoughts are on this, having no one, Kelly Gruber.

Yeah, it doesn't surprise me. what he did was you know you described it I mean that was you know I mean you know I don't know I'd have no interest in seeing the guy talking to him do you know Larry and again I won't ask you to reveal anything

out of school but do you know anything about the Alamar situation or just no no just what I've heard I didn't know You know, that's all. I don't know any specifics. See, I'm kind of a little bit removed from that part of it because I mainly do game stories and previews now. I'm not like, you know, on a beat like I would be at a newspaper and I don't talk to the general manager every day and stuff like that.

Like I used to, you know. So maybe on the way out here, I was going to ask you about, before I realize how, you know, we got to keep signing for the sequel, but I was going to ask you about the 87 collapse, but I feel like that'll just depress all the listeners. So maybe if you don't mind, like maybe sharing a little bit about like that moment when the, I guess when Timlin throws to Carter in Atlanta,

and then of course, speaking of Carter, when he touches them all at the dome in 93, just, you know, this team won at all, something the expos didn't do and something the leaves haven't done since Will before I was born. Yeah, I remember that home run, And it's funny when it was going, and I didn't think, I didn't realize it was going to be a home run. When it first hit, I thought me he was going to be off the wall, and the Blue Jays would tie the game or something like that.

And that's what I was thinking about. Okay, so it looks like maybe there'll be extra innings, you know. And all of a sudden it went out and, you know, obviously the place went nuts. And that was pure unbridled joy on Carter, the way he ran around those paces. Absolutely. And I was, it was nice, it was nice for Cedogastin, you know, because, you know, here's a guy who had a lot of success up to that time, but didn't always get the credit, right? And anyway, that, that was, it's pretty hard to, like, top that. I mean, there hasn't been another in history in a World Series of a walk-off home run that brought a team from behind, I don't think, is there?

No. And so that was, that was simple. But, you know, if you want to go back to 92, another big home run for the Blue Jays was Alamars against Decker's League. And that was a huge home run. And that kind of gets overlooked. But that was, that was a huge one too. And 92, yeah, that was huge.

That made a difference. And, you know, they might not have made the 92 World Series without that. And then you want to go to the series of self. I think Ed Sprague's pinchette home run was big. You know, that was a big one too. I guess if you're doing like best biggest home runs in Blue Jays history, those are the big three I would think. Well, Jose Batista, the backflip.

Except I always feel like you better put an asterisk next to that, that, you know, oh, this team doesn't actually make the World Series like they go. Oh, I see what you mean. But whereas that Alamar, so that Alamar Homer on its own, if the Js don't get to the World Series and win it, we probably don't talk about it at all. We don't talk about it like that. It's just a...

And the thing is about that one was that a lot of people don't know, I guess, but Beckersley used to tip a slider with a little glove tap and Cito who is probably one of the best people I've ever he acknowledges me one of the best people at spotting pitchers tipping pitches they were so they were on to that

you know and anyway I think I might have helped Elamore on that at bat that was I remember when the Jay's got Cito David Cohn in 92. The first thing Ceders said to David was,

we've got your pitches, Dave. He's what? Wow. And you know what? That's been my hobby ever since. I've talked to Cito about that, and I can't do it as well as Sam because a lot of times

I'm obviously looking down on the computer, but that's one of my hobbies is predicting it guys tipping pitches. Oh, interesting. And telegraph. Pitches. Are you the man in white? You know what?

I remember Fenway. Yeah? And I wasn't writing. I was just there as a spectator. And I was sitting down and I was behind home plate. Eduardo Rodriguez, I think it was.

And he tipped his in his delivery, he tipped his chain job. It was a different arm slot and it was a little bit slower. and so I started calling. And I love, if anything I can do that I enjoy the most, is aggravating Fenway Park fans, okay? Because they're a bunch of know-it-alls.

So I'd say, here comes a change-up. And then, bingo, there would go up on the board, change-up. Right. And I did that a few times. And then, and then I yelled out. I said, this one, he's telegraphed this more than any other of his change-up. jumps. And to Oscar Hernandez thought the same, he jumped all over and I hit it like about 400 feet.

And by then I was getting a few glowers from which made me feel good. And if I want to go back to my cousin Boston, who was the Harvard guy. Yeah. And I lived in Stoughton, even when the Blue Jays got a team, he was a huge baseball fan. He was an incredible Red Sox fan. And if I wanted to find out, he was the Red Sox. because he had a scientific mind, he devoured everything, right? He could repeat every stat, everything about the Red Sox.

So I never had to read the papers. I just had to talk to John. So, okay, so obviously two world series that you were covering, and in 2009 you leave the Globe and Mail. We mentioned that you covered baseball after that for MLB.com, the Canadian Press, Baseball America, the Sport Exchange, and various other newspapers. But is it, why did you leave?

Even 2009, is it just they offered you a package or what happened? Okay, well, they took me off the baseball beat in 2006. They put me on the soccer, Petrono FC. Sure. Which I really enjoyed that. I loved it. Talk about first year team and everybody's cooperative. And I was lucky enough to get a lot of scoops because I knew how to work Mo Johnson.

And I knew when to phone them up. And I did, you know, so I really enjoyed that year. and I did it for the first part of 2008, but they wanted me to go on the desk because they had a shortage on the desk. And I got into a bit of a bit of a situation. The guild thought it was being treated unfairly, and I was told by lawyers it was ageism.

And so I won the right to report again. mixing it with some desk. And then when they, they offered a buyout, I guess it was in January of 2009. So I took it. I wasn't going to. Two weeks I mulled it over, right? I said, I didn't fight this hard to get back to reporting to then just walk out. And then one morning I woke up and said, are you stupid?

Are you stupid? Because I mentioned Schultz earlier, who's going to be here tomorrow because we record this thing called every spring of parade down Bay Street of Gere Joyce. And they're going to be here tomorrow afternoon. And he plays Red York, Schultz. Oh, yeah, I've heard that. Yeah, so we're going to record in a fifth episode tomorrow, actually. Oh, great. It's amazing.

I get to play Ollie Thumbs, the producer. Okay. But what am I saying? Oh, Schultz, he says to me, when he came on, he said he was hoping for an opportunity for bios, because I guess they'd have these meetings and announce that we're going to offer, whatever. And he said, when they announced they were offering biots, he had to, like, bite his lips so that he didn't, like, scream of excitement and start jumping up and down

because he was just really waiting for a buyout offer. and it came and he took it and he's been happy ever since there. Well, I'll tell you, my situation is a little different because I'll tell you what. Yeah. In 65, when I turned 65, remember they had done away with compulsory retirement. So I was saying myself and Michael Velpie, who was a columnist and reporter at the globe. And so we were going to work on Beyond 65. And I don't think they liked that too much.

They said, oh, you can do that, but she can't qualify for the benefits program anymore. So Michael and I fought it through the Guild, and they gave in. And they said, okay, you can belong to the benefits program and still, a way you're working after 65. But, you know, I don't want to get into it because it's been anyway, but that sums up the way the Globe Mail has become. So I can see why Dave would celebrate. You know what I mean?

The post media just offered a bunch So Steve Buffery's gone now No longer working out Steve Buffery's a terrific guy I remember talking with John Kernan He used to work with The Spectator Hamilton Spectator And we were talking about different people

We knew and the word that John came up with Steve was Authentic And I can't think of better praise And I had a better word to describe Beezer He also spent the last few years Covering TFC

Yeah absolutely And just shout out to Liz Braun not a sports writer, but she took a package after decades at the sun, and she's going to drop by here for her exit interview, and we're going to talk about it. So Liz Braun coming back to Toronto Mike shortly. But Larry, we left enough for a sequel, I think, but you were absolutely incredible.

Are the Blue Jays going to win the World Series this year? Probably not, but it wouldn't surprise me if they did. I think Toronto fans should be excited about this team. The one concern I might have is the bullpen, you know, leading up to Romano. But the thing is, it's different now. It's not like it used to be. So look what Alex did with the Braves.

If you make a couple of the key trades at mid-season, you don't have to win your division anymore. And we've shown that home field advantage isn't all it's cut up to be. And the J's are good proof of that last year. So if I wouldn't, It's not out of the realm of possibility. You know, it wouldn't surprise me, but I can think that there's other teams

that I would pick ahead of them at this stage, that's all. But I think this is a good team, and it's a fairly complete team, and I think it's going to be a lot of fun for the fans. How was this for you? You had a good time making your Toronto mic debut? I loved it. You know, I tend to wander sometimes,

so I apologize if I didn't completely answer the question, like about Sessa Fielder, you know, the fact that he got over to Japan and got the play every day, because he had the potential. Like when he was in rookie ball, man, he had a ball so far, and that's what the Jays were attracted to him. Right. And he made the trade, right? He had a ball so far, and they could see the potential there.

And they just gave him a chance to play every day is what he needed. He wasn't going to get in Toronto. He was going to get in Detroit. Did you ever see a son hitting at the dome? I remember his son on the charter flights. When the son was two years old, he looked like it was five. Prince was big. He was a big kid.

And I did see him take batting practice. And I got another one for you. When they got Fred McGriff in that trade, and mainly the big headline, it was Dave Collins from the Yankees. I remember Fred McGriff taking batting practice for the first time after the trade. And Dave Collins looked at it and he says, Are you sure I wasn't the throw-in in the trade? And there's a story behind that trade, but maybe we should leave it for another time if you want to have it back.

That's up to you. I will say Dave Collins still holds the franchise record for a stolen bases in a season with 60. Yes. Something Devon Wright and Alamar couldn't beat. Well, yeah, and I think that was in a time when in the 70s and 80s, I think a lot of people stole a lot more bases. And I think some of them were stolen for the sake of stealing bases. I think what's come out as analytics has shown that Bill James started it.

He started out, let's say we started with this thing. He said, he set out to prove that still-known bases were important, and he found that it was just the opposite. That you had to be successful a certain rate before they were valuable, you know? That's how he became a saber matrician. That's how it started. Love it. Is there any story that didn't get prompted for or didn't come out in this episode

that you're going to be on your way home saying, oh, I meant to tell this story or that story. This is like a moment here. I'm bringing down the closing theme because I realize there might be something in the chamber there that you need to let into the wilderness here, Larry. This is your opportunity. Do you want to know the Fred McGriff's story?

Yeah, now let's do it. We have enough for the sequel without that one. Let's get the Fred McGriff's story. Jay said this guy, I can't remember his name right now, but he had about 14 saves. He's a great guy. He was such a great guy.

Why can't I remember his name right now? But anyway, I remember him coming out and they dug out one day when he was still with the Jays. He says, where is everybody? He says, they're at Pass. The church, you know, he says, oh, yeah, I always wanted to do that,

he says, but they always have it on Sunday morning. Anyway, they traded him and they got, But, so one of the, Steinbeyer won him so bad that, okay, they gave up Dave Collins. And then, but Gillick always liked to get a throw in. And they had their eye on McGriff because they'd seen him get some mammoth and home runs. Right. As an A ball. And maybe he was even a rookie ball.

But anyway, so he, Gillick held out, held out, held out, held. out and he knew Steinbrenner getting impatient and get involved in the in the talks. The Steinbrenner got in and he, and Gillick said, I have to have a minor leaguer. And he said, okay, it was Dale Murray was the pitcher. Okay. And he said, okay, here's the deal. This is, you name three minor leaguers and, or we'll name, how did this go now? He said, name three minor leaguers.

want and we'll tell you which one you can have. So the first one, their name was Don Mattingly. They knew he wasn't going to give them. Right. Next one was Dan Pasqua, who everybody thought it was going to be a great hitter. People would say that the ball made a different sound when it hit his bat. And, but the guy that really wanted was Fred, well, they would have taken Maddeny, obviously. But then they named Fred McGriff. Stuyler never heard of Fred McGriff because he was so far down in the system.

Right. That's how they got him. Wow. And when I... Then I have a follow question. When I called, when they made the trade, I called Fred McGriff's home in Tampa. And his mother says, Fred, he's not home right now. He's at work.

He's at work. I think it was a public store. He's one of those big chain stores. He says, but if you call back tomorrow at 7 in the morning, he'll... He says, that's kind of early. He'll answer. So I phone him at 7 in the morning. He answered?

Wow. Okay. Quick question here before we say goodbye here. I'm a big George Bell fan, as mentioned, and I was always told, and you're going to confirm if this is true or not, Bobby Cox liked to play Dave Collins in left field. They were platoon them at first, yeah. And then Pat Gillick wanted George Bell to get playing time.

And I mean, and then the coach, the manager, sorry, Bobby Cox would play Dave Collins. So Pat Gillick traded Dave Collins, just so Bobby Cox would have to play George Bell. Have you, this is something I was told. Any truth to that? Does it sound plausible at least? Well, don't forget they needed a closer and they got Bill Coddle. Right.

Well, yeah. Who got referenced? And they also traded Alfredo Griffin because they had Tony Fernandez coming up. Right. Right. Embarrassment of riches there. All right, Larry. I think we kept enough for the sequel here. But what a debut, man.

Do you want to know how long we went? No. I enjoyed every minute of it. I enjoyed every minute of it. It would shock you, but to me it wasn't long enough. I just hope I didn't bore any. No, are you kidding me? All the matters is me, Larry, and I was enthralled.

And that brings us to the end of our 1,2301st show. You can follow me on Twitter. I'm at Toronto, Mike. Okay, Larry, how do we follow you? Is there any social media presence for you or a website you want us to go to? Some of those stories from Reuters you see in advances are previews of Leifes, Raptors, or Blue Jays games are mine. Great. Globe uses them quite a bit.

Isn't that ironic? That's funny. And also, they use our previews. If you go into scoreboards, say, in the New York Times, have a scoreboard section there. So you go into the games, and the previews are field-level media. So some of those are mine. Love it. Our friends at Great Lakes Brewery are at Great Lakes Beer, I'll be recording live from the GLB Brew Pub

on Thursday evening. Palma Pasta is at Palmipasta. Maneris is at Maneris. Season 4 of Yes, we are open, is now available. Al Grego hosts, and yes, he's an award winner. My Recycle My Electronics are at EPRA underscore Canada, and everybody can go to Recyclemyelectronics.ca

to find out where they can drop off their antiquated old tech. Don't throw that into the garbage. We don't want it in the landfill. Go to Recycle My Electronics.com. dot CA. The Moment Lab. They're at The Moment Lab. Welcome aboard, guys. And Ridley Funeral Home are at Ridley F.H.

See you all Thursday when my guest is Edward Keenan from the Toronto Star.