Toronto Mike'd: The Official Toronto Mike Podcast - Richard Flohil: Toronto Mike'd #1218

Episode Date: March 10, 2023

In this 1218th episode of Toronto Mike'd, Mike chats with promoter and publicist Richard Flohil about working with BB King, The Downchild Blues Band, Miles Davis, kd lang, Alice Cooper, Crash Test Dummies, Justin Rutledge, and so many other fantastic artists. Banjo Dunc co-hosts! Toronto Mike'd is proudly brought to you by Great Lakes Brewery, Palma Pasta, Ridley Funeral Home and Electronic Products Recycling Association.

Welcome to episode 1218 of Toronto Mic'd. Proudly brought to you by Great Lakes Brewery. A fiercely independent craft brewery who believes in supporting communities, good times, and brewing amazing beer. Order online for free local home delivery in the GTA. Palma Pasta. Enjoy the taste of fresh, homemade Italian pasta and entrees from Palma Pasta in Mississauga and Oakville.

Electronic Products Recycling Association. Committing to our planet's future means properly recycling our electronics of the past. And Ridley Funeral Home, pillars of the community since 1921. Joining me today, making his long, highly anticipated Toronto Mike debut, is Richard Flohill. Welcome, Richard. Thank you very much. Thanks for being here.

You told me just before I pressed record, you told me this was your very first podcast. Is that correct? That is correct. I mean, I've done the odd CBC on radio thing, but I could tell the story of how I had a program on Q107 and they fired me because I played an Ann Murray record. Don't tell that story, Richard.

I'll delete that, don't worry. Please, Richard, we're going to find out who you are and we're going to capture all these stories, but now that you've teased me of that one, what Ann Murray record did you play play i can't remember now but she always did on her earlier records really interesting beatles covers yes john even told her at like a grammys or something that he loved her uh covers yeah yeah she and apart from the fact she's an extremely likable woman and has a very, or had, she doesn't sing anymore,

a really distinctive voice. Yes. She got slotted into the sort of mainstream middle of the road thing where hip people suddenly sort of disowned her. And I like the hell out of her. So wait, okay, firstly, there's a co-host for this program who will be introduced in a moment because he's a great, great

FOTM. In fact, I'm wearing this hoodie because I knew he was coming over and it will all be explained in a moment, but I want to know what was the name of this program on Q107, how long did you host it, and who fired you? Oh, well, it was, the CRc regulations at that time said that you should

have something called foreground programming right so i was hired by bob makowitz to do a morning show on sundays at a ridiculously early time with a co-host a wonderful woman called shirley mcqueen and she's an fotm i mean okay i should explain to richard because you didn't have a chance right banjo no i didn't that's a teaser who's going to be the special co-host today but uh shirley mcqueen is an fotm that means friend of toronto mic'd which means she's been on this program i love her richard you're now an fotm better late than ever than never, my friend. Okay, thank you. Anyway, I did the show for maybe six months every Sunday morning. And one day a listener called in afterwards and said,

do you realize you haven't played a record by a woman artist? And I went, yeah, you're right. So next week we'll do all women artists which I did and I included an Anne Murray record and apparently Q107 sales manager was driving home from his cottage and damn near drove his car into the ditch to hear Anne Murray on Q107 so I was hauled in and I was offered a new time slot six o'clock in the morning till eight. And since they weren't paying me anyway,

I passed. You took a hard pass on that one. Yeah, it was kind of creative firing. Well, I love, I have to say, I got to love this story that you finally got on Toronto Mike to tell the story of getting fired by Q107

for playing Anne-Marie. Like, to me, this has been worth the wait right here. So I tease the fact that there's a special co-host for this program. It is a voice that will be familiar to all listeners of Toronto Mike. Been on the show multiple times. And pre-pandemic, sponsored the show. Sponsored. I don't.

I know. You know what? What's going on? There's a, or maybe prompt me later because I want to capture. That cheap prick didn't put up the money to sponsor Mike.

Prompt me later to tell you that my little, my little sponsorship conundrum, I don't know what you call it, but I got a call yesterday about sponsorship. That's kind of interesting.

So we got to get back to that. But ladies and gentlemen, co-hosting this program, in fact, driving Richard Flohild to my home in a snowstorm, Banjo Duncan Fremlin. You have no idea the risk I took in coming with Richard.

How was it for real? Well, for one thing, you're stuck in a car with Richard, born in 1934, and it's a snowstorm, Mike, so I had to make sure I had a lot of gas just in case I couldn't get here. So I was trying to shut him up during my drive here

so he'd still have stories left over for Toronto Mike. Or you could have just recorded the phone, sorry, recorded the drive, and then I could just pop it in right here. I want to know whether or not Leonard Rambo paid Richard money to play Anne-Marie, an Anne-Marie record. Any payola going on there?

And did any of the listeners, were any of the listeners high on acid when they were listening to this Anne-Marie? Well, I used to get a lot of calls saying, are you going to play Led Zeppelin? And the whole thought of the show was that it was basically acoustic music. Right, okay. And the answer was no, go, you know, hang on for a couple of hours and then you'll have all the Led Zeppelin you need.

Okay, so here's what we're going to do. Richard, I want to capture as many stories as possible. I'll clear all my appointments, whatever it takes. But Dunk, so thank you for driving Richard here today. I apologize that I had to postpone our original slot, but I have a good excuse. As you know, I was in the hospital. So the previous episode to this

is me actually recording like 10 minutes on what the heck happened. So if you're like, what's Mike talking about? Just go to episode 1,217 and it's like a nice crisp, I don't know, 10 minutes of me explaining exactly what happened. But I'm feeling good. I'm excited about this conversation right here.

But if you, Banjo Dunk, were going to explain to the listenership who is Richard Flohill, how would you describe him? Because both you and Blair Packham, who I have a message for you, Richard, from Blair in a moment, but both of these gentlemen that I respect immensely said,

have you had Richard Flohill on the show? And I'm like, I haven't. And they're like, rectify that immediately. So Banjo,, have you had Richard Flohill on the show? And I'm like, I haven't. And they're like, rectify that immediately. So Banjo, who the heck is Richard Flohill? Well, first of all, I saw Blair on Wednesday. I shook his hand for the very first time in my life. I had never met him. So I sat in the audience and watched Blair.

And I got to tell you, it was somewhat intimidating. I had the impression if I didn't like him, he was going to come down and beat the shit out of me. Oh! No, I had that impression. He's a very out there kind of performer. You think so? No, I mean this in a great way.

No, he's a strong performer and I will go back to see him many times. He played a couple of Toronto Mike listener experiences. But he's a big man compared to me, so he could easily have punched me out. But I'm a big man compared to you. I don't know about that. Okay, that's not true. We could go back to this. Richard and I could take you outard who is richard flohill yeah well richard to me is

someone who's always i mean you know i got in the business officially uh professionally in 77 and richard was always this elusive uh more powerful person uh in fact i'll just tell you a quick story i released a cd in 2000, which really wasn't all that long ago. And so I wasn't planning on hiring him, but I just thought I'll call Richard and sort of see if I can sneak a few tidbits of knowledge out of him for free. Right.

And so I call him and I say, Richard, it's Duncan Fremlund from Whiskey Jack. And he said, you can't afford me. And that pretty much says all you need to know. And this is 2016? That's only 2016. So he was like 85 years old or something. He was in his 80s.

Okay, so he's a music promoter. Give me that elevator pitch. I'm going to say, you know, I probably don't know him. If only he were here, we could ask him who the hell he is. We could. I really don't know him. If only he were here, we could ask him who the hell he is. We could. I really don't know him as well as Blair does probably, but I always saw him as, and hopefully we can delve into that today, but at the time, in his day, probably one of the most powerful,

if not the most influential person in the Toronto, and maybe even the Canadian entertainment scene. So why did it take me 1,218 episodes to get to him? There's a stubborn streak in you, Mike. You know, I've been lobbying for more country music on this station for a hell of a long time. Well, now that I've had this health scare, I'm going to

basically just do whatever you tell me to do is where we're at. How would you describe yourself, Richard? And then I'm going to read a quote from you when you heard you were coming on Toronto Mic'd, and then I have a note from Blair Packham, and there's a lot of ground to cover, but describe yourself. Who are you? Who the hell are you?

I'm an English-born, trained, long-time resident of Toronto, 65 years here. I've worked for the last 50 years, full-time, self-employed, as, oh, in no particular order, music magazine editor, writer, publicist, road manager, band manager, almost anything that doesn't involve singing, playing an instrument, or dancing, the latter of which I do really badly.

It frightens children, so I never do it in public. children, so I never do it in public. And I've never felt that I had any power at all. I did what I did. I worked with the artists I worked with. They came to me initially and said, would I do publicity? Would I do this or that or the other? And the answer was, if I like the music, the answer was yes. If I didn't like the music or I didn't like the artist, I did a lot of work with Nana Muscuri. And God bless Nana, I would not walk across the road to hear her music. But she is the kindest, nicest, most organized celebrity that any publicist could wish for. Wow.

Wow. Wow. Okay. So, so much ground to cover here, but I thought I'd start by reading something you tweeted when I promoted that you were making your Toronto Mike debut. And again, Banjo let the cat out of the bag that you were born in 34. So I'm doing the quick math and I realize you're, are you 89 years old? 89 in June, 88 now.

What day in June? June the 24th. Oh, we're so close. Okay. We're so close. Only 50 years difference. Please come to my party. Okay. Well, invite me because I'll be, I'm only five decades behind you. And by the way, after this week, I would have made a joke about, you know, I'll pass you at some point. But I had a rough week,

so now I'm not so sure over here. Holy smokes, what's going on? But let me read what Richard wrote and then what Blair wrote and then we're going to start getting these stories. But Richard writes, looking forward to this, the stories I might tell,

the most unpleasant people in music, travels on the road what's an 88 year old sex life like or not very exciting are folk festivals boring why london is the best city i know uh could be fun so that was uh like a hell of a teaser because i'm gonna get at to all those things but blair packham when I told him you were finally coming on, because much like Banjo Dunk here, he's like, get Flo Hill on. Blair writes, remind him that I met him in 1973

at age 14 at Mariposa when it was on the island. Okay, I'm going to pause there before I get to the rest of the Blair thing. Tell me about, I know you're a big fan of these festivals, Mariposa like regale me in some stories about uh mariposa well i don't know that i can come up with in

the first mariposa uh that i went to was in the first folk festival i went to was in 1965 i had been bringing blue singers into tor, mainly because I wanted to hear them in a rather more safe setting than the west or south sides of Chicago. So I brought in people with obscure artists like Sleepy John Estes, and then with a friend we brought in Muddy Waters and so on. So I had this ill-gained reputation as a um blues maven you know sure so mariposa invited me to host something called a blues workshop and i don't know okay and there was a huge sum of money involved i think it was 50 and i did it and uh i went to this festival

and it was like, who was the guy whose apple dropped on his head and he discovered gravity? Was that Isaac Newton? Yes, that was Isaac. Okay, same thing. That weekend I hung out with Gord Lightfoot, Ian and Sylvia, Phil Oakes, the Staple Singers, and so on and so on.

And they were, all I was really into at that time was the English versions of trying to play early American jazz, which we called trad jazz, and blues. And suddenly I'm meeting all these people and I am blown away. And that first year in 1965 i met my oldest friend dick waterman who now lives in oxford mississippi his girlfriend who i met when i went down to the states a couple of years later was this 19 year old kid called bonnie rate who was learning guitar knee to knee with these grizzled old blues singers. No, Bonnie, you do it this way.

It was magic. And so I became involved. And then I thought, can I do the publicity for the Mariposa Festival, which I did. And then in the late 60s, 70s, here's the thing, Mike, and you will discover this and Duncan certainly will. The older you grow, your memories are okay if you're lucky. But when anything was, I don't know. I mean, at one point for four or five years, I was the artistic director of Mariposa. I'm a member of the Mariposa Hall of Fame.

And I don't know. I just love the variety of music that you can hear at these events. I also go to the Calgary Festival, a sweet festival in Canmore, Alberta, and the Edmonton Festival. I think I've missed two since they began. Wow. And of course, you'll never forget that moment in 1973 when a young 14-year-old Blair Packham was, Hello, Mr. Flo Hill.

I don't remember it. I am a huge admirer of him. I think he's one of the great songwriters of this country. Oh, but enough about Duncan Fremlin. We're talking about Blair Packham here. I was. Amazing. Now, we're going to be all over the place

because I'm glad you said you remember the stories, but you don't remember when because I don't know when, so I'm just going to go crazy here. But I'm going to play a little music here. We're going to talk over it, don't worry. but just because i think this will be a very interesting topic off the top here just a moment of bb king yes the thrill is gone The thrill is gone. The thrill is gone away.

The thrill is gone, baby. The thrill is gone away. You know you've done me wrong, baby And you'll be sorry someday The thrill is gone I know it's sacrilegious to bring it down, but Blair wanted to know about promoting B.B. King's first Toronto appearance, and I really want just everything B.B. King you can bury me in, so I will be quiet. I'll back away from the mic. Richard Flohill, talk to me about B.B. King's first Toronto appearance. And I really want just everything B.B. King you can bury me in.

So I will be quiet. I'll back away from the mic. Richard Flohill, talk to me about B.B. King. Well, I was a fan because I bought all his early records. And I had the opportunity to book him. And I did him in 1968. It was the first time he'd ever been to Canada. Actually, that's not quite true. Two weeks before, he had played at the Grand Theatre in Kingston.

And I went up to that concert with Peter Goddard, who was a writer and a star, a buddy guy who was in town, and a guy called Adam Mitchell, who was the lead singer of a band called The Paupers, and now lives in L.A. and produced Linda Ronstadt and is a wonderful dude. Anyway, the concert happened, and I was very, very lucky.

It was the first big show I'd ever done I mean Massey Hall you know wow wow and they gave me that they didn't ask for a deposit they didn't ask for money I never signed anything it just said yeah you got the date wow so um B came into town a day early we did a lot of promotion and running around he had the wonderful ability to do cat naps well and if and he'd nod off for 10 minutes and he'd be alert and fine uh the concert happened what between the time i booked him and the time the concert happened thrill is gone became his one and only hit. And the show sold out. Tickets were $4.50, $3.50, and $2.50. Do we have any idea what that is in today's dollars?

No. I've got to go to an inflation test. Yeah, it would be $350, $250, and $150. The last time Bea played in Toronto, I was backstage at Massey Hall, and I have no idea why. Maybe I had something to do with the opening artist. I don't know.

But his band was on stage doing the play on song, and he's standing. They don't have wings at Massey Hall. There's a door you go through, and then you're on the stage. He's standing by the door with his guitar on, and he sees me. He hugs me, and he said, you must have lost money all those years ago when we did that show here and i said no b i actually made 700 you set me on the road to ruin and he said happy to have helped walked on stage and hit the first note oh man wild okay and by the way dunk i just want you

to know yeah anytime you have a thought or question if you don't mind this has been on my mind for quite some time and uh you know i've listened to interviews with a lot of the old british rockers that are about 10 years younger than you richard you seem to have, you were in 34. They were, many of them were in 40, you know, just in the middle of the war or whatever. And you all seem to have this incredible infatuation with Southern blues. Yes. You know, you hear the Rolling Stones became the Rolling Stones because of the Southern blues.

I never liked the Beatles. I thought Lana was a shitty impersonation of Little Richard. Well, that's the end of this podcast, Mike. Now he knows. He waited his whole life, 89 years, to get into a podcast where he could talk about this. It's not that you think they're overrated, which I hear that opinion sometimes, because they're rated next to God, right? But you don't think they're a good band?

I think they're a good band? Oh, absolutely. I think they're an amazing band. Lennon's the only one of them I ever met, and I thought he was an arrogant kind of shit, but I understand why he was. I mean, the amount of celebrity that was heaped on them is beyond belief. And I'm amazed that they stood.

But in the very, when I first heard the Beatles, I thought, I like the Rolling Stones better. But you still didn't answer my question of why. What is it about the Southern blues that the British? I wish I could explain it. I don't know. The first blues people I heard was because I was a huge fan of Louis Armstrong. And in the 20s, when he made some of the most influential records ever,

he was basically a session player. And he'd get called in to work with vaudeville-type blues artists like Bessie Smith and Alberta Hunter and others. And that led me in, those women singers led me into blues. And the very, very first R&B blues record I heard And the very, very first R&B blues record I heard was a guy. Now I'm having a brain fart. But he had a great, oh, Wynonie Harris. And he had a great song called Good Morning Judge.

Why do you look so mean, sir? I didn't know her pop was a city cop and she was just 16 I thought oh this is great so I'm buying this on 78 RPM records one a week in Britain in England before you know in the early 50s wow alright so as we again we're going to be all over the place

and I don't want any stone left unturned okay I don't want any stone left unturned, okay? I don't care if this is a nine-hour episode, okay? We're going to capture everything. But I do have a couple of songs that guide us through some of the sweet spots that I'm pretty jazzed about talking about. Oh, dear. Richard's holding his head.

Get the blues up. Get me a rock and chill. Now when I got the blues up. All right, we won't... He's going to start crying. Yeah, listen, I'll bring it down. I can read the room here. It took me 1,200 episodes to start reading the room, but are you comfortable talking about your relationship

with the Downchild Blues Band? Oh, of course. I mean, they fired me on my 75th birthday after 39 years. So you spent 39 years with the Downchild Blues Band, and on your 75th birthday after 39 years. So you spent 39 years with the Downchild Blues Band and on your 75th birthday they fired me. Well they weren't going anywhere Mike.

Well they had a new manager and it was like the point is when a band reaches that level and apart from changing their name to The Legendary whatever, I mean there's not much more you can get publicity

wise. You took them to their peak, like this is basically their ceiling. I don't know that I took them there. They're the ones with the talent. Right. But I certainly helped in all sorts of myriad ways.

We did special events. On the 30th anniversary, we went back exactly 30 years later from their debut in Grossman's Tavern on Spadina. And we actually charged a $10 cover charge and we had two we did it for 10 days two special guests every time uh CBC televised one of them I think with Danny Lanois and we're gone but the best story, I came out of that and it was packed every night. Wow.

We booked Jeff Healy, who I later worked with and who I adore and was one of the greatest people. Love that guy, yeah. And Jeff arrived with his not very good band. You know, the drummer died last week.

Yes, I know. Enough said. Don't speak ill of the dead, right? You're outliving all of them, Richard. Anyway. You can outlive me. The most objectionable people you can ever meet in life are really good-looking women

who know they're really good-looking. One of them, six foot tall, came up to me in Grossman's Tavern, looked down from her great height and said, where's the dressing rooms? I said, dressing rooms? She says, yes, dressing rooms. I said, well, why?

She said, we are the band's dressers. I said, what? She said, yes, we make them look good on stage. Where's the dressing room and does it have a mirror? And I said, you go down those steps, Mark Jentz. You pass the pisses. There's an iron door. It's called the potato room.

And that's the dressing room. And no, there isn't a mirror. Okay, okay. I got questions about Damn Child Blues Band here. But firstly, everyone knows the Grossman Tavern. Al Grossman, right? Yes. His grandson is Eric Alper.

You know this name? Yes, of course. Of course you do. I know. Richard Flohill knows everybody. By the way, don't hesitate to name drop. The more name dropping, the better. Don't hesitate.

Okay. But it's true. You wrote this. So I want to shout out an article. It's a few years old now, but it's still great, especially if you're going to have Richard Flohill on your podcast. It's by rootsmusic.ca. So shout out whatever rootsmusic.ca.

Great resource. Had a chat with you, like a little interview with you, some facts about you. I'm going to ask you about a couple of them, but you talked about, uh, the downchild blues band came to you after they fired you on your 75th birthday and asked you to write a bio for the band because there's nobody on

this planet who knows more about the downchild blues band than Richard Flohill. No, it wasn't a bio. It was actually a documentary film they were making. Oh. And since I was, apart from the leader of the band, Donnie Walsh, I was the only person all those years later who was still.

And at first I thought, oh, no, i'm not going to do that and they just fired me for crying out loud right stuff it you were going to say my wife said look you're bigger than that go do it so they interviewed me at length and filmed it and when the documentary came out, and they didn't pay me either, but when the documentary came out, I was the link between every sort of decade of the band's history because I knew more about them than probably they did. For sure you did. For sure you did. For sure you did. Incidentally, the very first time they asked me back in 69, would I be interested? And I went to Grossman's, and I got thrown out immediately. I wasn't getting served.

I needed a beer. There was a very large waiter who looked like a linebacker in an American football team. I said, look, what does it take to get a beer around here? He said, you're barred out. That's it, eh? And I was thrown out at the door. Al Grossman said, come back tomorrow.

It'll be all right. You said beer. That's the B word around here. So I'm going to just take a moment to thank the good people at Great Lakes Brewery because they sent over fresh craft beer for you and Dunk. So delicious fresh craft beer brewed right here in southern Etobicoke. So you're going to take some beer home with you, Richard. I'm not because I just stopped drinking.

Well, you're going to give it to Dunk then. He's going to benefit. That's it. That's it. A fun little quick announcement, a little housekeeping, if you will, is that I'm actually recording live from the GLB Brew Pub in early April.

There's going to be an event there that I'm going to be recording from and there's some cool guests lined up. So stay tuned. That's at, by the way, Jarvis and Queens Quay. I just said the word Jarvis. That's the J word. My third born is

named jarvis but i want to uh shout out my second born michelle because my daughter michelle is at mcgill university right now and i'm wearing my mcgill hoodie because i'm always so proud to wear this hoodie and i wore it today because banjo dunk was going to be in my basement and is it true mr dunk uh mr dunk did i call you that is it true mr fremlin, Mr. Dunk, can I call you that? Is it true, Mr. Fremlin, that you did write, because my daughter did some work with you, and you wrote a loving recommendation and endorsement of my daughter for the good people at McGill? Immensely talented young woman who was holding my hand

as I weeded my way through the digital world of sound engineering and software and everything. And you put me in touch with Michelle and I would send her these pleading questions, probably really dumb, inane questions for most people who are in the know, but she did not make me feel like the inadequate tool that I really was. And so can I shout out to Michelle and thank her for helping me with all of this? Well, I'm thanking you for that endorsement because she got into that program, which apparently was very difficult to get into,

and she's loving it there and she's thriving there. So, you know, once you do a favor for somebody's daughter, it's sort of like in The Godfather, you know, you can't refuse a... Well, I think you've just defined probably Richard Flohill's business model. You know, you think about all the, I don't know how many years, Richard, you were the publicity guy, but you think about, and I'm always

intrigued by the relationships that were developed over the years that enabled you to wield, and maybe you don't think you were powerful, but believe me, if you were on the outside looking in, we saw you as this you know monster who had access to people and publicity and newspapers and radio and stuff that the rest of us could only dream about and we i'm sure many would have paid big money for you to represent them so adequate money adequate money well maybe

you didn't quote high enough i didn't well more. Well, more than banjo dunk money, that's for sure. Anyway, it's all about relationships, isn't it, Mike? That's what Toronto Mike is all about, isn't it? Well, that's it. Now that we got Richard, he's a valued member of the FOTM community here, we're going to make sure it's going to be at least another 30 years before he requires any services from Ridley Funeral Home. So shout out to Ridley Funeral Home.

Blair Packham, by the way, again, we're going to be all over the place, but we're going to collect as many stories because I have a great story I'm going to ask you about food in a moment. But Blair Packham's final note was, and I hope I can pronounce this word right. This is like a $10 word.

I don't know if Blair is making good coin or whatever from Last of the Red Hot Fools, but he writes, ask him about his coterie. Is that the word? Coterie of young, talented women singers. So I have to Google coterie and then I'll get right back to you, Richard. I think it's like club. Okay, like your clique or your... Yeah, harem. Okay, and I feel,

is it French? Is it coterie? Like, I don't know. I butchered it, I'm sure, but I butcher like easy words. So Richard, what can you say about these young, talented women songwriters that you surround yourself with? Well, it's not that I'm surrounding myself with, although that I'm very high on one in particular now. But back in the day, I worked with Lorena McKennett, who I worked with Lorena for 23 years. I had the opportunity to travel with her to Spain and in Italy and in all over the States, Boulder, Colorado and New Orleans, I remember well.

I worked with Katie Lang in her very early days. Wow. And so on. And I, you know, I'm a straight guy, and I'm older than dirt, and most of my friends are women, and they're younger than I am, inevitably. And that has always been, and I have a sort of basic rule, and the rule is, by all means, sleep with them, just don't have sex,

because that changes the dynamic of a friendship them, just don't have sex. Because that changes the dynamic of a friendship. And I'd rather have friendship. That's loaded, eh Mike? Did you write that down? I gave Donk a pen over here. Did you write that down? You can sleep with them, just don't have sex. Here's a Winnipeg band.

Just give us a taste of this and I got a few questions about this band. And... That's a deep voice. Yeah. I wish I sounded like this guy. There was a real gent. He would not be caught sitting around in no jungle scheme. Dumb as an ape doing nothing. All right, I'm bringing it down because I'm getting self-conscious about my voice,

listening to Brad here. But this is, of course, Crash Test Dummies, Superman song. You've worked with so many great Canadian musicians. Brad here, but this is of course Crash Test Dummies, Superman song. You've worked with so many great Canadian musicians. Anything you can share with us about working with the Crash Test Dummies? Well, I think inadvertently I may have played a part in getting them their first record deal. I was very attracted to the voice and the name.

And I sort of talked about them a lot. And I think, I can't recall, it was a long time ago. Brad went through some ridiculous nonsense. I saw him at the Winnipeg Folk Festival do the worst onstage meltdown I've ever seen in my life he I remember that evening because the band was in tears because they knew that this was a disaster four or five years later when he recovered they gave him another spot as what in festivals they call a tweener, which is you get to sing two songs while the stage has changed the stage around for the night. And he redeemed himself.

And now Brad and the band are touring the States. The guitar player is my dear friend Stuart Cameron, who is the son of John Allen Cameron. And John Allen was one of the greatest artists this country's ever seen. He was a lovely, lovely man. And Stuart has his father's grace and ability to, and he's now a key part of Crash Test Dummies, and I'm delighted that they're on the up and up and still

working. I know the Barenaked Ladies quite well and the game changer in all of this is of course that big US hit in Crash Test Dummies with the mm-mm, I don't know how to say that title, mm-mm-mm. Yeah, I mean Superman song

big hit in Canada but it was mm-mm-mm. Yeah, I mean, Superman song, big hit in Canada, but it was mm-mm-mm that was a big hit in the States, which does wonders for a band's ability to tour that country. Yeah. Good on them. You know, they're from Winnipeg. I did just book a... We're doing a 25th anniversary special

with The Watchmen on this program, and that's going to happen on St. Paddy's Day. So they've got an album turning 25, and we's going to happen on St. Paddy's Day. So they've got an album turning 25 and we're going to dive deep. It's the album with stereo and a bunch of other hits on it and Sammy Cohn will be here

and of course we're going to have Danny Graves on the phone with us. He's going to join us remotely so that'll be fun. So everybody, if you're looking for some Winnipeg... They're not going to be playing

When Irish Eyes Are Smiling or Danny Boy, are they? No, I don't think so. Two of my least favorite songs ever. Okay, tell me why. It's overplayed on St. Paddy's Day? Why do you hate those songs? Oh, gooey, sentimental rubbish.

I once saw a St. Patrick's Day parade, and there were ten fat people on the back of a flatbed truck singing, hey-ho, I'm an Irishman, love me, I'm an... Oh, I nearly lost my lunch. I'm just taking notes here now. This is not Irish culture. And I've worked with Tommy Macomb, Liam Clancy, the Chieftains, and a number of other Irish bands.

Clancy, the Chieftains, and a number of other Irish bands, they are Irish culture, not the kind of sentimental crap. Well, I do know, I've taken a trip to Dublin and they do kind of, yeah, the Americanization of St. Paddy's Day

is nothing authentic, that is for sure. Hey, I'm going to give you some food, but what's fascinating to me is a note you wrote for this rootsmusic.cap site reference. But is it true, Mr. Flo Hill, and you cannot lie on the Toronto microphones here,

you haven't eaten a vegetable since you were 16 years old? Correct. And you're 88 and healthy. Yes. I'm assuming because you look great. Yes. That's what, but you're writing this down Banjo veg they tell us to eat our veggies this man hasn't had a veggie since he was 16 and he's healthy at 80 he's a freak of nature mike no i have to explain this okay explain yourself i was shipped at the age

of nine to a boarding school i i jokingly call it a boarding school for unwanted children. The British are not very good at vegetables in good times, but in an institution feeding 300 small children every day, in a war when decent food is hard to find or rationed, and they would plop a Brussels sprout boiled for three days on a plate in a pool of green water and I got my first job at 16 as a apprentice boy newspaper reporter. I went home after my first day and I'd agreed to pay my parents one pound a week, sort of like room and board. And I was being paid three pounds a week. And my mom said, you have to eat your vegetables. And I said, no, I don't. I've got a job. I'm playing rent. I never want to eat a vegetable

again. And my father said, he's a stubborn young bugger, but he's got a point. And look at you now. You're getting the last laugh here. I have to say that my ex-wife used to make vegetable soup and run mine through the blender, so there were no nasty bits that would, you know, squidge on your teeth. You were traumatized as a young man in England.

It actually makes sense to me. Yeah, now I can't. If I took a vegetable now, it would probably be the end of me. Well, okay. It depends how you define tomatoes. Tomatoes, do you define them as fruits? I do. They're vegetables.

They're vegetables. Okay, well. Carrots, vegetables. I don't think there's any carrots in the lasagna I have in the freezer, but I'm sure there are tomatoes. But listen, you don't have to take home a frozen lasagna from Palma Pasta, but Dunk, I got one for you as well. Actually, if the tomato is not, if it's ground up.

It's pretty ground up. It's pretty smooth. Puree, I guess you call that when you have the newborns. That would be lovely. I'd love to take one home. So thank you, Palma. Sorry, Mike, I have to tell you that Blair Packham was selling these lasagnas from the stage on Wednesday night. He was.

I think he has so many of them, Richard. It's not even fair. There's only, yeah, Blair, you're right. But it's Peter Gross who is like every week he phones me up and says, hey, can I come back on? And I realized pretty early in this game that he was trying to score his large meat lasagna because he could get three meals out of it. So I think Palma Pasta is keeping Peter Gross alive and well-fed. So it's delicious, though.

You're going to love it, Richard. Duncan can vouch for it. He's had it before. I'm actually going to ask you about a couple of FOTMs you've worked with because I want these stories. These are people like yourself who have actually been in person on Toronto Mike. So no remotes or any of this nonsense

where people zoom in or phone in. These are actual people I could reach out and grab. One of them is Dave Hodge's favorite musician of all time, Justin Rutledge. Talk to me about Justin. Well, that was how I actually met Dave Hodge, who's the only sports figure I've ever met. Justin, I first met Justin,

he was a bartender at a place called The Victory on Markham Street, now destroyed to build large stupid condos. By Honest Ed's. And at the end of the night, he went on stage and sang this song that absolutely flattened me. And I said to him afterwards,

do you have any records? He said, yeah, I made a record. And I said, give me some. So I sent them to a bunch of record companies. And the response was, it's too country or it's not country enough and one person Shauna Decartier at Six Shooter Records said I'd love to do it but I'm pregnant with my second kid and I just haven't got the energy to do it. And I said, okay. And two days later, she phoned me back and said,

I cannot get this record out of my player. Let's make a deal. And so Justin wound up making his first records for Shauna's company, Six Shooter Records. Justin, the best thing I remember I did, and I'd love to do this again with him, I did what I called Justin Rutledge's Incredible Shrinking Tour. And he called it his Shrinking Erection Tour, by the way.

And the idea is we'd play the horseshoe on saturday night 400 people we play hughes room on tuesday on the sunday night which was like 200 people the cameron on monday which was 100 people and so on and we wound up in a house concert in i can't remember yeah we're with 50 people. Yeah, with 50 people, with 10, 20 people. Wow. And we got a lot of publicity out of that idea, which, to be honest, I stole from John Hyatt, did a similar thing in Nashville.

Okay. Started at the Ryman and wound up in some house concert. Can I pitch you, Richard, if this happens again, and I'm going to give you a back story about how far back I go of Jutland Rutledge, but if this happens again, it ends up in my basement and he's performing on Toronto Mic in front of me, myself, and I. You can come too. Maybe even Dunk.

Oh, cool. Okay? That's how we're going to do it. Real quick story because I've got to shout out my brother Steve. My brother Steve went to a high school in Etobicoke called Bishop Allen Academy and became good friends with his classmate, Justin Rutledge and bought a cassette from Justin, like,

I don't know, grade 11 or 12. I don't know when they're in high school. So I will say my brother, Steve was in the ground floor, even pre flow Hill. He was in the ground floor for the Justin Rutledge experience. And you mentioned Dave Hodge,

Dave Hodge, who's come on this program. He comes on every year to tell me his hundred favorite songs from the year, but he's been on the show many times, and he's gone on the record on Toronto Mic to say Justin Rutledge is his favorite musician of all time. And that man listens to a lot of music. And he had Justin play his daughter's wedding,

Dave Hodges' daughter's wedding. Cool. There you go. And there's another FOTM. It's funny because you talk about Justin Rutledge. Well, here you go. Chuck D from Public Enemy. Did you work at all with Chuck D?

I did a bit of publicity with him in conjunction with Canadian Music Week, but I did publicity for other people. Alice Cooper. Great Alice Cooper story. Okay, hit me up. I love Alice Cooper. Let's hear an Alice Cooper story. Okay, hit me up. I love Alice Cooper. Let's hear an Alice Cooper story. I remember calling his manager, Shep Gordon, in L.A.

Hi, I'm doing publicity, blah, blah, blah. He said, and he hadn't had his coffee, he said, shit, I'm too busy to deal with this. Here's Alice's number. So I got his home number, and I phoned him and said, hi, I'm doing this. Yeah, I said, I'll do anything. And I phoned him and said, hi, I'm doing this. Yeah, I said, I'll do anything. Just send me, in those days, a fax with a list of who I'm to interview and what time. I said, this is, to myself, I said, this is too easy.

And then he said, oh, there's one thing. No, nothing before 10 in the morning. I'm taking the kids to school, and then I'm going to Starbucks to read the paper. I thought, okay, I can deal with that. I said, nothing after two o'clock, I'm playing golf. Of course. But he was lovely.

He did some interviews and he was great. But can I ask you, when you call him, and I want to get back to that story, I don't mean to interrupt you, except do you call him Alice or do you call him Vincent? I call him Alice back to that story. I don't mean to interrupt you, except do you call him Alice or do you call him Vincent? I call him Alice. Okay. Yeah.

It's like when you meet women who are sex workers, you call them by their sex worker name, even if you know their real names. Sure. Well, you knew that, didn't you, Mike? Well, let's say when I had Lee Aaron on the program, I did not call her Karen. Okay.

Yeah. I'm calling her Lee. Same deal. Because Alice Cooper was the name on the program. I did not call her Karen. Okay. Yeah. I'm calling her Lee. Same deal. Because Alice Cooper was the name of the band. Yeah. And he had a terrible band at that time. There's a wonderful book, the name of which I cannot remember, that came out with the story of the whole Alice Cooper on the road tour. Right.

And the band broke up, right very messily and uh i mean that does happen a lot do you call katie lang k do you just say hi katie so you you were early with her career uh were you at all surprised with the fame she reached with mega US hits and stuff? Was that at all shocking to you? No, I wasn't. I knew from day one. And I was hired by her manager, Larry Wanagas, who was a lovely, sweet guy. What year was this, Richard?

Oh, don't ask me when. It was years and years and years ago. Early 80s. Yeah, I guess. I would guess. And she, I knew from the get-go that this woman had everything to be successful, except her ability, she's really awkward in social settings. She could not schmooze her way out of a wet Kleenex.

But everything else, focused, ambitious. When I was working with her as a publicist, she was in a van with four farting, burping, hamburger eating guys. And I remember Larry and I saying, we got to get a woman on the road with her, just to keep her company and give her a level of comfort. And I remember we did, and we made her the road manager, if I remember rightly. Are you responsible for that story of on her way to Toronto for the first show. I think she played Albert's Hall the first time. So on her way, she was in Canora on the Easter weekend and she did one set in the Jesus pose on the cross,

Jesus on the cross pose. Is that bullshit, Richard, or did you create that and spread that around? No, I'm not taking any responsibility for that. What I will take responsibility for was that her very first appearance in Toronto was at Albert's Hall. And, well, in those days, print press publicity was everything. Right. And I got a call from Liam Lacey, who at that time was the music guy on the Globe.

And he said, I want to go on the road with a band. And I was all set up to go with Tom Cochran, but they blew it out. Do you have any bands on the road right now? And I said, yes, KD Lang is in Winnipeg. And she's coming the way through. The result was a huge full-page Globe and Mail front entertainment section. If it's Tuesday, it must be Kenora, I think was the title. Oh, man, back when print was king.

Yes, and that was the first two days later after that came out, three days later, she opened at Albert's Hall, and there was a lineup outside. I love it, love it. I was one of that story you told with these burping, farting guys eating the hamburgers. I believe that was the moment she said, that's it, I'm vegan. I don't know, I think she decided that a long time before. No, I think she decided that a long time before. Incidentally, it was very interesting because she came out as gay with an interview with the San Francisco Advocate, which is a gay newspaper. Right. And I remember Larry and I meeting and shaking our heads and said, that's it.

Her career's over. There was absolutely no, we had all along the way turned down opportunities for awards and whatever from gay organizations. No, sorry, Ms. Lange is playing in Wawa that night. And the fact is we had no negative response at all. A few months later, she came out as vegan and lost gigs. Right, because she's from Alberta. Yes.

Right. Beef Central. I mean, we got more shit for that. We're fine with you being gay, but this not eating meat has gone too far. Yes. Wow. Did you make stuff up though, Richard? Did you create these crazy stories just to in anticipation of someone's

arrival just to get the buzz on the street? No, to be honest if I'm, I never as a publicist, all publicists hype. Right. But you can't lie and you can't make shit up. You really can't do it. So it's all rooted in

some piece of truth. In reality. Hyperbolize. Well that was before Mike. That's not in 2023. Well there was a publicist now no longer with us called Gino Empry. And Gino was arguably the celebrity publicist of all time. And he was impossible.

He was narcoleptic, he was bitchy, he was a... Am I going to get into trouble for this? Well, he's no longer with us uh he was very powerful richard is what you're saying he he was all of that the best story is a friend i'm sorry that's okay you know what uh when i get to the next song and i start playing it i'll run up and get you a glass of water that would would be cool. There was a wonderful story a friend of mine told

me who worked with him in his office. He swans into the office and says, call Tony Bennett and tell him it's my birthday, which it was. So the guy called up Tony Bennett and said, Mr. Bennett, I don't know if you knew this, but it's Mr. Empry's birthday today. Thank you very much. A few minutes later, he calls, Tony Bennett calls back and said, let's go and have lunch. So they had lunch and afterwards, Gino comes back into the office wearing a brand new Rolex watch.

Woo! And he took it off and put it on this guy's desk and said, have it valued. Wow. And he went into his office. Okay, that's great. Gino Ampre, man. I was friendly with a guy who was dear friends of Gino Empry.

This is about 2005 or so, I want to say. So I used to get a lot of great Gino Empry stories. And what a character. Sadly gone before he could come on Toronto Mic'd and spill all the good stories here. But let me play a song that's going to set up another question. So this is something for you two to chill out to while I run upstairs and get a nice tall glass of cold water for Mr. Flo Hill. And you can talk over this, of course,

because this music was built to be talked over. But I'll be right back. I don't even know what it is yet. You're going to be surprised. Is it Brubeck? I think so. It's like back in the day, Downby used to do these blind, they'd play records to people and say, who's that?

And half the time, they didn't know. Is this Dave Brubeck? No, it's Miles Davis. Oh! Oh! Oh God, okay. Oh, God. Okay. Shame on us.

Shame on me. It's okay. I set you up for failure there. Okay. Miles Davis. Any Miles Davis stories for us, Richard? Oh, yes. In fact, I've been doing this for 10 years,

and I probably will never finish it. But I'm doing a book called The Night Miles Davis Tried to Buy My Car and 100 Other True Stories of Life at the Edge of Music. Yeah, I presented Miles. He'd been away from live work for a long time Came to Massey Hall in 73 Sold every single seat Including the ones that are behind the pillars at the top balcony

Wow And he showed up 45 minutes late And we were just having a conniption And he showed up 45 minutes late. And we were just having a conniption. And I remember going on stage and saying, you know, ladies and gentlemen, Mr. Davis is on his way. Good things happen to people who wait. I apologize for the delay. And I'm babbling away.

And I look down and I'm actually wearing a suit and the seam on my left hand seam of my sleeve is splitting and the sleeve is about to fall off and I went oh and I lost my way and I stumbled off stage and as I stumbled off he walked in the back door handed me his coat, took his trumpet out in case it went on stage and hit the show. Wow. And I could never remember when it was. And I went on Facebook, and it was weird because I said,

does anybody remember seeing Miles Davis at Massey Hall? I don't know when. I said, does anybody remember seeing Miles Davis at Massey Hall? I don't know when. And I got a guy called Mark Miller, who's a great writer, sent me reviews from The Star and The Globe, which confirmed the 45-minute late bit. Right.

And the date. Somebody else sent me a list of all his musicians and the songs he played. Best of all, somebody said, oh, somebody sent me a link to a bootleg recording of the whole thing. Wow. And best of all, somebody said, I've had a picture in my bathroom for ages of Miles Davis holding a bottle of beer, climbing into a car with Ontario license plates. I said, it's my car. Because the limo didn't show up. So I gave him a ride to this hotel.

That's incredible. And I was freaking out because of a cop had stopped us. He's drinking beer out of the bottle. And along the way he said, so how much is this car worth? I said, maybe two grand. He said, I'll give you $2,000 in cash. I'll buy the car. Wow. I want to go home.

He had a gig the next night at Place des Arts in Montreal and instead went back to New York. Didn't do the gig. Did you sell him the car? No. Fortunately, I him the car? No. Fortunately, I arrived at the hotel before. I wouldn't have sold it anyway. Maybe if you had dressed better, Richard,

he would have gone on to Montreal. Remind me to ask him about a certain signature piece of clothing Mr. Flo Hill always wears, and I'm glad he's wearing today. Don't let me forget, Brad. So this book you are never going to finish, apparently, although you should, my friend. The Night Miles Davis Tried to Buy My Car and 100 Other Mostly True Stories from the Edge of Music. My condolences to you. I know you were working on that with your friend Michael Rycraft.

Yeah. Not only did Michael pass, but another friend of mine who was very much a financial supporter and mentor to me also died recently. So my thought was, geez, I got through the pandemic day by day. If I'd have known, and I suspect this might be true of many of your listeners, if I'd have known this was going to be two years, we'd have done something sensible. Learn French, play the guitar, whatever, do something. But you didn't know how long this bullshit was going to go on. So you dribbled the time away. And I was so uncreated. To be honest with you, I haven't written anything

since for the last three years. Anything, I mean, apart from my Facebook posts, which are frequent because if I don't write them, my children call and say, are you okay? I really want to know whether I died or not.

That's a good point. Dad hasn't updated his Facebook. Let's do a wellness check. How many kids do you have, Richard? I have two kids. They are 64 and 61, which I cannot comprehend. Where did the time go?

Right. Are they always like kids to you? Do you still think of them as... Yeah, interesting. Yes, they're my kids, and I'm really proud of them. And they've both done better than either their mother or myself would ever have thought. That's awesome to hear.

I know you're no longer with your wife, but I did read your note that you parted amicably, and now you live in the West End, but you used to live downtown. You don't have to give me an address, of course, but what neighborhood do you call home right now? Oh, I live on Quebec Avenue, which is, you know, just runs north of Bloor in High Park. And not far from Humberside Collegiate.

It's a walk. Yeah, that's a walk. But yeah, it's up there. All those kids have to walk to the subway every day. Yeah, that's a walk. it. So I know that high school very, very well. And that neighborhood I know well because there was a short period of time where I worked at the McDonald's that was at Run and Meet in Bloor. Yes, and the McDonald's couldn't make it. Now there's a wing

joint there. You know, I was wondering, how does McDonald's not make it? But here is the reason. I will now tell you, disclosing on the record the first time, that is a McDonald's without a drive-thru. The lack of drive-thru, I believe, especially when the pandemic hit, was the death kndonald's without a drive-through the lack of drive-through i believe especially when the pandemic hit was the death knell like you needed a drive-through to uh to survive i know they did last a couple of decades but anyway shout out to the now gone running meat

and bluer mcdonald's richard when i saw you walking in the snow and i was shoveling a path for you i'm like i don't want this gentleman to fall in my driveway. I was happy to see that you're wearing a white scarf. Yes. Is there any story there? This is like the signature accessory for Richard Floh. No story, but it has that with my rapidly falling out hair, which I don't bother with cutting because it's falling out anyway. It's an, you know, I don't wear a tie.

I've got one somewhere. So I wear this stupid white scarf and people say, oh, it's Flo Hill. Yeah, it's your signature accessory. Identifier. Well, you know, Dunk always has a hat, right? Dunk has a hat. So you got the white scarf and Dunk has the hat. We were talking about hats in the car.

I have a show business rule. Only one person in the band may wear a hat. Okay, so Bedini's got that in the real statics then. He gets to wear that. Yeah, or everybody wears a hat. That's whiskey jack. That's whiskey jack. That's it.

There's other rules. Never wear shorts on stage. Always introduce. Even if you're a ska band? Yes. Do not wear shorts or Crocs or sandals with socks. Please. And the only other, well, there's a couple of other rules.

One is always introduce yourself, even if somebody's just done it. And secondly, never leave your wallet in the dressing room. That's a good one. Yeah, Randy Newman came up with that one. Now, Randy Newman is, I think, one of my favorite songwriters ever. And I love the way he becomes the character in his songs. Other favorite songwriters, Steve Goodman, who, alas, people don't remember,

although his one song, City of New Orleans, the best train song ever. Right. And John Prine, and John and I were friends from 1970. I have a dear friend, Mariah, and she and I would buy each other show tickets when she lived in Toronto. And she bought me a ticket to see Dolly Parton.

And I put a tweet up saying, my best friend has sent me a ticket for Dolly Parton. Fair enough. I'm taking her to Vancouver Island to meet John Prine. And the next tweet that came in blew me away. It was, good idea, Flo Hill, John Prine. Wow. He was following his rubbish on.

Are you responsible for bringing him in the first time in Massey Hall? No, I did not. The first time was not Massey Hall. First time was Riverboat, I think, and later Convocation Hall. Well, the first time he played Massey Hall, he had a stool. It was just him and a guitar and a stool covered with Heineken beer. Yeah. And he proceeded to, I don't know how he did it without having to leak it.

He was on stage for close to two hours. Well, knowing John in the other Con Hall days, he used to do double bills with Steve Goodman and Steve had to walk him around and around and around just to get him straight enough to go on stage. He drank more than Stompin' Tom in those days.

Oh yeah. Is that possible, Don? I don't know. Oh, you mentioned the riverboat and this leads to a question that came in, so I Oh, yeah. Is that possible, Don? I don't know. Oh, you mentioned the riverboat, and this leads to a question that came in. So I tweeted, hey, Richard Flohill's coming over. And the handle of this tweeter is Track Toronto. And Track Toronto said,

what's your favorite song about Toronto? Do you have one? I know, I wish I mentioned riverboat because I know that Ambulance Blues by Neil Young references the riverboat Cafe. But, you know, to be honest with you, I'm going to think of three songs on my way home. And phone it in? Right now, I'm completely blank.

Look, listen. But the artists I saw there, the best one of all. Yeah. The Riverboat for anybody who is sort of you know under the age of 20 would would not know i say under the age of uh 50 you're right anyway it was a long narrow room held maybe 80 people right and joni mitchell was there and in between songs j Wood, who I first met when she was Joni Anderson at Mariposa in the mid-60s. She's on stage tuning and twangling away. And suddenly there was a hubbub at the front door.

Bernie Fiedler, God bless him, had made a deal with the Greyhound Bus Company that a tour of Toronto could include a visit to an actual hippie club. Right. And I'm sure he got X dollars per whatever. Yes. Suddenly there was this hubbub. The place was packed. Bernie, Beatles to the front door.

And here's a busload of tourists. Come this way. Come this way. And he walked them through the club and out the back door into the alley and slammed the door. The last word I heard was some tourist going, well, I never.

And Joni is sitting there with these people walking right in front of her, you know, completely bemused as to what was going on. I had on a, got to get my name right, Barry Witkin came on this program because he was a co-founder of the Purple Onion, which was there in Yorkville, that same scene. And he talked about Joni Anderson playing his venue

in, I don't know, early 60s. I'm told there is a plaque outside the house on Huron Street that she lived in, but I've never seen it. Another episode I'll recommend to you, Richard, if you're looking to kill an hour or two, is there's a musicologist named Mike Daly who came on this program. You know Mike well.

Good friend of Mike's. Okay, so he was here, I think that was like three or four weeks, but it's around there. And we just dove deep into the folk, the Yorkville scene in the 60s in this city because, you know, you mentioned 20, it's really, I'd say it might even be 60 maybe? I'm trying to think. People like my age

need to be educated on what kind of a scene Yorkville is because we all think it's a place for rich people to buy expensive bags. It is now, but it wasn't. No, no. So as we, you know, and again, if you have, you can even even these venues, you're dropping these names of venues and I absolutely love it. No, no. So as we, you know, and again, if you have, you can even, even these venues,

you're dropping these names of venues, and I absolutely love it. Like, I'm soaking it in. Like, so any Toronto venues, especially the venues that are no longer with us, like, if you want to shout them out, don't hesitate. Well, there was the Purple Onion. There was...

Groaning Board. Oh, the Groaning Board. Oh, Lord, Lord. Okay. But that wasn't Yorkville. That was down onaning board. Oh Lord, Lord. Okay. But that wasn't your Phil. That was down on Bay street. They moved. They had a Bay and then they were down on Jarvis or something. Yes. Grumbles. Grumbles to the bottom of Jarvis. I remember picking Randy Newman up at the airport.

And as we drove in, we got off the expressway and we passed up Java Street. And he said, I played there for a whole week with Jim Groschi. And he remembered that. Wow. Amazing. There's a gentleman I want to ask you about. Sneezy Waters.

Ah, Sneezy Waters. Peter Hodgson is his real name. Peter Hodgson is his real name. And Maynard Collins, an Ottawa writer, wrote a play called The Show Hank Williams Never Gave. And we put it on at the Horseshoe for 10 days, sold it out every, and it was an amazing show. And Sneezy played the part of Hank.

And he looked like Hank, and he had kind of... No, he was Hank, Richard. Yeah. I was there the part of Hank. And he looked like Hank. No, he was Hank, Richard. Yeah. I was there. He was Hank. He really was. And there's a lovely story. Anyway, the very first night he went downstairs to the washroom and this bottle blonde lady of indeterminate age said,

Hank, I ain't seen you since Belleville in 90. She actually thought it was Hank Williams. Wow. And Sneezy was so freaked out. So what we did after that, we arranged that the show ended with Hank drunk, stumbling off stage. and we know he's going to climb into a Cadillac and he's going to get on the road to Canton, Ohio, and he's going to die in the back seat. And that was the best ending to the show. People would scream for an encore, and we had a car waiting for him to take him to the hotel with no interaction, no encore, no final bow, no thank you.

He's out of there, drunk, stumbling into a cart, ready to die. It was incredibly... Later on, they did the show as a theater piece. And to my mind, that spoiled it, because they did take a bow at the end of it. But there is a lovely story. They were playing in Kingston the same time as the Johnny Cash show was in town. And they were all staying at the Holiday Inn. And there was a sort of gathering in the bar. Somebody introduced Sneezy to the woman with the hat.

Minnie Pearl. Minnie Pearl. Who apparently had had at one time or other a pelvic affiliation with Hank. And said, this is my friend. We're writing that down right now. Pelvic affiliation. Somebody said, you know, to Mini Pearl, this is my friend Sneezy Waters playing.

And she nodded and said, thank you, and he went away. Then somebody showed her the publicity picture we had taken of him in the back seat of the car. And she said, I've seen every picture of Hank, but I've never seen that one. Wow. I said, that isn't Hank. That's the guy you just met. She said, send him back over here.

Wow. So Sneezy went back. She took him to her suite and said, okay, walk. How did Hank walk? No, you've got to turn your feet out a bit more. Okay, the gate. She gave him a lesson in Hank accents, speech, whatever. It was a great show.

It was a miracle show. And it's something I haven't written about for the book project. Maybe I should. Something that too bad never happened more in bar settings, and that is combine theater with, you know, bring theater to the bar. And, like, imagine doing something like that with the Muddy Waters show or John Lee Hooker or something like that. Well, you could do it with a Stompin' Tom show.

Well, we kind of do. Yeah, you do. Only we don't do the theater thing. Or we do the theater thing. It's just that Tom isn't there. So I want, actually, I do want a thorough banjo dunk update before we finish up with Richard. But I will shout out a gentleman who came over here. And he told me about this Hank Williams, the show he never gave.

I hadn't heard of it. And David McPherson wrote about it in his book about the Horseshoe Tavern. So shout out to FOTM, David. He also has a great book on Massey Hall and he's come over twice to talk about these books because I'm so curious and fascinated by all this. But you're telling me, Dunk,

you were at the Horseshoe Tavern to see? I was there. Wow. Four of us went down. Really didn't know what to expect because as a public relations guy, Richard hadn't done a very good job. So we... I'm totally kidding, Richard.

We want to tease you into the place, not tell you everything. When I think of Richard Folehill, I think of teasing. There's no question about that. But we went down, not, in those days though, we would go down to the Horseshoe or the Alma Combo without really knowing what we were going to see because it was almost you knew it was going to be an experience.

And so we were lucky enough, I guess, to get tickets to go down there and there were a lot of tears in the audience as this show was unfolding because it became clear, and I'm kidding, I'm not kidding, that we were all convinced that this was Hank Williams. Never experienced anything like that in a bar ever before or since. And it only did, was it 10 nights?

Yeah, we did 10 nights. Leave Him Wanting More. That's a good thing. Oh, and the music was so good. Oh, my goodness. That band was... The band was so good, and what they did was they played period instruments from the early 50s, period microphones.

We took everything that was newer than that out of the club, so it was exactly as it would have been on New Year's Eve 1952. Hank died? Something like that. And that was that he didn't do a show on New Year's Eve, 1952, Hank died. Something like that. And that was that he didn't do a show on New Year's Eve. The first show he did was on the first in Canton, Ohio. Was Mark Haynes in that band? Do you remember?

I don't remember who was in the band, but they had it down. They had done the show in Ottawa two or three times. So when it hit Toronto, it was like perfect. Okay, wow. Like if you're setting up your bar to appear like it's stuck in time, 1952, you're going to have a lot of tech you need to get rid of. But don't throw that tech in the garbage.

Don't put it in our landfills. Go to recyclemmyelectronics.ca and find out the place nearest to you where you can safely drop off that tech to be recycled properly. There's a lot of chemicals and garbage in those devices and we don't want it in the landfill. So thank you EPRA for

recyclemyelectronics.ca I have a few more things for Richard because heck, it took him 89 years to get down here. He can't get out of here that easily. But, Dunk, you've been amazing as a co-host, and I know you've been taking notes. You're allowed at the end to just pepper him with the stuff on your notepad there. But give us an update on your life.

What's going on? Is there some doogie and done? Yeah. Tell me what's going on. Well, 2023, it's crazy. Here we are in our mid-70s. This is maybe our busiest year ever. The phone is ringing. Wait, did you say mid-70s?

Yeah. You. Well, I'm 73, but. Okay, you want to know? I never ever, I don't think I've ever asked you your age. I was thinking you were like 65. Well, bless your heart. It really doesn't matter.

I thought Richard was 80. I thought he was like 87. He's 88 years old. No, he's my dad. I call him dad. Okay, sorry. I got distracted. It thought he was like 87. He's 88 years old. No, he's my dad. I call him dad. Okay, sorry. I got distracted there. It's a super busy year.

And it's funny. I know that there are musicians out there that are having a tough time. And if I had to rely entirely on my music career to pay a mortgage and stuff, I would certainly share that grief. You supplement the income. Yeah, I supplement the income. But, you know, finding work in this, Richard was talking to me about his young friend

who has 32 gigs this month, I think you said, Richard. That's insane. Imagine the amount of phone work, leg work, relationship building that goes into doing that. So all of the work that I've been spending in the last, I don't know, eight or nine years with my show, the Stompin' Tom show and the show that Douglas and I have is doing. Douglas is still coming on Toronto Mike.

Well, I hope so. He should. I met him at TMLXX. Yeah. Another amazing story. Where were you? Amazing story.

I was, I was in Barbados. So yeah, it's a good excuse. So it's, it just shows that, you know, there is work out there.

It's just so hard to get, and you have to make so many compromises. I also have a pet theory on this, and you can tell me I'm full of it, because why not? And I might be brain damaged, so that's my excuse. But I think post-pandemic,

I feel people are really, really hooking into nostalgia. I feel like this pandemic was a serious disruptor a few years, and look what it did to us. Look what it did to our kids. Look what it did to our lives. Did you know, like, a few years ago, in fact, we're almost in the anniversary,

because it was March 13th, 2020, when we were all told to basically, like, stay home, don't get within, I don't know, two meters of your neighbors, of your loved ones, of your family, your mom, your kids. Like this was like orders from your government three years ago. How traumatizing and disruptive and awful does that seem in retrospect? So, of course, once we come out of this thing, I feel we're going to look back to a simpler time in our lives.

Maybe it was when we would be, you know, enjoying Stompin' Tom Connors, maybe at the Horseshoe Tavern or something. I think nostalgia is super hot right now. Well, you know, the tribute bands have been overriding the entire country for a decade before, you know, and they're my competition. If I go into a theater and I'm trying to sell the show, I got to sell the show against Roy Orbison and the Beatles and the Stones and Eagles and all of that. And frankly, those are the musicians that make a hell of a lot more money than the rest of it. So I'm

not keen on the tribute shows particularly. But we are doing, we're bringing the show, our Stompin' Tom show with Stompin' Tom's fiddler from PEI. His name is Billy McGinnis. So we're coming to the Moonshine Cafe. I was just there.

Sunday, April 23rd, Sunday afternoon, 2023. So it would be nice to see Toronto Mike in the audience for that. Well, I literally made my first visit to the Moonshine Cafe. I want to say that it was a big snowstorm. Rob Pruce was at the show. That's correct. And Sandy Horn was there. And Brittle Star was making a special appearance.

So, okay, I'm going to get that in my calendar for sure. But you know the neat thing about our guest here, Mike, is that he's still at 89 or 88. He still has an incredible audience. And he still has influence. Thankfully, he doesn't really know how much influence he has. So, he can't charge for it. But if he did, if he knew, I mean, how many followers?

You know, the thing is when Richard gets on Facebook and he farts, he gets like 300 comments and then all these shares. And it's just, you know, so I want Richard to be my friend and I want him to tell everybody about not just that show, but I'm bringing in a duo, a husband and wife team from Alberta in April and May. They're called Over the Moon, Craig Bignall and Suzanne Levesque, who they have met you, Richard. You just don't remember.

That's how big you are. He's met a lot of people. He has met a lot of people. Anyway, I'm hoping that Richard will spread the word when I share the dates with him. Please do. Well, anyway, I'm hoping that Richard will spread the word when I share the dates with him. Please do. The one thing I do like to do is go out.

I've been to 31 shows so far this year. Okay, and we're only March 10th. That's amazing. I know. Wow. Okay. That's amazing. I think that's amazing because Dave Hodge, when we do our yearly, he tells me about all the shows he goes to and I go, oh, this man's in his 70s.

I don't know if I have the energy for that and that was before my health scare. But meanwhile, I'm sitting here of an 88-year-old, almost 89-year-old who's been to 30-plus shows already in 2023. Amazing. Long may you run. Shout out to Neil Young. That's incredible. Did you ever meet Neil Young? I met him very briefly. I was friends at one time with his brother, Bob,

but I haven't seen Bob in four or five years. It's been a minute. I met Neil Young once backstage at, I think, Maple Leaf Gardens. Okay. The people who... I was in a bar the other week and

at the next table there were a bunch of guys talking about who what famous people they'd met I wasn't involved in the conversation but it was getting so stupid that I finally leaned over and said look guys

I got you beat Louis Armstrong Dolly Parton and that was the end that I finally leaned over and said, look, guys, I got you beat. Louis Armstrong, Dolly Parton. And that was the end. Shut that one down really fast. I don't think anyone could beat Richard Flohill in a famous person meeting competition. But now I can tell people I've met Richard Flohill. So this is absolutely...

And honestly, I know that's a hard... I can hear your voice. It's like you've been talking for an hour and that voice wants a rest. But I would do a sequel, Dunk. I feel like there's more stories here. You should get Packham to come on with him. Is that the next guy?

He probably knows more of the dirt on Richard than I do. There's not much dirt on me. There's some, obviously. You don't live this long without getting a bunch of stories. And if you don't get a bunch of stories, you've really blown your life. Is there anything left on that bucket list? I'm sure you'll live forever, but just in case you don't. What are the top items on that bucket list?

Well, I have a friend I met in London. Her husband, for her 30th birthday, gave her a return ticket to Toronto so she could stay with me for three weeks. And then I'm going back to England to stay with her because London's my favorite place in the world. Yeah, we opened with that. And why is London the best city that you know? Oh, it's just, it's got everything.

Unfortunately, it has British people who generally are, I mean how did britain walk out of the european market are they mentally retarded they rode a wave of populism i believe yeah and they have always a good idea right right gary government for years has mishandled everything don't have you come across a guy called Jonathan Pye? Doesn't ring a bell. Jonathan Pye, you should check him out. He's on

YouTube. He does a new one every week. Jonathan Pye is a British actor who invented this character. This character is a television talking

head and he's a roving reporter. Okay. And he, unlike Rick Mercer who used to do really good rants, he couldn't swear. Right. This guy can. Okay, I'll check him out. Just take note, Richard, I never

called you Dick once during this episode. I'm not Bonnie Raitt. Well, there's a story behind that. Oh, I know. I was putting that ball on the tee for you, Richard. Let's go. Well, Steve Anthony was a VJ at Much Music. And he introduced me live,

where I couldn't do anything about it, as here he is, our favorite dick in the music industry. I came within seconds of punching his face. And if I had done that, I would now have 10 million YouTube views of that. I came so close. I was so angry. So then, you know, people have known me 30, 40 years.

Still, hey, and I will say, no, it's Richard. Richard Flohill, you're now an FOTM. Steve Anthony, by the way, was the boy in the box that Corey Hart was singing about from his Montreal Shome days. There's a fun fact for you, but you probably already knew that one. But thank you so much. Thank you, Banjo Dunk, for returning.

You know you're a beloved FOTM. We love you on this show. People should find out where they can see it. Go to the Moonshine Cafe. Anywhere you can see Banjo Dunk, see Banjo Dunk. Richard Flohill, thanks again. What is your Twitter handle? And then I'll...

Oh, I can't remember. You can't remember. People, I'm going to be tagging Richard on it. You're going to figure it out. So Richard Flohill does... I don't even have a website anymore. But you got Facebook and Twitter. I think that is your channel.

Yeah, and I'm messing around with Instagram, but I can't make it work properly. I don't like it. I find a phony baloney on Instagram. I prefer your other two channels there. And that brings us to the end of our 1,218th show. You can follow me on Twitter. I'm at Toronto Mike.

Follow Richard Flohill. He's on Twitter and Facebook. Our friends at Great Lakes Brewery are at Great Lakes Beer. Palma Pasta is at Palma Pasta. I do have a lasagna for you two gentlemen. Recycle My Electronics are at EPRA underscore Canada. And Ridley

Funeral Home. There's no orders here today, Mr. Jones. I'll let you know, but not today. They're at Ridley FH. See you all next week when I'm going into my calendar in real time to tell you that Decisive is returning that's a great rapper with a

great story he's back here Monday night and then we have who do we got here oh Colin Mockery and Debra McGrath talented Canadian married couple everybody knows those two they're here on Tuesday and then while I'm going through the week talented Canadian married couple. Everybody knows those two. They're here on Tuesday.

And then while I'm going through the week, well, Ron Hawkins is going to wrap up, but I see it's Sammy Cohn and Danny Graves talking about The Watchmen. See you all then! Thank you.