Toronto Mike'd: The Official Toronto Mike Podcast - Sonny Greenwich, Jr from Bootsauce: Toronto Mike'd Podcast Episode 1779

Episode Date: October 14, 2025

In this 1779th episode of Toronto Mike'd, Mike chats with Sonny Greenwich, Jr about Bootsauce. Toronto Mike'd is proudly brought to you by Great Lakes Brewery, Palma Pasta, Ridley Funeral Home, Nick Ainis, Blue Sky Agency and RecycleMyElectronics.ca. If you would like to support the show, we do have partner opportunities available. Please email Toronto Mike at [e-mail].

I mean, we were idiots, basically, you know? Right. Welcome to episode 1,779 of Toronto-Miked, proudly brought to you by Great Lakes Brewery, a fiercely independent craft brewery who believes in supporting communities, good times, and brewing amazing beer. Order online for free local home delivery in the GTA. Palma Pasta. Enjoy the taste of fresh, homemade Italian pasta and entrees from Palma Pasta

in Mississauga and Oakville. Blue Sky Agency, the official distributor of Silen's quiet, comfortable, and customizable office pods. Create sanctuary within your workspace. Nick Iini's, host of Building Toronto Skyline and Building Success, two podcasts,

You ought to listen to. Recyclemyelectronics.ca. Committing to our planet's future means properly recycling our electronics of the past. And Ridley Funeral Home, pillars of the community since 1921. Today, making his Toronto mic debut to talk boot sauce. It's Sunny.

Grennitch. Thank you for making some time. It's great to meet you. Yeah, nice to meet you too. My friend John Lolley, the drummer for Bootsauce, was telling me all about you. So I'm glad to be here. Okay, what did John say? I need to know.

Actually, what he said was, man, Mike is looking for you. And I said, what? Looking for me? Uh-oh. Well, I got connected to John because he did some drumming for Rusty. Yeah, I think he's still playing with them now. And yeah, I think you're right. And then Jim Moore was on the program, who, by the way, living in England.

We'll find out in a minute. you're hiding. But Jim Moore, I said, Jim, can you hook me up with John? I want to get John on the show. John politely declined but said, Sunny's your guy. And I think you're my guy to dive into boot sauce. You're the boot sauce man, right? Well, I'm one of them anyway. And I'm still alive, so I guess that's good. Hey, you know what? Shout out to Ridley Funeral Home. That works in my favor. Okay, shout out to Ridley Funeral Home. There we go. So if Jim Moore, is living in England now. Where do we find you today, Sonny?

I'm in Ireland, actually, in a little town called Kinsale, which is on the south coast of Ireland, on the very bottom, sort of like, well, I mean, the ocean is just there, basically just out the window. How'd you end up in Ireland? My mother was living here years ago,

and I came over to visit, and I met an Irish girl, and I stayed. You can't resist. just a good Irish girl, right? Like, you're done when you meet Irish women, right? Yeah, it was kind of like that. My wife didn't like it very much, though.

Oh! I see what you did there. Okay, you know, that tells me you're a true rock star when that's happening, right? Lots going on. Yeah, there's always always stories behind the stories. Well, that's the real talk.

We'll see how comfy you get, if any of those spill out. But do you mind if I ask, how is your dad doing? He's doing well. He's turning 90 on the 1st of January, so just a couple of months away now. But he's doing well. He seems to be happy out.

And I haven't spoken to in a couple of weeks, but he texted me or sent me an email about some crazy thing he was looking at on YouTube. So we were in contact all the time. But yeah, and he's still in Montreal as well. Okay, I thought maybe he was in Hamilton. No, no, no, no. He was born in Hamilton, but I don't think he's lived in Hamilton since he was like a teenager or something.

Okay, note to Rosie Gray T.L. We have an edit to make on the Sunny Greenwich Senior Wikipedia page, which thinks he's living in Hamilton. No, no, he's in Montreal. He's been in Montreal. I mean, I was born in Toronto, but I grew up in Montreal. all. So it's, I mean, it's, it's been Montreal the whole time, pretty much. Okay, so we're going to get into it.

But for those who, the ignorant, just let the people know, who's your dad? I mean, your dad's a big deal. Yeah. Well, he's a jazz guitar player, Sunny Greenwich. And he would have been sort of considered, I guess, the Canadian Miles Davis type, you know, the sort of avant-garde jazz thing. and that sort of business. I mean, he's got the member.

He's a member of the Order of Canada. Like, he's a big F-D-Dle. Yeah, yeah. Yeah, it's amazing and incredible. Yeah. When are you getting your order of Canada? Well, you know, I've been thinking about it for quite a while. No, actually, I don't think I've done anything special enough to get one.

And also, I've been living out of Canada for 30 years. I mean, I've been in Ireland for the last, well, since 97, I guess. Well, that won't work against you because Wayne Gretzky has been living out of Canada since 88. Really? Really?

Yeah. Wow. So, Sonny, look, so we've established you've got the pedigree. Like, your dad, he's a legendary guitarist, a jazz musician. He's received the Canadian Jazz Master Award. So, like, I'm curious in your introduction to music

before we build our way to boot sauce but it sounds like it was in your blood yeah kind of I mean I mean there was always music on around the house and always great music not always jazz even

so I mean a lot of things like Stevie Wonder the Beatles that sort of thing a lot of classical stuff to Stravinsky mostly that that sort of thing so I always had music I mean, since I was, I mean, since I was born, basically.

And also, like, in places like, I don't know if it's still there, but George's Spaghetti House, like my dad would play there often. And I would, you know, they put me, just line me out on the, on the stage there. And I was only in the two or three years old, you know, kind of thing, funny. So, like, take me from this, you know, love of music from a young age where it's in your blood and you're exposed to it, obviously, to the forming of boot sauce, like, just, Give me the highlights on our way to boot sauce. Yeah, well, I was in a band called Dog Food,

which then turned into Dog Star, and not the one with your man. Keanu Reeves. Yeah, because he's a little bit younger than I am. So maybe he stole the name. Although he was in Toronto during his teenage years. He was living in Toronto. Oh, I know, I know he was.

I'm sure he, well, I mean, he could have heard of the band. You know, we were in Montreal, though. But anyway, so that's basically what I was doing. And I had moved to Paris, actually. And I was living in Paris for a few years. And I was just passing through Montreal, actually. On my way, we were myself and my first wife were on our way to, no, my second wife, sorry. You got to keep track, Sonny. Come on, we got to keep track.

I don't know, me. It's a long time ago. Um, we were on our way to Hong Kong to, uh, to meet up with friends there. And I accidentally bumped into Drew and Perry and, uh, we just started jamming in, in a friend's house and it kind of took off immediately, you know, um, we, uh, well, basically it, we just really hit it off and, and musically as well as, as just being crazy dudes. well let's talk influences like so i mean i can hear influences when i listen to boot sauce but like who are the the the acts the bands that you were uh sort of inspired by

i mean initially i think it would have been the chili peppers but sort of before the blood sugar sex magic like mother's milk stuff yeah more more when they were kind of a dance band you know uh and they we were probably one of the first bands Well, probably one of the first bands of Canada anyway to use samplers and sequencers and all that kind of stuff live as well as in the music. So it was kind of a mix because we kind of liked the dance music stuff and it was great fun hitting the samplers and getting these great grooves going. And then we wanted it a little bit heavier. So we added the guitars and I was the guitar player. So Perry played guitar as well.

um and that kind of gave it that bit of rockiness i guess you know it's true it's tough to like stick boot sauce into a genre bucket right because you're you kind of got some you got lots of funk going on there uh it got some hard rock going on there there's some soul to your style like so you're sort of a a mishmosh of uh different uh styles coming together yeah i don't think we ever really worried too much about where we were headed musically uh I think whatever ideas came up, we just followed them through, or as best we could. Excuse me. No problem.

So, okay, so I'm curious, though, when it comes to mentorship. So obviously, we talked about, you know, your dad must have had an influence in there, but you meet Perry. So Perry, his real name, Perry Johnson, what was his name in the band? Perryfume? Perfume, yeah. Perfume, yeah. Perfume. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

I get it now. And Drew Thorpe, Drew Ling was his... Yeah, Drew Ling, yeah. Okay, so you three, how do you add, you know, we talked about John off the top, but how do you add John and Alan? Like, give me the OG lineup. Yeah, it came...

We started trying to do some gigs very early on, and we were looking for a base player, so Alan happened to be. be around and free at the time. So he, like what we were doing, so we hired him pretty much, he was there pretty much from the beginning. We were signed to Polygram within six months of us meeting. So we had a friend of mine from school, Steve Schip, who became our manager, and he got us

into Polygram. So that was myself, Drew, Perry, and Alan. And then John Lally came along, I guess, maybe a year later or so. We had another drummer called Rob Kassanel, who was in a band called Seven Sisters in Montreal that were doing pretty well back of the day. And then another guy, whoops, oh, I can't remember his name. Oh, and there was another drummer in between who did one of the tours with us

But we were, we were such bad guys And we basically tortured the guy And he left And then we found Johnny And now he's listening to this episode And he's like, the bastard can't even remember my name Yeah, well, yeah Yeah

Well, you know, I kind of I kind of did myself some damage over the years you know I don't remember a whole lot really can you elaborate I mean this is the real talk right are you talking about

you know consumption of narcotics what are we talking about? Yeah yeah a lot of drugs and a lot of alcohol we weren't exactly choir boys and we were I mean

yeah we were very bad boys let's just put it that way well Sunny I'm glad you brought it up okay because you know I talked to lots of different musicians and we're going to get into a couple and specifically in a moment because I'm going to ask you about one particular tour but you know there's some musicians don't love don't love you guys in boot sauce like there's a do you know this that some Canadian musicians aren't big boot sauce boosters well look I can't see we were I mean we were we were we were

idiots basically you know i mean i was i was the oldest guy in the band and i was i had just like turned 30 or something you know so it's not like uh we i mean we were more musically advanced than than than as humans you know uh we probably did a lot of things uh that pissed people off and we were not short on ego anywhere and uh we basically didn't let anything get in our way, you know, and I think that that, we probably stepped on a few people's toes that we shouldn't have. And, and in fact, that I never really wanted to anyway. It just happened that way, because most of the time we were so drunk, we couldn't figure out what was going on anyway, except for the shows. We were always sober for the shows, and then after the shows got

trashed. Well, Sonny, I feel like this is the start of the boot sauce redemption tour here, okay? Because you guys, like you said, you were idiots, you were, you had some substance abuse problems, you had no shortage of bravado, because when I read old, you know, old interviews, and it's, you guys, you guys thought you guys were pretty hot. And I think that the Canadian mentality is to be a little more humble, more modest. And I think to hear that kind of brash, like, we're awesome. attitude can rub certain Canadian musicians the wrong way, perhaps?

Oh, yeah, definitely. I mean, without doubt. But I mean, you've got to think, I mean, Drew and Perry had just come back from London, and they were, you know, doing whatever they were doing over there. So they, I don't think they've, we never really thought of ourselves as, like, a Canadian band, you know. We just thought, you know, we're here and we're doing something special and, you know,

no one's going to get in our way kind of thing. But it was ridiculous. I mean, although we did make some friends alone. I'm sure there was one or two. Okay, well, so let's walk through it. So just before we get to it, because I have some key questions. As, you know, John said, I'm looking for you. Like, quite literally, I decided one day I need to talk to a founding member of Bootsauce to

find out, like, from your perspective, like, how it all came to be. And then, because I didn't think it was fair to you guys at, I don't know, Art Bergman, for example, whose name will come up in a minute, but Art will come on my show, he'll be in the basement here, and then it'll essentially be fuck boot sauce, right? And I feel like, no,

like we need to talk to boot sauce and understand, like, you know, where you were at at that time and where you are today and all this. I think it's only fair to boot sauce. Go ahead. Let's let me put it this way. I love art.

I've always loved art. Art was one of my favorites. And in fact, the reason we had him on the, tours because we loved art and also also the Sons of Freedom whom I absolutely loved but the thing about art art was having a hard time at that time as well as we were and the problem we had management that basically would not let us do anything to help anyone like for instance to help art I mean, a couple of times he was having problems getting from one town to the next.

And the tour manager just said, no, wait, he's not getting on our bus, forget it. It's not happening. You know, and I mean, we got the blame for it, but the problem really didn't stem from us. I don't think we, why would we care if Art got on the bus with us? I mean, we had great fun with Art. I loved Art, you know. Still to this day, I mean, it kind of makes me kind of sad to think that he might think that I don't like him. Well, here's how I understand it, having, you know, talked to art a couple of times about this.

So, okay, so for those, we are skipping ahead, but we'll go back and go forward like a good Tarantino movie here, okay? But this tour was called The Big Bad and Groovy Tour. Yeah. So it's, like you said, Sons of Freedom. It's Boots Sauce and Sons of Freedom. We're in like 92, I think. And then you have Art Bergman on the tour. Yeah, and I think there was a band called Pure as well.

Yeah, peer. I remember. I like, yeah, I like Pier. Yeah, they were great. Yeah. So this is, you know what, it's been interesting because you were, I knew you guys. I have, um, just I know all these Cancon alt rock bands. We're going to talk about a couple more you're connected to possibly.

But I got to say, a complete blind spot for me. And my buddy Sammy Cohn from Watchman is coming over to kind of basically, you know, virtually slapped me here in the basement because of my ignorance. But I got to say in Toronto, Ontario, Canada, sons of freedom weren't that big. Yeah, they're a Vancouver band. But how did I meet them? I met them in Winnipeg, actually, the first time.

And it was actually, I think it might have even been before Boots Us. But they were playing at a place called The Spectrum, where all of us ended up playing over the years. and I saw them and I said Holy smoke I love these guys they were just the the heaviest and the greatest I just love them

I mean I still have them rocking in here in the studio often well that's where Sammy's from so that makes sense like Sammy and the Watchmen they're from Winnipeg and yeah but they're from

Vancouver the sons of freedom right but I guess when you get west of Ontario that's where I don't know you get west of Ontario I mean yeah it's sort of like we went out of tour, the first big tour we did

was opening for 5440 and 5440 I mean I had never heard of them in Montreal but they were massive in Vancouver. I mean even in Toronto I think they were just starting to break Toronto at that point. Well much music was a

big driver too right so we had in Toronto anyways at that time we'd have 102.1 the edge and that was the radio station for that kind of alt rock can't con stuff and then we had much music and between the two 5440 absolutely had a string of huge, you know, radio, much music hits. Oh, yeah. I mean, they had some great, great tunes.

I mean, didn't, um, didn't hooty and the blowfish cover one of their tunes. For the Friends soundtrack. Like this was, this was for friends. So, yeah, this song is in, this cover of I Go Blind is in Friends. Yeah. Wow. Yeah. Wow.

Well, that's, that's, that's, anyway, they, the guys from 5440 as well, we're, we're, we're, we're, super great to us, you know, very, very kind to us. And it was nice to them to bring us along because we were basically nobody, you know. It was our very, very first tour. Okay, so I'm going to ask you about another tour because I got a band visiting here in a couple of weeks. I'm going to ask you about, but I got to finish the R. Bergman thing. So R. Bergman tells the story, he got kicked off your bus and he had to hitchhike to the

next town. And just coincidentally, one of my favorite bands, also not very popular in the West Coast, but huge here is lowest of the low. and Ron Hawkins wrote a song about seeing because they were coincidentally driving that highway and they saw Art Bergman a hero of theirs like they saw in a hero of yours it sounds like too but arts hitchhiking

and they wrote the song for hallucigenia they wrote the song Life Imitates Art about this moment they witnessed so I've had Ron on to talk about it arts talked about it became a thing on Toronto Mike where Art Bergman kicked off the bus because of basically blaming you guys but you're telling me you had a tour manager

who was calling the shot. Who's this tour manager? Do I get a name or what's the deal there, Sonny? Well, I don't think I better. Well, I'll put it you this way. This tour manager had to fly back from one of our shows in Vancouver to New York because he was being taken to court for putting a mic stand over a guy's neck and standing on it because the guy jumped up on.

stage with Joan Jett. Wow. So this guy was not messing around. And this guy said, you know, Art can find his, you know, I know he's on our tour and we're going to the same place, but fuck that. Art can hitchhike to the next town. Yeah. Art didn't make, you know, art was in a bad way, you know.

I mean, he was, I mean, we were in a bad way and he was worse than us. there's just it's hard for me to describe because he was always like I don't even know his music that well but I know him and I always felt

a real connection to the guy you know I feel like he's he was he's one of the great Canadian you know he's out there he's got the order of Canada he does he does of course and he deserves it

Um, but, you know, uh, the, he, the, the manager would say, oh, look, we don't have, we don't have, we don't have the, uh, whatever, the proper insurance to have him on the bus, blah, blah, blah, you know, whatever, but they were not having him on the bus. And the thing is, I remember that night, sort of, because we were completely wasted, you know, I mean, there was just, there was, there's, there's, there's. I'm sure, yeah, I'm sure, I don't know. I feel bad about that because it wasn't our fault. I can guarantee you that. It wasn't, it wasn't myself, Drew, Perry, and Alan saying, Art, get off our fucking bus. You know, that's not the way it was.

I'm so glad you're here, Sonny. This is a, you know, you're setting the record straight from, at least from your, there's three sides. I learned this from a band that also reminds me of your band a bit, Extreme had an album called Three Sides to Every Story. Do you remember? Oh, yeah, yeah. Yeah, go ahead.

They were right around the same time we had started out as well. So they were always trying to get us together. And we never did meet. I don't think, I know that Perry and the guitar player from Extreme, they had the same kind of look with the long hair. Nuno Betancourt. Yeah, Nuno, of course. so they were they were always

you know the record company was always trying to pigeonhole us into something so the very first band was those guys the fine young cannibals right so because of that you'll notice on the very first album

there's no pictures of Al anywhere it's only the three of us it's only me Perry and Drew because they wanted the half black guy out the front and the two other guys you know in the back you know and that was literally because of she drives me crazy you know um and then when when extreme came onto the scene then it was like oh well hang on a second here's another band we could

be just like you know even though we didn't really have that much of common than except for the the heavy guitars oh you so there was one extreme song that was uh all over much music i remember get the funk out yeah and and get the funk out does sound very boot saucy Yeah, well, it was after us. Yeah, well, that's an interesting distinction. Okay, so come on, extreme. Okay, but you're right, they were more, they were heavier, like he-man women-hater, and then they did that ballad-y thing and found that's how you make money in America.

Noon is an amazing guitar player. I mean, he, and they were, they were a great band. And like I said, they did try and get us together, and it just never worked out. We never did actually meet. Well, listen, unfortunately. Unfortunately, for all of mankind, okay, the boots. extreme meeting never happened. But again, I'm going back and then we're going to go forward

because I have another bunch of points here. But in my calendar on Toronto Mike very soon is John Kastner from Doe Boys. And he, when I think of, like, so you're talking to a guy from Toronto and I pretty much focus on the Toronto scene, but of course I go beyond that for different acts and stuff like 5440, whatever. But you guys are a Montreal band.

So can you just tell me what was the scene like when you were in the late 80s or early 90s, when you guys are making noise. Like, who else is on that scene? I know the dough boys are... Well, yeah, the doughboys would have been there. There was, um, uh, the men of hats, of course. Um, what else?

There was a band called Rise that was doing really well. There was, um, those other guys called, uh, well, there was a, there were a bunch of great bands in Montreal at the time. Um, and, you know, uh, The thing is we were kind of separate because we just hit, like, those guys had only been in Montreal for maybe a week when I met them. So they didn't really know any of the other guys. And like I would have been friends with Chris Barry, say, from the 222s at the time, who then became 39 steps along the way. So I knew those guys.

But Castor, I only knew sort of, you know, because I'd see him around town, you know. I mean, we would all hang out at the Biftec or whatever, so he'd be there and we'd all be, we'd all be there. Because, you know, Scott McCullough, of course, leaves that, well, leaves that band and then forms rusty with the... Yes, I don't think I knew Scott when he was in the band. You know, like I, like, we were close friends, let's put it that way. I mean, we'd see each other every night. but you know we we we kind of had our own our own thing you know um trying to think who else what about the box the box are there or uh is that earlier again no they they were around at the

same time but they wouldn't have been a downtown band right they were they were um yeah i never even met them so that that that says something because they they wouldn't have been around whereas all the rest of us were literally on St. Laurent Street every night. Wow. You know. Okay. Shout out to Sass Jordan, who was doing some background vocals with the box, I think.

Yeah, Sass was great. She was, I remember her, I can't remember the name of the band, but she used to play at a place called The Mustache. And this was before, right beside the forum, beside the old forum. And, and, I mean, everybody was like, oh, my God, this girl's amazing. You know, and it was, like, she was someone that we looked up to at the time, you know, sort of before Bootsauce, this would have been. Of course. When I was a bit, when I was a bit younger.

Right. Oh, no, love this taste of the Montreal scene. So you guys kind of come up in Montreal. So we're talking late 80s here, but where's a good place for me to go? Okay, well, let me ask you, whenabouts in your boot sauce career? Do you guys do that tour with rainbow butt monkeys? Well, you see, I remember a lot less about that tour. Well, I only ask because now that, of course, they're now Finger 11.

They've been Finger 11 for a long time. But Finger 11 are making their Toronto mic debut in the basement here in a couple of weeks. They got some new music. They're going to be promoting. We're going to talk about rainbow butt monkeys. And then I was reading, you know, I'm doing my homework. I'm doing my homework on Boots sauce. And I'm reading about this, you know, and the name.

are kind of funny, right? Like boot sauce and rainbow butt monkeys? Well, you know, I can tell you, like, they were all the same label as us. So that's how we got put together for this tour. I'm trying to think who else was. There was other people around, but I mean, like the rainbow,

they were younger than us. So let's say if I was early 30s, they would have been sort of early 20s. So we didn't mix that much, although we did meet the mom. obviously, and they had fun together, but, like I said, I seriously damaged myself those years. Well, it's part of your story now, Sonny. It's part of your story.

Yeah, well, yeah, I wish, yeah, well, I mean, I guess, you know, I don't have any regrets, so, but, well, maybe I don't want Art to hate me. Well, you know, I can broker, I can broker a piece of cord here. Like, that could be my role in all of this. I'll bring Bootsauce and Art Bergman back together. and make the piece. Yeah, well, I mean, you can try and make it peace with the guys for boot sauce, too, between us. Well, that's what this is here.

I want to learn more about boot sauce. Okay, because, um, so let's talk about the hot chocolate cover, okay? So I think that I will say, I can safely tell you, the first boot sauce song I ever hear is everyone's a winner. Yeah. And of course, was there, like, was there any, uh, anything before? everyone's a winner that a guy in Toronto listening to 102.1

the edge and watching much music would know? I think scratching the hole was the first I'm pretty sure scratching the hole was the first video that we did. And I think everyone's the winner was either the second or third something like that. And it was

I basically Perry just loved that riff. You know the main riff. And we And we had, we had, I think we kind of even back and forth to whether or not we do the other, the other, so, you know, what's, what's the other one of theirs? Oh, yeah. I'll get it for you. I'll get it for you while you keep talking here. I'll get it for you.

Yeah. So it was a toss-up. Yeah, you're sexy thing. Yeah. So it was kind of a toss-up because we loved those kind of crazy riffs and, you know, the funky stuff. and so I think it was Perry that brought it up initially at least I think I think that's it but it was you know it came up somewhere along the way

that we needed to do a cover to try and you know get ourselves more noticed let's say because it was kind of the thing that that everyone did at the time and I suppose people still do it well you're right though just on that note like the first poison song a lot of people heard was uh was that smoking in the boys room or was that Motley Crewe? Oh, no, but...

Well, smoking in the boys' room was a hit when I was in high school. Was that Molly Crew? No, no, I'm saying the original band. Yeah, yeah, yeah. But I remember, like, you know, this was a move, like you said,

this was a move for these rock bands to release a cover to get exposure. Yeah, for sure. Your mama don't dance. Okay, so, okay, okay, okay. I believe Motley Crew covered smoking in the boys' room, and then I think Poison covered

your mama don't dance and it could be the other way around i have to google it yeah yeah either way yes of course i mean we probably had more in common with motley crew in terms of the self-destruction right right you know because they they they like to party you know and and i suppose we were the canadian partiers uh in the same vein as them let's say well you're still here sunny i'll just give you props right off the top you sound you sound coherent you sound i don't i haven't looked at your medical records i'm still waiting from them to be careered over but you sound healthy like you're a survivor here you are in 2025 yeah absolutely um well i've been off i haven't had a drink in nine years good for you man and uh let's say i don't

I mean, maybe 12, 12 for the drugs. Well, good for you. Something like that. Yeah, yeah, absolutely. But look, I'm not here to preach to anyone, but my life has certainly gotten better since I quit drinking. You know. Well, you know, it's, you got to drink everything in moderation. If you have a problem, it may be best for you to stop partaking at all.

Oh, yeah, absolutely. And the thing is that, I mean, you know, even over here in Ireland, I was still gigging the whole time. So I'd be out every night. So the booze is right there in front of me. The drugs are not as big a deal here, really. You can't get it if you really look, but it's the booze, obviously, in Ireland, of course. Oh, yeah, all the Guinness.

Yeah, like, it's an alcoholic to get off the booze to Ireland. Look, my people come from Ireland, and I can tell you, yeah, alcohol is the drug choice. You don't have to tell me. I can look out my window and see it. oh my goodness okay by the way you i don't want to bury the lead here i feel like this is a big deal you won a juno award for everyone's a winner really yeah like i feel like you in 90 yeah well i was going to ask you where it is but it sounds like i'm breaking news to you but in 1992

it was best dance recording oh yes of course yeah no because we we had been up for best new band or something whatever that one is right and that's right i saw So I guess the tune was, it's in, it's in my sister's basement, so I don't actually have it with me. can't believe the way you are oh baby I just

this day that you got to need because baby I believe that you're a star everyone's the winner

baby that's the truth I'm making love to you is 63 every everyone's the winner baby

that's no wine when everything is satisfied Let's see it again. It's time to get. 25. Write that date down. That is the date for TMLX21, the 21st Toronto mic listener experience. It's happening at Palma's Kitchen in Mississauga at noon. We're going to have a live recording. So drop by, say hi. You can pop on the mic or just enjoy the recording and mingle with other FOTMs. Palma pasta will feed you delicious Italian food and I'll bring fresh, great, Lake's beer, delicious craft beer, brewed right here in southern Etobico. That's November 29, noon to 3 p.m.

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Go to recyclemyelectronics.ca. Put in your postal code and drop them off to be properly recycled. Back to boot sauce, baby. Every once a winner, yeah, again, oh, let's do it, let's do it again, yeah, oh, oh, let's do it again, yeah, oh, let's do it, let's do it again, we're doing it, I don't want to be in a baby me here. I'm going to marry me. Here you're going to be here.

I'm going to be a lot of everything. And I'm going to be a heart. Wow, I forgot that's what it was. Yeah, you won. So just, yeah, you're right. You were nominated for Most Promising Group. I guess you don't remember who beat you for that in 91, do you? No.

Okay, because I would say, fuck them is what I would say. Okay, we've got to find out who they are. Well, hang on a second. Well, you don't remember them either. So, like, it's kind of, you know, it's kind of a curse that thing. Well, you're right. In fact, I'm going to go in now in real time. I'm good.

Oh, you know who it was? Oh, no. that was entertainer of the year. I know. Entertainer of the year that year was the tragically hip but that's not best

that's not newcomer. Okay, the winner was oh, wait a minute here so they have most promising male vocalist most promising group oh my goodness

it's funny because I just did a deep dive into this group last week with Laura Hubert. It's Leslie Spit Trio was the most promising group and you were nominated

with some pretty good competition here I remember the Leslie Spichio. They were good, as I remember. Yeah, so the singer was in this basement last week. We had a great chat. And you were nominated with Crash Vegas, who I've had just had Colin Crips over, and I've had Michelle McIntyre over,

National Velvet in Spirit of the West. Rest in Peace, John Mann. What's the story there, sorry? Well, that was the nominees for most promising. No, no, no, wait, wait, Oh, John Mann passed away. Yeah, he passed away because he had, I believe he had Alzheimer's. Oh, no way.

And then he died very, very young. Sort of around the time Gore Downey was dying. We lost some great Canadian musician. I didn't know that at all. I mean, I've been out of the scene for a long time. I didn't know that. Wow. Yeah, I'm sorry to break that news to you.

That's a surprise. Yeah, we kind of knew all of those guys, because we were all touring around at the same time. what was the singer's name from National Velvet? Oh, she shares a name, okay, so hold on. Is it Holly? Was it Holly? I will tell you right now that you're thinking of Maria Del Marr. Oh, my God.

There's two Maria Del Marys, and I don't think they like being confused for one another. Yeah, well, the Maria that I know was a absolute party animal as well, and we got on like a house on fire. right okay that explains sex gorilla yeah yeah yeah we had fun together in fact we had fun with most of the bands that we met up with along the way it's just that we never

we were kind of corralled from everybody by our management and I remember it happened that somewhere else where like our manager made everyone leave the backstage

when we were getting ready for a gig and we were like, what are you talking about? Why do they, what are you doing? You know, like crazy stuff like that what happened to us. And of course, we being in the band got the brunt of the anger. 100% of course.

Nobody's, I don't even, you won't name this person, but. Elliot Salzman. Okay, so Elliot, it should be, instead of fuck boot saw us, so you should be changing it Fuck Elliot Saltzman. Or Steve Schip, or, you know, he was our actual manager.

Okay. So Elliot just followed orders. But what was the strategy here that you need to be a big band in the world? You got to act like your shit doesn't stink and you're better than everybody else. Like, was that the strategy? Yeah, I think that was it. And I mean, that was, yeah, yeah, pretty much. Yeah.

I'd say that's exactly the strategy. And like today, that seems like craziness. But in those days, I mean, like, for instance, Bowie would tour, you know, with limousines and everything else, and he was selling no records. It was hardly doing anything in terms of selling tickets to concerts, but gave such an impression that he was massive, that he actually became massive. You know what I mean? He was the classic guy that started that thing up and his management. So I think it was, it was, people were, you know, I don't think any of us knew what was going on, to be honest, you know, and also, you know, of course, Elliot was Joan Jets, um, right-hand man. And, uh, Kenny Laguna, who is also, and is still Jones manager, uh, was also helping manage us for, for a time. So they were trying to kind of put this huge engine onto us that didn't really fit well in Canada, you know, where everyone knows each other.

The tragically hip guys would bring us beers on tour. Like we were sat in where we were in Boston one night and these guys come walking up and who are these dudes? And they have a case of Molson Canadian drop it right, poof, on the stage in front of us. Like, what the heck? Like, how did that happen? And it was them. So then from then on, we would drop beers, cases of beers for them when we'd see, okay, they're going to be here like a couple of weeks after us or days after us.

So we'd do this back and forth, back and forth for years. It's funny, you know. They lent us gear one time when our gear got either stolen or broken down. or something in Kingston they like they were always great to us and in fact I've seen a couple of the guys here in CanSale

because they like to golf and CanSail's got one of the nicest golf courses in the world here so I have seen them a couple of times over the years the last 30 years I mean sure it's interesting how a band's reputation

can stick around here we are in 2025 and because of management's decisions for whatever reason, there is a, amongst some musicians in this country, there's a negative thought about boot sauce. Meanwhile, and I've been doing this 1,700, whatever times, the hip is the exact opposite like you described. Like the hip are always great to their supporting bands and they treated.

Well, 100%. 100%. The kindest and nicest guys around, for sure. I mean, even in those days, it was blatantly obvious that they were different from everybody else. Were you able to watch from Ireland, were you able to watch the final tragically hip show from Kingston? I only saw stuff afterwards and only a few songs. So I didn't see any of the live stuff at all. And also, I mean, I was playing seven nights a week.

I didn't have much time to do anything other than make money or try and make, try and keep myself alive, you know. You ready for me to ask? You ready for this? I think this might be the greatest controversy surrounding boot sauce as we kind of walk through your career. And it involves a band called New Kids on the Block. Oh, yeah. Okay. And it's interesting how this ties in because I was reading this, speaking of Kingston,

I was reading this article in the Kingston Wig Standard about this. quotes from members of your band and this article uh the guy behind this article is a guy named mark wiseblot and mark uh much like you now uh an f o tm a friend of toronto mic you're now an fotm sunny but it's funny about a small world here in 2025 how all these pieces fit together but please for the record this is important what can you say about boot sauce's role in lip-sinking allegations against new kids on the block well i can look we got in a lot of trouble for that and I don't want to get into any more trouble today

but we didn't make this story up this story was from a studio that we were recording in and there was someone in the studio and said hey want to see something really cool listen to this and he sings one of their songs games it's it's a part of the song games yeah well I don't I don't know anyways

and it wasn't obviously wasn't you know it was it was this guy who was singing right in front of us so like I mean I don't I I mean I really don't want to get into that because you know those guys are playing the sphere and I want to go see that show I saw them with Paul Abdul here in Toronto last summer oh you know because unlike in sync who can't really tour because one of their main guys has a thriving solo career, right? Like I'm talking about

Justin Timberlake. New kids in the block all five guys still active in the band so they can still, you know. Well, I mean, as I said, I've seen well, quite a few numbers from the sphere concert and it looks amazing. And I've been in the sphere myself a couple of times. It's an amazing

place. Yeah, it's It's fantastic. It's, it's, yeah. Okay, so, sorry, I don't want to get you in trouble. You don't have to say anything about it, except I will just say at the time, there were allegations that, I think it was an engineer at the studio that you're at, was basically saying, hey, we did the games part, like, in post without the new kids on the block.

Like, it was just suggesting that they weren't singing all their parts. Allegations of lip-sinking. Okay, well, the thing is, I mean, I should have just kept my mouth. shut. Let's put myself and Alan. Alan's the main guy quoted, by the way. Alan's clear. Yeah. But we should have just kept our mouth shut because, I mean, you know, it's not our business to be,

you know, but we were stupid and we were drunk. I mean, I mean, it's, it's hard to explain how drunk we were and for how long for years at a time, you know. It's not like none of us, none of us had to work. And in those days, none of us

worked. None of us did anything. All we did was the music and tour. So there was no, it's not like today where you can't make any money at all from music. We, you know, we were taken care of. We always had a tiny, like, trickle of money that they would hand us a per diem here and there. So, you know, we always had something, you know, it's hard, it's hard to explain. It was a different time. basically and also like for instance when the first album with the brown album came out right it was on final you know what i mean it yeah 1990 it comes out right i mean i'll give you another example like the bootsaw stuff only hit spotify i think it was two years ago and so for all those years you could not hear it unless you had a cd or whatever else or i you know quite a few people actually

got in touch with me and I sent them copies of the album because of the albums. But why is that? Because both the Brown album and Bull, which we're going to talk about a big song there in a moment, but they were both, they both sold very well. Yeah, it was right on the cusp of moving

to CDs and then from the CDs to online, to iTunes and, you know, and the rest. Right. So we got, we, we basically just got swallowed in the, in that mix, because we were right, I mean, we were, we were, we were on the vanguard of what was happening, you know, I mean, we were literally miles ahead of what everyone else is there. Like, I'd have, the lights would fall on my pack, you know, like, you know, that kind of stuff, which, which everyone does now.

But in those days, nobody did or had a computer on stage because we were so vain, we didn't want to have a keyboard player on. on stage with us, you know? Perry was the keyboard player. Perry did all the parts. He played all the parts. But the computer would play them back for the shows. That's interesting. Yeah, so we would play, like everyone does now, today,

we play to a click track. So in my monitor, for instance, there'd be a beep, boop, boop, boop, you know, and they didn't play to that. You know, and then the rest of everyone playing to it, obviously. so but the samples were being fired out by the computer you know interesting okay well no no you're you're telling it you're telling me the definitive story of boot sauce which is exactly what i was like hoping for i make i got sunny and i got them in ireland we're going to have a good chat about all this i think the biggest song you guys wrote we're going to talk about right now it's funny we talk a lot

of monkeys here right because you got rainbow butt monkeys right and then what can you tell me about Love Monkey number nine. Like, just bury me in details. Like, who wrote this thing? Would you say that's your biggest, the biggest hit you guys wrote? No, I think what you need was bigger. Okay.

Not like I knew that you were there. Through your friends, I noticed this less. The first hole was bold as love. I was almost all right What you need to change in those emotions What you need for living out your greatestness What you need for changing those emotions What you need for the end

Not like you said that we were there Couldn't make much difference Not like I said that you ever cared Your family and friends were the buyers Your simple ties were meant to cast rise Too hurtful, too painful Times Never said

But we were to share Up and chill in to bear What you need for changing Those emotions What you need for living I should be What do you need? What you need for changing

Those emotions I know what you need What should need for Changing I know what you need. Watching me for living I should read. Watching me for changing. I know what should be.

Watching me for. Watching me for. Stillborn was not, what we're still born was not what we ever planned. It's just what we're tells in the hand. The loss of blood was our loss of love. Some cruel could touch from above. I know what you need. What do you need?

I know what you need. I know what you need. I know what you need to change in the motion I know what you need I'm living in a I know what you need but I don't want you to teach with the motion

No I don't want to me Ha ha baby I'm going to Oh I don't know what you need. I know what you need to me. I know what you need,

I know what you need. I know what you need. But that's true Oh, yeah, baby I'm trying to be able to be. But that being a child But that being said I think Love Monkey

I'm trying to remember I mean the idea for the title was kind of Drew's idea I'm pretty sure the whole and then the idea of course of having it as you know kind of an ode to

you know animal testing and all that kind of stuff that was kind of his idea the music I think was pretty much all of us together as usual Normally the music would come, you know, everyone would put a little bits of parts in. But I think the idea was Drew's originally.

Although I'm not, you know, again, as I said, I don't remember a whole lot from back then. Well, we're jogging the memory. We're jogging your memory, Sonny. You're doing a great job. I just want you to know. You're doing great. But, yeah, as far as that goes, no, I think what you need was bigger. Okay.

And did more sales and played more. but bowl was your biggest album is that fair to say because it has it has Love Monkey number nine's on there and what you need and big bad and groovy like all three were pretty big singles

for you guys yeah yeah I can't even remember it was on the first one but everyone's the winner was on the first one so that was and also scratching the hole

which was pretty big too I mean that was the one that was the one that got us on to much music first. Yeah, you know, it's a hard time remembering, but, but yeah. And you got to, I want to shout out a guest vocalist on your song, Hold Tight, which is on Bull.

Some guy named, some guy named Lemmy. Yeah, Lemmy, yeah. Well, this was actually at the same studio where that other situation happened. I think it was like the Monsters of Rock or one of these kind of tours that was coming through. and there was a hurricane or something was coming up, and everyone had to, anyway, the show was canceled, and we were in Rhode Island. Anyway, the big show was canceled,

so we just said, hey, let's go hit the alcohol shop next door, get all the booze we can get, and get all these guys down there. So Lemmy was on it, the Wizzo was on the record. the guy from Metal Church sang on one of the songs as well so it was just a huge party

in the studio and whoever we could grab and bring him in and get him to record something you know that's how that happens so out of the gates you got the Brown album

we're in 1990 but here's what I find interesting here and Sonny you've been great and I know I think I probably said I need an hour and I'm gonna maybe leak over an hour but you can always leave the Zoom and then I'll just say

fuck bootso us, okay? All right, so 1990, the Brown album, that's Next Plateau Records? Well, in the States. In the States. Okay, who was it here? It was in Polygram here. Polygram here.

Okay, that makes sense. And it was also, we were also on island. Yeah, because Bull is on island records, right? Yeah, yeah. But in Canada, it was always polygram. Okay, got you. And that's why all the EPs. Okay, so, because Sleeping Booty is Vertigo Records in the States.

yeah you see yeah I don't all right so how about Sonny you got these bangers here how how is boot sauce received

outside of Canada uh with much skepticism you know I said man I was in this band it was great you would have loved it and he said yeah yeah

whatever old man you know oh yeah but we did We did quite well, because we did play, we did Wembley with the cult, and we did a bunch of gigs with the cult around Europe, well, around the UK and Ireland, actually. So I played in Ireland before actually moving here, funnily enough.

Yeah, we played the Pointe here in Ireland, Point Theater, which is not even there anymore, I don't think. Well, no, I know it's not there anymore. remember what it's called now, though, because I live, like, so far from Dublin, it's actually harder for me to get to Dublin than it is to get to, like, Paris or whatever. Interesting. Yeah. Because Ireland is a tiny, and there's no flights between Cork and Dublin anymore. There used to be, so it used to be easy to get back of Worcston.

So that's, it's either the train or the bus now, or drive. You don't have a boot sauce helicopter, no? Yeah, I wish. Okay, so I'm just wondering why it comes to an end because it feels like you had a lot, obviously you had a lot of bravado and then you had this funky sound

which was very chili peppers-esque if you will and we talked about how that sound in the early 90s and why does it come to an end for boot size? Yeah, it's funny it just kind of fizzled out more than anything.

I think we finally realize I mean there's stories I keep hearing rumors that we got ripped off more than any other bandits ever in Canadian history, whatever I hear stories about this all the time and even in the day we were thinking

man I you know we've been selling a lot of records why is it that you know I don't have any money or anything you know And so we kind of were fed up with the management. Polygram didn't care about us anymore. They had, I think they had just changed presidents here in Canada. And basically, it, it fizzled out. And also, like, we were in a bad, desperate way, you know, like, alcoholic.

drug addicts, drug-addicted mess, you know. So, yeah, we never broke up as such. In fact, I don't think we're, I think we're still together as far as I know. Oh, that's like an indefinite hiatus. Yeah, we just never got back together. And that's basically how it ended. I think the last show we ever did was in, it was in Toronto. So there was a place, my memory is a little vague on it,

but I think it's out the beach's way. There was some concert hall out there. It was the last place we ever played. Well, was it out near the beach? Okay, so the opera house? No. Yeah, it might have been. Okay.

I can't remember, to be honest, but I know it wasn't the place. It wasn't Queen Street where we always played. Right. You know, we were always, I mean, We even did one night, we did four, four gigs in one night on Queen Street, like a tour of Queen Street. Yeah, so we did, I can't remember the clubs, but like Lee's Palace or are we talking about? No, no, no, literally Queen Street.

And we ended up, I think, in the, is it the horseshoe? Yeah, that's at Queen and that's there at Queen's. Yeah, okay, so I think we, the last gig, we did four gigs on the same night where you could buy one ticket to see of all four shows or, or buy into each of the four shows. And we did it in one night, four shows in a row. So are you still in touch, Sunny, with the other members of Bootsauce? I'm in touch with John Lolley, of course, the drummer. Thank you, John, by the way.

And Alan? Yeah, yeah. John is fantastic. And John has played on all my solo records as well. How did he get the nickname Fat Boy? Because he won't come on Toronto, Mike, so I need to find this out from you. Because he likes to eat. okay and of course he's thin you know he's not fat at all well it's like an ironic nickname

yeah yeah yeah yeah that's okay so john fat boy lally uh obviously uh am i'm saying that right lally i always want to say yeah lally okay and uh obviously you're in touch with him he put me in touch with you and i want to thank you john if you're listening at home allan the bass player uh yeah how's he doing he's doing great um he's i'm gonna go visit him in spain just after Christmas, I think. He's coming over to hang for a while. Amazing. Amazing.

Now, any contact at all with Drew or Perry? I haven't had any. Well, I mean, that's not true. I spoke to Perry a few years ago. Yeah. I spoke to Perry a few years ago. But Drew, I haven't spoken to. Although Al has spoken to him,

and I think John has spoken to him, too. It just, we never really got on great myself from Drew. so it was kind of just one of those things nothing earth-shattering but I haven't talked to him let's just put it with that by the way my last update and this could be wrong

but Perry was working at the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame in Cleveland was information I had yeah I have no idea and Drew might have been working at a music store but retired from the music industry but you know the big question I got to close with Sunny

is you know how pote in a drug nostalgia is I feel like You know, doing a limited engagement, uh, reuniting boot saws. You guys never officially broke up. You just all went your separate ways. And I think you probably saved your lives by getting clean and sober when you did. Keeping the band together may have killed you.

Well, I'd say so. Or we would have killed each other. One of the one of the other. But, um, so the, we had talks about doing a tour. for the 30th anniversary of the Brown album, which was, I guess, five, I don't know, four years ago or whatever it was. And everyone said they would do it.

And then nothing happened, basically. In terms of what I can gather, there wasn't enough interest in the tour for us to get back together and do it. You need to add another band. need to reunite two big Canadian bands and then you guys together do it. Yeah, or not do it at all. I got other stuff to do, you know.

So tell us that then, Sonny, what have you been up to? You said you were playing seven days a week? Yeah, I was in a crazy sort of almost a country band here playing mandolin for years. and that was my trip it was a band called Crazy Chester out of Cork

and we did really well actually the band is still going but once the COVID thing happened I kind of just got out of it and I haven't done anything since then in terms of that band but I've been let me just see if I can find here

sorry Sonny. Do people sing that to you every time they meet you? Sunny. Well, it happens often enough. So I have three albums on my own, my solo albums, which is sort of a jazz thing. And that all started from COVID. So once the COVID thing hit, I quit the cover country band thing and started kind of recording jazz stuff, which is what these records are and they're all available on Spotify

and you know all the regular places Apple Music and everything else and I was just in Hollywood recently because I was up for the best jazz tune of the year from the Hollywood Independent Music Awards I was there in July so I was nominated for best tune

it was the best best fusion tune but I didn't win but I did go though so it was fun but that's amazing that's amazing that's cool yeah yeah so yeah so those albums are all there under sunny Greenwich Jr

so there's uh together alone O'Clair and Orris Theatrum which are the last three and there's also an album that I did with with Alan Baculis called Brain Smack a collection of Terrible and Lurred Parables which is more boot saucy than the stuff that I'm doing myself.

Very interesting. Yeah, go ahead. And I have a YouTube channel. I want to ask you about that because I noticed your setup. Okay. So you've got a great camera on you. You've got a great mic there in Ireland. And I can see like behind you.

There's clocks. And I can see what time it is in New York, which is the same as Toronto. And I can see Tokyo, Los Angeles, right? So tell us about the usual. channel, what's going on there? Well, the YouTube channel, I kind of started out because I was looking for help with Logic Pro, which is the actual program that I used to record all these records.

And I realized that I actually knew a lot more about Logic Pro than most people did. So I started just doing the YouTube thing, kind of having fun with it, you know, and showing people tricks and tips on Logic Pro. and then that turned into myself and my wife would go for walks and then we started going to Vegas and, you know, so like I just throw anything up there that I kind of feel like, you know. But it's good fun. Yeah, it's great fun.

So people just look for Sunny Greenwich Jr. on YouTube and they'll find you. Yeah, on YouTube right there. And also the albums, of course, like I said, on Apple Music or Spotify or whatever else. And they've been doing pretty well. And I, you know, I think one of the songs has, you know, been played like 100,000 times or something kind of crazy. What does your dad think of this jazz music? Ah, he laughs at me. Is that a big burden, though?

You got the same name, right? Like, I always, I have four kids. I got to say, I thought about this. I thought, I can't give him my name. Like, you got to have your own identity, but you're carrying around the name, Sunny Greenwich. Like, is there extra weight on that? Yeah, no, I don't. I don't really find any weight with it.

I mean, my dad's kind of hasn't played in, I don't know how long now, 15 years or something since he's done a gig. So he's not doing any gigs or releasing any music. So it hasn't really been that much of an issue. And also, funnily enough, I was born on New Year's Day, as was my father. Wow. So in the, I've got to. I don't have it somewhere. I got a picture.

I was on the cover of the, was it the star in Toronto, the Toronto star on the, on New Year's Day when I was born. So what it was is because I was born on New Year's Day and they, you know, the newspapers were there. They needed a name.

Right. So they called me Herbert Lawrence Greenwich the 3rd. So that's my grandfather, my father, and me. So I'm Sonny Jr., but I'm Herbert Lawrence Greenwich the third.

That's too long for the marquee you got a short in that. Yeah, yeah, yeah. That's it. Sonny, I'm so glad we connected because...

Yeah, me too. I mean, I wanted to meet... I wanted to meet... You're kind of like now in 2025. You are the spokesperson for Bootsauce. You are Mr. Bootsauce.

Nobody else in the band is doing any boot sauce retrospectives. Like, that's your role right now and you kicked ass and I feel like you guys had some substance abuse problems, you had alcoholism,

and you had management that wanted you to be assholes. So I feel like hearing your perspective on all this, you can better understand why people say fuck boots us. Yeah, and I wish they wouldn't say that. Well, you know what, I'm going to stop saying it. Because of this, I'm going to stop. It's going to be erased from our lexicon. Well, okay, well, that's good.

I like that. I mean, because, you know, I don't know how to put it in a way that makes sense. But basically, we were drunken idiots, we were kids, and we had no idea what we were doing. None. You know what I mean? And we were put in a situation where it was all the alcohol, all the drugs, all the girls, all the whatever, you want it. So what else would happen? You know what I mean?

And then also people telling you every day that you're better than everyone else. Right. You know, and then things like, you know, like, no, I don't know. You know what? You were aspiring rock stars and you felt that's. No one. But in that, in those days, we weren't aspiring. We were there.

We were there. You know what I mean? I mean, now it seems unlikely and impossible. But at the time, it was pretty fun. And it happened, you know. It happened, and now you're an FOTM. And maybe if you're ever in town and you have a couple of hours, I'll buy you a coffee. Well, you know, I would absolutely take you up on that 100%.

And I'll bring John along as well. Oh, yeah. I want to meet John, too. Yeah, he's around town. You know, he lives somewhere out to Danforth or something. So he's there. It's not like, you know. He's there.

That's why I invited him. him over because I'm like I know where he is because I follow him on Instagram and that's why I said oh he can make because I'm in South Atobico but he could make the trek over here and uh yeah yeah he passed me over to Sunny and I'm glad he did that and we had a great chat so thank you sunny thanks for this chat and uh keep on rocking in the motherland Ireland I will and thank you so much for the

chance to uh well at least say something to art which is you know makes me feel better I hope I hope I hope he You get it through to him that I never had any bad feelings against him at all, ever. Only good feelings. And that brings us to the end of our 1,779th show. Go to Toronto Mike.com for all your Toronto Mike needs. Much love to all who made this possible. That is patrons like you become a member at patreon.com slash Toronto Mike,

Great Lakes Brewery Palma Pasta Nick Iienes Recycle My Electronics.C.A Blue Sky Agency and Redley Funeral Home See it tomorrow when radio veteran Lisa Brandt

makes her Toronto Mike debut. We're going to be able to be. Thank you.