Toronto Mike'd: The Official Toronto Mike Podcast - The Pen Flip: Toronto Mike'd #960

Episode Date: December 6, 2021

This Mikeumentary dissects and analyses Dave Hodge's pen flip from March 14, 1987 with perspectives from Dave Hodge, Ken Daniels, Ron MacLean, Paul Romanuk and Peter Mansbridge.

Can you take me back to that day when he flipped the pen? Because you were there. I was. Well, first of all, let's get this right. Yeah. It was a pencil. Whoa. Not a pen.

This is breaking news right now. Are you kidding me? No. Ask him. Everyone, I got to go back and listen to what he told me, but everybody calls it the pen flip, but it was a pencil. Okay. I'm 99.9% sure. I'll give you the one-tenth that I could be wrong.

We got breaking news. Ken Daniels, we just learned it was a pencil, not a pen. Ask Dave. See if he'll remember. Dave will go, how the hell do I remember? What up, Miami? Toronto. VK on the beat, uh-huh, check, uh-huh

I'm in Toronto where you wanna get the city love I'm from Toronto where you wanna get the city love I'm a Toronto Mike, you wanna get the city love My city love me back for my city love I'm in Toronto where you wanna get the city love Welcome to episode 960 of Toronto Miked. Proudly brought to you by Great Lakes Brewery. A fiercely independent craft brewery who believes in supporting communities, good times and brewing amazing beer.

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Pillars of the community since 1921. I'm Mike from torontomike.com. And this week, it's the highly anticipated Pen Flip Mikeumentary. As with the Harold Ballard and 1050 The Team Toronto Mikeumentaries, this episode only exists because of immense assistance from Tyler Campbell. In 1950, the great Japanese film director Akira Kurosawa's Rashomon

told the story of a brutal murder from the perspective of four different witnesses, each one remembering it differently. The memory can be an unreliable narrator. Each one remembering it differently. The memory can be an unreliable narrator. Each person unconsciously applies their own experiences, circumstances, and biases to them. Combine those differences with the fog of time, and you will often get stories from credible witnesses with varying and contradictory details. This phenomenon is often called the Rashomon Effect. On March 14th, 1987, following a game between the Calgary Flames

and Toronto Maple Leafs that ended early, Hockey Night in Canada switched over to full network bonus coverage of the end of the game between the Philadelphia Flyers and Montreal Canadiens. The game was tied 3-3 at the end of the third period, which ended just before 11 p.m. Eastern Time. Instead of staying with the game

and showing the overtime period, CBC decided to switch to the regularly scheduled airing of the news, so that viewers outside of Quebec would not get to see how the game ended. Dave Hodge, the host of Hockey Night in Canada since 1971, was frustrated by the decision, ending the broadcast with this. Now Montreal and the Philadelphia Flyers are currently playing overtime and are we able to go there or not?

We are not able to go there. That's the way things go today in sports and this network and the Flyers and the Canadians have us in suspense and we'll remain that way until we can find out somehow who won this game or who's responsible for the way we do things here.

Good night for Hockey Night in Canada. Several key players from that night, including Dave Hodge, have visited Toronto Mic'd over the years to share their personal memories of what they saw. Some were in the room when it happened.

Others were watching on a studio monitor. All of them remember it a little differently. We've compiled them all here in a Toronto Mic'd micumentary, all about the pen flip. First, let's hear from the man who flipped the pen, Dave Hodge, on episode 191 of Toronto Mic'd, telling me how it went down from his perspective. Let's talk briefly about what happened on March 14th, 1987. And we'll just touch upon this, whatever you're comfortable with.

I know you've been asked about this day like probably a million times, and you're probably sick of talking about it. But we're just going to address it. So basically, maybe I'll play the clip, but maybe you can just set it up really quickly. What was happening? The Flames were playing the Leafs, and it ended early, and then they switched over to the Flyers and Canadians, which was for the third period,

and I guess it was going to overtime. So tell me what, before I play the clip, set it up here, and then we'll talk about it briefly. Well, it shouldn't surprise you that, in my mind, live television and the broadcast of a game should probably start at the beginning and end at the end and not sooner. Certainly, if you have people watching a game, although they didn't see the Philly-Montreal game across the network in its entirety, if they see it tied up and they're ready for overtime and then you tell them you're not going to be able to show overtime because, sorry, we have to leave, it's 11 o'clock at night.

And the reason for leaving the game in midstream, as it were, was that the New Democratic Party of Ontario had just announced a new leader, and the rest of the country actually saw the Flintstones. Really? You should know. I did not know. So it wasn't all that important for anybody other than Ontario,

and the people in the rest of the country made their feelings known that this was a decision that almighty Toronto, or Ontario anyway, central Canada was making for itself, and never mind anybody else. But earlier in the day, the CBC had done the same thing to a curling match that was an important playoff match at the Briar. A couple of rocks to go. Sorry we have to leave.

I was watching with Bob Cole. And Bob gets angry at the best of times. Newfoundland was playing BC. I was living in Vancouver at the time, so I had interest in the BC rink. He had interest in the Newfoundland rink, and we didn't see the match conclude on TV. So that was frustrating enough.

The same thing happened later at night in the hockey broadcast and hockey night in Canada. And what I did was express frustration, I guess is the best way to put it, that this was happening again. I didn't think it should ever happen. I really hoped from that day on that it would never happen again. And I think it happens far less ever since because people realize how basically dumb it was at the time for a network to do this and just shrug its shoulders and say, you know, this is our policy. This is what we do. That's a longer version than I intended. But yeah, it was live television.

Sometimes you don't have a chance to gather yourself. And at the moment I was told, you know, I was asking a question on, on camera. In fact, can we, can we go back? Can we, we've been in a commercial. Can we go back and see the end of the game? No sign off. And I said what I said after hearing that. Paul Romanuk became one of the best known play-by-play announcers in Canadian television, both at TSN and Sportsnet. But before his voice became familiar to hockey fans,

he began his career as a runner for Hockey Night in Canada in the mid-80s, tracking stats, getting coffee, and relaying scores to Dave Hodge for his out-of-town updates. On that Saturday in March, Paul Romanek was in the room when the pen was flipped. Here's Paul on episode 281 of Toronto Mic'd

with his memories of the incident. So where were you when Dave threw the pen? I was beside him, pretty much. Because he's been here. I don't know if you heard the Dave Hodge, but before we started recording,

he looked me in the eyes and he said, I don't want to talk about the pen flip. This is what he said to me just before we started recording. I had a lot of pen flip questions. I had the audio. I was like, I'm like, well, I said to him, I just said, you know, I'm talking to Dave Hodge here.

I'm like, I'll ask you about the pen flip and you can say what you like. Like you don't have to say anything. You can just say, I don't want to talk about that and I'll move on. So I asked him about the pen flip and he did a good, I'm going to say he did about 25 to 30 minutes about the pen flip. So he gave me, I know. And I was like, oh my God, this is Dave Hodge. He's one of my favorites too. But tell me about a working with Dave Hodge and being there that day and any insight you can uh share on that would be just cool for me well of course it's it's in the fog of uh of time now so uh and as science and research has proven everybody has different memories of of things that they see

even though they all saw the identical thing uh and you can ask people literally minutes after they've seen it and everybody will have a slightly different interpretation. Here is mine. I was – one of the jobs was to do out-of-town scores, watch the out-of-town game for Dave. And this is analog technology, 1980s. So it was a big deal for Hockey Night in Canada to have a satellite feed of an out-of-town game. On this occasion, it was the Montreal game. I want to say Montreal-Philadelphia, but it could be wrong.

And I would watch that game. And when there was a goal scored, I'd say, Dave, there was a goal scored in the Montreal game. And he'd sort of turn around from what he was doing and take a look at it. And he'd say, what happened? And I'd say, oh, Chelios knocked it down at the blue line, moved it up, and it was a quick shot by Nazlin, top corner. So then when there was a pause, Bob Cole would go, and now let's go down and hear what Dave Hodge is watching the other game.

Dave, and he'd go, second period, Montreal, the puck comes back, Chelios over to Nazlin, he scores, Canadians are up 2-1, and they play it back. So that was my job that night. Well, earlier in the day, the Briar had been running and the curling championship and Dave and Bob Cole were both big curling fans. And they were sitting in this little sort of ante room by the studio at the old Maple Leaf Gardens watching, uh, it was called the client room, and it had TVs in it, and they were sitting, and they were watching CBC Sports, watching the briar. And CBC did what back then was a classic CBC thing, where local news was sacrosanct. So at six o'clock or 11 o'clock,

it didn't matter what was on, you dumped out of to get to the news that was that was the way it was so they dumped out of as i recall extra ends of the briar to go to local news yeah and i remember dave and bob sitting in there and to keep in mind i was a runner so it's not like i was sitting in with hey guy what do you think of that i was i was you know yes mr hodge i'll get you a coffee was that double cream so they were both apoplectic, like, what the hell is this? This is bullshit. How can they? One of those.

So fast forward to that night. We were watching the game. As usually happened, the Toronto game would end earlier, and I don't know why that was. So they were late in this Montreal game, and let's say for sake of argument, the game ended at 7 minutes to 11 when you have to be off. And they would throw to the other game. And the producer was a guy named Doug Sellers,

who was a great young Hockey Night in Canada producer, left, went to work for Fox, and unfortunately, he died a few years back, but he was up and coming, very, very good producer, producing the game. So because I was doing that job, I had a headset on, so I could hear the truck, the production truck, and of course, Dave was pretty much right beside me. And I'm trying to remember. The game ended. We did out-of-town scores through to break. And then in break in a situation like that is typically when the producer will,

okay, here's what we're doing. We're going to do X, Y, and Z. You tell your host, and it's your host's job to execute the plan. And what the plan was, Dave, we're going to come back out of break. Want you to throw to extra coverage of the Montreal Philadelphia game, if that's what it was. And, uh, and then, you know, we're going to stay with that as long as we can. And it was a close game. It was late in the game. It was four, three, three, two, something like that. And Dave, one of the most intelligent people I've ever worked with flagged it up and said, if they tie it, we better stay because this network is already dumped out of the briar earlier today.

And the producer has absolutely no control over this at all, right? It's the network that decides it. So they go to break. They come back and we now take you to extended coverage. Boom. So we go to the game. The game's going on sure enough somebody ties it so it's tied now now we're going to go to overtime okay so then they throw it a break there we come back on camera the producer says something along the lines okay dave um we're going to run through the out of town scores and then you got to come back on camera and say, you know, basically apologize that we can't show you the end of the game as a result of network commitments and yada yada. So Dave said something along the lines, again, as my recollection is, don't put me on camera and make me do that.

I'm not going to come on and tell people we're not showing the end of this game after we've already done this to curling fans. The producer plays his card. Producers in charge, as he should be. You know, hosts host, producers produce. That has to be the pecking order. And the producer says, you're the host of the show. Here's what we're going to do. We're doing out of town scores.

You come on and wrap the show up. That's the way it is. So we go through, he comes out, we go through the out of town scores. He comes back on camera, obviously disgusted the whole bit where he looked off camera and said, are we going to that game?

Are we going back to the game? The game was 100% to my recollection, theatrical. He knew exactly what we were doing. He'd been told a couple of times and, you know, and the only guy off camera when he looked off camera would have been the floor director who wouldn't have had a clue what we were going to do. So then he, you know, looked back and said, no, apparently we're not going to that game. And so we will have to wait and see who won the game and who's responsible for the way we do things around here. Flipped the pen in the air.

And that was the end of the show. He got up, walked over, grabbed his coat and left. And that was the last thing he ever did for HockeyNet in Canada. That is my recollection. Apologies, Dave, if I remembered it differently than you. But that was my recollection. Apologies, Dave, if I remembered it differently than you, but that was my recollection. It's funny. When Batista hit that big three-run homer and flipped his bat, we were talking about we need—I bought a t-shirt with the Batista bat flip on it, and then I was joking that

we should have t-shirts with the pen flip. This is an iconic Canadian media story. But you know what? And this is why he was one of my broadcasting heroes. And it is proven, as so often as the case in these things, he was on the right side of history because it is now whether it's CBC or anybody, it is verboten to dump out of a live sporting event before there is a proper result. You just don't do that anymore. And I think he was the start and his digging in his heels and it cost him his job. Ken Daniels is one of the top play-by-play announcers in hockey, calling TV broadcasts for the Detroit Red Wings. His roots, however,

are in Toronto, where he did weeknight sportscasts on CBLT and eventually hosting and calling games on Hockey Night in Canada before he was hired by the Red Wings. Ken wasn't at Maple Leaf Gardens that night, but he was working just up the street for CBC. Here's Ken's memory of the, quote, pencil, unquote, flip from episode 318 of Toronto Mic'd. That's great.

Now, the day of the pen flip. Pencil flip? Pencil flip. You're right. I got to stop calling it pen flip. Where were you when the pencil was flipped? With my feet up on the desk at CBC waiting to do the late sports because we would follow the late local, the national, and then there'd be late local news after that, when the days that CBC didn't give a crap about overtime pay for everybody.

So they kept them on. They stopped that years later. But I was in the sports office above the Max Milk, just north of Maple Leaf Gardens, when the offices were on Church Street. And I watched that game, and it's around 11 o'clock. The Philadelphia-Montreal couldn't go there for overtime. And, you know, I have to find out who makes the decision, who explains who makes the decisions around here. I watched that game and it's around 11 o'clock. The Philadelphia-Montreal couldn't go there for overtime. And, you know, I have to find out who makes the decision,

who explains who makes the decisions around here. And good night from Hockey Night in Canada. I went, whoa, I wonder if he's going to be gone. And I walked out of the office and went back to the news area and they were all, whoa, that could be the end of Dave Hodge. We all thought the same thing. And I'm going, no, Dave Hodge can't possibly be gone. And sure enough, well, you know the rest of the story there, Paul Harvey. And then in comes Ron from Red Deer.

But Dave that night, and because earlier that day, I believe the curling was cut out for the Democratic Convention or the NDP. NDP, Bob Ray. Right. Bob Ray was winning that. And they cut away from curling, and Dave's from BC, and that was all part of it. So the whole day, I think, just came together, and that was the conclusion of a bad day of television from where the principal, Dave Hodge, and he wasn't wrong, would sit as opposition to what the news thought. So I was just waiting to go on. My script was ready.

When I used to do TV news and when I did radio, I never liked to give away the score in the on-camera. Figuring if you could keep people for 30 or 40 seconds, why are you giving the end of the book in the beginning? So it's, you know, I could write all my scripts generically at five in the afternoon and sit back and watch the games. So I'd say, you know, the Leafs are home to so-and-so tonight, uh, month, uh, Detroit

in a five game winning streak. The Leafs looking for their first win in six. Let's go to Maple Leaf gardens. And that would be it. And you get in, you do the highlights and the score is the score. So I was basically ready to go. I've just sitting there waiting. And then that happened.

Holy cow. That was unbelievable. Another outside observer to the incident was the man who anchored the National, CBC's flagship news broadcast, Peter Mansbridge. He was standing by, waiting for Hockey Night in Canada to end

so that he could begin his newscast. Here's Peter from episode 929 of Toronto Mic'd. Yeah, that was a strange one. Look, I was there that night. That was a Saturday. And so I was there when Dave threw the pen across the studio floor. In fact, I tried to find that pen because I thought it'd be worth a lot of money. But, yeah, I don't know how that unfolded that night i mean it was a bizarre

thing of time zones it was an app i think it was an afternoon game as opposed to an evening game it was there was something weird about it but anyway it was another very odd decision so we call it that by by the hires up at the at the cbc who make those kind of calls now uh as i recall in my conversations with dave about this is it was a compounding thing because he and bob cole had been watching curling earlier in the day uh i think whatever where something with uh whatever the curling championship is where the provinces play each other, and I'm showing my ignorance. Breyer. Breyer.

I apologize to all the Breyer fans. But there was Newfoundland was playing, I guess. That's Bob Cole's home team there, and they left him. He was the representative for Newfoundland more than a few times. He's a great curler, Bob Cole. I got to brush up on my curling. That's all my to-do list. Hurry hard.

Hurry hard. Hurry hard. I always think of make the final. Yeah, shout out to another fellow FOTM. Okay, but what I remember is I guess CBC had left curling, which irked Dave and Bob Cole when they were watching. And then to later that same day, to leave the overtime game of a hockey game, I guess that was like a final straw. Hence the pen flip.

By the way, somebody I spoke to, and I'm not sure if it was, might have been Paul Romanuk. I got to look into my archives and remember who exactly it was. But somebody who was in the room that night claims they picked up that pen and they kept that pen. So I have that somewhere in the archives here i have to dig it up and maybe i'll put together a special feature on the pen flip with various accounts probably a lot of people who claim they have that pen next to dave hodge the person most impacted by the flipping of the pen was the man who succeeded dave host of Hockey Night in Canada, Ron McLean.

Ron was there, just outside the studio, a witness on the night that would forever alter his career and make him the face of Hockey Night for the next 30-plus years. Here's Ron from episode 165 of Toronto Mic'd. Okay, well, let's do this then. It's like 30 seconds long. I'll play the Dave Hodge clip. from episode 165 of Toronto Mic'd. Done it for 60 years. It's like 30 seconds long. I'll play the Dave Hodge clip. This is the infamous pen flip, which by the way, not much of a flip.

It's gorgeous though. The thing is, the podcast won't do it justice. You have to find this, the pen flip. But let's listen to Dave Hodge. So is this the 86, 87 season? Yeah, it's March 87. And to set it up a little bit, I've heard Dave speak about. This is, so is this the 86-87 season? Yeah, it's March 87. And to set it up a little bit, I've heard Dave speak about this many times,

but I guess earlier in the day, this is his words, he says he was watching Curling on CBC. And Breyer maybe, I think it was Breyer. It was a semi-final, Newfoundland, BC, two rocks to play in the 10th end.

You should tell this story. They cut away to the NDP convention in Ontario. Right. Because that was when Bob Ray won the NDP nomination and he would go on to be premier. But yeah, so they'd already brutalized the semifinal curling coverage in the afternoon. And now after a Calgary, Toronto hockey game, we join Montreal, Philly in overtime.

But in that overtime, we have to cut away. We have to, because it's bonus coverage, we're not allowed to finish the story. And that set Dave off. And I was there. I was at Maple Leaf Gardens in Toronto. I was in what we call the client room, Mike, just around the corner from the studio. I watched the whole, Doug Sellers, God love him, is no longer with us.

Doug died at 50 playing hockey down in California. But Doug was the point person who was having to say to Dave, Dave said, don't put me on. Please just go off the air and make it look like some kind of a mistake, you know, that we were cut off. But let's not have Hockey Night in Canada tarnished with the same brush that already the curling producers and people are. So he was begging Doug not to put him on camera

and Doug was saying, Dave, you know, you're our guy, you have to make this somehow palatable for the viewer and sort of get us off the hook here. It is bonus coverage. It wasn't like they watched the Flyers Canadians all night. Right. And he just, yeah, it was an amazing thing to watch.

It was the last straw. Like Dave would be better to explain that. Yeah, I got to get him in here. I think he was just tired. And he felt, I mean, he was entirely right, of course. And that's what made Dave great. You know, he was always going to be the journalist first and foremost.

So, but it was, it was a crazy scene. So then, uh, it happens just, I just was standing right outside the door where he delivered that little monologue. And then he comes roaring into the room where I am and he grabs his coat off the, you know, I'm sick of these guys making me look like an idiot.

And, uh, and, uh, then somebody grabbed him. I forget who, and says, Dave, it's okay. We're going to, we'll go back to the Harbor Castle Hotel, which was a Hilton in those days, a Westin now. And we went, uh, and I'll never forget this. Uh, Harry Neal and I drove in one car and Dave Hodge went down in another, and there was

probably about five or six of us at the little bar at the Harbor Castle. And Harry Neal at one point turned to me while we're having our beer and he said, Ron, you should work on your relationship with Don Cherry. He says, that I think is going to be your ticket. Wow. Yeah.

During Dave's first visit to the Toronto Mike's studio, I played that clip of Ron for him. Here are Dave's thoughts on Ron's comments and his final words on the infamous pen flip. Again, from episode 191 of Toronto Mic'd, here's Dave Hodge. Does Ron have it right there? Yeah, well, that's another way of saying,

I think this guy over here is getting fired and you're getting his job. So, which Ron kind of already had, sort of. But yeah, that's the way it went. I'm not sure I said much after I picked up my coat other than I probably had a look on my face that knew I wasn't going to be back in that studio again. Although that was still to be determined. I mean, it played out in the next few days with basically CBC said, you know, we're not happy with what you did. And I mean, I played out in the next few days with basically CBC said, you know, we're not happy with what you did. And I said, well, that's, you know, that's,

that's up to you. But I said, I hope you've taken some kind of a stock of the viewer's reaction because, um, they, I told you Mike earlier before we started that I probably should want to talk about this because it may have been in some ways my finest moment. It's the only moment I can think of that has never been criticized by anybody who was watching except the powers that be at the CBC. And why would any viewer sit there and go, oh, this is okay. We don't mind this. Let's see the Flintstones or let's see who the new NDP leader was. I'm not suggesting that wasn't important, but all things in due time. And when you're doing live sports, some things, other things have to wait. So it was, in the end, it was the CBC saying, you know, we'll fly you back and you come and see the head of sports and some other

executives at the CBC and you apologize for what you did. And we'll go back to where we started. And I said, I have absolutely nothing to apologize for. Again, ask the viewers if they need my apology and I'll apologize to them. But I said, I don't think you'll find one that is demanding that. So basically I said, I refuse to apologize. And they said, well, you're suspended. And I said, when am I going to work next? And they said, we're not sure. And I said, well, if you're not sure when I'm working next, and I'm not sure when I'm working next, I will take this opportunity to decide that I have been fired. And there was another network covering NHL games at the time. And five minutes later, I had a job with them.

So not to say I was real pleased at leaving Hockey Night in Canada, but 16 years was a long time. I enjoyed all of it. And, well, somebody said, hey, you could still be there today. I went, I think that would be difficult. That is really overstaying your welcome. I mean, I'm 25 years now at TSN, and that seems like a long time, especially when I put it next to the 16 years at HockeyNet. I'm really happy and proud of the different things I've done,

and I really do say that every change has been positive. I know it's an old cliche, you know, one door closes and another opens, but I think that that's helped keep me alert and alive and fresh and interested. And I've done various things at TSN, obviously. You don't need to be changing employers to change tasks. And I need to be kept fresh. Well, Brian, this kind of answers Brian Carstair's Twitter question. He wants to know if you regret flipping the pencil in the air, which is actually a pen, or has it worked out for the best?

Yeah, no, and I would never say I regret anything that I did on the air, live, because if you're going to second guess stuff that you do in that situation, you'll drive yourself crazy. You have to realize that you're there, the microphone is on, the cameras are on, everything's hot. phone is on, the cameras are on, everything's hot. You say what you say. Obviously, I would hope I never swear. But if that happened, I would be entirely at fault. And, you know, I wouldn't blame anybody else. I think I'm responsible for everything I do. And no, I don't regret for a minute what I did because I was being myself. I was reacting to the very frustration that I had that I knew or sensed that the viewers would have too, especially because we'd all had it, those who were watching the curling

earlier in the day. And if this had been the only example of that on that day, maybe I wouldn't have reacted quite the same. But I reacted the way I reacted, and you can't take it back. I dropped my iPhone on the floor, a brand new one the other day, and it didn't have a case on it yet to protect it.

And boy, I swore that day, but that was entirely my fault, and what are you going to do? Tor Habsfan, sounds like an oxymoron, but it's not. TorHabsfan on Twitter asks, are you surprised that people still talk about the pen flip and that to many it's one of the great moments in sports broadcasting?

I don't know that it's that. I wouldn't thank you, but I don't really think it qualifies as far as that goes. I mean, it's a moment that proves that live television can produce almost anything of an unexpected variety. And that's why I love, love, love, love anything I do. It needs to be live if at all possible. So the reporters on TSN at times needs to be taped So the reporters on TSN at times needs to be taped just for logistical purposes and in the studio scheduling purposes. But I'm always fighting to be live because you're better that way.

The show has a greater energy. And you can react at a moment's notice to some news that might be breaking in the middle of the show. So I'm always wanting to be live and I'll never, uh, I'll never, um, regret anything that happens to me, uh, that happens live. It's, I've had lights go out in the studio. What do you do then? Well, you know, you go to commercial or you make a joke that the world's ending and I'm right where I'd want to be

if that's happening, sitting in a TV studio. You've got to think on your feet and live television makes you and helps you do that. Last question on this topic. As you mentioned, right away you're scooped up by Canwest Global to host their NHL coverage. So before we get to that, Richard just wants to know if you kept the pen that you flipped.

But I'm going to say no, you didn't keep that pen. Well, no, there's an interesting story to that. I was asked on the plane back to Vancouver the next day by people who had seen it, do you still have the pen? And I said, yes. And they said, could we have it? And I said, maybe I should hold on to it. I didn't have any real value. I've had to think on my feet and say, do I want to keep it or do I not? And a gentleman from a hotel chain in Vancouver,

in Vancouver, based in Vancouver, said we could auction that pen for charity. And I said, that sounds to me like an interesting idea. So the pen wound up in the Pan Pacific Hotel's possession. They auctioned it at charity, and the bidder donated it back to the hotel where it could be framed and shown in the lobby. I'm sure it's not there now, but for a while it had its place of prominence where the people could see it and read a small inscription, and I thought, yeah, why shouldn't, why shouldn't the pen get its own dose of fame? Four witnesses to an indelible moment in Canadian broadcasting history,

each with a slightly different retelling. Specifics aside, it gave us Ron McLean as host of Hockey Night in Canada. It led us to Dave Hodge's tenure at TSN and The Reporters. And it gave us all a where were you when it happened moment to reflect on nearly

35 years later. Another individual who was there but declined my invitation to appear on Toronto Mic'd is John Shannon. I wanted John Shannon's account so badly, I offered to Zoom with him

and only speak about this fateful night in 1987. Unfortunately, John declined. As a fun postscript to this, Dave recently joined me on episode 954 of Toronto Mic'd to share his top 100 songs of 2021. I told Dave about this upcoming micumentary to see how he felt about more pen flip talk. Here's what Dave had to say. how he felt about more pen flip talk.

Here's what Dave had to say. There's a new Mikeumentary coming very soon that's all about the pen flip. And I'm curious, what is your reaction? How do you feel about the next Mikeumentary topic being the subject of the pen flip, which, by the way, turns 35 years old early next year? It's not something that is the first thing that I like to talk about, but it's not something that I won't talk about.

I realize that people are interested in the incident and what led up to it, my reaction at the time, my reaction since. So I'm not going to sit here and protest the fact that you want to develop more detail, and I'm anxious to hear people's reaction to it then and now and to check and make sure the detail is correct because almost step by step I can relive that night and other people too from various perspectives. So yeah, go ahead and make it interesting for me and for anyone else that might want to hear more about it. The first thing you got right that a lot of people get wrong about this is that it was indeed a pen and not a pencil. I keep hearing from people who talk about

that time you tossed the pencil. And right off the bat, I have to say, well, a correction is needed. It was a pen, not a pencil. Okay. So we get that straight. But as I say, I didn't have to correct you because you've always referred to it as a pen, but just realize that a lot of people talk about a pencil. Hear that, Ken? It was a pen, not a pencil. And that brings us to the end of our 960th show. You can follow me on Twitter.

I'm at Toronto Mike. I want to give a huge thank you to the tremendous supporters that make these Mikeumentaries possible. Our friends at Great Lakes Brewery. You can follow them on Twitter at Great Lakes Beer. Delicious, fresh craft beer from a fiercely independent local craft brewery. Chef Drop.

They're on Twitter at GetChefDrop. Go to chefdrop.ca now and save $50 with the promo code FOTM50. Moneris is at Moneris on Twitter. And Moneris brings us the inspiring podcast, Yes We Are Open, hosted by FOTM El Grego. Subscribe at yesweareopenpodcast.com. Speaking of inspiring podcasts, you can follow McKay CEO Forums at McKayCEOForums, at McKayCEOForums on Twitter. And I urge you to listen to and subscribe to their podcast, The CEO Edge. I post new episodes on TorontoMic.com every week. PalmaPasta are on Twitter, at PalmaPasta.

I know who's catering my holiday party. Go to PalmaPasta.com know who's catering my holiday party. Go to palmapasta.com. StickerU.com. They're at StickerU on Twitter. Ridley Funeral Home. They're at RidleyFH. See you all next week. The day is coming up, rosy and gray. Yeah, the wind is cold with the smell of snow. next week. I've been told that there's a sucker born every day.

But I wonder who. Yeah, I wonder who. Maybe the one who doesn't realize there's a thousand shades of gray. Because I know that's true. Yes, I do. I know that's true Yes I do I know it's true Yeah I know it's true

How about you? While they're picking up trash And they're putting down rogues And they're brokering stocks The class struggle explodes And I'll play this guitar just the best that I can Maybe I'm not and maybe I am But who gives a damn?

Because everything is coming up rosy and gray Yeah, the wind is cold But the smell of snow Warms me today And your smile is fine And it's just like mine And it won't go away Cause everything is Rosie and Gray

Well, I've kissed you in France And I've kissed you in Spain And I've kissed you in France and I've kissed you in Spain And I've kissed you in places I better not name And I've seen the sun go down on Chaclacour But I like it much better going down on you Yeah, you know that's true Because everything is coming up rosy and green. Yeah, the wind is cold, but the smell of snow warms us today. And your

smile is fine and it's just like mine and it won't go away away Cause everything is rosy now Everything is rosy Yeah, everything is rosy and great Thank you.