Toronto Mike'd: The Official Toronto Mike Podcast - Tom Wilson: Toronto Mike'd #989

Episode Date: January 27, 2022

In this episode of Toronto Mike'd, Mike catches up with Tom Wilson. There's Junkhouse talk, an update on his journey of discovery as a proud Mohawk man, a passage from his new book and so much more. Toronto Mike'd is proudly brought to you by Great Lakes Brewery, Palma Pasta, Canna Cabana, StickerYou, Ridley Funeral Home and Patrons like you.

Welcome to episode 989 of Toronto Mic'd. Proudly brought to you by Great Lakes Brewery. A fiercely independent craft brewery who believes in supporting communities, good times and brewing amazing beer. Order online for free local home delivery in the GTA. StickerU.com. Create custom stickers, labels, tattoos, and decals for your home and your business. Palma Pasta.

Enjoy the taste of fresh homemade Italian pasta and entrees from Palma Pasta in Mississauga and Oakville. Redley Funeral Home. Pillars of the community since 1921. And Canna Cabanaana the lowest prices on cannabis guaranteed over 100 stores across the country learn more at canna cabana.com joining me this week making his triumphant return is the man sometimes known as Lee Harvey Osmond, but I call him Tom.

Tom Wilson. How you doing, Tom? The music, Mike. It's sexy. You know what? Talk to me. That music makes me feel like loosening my bra.

When you say that, now I'm thinking of Bruce Springsteen's tits. Oh, did I tell you that story before? That story is like just one of the epic stories in Toronto Mike Tisseries. I've been practicing something, so I'm ready. Ready, Tom? Yeah.

Skenakowa Ken. Hey, that's pretty good. I've been practicing. You know what? Better than me. Jeez. How are you doing, man? I love that line you dropped last time you were here. You said you thought you were a big sweaty Irishman,

and it turns out you're a big sweaty Mohawk man. Yeah, well, still not a sweaty Irish guy. Still a big Mohawk guy. And still a sweaty. But working on being less puffy, though, though mike let me take a look at you here let me let me drink you in you look amazing you're how old are you 62 and you're not dying your beard and stuff oh come on fuck mike yes i dye my beard what are you talking about i don't dye it that much because I don't have anywhere to go. So there is this, basically, I'm fed up with hair. Now, I am Mohawk.

I am indigenous. So I absolutely have no hair on my, well, I have a little bit of hair in my body, you know, in some of the spots. But, you know, for the most part, I have no hair on my body. I'm nice and smooth like a uh baby and that's a great image uh i had i had no idea about the hair thing but uh i've been you know following your journey and last time you were over you had you even you even read i know you brought your book you read a gourd downies uh book from beautiful scars yeah and you're in our so much so much ground to

cover but i'm going to start with like some listener questions because i'm going to just start by talking about hamilton yeah hebsey ever heard of this mark hebbshire fellow love mark hebbshire what a wonderful guy and uh somebody i used to watch on i think it was sports line or sports net sports line sports line yeah yeah he's great although he's also on sports net but he's mainly you know him probably alongside Jim Taddy on Global Sports. Yeah, man, they had a great show going. Ask me who Mark Hebbshire's current co-host is.

Is it you? It's me. Oh, yes, of course. Yes, well. You got to tune in. You got to tune in. You got to come on Hebbsy on Sports one day. Okay.

Hebbsy on Sports, by the way, Friday at 9 a.m. Hebbsy gives me a quarter every time I tell people that. But I want to read Hebsey's note. He says, you can walk down just about any street in Hamilton, and there's a pretty good chance you'll run into Tom Wilson. Or someone that looks like Tom Wilson, yeah. And then he goes, ask him if he'd consider running for mayor. I would not.

I would not. Let me turn off my phone. Does this person know that I have the great Tom Wilson returning to the program? Here, I'm not. I would not. Let me turn off my phone. Who does this person know that I have the great Tom Wilson returning to the program? So why, why is that out of the question for you? Cause I think Hamilton could use your leadership. Well, it could definitely use leadership. Let's start with that. If it's me, uh, you know, uh, I don't know if it should be me, you know? Um, in fact, it shouldn't be me. I mean i'm completely add i mean my job my job i guess as an artist is to uh is to fill in the blanks that you know politics and uh consumerism and uh

religion seem to miss you know so that's that's where i sit and that's where i'll remain to sit and i and i'm not hypercritical of of. I mean, honest to God, politicians really should be considered like the in-laws. You know what I mean? The politicians are the guy that your daughter marries that you never liked anyway, right? So, I mean, you know that you're going to have to get together with them at least two or three times a year. And they just might end up, you know, producing grandchildren for you. So you know what, politicians, I don't want to be the in-law. I want to be the person you want over to your house. I don't want to be the mayor. Nobody wants the

mayor of Hamilton in their house. Good Lord. In fact, you know what, the mayor of Hamilton, the present mayor of Hamilton, once, this is a a true story so Fred Eisenberger who I I didn't pay attention to city politics but it's during the time when um uh Canadian Idol's going on right right and there's a young fella from Hamilton who's on Canadian Idol and CTV gets a hold of me and says listen will you come down he's in the finals would you come down and be in the audience we're going to give you a shot on camera we want you to say a few words and i said yeah yeah sure that sounds fine he said well you know what the mayor of hamilton's coming down uh two i said well that sounds great i've never met him before uh i hear that he's a nice man

so anyways the day comes and it's four in the afternoon we got to be there for the shoot the filming of the tv show and uh this guy knocks on my door yeah and i answered the door and i said hey man come on in listen i'm sorry i'm running behind uh i just got to do this and that and then the phone rings and now the guy is still standing in my front hallway right i said hey hey listen listen um i just gotta i just gotta take this call i'm not gonna be listen let me take the call so i take the call 20 minutes later i come out from the phone call the guy is still standing in my front i haven't offered him a cup of tea or even like a piece of cheese you know and a slice of lasagna i haven't offered him anything i've just left him

hanging in my front hall now for 45 minutes. And I said, listen, I don't know what I, I said, I'm so sorry. Would you just please? I said, I'm going to tip you at the end of the day anyways. Listen, but we go out and tell the mayor how sorry I am for, for, for holding him up on the car. And he said, I am the mayor. Yeah. That's a good story. and he said, I am the mayor. Yeah, so I really shouldn't be,

I shouldn't get anywhere near politics. You know, I say things once in a while, you know, I mean, recently the city of Hamilton decided to close up all their heat vents, all the heat that comes out from the building. You know what, I was going to ask you about that because I saw that photo. Then I was thinking of the jam,

the cover of the Murray McLachlan song that you recorded. It's not a cover, god damn it. Okay, tell me. That's not a cover. I thought that was a Murray McLachlan song. He covered you? We wrote it together. Honestly, my mind's blowing. I need the real deal here.

People, we're talking about a burned out car. Actually, here, let me just play a bit of it and ask you about this, because I've loved it forever, and then I just thought... Thank you, Mike. Let's just drink it in for a moment here. Yeah, more distortion. More distortion.

Live out of a suitcase in the back, washing the restrooms at the shell. Get my meals in the Taco Bell, eating parking lots from a paper sack. Parking lots from a paper sack Duck out of the windows and out of sight The cops come by and shine their light The dealers are fighting in the night I hug my sleeping bag real tight.

I live in a car that doesn't go nowhere. It's one small step to a shopping cart in a twilight world That has no heart I'll watch the sun go down From a burned-out car Tom, I told you this last time you visited, but was that juxtaposition,

the contrast of your voice and Sarah McLachlan's is gorgeous. Oh, thanks. Just gorgeous. Okay, so set the record straight because there's a Murray McLachlan version of this jam. And for some reason, I figured he did it first and you covered him. But give us the real deal here. What's the real talk? Well, Murray, I've been a fan of Murray's.

Murray McLachlan is somebody that is is well, as I say about artists that inspire me, he opened up the door of possibilities to me when I was still figuring out my arse and hole in the ground and trying to figure out which was which. And he I loved him, man.

And I still love Murray. He was here recently, fairly recently. He's been on the show. I mean, the guy wrote down by the Henry Moore, you know, probably the greatest tribute to Toronto and that era of Toronto that has ever been written, you know. So we became friends, and I mean, at the time, Junk House was, you know,

doing really well, and we figured we'd write some songs together, and we got together and went to his house, and we wrote this song. And after that that i was still drinking at the time and i said hey man let's uh let's have a couple drinks and he didn't have anything to drink at his house except for his giant bottle of i think creme de menthe or absinthe or something i don't remember what it was right and uh we drank the whole thing and then i passed out in his backyard and um and i woke up the next morning and went home and that was that was really the

end of the story at his time i think his wife uh denise donlin was the head of much music right at the time and um so that was that was uh that was writing the song and then uh second junk house record was coming around the pike called Birthday Boy. And I thought that I would use the platform of having gold records and all that stuff to be able to make a statement. At the time, Jack Layton was standing up for homelessness in Toronto and people who were living in the street. Now, you've got to remember back then, Toronto Mike, back then you could drive into Toronto. It was the first indication that North America was starting to crumble.

I mean, if you want to find out the state of our country, look into the eyes of the person that is coming up to the side of your car looking for money. That's going to tell you exactly where things are. And if you think that you're above that, just remember that you are just one trip away from being in the same position. And if they're coming for that guy or that gal who's living in a tent under the gardener, you got to know that they're coming for you too. So Jack Layton was making that statement. People were becoming aware of it. I was getting off on Spadina Avenue. And for the first time in my life, there was people coming up to my car, squeegee kids, and there was people looking for

money. And there was desperation. Just the tip of the iceberg of desperation was beginning in my awareness. So I thought burned car would be uh the way to go would be a subject and and and i thought i would use junk house to be able to help promote the idea that uh we have to support uh people who are less fortunate than us in our country and what's hamilton doing i saw the photos on your uh twitter stream and it i i got very angry like yeah i mean it does make you angry you know it's like you know i don't know who to be angry with really i mean it's like i can't i can't really you know i'm not one of the people that attack mayors and and etc just for the sake

of doing it but uh the city of hamilton city hall in fact who like a lot of cities in Canada, have been tearing down tent cities and have people who are already lost in this world. Right. The city of Hamilton wanted them to just get lost, wanted them to get further lost. And I didn't like that either. But then it was hot air vents in Hamilton City Hall blocked to keep homeless away. Can you imagine? And that was negative 12, and it's going to be negative 21 on Saturday.

And all I said was Hamilton City Hall show an incredible lack of humanity again. It's a boorish group of old men representing an archaic system, which I actually do believe in. So am I going to be the mayor of Hamilton? No, nobody will vote for me to be the mayor of Hamilton. Well, that's not true. Well, they will vote for me, but you know, you got to be careful what you ask for, Toronto Mike.

Well, I'm not even done with the Hamilton questions because Brian Bradley, who writes for The Star, and he's also an FOTM. Hello, Brian. He actually recorded something nice for the 1,000th episode. Maybe after this I'll make you, I'll force you to record something. I would love to. Brian Bradley says, I'd like to

hear him talk more about the places for artists in Hamilton in the 1970s. Art galleries, coffee shops, a pizza place. The Lunch Bucket City had all this culture and no one was paying attention. That's Brian Bradley.

Hamilton is a microcosm of Canada in that if it comes from your hometown, if it comes from the street you grew up on, then it actually can't be any good. Canada has that attitude about its artists and writers and actors, visual artists, musicians, you know, that if it's from, I mean, it was traditionally this kind of being under the thumb

of the British Empire, you know, that we aren't good enough, that what we produce isn't good enough. It has to come from the UK. It has to come from, you know, the Queen's tit in order for it to be, uh, in order for it to be any good. So, um, there was a guy named Bill Powell in Hamilton. Who am I talking to? Brian Bradley. Brian Bradley. Yes, I know. I know Brian Bradley's name for sure. Uh, Brian, there was a guy named Bill Powell in Hamilton who was, uh, who taught me at an early age to be, you've got to be 75% artist and 75% carny to be able to exist in this world as an artist. Does that math work?

I'm working it out in my head. 75-25? Oh, I thought you said 75-75. Jesus, that sounds like my kind. Back in the day, I would have called that my kind of drug deal, Mike. But sorry, forget my math here. So Bill Powell started a place called the Night 2 Coffee House where Murray McLachlan played, Joni Mitchell played, Stan Rogers,

Woody P. Bennett, all these great, great songwriters. And downstairs was an art gallery. And then he started a thing called the Festival of Friends, which I believe is still going to this day. But he believed that art could make a change in our society for the better. It's something that I still believe. And even though Bill and I, Bill passed away about six years ago, but Bill and I, we kind of went at it we we fought

quite a bit over the years he was a guy that he was also acted as an agent for a bunch of us and he'd call you up and say uh tom i had a 25 gig i said great i was like 17 16 17 i said great where do i have to go he goes you got to go to the hph the hamilton psychiatric hospital he says it's okay you got to you got to go up, you're going to be doing a gig, you've got to bring your own PA. You're playing for the violent offenders up there. And as a 16-, 17-year-old kid, I would bring a trainer PA, and I would go through all these locked doors and security

at the Hamilton Psychiatric Hospital, and I'd play the gig. And I started to play the gig, it was like twice twice a month I was going up there and doing that and I started to make friends with a bunch of a bunch of the people that were up there doing doing their time in the psychiatric hospital um and he'd also call it up and say hey Tom I got you a gig he said Upper James Street uh there's a Burger King opening up. I said, okay. He said, you're going to play the grand opening. I said, okay, sounds good. And he says, okay, you've got to bring your own PA. I said, okay.

He says, and bring a ladder, too. I said, bring a ladder. He goes, yeah, yeah, yeah, you'll find out when you get there. I get to the Burger King. It's the grand opening of Burger King on Upper James, and sure enough, the manager comes out. He goes, okay. He says, we've got power running up to the roof.

He said, you've got to get up on the roof, and you're going to play from up there. Like the Beatles. And it was like the middle of August, right? It's like absolutely scorching heat. Right. And I had to carry a PA up a ladder and set it up and perform up there. I think it might have been for, let me see, about $25. And he also had a gig at the African Lion Safari.

Right. Which was, I played there. It was at the cafeteria. They had like a VersaFood cafeteria there. Okay. And outside they had a little patio and there was a Ferris wheel that went around and you would sit there.

You'd go show up at noon and you'd finish at six o' that went around and you would sit there you'd go show up at noon and you'd finish at six o'clock at night and you'd sit out in the sun and you'd start a song so it'd be like something sensitive like i could really love you and then all of a sudden the ferris wheel would start and you'd have to stop the song and then you know you'd have to weigh out the song and the people be eating their versa food hamburgers and then ferris wheel whatever it is would stop and they have i could read and then you know something else would go off so it was like it was six hours a day it was six days a week and it paid six hundred dollars in 1976 tor Mike. That was a truckload of money for a 16, 17-year-old kid.

Wow. Okay, so far there's been a number of mind blows already, one of which is that you dye in your beard, which kind of breaks my heart a little bit. But also that you have the same brand of gum that I do. I swear by the five gum because the flavor lasts. You, me, and Colin James. Colin James is an FOTM.

I love that guy. Yeah, yeah, yeah. He's a triple sticker too. It's like one stick. Oh, I do too. I do too. I do too. And you know what?

Sometimes when I feel like I can't play guitar like Colin James, but I want to feel like Colin James, I used to put the extra stick in. So how well do you know Colin? Really well. Really well. Really well. We've been writing songs since 1996. We met at the Q107 Toronto Rock Awards back in the day.

And Junkhouse was playing and he was playing and he came into our dressing room. And Dan Aiken, the late Dan Aiken from Junkhouse was, he was, he's from Regina, and he knew Colin. And Colin had heard Out of My Head on the radio, and he said to me, he says, man, he says, that sounds like if Howlin' Wolf, yeah, that's it. If Howlin' Wolf put a rock and roll band behind him and released a record today,

you would be Howlin' Wolf. And I never thought about that, but I guess that vocal's kind of like, you know, listen to that, vocals. It's a little bit of Howlin' Wolf, Toronto Mike. Smokestack Latin. Here, I'm going to take this opportunity to ask you something I've been wondering about which is

I'm a big Junkhouse fan you know this straight up legit will still spin a bunch of Junkhouse and I was also a big 102.1 The Edge listener and I couldn't help but notice that they didn't really embrace you

I didn't sense any love from CFNY for Junk House. Oh, fuck CFNY, man. Fuck them then and fuck them now. CFNY wouldn't play any of our records because we didn't have the right haircuts or the groovy foreheads

and we didn't hang around on Queen Street West waiting to be discovered instead of making art. We were actually busy doing it. So, yeah, I still say fuck CFNY. Actually, they gave us play on Shine, and that became a big hit. But, you see, and that was back in the day, you know, when my friends were, I was 33 years old when Junkhouse put out that record, maybe 34. I was already an elder, man.

I had already apprenticed since the time I was like 15 years old. I had done my time. I wasn't 21 years old time I was like 15 years old. I had done my time. I wasn't 21 years old. I wasn't 20 years old. My friends in Sloan, you know, they were younger. You know what I mean? My friends in Trouble Charger, they were younger. You know what I mean?

I was supporting a family. So when CFNY didn't play my records, it meant that it was hurting my income, right? So that's, and I'm a hamilton guy i'm a knucklehead right so uh my my feelings weren't hurt as much as uh i knew that i was losing money fuck them like it seemed to me at the time because if you know uh q107 you mentioned fine great awesome great station they supported you but and much music played the i got a lot of my junk house fill for much music but CFNY, it was like they deemed you too rock maybe

maybe you were too Nah, we were from Hamilton, come on Okay, alright but I'm naturally, let me tell you a little background here, which is I have a sub-series of this podcast called, what do we call it PPMM, what does that stand for? Progressive Past of Modern Melodies, where Brother Bill from the aforementioned 102.1 The Edge

and my buddy Cam Gordon, we just dive deep into like musical, really deep, really deep into some kind of Canadian musical arena. And we did a whole episode with Ivor Hamilton. Yeah. About how did The Edge decide what they were going to play and what they weren't going to play?

And is it possible they figured you're a Q band, so we'll leave that for Q, because it's a little more straight-ahead rock. I'm just trying to figure out why the hell. You're telling me it's because you're from Hamilton? No, you know what? Actually, I just said that because it sounded good. Listen, you know, there's no excuses.

I don't care if your competitor was playing us. I mean, it didn't matter to me. We went to, when we delivered Out of My Head to CFNY, I went with the record company, the record rep went in, and the guy handed him the new Junkhouse single, which was Out of My Head. And he said, he held it. I remember him holding it in his head yeah and he said uh he held it i remember him held holding it in his hand and he said do you remember who it was no i don't remember he said

hey remember uh he's holding in his hand he says to me uh he says to the record rep goes hey yeah uh when when you bringing me the new ren and stimpy record so um they went out to talk about something uh they went down the hall they left me in the office alone so i went out to talk about something. They went down the hall. They left me in the office alone, so I went behind the guy's couch and pissed on the carpet behind his couch just because I thought, you know what? And I left.

Actually, I think I left after that, but that's the kind of thing that I was dealing with. It wasn't a mentality that I wanted to really associate with. You mentioned, though, they played Shine, is that right? Yeah, they played the heck out of Shine. Thank you CFNY, you're a great station. I really appreciate it. I unfuck you, okay?

Can you just come over like every week and we'll just spin like Tom Wilson jams? Alright, we're going to run out sooner or later i gotta stop playing the same fucking songs over and over again but i do i do have a new one i'm gonna play later lee harvey osmond and how do you decide like like like when you record a song it's it's not tom wilson it's lee harvey osmond can you explain that for like uh the amateurs out there trying to figure out who's this lee harvey osmond guy and you're talking to tom wilson well

lee harvey osmond came about it was gonna be I wanted to do something different I'll tell you I'll be quite honest with you Lee Harvey Osmond was formed because we had a Blackie and the Rodeo King tour and Colin Linden got uh the job uh playing guitar for Bob Dylan and he called me up and he says he says I'm so perplexed, Tom. I said, well, what is it? He said, well, we have this tour coming up, but I got the phone call I've been waiting for since I was 14 years old. I said, what's that? He says, well, Bob Dylan called and asked me to join his band. He said, what should I do?

I said, join Bob Dylan's band right now. Right now, because you know what? Who knows how long it's going to last, and it's going to be something that you will cherish for all of your life. And that left me out of work with nothing to do. I had become friends through a project with a guy, a fellow named Mike Timmons from the Cowboy Junkies. Of course.

And there's a few records that really shaped, the beginning of Junk House was shaped by this idea that doesn't come across with the records that you're going to hear by Junk House. But Cowboy Junkies, Trinity Sessions, Miles Davis, Kind of Blue, Muddy Waters, Folk Singer. Three records that shaped the early Junk House music. It got changed, of course, once we signed to Columbia and Sony, and we turned into more of a rock band. But before that, we are all about tones and about serving the song. And that was what we wanted to do. So I got together with Mike, and we started making this first Lee Harvey Osmond record. And it was exactly what I wanted to do. I wanted to work with Mike Timmons since I dropped the needle on the Trinity Sessions.

So that really was picking up where I wanted to be in 1990 before I formed Junkos. Alright, we're going to bounce around here. We are. You know what? I just called my doctor because I decided at 62 I got to get myself some ADD medication. And I'm wondering, are you on ADD medication? Or should you be on ADD medication? It's funny you're saying this. My wife thinks I should be.

I'm surprised I'm even talking about this, but I have no problem talking to the great Tom Wilson about anything. But I don't think I need any medication. I think I just have a lot of energy, and I feel like there are these tangents and I'll go, but I always remember to come back. Like, I feel like I'm good. I don't know, man.

I've done this a thousand episodes and I think it's working out. How old are you, Mike? 47. Okay, you will forget to come back one day. And then you're going to, like me, you will completely forget. Isn't it just like, I don't know,

maybe you know the same deal, but like just the synapses are going and sometimes they want to go there and you're like, what the fuck? I'll go there. This isn't CBC. Like I can go there and I come back. The whole joy of Toronto Mike is I can do that. Well, yeah, you have the freedom of expression and it's a creative, you know, this is a creative movement. Yeah, for sure.

Yeah, I have the same problem. I'm really suffering. And I think that partly it's because of COVID. And I mean, it's funny because, you know what, the thing about COVID is that people are starting to discover things about themselves that they've been keeping down for years. You know what I mean? We've been able to manage guys like you and me, Mike, because we're able to bounce around. We're able to do different things. Guys like you and me, Mike, because we're able to bounce around.

We're able to do different things. And now with COVID, we're kind of limited. And we're actually discovering things that we didn't know about ourselves. This is all fascinating to me. Are you at all like this? Okay, so every day, I got to go for a bike ride. Almost like my medicine for the day. So today, it's minus. I mean, Humble and Fred, I produced Humble and Fred show,

and I was on with them this morning. I like those guys. Those are great guys. Would you do a Zoom hit on Humble and Fred, I produced Humble and Fred show and I was on with them this morning. I like those guys. Those are great guys. Would you do a Zoom hit on Humble and Fred one morning? Sure. Why can't I just come in? Oh, because they aren't doing that right now. You know that Humble and Fred, you know what Humble and Fred,

now we're really ADDing. Humble and Fred, the first time Blackie and the Rodeo Kings played Massey Hall, the morning of the Massey Hall show, they said, well, you got to go do this Humble and Fred show. And it's like, well, listen, this is a big day. We've never played Massey Hall like this. We've got to sound check and the crew's loading in,

and we actually want to experience Massey Hall being ours for every second of the day that we can. They said, well, you've got to go do this Humble and Fred show. It's like, okay, we'll go. We get in the car. It's out here. We came out here to Etobicoke somewhere you've got to go do this Humble and Fred show. It's like, okay, we'll go. We get in the car. It's out here. We came out here to Etobicoke somewhere, right? We're out doing Humble and Fred at the time. And they have us in, and they're really great guys,

and I've been listening to them, you know, hearing them on the airwaves for years. And sure enough, they said, hey, that was great. Thanks a lot. Everyone's just going to be playing. It's going to be airing. It's going to be airing later this afternoon. I said, that's great because we got our show tonight at Massey Hall.

We leave. And then we get a call from the publicist about four hours later saying that Humble and Fred forgot to record the interview. Oh, my God. Okay, so. You were not on the scene at that time. No, no, no, no. I was not the producer at that time.

So even though, even though. Listen, in my. Wow. My instincts are that I should really hate Humble and Fred. I love Humble and Fred. Well, it's funny because earlier in this episode, you said fuck CFNY. Now I unfucked them.

You unfucked them. I unfucked. You shined. Because Humble and Fred, of course, were morning show on CFNY throughout the 90s. But that's a fascinating story because yeah, they were on 30th Street. That's right, yeah.

Yeah, and there was a shooting in the building, which is sad, unfortunately, but there was a shooting in the building uh which is not which is sad unfortunately but there was a shooting in that building like a week ago i want to say a couple of people shot in that building on 30th i know so that's not good uh but uh back to humble and fred uh that's amazing because i'm sure that's one of those things that it's never happened to me yet but like you only do that once right there's only that one time where you forget to record it like after you know what i mean like i'm i'm staring at squiggly fucking lines right now and i have a backup just in case just to make sure that this gold gets captured but we'll get you back it'll have to be zoom until this pandemic okay very well very well

with toronto but we're gonna make that happen uh okay again so much great i love it i love the humble and fred tangent we're coming back here because Mal Furious wants to know, what's your favorite hangout spot? And maybe during the pandemic, it's kind of dampened at all. But what's your favorite hangout spot in Hamilton? But he says, be it for scenery, grub. And then he says something that I know you don't partake in, but he says, or beers.

But I know you're not drinking any beer these days. No, 23 years. Good for you. Yeah, I like watching other people drink. Notice I took it off the table. Like, I just didn't think it's appropriate. Oh, that's okay, Toronto Mike. You put the lasagna on the table, and I'm like 30 pounds overweight.

You know what I mean? Yeah, but you're a tall guy. How tall are you? I'm getting shorter. I'm getting older and shorter. I'm 62, and I'm 6'2". Oh, that's perfect. Stay like this.

Look at these delicious beers. Come on. You know what? I don't think it's appropriate. Come on, Mike. Here Oh, that's perfect. Stay like this. Look at these delicious beers. Come on. You know what? I don't think it's appropriate. Come on, Mike. Here's, look at this Great Lakes lager. I'm going to knock 23 years right out of the park. Don't even think about it.

I would punch you in the face. I know. Please don't. I'd knock you out. But yeah. Well, I will thank them. And again, you're not getting any because that's how much I care about you. So you ride your bike every day.

Oh, yeah. Every day. And today, cold day. Oh, yeah. That's where I was going with that. Humble and Fred Tangent. We're coming back here now. Fred's like, when I told him I was going to go, I had the fastest man in the world was

here today. Not Usain Bolt. What? But he was the fastest man in the world. Donovan Bailey was sitting in that chair earlier today. No kidding. Wow. You're not even the most famous guy to visit me today.

I don't feel like, you know, how could I possibly be, Mike? If I'm the most famous person that visited you today, then you got some serious problems, my friend. All right. So I was just talking about how between Donovan Bailey and Tom Wilson, I said I was going to do this ride. And it's, I did.

There's bikes around you, but I did this hard ride in the cold. And if I don't do the ride it kind of fucks up my whole program like i have to go hard do this ride and then go hard and i can do a million fucking things well and it's firing all these synapses are going and i'm rocking and i'm rolling and uh it's all like this this recipe it's it's it has to be done i'm the same way i walk my dog i got a dog uh during. What kind of dog? I got Lucy. She's part Australian Shepherd, part Border Collie, and Shepherd.

Shepherd coloring. So she's got Shepherd in her, too. Smartest dog I've ever owned. She's wonderful. I take her out to the big Ancaster Dog Park outside of Hamilton, out by the Silver City and the big box mall there. They have this great big area you can take. Anyways, I walk hard.

I get out there, and I walk hard, and I try to get about 6 000 steps in wow in the morning which isn't that much but it's okay sounds like a lot but uh when i if i don't do that then i can't calm my brain to be able to sit and write this book or to write songs or to paint or to come and talk to you and you do you're you're you're solving the world's problems on these walks, right? Oh my God, Mike. You and I had the greatest interview this morning at the Ancaster dog park. I can't even believe how fantastic we were. Award-winning work. Thank you, Mike.

So much ground to cover. In fact, this helps answer that Malfurious question because it sounds like that park you take, this Ancaster park you're describing, that might be a hangout spot for scenery. I don't know. This is the Malfurious question. He wants to know what your hangout spot is.

Okay, so you know what? The place I go to, and it's because it has delicious food. They don't overfeed you. I hate the word tapas. I don't know what it is. It bugs me about that word. But it's a bigger portion than a tapa. When you say the word tapa, Mike,

when you say, let's go out for tapas, you don't say that to your wife. You say, honey, why don't we go out for some tapas? So they serve to 2 o'clock in the morning. They're in an old Portuguese restaurant that still has the old model of a wooden ship hanging out in front of the place. It's like, you know place look it's like you know you know like in those uh you know a pinocchio or something when the cobbler's boot is out in front and it's it's got a great atmosphere uh nobody bugs the shit out of you and uh the food is

wonderful and they served it too so my my wife and i like to go there like any time of night man so are you married well because you said wife. I'm engaged. Okay. I'm engaged, I guess, which is like so embarrassing because I mean, I think I should be collecting old age pension now. And to say you're engaged when you're like,

you know, a senior. That's okay. Like, you know. I just say I'm married because we've been together for seven years and I love her. And you live together? For seven years, yeah. Well yeah well that's a that's a common law marriage so I think that you can see your marriage now you can say whatever you want actually but uh good for you is this

so there's a like please remind me there's somebody in your uh family circle that is a diehard FOTM like can we get into that for a moment, just so I can capture this detail? Well, let's just call my brother-in-law, okay? Andrew Burnell, he was supposed to come here. I said, listen, man, you gotta, you know, he says, when you come to do, when you go to True Toronto Mike again, please bring me. He says, I'm Toronto Mike's biggest

fan. I love Toronto Mike. Wow. His name's Andrew? Andrew Burnell. Andrew Burnell. Andrew Burnell. He'll be listening. He'll be hearing this. And I said, you've got to come. You can sit down in Toronto Mike's basement right between the laundry and the freezer full of lasagna and beer. I said, it'll be great. So he loves your show and loves you.

I like this guy. And, I mean, this is a guy that, you know, I mean, I started bringing him around. You know, when I'm doing things, events in Toronto, my wife and I, he comes along with us. He's a great guy. And he's the first guy to get drunk backstage. And you'll see him, you know, he'll be cornering Alex Lifeson, you know, or, you know, Gord Sinclair from the Tragically Hip or somebody. But he loves being on the scene.

And Feist introduced my friend Leslie, introduced herself to him. So, you know, I mean, he's a great guy to have around because I think he really digs the backstage scene in that way. And so, but you are on another level, Toronto Mike. Wow. Leslie Feist, Alex Lifeson, the tragically hip, they're all down there Toronto Mike. Wow. Leslie Feist, Alex Lifeson, the tragically hip,

they're all down there Mike. But you, you're up there. Keep talking. So just, now let's just quickly tell the listeners that it's not your first visit. You visited,

I finally dug up what day this was. So we did this on November 15th, 2018. So way back. Oh yeah, okay. That was when the book came out. Yeah, because you know what?

I remember I was better dressed than I was today because I had to go do something at Core Entertainment. I had to do a TV show. So I had to like, I remember you. At Chorus at the Queen's Key there? Yeah, yeah, yeah. I had to do whatever. I don't even know what I was doing,

but I was doing a TV show there, and I kind of had my author outfit on. No, you looked good. I'm looking now in the picture we took. I had a hat and a scarf and a decent coat. And you're holding that lasagna tight. You're just grasping it. Don't mess with the lasagna.

Okay, well, let me officially make it official that Palma Pasta sent over a large lasagna, frozen lasagna that you're taking back to Hamilton with your thumb. The last one was amazing. Yeah, I was telling, that's a family-run business, so I was talking to Anthony Petrucci, whose family owns Palma Pasta, and I was telling him that you love that lasagna. I mean, you're not alone.

A lot of people love Palma Pasta. Yeah, it's so good. And does your brother-in-law get any of the lasagna? I told him if he showed up, he probably would. Alright. You know, just as, you know, take care of him. He's a good effluenteer. You know what he gets now? What? Nothing. So here's what I wrote, by the way. That was

episode 399. So go back to 399, hear the origin story, and then I gotta ask you for a health update, because you revealed something to me when you visited. But I wrote at the time mike chats with tom wilson about his musical career in junk house blackie and the rodeo kings and lee harvey osmond what he learned about himself six years ago that's that you're a mohawk man yeah that's right that whole story is in there that's unbelievable we should touch on it in a minute but uh what else did I write? His autobiography, Beautiful Scars. You read a passage from Beautiful

Scars. Maybe you'll read something again today, but it was about the tragically hip and gore downie. We talked about Neil Young, who's back in the news again, because do you ever make any money from Spotify? Do you ever make money from streaming? None. None. I hear that. Fuck, what is that? Because you've got to be like Drake

or you've got to be Justin Bieber. That's fine with me. I don't care. You know what? I mean, my whole, even when Columbia was putting out records for us and Sony Music and stuff, I never even cared. You know, I didn't care what we sold. I come from, you know, remember I told you about that guy Bill Paul from Hamilton?

Yeah, of course. It's like 75% artist and 25 carney and um the idea you know that uh that you're going to make a lot of money selling records you know is just there's very few that actually make a lot of money selling records and i mean i don't feel like getting into the boring accounting of touring and support and the money that's thrown into an act back in the nineties. I'm talking about. Is that, is that why a band like junk house needs to break in the States?

Like for, for, for, for finance, just because that changes. Well, you know what I mean? I,

I, I mean, uh, you know, Sony spent a million dollars on junk house in the first six months, which is why, you know, them, you know, if not, we dollars on Junk House in the first six months, which is why you know them. You know, if not,

we would just be unknown. That's all there is to it. No big deal. It could have been us. It could have been the next guy. Unscrew the heads of your favorite band and screw the heads on of the neighbors and the people who you run into at the grocery store. And you got the same thing.

But going back to my philosophy, Toronto Mike, I come from the King Clancy school, which is if you don't get them on the ice you get them in the alley after the game and I always felt that you know what you might not buy my record you're gonna end up at my show somehow I'm gonna sell you a t-shirt I'm gonna I'm gonna get you somehow I'm gonna do a show hopefully that is going to leave you spellbound. And then you're my friend and my fan. And most of my fans are my friends,

because I guess there's not that many of them anymore. I love it, but you misattributed the quote. That's not King Clancy. Who was it? Harold Ballard? Con Smythe. Con Smythe, yes. Con Smythe.

But love that quote. I think it's still above the address.. Con Smythe, yes. Con Smythe. But love that quote. I think it's still above the draft. It hasn't helped them, though. They haven't actually made the playoffs since 2004. No. I did get to a game, though. I got to a game. How did I get to a game, I wonder?

During the pandemic? Well, just before. Okay. I went with my fellow named Ryan McMahonahon who also has a podcast called thunder bay um which is fascinating maybe he's thunder bay ryan well no he's just definitely not thunder bay ryan uh he did this podcast on thunder bay on the incredible uh corruption oh yes yes. This is through the Kennedy Land Network. This is Jesse Brown. I've read about it.

This is a big popular podcast. It's very big. He's doing a documentary film on it right now. And Twitter, et cetera, the Thunder Bay police force is crumbling under the weight of corruption and racism and basically lack of humanity. Well, a couple more quick questions and then I'm actually going to get to my notes here.

But Basement, a lot of people, when they find out Tom Wilson's returning, like your first episode was truly like, I would call it epic. Like people reference it a lot. Not just Bruce Springsteen's tits, but just the whole vibe you revealed early in that episode that you had just had a stroke.

So let me ask you, have you had more strokes? How are you doing? No, I'm trying to not have any more strokes. I actually trot on the mic. I mean, the first one was so much fun. In fact, I told you the whole story of having the stroke and driving the car and all that stuff, right? So no, no more strokes, and I'm fairly healthy. And even though, you know, just before COVID, I was working in Nashville for about three weeks,

blacking the Rodeo Kings. We played the Grand Ole Opry, and we did a few shows, and I was working down there. I was eating, like, barbecue and fried chicken, and basically everything down in the south is fried. Fried or barbecued, everything. You can't get a vegetable, you can't get a carrot without it being deep fried, right? Which is like, the population, I don't know how anybody lives past like 37 in the south.

Anyway, so I go down there, I put on like 20 pounds, right? anyway so i go down there i put on like 20 pounds right so i come home from nashville and then i get a call asking me to go and be a presenter on the juno awards on camera like on the show right oh geez you know and i look in the mirror and oh my god i look like jackie gleason from the honeymooners right i figure i gotta go lose some weight and I start losing weight. I do it really diligently, Toronto Mike. I don't ride a bike like you do, but I really go out. I lose 20 pounds. And then of course COVID comes.

They cancel the Junos. And during COVID, I put on 30 pounds. 30 pounds. How'd you lose it? You just stopped junking? Junkhouse, stopped junking? And what did I do there? And you what? You you just did more exercise like more hard walks and stuff yeah i mean i just you know um margo really uh she really feeds me oh this is the wife margo okay brother of uh andrew

no sorry sister sister of andrew in fact you know what uh? My wife doesn't even have a name anymore. She's just called Sister of Andrew. Sister of Andrew. Right. And does Margo enjoy the lasagna as well? Oh, yeah. We're going to crack that thing open. Probably not tonight because I have another appointment in Toronto. That's okay.

That's okay. Let it thaw in the fridge for like 20 minutes. It's getting done. It'll get taken care of. Dude, anytime you're in town, anytime you need to hang around for an hour, just drop by. We'll play some songs, shoot the breeze, and I'll get you a new lasagna.

Well, this is the thing. The lasagna I had last time was great, but I was so excited when I got home from the Toronto Mike show that I threw it right in the oven and threw the box out, threw the box out, and any indication of where it came from,

so I never knew where this was palma pasta you could have dropped me a note palma pasta you know what i'm gonna nail it nail the box to the wall like you did in your studio here so sobriety and again i'm gonna jump around but i i do have things i want to get to but sobriety uh no drinking for you proud of you buddy uh but would you do you partake in uh in in uh herbs like cannabis uh, herbs like cannabis? Yeah, yeah, yeah. Well, I mean, um, my doctor, uh, my doctor prescribed me marijuana before it was cool. Um, uh, or before it was legal at least. Right. Wait, wait, wait, hold on, hold on, hold on, hold on.

My doctor prescribed me marijuana when it was still cool. Um, and, uh, and literally like they used to send me, like, a purolator courier used to show up with, like, a box of weed every month, and I didn't smoke weed, right? It was never my drug of choice. It gave me anxiety. Most of the time I smoked marijuana, even in my youth and throughout my life, I would end up in the fetal position on the kitchen floor a biker clubhouse is crying and it's an un it's not a

popular look in a biker clubhouse okay toronto mike if you're in a biker clubhouse you gotta keep your cool and keep your mouth shut and be respectful i wouldn't know actually tom but i ended up in the fetal position right crying on the kitchen floor. So I never really dug the drug. How's that? But now I got prescribed it. So literally I'd get boxes of marijuana sent to my house and then you would come over or somebody would come over and I'd say, hey, yeah, this is great hanging out.

This is fine. Hey, do you smoke weed? Right, okay. Let me get you a bag of weed. And I would go to my cupboard and I would load you up a bag of weed. Well, you know, you don't have to smoke it, right? There's other ways to ingest the, the magic. Well, this is, I don't, I don't smoke it. I have cookies that are made for me and I have one of those before bed. And that's, other than that, I'm not that interested in,

you know, I'm not that interested uh changing my perspective during the day i would never never think about eating a marijuana cookie and coming to the toronto mike show although it appears that i i'm have some of the effects from last night's marijuana cookie are lasting here all right on that note though i just and i don't know where this is compared to where you live but i did a little uh searching at canacabana.com and there's a location at 1317 Barden Street East. Yeah. So I don't know exactly

where that is. I gotta learn more about the wonderful city. Are they one of your sponsors? They're a new sponsor, yeah. Oh, okay. So for those listening who do enjoy cannabis, consider Canacabana. There's a hundred locations across the country but they've got more than just

weed they've got bongs and pipes and vapes and dab rigs and grinders they got pills and blows they got it all man and you can save money you'll never beat Canna Cabana on price but if you become a member of the Cabana Club there's always a sale

going on and they'll match any price you find that's better, but you'll never beat them on price. Canna Cabana, new sponsors of Toronto Mike. And yeah, they got a Hamilton location for those Hammer people that are listening. I'm going to go see them. Go say Toronto Mike sent me, say that. And where about, what is the address again?

1317 Barden Street East. Unit 109. It must be like a strip mall or something. I think it's near Ottawa Street. It's in the Hamilton. They have the neighborhood fridges

for people that don't have food. Oh yeah. They put them up on Twitter. So I was over there this morning. I went and grabbed $300 worth of bread and tomatoes and milk and juice and stuff and filled up a fridge for them, which made me feel good. It made me feel good about coming here today, Toronto Mike, because you know what?

I felt like I did something good for somebody. Dude, love hearing those words. Because this interview is definitely no good for anybody. This is great. Basement Dweller just saw that he tweeted a photo, sorry, just saw that tweeted photo of Tom Wilson in that awesome bear jacket ensemble. Yeah. So before I even ask his question, I actually thought you were going to wear that today.

I was a little disappointed at the door. You're dressed, you're not wearing your bear skin. I know. I'm sorry. Is that a, is that Mohawk? No, no, that's a, that's something that my daughter got me. Well, I mean, uh, my father was bear clan, but you don't follow your father's, uh, clan. You follow your mother's and my mother's turtle clan. So I'm actually a turtle clan. Um, but the bear costume is, uh, I, I chased my grandsons around in that outfit all the time.

Since they were little, you know. Amazing. And so I love that bear outfit. And still, they're like getting older now. They're like 10 and 8, right? And every once in a while when they're at my house, they say, Grandpa, put the bear costume on. And then it's running, the entire house gets used.

Lights go out, and I get to be the bear. Well, Basement Dweller wants me to tell you that you look like an extra from that great late 90s Thrush Hermit video The Day We Hit The Coast. Thrush Hermit, great. Thank you for that, Basement Dweller. And he goes, his jacket

also made this gentleman recall David Wilcox's classic Do The Bear Cat jam, of course. And he goes, his jacket also made me, made this gentleman recall David Wilcox's classic, Do the Bearcat. Of course. And he's still hoping that he could one day, oh, he wants David Wilcox to be a Toronto Mike guest. He should be. Yeah. Carl, he doesn't go by David anymore. I didn't know that.

Okay, you want to connect me? That's how this works, right? You got to talk to Carl Linden. Okay, I'll talk, you know, he's the missing member of the band, Blackie and the Rodeo Kings. I've got two-thirds of the band on this program, so I'm working on that. Yeah, we'll get Colin on.

Okay, he says, that's the only bluesy rock that his late father ever cared for was David Wilcox. I like this one. I mentioned Brother Bill earlier, because he was a DJ on 102.1 The Edge, and he co-hosts this sub-series called PPMM. He goes, fun fact, Tom's father

was on Lancaster's in World War II. So Brother Bill's father was, and sometimes I'll be on a bike ride and I'll see the plaque commemorating the Lancaster Bombers and you still see one that flies out of Hamilton and I'll send these pictures to Brother Bill. So Brother Bill wants me to ask you if you have any stories

about your father being on Lancaster's. Well, first of all, it's great to talk to another CFNY on-air personality who never got the opportunity to play my music. Just shine, just shine. Just shine. Well, Brother Bill, that's fascinating. and you said his father was uh so my father was a um a tail gunner and a rear gunner he's also a sergeant a flight sergeant on a lancaster bomber and um he got hit by this plane got hit by uh anti-aircraft fire from uh from uh the Nazi Nazi regime. And, um, uh, they crash landed, uh, they made it

home, but they crash landed on the airstrip and, uh, he was not supposed to survive. In fact, most of the, uh, and I've talked, talked about it a lot, but most of the young men slash boys that sat in the, uh, uh, tail gunner position didn't make it home. George Wilson made it home and he made it home with a massive head injury and totally blind,

but he didn't talk about it. And when he drank, the venom that was left in him from the second world war and from his head injury came out, but he never really talked any details about that job he had. Wow. To change the channel here, Bracebridge Hall just wants me to say, a remarkable tale from a remarkable storyteller

from the stage to the page. Tom Wilson, we are listening. Oh, wow. Because you're a gifted storyteller, but you already know this. I take nothing for granted, Toronto Mike. Take nothing for granted. It's a deadly combination of like this, the best voice I've ever heard on these microphones

combined with tremendous stories. And again, if people haven't heard the, and we're not going to tell it now, but go back and listen to the Bruce Springsteen's tits story. Bruce Springsteen's tits in the first appearance of Tom Wilson on Toronto Mike. It's a great story. It is.

It's in the way you tell it makes it even better. Andrew, I don't think this is your brother-in-law, but another Andrew says, have you, Tom Wilson, or the label, expressed interest in vinyl reissues of the Junk House catalog? Junk House Strays will be coming out, I believe, in late 22, maybe early 23.

And Sony Music, honest to God, you know, Junk House were a band that sold hundreds of thousands of records around the world, not millions of records. Let's be very clear. So for Sony Music, basically, you know, when you get signed, it's like everything in life, Mike. You know, it's like you get married and you got a big party

and everybody gets drunk and everybody loves you, Toronto Mike. But when the marriage ends, it's like nobody comes around. And everybody hates you, Toronto Mike. But same thing with the record labels, right? It's like we got signed to Sony. There was like lots of money spent on it. We didn't know what was going on being knuckleheads from hamilton and then when we weren't allowed to make records

with them anymore nobody came around said anything and do they make you like how does it work do they make you pay back that money that they spent uh promoting you or no that that's no no i don't know because i heard about like sometimes i would hear stories from bands that like they had to pay back for the videos that were made like they made, like, they had to pay back for the videos that were made. Like, they made expensive videos and they had to pay it back. It's because the videos were bad. If you make bad music, you have to pay the money back. Luckily, I managed to make some good music, so I don't have to pay anything.

Well, Andrew says he'll be first in line for the Strays. Thank you. Thank you, Andrew. And you know what? Well, I'm sure that, you know, I'll come back on Toronto Mike and we'll talk about that. I would love it. Uh, Jerry,

the garbage man, there's a good handle for you. I've heard him call small Canadian bars, hugging slugs. No knuckles and chuckles. I got it. All right. Well,

maybe Jerry's got it wrong here, but he goes, what are some of your favorite Canadian clubs slash bars to play? And then he wants me to just throw in the fact before you answer that question. Your audio book, he says, your audio book reading, and this is Beautiful Scars, was unmatched, and I look forward to the new one.

So answer Jerry's questions, and then I know you teased on Twitter that there's a new book coming. Well, there is a new book coming. I will talk to Jerry. Jerry? Jerry the Garbage Man. Jerry the Garbage Man.

Thank you for your question, Jerry. Jerry, I did Jerry the Garbage Man. Jerry the Garbage Man. Thank you for your question, Jerry. Jerry, I did read the audio book, the first audio book. I'm going to tell you how this happened. Yeah. You've got time, right, Toronto Mike? For you, I cleared my whole schedule. And you will be editing some of this, I imagine. All right.

Should I be recording this? First of all, I'm going to start uh by expressing uh with all sincerity that um i'm not a musician i just like writing songs and singing them and i've been doing it for 47 years and i don't listen i'm not looking for your toronto mic you don't have to say come on tom you're a great musician i am not a musician. I'm in bands with great musicians. That's how it's worked for me. I'm also not an artist, not a visual artist. If you asked me to paint this can of Lake Effect beer here,

I'd have difficulty doing that. But I love to paint, okay? And this is what I like to paint toronto mike shown me a piece of my art here um also uh i'm dyslexic so i have incredible difficulty reading books but somehow i managed to be able to write them so what's his name again jerry not larry jerry the garbage man jerry the garbage man i'm going to tell you that uh when it came time to for the audiobook i went in for a meeting at random house and they said we're going to do an audiobook i said that's fantastic and they said and we've got this great reader i said what are you talking about they said

well we got this guy he's got a great voice and he's going to do the he's going to read the book for you i said how much does this pay and they told me how much it paid i said tell him he's going to read the book for you. I said, how much does this pay? And they told me how much it paid. I said, tell him he's not got the job. I'm taking the job. I said, why are you going to have somebody? Because at the time I was doing, I was a commercial voice, right? So everybody who's listening now close their eyes, and I'm going to give you an example. It's going to be, there's some things in this world you can still count on.

McDonald's quarter pounder with cheese. Here's another one. It world you can still count on. McDonald's quarter pounder with cheese. Ah, here's another one. It's not what you're reading. It's what your dog's eating. Kibbles and bits. Wow. So I was that guy, right? I've done, I did all these commercials back in the day.

So I said, I'm the guy to read the book. What I forgot, Toronto Mike, was that I have difficulty reading so now i have to read you know what was it uh 360 000 words i don't know how much i don't know how big my book was how long that but it's like uh oh it's like 200 and 220 pages right um the wrinkling in my forehead from concentrating was so great that I actually had to go get Botox just because. Is that true? Yeah, I had like these concentrating lines running down my forehead.

Why are you so afraid of aging gracefully? Dyeing the beard, getting the Botox. Hey, baby, when you look this good, you got to keep it. Something like that. Is that right? I don't know. I'm so glad though. Can you imagine getting like the audio version

of Beautiful Scars and some other guys reading it? Like, don't go out for like burgers when you got steak at home. That's right. That's Paul Newman. Is that? Yeah, that's a Paul Newman one. I wasn't sure who I was quoting there.

You know what? Let me help you. Excuse me. King Clancy did not say that Toronto Mike. Paul Newman said that. Paul Newman. I believe Con Smythe is, I think he's buried in the same cemetery

as Harold Ballard and Jeff Healy. Park Lawn Cemetery. Really? Not too far from here. On that note, I do have a flashlight here. This is to keep you safe on like the late night walks with your dog. Is that for me for really?

Yeah. This is for safety. This is courtesy of Ridley Funeral Home. They just want you to stay safe so they don't see you anytime too soon. What the fuck? Ridley Funeral Home. Well, thank you Ridley Funeral Home. I hope I never meet you.

But thank you for this. And you know what? If you're feeling stiff, best call Ridley. That's a free, can we use that? It'll be airing on 680 News tomorrow. I think that, you know what, I just make this stuff up. And you got the sticker from, you put it in your book there, but that is a Toronto Mike

sticker from stickeru.com. I know. This is great. You know what? You know what? You're like a junior B hockey team. You know when you go to see the junior B hockey teams back in the day and they've got like every local business

stuck on their jersey? Right. That's right. Exactly. It's like a NASCAR. Johnny O. I love this question. Johnny O. Good FOTM. He's a listener of the program. Writes in, I've been writing a script for a show I want to pitch to Netflix Canada.

I had Tom in mind as the main character. If it gets picked up, would he consider Tom in mind as the main character. If it gets picked up, would he consider acting in it as the main character? The other thing I can't do is act. Oh. I have had, but you know what? I'm going to say yes to this, okay? Because there might be, you know what?

I can't do it. I'm going broke as we speak here. Yeah, it's a payday. So, you know, I mean, yes, you know, send, send. Don't even bother sending the script. Just tell me where to stand. So people over the years, I've had people literally standing in the dressing room, in my dressing room, like find their way backstage. Like people in suits come to my backstage, into my dressing room at Massey Hall and say, Tom, we really loved your show.

We want to have you in our movie. We're doing this movie. It's going to be, you're going to play this guy. It's going to be, this is how it goes. It's not happening right. And I say, Hey man, I don't know how to act. Oh, well, we just saw you on stage. You actually, you commanded the room tonight. You are, you are a great actor. I said, well, I really can't, I don't know how to act. And they insist on me being in their movies. I've been in six movies. I can only name, actually, I can't name don't know how to act and they insist on me being in their movies i've been in six movies i can only name actually i can't name any of the movies i've been in six movies and uh and and sure enough they hire me i end up on the set right i'm sitting there it's like the lights and the cameras and it's like uh and they say okay action and i start acting and i look over at them and i can see the life draining from their eyes as they realize holy shit he was right he really can't

act oh my god i love it uh do you still sign your pictures with e-i-e-i-o no i'm trying to remember when i used to do that did you maybe you did it he uh this gentleman got your autograph uh in north bay you were playing wilders wilders for sure hey the home of omar vacuum cleaners and dog food i i had no idea oh yeah there's a store there in fact i don't know if omar is still there and i'm sorry we of ADD'd right out of the question, but we will come back. So Omar's in this guy. What's his name? Well, Johnny O is the guy.

Johnny O. Johnny O. You know this if you're from North Bay. And you can actually... No, that's a different... He's not the North Bay guy. He's the guy who wants you in his Netflix series, though. I scrambled it a bit.

Okay, anything with this... You messed me up. Don't worry about the North Bay guy. It's a... Anyways, Omar's Vacuums and Dog Food. It's a store that used to be on the main drag in North Bay. They also sold vintage stereo equipment and vintage guitars. And every Saturday afternoon, if you went in there around one or two o'clock,

Omar, who was an old French-Canadian guy, used to have him and about four or five fiddlers playing in the store. It was so beautiful. Why did you not bring your guitar today when you tweeted at me that you were bringing your guitar? Well, I realized you weren't paying me. I love you again. The lasagna.

Yeah. Not quite. And the flashlight. The other store that used to be on the main drag was like a novelty store. Okay. And this is a true story, Toronto Mike. Okay.

I'm in the, so my first wife used to collect salt and pepper shakers, right? Okay. So I used to go and buy her salt and pepper shakers at the store. Now there was a guy that ran the store, but he had an old woman, his mother behind the cash. And he gets that the novelty store and the, the, um, uh, salt and pepper shakers weren't selling. So all he had were sex toys.

The entire store was all these giant dildos, you know what I mean, and weird anal lube by the gallon, right? And I used to go in there to buy the salt and pepper shakers, which was the only other thing for sale in the store. It had a great neon sign, a joke sign out, and had all the sex toys, and this old woman behind the counter,

I used to go in there and buy salt and pepper shakers. And when I went in, I heard her. I bought them. I bought like six. And I brought them up to the cash. And her son was there. And she reached and looked over to him. She goes, see, I told you they'd sell.

Fucking amazing. North Bay is a hot town. I was going to say, it's a hotbed of activity. I have no idea here. But yeah, we officially did tell Johnny, oh, you would do the Netflix series. I think that's official. Yeah, sign me up.

Send the contracts to my agent, please. Tim says, would love to know if he could find a way to put his limited release dollar bills version of Italian Sunglasses into wider distribution or record another live version with a full current band lineup. Such a good song.

Whose question is this? Tim. Tim? Well, Tim sent me via Facebook. He sent me this. He sent me the recording from Dollar Bills. Love it.

Sounds pretty good, you know. Is that just on his phone? He's just, okay. I was about, shit, about 22, 21, 22. Wow. We had a, we had like a 1970, no, maybe 1969 Crown Victoria on the road.

And we had a cube van that said domestic refrigeration on the side of it, full of PA and guitar amps and stuff. And we traveled around. We did the route from Detroit to Montreal back and forth for about four years with the Florida Razors. And, uh, we ended up at Dollar Bills in Kingston and made a record there.

Daniel Lanois ended up mixing the record and, uh, and a record company put it out on CD a while ago. I think that we should put it up on, uh, not Spotify, but we should put it up on iTunes or something. Yeah, fuck Spotify. They don't pay me either, so it doesn't matter. You don't pay me. You know what?

You are so much like Spotify, Toronto Mike. You know, except Spotify don't even send me a lasagna. Yeah, remember last, you know, when you do a CBC show, do they send you home with like food? Nothing. Nothing, right? Like, so come on. The other day I was having a shower. They send you home from the CBC,

they send you home with a bad attitude. I could observe his voice. So, again, I almost feel like people need the first episode before they come to this one. So, maybe we should start this episode, Tom. Are we just getting going? Just to reiterate and just to revisit

some things we talked about the first time you visited in episode 399, your story, which every time I share your story with somebody, they have that same reaction, which is like, wow, what a story. This needs to be a movie, to be quite honest. Forget Johnny Owen, his little Netflix series. There needs to be a biopic, a Tom Wilson biopic, because for those who don't know, and you should all read Beautiful Scars and listen to the first episode of Toronto Mic'd with Tom Wilson, you were, how old were you

when you learned you were adopted? 50 something. 56, 56, 55 maybe. And here, and again, I know you're thinking to yourself, like people have heard these stories already, but if you could, if you could tell the story of how you learn you're adopted, and then if you don't mind, the story of how you learn who your birth mother is, because those are stories that when I hear you tell these stories, you're kicking the camera there, Tommy.

Those stories are, to me, just like, wow. Like those stories, like that happened. Well, it's not an uncommon story, right? And it's part of, you know i i it's been pointed out to me or i've pointed it out that it isn't an adoption story it's not an indigenous story alone it's a canadian story because the job of um the british empire was to uh not only if they couldn't kill the indian population was to uh strip them of their culture and their identity. So what I write about now, Toronto Mike, is about identity

because you don't realize how important it is until you don't have it, just like everything else in life, right? So if you don't know where you actually came from, if you don't know what your culture is, you aren't able to reach back to that, you know, to preserve yourself, then you really have, you have no backup, right? So, um, I, uh, I suspected that, uh, Bunny and George Wilson were not my parents. And I suspected that most of my life. Also, if you look at pictures of me as a younger man, even as a child, I mean, uh, I look like an indigenous kid. I don't look like, uh, the Irish and Scottish and

Italian and Portuguese kids that were in my neighborhood when I grew up. Um, and, uh, and I continued on in life with wondering about that. Right. So, was actually uh seven years ago i think eight years ago let's say that i was uh going out in a speaking tour and uh they give you a handler when you go on a speaking tour basically somebody that get you to the airport get your hotel get you on stage like a road manager kind of thing and she pulls up in a limousine she got the limousine i go out in front i put my bags in the trunk i go around the side door i open the side door i get in there's this younger woman in there she says oh my god this is so great i'm a fan of yours we're gonna have a great time we're

going to winnipeg and regina which is the joke um and uh she goes you don't know this but your family and my family used to be friends and i I said, well, you know, I hear that a lot because, uh, the last name, but Bunny and George Wilson were really old. Uh, George Wilson, as I mentioned earlier, was blinded in the second world war. They didn't have any friends in Hamilton that I knew of or remembered. The only people that ever got into our house were relatives that came down from Quebec. And she said, oh no, no. My grandmother used to be friends with Bunny Wilson. Her name was Mary Brennan. And Toronto Mike, I was like in my 50s, and I remembered her grandmother's name from when I was four years old.

And I thought, oh, my God, Mary Brennan. I said, I haven't heard that name since I was like preschooler. But I remember it. I actually remember your grandmother. And my heart, as I've mentioned before, my heart burst open because I didn't think that Bunny Wilson had any friends. And sure enough, you know, here was this friend that was brought back, brought back from oceans of time, delivered to me.

And I said, wow, I remember your grandmother. She goes, yeah, yeah in fact my grandmother was so close with bunny she was there the day you were adopted boom i know i said what and uh and that started this journey that i'm still on mike uh so uh about two weeks later i was driving my cousin janie home cousin janie is a matriarch of our family. She sits at the head of the table for Thanksgiving and Christmas, all the kids' birthdays, my grandson's birthdays. And, um, I said, Hey, Janie, you know, I found out I drive her home from my grandson's birthday. In fact, I said, you know, I, Janie, I found out just a little while ago, a couple of weeks ago that mom and dad weren't really my mom and dad. And I know you're really close with them. And if you ever

remember anything or want to tell me anything, you know, give me a call and let me know. And I know you're really close with them. And if you ever remember anything or want to tell me anything, you know, give me a call and let me know. And she turned to me and she said, Tom, I don't know how to tell you this. I'm sorry. And I hope you forgive me, but I'm your mother. And, uh, and that started, that really did start the journey with intent, a journey to rediscover my identity, my culture. And even if I can't feel like a Mohawk all the time, I'm a guy who grew up on the East mountain of Hamilton, even though I didn't grow up the same way my brothers and sisters did. I work every day through my art, through my writing, through my music to bring honour and light to the Mohawk culture.

That's my job. That's what I'll be doing. You know what? You interview me in 10 years, Toronto Mike, I'm going to be doing the same thing. I warned you earlier, I had some more recent music. It wasn't just going to be Junk House today, but I'm going to play this beautiful song from you, Lee Harvey Osmond. The song you titled Mohawk.

It's quite a long intro, by the way. You can, want to hit the post? You can set it up if you like. You can set it up if you like. Well, when I was really, really young, I had a reoccurring dream that I was getting on the back of a turtle to go across a body of water. And as the turtle started to make its way across the body of water, it turned into my grandfather, John Lazar.

I realize now that reoccurring dream that I was having as a kid and throughout quite a bit of my life, that body of water was the St. Lawrence Seaway. And the place I was trying to get to was my true home, Kahnawake, Mohawk Territory. I'm nervous, I'm practicing my smile I stare in the rearview mirror and slowly, silently mouth the words From a mohawk baby To a mohawk man Here I stand

Yeah, I stand Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah One more, babe And the car rolls on The car rolls on Wow, those saxophones sound amazing.

Anyway. I'm on my way to the mystical land of my... How are things going with... Oh, just a second. Oh, your phone is ringing there. Oh, hello? Oh, this is great, Toronto Mike. This is...

These people call me and tell me that, you know, credit cards got used. Oh, yeah, yeah. And they call me that I got stuff. The border's out. Hello? No, they're not going to answer. But it's really fun. I hope they call back

because we could have a great portion in our show here today. My question is, okay, so this is like an autobiographical song. You're telling the story. Like, how many Mohawk siblings have you met? Six, seven. And how is that going?

So this is sort of the update to the journey, right? I mean, so much has happened since you were here in November 2018. But how is this discovery, this journey of yours and discovering your roots as a Mohawk man? Like how is that progressing here? They accepted you with open arms? Yeah, the culture, you know, there was, you know, there's no, it's a colonial question to say, and I've had it quite a bit, and I don't get insulted because of where I am from, where I grew up.

But it's always like, so how much Indian are you? Right? And like that's, indigenous people don't ask each other that, you know. You either are or else, and if you aren't and you're faking it and you're acting and pretending to be indigenous to using a cultural appropriation

to make your way, to make money, then they'll just burn your house down. It's easy. How did you find out who your birth father is? I went on a website called 23Me. Remember I talked about, just a few minutes ago, you will remember, by the way, Tron. I talked about identity and culture

and losing your connection with your blood, your blood memory. Well, what was the question again? Well, we know Janie, you referred to as your aunt, kind of discloses to you in the car that she's your birth mother. But how do you discover who your birth father is? I wanted to find out about if, since I found out that my cousin Janie was my mother, I didn't know who my father was. I wanted to find out about my health.

I wanted to find out if I was going to get Alzheimer's or cancer or diabetes. Or more strokes. Or more strokes, heart disease. I wanted to find out about all that, so I went on this website called 23andMe. 23andMe is a site put together not so that I can find my lost brother or sister.

It's to find out about yourself. And it takes your DNA right back to its original your original origins to the cradle of civilizations Africa Asia you know Middle East and tells you where what part of the world you're from right it also tells you about your you know all these diseases that you might be susceptible to. And there is a section in 23andMe about for relatives. But Toronto Mike, they're mostly like sixth and seventh cousins that come in.

People that have no consequence, right? It could be you. You and I could be sixth or seventh cousins for that matter. But out of nowhere, a woman from Montreal named, you know, Tracy gets a hold of me and says, listen, I'm looking for my grandfather and you and I share 27% DNA. I think that you're my grandfather. I wrote back to her because I had to be, I wanted to be respectful because somebody really is looking for family here. This is an important thing.

I wrote back and said, listen, you know what? I'm like 50-something years old. My grandkids are just babies. I'm not your grandfather, but good luck with your search. And she wrote back almost in a couple hours, she wrote back, in fact, and said, well, you might not be my grandfather, but we still share 27% DNAna and that makes you my half brother uh i said well then we got a hold of each other where's your father from you're my father's from

ghanawage what's his name his name is louis bova and then uh you know i said well that's funny because my mother's from ghanawage funny as in this is obviously my father and and we took it from there and i got to meet uh i got to meet most of my brothers and sisters. In fact, I have just been officially made a Mohawk of the territory, the Kahnawake territory. Congratulations. That's very cool. Mohawk territory in Kahnawake, yeah, which is a big deal, you know,

because I went to get my – there's all kinds of, it's been a long, since 2018, there's been a lot that's gone on. We're not going to cover it in this podcast, Toronto. You'll be back, though. You'll be back. We could if you decide to edit this. You are editing this, aren't you? You know I won't edit this.

Okay. Andrew knows that. Yeah. It's part of the charm. What a mess. Unnecessary. No edits required. All killer, no filler.

Now, you're, you know, being a proud Mohawk man, I know you speak of the Skywalkers, right? This is the term for your ancestors would be, what is it? Would be like if you were building the World Trade Center or a large skyscraper, your ancestors might be, they would be just unafraid of heights and might be, please, this is Skywalkers. But you yourself, not a natural born Skywalker.

No, I joked about that, that my sister's grandfather is like the fourth guy in, sitting in on that famous photograph of the Mohawks. That very famous picture. Famous photograph of the iron workers sitting having their lunch on a beam, building the Rockefeller Center. A lot of those guys are from Kahnawake, and the fourth guy in from the left is my sister's great-grandfather. So I have difficulty getting on a stepladder to change a light bulb.

Meanwhile, my brothers, you know, are swinging from bridges and from tall heights, dancing in the clouds up there. Which is an interesting experiment with like nature versus nurture, right? Like, so if you're, you're, you're born into this legacy and you sort of assume it at a young age, and it's very different from assuming it in your 50s. Yeah, this is... The same as, I'm going to tell you, the way this works for me is the same as I open up Twitter and see that the fridge on Ottawa Street in Hamilton is empty. So I go to Fortino's, and I buy, you know, four or $500 worth of groceries and I take it down and I fill that fridge. You know what I mean? You do your,

you do, you work with what you have, you know, and that's my whole problem, by the way, with, uh, with what's going on in this world is that, um, uh, we have come up against a great global challenge, and a lot of the population is just not very giving. All the things that, you know, it's almost, you remember the Ten Commandments, the movie The Ten Commandments with Charlton Heston? Of course. And then there was this other guy, Edward G. Robinson,

and he didn't believe in any of it, right? He didn't believe, he was following Moses out of convenience, but not out of, uh, belief. And, uh, Moses goes up to, uh, to the mountain to get the tablets, the 10 commandments and, uh, Edward G. Robinson's character, you know, he just gets everybody partying and fucking and drinking and doing blow down there, making a golden calf. And that's what's going on now. It's, as I said, you know, what do you want, really what do you want to fight the government for?

The government is always going to be there, and we're always going to dislike them. They're always going to be the in-law. They're always going to be the guy that your daughter married that you don't like. It's just the way it is. Let me just reiterate this, that I'm just so grateful you came back,

man. Like I so much loved our first, you know, discussion on Toronto Mike episode three 99 and for what? Almost four years, I guess three, three plus years. Anyway,

I've been thinking we got to get Tom Wilson back in the basement. $3.99. And for what? Almost four years, I guess. Three plus years anyway. I've been thinking we've got to get Tom Wilson back in the basement for round two. So I just want to say thank you because I know it's a long drive and it's not a lovely day. It's cold and snowy and you're here and I'm so glad you're here man. Loved this.

Thank you Toronto Mike. It's a pleasure to be here with you you're great guy and uh you're you know what i'm gonna say that you're not gonna like it maybe you don't like it but you're really well loved people really really just andrew right well and my brother-in-law mostly uh i think i don't know i'm not sure i think he has a thing for you but but that's okay you know that's acceptable and i don't want you to be driving back to hamilton and thinking oh damn i forgot to do x so this is your like your last chance is there anything else you wanted to uh share or uh read or anything you didn't bring a guitar that's okay

next time you're gonna bring a guitar i'm gonna read uh i'm gonna read something i just wrote for the uh for the next book the next book book is possibly going to be called Blood Memory, and it is a continuation of the journey. But this little piece is called The Podiatrist's Office. And as you remember, I met my mother, who has acted as my cousin my entire life, only eight years ago, let's say, about eight years ago. So my cousin is my mother. My mother's name is Janie. Janie turned to me in the waiting room

of her podiatrist's office. Every time she moved, her nylon winter coat rubbed against her and made scratching sounds. The sound made my teeth hurt. I bought her that coat a few years ago. It's down-filled, keeps her warm through the long Great Lake winters. She leaned in closer, over the armrest of her chair, her head almost touching my chest. Her movements were very slow. She's 82 years old now. She's earned the right to move as

slow as she wants. At first, I was scared that she was passing out as she leaned on my side and dramatically tilted her upper body over me. I thought maybe Janie was about to have a silent dog-like vomit into my lap. Instead, she was trying to tell me something, a secret no one else in the waiting room was supposed to hear. I leaned in, too, to get my ear closer to her. Then she whispered, Today, she paused, I'm going to introduce you to the doctor as my son.

Okay, Janie, that sounds good to me, I replied. This was going to be the first time in 61 years that my mother, Janie, would acknowledge herself to anybody as my mother, me as her son. And so it seemed to me right on. It was that simple, that easy to blow off 60 years of lies and deception. I thought about my cousin Janie over the years as just a relative. She was a quiet woman, quiet and vibrant and hip, but only as an older cousin to me.

For most of my growing up, she lived in Toronto, a few miles up the road in the QEW. She'd take the great coach Express into Hamilton fairly regularly to visit Bunny and George. Janie was like a member of our direct family, but not really. She was warm, engaging But she still remained on the outer edge of the picture There was clearly an undying love between her and Bunny Although she was executed with some trepidation The words I love you were never spoken

And there was an obvious friction In the relationship that remained unaddressed. Just some bullshit going on between the three adults in my life, Bunny, George, and Janie. I wasn't privy to any of it. Their dark brooding energy filled the four-room house. It was dull and it burned and it hung in the air and it disappeared into the plaster walls.

That darkness, that thickness, that hung in the air, and it disappeared into the plaster walls. That darkness, that thickness, and I'm sure it was left in those walls, and it must still be haunting the old post-World War II bungalow today. In the end, Janie seemed like she couldn't get close enough to any of us. In my mind, she was what you'd call a loner keeping her business private to all of us and regularly rolling into town from her life in Toronto with her Amelia Earhart carry-on bag over her shoulder and a couple shopping bags in her hands I remember that Amelia Earhart bag it was a green leather robust colorful very stylish even as a seven-year-old, it was obvious that bag would go with anything. She was slick, all right.

She had style, and she used that style to overcome any prejudice. Style has the ability to transcend race, class, and time. Her natural Mohawk good looks cut right through the white world. Circumstances had forced her to live in the white world. Above and beyond, she was a regular cat about town. Janie showed up for practically everything I did as a kid of some merit, luck, or concern. She was there at my grade eight graduation. Janie was there at my peewee hockey championship game. She was there at my church concerts. Jesus, Janie was always

tagging along swooping in just at the nick of time my daughter saw Janie as some magical woman with an independent woman who would come around for holidays and birthdays she would show up at our door with Barbie dolls for my daughter Madeline and she'd sit and play with her for hours over cups of tea and cookies Madeline remembers her showing up for her brother being born. She took a bus or maybe a taxi to get to the McMaster Medical Center in the middle of the night for Thompson's arrival. She got to the hospital in perfect time.

It was probably a taxi from her apartment in St. James Place off Parliament Street in downtown Toronto. She was right there where she always ended up, quietly on the fringe of the family, on the outer edge of the picture. I'm so glad you read that. So that was amazing. And I could see there was something in front of you, and then we were winding down.

Well, thank you, Mike. Tom, there might be something else you want to say. Hint, hint. I'm glad you got that in. That was amazing. Thanks. So you're going to come back when the new book comes out? I'm going to come back when the new book comes out,

which is about the end of this year or sometime in 23. Everything is behind, Mike. We live in a world where everything is behind. Thanks for that, Tom. Hey, you still in touch with your ex, Kathy Jones? Yeah, yeah, yeah. She's, she got herself in a little bit of trouble there. You ever tried to talk some sense into her with the vaccination? Or is that a story for another day? Well, it's not really my job. You know, I mean, if you don't want to be vaccinated,

that's okay with me. You know what, I just, I just don't push a mandate on anybody. I live my own life, and I try to do good things for people every day. I try to live in the moment. And even though I mess around with you this afternoon, and it has been really fun, the main job is to always respect and love everybody around you because we have the ability as individuals to make this a better planet.

And that brings us to the end of our 989th show. 989, not a bad number. You can follow me on Twitter. I'm at Toronto Mike. Now Tom is at Lee Harvey Osmond. You can follow him on Twitter. I'm at Toronto Mike. Now, Tom is at Lee Harvey Osmond. You can follow him on Twitter.

He's a good follow. Our friends at Great Lakes Brewery are at Great Lakes Beer. Palma Pasta is at Palma Pasta. Sticker U is at Sticker U. Ridley Funeral Home is at Ridley FH. And Canna Cabana are at Canna Cabana underscore. See you all next week.

Yeah, the wind is cold with the smell of snow Because everything is coming up rosy and green. Yeah, the wind is cold, but the smell of snow won't stay today. And your smile is fine, and it's just like mine, and it won't go away. Because everything is rosy and green. Well, I've been told that there's a sucker born every day. Thank you.