Toronto Mike'd: The Official Toronto Mike Podcast - Underwhelmed: Toronto Mike'd #1310

Episode Date: August 21, 2023

In this 1310th episode of Toronto Mike'd, Mike takes a closer look at a 90s jam that mattered: Sloan's Underwhelmed. Toronto Mike'd is proudly brought to you by Great Lakes Brewery, Palma Pasta, Pumpkins After Dark, Ridley Funeral Home and Electronic Products Recycling Association.

Underwhelmed is a word. I know it is because I looked it up. Merriam-Webster defines underwhelmed as to fail to impress or stimulate. I was not underwhelmed by Sloan's Underwhelmed when I first heard it on 102.1 back in 1992. I was the opposite. I was whelmed, if that's a word.

I know it's not because I looked it up. That's one of those skills I learned in my school. There's a podcast from The Ringer called 60 Songs That Explain the 90s. FOTM Hall of Famer Cam Gordon, Director of Communications at Twitter Canada before Elon Musk realized he had no need for such luxuries, once told me,

The Ringer founder, Bill Simmons, is who you'd get if Leo Roudens and I had a baby. Physically, at least. 60 Songs That Explain the 90s is hosted by Rob Harvilla, and he's unabashedly American. I don't hold that against him. He's American. Not that there's anything wrong with that. But it means there's very little CanCon on his list. His list of 60 that became 90 and will likely grow again as of this moment includes exactly and precisely three CanCon jams. There's You Oughta Know by Ottawa's Alanis Morissette. three CanCon jams. There's You Oughta Know by Ottawa's Alanis Morissette,

Man, I Feel Like a Woman by Shania Twain from Timmins, Ontario, and My Heart Will Go On by Charlemagne Quebec's own Celine Dion. Alanis, Shania, and Celine, three Canadian queens who require no surname. And here's a mind blow for you. I hope you're sitting down. The top three albums by women women in terms of global sales are in this order. Shania Twain's Come on Over from 1997,

Alanis Morissette's Jagged Little Pill from 1995, and Celine Dion's Falling Into You from 1996. Come on Over sold 40 million units. Jagged Little Pills sold 33 million units and Falling Into You sold 32 million units. This list is not just Canadian women. It's all women around the world. You ought to know.

But we share Shania, Alanis, and Celine. Hey, share. Shania, Alanis, Celine. All women who need no surnames, but I digress. We share Shania, Alanis, and Celine with the world. And that's cool. But what about the 90s jams we kept for ourselves? Who's celebrating the 90s songs we didn't share?

Okay, I'll do it. Because someone has to. I'm Toronto Mike, blogger, podcaster, podcast producer, and proud cyclist and father of four in that order. And this is 90s CanCon that blew Toronto Mike's mind. Sorry, that, underwhelmed. Halifax's Sloan was, and is, Chris Murphy, Jay Ferguson, Patrick Pentland, and Andrew Scott. They formed in January 1991,

and took their name from the pronunciation of their friend Jason Larson's nickname when said by Larson's boss. That nickname was Sloan, but it sounded like Sloan because the boss had a French accent. The big trade was that Chris, Jay, Patrick, and Andrew could name their band after Larson, but Larson would get to be on the cover of their Peppermint EP. Done and done. But why did I tell you all of that? I just realized I had Chris Murphy, composer and singer of Underwhelmed, over to my home, and we recorded an episode of Toronto Mic'd together.

And of course I asked him about Underwhelmed, but I also asked him about the band name. Here's what Chris Murphy told me. First question, tough one. I'm sure you get asked it all the time, but what's the origin of the name Sloan? What's the origin story? It's just our friend had the nickname Sloan.

He played in a band called the Straight Jackets. They were just kind of one of our contemporaries. And he was called Sloan because he worked in a factory, or at one time he worked in a factory, and his boss, who was, I think, French, although I don't know if that plays into it, but would refer to him as the Slow One, and he was called sloan and then our the story goes and i think it's true that we said we wanted to call our band sloan and he said

you can call your band sloan as long as you put a picture of my face on the on your record so his picture does appear on the cover of our first ep which predates our first full-length record so it came out in the summer of 1992, and it was called Peppermint. And on the front was this guy. His name is Jason Larson, and he was Sloan. So it has nothing to do with Ferris Bueller's Day Off. No, and that's a movie that I saw at the time,

and that came out at a time when I was becoming aware of counterculture and punk and stuff like that. And so a lot of people loved Ferris Bueller and still do. And I remember I was at the age where it came at the exact time when I was like, really, is it cool to lip sync, twist and shout? I don't know if that's that cool. Yeah, like that's bullshit. So I was like, oh, you can swear on this? Oh, yeah, yeah, you can swear on this? Oh yeah, yeah, you can swear. Well anyway, so yeah, I thought that was like bull crap.

And um, yeah, so I, yeah, so it doesn't have anything to do with, I'd have nothing against Ferris Bueller's Day Off, but like I kind of, sometimes I have this sort of, my persona doesn't like certain things, like Americana music or whatever, but it's

not really the way I feel, I just sort of exaggerate. So like, I kind of come out like, I was like, I was too cool for Ferris Bueller's not really the way I feel. I just sort of exaggerate. So I kind of come out like I was too cool for Ferris Bueller's Day Off when it came out. People think Twist and Shout is a Beatles song. It's actually the Isley Brothers. That's right. The funny thing about that is their first song

was called Shout. You make me wanna shout. From Animal House. But Animal House, Yeah. Well, from you, yes. But Animal House, the dramatic time of that is of the time of Shout or whatever. But, and then, of course, the twist was so big that they basically, it just reeks of someone saying, okay, boys, go back and add twist to that thing. That's right.

But Twist and Shout is great. And, of course, I know it mostly as The Beatles. And I think, I believe the version that he lip syncs in the movie is The Beatles. Definitely. Yeah, for sure. You gotta love a Ferris Bueller tangent. That Peppermint EP included a version of the Chris Murphy penned Underwhelmed, but not the version you know. It's similar Underwhelmed, but not the version you know.

It's similar, no doubt, but not quite there. The song was re-recorded for Sloan's debut full-length album, Smeared, and that's the version you likely know best. Much like how the Pursuit of Happiness re-recorded I'm an Adult Now for Love Junk, only without the run grin. When Rob Harvilla plays a song, there's a sound effect of someone pressing play on a tape deck. Now I could see that for 80s songs, but by the 1990s I had fully switched to CDs. I didn't buy Peppermint, but I did buy Smeared. And of course, I bought it on CD.

But let's hear a little bit of the Peppermint EP version of Underwhelmed. She was underwhelmed, if that's a word. I know it's not not cause I looked it up that's one of the skills that I learned in my school I will never will venture that way

cause I learned it at a great school when I was young She said you were funny I said you are funny She said thank you And I said thank you, bye She rolled her eyes

With her beautiful eyes The boy's got the grammar, it's the meaning That is certainly in my heart But not in hers But not in hers But not in hers But not in hers The night it hurts We were talking about people that he'd meet I felt like a mess cause I was one She said it's okay, but I felt like I just ate my own Just date my young She was obviously a person

With a buzz I know that I don't Smoke or drink She told me to loosen up On her way to the L.C. She skips her classes And gets her things A girl of my courses Rain or shine She skips her classes and gets confused The girl of my course is rain or shine

She's passing her classes while I attend mine While I attend mine While I attend mine While I attend mine While I attend Cynhyrchu'r cyfan Cynhyrchu'r cyfan Cynhyrchu'r cyfan Cynhyrchu'r cyfan Cynhyrchu'r cyfan Cynhyrchu'r cyfan Cynhyrchu'r cyfan

Cynhyrchu'r cyfan Cynhyrchu'r cyfan Cynhyrchu'r cyfan Cynhyrchu'r cyfan Cynhyrchu'r cyfan Cynhyrchu'r cyfan Cynhyrchu'r cyfan She wrote out a story about her life I think it included something about me Not sure of that, but I'm sure of one thing

Her spelling's atrocious She told me to read between the lines Tell her exactly what I got out of it I told her affection had two F's Especially when you're dealing with me Usually you're honest, but all the rest Time goes by and she says that she knows She cracks me up and I'm in her arms

Her beautiful arms She says I've got her, she tells me to go I really won't know, she's what she thinks of me This man and woman, it's the most annoying I miss the points I miss the points I miss the points I miss the points I miss the points

I miss the points I miss the points I bought Smeared on CD, and I bought it because of one song I heard on CFNY. I bought Smeared because of Underwhelmed, and I have zero regrets. Sure, you could catch Underwhelmed on much music, but I don't remember it as part of their regular rotation. At least I don't remember seeing it alongside Nirvana and Pearl Jam. You had

to catch it on Much East or The Wedge. Note to self, get Simon Evans on Toronto Mic'd. The video for Underwhelmed by Sloan was in black and white, mostly, and it had a low-budget, uber-cool early 90s vibe. It's mostly just the band playing live, but it got them on much music and in TV rooms and rec rooms and living rooms across the country. But for me, it was a CFNY jam. Speaking of low budget, guess the entire cost of recording smeared at Halifax's Sound Market Studio. Go ahead, take a wild stab at it. Take a guess. I'll wait.

Okay, that's way high. $1,200 Canadian. Smeared was recorded at a low cost of $1,200 Canadian. Big like Leanne Rimes because I'm all about value. That's $1,200 to record smeared. Did I mention Chris Murphy's been over to my home and we recorded an episode of Toronto Miked together? Did I mention I asked him about Underwhelmed? Here's Chris Murphy telling me about Underwhelmed? Here's Chris Murphy telling me about underwhelmed. She was underwhelmed

if that's a word No it's not cause I looked it up That's one of the skills that I learned in my school I was overwhelmed and I'm sure of that one Cause I learned it back in Resuo

When I was young Yeah, I can listen to this whole thing now. I gotta say, a couple of things for me right now, which is I'm a teenager when this comes out, so I'm listening to a lot of, uh, CFNY. I think it was the edge back then.

Yep. And it was, uh, the big stuff I was really into after the public enemy and the hair, after the hair bands all disappear and we get, it's Nirvana and Pearl Jam and then, uh, bad motor finger from Soundgarden,

like this grunge, I guess we'd call it. Okay. So grunge hits. We're talking Seattle and stuff. Then CFNY starts playing this track. I loved it. The first time I heard it, I loved it. I still love this track 25 years later.

This is one of yours. I'm going to try to focus on your stuff. I wish you would. I don't care. I can talk. I can speak to any of that stuff. I've got my homework done. Well, quick sidebar. Yeah.

With this Trans-Canada Highwaymen thing, am I getting ahead of myself? Should I not mention that? I'm going to do a whole, I mentioned it off the top. I'm going to do a post-Sloan, I have a lot of Trans-Canada Highwaymen. You can run it.

But in Trans-Canada Highwaymen, I'm supposed to bring four songs that I can do kind of thing. You are a little ahead of yourself because that's coming up. Never mind. Strike it from the record. That is the Nirvana album I was listening to in 1992. Understood.

Okay, so here's a few questions. The first big question is, and I only learned this as an adult, and I feel almost like misled by you and I'm angry at you because you tell us right off the top that underwhelmed is not a word. Okay? But it is. It's in a dictionary. Speak to that. That's pre-Google.

I don't know. I just thought it was funny. But you didn't have access to a library with the Oxford Dictionary. The scope of the journal or whatever self-conscious book this got written in when I was a teenager, I didn't think, oh my God, I wonder if, maybe it is a word. Maybe I'm lying in this song.

And then what will happen? Because this song came along at a time when I was literally writing in a journal, like a little goofball like in the coffee shop writing you know poetry and but and this and it predates so this gets recorded in in 19 September 1991 so we recorded this there are two versions of this song so the original version was recorded in September 1991 it's the first thing that we ever recorded. And that was right as Nirvana was happening. So we owe a lot to the timing of... Nirvana changed our lives and gave us an opportunity.

Basically the one big opportunity we had in our life that we're still... We haven't had an opportunity since. I mean, that's not true. But that was but we're still blowing on the ember of the opportunity we were given because of Nirvana. But this song, I think, is from even four or five

years before that. It was just in a book. I just had the poem, as it were. Do you still have that book, by the way? I probably do. Kurt Cobain had a book like that. I know Kurt Cobain blows his brains out at 27. It's a whole different story.

But I bought, I literally bought the copy of his notebook. Right. That he was doing the same thing you're describing. Yeah, mine was decidedly less nihilistic. But it was just as, you know, it would be just as embarrassing to read now because I was just saying stuff like, why do those jerks have those girls or whatever? Like, pathetic. Like, sensitive boy.

Okay, so you mentioned you owe a lot to Nirvana. So two things come to my mind, which is, one, now you've got a bunch of, like The Edge is a good example in Toronto. That station now... We didn't have anything like that in Halifax. I didn't even know that existed.

Because that station, now that it's going, of course, there's a CanCon rule here too, which we'll get to, but now that they, that's the music they're going with,

whatever they were calling it, new rock or modern rock or whatever, we can call it grunge, whatever, you fit in, that sound that we just played with Underwhelmed

fits so perfectly with that. I heard, like that was a high rotation on our local modern rock station that's right but the kind of CFNY slash like 102.1 The Edge or whatever that was a vanguard station so there weren't very many alternative rock stations at that time. So I really, that was the only place that we,

that that song got any play. Is that right? So like outside of the GTA, outside of Toronto, you know, that wouldn't even be on the radar of a lot of people. You know, we would say here,

we're going to play Underwhelmed. And within 200 miles of toronto people would be like all right but outside they're like play the future shop song or whatever that's funny okay so we we started talking about halifax as like canada seattle this was the scene yeah we we took advantage of that too we were self-conscious of that and thought it was goofy, but we benefited from that for sure. And who else? Thrush Hermit, right? With Joel Plaskett. This was the...

And Sarah McLachlan was there at the time. Is that right? She was there in high school. She left right after high school. She went to Vancouver or something like that. That's right. So she's associated with Vancouver. She didn't... Yeah, so you wouldn't know,

people didn't know who she was until Vancouver. But I did, I remember her from being kind of on the scene, although I didn't really run with her. Like I could count the amount of times that I was in the same room with her, like on one hand. But I wasn't, I was really, I come from the sort of like the hardcore punk scene was what I was into. So she was playing music around town, but I would have thought it was just lightweight.

And, you know, I would probably maybe like it now. But at the time I was too rough for that. What about Joel Plaskett? Like what's your relationship like with him? I think at one point I was kind of a mentor character for him. You know, I don't want to put any kind of importance on my role in what he's done. Like, he has really kicked ass and really has a little empire down there. And I think he's good to people and all that stuff.

But I have a romantic memory of hanging out with him. He was literally a 16 year old boy and I would have been 23 or whatever. So I'm seven years, his senior. Now we're the same age, but at one point, you know what I mean? Like,

uh, yeah, at one point I was, uh, an older kid and, and I was kind of hot shit in, in, uh,

town and Sloan. I got a record deal with Geffen. Even before our record deal, we were kind of like the happening band in town and we liked them and we kind of gave them some opportunities. And I remember at one point they were, it got to the point where,

not just with them, but the other groups too, our involvement, so originally no one had aspirations of having a record deal or getting out of town or anything. So then all of a sudden Nirvana happens. The world is upside down. The music industry is looking,

comes looking for people like us and they find us and we got a big break. And so then the aspirations of everybody else in in halifax and probably you know all over the world or whatever changed it was like hey i'm in a cool punk basically punk band that can write songs too and so you know we put out the first little ep by thrush hermit and we we supported them and took them on tour and all that stuff but became a time where where our involvement with these groups um almost seemed like a detriment because they they were all seen as like Sloan's little brothers and like just like we we kind of owned the story of being from Halifax and so it it would have been as Nirvana was to Seattle, we got to sort of

own that story. And all of the groups, the Super Friends, Thresh Hermit, Hardship Post, I don't know if they are on your radar, Jail. Yeah, Jail is like J-A-L-E. That's right. And that was women. Right. And a lot of these groups had to sort of be these sort of sub-stories of our story. And I felt at one point that it was almost like they were like, I don't want to come on tour with you guys anymore. And we were like, come on, our friends, we're all buds. And they were like, you know, it's kind of not cool anymore. Escaping the shadow.

Now, you mentioned the word sub there. So tell me how this went did you sign with Sub Pop? we did not why do I think you signed with Sub Pop? we did a single on Sub Pop and we were buds with the Sub Pop people so

the first people that we spoke to were Network speaking of Sarah McLachlan that was her label and we spoke to were Network, speaking of Sarah McLachlan. That was her label. And we talked to people at Network, and they were like, we did a little cross-canon, the tour which brought us in May 1992 to Vancouver.

And the people at Network saw us. But a guy from Geffen came up and saw us. It wasn't David Geffen. I never met David Geffen, but we got signed to Geffen by this guy who was like an underling mailroom guy who worked under the stream at Geffen of a guy named Tom Zutod, who signed Guns and Roses. He signed Motley Crue to A&M.

He was like, he was like a, a big A&R guy. And our guy was like a minion of his named Todd Sullivan. And he signed us. And we didn't do much for Geffen, for sure. But then his next signing after us was Weezer. And they became so big.

You could have been the Weezer, man. We could have been Weezer. Had Weezer's first record been our second record, I would be a giant success. Yeah, you know what? He's funny with me, because here, so you guys, your first album,

your first album, main album is Smeared. Smeared, yeah. And it's got a grungy kind of sound to it, and then you put out Twice Removed, and it's a different sound,

and I think there's this perception like, oh, this is different, and then it's, although we're going to get to how it's underappreciated, and then time goes by and it's actually super appreciated. But I always think of Weezer because they put out the, I don't know, the Undone, the

Blue Album or something. I think it's just called Weezer or the Blue Album. And then the second record was a real departure for them. Yeah, exactly. And then everyone's looking for that again because it's got the Undone, the Sweater song, which is like you're underwhelmed or whatever. And we're looking for that and the Buddy Holly or whatever. And then it's different.

And then a little time goes by and you realize that's freaking better it's different it's better a little bit of comparison there but um i have a cut so so you're caught up in this grunge wave geffen uh smeared of course uh played a lot here i had no idea like vancouver at the time in 1992 i had no idea vancouver didn't have one of their modern rock stations playing the mess out of like they might have've had like, there's a wreck. There's a couple of stations out there. There's one called Seafox. They may have been going by then, but,

uh, you know, CFNY was really early, early on us. And, uh, and so underwhelm was big in Toronto, in this area,

but I don't think really anywhere else. And then we didn't really get a lot more radio play until uh you know four years later or something because because as you say our second record was a big flop yeah let's talk about that second album because this song is yours as well see i'm focusing on the chris murphy song i appreciate it although in this era in this era it was very much about me it was kind of my band at first to share. And I was willing and happy to share it. And luckily I did because the other guys, Patrick especially,

kind of became the main money generator, really, like his songs. But from the beginning, even early on when most of the songs were written by me, I was really into this idea that we all share them equally. You had a Beatles-esque mentality there, right? Where all four of you would write for each album? Yes, so Beatles in that we wanted to be four irreplaceable characters within the band. But the Beatles, just John and Paul made all the money. That's right, they were just... The Beatles, just John and Paul made all the money.

That's right, because that was their deal with their songs. So they just split their songs and then spent less time on George songs and Ringo really... Ringo just sang songs that were written by John and Paul. George did have some pretty songs though. Here Comes the Sun is a George song. Yep. No, George had...

I don't think... I don't go as crazy for george as as a lot of people do but um he's but he's got five unbelievable songs and then is he the mitch marner of uh beatles and that he's playing in the austin matthews uh nylander shadow or no i don't know i don't know what you don't know we'll skip that comment i'll strike that from the record all right so coax me though and twice removed and is not beloved as the follow-up to smeared at the time I recall so yeah it's we kind of felt that that the alternative music house of cards was going to come down at some point because it seemed that every every candy ass candlebox band was in this sort of alternative club and i was like let's get out of here like at some point someone's gonna say emperor's new clothes like what is up with this

crappy music so let's get out of here and uh you know our first record i record, I was hard on it, like, for the subsequent years after. I was like, it was just like a, it was so du jour. It was so, it was kind of like, like it was on the kind of caboose of this sort of shoegaze thing. Like, it was almost like a song for song ripoff of the 1988 record Isn't Anything by My Bloody Valentine. Like, our reference points were already kind of over. Internationally,

we're over, but in Canada, it would like seem new, but it was like, this is pathetic. Like, we're, you know, when you're from Halifax

and we're just like, we're kind of the shoegaze band in Halifax. But when you're like, when you're going to England, it's like, it's embarrassing. It's like, this is five years old

and so we're like well let's get out of this let's reinvent ourselves let's try to make timeless music instead of this sort of like of the times music so from our second record on Twice Removed our reference points became John Lennon Plastigono Band

Fleetwood Mac you know these other like points became John Lennon, Plastigono band, Fleetwood Mac, um, you know, these other things like this song right here is, is basically a carbon copy of, uh, go your own way by, you can go.

Yeah. So it's got that sort of syncopated versus, and then the sort of four on the floor, um, uh, chorus or whatever. Love that track. So anyway,

so we wanted to make, it's like, oh, Smeared, that's so, that's whatever, hack. Yeah.

And then, now I like it again because it was like, yeah, it was of the time, but you know, I was, we were whatever,

23, 22 when we were writing it. So like, that's, it's adorable. And in a way, when you write music that you hope is timeless, the other, you know, then in a way, when you write music that you hope is timeless,

the other, you know, then in some ways it, this is maybe an unnecessary sidebar, but like when music is really of a certain time, that becomes, there's currency in that. It's like that really reminds me of that time. But when you have a song that could have come out in 1981 or 1990 or 1965, it's like, when was that? I don't even know when that was. But Twice Removed, sorry, just to speak to your point from earlier, it was kind of a commercial flop because we kind of tried to reinvent ourselves, which Geffen was like, I get it, I get it.

You're doing a different thing, but really you're making our job difficult. We've marketed you as this type of band and now you're this different band. This is the Neil Young thing where he'd put out some kind of a... But he was already kind of established. So we were just like this new band and on the one hand we were like,

and remember we have different singers. They thought that was a drag too. It was like, we're trying to market you here. Yeah, they like the front man then patrick sings this one and then and they were like you know chris you should sing them all and re-record twice removed and just make it like smeared and we were like no way man this is what we're gonna do and you know so a lot of people like that story because it really seemed like we were really sticking it to the man or whatever. Whereas, truth be told, I would have probably done anything to be successful at the time.

I was like, this is my opportunity to make something of my life. But that's what we decided to do. And looking back, I'm glad because People Do, like Twice Removed, did become important to music lovers and stuff. It was like, it was a real about-face, and it was maybe daring to do and to have done it in the face of commercial failure and all these things. Sometimes I cynically think that what people like about it

is the sort of commercial failure aspect of it more than the music. It's like, I love that you were such a commercial failure. We love that. There's something to that uh it's kind of like an indie rock sort of like loser mentality it's like yeah man and in canada i noticed that we sort of embraced that like we all turned at some point i know deservedly so maybe but we all turned on nickelback like because they sell like millions and millions of albums like there's something to that like we we love you because you you didn't sell millions and millions of albums. There's something to that. We love you because you didn't sell millions and millions of copies of Twice Removed or whatnot.

But just to close up this Twice Removed point, and everybody who knows Sloan knows this, but it's a fun fact, that the 1996 reader poll by Chart, you've got to put an exclamation mark, the Canadian Music Magazine Chart, ranked it as the best Canadian album of all time. chart you got to put an exclamation mark the magazine music canadian music magazine chart ranked it as the best canadian album of all time like that's uh crazy talk right that's uh yeah so it's hyperbolic silliness but like and so you want to accept compliments of course, like when you're, you know, as vain as I am. But you think, you know, if you take that seriously,

then you have to take seriously everybody who thinks you suck. But like, I don't really take either seriously, but... You can't cherry pick your... Yeah, so like if you're going to accept that, then you have to accept how terrible you are or how terrible you will become. When you're making your 11th or 12th album, and people say, these guys used to be cool.

It's like, well, we're as cool as we can be for 48-year-old men. What do you want us to do? Heroin or something? Did you ever do any heroin? No. Because in that grunge scene, I know you already said no, but the anniversary of Layne Staley's death was, I think, yesterday or something, like 12 years ago. Yeah, that music means nothing to me.

He's fine. I have nothing against him. So you did not even... Who is that? Screaming Trees? No, no, no. Alice in Chains. Oh, whatever, yeah.

Not my bag. Okay. But I love Nirvana, and that was, you know, that's a nihilistic guy, but he's also really funny. And Kurt Cobain. Well, yeah, he had his own addictions with heroin. Yeah.

So Sloan avoided that trap fall. That's why you guys are all still with us. Yeah, we were never quite as troubled, I think, as Kurt Cobain. I feel like I'm more like a Dave Grohl character. I think that he just loves music

and loved and wants to work hard and is an affable nice guy. Yeah, he's like a family guy, right? And he's got the kids and all that and then he goes and rocks with whatever. You know, a lot of people make fun of him like he's ubiquitous, And he's got the kids and all that and then he goes and rocks with whatever. A lot of people make fun of him. He's ubiquitous. He's like, whatever.

And if I probably had the opportunities, I would do everything he did too. I'll induct Rush into the Hall of Fame. I love them too, but I didn't get that call. I noticed he likes to go on drums with his idols. If they need a drummer

or whatever, he'll jump in there and do that. Well, he's pretty good. He's a world-class drummer. He's excellent. I heard he was a drummer with a popular band back in the early 90s. I saw Dave Grohl play in 1988 with his band Scream in Washington, D.C.

Wow. I went down to Washington, D.C. with some friends from Halifax to see Punk Rockers and we were about to leave. We had been there already two weeks just sleeping in a van

in the boiling hot 40 degree weather in a place that was way more dangerous than we understood as well. And that's Fahrenheit, but no,

that's Celsius, sorry, yeah. We were just like sleeping, you know, in a van, like in a parking lot in D.C., which is like pretty high murder

rate and stuff. And then we heard Dave, uh, we didn't know Dave Grohl all the time, but we heard Scream. It was this band we liked. They're playing in a week. Let's just stay an extra week and see it. And so we did. It was, they played probably 25 minutes and they just played covers and stuff. And we were like, we should have probably gone home. We stayed a week for this. No, cause now you got that story. But now that story that's right and what would i've done had i gone home just like fart around that's right so twice removed uh yeah the uh is it true that you guys almost broke up after twice removed yes we uh that became kind of a story because we didn't break up in the end.

We came back, and then people just thought that we were either pulling a publicity stunt or whatever, just making up a story for fun. But we actually did want to break up. We were ready to break up, and we were essentially inactive for the better part of a year. up we were going we were ready to break up and we were essentially inactive for the better part of a year but we were playing shows we were playing the end of the shows that we had the obligations that we had and then there were a couple of um opportunities to play shows for money that we took because we were broke and young and uh but i had every intention of you know forming a new band or whatever i was going

to do jay and i were kind of working on our little record label that we had down there murder records murder records terribly terribly named that r is shared though that's what you murder records they share the r is that yeah the second r like murder records kind of thing yeah yeah murder records and um the thing was i really thought that andrew was gonna leave i thought that andrew had already moved to toronto the rest of us were living in halifax i felt like by doing so he had sort of established that it wasn't his priority kind of thing but at the same time i was so romantic about the the the chemistry of the members that i was unwilling to entertain the idea of getting a new

drummer so i was like i'm out so we fought about that because i think that other people probably were just like let's continue on and make something with our lives and i thought we're young enough let's just like reinvent ourselves we can be in another band or you know i had other friends like my friend matt murphy no relation i was in a band called the super friends and I toured around with them as their drummer for a while. And I kind of thought that I was either going to join that band or I was going to try to poach Matt and be in a band with him. But wait, there's more. The roots of Sloan go all the way back to 1986 when Chris Murphy met Jay Ferguson and they played together in a band called the Deluxe Boys Jay Ferguson also visited my home and we also recorded an episode of Toronto Mike together

here's Jay telling me about Underwhelmed this little jam got my attention the first time i heard it okay she was underwhelmed if that's a word i know it's not because i looked it up that's one of the skills that i learned in my school and by the way still i mean i was overwhelmed and i'm sure of that one Cause I learned it back in Mexico When I was young Okay, so this song's from Smeared. I kind of need to step back, actually, but we'll have this in the background. It's a good starter here.

Give me the Sloan origin story. The origin of the band kind of right exactly yeah well uh shoot okay so i played music uh everybody in the band kind of played in different bands uh chris and i were in a band called carney lake road from 87 to 1990 And that was a band also that had, I sang and wrote and Chris played drums in that band and he sang and wrote and then Henry Sangalang who went on to be in a band called The Flashing Lights. I don't know if you would have been familiar with them. So Matthew Murphy, who I went to school with as well,

had a band called The Super Friends, which were on Sloan's Murder Records label. And then when The Super Friends broke up, he started a band called The Flashing Lights and Henry ended up playing in flashing lights so henry played with this uh sorry long family tree here i'm trying no i actually i this is i need this okay seriously slow it down in fact this is good stuff so so henry originally played uh with chris and i in carney lake road from 1987 to 1990 and uh you know we played we even played here at the Rivoli in Toronto in 1990

and got interviewed by Erica M. And I felt like Kearney Lake Road was like, you know, maybe we're really going to make something of this. But it's hard. And, you know, the music was not... Did Chris have this song already? Or was there something... Oh, for Underwhelmed?

Not at this point. No. I mean, he... When did he write this? It probably would have been... So Kearney Lake Road broke up in 1990. Chris and i were still friends and chris played music with andrew uh with another friend of theirs named uh shoot i'm blanking right now uh jim and um uh and uh then patrick also played in a band at the same time called happy co and uh and then around 1991 early 1991 like

uh patrick's band broke up chris and i started talking about playing music again together in late 1990 and he already knew andrew and chris taught andrew how to play drums and immediately andrew was a better drummer like in five seconds and chris is a great drummer but andrew still gets back there uh yeah he does no he's chris is a fantastic drummer, but Andrew is super... Well, he still gets back there every time. Chris is a fantastic drummer, but Andrew is so musically capable on multiple instruments. Great piano player, super guitar player, and a fantastic drummer. The best drummer in the world. So, it was almost like musical chairs. In Halifax, bands would stick together for as long as they could, and then it's

like, well, we've played the Flamingo 15 times, and we've played every benefit for CKDU, the college station, and we can't play anywhere outside of town, or we can, but it costs us money. What do we do now? That band breaks up, and then you start another band. So it's almost like musical chairs. So our band started in 1991 with Chris and I,

and we invited Patrick or talked to him because his band broke up, and Andrew had been playing music with Chris, so it seemed natural that he would come and play drums. And we sort of made some recordings over 1991, and one of them was on a compilation called Here and Now, which originally only came out on cassette. It was like a compilation of Halifax fans.

Did this have like Eric's Trip and Thresh Herman on there? What's on there? Do you remember? They weren't on. Shoot, were they on that? You know what? I'd have to go back and look. I feel like I have. Okay.

But on this note, I'm going to ask a question real quick here from DJ Dream Doctor. Okay. That's a cool handle on Twitter. Wow. My favorite Sloan release is the first EP. Yeah. So he wants to know, A, is that okay? Is that okay to like that? Yeah, that's his question. It's great. Yeah, no, I love it. I think it's

a great recording. It's called Peppermint, yeah. His second question is, he wants to know whatever happened to Jail? What happened to Jail? Sure, Jail, so our band once, our band kind of took off. We had Murder Records, which we released other bands. You mentioned Eric's Trip and Thresh Hermit.

So in the early 90s, our band, you know, we got successful by, we signed to Geffen Records and we sort of got out of Halifax and a lot of other record labels came to Halifax and signed bands. And we also put out a lot of records by bands from out east. And one of them was Jail, eventually jail eventually but jail had already signed to sub pop so they put out two records on sub pop and then an ep on our label then they changed their name to the v's and i think they became a trio at that time but they kind of just i think a lot of bands you know there was an exciting gold rush era in 93 94 after our band kind of got out and we were

lucky that you know we were able to get out and we had a little bit band kind of got out and we were lucky that, you know, we were able to get out and we had, uh, a little bit of money put behind us and we had radio, you know, as you were saying, 102 Point the Edge played our, played our records. And, um, we were able to continue it almost as a, we were fortunate enough to almost continue it as a business so that we could keep going and make records. And we developed enough of a audience that we could keep going. Maybe some of the other bands that, you know, signed to sub pop or other independent labels,

they, they reached a certain plateau and then it was, maybe they just didn't have that, you know, a breaking point where they could make it over the hump to the next, the next stratus. It can be very expensive. Yes,

exactly. To be an artist in this country. Certainly, yeah, yeah, yeah. And I mean, I think there's a lot, I don't know if it's easier or harder these days. I'm very grateful that we were able to build up an audience, especially during the 1990s. But there were bands,

so a band like Jail, for example, they just sort of went as far as they could and they kind of hit a wall and they didn't really have that, oh, that hit song that took them to a broader audience or were able to play to more people and more people. They kind of just probably hit a broader audience, or, you know, we're able to play to more people and more people, they kind of just probably hit a plateau, and we're like, you know what, I'm in my late 20s,

am I going to continue, or, you know, maybe I want to get married, or maybe I'd want to have a job or pursue other interests or whatever. So that kind of happened to a lot of bands from out east, and, you know, our band was fortunate enough that we were able to, you know, have a big enough audience to continue. Underwhelmed was a hit in Canada and peaked at number 25 on Billboard's Modern Rock Tracks chart in the United States. In 1993, Sloan embarked on a 10-week North American tour, which included dates opening for the Lemonheads. Sloan's follow-up to Smeared, twice removed, royally ticked off their record

label Geffen, as it was far less grungy, and yadda yadda yadda, they released their 13th studio album in 2022. Did I yadda yadda yadda the best part? You're damn right I did. 500 up, take it in, coax me, people of the sky, the good in everyone, everything you've done wrong, the lines you amend, money city maniacs, she says what she means, losing California, if it feels good, do it, the other man, the rest of my life, all used up,

who taught you to live like that, believe in me, unkind, scratch the surface, how's that for yada, yadda yadda? Remember earlier when I told you Shania, Alanis, and Celine had sold hundreds of millions of albums? 30 plus years of big, slow singles, high rotation, much music videos, and nine Juno nominations, and they've sold just north of 200,000 albums.

But they call their own shots by releasing music on their own murder records label, splitting the money four ways with each member writing on their own and even sharing vocals. That same lineup that blew my mind in 1992 with Underwhelmed is intact in 2023. How many bands can make that claim? Yes, Sloan is underrated because Sloan is fantastic. And I'm sure of that because I

learned it back in grade school when I was young. I'm sure of that one Cause I learned it back in day school When I was young She said you was funny I said you are funny She said thank you And I said never mind And she rolled her eyes Her beautiful eyes

Boy, it's not the grammar It's the feeling That is certainly in my heart But not in hers But not in hers But not in her, but not in her But not in her, but not in her We were talking about people that he beats I felt like an ass cause I was one

She said it's okay but I felt like I just ate my young She's like still person with a cause I told her that I don't smoke or drink She told me to loosen up on her way to the L.C. She skips her classes and gets really great I go to my courses rain or shine She's passing her classes while I attend mine While I attend mine While I attend mine

While I attend mine While I attend While I attend I'm blinded I wrote out a story about her life I think it included something about me I'm not sure of that, but I'm sure of one thing Her spelling's atrocious She told me to read between the lines And tell her exactly what I got out of it I told her affection had to rest Especially when you're here with me I usually notice all the little things I was proud of it, she said, there's no need

She cursed me up and down and broke her heart Her beautiful heart She says I'm caught up in the triviality I really wanna know what she thinks of me I pick my love for her and fix me Miss the point I miss the point I miss the point

I miss the point I miss the point I miss the boy I'm not afraid of the dark And that brings us to the end of our 1,310th show. You can follow me on Twitter. I'm at Toronto Mike, but I'm also at Toronto Mike on Blue Sky Social. So if you're there, follow me because at any moment now Elon's going to do something

that pisses me off just enough to uninstall that Blue Bird app. So I'm on Twitter and I'm on Blue Sky at Toronto Mike. This episode was made possible because of the wonderful support from Great Lakes Brewery, a fiercely independent craft brewery who has been servicing us in Ontario since 1987.

Fresh craft beer. Get it at GLB. Get your authentic Italian food from Palma Pasta. Go to palmapasta.com. They're in Mississauga and Oakville. They're also going to feed us on September 7th. Listen closely. This is a free event. TMLX 13 is 6 to 9 p.m. on Thursday, September 7th. We're all collecting at Great Lakes Brewery in Southern Etobicoke. It's down the street from the Costco,

not too far from Royal York and Queensway. Join us there, 6 to 9. Great Lakes will buy you your first beer. Palma Pasta will feed you. We're all going to collect and socialize, and it's going to be fun. TMLX 13 getting hip to the hip is

coming sooner than that getting hip to the hip is on September 1st and I got the exciting news yesterday that Sean Cullen will be there to entertain you so you get Sean Cullen you get a Tragically Hip cover band you get a recording of Getting Hip to the Hip that wonderful podcast

and I'll be there. It'll be a great time. So if you're listening to this, go to gettinghiptothehip.com and use the promo code FOTM10. It'll save you 10%. And if you want to save money, get your Pumpkins After Dark tickets at pumpkinsafterdark.com. I've got a promo code there as well it is T-O-Mike-1-5 T-O-Mike-15 that saves you 15% Pumpkins After Dark the award winning Halloween event is in Milton from September 23rd

through Halloween be there and while you're doing shit recycle your electronics at recyclemyelectronics.ca don't throw your old tech in the garbage go to recyclemyelectronics.ca. Don't throw your old tech in the garbage. Go to recyclemyelectronics.ca and drop that stuff off so it can be safely disposed of.

Speaking of safely disposing of, shout out to Ridley Funeral Home. Pillars of this community since 1921. Brad Jones has an excellent podcast called Life's Undertaking. I got a note the other day that they love how Brad talks about life and death and how he records his podcast. I'm honored to co-host it. Find Life's Undertaking with Brad Jones from Ridley Funeral Home, wherever you find your podcasts. Speaking of that,

if you like what you hear on Toronto Mic'd, I'd love it if you told three, no, four, five friends. That's your homework. Tell five friends about Toronto Mic'd. See you all later this week.