Trading Secrets - 161. Kat Stickler, TikTok sensation, dives deep into her trials and tribulations that inevitably lead to her successes as a professional, mother, daughter and inspiration to millions.

Episode Date: April 29, 2024

This week, Jason is joined by entrepreneur, social media sensation who is known for her infectious energy, relatable humor and candid storytelling, Kat Stickler! Over the past few years, Kat has grown her social media following to over 12 million strong by storytelling her life as she seamlessly juggled parenthood and her career. Kat’s ability to relate to her followers by sharing her experiences going through divorce, co-parenting and the intricacies of motherhood through comedy makes her one of TikTok’s most popular personalities in today’s world. In addition to her thriving social media presence, Kat has partnered with major brands such as Olay, HGTV, T-Mobile, Amazon and more. More recently, Kat has added entrepreneur to her resume by becoming the proud co-owner of a retail beverage brand Stur natural water enhancers. Kat gives insight to how nerves are a good thing, how she shifted from ambitions of becoming a doctor and working in a research job at a VA hospital to considering becoming a lawyer after the birth of MK, how she struggled with PPD and adapting to life with a newborn in the middle of the COVID-19 pandemic, why she believes she went viral, how the divorce impacted brand deals, and her relationship with money. Kat also reveals how she started working with her manager, what she needed to do in order to make it work and how she planned it out on a cardboard box, her agent explaining why she decided to work with her, her insight to content creation, one of her biggest viral videos, and the good and bad that resulted from it. What book motivated her to join TikTok? What were the first times she felt like she made it? What fulfills her? Which makes more money, the creator fund or ad deals?  Kat reveals all that and so much more in another episode you can’t afford to miss!  Host: Jason Tartick Co-Host: David Arduin Guests: Kat Stickler Stay connected with the Trading Secrets Podcast!  Instagram: @tradingsecretspodcast  Youtube: Trading Secrets Facebook: Join the Group All Access: Free 30-Day Trial  Trading Secrets Steals & Deals! The Washington Post: From climate and culture to crosswords and cooking, The Washington Post helps you discover a world of surprising stories, important insights, and actionable advice. To access The Washington Post for just under 50 cents per week, head to WashingtonPost.com/SECRETS Trading Secrets is sponsored by The Washington Post Monarch Money: Unlike other personal finance apps, Monarch’s simple, intuitive design makes it so easy to set up, customize, and use. Monarch is obsessed with constantly improving the product by releasing updates every two weeks and allowing customers to submit suggestions, vote on requested features, and view the product roadmap. Trading Secrets listeners will get an extended thirty-day free trial when you go to monarchmoney.com/SECRETS  Factor: Get chef-prepared meals on the table in 2 minutes with Factor's ready-to-eat meals, so you can get back to doing what you love this spring. Factor meals eliminate the hassle of prepping, cooking, or cleaning up. Simply heat and savor the good stuff. Head to factormeals.com/tradingsecrets50 and use code tradingsecrets50 to get 50% off your first box plus 20% off your next box. ZocDoc: Zocdoc is a FREE app and website where you can search and compare highly-rated, in-network doctors near you AND instantly book appointments with them online. Go to Zocdoc.com/TRADINGSECRETS and download the Zocdoc app for FREE. Then find and book a top-rated doctor today.  Lume: As a special offer for listeners, new customers GET 15% ALL Lume products with our exclusive code - and if you combine the 15% off with the already discounted starter pack, that equals over 40% off their Starter Pack! Use code TRADINGSECRETS for 15% off your first purchase at LumeDeodorant.com

Welcome back to another episode of trading secrets. I'm your host, Jason Tarterkin. Welcome to the pre-market trading segment, where I'm going to tell you a little bit about our guests and update from the market and just a little update from my personal life. Well, here we are. I am live in stagecoach right now sitting at the Patron House. We have some fun people that are staying on the property.

I saw Lana Del Rey is here. Nikki Lane is here. Joey is here from The Bachelor. Kelsey is here from The Bachelor. We have Alex Hall and Polly from Selling OC. Nick Deo, who is Gary V's VP and just a great human and his girlfriend, Aaron, were here. And many others, it has been such a blast. I've never done stage coach before.

But I will tell you, this was just such, such. a special weekend the music was incredible the energy was electric and i just like the vibes it's just like clean good vibes i don't know that i've seen one person angry the whole weekend even with you know hundreds of thousands of people standing in line shoulder shoulder waiting to hear their next musician everyone just had incredible vibes we got to hang out with nicky and pre bella they gave us some passes to go party with them that was a blast too but without further ado let's get into today's guest. A very, very creative, brilliant, beautiful human inside and out, Kat Stickler. She has gained her popularity through TikTok that really popped in 2020. And Kat's

whole story is just truly, truly, truly incredible. She has been through the highest of highs and the lowest of lows. And through each of those has used them as an opportunity to grow as an individual and connect with others. She is praised and beloved by the the people that are in her closest to circles, but the people that are on the outside of her circles that follow her, look up to her for inspiration for that light in times of darkness as she has experienced that darkness isn't connected with so many people by sharing that.

And when you're just having that bad day, cats comedic skits will certainly put a smile on your face. Now, when we recorded this episode, it was about, it was early February. So just to give you a perspective from a time standpoint, And of course, in an episode like this, I would highly, highly encourage you to stay tuned to the recap. One, because it's a curious Canadian, a close friend.

And of course, in a rare, rare circumstance, David was in the room. David recorded with us. This also was a great episode to catch on YouTube because the dynamic in the room was so absolutely hilarious. And you'll hear more about that in the recap. But for the first time ever, we did a full intro. And then after 15 minutes of recording, all of us were like, should we restart and in unison, everyone's like, yes, and we restarted. Those details again are in the recap. Now, when we did restart, what's interesting, as I was doing the edits,

I didn't pick up, we refer to, you'll hear me refer to the fact that she passed on the Bachelorette. Why do I say that? Because in the first intro, which we didn't grab, we deleted that, we talked about the fact that after her divorce, she was approached or her manager was approached by the Bachelorette to consider being the lead of the Bachelorette. This was news to me, I did not know that. This is around the 2021 time frame. So I found that pretty interesting. But trust me, I tell you, I think another thing that's really worth mentioning,

when we talk about finances and money, I'm big on financial transparency, right? I'm like, let's share numbers because through numbers, we can educate, we can insight. We can learn. We can grow. We can use other people's stories through numbers to help navigate our own. But I am learning, especially three years into this, that there is a small subsector within this space of financial transparency where sharing the numbers can actually be unhealthy and or unproductive. Now, I do think those are outlying circumstances, but they do exist. And in this episode, we had some calls before to make sure we were not stepping into those, right through divorce we can learn a lot where pre-numps or protections or insurances could have

helped people what people would have done then knowing what they know now sure but in some circumstances with divorce and child support and other things these numbers can be unproductive and we do have guests and celebrities on all time that can't share some of the numbers because they're contractually obligated to not share those numbers right so there is a small percentage of outlying circumstances in which we can't get into those so this episode You're going to hear numbers, but there's also some areas that we do stay away from. But the numbers you do here will be impressive. I think the inspiration, the creativity and things you could take away from Kat's journey

and apply them to yours are what will really help you when you think about building your brand, your professional and personal, and of course, financial success. So get ready. Trust me when I tell you, this is an episode you can't afford to miss. Now, this does connect to this episode because Kat has a child. Now, she doesn't talk about, and her child's name is MK. She doesn't talk about MK technically being on payroll. And I don't think she is, but she talks about her mother being on payroll.

But I thought it would be cool to share that there are actually our tax implications in which if you own a small business, you can hire your child to work for the family firm. Now, let me explain. The child's earnings are likely to qualify for this favorable tax treatment. So as a small business owner, you can pay your child and hire them up to three, three, $13,850 in 2023, and that number jumped up to $14,600 in 2024 without them owing any federal income tax. So the strategy and the thought process is that's because the amount of that matches to the standard deduction for single filers. Now, there are some things that have to come with this, right? You have to give them an actual job. So they must be performing some sort of work.

You have to make sure the work suits them as a child. You have to pay reasonable wages and then follow employment laws and keep good records and, of course, consider tax implications. But, you know, I have a buddy who's a dentist, owns a small business, and his child does marketing on his Instagram. And by that, I mean, the child is literally in pictures. And he could pay his child that money and he could use that as a tax write-off for the business.

So that's my little financial tip before we get into it. And the personal update I gave you, we were in stageco. coach this week. I was good to see so many people from Bachelor Nation. I ran into pilot, Pete, Tyler, Dylan, Hannah, Joey, Maria, Kelsey, Sean. The list is endless. And I already told you some of the people are staying at this house. And Patron has been an unbelievable, unbelievable brand to work with. So if you get a chance, go check out their L Alto and L. Cello. Those are their two high brand tequilas that are fired. But you know what? I'm off of this stage coach, talk enough of the finance talk let's ring in the bell with the one the only cat stickler welcome back to

another episode of trading secrets today we are joined by entrepreneur social media sensation and most importantly mother of one mk known for her infectious energy relatable humor and candid storytelling cat stickler over the past few years cat has grown her social media following to over 12 million strong by storytelling her life that she seamlessly juggled parenthood and her career. Kat's ability to relate to her followers by sharing her experiences, going through divorce, co-parenting, and the intricacies of motherhood through comedy make her one of TikTok's most popular personalities in today's world. In addition to her thriving social media presence, Kat has partnered with major brands such

is Olay, HGTV, T-Mobile, Amazon, and more, and more recently. We love this, David. Kat even added entrepreneur to her resume by becoming a proud co-owner of a retail beverage brand stir natural water enhancers, which I will tell you guys, go check out the YouTube because she is drinking it right now. Today we are going to learn all things about Kat. How she gained the attention of millions through living her life every day with a comedic twist. Kat Zickler, thank you so much for me on Trading Secrets today. Thanks for having me. So here's the deal, David.

This is not the first try. This is the second attempt. To Money Mafia back there, we got David. And David is very rarely here on the ones and twos, special occasions. But I tried to get Kat on the podcast in Tampa Bay. She confirmed. And then last minute, she canceled on me. That's, you know, tough.

But we did get her pegged down here. We had a dinner, and we were some friends. I was telling her about the pod, what she can expect. And in general, I could tell you this, while she's extremely impressive and like I said, infectious energy on social media,

the podcast stuff gets her a little, gets the nerves flowing. Do that? It does for everybody. It does for me. Are you doing this for three years? Not as bad as they were in the past. Yeah.

But it's always nervous. You get the bright lights. Yeah. You almost need some like background music in here a little bit. Yeah, light it up a little bit. You know,

but it's great. It's great to be here. It's so great to see you. Now, I've been trying, I've, in our little podcast, meetings that we have. We talk about guests. I brought your name up years ago about someone that we should get on the podcast because Jason relies on me for the social media space. There we go.

Jason relies on me in the social media space. I spend way too much time on TikTok and Instagram and your content is like you said, it's infectious. It's high energy. It's fun. And you kind of blew up around the COVID timeline a little bit when a lot of the creators on TikTok blew up. So I've been saying your name on our podcast meetings as someone that we should get on. and so you're here. So I'm feeling good about it. She's tough to get a hold of them. You have to get a hold of.

You know, you throw a message in there. A lot of people throw messages to her. 10.2 million followers on TikTok. 10.3, according to my notes. All right. Well, here you are. We got you pegged down. You're here.

Before you get to the questions, how you feel it? How are you? Super good. Yeah? Yeah. Really, really calm. I love this stuff. All right, let me ask you this.

I think this is very relatable for people back home because no matter what job, they're in at some capacity like nerves come into play. You are in front of millions of people every single day. And it surprises me that like even jumping out of mic makes you a little bit nervous. So how do you, what's your advice for people back home like when they get nervous in these situations? Like how do you handle yourself to keep performing? Like what type of advice would you give people back home when nerves enter into the equation? I feel like nerves are good. They make you feel alive. I think you should be nervous at least once. day. Or 50 times today.

Is that? All right. Well, we're happy to have you on. Let's talk a little bit about this. This is a fun topic. ABC, the Bachelorette. Was there any part of you that thought about doing it? Yes. Okay. And what was like the business strategy behind not pursuing that? I feel like it wasn't really a business strategy. It was more like a life, a life strategy. Um, I think it was just not the right time. And my focus wasn't dating a bunch of guys. Also, that sounds like a lot of work.

That would be a lot. I know people are like, that sounds awesome. Like, whoa, guys. And you have to make out with all those people. That's the thing that gets me all the time. You probably made out with that girl and she made out with 80 guys before you. Well, 30. Yeah.

That makes it sound a lot of bad. Like, I cut it off at 30. Yeah. Yeah, but also you did. I think you know this. You get fully blood tests. Like everyone there has to be. That doesn't make it.

better. It doesn't make it. No, that doesn't make it better. Why does it not bother me? Because it's, you're still swapping spit. I just did think about it. I'm like, whatever. Like, I mean, whatever. Did you ever see another guy on the Bachelorette and then he had like lipstick on his mouth? And you were like, 100%. 100% that happened for sure. And you were like, it's cool, man. I'm going to go get some lipstick on my mouth now. You get my turn. All right. So if you were that we're going way off the business category here, but if you were the Bachelorette, night one, there's 30 guys. You got to at least sit with 20 of them. What percentage of do you think you're going to give a kiss to? None. Zero.

You're not kissing one guy? I'm pretty sure it's in their contract where you have to kiss. I would put the contract, no. Really? Yeah. You would have made it or you still could make an electric bachelorette. Yeah. And they could lean in and it would be a fun like, hmm.

You'd be the first person ever to not kiss one person. Yes. Okay. How would you then give? And we're going to get to business here, guys, I promise. But how are you going to give the first impression, Rose? If you don't like, because conversation, you think I'm going to be like,

Oh, your kiss was so good. You get a rose. You're going to make a great life partner because you can mac on me good. ABC's listening. You might have to call her and she might have to be your next batch, you're right?

Because I think the ratings would be electric. I'd watch it. I might submit myself. To be out. Oh, to go. Oh, I see what you did there. Yeah, you know. Why not?

And now we definitely watch. There we go. All right. Well, now that we covered that, let's take a walk down memory lane, Miss Kat Stickler. I think what's wild about your story is what you've accomplished in such a short period of time, right? So you went from being a med student, all these years later, over 10 million followers, making

absolutely waves in the creator space. Like, it's really, really cool. But unexpectedly, you're going to be a mother, just like talking about that time frame. And some of the stuff from like a financial perspective or planning perspective, like, where was your head and how did you continue to proceed with such confidence? I wasn't confident when I proceeded, but I still proceeded. So I really wanted to be a doctor. And then I actually got like a lot of nerves because I wasn't, I think I honestly just wanted to make my parents proud of me.

I wanted to feel like I've had value in society. And everyone's like, doctor, lawyer. That's what you have to be. And so I took a research job at the VA hospital. So it was post-combat veterans. And I was just really passionate about it. It was a TMS study, which is transcranial magnetic stimulation.

We studied the brain. We did EEGs. It was like, it was the best. It was the best. It was so great and I fucking loved it. Can I cuss? Yes. I didn't mean to cuss.

And before that, I did this exoskeleton trial. And it was like seeing people walk for the first time. And I think I just really wanted to feel like connection. Yeah. And just be a part of like it's so fucking cool to see someone walk again. I just felt like that made me feel value and that gave me. purpose in this life. I feel like I've always had this existential crisis. Like whenever I'd go out, I'd be like, I'm here. I'm wasting time. What am I doing? What are we all doing here on this earth?

Why are we all here? And I think I found it like through research and studying that stuff. So I was really passionate about that. And then this is actually kind of funny. Yeah. I don't know if it's funny. I think it's funny. Let's hear it. We had to do EEGs and all the vets. So it was post-combat trauma veterans. And we were basically testing if there was a correlation with TMS and CBT. There was like three trials, right? So you had therapy, TMS. You had therapy, fake TMS, and you had just TMS. They were testing to see, these are vets that had like a lot of trauma. They weren't sleeping. They've tried therapy. They've tried medication. They've tried immersive therapy. They've tried everything. So we were trying to see if this worked. Okay. When you're doing this testing,

are you still in school? So I'm doing both. I'm doing school and I'm working. Okay. So this is a research job. then. Yes, at the VA. And it's crazy to get a job at the VA if you're not actually a veteran. Okay. It's hard to do that. It was because I volunteered a lot at first because I just love them. We talked a little money here. At this point, what are you making? 40,000 here. So 40,000. So working with the government was really good because they have really good benefits. I left when I was literally right before I popped. I stayed the whole time. Okay. And that big girl. Yeah. 41 weeks. I kept her in an extra week and I cooked her out there. Wow. Okay. So then you have them. Think about like, how soon after having MK did you start to see some traction with all the social media growth that you've had?

So after I had her, I was actually super, I mean, I don't even know how old she was, she wasn't, how old was she when I made my first video? Nine months. Yeah. Those nine months were a struggle. Yeah. When I got to the nine months. When you say struggle though, what, tell me about it. Like I had like PPD. I had the whole thing. It was. Honestly, I think it was also my circumstances. Like I was, you know, it was a very brief dating time. And then I'm pregnant and I'm married and living with this person, having a child with them.

And my whole, the trajectory of my life just got derailed. And so did this other persons. You know, it's not just mine. And I just felt like, like I was asleep. Yeah. Like I felt like the pregnancy was like, I was super happy and like just eating and happy. And then after I had her, it was like, what happened?

Yeah. Like, then I feel like my body was like protecting the pregnancy and then after it was like, I woke up from a dream in like someone else's life. And I had a lot of trouble identifying with this new person because you like lose your autonomy. You lose, you lose everything. With PPD, with PPD, I don't know, lose everything when you have a kid.

Lose the life that you used to have 100%. And so then, you know, your whole focus and everything shifts to what your current life is. And that it's the biggest change that you could ever make in anything. Changing a job seems like nothing compared to, I mean, I didn't, I wasn't pregnant and I didn't birth the child. So I can't imagine the impacts it has on your body. That's huge too. Yeah.

And then after, it's like, okay, this is a new life and you'd left your job. And now you have a child to take care of and was in the middle of COVID. It was in the middle of COVID. So talk about change, right? Like what's happening in this world? With the PPD, were you working at this point? No, this was, I had like, so I was on maternity leave and then COVID hit. So they were like, since it was a research study, I couldn't go back.

Okay. And they're like, let's just wait, let's just wait. And they kept waiting and waiting and waiting. And I don't know, it was wild. It just really left to your thoughts. Your body's changing. Yeah. Your life is changing.

I was very obsessed with making sure she was alive. Like, and I just didn't sleep. I would just try to hear her breathing every hour. And I think that just added to me not sleeping, which added to like all these thoughts. And it was like. So did you start making content on TikTok and Instagram because you were just home and bored? Or did you make anything? So you didn't even have a TikTok before, like when you were pregnant or anything.

No. It was all after. All after. Wow. What made you even sign up for TikTok? Like, was social media any part of your life in any capacity? Okay. I mean, I would delete it for months at a time because it was such a distraction.

So what made you actually download the app? Such a good question. Because everyone was doing it during COVID. Yeah. Everyone was doing the dances. Like, I still remember my COVID TikTok playlist memory in my head was like, it's when everyone was burnt over. That's what I jumped out. I didn't want to be on.

on. But I was just like everyone says you have to be on. Yeah. You know what I mean? Obviously, you've had a lot of success in a lot of different capacities, financially and professionally in all different worlds today. This was only, this is like three years ago. When you see where you are today with the like monstrosity of success that you have. Monstrosity. Monstrosity. What would you tell that girl going through PPD, unemployed, dealing with some relationships. issues, a single mother. I wasn't dealing with relationship issues. You weren't at that time. Maybe I was. Okay. What would you tell that person? I'm actually unsure. Probably was. What would you deal? What would you tell that person? I wouldn't tell her anything. She's going to figure it out.

Okay. Yeah. All right. So then that's the golden question. How did you figure it out? What was it? Thanks for asking, Jason. Yeah. I'll take over from here, boys. Let's go. So I read this book, You Are a Badass by Jen Senchero. Jen, if you're watching this, I am a big fan, and I would love to meet you one day. So it's basically about embodying, just believing in yourself. And I just felt like I didn't believe in myself.

And it sounds so cheesy, but I literally did everything in that book said. And then that's what made me want to get a TikTok. Because I was like, you know what? And people didn't want to do TikTok because they were embarrassed. Yes, yeah. But I got pregnant and I was embarrassed by that because it was like, it wasn't planned.

It was this whole thing. My parents were like, what are you doing? My friends were like, I'm so sorry that this is happening to you. It wasn't a happy time. It ended up being the best thing ever. but it would just, at that point, it was, I had to, I was scared to come out of my house to show my belly. Yeah. Because it was big.

They would know I was pregnant if I walked out, no matter how big my sweatshirts were. I had already, like, gone through this thing of embarrassment that was way bigger than posting a video online. And then I just started posting. And then I put, just like, do a video if you wanted to do a video when MK's napping. And I would only film when MK was napping. Wow. And then I kind of liked editing and I liked storytelling. and I liked communicating creatively like that.

It helped me express myself. I feel like I've always had kind of a hard time expressing myself. So I think it was a cool outlet that I never knew could be, you know, a job. Yeah. So once you started getting going, what am I doing? You're doing great. You're doing great. One thing I think about is like, especially coming from the Bachelor franchise,

everyone gets, you get ABC cameras on you for three hours, two to three hours a week, for 10 weeks. You get this huge platform. And you, in a short period of time, have gained a mass following larger than probably 10 to 15 leads combined, especially on TikTok. And you did it in such a short period of time. What do you think it was about your videos, your storytelling? What is like the trading secret behind Kat Stickler's Secret Sauce that made you explode the way you did with your videos? That's a good question. because there's something so like literally like I'm going to compare you to this you think about like the

greats out there there's something about Tom Brady the way he read plays there's something about some of the best Michael Jordan the way his work ethic Kobe Bryant what you did in such a short period time I don't know 10 people maybe in the world 10 to 50 people in the world have done it what was it I don't think I'm special I think it's I don't think it was I think I can make a decision and really stick with it once I make my decision. I think that's a superpower because I feel like a lot of people are really back and forth. But like I decided I'm like I'm going to have this baby and I'm going to own my life and my decisions. I was like I'm going to get married. Like I want her to have like a united like father, mother in the same household. And then when things kind of took a curve, I made a decision. Okay, this is what I'm going to do now and I stuck with it. But I don't think I'm special in the sense of I just went through a lot in a condensed period of time. And I think a lot of virality is based on related. ability. Like you see viral videos, especially the ones, you know, there's no language. If it's a universal understanding, those go insanely viral, right? Like, it's like, you don't need language and anyone can connect like that. So I think I just went through a lot and just a very short period

of time, which allowed me to connect with a lot of different people. So I think that was really just going through a lot. Yeah. Do you think that if you didn't go through what you went through that your virality and your success and falling would be what it is today? No. I was. I also don't feel like I would feel like I had anything to contribute. Right. Or just say. Yeah. Because when you go through it, it's hard.

But like, you don't think it's hard in the moment because you're just like trying to survive and you're like, I just got to do this. Was posting and growing your platform? Is it like almost like a coping mechanism too for what you were going through in a way? Like did you really like lean on, lean into it because it was maybe one of the only things that made you feel good or like a release? I think it was also like questioning. Because, you know, some brands didn't want to work with like, oh, well, you were married now. Right. That was why we wanted you, but you're not married anymore.

Interesting. So I think it was also figuring out. I remember I asked Alice, I'm like, am I going to be able to, like, afford an apartment by myself? Because that was a huge thing. Like, with my ex and I, he would always handle the money stuff and I would handle, like, the creative and the filming and the, and just doing it. And I've always had this, like, relationship with money that, like, I respect it. Like, I really respect it. Yeah.

I don't really like diving into it because it's. really overwhelming. My ex and I, like, we didn't come from money, so it's not like it was this thing. I just always felt this odd relationship with money. So I actually, I think that's why I was nervous on this podcast. I just, money makes me, it makes people weird. I feel like it makes people change. Yeah.

It brings out a different side of human beings that you, like, really never see. People kill for money. Did you know that? Oh, yeah. It's crazy. It's a job about that. It's absolutely nuts. when was you had mentioned like you and your husband you didn't come from money but then you step into it

with all this business like what was the first big moment where you're like whoa wait a second I'm making these videos online cool I'm getting followers and likes but like now I'm making money what was that and what was like the first check you saw that you're like holy shit I got paid that amount to do this like the first time so this is going to sound odd it was two times so the first one was a Christmas ornament. I did on my stories. It was for $250. Okay. What year was that? I don't know. Like, you asked these years. I feel like we're in 2021. I don't even know what year we're in now. 2024. That's a long time ago. Three years ago. Yeah. Okay. And this woman had made these handmade ornaments and it was $250. That got me so excited. And I feel like you should be just as excited. I'm not just like really, just

like really respect and appreciate that work as much as you would, a huge deal. Yeah. But that was the first one. I was like, oh my gosh, I'm making a difference in her small business. Yeah. And then when I actually got my manager, my soulmate, my best friend, my lover, I just love this woman. I don't, I just love her so much. Alice, what year was it that you started working with Kat? 2020, you started working. So you guys started working before Kat went viral.

70,000 on Instagram, 400,000 on TikTok. I want to give people a little background. is Katz Manager, extensive resume in the marketing and I mean, the names working with Haley Bieber, the biggest players out there. And then when, BP, baby, she was VP. Yeah, and when created her own boutique, we're going to get into a lot of things you already talked about, but I got to ask you for the talent she was working with at that point, like, you were just up and coming. So did you have to, did you have to ask her to work with you? Did you have to hit a certain threshold. Like, what did that look like? So she like basically reached out to me in DMs and I was like,

hey, do you want to FaceTime? That's how I communicate with human beings. And she was like, sure. And then I'm like literally like breastfeeding MK. I'm like, hey girl. And she was Australian. I'm like, oh my God, you're Australian. I didn't understand half what she said. It was funny. I saw a video she did that e-news posted. It was the peach milkshake one. I think a lot of fans know this very well this video. And I just knew she had talent. And I wasn't. looking to do this, but I just wanted her to know, girl, you've got it. You have to go after this and I'm sure agents and managers are going to be circling and they're going to see it what I see as well. I knew she had what it took because I've worked with the world's best,

right? Brady, Haley, Haley, and so I'm very good at spotting talent. So I just wanted her to know you've got what it takes and you should go after this. This is something you really should pursue. So you saw the it factor in Kat and that's everything. And I saw the it factor and Alice. Okay. So how did you get Alice to work with you then? Well, Alice told me like what to ask all these brands that so like these agencies that wanted to sign me. Yeah. And they take like an extra 15% off the back end. And I was like, I just like Alice. And I called her back and I was like so I did what you said. And I interviewed all these people and I just really want to work with you. This is huge. Like having a someone who believes in you. Yeah. Because she's also an extension of me and she represents me. And it's my livelihood. like she also takes care of that. Like, that's a huge responsibility. You have to trust whoever is your agency. You have to.

How they get back to brands, how they respond, how quickly they respond, what they say when they turn a brand down, what they say when they're negotiating. Like, it's a huge dance. And if your agent or your manager isn't doing a good job, it's going to reflect poorly on you. And it kind of goes into you are who you surround yourself with. So it is who you are. And I asked her, I was like, so what is it?

Because she was, you know, playing hard to get. Yeah. Okay, that's fine. I was like, how much do I need to make for you to do this full time? And then she told me, and I was like, okay, I was like, give me six months. You know what my question's going to be. No, I'm not going to tell you how much she said. Because I honestly don't even remember what you said.

How much? How much was it? How much was it? Wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait. I'm going to take a guess. I'm going to take a guess. You go first. So it's how much does she need to make?

No, how much do. How much does Kat have to earn? It doesn't matter. Either way. Either way. Either way. Yeah. How much does, let's just say, how much does Alice have to make to make it worth while knowing the people she's working?

I would say, I would say, I would say Alice needs to make six figures, minimum. Yeah, I was going to say, $2.50. Yeah, that's my guess. What was the answer? Hi. Hi. Wow. Let's go.

Wow. Price is wrong. She challenges you. She says the number she needs to make. You say what? So then, yeah. Let's fucking go. Okay.

So that moment right there, what did you? Obviously, now you're in full business mode. You've got to start monetizing. What did you do to do it? Or what did you change? I got a big box and I broke it up and it was a big cardboard paper and I wrote down everything I had to do. What did you write down? I wrote down minutes.

I wrote down. I need to sit down and focus and edit for this amount of time. I need to film during this time. And when MK naps, I need to like clean the kitchen. Also it was a very small apartment. So I want like space, clean space, clean head, you know? Yeah. Do you guys clean it a lot?

Yeah. Yeah, yeah. Cool. And also, she turned down a lot of deals. Like, she was like, we're going to have to say no a lot. Yeah. It's kind of like dating, I think. It's like, you got to just go through the weeds. Like, no, sorry, no, sorry. No, sorry. Like, don't just say yes to the first person that asks you out, ladies. Don't do it. Say no, actually, to the first person. She said no a lot. And I'm like, hey, just checking in. I'm not going to be able to get these numbers. You keep turning down these deals. We haven't been making any money lately. This is my income. And she's like, this is just the always. come back. And they came back. Just like they always come back. They always come back. And it was like, they came back even better. And I was like, whoa. So it was a lull period. But I had full like faith and trust in her. I got a question. I need you to come to the mic here. Come to the mic. This is the question I have for you. You look fucking good. So people need to see you. Here's my question for you asked.

So six months, she had to earn this amount for you to work with her. What would that have taken? What's the blueprint to do what she had to do to earn that? I said, okay, what brands, just give me your dream list. Tell me who is your dream brand partner. You know, and we, when I manage someone, I'm, as you can see, we get, we go deep. Like, it becomes like a family. So it's a very, my management company is very small, very boutique. I don't want to be a huge agency with hundreds of talent. I want to give very personal one-on-one attention. Yeah. Very kind of high, high touch. I mean,

visually, I mean, so I feel like we just spent so much time together. Why aren't you guys? Right? Yeah. We spent so much time together.

And so I know her in and, like inside and out. Like I know her answers before she even says them. And I think it just really helped me understand her what she wants. I know what she would say yes to,

what she would say no to. And I just, honestly, from the beginning, it was just believing in her. I just knew she had it. And I just knew just keep going. Don't worry.

You know, you get haters out there and things, but I'm like, put the phone down. It's very much just making sure she was okay. It was my main priority. It wasn't actually about the money. I'll be honest. It wasn't.

Yes, of course, you know, I came from corporate and, you know, I had a salary and I wasn't, I was turning something else down to then start this company to do this. Yeah. So, you know, I'm, you know, we both want to be successful. But it wasn't about that. It was really making sure she was okay. Because I knew the rest would follow. Yeah.

Okay, I got another question for you while you're here. You've worked with megastars, right? people back home are lost. They're trying to find their star in them, no matter what it is that they're doing. Kat's done it exceptionally. You manage her day to day. What do you think it is?

What is it about Kat that makes her, you know, I saw a list, top 10 U.S. skincare influencer in the entire country, 10 million plus followers. Like, what is it about Kat that makes her like that? And then what advice would you give for someone back home? It's like trying to find the star in themselves. So for Kat, it was her relatability,

what she touched on before. As we always say, vulnerability is the route to all connection. And she is so great that she just, she goes there. She's so open and sharing to her fans and her followers and shares things that so many people

wouldn't tell their best friend, let alone millions of people. And the fact that she did that, it allows people to connect with her. And you know what? It became cathartic for her as well, going through what she went through. And I was there.

I was, well, were you there? I was I there? First play there. I was on the 7-A-N flight that day. But so the fact that she doesn't allow fear to stop her is incredible. Now, obviously, everyone's different, right? Yeah. Your talent is very different.

You've got a different brand. You've got a different connection with your followers, right? But with Kat, it was she had something to share, and she's such a good person. She's just probably the kindest, loveliest, sweetest, funniest. I mean, she's just the real deal. so genuine. And I just, honestly, I just, I remember I always used to say during COVID, you're doing crying. I'm not. But when I said during COVID, I can't wait till we can start traveling and people can meet you. Yeah. And the effect, you guys know, the effect she has on people

is you guys. Yeah. Everywhere we go, people are obsessed with her and they should be because she's incredible and she should, she just needs to know that every day. Yeah. Wonderful. That's beautiful. That's beautiful. And your relatability too in helping people like, I know you talked about your passion as you were being a doctor, like you felt really fulfilled? Like, are you getting that same fulfillment now through your videos because your content is so relatable? Like, you're helping a lot of people. Yeah.

I think I was like seeing, it's different because I'm on a screen. I think it's definitely affected my social anxiety. But I think I could see someone walk. I could see someone get better. I could see someone analytically like, oh, they're sleeping more. They're not having nightmares. That was different. So it was more, this is just a screen.

screen. So I just go off of what people tell me when they come up to me. Yeah. I read something that your video has to be a certain amount of time on TikTok, and then per a million views, you make a certain amount. Do you have any idea? Like, how long does the TikTok have to be for you to get paid off the creator fund? This is a new thing TikTok did. On desktop, you can schedule content, which it didn't have before. Okay. How much or how long does a video have to be for you to get paid? Over a minute. Okay. And then suppose you get a million views on an organic video.

If you had to take a shot in the dark, like how much cheating TikTok pays you from a creator fund on a million views? Like less than 2,000 per million. But like, 2000, okay. Like we have cop video that did millions and that was 10 seconds. So you don't get anything for that. So you wouldn't get anything for that.

So you get a million views on TikTok organically. If it's over 60 seconds, you make a couple grand. But if you have like 10 of those videos a month, that could be like 20 grand just off a TikTok creator fund a month, which isn't, I mean, that's pretty. good. So the Creator Fund brings some money in, but the ad deals are significantly more. Okay, tell me about this, but your videos, like almost every one of them just pops. We've watched them in preparation. They're absolutely hilarious. What does the prep look like? Do you like write it all out? Do you have it scripted? Do you like have editing? Like talk to me about like the preparation

for your videos. I wish I could say something beautiful. Like I wake up in the morning when the sunrises and I write my scripts out and I film. But it's literally just whenever it's, comes to me, I write it down. Because you were a writer. You were an English major before. I love writing. I love reading. I love stories. You're a good storyteller. Yeah. Like when you were telling me a story. Yeah. That one time. Are you flirting with it? Yeah. I was going to say, what's what I? You're telling you stories. Right? Exactly. I am not flirting with you. I'm talking to the camera. I'm not flirting with you. Okay. You keep that on record. Are you turning red? No. Am I?

A little bit. What was I saying about? You're writing. You're great in talking about your writing. and storytelling. You're in English major. So you do all your writing before you shoot? Not everything. Like, I've done Hispanic mother skits where a whole skit, but my mom doesn't think it's funny. So I got to redo it. Like, when I film with her, like, I have to get her organic laugh. Okay. Um, so sometimes I wing it or sometimes she'll do something hilarious and I'd be like, we got to film this right now. Like, this is hilarious. It's honestly, there's no rhyme or reason to it. Okay. Really not. And I wish there was. and I think I'm trying to make it like that because even though I'm a creator, like, Jed Appetal has a thing where he's like, you got a write.

You got a right. You got a right. You got a right no matter what. Like you're a creator, but you still got a right. And I just have a hard time with that. It's hard to be funny all the time. It's hard to connect all the time when you're still processing your own emotions. Suppose someone back home is like really inspired. And they want to just try and gain a little following for their business or for whatever they're trying to do.

Is it really important to follow trends and use trending music? When I grew, it wasn't through trending audios. It wasn't through trending music. It was through like setting a trend. It was through doing a new, something no one's done before. That's like, that's when it really added to follower growth. You can do the trends are fun. If you want to do growth, I think it's like set your own trend.

Okay. One thing you started off doing pranks. With our agency, we rep some people that do prank stuff. And some of them get billion across all social media. They get billions of views a month. We can't get a deal for them. They get paid off the creator fund. And some of the issues are that their pranks have no connection to them.

They have no brand. So when they speak about a brand, people aren't buying from them. They're just watching their pranks. What do you think it was that got you to move from pranks to get views to people to say, I love cat stickler. I am engaged to cat stickler. I need more of it. What did you transition with your content to really start getting people connected to just you?

I think the divorce. Yeah, when they kind of saw me, I kind of lost my mind a little bit. I mean, everyone wants to see if she's going to, you know, fail or not. So I think it was just they saw me at my most vulnerable and they saw me. I was sad. I was so sad. Actually, when Alice came after everything happened, I was laughing a lot. I was hysterical.

I was in shock. And people were walking by like, oh, they are having such a good conversation. And I'm like, little do they know. My life is just 10 to 180. I was losing my mind. I was losing my mind. So I kind of lost my mind in front of people. And every, but that's the thing.

Like, I'm not special. Like, everyone goes through this in their own way. Like, you go through your pain and stuff. Mine just happened to be shared. You mentioned your divorce. I just want to ask you, the book I wrote is about love and money. Are there any lessons on love and money, conversation, communication, maybe things you might have done differently going through a divorce and being a mother?

I am so happy. I have MK, like she's the best thing in my life. But whoever you decide to have kids with, you are tied with for life. I think I was naive to that. But I would, you know, do it all again. I love her. I'm just saying that to girls out there and guys out there. Just human beings out there would always handle like the money side.

And I would just like make the money like and be creative and be funny. And that was just, I felt very naive after everything happened. I hated feeling like that. I just felt like a deer in that. headlights and I just hate feeling like I felt sorry for myself and I hated that I would ask you to send me books I was like I need to learn like what am I doing where is this money going how do I invest you know the ostrich when it's like about to get killed it just puts its head in the sand yeah that's how I felt with money over half a couples have financial infidelity which is like cheating

through money interesting based on the lessons so it's it's doing things deceptive with money that the other person doesn't know about spending spending and not telling maybe it might be on gambling It might be on drugs, could be on whatever. Wouldn't you know if it's a joint account? Well, I think the question comes from you saying, like, he handled the money. Like, through your lessons, did you learn? Was there any type of financial infidelity or financial fraud happening? No.

Next question. Okay, next question. All right, we'll move on from love and money. But we'll stay on the topic of family. You already mentioned your mom. She's a star. She is hilarious. Of her.

We've seen the video. videos. She's hilarious. Okay, a question I have for you then. Has your mom got any paid deals? No, but she should. She should. She's on payroll. Mom is on payroll.

Okay. Talk to, so there are different tax strategies where you can put family on payroll. Is that something you did? Lower's tax. Yes. Yeah. Wow. You do know your, you read that finance.

Yeah, I'm really smart, Jason. Smart, quick, funny. Keep going. No. You were saying? Yeah. No, but. my mom yeah we owe it all to mama she's the best i love that woman so much are those your most

consistently um popular videos like they do the best or with your mom i think my my first Hispanic mother video i was like people are gonna think she was really strict on me but like everyone was like oh my god my mom does that too i'm like oh my god you too and she's like yeah she makes me eat food that's expired oh my god did you ever get sick and they're like yeah so i'm just like connecting You remember the first one. Like, it's always when you're making videos like this, you don't know if people will connect. Like, you don't know if you're the only one. That's like those crazy viral videos that it's like something so specific.

And everyone's like, oh my God, me too. That does so well. So I think that was leverage that I had with going through what I went through. They're like, oh my God, she's going through divorce? Me too. She has a kid? Me too. Yeah.

Like just, I really like to cover my bases with relatability. During a day, like when you're just going through things and like something weird happens that you're like, oh, I guarantee this happens to every. everything. Like, do you write that down as an idea for like the next video? Sometimes. Interesting. Okay. Now, a big video, you already mentioned it, it went super, super viral. Just recently was this big NYPD video. Oh, NAR, Jason, NAR.

So there's this video of you, for anyone that hasn't seen it. I think it has over 30 million views, at least on Instagram. So I can't even imagine what TikTok is 50 million. It's actually 68 million on Instagram. Eight million. Okay. But you're walking around the cop and people

totally connect to this. I got to ask because there's a lot of some backlash with it. What do you mean? What backlash? We'll talk about that. Okay. But my first question is...

Is this your clickbait? Is this your like, guys, watch this podcast. She's going to talk about the cop. She's going to talk about the cop. Actually, the cop is here. Come on out. And so is his girlfriend.

Okay. Okay. So why? What, like, what I'm trying to get at with a lot of these questions, are people back at home, as she's chomping on her ice in the microphone. People back at home can start to like learn from your success. Like, why is that video going? Why are you 16 million people watching that? Why? What's the answer, Alice? I think it was three things. One, can I also note Alice found this man. She said, I was talking. Is Alice the genius behind you? Yes. Alice is Alice is Cat Stickler. Everyone go follow Alice. You guys think it's me. Alice saw you want to do. But we were in Times Square in New York and I was like taking a picture with this beautiful family. And then Alice is like interrupting me.

I'm like, this is so not like Alice. I'm like Alice, what? I'm busy. I'm like talking to people. She's like cat, right there, right there. Go, go, go. I'm like, because I wanted to do a cop video. Yeah.

Because it was a trending audio and. So you do like a trending audio. I did like a trending audio. But I knew I was getting a police escort. So you got to do the training audio. It was based on, you know, what's going on in your life. Yeah. And then I saw the cop and I'm like, all right, nice to meet you, everyone.

I'm going to go film this really quick. It was a three-minute interaction, okay. We did not touch each other. Obviously, Cat looked absolutely stunning. She was literally about to walk on. You did, Kat. You look's beautiful. Time Square stage, host the ball drop. So that was amazing with Kay Jolers, Love U.K.

I love you, Kay. Okay. There was obviously, at the time, TikTok had all these cop videos, right? So you see thousands of these videos of girls. walking around a policeman and some of the times the policeman. Everybody knows that I'm a good girl officer. That's the audio. Exactly.

Some policemen interacted with the creator and some didn't. So some worked, some didn't. You know, Kat looked incredibly beautiful. This young man looked very nice. He was, you know, all up for it, very happy to do it. It was literally a three-minute interaction. Like she said, they never even touched. It was Times Square.

It was New Year's Eve. You could see the lights around. It was just all of these elements. It kind of connected. It was New Year's, you know, it's just, it had all the elements, right? It was how Cat walked around, looked. It was just, it was very engaging. It was super quick.

It was like 10 seconds. But then life went crazy. It was wild what happened. So that went crazy. Let's talk about this. A viral video like that, tell me the area's good and bad. How does that impact business? If you want to know, actually, an hour after that video went live, I did a deal because of that video.

Interesting. Was the deal larger or smaller than K? Huge. One of the biggest deals. Well, I won't say who or what or whatever, but we were working that night and it was like almost midnight. But obviously people could see there was a magnet, which was like there. Now, did we know he was single?

No, there was no conversation about that. But, you know, they just followed each other on Instagram. That's all that happened, right? Nothing bad. But literally an hour later, a very. very nice offer was made for if something ever had progressed with the two of them. Oh, wow. But we never got that far.

Okay, you didn't get that far. Whoa, what was it? Yeah, that's like on that note. All right, what give us to bad? What bad came from that video business-wise? Bad. I mean, I don't know. People were like, oh, she's a homewarker because he has a girlfriend.

But again, I get nervous with doing stuff like this because you can see everything I do, right? Yeah. They saw a 10-second video based on someone saying, oh, that's my boyfriend. someone asked you to take that video down. I go to my DMs. No one asked me to take any video down. And I'm like, wait, what's happening? And then this whole narrative gets...

Because, I mean, that's social media. It's just perception. Everything is perception. Interesting. Was he interested? I'm not saying it. No. Yeah, that's a no point. All right.

All right. Well, we'll leave that. You guys can go watch the YouTube and just get a little reaction. The YouTube video here. People can see you. This is on YouTube? Oh, yeah. They can see your reaction and then make their own...

distinction. Kat, Stickler, this has been one of the most interesting podcast, a wild one. You're a fascinating human. I get why people just want to keep watching it. You're very special. You have something very special. It's very unique. It's different.

It's great. It's you. But we got to wrap with the trading secret. Actually, we have Atlas here, too, so we'll get one from you. It is a lesson on money or career navigation or just even life. Can't get from a professor. Can't learn on a YouTube tutorial or TikTok tutorial. you can only get from your experience. So we'll start with you, Alice, a trading secret from

Alice, given all your career track, maybe working with Kat. What would the trading secret be for people back home? Okay. So it's a, I think a lot of people follow this rule where you pay yourself first. And by that I mean put 10% or 20% of whatever you can into a savings account, high interest savings account, something where you've got money for a rainy day. Then you go through, you pay your mortgage, your rent, your grocery bills, your car, your petrol, all those kind of things. But you always want to pay yourself first and just get that money out of the way when you get your paycheck or however you get paid because compound interest is going to be your best friend in life. That is a hell of a trading secret. And one that's in the book. So Alice,

we are aligned. I feel like Alice, feel like you and I are aligned. Jason, we can agree with Alice's secret. Cat, trading secret. You've gone through a lot. You've come from nothing. And now I haven't come from nothing. How dare you? You built everything you have. Let's rephrase that. You built everything you have, and now you have the world at your fingertips with so much to look forward to.

What's it trading so you can get people back home? Like, honestly, dealing with finances, I was avoiding that because I felt like I didn't understand it. It was overwhelming to me. It felt like this huge shadow, and I was like, I don't want to do with that. But it's not empowering. It's empowering when you tackle that. It's empowering when you learn how to use a new software.

I'm like, I'm not tech savvy. I don't know. it's empowering to learn these things that help further you. And also it's like having motivation. M.K's my motivation. And she, I just really want to make her proud and I want to and also just having a self-awareness to know your values. So they're not so easily swayed by another human being or like by someone else's opinion. I think that's huge. Because I feel like I know who I am and I know the mistakes I made. I know why I made them and I learn from them and I know why I did them and I know what I do and why I do it. And I know who I am and it helps me whenever

or anything with all that outside noise that helps shut it out. So that helps I think also in life. I think that's great. I think that's great. I'm going to wrap with this. I want you and me quickly and then we're going to wrap to give a trading secret. What is one secret you've learned from Kat, either today in this interview or from her success?

To me, the fascinating part is like you leaning into your social media at the hardest time of your life was the thing that saved you. And I think that that's like really powerful is if you're struggling, you've got to lean into something that makes a you feel better, and then if it can also make other people feel

better, it's going to keep motivating you to do it. So I think leaning in to something like that when times are tough and finding what that is for you, and even when times are good, leaning into something that impacts others is a pretty powerful message. Yeah, I think that's a really good one. I think that's a really good one. Mine would be your resilience. I think you've seen a lot. You've gone through a lot. You keep pushing forward and you keep growing. I think that's amazing. And I think the second one is you are truly, truly unapologetically yourself at all times. The same person that we walked into this door with is the exact same person on this mic. Like there is no stage present. There is no fake tone. She has no stage presence. Like literally

actually none. We actually need to work on this. It is absolutely incredible. It's like no switch, no nothing. Wild. It's I've never seen people say it. And this is not. that you act? No, no, no. You are like 24-7 consistent. And that's why they love you. And that's very special. I never lose that. So that's my trading secret. I've learned from Kat Stickler. Alice, Kat, David, what a great episode of trading secrets before we wrap, because we got another podcast that's coming in here for everyone back at home. I don't know how they don't follow you, or maybe they don't know your handles. But if they don't, where can they find everything you have going on? On the internet? What I mean? Like, Pat Cicler.

Cat Stickler. Cat Stickler. On TikTok. I don't think my, I have an accent right now. I know what that came from. I don't think my YouTube is Cat Stickler. It's Cat Stickler 5757. Go follow her and YouTube Cat Stickler 5757.

TikTok Cat Stickler. IG Cat Stickler. It's not like an info. And that's what I do. Go check out. Stir. Stir is the company she has ownership in. Go check it out.

You have equity in that. Anything else before we wrap? No. No, thank you for tuning into another episode of trading secrets, one you can't afford to miss. Ding, ding, ding. We are closing in the bell to the cat stickler podcast with the one and only, the curious Canadian, lot of action, lot to cover. I am, I am at the edge of my seat waiting for the curious Canadian to chime in for this.

One, because you're the curious Canadian. Two, because you're a very close friend. and three, because in a rare, rare occurrence, David, you were in the room podcasting with us. So what do you think and where are you at? What do you got? Yeah, I mean, there's no more interesting recaps for me than the ones where I'm on the episode.

And there were never more interesting episodes than being in the room recording this episode, which we'll get into, Jason. But listening back, honestly, it just brought back like feelings and memories and like, belly laughs from from being in that room so if you don't mind jason i feel like as curious canadian i got to paint the picture for the viewers at home of kind of what i'm talking about if you're good with that paint it paint it baby all right so when we when we recap or when we recorded it was in february uh late february that was that the first that was not the first confirmed not the first

confirmed not the first time that you had met cat correct confirmed so i had just for a timestamp perspective I had met her two weeks before that for the first time. I was in Tampa Bay because the vice president of our agency was getting married. And, you know, a lot of the time, what I do with my travel schedule, David, as you know, is I will see where I'm traveling to. And then I'll try and understand who's in that city and try and schedule a podcast with them. So when I was in Tampa, I was like, okay, how do I make a fun trip somewhat connected to work and recognize that Rob Grinkowski's there,

Camille, his girlfriend sometimes there and Cat Stickler's in Tampa Bay and both Rob and Camille were out of town so I reached out to Kat to try and podcast with her and we had some issues with scheduling it and her timing and she got booked for this deal that she had to go somewhere that weekend for so we couldn't podcast but I actually met her

I was like all right well why don't we just have a why don't we grab lunch and I'll talk to you about because she was like really curious about what the podcast is like what we'd actually talk about so why don't we grab lunch and actually I'll tell you like what it's about. So that was the first time I met her about 14 days before this. Okay. And since then, obviously, since you recorded, you guys have, you guys have seen each other again? Oh, look at you. You're dropping words like, obviously, David. But you're dropping

words like timestamps. So I'm just trying to do my part here. I've seen her since then. Yeah. Okay. Okay. Well, people, you know, being in that room was hilarious. And Jay, I think that you could kind of add to this too. But it was just, I, I was there. I was excited to be on a podcast. I also was a little hungover because we were in Chicago with some friends at the time

when we recorded. And I was nervous as can be and to see look over and see Cat as nervous as me was a hilarious, be extremely unexpected. And then you put a little fairy dust if I'm looking at her,

she's looking at you, you're looking at her, everyone's looking at me. I'm like, I think she likes him. I'm pretty sure he likes her. And we got a podcast together. And it was like

the funniest. It was just so funny. It was like one of those like where you like you, you just can't stop laughing. Like you can't stop giggling. It doesn't matter what anyone says. It was hilarious. You know when you're in those moments in life where there's so much intangible energy. Whatever the conglomerate of that energy is, but there's so much that like you just don't remember or you'll never forget that feeling of being in there. That's what I felt like with this episode.

And I think because we knew for everyone behind the scene. we knew coming into this that cat was really really nervous about this she rarely does like live podcasts like this she talks about in the episode we're talking to a camera in front of millions of people on a day-to-day basis doesn't faze her at all but the idea of like the live lights the camera and i think obvious you know a lot of the things david you alluded to but also the subject of like money with her like this this is the stuff she never talks about and feels uncomfortable was so there was like all these moving parts and i mean i'll never forget this we deleted guys i want to tell you we did a 15 minute part of this episode and we literally meet david and her all at the

same time we go should we just start over and everyone in unison was like yeah start from the top but i did a full intro welcome back to another episode of cat back bye bye bye bye and cat thank you so much for joining us today and it was just like 20 seconds of crickets no words And David's like, cat, this is what you're supposed to say, hi, thank you for having me. And she just started breaking out and laughed at her. Like, it was so bizarre. It was hilarious. It was so fun.

Most people are like, oh, thank you so much for that intro. I have to bring you everywhere. She was like, hi. Hi. Hi. Thank you. After like 20 seconds, I'm saying nothing. It was.

I had, when we were in that little intermission, before we started again. I was trying to be like cat like I'm nervous too like the bright lights like she's like David just like you like you said Jason she said David if we if we were on a phone if we were on FaceTime I'd be crushing that she's like I'm not used to having a microphone on my face I'm not used to two guys like looking at me as I'm trying to answer questions let alone the type of the questions that they are so I thought it was so incredibly like it was infectious like that room was infectious having Alice there who obviously is a boss in her own right coming on the podcast through in and out of the of the interview it was it was so good and just listening

back was so funny and jason for the people at home you have to do this you have to put on our trading secrets instagram whether it be a story or when this episode comes out you have a screenshot of the youtube of the recording and it's right when the recording wrapped and like we're like okay and done it's like you and i look at each other and it's just like what the hell just happened what was that was that now I will say, just because it was, there were just like stories flying around everywhere. And then once Kack on her rhythm, oh my gosh, she was amazing, but in the beginning, it was hilarious. And the listeners probably right now are like, what are you talking about? That

was a clean 46 minutes. I'll tell you what we did some cleanup with this fun. There were some good editing and it all worked out. But let's talk about this. Because I think there's a lot of, I think there's so many takeaways from Kat. I talk about in the intro a little bit. But some of the things we're learning, David, is like having financial conversations are typically so healthy, so productive, so educational and insightful. We know that given some of the experiences that Katav has had through divorce and paying child support, you know, that some of these conversations legally are better not had than being had. And so we could step into some of the numbers, but a lot of them would have actually been unproductive or unhealthy or put her in a worse position. So I think it's good that we're learning things like that. There are time and places to have the money conversations with certain subjects,

and sometimes there's not. But we did get some good numbers here, right? I think we got, you know, it's interesting to learn that when creators do a video organically, that do about a million views or more, they'll get like two to three thousand bucks from TikTok. We talked about music integration. I could tell you for our agency, we have someone that has 500,000 followers and less that is getting paid somewhere in the 5 to 10K range to just do any TikTok they want, anything they want.

They just have to implement this one song for exposure. I think in 5 to 10K for that. And then we learned a big number. We learned that Alice approached Kat and said, I'll be your person, but I'm going to have to make more. We guessed $102.50, and she said higher. So there still were some good numbers here while there was even more insight into how to connect with people

and how your relatability can build a powerful, powerful brand. Oh, I mean, the first off on the numbers, I mean, for Alice to say for me to work for you, I have to be making more than $250,000 out of this. I mean, that is just an astronomical number. Is it fair to say that if I, let's say I wanted you to rep me and you said the same number, is it fair to say that that could take, I mean, realistically, I mean, that could take, first off, there's no guarantee that it ever gets done, but that could take well over a year, a year and a half, just grinding. It could take a lifetime. It's a lifetime, man. But it's also a testament to Alice, like Alice talked about it. I've worked with Haley Bieber.

I've worked with Tom Brady. Like Alice has the eye for what it takes, and she saw something special in Cat. And I think in this episode, my biggest takeaway is that the fun we just even had in this recap, that is Kat's superpower. And I've dealt with David hundreds and probably thousands of public figures at this point. And I've never, ever, ever seen someone truly that just Mike's camera action in the Uber, walking into the studio, walking out. No matter which version it is, it's the same true cat. And I've never seen that in this face.

Even me, welcome back to all stage is bullshit. And so I think that's her superpower, though. And David, I've seen, you know, in person, people. people come up to her and it's not and they come in the swarms and it's not could I get picture to get a picture it's I'm a single mother I lost hope in life and you gave me that hope it's I was in a terrible dark place and couldn't see light and I connected to your dark place and you gave me light it's I heard one person say you are a living goddess is what she said so I think you know we saw her in the studio we saw her panicking

We saw her like uncomfortable, but then coming together in such beautiful ways. And it's interesting to also see the outside when they connect with her and talk to her the couple times that I've seen it. It's not just, wow, you have TikTok followers. It's you've truly changed my entire life and outlook. And there's something we can all learn from that. A hundred percent there is. And we better learn from it too. And if you're listening to this episode, I couldn't believe the.

amount of the array of different relatability is that she kind of referenced through it. Like, I loved how she said as well, like, I'm not special. Like, she said, I'm not special two or three times the episode. She talked about, you know, that she wasn't confident with all this

bad stuff, but you said, what would you, like, what would you tell that person? Nothing. Like, they'll figure it out. Like, I wasn't confident. I loved that answer. Yeah. And she said, that was maybe one of my favorite answers. Yeah. And you were like, how did you find the confidence? She's like, I wasn't confident, but I proceeded. I think it's almost that same like she's just she kind of says it how it is like she's

kind of taking the attention to how it is it says how it says it I'm just dying laughing because as can is saying these like unbelievable motivational things that are just fucking unbelievable that I just hear chomping at the ice bits as I'm editing it I'm like this person it's the funniest human I've ever met like unintentionally and intentionally the funniest person I've literally ever met. There's a sound clip when she's like

25 minutes into the episode and she's like, how am I doing? How am I doing? I'm like, who's looking for your cat's like a 30 million followers on all these platforms

you're an absolute boss. You're looking over at me saying, how am I doing? I'm like two thumbs up. You're doing great. Like this is awesome. Just keep going.

David's a hockey coach with 400 followers. Like you're going to ask me how you're doing. It's like you know, No, I'm completely in like a nobody on this episode as well. So, no, it was, it was just her, though. Like I said, like there were so many moments, even I found myself when she was talking

about the PPD struggles of when she first had MK and then going from maternity leave right into COVID and her research job, like wasn't happening more. It's almost like, okay, like, what do I do now? Like how many people when COVID happened and your job changed probably had a, what do I do now? And what did she do? She found something that changed your life. She found her way to express herself.

She found her way to relate people. She found her way to kind of make steps and being happy in her life. And that happened through TikTok and she stuck with it. It's, it's incredible, man. Like her story is really, really incredible. And I don't doubt that people say that when they see her in person and are that relatable with her because she is that type. She casts that type of energy.

Yeah, 100%. That's, it was special. She's special. There's obviously so many layers to her. and when she took that shot, when she's like, you know what, I'm just going to do it. And she did her minutes and she time blocked and she just stuck to it. Look at what happened. She changed her life.

She changed her family's life. And it's really, really a beautiful story from a beautiful person. And we laughed in this episode. I think at times there might have been like funny, happy tears in this episode. We were awkward in this episode. We were fun. We were, we were, you name like every emotion. I feel like it happened while.

recording. And David, I think one of my favorite, another behind the scenes part. Because, because guys, when some of the edits, like, we were talking so many different areas. And you guys know with my interviews and I like to keep them pretty structured. So I'd have to, like, do a lot of as a host, you have to like reel your guests back if they go on a tangent in a different direction back to like subject matter. So you can go to the next question and transition. At the end of the episode, David, she answers something like when I was just like, it was like the, it was the biggest. softball. It was like, oh, I can't. So can you let everyone know where they could find you?

And like, she's like was thinking, she goes, oh, she goes, she goes, like on the internet, are you saying? And I just go my response. I go, oh boy. Like I'm like literally, they're not doing this. But yeah, anything else, David? No, she was great. It was great to be in person with you guys to do this episode. I will say all of the edits that came out in the way that I got to listen to episode back, it really, uh, encapsulates who she is, how related to what she is. And I hope, I hope the people at home got the energy, got that infectious feeling of, of, of the giggles and the laughs of what it felt like to be in that room. Um, it was an awesome time and one of those memories of this podcast that, you know, I'll

remember because it was, it was, it was great. So, um, and, uh, it's great. It's, uh, great keeping an eye on you two from afar and getting a little tidbits from here and there. So great episode all around. Two great people. The curious Canadians dropping things like obvious. The curious Canadians dropping things like the two of you. Look at that guy go. Kat Stickler, if you're still here on the recap, you absolutely killed it.

Thank you for telling your story. Thank you for inspiring so many people through your vulnerability and some of the struggles that you've endured. And you continue to do it on a day to day basis. and Alice is right. You have whatever that superpower is. So I think something that's really cooler that we can all do back home is dig deep, find our superpower, and just one time this week, try the cat stickler method. Strip away the ego, strip away the concern about what people think. And if it's with one person or it's online, truly, truly tell someone exactly what you're feeling without embarrassment or shame or blame and see what that could do for you because

we saw with cat it changed her life so we appreciate you guys tuning in david thank you for being here with me this is a nice good long recap and let's get ready for another episode of more money coming up this thursday don't forget to follow us on instagram we have some great stuff going up on youtube and make sure to give us a five-star review we will see you thursday for an episode of More Than Money.