Trading Secrets - 184. More Than Money: 22 books published by the age of 20?! Carrie Berk dives into the world of her writing career, influencing, and reality TV

Episode Date: July 18, 2024

This week, Jason is joined by writer, blogger, and social media sensation, Carrie Berk! Carrie dives into how she is able to prioritize and set a schedule for herself which has helped her accomplish all of her successes at the age of 20, how she found the balance between career and social life, why it was important to her to get her degree, how her dad taught her how to organize her money, the best and worst brand deals she has done, her experience in reality TV, how her writing is different from her moms, how she landed a publisher, telling stories that matter,  and so much more!  It’s an episode you can’t afford to miss!  Host: Jason Tartick Co-Host: David Arduin Audio: John Gurney Guest: Carrie Berk Stay connected with the Trading Secrets Podcast!  Instagram: @tradingsecretspodcast  Youtube: Trading Secrets Facebook: Join the Group All Access: Free 30-Day Trial 

Welcome back to another episode of Trading Secrets, More Than Money Edition. Today I am joined by writer, blogger, and social media sensation Carrie Burke. Carrie is taking over the content creator world by Storm at only 20 years old. Inspired by her mother, editor, journalist, and author Cheryl Burke, Carrie began writing as a child. Eventually, with her mother's help, she developed and wrote a series titled The Cupcake Club, a series about a young girl who tries to make friends by starting her own Cupcake group. She has 21 books to her credit with her 22nd on the way and her first solo debut,

My Real Life rom-com, which is on pre-sale right now. With storytelling in the back of her mind, Carrie got involved with social media world and launched her own fashion blog. Carrie also ventured into the world of reality television, starring in season three of Next Influencer, which airs on Paramount Plus. Now with over 3.8 million followers on TikTok and a successful blog titled Carrie's Chronicles,

she's establishing herself as a creative and powerful voice for Gen Z with her content focusing on fashion, workout routines, and other ways to share positivity with the world. Today we are going to pick the brain of who the Wall Street journal calls a community-minded young creator and learn how she hopes to share positivity through content creation and writing. That was so nice. Yeah, you know, honestly, I'm starting to think I got to redo things in my life because

at 20 years old, by the way, I didn't say out there, Money Mafia, she's also a senior in college, but by 20 years old, you have done all this. I mean, when you hear this stuff back, millions of followers on Instagram, you know, 100 million when you look at your overall social media impact, the books, being a student, the freelance work, like, how do you do it all? What do you think about it all? It's a lot. I mean, just listening to it, like, makes me tired. Sometimes I don't even think about it like that. I think I just, I've really learned to prioritize my time well. So I take things day by day, like one day I'll dedicate to only school. One day I'll dedicate to the book. I mean,

this month, especially with the book coming out, it's kind of all book month. Yeah. But I'm also starting my senior year of college. So it's kind of a lot. But just really like prioritizing self-care in the middle of everything and trying to set aside like a really clear schedule for myself every day. So all these things, 20 years old, senior in college, like, I mean, this is kind of a crazy question. But do you have personal time? Like, do you have personal life? And if so, like, how do you even time block for that? I do have personal life. I've gotten much better at this. I feel like during the pandemic, when I first became an influencer and starting to gain like some clout online, I only was paying attention to that. Like I spent all day just filming videos, didn't have any personal life. And then once like the pandemic stopped and life came back, I realized that I missed having a personal life. I craved having time with my friends, having self-care time. So yeah, I think I basically divide my day in half. Like half of the day is dedicated to career. The other half of the day is dedicated to social time, whether it's FaceTiming a friend or like going on a date with my boyfriend or just

doing like a Peloton class, just something to like make me happy. Because content creation and career stuff makes me happy, but it's like not the same as like taking a warm bath. Yeah, totally get that. I was thinking about this. When I was in college, I had like a little side job. I was probably making, I worked at Dick Sporting Goods. And then I also had a internship at Target making 15 bucks hour, which I thought was like the cream of the crop. And then, you know, beers would be like 50 cents to a dollar, get a mixed drink for three dollars back in 2010 time frame. And I just couldn't imagine, like having a ton of success when I was in college. I wasn't focused on it, but if I did, I would be like, I don't know if I'd still be alive at my age. And I think about

being someone who's having so much financial and career success at such a young age, Are people in college, is this the norm or are people looking at you like, oh my God, look at everything you've achieved and you're still going to class? Is it hard to even focus on class? Like, what does education mean when you already have all this success and financial wherewithal two? Like, what's your stance on that? So I got into this industry at a very young age, obviously. When I was eight, I saw some success, some financial success from a really young age. So I kind of knew the industry at that point, but it was always like very important to me to get an education.

Like even when I was blowing up on TikTok that was going into my freshman year in college, but it never even crossed my mind that I wasn't going to get my degree. And there's so many people out there who are doing what I'm doing and just don't get their degree. And like TikTok is their entire livelihood. But I feel like there's always something you can learn. Like no matter how long I've been in this industry, there's always something you can learn. I wanted to get the degree to build on my craft. I mean, even though, like, I had this experience last year, I got turned down from so many internships.

And I realized I just needed one more a year of, like, education to just better myself. And then I got a great internship this past summer at the New York Post. That's huge. So, I mean, it's just years and years of work and just, like, constantly trying to better yourself because if you have that mindset and you're focused on that and not just, you know, I have this many followers. I'm good. I'm good for life. You have to constantly be trying to level up in your own life. I love it. You mentioned eight. I think about when I was eight years old. I think I had a lemonade stand. And if I had W2 income, which of course I didn't, it was probably like

$6.45. Do you remember like at what age you made like your first, I don't know, like $1,000 or $5,000 or $10,000? Like what ages were those? When I was eight. When you were eight? How much at eight years old were you make it. I mean, I'm trying to think I got whatever my, my first paycheck was for the book. I had to like split it with my mom, obviously. But I was looking at these numbers and I'm like, what does this even mean? Like, I'm just learning like math for the first time. Like, what does this even mean? So I don't even think I understood back then. And even like going into the pandemic when I was starting to earn money on TikTok, that was uncharted territory. Like people were just starting to monetize at the time on social media, I didn't really understand what it meant to monetize your content. Yeah. I mean,

you do brand-in content all the time too. You get it. Yeah. So I was like 18 at the time, so I didn't really understand like what it meant to monetize off of TikTok until I started seeing the money. And I was, wait, like I could actually like make a career out of this. Yeah. One of the things that comes on this podcast a lot is if I knew then, what I know now. And I think about at 18, It's almost, I mean, you started earning money at 8, but it's hard to do that. So what did you do to, like, understand taxes and how to negotiate for yourself? And these things at 18 where you should know how much your rate is and, like, how to deal with money, where have you learned all this?

Yeah. So it's been tough for me because I still live at home. Like, I'm not, I'm financially independent, but I don't have my own apartment yet. So it's been kind of, like, difficult. But I've had to learn a lot from my family. So my dad works in finance. That's been really helpful. So I asked him lots of questions.

At first, when I started to earn money, I wasn't even, like, keeping track of it because I'd never filed for taxes in my life. So I didn't even know that was a thing. Of course. I didn't have 18. I had no idea. So then my dad says to me, he's like, you know, you have to file for taxes this year, right? Like, you're going to lose, like, almost half your money.

And I was like, why? Like, what does that mean? Why am I going to lose my money? So when he sat me down, we had to make a spreadsheet of, you know, what brand hired me, the day my money came in, how much I was earning, what content they bought. And he really taught me how to organize my money so I could really look at it as a whole and file for taxes, I guess, for the first time in my life. I love it. So as someone who's 20 now, there are some people on this show that are in their 50s, 60s, some people that are listening that are in their 40s, 30s and 20s. But knowing

what you know now, what's one piece of advice you'd give someone out there as it relates to like a financial tip that you didn't know that now you know because you've gone through the this whole wild business journey? I think stay organized. Okay. That's a good one. Yeah. I mean, back then, I wish I started keeping that spreadsheet earlier

because then I had to just dig through all my archives and videos and see this brand paid me here, this brand paid me here. And it was just really confusing. I think the earlier you start keeping track of where your money's coming in from, the better off you'll be in the future. That's a good one. Stay organized. Now, we're going to talk about the book writing and reality TV.

in the content creation. One of the first things I want to start with, though, is I don't think we've had on this show someone, I don't know if we've talked about it if we had, someone living and breathing the Gen Z life. Obviously, you are. Most people that listen to the show are Millennials. So what would you say is the number one misconception of Gen Zers that millennials should know? Oh, I like this question. I've never gotten this question. Gen Z is very driven. I'll get to the misconception. But Gen Z is very driven. Like, we have beliefs.

If we believe in something, we're not going to be afraid to shout it out to the world. So that's why you see, like, all this political and social change that Gen Z is driving forward in terms of a misconception. We're not stupid. Just because we're young doesn't mean we're stupid. Like, we're young, but we're educating ourselves and constantly trying to make a change. change in the world. So I feel like Gen Z almost has like a head start and they're trying to get involved in the world before they're even a full-on adult. Yeah, I think one thing is each generation has something that's very special and unique, especially to their time frame. And you could think

about, you know, baby boomers and all the different generations and what they had gone through from, you know, like, you know, my grandfather used to have to collect the tinfoil from the back of his gum for World War II and like put all the materials together and give it to us. So they have such different sense of like maybe grit or mental strength and physical awareness where one thing I think without a doubt, especially Gen Z years, is the access that you guys have and you've grown up to information is so next level. The things you've been able to see and hear and learn at the touch of a button are things that, you know, even our generation has had to wait 10, 20 years to hear. So I think that's a really good one that you guys have a lot more insight at a much faster pace than the other generations. And I think that's a good transition to your TikTok because your TikTok, you have a lot of Gen Z followers, 3.8 million followers. And you do a lot of these reviews of all different products I saw.

So one thing we talk about on this podcast, of course, is like value and dollars and cents. Let's do a best and worst. Think about all the products you've done. And what do you think is like the best review? that you did as it relates to what the product cost and what it was. And then I want to get worse, like how much it costs in the worst product you had for people that are out there. So we'll start with the best, the dollar amount of the product and why it was the best and what it was. Okay, I'm going to start off with the worst one. So the worst one I did, it was one of my most

viral videos and it was trying fake freckles. So it's this product, it's like $12.99. I think I got it on like Amazon or something and you stamp the freckles on your cheek, but they don't look like freckles. They kind of just look like polka dots all over your face. So I must have tried this product like five times on my TikTok. And every single time, I think the first video got like 17 million views. 17 million. It was crazy. Just like each time it got like millions and millions of views just for me like failing at my freckles. So that product, I mean, it was like cheap, but like you could tell it was cheap. It was pretty bad. So fake freckles, 1299, watch out for that product. Before we go to the best product, best value, talk to me about the psychology of virality. Why is it a video of

you putting on fake freckles that just like are a mess? Why is it that 20 million some people gravitate to that? Like what is the psychology behind that? What do you think? People just love seeing other people fuck up. Am I how to curse all this? You think? Yeah, you can curse all day. You think that's what it is. Oh, I do. Yeah. They just love fuck up. Yeah, that's what I always say this. Like, when I need good content, I always think like, okay, what beauty products do I have right now? What's something like really bad I can do with this product? Interesting. So it's the things that are wide. Yeah, because everyone wants to watch like a car crash, right? Everyone wants to see the house, like it just is what it is. All right, that's the psychology of that. So if you're trying to go viral out

there, do something stupid that you're going to fuck up. Now let's go the best and worst brand deal you ever did on TikTok. Okay. Best brand deal. This is an easy one for me. I get asked this question a bunch by like friends. Okay. So I got sent to Disney World for a brand deal, which was so much fun. Like I got there, like my name was all over the room, crazy decorations. It was just insane. So I had to get up at five in the morning and they did a photo shoot with me for new statues in the park and I had to post a TikTok for them. It was just so sick. I grew up watching Disney. So that was like the dream. Okay. So you had to post one TikTok and in return, what do they, they comp everything? They comp to everything. Okay. What do you think the value of that, like if you had to put a price tag to that trip, not in your like sentimental

mind, but how much you think they probably spent on that? Okay. So they paid for a flight for me and my mom. Okay. So how much is a flight to Florida? Let's just say like if it's, you know, I'd say like a thousand bucks all in. Was it first class? No. Okay, so $1,000 all in. Like $1,000. Okay, yeah.

And then the hotel, probably like $400 a night or something. Yeah. And it was two nights. That's like $800. And then park passes, which is like... Probably like $5,000, $200 each. Yeah, like $2,300 bucks. It's probably all.

And this is $5K easy all day. Probably, yeah. But for a TikTok deal, I'm going to take a guess that with 3.8 million followers. You have done a TikTok deal that's paid you more than 5K a post. Not often, but yeah. Really? Interesting. And have you seen that rate fluctuate through your time as a content creator? Absolutely. During the pandemic, everyone was hiring content creators. So I was getting paid so much. Like even when I was at a million followers, I was getting paid for occasional deals more than I'm getting paid now, just because brands had the budget. So even though I had,

almost three million followers more than I did then. Yeah. Now, like the world's back to normal. People aren't paying creators as much for their videos. My engagement's not as high on TikTok because people aren't living on their phones as much. Which is a good thing, I guess. But not for like monetizing my career. Back in the heyday, would you say if I had to guess, like around 7,000 a video?

When I had a million? Yeah. No, it was like a thousand. Thousand a video. Yeah. Interesting. Now on Instagram, you have 916,000. followers. Do you find that you could make more money off Instagram versus TikTok, or do you not

really have an opinion on that? I think I've always made more money on TikTok just because brands look at the follower count first and foremost. So they see the million and I'm like, okay, it's like done. We're going to hire her for TikTok. I honestly prefer it that way. My TikTok tends to be targeted towards a younger audience. And a lot of the brands I work with are targeted towards a younger audience, so that's easier for me. My Instagram is more so, like, for my friends now. Like, I built the following over the pandemic, and I kind of reached a point where I was just like, why am I not living my life? Why am I not posting my everyday life on my Instagram? Yeah. So that's where I'm at now. If I get hired for a brand deal on Instagram, sure,

but on occasion. All right. And then YouTube, over 100,000 subscribers. How is the monetization of YouTube? It's pretty bad. Interesting. Tell me about that. Yeah, so I don't post long-form videos on YouTube at all, really, because it just doesn't get any views. I was wasting my time, editing videos. YouTube Shorts is primarily what I do or used to do. I don't do it as much anymore because I don't have time. But YouTube Shorts, when I started, was a relatively new initiative. They wanted a lot of creators on board.

So I tried it out. it took me a really long time before I started to see any views or any money. So a friend gave me advice to post eight YouTube shorts a day for a month. So that was like ridiculous. I did not only do it. Well, I did it. I had like a few times where I would try it and then I'd get bored after like two weeks and I'd stop. But if you stop after two weeks, then all your progress goes to shit. So I had to do it like a one month consecutively, eight videos per day. I was using content from like 2019 because I don't have that much content. Yeah. When you come up with that many 800 videos. Yeah. So it was crazy amount of content. But I did it. And then I was starting to see views. So I was

getting YouTube shorts views like 20 million views on a video. Like 10 million views on a video. So finally it was just starting to like take off. So I kept doing it for a while. And then even after like all the views, I think I was only making like 500 bucks a month. Interesting. So with 100,000 plus subscribers, you're only making like 500 to a thousand bucks off YouTube. Off of shorts ads and like video views. Yeah. So it was just like a waste of time after a while. Like I didn't want to be doing it anymore because it was just like not enough money. Yeah. Like I would rather like spent my time doing $500 for a TikTok. Of course. When you look at you, obviously you have your hands in a lot of things. Freelancing, blogging, content creation. We'll talk about reality TV,

your books, your solo debut, your book. When you think about all the areas that down the road you'll be able to make money, are you optimistic about the money you'll be able to making content creation, or do you think you'll be pursuing other avenues to source income? I think being a content creator was never the goal. I kind of just fell into it over the pandemic. I enjoyed it. I enjoyed connecting with people online. I enjoyed the money. So that's why I started doing it, but it was never the goal. I love writing. I want to be a writer. That's always been the goal. I went to school to be a writer. So I want to get a job at a newspaper, magazine, some type of media. That's always been the goal. I think as long as they'll let me, I'll keep

TikTok, Instagram on the side as a side hustle, like for a little extra money because the money in publishing, like, isn't great. But yeah, I think it was never the goal. It's also not sustainable. Like, you never know if TikTok's going to go away soon. Sure. It almost did over the pandemic. I remember like crying to my mom one day about the TikTok fan. She's like, my career's done. I'm not going to make any money. And she's like, do you realize like this is not your career, right? It's just like a little side hustle. She's a junior in college. She's written 20 books already. My career's all over. Mom's like, you're fine, honey. Don't worry. Exactly. No, that's literally what happened. Yeah, I can imagine that. Okay, so content creation may be down the road and make a couple

bucks, you make a couple bucks. You still have millions of followers. Now, one transition you made was to reality TV. You were on season three of Next Influencer. Did going on reality TV help you in the monetization of your other areas? No. Not at all, huh? I love Carrie's story because her perspective is so different than so many people that come on this show. Do you think it hurt you? Did it hurt you know it on a reality TV show? Why? I think I cannot say enough bad things about reality TV. Why is that? It's just you don't. Sorry to interrupt, but I also want to give people the perspective here. Yes. This is not a reality TV hater right here. You said you're a big bachelor fan. You enjoy consuming reality TV. I love it. So it's not like you have this. vendetta against reality TV. It's just your experience was that bad. Yeah. I mean, I went on the show. I was a huge Bachelor fan, loved watching it. I got this opportunity to be on reality TV. And I was like, oh my God, amazing. This is going to be my Bachelor dreams come true. They're going to fall in love on this show. That wasn't what the show was about. But I was like, I'm so excited to be on this thing.

So it was basically like a bunch of content creators living in a house for two weeks. competing to be like the next big influencer and at the end of each day like you rank each other on a scale of like one to I think was 11. Okay. So you like look every morning and like there's like a list of like basically a popularity contest. Yeah. So I like made an enemy on day one who whose sister happens to be an iconic bachelor villain. Oh no way. Yeah. Can you tell me who? I'm going to have to do research and find out now. It's Corinne Olympia's sister. Oh, no way. Her sister was on there. Oh, my God. And so you butt-headed with her? Yeah. That is so funny. So, yeah, she's my roommate on day one. And we just basically, we got along at first, got into some stupid drama over a boy. Yeah. Turned the entire

house against me. And then it was just like, hell. Like, I did not realize like how much these narratives are shaped, I guess, on reality TV. Like, I would be, like, having a normal conversation with someone, and all of a sudden, like, one of the other cast members would, like, pop up as if, like, someone didn't, like, give them a push. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Like, oh, here they come. It's just, like, so unnatural. Like, I had no privacy. Like, I could not.

They were, like, they were gopros in my room. Like, I couldn't speak to, like, my mom on the phone. Like, what if I was, like, on the phone with, like, my therapist? And they were, like, GoProing me. Like, it was just really, like, a violation of privacy. Yeah. Interesting. I mean, that's the crazy thing about reality TV is like you open yourself up to everything. How long did you last on the show? I lasted the whole time. So you made it the whole time. What place did you come in? Like, do they do a place? Do they do a breakdown?

No, there was a top three. Okay. Did you come in the top three? Hell no. Okay. If you do come in the top three, was it a challenge show where you get like paid or anything if you win? I think if you won, you got like a contract with the production company. Okay, got it. Interesting. I don't even know if like anything really came of it for the dude who won. Yeah. Interesting. I don't know. I stuck it through to the end because I wanted to show people. Like, I was so bullied on that show. Like, people like screaming, cursing me all day long. Like, it was ridiculous. So I stayed on to set like an example for people to show like if this is how you're being treated in everyday life. You don't need to like go hide and run. Like you can stand there and stand up for yourself. Good for you. That's why I stayed. Yeah. Interesting. I was out of there. So you filmed for two weeks, you said? Yeah. Let me take a guess. Two weeks. reality TV. Who is the network behind it? Paramount Plus, awesomeness TV. Paramount plus. I'm going to say you were paid, let's go with $20,000. Can't give the exact amount, but it was lower than $20,000.

All right. Well, right. Give me this. Was I warm, cold or hot? Cold. Cold. Wow. All right. That puts in perspective, everyone. All right. So reality TV is no longer in your future. Is that fair? Hell no. Hell no. Okay. So that's a decisive, never again. If you want to hear more, there's a whole chapter in my book about it. Okay, that's a good transition. Talk a little bit about my real life rom-com. This is your first solo debut. You did the deal with the publisher?

Yes. Okay. Now, for those who live under a rock, Carrie's mother, Cheryl Burke is a huge, huge, huge author, has co-writing, ghost-writed, done so much work. Before we get into your book, how much pressure did you feel that this is your mother that's had so much success with it? or do you look at it like it's been a huge advantage in your writing career because you have such an unbelievable inspirational mentor? I think both. I think she's the one who's inspired me to be a writer.

I grew up watching her write at her computer with her back turn to me, just like totally in awe of how she just turns out stories so quickly. So definitely inspired by her. She was my writing partner in crime for so many years. But it reached a point where I felt like I couldn't step out from under her shadow. So that's what this book kind of is. Like I was starting this and I said to my mom, I was like, look, I have this project that I'm working on and I don't want you to read it. She always loves reading my writing.

I was like, you're not allowed to read my book until it's like a month out until publication date. She just read it. I've been working on this book for three years. She just read the book. It's crazy. So I've definitely felt a lot of pressure to live up to her and try and prove to people almost that I'm not just. in the shadow of my mom. So that's something I'm continually trying to do.

I also don't really want to go in the same avenue of writing as she is. So she's like a celebrity ghost writer. I love journalism, like fashion journalism, sports journalism. Like I'm totally my own lane. And this, this is like something she's never done. Like she's never written a memoir. She doesn't usually write about relationships. This is my own passion project.

I really wanted to do by myself. Okay, so it's your first solo debut. You're doing it by yourself. No Cheryl Burke touching this book. Just Carrie Berg. See, it's just my name. Just your name. So what can people expect if they pick this up? So my real life rom-com, think of it like the Gen Z version of Sex in the City. So it's not a dating guide per se. It tracks my adventures and misadventures in dating as a teenager, young adult growing up in New York. So each chapter is dedicated. to a different guy that I crossed paths with during my tween and teen years, very sex in the city, like a Mr. Big for each chapter. Okay. So it's really fun. I mean, the point behind it was not to tell people like how to date or who they should date, but really to just show that like I'm their peer and to relate to them and, you know,

be vulnerable about my experiences because all the dating guides out there are written by like 50-year-old women for kids. Another touch point here from like other generations to Gen Z's dating. Gen Z dating, I'm going to ask you the same question I asked you before about the work world. Now we're going to go into the dating world. Gen Z years, what is the biggest misconception out there? For all the millennials and generations above, they're listening to this when it comes to like dating. What is so different now? Like, okay, recently single, I have a friend who's married. She's so sweet. Her husband, I was in his wedding. They have two kids and she's like, I'd be terrified to date. All this stuff. He's and all this stuff. Like, I'm so glad I'm married. What do you think are some of the biggest misconceptions and what should people know about Gen Zers in the whole dating world today? Okay. So people think Gen Z is very social media obsessed. And they are, but it actually serves us well in the dating world because dating apps are such a big thing now. So I was so, like, against them for so long. I just, I thought, like, I live in New York City. I'm just going to stumble

upon someone on the street, like fall into their own. Exactly. Yeah. But it's like not reality. I mean, it's not the world we're living in. We're living in a digital world. So many people meet each other online these days. Totally. I kind of just had to tap into that. So I have a whole chapter in the book. It's called The Dating App Disasters about when I first started using dating apps in the city. I mean, I feel like anywhere you live and you're using a dating app, like it can be dangerous. You never know who you're going to meet. Like, that was always the main worry for me, but I think, like, once you have, like, a strong

sense of, like, yourself and who you want, you're able to, like, filter through these guys. Like, Gen Z has such a strong sense of, like, what, who's legit and who's not on social media. Got it. That if you see, like, a hinge profile, for example, that's, like, suss. Then you can, like, call bullshit on the spot. Gotcha. Okay. So you can just, the transparency within your generation, you see bullshit from a mile away.

Yeah. Faster than anybody. Just, like, swipe through. Like all the fake filters, all the fake app, all the fake stuff. So you can instantly find if someone's full of shit or not. Yeah. I call it like a video game. Like when I used to be on dating apps, I would like go through it like fake, fake, fake, fake, fake, fake.

Wow. Okay. Fake, fake. See, we had the shows like catfish. Those won't exist with Jen Z ears because they will not get catfished. All right. Let's talk about the book real quick. Business behind it.

Did you land a publisher? How'd you land a publisher? Who is it? So I landed a publisher. It's Postal Press distributed by Simon & Schuster. Amazing. So I worked really hard. to get that. I actually reached out to my book agent from when I was eight, hit her up by myself.

I was like, hey, you haven't heard from me. I think at that point I was like 19. I was like, you haven't heard from me in over 10 years. Like, remember me. I wrote that little cupcake book. I'm working on something else. Can I meet with you and sell this to you? So I met with her, treated her to lunch, brought her like a portfolio. Yeah. Like, here's my book. Here's my manuscript. Let me know what you think. Yeah. So actually before that, not a lot of people know. is I sent this book to a male book agent and he didn't get it. He did not understand the concept. He thought it was like cliched.

And I sent it to this book agent and I said to her, you know, it's not cliched. There's really no one out there sharing their dating experiences in such a vulnerable way like this. Whether you're, you know, Gen Z or an adult. Like you don't see a lot of people do that. Right. And she got it. She just got it. Wow.

So she picked it up, started pitching it, took about six months. And then this publisher, I spoke to a bunch of different publishers, but this particular publisher, they just really got my vision. Like, I met with them. And I was telling them about the book and just the way that they were so receptive and passionate about making my book a success. Like, I knew that's who I wanted to choose. Now, do other publishers bring in offers? Or was this was Simon the only one? Or like, how do you determine? How does that work, the business behind that? There are a few offers. I think what I told me. my book agent at the very beginning, I literally said, like, I could be getting paid pennies for

this book. Like, I just want someone who believes in it as much as I do. Okay. So that's what I was looking for. Like, I wasn't really looking at the dollar count in this case. I just was looking for someone who got the concept. When I was explaining, like, I have these little boxes in my book of like little golden nuggets of dating advice. Like, I told them that. And like immediately they're like, that's brilliant. Like, and here's what else you can do. Like, they not only got my idea, but they were bringing other things to the table. So I was just looking for someone who just really got my ideas and was trying to further them.

Understood. One of the things we talked about on the show is money, you had said pennies for the book. If pennies, let's just say the advance wasn't, if it wasn't advance or it wasn't an advance, how do you determine success here? Do you say, like, I want to make $10,000, $100,000? I want to make a million.

Like, how do you determine monetary success for this book? Do you have a goal? Do you have a vision? I really don't. Like, to be honest, I really don't. I was never thinking about money for the book. Like, if I make money, great. But the goal was just to connect with people.

I mean, it started off. I was writing this book. I wrote it out of, like, heartbreak. And I just was using it as, like, self-therapy almost. Yeah. But it just became so much more. Like, I realized that I have a responsibility to, like, be a voice for so many people out there who feel alone in their experiences.

And, you know, there's no one out there describing, like, what it's like. the second you get your heart broken when like it feels like the world is crashing down around you. I talk about anxiety in the book. There's no one really my age talking about what it's like to live with anxiety as an influencer, like as a 20 year old girl. So there's so many topics that I feel like we're just so important to share in this book. And that's what's like the forefront of my mind as I go into promoting this. Not really the dollar count. So impact purpose. That's what's driving this. The dollars and cents, not so much. But you have had. other books that have turned into off-Broadway productions. You've had other bestsellers. You've

had New York Times bestsellers. We already talked about the quote Wall Street Journal said about you. Do you have a different goal other than purpose and impact in dollars with this book? Do you want to be New York Times seller? Do you think it could be a movie? Like, is there a long-stretch goal you have with this one? I think long-term goal. I would love to see this as like a Disney Channel show or like a Netflix show. I feel like each chapter being dedicated to a different guy, it's like set up to be episodes basically. So like a little younger version of sex in the city. I think I always had that at the back of my mind when I was writing this book.

So we'll see how it goes. I like it. On the cover we have Carrie there and she has her hands out and it looks like there's a football player. There's a musician. There's a skateboarder, maybe a lawyer or a study, a neuro. What would you classify this type of dating topic? The guy with glasses, whatever that means. Oh, college student. All right. So A to Z in the dating world, my real life rom-com.

Guys, go check that out. I want to transition to journalism. So big part of your mother's career. You know, we have your work experience. And this is very, very deep for being 20 years old. Intern at 17 Magazine 2017. Intern at Girls Life Magazine from 18 to 20. A writer at Watch Magazine 2022. Intern at New York Post currently, 2023. Freelance Writer for Newsweek. Freelance Writer. for Huff post. If that doesn't make you feel like you're not doing enough back home, I don't know what does. The first question I got for you in journalism is, especially someone from reality TV, what frustrates me is when I do interviews, especially with like Us Weekly

or, you know, I know life and style. Your mom's the editor-in-chief for life and style, right? Former editor-in-chief. Former editor-in-chief. Okay. Where I always get worried about us, I'm going to say one word wrong, and that's going to be like the clickbait. So I said the word, but it just is sometimes taken out of context to get people to click. Talk to me about just that business behind there. Like if we click, obviously, that's more money towards the article. Is that the goal? What's the strategy? Talk to me just about the even title of articles when you're thinking about it from a journalism perspective. Yeah, it's always, it's all about the headline. I mean, at the New York Post, something we really like take pride in is like our headlines.

So, you know, you see, like, those huge call-out headlines on the cover of the New York Post, and that's what makes you grab them. So it's kind of like the same on if you see a social media post just in general, like it's all about caption or the header on something. So that headline, I think, is super important for an article for journalism. I think, unfortunately, for like gossip tabloids, not like the New York Post, but like, you know, like us weekly or life and style, one of those. like it's just like the nature of like a gossip tower like I don't know what to tell you but yeah I mean I try I pride myself on like integrity in my journalism work yeah so you know writing stories that matter telling really important stories someone the other day I just thought of this like I was doing some job like a writing job for school and they were like yeah like for this particular interview

it was just like a vibe check like ask what this person is up to how they're feeling and I came home and I just felt so shitty. Like, I was like, I don't want to be a vibe check reporter for my career. Yeah. Like, I want to tell stories that matter. And I was so lucky that my internship at the post at page six, like, I got to tell, like, really cool stories. I got to interview a Jets player.

Cool. And that was like a story that I pitched myself. So that was really cool. But, yeah, I mean, this book is like proof, too. I just want to tell stories that matter as a journalist. Interesting. When a journalist is thinking, because you said it's all about the headline, especially in New York Post, when you're working on a story, do you almost start with what could the headline be and then go into the story writing? Like, what does the process look like as you're like thinking about I can envision this being a top headline story?

It depends on the writer. For me, I actually have a really hard time with headlines. Like I sometimes the article's all done. and I'll have it, like, cited in everything, and I won't have a headline. So I'll write the body of the article first. I start with what they call the lead, which is like the hook of the article, the first sentence, that draws someone in because that's the hardest part and then unfold, like with all the facts. Okay. It's actually been really helpful learning about that in college because I've seen it.

I read it a lot online, but I didn't really know, like, the bits and pieces of how it works. So, yeah, I think in terms of a headline, sometimes it's easier to think of it, like, once the entire article's done. Okay. And you're just trying to, like, I guess, like, tie it into, like, what else you wrote. Okay. Talk to me about the industry, if you want to get into journalism, the different jobs that are there and what you've heard people can make in those jobs. Okay. So for journalism, I think the most important thing to know right now is social media. You have to have some knowledge of digital media and social media. Because the reality is, like, the world of journalism right now is going online, if it's not almost all online right now. So no matter how much I love reading a magazine or a newspaper, I'm probably going to end up working for a digital publication.

Like, I've come to terms with that. Like, even a whole summer working at The New York Post, I exclusively wrote for their online platform. Got it. And that's okay. Like, they have a major, major, like, digital readership. So I think, don't quote me on this, I think it was like about 80 million, like unique viewers a month. Oh my gosh. It's like 80 or 88 million.

Yeah. That's a lot. Yeah, it was crazy. So, yeah, I mean, I think just having some knowledge of social media, that's where me being an influencer comes in handy. I mean, I feel like I, for a while I was thinking about dropping the influencer thing, just going into the journalism world because I didn't want them to think it would be a distraction. or something, but it's actually, at least so far, served as an asset because they see, like, oh, you have some knowledge of social media, you are able to grow your following. Maybe you can do the same for us.

Got it. That makes perfect sense. In an entry-level journalism position, do you have an idea of salary range people make around? I think it depends on your position. I think for starting off in journalism, like you can be like an editorial assistant or just like something reporter or something writer, and then from there you go up to a director, manager. So, the answer is I don't know. Talk to me in like a year.

We'll come back at a couple of years. We'll get those numbers. All right. Of all, let me ask you this, which pays the best, which is the most challenging? Freelancing, book writing, social media influencing. So social media influencing pays the best. Okay. I don't enjoy it as much.

Yeah. I'm very transparent about this now. I've said this multiple times. My heart is like not in it as much as it used to be. I'm burnt out. I want to write more. Like I still like it and I like connecting with people on it. But I'm I don't post as much as I used to because I just don't have the time on my hands. Totally. So I do it because I'm monetizing and I somewhat still enjoy it. But what I enjoy most is the journalism, the book writing. I don't know if I'm going to write another book. Yeah, it's a lot. I think my boyfriend might murder me if I write another book. Well, dating book, I'm sure your boyfriend's like, okay, can we go to the next topic? I think he's done.

He's done with it. He's the first one to read it too. Yeah, yeah. Oh, boy. For anyone. Understood. All right. So maybe it'll be another book.

If it will, maybe it'll be in a different world. It might be journalism. Might be the next content creation, mastermind. It already seems like you're on that track. I mean all things A to Z. You're covering it. You're doing it. I have one last question about journalism.

You talked about integrity of journalists. That's like a big topic of conversation, like where if a journalist takes something and even somewhat slightly misrepresents it for like the most credible places, right? Like the Times, the Post, all those areas, vanity fair, whatever. You're gone and your career's ruined. Yeah. How do they define, though, in journalism, like the integrity line? To me, as someone who doesn't know anything about the industry and correct them, I'm wrong, it seems more like a gray area.

Maybe I'm wrong. Maybe it's very black and white, but it seems gray is to integrity when you're writing the article of like opinion versus fact. Yeah. How do you differentiate and how do you make sure you're never going into that line of you're fired and your reputation's ruined in this world? It's all about like, I think for an opinion piece, you can generally say whatever because it's your opinion. If you're quoting someone, like especially for a celebrity piece, like it's got to be like a word for word. I always have like the transcript on hand. I have like an audio recording of the interview just to be extra careful, especially when like working at the post page six. Like I had like such a responsibility to like maintain the integrity.

I made sure I think it went through like two rounds of editors like before the article like came out. Like this Jets player interview, I was like writing at my hands shaking. I was doing this, right? Such a big deal. I think I wrote like a paragraph for that article. It was like, it's my big break. Right, I've had a Jets player. It's a celebrity.

Yeah, got it. So, so nervous. Yeah. So just making sure you're quoting everything, right? And then when you write an article like that, how do you know what success is? Do they give you the analytics for each article? Like, do they tell you how many unique music got and stuff? I think not for an intern.

I think someone must have those analytics. Down the road. Yeah. I mean, for me, at this stage in my writing career, it's just all about, like, the bylines. So it's collecting as many articles as I can. To showcase your portfolio. Yeah. I think this summer, I wrote, like, 75 at the post or, like, something crazy like that.

I mean, yeah, I was just trying to, like, build the experience, trying to get as many, like, bylines as possible. Because if I go into a job interview and they see, like, oh, you've written 75 articles for the New York Post. Like, you must be legit. Yeah. Watch it. You're in the game. All right, 22 books to your credit. First solo debut, reality TV, freelance writer, journalist, all the things. That is Carrie Burke.

Carrie, where can everyone find everything you have going on in your book? So you can order my book available now on Amazon, Barnes & Noble, Target, Walmart, basically any bookstore near you. And you can find me on Instagram, TikTok, any social media at Carrie Burke with an extra K at the end, because normal Carrie Burke was. taken. I like it. Carrie Burke, go find her on all those platforms. Give her book a try. Give it as a gift. And at the very least, if you are looking to see if that freckle type makeup is worth it, she's got tons of products with you. So check her out on TikTok. Carrie, thank you so much for being on this episode. Thank you. I'm going to be.

Mm-hmm. I'm going to.