Trading Secrets - 187. More than an Olympic athlete: Kerri Walsh Jennings breaks away from the label, reveals the shocking numbers behind her volleyball career, and following her curiosity

Episode Date: July 29, 2024

This week, Jason is joined by 3x Olympic gold medalist, 1x Olympic bronze medalist, and one of the most proclaimed American Olympic athletes in recent memory, Kerri Walsh Jennings! Teaming up with Misty May-Treanor to win three olympic gold medals and three world titles and go undefeated for a remarkable 112 games. On returning to the Olympic stage at Rio in 2016 with new partner April Ross, she brought in a bronze medal at the age of 37. In recent years, Kerri has expanded her professional skillset by co-funding a non-profit organization to unite, empower, and inspire the sport of beach volleyball in communities around the country.  Kerri dives into her take on the business landscape on beach volleyball at the collegiate level, the different approaches to being excellent in your sport as a kid, how she handles the outside noise, how to utilize and breakaway from the label, the monetization behind beach volleyball, how a domestic contract changed their world, and what funds olympic dreams. Kerri also reveals how USA athletes differentiate from other countries, how she wants to improve the ADP for beach volleyball, realistically what the pay is like, being humbled by indoor volleyball, the business behind San Diego Mojo. What were her first big deals? What do the athletes pay for?  Kerri reveals all that and so much more in another episode you can’t afford to miss!  Host: Jason Tartick Co-Host: David Arduin Audio: John Gurney Guest: Kerri Walsh Jennings Stay connected with the Trading Secrets Podcast!  Instagram: @tradingsecretspodcast  Youtube: Trading Secrets Facebook: Join the Group All Access: Free 30-Day Trial  Trading Secrets Steals & Deals! MeUndies: MeUndies has you covered during the warmer months with lightweight, anti-odor and quick-drying Breathe fabric. MeUndies has so many different styles of Breathe underwear and they’re all incredibly cool and comfortable. Get 20% off your first order, plus free shipping, at MeUndies.com/trading Bilt Rewards: Bilt is breaking ground as the FIRST rewards program that hooks you up with points on your rent. Even if you’re still rocking the old-school rent check vibes, Bilt Rewards has got your back. They’ll mail the check for you - it’s like having a personal rent-paying assistant. Every month, pay your rent and watch the Bilt Points roll in. Earn points by paying rent right now when you go to joinbilt.com/TRADINGSECRETS Linchpin: Hiring top talent for your teams has never been easier. Linchpin is a recruitment firm that creates custom hiring and consulting services. If you are looking for a results driven and human-centered approach - this is your solution. Head over to thelinchpinco.com/contact and select Trading Secrets in the 'Where did you learn about us” section for 10% off your first placement!

Welcome back to another episode of Trading Secrets. This one is one you can't afford to miss. The Olympics are underway, and we have one of the most decorated USA Olympians Kerry Walsh, the sand volleyball hero on today's episode. going to hear so much information of what it's like to be an athlete in the summer Olympics. How much do they get paid per medal? What costs are they responsible for? I'm telling you, we do a lot of cool interviews on this podcast, but there is nothing quite like this one. And I got to say, shout out to Carrie Walsh. We have some guests that come on, and it's very

tough to get information. Carrie was an open book. And not only will you be completely intrigued by her information. You will be inspired by her take. Now, a quick little take on just the overall market of the Olympics, the economics. Stay tuned to the recap because we talk a lot about it. But what you need to know is most countries that take on the Olympics actually lose money. That's all discussed in the recap. But the Paris Organizing Committee has a budget of $4.4 billion. But when other costs like infrastructure were included, the total is close to $9 billion, according to the data from Statista. So there's so much that happens beyond what our eyeballs see in the Olympics,

and hopefully in this episode, you'll get just a little taste of that. Now, an update for my personal life, I am in Tampa this week. I have had the absolute honor and privilege of spending this weekend with Kat, John, and Alex, your dear friends. It has been so much fun. But you know what? the Olympics are underway. The medals are being tallied up, and there is so much you are going to learn from Kerry Walsh. So let's ring in the main segment with the one and only,

Carrie Walsh. Welcome back to another episode of Trading Secrets. Today, we are joined by three-time Olympic gold medalist, one-time Olympic bronze medalist, and one of the most proclaimed American Olympic athletes in recent memory, Carrie Walsh. Jennings, nicknamed six feet of sunshine. Carrie formed the greatest pairing beach volleyball has ever seen, teaming up with Misty May trainer to win three Olympic gold medals and three world titles and go unbeaten for a remarkable 112 games. On returning to the Olympic stage at Rio in 2016 with new partner April Ross, she brought in a bronze medal at age of 37. In recent years, Carrie has expanded her professional skill set.

by co-funding a non-for-profit organization to unite in power and inspire the sport of beach volleyball and communities around the country. In addition to that, Carrie became the owner of the San Diego Mojo, a world professional volleyball team and the Pro Volleyball Federation PVF, which we'll talk about, which kicks off here in 2024. We are going to learn all about what it's like to be the life of an Olympic athlete professionally, personally and financially and how she's been able to leverage her success on the court to success in business endeavors. Carrie, thank you so much for being on trading secrets. My pleasure. You nailed that. That was impressive. All right. I love that. You know, part of the intro, like there's a little strategy behind it. We got to nail it. We got to make you feel good. Then you're relaxed. And then you'll

give us all the crazy dirt behind the career. Oh, how funny. I have no secrets. So see, that's why you want me to go. All right. Well, let's start with this. So, I think what's interesting is what's going on with beach volleyball. I'll go back to your career from day one. We will step back into that. But just in general, beach volleyball right now, it's one of the fastest growing collegiate sports out there. 500% increase is what I read in an article in the NCAA team since 2011.

So there's been a lot of change to the whole business of the NCAA world, especially with NIL and the ability to monetize. When you think about your career, when you were back in those days versus where it is today, what's just your overall take of the business landscape of how it's changed, seeing that the sport you come from has grown so fast? Well, I think you just nailed it by using the term business. Like, it truly seems like everything is a business now.

You know, when I played in college at Stanford, I played indoor beach volleyball didn't exist in college and the pros it did, but not yet in college. It was, you know, it was kind of back to the innocent, I'm going to play for this university. It's not about my name. the name that I represent went to Stanford and things have changed, you know, total 180, you know, coming to 2024 and like you said, NIL. And these athletes are brands, you know, starting before

college. And, you know, they're recupering the, they're recouping the benefits of that. I know it's a tradeoff because it's not as pure and it's probably really hard for these athletes to focus and just to be student athletes, which is their main job. You know, now they have a voice and a platform and they have these companies bidding for them. and these universities bidding for them. And so I think it's a really exciting time to be a collegiate athlete, certainly an exciting time from the brands to figure out the Wild West that is NCAA. Part of me, like, is very sad because change is always hard.

And I feel like the purity, not that it was pure when I played, but it felt like it. I think there's something, like I grew, I'm a product of the 80s. You know, there's something pure and there was a code, you know, when I grew up. And, you know, the kids were kids and they were allowed to be kids. And now these kids, you know, starting, you know, when they're 10, they're like being programmed and being trained for a specific outcome. And that's beautiful. There's a lot of excellence out there. There's a lot of, you know, people moving up the ladder really fast. But I think the childhood has been lost to a certain extent. But everything's a tradeoff, you know. So I think the business of youth sports, the business of collegiate sports, it has to be named a success story because there's so many people. There's so many opportunities and people are benefiting from it on. all sides. And yet that's pretty bittersweet because it's been a drastic change. So I just can't

wait for the level set. You know, usually you start on one spectrum. There's overcorrection and now we got to figure out how to take care of the kids as we go. Yeah, that's such an interesting take. Like the economics makes so much sense, the business behind it. It now is capital, you know, B-U-I-S and E-S and it's thriving. But there is that whole dichotomy of like the character, the development of the kids is this best for them, mentally, physically. And like, even just like spiritually as a kid, just being a kid. I've had athletes that we've had on this show are A-Rod, Gronk, Sergio Garcia, Rob Deerdeck, and yourself.

I've asked all them this, and this is a perfect time to ask you this, as things are changing and becoming so competitive, and you're seeing, even younger than 10, you're seeing some like four, five, six-year-olds get so niche within their sports that it's one way, the highway, and nothing else. just from a parental standpoint, what's your overall take on that? And do you think if your kid is not doing that, that they're being set up for failure

in the space of succeeding within their sport? You know, I think it's a very, very long conversation and a lot of ways to view it. You know, personally, I think just like my general principles in life is that I want range in life. I want diversity. I want to try my hat a lot of things. I want my children to do the same because you just don't know. what I want as a five-year-old, if it doesn't change by that time, I'm 10, 15, 20, 30, like there could be something wrong there.

Or you're like Tiger Woods and you're just, you're him. You're the anomaly. You know, but he's the anomaly. And so for me, it's just every generation is different. And I think, you know, I'm 45 years old. I have three children. I don't want my kids to grow up the way I did. Like they're built for this time, this generation.

That being said, there's a lot of concerns because there's so much outside input, you know. and a lot of pressure to truly specialize. Like a three-sport athlete these days, you're such a unicorn, it's insane. When I know that growing up, playing every sport I could as long as I could, made me excellent. It made me hungry when, you know,

I would have an off-season of volleyball. I played basketball. I could not wait to get back on the court again. That hunger is like a huge resource, that these kids don't have that anymore, literally or figuratively when it comes to their craft because they do it all day every day. And like you said, in this little niche.

And so, again, everything's a tradeoff. And I can't totally bash what's happening because it's what's happening. I think what comes down to for me as a parent and as someone who wants to be excellent until I'm, you know, in heaven, hopefully, you know, 100 years from now, my kids to be excellent, have great lives. It's about the individual and the individual developing themselves. So if someone wants to take the Tiger Woods approach, you know, be very focused, very specific, it's not that he's just a great golfer. he learned discipline, he learned communication, he learned so much to be excellent in this craft. And we can't ignore the fact that that's still happening, even though it's, you know, kind of sad when kids have no range, you know, they're very specific.

It's sad, but it also could be an amazing success story. So, I think ultimately it's up to the parents. It's up to the environment that we put our kids in just to remind them that this sport, this, you know, niche, whatever you want to be, this is the vehicle for you to grow, for you to become you. And you're not a one-trick pony. you know, to be excellent, you have to be a multi-trick pony, even though this, you have one focus. You know what I'm saying? So I think it comes down to the individual.

Yeah, I think that's such a unique approach, especially the ideology of just the range. I think that makes perfect sense. One of the things you had said, too, was outlying noise. I think whether there's an accountant, teacher, nurse, or salesperson that's listening to this right now, there's still outside noise that has impacted their direction. And maybe they're starting to contemplate that. I think about someone like yourself and the other. athletes that we had on, I think specifically Rob Deerdeck, right? Sergio Garcia, pro golfer, you know there's a massive career there and there's massive upside. A. Rod, Gras, same thing. I think like skateboarding for Rob Deerdeck, beach volleyball for you. You go to Stanford in Ivy League

school, the best of the best. Did you have any outside noise kind of directing you maybe against pursuing a sport where the question marks were still there if you could actually make a career out of this? And if so, how did you kind of overcome it? You know, I kind of by nature and by nurture, I'm just pretty oblivious to the outside world. They're inspired by the outside world, but if I have something that I love, I'm just here. You know, I just, and that's been, that's helped me become great. Because again, if it's in my heart, if I feel like I have a calling, I don't care about the outside noise. Generally, when I'm feeling weak, when I'm about to level up, or when I feel like my soul is ready for a transition, that kind of little fissure in my clarity and in my direction

comes in because I'm being called to change. And that's when the outside noise can get in, you know, which at that time, and I've been through it like in every transition after high school, like, God, am I good enough for college and all these things? And in college to pros. And I just, and when I played pros, I never, I just loved it, you know, and I knew I was an NFL or MBA. I didn't have the golf money. I didn't care. I love the lifestyle. I love the pursuit that I was on. You know, it was bigger than that to me. And now with all the money in the market right now, you're like, damn, you know, 15 years later, it could have been amazing, but I didn't have that.

And I'm never one to be like, oh, like for me, I'm over here playing beach volleyball, busting my ass just like Gronk does. And I'm getting paid one one millionth of what he gets paid. Like that's not how I see the world. I see the world. This is my choice with this choice that I have. I'm not going to be a victim of my own choice, you know, like I'm a big girl. You know, I know there's opportunities here.

there's a lifestyle here that I love. I'm allowed to pursue my dreams, you know? If it's not bringing the millions, that's okay. You know, and there's other avenues. It's not about, you know, there's other ways to do is my point. And Rob Deerdeck, he transcended his sport. You know, for me, it's like, again, it's so much more than being an athlete, you know. And for me, I've been labeled a female athlete.

I've been labeled an Olympic athlete. And those two are beautiful things. They're obviously true, but it keeps me so minimized. Like, I'm so much more than an Olympic athlete. athlete, that's relevant once every four years. You know, I'm so, like, I always want to be just considered a rad athlete, you know, take away the female. I know I'm female.

It's obvious, but it's like, I don't want to be minimized. And I think when you label yourself, it inherently limits you and the limits the way the world sees you, you know, and the way I love following, you know, even Gronk and he's getting into the TV world and Deerdeck, who is just so incredible, he made a decision, you know, when he was transitioning in his career to be excellent in many, many ways. And he's a mogul because he kept developing self within his sport as a vehicle. But he's like, screw this. I don't have a shelf life.

I'm going to go and learn. And I'm going to curate my environment, curate what I focus on because I want to kick ass forever. And he's kicking ass. And he's inspiring me and so many people who play a niche sports and a niche world to go and develop themselves so they can reap the benefits of this amazing market where there's so much opportunity of a return. Yeah.

I think that makes perfect sense. And for my listeners out there, I'm going to get into some of the dollars and cents, but my curiosities are driving me in another direction a little bit now. Because I think about when you talk about labeling, I think it relates to so many people back home because you get labeled with your job title. You get labeled with what you are. And I don't think most people have maybe just the overall depth, their perspective you do to get out of the label.

I think they get pigeonholed into the label. And as a result of that, that label puts ceilings on what they can do and how they can do and how they think they can navigate. I know personally, like just through therapy, when I get mislabeled, that's something that personally totally deregulates me. Like, it's something I work on. So for you, when you were given those labels or when you're like, no, I'm bigger, better than that, I can do other things,

I guess what are some tactics you would provide others back home that are sitting there that are like, wait a second, I do get mislabeled, and that does impact the ceiling and the expectations of what I actually could do. Yeah, you know, I mean, I think it's something I'm certainly still working through as I just retired, you know, in 2023 like a month ago. I'm still. Congratulations. They think, thank you. Thank you. It's sweet, but I'm ready. You know, it's just, it's not all bad, right? Like, I'm an athlete. Poor me. I'm a pro athlete. People see me as that I want to leverage that label, right? Like, if you're the VP of whatever, like leverage that label and know that it's not a ceiling. It's just literally everything is just a stepping stone. And it's up to, us like to know thyself know where you want to go you know acknowledge where you are right now acknowledge the great things about it and where do you want to go next you know and if you have that kind of north star that maybe fluid and keeps changing but is guiding you who really cares what you're labeled like i the world's going to do what the world's going to do it's up to me it's up to me

you know and so i think ultimately i think every single question you asked me darling i'm going to be like pointing back to myself because it's up to me you know it's not it's not up to you to make me realize that I'm more nuanced than just a female, you know, five-tidal Olympian. Like, that's my job. But I think, I think it's up to us to go outside of ourselves and see who's kicking us in the industries that they're in or who's cooking at, kicking us in other areas where we just need to expand our identities personally. Because once you kind of see yourself like, oh, I can be that, then your universe and

your thoughts and your actions start to kind of shift to help you become that and take that journey. You know, so it's not a linear thing. you know, you don't go from A to Z and it's like totally straight. Like, I'm finding out who I am right now in this conversation with you. Yeah. You know, and so, yeah, again, everything, everything is there to serve as far as I'm concerned. And then just what are you going to do with it? And where do you want to go with it?

That defines these things. It is a mosaic, guys. It is far, far from the blueprint. I think that's perfectly said. Thank goodness. Yeah, right? I know. I know.

Well, like you. Like, I love what, sorry to interrupt, but I love what you said. Like, your curiosities are leading you somewhere else in this conversation. I do a lot of therapy as well. I love it. I do a lot of spiritual work. And like what it comes down to that I'm learning and what my life experience shows me is that if you follow your curiosity and you follow your sincere passion, like you're stoked. Not only are you like alive and feeling it and being inspired, which kind of makes you, it's like being inspired is the antidote to overwork.

It's the antidote to, you know, just kind of being in the humdrum of life. like you're in it, you know, and I think people, maybe they allow the, the labels that we put on ourselves, or people put on us to keep us uninspired and boxed in. So it's up to us to follow our curiosities, because our curiosity is what I've learned. It's part of our intuition, you know, just same thing as our desires. Like our desires, it's a calling. And maybe you're like, I have a desire to be rich. And that's like the surface of it. But if you sit with it and if you kind of go down the path of I want to, I want to, you know, make a lot of money and have generational wealth, like what really is under that? Sure. You know, it's like,

Maybe you want to live a life of excellence and discipline. Maybe you want the freedom that comes with that or the creativity that comes with that, you know? And so I think it's really important for all of us to follow our curiosities and desires and to really sit with them because that will lead you to great places. Yeah, I agree with that. I also think that it's, if anyone's listening to this and they're starting to feel, I don't know, maybe of any form of shame like, oh, I really haven't pursued curiosities.

I don't think the system is set up for us to pursue our curiosities. I think the system is set up for us to kind of check the boxes and live that blueprint life. So I do think it takes like a very thoughtful, intentional effort and a consistent effort to pursue those curiosities because most of the time you're not rewarded immediately for doing so, which is a big take, right? Now, so one thing I'm curious about, I looked at your, you have the title out there, at least online, is most women's career earnings, $2.6 million, just $2.6,000. $2.7 million, but I wanted to rewind back to the start of your career. Your first Olympic debut is in 2000. Now, at this age, I think you're around 22, 23. Talk to us a little bit for people who have no idea. Where does monetization even begin when you go into pro beach volleyball? What does it look

like? You know, it's so interesting. So my first Olympics, I was still a student at Stanford. I turned 22 at my first games in Sydney. I was getting paid. I can't remember the, I think $1,200 a month. My first raise, I think I got, I went up to like $1,500. You know, so that was like the life of a pro Olympian, you know, back in 2000. I didn't give a shit. Like I was so fired up. Like, you know, following my dreams. My life was unfolding. I had no sponsorship deals. You know, I think Nike probably represented our team or was the sponsor for the team. And you get the perks that come with a team sponsorship, but nothing individual. Once I moved to the beach, which was the year following the Sydney Olympics, 2001, I just turned 23. I was training with Misty

May, one of the best players in the world. She had just competed in the Sydney Olympics. Her first Olympics and Beach got fifth place. We, our first two years together, by the end of year two, we were the number one team in the world. And it was awesome, like kicking ass, you know, making good prize money, you know, until you have sponsors, you live and die off your prize money. And the prize You know, it's fair enough. Like it covered our costs, covered our coaching, and we had a little, you know, spare change at the end. But we were the best team in the world for the first two years and didn't have one single deal. The moment that we signed with the AVP, the domestic tour back in 2003, the sponsors came.

Because when you're playing internationally, they don't, you know, the American public doesn't see you. You know, and the brands don't really care about you. Once the Olympics come around again, they'll care about you. but it was interesting because we did not, we intentionally did not sign the ADP contract because we thought it was too confining. We had aspirations of being the best in the world, to be the best in the world to play on the world tour.

And the ADP contract wanted to keep us exclusive at home, or at least be able to control and say when we can go and not. And that wasn't okay with us. So Misty and I fought really hard to be able to do both. Finally, we came to terms after two years. We signed it. We became, you know, at the time, I think we were on Fox Sports every weekend.

We're in NBC, many, many of the weekends, and we were winning. And the sponsors came. And it was incredible. Gatorade, I think, was my first big deal, Gatorade and Speedo. They were incredible. You know, not that it was the best money in the world. I couldn't even tell you what I got annually. What does a Gatorade Speedo big deal mean to you?

It's like, what is that? Well, any deal at the time that wasn't product was a good deal. But no, I mean, we got, I don't even know, like, they were both, Gatorade was under $100,000 a year. Speedo might have been right at that. But it was just for apparel. It wasn't for ball and sunglasses and all these things. But Gatorade put me in commercials.

Okay. Which, you know, that's money in the bank. Say it again. I said, once you go on commercials through Gatorade, doesn't that technically can't appellate you for other advertisers? Yes, 100%. I mean, the more you're, you know, the more visible you are, obviously, the better you are. And the CEO of the AVP at the time, Leonard Armato, he's been the greatest evangelist

for our sport by far, anyone I've known in the sport. He's incredible. and he created an amazing platform where the brands wanted to support us, wanted to support the tour and the athletes. We were consistently on TV, you know, both locally, regionally and nationally. And it was the biggest party out there. And Misty and I won at the right time, you know. So, but it took us signing a domestic contract and the brands knew we'd be home

and consistent for it to change our world and it changed our world. Interesting. Okay, I have a million questions because you touched on. so much just the answer. But I want to go back. Let's go back to the 1250 to the 1500 when your first signed as an Olympian. The golden question I'm thinking is who's paying? Is it the United States federal government that pays? No. No, it's so interesting. So the USA volleyball is our domestic federation. So every sport, like there's USA basketball. That's the federation, right? But what's interesting, I think the United States is, I think maybe the only one, but there could be one or two more, the only national governing body that is not supported by our government.

So our government has nothing to do with it. So there's no subsidies that go to support Team USA. Right. So it's all the brand partnerships. That's why the Nike deal, the Visa deal, you know, the Coca-Cola deal, those fun Olympic dreams. You know, they obviously buy all the TV time, work with NBC. But that money helps. helps fund the federations. And the better of the federation, the more wins, the more goals they get, the more funding they get. You know, so, so yeah, so the government is out of it, which is great, because we can't be bought and paid for, you know, like the athletes are pretty autonomous. Everyone's broke. I think a majority of the Olympic athletes live under the poverty line if they were just

to take what they get from our federation. But, you know, our federations are kind of the admins. They don't really do much for us. And that's, that's not consistent across the other countries. countries for the most? Gosh, no. No. But, you know, it's a trade-off as well. Like, like Germany, Brazil, like in beach volleyball, my sport, the whole world is so good now. And the athletes outside of America are 100% more supported than we are here in the U.S. Not that a federation doesn't try their best, doesn't support us because they do. You know, they help us, you know, support our coaches with

subsidies and stipends and help us travel to a certain extent and nutrition and training. But it's, it's like pittance compared to China, compared to Russia, you know, those athletes get a salary, they get their housing paid for, all these things. We don't get that. But that being said, I am the master of my own destiny. I get to choose my partner. My federation doesn't pair me up. You know what I'm saying? So even though we're all broke, I'm free. And I get to control to do what you want. Exactly. Which is priceless to me. And I think that's why America continues to do well because you have, A, we have a bigger pool of athletes to pool from. You know, we're a big country and our sport is kicking ass. In Canada,

there's like four top athletes and they have to like intermix. You know, if they're fighting, there's not very many in the pipeline coming up. You know what I'm saying? Same thing for Switzerland. So I would much prefer the freedom than, you know, being owned, but it's challenging. And you think that with the model that we currently have, even though it's not nearly as lucrative, is other countries, when you look at the trajectory of United States in the Olympics, your overall thought processes is this model will still be a winning model, what we're doing? I have to, yeah, I believe that because no one else has the NCAA pipeline that we have. True.

Which are mostly a vast majority of American athletes being trained. You know, internationals are coming over to, you know, get college degrees. Most of the athletes in other countries are pro by the time they're 16. You know, they don't have the university, college scholarship system we have. You know, so these athletes are coming out of college. You know, USC has been a perennial, you know, champion in beach volleyball. And they're coming out of college winning world tour events because they've been so supported in their four years of development in college.

And so they come out like a pro athlete. They're being way more taken care of than even the current pro-an athletes because they have a system and a structure around them, you know. So the NCAA gives us a pipeline that is very, very relevant that will keep America. strong forever but that's why when we get to talking about the pro volleyball federation that's why it's so important that we have a pro a very strong pro tour here in america because that just further develops you know there there's a there's a gap between collegiate to to team USA right and so we need a very very strong pro tier in america to bridge that gap so our athletes can stay sharp

Misty and I won three gold medals because the AVP at the time was so damn strong. Like we had no weekends off. Now the ADP is very, very weak. And I say that with all due respect, it's tough market. There's a new investor. I don't have any details on that. But my mission in the next five years is to develop an entity that brings American pro beach volleyball back to the best in the world. Because we need that.

Our kids deserve that. These collegiate athletes that are so badass deserve that. And the market wants it. you know like look at this tide that volleyball in general is writing it's time and in your answer to that then is the pro volleyball federation which kicks off in 2024 correct for indoor yes absolutely okay yeah absolutely yeah because right now i mean kind of same thing for beach like in all the top collegiate athletes go overseas to make a living now indoor like they leave for eight to nine months to go and make a living right and some of them are making 40 grand some are making hundreds of

thousands, but they're leaving American soil to go be obscure until Team USA calls, you know, three years, every three years so they can train for the Olympics. And that's when they become relevant again. So what the Pro Viable Federation is doing is they're building, you know, a mirror property from the great European, South American and Asian leagues here in America. The Trump card that we have that no one else has is that we have American media here. And these athletes already have collegiate NIL, you know, IPs and platforms. and voices that the moment they sign internationally, all that goes away. So the fact that the ProV Volleyball Federation is giving them a platform to keep all of that

and to grow upon it and to grow their own personal brand, like that's money in the bank. Yeah, it seems like a missing piece of the puzzle with NIL moving in the way it is for NCAA. It's a missing piece of the puzzle that Americans need for us to continue to thrive within this sport. A hundred percent because, I mean, it's going to be, it's going to be really sad of people's glory days were in college, even though they could have been the best in the world, but they got these athletes, some of them are getting paid a lot of money in college. The moment they become pro, all that goes away. And they're going to be making the league minimum or whatever it is, you know, but if they play here in America and if the pro federation does what we intend to do, which is to become

the number one premier league in the world, it's going to take time, but we're going to get there with great media partners, with great band partners. These athletes are going to be able to pursue their dreams making great money here in America forever. And then they're commentators, you know. And then they become, you know, local celebrities and national celebrities where they can keep doing commercials. They can start their businesses based off of, you know, their everything that started in college, really.

Right. What's interesting is what we've heard from you is the following three things. We've heard European League Minimums and Dollar amounts. We've heard about the new Pro Volleyball Federation, which is trying to replicate that, if not do it better to keep Americans. American soil. But another thing we heard from you, she said previously was that you and Misty had to win tournaments to win enough money to then cover the cost of your coaches. That still threw me and I have to go back to that. What was the business model like then? Did you have to pony up money and

get sponsored enter tournaments? And then if you won, like how to in paying for coaches, right? That is so different than any other sport that's out there. That's just in the institution. So tell me what that model was. Well, it hasn't changed. to be honest with you, you know, so, so I'm talking about beach volleyball right now, right? So because if you're indoor volleyball, you're in that system, there's a head coach, you know, the organization pays for the coach, you know, you have a salary, you have guaranteed money when you play indoor volleyball. The variable is how much, right, and your contract, like, then where you're going to play

all these things. Beach volleyball, unless you have brand partners, which I would say 90% of beach, pro beach volleyball players do not have brand partners that actually give money. They get product, you know, maybe a stipend here and there, but you're not making a salary that you can live on. So the model is prize money. The model is you pay all week, you pay your coaches, you pay your trainers, you pay to eat the best you can, you pay for your hotels, you pay for your travel, pay for your coaches,

hotels and travel. The athlete pays for all this stuff. And then you're hoping to recoup all or most of it when you win on the weekend, right? But you might have some tournaments where you're losing money. Oh, 100%. Well, most people are losing money. Like, you know, the top two, you know, teams make a decent amount, but that keeps lessening the prize money keeps going down and down. It's pretty pathetic right now on the world tour and the domestic tour right now. So people are losing money. The moment beach volleyball players retire right now, they'll have more money in their bank, 100%. Everyone's broke, which is sad. But it's amazing because these athletes are so dedicated. They're so devoted. They love it so much. They're willing to have two and three jobs, right? And that's what most people do. They work to support their professional beach volleyball hobby and, you know, and they grind it out. And to me, that's beautiful. That's why Americans kick ass because they're like, oh, this is an obstacle.

This is a mountain I have to climb. All right. I'm going to climb it. It's part of it. I love it so much. Yeah. So, but I need to change that because people retire too early now and some people don't, some of the best in the world don't even get started because they're like, there's no career for me here.

Like, I need to start my life life. Yeah. When you say prize pools for those that do win, like give me an idea of what a prize pool looks like in this space. You know, it's every tournament's different. And if you were to go to ADP.com or FIVB, you know, dot com or BVB info.com, you can go and see the prize money for every tournament from the 80s to now. And in the 80s and early 90s, people were making hundreds of thousands of dollars per victory, right? You split with your partner. Now I think for a domestic tour win, maybe you split 10 grand. Yeah. Interesting. You know, no, no, it's like 20 grand. Maybe on the world

tour. I think, you know, we had world championships this year. You know, they're making, they're making nothing. They're not making anything. That's just, you know, and what do you have to, what does a coach typically pay? If you bring a coach for the whole tournament, what do you typically have to pay? Well, we either percentage of your prize money, which is a risk for the coaches, right? Or, or, or you pay them, you know, a daily stipend, you know? Seems a little. Oh, it's broken. You've, like, we're seeing, like, what happened with Liv, obviously. And, you know, and It's creating a lot of inefficiencies or maybe more efficiencies now with PGA. Do you think there's going to be someone that comes along with some big pocket that just completely takes the sport over?

Well, I think it's beautiful what the Pro-Vlivenileball Federation is done because they have a league, right? The leagues, the overarching league structure akin to the NFL, right? The league runs the league. And then they're bringing these individual owners. And the individual owners, they're business people. They know the entertainment space. They know the sports business space. and they're bringing their respective teams to come and win.

Like there are seven teams in year one of the Pro Volleyball Federation. And there are seven unique ownership groups. And they all want to win and kick ass, right? And so they bought into the league and they have to, you know, pay their P&L, you know, every year. And it's a rounding air to own a professional team in our sport to most, you know, to most of the world. You know, you can own it for a song, which is beautiful. Like, you know, we have room to pivot and you can curate this amazing. experience and the ProVolival Federation is going to kick ass.

And so anyhow, the model has been broken. We, once the media remembers and, you know, just gets behind your sport, like is happening in indoor volleyball, like they started putting NCAA collegiate volleyball matches after the NFL. Yeah. Ratings by a million. It matters. These details matter.

So I think the media, probably because of the marketplace, has picked, it has picked volleyball as a winner, something they're going to get. behind. That changes the game forever. And I think people are going to be like, whoa, where did volleyball come from? They're an overnight success. That's such crap. It's been, it's been, volleyball has been growing like being besters since I played. You know, I graduated different in 2000. And it's been like this, indoor for sure, beach for sure. And now the marketplace is recognizing it and the media is getting behind it and we have the recipe for success. And that's why for the Pro Volleyball Federation to be first to market here in America to sign these amazing athletes that

hungry that want to stay home, that want to be pioneers and develop this league here in America with the support of CBS, who is our first national TV sponsor, with the support of companies that are amazing in American sports history like Franklin Sports. We're building this a team of individuals and of brands that are going to support this league moving forward, and the athletes are going to just, they're going to give it everything that have. I think it's fantastic. It sounds like such a great stepping stone for what is so needed. what question i had just about the two sports of indoor versus beach volleyball both are olympic sports but are they transitional like can you be the best indoor player and still be

the best beach players it feels like a whole different ball game well that you know the fundamentals of each skill are pretty similar right you know like you bump set spike like if you have good ball control on the in court volleyball six on six you're probably going to have good ball ball control on the beach but you have the same you have the wind you have the sun you know obviously two players compared to six. So for me, it took me a good year to, like, not cry every day at practice. I felt, I was so humbled because I felt pretty competent indoor, but it took me a while. And it was very, very humbling. But yeah, so for me, I was obviously made Team USA indoor, plant at Stanford. We won national championships. And I transitioned to beach. The people

who do well on the beach and people who can outlast that is comfort, you know, who are committed, who surround themselves by excellence, who are curious, who allow their potential. to provoke them in a good way, not to make them feel like they're a loser, you know, and those who are resourceful who like, like, I'm not going to make any money until I start winning. How can I, you know, fund this dream of mine? So I don't have to be worried about paycheck to paycheck. I need some simplicity. So it's just, you know, anything that requires greatness and, you know, kind of giving yourself enough time and space to do the learning curve, right? You have to have that to be beach volleyball. Indoor volleyball, there's, there's, you're

more of a herd. There's less autonomy. You're told what to do more, but there's guaranteed money. You have a structure you're familiar with. The leagues already exist. It's a little bit more embedded. Okay. Well, I have you on Beach Volleyball. I got to go back to this question that I was very curious about was three-time Olympic gold medalist, a bronze medalist. Do athletes get paid when they win a medal? Like, are you paid a certain dollar amount for a medal? And what is that amount? So, yeah, so within the USA Federation, there's something called Operation gold and you know you have to you have to sign this contract and I believe I made 25 grand for gold medal okay yeah and then like if I'm one of the top I want to say six athletes within

my federation per gender then I get the chance to get health insurance okay um and I get I get like I think the biggest kind of monthly stipend I ever got for USA volleyball was $3,000 a month personally right and so that goes to me paying my coaches that goes to me, you know, travel expenses and paying my rent, all these things. And then there's also a coaching stipend where if you're one of the top teams, I think, I think it's either every quarter or twice a year you get a $10,000 coaching stipend that goes to your coach to help subsidize these costs. But you're training five days a week, you know, and again, you're paying for your coaches travel. You're paying for all these things. Like, you're so out of pocket. It's so

insane. Absolutely insane. Isn't it so impressive though? Yeah. Like that's the dedication. is so incredible. It is because it's definitely commitment over dollars. It's definitely pursuit of passion and pride over financial gain, which so many people in this world go their entire careers with never stepping into that zone even for an hour a week, yet alone career. So it is, it is like quite impressive, you know. But it's interesting how it's changing for the good to make it more sense. Because if you could have financial gain, passion, and pride all aligned, I think you created an unbeatable group. Yeah, 100%.

You know, and like, I mean, the marketplace with social media, like, you know, there's so many, there's so much money out there, you know? And so, again, if you're resourceful like you and your podcast, you're kicking ass, you're creating merch, like all these things, like that's the opportunity that's out there for all these niche humans, you know? And so again, it's, you have to be gritty, you have to be a hustler. But if you have that passion that comes inherent when you're chasing something that you love so much, like it exudes and the authenticity exudes. And so you can create your own stability

financially, you know, even if you're just piecemeal together. But then at some point when you do start winning, you know, people do show up. And you do separate yourself in the crowd because you are so sincerely passionate about something. And, you know, you stuck with it. Like people want to be around that energy. A hundred percent. Something we talked about here is just financial transparency and then the process of negotiating. Like for you and Misty, did you guys talk about where you paid? negotiate together where you just paid the same like how did that work so we each had individual agents right the marketing agents we never we had the same one for like a minute but that became clear that wasn't going to work out because it's such a small pool you know and you want to kind

of you know you want the best for everyone really so yeah so no I wasn't privy to missy's deal points she wasn't privy to mine the league the AVP back in the day there would be obviously two our sponsors and they would say, hey, Misty and Care would be great. They're winning. Or, you know, they would kind of feed you opportunities here and there. But no, it was up to you to have an agent to represent yourself or represent yourself well and go from there. Okay, interesting.

All right, I just have two more questions for you. One is geared around just this whole concept of winning. I think I'd read that your win streak was a hundred and twelve consecutive matches, 19 consecutive tournaments. I mean, that is unheard of to be that sharp, that perfect, that long. And I think there's probably concepts or behaviors you guys deployed to do that that we could all take away from. What would some of those concepts, behaviors, or disciplines that you guys executed in this time period to literally never lose that maybe we could try at home and into our lives of what we're doing? Well, fundamentally, we loved it so much.

Like, we loved it. Which is huge, right? If you love something, you'll suffer for it. You'll show up every day for it. Like, that's why the purpose, the love behind something is so important. And that's for whatever you're doing, you know. We also respected each other greatly and we didn't want to let each other down. And so we held each of ourselves so accountable because I wanted to be my best for Misty.

And Misty wanted to be, and that's, that's priceless, you know, like we were a team in the, in every sense of the word, we became a family. We showed up every day to win. Misty's dad, Butch, very, very early on our career, he's like, you guys, you know, beating someone 217 is too close. Like, kick everyone's ass. And so we took a lot of pride in that. And not that we wanted to, like, demoralize people, we wanted to be excellent. You know, we gave everyone, whether it was the last seat in the tournament or the one closest to us, we gave them our best out of respect, out of respect for them, for us, and just

out of respect for the opportunity we had to dominate, you know, which is beautiful. But I think the most important thing that Misty and I did, and we didn't do it perfectly, but we did it a majority of the time. When things got hard, we went like this. you know anytime we did lose not within that streak obviously but we we lost you know here and there we would always leave the court arm and arm we would never go like this whereas you look at every other team even you know this applies to relationships partnerships like usually you lose and people fracture and you go over here to your corner you talk shit you point finger we never did

that we literally made a point of doing this and then we would watch next game and sitting by each other you know there was no separation from us and that was off the court and on the court when things got really hard and walking in the court misty and i came so close together and it not necessarily was it spoken not necessarily did we have this game plan it's just what we did and that to me is it's it's it's the recipe for success and even if we did lose it's like who gives a shit because we stuck together now let's go and figure out how to not let that happen we had fun with that you know It's a recipe for success, and it's a masterclass on partnership, which exists in all forms, right, personally, professionally, socially, friendships, all of it. So, yeah, I mean, that's absolutely brilliant. And I guess that that is the recipe for staying undefeated that long. While I have you, the last thing I'm really wanted to touch about is just the ownership of San Diego Mojo. So just kind of the business behind it for the listeners back home, you know, where can they learn even more about it? Just tell us a little bit about that. yeah well you can go to san diego mojo vb.com and check out what we're all about and it's that same

handle on instagram you know on threads and x and all these things so please follow us you know it's been a dream come true being part of this ownership group to be the first team on the west coast the first california team in the inaugural season to be part of this leadership group it's just been a dream come true and you know i decided to retire you know end of last year and I have, I mean, there's so many things going on, but I had no direct plans. And this fell into my lap in the spring. And I started to learn about the ProVoli Football Federation. I started to learn about the other ownership groups. And it got me so excited. And so for me, as part of the owners in San Diego, I'm a, I'm a lover of San Diego. It's an incredible sports town. It's such a huge

community, even though it feels niche. They show up for their teams. You know, the wave, you know, the woman's professional soccer team, they're at Snapdragon Stadium. They are kicking. ass in attendance. People show up in San Diego and volleyball is a lifestyle there. They have some of the top juniors clubs in the country, picking butt, indoor and beach. And so it's like we've picked this amazing community, one of the finest cities in the world, to bring a pro volleyball federation team there. All the athletes want to be in California. You know, I mean, there's six other amazing franchises. Nothing can beat us because we're in San Diego. God bless Vegas. God bless Omaha, God bless these amazing franchises, but there's something special about California,

you know, and so and the community and the business community, they rally. You know, I have called so many people in the business world be like, how can we help care? We want to be part of this. Like, let us, let us be part of this. And for me, you know, we had our launch party where we announced the name and all these things. And I really reflected on what it means to be an owner and the ownership that comes with it. And I take this very seriously.

Like for me to have ownership of something, I'm going to handle it. like I handled it with Misty. I'm going to go like this. I'm going to be all in. I'm going to get dirty, be consistent, support these athletes, support the community.

And I hope the community tips ownership of us as well because they resonate with us because these athletes are going to kick ass. The leadership group, our president, our GM, they're on fire.

Our PR, they're on fire for this. So, you know, I think greatness doesn't happen in a vacuum. It does take a village and the village in San Diego is super dope. So I can't wait just for them

to fall in love with us and us to ride this wave together. That is so cool. And it seems like with your approach, it's always like right now, what are we doing, thinking in the present, thinking with passion and pride. When I think about ownership of a company, though, or of a sports organization like this, and I just go to economics, which I know is definitely not a direction or motivator for you. I have to imagine the idea is build this up, build equity within the league, eventually your value goes up. And then possibly, I mean, we just saw Mark Cuban exit some of his shares of Mavericks for the three point something billion is the idea though is to like build equity and then possibly exit is that like the financial goal with ownership that i mean the the goal is to kick ass and to make a ton of money like period we want to be defranchised that's the standard bearer and with that we need to be financially sustainable and thriving and the other members of the ownership group everyone we bring in wants that they want to win you know they're thinking billions they don't want you know which obviously

takes time. Like, how long did it take Mark Cuban to develop the Mavericks? You know, like, but that's the mindset. And so not necessarily that I'm ever thinking about an exit. That's part of it, though. That's life. You know, I'm 45. I got three kids. Like, things are going to shift and curiosities are going to change and priorities. But I'm in this to win it. And I think the financial opportunity on all sides of this is amazing, whether you're an athlete, whether you're an owner, whether, you know, you're in the league infrastructure, your brand partner media. Like, volleyball is where you want to be and I'm just I'm just excited to bring my heart to it you know I want to make money I want to be free you know like we talked earlier on like you know some people like you follow

your desires and I have this desire to create generational wealth and it's because I love my children I want them to be set but I want that freedom that comes with it and the creativity and I want to create things in this world and this certainly the pro volleyball federation and my you know ownership stake in San Diego mojo can be part of that for me and it's not just self-serving it's It serves my family, it serves my community, and it serves just every single athlete for generations that are going to be able to compete. That's beautiful. Yeah, I think it's so cool. Carrie, we're going to have to have it back on trading secrets. We do sell it for 8, 9, 10, but I don't know. Who knows how it's going to be round two with Carrie.

But, Carrie, what we got to do before we wrap up is get your trading secrets. So it's something that people back home, they can't read the textbook, they can't get out of TikTok tutorial. They can only get through your wild career direct. successes and failures. So we need one trading secret from you, Carrie, that you can leave us with. I mean, I have to believe you've heard this before, but there is no secret. You show up. If you want excellence, you organize your life to be excellent. For me, a secret of mine that I want to shop for the mountaintops is to learn from the best. There's so many resources out there. If you want to be an amazing trader, if you want to make a, you know, boatload of money,

if you want to be excellent in volleyball, go and learn from the best, watch their video, listen to how they speak, listen to how they organize their lives. But ultimately, I think the biggest secret of all is that you are the answer, you are the antidote, how you choose to show up every day, whether it's a shitty day or great day, you're kicking ass, whatever it is. It's a new day right now. It's a new moment right now. So choose who you want to be.

Practice your way into becoming that and being that and you'll get there. I love it. I think the secrets, there are no secrets. The secrets lie within yourself and they lie within the people that have already done it successfully. That's a hell of a trading secret. Carrie Walsh Jennings, where can everyone find? to everything you have going on. Well,

San Diego MojoB.com for sure. And then at Carrie Walsh across the board. Yeah, thank you so much for having me and for spreading love for the ProVybal Federation and San Diego Mojo. It's going to be incredible.

Hopefully we'll have a team in Nashville soon. New York's been after. But the sport is blowing up and I really appreciate you allowing me to come on here and just talk about it because, you know,

it's like baby steps. You know, like you don't fall on top of the mountain. These interviews, your curiosity, your openness to having me on matters a lot. So thank you so much. I look forward to coming back and sharing all the good news and hopefully hosting you at a game or two.

That would be awesome. We've loved having you on. We can't wait for you to come back. And guys, go give Kerry a follow on Instagram and X. And, of course, Sandeagle Mojo. We'll be looking for that Nashville team. And Carrie, this has been so informative, insightful and motivational. So thank you for behind this episode, Traying Secrets.

My pleasure. Godspeed. Ding, ding, ding. We are closing in the bell to the Kemp, Carrie Walsh episode, how appropriate, how timely. The Olympics are now underway. What an exciting time for sports, for the entire world to sit and watch such entertaining sports from all different areas, all different countries.

You got to love it. Now, with the Olympics, David, I feel like there's so much to cover. I mean, there's the athletes. There is the NIL. There's everything that Carrie talked about. There's the medal comp. There's so many directions we could go. We'll stick to business and the numbers here.

But I know you, right? You were an athlete in college. I was an athlete in college. You work with kids every day. Hopefully, one of your athletes that you work with every day will be on the USA hockey team one day. But I know you have to have a million and one opinions on what you just heard. David, what do you think? Yeah, it's the Olympics.

It's a great time in the summers, especially when it seems like there's nothing on TV. It brings everyone together. You got a lot of athletes, former athletes, amateur athletes, professional athletes, tuning in to see the sport. And then it just brings in everybody to see the culture of the city. How are they going to do the opening ceremonies? What's the fashion of these countries wearing these things? It's really just such so interesting. And then like you said, the business of it all. Olympics, we've seen cities in the Olympics in the past that have really been hurt from the economic like downturn of facilities that don't get used or maybe infrastructure that they overpaid for.

I know in Paris itself, the scene river, they've spent one and a half billion dollars trying to clean the scene, and it's not quite clean levels. But we could talk about a bunch of different things. The number one thing I got to talk about that Carrie Walsh from this interview in particular was Jay, it truly felt like I was Olympics aside.

It felt like I was tuning into a motivational speaker. The one thing that I have highlighted from this, and I'd love to just get your take, if you felt this was she had the most clear definition of her own self-accountability and self-ownership in who she was, how she got to where she was, the career that she's had, and just like owns it all and makes no excuses, no pity party, no victims. She understands that she wasn't get petty law, but this was her choice. I just felt so empowered in my own life by listening to her because I was reflecting on

the choices that I made and what maybe I complain about or what I'm happy with because I know that I maybe suffer at times. That was my takeaway. I was so incredibly inspired by her. Did you get that feeling kind of being on the interview with her? David, she was amazing. Like I left that interview just blown away by so many things. And I'm like, I want Kerry to like get involved at a greater level in all areas of

leadership. Like this is the person I want leading the charge. Before we dive even deeper into Carrie specifically, you mentioned something that was so pertinent to what we do on trading secrets. And it's the economics. I read many articles about how the Olympics, it's just become the exact quote. A lot of headlines are saying they're economically unattainable to host anymore. And so there was a grid. And I'm looking at it right now. And it goes to the Summer Olympics bid budget estimates versus the final costs going all the way from 1992 to 2008. And 2028, it will be in Los Angeles. And they show the budget. they're expecting versus the actual costs. In no Summer Olympics, David, from 1992 to what's already going to happen in 2008, which is Los Angeles, has a budget been in line with the final cost.

We know that Paris is already up at least 115% from their budget. If you go to Barcelona, which was 92, Atlanta, 96, Sydney, 2000, Athens, 2004, Beijing, 2008, London, 2012, Rio de Janeiro, 2016, Tokyo 2020, Paris, 2024, and then L.A. 2028. Every single one of those circumstances, the final costs were more than the budget. The largest being Rio de Janeiro, 2016, the budget was around $5 billion. David almost cost them $25 billion. So that is something we just can't ignore. United States, L.A. 2028, the budget is around $5 billion.

it is already in 2020. They haven't even happened. There are already costs of over $7 billion. So this is really important stuff that you alluded to. And if you want, we can continue this conversation or we get back to carry, but there's so much to talk about. Well, I just, I pray for the traffic in LA in 2028 when they have these, but it's a wonder why, Jason, do you think that the economy and maybe the free advertisement or press for

these cities for turrets? Do you think that it at all can equate to hosting the games? I think it's actually a really good connection to some of the small business owners that are listening to this podcast or just individual contractors or just workers. I think in general, there's something with ego and there's something with business, right? And when your ego attaches to business, you lose the focus of the business, right? And when you have your country hosting the entire world, there's so much pressure for the impact. the impression, what people are going to say, that I think people lose sight of the dollars and cents and they go and spend more and more than they should. I think this happens with small

businesses. I think this happens with individuals trying to keep up with other people on social media. We know it's an American issue with people in their spending. I think what happens is they think they need to leave a greater impression than is necessary because they're so worried about what everybody else thinks. That's truly my baseline, my hypothesis as to why. And if you look at all those what are people going to think what's the setting what's a backdrop the most beautiful backdrop and facility that is at the paris olympics in my opinion as it relates to this podcast is the beach volleyball court the beach volleyball court at the paris olympics has the eiffel tower directly in the middle in line with the net at center court um one of my coaches actually is over

in paris right now shut up ryan patrick um he sent me a picture and it's just beautiful it's It's the sun is setting. The Eiffel Towers in the background. And here we are beach volleyball, which is one of the most popular summer sports at the Olympics. Have you ever been to Paris? I've never been to Paris. I've never been to Paris. It's gorgeous. It's beautiful.

Very romantic. You know, I was warned a little bit that, like, they don't love Americans over there. I hate to take that generalization and apply it to everybody because that is not fair. I found everyone was, like, very, very kind and sweet. I will tell you one time I went to pay for a train and I had a I only like 50 euro and I think the train was like three euro and the guy looking at me and I trust me I would tell you like if I was a dick or in a rush or anything I wasn't he looked at me and could clearly like just tell as American and he he took all this change in euro 47 euro and he like like almost like poker chips

lined it up and getting ready to give it to me is change didn't give me one bill and then just pushed it over and all like toppled yeah and i intentionally i'd like clean up all these euro and i was like what the hell was that and my buddy was like dude you look like an american you walk like american you are american that had to be that i just would love you maybe it maybe it was it right but that's a story i definitely that stuck with me i've never been to paris i've never been to an Olympics definitely something that I would like to do similar like a World Cup and just like honestly the more that I want to talk about things I feel like we could have a whole episode on the economics of the Olympics you got the athletes in the Olympic village that are sleeping on cardboard beds they're trying to Paris is trying to make like this being the most sustainable game sustainable Olympic games of all time probably on the fact that you said if they can recruit some cost and sustainability rather than just wasted furniture facilities. et cetera. It's just a $6 billion, like you said, $6 billion cost is just ridiculous. But yeah, I mean, the Carrie's story about her pursuing her Olympic dream and relating it

back to her college experience, relating it back to her pro experience, now owning a pro franchise, what part of her experience, you know, let's talk on the business side, do you think really stood out the most? To me, it was her take on just, I think, I think, I think a, monetizing kind of as an athlete in United States and how the beauty of it is like, you know, there's so much opportunity, but there's also so much frustration, challenge, issues, things working against you. And I think she did an unbelievable job of showing you a T-chart of the good and the bad with it. And I think as a spectator, what we always do is we watch and we're rooting and we're cheering and we're quick to critical.

to size, but we don't actually think about the day in and day out of these athletes, what they sacrifice to represent their country, not just from the United States, but from every single country. And there's so much that goes into it that we as spectators don't think about. And to me, I think that was probably one of the most interesting, eye-opening, and maybe even I'd use the word jarring observations I had in talking about. Well, she even said she doesn't like to be referred at as a gold medalist Olympian because it makes people think that every once every four years she pops up. She does her thing and then doesn't think about what she's doing for the four years in between. I loved some of the conversations that you asked her. By the way,

I thought you did a phenomenal job as the interviewer. And she was very complimentary of you. You said you followed your curiosity sometime, kind of went off script of what you thought it was going to be. But a lot of real world takeaways that she had from her experience was when she talked about being labeled. She says, your label is not your ceiling, know your self-value, and the choices, she always went back to her choices. I choose to do this because I'm in love with it. If I'm in love with it, I'm committed to it.

She had a line that says, if you love something, you'll suffer for it. But if you suffer for it, you'll show up every day for it. I just thought some of those things that she said were so just inspiring, to be honest. I have to say the line that she says, the moment that some of these athletes retire, is the moment they have more money in their bank because they're just not, they're losing money all day, every day, paying for coaches, paying for training and not even really,

unless they win the competition, maybe it's break even if they don't, they just lost money on that. I found that so inspiring and I just love how she said, she said, you know, shout out to your podcast, our podcast for creating awareness on this. She said that, you know,

it's not going to change the industry in one day, but opportunities like you are giving her to come on this podcast and talk about this. She thought she was really, appreciative of it. And beach volleyball and volleyball in general has opportunity to grow. I have to say this because I have it written down.

Last year, the record for any female sporting event attendance was broken by Nebraska and Omaha University. 92,000 and three people sold out the University of Nebraska Cornhuskers Football Stadium to watch women's volleyball.

That is unbelievable. It's there. It's right there. They're tapping into it. So there's just a lot things swirl in my head that relate to this episode. What did you think about just what they're paid for the medals and, you know, what's also interesting, too, is like the different sports, like the popularity of the sport and just like the current climate and everything that's happening has a huge impact on popularity,

name image likeness, the economics before the Olympics leading up to, you know, ad deals that they get to after the Olympics. I found that pretty fascinating as a competitive hockey coach dealing with some of the best players in the country and even some of the world that you deal with. Like, I don't know. Did you have a, did you find that fascinating? Did any of that connect to either hockey or what you're viewing as a spectator to the Olympics? I found it fascinating because it kind of just told more of the story. Like you throw out numbers like 25,000 per gold medal, you know, a three month stipend that was the most she ever got for her training, you know, a 10K coach's stipend.

Like these are so small numbers. We're talking about 25,000 for a gold medal. She won 3, 75,000. That's in a 12-year span. Crazy. Like, that's nothing. That is peanuts. That is peanuts money.

So the Olympics is also broken in the sense that 90% of people competing, like she said, they're broke. Everyone in the Olympic Village, they're broke. They're just happy there to have a vacation, compete in the sport they've trained at and lost money at their whole life because it's their passion. But it's broken because then you got LeBron James and Steph Curry and Kevin Durant. and you've got multi, multi, multi, multi millionaires competing for the same thing. So it's either let's have them all be professional and all get paid or let keep the Olympics as a pure amateur sport. But I understand they're trying to make money on the Olympics.

The people behind the Olympics, they want the biggest names. But yeah, the payments and everything, it fascinates me. These people are doing it for their passion. Let me ask you this. You're head of the USA Olympic Committee, right? You're in charge of every single sport, all about. America's Olympic athletes and sports and presence what's one thing you're changing what's one thing you're doing I mean just like anything I feel like I'm trying to I'm trying to

not unionize it but I'm trying to make sure my athletes are taken care of like the Olympics have so much pride like at the end of the day like military and wars aside sports are the the common field where countries get to go head to head and competition and sport and the Olympics garner so much pride so i would like to just see like you know our athletes who compete are able to compete full time um you know USA superpower greatest country in the world um i can say that now being here living here breathing the air i would like to see the athletes who compete to represent us get taken care of and be able to do so um the more that i think we can do that the more i think that we could perform and they

deserve it at the end of the day just like you have your clients who go entertain people you want them taking care of these people are entertaining and representing our country and um just really interesting and and you know what like you said though the sponsors the corporate sponsors they're the ones funding all the federations for the athletes to go compete other than being government subsidized like other countries so it's hard it's a grind but that's probably the number one thing that i would do I would try and just do that and get them taken care of. I like that. Now, if we look at historicals, if we go back to 2020 in Tokyo,

the United States had a total of 113 medals coming in first place. People's Republic of China had 89, Japan 58, Great Britain, 64, Russia 71. And then the gold medal tally for United States back in 2020, 39, leading the charge, United States of America. China, 38, Japan, 27, Great Britain. and 22 in Russia, 20. Now, if we look at the count, obviously, we are very early in. The United States is off to a really hot start with a total of nine medals.

France is seven, Australia, six, Japan, six, South Korea, six. So, you know, you've got to look at historicals. And clearly, they are doing something right, economics aside. But you know what, David, maybe one day you'll be in a role just like that. You never know, you know? Well, here's a question for you. you own an ad agency, right? Let's say you were put in charge and said, Jason, you're hired by the U.S. Olympic Committee.

And your job is to make sure that our athletes are taking care of financially so that the next Olympics, they can train and have the money to train and not be living in poverty. Do you think that you could reach out to brands, given the awareness that the athlete who's going to be successful in these Olympics creates, do you think you could create sustainability through brand deals for athletes given in 2024 and how much popularity some of these athletes who win medals the Olympics get? I mean, I think the baseline of that question comes down to the thesis of this whole podcast, which is we weren't taught the things we need to know in school. These athletes aren't taught the things they need to know as it comes to the business of the sport. And so if I am running everything, what I would do is support not only the teachings of the finance,

and the marketing and everything else, but I would all support the small things that help them market, which is, you know, getting social media coaches, getting videographers out there, getting photographers out there, helping people create the content because we know that's what leads to their NIL and that's what can lead to success.

And we're seeing it all over the place. Like, okay, let's bring it back to reality TV, like I love island or even The Bachelor. You're seeing the Nelk Boys do a video of The Bachelor and get more views than the actual show itself, right? you're seeing Love Island clips on TikTok getting more views than Love Island when it's one of the most popular show in the entire world watch per minutes in the last week. So I think what I would do is I coach these people. If you coach these people and you give them the resources, they can then allow themselves to build something greater than just being an athlete.

I think that's where I'd start. Let's watch the Olympics, Jason. Let's find our Olympic hero and let's get them some brand deals at the end of the Olympics. What do you say? I love that. let's wrap with this david it's a little off the script of economics and business of the olympics but let's just go to this your favorite summer olympic sport to watch what is it this year it's going to be basketball team canada is in basketball for the first time in the olympics in my

lifetime i believe um and they have most of their NBA players so i'm curious how they do on that stage with the NBA players, but I'm going to say like offshoot sport that I love watching Summer Olympics. I have always love watching Beach Volleyball, Misty May, Carrie Walsh. I remember watching them growing up. They are absolutely dominant. They are the most competitive people. And I love watching a little table tennis too.

I love watching a little table tennis at the Olympics and just seeing them just slap it around because I love play table tennis myself. And that's one sport I would get smoked at. I love it. Men's basketball for me this year, women's basketball. I can't wait to watch that. And I just love men's and women soccer is always so much fun. But, you know, anything on the track and anything in the pool is something that will catch my eye, too.

So it is so, so much fun. But the other thing, too, is like you just think about everything you do and how you do it represents the entirety of your country. And I know you just said, Canada, David, I saw that the Canada women's soccer coach is not good. is asking or is removed officially from the team after there was a drone spying scandal. So some of these people, like you're on a stage in which the entirety of your life could change for the good or for the bad based on how you decide to conduct yourself. It's fascinating to just see the pressure and the things that occur under this type of lens. Yeah, you got Ben Johnson, the Canadian sprinter, who was in the 80s accused of doping.

You got people, you know, getting in trouble for doping. all the time but it's for the biggest stage like you said this could change people's lives so we'll be tuning in i'll be i'll be keep tuning in i love having to be able to turn on the tv and have something to watch so um give me all the olympics all the time i love it there's a lot of people that'll be talking olympics whatever channel you go to you'll see it but there aren't many people talking about kind of the business and economics behind it so carrie walsh we appreciate you coming on and hope you guys learned a little bit given her experience and just her like i think her openness and vulnerability to what we never see on TV.

That's what I love most about this interview. David, anything before we wrap it up, close it out? Nothing of particular note here. Just excited to see how this plays out. See how the metal count plays out by the end of it. Curious Canadian, I wish luck to your Canadians. And I know you are working on that American citizenship. So also to Team USA in all categories.

And we will be tuning into this Olympics all summer long. And remember to subscribe. but give us five stars. Let us know what you thought about this episode. Join us on our Facebook group on YouTube and Instagram. And we hope this was another episode of Training Secrets, one you couldn't afford to miss. Thank you.