Trading Secrets - 327. Mary Holland Nader on Leaving Wall Street, Reality TV & Building Her Own Financial Future

Episode Date: August 31, 2026

Mary Holland Nader has lived two very different lives—and somehow built both at the same time. On this episode of Trading Secrets, Jason Tartick sits down with Mary, one of the Nader sisters from Hulu’s Love Thy Neighbor, to unpack her unconventional journey from Wall Street to reality TV, modeling, content creation, and entrepreneurship. Mary shares what it was really like starting at Deutsche Bank fresh out of college with a $100K salary, working her way into wealth management, and secretly juggling her finance career with modeling and brand deals. She reveals the moment a $5,000 modeling job made her calculate her hourly rate—and realize her side hustle could eventually out-earn her Wall Street salary. The conversation goes deeper into Mary's decision to leave the security of a steady paycheck, healthcare, and corporate career to pursue entertainment and build her fintech startup, Mary & Pip. She opens up about the financial realities of becoming an entrepreneur, managing unpredictable income, negotiating alongside her sisters, and the freedom that came with finally controlling her own schedule. Jason and Mary also dive into the rapidly changing world of AI—from how she uses Claude, AI agents, and automation in her everyday life to why she believes emotional intelligence and relationships may become more valuable as technology reshapes the workforce. Mary also shares her perspective on protecting your financial information online and why you should think twice before giving sensitive data to an AI tool. Plus, Mary breaks down what it's like watching the Nader sisters' rise happen almost overnight, how Love Thy Neighbor changed her career, what goes on behind the scenes with executive producers, and where she wants to take her career next. From Wall Street to reality TV to fintech, this is a conversation about taking risks, following curiosity, and knowing when it's time to bet on yourself. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

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Light.com slash secrets. Go to my skylight.com slash secrets for $30 off your 15-inch calendar. That is, N-Y-S-K-Y-L-G-H-T dot com slash secrets. Welcome back to another episode of Trading Secrets. Today, we're joined by someone who spent her 20s living two completely different lives at once. Honestly, it's relatable. It's Mary Holland Nader, one of the four sisters on Hulu and free forms love thineater and the founder of CEO, Mary and Pip, a fintech startup built to make financial wellness accessible to the freelance generation. Before she was ever on camera, Mary spent almost five years on Wall Street at Deutsche Bank, managing money for the ultra high net worth. Then she walked away from that steady paycheck and pivoted into modeling, content creation,

and a reality show along her sisters. That's some 2026 stuff right there. Now she's building Mary and Pip, an RIA registered platform and behavioral finance app aimed at people whose income doesn't come in tidy biweekly paychecks, all while being known to the love thy Nader fans as the Cass resident finance sister. Mary, thank you so much for being on Trade Secrets. Thank you for having me. I'm reading this and I'm like, it's like bringing me back to my days, right? But in my 20s, like this was the thing.

I was in finance and then also in ABC calls. for a show. I make the transition. It blows up the whole finance career. A little bit similar to you. So let's like go back to the days of right when you started at Deutsche Bank. You're starting there. Talk to me about what the role was. Like what did the money of the salary look like? Yeah. What did your vision of your career look like? Okay. Yeah. First of all, exact mirror kind of situations. Wall Street to Reality TV, which is why I'm so excited for this conversation. But I started at Deutsche Bank, you know, bright eyed and bushy-tailed, ready to climb the corporate ladder. It was kind of like the, let's see, when did I start?

2022. And it was the place to be. I mean, Wall Street as a finance major, it's where everyone wanted to be. So I was just honestly eager to work and learn and ask as many questions as I could. Of course, as you probably know, first on the list was taking my licensing exam. So I had to study for my Series 7 and 66. But I was honestly new to New York, new to Wall Street, just super eager to prove myself. Yeah.

And so your first job talked to us about like, what did that look like? like salary-wise. So I think that at the time, which, by the way, was so unheard of and crazy for me, like it was a huge number. I think I got 100K. So at six figures, right out of school. Right out of school. Yeah, which was incredible. And I was so thrilled. And I think that that's how they get you on Wall Street. They get you with that starting salary, maybe outpacing your peers. And then you marginally increase every year to where eventually you're not getting paid as much as industry standard. And then they keep kind of dangling that. carrot right in front of you. Before we get into later years of Deutsche Bank, the interview process,

they say to work on Wall Street or a bank like Deutsche Bank, it's very intense, it's very hard. When you go back to the interview process of trying to land that job, is there anything that sticks out to you as like, damn, that was a hard question or, ooh, that process was a little tough. I always talk about this and people love this on social media. I mean, talking about how I got into wealth management, because the most important thing you need to know to get into Wall Street is just to know, have a pulse on markets, know what's happening in markets, have an opinion on it, most importantly, don't just, it's not something you can necessarily memorize. So I would listen to podcasts on markets while I was at school and then had questions ready to ask

the interviewer. So for example, the head of fixed income asked me, you know, do you have any questions for us? And at the time, the Fed had just made a huge rate increase. So I was like, I saw the Fed increased rates. How does that affect your day to day? And they were super blown away by how pointed my questions were instead of just saying, what's a day in the life? But I had, you know, the traditional, behavioral, technical, and then Super Day. So they flew me up for a Super Day in the office, which was intimidating, but also very exciting. At Super Day, was there anything that you know that you nailed when you walked out? If someone right now is interviewing for a job, because a lot of people are switching their careers in industry, is there one thing from that

day? You're just like, I crushed that. There was. So they were talking separately about something that was happening in Markets. I can't remember exactly what it was, but I had read the headlines that day, like that morning on the entire way there, I wasn't even thinking about any of my prepared answers. I was just catching up on market news. And I was able to drop in, oh, I heard that Black Rock was doing something like that. You know, I was able to like drop in something from today's news. And I saw the looks on their phases. They were like, oh, wow, you keep up with market. They were super impressed. So any advice would be you're as ready as you're going to be on the day of your super day. So just focus on what's happening in markets that day and try to incorporate it in any

answer. I like it. And I think any industry. Right? Any industry. Know what's happening in your industry. Bring it to the interviewer. Totally. And that's like huge value add to the company to the space because most people aren't doing that, right? Most people are going to work, checking their boxes and then removing themselves from their work. But you work your way up. And then I think I heard on one podcast, it's right around your fifth year. Or was there your fourth year. Okay, you count my internship year. I think you said your fifth year. I was doing the math. I was like, okay, 20-22. How's that end up? But now you're an analyst and you're making around 140 grand. Does that sound right? based on what he said? Okay. So as an analyst real quickly, can you explain what that means most people that don't know? What does an analyst do? Yeah, absolutely. So you're an intern, you're just doing kind of the bitchwork. As an analyst, most banks have graduate programs. I don't know if Key Bank had that, but it's like a two-year program. You get to see all different

areas of the business. So as an analyst, I was rotating basically through product areas and client-facing areas to see what I liked and obviously which teams liked me. And at the end of the analyst program, you either, you basically are chosen by a team. It's kind of like rush, which is funny. So I was chosen by the team that I wanted, which was the investment management team. So we were the market experts for our ultra high net worth clients. So the bankers would go get the business and then they would bring in the investment managers to explain markets to them and to basically connect the client-facing people to the product-facing

people to basically say, this is the products you need. We're going to go to the portfolio management team, get a portfolio together for you. we're going to explain it to you. So it was the dream team, like varsity team that I landed my last year that I was there. So I was able to actually be more client facing my last couple years. Got it. Okay. So there's a lot of action there. I'm going to actually go on Mary's podcast. I'm going to talk about my banking days. After the mortgage crisis, it was a whole shit show, honestly. So a lot of action there. We'll be on your podcast to talk about that. So everyone tune in there. But you're doing this. You're in the weeds of banking. You just talked about

your job. And all while this is happening. your sisters on dancing with the stars. Then she's with Gleb, then they're dating, then you're seeing your other sisters pop off in your career, and you are just like bleeding and sweating and dying and literally chained to the desk of the investment bank. What is going through your head? I mean, we live in a world right now

where so many people are always looking side to side. We're always seeing what other people are doing on social media. You're seeing it under your roof. Like your sisters are out there thriving in entertainment. What's going through your head is you're grinding in the banking and finance. industry. Honestly, like praying that no one at work sees any cover that I'm on with my sisters, because thankfully when my sisters came all to New York and started entering the modeling industry,

we started doing things together. And when you're in your early 20s, you can't say no. No is not in my vocabulary, right? So we would be asked to go to influencer events or go to fashion week events. And me as a 23, 24 year old, even though I am an analyst burning the midnight oil and waking up super early, if I get off at 7, 30, 8, I'm going to go straight. And I'm going to go straight. to one of these events because it's the coolest thing I've ever heard of, you know, especially being from Louisiana. So I was really burning the candle at both ends, like going, waking up super early, getting there before anyone, and then still going to influencer events with my sisters. And then we would get these huge magazine cover opportunities. And I was just hoping at the beginning

that before I was making any money that like no one at work would find out because I was so focused on maintaining my credibility and thought that somehow that would tarnish that credibility. Of course, once I started making money via brand deals, I had to disclose it with the bank. But I think at the very beginning, I was really trying to live kind of the Hannah Montana double life, which is funny. And what year was it that you started getting brand deals? I started getting brand deals, probably right after I got my licenses, after I got my Series 7 and 66. So I think it was a year and a half in to working on Wall Street that I started getting brand deals. And you're early on, you're not going all in on content creation, right? So you're just kind of like touching and going,

but keeping your work the priority. Was the, monetization of brand deals at that time even close to where you're at from the finance space? Not at all. No. I think my first brand deal was $900. And I actually still work with the brand. It was Gorgie. Love you guys. A great increase since then. Gorgie's everywhere, I feel like. It's, it better be. I'm really doing my part. It's like every, it's just all over the place. It's amazing. I highly recommend healthy energy. But they were my first. She kind of took a chance on me. But $900 at the time. I mean, I was freaking out. Like supplemental income. I hadn't used.

even thought that was possible. Sure. And even on Wall Street, it's funny, I was still living paycheck to paycheck in New York City. Like most of my paycheck went to my rent. I was getting around 2,500 every two weeks or something, something around there. Sure. So I remember like the day, and I'm sure you're about to ask this, but now that I'm on this tangent, I remember the day I realized because after I signed with Ford and after I started

making more money, I got offered a job for five grand to model for the day. I did the math and I was like, oh my gosh, this is more than I would make in a month almost at Deutsche Bank for one day. Yeah. Of course, I didn't account at the time, you know, 40% goes to taxes, management fee. So it ends up kind of netting out, but still way more than I would make hourly. I was making about three. I remember doing the calculation, which I think is so important for everyone to calculate

their hourly rate, if that makes sense. Like I was making $300, about $300 an hour at Deutsche Bank. and that modeling job, I was going to be making, you know, five grand in one day. So I was like, of course. Okay. So you get offered a 5K modeling job. Yeah. You're working for the bank. Yeah. What do you, do you take a vacation day? What did you do? Yes. All of my VTO was used to work on my other job. It was so funny. I didn't take a single vacation. I think when I was at DB. I was always taking off to model. And my team knew. Yeah. Thank goodness. And I'm if I could suggest to anyone in corporate America who's doing something on the side, just tell your team and like tell compliance.

You'd rather tell them and let them know that you're genuine and you care about this job first than get in trouble later. I was super scared to tell them, but they didn't care. Now did you get when it all came to a head, right? So you're potentially going to be a cast on a reality TV show. Now you're, you signed with Ford modeling in 2024. ABC Hulu's knocking on your door. I think if I remember right, the first real like TV appearance in the ABC Hulu world was when you guys were on dancing with stars. Oh, my God. I forgot we were all in it.

The day she got kicked off, by the way. Yeah, right. The day, yeah, they bring you all on. That she gets kicked off. But at what point did there become this decision that you have to leave the banking world to pursue entertainment? Which, can we just pause there? I was on Dancing with Stars, dancing in a bra and Daisy Dukes while working on Wall Street.

Like, my team saw that. So you were still working at the time? I was still working at the time. Taking PTO? Taking PTO for dancing with the stars. At that point, you were always trying to like kind of keep it hidden. And at that point, I assume it's got to pop. It was, yeah, at that point, it was like cats out the bag.

You're not hiding from that. I wasn't hiding from it. I told them. I was like, in case you see, because a lot of them watched it. But just to throw that out there, that was, I can't believe I did that actually. But that was, let's see, October of 2024. And then 2025 January, we got the call. I had no idea that it was coming.

We had filmed a sizzle reel a few years before. And I honestly thought it was a wash. I didn't think they would ever call us again. Yeah. called us in 2025 in January, that next January. And they were like, let's do it. I remember I was actually on vacation with my boyfriend at the time. And I was like, oh my gosh, should I just take the, I have to quit, I guess. I just assumed that Deutsche Bank wasn't going to let me. And Hulu was like, well, you're the finance girl. So like, what are you going to do? Are you going to film at DB or what's your next move? So I asked D.B. Of course, they were like, you can't film a reality show here, expected. When you say here, you mean in the office? In the office. They explored, which, To their credit, they were like, you could take time off and come back. Yeah, that's what I did. You know, okay, which is what you did. So at the time, I was kind of like weighing it back and forth. And I was like, I always have seen a gap in the market. I've always wanted to start something. As terrified as I was, I was like, what founders dream to pitch their, you know, startup on reality TV. Sure.

On public television. So I basically made the decision. I was like, you know what? And at that time, I was making a lot more money doing brand deals. I had surpassed my salary. at DB. Oh, wow. So regardless, I was like, you know what? I need to move on in some way. And honestly, the Hulu gave me kind of the kick on the butt that I needed to just make the jump. It's so hard making the jump. And so they were like, all right, we support you. And I, but they did let me film my exit my last day on TV. So what you see in season one, which is crazy that they did. That's like unbelievable. I know. I know. They loved me there. But they let me film it somehow. And what you see on TV, me turning in my ID was actually my last day.

And I actually was entering this huge life change, like 25, 26, had no idea what I was going to do. I didn't know at the time if I was going to pitch my startup because obviously how scary is that. I had never founded a company. I'd always played the safe route. Or if I was going to go work at a VC or, you know, work at a startup for the show. I had also never filmed a show before. I didn't like seek out the show. You know, my sisters kind of brought it to us.

And I was like, okay, I guess so. So it was all extremely new, which I think translates in season one. It does translate. It does. We're going to talk about that the entire season one and that transition before we get to that. So I just want to clarify that. Before you leave the bank, you're making more in brand partnerships than you actually are working at the bank.

Yeah. So that financial decision, obviously, when then Hulu and ABC comes out on your door, seems like a no-brainer. Yes. Okay. Makes perfect sense. Now, to me, we talked about dates with the stars, but you go on dancing with the stars,

and from my vantage point, things happen quick for the Nader sisters. Yes. It was like, like, obviously, your sister has always been in the spotlight, has had a huge career. But you guys, go on dancing with the stars. She gets voted off.

She's pissed. She gets voted off. Her neglect breakup, whatever. That's obviously, like, trending everywhere at the time for, like, way too long, but literally everywhere. And then all of a sudden, it's like, Whoa, the Nader sisters are about to be the next day.

This might be Kardashians 2.0. That was from my standpoint or like even the Trading Secrets team. When we talk about, we're like, okay, who should we have on the podcast? We're like, wow, what's going on with the Nader sisters? They're getting this show. They're over here. They're moving everything. Did it feel like that from your standpoint, too, that or was this kind of like part

of the plan or did it just come out of nowhere? It definitely felt out of the blue. Yeah. I'm sure it was part of the plan for Brooks and for some of my sisters. Sure. And it might not have seemed as jolting and shocking. But of course, when it's happening to you, you're like, surely not everyone sees this happening. Everyone has their own for you page now.

But it did feel like we had a new billboard every other day. And we were on Good Morning America. And then all of a sudden we had a show. And it happened overnight, it felt like. And watching the opportunities that came from first Dancing with the Stars, then we get the show. And then the show comes out, even when we got the show versus when it came out versus six months after the show came out, we had another influx of things happening. So it did feel out of the blue for me. I'm not used to it at all. It's crazy. And then it's like the show airs and then

all of a sudden, like all me and peers and people that we manage, we're getting all these invites to come to the premiere of party. I'm like, they are absolutely chilling. All of a sudden, like overnight. Yeah. After season one, when you look back at the decision for you to leave, what was the biggest financial win for you making that decision? What came out of the show? Brand, Brand, opportunities that in your net worth, your P&L, your balance sheet was like, wow, that was the big moment after season one for me. I mean, I think just seeing our rates skyrocket from single digits to double digits was so insane.

And the moment when I made half a year's salary in one deal. But you know what also was the big change was my time that I had during the day. Like I thought I was so terrified to leave the steady paycheck, right? Like that's the biggest in the health care and the this, the that. The biggest negative has been the health care because it's just such a bitch. It's so expensive. It's so expensive. And then any like, I mean, I'm sure we're kind of probably on similar plans.

It's super expensive. Then you try to get approval for anything and it gets denied. Then you're out of pocket. It's crazy. Like that's probably like one of the biggest expenses. Horrible. I know. And yeah, that was that was definitely the biggest like adjustment as well as having to account for taxes and

having to account for management. Like you think that if you get a 5K deal, for example, it's in your pocket, but no. You have to really be more disciplined with how you manage each paycheck. But I think that the amount of time and creative freedom that I had, I thought that when I was at Deutsche Bank, I always felt guilty for not doing more and for being tired after work and not wanting to work on my side hustles and for just being even exhausted in my social life.

And when I quit, the amount of time and creative freedom that I had to work on other things, like things just start blossoming. And I'm sure people are always like, how do you do it all? how do you do it all? And I'm sure you get that too. But it's like when you manage your own schedule and you're passionate about everything you're doing, it's suddenly so much easier to get out of bed in the morning and work. A hundred percent. And this is what I think that's hard for other generations that I kind of connect with. And you kind of had that moment with your mom on the show, right? You're trying to explain to her why you have to why you have to take this gap and make this change. I'm sure there's a lot of people in their 20s that might be listening to this. What advice do you have them? If they're stuck right now in their 20s, they want to make a change. They want to get on the path that they all. always dreamed about being on. Where do you start? What do you do? What are your steps? I would say to not overthink it and just do the smallest little thing. And now the only thing you have to do is learn about it. You know, ask AI about it. Find someone even better than asking AI. Find someone who's in the industry

that you want to get into. If you're an artist, go talk to another artist about how they started their company and build the website, get the LLC, open the bank account. Just one little step instead of thinking about it, like a huge mountain you have to climb, I think that taking baby, which sounds so cliche and such boring advice. But when I do the smallest, tiniest thing, like opening an LLC for your company or side hustle is free. It's pretty much free. It's like 250 bucks. You can go to Google it. You don't need any, you don't really need any background information to open an LLC and open a bank account. And then you feel empowered. If action creates evidence and then evidence quiets that doubt that you have. And the more evidence you have, the more real your

side hustle becomes, I guess. I love it. Great steps. In those steps, you mentioned AI. And then in the show, you talk about AI a lot. And even, I think there's that one scene where you're looking up how your sister should deal with her breakup. Right. So I'm curious, how often do you use AI, both in personal life situations and even finance? And what would you recommend people actually do with AI? Okay. I use it all the time. Okay. I'm not dependent on it. And it's it's there on social too and on TV. It's always there. Yeah, as you can see, I have a love affair with all AI. But I just think that it is such an incredible thing that we have a thought partner that we don't feel judged by. I know there's a lot of confirmation bias to be aware of when you're using it. But just that alone quiet so much self-doubt. And, encourages you to ask more questions and be more curious. However, it does threaten curiosity a bit, I think. I'm seeing in next generations, like when I was at Deutsche Bank, for example, I would ask

anyone above me, any question just to learn. No such thing is a dumb question. I would just I would be a sponge. You know what I mean? Like you just ask, ask, ask. And now, even when I'm in conversations with some of the most powerful people, I catch myself logging questions to ask AI. because I don't want to embarrass myself. For sure. Or I should know that about you, you know? And I think that especially for people who have done it and who you're seeking wisdom from, they want to help you with those questions.

And there's nothing like a personal experience. AI cannot give you that. So I would just be cautionary when it comes to your curiosity. Ask AI everything, but also ask real people. I use AI. I use like ClaudeCode code for my everyday tasks. And it just makes things that I, you know, build. a PowerPoint or an investor deck, for example, what used to take me a week can take me a day now

and then I can just more quickly send it to my teammates to review. I have a health folder, which of course always seek medical professionals. But there's a lot that you can, if you have different projects, you can train the AI to just know things about you, that it's just super helpful. And I can just be like, draft me up a whole document that talks about my medical history. So if I go to a new doctor, I don't have to explain everything for the hundredth time and I don't have to worry about forgetting everything. I can put every test in there and just send it off to the doctor. So it totally depends on the use case. But it is such an amazing tool. And as long as I think that we continue to be curious about it and cautious, of course,

don't just give it all of your banking info, obviously, but where you can. Can I, first of all, this conversation is amazing. It's not where I saw it's going. Yeah, of course. I have so many questions now. I'm just what you said right there. Let's just start with that one because that's a really hot topic. And obviously, Obviously, you have a lot of finance, expertise, and background. The idea of giving Claude, chat, any LLM, any information on your finances, how do you do that and why should we not provide some of that information? What's your take on that?

Absolutely. So, I mean, we just saw Open AI a story of them training two of their models to, like, basically attempt a hack on their systems, which is what they call pen tests, like penetration test, to make sure that it's not vulnerable. and the AI agents got a mind of their own, for lack of better words, and escaped and went into other people's data and other AI company's data. And so that right there is a cautionary tale. And if you go into any LLM, there is disclaimers that say, like, this is not secure. So you just have to assume there is a risk that it goes somewhere. There is, no matter what,

even my health information, which I know is kind of dumb of me to put in, but that's a little bit different than your banking information. Now, I think you could put in maybe, your statements without the account number. I mean, I'm not even telling you to put any in there, but what you would rather do is download a secure bank encrypted app to do your budgeting. And same goes for asking investment advice. There's so much bias out there. There's people that pay LLMs and encourage them to suggest there's, who knows what the Open AI founders invested in. He could be pumping. I mean, we don't know. So you just can never be too careful. And you want to just always go to credible sources instead of relying on anything that AI says. And same goes for putting your

information literally anywhere. I have a head of cybersecurity. And I've been doing a series on cybersecurity tips because it is so dangerous out there. Everyone is vulnerable. It's crazy. No matter who you are, everyone thinks it won't happen to them. But you click on one bad link. You put your phone number in one place and your whole life could turn upside down. So proceed with caution. As my mom says, keep your head on a swivel. and just be smart about where you put your banking information. Of course, if there's a bank encrypted app, which is why it's taken us a while to build Mary and Pip,

because we're like cybersecurity is our number one priority and compliance, and we want to make sure that your information's safe. Unbelievable. It makes perfect sense. There was like this huge clip that went viral of Mel Robbins telling everyone to put all their financial information into these LLMs. That will solve your problems. She got beat up pretty good for that.

And I think for right reasons of what you're saying, we haven't talked at all. this podcast. We've talked a lot about AI. We haven't specifically talked about Claude code or cowork. Can you give someone that has no idea what that is, a quick description of what it is and what next steps could be if they're interested in doing it and using it? Absolutely. So Claude, just the chatbot is an LLM. The next step up would be Claude Co-Work, and that's where you give Claude access, again, not guaranteed secure. So I just want to preface with that. But you give Claude access to, let's say, your Gmail. And I'm going to use a very simple example of using

cloud co-work. You could give Claude access to your Gmail, Google Drive, and Google Sheets and say, I am looking for podcast guests who are finance experts on the cross-section between media and finance. Send me a list. It can send you a list, find their contact information online. It could preemptively go into your Google Sheets, create a whole list. It could draft an entire email, all without you touching it. And so then it could either send the email for you. You could give it directions to do that, or you could go into your Gmail and see all of the drafts. And it just saves a lot of time. Like, that's a very simple example.

Claude code is a next level up. It gives, you give it access to what they call MCPs and I won't get too nerdy on it. But basically, it's on the back end of the API. So without you having to instruct Claude, what's the update on or go send an email for me? You can go into Claude code and create this whole basically agent that runs in the background. so that every morning, for example, I get my to-do list updates. I have a notes app called To-do, and it updates from one of these Claude Code MCPs, basically Claude while I'm sleeping.

Every morning at 9 a.m. goes out to my Gmail, my Slack, my personal email, my professional email, everything where my granola notes, my AI note taker, base camp, all of the systems that we use in my company and sends me a daily to-do list based on everything that's happening in the company. And we have one for operations, for engineering, for everything. So it's like summarizes exactly what's happened, which I could go on forever on how to build that. But once again, you can ask the LLM how to build it. That's what's so cool. It's like you don't have to have engineering degree to do this.

She'll give you, I say she, but she'll give you a step by step. I mean, Claude, Clodette. She'll give you a step by step guide on how to build one of these MCPs or agents using Claude Co-work. You just have to download Terminal, which is like where the Claude Code lives. But anyway, I digress. It's basically LLM's step up is co-work and then a step up is Claude Code. It's changing the way we live. I think a lot of people are scared of it.

And what I would say is embrace it. And if there are any takeaways right there that people feel are too challenging, hard, or complicated, I would say of everything you just said, start with granola. Like that is the most, it's the most basic, easiest thing to do. There's no jargon. You don't have to be an engineer. You download that. You press record.

You have a conversation. It makes notes for you. Just start there. And you're going to see how that will change your life. And then there's so many different ways through connectors and using Gmail and everything else that it can change. Do you think we could wrap the AI topic up here, but do you think jobs like you had like an analyst role or some of these other professions out there in jeopardy? And what do you think will happen? Absolutely.

I think any job that doesn't require EQ is in jeopardy. I think that previously your advantage would be your degree or your technical ability. And now the people who will win are the people with high emotional intelligence. And I do think wealth management will always be a job because it requires person to person. Like you're never going to fully rely on AI to tell you what's wrong with your body instead of a doctor. You know what I mean? Or a specialist. And wealth, people will pay for wealth the same way they pay for health.

They want a human being to have an opinion and to be able to take a look. And I think that jobs that just require relationships are always going to be around. I think that maybe more high net worth jobs. Like we were just talking about how much we love, live, travel with Livy. Like jobs like that, she's amazing. But jobs like that where you're working with high net worth clients and then jobs where you need relationship skills more than ever now. Completely agree.

Now this AI talk all came and stem from Love Thigh Nader. I wanted to ask you about Love Thinator. I saw the executive producer is Jimmy Kimmel. And I think on so many shows, we see names like that that become executive producers. What role does an executive producer like Jimmy Kimmel have on Now Nighter? Yeah. He, I mean, Jimmy's amazing, first of all. He's awesome.

And he is on every episode. It's not just a title that he has. We have the same manager. Us and Jimmy have this share-a-manager, Baby Doll Dixon, who's also an icon in Hollywood. And so Jimmy and. And Baby Doll are both producers. But they are on every single episode, making sure that obviously their job is basically to kind of protect us, but also make good TV. They've been in the TV industry.

They've been in Hollywood forever. And they know what good TV looks like. And I think that if each of us girls were EPs watching it, we would definitely have a million notes. And it's all of our first time doing this rodeo. So having Jimmy on to interview producers, he helped us decide which producers to go with. Alex Baskin, who's an icon in the industry as well. He did all of those industry interviews with us, and he's by our side, you know, for every launch, for every, he appears in the show as cameos. We go on his show, obviously, when, during the press tour. So he's heavily involved. It's not just,

which I love, I feel like there's a lot of EPs that don't really do much. I'm not familiar with a ton of TV, but I would imagine that sometimes that name is just slapped on there. And he gets final say on every episode. He sees them before we do. That's pretty cool. Awesome. I love it. So good to hear that. When we hear about business and finance and all the moves you've made, negotiating becomes a big part of it. We have had so many people on the show from all different reality shows. And I'm always curious how they're compensated. But most importantly, how do they negotiate? And some of them are just like, I go in by myself, I bring someone else in. We talk about it. I think about those principles as they relate to your show. It's your family. It's your sisters. So season one goes down. Now you're

filming, you already filmed season two. And you go into season two. Where do you start with negotiating? Do you all do your own thing? Do you come to agreement together? Like, how do you approach that? Great question. So Baby Doll Dixon is our manager for for this show and he negotiates everything for us. And we go in as sisters. Right. We're a family. I love that. We pretty much do all of our sister deals. together. I mean, we get paid separately, of course, but we're negotiating, it's not like, you know, who's putting in the most effort, you know what it? And maybe down the line, I'm sure that's how other family TV shows work if you're not as involved. Because it's a full-time job, as you know. Yeah. You're filming, you can't really do much else. So yeah, we're negotiated as

kind of a group. I think that's so cool. Which is cool. I love it. It just shows how unified you guys are as well. How quickly after season one did you find out there would be a season two? Season one came out end of August. And I want to say late October, early November. We found out about a season two. And we were just talking about this, but it's so crazy because they can know within the first two weeks, within the first month, if you're getting a next season or if their money was made back from the investment. Obviously, being on that top 15, top 10 shows on Hulu really helps, which we were, which was incredible. So thank you all for this watch.

I really appreciate it, my livelihood. But you really never know. It could take, you know, six months to find out about another season. It could take six weeks. So it's always just kind of it airs and you hold your breath. I'm sure being a numbers person, at least I would like, oh yeah. You're thinking, okay, give me the numbers, give me detail. I want the analytics. Are we trending up, turning down. Is there any way that they provide any of that? Or do you just have to go off the top 10 reporting list? Jason, we just like, I know. It cringes me out so hard because I'm such a numbers person, but we don't get any of that information.

We're just holding our breath and watching every day, refreshing, every day playing the show on our TV in the background and promoting. You know, it's like always odd, just running in circles, literally. Electric bills off the charts. No, totally. Whatever it is what it is. I love that. People come over, they're like, y'all are narcissists.

We're like, no, we just need to stay at number one. Yeah, exactly. It's very, very simple. I love it. Well, you have so much going on now in your independent brand. Let's talk about entertainment and then we'll go into the finance independent brand. On the entertainment side of the business, where do you want to take your career from here? You signed with the Ford Modeling Agency in 2024.

We're going with Baby Doll. This is your second season. Do you want to go into potentially reality TV competition like Dance with Stars? You want to go a different direction, maybe scripted. What does it look like, the career trajectory? Great question. I've never been asked this separately and I love it. But yeah, I'm also signed with WME, who I work more with, honestly, than the modeling side.

And WME has been incredible because they basically the difference between WME and Ford is, Ford is modeling jobs, right? Like day rates, you know, pretty standard. WME will get me the brand deals for, I don't know, the AI companies or anything like that. And so WME, I definitely want to start working more in my own lane, if that makes sense, with different brands that I personally use. For example, I'm obsessed with AI. I've actually never worked with an AI brand before. And just some of the business-oriented stuff, like positioning, myself more as a business leader and with thought leader than a Nader sister, which I know

will always be a Nader sister. I'm so grateful for that. But less fashion girly and more kind of business-focused brands, I would love to expand my career and work. In terms of scripted, unscripted TV, I think that unless I'm a shark one day on Shinktay, which is obviously a goal, I think that my next few years are going to be really heads down outside of Love Thy Nader, of course, which I'm so great for. to Hulu because my entire story of Marion Pipp is shown on, which we'll talk about, I know,

but is shown on season two. And so the next few years, just continuing to build in public via that channel and keeping my head down and trying to make a good, honest business. Because it is, I know how much work it takes to do on scripted TV. And I also know how much work it's taking to get this company off the ground. So I want to make sure that my time is used wisely. I love it. Okay, we're going to transition to Marion Pip before we do, it's the last question. Yeah. One reality show other than Love Thanator. You got to go on one. Ooh. Gun to your head, which one are you going with? Gun to my head today, House of Stasi. Hey. Hot right now. Yeah, perfect timing. I know. We actually have a cameo. Oh, let's go. Yeah, definitely. We're Mormon wives, love. Oh, there you go. Back and forth.

All right. So you're the CEO of Marion Pip. Where do you guys stand with your launch and tell people about what Marion Pip is? Yeah. So Marion Pip, for the past year, it's everyone thinks it's just a community led, you know, financial wellness brand, what is that? We're actually launching a mindful robo advisor, an investment app, basically for those who don't know where to start. So I like to say it's like the mirror or opposite almost of Robin Hood. Robin Hood is built for Player X, for someone who wants to trade, for someone who's really interested in day trading and picking out their own stocks. A lot of my friends and freelancers don't even have a high yield savings account, right? And I would never suggest to anyone to go out and invest if they don't have an emergency

fund cushion. So our app will provide the three basic accounts that you need to start with, high yield savings, retirement, and investment accounts. And I want to be the go-to spot for people who don't know where to start. So if you want to trade yourself, we're not for you. It's a robo advisor. So you take a short quiz. We put you in the right portfolio for you, assuming you have your high-yield savings account open already. We basically hold your hand through step one of building your financial health to the final step of just growing with you. Wow. And that launches October, mid-October.

Nice. Congrats. Thank you. How long have you been working on it for? I've been working on it for about a year since I left Wall Street last year. Okay. And we talked money on this podcast. How much you have to invest in an app like that?

Oh my gosh. So honestly, much less than I would have five years ago. Because of AI. Yeah. That's not to discredit how much we're doing to make sure that the app is secure, which is why it's honestly taken longer than a lot of these vibe-coded apps. you've seen pop up overnight. Sure.

I've had to have blinders on watching my friends build apps overnight or watching people on social media say, I built an app in a day. And I'm like, no, I'm building a financial platform. This is different than just a vibe coded app, you know. So my first hire was cybersecurity. But we raised 600,000 via friends and family last fall. I think I actually called you, which is when I thought about your talent agency. Yeah.

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. We're about to raise again. Okay. Give me a call again. Yeah, let's go. But 600,000 in the fall, we're about to raise again this fall.

Because we're running out of money quick. I mean, it burns fast. And with that money, my first hire was cybersecurity and compliance. Just coming from Wall Street, I knew how important those were. And then I brought on, I poached my best friend from UBS to be my chief investment officer and president. So I poached her from UBS, Kara. She's an icon.

And then we just brought on our full-time engineer. But she's been on with us for about five or six months building the app. That is amazing. Yeah. And now she's joining. full time. So we're in beta now, which is basically like the test run. We have about 100 users. Accounts open. Everything's working perfectly. We're basically using these users to get feedback on how the app looks, the interface, how easy it is to use. How much would you pay for this? Things like that.

When running the beta, what's been the biggest feedback that you're surprised by or that's been like the biggest hurdle to overcome? The biggest feedback that I'm surprised by is how hesitant people are to see their net worth and open their bank accounts. Crazy, isn't it? Which is wild. What do you think that what's the why there? I think that I mean our bodies are programmed to avoid fear. It's the ostrich effect. You know, if you think something's wrong with you, you avoid the doctor. If you are, if you expect bad news, then you avoid whatever situation that is. And it's a psychological effect, which is why we have a behavioral scientist on board to try to overcome some of those psychological barriers. But the ostrich effect is just you don't want to welcome bad news. Like,

you don't want to open your bank account because at some point in your, your past, you've opened it and you've been met with a fighter flight response or like a pit in your stomach. We've all experienced that. Your account's overdrawn or you realize you've been paying the minimum amount due instead of the statement balance on your card. So it's astronomical. Even I on Wall Street experienced that so many times. And one of the reasons I started this was because when I left Wall Street, I personally was avoiding my bank account. And I was like, I worked in finance. If I'm avoiding it, everyone's probably avoiding it. And at first I thought that, because of the vibe, it looks more like a wellness or meditation app than a finance app.

There's no graphs. We try to make it very calm when you open it. And so I assumed that that alone would fix the avoidance problem. But one of the also favorite features of the app is that you can see all of your bank accounts in one place, whether it's with us or not, your investments, all of your accounts. And so people are hesitant to connect. They're like, oh, I'll wait to connect my credit card when I'm able to pay it off. Yeah. Interesting. So then what do you, that's a big I think that's one of the biggest issues you have to solve for in finances. Yeah. Throwing your credit card bills under the, you know, mattress, not letting people see it,

not talking about it. I know you said you use, like, calm approaches in calm colors and branding. What else can you do? Right. So we incorporate. Like pop up messages? It's okay. Yeah.

No, we definitely, we have all of our notifications are tailored. So you can choose sassy, funny, like calm or gentle, very bespoke. And because we have your transactions, which, by the way, we, Mary and Pip can't see. Only you can see. But the app can get to know you. So it can be like, hey, you've spent, you know, $600 the past two months in a row at a bar. Like, are you trying to prove something by paying for everyone? Like, no need to do that. You know, things like that. So it'll take the finances, draw conclusions, ask you questions. And ask you questions. So, and it's almost kind of like putting a mirror in front of you. And what we're trying to do is, you know,

slowly but surely get that exposure therapy and get you used to it. And we have this thing called the money ritual, which is just, I mean, everyone has a different version of it, but it's checking in every single week, no matter what is happening, no matter where you are in the world. It's five simple steps. We take you through it because if you connect all of your accounts correctly, we can see everything. We can tell you exactly where your money went last week, what your biggest budget breaker was. So the more you do that, our goal is you never get past, you know, paying off your credit. You never get past paying your future self. So that's the habit building.

And we also have, of course, like streaks and things tied to that. But it's through kind of like the bespoke notifications, you know, your shareability with friends to do the money ritual to talk about it, money transparency, a number of things that we're still working with our beta users to see which buttons are the most difficult for them to press. and how can we encourage them gently to do so. Wow, that is so cool. Congratulations. It's amazing. When you do launch, where can people find it? In the app store.

Okay. Yep, for iOS only at first, but please sign up for the wait list until then, because everyone on the wait list gets exclusive pricing and gets in before anyone else. Okay. We're launching mid-October, but if you join the wait list, then you get in before and you get exclusive pricing. I love it. That is amazing.

All right. Now, as we're wrapping this up, I want you to think about the Jim Carrey check. He had a check for $10 million. in his pocket, right? He's like, I'm going to make this in five years in Hollywood, dumb and dumber on year. I think it was four and a half. He hit it. Got his 10 million. What's like your blank check? What's your number? What are you trying to achieve on either an exit or in an annual basis or even one brand partnership? I want to make this much. Like, what's the blank check for for Mary? Oh, wow. That is so hard because, I mean, it sounds so pick me to say I'm not doing it

for money. I just really want to change the conversation around money. So there's no blank check for Marion Pip. My goal with Marion Pip is to actually just be the go-to app to change people's relationship with money. Got it. And that when people, when you have a friend who's struggling with money, anxiety, that they'll say, check out Mary and Pip, it really helped me. That's my goal with that. Obviously, sky's the limit for my personal brand deals. Blank check, if I could make, I don't know, like a million bucks on a deal, that'd be sick. All right, let's go. You got to put it out there. Yeah, we're going to make it happen. There's going to be an AI company that's going to listen to this and do a million-dollar deal with you.

That's my base rate, guys, by the way. That's the base rate. Just for starters, talk to baby doll, WME and everyone else involved after that. Probably one of the last questions I got you is you talk about one of your biggest struggles is being taken seriously when walking into a room. And I wanted to bring this up because I think any professional deals with this in any industry in any space, I think some people might assume like, oh, if you have more credentials or more education or more years experience, it's not a struggle you have, but I've talked to many

people that it is. So being taken seriously when you're walking into a room, what's your trading secret for those that struggle with that. Yeah, it's definitely all about how you talk to yourself. And I think that everyone's worried about themselves in any room that you walk in. Keep your shoulders back. I mean, listen to the etiquette coach that you had on on trade. That was actually very helpful. She was amazing. That was amazing. And now I actually, I know, I got to step up my posture. But even just knowing kind of the trading secrets, I guess, to looking more confident, make you feel more confident, I, she easily, and this could just be me.

mirror before introduce myself how I will at the event. Because especially when you're multi-hyphenate, I could start with, I'm a creator, I'm on Love Thy Nader, I do reality TV. But when I walk into any room lately, I want to be, I'm a CEO of a fintech company. So that that's where the conversation heads. And for a long time, I stumbled on my words based on what room I was in. Yeah. If I was at an influencer event, I would say I was an influencer. I was in a boardroom. I would say, you know, former Georgia Bank, like even in the recent months, it's, have I gotten to say I'm a CEO? Like, it's really hard for me to realize that I'm in that position of power. Sure.

And so I think that saying that to yourself in the mirror or practicing it with a friend before on how you're going to introduce yourself is really helpful. That's a really, really good piece of advice. I mean, I'm taking this advice too because it's something I struggle with too, right? Yeah. When I'm with a group of finance people, the conversation changes what I am. If it's business leaders, I'm a different title. If I'm with creators, it's a different title. And I think what's relatable to that is we're living in this world where people are wearing more hats.

And kind of like, unfortunately or fortunately, you're going to have to wear multiple hats, right? With the way things are changing, you're just going to have to. So I love that idea. Come up with what your identity is, no matter what room you're in. And like self-talk yourself is to the why into that, believe it, know it, and present it. Absolutely. Brilliant. All right.

Well, Mary, season. Two's coming out. Season three, hopefully on its way. We'll see everyone if you're out there streaming, but you got to leave us with a trading secret. Something specific to you. Can't learn from a professor. Can't learn from a textbook. Only your experience can be finance advice, life advice, whatever you want to leave us with. Amazing. I would say I kind of mentioned it earlier, but my hack for paying off credit is weekly instead of monthly. It's so much easier to pay a couple hundred a week than thousands a month. You're more likely to have that balance every week than the huge balance at the end of the month. So, schedule a weekly meeting with yourself and pay off that credit every week and you'll feel more in control of your money. Small bites instead of the big bite that is a great trading secret. And Mary, where can everyone find everything you have going on in all your pages? Don't even care about me. Just find Mary and Pip on everything. TikTok, Instagram, our website's Maryandip.com. You can see My Money Ritual on our website and join us every Sunday. All right. Let's go. Mary, thank you so much for not trading secrets. You killed it. We're excited for season three.

Anne Mary and Pip, of course. Thanks, Jason. Two and five Canadians will hear the words, you have cancer. That's why every step and dollar raised matters. On September 19th, join thousands in Toronto for the Princess Margaret Cancer Foundation walk. Challenge yourself, friends, and family

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