Trading Secrets - 333. Andrew Spencer & Alexe Godin: $100K Debt, 3X’ing Her Salary & Why They Turned Down the Money for Love

Episode Date: September 21, 2026

Bachelor Nation’s Andrew Spencer and Alexe Godin join Jason to break down the money, career pivots, and relationship realities that came after Bachelor in Paradise. Andrew reveals how his income has grown from roughly $75K his first year after the show to $200K the following year—and why 2026 could be another major jump—while Alexe opens up about nearly $100K CAD in student debt, leaving her career as a speech-language pathologist after realizing content could pay roughly 3X more, and using her Paradise winnings to help wipe out debt and invest for retirement. The couple also gets candid about turning down the money for love on Paradise, why Andrew secretly strategized once a cash prize entered the game, their very different relationships with money, keeping their businesses and finances separate for now, and how their childhoods shaped what financial security and family mean to each of them. Plus, Alexe talks about pursuing acting, Andrew shares how he’s building a brand beyond Bachelor Nation, and they open up about navigating the pressure to get engaged, merge lives, and figure out what comes next. Host: Jason Tartick
Audio: John Gurney
Video: Marc Colcer
Guests: Andrew Spencer & Alexe Godin Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

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Just go to my skylight.com slash secrets for $30 off your 15-inch calendar. That's M-Y-S-K-Y-L-G-H-T dot com slash secrets. Welcome back to another episode of Trading Secrets. Today we're joined by a couple Bachelor Nation that fell in love on the beaches Andrew Spencer and Alex Gudden. That's good. That was good, actually. I will take it.

My beats per minute right there, just when I said. I was nervous about that. Andrew was a professional football player in Austria and Chicago where he coached. Alex was a speech-language pathologist or is. We'll talk about that on this show from Canada and you talked openly about your student debt on the beaches. You have your master's degree and making big impact. You two met and fell in love

with each other on Bachelor in Paradise, leaving Costa Rica as the runner up. Since then, they've been dating, traveling the world together, crushing life and content. Your content is hilarious, by the way. There's so much mayhem that comes with post-reality TV. We're going to talk all things, the prize money, life today. How far it's coming the last year and what's next? How are you guys doing? Dude, that was really good. I'm sorry. That was really good. No, it was just like, You crushed it. Like, the flow was great. I feel like that was one of my worst things.

I didn't feel good about that one. You didn't stumble. That was great. You guys are pumping my tires here. How's life been in the last year? Because holy smart. Does even feel, like, I always say like bachelor time. I don't even need notes with batch because like, you understand.

This life is so crazy. Yeah. Like post-batchar nation, in bachelor nation, a year feels like 10 years, but also feels like a week. It's hard to really explain. How would you summarize the last year? I think for sure, like how you just said it, it's fast. We were like, oh, we only been a year. Like, we have so much time.

Like, we'd be patient. And also we're like, dang, we've been together a whole year. It's a long time. You know what I mean? It's like, yeah. But I feel like when we first got out, I was like, oh, I'm ready to move to Chicago, like a month in. And then we kind of took a step back. I was like, wait, we've only been together for a month.

I've only known you for... Compare it to, like, a real life relationship. I was like, wait, we're moving a little too fast. Yeah. So we've been taking it slow, like a real relationship. ship. Yeah. Yeah. So to speak and I think that was a right move. That's a right move. That's a right move. What also got me with timing was Andrew and I are in this fantasy football league together. Yeah. Oh, trust me. I lose him from September to February. Well, you might gain some time back here.

Oh, because this was the fantasy, we called it the fantasy suite. Yeah. There was like me, I'm in there, you're in there. Nick Vial, Ben Haygings, Matt James. Yeah, there's a lot of Grippo in there. Michael A. Grocer store Joe. Yeah. Right. So we've been doing it for years. and then a couple years ago, Chris Harrison was in there, he tapped out. And then this year, you just said to the good chat, you go, no, he said, is this show canceling too? I love that. Unbelievable. Well, yeah, I was just like, all right, usually there would be like, hey, boys, send your $300. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

I'm like, all right, let's go. So was it canceled or did it? I tried to revive it. You tried to revive it. Ben Higgins was like, I think so. I think so. Also, it kind of, it was really interesting because it woke me up a little bit thinking like, Wow, a year in this space changes so much.

Like, I feel like a year ago, all of us were like dialed, chirping with each other at events all every single weekend. You guys are the first Bachelor Nation couple I've had on and probably like a year plus. That's so rare. You know, maybe Michael A. came on, but it's so rare. Like, this is, it's changed so much in a year. What is your take of the state of the union of Bachelor Nation right now? My thing is they're always, they're the blueprint. So to all these, like, dating shows, like,

it will always be prevalent. Bachelor Nation, they do dance with the stars. So, I mean, like, obviously, Tyler being on that, you're just always in a know of where Bachelor Nation stands. And I feel like with that background and that knowledge, they're never going to go away. You know what I mean? I feel like if they go away, it still has to be like another, like, 10, 15 years.

In my eyes. Yeah. That they'd be completely done. I think it's still, there's still a life beat there because it just means so much to the culture, especially surrounding reality TV. And reality TV, still I feel like it's at the piece. Isn't it the longest-day-ting rally show that's still going on?

I would, I don't know. I don't know. I don't want to fact-check that, but I think it is. Probably pretty close to it. Yeah. Yeah. So, yeah, I just feel like. So you're bullish on it.

You're buying Bachelor. I'm buying. I'm buying. They got all the funds and things they need to figure it out. Obviously, they had a little hiccup, but like it's, it's, it's a strong. It's a strong, right? Yeah.

Every time you say the word, everyone is heard of Bachelor. Do you feel the same way? Yeah, I feel like my first reality TV show I've watched was when I was a kid, you know, and this. this high so for sure I think it's like yeah and I think it every reality show is going to go through that curve of it's really peak and then it kind of has a a low I don't know what you call that so I think it's like a roller coaster I think it'll yeah I mean you still hear it in movies oh what do you think this is the bachelor like yeah I feel like that's it's just the most iconic reality dating show

do you think with that there's so much competition now right and you see like love island in the way in the last year right Olander was on the podcast last year I look at it now she's like oh you know She's like an A-list celebrity. She was at Carl Anthony Towns's wedding. Yeah. Good God. We got a bachelor. We got like, I mean, listen, I will forever be grateful.

I am so appreciative of that show. And all the alumni we get to connect with, it is a dream. But then I see what's happening with Love Island and their show. And then I look at like, is there a Bachelor Nation cruise coming out? Like, what's going on? I was like, I literally asked this morning. Wait, were you supposed to go on it? No, no.

We were going. But I was like, wait, are they still doing that? Yeah. I'm like, just like, what? That's why I brought it up on what is the state of the year? Right now they're living in nostalgia. And I'm telling you, like, these shows, like, Love Island, you're going to hit your fatigue. Your fatigue, that's what I meant.

You're going to hit your fatigue. Because I saw a TikTok this morning, someone talking that I think in five years, I don't think Love Island will be what it is right now just because of fatigue, like you said. You're starting to see the same repetitive thing. And, like, The Bachelor gets that as well. I mean, every show. Back when you were on, it was kind of like Love Island craze, you know, maybe not as much. Before I went on, there was no Love Island. Like, I was on a long time.

But I mean, the show was equivalent to what Love Island was, right? Oh, yeah, it was huge. And after that, it went Tyler, and then it went Hannah. Yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And then you could say our season kind of dived. Yeah, yeah. It was COVID. It was COVID. It was COVID. Well, it was the COVID season.

Yeah, yeah, yeah. COVID seasons. It still was, like, it still was rich. I mean, if you want to talk about dip, come on. You're fine. Trust me. They're like, Andrew and who? I don't know. I don't recognize her from anywhere. Oh, my gosh. Okay. Well, it's always good to like. I'm joking. I'm joking.

I'm joking. I mean, predictions. What do you think will happen with this whole season that? I think we'll get a, we'll get a bachelor in. Do you think this, do you think they'll drop?

I think. I think. I think they'll drop. No, that's cooked. You don't think it's cooked with confidence? Yeah, I think it's done. I just finally just pick a new person.

You're confident? You still think it's coming? I think it's, I think, I don't think it should. I think they made the decision. Yeah. I just think if you put a gun to my head, will they end up releasing it?

and just drop it on like a Hulu or something, I think they will. Yeah. I mean, I've done it by now. Why not now? Like at this point. At this point, it's been so. That's what I'm saying. Maybe like after the, when the bachelor's coming out, maybe, if they do another bachelor, if they use a guy from that season, I can see it. But if they just start fresh.

I don't think, exactly. I agree. I just think, like, they just need a little bit of nostalgic right now. Like people in, like, nostalgic. To miss it, you mean? No, to see it. Like, people need to see the bachelor again. We lost, what, two years now? Yeah.

When's that time? Oh, year, a year and a half? It's been a minute. It's been a minute, and I feel like that's something people are yearning. Usually it was like a break from Love Island. Now you're just getting Love Island-type shows. Everyone's just making out. Some people, Harry Mary.

You know what? Harry. So you miss the elegance, I would say. I don't want to say. It was traditional. But, like, people don't laugh at The Bachelor and they're dumb. Like, sometimes you'll see some people with some really cool careers, like some really cool backgrounds that are like trying to make it in some of

some other ways. I feel like there was just, there's just a different aura around the Bachelor. It's funny you said, I remember, like, it was about a year after I got off, and there was a guy from MTV who had been on MTV dating shows. And he said to me, he's like, oh, yeah, but you're the ABC guys. You're the ABC guys. You're the ABC bachelor must be nice. And I was like, I was like, I'm serious. I don't. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I know what you're talking about. Yeah. Like, tell me, what do you mean? And he's like, oh, you got like, it's like, you guys are like that elite show. I was like, no, no, no. That's what you think of it this way. I had no idea. They look at us as like the preppy kids.

Right. Like Netflix, like I'll be in the room with these guys, and it's always, everyone clicks up. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Bachelor Nation goes a Bachelor Nation, Lowellan goes with. But I think that's also maybe why it started dipping, because then you get the shows where it's a little bit more outrageous. And the Gen Z and, I mean, me included, we're like, oh, we want to see like. Yeah, no, I agree. We talk about, obviously on this podcast, we talk about a business, right, and a little behind the scenes.

Yeah. I think of any show that, you know, on this show, we've probably had someone from every single reality show at this point. I think that Bachelor people, I'm curious if you guys agree with this. I think Bachelor alumni are like the most careful with the media training. Oh, trust me. We're like, we don't want to take one step. We're like, obviously we'll talk about the decision you guys had to make with the money and stuff like that. I feel like on some of these Gen Z shows, they'd be like, fuck that.

Give me the money. Give me the money. You don't care. You agree with that perception that like we kind of tiptoe a little bit. Oh, 1,000%. I mean, I feel like in paradise, you'll see more raw, real. kind of like Love Island, but we'll never go too far. Like, even I'm the one who said the joke about an erection,

and I feel like it was the whole thing. Like, oh my gosh, he's talking about sex on the show and his penis. I mean, I think that needs to be like, obviously, more open. Yeah, yeah. Yeah, like, we're not like, we're all prude. No, and I hate how that, like, had been portrayed for years ever, just like some saints. No, no, no, no.

We party. We have fun as well. It's just there gets a point where they push the line too far. Yeah, yeah. And, like, the other shows. I'm just like, I think that. The Bachelor knows the line, and I feel like they don't cross it, which is nice. But you and I said we kind of tip to a little bit.

You had mentioned, well, the fan base. What do you mean by that? Oh, man, the fan base, it kind of keeps you locked in. I feel like, I mean, I think Love Island fans are now starting to try to reel them in and, like, trying to hold them accountable for things. I feel like I was so just, like, I was timid about any posts. I made sure I read up on things. If I'm posting something, I want to make sure that I was spelling things right.

Like you were just... Like even this morning, I was like, I posted something and I saw a comment. I was like spiraling. I was like, I shouldn't have posted that. Yeah. But I thought it was funny, but like, yeah. So it's, you got to be careful because I feel like it's not... They make you really feel like you're a role model.

And like you have a platform. But not we are, but they make you, like, honor that. And I think that's the thing. It's like, yeah, be yourself. But at the same time, like, understand that you are a figure in this world that, you know, that have some impact on other minds and other people. And I think that I take that profoundly. I really love the fact that, like, okay, yes, I have this platform, but I want to show who I am and also be a beacon to someone else to kind of treat the same way or be to be the same way to other people.

So that's kind of like I feel like I was. You're right. With the platforms come a responsibility. Right. And when you're not like, you know, that's Spider-Man. That's Spider-Man. Toby Spider-Spiderman. But no, I think like with that platform comes a responsibility to make sure that you educate yourself.

on things that you speak about. And if you were unaware, you make sure you get aware and make mistakes. And that's human nature. And hopefully that the core of your center is just a good person. And that that's relatable to everybody and everything. I think where maybe some of the issues become are some of the top 1% of fans that it doesn't matter which way you blink, they're going to talk shit. And we don't, we don't acknowledge them. I think if you change who you are and how you show up for your community and your space on social because of them, you're losing. No, you don't want to curate your whole. life to, no, but I...

It's funny, because you guys are so used to it. I have, I'm still kind of like, going through it, so I'm hearing you guys and he's like, I'll see things and he's like, it's so, who cares? And I'm like, but I do. And like, hearing you talk, it's like, it seems like so like, you know, you're yourself, you post. You go through your rough patches where you're like, damn, why am I posting wrong

things right now? But you really go through and you really know who you are to your core. You'll be fine. Yeah, yeah. I think that's what it matters. And like all the noise, it doesn't, it doesn't mean anything if it's not true and it doesn't have wings. Exactly. Yeah.

And I've seen, I've just seen crazy stuff over there. I've seen people, now especially, there's a lot of what can happen in the reality space is character assassination. Oh, my God, yeah. People will hire teams and get groups undercover. They'll go on Reddit without posting history, all this stuff to just try and smear someone's names. Yeah, 1,000%. What do you mean by hire companies? There's like, they'll hire groups, bots to like it, by the haters, hey, we don't like what you did or something, and they'll come after you.

And you'll look at the people that are saying it and they're trying to create momentum of a narrative that's not true. Oh, it's a very real thing. And then you look at who the people are and they have no posting history and stuff like that. So it's a wild, it's cool to talk about it because it is a wild world that reality stars or people from shows. They deal with.

We talk about the upside of earnings and stuff like them. But there's also this other wild, nasty side. And everyone's like, yeah, well, you don't work at 9 to 5. I'm like, I'm telling you, my 9 to 5 is every day. all day all hours it can start at 1 a.m. You can start at 1 a.m.

And your performance is like on who you are and then if you meet someone you have to be able to give them the attention that they feel like they deserve and that's like amazing that you want to be able to do that but that's also you're always on because you're also you're a brand

and you want to show your brand off all the time I've never worked straighter in my life than now because I used to be like this and I'm like oh wait just in case you know what I mean? Wait just because like someone might be lost. I just slouch. Sometimes at the airport often and then I'm like, oh my gosh, hi.

So now I just try to walk more straight. Yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah. You're just aware of everything. I know. Like, making sure that all your smart is a check. You'll be like, oh, and I'm like, what? Who?

Yeah. I mean, it's your job. Yeah. No, it's a, it's really. You always have to be on. And, like, that's the thing. Like, I'm not mad at it because I get, like, the benefits from it. But at the same time, you know, that's what you signed up for.

That's what you signed up for. We've been talking a little bit about, like, kind of the stock equity of Bachelor nation and stuff. I'm curious. When you came on, you came on two years ago. It was April, 2024. Me, you and Greg were here. Yes, yeah, yeah, yeah. Yesterday.

Yeah, yeah, yeah. Over two years ago. That's fucking insane. I was like, oh, I remember this building when we walked up. Yeah, right? Yeah. At that time, you said the first year out of the show, you made around $75 grand. That next year, you made $200,000.

With the show going down, is your business still increasing? Yeah. I mean, people know me from TikTok and Instagram now. Well, now that we've been together, everyone, I'm like Alex's boyfriend. So, like. So like now I'm known as like other different things And people still like oh you're Greg and Andrew You know what I mean?

So like honestly it's more Greg and Andrew still to this day Sometimes I was like wait at a certain point It's going to be Andrew and Alex And I'm like no it's still Andrew and Greg Yeah always Yeah no so seriously they'll always say like oh Greg and Andrew We love your videos And I'm like in the back I'm like hello

That's like the gingerbread Like gingerbread video that we made like three years ago That's what we establish a name for ourselves in that say And I feel like, like I said, being bred and born out of the Bachelor Nation, it like teaches you how to, I don't know, like, be, turn this job into a professional thing. You know what I mean? Because you're brand friendly. Everything's your PG-friendly. So you can, you could do from sports to literally anything, you know what I mean?

Because you're, they want you around. And I think that has been the biggest thing for me is like being able to be approachable for every single brand. Sure. And I think that's hard compared to Love Island where you're doing all these things and you might not like fit into this brand and what they want. So like that's kind of like how that works. They're doing well for themselves. Oh, 1,000%. But I know you mean.

But like, you know what I mean? Like, are you still going to be doing the things that you're doing from Love Island to continue yourself out? I think what I'm hearing from you is like your brand that you're creating online has separated itself from Bachelor. And obviously you have the adjacency with the people you're surrounding yourself. Yeah. But it's it's got a longevity comedy. It can stand with time. And it's in a space that's brand safe.

It's funny. It's funny. It stands with time. And it's part of your strategy, too, right? I never forget the Bachelor. Like, they are literally what made me who I am. So, like, I will always still be Andrew Spencer from The Bachelor. But now Andrew Spencer, who loves rom-coms and loves college football. You know what I mean?

You're able to branch out from these different things, and that's amazing. Okay, so I'm going to you, Alex, in a second. But 200 grand, how are we doing today? What does 2026 look like? 2026 looks great. Like really good. Like 2X? Yes.

Yeah. What's funny? I love that. Funny on the show. So there was like this game that we were doing and Jesse it was basically like higher or lower. And my question was like how much would you like your partner to make? And I said like 150 and then he had to pick lower or higher and you pick lower because I was like I'm fine with 150. And I remember Jesse was like, would you mean like Canadian or American?

And I was like, Canadian's fine with 150. And then you sat down and you're like, we'll be good babe. I got to. For me, you know, coming from health care and profession, I was like, 150 is amazing. Yeah. It's a lot. That's a good transition to before you go on the show, speech pathology, and you talked on the show about your debt.

Yeah. I don't think I've ever had a speech pathologist on. What does earnings look like in that field? In that field. I mean, it depends what sector you're working with. So if you're in school, you might get a little bit less than if you're working in a hospital. But we are very lucky. I used to work in a school.

I had the summers off. So you're not working for a big chunk of the year. But the thing is that I think was hard for me is that you do cap at a certain number. And it's usually around, you know, like 120. Okay. It probably depends on what state you're in or Canada, U.S. And I think for me who wants always incentives, it was kind of like, ooh, I'm going to be capping at one point. So no matter how good I'm doing or how much skills I'm acquiring, I'm always going to be capping, right?

So that's a little bit hard. And I used to have to nanny on the side the first year because I had so much debt. I was like, why did I get a master's degree and I'm nannying on the side? This is insane. How much was the debt that you had? Like, what does it cost to get the master's? The thing is, so I was on my own since I was 18 and I was also not really responsible with my money. So I was someone who was very like, well, I still want to do all the things that my friends are doing, which is not a good way of going about it because I, you know, you can't use the money that you can't afford.

But at the same time, I traveled a lot. And I think sometimes when you expand your opportunities in a sense, I did travel. I did get a lot of debt, but then that's how I discovered for The Bachelor. I took a picture in Miami, and someone was like, oh, you should be on The Bachelor. So in my head, I'm like, created my own luck. So, but yes, with all that said, it was Canadian though, but it was everything undergrad, grad, like 100K. Okay. And then you go on the show, you get off the show, and you go back to work.

And this is something all of us deal with, right? Every single lot of it is. Yes, I know. You go back to work and I did. You did it for a year. You did too. Where do I? When do I?

I do I? I did it too. Exactly. Do I pull the cord? I went right back to playing, right off the plane. You know what I'm saying? Went off the plane. Yeah, you have to.

Next Monday I was back in the office. Literally. No idea. You're hitting people. I'm there with a calculator. Yeah. Yeah. But then there's like this, all this shit starts popping on your lap. You know what I mean?

All these opportunities were paid. Yeah. So what was that in, I think, different times, different years. But like, what did that decision process look like for you to say, hey, I'm going to take a step away? So I think it didn't help that I was with Andrew, and he had, I was still having my night to five. And I would call him, and he was off. couch and I was like, wait, what? But also, not I'm joking, but what I was, it's

okay, it's okay. But he would ask me to go through these places and I was like, I can't take the time off. Like that's, I can't just like, walk out and like, I need to see the kids. And to a certain point, I was like, okay, how, if I look salary-wise, makes no sense that I would be making X, you know, three times more.

Sure. Financially in this economy, I was like, I love what I do, but I want to prioritize, obviously, me and how, like, my finances. And I want to be able to go to the places that you want me to be at. So I kind of had to be like, okay, I think I'm going to. So it was like a career trajectory and a freedom play for time. Exactly.

Exactly. Exactly. That makes sense. But I always, always say it's true. If you don't do it right in the sense, you kind of look, for me sometimes I'm like, I kind of lost my purpose a little bit because I would go in and like help kids. Whereas I'm not necessarily doing that anymore. I am still, like I used to be posting speech therapy videos online just to kind of help me at least like,

help people in a different way. So there's definitely that aspect to it, that, you know, you have that freedom being what we do now, but you kind of lose sometimes that, like, you know, that you're impacting somebody. Yeah, impacting or, well, I think it's, I told you, I saw your profile before. You got a non-for-profit on there that raises awareness for, that's true. I need to be reminded and things like that. Right, that contributes. But I do think, this is not as concrete, you know, so in my head, I'm like, I'm not helping anybody. Yeah. But some, you know, people will be like, oh, you, you made a funny video and that literally made my day and I'm like okay I need to remember that like those little things count as well.

Yeah. Do you think the, there's ever an identity struggle of like what am I now? What is this? Absolutely. That's literally what I go through today. That's where Jackie BT comes in. No, no dad's serious. That's who she talks to you. No, I'm going to invest. No, don't think it's not good for the environment. I get it. It's sometimes when I'm in a little crisis, I'm like, who am I? Everyone can stop. Listen, it's not good for the environment. It's not. But if you are against AI, my team. take is get on the board to put in regulations in place for AI because

we need those. But that being said we also can't stop the beast. The beast is unstoppable. It's there already. So if you're an AI hater, take that energy and create change for AI because it's going nowhere. It will. I'm scared. It's crazy. I know. My guys,

one of my ex-roomate, one of my best friends, he is a engineer, so he keeps us up to date on everything and it is a scary world out there. It's a wild I agree with that take. That was a really good take. Yeah. But with, so with chat, though, and finding the identity, just talk to me a little bit about, like, what that looks like, because it does tie into, like, career navigation, like this idea of, of like, okay, things are great. I'm getting to go to these things. I'm getting paid. I'm making more money. But I'm also dealing with this internal struggle of what the identity is, and how have you dealt with it? And what does it look like? I think for me, it's people reminding me that maybe, like, for example, the speech therapy, I was making videos and people would comment, like, thank you so much. I didn't know to use these tricks. And I was like, oh, even if it's not a one-on-one service, I'm still helping people in a different.

different way in a larger, broader scale. And I just, those constant reminders, or even people, I love to, you know, answer people that are DMing me. And when they do tell me like, hey, like, you literally make my damn, like, that is a way to impact people, even if it's not, again, a service or, you know, I'm helping you do this. Okay. It's, yeah. So for me, that's how I kind of have to, I have to talk to myself, you know. I love it. And then, I'm coming back to you in a second, but now where you are, right, you're all in on this career track.

Yes. What do you see, like, when you take the crystal ball, you look like a year or two years from now. What do you imagine? How does it shape? I don't even know. If you know me, you know, I don't even know in a week. I'm very like, these are our two type Bs, right?

Exactly. I'm very similar. I'm a tweener. Oh, you cannot be tight. You're a tweeter. What's interesting is like, Pete, I'm a very tweeter.

There are some days I'm like, I can't, I need to just do today. I will lose my life. And then there's sometimes I'm like, I'm just like locked in dialed in. So like financially savvy. I was like, there's no way this man's type B.

No, I'm like really. And so and Catherine's type B too. I love that. But also type A at times. It's like a mix. Okay. See, she's like type B. Type B is going to lose our entire conversation.

We got to go back. She might be type Z. Yeah, I say time. You know what? Honestly, Catherine, there are times I get home and her somehow the car door is still open. The garage is still open. That would be.

Grocerers. I'm like, how is this possible? Do you know? One time, this was at my lowest. I went shopping back home in New Brunswick, Canada. And I went to the, the shopping, came back two hours. I'm like, where are my keys? God damn it.

My car was still on. I forgot the keys in the engine and left shopping, came back. But thank God I came from a small town. Like, no one stole the car. But the engine for two hours. Literally. 2007.

Yeah, anyways. That's Catherine, too. It's beautiful. It's endearing, you know? It's endearing. I'm going to go full back into type A mode here. And tell me, career trajectory. One year, two years.

How do you picture it? So I always, now I'm saying I'm going to do this as much as I can. And I would love to go back. I'm going to be honest. I feel like it's... I think you should. I think you're great at it. Thank you so much.

And I think that's also another thing. It's like I'm so new to this. And you know, you compare and you're like really hard on yourself. And I know speech therapy I'm good at it. So I'm like, I want to go back to something I feel good and confident about. So financially, this makes sense right now, you know. Well, also, she's been working hard at her dream and she's been an acting thing as well. She was a childhood actress.

Like, she started like it, like it was like a French de Grassee back in the day. And she was just in a movie Not too long ago You were in a movie? I mean it was like a... Wait, why are you not talking about this? You know, she doesn't... Once I feel like I

You know, built a lot of credits And I can be proud of like, yes, I do this But I want, you know, humble And that's just me. I'm like... But why? Tell me why. Is it worried about perception or is it...

Perception? And I think people are going to be like, oh, this, you did one thing. I know their actress, like want to be actress. Not even that. Yeah, that I don't mind. That's not really the issue. People are nasty.

It's like there's a dream year as you enjoy it. Do it. Anybody that's judging you for it is either jealous. They're not doing it or they may see something in you they don't like about themselves. Like screw that. That is such bullshit. Well, it's funny. I'm taking acting classes every week, right?

And I'm with this last week, actually, they were like, oh, what do you do? And I mentioned it. And I said, the bachelor. And they were like, oh, my gosh. So one of the kid, he's 17. We go in a breakout room to do, like, improv. And he goes, I just texted my sister. And she knows you.

And but she said, what does she do? Because he's 17. I'm 29. And apparently she said, what does she do? doing in your acting class. Like this year's 17. He was like, no, it's an improv class. Like, it's not. I was like, oh my gosh, that's embarrassing. But yeah, yeah, yeah. So I'm working towards it. So hopefully. Work towards it. Say it loud and proud. I think it's cool. I think it's fun. I agree. Good for you. That's hard work. I've gone to an acting. I did one. It was three hours.

I sat there for three hours. I observed. I never gone back. I thought it was so impressive. Maybe one day I will, but I can't believe how much work. There is a guy who was like Simon And people didn't come prepared with their lines. By the way, their lines were like, it must have been like 15 pages because it was a lot. And they lost one word and he's screaming at it. I'm like, how much work on. How much. You remember that?

Yeah. I'm like, and I have to read for her. This is my favorite part stuff. She hates when I try to get into character. Because I'm like, you're doing it. He's doing too much. No, exactly. And he and he, he's a Simon Cowell.

He's like, do this like this, do that one. Hmm. He, he. But I will say, it gives me what I love about this job is that, job is that finally gives me the flexibility to like work on auditions and and whatnot versus when I was the speech therapist I would still audition but you just don't have the time I would have to literally like on my lunch break have to like read my lines and practice and do all the work and then see kids and it's just for me since I'm

type B I'm just it was too much so I'm so grateful that I have this and I can have the flexibility to take my acting class afford acting class I couldn't afford it before so it does give you that flexibility yeah I love it I think when you land that next big one you're coming on here it's gonna happen. I'm putting it out here right now. Screw people's opinions. Don't let them hold you back. Keep doing your thing. That fires me out. All right, Bachelor in Paradise.

You make a decision to go back on reality TV. I have talked to Justin Clay's about this on the podcast. I said, Depp's. Greg, we've talked about it. You have even talked about it. Going back on reality TV in any form is a risk. Like, I mean, how to edit, the cut, the perception. Obviously, it paid off

financially and with love. But after the show, I'm curious, when you left Paradise and you saw the results of Paradise, did it give you kind of that, the bump that you might have expected by going back on TV? Not. No, he said no. You didn't stay flat out now.

I was like, no. No, not for you. Well, obviously, personally, yes. It gave me the, like, my lifestyle. Of course. Yeah. Yeah. But, like, I think that was what I was actually going on.

Like, I was single at the time. You know what I mean? Like, yeah. There was no wrong answer for going on The Bachelor in Paradise at that time. I was just like, listen, I have nothing. I can live for a little thrill right now. Let me go do it. And, you know, I actually thought I was going to get dumped.

And I'm like, all right, going out. I'm leaving home. I'm going home. And I know, and I am like, fuck, I like this girl. And, like, that's kind of like how it happened. I was like, I was not expecting to find a girlfriend there. I thought it was going to be the same old, same old, you know, get a couple laughs, reboost the being like of a relevancy, you want to say.

And get out of there. And I think once I got there, it kind of flipped. and I just really didn't care and I was just like happy we just spending every moment together and then we found it was a cash prize and I had to be quiet about I don't care about the cash prize

I don't care about this because then no one thinks of you as a threat yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah I was like he's gaming once it's cash prize it becomes a game it goes game technically it's a game and the thing is if you tell yourself

it's something you can eat whatever you want you can say hey listen I don't care about this Yeah, I don't care about this, but deep down, you're like, I do care about this. I'm going to tell everyone and everyone thinks of you. Oh, yours was like a strategic? Oh, my God, yes. I was, I was low-key wheeling and dealing.

Get this guy on traders right out. I was like, good karma. I was like, the universe is going to, like, thank me back for not caring, and then they will be. It didn't matter at the same time. Yeah, yeah. But I was like, why didn't you take the money? This question is, why didn't you take the money? Yeah, that was coming.

Well, at the same time, like, if I took the money, like, what would they have done for me? Like what you said? You know what I mean? Like the audience is going to look at you like they're going to tear you apart. For sure. But also like it goes back to you. I really believe that you needed that money. Like that was like a real thing for me is like if I took it, I would have been doing well again.

You know what I mean? Like I was already doing well at the end of the day. Like I was in a good spot. Like he's already doing X, Y money. I would have looked like a big asshole. Like with such impactful. Like with such impactful work to like. Like our youth, dickhead, Andrew Spencer.

She's an S-LB, and she just defunded her. I truly deal fell apart. I truly deal fell apart. No, no, no. No, exactly. It was just also your background story, like your life story. Like, those things mattered. Hearing those stories and how you grew up and, you know,

doing everything kind of on your own since 18 and just like how your family dynamic where you're not, like, close to your mom or your dad. And I was just like, damn, I'm going to give her money. I can't do it. I can't take it. about almost say I mean he was telling you to take it no no because we didn't talk so that's the whole thing we had no idea that's what they wanted you to be separate yeah yeah yeah can i phone a friend i wish

about the ITMs and stuff but that's right it's not they talk so um you had no idea it's so funny it's like any bachelor world that you're in you're so in la la la land that of course i wanted it but i was just like oh my gosh i'm just going to be with and he's going to love that i didn't choose him that i didn't do that um which i did gogles get off and you're like fuck damn i was gonna take no but also So though, if she did take the money, I don't know if I would have felt the same way. Sure. I would have been like, I would have been like, okay, yeah, yeah, yeah. I'm happy for you.

Like, that is a life-changing moment for you. Like, that is exactly what you need. I'm not mad about that. They don't want you to talk before. Yeah, yeah. Of course. Take it and we'll be back again. But like that you would have been without.

And then I, like, you just get a little salty. You're like, damn, I'm only worth $500,000. Yeah, that's worth $500,000. Yeah, I didn't. I think not taking it is the right move. Yeah. I mean, everyone says they'll take it, but like at the end of the day, like, we wake up together every day.

I have that. And then also you also do brand deals with each other. That money will, yeah. It'll make itself away. It comes and goes. Money comes and goes. Plus you think about it. It was 190.

Taxes in California. 50% gone. Literally. You're down to, you know, 95. You're splitting it to, you're splitting it, right? Yeah. So then you're down, right? Oh, it was gone.

Yeah. Second. I got it. It was gone because I paid my dad. I was like, oh. money and your retirement, you got 30K left, it's like, I'm gonna give up my, like, potentially love my life for that.

Exactly. So I didn't, I didn't see, I didn't see, like, the benefit. Oh my gosh. Did you have any, did you have any like being on reality TV going back in a paradise and knowing that you have a brand to protect? You're earning hundreds of thousands of dollars. Did you have any hard rules? You're like, I won't do this in paradise. I don't care. I'll just leave. No, dude. I was looking to be, like,

I was looking to be like, we're like, we're going to spice this shit up. I'm like, I'm ready to spice this shit up. I'm like, damn. I'm gonna be in like a love triangle here and a love triangle there. It did not go that way. And I was just like, oh, this is, I'm so boring. This is like, everyone's like, where's your screen time?

I was like, I don't know, we're just hanging out. I thought I was going to be messy. Like, that's what I was looking for. And like, I would never step outside who I truly am. Like, I'm always going to be me. Everyone's like, like, they've known me since I was a kid. They're like, dude, I love how you just translate onto the show. Like, that is you.

I'm watching you all the time. And my buddies were telling you that. And I was just like, yeah, it's that easy. But you can also, like, be funny here or be extra here or be a little bit, but you don't come beside yourself. Like, don't do something that you're not comfortable doing. So I was just like, all right, this is a role, and your roles change in The Bachelor. You have to understand, like, there's roles on every season.

Sure. And once you find your role, you just stick with it and you just, you don't try to go and become something different. What did you think your role was, knowing that? On Paradise? Yeah. Like, the way they edited me, you mean? Just the way that you felt like you had mentioned, like, You knew the role that you were in and how you're going to be that role?

Yeah, it's funny because the first time around, you know, my role, I think, I didn't have a lot of screen time because I think I was so shy in a weird way. But I was obviously for sure the one who was just making, I'm just very blunt and I have no filter. And I think it was well received. I was like, oh, that's me. And I did the same thing on Paradise. And then, yeah, I got neurodivergent allegations. What is wrong with this girl?

Yeah, no, literally. She looks amazing. Like, why isn't she like? But she can't talk. Or like, I'd see comments like, leave her alone. She's, you know, X, Y, Z. And I'd be like, oh, okay. Yeah, yeah, I'm sure.

Okay, I'll take it. Chat, am I this? But I'm like, how would you feel to have a camera in your face? And I think a lot of it, too, was the language barrier a little bit. I was telling my friends, I was like, if they think I'm funny, if they only knew how funny I am in French, right? Because there's a little bit, especially. I don't know how funny she's in French. I am hilarious.

No, and bring the whole day. I know your bilingual, but it's French, your first language. and I learned it in senior year because I wanted to, no, not senior, sophomore, because I wanted to act. I was like, I, if I'm going to go to, you know, I have to know English, but I used to have a very strong accent like this for a long time. Really? Yeah.

Wow. Yeah. So I've gone, I've come a long way. I was speaking actress. I did the actress. When you did it like that, I was like, that's an actress. That's an actress right there. I saw someone.

I've never heard one. Yeah, more French Canadian. But anyways, yeah. So I think my. roll. I was just like, I'll be myself, and then the edit came, and I was like, oh my God. And honestly, I wasn't, like, I was like, I see it. I am neurospicy for sure on this show. I could just see you trying to, like, be serious about acting and like, you just being like, well, give me the French.

Like, I was just in front. Now, do it in French. You know, I'm very too much fun with those. No, I have a great, until I get yelled at, then I'm just like, oh, all right, I'll stop. Like, it's serious right now. I'm serious. All right. One of the things actually I did, when I put this in the AI, it came up, it said that in the AI.

This is their words. By their own admission. They have had some real arguments and discussions about money in where they stand with that. That was AI. Is there a truth to that? Dude, oh my God, I went to your thing at Capital One. Yes, yeah, yeah, yeah. You're like, oh, there's love and money.

Divorce happens because of money, like certain percentage. And I was like, oh, fuck. First growth. Because, like, here's the thing between us. I'm like a hardcore romantic. I could live under the overpass if it's with the person. Like, I'm, like, madly in love with. and that's all I care about

and obviously I want to have a good life and want to do all the night I'm going to make sure I do the right things to put my family in the best situation because if you love them you wouldn't be underneath there but I'm just saying if circumstance has got so bad it would not I would not quit

you know what I mean so my thing is would you do the same she was like hell no it wasn't that you wouldn't add no no because I think a lot of it the issue was because I am someone who very ambitious and for me education was really really important and I, you know, I did that.

And the question was more like, how would I say that? Would you settle for, you know, and I was like, well, I went to school for a long time. So I would have to need someone who would lifestyle-wise would match me, you know, like for me would be, maybe hard to be with, I don't know how to say that without sounding like an asshole. So I'm not going to say anything. Here's what I want to jump in. I want to jump in and say, I was, he's so hard not to laugh with anything he says. That's the thing. It's just hilarious.

I was laughing because he's so funny. But what also is like not funny and very real is like we all have our own relationships with money. Yeah. Right? You've talked about like your childhood and being in your old 18. Exactly. Money represents something different to you. To me.

It could be security. That's the word. Security. And it's not that it's my only priority. I have so many. But it is still a priority because I know how I grew up and I'm like I don't want to give that to my kids. I want to be able to afford college for them. So that they don't have to go through the.

And I think that's where we like. We connect, but also have, like, a little bit of a difference. So, like, we grew up very similar. For you, like, money for him, you're like, I don't care. My thing was, it was, like, I remember, you know, my mom, like, obviously, we lived pretty rough, like, growing up, and she was a single parent and struggled. I mean, worked three jobs. I never saw my mom at home.

She was always, like, all right, bouncing the next job. And, like, for the most part, there was, like, no one at my games. Like, my mom wouldn't be there because my dad was already locked up. So it was, like, I couldn't have that family as, So my, for me, my thing is all about staying together and being with my family. Like, I need a full family no matter what, how bad it is. And I had the best childhood. It was because we were all together.

And I think that is the biggest thing is if you have love in the relationship, it doesn't matter how much money you have, you are already rich in life. And like, that's how I look at it. And I understand where she's coming from. Yeah. But it was just like... In the beginning. Now what I understand.

I think the one thing was like payment disparity and like how much would, we like be comfortable with living with. Yeah. You know what I mean? And I think that was just like she, because she wants to like be able to give her kids things that she never had. Sure. And I think that was the thing.

It was just like, all right, I want to travel. I want to be able to go to like live in like. Bring them to Disney World where I never had to go to. You know? And I was like, okay, live by that rule. And we just don't care and we're not smart about our money. It's possible that we're not going to be able to offer that to our kids. So I think that's where the disagreement was.

And especially that I'm going to be totally honest. I've always said it. I'm not financially savvy at all. Sure. And I tried, I actually got the book, what is it, five years ago, rich dad, poor dad. And I was so enlightened. I was like, oh my gosh, I'm going to invest. And then I forgot all about it. I got a book for you. Oh, where is it? Where's the, usually the product placement? But so because of that, and this is bad to say, I wanted to be with somebody who was a little bit more, who knew a little bit more about monies.

That's what they could teach me. It's just so bad. So when I heard that, and he was like, oh, I don't care. And I'm not, I was like, oh, my gosh, we're both. Like that, I was like, it's going to be a nightmare. Our kids are going to have to, Mommy, put your money aside, save. I think two things can be true, right? Your feeling and what you want can be true. Your feeling the way you want should be true.

None of those is right or wrong. And I also think, like, the best way to approach it is, like, money can actually be the best way to bond a relationship if it's approach with curiosity and not judgment, right? So you want your kids to go to Disney World. I think, you know, this is from studying it, reading it, trying to understand it, failing at it. in life, like you fail at these discussions.

I think you meet those conversations with instant judgment. It doesn't open up any room for curiosity. And I think curiosity gets to the root of like what's coming on the surface with money. And the root actually becomes very endearing. Like it's quite beautiful that you want to be able to spoil your kids to go to Disneyland because you didn't get that. Like that's a beautiful thing. And it's approached so much different when there's curiosity assigned to it. Do you guys have like, are there any, have you established any rules that you think are working for people that are struggling?

with this whole conversation of love and money? I think patience. People, I'm telling you, patience is the biggest thing that we have in our relationship. If we have an argument about something and we still don't agree, it's not like we're not going to fold because of like you had a good argument. This, I'm like, okay, I'll be back. I'll be back with my lawyers, okay?

So. You go deep freeze. And then that's okay. It's like okay to have arguments, have disagreements. come back up. Like we're still debating on where we want to live. You know what I mean? And like, it's like, okay, well, I'll sleep on it and we'll come back to it because it's the patience.

Like, I know I see this woman at the end of the tunnel. So it's like, we have nothing but time right now when it comes to that situation. So I'm just like, I'm not in a rush to get all these answers right now. My thing is, is like, we will figure them out. We'll go be proactive. We'll go look at things. Like me, I'll go look at things. She just talked to an advisor today.

Not today, but like this sweet for the first time. Yeah, yeah. So it's like there's ways of like going towards the goal. And I think that is the biggest thing is like if we move together. And it's sweet because you wouldn't tell me, but I was like, who are you on the phone with he and you just wouldn't tell me? Like that was like maybe months later. And I found out he was like talking to someone for like an investment portfolio.

And I was like, you're doing, you know what I mean? He didn't want to tell me, but he was like, I'm going to take it exactly. And I was like those little things. I'm like, oh, I, it's worth it. You know, if that makes sense. Yeah, I don't know what it is about me. I just can't, like, let you win or think you won't. Do it in the dark.

You're going to have to work on that. I know. It's like, I like, it's been, I've always been this way. Like, it's like my motivation to do things. Like, I mean, I'm running a marathon coming up here. And I don't like to share my, like, times. I don't want anyone people to know. I want people like, oh, fuck.

Yeah, yeah, yeah. Oh, it's like set the bar low. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah. I think the same thing with acting. I'm the same way. I'm like, I'm like, set the ball of low. And then once you sing at the Golden Globes,

oh, from The Bachelor. Oh, yeah. Right? Okay. It's more like that. Do you guys, do you share openly about like what your finances are, like what you make and credit score, that things like that? Yeah, pretty much. I mean.

Like, maybe like deals. Yeah, deals. We don't get too personal in our like because like, no, I just feel like that's going to lead to another argument. We're not ready for it. I just did a piece. I got interviewed two days ago by London Times on the idea of pre-nups and it's in the creator economy. Yeah. And it's this concept of like this economy is blowing up.

so much. And people, your brand is your brand, that's your equity, that's your business. In the past with like pre-dumps, you'd own a steel business, right? And you bring it and be like, okay, that's mine. Now, like, you guys might have like a joint channel. Like, your business could be like your two brands. How do you differentiate that? What does the splits look like? How are contracts built? Like, yeah. It gets, it's everyone, to some extent, it gets complicated. Yeah, I mean, I think we keep ours separate. Yeah. Yeah, I think it's going to be, for the most part pretty separate but I mean I always put my faith in humanity and in people and the people I choose to be around I feel like I have a good discernment in that way and I feel like we would be so

good at being able to understand what's what what what what partner needs and if we like ever had a divorce whatever the case me if that got forbid but like I wouldn't yeah I would know like okay this person's not going to and I would never low ball or cheap like anything from her like if Hey, we were together, we had, we accumulated this X, X amount of money. I would, whatever it is, like, I pay my tax. I don't try to find loopholes. Whatever I have on taxes, I will pay. See, the things like that, Jason's like, no, you got to look for the polls.

I just like, I'm just like, I'm not trying to cheat anybody out here. And I always think of the betterment of it. It's like, okay, my taxes are going towards someone that really needs it. Like, people were like, oh, I hate food stamps. Well, I needed food stamps when I was a kid. And if I didn't have that, like, I wouldn't be here. No, I wouldn't know what I mean? So it's like, that's how I look at taxes.

I'm like, okay, I made X amount of money. I made a lot of money. Yeah. All right, let me give this back to who needs it. If it goes to the right place. And I wish we could be, I wish we'd be able to fucking choose where it goes. Like, oh, you made this month. This is where it's right to pay.

Pay here, here. I would love to. To a certain extent, that's where that's where our right to vote comes in. Yeah, but I mean. But I agree with you. You feel like it's like how much of an impact is that. Yeah. That's why, I mean, for many reasons why it's so important because you're right.

Right? Like, I love that take. from you. I absolutely loved it. Wow, a lot of action here. One of the last things I got is we're wrapping up here is just, you've talked about moving in together, aside from like, what's the plan? That's annoying. Do you feel that

bachelor nation couple pressure? It's like every single second. It's like giving me the answer. And you're not giving me the answer, so you guys must have broke up or you hate each other. We just had the longest conversation this week. It was really needed and I think... It was beautiful. It was so beautiful.

And the thing is, it's like, it's scary as fuck. you know I think Bachelor Nation and people see people from Bachelor and you think it's like really easy to propose to somebody and I think like oh like it just happens

like went in there and I'm like I've never been here before you know what I mean so I've always thought like oh I could propose this person until you're like fuck I could propose this person

it is a whole deeper meaning when you think about it so everyone's like when are you getting married when are you getting married and I'm like oh my God oh my God oh my God I'm thinking about like

this whole life that I have to to like even like financially like where we're gonna live and like you finally come to to terms that this is there is this is there's no expiration date on this relationship and like all your other relationships you always felt like there's an expiration date like i'm not ready to get married blah blah blah like now it's like fuck you know what i mean there's nothing like it's this and it's a it's a frightening feeling because you've never been there before and everything that i thought i knew about relationships i don't and i'm so far away from like i didn't know if i was ready for

moving in, like as soon as moving in is right through on your door, you're like, oh, shit, we're moving in, you know what I mean? You start to really compartmentalize all that stuff, and it hits you and you're just like, these people all, they just think that this shit is just like easy because we're on a dating show and we show our life, I share our life, and we love spending time with each other, but it's, we have to decide on all, our both of our wants. It's not like a, we're two both individuals that are very independent. Very independent.

And we, and I like want to make sure that she's getting everything that she wants out of life. She wants to do her acting career. She's going to stay in her life because that's what I want her to do. I don't want to move her to Chicago for me. You know what I mean? And because, and that was the biggest thing. She's like, I'm not going to uproot my life just because you want to be in Chicago. And I'm like, love that.

Yeah. I am not going to force you. Well, he said the same thing. He said, I'm not going to. No, unless you take off in whatever your endeavors were, oh, my God. If this is your thing and boom, it's booming, I'm in L.A. whatever you need. If you're like, oh, it's booming in New York,

oh, I'm there for you. Whoa, whoa, whoa. I think the takeaway also for me is more like, I don't see an expiration date for the first time in a relationship. So I love taking my time because I'm like, no, we will get probably, we will get engaged at one. So I'm like, we can do our own little thing that we need to. We don't need to rush everything and make it a thing because I know it's going to happen.

So for me, you know what I mean? Yeah, it's a comfort feeling, but at the same time, it's also pressure. Because on top, because we're taking longer than what I think people would. I was going to say, the pressure is, is it time? It's time. It's, yeah, yeah, yeah, you see. I'm like, we have good. No, I will say, I see the comments and I love it because it means that they love us and it's, they see the potential in us because it's everyone's like, get married already.

And I'm like, we will do it, but give us, you know, we're, in my head, I'm still young. I'm like, COVID years, I lost three years, so I'm still 25. Yeah. And I think, I think 1,000 percent, it's because we should do it. We should do it. Independent people. I think that, like. Also that.

Yeah. I've never been someone who's going to. move for somebody. We're very free when it comes to that situation. We're both similar, which helps because then we understand each other because it's not like a resentment, like a, oh, you don't want to be here? It's like, oh, I totally understand. Me too.

I'm the same way. So it works perfectly. But then we see all the other bachelor people, you. I know. I'm like, getting married or getting proposed. TC? I'm like, oh my God.

Like, fuck. I'm like, shit. Okay, we got to be, we're going to be like. For my grandma. Was it, when did she say? Oh, well, like two years ago. And just, again, small town, right? She goes, well, you'll never have kids.

So I was like, what do you meet? Because in her head, I'm like, I'm too old now. I was 26 or 27. Yeah. And then on the flip side, like, we're sending each other rings. You know? So it's like, oh, there's no pressure. Like, look at this one here.

Blah, blah, blah. And putting both those together. And like I said, patience is our key, is like our key word. Yeah. Is, you know, we're not in a rush to do this or that. If they're spending the rest of our lives together, we're no rush. And then we also talk about, like, wedding side. Like what we want for a wedding?

She wants to elope. And like I have like this huge family friend thing that I want to like be able to be able to. Exactly. Because he has a big family thing and versus me. I'm like, ooh, that's going to be hard conversations. And I don't want his side to be like this and then me. You know what I mean? And I also don't want that to happen to her.

So it's like we're just trying to figure out what's the best thing for us moving forward with like how we want to navigate. And it's always a decision. It's always like coming together. Exactly. It's not like we're just having a relationship. and we're not talking about those things. Yeah, we don't just say yes for the sake of saying yes. Yeah.

I mean, my take is like, people are going to listen to that, and some people are going to be like, yes. They're going to be like, hell yeah, they're going to clap, they're going to cheer, they're going to stand by your side. People are going to be like, they're not making it. Exactly. But that's like we understand each other and like that's what we love. And that's exactly. There's people. It's fraud.

It's fucked. What age do you not listen to the noise? Yeah. Does it come with maturity? I think it's just like when the only timeline that matters for how long you're about it or what you do and how you do it is what you're feeling and when you're feeling it and the way you're feeling it and none of that pressure means a damn thing. And if somebody's gone through highs, lows, lefts and rights relationships,

the thing is, is like you're going to know. Like when it's time to move in, you're going to be able to be like, it's time. It's time. And then when that wedding comes and there's different wedding sizes and parties, you'll be as one and you'll figure it out. 1,000% at the time that makes sense for you and no one else. And whatever everyone else says, like, fuck them.

True. Like that's like, that's literally the only way. Because it's going to happen the way it should. And even like, yeah, there's a couple of us getting engaged. That's because I think, you know, it's just for us at that time, it makes sense. Yeah. And for no one else. 1,000%.

And like we're very open about talking about this. Yeah. This isn't like a secret for us. I don't know why. It's not a frightening thing to talk about. Well, the thing I think of something that's happening. big time right now. And it's really important that you guys talk about this is people are taking their careers very seriously. They're getting married later. They're living independent lives.

They're traveling out of the country earlier. They're doing all these things that our next generation, my parents are a great friend. They didn't do that. Yeah. So what happens then is you start to build this I need to survive as a single like independent person. You get your heartbroken. You get survived. You get You get wealth, you got to survive. You lose your money. So then you build this shell of like, I got to protect the house. Exactly. And then you get to your 30s and you're like, wait a second.

I got to share that house. And like how we both brought up, like, that's just like, that's literally it. Our upbringing is the reason why we're so like, okay, we're getting there. This is crazy, but I've never seen it firsthand. Yeah. Like I don't think anyone in my family was like married for like that I seen around. You know what I mean? It was just not a thing.

It was just a bunch of single moms around. For sure. So, you know, I'm just like, all right, well, who's the guy that steps up? Who's the dad in these situations? You know, like, a role model to look at. All I had was, like, coaches and their families and friends and their families. So, that's what I would look at. So I never, like, in my family, my immediate family, like, seen that, you know?

Learning things as we're speaking. Yeah. I know you're so right. Yeah. I feel that makes sense or upbringing. We never had that. Oh, my gosh. So we're just, like, too terrified people trying to do the right thing.

trying to do the right thing while protecting your entire self which has gotten you this far which has been pretty damn good okay let's wrap this up that's good that's good one trading secret

yeah right it's good it's like trading secrets it's therapy over here one trading secret from each you it could be on financial advice it could be on relationship advice it could be on career advice

anything that someone can't get from a professor or textbook they can only learn from you Andrew you've done this before yeah so you gotta give us a different one but a trading secret from Andrew Spencer's, we'll start with you. My biggest trading secret is empathy.

Always live with it. Always have it. Always look at someone else and try to live with walking their shoes. And I have that perspective in most things that you do. I think that's like the biggest thing how I walk and live. As I try to like put myself in other people's shoes, I'm like, how are they doing? Am I doing okay? Like, you know what I mean?

Just try to put things in perspective, I think. Empathy's been my biggest superpower, I think, in my life. I love it. I think it's a great training secret. I was shaking. I was like you were so long-winded. I could have taken that time. No, that was no, in a good way, because I could have thought of something and blank. I think to treat everybody with respect and when you meet people, because you never know what, you know, someone's going through because even. In other words, no, just because it's funny because people meet me and I'm very bubbly.

And then once I, you know, told my story, it's like, oh my gosh, I wasn't expecting that, right? So I think you just never know what everyone, like someone's going through. So I think to treat everybody with, that sounds like an elementary thing. Treat everybody with respect. It's like, we know that, Alex. It was my high school model. But it's like, I don't know. Respect, press pride equals courtesy.

Or even with this job, honestly, even with this job sometimes, like, I was so nervous because you would meet people and I don't know if it gets to their head or it's just they're very, you know, sand offish. And I'm not like that. I meet everybody and I'm like a little puppy. I'm like, hi. And once you're not greeted with that, you're like, oh my gosh. So I think it can go a long way when you're, you know, a friendly person and you show your best self. And. Trade everyone will respect.

Yeah. And you're quirky. Like I think like you said on the show, people were perceiving your or something. But like, you're like, I'm corky. It's who I am. Quarky. No, and own it. No.

And that's my biggest superpower. That's your beauty. It's like your beauty is like, that's who I am. And like that's why people have connected with you. See, that's going to be my truth. Scratch everything I just said. So my trading secret, honestly, because I say that to everybody, be like, not scared to be your authentic self because I think it got me to where I am.

I got opportunities or met people because I was like the quirky weird girl. And I was like, you like that? Oh my gosh. You're so cool. What do you mean? Right? And been not who I am, I don't think I would have had those meetings or opportunities and met the guy that, you know, fell with my quirkiness. There you go.

And she's not like falling over every second. Like, you lock in. Yeah, yeah. I can lock in. Yeah. Like, I've seen you as a teacher. Like, I've walked in your classroom. Yeah.

I can. Yeah. I sometimes feed into it a little bit. Yeah, you do. I love to, again, being character. I'm like, oh, you want me to be quirky? I'll be quirky. I'll turn it out.

What side do you want? What's the one? I'm multifaceted. I love it. Well, good stuff. Well, guys, thank you for coming on training secrets. Thank you for talking about this. I do think you'll empower a lot of people that are dealing with similar struggles

that are afraid to talk about those things. Yeah, the pressure, the bullshit, the timeline. It's all good stuff. Where can everyone find everything you guys have going on? You can find me on Myspace and... Tumblr and Twitter. Only fans and her spouse. You want to know something funny.

So we went to Albania this summer and we're on a boat and I'm with my friends. And I don't like saying that I do content. The people in the boat, you're like, what do you do? and I go, well, I do content. That was it. And my friend was like, Alex, you know, like saying, like, you do content? That kind of gives the impression that you do OnlyFans. So then me being quiet.

I'm nice to you. How you doing? Yeah. So then 10 minutes later, I'm like, oh, my, there's nothing wrong with doing OnlyFans. But I was like, by the way, no, no, no. I do. For the record. For the record.

PG comedy. PG comedy. I love it. But I'm on Instagram, Twitter, TikTok, all at Andrew Z. Z. Spencer. And TikTok and Instagram, Alex, period. Go die. Go die. Go die.

Go die. Yeah, that's how you say it. Go die. Well, thank you guys for being on this episode, Trichikers. Thank you for fun. It's fun. Yeah.