Trading Secrets - 64: From one intern to nearly $2 billion in sales! Selling Sunset’s Jason Oppenheim on real estate, reality tv, and the power of being direct

Episode Date: August 8, 2022

This week, Jason is joined by attorney turned real estate broker turned reality television superstar, Jason Oppenheim! Before starring in the iconic Netflix reality tv show Selling Sunset, Jason attended UC Berkeley where he got his JD and practiced law. Jason went on to work in real estate and started the Oppenheim group with his twin brother Brett in 2014 in a two bedroom house with one intern. The Oppenheim group has gone on to generate almost $2 billion in sales and shows no signs of slowing down. Jason gives his insights on where he believes the real estate market could be heading within the next couple of years, how having a direct, honest approach is his niche, and not settling just to get a listing. Jason also shares why you should go with the big brokerages, avoid buying investment properties in tertiary areas, and why you should be hesitant of any agents that are willing to negotiate their rates. What should a buyer be asking when looking for a real estate agent?  What hesitations did Jason have with doing a reality television show? Jason reveals all of that and so much more in another episode you can’t afford to miss!   Be sure to follow the Trading Secrets Podcast on Instagram & join the Facebook group.   Check out The Restart Roadmap: Rewire and Reset Your Career now!   Sponsors: Shopify.com/secrets for a free 14-day trial   Host: Jason Tartick Voice of Viewer: David Arduin Executive Producer: Evan Sahr   Produced by Dear Media.

The following podcast is a Dear Media production. Welcome back to another episode of Trading Secrets. Today I'm joined by attorney turned real estate broker, turned reality television superstar Jason Oppenheim. Many of you may know Jason for his role on Netflix hit reality show, selling sunset. The show chronicles Jason's real estate brokerage, the Oppenheim group, in Los Angeles, California, which he co-founded alongside his twin brother, Brett Oppenheim. The show just recently debuted, but it's in its fifth season and the ratings continue to climb. Most recently, the show was the winner for the best reality TV show, an MTV movie and TV awards for

2022. However, like many of our successful guests, Jason's rise to the success didn't come from just one venture, and it wasn't always easy. Jason attended UC Berkeley, where he studied political science and legal studies, graduating in 2000. He then went on to earn his JD from UC Berkeley before practicing law in Los Angeles for five years. He started off the corporate world, working for Coldwell Banker, and quickly established himself as one of the nation's top realtors after three years within the company, he finally decided to go on his own and be his own boss, which we'll get into.

The Oppenheim Group since has generated almost $2 billion in sales when they started operations in 2014. And we're going to get into that episode. And also, this is going to be a little bit of a different introduction because we're not going to ring in the bell yet. The curious Canadian called me and said,

listen, I checked out the entirety of that Zoom. I heard when you pressed record. I got to hear behind the scene. and the viewers need to know what happened before they listen to the full interview. So for the first time ever, the curious Canadians requested to come onto the intro before the episode airs, before we ring in the bell.

So David Ardrin, what do you got, but? Well, I'm loving the intro seat here. It feels a little different than the recap seat, but as the voice of the viewer, I have to paint the picture for the people and the listeners at home of what you went through for this interview. So if you're listening to this,

The interview is great. You're really going to enjoy it. But boy, oh boy, did I think we were headed for an absolute dumpster fire. So Jason gets on. So when I listen to the recap, I get the interview and then they always start recording right before. And Jason, you know, he basically says, I'm going to do a quick little intro. And then here's a premise, trading secrets, blah, blah, blah.

It does his like 30 second elevator of what to expect. And then he goes, he always makes sure. He goes, okay, I'm thinking, you know, 45 minutes for this. He, Jason Oppenheim stops what he's doing. He goes, there's absolutely nowhere. there's just no way and drops his he goes give me one sec drops his mic and walks out of the screen and you were left stunned just kind of looking around the room like what the heck is going on here do you think do we have the clip can we play the clip for the for the viewers we do have the clip that

did all happen uh so we're going to play the clip just so you guys have an idea i think the big thing to know though is that when i said did when he told me that what happens is an interviewer you're already like a little nervous, right? That's just your, you're just nerves are going. Plus, it's Jason Oppenheim, who's kind of a big deal. And then you prep like crazy for 45 minutes. And so he tells you you have 10 minutes and you instantly have to cut everything in half, which is like a complete scramble. So I think it gives good premise to the interview. Let's cut to the clip that David's talking about. How long is it about? We can, I would say like 45 minutes if that works. There's no way. Okay. How much you guys?

I don't know who, uh, no, hold on one second. Let me see about my, can you hold on? Sure, sure. Okay. Hey guys. Sorry, my back. But yeah, we got to expedite. My cousins are across the street. I had no idea that it was more than a 10-minute interview. Oh, understood. Okay. Okay. Got you. Do what you can. We are going to cut out a bunch, a big portion of this. The big portion is going to be actually the real estate business and we'll just get into kind of the marriage of luxury. real estate, unscripted television. Give me, so let me ask, how long can you give me, just so I can time it appropriately? 20 to 30, I guess.

Okay. All right, there it is, David. That's the clip. That's what you're referring to. If you could see the video on that, you could cut the tension in the room with a spoon, let alone a knife. And when he came back and he was like,

you know, really, I got 10, you know, I got 10 minutes. And I was like, oh boy. And you had to go like, you know, speed round 101. But I got to say, the recording was 31 minutes. So something went really well. You pivoted really well. It was a masterful display in interviewing one-on-one because, you know, I think I've only seen you that nervous in your body language in an interview once before. And that was the start of the A-Rod episode. So props to Jason Oppenheim, props to Jason Tardick for absolutely battling his way through that. The pivot. We'll talk more about the pivot in the recap. We're going to

bring on Jason Hoppenheim. And I also want to say, once he did come back, he was great. I think that you'll listen to this podcast. He was entertaining, educational, insightful. He was fantastic. If you're interested in real estate, it's a must listen. So he was great. I'm going to just put it on. Let's say, we'll put it on his admin. His admin didn't prep them properly to say, hey, it's a good podcast. You'll enjoy it. And we did get a couple. That was a really good question. So stay tuned. David, could I ring in the bell now? Yeah, ring it in, baby. All right, we are going to ring in the opening bell to the Jason Oppenheim podcast.

So both the real estate and reality TV markets right now are mayhem. So the timing of this podcast literally is perfect. Jason, thank you so much for being with us today. We did a full intro on your background and where you went to school, attorney gone real estate broker, gone owner. And you start the Oppenheim Group in 2014 at any capacity, in any site of mind, did you ever expect that your real estate brokerage group would somehow grow into a reality TV sensation? And was that ever in the business plan anywhere when you started this group? No. No, that was not. Well, I didn't even have a business plan. But if I did, that would not have

been in it. No, that was just lock or, you know, honestly, it was specifically not in the business plan, meaning we didn't want to do a reality show, even when we had been approached many times because we thought it was too risky and, you know, and we were already doing so well. So initially we thought it would be, you know, more risk than reward. Obviously, in retrospect, I'm really happy. Of course. One thing I want to ask you before we get too much in the selling sunset side and how that correlates to Oppenai Group financial success is I read that when you started the group,

you started out in a spare bedroom with one intern. How much financial stress were you undertaking when you started the Oppenheim Group and what led to the growth that you guys have had today? So I started in real estate in about 2010, and it took me about three or four years just to build a business where I was becoming successful and more successful than I was as an attorney. The first couple of years were very, very little money.

Third year was okay. Fourth year was pretty good, and that's when I left to start my own company. I had assumed that my revenue would go down significantly when I started my own company. I was going to be no longer associated with Coldwell Banker. And I just thought that, you know, being on my own and, you know, starting the Oppenheim group, which nobody had ever heard of, and not having an office and, you know, the support and whatever it is that these brokerages convince you that is so important, that is actually not important.

But, you know, when you're there and you get inculcated and you're told, like, how important it is to be the big brokerage, you know, you believe it. So, yeah, I was prepared to make a lot less money that year in 2014. And it ended up, and yeah, I started in a second, it was an office, it was a second bedroom and it was a two-bedroom house and it was the second bedroom. And it was just me and an intern. And we had a great year, you know, we did really well out of that house so well that the next year I said, I want to get an office across the street.

Literally, it's a, my house is across the street from this office or the house I was living at. And, you know, then I'm like, I'm going to build out an office. I'm going to hire some friends. And it just kind of organically grew. I never had like a plan. In fact, I'm not really someone who believes in goals and business plans. I just, every day I just work as hard as I can and make the decisions that I think are best for me. And then it just kind of moves in the right direction. But I don't really sit around thinking like, I'm going to, this is what I expect in year three. This is what I expect in year four. I mean, I don't know how that really, helps you know yeah i mean it's it's clearly worked out like whatever that is like the intuition and the

vision you have is aside from just like following a blueprint plan clearly has worked i think one thing you give a lot of people intel to that your average individual wouldn't be able to see is the big difference in compensation from going big corporate like a cold well to actually owning your own shop and a lot of people are inspired by your show that have become real estate agents so tell us a little bit about compensation, how drastically is it different from working for the big dog? How much are they taken off the top versus how much are you then profiting when it's your own shop, your own brand, your own boutique? That's such a good question because right now, I would say it's probably better to be at a large brokerage if you're an agent that's doing okay because you can negotiate some really

good splits at some of the top brokerages. Probably, you know, if you're making a couple hundred thousand you probably get an 80-20 split back you know in 10 15 years ago it was probably a 60-40 split so these it's kind of been a race to the bottom this is why brokerages are going bankrupt and why they've all lost you know half their market cap in the last year or two i mean you're seeing compass and douglas element you know headed towards well i don't maybe bankruptcy if we go into a recession or or things slow down but so yeah and then you don't have all the hassle of office space, branding, marketing, design, insurance, Arizona emissions, you know, it's a heck of a lot easier. If you're not like a cold-blooded entrepreneur that really wants to work for him or herself,

I would recommend just taking the easy route. I don't think you make more money. Yeah, you may save 20%, but your overhead and a time demand, I think largely vastly exceeds the money that you would make. There you go. If you want to grow a broker. And so I want to interrupt, But just to say, first of all, I would not grow a brokerage. I would not open up a brokerage right now. The brokerage model is dead. So for that reason, I would also work at a larger brokerage, to be quite honest, right now. I mean, guys, you're hearing it directly from Jason Oppenheim.

Go with the big brokers, especially in 2022. There's a lot more, there's a little less glam than what you might see on television. And that's what I want to actually ask you about, Jason. One of the things you said is that you actually had a lot of hesitation. to doing selling Sunset because of the risk that inherently come with unscripted television. Looking back at where you guys are today, did any of those risks come to fruition that you, obviously there's been a ton of success? And I went over that in the intro. But do you look at any of those risks that you were worried about that have come to fruition and are still an impediment for what

you're doing on a day-to-day basis? No, I really haven't seen the risks come to fruition. You know, it's really been just a lot of upside. There are, are the risks that I had thought about our reputation and you know and that no I mean have there been you know is it demanding professionally and emotionally to be you know filming a show and and being the broker to so many people on a show yes you know that has been very demanding on me and while I wouldn't call that a risk it's certainly a side effect of doing a show but no I mean, all the risks that I had initially thought of just did not end up being a concern. That's awesome.

And when you guys actually did the Netflix deal and you start the process of filming, did you know that there was a high propensity it could get picked up? Was it guaranteed that it would be picked up? What did the outlook look like when you underwent that entire filming process? Well, they initially just picked up a pilot. so you film a 20 minute pilot that would never go to air and that's just for them to look

watch and to decide if they want to pick up a full season and they did watch it and they picked up a full season. So then we knew we had at least one eight episode season. But you don't know every season you film you don't know if you're going to be, well that's not true because we generally film like two seasons in a row but

you know they just pick up a year at a time essentially. So you're never committed beyond that. Well I guess we're committed because we signed longer-term contact. But, I mean, Netflix and probably any other streaming service, they can decide at any moment that they don't want to continue filming. And I think, you know, they have to watch the success of the show every season.

And they have all these metrics and they watch it for a month and they see what happens. And then they make a decision. Five seasons later, you guys are seeing the ratings. They're skyrocketing by the minute from at least everything we can read and we get a hold of. When you look at compensation from the show, right? We had Rob Deereck come on, talking about how he was able to negotiate with Netflix and that he was getting 125K per episode and then was able to integrate, he was able to negotiate integration brand rights. So he was making a couple million off an episode.

What is, I apologize. What show is he on? Who is he? Okay. So Rob Deirdek, he was a famous skateboarder, world-renowned skateboarder. Then he started and was founded in D.C. shoes. And then he had a show Robin Big on MTV. And then there's the show ridiculousness on MTV. If pretty much you go to MTV, it's the only show that's out there, Rob Deirdek, he's the host of that show. So he was able to negotiate those rights through the MTV. I think MTV has lost so much money from Rob Deerdeck that he's the only guy that they're showing and playing on a 24-hour period. But that being said, what I want to correlate is like the actual business of the show versus the business of the Oppenheim group.

You guys have done almost $2 billion in sales. Do you look at the profitability from the show and your business? And are they somewhat weighted at this point? Or is the business still out significantly performing like any type of monetization from the television show? The business is significantly outperforming any monetization from the show. For me, I would argue that many of the women have been able to monetize their social media and, you know, do books and shoe lines and clothing lines. And so I think for many other people, the answer might be different, but because I'm not in any of those avenues of monetization, I'm just a real estate agent. Yeah, I mean, not even close. The business has and continues to be the large and significant source of revenue and

income for me. That's fascinating. And so with the business model, I was just recently approached for a show that's going on Amazon to do a real estate deal or buy it, flip it, it was going to be an Airbnb and it was for the purpose of filming. And so when I approached the guy who approached me on it, I was like, why are you bringing this deal to me? It's like, well, because we need to plan this episode. I'm like, if this episode wasn't in existence, would you bring the deal to me? And he said, probably not. And then it got me thinking about shows that have businesses in which it's also creating entertainment. And from your perspective, how much has that changed the way that you guys have had to manage the business? So you talked about some of the girls, obviously aren't making what you

make as an agent. Do you, did you guys have to change a lot of the business core model and how you hire and who you bring on as agents and things like that to make sure that you're like fitting the mold of what the entertainment world would want? No. I mean, the nice thing is that really the business just kind of moves on its own and they follow us. They've never, ever asked me to change my business model in any regard, nor would I. I mean, it's kind of sacrosanct, you know, and I think they know that. So I just run my business. I've had most of the women on the show have been here and or are people that I wanted to bring on show or no show. And again, most of them were here before the show. So no, I mean, I would, the nice thing is that, no, my business is my business and

I run it. And I've never had anyone ask me to change it. Love it. All right. We're going to do just a quick couple rapid fires. Then we're going to get five, 10 minutes on Jason's outlook in the real estate industry. A couple little rapid fires here. Anyone that's on your team or a part of your team, who is one agent that you would not want to go up against in a deal if you were battling with that person? My brother, because we would argue, we're both very stubborn. I mean, I've tried that before. Okay, there you go. Your brother. All right, it can't be your brother. One real estate agent that you know that you sit them down at a lunch or you put them at a happy hour or you put them at a presentation when it comes to relationship development that they will hit a grand slam.

Oh, you mean with a client? Yes. I couldn't just pick one because the women are exceptional with clients. And I would argue that most of the women are better than me with clients. So I would, I think that's why we work well. Sometimes I'm very abrupt and terse, maybe a little to the point. maybe it's very direct almost to a point where if you don't know me you might think i'm being like a little bit of a dick so i think they're better than me i like to bring someone else on

with me so i don't rub somebody the wrong way i'll go into a house and rip it apart and tell them you know yeah i can rub people the wrong way because i'm just a little too direct so i probably would put anyone as better than me in front of a client anyone but myself All right, then I got to ask you this. Unless it's an existing client, and they know me, and they love that I'm honest and direct. But sometimes a new client can be a little bit like, whoa. Yeah. I think direct is definitely a quality of yours, but obviously it's turned out to be extremely

successful as you're one of the biggest and best brokers in the world. In the world, the luxury real estate, when you're dealing with a clientele that has such outrageous expectations. And a lot of those expectations from what I understand is kind of the red carpet treatment. how have you been able to differentiate yourself in a space that you are so direct? Is it the knowledge? Is it the analytics? Is it the deal making? Like, what makes Jason so special? Well, I don't want to sound. I mean, I appreciate that compliment. I think that my niche, if I have one, is that I'm, is the direct, honest approach. I think that so many of these wealthy buyers and sellers, particularly sellers, are often told what they want to hear or have, you know, sycophantic relationships in business. And I think there are a lot of yes people out there. And a lot of real estate agents, what they think they need to do to get a listing is to tell the client what they want to hear. The client thinks their property is worth $10 million.

And it's the best property in the world. You know, and they did the, it's their furniture. A lot of agents will go in and be like, oh, my God, I love the furniture. I love what you did here. I love what you did here. Like all, everything's all jolly and happy. And the house is worth $10 million. But none of that is true. What I think the seller really needs to hear is that he's emotionally attached to his house. It's a nice house. But there are other houses much better on the market at $10 million. His house is worth $8.5 million.

The furniture should be all removed and it should be staged. And he needs to paint the walls white. And he needs to do some new landscaping and do some new lighting. and he has not kept the house up well and he needs to not have his dog in the house during showings and he needs to not live there during showings and a lot of

and I think if it's a person that really is a good business person I think they're going to understand that that's it's in their interest to hear those negatives and to hear that honesty and then to come out on the market at the right price and to come on it presenting at its best

and not to do reductions and not to show the property, you know, with their own furniture and all the other shit that makes a house look bad. I mean, presentation matters so much more than people understand. So yeah, my niche is just to be super direct, super honest, and forceful, because even if a client disagrees with me, I will present them with evidence. I'll show that I'll take them to other houses. And oftentimes, clients don't go with me, to be honest. They'll go with another agent, the agent that told them what they wanted to hear. More often than not six months later when that listing contract aspires, they call me and I sell the house. So, you know, it's up to them. I'm not going to tell a client what they want to hear just to get a

listing. I love the perspective there. I also think a lot of these people have a lot of order takers in their life. They also have a lot of delegation that they do on a day-to-day basis. And they're probably caught off a little off guard when they have someone come in that reverse the rolls and says, I'm the expert here. If you want the best bang for your buck, if you want to get the best deal, you'll work with me and this is how it's going to be done. And to your point, I'm sure people at that level also respect that that niche in that that probably directive. So it's obviously worked out for you. I think that's awesome. While we have you, Jason, I do have to get some perspective on just the market in general, right? You got more than 9 million home buyers right now that have been priced

out of the market. And I know that's not the world that you operate in. But in general, there's a lot of question marks on what's next for real estate? Is there a bubble? What will the hikes be like? What does affordability look like? What's Jason Oppenheim's overall take on what the next year or two could look like in the United States real estate market. Well-phrased question, normally I'm a little bit more confident in my responses to where the market's headed this. We're in kind of a tumultuous time. I think there are some headwinds. And I think there's some kind of complicated things out in the macroeconomic world that I don't have my head around and I'm not quite certain up. For example, I don't know if the Russian-Ukraine war is going to get worse or better.

I don't know if oil is going to go down to $80 a barrel or $175 a barrel. I don't know if interest rates are going to go to 5% or 7%. But, I mean, if I had to just kind of surmise based on the existing evidence, I would say we're probably going to see a cooling in the markets in the $3 million in under range. I think we're probably a minor cooling. You know, I don't think we're going to see any crash or any, you know, a macro adjustment. We're just going to see a leveling off and a cooling. for a couple of years.

I think in the luxury market, like, you know, the 5, 10, 20, I think we're going to see pretty continual stability, honestly, because I don't think those are interest rates focused so much. I'm rather optimistic about the luxury market. And then geographically speaking, I think there's going to be a pullback to large cities. So I do think you're going to see,

like I think L.A. will generally do well. New York, I think, as well. I think the biggest concern are twofold. Geographically, secondary and tertiary markets, so Las Vegas, maybe, Miami, markets that have done really well, Aspen, Montecito, sorry, those markets, I think, you could see a 20, 25% drop. And then also, I think, Airbnbs. I think we've seen a ton of people like on vacation, taking Airbnbs. And I think these Airbnb rentals are going to drop significantly.

So the worst thing you could do is go to like Big Bear or, you know, Coachella Valley or whatever, which is already a market that's going to soften and then go buy like some Airbnb rental there, where you could face Airbnb restrictions. You could face a mountain of people needing, if we're going to recession, they're all going to be wanting to sell those homes. So I'd be very careful about buying an investment property in these tertiary eras. Really good advice, really good outlook. So less than five minutes here with Jason.

So one thing I've got to ask you, a trading secret for a buyer. Someone is looking to work with a buyer. Someone's looking to work with an agent who is a buyer. What's one thing they should know about the agent or a question they should ask the agent as a buyer in today's market? You've got to make sure the agent knows the area. So I would really ask the agent, like how many sales have you done in the area in the last year or two in your price point that you're looking at? Because real estate is a very nuanced profession. It's just like law.

I'm not going to hire a great lawyer to do your employment litigation. You're going to hire an employment lawyer that knows what they're doing. You're not going to hire an environmental lawyer to handle your divorce. So same thing in real estate. You got to, don't just hire the best. Hire the best in your price point, in your geographic area. What's your take on making sure that whoever you're hiring as an agent to buy a house, you're also hiring to sell your house and working and negotiating a discounted,

agent fee. Oh, if you are going to, usually you need to sell a house and then before you buy a house so that he's going to do both. I mean, I don't negotiate my fees. I'm selling a house and buying a house for someone right now, but agents do. I would be careful of agents that negotiate their fees, to be honest. I've never met a great lawyer that negotiates their fees. And I arguably don't think there are great agents that negotiate their fees. I mean, around the edges, whatever, sure. been a lot of business with them. But usually professionals that are really good at what they do, they know their worth and they don't negotiate their fees. If they don't know their worth and they don't believe in themselves and they don't think that their services are valuable enough,

they'll negotiate. And I think that's just a red flag. Interesting. So I know you said little cuts here and there for people that have earned that business, but in general, Jason Oppenheim does not negotiate his fees. Correct. And more so I charge more than everybody else. I ask for, I ask, well, demand really, 5.5% on listings, whereas most of my competition asks for 5%. And then there are a lot of my competition that will reduce their rate to get a listing. You have such confidence in what you do and you prove it with all your numbers and statistics and your entire resume. So obviously the confidence is aligned. Was that confidence at the same rate before the show or has the show helped propel your demand and all the success

you've had. I don't think this show has changed anything. I mean, in terms of how much I charge, I've been here doing this for a while. I think it really came from being a lawyer. And then I went, you know, when I was a lawyer, you know, every, you can pretty much figure out the quality and experience of your attorney based on how much they charge. Even at my own law firm, I was at Elveney and Myers. It started at like, you know, whatever, $1,500 an hour or $2,000 an hour for the top most experienced partner. And it literally went down like $100 an hour, you know, partners that didn't do as much business, partners that weren't as experienced, then down to counsel, then down to a fifth year associate, then a fifth year associate, then a third year associate, then a paralegal. And it,

and you charged different amounts based on your knowledge experience, et cetera. And then another law firm that's not as, that doesn't draw as many top talent from Stanford and Berkeley and Harvard, they charge a little bit less. So it was, you saw that how much people charge was so tied to the quality of services they provided. And then I went to real estate and everyone's charging the same commission. It made no sense. The worst

shittiest agent is charging the same commission as the absolute best agent. That model didn't make sense to me. And as I got more experience and felt like I provided better and higher quality service, spend more money on preparation, have concierge services that

prepare their houses. It's more thorough about getting their properties sold and focusing all the detail of everything and being way more expense in how to sell a property than somebody else and how to advise a buyer, got more knowledgeable and related to taxes and 1031 exchanges and all the nuance of everything. Now I feel like I offer the best service to my buyers and sellers as much as any other agent that, you know, that's here. And why should I get paid more for that? Why should I be charging the same as the person who just got their real estate license three months ago and has never done a deal. It doesn't make any sense to me. It's so wild. I've talked to so many people in the real estate

world and no one has ever questioned that and it's such a damn good point. I love it. But Jason, we only have a couple minutes with you. So we got to wrap up with your trading secret. What's one piece of either career advice, financial advice, career acceleration, or even real estate advice you can give to someone that they couldn't find in a textbook, learn in a classroom, or find anywhere on YouTube, only from Jason Oppenheim. Leave us with what your trading secret would be. I mean, I guess this is a kind of a counterintuitive argument, but one thing that you always see on an online course or on really anything that you're looking for when you go online or read a book or whatever is the trading secret. And I would argue that the trading secret

is that there is no trading secret. And I know that might not be the right answer, but there is no secret to success and and stop looking for the secret and maybe go back to what has allowed people to achieve success for hundreds of years. I mean, if there was a secret, it would be out there by now. So the real answer is that it's just really hard work and a ton of hours, gaining experience, being ambitious and knowledgeable about what it is that you want to do, and just actually being exceptional and doing their things necessary. to be exceptional on what you do. I went out, you know, and got my contractor's license because I wanted to be able to advise people on remodels and I wanted to be able to coordinate, you know, and discuss

with inspectors and understand all the nuances of a property. I wanted to understand, I studied architecture and design. I know everything about roofing materials. I mean, whatever it is, be exceptional at what you do and you will be successful. And you're not going to achieve success unless you open up a book and you read about roofing materials. You can be on YouTube all day long, and if you're Googling the Secret to Success and not what are the best roofs for Los Angeles or how much is a solar panel roof cost?

Because that might come up in a question, you're looking up the wrong thing. I love it. I think you just broke the mold. Trading Secrets Podcast, there is no trading secret. We'll expand on that in the recap. Jason, thank you so much for your time.

It's fun to see on TV. Good to talk to you and all the best and continued success. Hey, thank you, man. All right, take care. Ding, ding, ding! We are bringing back the Curious Canadian

after the Jason Oppenheim episode. Obviously, you heard our intro. You just heard the episode. Now we got David with us to break down all his thoughts, questions, details, and insights. So, David, now that you've listened to it, start to finish, literally,

start to finish him, but part of it, what do you think? I mean, the guy's smart. He, I can see why he can out hot out of the gates with that response to your time question. Obviously, he had some family in town too, so it's not like he was just trying to be a total dick by choice. But you crushed it. What I'm curious before we get into the details of it, you know, what was your goal for pivoting? Is there any questions that you scrapped that you wanted to answer? And then, you know,

voice of the viewer style. It felt like if I could put myself in the viewer's shoes, you were at a job interview, you prepped 20 questions that they were going to ask and they came out hot out of the gates asking none of them. And you were kind of deer in headlights. So what's your advice for someone who might find themselves in that situation since not everyone can interview a famous real estate TV star and he put in that situation? I think at that point, the biggest thing you have to do is just say, all right, I already know enough about this guy. I've already prepared. We don't have to go down the exact order that I had planned. I have to allow my natural curiosities to just drive me. So after the first question, every single word he said, every single body move he made, every time I thought he was interested versus not interested, I would just let my curiosities drive based on how like engaged I felt he was. And I had 25 questions I wanted to ask. And I probably only asked about two of them. But at the end of the day, it was a good conversation that if you're looking to get into real estate, you're looking to buy, you're curious to selling sunset. You're curious how much they make more on the TV side of the real estate side. We got the answer.

So just let your natural curiosities and job interviews and dates and conversations with anything drive. And the only way you could do that is be thinking and really actively listening. When what was the biggest challenge? Like obviously there was the time challenge. But what else do you find was the biggest challenge to kind of really execute that interview the way that you wanted because we were really looking forward to the conversation? 100%.

So one of the biggest things that we're going to do with all podcasts here moving forward, almost all, is just have in-person interviews because when you're talking about something like really is intimate, is money and career, you have to like build that connection. So when I have these in-person interviews, they're there before. I could joke around. We could get to feel each other's energy. I can really build the baseline for what we're going to talk about in those conversations are so much more thorough. It's tough to come out guns ablazing when someone tells you if they have 10 minutes and you know how valuable the time is and you have to totally readjust. So the biggest challenge was that in an intimate conversation, you really have to set the

stage for whatever you're doing. This is like if you're asking for a raise, if you're having a serious conversation with your partner, like anything, setting the stage is imperative. And we didn't have the ability to do that. Well, after listening to the episode, it actually started to make so much more sense when I have a quote, I'm a little abrupt, a little terse, a little to the point, a little too direct. If you don't know me, you may think I'm being a little bit of a dick. I can, I can rug people the wrong way. I was like, uh, you think, but he's like, my direct and honest approach and not telling people what they want to hear is my niche. It's why I'm successful. And as he said, I ask, no, I demand five and a half percent for his commission fees. But there was really, I mean, when you started

getting into it and asking him really pointed questions, you know, after his a lot of time limit, and he says, you know what, Jason, that's a really well-phrased question. You got to just be like absolute fist pumping inside when that happens. I'm just like, let's go. Okay, we're on the right track, I got him engaged, now we got to build this momentum. I think the other thing, too, is he's so self-aware. Like, he knows exactly what he is. He knows how he comes off. He knows it. He understands it. He owns it. Like, you got to give him credit for that. And I also think a huge takeaway is when you talked about the fact, like, negotiate my rate, like, I'm not going to know. Good luck. Like, I know how valuable I am. I might even charge him more. And I think more

people that do any type of 1099 or freelance work, take that attitude. Like, know your worth and say, yeah, I'm not going to take a haircut for this if it doesn't make sense. I think there's something to be said. But if you're doing that, you better damn well make sure you got the quality, consistency, and delivery that Jason Oppenheim does. Absolutely. One of the best things that I loved is an example of his directness that actually made sense

instead of being like, no, this guy's just being an asshole. Is when he talked about all the things when he goes into a potential client when he like rips them apart about their house when they think they have the best out ever. He's like, your furniture sucks. You got to paint the walls by. get your dog out of here. You're emotionally attached.

Like, don't live there. There's other houses that are nicer. Like, that makes sense, though. And he's like, that's what people want to hear. And then they come back to me when their houses don't sell. So, look, you crushed it. I texted you right after. I was like, that's probably the best navigation of an interview I've seen you do.

Thank you, brother. So crushed it. First question I have, Curious Canadian definitions. This word, totally, this word went over my head. You were talking about the real estate market. and he said, you know, he was really worried about secondary and tertiary markets. Obviously, I know what the word secondary is. I have no clue what the word tertiary is.

So what is a tertiary market? Okay, I'm going to tell you, I'm curious. I'm going to do a little Q&A with you, right back to the curious Canadian. What do you think it is? I have no clue. I'm thinking like primary, secondary, tertiary. I feel like someone's spelled like the word like secondary and third market and like spelled at tertiary, I don't, inconvenience to just complete through a curveball to the common folk out

there. I don't know what it is, but I assume it's like the next level of, you know, median level, regular, you know, regular family, you know, Middle America type market home. Okay. Now, you brought something up about spelling. So I got to ask that. How do you think you spell tertiary market? How do you think I spelled it? Yeah, spell it. Spell it for me. Like we're going to play, like, we play word all every day, every day. David and I send each other our world's course. Let's play a little a little spelling game here.

A little spelling B. Cherchery in my notes. I love the way you say it, by the way. It's like, it's taking so much effort for you to say this word. Like I can see you in your lips. Like, do I Google it quick?

I've got to know. Don't Google it. I spelled it. C-H-E-R-S-H-E-R-A-I-R-Y. Churcherary. What were the first two letters? C-H. That's why you're saying it with such,

a lip-lip-a-lis tertiary so it's T-E-R-T-I-A-R-Y yeah I've never seen that word in the history of my life if that was on wordal I would have my first word of loss to be retired from the game forever ever and David said that's his rule with word if he ever loses he will never play again he has yet to do so but the other day he got six out of six all right so what it is though it's just like a smaller a smaller market right so they'll define it like think about market cap with companies There's different market caps based on size of company. Same thing with real estate. Tertiary is a market with the population of less than like a million people.

So like Rochester. Yeah. Rochester is the definition of tertiary market. Secondary market would be a market with about 1 to 5 million people. So a really good city to kind of place into a secondary market would be Dallas. It would be a Dallas, Texas. Nashville, Tennessee. Austin, Denver.

A primary market is going to be $5 million up. Those are your major, major markets, right? So we all know them, Chicago, New York City, L.A., San Francisco, et cetera. So what he was saying to the takeaway there is he was saying that those primary markets, those New York cities, those L.A.s, those San Francisco's, those will get, in his opinion, those will get the hardest during this real estate pullback, where a market you live in, tertiary market won't feel the pain as much. So if you imagine like a hammer coming down and it's making an impact on a rock,

those primary markets are going to break. Those secondary markets are going to have a little, you know, little damage. And the third dairy market might have the slightest little fracture. So third dairy, it should be called third dairy instead of tertiary. But it's good to know you just reference my house as a pebble instead of a nice boulder there. So there go. So one question I had, he talked a lot about, you know, the corporate world and working for a broker. You know, I know a lot of guys, you know, former hockey guys have been playing pro until the 30s and they need something to do.

And they join a real estate team. They go work for a big corporate company. And it seems to work out pretty well for them. So I'm just curious on your take, like, you know, if Jason Tarduk had to go work, what do you go work for a big corporate? Would you go work for a broker? And what's the really 101 difference of working for a big corporate and a broker? This is one thing he said, I completely agree with. Unless you are a cold-blooded entrepreneur, what does that mean, that you want to work for

yourself, you live, you breathe what you do 24-7, that the minutia of the behind-the-scenes work, which isn't going to drive revenue, excites you, knowing that you have to get the the insurances and the marketing and the logistics and the payroll and the benefits and all that stuff, if it really excites you to have your name on that business and that it's yours, yes. Okay, start your own brokerage. But like he said, it's not the way to go. The easiest way to slide in is let those big companies pay for the costs. Those big companies that are paying for the costs.

Apparently, he said a lot of them are going bankrupt. And he was saying the splits are very advantageous. So when he said like the 80-20 split, did you understand what he meant by that? It's actually one of my questions. Like he said, I'd rather work for a brokerage now because I can get an 80-20 split when it used to be 60-40. I'm assuming that it's like a commission split, but I don't really know. So best case scenario for you're a real estate agent. Like, suppose we hire a real estate agent, right?

So we actually just hired Derek Huff's sister, and that's one of the things, of course, she wants to do, is represent us for when we sell the home and when we buy another home. Because how we'll work in a typical transaction, if you have a home, imagine home A, you have a buyer coming in, a seller coming in. And there's usually two agents,

and on that transaction, 6% of what the house is sold for is what they'll get paid, and they'll split it 3%, 3%. Now, in a perfect scenario, the agent is representing the buyer and seller, and they'll get 6%. What he's referring to is what the percentage of the brokerage takes, right? So in a 60-40 split, they will take 40% of the actual commission that the agent gets. And the 80-20 split,

they'll only take 20%, and the real estate agent will get 80%. Now, it's interesting about these models. For real estate agents, they don't get paid a base salary for most places. They don't usually get benefits and stuff. They get paid what they kill. They get paid what they sell. So they will get 80% of the commission they received, 20% goes to house. So it could be very advantageous. You want to start selling homes. You got a place. They got branding. They got marketing. They got positioning. They have the software. They have everything. You just step in, start selling. Then boom, you'll get paid. So I do agree with him in this case that if you just want to try it, give it a shot, go work for a big broker. Go work for a big company, big corporate. And if you've

really proved yourself and you've really built an incredible book and you know the business inside out and you feel that the value you bring to them is greater than the value they bring to you, go start your own shop. But like he said, apparently many shops are going bankrupt. That was just one of those moments where I asked a question. I forgot I was actually on the podcast and I was like just looking at you, being like learning, being like, okay, this makes perfect sense. Like now I, you know, when it gets brought up, I actually am a little more educated. So love it. Great answer. You got something quick? Good stuff. What else you got? Sorry, I thought you had a question there. Oh, no, no, no. I put my hand up, but I was just

Stretch it. No question here, but. This is your time. You ask all the questions here. You say the rent word and people freak out. You know, I don't want to throw away money. I don't want to set money on fire and give someone else the money. I want to own equity. Would you rather rent for a year instead of buying a home if it meant that after that year of rent, you got the same home at the same price, but you weighted the interest rates out so they went down 1%. I mean, the answer is yes, right? Okay, good. Because here, in any question you pose, it's all going to come down to how you pose

it and what the numbers are, right? But suppose I'm buying a million dollar home and in a year from now, interest rates are 1% lower, right? So 1% lower. That's 10K a year in additional interest I'm paying. So if I have a mortgage for 15 years and it's 1% lower, it's 150K I'm saving, just in the interest rate. So it all comes down to dollars in cents. And that, that's what you have to analyze right now. And if it makes sense to wait it out for your financial profile, wait it out. I actually just talked to Ashley I this way. I was in, I was doing a, I was working with IHeart, did a commercial, did a couple podcasts. She was telling me a little bit about her home situation. She feels like she didn't make the right move. And, but one of the things I said is you

did get into that house in June. And if you got into that house today, your interest rate would be about a percent higher. Let's look at what that would be an interest over the course of your loan. And she was like, oh, never thought about it like that. Ashley and I, my Ashley, not Ashley I. The Ashley I. Ashley's blood. Yeah, Ashley's, Ashley Ardwin now. We were talking about this the other day because she listens to the podcast and she actually learns a lot of stuff too. And we were bringing up interest rates. And we got ours in September 2020 at a 2.85%. And we did the math of what the interest rates are now, which are close of six, and we have saved the entire value that we paid for our home, the initial mortgage

on our home, we would have be paying in interest over the course of 30 years if we got it now. So I totally feel that sentiment. So I'm glad for you to explain that to the Ashley I. I think we're going to end this with touching on his trading secret because that's how we end every episode. You can tell that Jason Oppenheim is really sure about himself. He said, the trading secret is no secret. and he said, stop looking for it because if it was out there, everyone would know it.

And he said the real answer is hard work. He's not into three to five year plans. He says he just puts his head down and works as hard as he can and makes decisions as they come up. Just wanted your overall take on that. And is that something that people can really take with them or just curious of what you're feeling that? Here's my takeaway from that.

My takeaway from that is like if you're looking for the trading secret, it's likely that the masses have already given a shot and you're late to doing it and good luck. like that's my takeaway right because i think what he's saying is hard work will then provide learning lessons and more information and those learning lessons and information give you the ability to continue to progress in whatever you're doing that's like my takeaway from it because i think hard work means actually getting more information reading more doing more research doing more due diligence. And the more information you have, the better you'll be able to make the right moves. It's like if you're a chess player and you know exactly what your opponent's going to do

based on the information you have, you're going to beat them. And so I think what he's saying is too many people sit back and wait for shortcuts. And the thing is that you actually have to be proactive. Go understand it. Go read. Go look at tutorials. Go get more information. Get your ass out there. Start hustling. And when you hustle, all that stuff becomes easier. And I think he's saying like there's no way to just sit back and get rich quick and my biggest takeaway when he said no three no five year plans and i agree with him on that sense is as soon as you said a three or five year plan you're immediately putting a ceiling on what you're capable of where if you really like you said immerse yourself in what you're doing and the information provided and able to just work

hard and make decisions you may supersede those three to five year plans just because you're living in the present and not worrying about what you set so now it's good to have goals it's good to have accountability and make sure things are attainable. You know trading secrets crew is all about small goals and checking things off to getting to get that snowball effect. So, you know, I just thought it was a really interesting trading secret.

One, we haven't heard before. Yeah, I agree with you. And I do think what I'll say is, I think having an idea of a three year, five year plan of like just where you want to go, fine,

great. But yes, it puts ceilings. And two, the thing is, is just like this episode, the biggest theme, like we talked about in the intro,

is being able to pivot. If you can't pivot your business model, If you can't pivot how you're working every day, if you can't pivot the way that you talk to your partner when you get in fights, if you can't pivot the way that you manage your money, you're going to fall behind. And in a world that's ever changing, if you look at July 22 versus where this world was in December 2021, it is a whole new fucking planet. Everything. You look at the value of the U.S. dollar, the recession, the interest rates, the inflation, the war, everything. the market's down over 20%. Everything's changing.

So you could have planned your 2022. And holy shit, good luck. There are too many uncontrollables you can't control. So the whole theme of this episode, my takeaway for today is master the pivot because in all forms of life, you have to pivot. Davey, got anything else? I just love seeing you in the pressure cooker.

It was fun to watch. It was nice making an appearance on the intro. It only took me like what, 67 episodes to make an intro. So who knows? Maybe I'll make a few more appearance. I like it. Maybe, guys, what we'll do is we'll start doing a little brief recap of the episode in the intro so you know what to look forward to. We'll have the Curious Canadian on. Let us know. Give us five stars in the reviews, as always, please. And please make sure to give us feedback. If you guys think it

makes sense to do kind of what we do in the recap in the intro, please let us know in the reviews. Again, give us five stars, but let us know because we are, oh, look at this. That was me going to the show notes, going to the reviews, and I accidentally hit play on our last episode with Rachel Cruz, because I want to give some shoutouts in the reviews. We have Color Guard. Thank you for the five, five stars. We have Coley Scott, who gave us five stars. We have Lizzie 718 who gave us five stars. Sarah Walts gave us five stars in a great review. We're reading all the reviews. I just read some off the top here, and we actually have someone on our team that's going through every single one. So please put them in five stars and let us know if you want the Curious Canadian

in the intro. David, last take, anything? No last takes. Just staring at a beautiful view. Curious Canadian has been in Canada. It's been a great time. And I can't wait for next week's episode. That is a beautiful thing. We hope you thought this episode was another episode of trading secrets that you could not afford to miss. We will see you next Monday. And don't forget, we got trading secrets on the streets where we're asking people what their salaries are today, what they expect them to be, what they were when they

started. That's all on. Trading Secrets, IG and Jason Tartick-Tick-Tac. Go follow. Make sure you tune in. Trading Secrets in the streets every Wednesday. And we'll be back next Monday with another podcast, an episode you can't afford to miss. dream