Trading Secrets - 86: 5 Billion views and over 30M+followers from popping pimples! Dr. Pimple Popper Sandra Lee reveals the $ecrets to the virality of pimple popping videos, the dermatology industry and the BTS of the TLC show

Episode Date: January 9, 2023

This week, Jason is joined by board certified dermatologist, founder of SLMD skincare, and social media star known for her series on TLC, Dr. Pimple Popper, Sandra Lee!    Years before getting her own TV show, Sandra earned the nickname Dr. Pimple Popper from her YouTube videos where she posted these bizarre, yet fascinating pimple popping videos that captivated audiences across the country. After realizing that people found her field of work so interesting to watch, she soon turned her medical profession into a viral sensation. Suddenly a TV show, a skincare line, new book and a combined 30+ million followers (aka the Popaholics) across all social media platforms. Dr. Lee has supplanted herself atop her profession in the media world.    Dr. Sandra Lee gives insights to the virality of pimple popping and how it all started with posting a blackhead video on instagram,the impact of a client sharing their story in a blackhead video, the wild world of YouTube when it comes to ads and her content, why she believes some of her patients come to her, and what products she recommends.Sandra also reveals how she got into dermatology, how difficult it can be to get into the speciality, how her and her husband took over her dad’s practice when he retired and took it to the next level, how she took her revenue from YouTube and invested it into her skincare line, and what she considered before agreeing to the TLC show. How much education goes into becoming a dermatologist? How does Dr. Lee find her patients? What is her number one tip when it comes to acne and blackheads? When should you pop your pimples?    Sandra reveals all that and so much more in another episode you can’t afford to miss!    Be sure to follow the Trading Secrets Podcast on Instagram & join the Facebook   Please note that this episode may contain paid endorsements and advertisements for products and services. Individuals on the show may have a direct or indirect financial interest in products or services referred to in this episode.   Sponsors: Rocketmoney.com/secrets to cancel your unwanted subscriptions Zocdoc.com/tradingsecrets to download the Zocdoc app for FREE   Host: Jason Tartick Voice of Viewer: David Arduin Executive Producer: Evan Sahr   Produced by Dear Media.

The following podcast is a dear media production. Welcome back to another episode of Trading Secrets. Today we are joined by board certified dermatologist, founder of SLMD skincare and social media superstar, known for her series on TLC, Dr. Pimple Popper ever heard of it, Dr. Sandra Lee. Years before getting her own TV show, she earned the nickname Dr. Pimple Popper from her YouTube videos where she posted these bizarre yet fascinating pimple popping videos that captivated audiences across the country. After realizing that people found her field of work so interesting to watch,

she soon turned her medical profession into a viral sensation, suddenly a TV show, skin care line, new book, and a combined 30-plus million followers, aka the papaholics, my mother's one of them, across all social media platforms. Dr. Lee has supplanted herself atop her profession in the media world. Dr. Lee, thank you so much for being here today. We are excited to have you on Trading Secrets. This is awesome to be here. Thank you for inviting me.

And a special hello to Mom Tardick, of course. I love that. So we talked a little bit about New York and stuff, families. there you said your husband's from there and you were born in queens right yes okay so my mom's got some new york in her too so she's very like when i ask her she's very direct she's funny she's hilarious so what i do is when i have a guest on that she knows it's a rule i could do all my prep i could have my documents but i got her right okay so i called her i said all right mom this you got she and then she goes wait a second because she saw i sent her the list she goes sandra lee are you

sure you got the right one you got dick dr pimple pot are you sure i go yes mom and i said all right mom give it to me. What do I need to know? Her response was, she's sweet, kind, successful lady who is smarter than shit. So that's Mama Tartan. I love her. She's amazing. And she's smart. She's the smartest, right? You probably ask her for a lot of advice. And, you know, she helps to direct you and things. She's the backbone. We'd be lost with it. She tells you like it is. She tells it how it is. She's the backbone of her family. We'd be lost without her. Okay. But here's what I want to start and talk about virality right now. It's like the hottest thing in 2022. And you have people just that have no social media following on like TikTok and stuff trying to like back into how do I get a video

viral. Everyone's talking about it. You did this way before it was a hot topic. And you did it in a way that it's very fascinating because it's pimple popping. Did you ever expect that pimple popping would become this virality? And what do you think like the psychology behind it is? Why are people so fascinated by? You know, I'm always shocked and surprised at where this is and what it's become, but, you know, it has been a lot of work as well, you know, really kind of recognizing that there's something there and taking it, trying to take it to the next level. But it was truly shocking in the beginning. You know, I've always liked to do things that were really just, like, silly, I'm into stupid

crafting and things like that. Like, I try to be like a Martha Stewart or something. And I do all these things, and my husband would get so annoyed with me because it would be like useless things instead of working and like actually making money as a dermatologist because that's a good income too certainly my own my own profession standalone has was a good you know a good stable profession that really like you know you have a nice lifestyle but i would at night i just happened to open an instagram account and thought you know people would like to see a little window into my world and i started to post a blackhead video and people were just drawn to it and it was so strange

Like, I couldn't understand what was going on, but it was also fascinating. Like, I was like, who are these people? Why are they liking this? So I would do it again and it would happen again. And it just became this thing. And he didn't even know I was doing this. I was like literally under my covers in my bed with my laptop, just posting things. And I was like, I'm going to just try to, you know, put this on YouTube and monetize it and see what happens.

Because he thought it was still wasting my time. He growl at me, like, turn the light down, go to sleep, you know? And then I think in like the first month, I made like a couple things. thousand dollars on YouTube and I was like crazy and so I said you know I I actually didn't tell him that I like waited a little bit and I think the next time I like doubled it it was well it was like 2000 and then it was like 6,000 5,000 6,000 5,000 6,000 and that was when I told him and he was like oh wow like okay like this is the thing okay it's okay like I'm not going to get so mad at you but I don't know it's just this thing that people are just drawn to it and it has it's like a

watching an accident, I guess, and you can't look away. It's shocking, but also it's really cathartic. A lot of people watch these videos to help them to sleep. Interesting. You know, it's not even just the interesting and the human factor with it because I think the television show kind of taps into that. Like, you know, wow, these people have these things and you're changing their lives.

But really came down to the pimple popping, just watching this release, people felt like, you know, that it was just something like, oh, I feel good now. Like, I could just, it makes me have. it makes me fall asleep really well and just they have bedtime list and that's why what's so interesting about the youtube channel is that i think i have like about seven million or something subs or you know for the last six years we've been doing it but we have over five billion views which is which is crazy because it's people that watch the same videos over and over again you know

when you go on youtube and you watch like an interesting video somebody that you follow you don't really watch it again or you're trying to learn how to change attire or something like that you like look it up, but people watch the same videos. They favorite them and they watch them over and over again because they love them. They give them so much satisfaction, which is really interesting. Yeah, I feel like that ratio of subs to views is like extremely, it's unlike anything in the YouTube space. So I want to talk, we're going to talk about social media. I want to talk about the monetization of that. Before I do, was there one, so you talked about how you got started, you made a couple bucks, you know, like people are interested in this for a lot of things,

like stress relief, maybe the anticipation, there's all these moving factors. Was there one moment you remember where there was, it was a video that just started going nuts, like millions of views. Like there's this one moment that started to change everything. Yeah. I mean, I think there, well, I can't remember the distinct, the exact video, but there's a couple of them really early on. And it's all about these videos where you don't actually know who the person is, but you just see the blackheads and you kind of hear the conversation. Like, people didn't even recognize me. They would recognize my voice.

In the beginning, they wouldn't even know what I look like. And they just, it's all about the blackheads. It's like that they're unpredictable. You don't know what's going to happen when one pops. And then it's combined with these lovely people. You're just hearing a little bit about their lives. Like there's one guy, pops, and we called him pops. You know, that wasn't his real name.

And he was telling us about how his mother, I'm sorry, not his mother. His wife passed away and he had to move into. like assisted living and he was really depressed and sad about that and people like fell in love with him so they were watching these amazing blackhead videos and that was placed next to like hearing his story and they actually it actually prompted me to start a go fund me page from and I think we raised I don't even remember how much it is anymore it was like 20,000 dollars or something like that and when we gave it to him he was shot because he he knew was on video but he didn't know nobody knows who he is anyway that that was like a crazy part like that was like wow like this is

something that it draws people to actually donate to somebody that's completely they don't know who this person is and just because of blackheads and his story like I don't know it's just mind-blowing it's a wild like dichotomy of thinking that blackheads and pimples are this magnetic force that are doing all these things helping people sleep helping them with distress entertaining them and then making an impact and like to a community and where people need it and telling stories I mean, anything's possible out there. And so I want to get into, because guys, you, the Money Mafia, that's what we call our listeners, your papaholics are my Money Mafia.

So I want you guys to know, we're going to get into the TLC show, we're going to get into social media. Before I do, I really want to get into the whole career of dermatology. In case there's anyone out there that's interested in potentially getting into dermatology, what made you initially interested in doing that? You know, it was probably more so that I didn't really know what I wanted to do. Like, I was in college. I went to UCLA, and, you know, I just was kind of taking. the normal path with me. I wasn't super driven there at that point. I think it was later

in my life that I realized I'm like a triple A personality and I really wasn't back then. I don't know if you can evolve into this sort of person. And I just was, you know, going from my dad's in medicine, my dad's dermatologist, so I got exposure. So I knew it was an amazing specialty. So, you know, and then actually it was one of the hardest specialties to get into. Interesting. Because there's very few spots available. There's very few dermatologists that are created, you know, There are a few residency positions as a physician. Okay. And also it's the lifestyle in general is really nice because, you know,

a lot of it is fee-for-service or things that you don't have to deal with a lot of life-threatening emergencies per se, you know. I mean, of course there's melanoma, there's cancers and things like that. But a lot of it is sort of like for anti-aging reasons. So it's like a really kind of a cushy kind of job. Like a lot of, you know, males and females can do this and have like a life outside of medicine. Is that still the case today? So if someone hears this and like, yeah, I want my kids talking about maybe. begin to dermatology, or I'm thinking about it, is it still that challenging to get place

into the dermatology world? Yes, and in fact, I just met somebody recently that was finishing her residency, and they actually kind of push you to do this extra work. It's like you have to earn it now. You have to do an extra year of research beyond medicine. So like when I get out of school, you know, finishing my training, technically, all residency and everything, I was 33, 34. Like, that's a long time. That's a lot. So let's talk about that quick. Education-wise, if someone's interested, what does it look like to get a year? It's a long road. It is.

And so, and that's, the climate has changed a little bit because now, you know, there are other avenues to sort of do dermatology, like going to be becoming a physician assistant, nurse practitioners, some of them, depending on the state, you can actually own your own business or have a physician kind of, you know, sort of take the liability and like, you know, like be the medical director and then you have your own business. So there's just different variations of it. But really to be a true dermatologist and to actually, you know, be the expert in the skin. hair and nails and treat like medical conditions, you want to be, you know, you want to go through residency. So do I think it's, I think it's an amazing specialty. I'm so lucky to be in it. Do I think it's a different climate now? Would I recommend my kids be in it? It's a long road. It really is. And I mean, it's a great, like it's a great income. If I had not done all of this other stuff, I would, you know, it'd be a great, you know, you, you're very comfortable, you know, financially

And so, like, it's a good, it still remains a great specialty, but it's just a long road to get there. And you really have to want it because there's probably a lot of roadblocks there. Okay. So that's one thing I want to touch on before we go into the show and social media. You said it's a good income. One of the issues is when someone hears about industry or something, they can Google it. And the numbers are all over the place. So in the dermatology field, if someone comes out of residency, what, like, an average can they expect to make, do you think?

maybe high, low, medium, your projections. Well, I know that, like, a lot of the residents that come out, people, like, companies try to entice them. They're certainly offering them, like, half a million starting, you know, that kind of thing. But, you know, depending on where you're practicing and the type of practice that you have, you can make, you know, definitely seven figures, you know. You can make a good living there. And, you know, it was just, it was me and my husband.

So we're double dermatologists in our own practice, private practice. you know, we were making good money. And then this thing came along. And, you know, dermatology is still stressful. You're still, it's still a job, just like everything else. And it was really kind of cool that I got to do something that was different that still used my knowledge and my experience in dermatology, kind of like, just like, you know, it was like a Mohammed al-Limmy.

You just kind of, you know, just kind of shift a little and dodge any kind of punches, you know? I like it. So it's kind of cool, yeah. Floating like a butterfly out there, sticking like a beat. I love that. When you guys, you started your own practice, did you guys go and like take one of these big $500,000 offers when you got to school? Or did you start right away working together building your own practice? We were lucky in the sense that we didn't have to do that because my dad is a dermatologist.

So he retired and we really kind of slid into his practice. And so I had a patient load already and, you know, to not make it too technically. Like there's different kinds of insurances that you take where, you know, HMO versus PPO's versus cash base. And so we really kind of were, had a little bit of a cushion there, but we took it to a different level. Okay. Two, my dad was pretty, like, slowing down. He wasn't really seeing a lot of patients.

But he'd been established. He'd been there for like, I don't know, 20, 20, 25 years or so, you know, he'd been there for a while. So we did have that great opportunity, which is why actually we're also in Upland. That's where my, that's where I grew up, like, after moving away from New York, you know, which is like between here and Palm Springs. So we're in Southern California. So that's why we started our practice there.

You know, yeah, that's really, we got it. We had a little step up, really, but then we really had to take that to the next level. But, you know, it is still like, it's nice to work for yourself. Like, we've never really had to work for anybody else. Yeah. I mean, that's like the dream in my opinion. If you guys heard HMO, PPO, some of that stuff was confusing. Make sure you stay tuned to the recap.

The Curious Canadian and I will break down all the definitions. Let's get into the social media. So you have your private practice, you and your husband, you step into your dad's practice, things are going well, social media starts to take off. You start to see a few thousand dollars come in. Now, TLC comes into the fact well after you've been established on social media. At this point, what did your growth look like before TV shows started knocking on your door? Yeah, well, I will say one thing that was really interesting, too, was, you know, as I said,

we were getting all these views. And this was before, I think it was called, I called the YouTube Adpocalypse, where they really kind of, you know, tightened down on their ads. And before, I guess it was more like you'd get a cent per thousand views. So you can imagine at one point there early on, I was approaching like six figures a month, just posting Blackhead videos, videos that I, you know, it was things I was doing at work. It wasn't like I was thinking up content being, you know, I'm a content creator, but it was. things that were walking in my door. You already do it. Right. I'm doing it already. I'm getting a salary for that, you know, and here I am just posting this later. And that was crazy. I was like, oh, this is, I could just do this. This is great. This is just like easy. Yes. You know, and it was

nice because it was anonymous, you know, just like there was a lot of safety. I think the fact that I was already 10 years into practice, it was really helpful too. And that was one thing that was a really big deal that I think I could approach this in a very, from a wiser point of view, just, you know, I was confident already in my abilities as a doctor, but I also was very careful. I think when you're younger, you can maybe get pulled into things and do things, maybe inappropriately. Like, I was very careful about my patient's privacy and things like that. Yeah, yeah, just a lot of things. When, for the, so six figures a month, I mean, that, that is huge. When you were making that,

it lasted for like a second. I mean, it was great. for a couple months. Well, that was my question, though, because that was a product of YouTube when they would pay for the ads. That wasn't you, and just because we've had a lot of people from influencing backgrounds talk about it.

These aren't ads that they're coming to you and they're saying, you know, I'm looking at Mountain Valley Sparkling Waters right in front of me. They're not saying, go do an ad on your YouTube. What YouTube is doing is they're just placing ads. That's what you're making it off of, right? And so how has that decreased and why has that decreased?

Well, I think it decreased. I kind of say unfairly, I mean, it disproportionately because, you know, I think they deemed my content gross and shocking. Okay. There was a lot of craziness going on there. I mean, like, I almost got kicked off so many times of YouTube. I would get strikes all the time. And I, but I do think a lot of that had to do with there were people on there that

were trying to steal my content. It was rampant. It was just crazy. It was like the Wild West, you know? Stealing your content, flipping it so that it wouldn't get detected. and then trying to get you off, you know, so that they would take the money. Like, there was a lot of that going on. And so, and just a lot of strikes because they thought it was, I was trying to be gross and shocking.

And, you know, people wouldn't want their ads running next to my content. Yes. So it was really annoying because I was like, this is medicine. I'm not trying to do something really gross. This is educational. It's entertaining, but educational. That's really like my mantra there with everything, you know. First of all, it's like we're tricking people until, like, educating them and they're understanding it.

So it was just really, it was really annoying. And, you know, I think that's why TikTok got so big. They get, they allow people to go viral. They get big, then they post, they get more involved. Everybody goes on TikTok. Yeah. Right. And then they dial it back.

Yeah, totally. TikTok is now dialing things back. They are dialing. Right. It's how they scale. They blow it up and then they dial back. They make everybody excited and then they get you involved. You're like, oh my gosh, I'm going to be part of this thing.

And then they pull it back. It was this connects, your comment also connects back to, We had a CEO of one of the largest town agencies out there. And he was saying he kind of quizzed me a little bit. And he's like, name the type of influencer that will make the most amount of money. And the answer is actually like babies and children like opening gifts. And so the logic and reason behind that is kind of what you alluded to. The big companies with the big dollars want the G rated version of what the content is because there's less liability with it.

And it sounds like you were in this like PG category, but then like, you're, like, YouTube kind of shifted you into a PG-13. And even at times, which is outrageous, this is health care. It got shifted into like an R-rated, and that decreased the opportunities. Yes. Okay. But I look at your social media following. I do this like 30 million.

I'm thinking 16.2 million on TikTok, 4.1 million on Instagram, 7-plus million on YouTube. I'm thinking easily in an annual basis, you're making millions and much, much, more off social media than a private practice. Does that hold true in 2022? You know, I think, you know, I was listening to your podcast coming out here. I know that a lot of people don't want to share, like, their brand deals and the amount of money that they make and things. And I wonder, do you think it's partly because they are not making as much money as you think that they are? And they just are trying to keep it private because it makes it sound like it's a lot bigger.

I don't know. I've seen both. I've seen three reasons. I've seen one, people want the perception that they're making more than they are. I've seen two people, it's such a wild world that there is no comparing A to B. So they hear what B is making. So then they are embarrassed that they're not making the same. And then I've heard very, very open conversations about contractually, I can't share it.

So like I did a deal with, I'm making this up, right? But I do a deal with Ford cars in the contract. They make it clear I can't share that stuff. So we do get people that are just like, I don't care. I'm going to put it out there. And then some people I think there's those reasons. Yeah, I mean, I would say for me, I think that in terms of like the deals or the money that I make off of the views, it's not as big anymore, you know, certainly on YouTube. But in terms of brand deals or sponsors, I don't really do that very often.

And I think it was because early on, you know, when I saw this happening on YouTube, I was like, okay, what the heck am I going to do with this? I mean, like, am I just going to be pop and bibbles the rest of my life? Like, can I use this for any reason? And that's why I really started my skincare line, you know, because I was thinking like, This is my platform here. People are asking me advice about skin. It's really nice for me to provide products that I know work for them, right? And it's all part of that educational and entertainment sort of thing.

So that's really what I put everything in. Like all the money that we made on YouTube really put it into that. So I didn't have to like get investors or start anything, you know, or anything like that because it was really like set up for us so we could just drive that into that area. And so I don't really do brand deals. I haven't really. I'm doing some now. like, but they're not as like, I'm sort of, I think I'm at that level where I have a little bit

more clout that I can pick something that's really big. I see a lot of these, you know, there are a lot of germ and medicine influencer, and they're doing a lot of sponsorships and things. And, you know, in the beginning you think it's cool, but then the audience, you know, they catch on really quick. They know when you're sponsoring, you know, when you're endorsing a product. So, and I think it can breed some disbelief, you know, and distrust in you. And that's something that I really need to maintain. I really don't want to back something unless I truly believe in it.

Yeah, I mean, the credibility with the doctor is just so important. And then I also think, to your point, too many ads, you lose engagement, you lose people that are just watching and you lose followers. Dr. Pimple Popper, that people know you from social media,

but they know you from the show. And I think it's so cool that social media is what sparked the conversation. Tell us about what that was like when TLC came to you with this opportunity. Interesting. Interestingly, I wasn't, I wasn't very gung-ho about it because I had people coming to me about different things. Book deals and production companies were courting me.

And of course, it's, I mean, it's, I'm honored to be even considered and it was really fun to kind of get into this little world here. But I was scared because I've always been my own boss. I've always had control. I have full control over my YouTube. I could decide whether to post things or not. I would edit every word. I would think about like what was being presented there. I mean, I'm not trying to change things,

but I would certainly try to protect my patients. I think that was the main thing. Protecting my patients and making sure they're not made fun of. And I was afraid of giving this to somebody else and then they could make it something crazy. Like I had to toss a table or freak out or, you know what I mean? It's like a reality show, really. And so it was concerning to me.

So I really kind of hesitated for a while. They really had to pursue me a little bit, not TLC, but production companies. Okay. So then production companies then would present it to, you know, a network. And I think that they took a chance on me, certainly, which was great. But again, it was like, can I do this? It's sort of like, you might be the same way.

Like, you know, when somebody gives you a goal, you're like just trying to see if you can do it. Yeah, of course. Right? Like you want to. You're competitive. You want to see whether you can do something like that. So I got it. And then I was like, okay, well, now what am I going to do?

You know, like now I'm giving people free reign to do whatever, make this, whatever they don't want. And I have to trust them. Yeah. And it really was, it was amazing. I mean, I think, like, our first season, we were, like, went up to top. We were, like, number one. I mean, on the, you know, in the ratings that night, like, millions of people were watching. It was just, like, this whirlwind.

Like, it was crazy. And I don't know. I don't know. I think they made it amazing. They made the show really good. They made me look better than I am, you know, like, just like, they really were able to tap into the love that is there and the really helping people. It was like an opposite kind of show than what you see in reality in general. Like most of them you're just trying to create controversy, right?

You have regular people or crazy over the pop top people and trying to make them look even crazier. That's why you watch it. The Bachelor. Yeah. But here you start with something crazy and you're trying to make it look normal. Yeah. Trying to do the sorts. It's like the backwards approach.

Right. When you're, I think it's fascinating that you wanted the creative control and the concern of not having it with the risk, but how it paid off just kind of let them go and let them take that. Guys, and just before the podcast went, we already made it clear. We can't get into the dollars of the TLC contract. So we are not going to push that. You guys, money off, would be proud that I talked about that before. Because they always say, ask your guests before so you don't push to it. Okay, so we're going to do that.

But the one thing I've always been curious about, suppose there is a component in your deal where you can get paid on performance. I'm always curious about reruns. There's always, like, seasons being showed. Do you know when there are reruns or seeing a show that's already been out there? dues, just like cast, they get paid on that or no? I don't think they do. Yeah.

It's like a season by season basis, right? This is a newer, well, this is my opinion, of course, and I don't have super knowledge, but just from my opinion and experience, again, just more recently, because obviously I've been a dermatologist, just acne and warts and pimples my whole life. So, like, here I am doing this other thing. You know, it all changed, I think, with, like, friends and, you know, know, syndication back then, like they get paid forever with it. Friends negotiated as a big group. Like, I've done deep dives on all these things. Yeah, the money, we'll talk about that

in the recap. The number of these guys, it was nuts. It's different. Well, now there's different avenues, and that's the other thing with streaming. Streaming has given the opportunity, I think, for a lot of big companies to not to start from anew with that knowledge of not becoming another friend's sort of thing from their perspective, you know, and try to create something that they have more power and control over, because you just want to do it. If you're doing a streaming, like, you're not going to necessarily get any money from, like, them putting it, selling it to another network or, you know, playing it again. Like, that's just the way it is.

And you're going to take it. Right. And not saying that I don't, like, I love TLC. I mean, it's amazing that now we're part of Discovery, which is Warner Brothers and HBO. So cool that we're part of this huge conglomerate now. But it's all changing. Yeah. Like, there's a lot of different things.

And those people are really smart. They know what they're doing. I mean, they've been doing this for a long time. Head executives of HBO Warner Brothers and other are there for a reason. They are sharp and they got the big honchos. Okay, I'm going to get a little off the business and career stuff, but I think this will help people at home. You have a blackhead.

You have a pimple. What's like your number one tip? Should you pop it? Do you let it go? Do you put ointment on it? Like, what's the play before it becomes that? Well, you want to try to try to keep your pores clear. you know, with like a salicylic acid.

That's, again, why I have my skincare line, yes. Alamedi skincare, because it really has, it started with acne line. You know, using products that we know can help prevent blackheads and white heads, which are the building blocks of acne, really. So using a retinol, using salicylic acid cleanser

or a topical, if you have an active inflame pimple using benzoproxide, sulfur, all those things are like really in our acne kit. And it's available at Target now, which is amazing. That is so cool. Yeah, good for, I mean, to get into Target is very challenging. Okay, so check that out, guys. If you need anything, the SLMD skincare line, the acne kit is in Target.

That, I think that's really good. If somebody has a pimple on their face, though, I have a question. Should you squeeze it or not? At what point do you squeeze it? Well, so I'm going to be like all of the dermatologists and say, don't squeeze your pimples. Okay, okay. But I also know that if I explain to people, like, and sort of educate them as to why, they're going to understand and be able to choose the right time to do it.

Because if I have a giant pimple, I'm most likely going to squeeze it, but I'm waiting for an ideal moment. And that is when it's at the surface of your skin, when it's like a postural or like what people call whitehead. Yeah, because what pimple's actually doing is when you get that red bump under your skin that you feel more than you see, that is actually bacteria getting involved. And the pain is because the swelling is there. So the bacteria is like feasting on, like your debris or dead skin cells or oil like that or in your poor.

And so then it gets really mad and inflamed. And your body is actually trying to push this out because it sees that it's foreign. There's a bacteria there. Let's get rid of this. And that's why you get that pustule because everything's kind of going to the surface, right? And so it's ready to be removed. And that's the moment where you want to take like a sterile needle or something like that or, you know, a lancet or something to be able to nick the surface. your skin and be able to express that purulent cell.

And the reason is the deeper you, obviously, I think a lot of us have tried to squeeze a pimple too early and it makes it just giant and mad and worse. And that's because it's not on the surface of the skin. And I think when you do that, when it's deeper seated and it's not ready to be removed, you really run the risk of scarring. Okay. You know, and that's what you don't want to have. You have beautiful skin.

Oh, thank you. It sounds like you've been really good about not squeezing things. I just follow what Caitlin does. Whatever she does. I'm like, yeah, give me some of that. And my mom, and my mom. She knows her stuff. All right. One last question I have about the show, and I'm not sure if you can show this, but if you can, below deck, we've learned that you have to, from some of the housewives, I said, like, they would have to pay below deck to be able to go on the show. We've learned from a lot of other shows that you get paid to go on. When someone comes into your office and on your show, is there any type of agreement that like, okay, you don't pay it for the treatment, or we pay you to come on, or you have to pay us to come on. Is there anything like that? Well, first of all, interesting, I have been asked to be on below deck, too, and I've seen there. So, yes, that is the case.

That is the truth, right? Yes. You do, it's discounted, but you have to pay them and you have to pay the tip, too. That's the big thing. That's what Jill Zeran said, the tip. Yes, yes, because then you have to not look bad or, you know, like, that's reflective. And it's a big-ass tip. Yes, it is.

Yes, it is. And it's a pretty big deal to go on that show and to do, you know, because it's still cost a good amount of money. Of course, you know, it's a beautiful yacht and all these. But, you know, also, if you get drunk and you fall around and make a fool of yourself, as we have seen, it's going to be part of the show. Yes. Yeah, what's the allure, I think, or what drives people to want to be on the show is maybe me treating them and being able to have this thing taken care of when they've been looking for somebody for, you know, years. But they don't have to pay for their treatment. Okay.

Got it. Yeah. So they don't. That's good. That's part of it. Yes. So, yes, there's actually even there's casting. Yeah, they're people, they're looking for a new.

They're looking for more, because we're right in the midst of taping still. So, you know, if you want, you can go on there. You know, there's an email that you can go on. Popper at Aberrant Casting, I think it's called. Where would they just Google something? They just email and say, hey, I have something. Can you guys? And so then they'll go through the casting process.

Popper at Aberrant casting, it's called. If we can get someone from the Money Mafia on this show, it would be amazing. That would be so cool. My mom would die if she came out. We're also in our family, we have. like crazy white coat syndrome. So it would be so interesting to see like how we'd be relaxed in your office based on how much annex we took, et cetera. Okay. We have like the worst white cone syndrome. So it's okay. I take care of you. That and pro nox, which is like a nitrous.

Yeah. All right. SLMD skincare. We talk a lot about money here. We talk about earning money, but we also talk about like consumer protection when people are spending money, what to look out for. I thought it would be amazing with your background, all your education to talk a little bit about skincare when people are purchasing because there are so many money grabs out there where they don't have the people that are credible behind the products. And they know the margins are super high. So as a consumer, the people out there that are shopping for skincare, given all your background, what is like a big tip you would give them when they're looking to buy skincare, what to be aware of what to watch out for? I think do your research, I would say. I mean, it's hard to do that.

You know, not all of us have time or the desire to do that. But I think that there are a lot of lot of influencers out there in this world that I'm in, like the skincare or, you know, beauty world. And they are giving a lot of really good information out there. But then there's the ones that they, you know, there's so many. Like you just have to go on TikTok or something. And you'll see like, oh, this thing will erase your brown spot, which is you rubbing with your finger. So yeah, you got to use your, but a lot of people get tricked. I mean, that's just the way it is. I have something that I'm dealing with now. I get people every now and then emailing me saying like you you jipped me with my skincare product I have this I tried to buy this anti-aging

thing that you endorsed and it's not working and now I can't get my money back it's not me they're like people that are faking oh they're doing fraudulent stuff for you interesting and they are using my face and and putting out articles there so that is not me I am sLMD skincare I do not have any other line it's not called something else and I think that there's a lot of that out there and it's really hard to weed through it. Okay. So if it's someone that is pretending to be you and it's not you and they're selling a product and they click on that, I have to imagine it's clearly not taking them to your actual site. Yeah. So just be like, I think doing the due diligence, like know what's the exact brand, the site, et cetera. And I think what they're doing is they're taking a person's

credit card and they're continuing to charge it and they're making it very difficult for you to cancel. Yeah. Yeah. And then you feel so bad, but it's like I've had friends, like friends are friends text me and say, is this you? Like, they'd be a little, I'd be like, no, that's not me. And it's not just happening to me. It happens to a lot of other, not just physicians, but other, like, celebrities or people like in the world, they're like, you know, they're getting, people who are thinking that they're selling something.

I guess it's simpler for me since I'm in the beauty, like, anti-aging industry. Yeah. Okay, guys, stay tuned to the recap, too. I'm going to talk about this. If you do have a fraudulent interaction, how you can get the money back, what liability the credit cards have and what they have to do. that they might not tell you, but you should be aware of. So stay tuned for the recap there. How about someone that's at home that's like, listen, I'm not a big skincare person, but like there's

one thing, if I needed to do this, what would Dr. Santerly tell me that I need to do and what's the product that they would give? They're only of the affordability for like one or two. Right. I mean, you know what I'm going to say. Yeah, I think so. I mean, sunscreen, right? Everybody needs to protect their skin from premature aging, browns, but like so many things that can protect you from. I think like a retinol or trinanone is really good because that's been around for generations and we know that it can help to minimize fine lines and wrinkles over time. And that's actually something that we've left for you. It's really meant for acne, but like it, we know that it works for anti-aging reasons, fine lines and wrinkles and things like that. So it's really great

for your skin no matter what. So that's really great to use. There's just different, like there's antioxidants. There's things that sort of give you a little superficial peel. It just depends. on the type of skin you have and what you're looking for. Okay. That's fair. Well, we're going to go through the process. Here's what we're going to do, too, guys. I'm going to try all these products.

And in the review, in the recap, I'm going to do a little review. What was my favorite? What I loved about them. So stay tuned to that to the SMLD, Jason Tarnick, review breakdown, and I don't know shit about skin care. So you're going to have no credibility behind this. Well, let me just tell you, though, because a lot of that has, mine is a medically based skincare line.

It is not really about anti-aging, though it is, you know, that, that's, you know, that's, an extra sort of thing with it. It's mainly because I knew that a lot of the people that are, you know, watching me are looking for a dermatologist and they can't see a dermatologist. Maybe they don't have the time or the money or the ability, but they want to take things into their own hands and really help their acne or their eczema or their issues. And so I'm really kind of teaching them what to do. And then I have products that we know work.

Because like you said, like there's, you go as seen on TV even. There's like things to remove skin tags, it's just BS or people come in. just the other day, someone came in and used apple cider vinegar on there, you know, and they created scarring, but they thought that they could get rid of a cyst or something. So there's a lot of misinformation out there, and I'm trying to give them things that we know work so that they can go to that, you know, target or go on our website and just find the products and know that they work for them, whatever they have. That's good, really good advice.

But you don't have any issues, so I hope you can find something. Wow, that's so nice. I'm going to take that. All right. I love that. But we're still going to do an SLMD breakdown. And so you guys stay tuned in the recap. I have two rapid fire questions before we get to your trading secret.

It's pretty simple. Today, 2022, when you look at like the biggest business revenue generator for you with everything you have gone out, the book, the TV show, social media, your practice, your skin care line. Today, what is it? You know what? I will say in all honesty, I don't really pay attention to how much money I get. My husband really handles that.

And I don't like to get involved. I don't really like to think about it too much. It's like too much pressure to think about that. I mean, I look at the big goal. Like, I understand I'm driven. I want to do things that can, I'm trying to think of ways to make, I'm trying to think of ways to generate money while you're sleeping, right? Like, I don't want to be actively working all the time to have to do this.

And so these are the things, these are the avenues I'm trying to move myself in. But I mean, I think that these, they're all, all my stuff is sort of interrelated. And it's fun to make more money doing something simple. or same amount of money doing something that's more stressful. I have found that people that are kind of just through this whole podcast, the people that are like the best at what they do within a niche, there's a huge percentage of them that are like, I don't really know the money behind it. I'm just so focused on my craft, which I love that.

I mean, there's so much to that. Let's fast forward the second part of the question. Ten years from now, forget about the dollars and cents because that's not what you follow. Which of those businesses do you project will grow the fast? If you had the crystal ball, what do you think it would be? Ooh, I always have a backup. See, it's different for me. Like, I can always back up to my dermatology.

And that is actually gives me the opportunity to be a little bit more risky, maybe, and daring. Because I have a day job. I've always said that. Like, I have a day job, even if all of this went away, I have. So I'm able to sort of try to maybe push it or try to do something a little bit different. So I don't know. I guess I will always have dermatology. So cool. This is so fascinating. Your story is absolutely amazing. But we got to end with the trading secret.

Something that someone can learn from you, Dr. Sandorley, with your entire career, whether it's money management, life management, it's just an inspirational quote you'll live by. What would be the trading secret that you can leave the money mafia with? Be kind. Be honest. Be humble. Just like I said before. Just be the person you are. Don't let things change you. And just be a good person and put out good in the world. And then I feel like I've always felt like that was the best way to make a decision because if I can say that I'm doing this because I think it's the kindest thing to do, then I can't

be faulted. Even if it doesn't work out, I'd feel like, well, at least I tried to, I didn't try to hurt anybody or I didn't try to, you know, do something evil like that. This is payback, you know? Yeah. Yeah. I think that what's really good about that, like, when I heard you say that, my, the first word, I thought of one word, it's intention, right?

Like, be kind with, like, your intention and, like, your intention means everything. And even when I asked you the money question, your intention isn't the money. Your intention is continue to grow and make an impact with the skill set you have. For anyone out there that somehow isn't one of these 30 million plus people that follows you, if you are one of those people, which is very unlikely. But if you are, where can they find everything you got going on? Your skincare, your book, your social media, everything. Well, SLMD Skincare is my skincare line.

That's at SLMD Skincare.com. We are also available. Some of our products are available at Target nationwide. We are also in the UK. It's SLMD skincare.co.uk. And so we have, you know, our YouTube has been around for a while. Our Instagram, our TikTok, which is blown up in the last couple years like a lot of other people's, all Dr. Pimble Popper. And so that's, and my office is in Upland.

That's where I practice. I only could see one patient at a time. But that's where I see patients like a couple days a week. I love it. And we film our show there, too. And that's where you film the show. All right. That's on TLC.

Sorry, I should say that. LC. We love TLC. All right. So whether you got a pimple to pop and you want to go on the show or you want to follow along, be entertained, apparently fall asleep or, you know, just watch the anticipation. Thank you so much for being on this episode of Traying Secrets. Thank you. Ding, ding, ding. We are closing in the bell to Dr. Sandra Lee, the pimple popper episode. You know, David, I felt a little weird there. Hating ding, ding, ding. I know we recap. corporate Natalie, but you know, the Jason Tells All episode, you were doing all the ding, ding, dings. Do you miss it at all? You know, I miss it a little bit,

but, you know, I think the episode did pretty well. You know, we like to keep track of the rankings of the episodes and the ratings, and we got some good comments on it. So it was, you know, I got my spot there. Once a year, I know it's guaranteed. Every time you come out a little book deal, maybe we'll do another one.

But it feels good to be back in the recap chair with you, 2023. I love it. Well, you nailed that episode. episode. Corporate Natalie was last week. And now with the whole build your wealth, better your health, this is definitely more of a health segment in podcast with Dr. Pimple Popper, but we covered all things. And David, thank you so much for sharing your blackhead removal before we started this recap. I greatly appreciate it. For all of you at home who are wondering what

he's talking about, my wife has one of those vacuum blackhead removers that you use on your nose and it comes with the app so you can see the video of what it's picking up and I don't know what's wrong with me but I just can't stop getting blackheads on my nose that come up with way too much I guess you could call them goo in this case which you would see from a normal pimple popping episode but that's just a weekly tradition around the Ardwin household what's it do you have a blackhead remover tool secret game over there that the Tardig bristos play well Well, the Tarnick Brist, I mean, Caitlin Bristow, every time I talk to her, she's got a new, she's somewhere doing some type of face. Like, you know, she's like anything that you can do for skin care.

She is doing for her face 24-7. She's actually at the place we go to here in Nashville. It's called Indy, run by Alyssa. She's awesome. And she's, they're doing a new thing where, like, they numb your face and they do, it's almost like, it sounds like micro-needling of some sort, but it's not microneedling. I don't know. There's always, something so she is the skin master i'm still learning all this stuff but i do have in that kit that i got from dr sander lee this is the black head removal tool that i've been using and it's pretty i mean it's not the suction cup that you use but this has been really good you see those little i mean it looks like like i mean a dentist could use this thing there those are like little mini captain hooks

on there they are so that that review i would give a 10 out of 10 for the pimple and then for the pimple popper stuff. And then also in my little grab bag, there was a bunch of stuff. The retinol was great too, but there's this SLMD, Sandra Lee MD. It's this salicylic acid spot treatment. So it's maximum strength, 2% acne treatment. So I had a little Zid on my forehead and I put this stuff on before on New Year's Eve. I'm not kidding you with. And one day I was gone. This stuff is like next level. So yeah, impressed by it. So around the Tardock Bristow household, is Caitlin, like, obsessed with, like, popping your zits? Is she, like, very hands-on with that stuff with, like, skincare stuff?

Or does she make you kind of, like, tend for yourself? She makes me fend for myself. She doesn't get in the weeds with that. How about you guys? Oh, it's the worst. I used to enjoy a nice little back grow. I could see Ashley wanted to, like, get in the weeds. Oh, I used to enjoy a nice little backgrawl.

I can't go. I can get a backscratch for longer than three seconds before her just, she's attacking something. It's just full on. Force. She, just like Mama Kaluch, your mom, Ashley is a diehard pimple popper fan. So she's really excited for this episode. I think it's actually her dream to work in, to work in that industry. But it was really interesting hearing the take of how much schooling that it took to get into, you know, the industry,

almost more than like your typical doctor to be a professional pimple popper. And I didn't realize how like competitive it is when she was sick. Because there's only so many few spots. I didn't realize it's like one of the most competitive areas. That's all news to me. Yeah, it was really interesting to hear that. I just can't get over how she said she has over 5 billion views on her page, or her YouTube page, and how many were repeat views?

Like, the fact that people watch it, the calm them and help them go to sleep, like my jaw was on the floor. I don't know how you kept your composure. What was her overall inside take? Like, she can't be fucking serious. No, I first fall, engagement's insane. The fact that people watch this stuff to go to sleep, I had no idea. Even doing all the research I did before the episode, I had no idea about that.

I think my biggest takeaway from it, I'm very surprised I guess that like how, you know, when she said like YouTube ads and stuff that was up big time making $100K a month, but she doesn't do any like placement ads herself. To me, I'm blown away by that because the money that's left on the table there is astronomical. It is. And you know what's also like, have you seen those like pimple popping toys that they have that are supposed to be like therapeutic for people? Like imagine how does she not have her own like line of like pimple popping toys?

toys that that or products that people can use is like for therapeutic things like I'm there's a lot you know I could see the Jason Tardick rewired talent you see the wheels were spin in there I had I had in my notes I'm like did a light ball go off in your head when you were talking about hypothetical brand deals uh bless you uh thank you're talking about hypothetical brand deals and you know so I could tell when you were going through this kind of seeing her number seeing her engagement um and knowing that there's a lot of potential. I don't want to say miss because they're not, she hasn't really even explored them,

but brand deals, product, product lines, like, I think you guys might be a little match made in heaven. And the chemistry is great, great between you guys, by the way.

I appreciate that. I mean, I thought she was great. She was like a light of energy in that room. She was just so wonderful. But it brought me back to the Rob Deereck episode. It's like, I'm surprised the way Rob Deerdeck sold placement into his MTV show,

like early on. I'm shocked that she, or TLC. Let's just even see TLC. They haven't sold into her social. I'm surprised they don't take like the commercial deals that are being done and then we'll also offer her a check on top like use this. These are the two big commercials or two big brands we use during your episode or your season. Let's get those integrated into your social. I think there's a ton of opportunity to make even more money than she's already doing. Now dollars and cents wise I'm I want to ask you a question here and I think I know the I have an idea of the answer but let's

talk about three different income streams that she has. She obviously has her private practice. She has the money from TLC from her very popular show. And then she has her money that she's made off. Let's just take social media. Let's just go YouTube. Okay. Which do you think over the course of her career has she made more money in the TV show, her YouTube channel or her private practice? I'm going to say number one would be private practice. Okay. Number two would be YouTube. I think. I mean, it sounds like it's come down a lot. And number three would be the show. She does sound like, you know, it's TV like she said. Does she reference friends and all? It just doesn't pay the way it used to. A five billion. I know it said it came down a lot. She was making

six figures in the first few months that she was doing starting YouTube. But five billion views is five billion views. I got to think that she's making some pretty good coin from that. So I think that you had a pretty accurate. And we're known to be pretty accurate on the show with our guest estimations. That's right. What else you got? I got a couple more things. One before you mentioned, every time you mentioned something in the episode about stay tuned for the recap, I got to give it to my people. I got one question though, a little hypothetical for you. Let's hear. Why? We're going to David hypothetical. You know, when we're like 16, 18, 21, we just can't wait to be older. Can't wait to look older. Can't wait to, you know, be able to go to a restaurant and have people look like, you know,

you're older, you're successful. Sure. But then we hit this age where it's, It's like, now I'm using anti-aging creams. I'm worried about my skin. I'm worried about like, you know, wrinkles, reducing wrinkles. What do you think is the sweet spot age that we're all trying to look? At the end of the day, what does Jason Tardick think the sweet spot age is where I no longer want to look older and I'm using anti-aging creams and wrinkle reductions because I want to look this age?

I'm just really curious. It's such a great question. I think it's a great question. Guys, and I always love your feedback. We literally are watching these reviews like Hawks, so continue to please give us reviews. But I'd love to have you guys give us five stars and go to the reviews and Apple

and then tell us what you think the answer to that is. I'm going to tell you right now, I think it is, I don't know, I guess like a really healthy 40. Like when you look at a 40-year-old, the 40-year-old looks amazing. Like you're like, wow, they look sharp and they look good. If you could hold that look for the entire of your life, wouldn't that be? Or do you think it's younger than that?

I think the answer is going to differ for males and females. I think for me, like I'm 36. Yeah? I think, buddy, you don't know your own age. No, that's weird. I think I'm 36. This is all we do here is we talk about numbers and owning numbers. Now, we want to get deeper and make sure we know all numbers.

Like where our crypto is, David, you don't even know your fucking age. Okay, okay. I'm turning 36 in a month. I just did the quick math in my head there. I think that my, like, I think early 30s, like 31 for me was like, okay, I look in the mirror now and I'm like, I've actually stared in the mirror and I'm like, dude, I got I just, I buzzed. I got grays coming.

Yeah. Yeah. Tons of grays. I just feel like a little more sag. Like, it's time for me to probably get Botox. So I was just curious, but, you know, if you could look. So your answer is like 31? I'm going to say 31 for myself.

I think that's fair. I think somewhere like the 30 to 40, like 40 to lower, like 30 to 40 would make sense. Yeah, I think so. You guys tell us. I'm curious. I think it's a great hypothetical. Guys, we read these reviews. B. Renee C. Her year the word she said is consistency in the reviews.

We had KDP 11. She told us what her New Year's resolution is to make this year the best year yet. Danny X Extreme gave us great feedback. Give us feedback. We'll check it out. We'll read it. is that perfect age that you would like to hold the entire of your life? This conversation brings me back. You ever seen that movie Death Becomes Her? No. Wow. Okay, first of all, you need to stop

everything and you need to go watch Death Becomes Her and they're actually bringing it to Broadway, I think. I heard a rumor somewhere. Death becomes her, David. Put it on your list. You'd be embarrassed by my list. I'm the biggest, like, I haven't seen that movie and people's jaws drop. You don't even want to know. You're that guy. I like that. I'm kind of like that. I'm kind of like too, but this one is a classic. All right, what else we got from the doctor, Sandra Lee episode? You mentioned in the episode, in the recap, the difference between HMO and PPO. Now, for those who are listening, those are, I think, different types of insurances that they accept for the private practice in the dermatology skincare world. So, difference between HMO and PPO. Okay, so just in

general, this is what they stand for, right? So, like, HMO stands for health maintenance organization. PPO stands for preferred provider. organization. They're types of health insurances, and there's pros and cons to both. And you could do all your research when you're understanding how to pick your health insurance plan. But a PPO is like a, that's the preferred provider organization. Some of the pros of that are you're going to have a bigger provider list. You're going to have more flexibility and control as to like where you actually can see a doctor because it's much less restrictive on where you can go. but usually the con is it's more expensive.

Like that's one of the big things. So I think preferred provider organization kind of gives you more freedom, but it's more expensive, if that makes sense. Where HMO, it's going to be lower costs, but you're going to have to go to those like in-network or covered visits, if that makes sense,

based on the policy that you have. So, you know, it's going to have to be, you go to your primary care physician, you then get a referral to a special, it's got to be in network where a PPO can be in or out of network and you can go directly to a primary care physician or if you want to see a specialist you can go direct to them. You don't have to go to the whole process of like go to my in network physician. And then from my in network physician, they refer me to a specialist.

Now having the luxury of the PPO where you can just go where you want, how you want, it's going to cost more. That's the big thing to know. Okay. That's a good breakdown. Now, this one I have to bring up because Dr. Pimple Popper said she was going to tune in to hear your answer. Talking about fraudulent interactions on credit cards, you said, stay tuned to the recap to figure out the best way to get your money back and what the credit card's responsibility

is during fraudulent charges. So Dr. Pippo Popper's listening. Jason, what do you got for? Okay. Well, first and foremost, what you got to know is that the federal law requires consumers to not be liable for any more than $50 in charges that are lost from the result of a stolen card or unauthorized purchases, right? So more than 50 bucks, according to the Fed, you are not liable. Now, majority of credit cards work where they have zero fraud liability, right?

So all cards are protected. And that is MasterCard, American Express, Discover, Visa, all those credit cards out there. They all have complete protection when it comes to fraud. Also, go listen to the Points Guy episode because I think that you guys go into some pretty good detail about that.

The last thing I got for you and you mentioned it, and I know you did a little bit of research on it, and it's a pretty astounding number, but she talked about her show on TLC. You asked her if she gets paid for reruns, and she basically said the rerun game is done in network TV because of the way that Friends is still making money off their show. So I know you did the research, and if people are home, are still listening. How much money do the people from friends, the cast from Friends make still from reruns on the show, friends. So Money Mafia sit here right now, sit in this for a second, think about it. What is your

answer? How much is the cast make per year? Think through it. While you're thinking through it, here you go. This is from Bustle. What they says, even though the program's been off the air for 17 years, the stars are all still raking in the dough from the series. According to USA Today, Warner Brothers, the studio that is behind the gargantuan rating success, still brings in an incredible, ready for this? One billion dollars every year from the show from syndication rights. That's a gross revenue of one billion still all these years later, 17 years later. Now what they say is that in the contract, each star takes home just 2% of that.

But let's do the math, guys. 2%. That adds up to about $20 million per member per year of the cast. I mean, that's absolutely incredible. And for the final two seasons, all six stars brought home an insane $1 million per episode. Now, if you look, again, early on to the show, they were paid just thousands per episode. That instantly increased, right? Season three, All-Stars were paid $75 per episode.

Season four and five, that increased into the six figures, then went to $750,000 per episode. And then we know what we just said, All-Stars brought home an insane $1 million per episode for the final two. seasons. It's unbelievable, man. It's absolutely unbelievable. It's about as unbelievable as having 30 million followers for pop and pimples. And that's, that is the beauty of the episode that we just listened to. An amazing career, well-deserved. She's got an amazing head on her shoulders. And it's just a really, really great listen for the first, better your health, build your wealth episode of 2023. There we go. I mean, I might say, I think, at corporate Natalie would have a little build your wealth in there. I'm going to argue that,

but we'll say this is the first better your health. But guys, thank you for joining us for another episode of Trade Secrets. Remember to give us five-star review and give us any comments you have and make sure you put your Instagram handle because we are watching. We are reading and we will see you next week for another episode of Trading Secrets. One you can't afford to miss with Mauricio. If you know them, you know. If you don't, you won't forget them. See you next Monday. Bringing that money, money, playing on me. Making that money and money, living that dream.

Making that money, money, money, rain on me. Making that money, money. Living that dream. Please note that this episode may contain paid endorsements and advertisements for products and services. Individuals on the show may have a direct or indirect financial interest in products or services referred to in this episode.